Jeff Hansen - Sea Shepherd Global Director - S02 E06 - The Scuba GOAT Podcast

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Matt Waters (00:06):
Hey there dive buddies and welcome to the show.
Since becoming closer to andmore aware of our blue world.
I've noticed how many marvelousfoundations charities and
organizations there are doingtheir bit.
Equally so I've also noticed thecommercial entities that are
seemingly polar opposite in thethought processes, or are they
rather than fighting to enforcea particular view?

(00:26):
Should we not be putting moreeffort into working together to
not only provide awareness, butalso protect the oceans
inhabitants?
My next guest has been themanaging director of sea
shepherd Australia for almost 14years.
And is one of the directors ofsea shepherd global undoubtedly
Jeff Hanson has been involved inmultiple discussions from both
sides of the fence.
And on several occasions hasfound that working with the

(00:47):
opposition, it brings up someunexpected and successful
surprises.
Jeff, welcome to the show,chief, how are you doing?

Jeff Hansen (00:53):
Oh, great.
It's really good to be here onScuba Goat and yeah, it's so
great to connect with you, Matt.

You are more than welcome on the show, buddy.
Um, and I've got, uh, right outthe gate.
I've just got to let everybodyknow that Jeff has gone above
and beyond because the kids areout of school at the moment and
he sat in his car to do therecording.
Good on you, mate.

This is the things you have to do when, uh, you
know, young hearts and minds,they just want to run.
Right.
And so they should right.

Um, right.
So, um, do you want to give us abit of a background on yourself,
you are over in Perth at themoment?

Yeah, this is where I guess I call home now, but I
grew up in Melbourne, um,opposite, uh, Darwin Creek.
And, um, I spent every day Icould down there lifting rocks
and catching lizards and snakesand just having a playground
there with my mates and my firstlove was dinosaurs, but as I
couldn't have them as pets.

(01:52):
So I think we moved to, toreptiles and, um, you know, I
guess I always had a dream ofgoing out to be a wildlife vet
specializing in reptiles orworking in Africa, saving
animals from poachers and, um,yeah, for all the wrong reasons.
I did a double degree inelectronic engineering and
computer science, um, at LATrobe uni in Bundoora.
And, um, uh, in reality it wasslightly eating away at me, you

(02:15):
know, work in Germany.
I worked in the states, whichwas great to see the world, but
whenever I watched the naturedocumentary or I felt ill in the
stomach and I thought I couldn'tchange my life.
Um, and then I, um, yeah, Ilooked at Steve Erwin's life
when he died and I thought, no,he died at 44, which is quite
young, but he led a full life ofpassion.

(02:38):
And so what's the point inliving to be a hundred and do
something you hate.
That's not a life.
Um, and so I started takingsteps in other directions.
I went and volunteered atAustralia zoo and it was like,
well, that's kind of, not reallywhat I want to do.
And then I met, um, it was withmy wife marina and we were on
the, on the Bunda cliffs, inAustralia, which stretches for a

(03:00):
hundred kilometers long and 80to a hundred meters vertical.
And looking over the coastthere, we saw a mother and a
calf Southern Ryte whale, andmarina said, I'm going to go
back and start to h elp th at se a s h epherd m o b.
An d, you know, I just learnedabout sea shepherd and was blown
away by the, the words of PaulWatson and the actions of the
volunteer crews and what theywere doing actively intervening

(03:21):
to stop illegal wh aling i n the Southern ocean.
And I just had to be a part ofit.
So yeah, I came back fromAustralia zoo.
I met Paul Watson in Fremantleand, um, I said to Paul, I've
just come back from Australiazoo.
And he said, well, I'm trying toname one of our ships the Steve
Erwin, could you help with that.
And I said, well, I've just comeback from there.
I'll, I'll see what I can dowith the connections I made.

(03:43):
And two weeks later, while stillworking[inaudible] I saw an
email which said Steve Erwin,and it is, um, Jeff, we have
permission to name the ship theSteve Erwin and we'll get right
on it, Paul.
And I was really blown away by,I thought, geez, I've only just
started taking a step in thisdirection and look what already
what had happened.
And then I flew to Melbourne andgot the ship ready for campaign,

(04:05):
took 10 days off school andwatch the Terrio and Chris, and
then, uh, name the, the ship,the Steve Erwin and it sail away
to Antarctica to defend thewhales from the Japanese
harpoons.
And, um, yeah, it broke my heartnot being on it.
Um, but on the third leg of thatcampaign, I got to go down to
Antarctica and see one of themost beautiful places on the

(04:27):
planet, uh, an ancient world ofice and, you know, Minkey's
Southern right Whales,humpbacks, you know, um, you
know, blue walls chunks of icewith the Delhi penguins on them
and, and all cause stormingthrough like the wolves of the
sea, you know, just anincredible and nature.
And I get, get gave me a tasteof what our oceans were like

(04:48):
before us.
And, and, um, I stronglybelieved, you know, we were
heading in a position where I, Ibelieve, um, was away from where
the Japanese whaling fleet was.
And I presented my hypothesis toPaul Watson and we changed
course and yeah, I kind of wascaught up in the moment and
stood back and thought, geez,what, what if I was wrong?

(05:11):
But, but luckily we had, um,yeah, we had harpoon ships on
the radar, um, trying to take usaway from our position, sitting
in the fog.
And then Paul asked me for wereI believe the factory whaling
ship to be the Nishin Maru,which is the one that if we find
the Nishin Maru, we can sit onit and block it from being able
to transfer.
Um, whiales in essence, if Ican't count low dead whales and

(05:34):
I can't kill live ones, andthat's one of our most effective
tactics down there and here wewe encountered armed, Japanese
coast guard, throwing percussiongrenades at us in Australia's
Antarctic territory.
And we, uh, saved over 500whales.
And then I presented a number ofideas on how we could grow sea
shepherd in Australia.
And Paul asked me to, to run itback in, um, 2008.

(05:57):
So yeah, and from then, it'sjust been one thing after
another, a real baptism of fire,um,

Was that, that, that, you know, where you've
gone from sitting and lookingout over the bight to being on
the ship with Paul and saying,we need to go that way instead
of this way, is that all in oneyear, is that all in 2008?

Yeah, 2006, late 2006 was, was standing at the
Bunda cliffs and then 2007 wassort of volunteering at
Australia zoo.
And, and then, um, meeting Paulat the end of 2007, and then,
um, February, 2008, the thirdleg of operation Migaloo.
I was on the ship.

(06:39):
And, um, with Paul, you know, as, uh, as a quartermaster in the
bridge.
So yeah, it, it happened quitequickly and I was definitely not
a public speaker, but I startedvolunteering with a local
Fremantle chapter and, you know,it just, um, they just flowed
like all, all the, you know, allthe stuff I was kind of keeping

(07:00):
inside me about the naturalworld, you know, cause at the
time when I met marina, I was, Imet her at yoga.
I was training for the westAustralian Ironman.
I was kind of doing lots ofkilometers on the bike and that
running and thinking, looking atnature and thinking, I'm going
to spend more time doingsomething with nature.
I don't know how or when, butit's, it's definitely, it's,

(07:21):
it's pulling me in, in thatdirection.

It's obviously a very, um, a subject that's very
close to your heart and stoodyou in good stead for well, the
next 14 years,

Yeah, I think we all have it as kids, you know,
kids that grow up in the worldthat we all love the natural
world, we're still connected toit, but it's the way society is
built.
The kind of tries to take usaway from it and disconnect us
from the natural world.
Um, and I think that some of uslong for it and, and feel very

(07:58):
strongly about it, uh, our wholelives.
And, um, I've always felt a deepconnection to nature and, and
even some things where, youknow, I, I hear about the
connection that Aboriginalpeople have and I've seen it
firsthand that they have to theland and the sea.
And some of the things that I'veseen, you wouldn't believe where

(08:19):
I've walked down.
Um, we're in wild beach andNorthern beaches of Sydney.
And I was with, uh, the morningelder and, and while song man
Barna Lori, and we left thehouse together.
We walked down to the beach, westood at the ocean and he's told
me there was a big part ofdolphins out there.
And I'd seen exactly what he hadseen and looked out together and

(08:43):
didn't say anything.
And a couple of minutes later, abig pot of dolphins come
through.
And I was just, and I thinkthat's the level of connection
that we may never understandthat you first Australians have
with the land and the sea andto, and to each other.
And one day I was out in theBush, um, actually in Victoria,

(09:04):
up near patent hill, um, goingfor a Bush walk through there
with, and I, I stood there and Ifelt that there was kangaroos in
the area and we're walking alongan incline and I just sensed
that they were in the end of thesanity, right close to us.
And then I looked up this hilland there was about four or five

(09:25):
of them just standing next tothe tree, just still just
looking, looking at us.
So I think we have, we very muchare connected.
And, um, you know, we, I thinkwe've, we've somewhat lost that.
And, and, you know, often,sometimes you'll be in the
garden and you were thinkingabout someone you haven't
thought of for years.

(09:46):
And then all of a sudden thephone rings and it's fam like,
we always think it's stillthere.
We've just lost that ability totap into it.
And I know that when, um, JamesCameron was, you know, he made
that film avatar and you can seethat the connection that the
indigenous group have in thefilm to the plants and the
animals and how it's allconnected through a neuro
network.

(10:07):
And, you know, I've read thebook, the hidden life of trees
works, explains that trees areconnected with Fungal neural
network where they cancommunicate with each other.
They can ensure that the youngergeneration of trees don't grow
too fast.
So they get a good foundation.
Or if there's trees in theforest are doing, doing, not
doing well, they can sendnutrients to some of those other

(10:27):
trees in the forest to helpthem.
Um, and yet I know that when SamWorthington was, you know,
getting ready for that role inavatar that, um, he, he spoke to
some local, um, Nunga, um,elders to understand their
connection to the land and thesea.
So it's, it's real and it's,it's there and it's, um, even

(10:48):
scientifically proven, um, it's,it's truly, truly amazing.
And then there's the whole, youknow, explaining the, the
importance of the natural worldto us from it's our life support
that makes it possible for us tolive here.

Well That's it, we are part of it aren't we.

Yeah.
And I love that.
Um, you know, I was with PaulWatson many years ago, down in
Margaret river in WesternAustralia.
And, um, he sat down with abunch of school kids and he
said, has anyone ever been on aspaceship?
And all the kids are lookingaround at each other.
And he said, yes, what you'reonline right now?

(11:25):
This is spaceship earth hurdlingthrough space, unlike any
spaceship, there's thepassengers and the crew, the
crew run this ship, the insects,the worms, the turtles, the
sharks, the trees, the plankton,they regulate our climate.
They take care of our waste.
They provide us with the foodthat we eat and the air that we
breathe.
Cool.
Wait, wait, just the passengers,where's this here.

(11:47):
And a good old time problem iswe're killing off a crew.
So we've got to protect the crewand if understood that business
and government and, and rightthrough the board, we, hopefully
we shouldn't need theseconservation movements or
conservation fights.
And we have a government thatactually holds the ecology of
our planet, you know, right upthere.

(12:09):
And instead of always focusingon the economy and infinite
growth on a finite resource,

Yeah, it's a, it's a difficult one.
Isn't it?
Especially when you've gotpeople that just don't have the
knowledge and experience of, ofwhat it's all about.
Uh, and, and in fact arecompletely oblivious to the
importance of everything,

But mind you, they, if they're given the knowledge,
they can, like, I've seen peoplethat have perceptions on sea
shepherd and be that governmentbe that industry.
And, and when you just talk tothem, not with ignorance, but to
explain the importance of thenatural world and talk about it
in different ways.
Like Sir David Attenborough doeswith BBC and et cetera, like the

(12:51):
more people that have thatknowledge, the more that it
becomes common, the more thatbecomes the new norm, um, people
will start to think about thingsdifferently and we have to
change the way we live on aplanet.
And as we can see, you know,that the money is, is going to
more investment in renewables,um, the price of coal and oil

(13:12):
and gas is definitely, it's notbeing commercially viable
anymore.
Um, and it just, the wholesaying is change is opportunity
in disguise.
So you have to be optimistic.
Um, I think we just need tocontinue the fight as long as we
can to, to have thoseenvironmental winds, to bite us
that time that we all that wewake up.

Mm.
Um, talking about environmentalwins, um, I'm dying to get on
the topic, um, Operation Jeedara, um, I'm just completely
fascinated.
And in awe of this one, uh, canyou give us a bit of a
background for those listenersthat might not be aware of?

Yeah, well, 2015, I was in Adelaide.
I met a fellow Peter Owne, who'sthe director of the wilderness
society in south Australia.
And he said that he put a callout to many groups to try and
get them to help with, um, a bigfight he was facing, which was
BP wanting to drill for all inthe great Australian bot in
waters, deeper rougher, and moreremote than the Gulf of Mexico,

(14:14):
where they had their massiveblow out there.
Um, and also found out that lessthan six months after that big
blowout in the Gulf of Mexico,um, that the Australian
government granted leases the BPto drill for oil in the great
Australian Bight, which is just,you know, at the time, I really
didn't know much about the bite.

(14:35):
So with Mernie elder BunnaLawrie and, um, Peter Owen and
myself, we sat down and form the, um, the great Australian Bight
Alliance and formed the strategyon how we could potentially stop
BP from drilling oil there.
And, um, we really looked at, Iguess, one of the things that

(14:56):
had worked in the Kimberly,which was where we were
successful in, in many othergroups and indigenous as well,
and stopping, um, a massive gashub from going through the
middle of the world's biggesthumpback Whale nursery was to
take the Steve Erwin up thereand showcase what we would all
lose if the project went ahead.
And so in essence, we puttogether a voyage of, of

(15:21):
expedition because when we'reGoogling these places that we're
going to go to, Pearson Island,Noyts reef and St.Francis Isle
Fennel island, and there wasvery little information about
these places.
Um, and so, yeah, we basicallylaunched the campaign operation
Jeedara, and the reason we callit Jeedara was because Mirning

(15:42):
elder Bunna Lawrie.
He told us the story of thegreat white whale Jeedara, um,
which went into the greatAustralian Bight along the
waters there and breathe lifeinto the land and the sea, and
that all the Marine life thatthere in the byte, um, through
that area, go there to honor thejourney of the great white whale
Jeedara.
And what's there in the bodies.

(16:04):
It's nature on steroids.
I mean, it's one of the last bigintact Marine wilderness areas
left on the planet.
Um, you're talking deep seacanyons up welling of nutrients,
giant squid, orcas, sperm,whales, blue whales humpbacks.
One of the world's mostsignificant Southern Ryte whale
nurseries and seals, dolphins,penguins sharks, Mako sharks,

(16:25):
great white sharks.
Um, the place is trulyremarkable.
And the offshore islands, thereare places like pearson island.
They, uh, the welcoming party,there is Australian endangered
sea lions rushing out to meetyou as long nose, fur seals,
there's, you know, black footedrock Wallabees, peninsula
dragons, Cape barren, geese.
And then, you know, I've beendiving there with, um, you know,

(16:49):
the south Australian parks teamand the water.
Quality's incredible, thevisibility, and then the Marine
life there, it's just so healthyand rich, you know, Harlequin
fish and Southern blue devils.
And yeah, it's just, and youknow, when we arrived at
Pearson, which was 70 kilometersoff the coast of the air
peninsula, you, you know, youhad to wait for the right

(17:11):
conditions to land at that beachthere.
And even then it was quitetricky.
And there's such so many rockswhere there's, you know, baby,
um, seals underneath them bethat Australian sea lions or the
long nose fur seals.
And it shows that if there was aspill in the byte and the spill
modeling showed that it couldimpact much of Southern

(17:32):
Australia from Western Australiaaround new south Wales, that
places like Pearson, which areon par with the Galapagos would
be lost.
That'd

Be w we gotta, we got to put it into perspective
there as well, because as a, asa non Aussie, you know, I've
only been here three years, soI've done, uh, a lot of learning
in the last three years.
But prior to that, I knewliterally nothing about
Australia.
So there's a lot of people thatlisten to this show that are
outside Australia, and to givethem an idea of the size of the
location we're looking at, um,when BP did their, um, estimates

(18:05):
on what would occur should aspell occur.
ie how far the oil damage wouldstretch.
It's over 12,000 kilometers.
Huge 12,000 is crazy.

You're dealing with a sea straight that is the
biggest in the world.
You know, the forties, thefifties, the sixties, you know,
there's nothing betweenAustralia and Antarctica.
Yeah.
Um, and you, you're dealingwith, you know, deep seas.
Um, and there is in the Gulf ofMexico, you've got quite an
industrial area where there'splenty of other vessels and
support rigs to handle thespill, but in the great

(18:43):
Australian Byte there's nothing,there's no oil and gas there.
So if there was a blow out,there's nothing there to handle
the impact.
And you're not going to be ableto do anything about a spill
there because of the sea state,the conditions, the canyons, et
cetera.
So all you're going to be ableto do is spray dispersants
everywhere.
And when you know that thedispersants that some of them
were used in the Gulf of Mexicomade the spill 52 times more

(19:06):
toxic.
Um, so this stuff, and even BP,when they, you know, through an
FOI request that was done, foundthat, um, BP actually said that,
you know, one of the benefits,if there was a spill would be to
create jobs in the cleanupeffort.
I mean, and, and, and, and the,the NOPSEMA, actually wrote back
and said, look, I, I think youbetter take, take that bit out,

(19:28):
but, but in the end, BP pulledout.
And then the next, next cab offthe rank was Chevron.
They pulled out.
And then we had, um, Equinor,which was falling out as Statoil
a Norwegian company.
And they were the last big oiland gas company to pull out.
So there's still a number ofleases there.
We're still working on it.
Or we want to say greaterprotection for the bight.

(19:49):
And we want to say ananti-seismic in our oceans.
Um, you know, seismic is sodestructive to our marine life,
um, from plankton right throughto whales.

Do you wanna explain that to me, mate?

Yeah.
So seismic is something that isused by a lot of the oil and gas
companies to, you know, firstly,you know, blast, you know, sound
waves through, down to the oceanfloor and then get a readout so
they can see what you know,where there are oil and gas
deposits in the ocean.
But you know, a lot of the Sonicblasts and the impact of that

(20:23):
does is it has shown to actuallycause impact to cetations right
through to, to plankton.
Um, you know, we're talkingabout animals that are, you
know, it could be down, it couldbe, um, you know, sperm whales
and all sorts of other whileswhere it causes hemorrhaging in
a brain and effectively, theyjust have to get out the ocean.
And often they strand or beachthemselves and autopsies have

(20:45):
shown, you know, blood comingout frequently through there is
a and causing hemorrhaging ofthe brain.
Um, the other type of noise inour ocean is obviously, um,
sonar from our, our submarinesand, and, you know, um, Navy
operations as well.
That has a big impact oncitations as well.
There's been footage ofdocumentation of, you know, a

(21:08):
Navy vessel going through and apod of orcas just storming
towards the coast to get to getout of the water because of the
noise is just impacting them sobad, like, wow.
Um, and then there's shippingnoise as well, which, you know,
our ships all over the world andit's really, well-documented in
the film, um, uh, Sonic sea.
And it just showcases, you know,the impacts that humans have had

(21:30):
on our oceans, um, through soundbecause, you know, our world is
very much driven by sight, youknow, we're up here and we can
see as far as, as light cantravel, you know, out into the
galaxies and like air is anincredible medium, um, for lot,
um, our oceans and water is anincredible medium for sound.

(21:52):
Where blue whales used to beable to communicate with each
other from one side of theplanet to the other.
And so when you think aboutthat, that that is their way to
navigate and communicate thatwith deafening out the oceans.
And that's so sad that we'vedone that.
Um, and like, because of,because of ignorance and what
we're seeing now is that evenfishing companies like, um, you

(22:16):
know, the tuner or, or other,um, Rock lobster, et cetera,
that they're actually asking,um, you know, they're joining
forces to see inquiry's up,which just got recently, there's
an inquiry got up on seismic andoceans from Senator Peter wish
Wilson of the greens and thereason he got that inquiry
because of backing from thecommercial fishing sector,

(22:37):
because they're saying theimpacts of seismic, um, on their
fisheries as well, because it'simpacting lobsters and plankton.
And so even in some casesthey're asking to be compensated
when, uh, oil and gas companiesthat come through and done their
seismic work.
So yeah, it's, it's another canof worms that, um, we, we need
to address, I mean, best way tolook after the oceans is just

(23:00):
leave it alone.

Just talking about the bight there.
Um, I did watch the video thatgoes with operation Jeedara.
Um, in fact, I've watched itprobably six times now in the
last week.
Oh, wow.
I think it's fantastic.
Um, and I urge anyone to watchit.
The thing that I actually reallyloved about it was when the old

(23:22):
boys sat up on top of the, um,the bight looking out to see.
And we talk about, as youmentioned earlier, Jeedara being
, uh, a white whale and lo andbehold, there's a white calf
that rocks up in front of himand stays for an hour or two,
doesn't it?

Yeah.
So as I mentioned, we named thecampaign operation Jeedara and
in honor of Bunna Lawri and themirning and they're dreaming.
And when we arrive at headabight, um, which is, you know,
you can stand there at theplatform and, and count at the

(24:00):
time 50, 60 mother and calfpairs of Southern right Whales
for their carves, uh, incrediblyimportant nursing grounds there.
And often you'll even see if,you know, cause you get some big
sharks, are there huge growth,great witehs.
And they'll come in trying tolook for an opportunity to, you

(24:20):
know, grab one of the calves.
And so they've noticed that the,the mothers will actually form a
form a group and put the carvesin the middle and protect the
carves carves that way.
But Bunna Lawrie a mirningelder, was standing at the, at
the edge of the cliffs.
And he was, you know, using hisclap sticks and, and singing and
doing ceremony and welcoming theWhales Whales.

(24:43):
And because of that, thatrelationship goes back to, you
know, thousands of years to, tomillennia.
Um, and he was standing thereand he had, um, you know, a
mother come over Southern rightwhale and sit right in front of
him and a white calf, um, rightin front of him.
And so I remember standingthere, we designed the logo for

(25:04):
the campaign and I very muchwanted it to be very, um, having
an emotional feeling andconnection with it.
And so that the logo had the,you know, the Bunda cliffs,
which stretched for a hundredkilometers long, 80 to a hundred
meters, vertical turquoise oceanand Jeedara the white whale.
And I'm standing there at that,had a bite with a burning elder

(25:27):
and, you know, we've got ourt-shirts on with the logo on it
and here's a white calf right infront of us.
You know, it's just,

Its uncanny, you're stood inside your own logo?

Yeah.
And I just think it's, there's,there's too much of that that
happens, you know, for it to becoincidence.

Yeah.
Yeah.
I've got to agree.
I mean, and I'm sure there'smany divers out there as well.
I'd probably think the same as,you know, you go looking for
particular species when you wantto film them or take camera
shots or anything like that, oreven just to experience it and
those times, and I've had a fewnow where you've been in the
water and there's been quite alot of other divers.

(26:06):
And let's say for example, awhale shark or a manta Ray is
off in the distance, or evenmore recently a Mola Mola.
And you see the cavalry chargeof all the divers chasing after
it to, you know, live theexperience.
And on several occasions, justhave that little moment.
And we had thinking, oh, she'sgoing to turn left in a minute.

(26:27):
I ended up just swimming at 90degrees, um, away from everyone
and the dive guides or your divebuddies are like, you know what,
the only thing you do and it'sgoing that way and that's okay,
come this way, come this way.
And sure enough, you know, itcomes back round and you have
that moment and you can stillsee the cavalry charge,
following the whale shark as shecomes over and gives you a

(26:49):
little wink on the way past.
And it's a sensational,sensational feeling.
And it is, it's almost like thislink that you're talking about.
That's what I feel.
I feel like there's a link thereto the special moments.

Yeah.
I think animals can sense it.
You know, when, when we're, whenwe're quiet, it's a bit like
that.
They talk about great whites tocan tell when my calm and my
heart, when our heart rates areracing, you know, and, and I
think that's the same with, withnature.
They can sense how people arereacting and responding.
Um, I've been fine with diving.
I, I get frustrated being in adive group where you've, you

(27:27):
know, you're constantly on themove.
Yeah.
Now when you, I like to justsometimes sit and watch and see
what happens, you know, um, abit like, you know, being
traveling in Europe and you finda nice Plaza or plucker and just
sit there and watch the world goby and watch the day-to-day
happenings of life.
And that's the thing, you know,you're, you're a visitor in, in

(27:49):
the world, in the oceans that atsome reef or some ecosystem or
some particular area, which is anumber of animals home and
they're going about their dailylives.
And to spend some time, youknow, I'd rather spend, you know
, half an hour sitting in onespot and just watching and see
what evolves.

I quite a lot of people in Papua New Guinea do
that, especially the older,older, uh, divers that didn't
want to move around to sit himon top of the reef, four or five
meters, leave them there for anhour and a half.
They loved it.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Watch the world go by.

Yeah.
It's a beautiful thing.
And I mean, it's interesting,like you hear those stories
where, you know, someone that'slooked after elephants for, you
know, many, much of their lifeand being a caretaker for
elephant, um, you know, orphans,et cetera.
And then that particular personhas passed away.

(28:42):
And the day that they pass away,a whole group of elephants have
come back into camp and paytheir respects and no one's, you
know, sent them an SMS oranything.
And there's so many stories likethat, that they have this
connection as well, you know.

Producer - Rod (29:00):
G'day Scuba Goat listeners, rod here, producer of
the show.
I hope that you're enjoying thisepisode and that you'll
subscribed and following the podon your favorite app, please
keep an eye out for the all newScuba Goat website coming soon.
Now, back to Matt and the show.

Um, let's, let's have a look at some of the
campaigns shall we.

Lets go.

All right.
I'm just going to list them offif you want to give a bit of a
background to them and a bit ofan overview how's that?

sounds good.

Ready?
Um, Operation Dolphin Bycatch.

Yeah.
So that's led up by our Frenchdirector Lamya and she's one of
our six global directors, um, todocument what's happening with
the it's a legal fishing fleetof France, but a bycatch of
upwards of 10,000 dolphins ayear.
So showcasing well it's going onthere, which is, and even
sometimes bringing dolphincarcasses into the heart of

(29:56):
Paris to say, well, this isstill going on.
And this is the impact that, um,you know, our health, you know,
of eating seafood is having, um,we go on about Tashi and his
10,000 dolphins getting killedevery year by illegal fishery
off of our coast.
So, yeah.
And, um, even to the point wehad, um, New York times on one

(30:17):
of our ships and we had afishermen saying, oh, we never
catch them.
Cause we've got pingers in ournets.
And this particular fishermenpulled in, uh, a net, um, with
New York times on board andthere was a dolphin court in the
net.
So, so yeah, it's, um, it's beena very successful campaign and
even featured in Seaspiracy.

Yeah.
Yeah.
And, um, is this, it's still aoccuring every year, isn't it
it's not been resolved yet.

Yeah.
It's still ongoing and it'sstill gathering more and more
support from within France toput pressure on the government
to system action.
So yeah, it's still ongoing.
What

Is, what is it with, I know we're going to talk
about the other operations andcampaigns and we'll have it, but
what is it with governments?
Why can't, why can't theyactually listen?
Um, you know, from, from yourexperiences, you must have
spoken with a few of them or atleast communicated with them.
Why, why is there such, um, why,why did they avoid actually
taking action and just stop inall the crap that's going on?

I think because they, they don't like to choose
one side or the other and oftengovernments will choose industry
over NGOs and conservation.
So that's, you need to build upa campaign to the point that
it's so strong that it becomespolitical, that it's going to
be, they're going to not getcertain key people in those
seats back in the next election.

(31:39):
Um, so ultimately very fewgovernments do the right thing
as in what's what's best forhumanity and best for the
nation.
Um, because they're worriedabout the impacts on the next,
the next election.
So, and you do have, forinstance, you know, rec
fishermen and commercial fishingare very powerful voice in

(32:00):
Canberra.
And we also have an issue wherewe have, you know, political,
um, you know, corporatedonations as well.
So, you know, that's, that'sanother big, big impact that,
you know, the greens have foughtto try and stop corporate
donations at a government level,but both the library and the
liberal parties have blockedthat because I get those
donations and that, that, thatimpacts, you know, political

(32:23):
decisions as well.
So there's, there's a lot ofstuff that needs to be sorted,
um, to stop us having thesefights.

And it's someone with a bit of balls in
parliament to say enough'senough, isn't it?

Yeah.
And you know, every time thatthey have tried and, you know,
in the past, even, you know, totry and see some real action on
climate, um, then they've seencertain seats where they still
want to have a coal mine, andthey're worried about coal jobs,
et cetera, et cetera, thatthey're going to lose those,
those seats in those positions.

(32:57):
So it's sometimes politicalsuicide to do the right thing.
But then there is the fact thatthese governments and people, at
times, haven't gone into theseareas and say, look, we're going
to have these announcements.
We need to shift away from coal.
It's not good for your healthwith black lung disease.

(33:17):
It's not good on the planet, butyou're not going to be left
without a job.
We're going to transition you.
We're going to work towardsgetting you out of these, these,
these, this, this industry likeGermany have done with, you
know, closing down coal there.
So it's just a lack of, I think,um, you know, vision and, and
communication and strategy.
Um, and I think the three yearterm doesn't help as well.

Yeah.
Yeah.
So it's fear of missing out andseats and, and the money that
comes with it.

Absolutely.
Yeah.

Well, you mentioned Coal as well.
Um, I'm just looking through thelist, this, uh, operation reef
defense, that's the one to dowith the GBR, isn't it?

Yeah.
So that's the Adani coal minedown in Carmichael, coal mine,
west part of the stop AdaniAlliance, um, and effectively
where they were going to,there's still, you know, it's
being slowed up as much as wecan, but, you know, a massive
coal mine up there from Adani anIndian, um, you know, company
that, um, know muscling in, onbuilding this massive coal mine

(34:18):
and having huge ships going inand out and across the great
barrier reef.
So yeah, we, part of thatAlliance and the, the way that
that's worked is really just to,we took the Steve Erwin up the
the coast to, to raise awarenessand show support of, of that,
um, that fight.
Um, and then also, you know,with the Alliance, they've

(34:40):
working behind the scenes, tryand stop, you know, certain
companies and banks fromproviding insurance and
financial support to that.
To that project, so it'sdefinitely, you know, an ongoing
fight, but yeah, I just don'tsee how coal is commercially
viable anymore.
And it's the same with, with gasas well.

And it's, I mean, this is coal, that's just been
delivered back to India, isn'tit?
It's not, um, it's not for usehere.

Yeah, that's correct.
And I think there's quite a lotof the call was going to be used
for some, you know, producingsome, um, some plastic plant as
well to make more plastics.
So, you know, in terms of, youknow, the, you know, the energy
required as well.
So yeah, coal is just, it's justgot to go and it's, it's, it's
moving that way globally.

(35:28):
Um, but you know, Australia, ifyou measure our emissions in
terms of, you know, what also weexport and leave the country
where basically one of theworld's worst polluters per
capita and, and our action onclimate is ranking about dead
last.

I can listen to it.
I mean the size of the countryand the, the natural source of
resources we've got here withthe sunlight and, and there's so
much more that can be done.

Yeah.
We have a country that has somuch sun, so much wind and so
much resources in terms ofmining and what we could pull
out of the ground to make more,you know, batteries and
electricity.
There's all this opportunity forgrowth and jobs in the, in the
renewable sector.
Um, recently we've closed down,you know, Holden another car

(36:12):
manufacturing plants here whenwe should have been on the front
foot and transition them toelectric cars like Australians
really want to get on board andbuy electric cars, but there any
global cars come from outsideAustralia.
And as a result, they're hitwith huge luxury car taxes.
So the Australians are reallywanting to get on board with

(36:35):
this, but they let down by thegovernment.
So, and there's just all thisopportunity right here in this
country to be a leader inrenewables and, and even car
manufacturing and everything,but it doesn't get the support
because of decades and decadesof fossil fuel companies going
into Canberra with theirpolitical donations.
And then those industries aresubsidized and a huge amount.

Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, fingers crossed.
We'll get someone who could,when are you, I'll tell you what
you take his job, you sort out.

I have been approached a couple of times,
but I just feel a lot ofpoliticians end up doing, you
know, things that are, you know,so wasting so much time on areas
that, you know, dealing withslush funds and what someone's
secretary is up to and asopposed to actually doing the
work.
Um, you know, and I think that'sthe thing I like about Sea
Shepherd, but it's, you know, wecan produce real, tangible

(37:28):
results for the oceans, uh, andwe're becoming more and more
effective every day.

Indeed, indeed.
Now I did mention in myintroduction to the episode
about how you've worked withindustry to come to resolutions
before, and I think it wasduring your Ted talk, um, or it
was a video I've lost count ofhow many videos I've watched now
in the last week, but, um,there's one in particular that

(37:55):
actually struck a chord withyou.
Would it be fair to say that.

Yeah.
So we've been successful instopping whaling in the Southern
ocean and, you know, theAustralian government and New
Zealand government, uh, kudos tothem that took Japan to the
international court of justiceand found Japan as wiling to be
illegal.
Uh, any end I did pull out and,you know, over a decade of
campaigning, we saved the livesof over 6,000 whales in the

(38:23):
Southern ocean whilst century isin fact, the sanctuary for the
whales for those campaigns tookup a huge amount of time, money
and resources.
That meant we couldn't do reallyanything else.
Um, and when we got back from anAntarctic mission in March, we
were pretty much getting readytill December to get ready to go
again.
So with the end of whaling, um,we looked at illegal fishing in

(38:47):
the Southern ocean and namelythe Pentagon Antarctic tooth
fish poaching, a deep sea Codfish, which is sought after for
its white, um, oily flesh, um,very little binds, uh, otherwise
known as Chilean sea bass in therestaurants, but there was six
vessels wanted by Interpol thatwere out there, you know,
flouting the laws, um, you know,fleeing and, and, and, and able

(39:10):
to be, you know, detained andDePaul was after them.
And within a couple of days ofreaching the searching grounds,
obviously the Bob Barker captainby Peter Hammerstad found the
most notorious poacher, thethunder, um, and we notified the
thunder.
You're not supposed to be here.
You're, you're illegal.
There's an Interpol purplenotice out for you.

(39:31):
And they said, oh, we're just,we're just transitioning.
We're just passing through.
And you've just dumped all your,all your gillnets, uh, and
you're on the run.
And they, they just ran.
So the Bob Barker began to shootand our vessel, the Sam Simon,
um, they also, um, they came inand found the location of the

(39:53):
thunders gillnets and pulledthem in over about three weeks
in icy cold conditions.
And those nets stretched for 72kilometers long.

72 K.

72 K's long.

Jesus.

And, but that se chase lasted for 110 days at
sea.
And during that sea chase, um,I'd recently met the guys from
Austrial fisheries, one of thelegal two fish companies, and
they had perceptions on us andwe have perceptions on them.
They felt we were a bunch ofCowboys and just there for
media.
And they quickly learned that,hang on, you guys have reached

(40:27):
the search grounds, found themost notorious poacher, and
you're onto them.
You notifying governments, younotifying Interpol to come out
and arrest the ship.
And so I guess a bit of arelationship developed between,
David Carter, the CEO of Australfisheries and myself.
And we realized that we saw thesame key threats to the oceans
and more illegal fishing,plastics, climate, and threats

(40:50):
to vulnerable and endangeredspecies.
So David said, well, we've got avessel leaving, um, Norway on
route two more vicious.
Perhaps we might be able to join up w ith the chase.
And so one morning the thundercaptain w oke up and found two
conservation ships and anindustry ship on, on his stern.

(41:12):
And that sent a very powerfulmessage because, you know, it's
one thing for conservation shipsto be, you know, chasing
poachers on the high seas, butan industry ship that was, that
was something new.
Um, and so that sent a verypowerful message out there and,
u m, which was, which wasfantastic, you know, to see
that.
And even the words that thecaptain of, u m, the Ostral ship

(41:37):
said to the captain of thethunder were really inspiring
saying, you know, you know,we've got to look after the s
ea.
You know, you've got to stoptaking and taking a nd, and, and
do do the right thing by ourchildren.
And of tthe Thunder wasdefinitely s haken by it.
And in the end, he, he scuttledh is i n his own ship o f the p
rinciple, our n ation, south tom ine.

(41:57):
We had to rescue the crew andtook t hem into the authorities.
And the office o fficers gotthree years jail, 1 5 million
euros in fines.
But, u m, in about, in about twoyears, we had the six vessels
wanted b uy Interpol.
We're all out of action.
Um, a number we found in port,we found him in the Southern
ocean, and then we located an inport, then we notify the
authorities and they went outand detained the ships one

(42:20):
vessel, the, um, the Viking wefound in Indonesia's borders.
We notified the fisheriesminister at the time, Susie, she
sent out the Navy, detained itand then, and then subsequently
blew it up.
So, and, and those campaignsgave birth because of, because
of one of the countries thatsaid that would arrest the
thunder was Gabon.

(42:40):
If it came in its waters, those,um, yeah, those that, that chase
of the thunder gave birth todiscussions with Gabon, which
then linked to the now eightgovernment partnerships we have
in Africa, which is producingincredible results for oceans.

Yeah.
Now that's a, that's a hugeelement of sea shepherd right
now, isn't it?

Yeah.
And that's, I think, you know,Testament to Peter hammerstedt
our head of campaigns globallyand was the captain of the
sander and, you know, his, hisvision as well, um, backed up by
our global directors that, youknow, Gabon had a very small
coast guard.
They couldn't patrol theirentire 200 nautical mile eez,

(43:22):
but they had a fishing fleetoperating in their waters that
pay money to fish there, butthey never inspected some of
these vessels because theycouldn't get out there and reach
them, even though they arewelcome to, um, or, or go and,
and stop illegal fishing vesselscoming into their waters.
So we said, well, we've got theship, the mostly volunteer crew
and the fuel, and you've got theauthority, so why don't we

(43:44):
partner up?
And so in essence, we providethe tools in order for them to
make the arrests.
We also provide a trainingplatform.
We bring expertise on board, um,to be able to assist with that
training, you know, Israelidefense, um, expertise as well.
And in the end, we now they'vebeen so successful those
partnerships in Gabon.

(44:04):
Yeah.
Over four years ago, now that wehave eight government
partnerships in Africa and we'vefacilitated the arrest of, you
know, over 60 illegal fishingvessels.
Um, and in terms of tangibleoutcomes in places like Liberia,
the artesian or fishermen, theycan see the fish returning for
the first time in decades.

Literally taken the words out of my mouth.
I was going to ask that veryquestion.

Yeah.
Yeah.
And they've, and they'reactually, you know, these people
, um, live on the beaches in,tin hearts.
They have nothing else, but alivelihood to either, you know,
eight or to, you know, as theirlivelihoods to catch fish, to
sell, to get their kids toschool.
This is all these people have.

(44:46):
And they've been yelling at thegovernments for years for help
because they've had thesemassive trawlers come through
and industrial fleets runningover their wooden canoes,
sometimes killing them, evenrecent stories of Chinese fleets
coming through there and pouringpetrol on them and setting them
alight, I mean, just crazystuff.
And so to be able to help, andnot only is it great from a

(45:08):
conservation perspective andprotecting, you know, these
incredible unique Marinewilderness areas, um, but also
to, you know, the impact onlocal artesian or fishermen.
Um, the president of Liberiagave us the highest military
honor for work tackling illegalfishing there.
Um, and then also once again,just showcasing the impact that
we're seeing with illegalfishing.

(45:29):
There's such a link withlibrary, you know, much so much
of illegal fishing floats outthere, uh, their slaves on board
because the fishing fleets thathave, have traveled further and
further to get the catch,because they're fished out
waters close to the home, theycan't get their costs of their
maintenance of the ship down.
They can't get their fuel costsdown, but I can get the cost of

(45:50):
the crew down by simply notpaying them.
And if you don't like it though,throw overboard.
And then some people have beenat sea for five years and not
able to get home.

Yeah, that's crazy.
Isn't it?
It is.
But what, uh, um, you know, withwhat you're doing in Africa,
though, it's a huge deterrent aswell.
Isn't it?
So where it's been pilfered andthen just having that presence
there now of having boats in thewater that have got people on

(46:21):
board that can take action andinspect the vessels, those that
are trying to Dodge, um, thelegal routes.
Uh, I'm sure, uh, staying, uh,more vigilant in staying well
out of the way.

Yeah.
Well, I mean, it only takes ahandful of arrests and the word
gets out and even the legalones, the ones with licenses to
be there in some places havebeen leaving the entire ease it
because they don't want to be,they don't want to be inspected,
you know?
So, so there's that hugeopportunity there that you can
protect a vast area of Marineecosystem, you know, it's huge.

(47:00):
Um, you know, and David, um,David, um, it's David
Attenborough on the recent, um,a perfect planet episode five
where he neurites our work in,um, in Africa.
And he talks about how wearrested one vessel, the little
Biko two, um, which was set upto process deep, deep sea sharks
, uh, for, for shark liver oil.

(47:22):
And that vessel had the abilityto walk out of a half a million
sharks a year, and with onearrest, we're able to save that.
And, you know, David's, soDavid's talking about, you know,
the importance of sharks and ouroceans, and also that they're
healthier oceans are the morerich and bio-diverse, they are
the greatest, they stand achance in fighting against the

(47:42):
impacts of the climate, as wellas the world's greatest carbon
sink.
So it all ties in, you know,with, with, you know, the more,
you know, illegal fishingvessels that we stop.
Uh, and the breather that wegive our oceans also ties in
with the climate fight, as wellas our work in the bite and our
work, um, cleaning up a beachesaround Australia and, you know,

(48:02):
working with indigenous Rangersin Arnhem land, you know,
removing tons and tons of Marinedebris and, and nets from
critical sea turtle, nestinghabitat, and sacred country to
the young old people.

When was that?
Um, what was that huge haul ofrope you guys dragged in?
Um, so many videos now,

It wasn't, there was one, um, you probably
thinking of the one-off, um, uh,Cocus islands, where it was yeah
.
A huge look like a big Moringline, or, um, it's huge amount
of rope that was just, you know,took our team a lot of effort to
getting out of the ocean.
Um, but yeah, Cocos is, it'sbeen tough for our crew going,

(48:46):
you know, volunteers they'regetting there and, um, and
cleaning up there becausethey're just, they're just so
amazed by how much rubbish andmarine debris is washing up on
the coast.
Um, and you know, there arestill beautiful parts of Cocos
that, you know, I guess a bitsheltered from the rubbish and
still a beautiful place to goand visit.
There's still a lot of work todo to actually clean it up.

(49:06):
And a lot of that trash there iscoming from Asia.
Um, but, uh, crew, I, I spoke tothem as they were there and they
felt so in such despair becausethey're cleaning up the beaches
and some of the plastic they'repulling up, um, pulling off the
beaches, just disintegrates intheir hands.
And as they're pulling it up,cleaning it up off the beach,

(49:28):
they're looking out to sea andthey can see more just coming
and coming and coming.
And they're like, what's thepoint?
And it's like, well, you know,not fighting these fights is not
an option.
You know, you just to know whereour planet's headed and do
nothing.
That's just suicide.
We've just got to do what wecan.
And this is same mentality wehad with previous wars.

(49:51):
You know, we, we didn't go well,the opposition's too big and, um
, what's the point we just giveup no, we all fought.
And that's, I think that's thewhole message here is if there's
one thing worth fighting for onthis planet, it's it's life and
looking after the natural,natural beauty of our world, and
yeah, we've made a mess, butwe've got to start somewhere and
start cleaning it up

For sure.
Yeah.
And do you think, um, that thenew gen, the younger generations
that are coming through are muchmore aware than, um, those that
are, you know, our age andolder?
Are they more open to listen?

Oh, absolutely.
Yeah.
I'm, I'm inspired by, I thinkthe curriculum now is teaching
more kids about the naturalworld and the impacts what's
happening with plastics andclimate, et cetera, et cetera.
We have the school strikers outthere on the street calling for
action on climate.
I was part of a panel a coupleof weeks ago, talking about
climate.
I was sat next to a girl is 15years old that just took the

(50:50):
Australian government to thefederal court, um, and found
that the Australian federalenvironment minister has a duty
of care for future generations.
And so, yeah, that's, I wasnowehere near doing stuff like
that.
Um, so yeah, it's inspiring tosee where kids are at and what's
coming down the line.
And to me that gives me a lot ofhope because I think, yeah,

(51:14):
we've, we're having some greatenvironmental wins, but
environmental wins are onlytemporary, um, because you live
to fight them another day, butif we've got this younger
generation coming through and wecan hold the line and we can
bide us more time for more of usto wake up and as younger
generation voting more for theplanet, then hopefully our jobs

(51:35):
will get a lot easier in thefuture.

Operation Pahu?

Yeah.
So that's um, in New Zealand,we've got the last of the, uh,
well, I got the Mala dolphins,which are probably one of the
most endangered small dolphinsin the world.
They're incredibly important toMauri culture.
Um, then we've got, you know,all the different, other small
spaces of dolphins that arebeing impacted by fishing gear

(52:02):
and fishing nets over therecaught in the gillnets, uh, as
well.
So our team in new Zealand'sthere just trying to see what we
can do to raise awareness about,you know, if nets are being put
in the wrong place or placed inexclusion zones that are
supposed to be, you know, netfree for the local, you know,
Mauri and Hector dolphins.
So yeah, there's a lot of work,good work we're doing there.

(52:25):
It's only a small team in NewZealand.
There's no one, no one paid overthere, but they do regular beach
cleanups and do what they can.
Um, absolutely.
So, and new Zealand's obviouslyhad, uh, a lot of crew members
over the years, you know, on ourboats, standing in the Southern
ocean, defending the southernocean whale sanctuary be that
Australia and New ZealandAntarctic territory places like
the Ross sea, et cetera.

(52:46):
So, yeah, it's, um, I thinkthat's where, you know, Paul
Watson started Sea Shepherd in1977, um, you know, and it was
really, I don't think Paulexpected it to get where it's
got today was kind of get a shipand go out and find the, the,
the, um, the part whaling vesselthe Sierra, uh, the most

(53:07):
notorious poaching vessel and,um, locate that vessel and take
it out of action, um, which hedid and, you know, which was
just remarkable back in the day,what Paul did.
And I guess it's really grownfrom a save the whales movement,
um, to a save the oceansmovement.
And, um, it just gets strongerand stronger.

(53:28):
Um, it's funding is always anissue.
Like we, I think sea shepherdhistorically has been incredibly
good at delivering results, um,and probably lacks the, the
funding to, to support it.
But we're definitely somethingthat we're working on.

Yeah.
And it's ever evolving.
That's the thing.
I remember everything grows fromsomewhere and Paul started it
and look at the size of it now,where's it going to be in
another 30, 40, 50 years?

I think that's the thing with Paul is that, you
know, when I, you know, named orfacilitated the naming of the
vessels of Steve Erwin and, andI spent like two weeks and, you
know, always, you know, workingreally hard to get that, that,
um, outcome happen.
The email I got from Paul was,hi, Jeff, we have permission to

(54:18):
name the ship the Steve Erwinand we'll get right on it.
Paul and I read it and I went,oh, wow, that's amazing.
But then I'll read it again.
It was that he didn't even saythanks.
And then I understood Paul'smentality really early on as the
founder of sea shepherd.
I didn't do it for Paul.
I wasn't doing it for him.

(54:38):
I was doing it for the movementand doing it for the oceans.
And that's the thing I reallyunderstood really early on about
Sea Shepherd, but also aboutPaul is that, you know, he asked
me to, you know, be the run seashepherd in Australia back in
2008 and he's nevermicromanagement, you know, and
he's, he said that the bestthing to do with power is just

(55:02):
to give it away, you know, andthat's the way that Sea Shepherd
has been able to operate the waywe've done over the years on a
budget globally of about$15million, because it's about
imagination and passion and, um,you know, people from all over
the world, mostly volunteers, ahandful of staff globally, um,

(55:23):
and that sort of ethics andvalues, um, is from the top all
the way through like our sixglobal directors have all been
on the front line.
They've all been on the ships,be there in Antarctica, you
know, play off Africa.
They've all been on the frontline, defending our oceans.
So they've, they all come with alove of the natural world, a
deep understanding of itsecological importance and, you

(55:46):
know, a real passion for beinglean and effective.
I mean, I, I'm the managingdirector for Australia and one
of the six global directors.
And yet I run Sasha, but from adonated office desk in Fremantle
, from a company that UDL, urbandesign landscape architects,
they're passionate about what wedo.
I said, look, there's a freedesk, free coffee, free internet

(56:07):
, go for it.
And I, I love that.
I love that we can be, you know,have not have these big offices.
And, you know, when we, we meetdonors, we can say hand on
heart.
You know, that they're part ofthis, they're part of the
victories.
There is these are as much oursupporters and donors is a crew
on the front line.
And you know, we're not buildingall this capacity, um, in terms

(56:32):
of big offices and wastingdonor's money.
Yeah.

Yeah.
It's been put to good use, hasto be, um, not political seats.
Yeah.
Yeah,

Absolutely.
And it's, it's important, youknow, it's, it's important to
say hand on heart that, youknow, I wouldn't waste my time
with an organization that wasn'tdelivering tangible results and
wasn't true to its values rightdown the line.
Now ships are all plant-basedships, there's no meat, right on
products on our ships andmerchandise is all eco ethical,

(57:02):
you know, right down the line,you know, organic cottons and
dyes and no sweat shops, etcetera.
Um, and any Sea Shepherd eventalways has to be plant-based,
you know, so we followeverything right down the line.

Yeah.
Yeah.
It's good to see.
And there's plenty of, um, youknow, you talked about the
volunteers and everyone doingthat, that good bit around the
country and indeed around theworld.
Um, I see a lot of markets andmarket stalls, um, being very
active here in Australia and Ithink it's fun.
Marvelous, absolutely marvelous.

Well, these volunteers, uh, you know, they
they're, they're moms and dadsand people with lives and
they're giving up their sparetime to get up, sometimes it's
dark to pack the car, to getinto the local markets and raise
funds and awareness.
There are no commission they'renot paid, um, or they organizing
a cleanup and they get down likeclean up the beach, but then

(57:59):
they've got to go home and getall the gloves and all the tubs
and everything and wash it allout and get it, get it dried for
the next next time and do acleanup.
And these people are gettingpaid nothing.
Um, and that's when, when youthink, you know, in, in me, in
my position, I've done all thatas well, but it's also, I feel
lucky that I've done every rolein sea shepherd that we have now

(58:21):
paid in Australia.
Um, so that comes with a greatlevel of respect and
understanding and appreciationfor what they do.
But also when we have ourvolunteers out there working so
hard, um, because they know thatwe're lean in effective, but
that also keeps me honest aswell to know that there's people
out there that are giving up somuch.
So we have to be, you know, trueto our values all the way down

(58:45):
the line.

I applaud each and every one of them bravo.
Um, Jeff, I think we'll, um,we'll wrap it up for now.
Um, however, um, thank you verymuch for coming on the show.

Ah, thanks, Matt.
It was a real delight

And spending a good portion of your afternoon, sat
in your car.
haha!

Well, I'm just parked right opposite the Swan
river.
And in fact, I'm looking outover the dash.
All I can see is water.
So this is often I run throughhere on my morning run sometimes
or ride, and I've even seenbottlenose dolphins here and
I've even seen the odd bullshark in the shallows here.

(59:29):
So yeah.
Lovely, beautiful, beautiful.
It's it's a good place to live.
Um, but, uh, yeah.
Thanks Matt, for having us onthe show, man, I've really
enjoyed meeting with you andconnecting with you and, um,
yeah.
We've whatever.
However, we use the ocean foroxygen or diving or whatever.
We've got to be custodians forour occeans.

(59:50):
They are our primary lifesupport

A hundred percent.
And I openly invite Sea Shepherdrepresentative to come on the
show and tell me theirexperiences as well.
I really enjoy that.
Um, we've got a new websitecoming out soon and it all has a
small bio pages.
So for example, uh, this episodeJeff's episode, will have a

(01:00:15):
little bio on Jeff and a fewquick fire questions, but all
the links to sea shepherd andeverything we've spoken about in
the show will be in there aswell.
And the same goes for anyoneelse who comes on the show.
So put the word out in seashepherd, get them on board a
bit more than keen to have themtune in and create some more
magic

Jeff Hansen (01:00:34):
Sounds great, Matt.
I know they'd love to sign upand have a chat and uh, yeah,
we'll see where thisrelationship plays, but it's all
, it's all good.

Matt Waters (01:00:45):
Good stuff.
All exciting.
Yeah.
Oh, Hey, I'll tell you what Ididn't ask you before you go.
Um, Scuba Goat.
I keep forgetting to ask thequestion.
Um, greatest of all time dive,probably the most difficult
question you're going to getafter this year.

Hmm.
Yeah, that's that's I feel veryspoiled because of dive.
The Galapagos was my first dive,uh, which was quite remarkable.
Um, and I've, you know, I'vedone snorkeling in Tonga with
humpbacks and I've donesnorkeling in an Exmouth with,

(01:01:24):
um, whale sharks and, MantaRays, which was probably one of
the most enjoyable experiencesjust lying on the water.
I was, it wasn't diving.
I was just snorkeling, but Ihad, you know, mantas just
coming through one after theother, um, probably about 30 of
them in a feeding pattern.
And they where probably 10meters away from me at the

(01:01:45):
start.
But in the end they were rightnext to me or I had to move back
otherwise the whole gamut theywere going to hit me.
Um, I really enjoyed that, thatexperience, um, diving, I mean,
I've, I feel lucky to have divedat Pearson island.
It's such a healthy Marineenvironments, so lash, um, and
just, you know, I rememberseeing the film crew that were

(01:02:08):
trying to get some footage forNorthern pictures and filming a,
um, a piece for ABC.
And now we're trying to get allthe Australian sea lions and,
and they're all over andprobably about 20 meters away
from me.
And I just sat on the bottom andI had five or six Australian sea
lions with me.
I had, I had, um, a female justsitting on the bottom, just

(01:02:28):
looking at me, staring at me anda big male with it, with a neck
that was just so thick and hisface right in front of me.
And I just sat there and I wasjust like, how good's this
beautiful, clear water.
I was just relaxed and breathingand have these sea lions just
connecting with me.
So, yeah, that's probably my,one of my favorite experiences,

(01:02:52):
um, diving.
Absolutely.
It's pretty remarkable stuff of,of a place that very few
Australians know about.
And I think that's where youmentioned about the bight I've
shown footage of the bight toAustralians and people in
Hollywood, um, and Australianshave going, how did I not know
about this place?
So yeah, there's people thatdon't know

There's two sides to it as well.
Isn't that you want to telleveryone and show them how
amazing it is, but at the sametime, nah, let's keep it a nice
little secret.
It's beautiful.
It's absolutely amazing.
I'm going to head down therenext year.

Oh, you got to do it.
And I think that's the thing,like there's, there's an element
where you want to try and keepthings quiet, but when that's
sometimes while big industrytakes advantage of that, if it's
remote and there's few people,so then you're kind of left with
the story.
You've got to tell the story ofwhat and, and bring, bring these
places into the land rooms ofpeople all over the world to

(01:03:49):
join the fight.

Yeah.
And that's it.
I mean, if they, if there'speople out there listening to
this podcast and they're notinvolved in sea shepherd and
they have a genuine passion forwhat we've been talking about,
get involved, just get onto seashepherd, represent, get
involved.
There's always something you canhelp with.

Yeah.
Plenty of things.
And even people that think,well, I can't be on a ship and
you might be even someone that,you know, can't get out there
and do much physical work.
There's always something thatpeople can do.
Yeah, for sure.

For sure.
And then those that were thelottery, they can give us a load
of money.

We'll put it to good use.

Jeff again, thank you very much for coming on the
show and I appreciate itimmensely.
Um, have a good afternoon and uh, we'll speak again soon.

You too, Matt.
Thanks again.
Um, really enjoyed our chat.

Thanks man.
Bye-bye everybody podcast forthe inquisitive diver.

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Jeff Hansen - Sea Shepherd Global Director - S02 E06

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Jeff Hansen - Sea Shepherd Global Director - S02 E06