September 28, 2024 • 25 mins
Get ready to uncover the transformative world of 5G technology with Ian Ross, the visionary head of private cellular networks for Australia and New Zealand at Ericsson. Imagine how industries are evolving with the shift from outdated copper cables to state-of-the-art 5G networks. Ian shares his impressive journey in the ICT industry, highlighting Ericsson's monumental role from the advent of 1G to the current 5G revolution, and how data consumption patterns have been radically reshaped by these technological strides.
Curious about private cellular networks? Ian expertly breaks down how these networks differ from public carrier offerings, catering specifically to the unique needs of enterprises. You'll learn about the myriad benefits these networks offer, from operational independence and enhanced security to tailored performance. Discover why companies are choosing private networks for reasons such as remote area coverage and critical uptime needs, and how 5G devices are creating more cost-efficient and flexible solutions, especially in industrial settings.
Looking ahead, the future of industry connectivity is nothing short of astonishing. Envision automated trucks, drones conducting shore inspections, and UAVs examining vessel propellers—all possible through reliable 5G connectivity. With advanced data and video analytics, industries are pushing the boundaries of innovation. Tune in to hear Ian discuss phenomenal real-world examples and how forward-thinking strategies are paving the way for a connected future that promises unprecedented efficiency and creativity.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Michael van Rooyen (00:00):
My guest today was so interesting that we
had to break it into two parts.
Here is part one of thatinterview.
Ian Ross (00:07):
I think we are going to get to the point where we're
going to look at the cost ofputting a modem connected to a
5G network is less than droppinga copper cable.
Michael van Rooyen (00:17):
Today I have the pleasure in having a chat
with Ian Ross, who's the head ofprivate cellular networks for
Australia and New Zealand atEricsson.
I'm a big fan of LTE and Ithink we in Australia haven't
seen the full force of LTE beingadopted by customers, and
today's going to be a veryinteresting conversation with
Ian, who basically lives andbreathes the space.
Ian, welcome.
Thank you, g'day.
How are you?
I'm very well, very well.
Thanks for meeting me today incold Melbourne.
(00:38):
I know you've been traveling abit all over the world, but I've
flown in today and it'scertainly colder than I expected
.
Ian Ross (00:44):
Yeah, we agreed as well.
Michael van Rooyen (00:49):
Thank you.
Thank you For those who arelistening.
Before we get started, do youmind just sharing a little bit
about your background in theindustry technology or other
background and what led you toyour role as head of
profitability at Ericsson forANZ?
Ian Ross (00:57):
Yeah, look, absolutely .
Someone described it the otherday similar vintage as me.
I'd been in the industry for aquarter of a century and that
was a bit of a concern whenpeople start talking about their
careers in centuries.
But look, it's a longestablished career in ICT,
worked with many vendors andintegrators over the time, a
range of different technologies,but I've always been at the
forefront of new tech andparticularly how it's applied to
(01:18):
enterprise to create value andto drive innovation.
My career evolved into bringingnew technologies to market and
trying to bring new service tomarket and monetize them, and I
found myself in an area where myskill set and interests really
revolved around technologymarket development, recruiting
channels, recruiting customersand driving that new step
(01:39):
forward.
So 10 years ago I found myselfasked to rejoin a tier one
global vendor.
They had a mobile core that wasselling successfully to
carriers around the world, but amining house had decided to
build a private LTE network andhas shown the world that mobile
technology is just not forcarriers, it's for enterprises.
So I took the opportunity andsuddenly found myself immersed
(02:00):
in the area of industry All newuse cases, new problems, new,
exciting things.
It's been an absolute ride,just not dealing with the
traditional ICT problems.
You're dealing with OT buyerssolving operational issues.
The opportunity came up atEricsson.
Ericsson was looking at takingtheir mobile leadership and
moving it into enterprise.
They'd had a few goes at itpreviously but were really
(02:21):
starting to double down, and soit was a great opportunity to
look at Ericsson's leadership in4G and 5G my background
enterprise and really start tosee what this market could do
with potential.
Wow.
Michael van Rooyen (02:31):
Private seller for Ericsson Private
seller and, as you said, youtouched on a great point there,
which is LT has always beenestablished by the carriers and,
of course, particularlyAustralia.
It's been locked up mainly bythe carriers for, obviously,
customers and population use.
And then being able to use itin a private format is probably
what people don't understand orhave never thought about.
People are certainly not in theindustry.
It would have been interestingto see how that first customer
(02:54):
did that.
There would have been a lot ofconcerns and problems.
But I mean, look how well thenetworks are working for us
everyday users and if I thinkabout the ability to continue to
deliver those services, as Isaid at the beginning, there I
don't think we've seen thetipping point of of how much we
can do with this technology andof course, for some people who
are listening, because whilstwe're you're talking in half
decades or quarter decades, Ishould say sorry is some of our
(03:15):
listeners probably don't knowerickson.
Obviously some of us will dofrom the, the old tedium days
and and core, but people justuse their phone, they don't
think about the back end.
Yeah, and of course ericssonhas such a long history in
carriage and telecommunicationsetc.
Well, I think we've been inaustralia for 134 years, oh wow
yeah it's funny enterprise.
Ian Ross (03:33):
People don't really know who we are and what we do.
The the technology providerbehind their mobile networks.
You know 1g, 2g, 3g, 4g and now5g, but they keep thinking of
us as son Ericsson, the maker ofmobile phones, of course.
So once you get over that, it'slike, yeah, we actually do
design and manufacture all themobile equipment that runs
mobile networks in this country.
(03:54):
You can't make a mobile call inAustralia without it going
through Ericsson technologysomewhere.
Wow, so it's, yeah, it's thehidden achiever.
Michael van Rooyen (04:02):
Obviously you work with carriers and
certainly Heritage has been inthat space and working with
PrivateLT specifically.
Can you give us some insightson the data consumption?
Are you seeing this 10 times,20 times, 30 times, over the
time you've been seeing this?
Is this just a huge trajectoryof data consumption?
Yeah, it just keepsskyrocketing.
Ian Ross (04:19):
I think everyone's always spoken about the internet
fueling massive data growth,but it's just been moving
dramatically to mobile.
Over the last few years thegrowth in the transition from 4g
to 5g has been astronomicaljust not for us, but also for
the industry, you know.
I think we've seen rates ofgrowth four times what they were
with 4g.
We're hearing stories aroundnetworks around the world
building up and adding usersfaster than any technology
(04:41):
before, so it's a definitelyexciting area?
Michael van Rooyen (04:43):
Look, it certainly is, and I guess off
that the space has rapidlyevolved.
As you said, we started kind of1.2, gprs and all these things
and you've been through all thelife cycles, and then there's
this rapid adoption of 4Kstreaming video.
Everyone wants to connect tothese Apple Vision, that'll be
the long-term play, all thishigh-speed stuff.
And with that evolvement, whatare you seeing as the most
significant trends in the sector?
Ian Ross (05:05):
Look to me and look it might be a biased view, but I
actually think the mostsignificant trend has been 5G
for industry.
When we think about mobility,we think about 5G.
We think about mobile towers,we think about phones and
tablets and watches.
But when you move beyond thatconsumer view of the world and
we start to think around, well,what can 5G really do?
(05:26):
5g has been designed formassive scale and
machine-to-machine communication, so it's really been designed
for industry.
And that's when we see the 5Gpotential of 10 to 100 times
increase in speed, the abilityto connect a thousand times more
devices being five times moreresponsive, driving automation,
digitizing things, improvingsafety, driving productivity,
(05:46):
improving efficiency, makingbusinesses in Australia a
greater comparative advantage onthe global scale, and I think
that's the real big change thatis being driven by mobility
Right.
Michael van Rooyen (05:58):
So people have been always saying the
mobile phone is the thing theythink about in the G space let's
call it that.
But 5G was really, as you said,built for industry.
I was interesting talking tothe guys at Cisco the other day
and they have theirobservability platform and
they're talking about howthey're working, even in that
space, to do observability fromcars and, of course, new
connectivity.
But on that, are businesses asyet getting the transformation
(06:21):
that will give them and what aresome of the other key benefits
that organizations could get outof it from an enterprise point
of view, I see manyorganizations at various stages
in their digitalization journeys.
Ian Ross (06:32):
Some of them are completely involved in
automation and radicallychanging how they conduct
themselves.
Others are simply trying toconnect workers better and
provide a better qualityconnectivity.
And I think as organizations goon this journey, they start to
realize there's more and moredifferent things they want to
connect.
And as businesses digitalizemore devices, they're moving
more data.
That data is more critical today-to-day operations.
It's not sending emails, it'scontrolling a production system,
(06:55):
it's responsible forenvironmental outcomes or for
safety control, and that dataultimately has to be lower
latency.
So I think organizations, asthey move through their
digitalisation, are starting torealise that the tools they've
had at their fingertipspreviously aren't as capable to
handle this new frontier they'redriving towards as they were
previously.
(07:16):
We're seeing Wi-Fi as a greattechnology, but when you start
to put multiple applications onWi-Fi or you want to start to
provide pervasive connectivityoptions across a wider area, it
becomes a very expensivetechnology to roll out at scale
and what we've seen in the fieldit becomes somewhat
unpredictable under load.
So if you're looking at acritical control system or a
(07:36):
monitoring system, somethingthat just not observes but
controls, you need a high levelof deterministic performance.
You need that predictability.
You need that throughput.
Rolling out computer vision andAI takes a huge amount of
uplink throughput.
When we look at SCADA and othersystems, everything now is
about massive sensor scale anddigital twins.
I speak to oil and gascompanies.
(07:57):
They have a vision of half amillion sensors on an offshore
platform.
Michael van Rooyen (08:01):
Half a million, half a million On one
of those offshore plants out inthe middle of the sea, basically
if it has a temperature, if itvibrates or makes a noise.
Ian Ross (08:10):
they want to be able to put a sensor on it and bring
it back to a digital twin fortheir simulation.
Wow, Now, that's aspirational.
That requires an order ofmagnitude change in the cost of
these sensors, but that's wherethe industries are going.
Michael van Rooyen (08:20):
Right, wow, wow, half a million sensors.
That's incredible, and thatjust goes to show the power of
it again, right?
I mean, if you're trying todeliver that as a Wi-Fi, nothing
wrong with Wi-Fi.
As you said, it's been aroundfor a long time, it's serving
its purpose.
Ian Ross (08:31):
It's a great technology, it's accessible,
it's well understood, but as thenetworks get more and more
complex and more demanding, thefundamentals of the technology
can't keep up.
Yeah, of course, and that'swhere we see mobility and these
3 all your technologies reallycoming to the fray.
Because don't think of it as anetwork, think of it as a
technology, and it helpsbusinesses start to realize
(08:52):
these advanced use cases thatare invariably wireless.
If you're looking at drones orremote control equipment or even
connected tightening tools,this is what we're seeing a huge
level of adoption in Europe andthe US.
Screwdrivers they're connectedvia 5G.
Wow Right, they self-calibrate,they provide full traceability,
(09:13):
but they need connections, ofcourse, and they struggle when
you're over traditional wirelesstechnology, yeah, and that's a
good point.
Michael van Rooyen (09:20):
So if I think about taking the
traditional RF and I'll talk802.11, so traditional wireless
that people are used to tryingto deliver, half a million
sensors is just not going to besustainable power, a number of
access points network to supportthat, as opposed to being
delivered by cellular.
Which leads on to a really goodpoint Everyone's familiar with
and I guess it's important forpeople listening LT.
(09:40):
They go to a carrier, they buya service, they buy a SIM card
and they pay for data and dataplans are getting better.
But just so we can just walkthrough this a bit more, so
people can understand your rolereally as private seller there,
do you mind explaining whatprivate LTE is and how it
differs from public networks?
I know technically it's notthat different, but just for
people listening, so we get thatcontext of this and what the
(10:01):
main advantages are forenterprise.
Yeah, look absolutely so.
Ian Ross (10:04):
I said before, when we think about cellular
technologies, don't think aboutit as a network.
I said before, when we thinkabout cellular technologies,
don't think about it as anetwork, think of it as a
technology, a wirelesstechnology.
So private cellular networksthey're dedicated, site-specific
networks that use cellulartechnology but for the purposes
of a single business, for anenterprise.
So you think of a carriernetwork.
You'll have cell towers acrossa landscape.
(10:25):
They'll have the network coreproviding voice services and SMS
and the sorts of things we useday to day, and we as consumers
buy them.
We buy a SIM card, we subscribeto our monthly plan.
A private selling network usesthe same technology but it's
really shrunk down to be rightsize for industry.
It's an enterprise that, withintheir boundaries, has their own
(10:45):
radio spectrum that theytransmit on.
They have their own radiotowers and radio sites and these
could be large towers, theycould be on ceilings inside a
warehouse, they could be onlight poles across a port.
They have their own networkcore, not as big as running a
nation's network, but they havetheir own cell network core that
sits in their comms room onsite and then connects to their
(11:06):
secure application workloads intheir data centre and they're
responsible for running theinfrastructure.
So they own it, they operate it, they control access.
They have their own SIM cardswith their own network codes,
their own encryption keys.
They become their own carriers.
There's multiple triggers to whythey would look at a private
network.
Sometimes it is they need anetwork in a remote area where
(11:26):
no public network exists.
So are you going to extend apublic network or are you going
to build your own?
In some situations it's arounddesign requirements that the
technologies are rolling out.
The applications they're usingmay need to have coverage in
very deep and dark areas oftheir facility and the public
network doesn't go there.
Or they might have a criticaluptime need.
They want to design for five orsix nines uptime and you're not
(11:49):
going to get that as an SLAfrom a carrier network.
They might have operationalneeds that they want to control
maintenance and upgrades intheir time, on their scale, or
if they just simply wantoperational independence.
The important thing with privatenetworks is they're air-gapped
from the public network, sowhatever happens in the public
network doesn't impact theprivate network.
These networks are allsometimes used for performance,
(12:10):
and we see this particularly inautomation, where you'll have
particular applications thatneed a certain level of
throughput or a certain level ofpacket loss, automation and
remote control, and those levelsof performance simply
unavailable as a public servicewhere they can be guaranteed but
you can design for them in aprivate network.
And I think, the final areasaround security.
(12:31):
The enterprise wants to controlemphatically who accesses the
network, who has the rights toconnect their devices, what
devices can connect, or simplyto ensure that all data remains
on site and nothing leaves.
Many organizations say look, Ihave a critical data flow, I do
not want to leave my premises,so I want to be able to connect
it via wireless, connect it toapplications in my data center
(12:53):
and not have it go out to apublic network.
So many different scenarios andreasons why businesses look
towards private cellular.
There is no one reason.
Michael van Rooyen (13:03):
I mean, as you just ran through there, it
ticks so many boxes.
I'm happy you touched on thesecurity aspect, right, because
inherently people again in thetag of wireless people think oh
well, there's some securityvulnerabilities.
And you touched about securingwhat's connected in their work.
When we think about from an802.11 point of view, there's
quite a bit of work and I thinkthe industry is going to do a
bit of work in theauthentication space and that's
that traditional radiusauthentication but that's more
(13:24):
device authentication Withcellular.
Even the way it's built fromthe foundations it's secure
inherently from the start.
I guess on the flip side ofthat is the devices you talk
about connector screwdrivers andothers are they relatively cost
effective?
Is there a balance on the otherend of the scale?
Ian Ross (13:41):
It does change with time.
What we do see in this space,particularly with industrial
devices, that quite oftenthey're engineered to a level of
standard above consumer, sothey appear expensive.
That quite often they'reengineered to a level of
standard above consumer, so theyappear expensive, but you don't
have your mobile phoneoperating up to 85 degrees 2G
vibration, right.
So that level of engineeringdesign does bring an element of
price premium.
But we do see with all mobiletechnologies that it does ride a
(14:03):
cost reduction curve over timeand we see an expanding
ecosystem of 5G devices enteringthe market for industrial
applications.
But there's also differentstandards of devices.
So there's the high-end,high-performance devices that
are designed to deliver gigabitsworth of performance.
Then we're moving into your IoTdevices and your reduced
(14:24):
capability devices that arecoming out for 5G and they're
really going to drive thatsensor sort of evolution.
Are we going to get down to thepoint where the 500,000 sensor
vision is going to be aneconomic reality?
I'll remain an informed skepticon that one.
Fair enough, but I think we aregoing to get to the point where
we're going to look at the costof putting a modem connected to
(14:45):
a 5G network is less thandropping a copper cable and
that's actually what's drivingthe evolution in the US in
manufacturing that organizationslook at the reconfiguration of
their production lines or theirfacilities.
They look at the number ofcable drops they need to do.
They have a number of around$1,000 US per drop and they
start to realize that a fewhundred dollars spent on a small
modem plugged into accessiblepower.
(15:06):
It becomes a very dynamic, veryflexible, very agile form of
connecting anything.
Michael van Rooyen (15:13):
Wow, if I think about manufacturing, car
manufacturing alone the way theyreconfigure the factories to
build different cars.
We just see cars come out ofthe factory but they have the
process of retooling that kindof factory to run 20,000 of this
car, then they retool it andthat all comes at a cost.
And if I think about evenstorage facilities,
reconfiguring storage foroptimization there's always
these plans for logistics Offthat.
So there's plenty of reasons todo private cellular many, many
(15:35):
benefits for the customer.
On the other side, what aresome of the biggest challenges
organized face when they deployprivate LTE or 5G networks and
how can they overcome these?
Ian Ross (15:45):
Yeah, look.
I think the biggest challengehas probably been around the
complexity of these solutions.
Historically, the advantage ofWi-Fi is it's been seen as a
simple technology.
Lots of people understand it.
It's very familiar, wellunderstood when we start talking
about 3GPP and differentacronyms and different
approaches and what isultimately a technology that's
been designed for national scaleand security.
(16:06):
It is a more complex andinvolved technology.
Many of the early leaders inthis space have struggled to get
that expertise into theirbusiness and retain that
expertise.
The way that what's happenedwith the industry over the last
couple of years is, I thinkwe've realised that the target
end users of these technologiesaren't experienced
communications technicians likeyou have on a mine site.
(16:26):
They are pulling cables on afactory floor or in a warehouse.
In many instances the businessdoesn't even have IT
capabilities in-house.
It's all outsourced.
So what we've done as Ericssonand, I think, as a general
industry trend, is there's beena lot of work in taking the
advantages and the innovationsthat 5G technology has and bring
(16:47):
them to enterprise, so thatcomplexity that has plagued
these systems previously has nowbeen replaced by systems that
are highly automated.
So we're using orchestrationtechnologies to automate the
configuration deployment.
We're using automationtechnologies to simplify the
ongoing lifecycle management.
So now a multi-element private5G network is as simple to
(17:10):
upgrade as applying a newversion of iOS to your mobile
phone.
It's pushed out to the network,you schedule it, it schedules
the upgrade, it's all touchless.
I think a lot of the work inthe industry, and particularly
where Ericsson's been focusing,is to make this incredibly
powerful technology much easierfor enterprises to adopt and to
use day-to-day.
Michael van Rooyen (17:30):
Absolutely Knowing the challenges we've had
in that space.
You just touched on a goodpoint about upgrading similar to
an iOS upgrade.
If I think about the challengesand I won't name the vendors,
but the challenge of aligningbackend infrastructure to
firmwares, to new devices it'sactually quite a complex
challenge.
I'm impriming that someonesomewhere thinks oh well,
they'll just replace everythingin one go or the lifestyle.
(17:51):
We know the practicalities.
You and I have spoken a bit inthe past, but one of the biggest
things that always stands outwith private cellular and
cellular as a whole is reallythe frequency or the spectrum
that's available.
That's the biggest challengefor us right in this area.
Ian Ross (18:05):
Yeah, it is, and it's a challenge, but it's also one
of the biggest advantages.
Fair enough, what really isgreat about Private Cellular is
it operates in licensed spectrumbands.
Where you have Wi-Fi, that is,in shared spectrum, you can't
control what access points arebroadcasting.
Where, in a cellular world, youhave to transmit with a license
from a regulator.
And so the ACMA in Australia,which means it's your own little
(18:28):
patch of radio spectrum in yourarea.
No one else can use it and ifthey do, you have a recourse
through the TelecommunicationsAct.
So it does add to that securitymessage that if you're starting
to put more and moredigitalization strategy onto a
wireless technology with Wi-Fi,you don't really know if it's
going to be there tomorrow interms of interference and
performance.
Where cellular technology youdo have that certainty.
(18:50):
But to do that you do need aspectrum license and this is why
globally, and particularly inAustralia, we've seen that the
early adopters of this weremining houses and oil and gas
companies.
They have operations inrelatively remote areas where
they're unpopulations.
There is a lot of demand forspectrum, so there is spectrum
free for them to be able toacquire a license to run their
networks Right.
(19:11):
Okay, the ACMA, I think is beingquite forward in what they've
seen the use of thesetechnologies in Australia and
over the last 12 months, openingup spectrum licenses for
enterprises at different areas.
I think last year they openedup a huge amount of spectrum in
the 5G bands that enterprisescan apply for.
They don't need billions ofdollars to do it, You're buying
it in like 1.8 by 1.8 kilometerblocks.
(19:33):
That was for remote Australiaand they're in the process of
allocating to metro and regionalareas.
So once that allocation processis complete then it will move
to what's called anover-the-counter regime.
So if you're an organizationwanting to explore private
cellular, you can now engage athird-party coordination company
.
They can work out what spectrumyou need and then make an
(19:55):
application to the ACMA and ifthe spectrum's available,
they'll send you a small taxinvoice and once you pay that
tax invoice, the spectrum'syours, oh right, and is there a
timeline on that spectrum?
Typically pay for it annually.
It's called area-wide licensing.
You buy these blocks based onwhat you're trying to do with it
.
It's quite flexible.
It's been designed to bemulti-technology.
Yes it works in the 5G bands,but you don't need to use it for
(20:17):
5G.
I have to represent Ericssonand say we'd love you to use it
for 5G everywhere, Of course,but yes, no it's an annual
license renewal.
Michael van Rooyen (20:26):
Look, that's clever, right.
I mean, at the end of the day,the technology is there.
Obviously the biggest inhibitorwas spectrum that are processed
so you can, as you said, havesecurity, have your own
frequency, know that no one'sgoing to interfere with you.
Because you want that lowlatency, you want that
reliability, knowing that youobviously talk to your global
counterparts.
Is this something that overseashave done for a while, like the
us?
Europe and australia is justnot playing catch-up but really
(20:47):
saying, okay, this does work andwhat we need to do to support
the country.
Ian Ross (20:50):
Yeah, it's funny.
I think it's positionedAustralia as one of the leaders
in this space.
Okay, wow, the mining housethat triggered all this, at
least from my little lens of theworld, was Australian-based
Right.
But what we have seen is inother markets around the world
where industry spectrum has beenmore widely available, so they
probably leapfrogged Australia alittle bit in terms of spectrum
access.
We've seen these networks takeoff.
(21:11):
So in Japan, in France, germany, in the US, with the Citizens
Broadband Radio Spectrum, cbrs,it's democratised access to
spectrum and has opened up awhole range of organisations.
So we see verticals that arereally resonating around
manufacturing.
Manufacturing is not cars andwhite goods.
Manufacturing, I think, is thefourth largest vertical, very
(21:31):
big in food and beverage,pharmaceuticals, minerals and
tobacco.
The example you gave beforearound reconfiguring car
production lines food andbeverage production lines get
reconfigured at a far moreaccelerated rate because we're
quite fickle as consumers, right, we don't want to buy the same
flavor of Tim Tams.
Michael van Rooyen (21:49):
We always need something different, right.
Ian Ross (21:50):
So we see manufacturing oil buy the same
flavour of Tim Tams.
We always need somethingdifferent, right?
So we see manufacturing oil andgas offshore, offshore
refineries mining is a givenUtilities.
Wind farms actually are a veryinteresting area, particularly
on offshore wind farms, becauseit's pretty dangerous to go
perform inspection and serviceon those turbines, of course.
So they're looking at coveragefor safety, but also for drones
(22:11):
for remote inspection.
Michael van Rooyen (22:12):
That's cool.
That's cool.
So many use cases.
Ian Ross (22:15):
Everything's automating in container ports,
particularly as a means ofcompetition.
So in Europe we see that allthe countries and all the major
ports are so close together.
It's all around.
How do you move as many tierusers you can as quickly as
possible?
These sorts of networks arebeing used to drive automation
there.
The idea is consistentconnectivity throughout the
entire facility, not patchy.
So people look to 5G for thatand I think, more locally, we
(22:38):
see agribusiness as aninteresting area.
Agriculture is quite advancedin terms of digitalization but
also quite limited in terms ofaccess.
Like all industries, they'relooking at connecting, securing,
deploying the technologies.
Michael van Rooyen (22:51):
That's fascinating.
That's fascinating.
Touching on some of thoseexamples, and I bet a lot of
people wouldn't have thoughtthose four different industries
are really straight business.
Everyone thinks of mining, butthere's interesting data points
you give there and otherindustries Off that, without
naming any customers.
Can you give examples of usecases where a business has
successfully, or an enterprisehas successfully delivered LTE
(23:12):
and what the impact was to theiroperations?
Ian Ross (23:14):
Yeah, look, there's a few.
There's a food and beverageprovider in Brazil.
It's actually a public case, sowe'll just call it out by name
Sure.
On their KitKat production line.
They saw the need to drivedigital quality.
So they rolled out what werecalled hyperspectral cameras.
These are cameras that seebeyond the visible spectrum and
they're using them to detectmissing wafers in KitKats what?
(23:34):
So?
I'm pretty disappointed when Imiss a wafer.
So it's good that they're doingthis.
But those cameras generate agigabit per second of throughput
.
So they roll a cameratechnology out on a food and
beverage production line withoutpulling cables everywhere, and
probably that capacity we can'tExactly.
And then they're using it forAGVs, so they're autonomous
guided vehicles to supply thestock in and out.
(23:56):
They need 50 millisecondlatency Again.
So you've got a device that'smobile, needs to remain
connected, needs low latency inthat connection.
And this is where cellulartechnology comes in, because if
you don't meet that 50millisecond target, then things
stop.
So that's a great example.
There's a port customer of oursin the UK that has decided to
automate all their boom gates.
(24:17):
So rather than having securityguards at every single entry
point in the port, they nowbrought it back to a single
security operations center.
All the boom gates areautomated, but as the trucks of
the containers enter and leavethe port, they're using cameras
and computer vision to read theserial number of the containers,
to create a real-time manifestof all the containers in the
(24:37):
port.
Wow, but those cameras are alsosurveying the containers and
doing a damage assessment.
So now they can determine if acontainer is all banged up when
it leaves the port.
Is it a result of treatment inthe port or was it banged up
when?
Michael van Rooyen (24:47):
it came in.
Ian Ross (24:48):
Wow.
So some great examples there ofjust different industries.
One of our clients has got aroadmap of new initiatives that
will take them out to 2030.
People don't normally thinkthat far out.
No, they're just looking ateverything.
It's a little bit of crystalball on science fiction towards
the 2030 end, but they'relooking at remote control trucks
moving to automated trucks anddrones doing shore inspection
(25:09):
and UAVs doing propellerinspections of vessels.
Once you have the ability toaccess virtually unlimited,
pervasive, dependableconnectivity, you can start to
exercise your imagination.
Michael van Rooyen (25:20):
I mean, just give me two customer examples
that are phenomenal.
I'll be making sure one of myKitKats now check for the wafers
Hopefully they're from Braziland that data analytics, that
video analytics right, that'swhat's driving this right.
It's just impressive.
I hope you enjoyed part one ofmy discussion with Ian Ross.
Listen in next week for parttwo.
My guest today was so interesting that we
had to break it into two parts.
Here is part one of thatinterview.
Ian Ross (00:07):
I think we are going to get to the point where we're
going to look at the cost ofputting a modem connected to a
5G network is less than droppinga copper cable.
Michael van Rooyen (00:17):
Today I have the pleasure in having a chat
with Ian Ross, who's the head ofprivate cellular networks for
Australia and New Zealand atEricsson.
I'm a big fan of LTE and Ithink we in Australia haven't
seen the full force of LTE beingadopted by customers, and
today's going to be a veryinteresting conversation with
Ian, who basically lives andbreathes the space.
Ian, welcome.
Thank you, g'day.
How are you?
I'm very well, very well.
Thanks for meeting me today incold Melbourne.
(00:38):
I know you've been traveling abit all over the world, but I've
flown in today and it'scertainly colder than I expected
.
Ian Ross (00:44):
Yeah, we agreed as well.
Michael van Rooyen (00:49):
Thank you.
Thank you For those who arelistening.
Before we get started, do youmind just sharing a little bit
about your background in theindustry technology or other
background and what led you toyour role as head of
profitability at Ericsson forANZ?
Ian Ross (00:57):
Yeah, look, absolutely .
Someone described it the otherday similar vintage as me.
I'd been in the industry for aquarter of a century and that
was a bit of a concern whenpeople start talking about their
careers in centuries.
But look, it's a longestablished career in ICT,
worked with many vendors andintegrators over the time, a
range of different technologies,but I've always been at the
forefront of new tech andparticularly how it's applied to
(01:18):
enterprise to create value andto drive innovation.
My career evolved into bringingnew technologies to market and
trying to bring new service tomarket and monetize them, and I
found myself in an area where myskill set and interests really
revolved around technologymarket development, recruiting
channels, recruiting customersand driving that new step
(01:39):
forward.
So 10 years ago I found myselfasked to rejoin a tier one
global vendor.
They had a mobile core that wasselling successfully to
carriers around the world, but amining house had decided to
build a private LTE network andhas shown the world that mobile
technology is just not forcarriers, it's for enterprises.
So I took the opportunity andsuddenly found myself immersed
(02:00):
in the area of industry All newuse cases, new problems, new,
exciting things.
It's been an absolute ride,just not dealing with the
traditional ICT problems.
You're dealing with OT buyerssolving operational issues.
The opportunity came up atEricsson.
Ericsson was looking at takingtheir mobile leadership and
moving it into enterprise.
They'd had a few goes at itpreviously but were really
(02:21):
starting to double down, and soit was a great opportunity to
look at Ericsson's leadership in4G and 5G my background
enterprise and really start tosee what this market could do
with potential.
Wow.
Michael van Rooyen (02:31):
Private seller for Ericsson Private
seller and, as you said, youtouched on a great point there,
which is LT has always beenestablished by the carriers and,
of course, particularlyAustralia.
It's been locked up mainly bythe carriers for, obviously,
customers and population use.
And then being able to use itin a private format is probably
what people don't understand orhave never thought about.
People are certainly not in theindustry.
It would have been interestingto see how that first customer
(02:54):
did that.
There would have been a lot ofconcerns and problems.
But I mean, look how well thenetworks are working for us
everyday users and if I thinkabout the ability to continue to
deliver those services, as Isaid at the beginning, there I
don't think we've seen thetipping point of of how much we
can do with this technology andof course, for some people who
are listening, because whilstwe're you're talking in half
decades or quarter decades, Ishould say sorry is some of our
(03:15):
listeners probably don't knowerickson.
Obviously some of us will dofrom the, the old tedium days
and and core, but people justuse their phone, they don't
think about the back end.
Yeah, and of course ericssonhas such a long history in
carriage and telecommunicationsetc.
Well, I think we've been inaustralia for 134 years, oh wow
yeah it's funny enterprise.
Ian Ross (03:33):
People don't really know who we are and what we do.
The the technology providerbehind their mobile networks.
You know 1g, 2g, 3g, 4g and now5g, but they keep thinking of
us as son Ericsson, the maker ofmobile phones, of course.
So once you get over that, it'slike, yeah, we actually do
design and manufacture all themobile equipment that runs
mobile networks in this country.
(03:54):
You can't make a mobile call inAustralia without it going
through Ericsson technologysomewhere.
Wow, so it's, yeah, it's thehidden achiever.
Michael van Rooyen (04:02):
Obviously you work with carriers and
certainly Heritage has been inthat space and working with
PrivateLT specifically.
Can you give us some insightson the data consumption?
Are you seeing this 10 times,20 times, 30 times, over the
time you've been seeing this?
Is this just a huge trajectoryof data consumption?
Yeah, it just keepsskyrocketing.
Ian Ross (04:19):
I think everyone's always spoken about the internet
fueling massive data growth,but it's just been moving
dramatically to mobile.
Over the last few years thegrowth in the transition from 4g
to 5g has been astronomicaljust not for us, but also for
the industry, you know.
I think we've seen rates ofgrowth four times what they were
with 4g.
We're hearing stories aroundnetworks around the world
building up and adding usersfaster than any technology
(04:41):
before, so it's a definitelyexciting area?
Michael van Rooyen (04:43):
Look, it certainly is, and I guess off
that the space has rapidlyevolved.
As you said, we started kind of1.2, gprs and all these things
and you've been through all thelife cycles, and then there's
this rapid adoption of 4Kstreaming video.
Everyone wants to connect tothese Apple Vision, that'll be
the long-term play, all thishigh-speed stuff.
And with that evolvement, whatare you seeing as the most
significant trends in the sector?
Ian Ross (05:05):
Look to me and look it might be a biased view, but I
actually think the mostsignificant trend has been 5G
for industry.
When we think about mobility,we think about 5G.
We think about mobile towers,we think about phones and
tablets and watches.
But when you move beyond thatconsumer view of the world and
we start to think around, well,what can 5G really do?
(05:26):
5g has been designed formassive scale and
machine-to-machine communication, so it's really been designed
for industry.
And that's when we see the 5Gpotential of 10 to 100 times
increase in speed, the abilityto connect a thousand times more
devices being five times moreresponsive, driving automation,
digitizing things, improvingsafety, driving productivity,
(05:46):
improving efficiency, makingbusinesses in Australia a
greater comparative advantage onthe global scale, and I think
that's the real big change thatis being driven by mobility
Right.
Michael van Rooyen (05:58):
So people have been always saying the
mobile phone is the thing theythink about in the G space let's
call it that.
But 5G was really, as you said,built for industry.
I was interesting talking tothe guys at Cisco the other day
and they have theirobservability platform and
they're talking about howthey're working, even in that
space, to do observability fromcars and, of course, new
connectivity.
But on that, are businesses asyet getting the transformation
(06:21):
that will give them and what aresome of the other key benefits
that organizations could get outof it from an enterprise point
of view, I see manyorganizations at various stages
in their digitalization journeys.
Ian Ross (06:32):
Some of them are completely involved in
automation and radicallychanging how they conduct
themselves.
Others are simply trying toconnect workers better and
provide a better qualityconnectivity.
And I think as organizations goon this journey, they start to
realize there's more and moredifferent things they want to
connect.
And as businesses digitalizemore devices, they're moving
more data.
That data is more critical today-to-day operations.
It's not sending emails, it'scontrolling a production system,
(06:55):
it's responsible forenvironmental outcomes or for
safety control, and that dataultimately has to be lower
latency.
So I think organizations, asthey move through their
digitalisation, are starting torealise that the tools they've
had at their fingertipspreviously aren't as capable to
handle this new frontier they'redriving towards as they were
previously.
(07:16):
We're seeing Wi-Fi as a greattechnology, but when you start
to put multiple applications onWi-Fi or you want to start to
provide pervasive connectivityoptions across a wider area, it
becomes a very expensivetechnology to roll out at scale
and what we've seen in the fieldit becomes somewhat
unpredictable under load.
So if you're looking at acritical control system or a
(07:36):
monitoring system, somethingthat just not observes but
controls, you need a high levelof deterministic performance.
You need that predictability.
You need that throughput.
Rolling out computer vision andAI takes a huge amount of
uplink throughput.
When we look at SCADA and othersystems, everything now is
about massive sensor scale anddigital twins.
I speak to oil and gascompanies.
(07:57):
They have a vision of half amillion sensors on an offshore
platform.
Michael van Rooyen (08:01):
Half a million, half a million On one
of those offshore plants out inthe middle of the sea, basically
if it has a temperature, if itvibrates or makes a noise.
Ian Ross (08:10):
they want to be able to put a sensor on it and bring
it back to a digital twin fortheir simulation.
Wow, Now, that's aspirational.
That requires an order ofmagnitude change in the cost of
these sensors, but that's wherethe industries are going.
Michael van Rooyen (08:20):
Right, wow, wow, half a million sensors.
That's incredible, and thatjust goes to show the power of
it again, right?
I mean, if you're trying todeliver that as a Wi-Fi, nothing
wrong with Wi-Fi.
As you said, it's been aroundfor a long time, it's serving
its purpose.
Ian Ross (08:31):
It's a great technology, it's accessible,
it's well understood, but as thenetworks get more and more
complex and more demanding, thefundamentals of the technology
can't keep up.
Yeah, of course, and that'swhere we see mobility and these
3 all your technologies reallycoming to the fray.
Because don't think of it as anetwork, think of it as a
technology, and it helpsbusinesses start to realize
(08:52):
these advanced use cases thatare invariably wireless.
If you're looking at drones orremote control equipment or even
connected tightening tools,this is what we're seeing a huge
level of adoption in Europe andthe US.
Screwdrivers they're connectedvia 5G.
Wow Right, they self-calibrate,they provide full traceability,
(09:13):
but they need connections, ofcourse, and they struggle when
you're over traditional wirelesstechnology, yeah, and that's a
good point.
Michael van Rooyen (09:20):
So if I think about taking the
traditional RF and I'll talk802.11, so traditional wireless
that people are used to tryingto deliver, half a million
sensors is just not going to besustainable power, a number of
access points network to supportthat, as opposed to being
delivered by cellular.
Which leads on to a really goodpoint Everyone's familiar with
and I guess it's important forpeople listening LT.
(09:40):
They go to a carrier, they buya service, they buy a SIM card
and they pay for data and dataplans are getting better.
But just so we can just walkthrough this a bit more, so
people can understand your rolereally as private seller there,
do you mind explaining whatprivate LTE is and how it
differs from public networks?
I know technically it's notthat different, but just for
people listening, so we get thatcontext of this and what the
(10:01):
main advantages are forenterprise.
Yeah, look absolutely so.
Ian Ross (10:04):
I said before, when we think about cellular
technologies, don't think aboutit as a network.
I said before, when we thinkabout cellular technologies,
don't think about it as anetwork, think of it as a
technology, a wirelesstechnology.
So private cellular networksthey're dedicated, site-specific
networks that use cellulartechnology but for the purposes
of a single business, for anenterprise.
So you think of a carriernetwork.
You'll have cell towers acrossa landscape.
(10:25):
They'll have the network coreproviding voice services and SMS
and the sorts of things we useday to day, and we as consumers
buy them.
We buy a SIM card, we subscribeto our monthly plan.
A private selling network usesthe same technology but it's
really shrunk down to be rightsize for industry.
It's an enterprise that, withintheir boundaries, has their own
(10:45):
radio spectrum that theytransmit on.
They have their own radiotowers and radio sites and these
could be large towers, theycould be on ceilings inside a
warehouse, they could be onlight poles across a port.
They have their own networkcore, not as big as running a
nation's network, but they havetheir own cell network core that
sits in their comms room onsite and then connects to their
(11:06):
secure application workloads intheir data centre and they're
responsible for running theinfrastructure.
So they own it, they operate it, they control access.
They have their own SIM cardswith their own network codes,
their own encryption keys.
They become their own carriers.
There's multiple triggers to whythey would look at a private
network.
Sometimes it is they need anetwork in a remote area where
(11:26):
no public network exists.
So are you going to extend apublic network or are you going
to build your own?
In some situations it's arounddesign requirements that the
technologies are rolling out.
The applications they're usingmay need to have coverage in
very deep and dark areas oftheir facility and the public
network doesn't go there.
Or they might have a criticaluptime need.
They want to design for five orsix nines uptime and you're not
(11:49):
going to get that as an SLAfrom a carrier network.
They might have operationalneeds that they want to control
maintenance and upgrades intheir time, on their scale, or
if they just simply wantoperational independence.
The important thing with privatenetworks is they're air-gapped
from the public network, sowhatever happens in the public
network doesn't impact theprivate network.
These networks are allsometimes used for performance,
(12:10):
and we see this particularly inautomation, where you'll have
particular applications thatneed a certain level of
throughput or a certain level ofpacket loss, automation and
remote control, and those levelsof performance simply
unavailable as a public servicewhere they can be guaranteed but
you can design for them in aprivate network.
And I think, the final areasaround security.
(12:31):
The enterprise wants to controlemphatically who accesses the
network, who has the rights toconnect their devices, what
devices can connect, or simplyto ensure that all data remains
on site and nothing leaves.
Many organizations say look, Ihave a critical data flow, I do
not want to leave my premises,so I want to be able to connect
it via wireless, connect it toapplications in my data center
(12:53):
and not have it go out to apublic network.
So many different scenarios andreasons why businesses look
towards private cellular.
There is no one reason.
Michael van Rooyen (13:03):
I mean, as you just ran through there, it
ticks so many boxes.
I'm happy you touched on thesecurity aspect, right, because
inherently people again in thetag of wireless people think oh
well, there's some securityvulnerabilities.
And you touched about securingwhat's connected in their work.
When we think about from an802.11 point of view, there's
quite a bit of work and I thinkthe industry is going to do a
bit of work in theauthentication space and that's
that traditional radiusauthentication but that's more
(13:24):
device authentication Withcellular.
Even the way it's built fromthe foundations it's secure
inherently from the start.
I guess on the flip side ofthat is the devices you talk
about connector screwdrivers andothers are they relatively cost
effective?
Is there a balance on the otherend of the scale?
Ian Ross (13:41):
It does change with time.
What we do see in this space,particularly with industrial
devices, that quite oftenthey're engineered to a level of
standard above consumer, sothey appear expensive.
That quite often they'reengineered to a level of
standard above consumer, so theyappear expensive, but you don't
have your mobile phoneoperating up to 85 degrees 2G
vibration, right.
So that level of engineeringdesign does bring an element of
price premium.
But we do see with all mobiletechnologies that it does ride a
(14:03):
cost reduction curve over timeand we see an expanding
ecosystem of 5G devices enteringthe market for industrial
applications.
But there's also differentstandards of devices.
So there's the high-end,high-performance devices that
are designed to deliver gigabitsworth of performance.
Then we're moving into your IoTdevices and your reduced
(14:24):
capability devices that arecoming out for 5G and they're
really going to drive thatsensor sort of evolution.
Are we going to get down to thepoint where the 500,000 sensor
vision is going to be aneconomic reality?
I'll remain an informed skepticon that one.
Fair enough, but I think we aregoing to get to the point where
we're going to look at the costof putting a modem connected to
(14:45):
a 5G network is less thandropping a copper cable and
that's actually what's drivingthe evolution in the US in
manufacturing that organizationslook at the reconfiguration of
their production lines or theirfacilities.
They look at the number ofcable drops they need to do.
They have a number of around$1,000 US per drop and they
start to realize that a fewhundred dollars spent on a small
modem plugged into accessiblepower.
(15:06):
It becomes a very dynamic, veryflexible, very agile form of
connecting anything.
Michael van Rooyen (15:13):
Wow, if I think about manufacturing, car
manufacturing alone the way theyreconfigure the factories to
build different cars.
We just see cars come out ofthe factory but they have the
process of retooling that kindof factory to run 20,000 of this
car, then they retool it andthat all comes at a cost.
And if I think about evenstorage facilities,
reconfiguring storage foroptimization there's always
these plans for logistics Offthat.
So there's plenty of reasons todo private cellular many, many
(15:35):
benefits for the customer.
On the other side, what aresome of the biggest challenges
organized face when they deployprivate LTE or 5G networks and
how can they overcome these?
Ian Ross (15:45):
Yeah, look.
I think the biggest challengehas probably been around the
complexity of these solutions.
Historically, the advantage ofWi-Fi is it's been seen as a
simple technology.
Lots of people understand it.
It's very familiar, wellunderstood when we start talking
about 3GPP and differentacronyms and different
approaches and what isultimately a technology that's
been designed for national scaleand security.
(16:06):
It is a more complex andinvolved technology.
Many of the early leaders inthis space have struggled to get
that expertise into theirbusiness and retain that
expertise.
The way that what's happenedwith the industry over the last
couple of years is, I thinkwe've realised that the target
end users of these technologiesaren't experienced
communications technicians likeyou have on a mine site.
(16:26):
They are pulling cables on afactory floor or in a warehouse.
In many instances the businessdoesn't even have IT
capabilities in-house.
It's all outsourced.
So what we've done as Ericssonand, I think, as a general
industry trend, is there's beena lot of work in taking the
advantages and the innovationsthat 5G technology has and bring
(16:47):
them to enterprise, so thatcomplexity that has plagued
these systems previously has nowbeen replaced by systems that
are highly automated.
So we're using orchestrationtechnologies to automate the
configuration deployment.
We're using automationtechnologies to simplify the
ongoing lifecycle management.
So now a multi-element private5G network is as simple to
(17:10):
upgrade as applying a newversion of iOS to your mobile
phone.
It's pushed out to the network,you schedule it, it schedules
the upgrade, it's all touchless.
I think a lot of the work inthe industry, and particularly
where Ericsson's been focusing,is to make this incredibly
powerful technology much easierfor enterprises to adopt and to
use day-to-day.
Michael van Rooyen (17:30):
Absolutely Knowing the challenges we've had
in that space.
You just touched on a goodpoint about upgrading similar to
an iOS upgrade.
If I think about the challengesand I won't name the vendors,
but the challenge of aligningbackend infrastructure to
firmwares, to new devices it'sactually quite a complex
challenge.
I'm impriming that someonesomewhere thinks oh well,
they'll just replace everythingin one go or the lifestyle.
(17:51):
We know the practicalities.
You and I have spoken a bit inthe past, but one of the biggest
things that always stands outwith private cellular and
cellular as a whole is reallythe frequency or the spectrum
that's available.
That's the biggest challengefor us right in this area.
Ian Ross (18:05):
Yeah, it is, and it's a challenge, but it's also one
of the biggest advantages.
Fair enough, what really isgreat about Private Cellular is
it operates in licensed spectrumbands.
Where you have Wi-Fi, that is,in shared spectrum, you can't
control what access points arebroadcasting.
Where, in a cellular world, youhave to transmit with a license
from a regulator.
And so the ACMA in Australia,which means it's your own little
(18:28):
patch of radio spectrum in yourarea.
No one else can use it and ifthey do, you have a recourse
through the TelecommunicationsAct.
So it does add to that securitymessage that if you're starting
to put more and moredigitalization strategy onto a
wireless technology with Wi-Fi,you don't really know if it's
going to be there tomorrow interms of interference and
performance.
Where cellular technology youdo have that certainty.
(18:50):
But to do that you do need aspectrum license and this is why
globally, and particularly inAustralia, we've seen that the
early adopters of this weremining houses and oil and gas
companies.
They have operations inrelatively remote areas where
they're unpopulations.
There is a lot of demand forspectrum, so there is spectrum
free for them to be able toacquire a license to run their
networks Right.
(19:11):
Okay, the ACMA, I think is beingquite forward in what they've
seen the use of thesetechnologies in Australia and
over the last 12 months, openingup spectrum licenses for
enterprises at different areas.
I think last year they openedup a huge amount of spectrum in
the 5G bands that enterprisescan apply for.
They don't need billions ofdollars to do it, You're buying
it in like 1.8 by 1.8 kilometerblocks.
(19:33):
That was for remote Australiaand they're in the process of
allocating to metro and regionalareas.
So once that allocation processis complete then it will move
to what's called anover-the-counter regime.
So if you're an organizationwanting to explore private
cellular, you can now engage athird-party coordination company
.
They can work out what spectrumyou need and then make an
(19:55):
application to the ACMA and ifthe spectrum's available,
they'll send you a small taxinvoice and once you pay that
tax invoice, the spectrum'syours, oh right, and is there a
timeline on that spectrum?
Typically pay for it annually.
It's called area-wide licensing.
You buy these blocks based onwhat you're trying to do with it
.
It's quite flexible.
It's been designed to bemulti-technology.
Yes it works in the 5G bands,but you don't need to use it for
(20:17):
5G.
I have to represent Ericssonand say we'd love you to use it
for 5G everywhere, Of course,but yes, no it's an annual
license renewal.
Michael van Rooyen (20:26):
Look, that's clever, right.
I mean, at the end of the day,the technology is there.
Obviously the biggest inhibitorwas spectrum that are processed
so you can, as you said, havesecurity, have your own
frequency, know that no one'sgoing to interfere with you.
Because you want that lowlatency, you want that
reliability, knowing that youobviously talk to your global
counterparts.
Is this something that overseashave done for a while, like the
us?
Europe and australia is justnot playing catch-up but really
(20:47):
saying, okay, this does work andwhat we need to do to support
the country.
Ian Ross (20:50):
Yeah, it's funny.
I think it's positionedAustralia as one of the leaders
in this space.
Okay, wow, the mining housethat triggered all this, at
least from my little lens of theworld, was Australian-based
Right.
But what we have seen is inother markets around the world
where industry spectrum has beenmore widely available, so they
probably leapfrogged Australia alittle bit in terms of spectrum
access.
We've seen these networks takeoff.
(21:11):
So in Japan, in France, germany, in the US, with the Citizens
Broadband Radio Spectrum, cbrs,it's democratised access to
spectrum and has opened up awhole range of organisations.
So we see verticals that arereally resonating around
manufacturing.
Manufacturing is not cars andwhite goods.
Manufacturing, I think, is thefourth largest vertical, very
(21:31):
big in food and beverage,pharmaceuticals, minerals and
tobacco.
The example you gave beforearound reconfiguring car
production lines food andbeverage production lines get
reconfigured at a far moreaccelerated rate because we're
quite fickle as consumers, right, we don't want to buy the same
flavor of Tim Tams.
Michael van Rooyen (21:49):
We always need something different, right.
Ian Ross (21:50):
So we see manufacturing oil buy the same
flavour of Tim Tams.
We always need somethingdifferent, right?
So we see manufacturing oil andgas offshore, offshore
refineries mining is a givenUtilities.
Wind farms actually are a veryinteresting area, particularly
on offshore wind farms, becauseit's pretty dangerous to go
perform inspection and serviceon those turbines, of course.
So they're looking at coveragefor safety, but also for drones
(22:11):
for remote inspection.
Michael van Rooyen (22:12):
That's cool.
That's cool.
So many use cases.
Ian Ross (22:15):
Everything's automating in container ports,
particularly as a means ofcompetition.
So in Europe we see that allthe countries and all the major
ports are so close together.
It's all around.
How do you move as many tierusers you can as quickly as
possible?
These sorts of networks arebeing used to drive automation
there.
The idea is consistentconnectivity throughout the
entire facility, not patchy.
So people look to 5G for thatand I think, more locally, we
(22:38):
see agribusiness as aninteresting area.
Agriculture is quite advancedin terms of digitalization but
also quite limited in terms ofaccess.
Like all industries, they'relooking at connecting, securing,
deploying the technologies.
Michael van Rooyen (22:51):
That's fascinating.
That's fascinating.
Touching on some of thoseexamples, and I bet a lot of
people wouldn't have thoughtthose four different industries
are really straight business.
Everyone thinks of mining, butthere's interesting data points
you give there and otherindustries Off that, without
naming any customers.
Can you give examples of usecases where a business has
successfully, or an enterprisehas successfully delivered LTE
(23:12):
and what the impact was to theiroperations?
Ian Ross (23:14):
Yeah, look, there's a few.
There's a food and beverageprovider in Brazil.
It's actually a public case, sowe'll just call it out by name
Sure.
On their KitKat production line.
They saw the need to drivedigital quality.
So they rolled out what werecalled hyperspectral cameras.
These are cameras that seebeyond the visible spectrum and
they're using them to detectmissing wafers in KitKats what?
(23:34):
So?
I'm pretty disappointed when Imiss a wafer.
So it's good that they're doingthis.
But those cameras generate agigabit per second of throughput
.
So they roll a cameratechnology out on a food and
beverage production line withoutpulling cables everywhere, and
probably that capacity we can'tExactly.
And then they're using it forAGVs, so they're autonomous
guided vehicles to supply thestock in and out.
(23:56):
They need 50 millisecondlatency Again.
So you've got a device that'smobile, needs to remain
connected, needs low latency inthat connection.
And this is where cellulartechnology comes in, because if
you don't meet that 50millisecond target, then things
stop.
So that's a great example.
There's a port customer of oursin the UK that has decided to
automate all their boom gates.
(24:17):
So rather than having securityguards at every single entry
point in the port, they nowbrought it back to a single
security operations center.
All the boom gates areautomated, but as the trucks of
the containers enter and leavethe port, they're using cameras
and computer vision to read theserial number of the containers,
to create a real-time manifestof all the containers in the
(24:37):
port.
Wow, but those cameras are alsosurveying the containers and
doing a damage assessment.
So now they can determine if acontainer is all banged up when
it leaves the port.
Is it a result of treatment inthe port or was it banged up
when?
Michael van Rooyen (24:47):
it came in.
Ian Ross (24:48):
Wow.
So some great examples there ofjust different industries.
One of our clients has got aroadmap of new initiatives that
will take them out to 2030.
People don't normally thinkthat far out.
No, they're just looking ateverything.
It's a little bit of crystalball on science fiction towards
the 2030 end, but they'relooking at remote control trucks
moving to automated trucks anddrones doing shore inspection
(25:09):
and UAVs doing propellerinspections of vessels.
Once you have the ability toaccess virtually unlimited,
pervasive, dependableconnectivity, you can start to
exercise your imagination.
Michael van Rooyen (25:20):
I mean, just give me two customer examples
that are phenomenal.
I'll be making sure one of myKitKats now check for the wafers
Hopefully they're from Braziland that data analytics, that
video analytics right, that'swhat's driving this right.
It's just impressive.
I hope you enjoyed part one ofmy discussion with Ian Ross.
Listen in next week for parttwo.
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