November 5, 2024 • 51 mins
Are you constantly feeling disconnected from yourself? In this episode, I talk with Nichola Day about allowing seasonal changes to be a reminder to look within and:
• The pivotal moment when you realize you’re highly sensitive and the need to advocate for your unique needs
• The overlap between different forms of neurodivergence such as high sensitivity, ADHD, and autism
• Giving yourself grace to move slowly through seasonal transitions and come back to your self-care practice again and again
Nichola is a Yoga & Mindfulness Teacher, and Yoga Therapist with her own business, 'Sensitive Yoga Therapy', based in the UK. She is HSP herself, as well as identifying as neurodivergent. She works to support other sensitives experiencing anxiety, overwhelm and burnout to reconnect back with their bodies, the natural world around them and their true authentic selves. She offers a route back to this through Yoga, Mindfulness, Seasonal Living & Inner Inquiry. When she is not working, Nichola loves to read, walk amongst trees and gaze at the moon!
Keep in touch with Nichola:
• Website: http://www.nicholaday.co.uk
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/sensitiveyogatherapy
• Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@sensitiveyogatherapy
Resources Mentioned:
• Autumnal Self-Care Pack: https://www.nicholaday.co.uk
• Sensitive Soul Space monthly membership: https://www.nicholaday.co.uk/sensitivesoulspace
• Yoga Therapy: https://www.nicholaday.co.uk/one-to-one-yoga-therapy
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https://www.sensitivestories.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Nichola Day (00:00):
If you are sensitive to your environment,
then it makes sense to adapt howyou look after yourself
according to what is going onaround you.
April Snow (00:17):
Welcome to Sensitive Stories, the podcast for the
people who live with hearts andeyes wide open.
I'm your host, psychotherapistand author, april Snow.
I invite you to join me as Ideep dive into rich
conversations with fellow highlysensitive people that will
inspire you to live a morefulfilling life as an HSP
(00:39):
without all the overwhelm.
In this episode, I talk withNicola Day about adapting your
self-care practices to theseasons, allowing seasonal
changes to be a reminder to lookwithin and giving yourself
grace when life gets hectic.
Nicola is a yoga andmindfulness teacher and yoga
(01:00):
therapist with her own business,sensitive Yoga Therapy, based
in the UK.
She is highly sensitive andalso identifies as
neurodivergent.
She works to support othersensitives experiencing anxiety,
overwhelm and burnout toreconnect back with their bodies
, the natural world around themand their true, authentic selves
(01:20):
.
She offers a route back to thisthrough yoga mindfulness selves
.
She offers a route back to thisthrough yoga, mindfulness,
seasonal living and innerinquiry.
When she is not working, nicolaloves to read, walk amongst the
trees and gaze at the moon Formore HSP resources and to see
behind the scenes video from thepodcast.
Join me on Instagram, tiktok orYouTube at Sensitive Strengths
(01:44):
or sign up for my email list.
Links are in the show notes andat sensitivestoriescom.
And just a reminder that thisepisode is for educational
purposes only and is notintended as a substitute for
treatment with a mental healthor medical professional.
Let's dive in, nicola, can you?
Nichola Day (02:26):
start off by telling us how and when you
discovered that you're highlysensitive.
Yeah, sure, it's been a bit ofa double bounce, I guess because
I had my first introductionwhen well, I should start by
saying that I've always known Iwas different, but I think
everybody says that.
But when I had my first son,which which was 2011, he was
struggling, it was a difficultbirth and he was clearly very
(02:48):
sensitive.
I've now got two very sensitiveboys and I think it was a
friend who said, oh, I wonder ifhe's highly sensitive.
So I can't even rememberwhether I got a book or I
Googled it, but it was on myradar at that point and although
I looked at all of the criteriaand was like, oh, yes, yes, yes
, it just didn't land.
(03:09):
And I think you know, at thattime I was really struggling.
Actually, I was having a lot ofpanic attacks and anxiety, new
baby parenthood, and also he hadsome developmental delays as
well.
So was a lot going on and therewas just not space for me to
get into it, but it was in thebackground chugging along and at
(03:32):
the time as well, I should sayI was a primary school teacher,
so I don't know what that wouldtranslate to in the States.
But I was teaching like yearone and year two so it's five,
six, seven year olds and yeartwo, so it's five, six, seven
year olds and really enjoying itbut getting frequently burnt
out.
So I think at that point I'dgone down the route of like it
must be me and then hit a pointof like no, it can't be me.
(03:54):
So there's something about,although I love my job, it
doesn't love me.
So I made a completely radicaland I think a lot of HSPs say
this radical and I think a lotof HSPs say this.
I had, like this pivot momentwhere I decided I was going to
leave a stable job and become ayoga teacher and because I've
been working with kids, I sortof transitioned softly.
(04:15):
So I started off with teachingkids yoga and in that journey I
was on Facebook, just a randomlittle scrolling moment, and I
came across a person who hadcommented on somebody who I did
my education training with andthey just said, oh, I've left
education to become a kids yogateacher.
(04:38):
And, very unlike me, I messagedthem and anyway, it's a long
story short.
She's now one of my bestestfriends, but in that first
meeting she was like are you aHSP?
And I was like, oh my god.
And we spent hours just like,oh my gosh, yes, yes.
And so it was from that pointwhere, I think, because I'd left
(05:00):
education by that point and Ihad like a buddy now to swap
ideas with and talk about it,with that I had space to dive
into it.
And, yeah, true to my nature, Ijust dived into all of the
breeding and all of the researchon the internet and, yeah, I
ticked every single box.
(05:21):
And I think when you first findout as well, you go through this
phase of like wanting to tellthe world you know, like you
really do.
Did you know about this?
Did you know?
And, perhaps not unsurprisingly, my mum and my brother were not
too interested.
You know, like, oh yeah, yeah,I guess that's you, but to me it
was a really important moment.
So, yes, I was very grateful tomeet my bestie and kind of get
(05:45):
immersed into it, because yousuddenly feel and I know
everybody who's HSP when theyget that moment, they just feel
so seen and I just felt so seen.
And you know, I think a lot ofus are seekers and if you don't
have that language, certainly inmy home there was growing up,
there was none of this languageof like oh well, that's okay
(06:07):
that you find these kinds ofthings difficult because you're
an extra sensitive person orwhatever.
So, yeah, it was a real I guess, connecting back with myself
and knowing that it was okay andalso knowing that there was
other people out there like me.
April Snow (06:20):
Oh, it's when you were telling the part about oh,
I shared this with my family andthey weren't as excited about
it.
I think that's a lot of ourexperience, because it's so
meaningful and impactful tofinally know this is my
experience.
There's language, there's otherpeople that share this.
You know that feel deeply andit's life changing to have that
(06:41):
language.
But other people are like, yeah, you're more sensitive.
Ok, yeah, I was like right,come round for tea, guys,
life-changing to have thatlanguage.
But other people like, yeah,you're more sensitive, okay yeah
, I was like right, come aroundfor tea.
Nichola Day (06:48):
Guys, I'm gonna get out the quiz, let's go through
it together.
And then he's like no, I didn'tknow, I did the same thing.
April Snow (06:55):
I was in graduate school at the time and I gave it
to every one of the people atmy counseling center that I was
working with.
We just stood around and tookthe test.
You just want to share it.
You want to see who else is?
Nichola Day (07:04):
yeah, you do yeah, yeah, you can't help.
But then just see the entireworld through that lens and you
start going oh, I wonder ifthey're highly sensitive and
it's like this kind ofunderground society well, it
really is.
April Snow (07:18):
That's how I found out about was through a friend,
and then I hear so many otherstories like it just finds you
and I think your experience isso relatable in that a lot of
times we don't have the space totake it in, but when we do, we
just want to go all in, readeverything we can, talk to as
many people as we can.
Nichola Day (07:45):
Yeah, because it's like a thirst for understanding
yourself, because probably a lotof us not all of us, but some
of us, who perhaps didn't have asupportive environment growing
up, we've just kind of survivedwith whatever coping strategy
possible that there is thathunger, because suddenly you're
like, oh gosh, this is a way forme to understand myself.
Finally, and like I say becauseoften we've been, it's like an
hallelujah kind of moment, isn'tit?
April Snow (08:05):
It really is.
Yeah, looking for that.
What is it for me?
What is it about me?
That's different, and I wasn'tfinding what it was until I
discovered Dr Aaron's work.
I love that.
Yeah, we are seeking not justabout ourselves, but about
meeting and life and the world.
Nichola Day (08:23):
Well, this is like the deep thinking, isn't it?
You know, like we, we're gonnabe thinking, or maybe it's
worthwhile thinking, but youknow it comes with the territory
it really does, and so youshare with me that you've also
been diagnosed with adhd andautism.
April Snow (08:38):
So I'm curious what your experience has been, if we
zoom out, with having multipleforms of neurodivergent what is
that?
Nichola Day (08:44):
like well, yeah, I guess it's not been an easy
journey, if I'm honest, and I'mstill very much in it, because
it's not that long ago that Iwas diagnosed, although I knew
yes, I knew which partly to dowith my kids seeing their
(09:04):
neurodivergence play out and, Iguess, a wealth of experience as
well of working withneurodivergent folk.
I think the thing is, when Ikind of didn't really think
about autism or ADHD and I wasjust kind of in my HSP world, I,
you know, I said to my friendswho are in this kind of bubble,
(09:25):
and my husband, who's alsohighly sensitive, I think I must
be just a really extreme HSPand I feel like that's quite a
common thing with women who arebeing late diagnosed.
Yeah, definitely, and all theHSP criteria, all of those
elements of being HSP 100%, I,I'm all in.
There were certain things thatI couldn't explain and I
(09:51):
remember asking quite a fewprofessionals and other people
in the field, like you knowwhat's the crossover here
particularly, I kind of wentmore towards the autism side to
begin with, but both my childrenalso have ADHD, so I had to you
know side to begin with, butboth my children also have ADHD,
so I had to, you know, becurious about that, and I went
deep into therapy as well my owntherapy.
(10:12):
I still see my therapist todayand there was these little
questions like okay, so how muchof this is my HSP-ness, if you
like, and how much of this isearly trauma and how much of
this is something else althoughwe weren't talking about it but
it was in the room.
So things like eye contact, forexample, I find really
(10:36):
difficult and I actually don'tgive eye contact.
I always look at people'smouths and I raise this in
therapy and she's like okay,let's just invite this in.
You know it could be to do withthis blah, blah, blah and just
little things like that that youknow.
I'd kind of got something in mymind to explore and I think the
(10:57):
difficulty I found in startingto seek that out is the inherent
problem with labels, actually,because labels can be really
helpful and I do believe inbeing able to have labels.
Particularly if you have been ina minority group, you need a
way to be able to advocate foryourself and labels can be
really helpful for that.
(11:19):
My case sometimes, and still now, I can feel like the labels of
HSP, autism, adhd are like theirboxes and actually when humans
aren't boxes and there's no hardlines, and I've spent far too
many minutes hours I wouldn'tcare to add it up of how much I
(11:43):
have researched the overlapbetween mostly being highly
sensitive and autism, andthere's lots of opinions about
that and I guess my livedexperience is that it's both.
(12:09):
This is my kind of feeling on itis that there's a collection of
traits with huge similarities,little differences here and
there, and I think it'sperfectly okay that these
overlap and you can feel thatthose labels describe elements
of yourself, you know.
So, yeah, I'm still very muchin it, if I'm totally honest,
and I'm still wading my way.
If I'm totally honest, I'mstill wading my way through.
But I do think there is thisproblem with boxes and trying to
(12:30):
squeeze people in, and I alsothink that there is a problem
with us sticking hard and fastto those boxes in the
professional world as well,because I just don't think it's
helpful for people.
April Snow (12:42):
It's really not helpful.
And how can we ever completelytease apart someone's
characteristics?
It's impossible.
And high sensitivity, autism,adhd.
There are so many overlaps andwhat happens is we often end up
fighting that, oh, I'm this orthat.
Well, I think we're sharingexperiences here.
(13:03):
Why are we battling each other?
It always is so, yeah,concerning for me that we feel
like we have to be all this orall that.
There's no overlap, but thereis a lot of overlap.
Yeah, right, I think we'regoing to find we're all kind of
related in these characteristics.
Nichola Day (13:18):
So I was laughing because I was thinking that is
really quite typical black andwhite thinking and that is
something that I can find quitedifficult actually, and yeah,
it's been helpful for me to dothe research and actually come
to a really good place offeeling like actually, no,
there's multiple shades of greyand it's just tricky trying to
(13:44):
find, or perhaps not being ableto get hold of, the right
information, particularly ifyou've been raised female.
It's so difficult to spot, mostlikely because of people
pleasing and masking behaviors,and so I think this is probably
you know where I'm at.
I'm still kind of unpickingthat now and just trying to.
You know where I'm at.
I'm still kind of I'm pickingthat now and just trying to yeah
(14:06):
, figure it out.
April Snow (14:06):
Yeah, it's true.
Unfortunately, women are oftenunderrepresented in studies, and
so we often have a differentexperience, and it does make it
problematic to figure out what'sgoing on for me, because we
only have one version that'sbeen defined and is assumed to
be the only way, and we'rerealizing now there's lots of
(14:28):
presentations not just forautism, but for high sensitivity
and for any type ofneurodivergence, and so we
really need to expand our viewas much as we can, and I think
this was the turning point forme was, I think, also it raises
how much kind of inherentableism we have within ourselves
(14:50):
that we just we're not and thisis helping me bring it to the
surface really these kind ofpreconceived ideas about what
ADHD is, what autism is.
Nichola Day (14:58):
And even now, even though I've done huge amounts of
reading and from people withdifferent lived experiences of
different types ofneurodivergence, it's still
there.
I still have to challenge thatoccasionally and go oh, hang on,
just check yourself there, nick, because that's not quite right
, is it?
It might not present like that.
So, yeah, yeah, lots oflearning.
April Snow (15:20):
Yes and yeah, deconstructing these
misconceptions.
We have no-transcript as aneurodivergent person,
(15:49):
Absolutely.
Nichola Day (15:50):
This is what I really really try to advocate
for is like actually it's.
I mean, my husband uses thisidea in our household that we're
all neurodivergent but we allhave a slightly different recipe
and it is a little bit likethat.
But we all have a slightlydifferent recipe and it is a
little bit like that.
You know different ingredientsbut we're, you know, under this
neurodivergent umbrella and Ireally like that.
I think the you know, whilst Iabsolutely want to be positive
(16:20):
and neuro affirming about all ofthese things, there's also the
issue of like it being adisability.
So autism and ADHD being adisability, and there's a fine
balance to be had between, yeah,but in accepting that, really,
because on the one hand, I'maware that I have the privilege
of being able to mask, of, youknow, of being able to go out
(16:43):
into the world and reasonablyaccess it, but on the other end
of the spectrum, there areoccasions when I do feel quite
disabled.
A lot of that is down tosociety's accommodate I don't
even like the wordaccommodations, I can't even
think of the right word butunderstanding, we just need to
broaden our horizons you know wereally do so.
April Snow (17:05):
There's more room for people to exist in different
ways and there's more supportslike we're put in such a narrow
box of.
This is how you function, thisis how you show up in the world
and I think everyone who'sneurodivergent struggles with
that in some way, depending youknow some more than others,
depending on how well you canmask, how high functioning you
(17:26):
are.
But we really do need space.
I think a lot of us aresuffering at different levels or
maybe not even feeling like youcan function because there's
accommodations or whatever youwant to call it, just permission
to live differently.
It's not there.
Nichola Day (17:40):
It's challenging in many situations you're just.
There's just an assumption ofthat.
You're typical.
Whatever, that is right, yeahit's true.
So in a way when you're onneurodivergent and it's
invisible.
If you see what I mean, youhave to.
(18:02):
You just have to work so muchharder to advocate for yourself.
I do this all the time with mychildren, you know they may look
like they're accessing school,okay, but actually at home, when
they come home from school,it's like.
I don't know if you've seenthese memes on socials where
it's like a firefighter puttingout a crazy blaze, like after
(18:26):
school.
It's like, okay, how can Iregulate them ready for the next
day at school?
You know these are veryinvisible, right?
Just?
April Snow (18:35):
think about how much they've had to suppress all day
long to fit in right and seethis with a lot of kids.
I don't have any of my own kids,but see this a lot with kids
that are in my life, where theyjust fall apart once they get
home.
You know, they've just beenholding in so much all day long.
Finally they can just let theiremotions out, they can unmask,
and unfortunately, a lot oftimes these kids without
(18:57):
knowledgeable parents getlabeled as having behavioral
issues or mental health issues,when really they just maybe need
some different supports andyeah, it can be tough.
Thankfully, you are sounds likea very affirming household and
your kids have space I'mlaughing because it is really
(19:18):
challenging.
Nichola Day (19:19):
Sure, four of us are all neurodivergent and we
have these moments where ourneurodivergence is riffing off
each other and we're just havinga ball and it's awesome.
And then there's the others,but times when usually it's like
sensory issues are clashing, oryou know, I've got one child
that just like to make it look,maybe stims with his voice, and
(19:42):
then another that'shypersensitive to noise, for
example.
That was just one and, yeah,just things like that.
April Snow (19:50):
When they clash, the ebbs and flows are epic right,
everyone is trying to get theirneeds met, but sometimes
triggering the others.
Yeah, yeah so speaking on thisstuff, I want to transition to
how do we take care of ourselves, right as in order todivergent
people as sensitive people, andI know you really think about
(20:11):
self-care in a seasonalperspective.
So why is it helpful for us toapproach how we care for
ourselves seasonally?
I'm really curious to hear moreabout that.
Nichola Day (20:22):
I'm so passionate about this because I've just
basically it's how I've kind offigured out how to look after
myself and my kids too, just ona very basic level.
If you are sensitive to yourenvironment, then it makes sense
to adapt how you look afteryourself according to what is
going on around you.
(20:42):
And I talk a lot about how eachmonth and each season comes
with its own challenges, if youlike, sensory challenges,
potentials.
And I always think, if you havethat knowledge, then you're
forewarned, aren't you?
So you can think, oh, ok, yes,june, july, the light is really
(21:06):
bright, so I'm just going tomake sure that I have multiple
shades in my car, in my bag, andmaybe, for my part of a
self-care routine, I might liedown and put an eye mask on for
a little bit.
And so, yeah, just on a verybasic level, we need to adapt to
(21:26):
our environment more so, Ibelieve, believe I think it's
good for everybody, but I thinkmore so if you're extra
sensitive.
And the other thing that Ifound is that by working
seasonally and, yeah, going withthe rhythm of the seasons, I
automatically then become moreconnected to my own inner cycles
as well, because it prompts youto look within, if I'm thinking
(21:49):
okay, so we're in autumn now,aren't we?
The leaves are shedding on thetrees, the trees are drawing
their reserves inwards.
What about me?
Are my stores filled for winter, or am I feeling a bit spent
after the summer?
And as you start to get deeperin with this, it brings you much
(22:09):
more closely to yourself, Ibelieve, and when we do that,
then we just become reallypowerful as sensitives, because
we have the knowledge of what weneed.
I'm not saying we might find iteasy to give ourselves what we
need, but the first thing isawareness, isn't it?
Knowing where you are inyourself, in your body, in your
(22:30):
mind, your spirit is reallyimportant?
And I think, when you followthe seasons, that you definitely
become more in tune withyourself, and then that gives
you an opportunity to prevent orbe more proactive in avoiding
things like overwhelm,overstimulation and maybe
burnout, for example.
I definitely.
I mean, I still have momentswhere I wouldn't call it burnout
(22:53):
, like almost like a miniburnout, I guess, but nowhere
near like I used to before.
I was living in rhythm with theseasons.
I also think that it connectsus to nature, and we spend so
much time in our heads it's likewe forget that we are part of
nature.
So it's like let's get out ofour heads into nature, back into
(23:14):
our bodies, and then, yeah, wecan start to think at least
about giving ourselves what weneed.
April Snow (23:22):
I love it.
Such a beautiful way to comeback inward, not just to
yourself, but then to connectwith the natural rhythms.
Take those cues from nature.
I loved when you said the treesstart to pull inward and kind
of replenish themselves.
Go back and create somereserves.
We need to do that as well.
(23:43):
We really do.
Nichola Day (23:45):
We really do.
Yeah, I love autumn.
April Snow (23:48):
It's my favorite me too, it really is.
Nichola Day (23:50):
It's so beautiful, oh yes cozy, jumpers, candles,
an excuse to say no and justsnuggle up with a blanket.
Yeah, no, I love it.
I think it's also about, I feel, that for sensitive folk, the
way we respond to the seasons isdifferent.
So, for example, in springthere are these energies of like
(24:12):
renewal and growth and plantingseeds.
And whilst, yes, that energy isabout for sensitives, it can be
really draining the spring,because the spring is a
transition month.
It's about dragging yourselfout of the depths of winter,
getting going again, moving thatstagnancy, and we're really
(24:38):
sensitive to change andtransition, so allowing
ourselves the grace of moving atthe pace that we need.
There's no hurry.
In traditional folklore,following the wheel of the year,
spring, or the start of thegrowth season, if you like,
isn't actually until the springequinox, which is in March.
So how wonderful is that?
(25:00):
It's like a free pass all theway to March to just slowly
begin, rather than this 1st ofJanuary, new intentions, etc.
Got to get back on it.
There's this.
No, actually, yes, it is thestart of a new year in terms of
the Gregorian calendar, butactually January through to
(25:22):
March can be a really slow,beautiful transition and
actually it allows you to livemore intentionally it truly does
.
April Snow (25:31):
There's this permission to slow down.
You're right.
There is this pressure january1st, all of a sudden, okay, go,
go, go, renew yourself, make allthese changes, but if we can
allow ourselves to be in tunewith the natural rhythms, we
have months to transition.
Yeah, to come out of winter,because it is quite abrupt,
(25:52):
especially sensorially wise thebright lights and the change in
temperature and the coming outof our cocoons.
It's always so hard for me.
Nichola Day (26:01):
It's so hard for me too.
Yeah, it takes a while.
April Snow (26:05):
I'm curious if there's anything that you
personally do to help yourselfwith that coming out of
hibernation process yeah, I sothat January.
Nichola Day (26:18):
Well, actually right from December, really
December, through to probablythe end of February.
I have a real issue with themonth of February.
I don't know if it's just me.
I just don't enjoy it.
I try, but that whole thatthree month cycle, I spend a lot
of time in a reflection, sojournaling, which I also follow,
(26:39):
the lunar cycle as well, whichis really helpful for me to keep
touching base.
So you've got those touchpoints the new moon and the full
moon that you can keep touchingbase with yourself.
I will spend a lot of time inmeditation.
I will do a lot morerestorative practice, because
you just need quite a lot ofrest when you're transitioning.
I will start to bring in somemovement practices that are
(27:02):
particularly helpful at thattime, that are quite cleansing,
but it will be at a pace thatsuits me.
So, yeah, there'll be a lot ofquiet time.
I also really like going onsolitary walks at that time of
the year in particular.
I do this all through the year,but I do find it really
important and when, you know,when there's nothing on the
(27:22):
trees at all, everything's justa bit I don't like the word
bleak, just a bit stark.
And where I live, there aredifferent routes, that different
footpaths that I use atdifferent times of the year, and
the one that I use during thattime and it's only really at
that time because it gets tooovergrown the rest of the year
(27:42):
it gives me a really good vista.
It's like quite a big expanseof sky that I can see, and so it
kind of mirrors what I'mfeeling at that time, which is a
lot of kind of quiet, stillness, but also it gives me a feeling
of space.
That's just what I dopersonally, but it's, you know,
it's whatever you feel you need.
April Snow (28:01):
Yeah, but there's no rush yes, such a good thing to
hear there's no rush yeah.
I really I hadn't considerednecessarily tailoring the
self-care practice to theseasons.
There are certain rituals I'lldo with the new moon, with the
full moon, but just this, reallyseeing what could suit my
emotion, my needs, depending onwhat's going on in my external
(28:25):
world.
And I love this idea of takingdifferent walking paths to match
my mood at the season thatfeels really beautiful and just
attuning, slowing down, givingyourself that grace Really
really powerful.
Nichola Day (28:40):
Yeah, and I have like a little altar space.
I have multiple altar spaces,actually Same but I've got one
in like a family room where Ikind of gather got more outside
stuff inside I think, gatherbits and pieces.
It's just like a visualreminder of what's going on.
(29:01):
So at the moment I've gotabsolutely beautiful, you know,
like the lovely kind of deadseed heads of grasses and other
plants, so they're reallystructural, they've kind of gone
brown and I've got a piece ofwheat and stuff from the fields
and it just reminds me, okay,this time of year is about
harvest and it's just that touchpoint every time I see it what
(29:24):
am I harvesting from this yearand also what am I gathering in.
So just like little visualreminders.
And you can do that when you'reon your book, you can gather
your bits and pieces.
April Snow (29:35):
I always love, I have little stones from
different important places Ivisited or times of my life, and
we really do need those touchpoints, those visual reminders,
because it's one thing to writein a journal, but I think for
think for me at least, it's easyto forget what my intention has
(29:56):
been, but to have that cue,that almost this object to
remind me is so important.
Nichola Day (29:58):
Yes, yeah, yeah, and I actually I always notice
if I've been pulled away frommyself.
One of the things I'll noticeis oh, my altar is out of date.
I know it sounds silly, but ifmy altar is up to date, then I
know that I've touched base withmyself, because I have taken
(30:19):
the time to go out for a walk,I've taken time to select things
that mean something to me, thatare going to remind me
something about the journey thatI'm on, because we're all on a
journey, aren't we?
and I also think in doing thatit gives you a greater reverence
for a life actually, and that'sreally important those feelings
(30:40):
of I can't remember the name ofthe book now, it's probably
really obvious, but feelings ofawe and wonder.
We know we didn't really needthe research to tell us, but we
know that those feelings arereally important for feeling
good and reducing all of the notso nice bits of being human
it's true, we need thosepractices and reminders that
(31:04):
replenish us, especially assensitive, sensitive people.
April Snow (31:06):
We need that depth and we can look to our natural
environment around us to pullthat back in, to be that anchor
point.
And I'm the same way I can tellwhen I haven't been practicing
because my altar has beenuntouched and that could be
something else for someone elseif you don't have an altar Like,
(31:28):
have your running shoes beenpicked up?
Or whatever your practice is.
But yeah, just reminders tocome back home to ourselves.
So we're practicing seasonallyand I'm wondering if, let's say,
we have lost our practice, wehave maybe neglected those needs
, how can we come back to itwithout guilt or shame?
(31:51):
How can we allow ourselves justto come back and not worry
about having missed it?
Is there anything that helpsyou make that transition?
Nichola Day (31:58):
well, you know, I practice and teach mindfulness,
and a big part of that is aboutcompassion and cultivating that
for yourself, and I think it'sjust important to remember that
we're human.
We're gonna get pulled offcourse.
This is the whole point.
So it's just personally.
What I do is I just place ahand on my chest.
Anytime I notice I've gotpulled off center.
(32:20):
I'm like it's okay.
It's okay, honey, gonna happen,welcome back whenever you're
ready.
And you know, for me it might bejust stepping outside of the
studio where I'm in now, put myfeet on the ground If it's not
too muddy or cold, or againgoing out for a walk, or often
I'll come to my mat and just liedown my yoga mat.
(32:43):
I might practice some yoga toreconnect with my body, because
sometimes if you've been in yourhead and you've gotten pulled
away from yourself and I've donethis myself and I'll think like
I'm going on a walk, that'swhat I'm going to do, especially
if you're in an overthinkingloop you can walk that route and
(33:04):
not have attended to anythingon it.
You could have spent the wholetime in your head, and so if I'm
in one of those moments wheremy mind is really leading, I
will need to come back to mybody first, which is where I
might do a little bit of yoga orsome kind of somatic practice
(33:24):
and then I'll be like, okay, nowI can go out on a walk.
But yeah, I think first andforemost it's just remembering
you're human and being kind toyourself and just repeatedly
it's like being that innerparent, isn't it?
And the more you do it, theeasier it becomes.
And I think it's accessible foreverybody.
Even if you don't necessarilyfeel it yet, you can offer it.
(33:48):
You can think in your mind howwould I speak to my kid?
Or how would I speak to myfriend?
You can.
One of my teachers says fake ittill you make it.
You know you can give it a goand actually, over time, and the
body doesn't know if you placeyour hands on your chest, the
body doesn't know who it's fromor what it can receive it,
(34:11):
whether you're not quite thereyet, because I know that
self-love and kindness can bereally really hard, especially
if you've gotten into thosehabits of putting other people's
needs above your own or beingheavily critical of yourself.
It can be tricky as we do.
April Snow (34:28):
You know, you mentioned earlier, we're human
and it's okay to have these ebbsand flows.
That's something I have finallyjust softened into.
Like it's.
I'm going to be coming back andforth to my practices and
that's okay, and I think themost important part for me is
that I just I always find my wayback.
Nichola Day (34:47):
Yeah yeah.
The point of mindfulness is themoment you catch the mind
wandering off.
So the same goes for self-care.
You know, the point ofself-care is the moment you
notice you need it.
Of course you can dopreventative self-care if you
like, but it's okay to noticethat you've gone off.
That's, it's fine.
And we always I think we alwayswill, of course we will yeah
(35:11):
because we're we're having ahuman experience, we interact
with other people.
You know it's life is is noteasy.
April Snow (35:18):
It's not right and just that.
Can we create permission to bethose humans, having that human
experience?
Nichola Day (35:26):
I think also with the seasonal living, it gives
you greater understanding of ebband flow, because that's what's
happening in the season.
So over the summer, generally,people tend to be more out there
and more social, and so we canlose a little bit of thread of
connection to ourselves a littlebit, depending on how much you
(35:46):
want to socialize over thesummer, but generally we do.
I did, and I needed a lot ofalone time.
But knowing that and going in,knowing okay, it's this time of
year, this is what's going tohappen, but I'm going to pen in
a date with myself.
Or just when you get into thatpoint of, oh, okay, I've been
(36:09):
out in the world too much, youknow that's the turning point
where you go okay, it's time toreturn.
April Snow (36:17):
Right and just listening to that call.
Yeah.
Earlier, you mentioned thatwhen you get a little lost or
life has been a little hectic,you just come back to your body,
you get on your mat, you go fora walk, maybe put a hand on the
chest.
Can you say more about why thatpart is so important to
(36:37):
reconnect with our bodies?
Nichola Day (36:39):
that's where we experience everything, isn't it?
oh that's where we experienceeverything in our bodies.
It's where we experienceeverything.
But I think for me it startedwith I remember my first yoga
class.
Not my very first yoga classbecause that was when I was 16,
but my very first yoga class.
When I got back into it, it wasafter my first son, and I
(37:00):
remember that feeling of like,oh crikey, I'd completely
forgotten you.
Like as in talking to my body,wow, I've completely forgotten
you.
And in reconnecting with mybody, I really started to
realize how much I had been nothearing from it, you know gut
(37:27):
issues and really really veryhyper vigilant nervous system.
And so that was my first likerealization, and so I obviously
kept at it.
And then what happenedmagically was I started to feel
like what it was like when mynervous system was regulated,
(37:50):
and that was quite a newexperience for me.
And then what happens is youreconnected to your intuition,
and that's just.
It makes me feel emotional justthinking about it, because you
know, I think the whisper hadalways been there.
(38:10):
I think as a HSP, you can't notfeel that just a feeling, but
to then reconnect with your bodyand eventually then get so
connected you're in tune withyour intuition, it's really
powerful.
April Snow (38:28):
Because that's when I think it's when the HSP then
becomes really empowered yes,when you're in contact with that
inner wisdom, so important,it's what makes us us.
I think you know that depth ofexperience yes what, for you,
was so powerful about intuitionspecifically, was it?
(38:48):
What does that mean to you?
I'm curious, because obviouslyyou got, yeah, an emotional
reaction there.
I'm just curious what it is foryou.
Nichola Day (38:57):
I think it's about up until that point my life
really had been driven by otherpeople.
And it doesn't happen overnight.
The intuition doesn't suddenlygo right.
I think you should quit yourjob, do this, etc.
Etc.
But that return to my intuitionhas allowed a steady process of
(39:20):
me being the kind of author ofmy own life, if you like, and
making choices for myself.
And it's from that place whereyou can start to offer care and
compassion towards yourself.
It's so freeing.
It's freeing to live foryourself.
April Snow (39:37):
Yeah, like when the intuition is there.
It's a sign that you are backin your body, you are back in
the driver's seat of your ownlife, that you're able to live a
life in alignment with yourneeds.
It's such a symbol of so muchgoing right and I imagine being
able to access a lot more of thepositive experiences of being
(40:00):
highly sensitive, like beingmore intuitive or creative or
empathetic.
Yeah, because when we'redisconnected, we lose that.
I mean, it's like you said,it's so whisper, yeah, but it
can be hard to not only hear itbut to listen to it.
Definitely to let it guide you.
Nichola Day (40:16):
yeah, yeah, because it's so quiet and other
people's noise, if you like, isso much louder.
We're predisposed for that, sosensitive to what's going on
around us, but with that threadof perhaps getting caught in
people pleasing and maybe nothaving great boundaries and
covering up your own needs andall of that kind of stuff, it
(40:40):
magnifies the stuff out thereand it really diminishes it to a
very tiny little whisper.
And so when you startreconnecting back to that, I can
still feel there's a couple oflittle moments where I had these
kind of little real, connectingmoments that created quite
significant change in my life,where I can still feel that kind
(41:02):
of exhilaration of oh, wow,okay, this is what I need, this
is what I want and.
April Snow (41:12):
I actually can give myself permission to do that
yeah, not only you're hearing it, but you're responding to it,
honoring your needs in there.
Yeah, if you could leave uswith one message for anyone
who's wanting to live more inalignment with their needs,
who's wanting to listen to thoseinternal whispers, what would
(41:33):
that message?
Nichola Day (41:34):
be.
I think maybe just start simple.
Just start with somethingsimple, like any of the things
we've spoken about today.
Maybe it's just a solitary walkthat you plan in once a quarter
or a couple of times a quarter.
I really quite like theequinoxes and solstices as pause
points and where you mightlight yourself a candle and just
(41:56):
sit with your journal and justyou don't need to have any
agenda, just doodling freewriting.
There's a wealth of resourcesout there if you're looking for
something more structured.
But just starting simple by,yeah, getting outside, noticing
the change of the seasons.
Maybe, like we've talked about,you can be like a little I
(42:18):
don't know somebody gathering,foraging for bits and pieces
that you can place somewhere,just to remind you.
Yeah.
April Snow (42:26):
So just starting simple and, like we've said, it
doesn't matter if you get thrownoff, just allowing yourself to
do that and coming back when youcan yeah, that's it, starting
with where you are and allowingyourself to let it be imperfect
and show up in whatever way thatyou can, whether it's a five
minute walk, or it's a two hourwalk, or you're gathering
(42:49):
something.
Just on, maybe, the change ofthe season versus every full
moon.
Nichola Day (42:54):
Yeah, I was just gonna say, and not like feeling
like it's something that youshould do and oh, my god, it's
the solstice and I've not doneanything.
Just yeah, don't overcommitthat, don't you know?
Just think about, okay, what isdoable for me now, and let it
be something that's that feelslike a treat.
April Snow (43:16):
Love that, what is doable for me now, and let it be
an enjoyable treat, not a chore.
Yeah, yeah, thank you so muchfor that and this was a really
inspiring conversation.
It's not something I honestlyhave thought as much about,
although definitely someonewho's impacted by the seasons
and inspired, especially aswe're coming into a new season,
(43:38):
to bring more intention to thattransition and listen to my
needs.
I know others will enjoy thisconversation as well, and you
have lots of resources thatyou're sharing with us, which
I'm so grateful for.
You have a free autumnalself-care pack.
When folks sign up for youremail list, folks can join your
monthly sensitive soul space,which sounds really lovely, with
meditations, therapeutic yoga,other seasonal resources,
(44:01):
resources.
And then you're generouslyoffering 20 off your yoga
therapy packages with the codesensitive stories and I'm
wondering, nicola, if you couldshare a little bit more for
folks who don't know what isyoga therapy or what does that
look like working with you?
Nichola Day (44:14):
yeah, sure, I think it's still a fairly new
modality, but it's just honestly, it's just brilliant.
I think it's a brilliantmodality.
Obviously I'm going to say that, but I love it because it's
holistic, so it obviously looksat all layers of experience.
It's not just the body, it'sthe breath, your energy, your
(44:35):
mind, your emotions.
What's going on for youspiritually?
And so when I work with a yogatherapy client client, we spend
quite a lot of time just reallylooking at the person as a whole
.
In lots of conversation I dohave quite a long form that we
go through, because it justhelps me to build up a picture
so that we can understand what'sgoing on for them in their body
(44:57):
.
Are there any aches and painsthat they're struggling with?
What's going on in their mindspace and, crucially, when
working with sensitive andneurodivergent people, what are
their nuances, what are theirsensitivities, what are they
hoping to get out of it, what'stheir lifestyle?
Like a big, big picture.
And then what happens in yogatherapy and this is true for
(45:21):
whatever your specialism is, andmine happens to be in working
with neurodivergence is.
We can sort of cherry pick, ifyou like, the practices and
tools from the world of yoga andapply them for the client.
So adapt them for the clientand whatever their needs are.
It also allows us to look atthat person as a whole through
(45:45):
various yogic lenses.
So there's a lovely modelcalled the kosher model, for
example, which is one of the.
I don't know if you're familiarwith that.
April Snow (45:52):
If you're familiar in the world of yoga, I know
yoga, but I haven't heard ofthat one, so I'm curious to hear
a little bit more.
Nichola Day (45:58):
Yeah, there's a few different lenses from the world
of yoga, and this is one that Ilike to use because it
essentially looks at thedifferent layers of experience,
so the body, the breath, themind, space, emotions, your
intuitive body, and thensomething called the bliss body,
which is essentially like yoursoul or your sense of joy and
that kind of thing, and you canreally then start to see, okay,
(46:22):
well, which layer of thatexperience is needing some
support.
And so what I suggest orfacilitate in session really is
dictated by the client, both inthe session itself but also with
whatever their longer term goalis in mind, and it could be.
It could be movement, it couldbe kind of more yoga-y looking
(46:44):
things, if you like, it could bea meditation, it could be quite
a lot of talk actually, andjust looking at things and
bouncing, you know, allowingthem to offload something or
explore things.
Often, when I'm working withhighly sensitive people or
neurodivergent people it'susually women there's a couple
of themes that we work with.
(47:07):
Often it's about connectingthem back with their body and
that feeling of interoceptionand just kind of sensing
themselves, their energy, aswell as connecting them to their
emotional body, so helping themto understand what they're
feeling, connecting them totheir emotional body, so helping
them to understand what they'refeeling.
You know, when we get caught upin the heads we can lose touch
(47:27):
with oh actually I'm feeling,I'm actually feeling some shame
or whatever it might be andholding space for that to move
through the body, and there arevarious things that we might use
to help that move through.
Or it might just be holdingspace and seeing what happens.
So there's definitely thereconnection to the body.
There's also this common themeof helping people reconnect to
(47:52):
their intuitive wisdom as well,as we've already discussed, and
sometimes this tends to leadinto a little bit of parts work
as well.
That sometimes creeps in.
It depends on the client andwhere they're at, and then
ultimately, it's about workingwith that person to figure out
together self-care practices orlifestyle changes that are then
(48:15):
going to help that person moveforward in their lives, and it's
such a beautiful process.
April Snow (48:21):
I absolutely love it it sounds wonderful and just
perfect for anyone who'ssensitive or neurodivergent,
where you're really customizing,you're allowing yourself to
show up whatever way you need toand allow the practices to kind
of flow with what you'reexperiencing.
And I don't think we often getthat opportunity.
(48:43):
We're maybe putting ourselvesin a box, even in our healing
process.
So to have that space wherethere's fluidity, I imagine is
so healing.
Nichola Day (48:52):
Yeah, wonderful, yeah yeah, I feel like I said,
sometimes it's like a little bitof a jump start for folks if
life's gotten a little bitchaotic it's it's like sacred
space, where they can then kindof reconnect.
April Snow (49:03):
Yes, yes, sacred protected space.
Yeah, so important for us.
It really is.
Yeah, it really is.
Well, nicola, thank you so muchagain for this conversation
just thank you thanks so muchfor joining me and Nicola for
(49:24):
today's conversation.
My hope is that it will remindyou that you're more impacted by
seasonal changes as an HSP, andI also hope it inspires you to
take care of yourself inwhatever way is available to you
.
For more support inreconnecting with yourself, sign
up for Nicola's AutumnalSelf-Care Pack or join her for
(49:45):
yoga therapy.
You can use codeSENSITIVESTORIES for 20% off.
All the details are in the shownotes.
If you enjoyed this episode,subscribe to the Sensitive
Stories podcast so you don'tmiss our upcoming conversations.
Reviews and ratings are alsohelpful and appreciated For
behind-the-scenes content andmore HSP resources.
(50:07):
You can sign up for my emaillist or follow Sensitive
Strengths on Instagram, tiktokand YouTube.
Check out the show notes orsensitivestoriescom for all the
resources from today's episode.
Thanks for listening.
If you are sensitive to your environment,
then it makes sense to adapt howyou look after yourself
according to what is going onaround you.
April Snow (00:17):
Welcome to Sensitive Stories, the podcast for the
people who live with hearts andeyes wide open.
I'm your host, psychotherapistand author, april Snow.
I invite you to join me as Ideep dive into rich
conversations with fellow highlysensitive people that will
inspire you to live a morefulfilling life as an HSP
(00:39):
without all the overwhelm.
In this episode, I talk withNicola Day about adapting your
self-care practices to theseasons, allowing seasonal
changes to be a reminder to lookwithin and giving yourself
grace when life gets hectic.
Nicola is a yoga andmindfulness teacher and yoga
(01:00):
therapist with her own business,sensitive Yoga Therapy, based
in the UK.
She is highly sensitive andalso identifies as
neurodivergent.
She works to support othersensitives experiencing anxiety,
overwhelm and burnout toreconnect back with their bodies
, the natural world around themand their true, authentic selves
(01:20):
.
She offers a route back to thisthrough yoga mindfulness selves
.
She offers a route back to thisthrough yoga, mindfulness,
seasonal living and innerinquiry.
When she is not working, nicolaloves to read, walk amongst the
trees and gaze at the moon Formore HSP resources and to see
behind the scenes video from thepodcast.
Join me on Instagram, tiktok orYouTube at Sensitive Strengths
(01:44):
or sign up for my email list.
Links are in the show notes andat sensitivestoriescom.
And just a reminder that thisepisode is for educational
purposes only and is notintended as a substitute for
treatment with a mental healthor medical professional.
Let's dive in, nicola, can you?
Nichola Day (02:26):
start off by telling us how and when you
discovered that you're highlysensitive.
Yeah, sure, it's been a bit ofa double bounce, I guess because
I had my first introductionwhen well, I should start by
saying that I've always known Iwas different, but I think
everybody says that.
But when I had my first son,which which was 2011, he was
struggling, it was a difficultbirth and he was clearly very
(02:48):
sensitive.
I've now got two very sensitiveboys and I think it was a
friend who said, oh, I wonder ifhe's highly sensitive.
So I can't even rememberwhether I got a book or I
Googled it, but it was on myradar at that point and although
I looked at all of the criteriaand was like, oh, yes, yes, yes
, it just didn't land.
(03:09):
And I think you know, at thattime I was really struggling.
Actually, I was having a lot ofpanic attacks and anxiety, new
baby parenthood, and also he hadsome developmental delays as
well.
So was a lot going on and therewas just not space for me to
get into it, but it was in thebackground chugging along and at
(03:32):
the time as well, I should sayI was a primary school teacher,
so I don't know what that wouldtranslate to in the States.
But I was teaching like yearone and year two so it's five,
six, seven year olds and yeartwo, so it's five, six, seven
year olds and really enjoying itbut getting frequently burnt
out.
So I think at that point I'dgone down the route of like it
must be me and then hit a pointof like no, it can't be me.
(03:54):
So there's something about,although I love my job, it
doesn't love me.
So I made a completely radicaland I think a lot of HSPs say
this radical and I think a lotof HSPs say this.
I had, like this pivot momentwhere I decided I was going to
leave a stable job and become ayoga teacher and because I've
been working with kids, I sortof transitioned softly.
(04:15):
So I started off with teachingkids yoga and in that journey I
was on Facebook, just a randomlittle scrolling moment, and I
came across a person who hadcommented on somebody who I did
my education training with andthey just said, oh, I've left
education to become a kids yogateacher.
(04:38):
And, very unlike me, I messagedthem and anyway, it's a long
story short.
She's now one of my bestestfriends, but in that first
meeting she was like are you aHSP?
And I was like, oh my god.
And we spent hours just like,oh my gosh, yes, yes.
And so it was from that pointwhere, I think, because I'd left
(05:00):
education by that point and Ihad like a buddy now to swap
ideas with and talk about it,with that I had space to dive
into it.
And, yeah, true to my nature, Ijust dived into all of the
breeding and all of the researchon the internet and, yeah, I
ticked every single box.
(05:21):
And I think when you first findout as well, you go through this
phase of like wanting to tellthe world you know, like you
really do.
Did you know about this?
Did you know?
And, perhaps not unsurprisingly, my mum and my brother were not
too interested.
You know, like, oh yeah, yeah,I guess that's you, but to me it
was a really important moment.
So, yes, I was very grateful tomeet my bestie and kind of get
(05:45):
immersed into it, because yousuddenly feel and I know
everybody who's HSP when theyget that moment, they just feel
so seen and I just felt so seen.
And you know, I think a lot ofus are seekers and if you don't
have that language, certainly inmy home there was growing up,
there was none of this languageof like oh well, that's okay
(06:07):
that you find these kinds ofthings difficult because you're
an extra sensitive person orwhatever.
So, yeah, it was a real I guess, connecting back with myself
and knowing that it was okay andalso knowing that there was
other people out there like me.
April Snow (06:20):
Oh, it's when you were telling the part about oh,
I shared this with my family andthey weren't as excited about
it.
I think that's a lot of ourexperience, because it's so
meaningful and impactful tofinally know this is my
experience.
There's language, there's otherpeople that share this.
You know that feel deeply andit's life changing to have that
(06:41):
language.
But other people are like, yeah, you're more sensitive.
Ok, yeah, I was like right,come round for tea, guys,
life-changing to have thatlanguage.
But other people like, yeah,you're more sensitive, okay yeah
, I was like right, come aroundfor tea.
Nichola Day (06:48):
Guys, I'm gonna get out the quiz, let's go through
it together.
And then he's like no, I didn'tknow, I did the same thing.
April Snow (06:55):
I was in graduate school at the time and I gave it
to every one of the people atmy counseling center that I was
working with.
We just stood around and tookthe test.
You just want to share it.
You want to see who else is?
Nichola Day (07:04):
yeah, you do yeah, yeah, you can't help.
But then just see the entireworld through that lens and you
start going oh, I wonder ifthey're highly sensitive and
it's like this kind ofunderground society well, it
really is.
April Snow (07:18):
That's how I found out about was through a friend,
and then I hear so many otherstories like it just finds you
and I think your experience isso relatable in that a lot of
times we don't have the space totake it in, but when we do, we
just want to go all in, readeverything we can, talk to as
many people as we can.
Nichola Day (07:45):
Yeah, because it's like a thirst for understanding
yourself, because probably a lotof us not all of us, but some
of us, who perhaps didn't have asupportive environment growing
up, we've just kind of survivedwith whatever coping strategy
possible that there is thathunger, because suddenly you're
like, oh gosh, this is a way forme to understand myself.
Finally, and like I say becauseoften we've been, it's like an
hallelujah kind of moment, isn'tit?
April Snow (08:05):
It really is.
Yeah, looking for that.
What is it for me?
What is it about me?
That's different, and I wasn'tfinding what it was until I
discovered Dr Aaron's work.
I love that.
Yeah, we are seeking not justabout ourselves, but about
meeting and life and the world.
Nichola Day (08:23):
Well, this is like the deep thinking, isn't it?
You know, like we, we're gonnabe thinking, or maybe it's
worthwhile thinking, but youknow it comes with the territory
it really does, and so youshare with me that you've also
been diagnosed with adhd andautism.
April Snow (08:38):
So I'm curious what your experience has been, if we
zoom out, with having multipleforms of neurodivergent what is
that?
Nichola Day (08:44):
like well, yeah, I guess it's not been an easy
journey, if I'm honest, and I'mstill very much in it, because
it's not that long ago that Iwas diagnosed, although I knew
yes, I knew which partly to dowith my kids seeing their
(09:04):
neurodivergence play out and, Iguess, a wealth of experience as
well of working withneurodivergent folk.
I think the thing is, when Ikind of didn't really think
about autism or ADHD and I wasjust kind of in my HSP world, I,
you know, I said to my friendswho are in this kind of bubble,
(09:25):
and my husband, who's alsohighly sensitive, I think I must
be just a really extreme HSPand I feel like that's quite a
common thing with women who arebeing late diagnosed.
Yeah, definitely, and all theHSP criteria, all of those
elements of being HSP 100%, I,I'm all in.
There were certain things thatI couldn't explain and I
(09:51):
remember asking quite a fewprofessionals and other people
in the field, like you knowwhat's the crossover here
particularly, I kind of wentmore towards the autism side to
begin with, but both my childrenalso have ADHD, so I had to you
know side to begin with, butboth my children also have ADHD,
so I had to, you know, becurious about that, and I went
deep into therapy as well my owntherapy.
(10:12):
I still see my therapist todayand there was these little
questions like okay, so how muchof this is my HSP-ness, if you
like, and how much of this isearly trauma and how much of
this is something else althoughwe weren't talking about it but
it was in the room.
So things like eye contact, forexample, I find really
(10:36):
difficult and I actually don'tgive eye contact.
I always look at people'smouths and I raise this in
therapy and she's like okay,let's just invite this in.
You know it could be to do withthis blah, blah, blah and just
little things like that that youknow.
I'd kind of got something in mymind to explore and I think the
(10:57):
difficulty I found in startingto seek that out is the inherent
problem with labels, actually,because labels can be really
helpful and I do believe inbeing able to have labels.
Particularly if you have been ina minority group, you need a
way to be able to advocate foryourself and labels can be
really helpful for that.
(11:19):
My case sometimes, and still now, I can feel like the labels of
HSP, autism, adhd are like theirboxes and actually when humans
aren't boxes and there's no hardlines, and I've spent far too
many minutes hours I wouldn'tcare to add it up of how much I
(11:43):
have researched the overlapbetween mostly being highly
sensitive and autism, andthere's lots of opinions about
that and I guess my livedexperience is that it's both.
(12:09):
This is my kind of feeling on itis that there's a collection of
traits with huge similarities,little differences here and
there, and I think it'sperfectly okay that these
overlap and you can feel thatthose labels describe elements
of yourself, you know.
So, yeah, I'm still very muchin it, if I'm totally honest,
and I'm still wading my way.
If I'm totally honest, I'mstill wading my way through.
But I do think there is thisproblem with boxes and trying to
(12:30):
squeeze people in, and I alsothink that there is a problem
with us sticking hard and fastto those boxes in the
professional world as well,because I just don't think it's
helpful for people.
April Snow (12:42):
It's really not helpful.
And how can we ever completelytease apart someone's
characteristics?
It's impossible.
And high sensitivity, autism,adhd.
There are so many overlaps andwhat happens is we often end up
fighting that, oh, I'm this orthat.
Well, I think we're sharingexperiences here.
(13:03):
Why are we battling each other?
It always is so, yeah,concerning for me that we feel
like we have to be all this orall that.
There's no overlap, but thereis a lot of overlap.
Yeah, right, I think we'regoing to find we're all kind of
related in these characteristics.
Nichola Day (13:18):
So I was laughing because I was thinking that is
really quite typical black andwhite thinking and that is
something that I can find quitedifficult actually, and yeah,
it's been helpful for me to dothe research and actually come
to a really good place offeeling like actually, no,
there's multiple shades of greyand it's just tricky trying to
(13:44):
find, or perhaps not being ableto get hold of, the right
information, particularly ifyou've been raised female.
It's so difficult to spot, mostlikely because of people
pleasing and masking behaviors,and so I think this is probably
you know where I'm at.
I'm still kind of unpickingthat now and just trying to.
You know where I'm at.
I'm still kind of I'm pickingthat now and just trying to yeah
(14:06):
, figure it out.
April Snow (14:06):
Yeah, it's true.
Unfortunately, women are oftenunderrepresented in studies, and
so we often have a differentexperience, and it does make it
problematic to figure out what'sgoing on for me, because we
only have one version that'sbeen defined and is assumed to
be the only way, and we'rerealizing now there's lots of
(14:28):
presentations not just forautism, but for high sensitivity
and for any type ofneurodivergence, and so we
really need to expand our viewas much as we can, and I think
this was the turning point forme was, I think, also it raises
how much kind of inherentableism we have within ourselves
(14:50):
that we just we're not and thisis helping me bring it to the
surface really these kind ofpreconceived ideas about what
ADHD is, what autism is.
Nichola Day (14:58):
And even now, even though I've done huge amounts of
reading and from people withdifferent lived experiences of
different types ofneurodivergence, it's still
there.
I still have to challenge thatoccasionally and go oh, hang on,
just check yourself there, nick, because that's not quite right
, is it?
It might not present like that.
So, yeah, yeah, lots oflearning.
April Snow (15:20):
Yes and yeah, deconstructing these
misconceptions.
We have no-transcript as aneurodivergent person,
(15:49):
Absolutely.
Nichola Day (15:50):
This is what I really really try to advocate
for is like actually it's.
I mean, my husband uses thisidea in our household that we're
all neurodivergent but we allhave a slightly different recipe
and it is a little bit likethat.
But we all have a slightlydifferent recipe and it is a
little bit like that.
You know different ingredientsbut we're, you know, under this
neurodivergent umbrella and Ireally like that.
I think the you know, whilst Iabsolutely want to be positive
(16:20):
and neuro affirming about all ofthese things, there's also the
issue of like it being adisability.
So autism and ADHD being adisability, and there's a fine
balance to be had between, yeah,but in accepting that, really,
because on the one hand, I'maware that I have the privilege
of being able to mask, of, youknow, of being able to go out
(16:43):
into the world and reasonablyaccess it, but on the other end
of the spectrum, there areoccasions when I do feel quite
disabled.
A lot of that is down tosociety's accommodate I don't
even like the wordaccommodations, I can't even
think of the right word butunderstanding, we just need to
broaden our horizons you know wereally do so.
April Snow (17:05):
There's more room for people to exist in different
ways and there's more supportslike we're put in such a narrow
box of.
This is how you function, thisis how you show up in the world
and I think everyone who'sneurodivergent struggles with
that in some way, depending youknow some more than others,
depending on how well you canmask, how high functioning you
(17:26):
are.
But we really do need space.
I think a lot of us aresuffering at different levels or
maybe not even feeling like youcan function because there's
accommodations or whatever youwant to call it, just permission
to live differently.
It's not there.
Nichola Day (17:40):
It's challenging in many situations you're just.
There's just an assumption ofthat.
You're typical.
Whatever, that is right, yeahit's true.
So in a way when you're onneurodivergent and it's
invisible.
If you see what I mean, youhave to.
(18:02):
You just have to work so muchharder to advocate for yourself.
I do this all the time with mychildren, you know they may look
like they're accessing school,okay, but actually at home, when
they come home from school,it's like.
I don't know if you've seenthese memes on socials where
it's like a firefighter puttingout a crazy blaze, like after
(18:26):
school.
It's like, okay, how can Iregulate them ready for the next
day at school?
You know these are veryinvisible, right?
Just?
April Snow (18:35):
think about how much they've had to suppress all day
long to fit in right and seethis with a lot of kids.
I don't have any of my own kids,but see this a lot with kids
that are in my life, where theyjust fall apart once they get
home.
You know, they've just beenholding in so much all day long.
Finally they can just let theiremotions out, they can unmask,
and unfortunately, a lot oftimes these kids without
(18:57):
knowledgeable parents getlabeled as having behavioral
issues or mental health issues,when really they just maybe need
some different supports andyeah, it can be tough.
Thankfully, you are sounds likea very affirming household and
your kids have space I'mlaughing because it is really
(19:18):
challenging.
Nichola Day (19:19):
Sure, four of us are all neurodivergent and we
have these moments where ourneurodivergence is riffing off
each other and we're just havinga ball and it's awesome.
And then there's the others,but times when usually it's like
sensory issues are clashing, oryou know, I've got one child
that just like to make it look,maybe stims with his voice, and
(19:42):
then another that'shypersensitive to noise, for
example.
That was just one and, yeah,just things like that.
April Snow (19:50):
When they clash, the ebbs and flows are epic right,
everyone is trying to get theirneeds met, but sometimes
triggering the others.
Yeah, yeah so speaking on thisstuff, I want to transition to
how do we take care of ourselves, right as in order todivergent
people as sensitive people, andI know you really think about
(20:11):
self-care in a seasonalperspective.
So why is it helpful for us toapproach how we care for
ourselves seasonally?
I'm really curious to hear moreabout that.
Nichola Day (20:22):
I'm so passionate about this because I've just
basically it's how I've kind offigured out how to look after
myself and my kids too, just ona very basic level.
If you are sensitive to yourenvironment, then it makes sense
to adapt how you look afteryourself according to what is
going on around you.
(20:42):
And I talk a lot about how eachmonth and each season comes
with its own challenges, if youlike, sensory challenges,
potentials.
And I always think, if you havethat knowledge, then you're
forewarned, aren't you?
So you can think, oh, ok, yes,june, july, the light is really
(21:06):
bright, so I'm just going tomake sure that I have multiple
shades in my car, in my bag, andmaybe, for my part of a
self-care routine, I might liedown and put an eye mask on for
a little bit.
And so, yeah, just on a verybasic level, we need to adapt to
(21:26):
our environment more so, Ibelieve, believe I think it's
good for everybody, but I thinkmore so if you're extra
sensitive.
And the other thing that Ifound is that by working
seasonally and, yeah, going withthe rhythm of the seasons, I
automatically then become moreconnected to my own inner cycles
as well, because it prompts youto look within, if I'm thinking
(21:49):
okay, so we're in autumn now,aren't we?
The leaves are shedding on thetrees, the trees are drawing
their reserves inwards.
What about me?
Are my stores filled for winter, or am I feeling a bit spent
after the summer?
And as you start to get deeperin with this, it brings you much
(22:09):
more closely to yourself, Ibelieve, and when we do that,
then we just become reallypowerful as sensitives, because
we have the knowledge of what weneed.
I'm not saying we might find iteasy to give ourselves what we
need, but the first thing isawareness, isn't it?
Knowing where you are inyourself, in your body, in your
(22:30):
mind, your spirit is reallyimportant?
And I think, when you followthe seasons, that you definitely
become more in tune withyourself, and then that gives
you an opportunity to prevent orbe more proactive in avoiding
things like overwhelm,overstimulation and maybe
burnout, for example.
I definitely.
I mean, I still have momentswhere I wouldn't call it burnout
(22:53):
, like almost like a miniburnout, I guess, but nowhere
near like I used to before.
I was living in rhythm with theseasons.
I also think that it connectsus to nature, and we spend so
much time in our heads it's likewe forget that we are part of
nature.
So it's like let's get out ofour heads into nature, back into
(23:14):
our bodies, and then, yeah, wecan start to think at least
about giving ourselves what weneed.
April Snow (23:22):
I love it.
Such a beautiful way to comeback inward, not just to
yourself, but then to connectwith the natural rhythms.
Take those cues from nature.
I loved when you said the treesstart to pull inward and kind
of replenish themselves.
Go back and create somereserves.
We need to do that as well.
(23:43):
We really do.
Nichola Day (23:45):
We really do.
Yeah, I love autumn.
April Snow (23:48):
It's my favorite me too, it really is.
Nichola Day (23:50):
It's so beautiful, oh yes cozy, jumpers, candles,
an excuse to say no and justsnuggle up with a blanket.
Yeah, no, I love it.
I think it's also about, I feel, that for sensitive folk, the
way we respond to the seasons isdifferent.
So, for example, in springthere are these energies of like
(24:12):
renewal and growth and plantingseeds.
And whilst, yes, that energy isabout for sensitives, it can be
really draining the spring,because the spring is a
transition month.
It's about dragging yourselfout of the depths of winter,
getting going again, moving thatstagnancy, and we're really
(24:38):
sensitive to change andtransition, so allowing
ourselves the grace of moving atthe pace that we need.
There's no hurry.
In traditional folklore,following the wheel of the year,
spring, or the start of thegrowth season, if you like,
isn't actually until the springequinox, which is in March.
So how wonderful is that?
(25:00):
It's like a free pass all theway to March to just slowly
begin, rather than this 1st ofJanuary, new intentions, etc.
Got to get back on it.
There's this.
No, actually, yes, it is thestart of a new year in terms of
the Gregorian calendar, butactually January through to
(25:22):
March can be a really slow,beautiful transition and
actually it allows you to livemore intentionally it truly does
.
April Snow (25:31):
There's this permission to slow down.
You're right.
There is this pressure january1st, all of a sudden, okay, go,
go, go, renew yourself, make allthese changes, but if we can
allow ourselves to be in tunewith the natural rhythms, we
have months to transition.
Yeah, to come out of winter,because it is quite abrupt,
(25:52):
especially sensorially wise thebright lights and the change in
temperature and the coming outof our cocoons.
It's always so hard for me.
Nichola Day (26:01):
It's so hard for me too.
Yeah, it takes a while.
April Snow (26:05):
I'm curious if there's anything that you
personally do to help yourselfwith that coming out of
hibernation process yeah, I sothat January.
Nichola Day (26:18):
Well, actually right from December, really
December, through to probablythe end of February.
I have a real issue with themonth of February.
I don't know if it's just me.
I just don't enjoy it.
I try, but that whole thatthree month cycle, I spend a lot
of time in a reflection, sojournaling, which I also follow,
(26:39):
the lunar cycle as well, whichis really helpful for me to keep
touching base.
So you've got those touchpoints the new moon and the full
moon that you can keep touchingbase with yourself.
I will spend a lot of time inmeditation.
I will do a lot morerestorative practice, because
you just need quite a lot ofrest when you're transitioning.
I will start to bring in somemovement practices that are
(27:02):
particularly helpful at thattime, that are quite cleansing,
but it will be at a pace thatsuits me.
So, yeah, there'll be a lot ofquiet time.
I also really like going onsolitary walks at that time of
the year in particular.
I do this all through the year,but I do find it really
important and when, you know,when there's nothing on the
(27:22):
trees at all, everything's justa bit I don't like the word
bleak, just a bit stark.
And where I live, there aredifferent routes, that different
footpaths that I use atdifferent times of the year, and
the one that I use during thattime and it's only really at
that time because it gets tooovergrown the rest of the year
(27:42):
it gives me a really good vista.
It's like quite a big expanseof sky that I can see, and so it
kind of mirrors what I'mfeeling at that time, which is a
lot of kind of quiet, stillness, but also it gives me a feeling
of space.
That's just what I dopersonally, but it's, you know,
it's whatever you feel you need.
April Snow (28:01):
Yeah, but there's no rush yes, such a good thing to
hear there's no rush yeah.
I really I hadn't considerednecessarily tailoring the
self-care practice to theseasons.
There are certain rituals I'lldo with the new moon, with the
full moon, but just this, reallyseeing what could suit my
emotion, my needs, depending onwhat's going on in my external
(28:25):
world.
And I love this idea of takingdifferent walking paths to match
my mood at the season thatfeels really beautiful and just
attuning, slowing down, givingyourself that grace Really
really powerful.
Nichola Day (28:40):
Yeah, and I have like a little altar space.
I have multiple altar spaces,actually Same but I've got one
in like a family room where Ikind of gather got more outside
stuff inside I think, gatherbits and pieces.
It's just like a visualreminder of what's going on.
(29:01):
So at the moment I've gotabsolutely beautiful, you know,
like the lovely kind of deadseed heads of grasses and other
plants, so they're reallystructural, they've kind of gone
brown and I've got a piece ofwheat and stuff from the fields
and it just reminds me, okay,this time of year is about
harvest and it's just that touchpoint every time I see it what
(29:24):
am I harvesting from this yearand also what am I gathering in.
So just like little visualreminders.
And you can do that when you'reon your book, you can gather
your bits and pieces.
April Snow (29:35):
I always love, I have little stones from
different important places Ivisited or times of my life, and
we really do need those touchpoints, those visual reminders,
because it's one thing to writein a journal, but I think for
think for me at least, it's easyto forget what my intention has
(29:56):
been, but to have that cue,that almost this object to
remind me is so important.
Nichola Day (29:58):
Yes, yeah, yeah, and I actually I always notice
if I've been pulled away frommyself.
One of the things I'll noticeis oh, my altar is out of date.
I know it sounds silly, but ifmy altar is up to date, then I
know that I've touched base withmyself, because I have taken
(30:19):
the time to go out for a walk,I've taken time to select things
that mean something to me, thatare going to remind me
something about the journey thatI'm on, because we're all on a
journey, aren't we?
and I also think in doing thatit gives you a greater reverence
for a life actually, and that'sreally important those feelings
(30:40):
of I can't remember the name ofthe book now, it's probably
really obvious, but feelings ofawe and wonder.
We know we didn't really needthe research to tell us, but we
know that those feelings arereally important for feeling
good and reducing all of the notso nice bits of being human
it's true, we need thosepractices and reminders that
(31:04):
replenish us, especially assensitive, sensitive people.
April Snow (31:06):
We need that depth and we can look to our natural
environment around us to pullthat back in, to be that anchor
point.
And I'm the same way I can tellwhen I haven't been practicing
because my altar has beenuntouched and that could be
something else for someone elseif you don't have an altar Like,
(31:28):
have your running shoes beenpicked up?
Or whatever your practice is.
But yeah, just reminders tocome back home to ourselves.
So we're practicing seasonallyand I'm wondering if, let's say,
we have lost our practice, wehave maybe neglected those needs
, how can we come back to itwithout guilt or shame?
(31:51):
How can we allow ourselves justto come back and not worry
about having missed it?
Is there anything that helpsyou make that transition?
Nichola Day (31:58):
well, you know, I practice and teach mindfulness,
and a big part of that is aboutcompassion and cultivating that
for yourself, and I think it'sjust important to remember that
we're human.
We're gonna get pulled offcourse.
This is the whole point.
So it's just personally.
What I do is I just place ahand on my chest.
Anytime I notice I've gotpulled off center.
(32:20):
I'm like it's okay.
It's okay, honey, gonna happen,welcome back whenever you're
ready.
And you know, for me it might bejust stepping outside of the
studio where I'm in now, put myfeet on the ground If it's not
too muddy or cold, or againgoing out for a walk, or often
I'll come to my mat and just liedown my yoga mat.
(32:43):
I might practice some yoga toreconnect with my body, because
sometimes if you've been in yourhead and you've gotten pulled
away from yourself and I've donethis myself and I'll think like
I'm going on a walk, that'swhat I'm going to do, especially
if you're in an overthinkingloop you can walk that route and
(33:04):
not have attended to anythingon it.
You could have spent the wholetime in your head, and so if I'm
in one of those moments wheremy mind is really leading, I
will need to come back to mybody first, which is where I
might do a little bit of yoga orsome kind of somatic practice
(33:24):
and then I'll be like, okay, nowI can go out on a walk.
But yeah, I think first andforemost it's just remembering
you're human and being kind toyourself and just repeatedly
it's like being that innerparent, isn't it?
And the more you do it, theeasier it becomes.
And I think it's accessible foreverybody.
Even if you don't necessarilyfeel it yet, you can offer it.
(33:48):
You can think in your mind howwould I speak to my kid?
Or how would I speak to myfriend?
You can.
One of my teachers says fake ittill you make it.
You know you can give it a goand actually, over time, and the
body doesn't know if you placeyour hands on your chest, the
body doesn't know who it's fromor what it can receive it,
(34:11):
whether you're not quite thereyet, because I know that
self-love and kindness can bereally really hard, especially
if you've gotten into thosehabits of putting other people's
needs above your own or beingheavily critical of yourself.
It can be tricky as we do.
April Snow (34:28):
You know, you mentioned earlier, we're human
and it's okay to have these ebbsand flows.
That's something I have finallyjust softened into.
Like it's.
I'm going to be coming back andforth to my practices and
that's okay, and I think themost important part for me is
that I just I always find my wayback.
Nichola Day (34:47):
Yeah yeah.
The point of mindfulness is themoment you catch the mind
wandering off.
So the same goes for self-care.
You know, the point ofself-care is the moment you
notice you need it.
Of course you can dopreventative self-care if you
like, but it's okay to noticethat you've gone off.
That's, it's fine.
And we always I think we alwayswill, of course we will yeah
(35:11):
because we're we're having ahuman experience, we interact
with other people.
You know it's life is is noteasy.
April Snow (35:18):
It's not right and just that.
Can we create permission to bethose humans, having that human
experience?
Nichola Day (35:26):
I think also with the seasonal living, it gives
you greater understanding of ebband flow, because that's what's
happening in the season.
So over the summer, generally,people tend to be more out there
and more social, and so we canlose a little bit of thread of
connection to ourselves a littlebit, depending on how much you
(35:46):
want to socialize over thesummer, but generally we do.
I did, and I needed a lot ofalone time.
But knowing that and going in,knowing okay, it's this time of
year, this is what's going tohappen, but I'm going to pen in
a date with myself.
Or just when you get into thatpoint of, oh, okay, I've been
(36:09):
out in the world too much, youknow that's the turning point
where you go okay, it's time toreturn.
April Snow (36:17):
Right and just listening to that call.
Yeah.
Earlier, you mentioned thatwhen you get a little lost or
life has been a little hectic,you just come back to your body,
you get on your mat, you go fora walk, maybe put a hand on the
chest.
Can you say more about why thatpart is so important to
(36:37):
reconnect with our bodies?
Nichola Day (36:39):
that's where we experience everything, isn't it?
oh that's where we experienceeverything in our bodies.
It's where we experienceeverything.
But I think for me it startedwith I remember my first yoga
class.
Not my very first yoga classbecause that was when I was 16,
but my very first yoga class.
When I got back into it, it wasafter my first son, and I
(37:00):
remember that feeling of like,oh crikey, I'd completely
forgotten you.
Like as in talking to my body,wow, I've completely forgotten
you.
And in reconnecting with mybody, I really started to
realize how much I had been nothearing from it, you know gut
(37:27):
issues and really really veryhyper vigilant nervous system.
And so that was my first likerealization, and so I obviously
kept at it.
And then what happenedmagically was I started to feel
like what it was like when mynervous system was regulated,
(37:50):
and that was quite a newexperience for me.
And then what happens is youreconnected to your intuition,
and that's just.
It makes me feel emotional justthinking about it, because you
know, I think the whisper hadalways been there.
(38:10):
I think as a HSP, you can't notfeel that just a feeling, but
to then reconnect with your bodyand eventually then get so
connected you're in tune withyour intuition, it's really
powerful.
April Snow (38:28):
Because that's when I think it's when the HSP then
becomes really empowered yes,when you're in contact with that
inner wisdom, so important,it's what makes us us.
I think you know that depth ofexperience yes what, for you,
was so powerful about intuitionspecifically, was it?
(38:48):
What does that mean to you?
I'm curious, because obviouslyyou got, yeah, an emotional
reaction there.
I'm just curious what it is foryou.
Nichola Day (38:57):
I think it's about up until that point my life
really had been driven by otherpeople.
And it doesn't happen overnight.
The intuition doesn't suddenlygo right.
I think you should quit yourjob, do this, etc.
Etc.
But that return to my intuitionhas allowed a steady process of
(39:20):
me being the kind of author ofmy own life, if you like, and
making choices for myself.
And it's from that place whereyou can start to offer care and
compassion towards yourself.
It's so freeing.
It's freeing to live foryourself.
April Snow (39:37):
Yeah, like when the intuition is there.
It's a sign that you are backin your body, you are back in
the driver's seat of your ownlife, that you're able to live a
life in alignment with yourneeds.
It's such a symbol of so muchgoing right and I imagine being
able to access a lot more of thepositive experiences of being
(40:00):
highly sensitive, like beingmore intuitive or creative or
empathetic.
Yeah, because when we'redisconnected, we lose that.
I mean, it's like you said,it's so whisper, yeah, but it
can be hard to not only hear itbut to listen to it.
Definitely to let it guide you.
Nichola Day (40:16):
yeah, yeah, because it's so quiet and other
people's noise, if you like, isso much louder.
We're predisposed for that, sosensitive to what's going on
around us, but with that threadof perhaps getting caught in
people pleasing and maybe nothaving great boundaries and
covering up your own needs andall of that kind of stuff, it
(40:40):
magnifies the stuff out thereand it really diminishes it to a
very tiny little whisper.
And so when you startreconnecting back to that, I can
still feel there's a couple oflittle moments where I had these
kind of little real, connectingmoments that created quite
significant change in my life,where I can still feel that kind
(41:02):
of exhilaration of oh, wow,okay, this is what I need, this
is what I want and.
April Snow (41:12):
I actually can give myself permission to do that
yeah, not only you're hearing it, but you're responding to it,
honoring your needs in there.
Yeah, if you could leave uswith one message for anyone
who's wanting to live more inalignment with their needs,
who's wanting to listen to thoseinternal whispers, what would
(41:33):
that message?
Nichola Day (41:34):
be.
I think maybe just start simple.
Just start with somethingsimple, like any of the things
we've spoken about today.
Maybe it's just a solitary walkthat you plan in once a quarter
or a couple of times a quarter.
I really quite like theequinoxes and solstices as pause
points and where you mightlight yourself a candle and just
(41:56):
sit with your journal and justyou don't need to have any
agenda, just doodling freewriting.
There's a wealth of resourcesout there if you're looking for
something more structured.
But just starting simple by,yeah, getting outside, noticing
the change of the seasons.
Maybe, like we've talked about,you can be like a little I
(42:18):
don't know somebody gathering,foraging for bits and pieces
that you can place somewhere,just to remind you.
Yeah.
April Snow (42:26):
So just starting simple and, like we've said, it
doesn't matter if you get thrownoff, just allowing yourself to
do that and coming back when youcan yeah, that's it, starting
with where you are and allowingyourself to let it be imperfect
and show up in whatever way thatyou can, whether it's a five
minute walk, or it's a two hourwalk, or you're gathering
(42:49):
something.
Just on, maybe, the change ofthe season versus every full
moon.
Nichola Day (42:54):
Yeah, I was just gonna say, and not like feeling
like it's something that youshould do and oh, my god, it's
the solstice and I've not doneanything.
Just yeah, don't overcommitthat, don't you know?
Just think about, okay, what isdoable for me now, and let it
be something that's that feelslike a treat.
April Snow (43:16):
Love that, what is doable for me now, and let it be
an enjoyable treat, not a chore.
Yeah, yeah, thank you so muchfor that and this was a really
inspiring conversation.
It's not something I honestlyhave thought as much about,
although definitely someonewho's impacted by the seasons
and inspired, especially aswe're coming into a new season,
(43:38):
to bring more intention to thattransition and listen to my
needs.
I know others will enjoy thisconversation as well, and you
have lots of resources thatyou're sharing with us, which
I'm so grateful for.
You have a free autumnalself-care pack.
When folks sign up for youremail list, folks can join your
monthly sensitive soul space,which sounds really lovely, with
meditations, therapeutic yoga,other seasonal resources,
(44:01):
resources.
And then you're generouslyoffering 20 off your yoga
therapy packages with the codesensitive stories and I'm
wondering, nicola, if you couldshare a little bit more for
folks who don't know what isyoga therapy or what does that
look like working with you?
Nichola Day (44:14):
yeah, sure, I think it's still a fairly new
modality, but it's just honestly, it's just brilliant.
I think it's a brilliantmodality.
Obviously I'm going to say that, but I love it because it's
holistic, so it obviously looksat all layers of experience.
It's not just the body, it'sthe breath, your energy, your
(44:35):
mind, your emotions.
What's going on for youspiritually?
And so when I work with a yogatherapy client client, we spend
quite a lot of time just reallylooking at the person as a whole
.
In lots of conversation I dohave quite a long form that we
go through, because it justhelps me to build up a picture
so that we can understand what'sgoing on for them in their body
(44:57):
.
Are there any aches and painsthat they're struggling with?
What's going on in their mindspace and, crucially, when
working with sensitive andneurodivergent people, what are
their nuances, what are theirsensitivities, what are they
hoping to get out of it, what'stheir lifestyle?
Like a big, big picture.
And then what happens in yogatherapy and this is true for
(45:21):
whatever your specialism is, andmine happens to be in working
with neurodivergence is.
We can sort of cherry pick, ifyou like, the practices and
tools from the world of yoga andapply them for the client.
So adapt them for the clientand whatever their needs are.
It also allows us to look atthat person as a whole through
(45:45):
various yogic lenses.
So there's a lovely modelcalled the kosher model, for
example, which is one of the.
I don't know if you're familiarwith that.
April Snow (45:52):
If you're familiar in the world of yoga, I know
yoga, but I haven't heard ofthat one, so I'm curious to hear
a little bit more.
Nichola Day (45:58):
Yeah, there's a few different lenses from the world
of yoga, and this is one that Ilike to use because it
essentially looks at thedifferent layers of experience,
so the body, the breath, themind, space, emotions, your
intuitive body, and thensomething called the bliss body,
which is essentially like yoursoul or your sense of joy and
that kind of thing, and you canreally then start to see, okay,
(46:22):
well, which layer of thatexperience is needing some
support.
And so what I suggest orfacilitate in session really is
dictated by the client, both inthe session itself but also with
whatever their longer term goalis in mind, and it could be.
It could be movement, it couldbe kind of more yoga-y looking
(46:44):
things, if you like, it could bea meditation, it could be quite
a lot of talk actually, andjust looking at things and
bouncing, you know, allowingthem to offload something or
explore things.
Often, when I'm working withhighly sensitive people or
neurodivergent people it'susually women there's a couple
of themes that we work with.
(47:07):
Often it's about connectingthem back with their body and
that feeling of interoceptionand just kind of sensing
themselves, their energy, aswell as connecting them to their
emotional body, so helping themto understand what they're
feeling, connecting them totheir emotional body, so helping
them to understand what they'refeeling.
You know, when we get caught upin the heads we can lose touch
(47:27):
with oh actually I'm feeling,I'm actually feeling some shame
or whatever it might be andholding space for that to move
through the body, and there arevarious things that we might use
to help that move through.
Or it might just be holdingspace and seeing what happens.
So there's definitely thereconnection to the body.
There's also this common themeof helping people reconnect to
(47:52):
their intuitive wisdom as well,as we've already discussed, and
sometimes this tends to leadinto a little bit of parts work
as well.
That sometimes creeps in.
It depends on the client andwhere they're at, and then
ultimately, it's about workingwith that person to figure out
together self-care practices orlifestyle changes that are then
(48:15):
going to help that person moveforward in their lives, and it's
such a beautiful process.
April Snow (48:21):
I absolutely love it it sounds wonderful and just
perfect for anyone who'ssensitive or neurodivergent,
where you're really customizing,you're allowing yourself to
show up whatever way you need toand allow the practices to kind
of flow with what you'reexperiencing.
And I don't think we often getthat opportunity.
(48:43):
We're maybe putting ourselvesin a box, even in our healing
process.
So to have that space wherethere's fluidity, I imagine is
so healing.
Nichola Day (48:52):
Yeah, wonderful, yeah yeah, I feel like I said,
sometimes it's like a little bitof a jump start for folks if
life's gotten a little bitchaotic it's it's like sacred
space, where they can then kindof reconnect.
April Snow (49:03):
Yes, yes, sacred protected space.
Yeah, so important for us.
It really is.
Yeah, it really is.
Well, nicola, thank you so muchagain for this conversation
just thank you thanks so muchfor joining me and Nicola for
(49:24):
today's conversation.
My hope is that it will remindyou that you're more impacted by
seasonal changes as an HSP, andI also hope it inspires you to
take care of yourself inwhatever way is available to you
.
For more support inreconnecting with yourself, sign
up for Nicola's AutumnalSelf-Care Pack or join her for
(49:45):
yoga therapy.
You can use codeSENSITIVESTORIES for 20% off.
All the details are in the shownotes.
If you enjoyed this episode,subscribe to the Sensitive
Stories podcast so you don'tmiss our upcoming conversations.
Reviews and ratings are alsohelpful and appreciated For
behind-the-scenes content andmore HSP resources.
(50:07):
You can sign up for my emaillist or follow Sensitive
Strengths on Instagram, tiktokand YouTube.
Check out the show notes orsensitivestoriescom for all the
resources from today's episode.
Thanks for listening.
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