July 15, 2025 • 51 mins
Do you constantly feel exhausted? In this episode, I talk with Dr. Karen Lamb about the connection between sensitivity and burnout as well as:
• The emotional and physical signs of burnout
• What nutrients are essential for deep processing
• Why sleep, hydration, and digestion are essential areas of physiological self-care
Karen is a Naturopathic Medical Doctor and Licensed Counselor specializing in helping highly sensitive and neurodivergent individuals balance hormones, restore energy, and truly thrive. With a deep understanding of the unique needs of HSPs, she blends integrative medicine and trauma-informed counseling to create personalized, sustainable wellness solutions. Through her work, she empowers sensitive individuals to honor their bodies, overcome burnout, and reclaim their vitality.
Keep in touch with Karen:
• Website: https://puravidanaturalmedicine.com
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/dr.karen_lamb
• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/share/g/12GpdYWThg2
• Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/drkarenlamb.bsky.social
Resources Mentioned:
• Sensitivity Burnout Quiz: https://puravidanaturalmedicine.com/quiz-for-hsp-burnout/
• Thriving Sensitivity Course: https://pura-vida-natural-medicine.kit.com/products/self-study?promo=HSPTHRIVE
Thanks for listening! You can read the full show notes and sign up for my email list to get new episode announcements and other resources at:
https://www.sensitivestories.com
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This episode is for educational purposes only and is not intended as a substitute for treatment with a mental health or medical professional.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Dr. Karen Lamb (00:00):
I do think that we have a very significant
susceptibility to burnoutsymptoms or some of these health
concerns that we're talkingabout, because we process the
world as deeply as we do, andevery experience of sensory data
requires a chemical reaction.
(00:20):
If we see light more brightly,hear sounds more intensely or
emotions more intensely, thosechemical reactions require
nutrients.
April Snow (00:38):
Welcome to Sensitive Stories, the podcast for the
people who live with hearts andeyes wide open.
I'm your host, psychotherapistand author, april Snow.
I invite you to join me as Ideep dive into rich
conversations with fellow highlysensitive people that will
inspire you to live a morefulfilling life as an HSP
(01:00):
without all the overwhelm.
In this episode, I talk with DrKaren Lam about why HSPs are
more susceptible to burnout andother health struggles, as well
as the importance of hydration,nutrient intake and sleep.
Karen is a naturopathic medicaldoctor and licensed counselor
specializing in helping highlysensitive and neurodivergent
(01:23):
individuals balance hormones,restore energy and truly thrive.
With a deep understanding ofthe unique needs of HSPs, she
blends integrative medicine andtrauma-informed counseling to
create personalized, sustainablewellness solutions.
Through her work, she empowerssensitive folks to honor their
bodies, overcome burnout andreclaim their vitality.
(01:46):
For more HSP resources and tosee behind-the-scenes video from
the podcast, join me onInstagram, tiktok or YouTube at
Sensitive Strengths or sign upfor my email list.
Links are in the show notes andat sensitivestoriescom.
And just a reminder that thisepisode is for educational
purposes only and is notintended as a substitute for
(02:08):
treatment with a mental healthor medical professional.
Let's dive in.
Hi Karen, I'm so happy to talkwith you today on the podcast.
Dr. Karen Lamb (02:36):
Thank you.
I am so happy to be here and toget to chat about one of my
all-time favorite thingssensitivity.
This is really exciting for me.
April Snow (02:46):
Yeah same.
And just hearing your expertiseand perspective on our sense of
experience with burnout andenergy management and I'm sure
there's so many other topics wecould cover Might have to have a
part two, but before we getinto that, I'd love to start off
and just hear a little bit moreabout your own HSP discovery
story, how and when you realizedthat you're a highly sensitive
(03:06):
person.
Dr. Karen Lamb (03:08):
Yeah, I appreciate that you say highly
sensitive, because I was told Iwas sensitive my whole life.
I mean, I'm sure so many of ushear that.
And growing up, I definitelyalways felt things deeply
emotions, energies in the room,or even just the way that my
body and other people's bodiesresponded to stress.
(03:28):
It was always very apparent tome and it wasn't until I read
Elaine's work, which was about20 years ago now, that I thought
, oh, oh.
April Snow (03:47):
Yeah, you get it.
Yes, the puzzle pieces startcoming together.
Wow, yes.
Dr. Karen Lamb (03:53):
I hope that someday I can I mean, maybe I
could just send her a thank you.
April Snow (03:57):
I mean, it just was so transformative, I mean it's
incredible just to have thatinsight of going from okay, I've
been called sensitive, justthat generic term, but then to
realize, oh, there's more to it,it's a trait, there's a
framework, there's language forit.
It is so illuminating to havethat light bulb come on like oh,
(04:19):
now it all makes sense.
At least that was what it wasfor me.
Finally, Absolutely.
Dr. Karen Lamb (04:25):
It really did.
So much came together for me atthat point.
And then, right around thattime is when I went to
naturopathic medical school andI started to notice that the
sensitive people in my programand I had different nutritional
needs.
And then I mean it was justvery serendipitous, you know,
(04:47):
like it was time for me toawaken that awareness.
And then I realized, okay, I'ma highly sensitive person and my
approach to wellbeing looksdifferent than others beyond the
bath and the downtime you knowall of these things.
It was also making sure that Iwas learning how to replenish
(05:11):
these nutrients, and it was justthe tip of the iceberg for
really passionate journey for me.
I'm really grateful to get todo these things in my work
because it just I feel like thisis my purpose and I think, as
sensitive people like ourconnection to our purpose.
I know it's important foreveryone.
(05:31):
I don't know why I just feel asbeing highly sensitive, it's
almost non-negotiable, you know,to really thrive.
April Snow (05:39):
Agreed, agreed, I think, because we are so
connected to our internalexperience, our emotional
landscape.
When there's that sense ofdisconnection or lack of purpose
or even boredom, we feel it somuch more deeply.
So I do.
I am in agreement with you.
I think purpose and alignmentwith what we're doing in kind of
our life's work is so much moreimportant for us.
Dr. Karen Lamb (06:02):
I think that's beautifully stated.
Yes, you feel it, you feel itright, so deeply we can't ignore
it.
And that's why not to get toofar off our topic, but I guess
it's not far off.
I think that there is thiswhatever anybody's beliefs are
like bigger reasons for us,aside from evolutionarilyarily
(06:25):
right.
I mean that that's clear, thatmakes sense.
I don't know.
I feel like we're kind of likethe heart and actually you
mentioned that in your podcast.
I love that.
We are the heart of our species, you know, and we can't ignore
certain things, and sometimesit's the canary in the coal mine
(06:45):
type of situation, andsometimes it's.
You know we can do better.
April Snow (06:51):
Yes, elevating the expectations or the standards.
That's part of our purpose here.
Dr. Karen Lamb (06:56):
Yes, I completely agree.
Sometimes it can almost sound alittle grandiose.
But I don't know, I don't thinkit's grandiose, I think we're
special, you know, in thatregard.
But other people will say we'renot special because we can't do
mass production of work, right,right.
April Snow (07:12):
But I see it as you know, everybody is special in
their own way.
The people that are non-HSP ismore extroverted.
Whatever it is, they have apurpose too.
It's just different than ours,right?
I mean, we're the noticers, thefeelers, the emotional leaders,
and let's not discredit that.
Dr. Karen Lamb (07:29):
Yeah, absolutely , and I think it's particularly
special in at least the way Isee it, because I love those
things, so I'm like that's sospecial, it's extra special,
right?
April Snow (07:42):
It's so meaningful to us, yeah, it is.
And, yeah, purpose is soimportant because of that.
Dr. Karen Lamb (07:48):
Yeah.
April Snow (07:49):
Yeah, you mentioned nutritional efficiencies and I
know we might talk about thislater, but I didn't want to lose
that moment.
You said, when you startedstudying naturopathic medicine,
you realized, oh, I havedifferent nutritional needs.
So I think that's an importantlayer to be able to find purpose
, to be able to live well, tonot feel like we are living
(08:10):
under that fog of overwhelm andburnout, which we'll talk about.
I mean, one of you could justsay a few things about that,
what you were noticing.
Dr. Karen Lamb (08:20):
Yeah, it first came to my awareness during
school when we were talkingabout vitamin C and one of the
ways that we naturopathicallyassess vitamin C.
Because you can do an expensivespecialty test that will do
like a micronutrient test thattells you you know what kinds of
nutrients you're low on or highon, and then that can have some
(08:41):
implications.
But there's a really easy wayto test it with your bowel
tolerance and and so you cantake certain.
You can do 500.
For sensitive people I usuallyrecommend like 250 to 500
milligram increments.
Non-hsps jump to one to threegrams, but sensitive people it
(09:01):
can go either way.
There can be a super highrequirement for it or really low
.
So I noticed that there wereabout a hundred of us in our
class and the people that I kindof had tagged as HFPs were all
talking about having had muchhigher bowel tolerance for
(09:22):
vitamin C, which is particularlyfascinating because vitamin C
is important in the conversionand the production of
epinephrine and thesestimulating fight or flight
types of brain chemicals andneurotransmitters.
And to me, once I put thattogether which was very similar
timing to Elaine's work, youknow, and me being exposed to it
(09:46):
I was like, oh man, there is somuch here.
Yes, yeah, so it started withvitamin C.
April Snow (09:54):
I mean there's so much because we talk a lot about
our emotional differences, ournervous system differences, but
why wouldn't there also then benutritional differences?
Of course, because I mean we'reliving in an interconnected
system.
I know we treat our bodies asthese separate silos, but it's
all part of the same system.
What an interesting discovery,I imagine you know.
(10:15):
Having worked with more andmore HSPs over the years, you've
been able to see more of that100%.
Yes, so we really do need totake care of our bodies
differently, as well as ouremotions 100%.
Dr. Karen Lamb (10:29):
Yeah, especially to be able to thrive in the way
that I want all HSPs to thrive,right Like what an amazing
world we would live in if wefelt really nourished and
grounded and in a place we canshine as brightly as we know is
possible.
April Snow (10:48):
Right, exactly, it's like we just need something
different to be able to do that.
So in your work with HSPs Iknow you've personally struggled
with burnout, but I imagine seethat a lot, whether it's
burnout or energy depletion orother physical symptoms.
I'm just curious if you couldshare a little bit more about
what those signs of burnoutmight be nutritionally or
(11:09):
physically or emotionally thatyou're picking up in your
practice.
Dr. Karen Lamb (11:13):
Yes, you know, the easiest way to answer that
and we can get into thespecifics but the easiest way to
answer that is the experienceof a highly sensitive person
when it becomes painful and issustained, right.
So the over-stimulation forsome of us, emotional reactivity
(11:34):
, emotional exhaustion,increased sensitivity, so all of
the things that can bewonderful.
Gifts kind of feel like they'reworking against us.
Gifts kind of feel like they'reworking against us.
And when we are there for anextended period of time, I think
as HSPs we always have, youknow, once a week or maybe at
the end of the day, where it'slike, okay, it's time, it's time
(11:55):
for me to, you know, stowmyself away, I will see you all
tomorrow.
But if that's the state thatsomebody is in, you know, really
continuously, then it's worthexploring.
Sleep issues become reallyprevalent during burnout.
A lack of joy or passion, whichis that light that I would love
(12:16):
all sensitive people to connectwith and shine system starts to
get really wonky.
So if we're exposed to highlevels of cortisol for an
extended period of time, thenthat has an immunosuppressive
effect and so we'll start to see, you know, frequent colds.
Or if somebody has anautoimmune condition, then more
(12:37):
flares of that autoimmunecondition.
Food cravings can also come upwith burnout, especially salty
or sweet, which is like, okay,well then, what's left?
Great.
But those are really common foradrenal fatigue, brain fog,
increased indecisiveness.
I know we all, as you know, wetend to be very intentional
(13:00):
about our choices and ourdecisions, but if it's just
feeling like you can't get to aconclusion or make a decision
and it's taking over, you know,in different elements like
procrastination or perfectionismalso tend to flare, and these
are all things that I think weas sensitive people will come in
and out of.
But it's that constant stateand what it really comes down to
(13:24):
is when the nervous system getsstuck in that sympathetic or
fight or flight state that leadsto burnout because it's just
the foot pressing on the gasconstantly and that is really
incompatible with sustainability, especially for a sensitive
person.
April Snow (13:42):
Absolutely.
You can't be in thatdysregulated state, that
depletive state for extendedperiods yeah, one day a week,
the end of days when you've gonethrough and you've done all
that you can.
Dr. Karen Lamb (13:53):
But if you're stuck in that, it sounds like
every system of the body is thenimpacted yeah yeah, exactly I
actually put together a littlequiz very, very old, like do it
manually, like those oldmagazine quizzes, and I put it
on my website because I'm justnot tech savvy and I wish I was,
but I'm not and it's a niceresource.
(14:14):
If people are curious aboutthat, I can give you that
information, because I don'tthink I mentioned it earlier.
April Snow (14:20):
Yeah, that would be great.
I'll put that in the show notes, for people Sounds good.
Yeah, yeah, cause I know therecan be a lot of different signs
that you're going throughburnout and they may not always
be obvious, right, or maybe whatyou would think.
Dr. Karen Lamb (14:35):
Yeah, yeah.
And I think that when we getinto that state of burnout and
things feel so stuck and I mean,I think I was in a constant
state of burnout until I learnedabout this, about how to take
care of myself so it was likefrom, I think, probably puberty,
right when hormones came on thescene and life got so much more
(14:57):
complicated especially with mysensitivity it was just
constantly feeling burnt out.
And when we get into that stateof stuckness, there is this we
feel so profoundlyunder-resourced that the idea of
anything changing feelsabsolutely impossible or
(15:26):
helplessness, and it's not thatright.
There is absolutely ways foreach individual sensitive person
to find a way out of it, and Ithink that's why I feel so
passionate about it, because Iknow what that feels like and
sometimes the solutions can feelso distant and impossible
because we're so under-resourced.
April Snow (15:40):
Yeah, we're living in that chronic under-resourced
space as HSPs, often eitherbecause of circumstances or we
do it to ourselves, notrealizing that we should or
could treat ourselvesdifferently.
So how do we start to come outif we're in that sense of
hopelessness?
Dr. Karen Lamb (15:57):
I mean knowing that there is a way For me.
I think that when I learnedthat there were different
nutritional needs for sensitivepeople, it was like a whole
world was opened up to me andall of a sudden I felt like I
needed to learn it, which wasquite the feat because I didn't
have anybody really there world.
(16:20):
There are many providers thatare certainly way more sensitive
than non-HSP you know,conventional medicine providers,
but not all naturopathicdoctors are highly sensitive and
oftentimes some are and don'tknow it or still kind of
function on a more conventionalparadigm.
(16:42):
And so I had a wonderfulnaturopathic doctor who
understood my sensitivity asbest as she could and honored it
, and that was already lightyears from the medical
gaslighting that I hadexperienced conventionally.
But it was really up to me, youknow, to lay that groundwork of
okay.
So now I know vitamin C andthat makes sense to me.
(17:03):
What about?
You know everything else, and Ikind of became a guinea pig for
myself and the work that I do.
And now I find it so empoweringto have you know my immune
system basket and my mentalhealth basket and my energy
basket, and knowing that I havethese resources whenever
(17:25):
something is feeling a littlebit off just feels really
empowering to me.
So kind of like in DBT, wewould teach people to have their
self-care basket, which when Ilearned that, was really
important for me as well.
So it's implementing thesedifferent concepts of self-care
(17:46):
that now include physical health, which was really revolutionary
for me.
April Snow (17:55):
Yeah, we often don't think about the physical health
in the context of emotionalstruggles like burnout.
We think of it more as you know, I'm overwhelmed, I'm
overstimulated.
But yeah, there's a physicalcomponent there.
You differentiate the mentalhealth basket, the immune system
basket, the energy basket.
Are you open to sharing maybean example from each of those?
Dr. Karen Lamb (18:17):
Yeah, so you know, obviously sensitive people
are very unique in our needs,but I can speak to the things
that are most comprehensivelywell-tolerated for sensitive
people.
It's just, you know, as you'vementioned, this is impossible to
(18:38):
be medical advice, because whenworking with sensitive people
it's so, so unique and thatfeedback that we get, that live
feedback from the body, isreally important to take note.
But vitamin C, of course.
So vitamin C it'santi-inflammatory, it's,
everybody knows, supports theimmune system and it can be
(19:00):
emotionally stabilizing, becauseanytime a nutrient is deficient
the alarm bells go off.
So anxiety, depression, fatigue, these are really really
general physical signs that ourbody's not getting what it needs
.
And vitamin C plays a role inso many.
(19:22):
It plays a role in the hormonesystem, so the endocrine system,
the neurological, mental health, brain chemistry system, the
immune system, the digestive.
I mean it is very, veryprevalent, so it's one that gets
you a lot of leverage andthat's why I love to start with
vitamin C.
There are some this is me goinginto, you know, the possibility
(19:45):
that it might not be good foryou, but if some people with
oxalate sensitivity, whichactually a lot of people do have
, might not respond well tovitamin C.
So, if ever you are introducingsomething new, always listen to
your body.
I can't stress that enough,especially for this population.
Right, like we have the abilityto be finely tuned instruments
(20:08):
and when we aren't I mean that'sthe experience of burnout right
, our music starts to sound alittle wonky.
Whenever your music starts tosound a little wonky, your body
isn't aligned.
Listen to that.
It does not matter what aprovider says.
Always prioritize that.
April Snow (20:24):
That's such a good reminder that we really need to
let it be subjective what isbest for me and in every area of
life.
Let's not look outward to whateveryone else is doing.
Let's look inward, and I'veexperienced that myself, just
having, over the last year,worked with a functional
medicine doctor and correctedsome deficiencies and seeing the
inflammation go down and mymental health shift.
(20:47):
It's like wow.
It's just a reminder thateverything is connected.
But to listen to what do I need?
Yes, so important, right.
Yeah, it's so powerful.
Dr. Karen Lamb (20:58):
Yes.
So vitamin C and what else isin my basket?
What other baskets do I have?
So that's going to be immune.
That's the really big one.
Magnesium you're hearing a lotabout magnesium.
We do tend to have a lot ofdeficiencies with magnesium,
because magnesium helps to relaxthings and, as sensitive people
(21:19):
, especially when we're in astate of burnout or are in this
kind of reactive fight or flightstate, everything gets really
constricted right Thoughts,bowels, blood vessels,
everything gets really tight andmagnesium can help to provide
some ease.
There's lots of different formsfor sleep, versus cognitive
(21:42):
anxiety or overthinking types oftension.
But generally speaking, you cando bowel tolerance for
magnesium as well.
So you could start withsomething like 100 milligrams
and add 50 to 100 milligramsevery day until there's loose
bowels, and then you take abreak and then you start back up
at one or 200 milligrams lowerthan what triggered the loose
(22:05):
stools.
Same with vitamin C.
So that's a really nice, easyway to test those for yourself.
If you have low blood pressure,be careful with that because it
can it will, you know relax theblood vessels, which can
decrease blood pressure, and ifthere's any kind of bone density
problems, because magnesium andcalcium will compete for one
(22:27):
another.
I'm going to pause here becauseI can talk about this oh yeah,
this forever, but I want to makesure that you know we have time
to cover the thing.
April Snow (22:37):
This is really helpful because there's so many
layers here.
Right, and I appreciate theunderlying message to like ease
in, test things along the way,reflect How's it going, make
adjustments.
Don't just take what you'vebeen told or what the common
dose is and you know we're kindof skirting around this issue.
But I want to bring it more tothe surface, which is HSPs often
(23:00):
have different reactions tomedication, to supplements, to
treatments in general, so it'sreally important to listen to
your body, to maybe start slowand then ramp up, yes, with
whatever you're taking yes yes,yes, I am so, so, so important,
(23:22):
and I've primarily focused mywork, my naturopathic work, with
on hsps for about 10 years.
Dr. Karen Lamb (23:30):
I've always done done it, but I wasn't
exclusively HSP until the last10 years and during this time,
every time somebody comes and doI have ideas of how something
might work out?
I have ideas but ultimately itis their body that is going to
dictate how quickly we gothrough.
(23:50):
That is going to dictate howquickly we go through you know,
any given protocol or whatdirection we take, and it's so,
so critical that people HSPsspecifically blank slate every
time you start something new,blank slate as a beginner's mind
, right, I know nothing aboutthis and I am here to learn what
(24:12):
my body has to tell me and thenproceed Because, just because
your neighbor, who's also an HSP, right, even within our own
trait, you know we experience alot of differences and that, I
think, is the foundation of themedical empowerment that I hope
that people HSPs start toexperience with these types of
(24:38):
messages.
April Snow (24:38):
Yes, empowerment is so important and I love that
reminder.
Your neighbor who's an HSP,your friend, your sister,
whoever, even if they're doingthis dose or taking this
protocol, whatever it is, startfrom scratch what works for you.
So in a naturopathics office, Iimagine there's more
(25:02):
conversation, there's more room,but what if you're getting a
message from a practitioner thatis more absolute, more
regimented?
Who's not thinking about asensitive nervous system?
What do you do then?
So, as you're talking, I'm likethis is amazing.
This is exactly how I want toshow up for my health, but I
know not every practitioner isaware of sensitivity or is
(25:23):
considering it.
Dr. Karen Lamb (25:24):
Yeah, yeah, I have a couple of thoughts about
that.
One is if you feel like yourprovider is constantly saying,
well, it can't possibly be that,or you know, just kind of
gaslit like your experience orwhat you are sharing is
completely negated orinvalidated, Then at that point
(25:46):
I would say I would highlyencourage that somebody find a
different provider.
And this can happen in thefunctional world, it can happen
in the naturopathic world.
I have worked with colleaguesand professors who were very
rigid about how they thoughtsomething you know, a protocol,
should be executed and I havesomething to say about that.
(26:08):
But to finish the first section, if you feel that you are
invalidated and not heard, Ithink that's the key If you feel
heard with a provider and theysay your situation is very
extreme and you're suffering alot, and I strongly recommend
that we do it this way and ifthings go sideways, then we can
(26:30):
reevaluate.
There's a dialogue.
April Snow (26:34):
Yep, they're actually hearing your experience
.
They're not shut off to it.
Dr. Karen Lamb (26:39):
Yes, yep, so that's a very important sign.
If you are not feeling heard, Ifeel like that is detrimental
to your health.
So forget about the fact thatyou know you haven't even
started the treatment right thatI think healing spaces in.
As a therapist, you know youunderstand the relationship is
(27:02):
the primary vehicle for healing,and that is no different in the
medical world.
April Snow (27:07):
No, it's the foundation.
You have to have that in placebefore anything else happens.
No, it's the foundation.
You have to have that in placebefore anything else happens,
completely agree.
Dr. Karen Lamb (27:16):
So that's one perspective.
If that doesn't feel, if youaren't even at neutral right,
like if you're starting offneutral and it's not an amazing
relationship, that can stillwork.
But if there's a sense ofinvalidation or medical
gaslighting, I do think thatthat is more problematic.
It's adding to the imbalancethat you're there to receive
(27:38):
help with.
So I would say find a newprovider.
If you're dealing withsomething that is really
disruptive to your life, right,and you are in a lot of pain,
like there is something that isprohibiting you from being able
to engage in work or family orjust quality of life, then it's
(27:59):
possible that a more robustprotocol may be in order.
And then at that point, ifyou're working with someone who
came really highly recommended,it might be an exception.
You know, to everything has tobe a conversation, but I would
still really emphasize theimportance of feeling heard.
April Snow (28:21):
Yeah, that's, I mean , essential right, and maybe
you're varying the degrees ofbeing heard or what you feel is
enough.
If there's other circumstances,it sounds like that has to be
there, at least in some level.
Yeah.
Dr. Karen Lamb (28:34):
I think so, without adding toxicity right to
a difficult situation.
Having said that, I think mostsensitive people can find
providers that hear them, youknow, and I think maybe even if
somebody is going throughsomething really complicated,
like a complex autoimmunecondition or something that's
(28:55):
not diagnosed yet but isdebilitating, maybe it's even
more important in thosecircumstances to find somebody
to work with you, because it'softentimes those cases that are
most sensitive to medicationsand supplements and vitamins and
herbs and all of that, and sothey need extra care to not feel
worse.
April Snow (29:15):
Yes, they really do.
You're talking about autoimmuneand energy levels.
Are we destined for thesethings, as HSPs Burnout, sleep
issues, autoimmune issues,digestive issues?
Because you see a lot of HSPstruggling with these issues.
Dr. Karen Lamb (29:35):
Yeah, I do think that we have a very significant
susceptibility to complexhealth pictures or burnout
symptoms or some of these healthconcerns that we're talking
about, because we process theworld as deeply as we do and
(29:56):
every experience of sensory datarequires a chemical reaction.
So if we, you know, if we seelight more brightly or hear
sounds more intensely oremotions more intensely,
depending on what yoursensitivity is or, in some cases
like myself, all of the above,you know, each of those is a
(30:19):
chemical reaction and thosechemical reactions require
nutrients and they require extradetoxification and a lot of
energy to run those chemicalreactions and replenish the
nutrients.
Once again, I like to think ofit as baking a cake.
So if you bake one cake, youneed your eggs and your oil and
your water and then you need theenergy to bake it and then the
(30:43):
experience of the cake, right?
So the emotion, the sadness orwhatever.
Or if it's a lot of sadness,then it's 10 cakes.
You know that you're baking.
Then you got to go back andclean the kitchen that's the
detoxification piece and restockyour pantry.
So these are elements that gointo physiological self-care for
sensitive person that you knowa non-HSP doesn't have to think
(31:06):
about they make one cake, maybefive in a day, right, like we're
like cake, cake, cake, cake,cake, cake cake you know this
little right, just a hamsterwheel of cake making.
Yes, a hamster wheel of cakemaking, yeah, and so they can
just eat their regular diet.
They can go about.
You know, they're 80% of thepopulation's self-care, which is
(31:31):
just existing really, you know.
And everything their pantrygets restocked, everything gets
cleaned up and they don't haveto think twice about it.
But we have a very differentinternal cellular experience.
So that makes it moresusceptible to answer.
April Snow (31:48):
No, this is making so much sense because I always
think about how much emotionalenergy we take from processing
our experiences.
I haven't extended that thingabout we need more nutrients or
physiological support Because,right, if we're having all these
different chemical reactions inour brain doing all this
processing, our brains are morelit up, taking in all this
(32:08):
information.
Of course our body is going toneed to pull that energy from
somewhere, and if we're depletedon that level, other systems
start to be impacted.
Yes, exactly so.
It's not that we're necessarilysusceptible or weak.
Yes, Physiologically, it's thatwe need a different level of
(32:28):
input.
Dr. Karen Lamb (32:29):
It seems very just basic we need a different
level of input.
It seems very just basic.
Yeah Right, it's not weakness,it's not a deficit, it's not I
was born to be ill or I was bornto be not well, it's, I was
born to be cared for in a verydifferent way than 80% of the
population, and whether or notwe had HSP parents, you know
(32:52):
we're just now at a place thatI'm able to change the story for
my son.
But my parents, who one, waskind of an HSP, but you know, an
officer in the military, likeright, he's going to be the one
to teach me.
I mean, poor man, like sodisconnected from his own needs
(33:14):
as a sensitive person.
So it's very common for, youknow, those of us in the
certainly 30s and 40s and beyondto not have had any kind of
guidance because they didn'tknow.
They didn't know, yeah, yeah,Even the self-care right of how
very empowering to shift thatmindset and just as, I think,
(33:54):
just as empowering as learning.
Oh my gosh.
This is a trait that benefitscommunities.
You know that has helpedsocieties to thrive and to
survive.
So is this understanding of thephysical piece that our bodies
are just doing more and so theyjust bring care.
That's it.
April Snow (34:14):
It's that basic Different body, different level
of care Right, and it issomething that our parents had
no clue about, right?
I mean, mental health ingeneral was not even on the
radar, let alone looking attemperament and nervous system
wiring and just thesephysiological needs.
So this is a good reminder thatwe need to take care of our
(34:39):
physical needs, so then we cantake our emotional needs and we
can show up for that purpose forour communities, because we do
have a very specific reason tobe here.
You know, this trait hassurvived, however long, for a
reason Exactly.
Yeah, so just to and there'ssome noise outside, I apologize
for listeners, just trying totake in what you're saying
(35:00):
because it's such an importantmessage.
So if we want to feel our best,we want to actually have energy
, we want to give ourselves abuffer against that almost seems
like a never burnout.
What are some of the basicsthat?
Dr. Karen Lamb (35:18):
we should be doing?
Would you say we talked aboutnutritional supplementation?
What else would you put on thatlist?
So before I go through some ofthis list, I just want to make a
blanket statement that verygentle and simple things go a
really, really long way forsensitive people.
So this might sound too basicor oversimplified, but sensitive
(35:39):
people most often thrive withthe most minimal and natural
interventions.
Is that always the case?
No, I certainly am not here topreach that natural approaches
are always the answer forsensitive people.
Absolutely not Integrative.
Use all the tools you know, butstart super, super basic and as
(36:00):
natural as possible and then gofrom there.
April Snow (36:03):
I mean it's such a good reminder because we are
more emotionally perceptive,visually perceptive.
I think our bodies are alsomore perceptive and just soak up
whatever we're giving it like asponge.
Yes, yeah, start small.
Dr. Karen Lamb (36:16):
Yes, yes, we have a very narrow window of
optimal functioning and you knowthat can feel really
frustrating when you're thesensitive person, and maybe even
to providers that are not, youknow, compassionate of that
experience, because that's wheremedical gaslighting comes into
play.
We know we're outside of thislittle window and so we're like
(36:38):
something's not right.
I don't feel well, I gotta talkto somebody.
Then they go talk to somebodyand they're like your labs are
perfect.
So we have such a fantastictool within us that is so
advanced that modern day sciencemost of modern day science,
certainly conventional labscannot identify what we are
(37:03):
feeling, and so we're greatcandidates for preventative
medicine because of that.
April Snow (37:08):
I mean truly, because we can detect something
before it shows up on the scan,on the blood test.
So I think there's a room thereto remind folks that
self-advocate right, find thatprovider that will listen to you
.
Like something feels off,because I've had that too where,
oh, my labs are all perfect,I'm like, but something is wrong
(37:28):
.
I'm having inflammation.
I need a closer look and that'swhy I went outside of the
traditional system to receivemedical care.
And yeah, just a reminder thatyou know listen to yourself.
But also the small, subtleintervention might be enough.
Dr. Karen Lamb (37:45):
Yes.
April Snow (37:45):
And we're really looking outside the box here in
every way.
Yes.
Dr. Karen Lamb (37:50):
And, if it's still present, keep bringing it
up.
If you keep bringing it up to aprovider and they get
frustrated or start invalidatingyou when maybe they didn't at
first, it's time for somebodynew, because the right provider
is always going to say we needto keep digging, we need to keep
looking until we find thatanswer.
(38:10):
If you feel like you'reburdening someone or don't go
into the people pleasing, sayokay, thank you, we've done our
work.
It's time to find somebody else.
April Snow (38:19):
This is not the time to people, please Right,
absolutely not.
Yes, because I've heard so manyHSPs share that they caught
something a major medical issueearly before their providers
would have caught it.
Dr. Karen Lamb (38:33):
Absolutely yes, a hundred percent, trust
yourself.
Yes, so to answer your question, I just wanted to make a
disclaimer.
You know that this might soundreally basic, but just
beginner's mind, right, onceagain, beginner's mind.
So, my, there's lots ofelements, there's many different
(39:00):
ways to optimize hydration, butthe reason that it's so
important and I like to includethis because my mom used to tell
me from a very young age youneed to drink more water, which
is interesting because now I'mthinking, oh wow, she was
teaching me how to take care ofmy age needs but I found it so
frustrating because I reallylike to understand why, and I
didn't feel thirsty, so it wasweird to me.
(39:22):
And so once I really understood,you know, going back to that
cake analogy, I have to go backand clean the kitchen.
So after each chemical reaction, after each cake that I bake,
which is constantly there, needsto be enough water, because
that's the most basic form ofcleaning our bodies, to get the
kitchen ready for my nextsensory experience.
(39:45):
And so there you can understandwhy HSPs have a high
requirement for water.
And it's not just drinking thewater, it's getting the water
into the cells and you know,electrolytes are important in
that process toxicity,mitochondrial function.
There's other elements of that,but just bare bones.
Most basic recommendation ishydration.
April Snow (40:08):
This makes a lot of sense because I drink a lot of
water every day, but there's asense of I feel like I'm
dehydrated, like my wife is.
She's not a big water drinkerand I was, like you know, I'm
drinking water all day long,from time I wake up till I go to
(40:29):
bed, and it's like, okay, thismakes sense because I'm thinking
about how the brain cleansitself while you sleep, but I
hadn't really thought about howyour body is needing to do that,
detoxing all day long.
And what's the vehicle for that?
It's water.
Yes, needs to flush through andthe more water I force myself
to drink more water and mydigestion is better, my energy
is better.
Like I notice a difference.
Dr. Karen Lamb (40:50):
Yes, yes, it was surprising In the energy module
of the program, of the ThrivingSensitivity Program.
That is the first thing that Italk about under energy, because
almost all people wish theycould have more.
April Snow (41:04):
That makes sense.
Dr. Karen Lamb (41:05):
Yes, yes, all right, and I too, you know, I'm
drinking water constantly andit's like I mean, the demand is
so high and I live at altitude,so that just adds a whole, a
whole other element ofcomplexity.
But it's so critical and it'sso basic and understanding.
I hope that explaining it inthat way is helpful for those
(41:28):
sensitive people out there likemyself who really like to
understand why am I doing this?
So hydration, first andforemost, and I love what you
said about regeneration andhealing of detoxification of the
brain and the body during sleep.
Dehydration can cause sleepdisruptions, because if you
(41:49):
don't have the water, you knowthe cleaning supplies then you
end up waking or not having veryrestful sleep, because the
whole purpose of sleep is todetoxify and regenerate tissue.
So if you don't have thenecessary tools to do that, it's
not going to feel restful.
So that's the next thing that Iwas going to mention is
(42:11):
optimizing your sleep, andthat's definitely sounds much
easier than it is right.
I mean, it's a checkbox, butit's a whole process underneath
it that we oftentimes do bestwhen we collaborate with a
provider that can help to use ascientific method to help go
through what's working, what'snot, systematically.
(42:34):
Bowel movements are anotherthing to keep track of.
Regular, easy, uneventful,fully formed bowel movements at
least once a day.
Every time our digestive tractturns on it is moving all the
way through from mouth to out.
So if you're eating a meal thentechnically we should be moving
(42:57):
another meal out.
So some people feel best whenthey have three bowel movements,
but my absolute minimum foreveryone is once a day.
So if you're not having a bowelmovement at least once a day,
that's a form of constipation,even if every other day it's an
easy bowel movement.
So people think of constipationas it needing to be difficult
(43:19):
to pass or dry.
It doesn't necessarily have tobe that.
It's more about how frequentlyare you removing waste from your
body, because the longer itstays in your intestines the
toxins get reabsorbed back inand that just puts extra burden
on your body to have to do thesame thing twice or three times.
April Snow (43:36):
It makes sense, right, as things come in, they
should go out.
Yes, yeah, feels pretty simple.
So we have in, they should goout.
Yes, yeah, it feels prettysimple.
Dr. Karen Lamb (43:50):
So we have hydration, sleep, bowel
movements, anything else thatfeels essential to focus on.
I mean, those are really superbasic and important, and I would
encourage people to take theirtime with this.
So that's one of the thingsthat I really like really pride
myself, and I had.
I saw somebody this morning andshe said I'm such a bad patient
.
I didn't do anything that wetalked about, and the first
thing I said to her wasabsolutely not, there are no bad
(44:11):
patients.
It's that we didn't identifyyour needs accurately and
because of that, we didn't makea plan that was actionable for
you, and so that's veryimportant.
With these three things that wejust discussed, it's you know
our brain can think oh, they'reso simple, I should be able to
(44:34):
incorporate them quickly, andthat is a disservice to your
process, especially as sensitivepeople, right?
So, starting with something assimple as adding two extra
ounces of water, starting bymeasuring the water that you're
consuming and then adding twoextra ounces and slowly building
up to what's ideal for you thatmakes sense.
April Snow (44:56):
Start small, something that you can actually
accomplish, instead of puttingall the pressure to do all the
things at once, cause, yes,sleep and digestion are pretty
foundational, but those are bigmountains to climb, depending on
what's going on.
But, starting with hydration,could impact both.
Dr. Karen Lamb (45:16):
Yes, yes, and sleep especially.
I mean sleep is notoriouslycomplex.
The only other thing I wouldadd is trying to rely on food as
much as possible for nutrientslike vitamin C and magnesium.
I'm not saying thatsupplementation, that there's
anything wrong withsupplementation, but there is a
certain leverage that we getfrom food because food comes
(45:37):
with the other nutrients thatmake it easier for those
vitamins to be absorbed intofunction.
April Snow (45:44):
Yeah, so you get the whole package, whole package,
all the components?
Yeah, that you need to actuallyutilize those nutrients?
Yeah, that makes sense.
Well, karen, we're gettingclose to time, so I just want to
see you know you've shared somany valuable pieces of
information today and really, Ithink, widen the scope of how do
we take care of ourselves asHSPs, how do we tap into the
(46:07):
strengths of our sensitivity,the value that we bring.
I just want to see if there'sany final messages that you want
to share.
Dr. Karen Lamb (46:13):
Definitely the burnout experience is solvable.
You know, even if you're inthat place of feeling really
helpless or hopeless, there isnothing wrong with you.
It's to be expected that, giventhe wear and tear, as we've
discussed today on our sensitivebodies, that burnout without
very specific intervention is.
(46:34):
I mean it sounds daunting butit's almost inevitable for all
of us as HSPs.
I mean it certainly has been myexperience, and so just knowing
that you know tuning yourinstrument as an HSP requires
special knowledge that we justit hasn't been given to us and
it is available for us andespecially finding that right
(46:56):
practitioner can make a world ofdifference.
I think that's a reallyimportant message because I hope
that sensitive people can startto fine tune their instruments,
because I feel like our world,more than ever at least it feels
that way in my lifetime is inneed of our beautiful melodies,
(47:17):
right that our tuned instrumentscan play.
So that's really an importantmessage and that's why I
developed the ThrivingSensitivity Program is to
systematically present thesethings in actionable steps in
ways that feel digestible andrun the gamut from, you know,
interpreting conventional labsand specialty labs and really
(47:41):
being able to feel empowered inour own health, because even
though there are providers thatcan help.
It is always my goal in workingwith sensitive people to get
them to a place where theybecome their own doctors, with
some guidance and someadjustment, always knowing that
they can come back.
But the idea is we have all ofthe information inside.
(48:04):
We just need that practitionerinformation of oh well, what
test is it or what nutrient isit and how do I assess that?
And that was my goal with theThriving Sensitivity Program is
for people sensitive people tofeel empowered with their health
and learn how to do that in amanageable, digestible way.
April Snow (48:24):
I love that, because so many clients that I work
with are trying to do that butnot having the guidance, the
resources or the understandingof being able to put that
clinician hat on, because wereally are so gifted at knowing
what our bodies need that we canreally heal ourselves.
(48:44):
And you're right that we areall susceptible to burnout just
because of the way our bodiesfunction and the world that we
live in and that mismatch.
But there's a lot we can do toactually find that balance and
we can actually thrive.
I just love that that's theword you put into the program
the thriving sensitivity,because it's true, I think we
(49:04):
think those two are opposite,but they can.
You know, sensitivity andthriving can coexist.
So I'll be sure to share thatlink in the show notes for folks
who are looking for thatsupport.
Also, share your social media,your website and the quiz as
well.
Yeah, so I just want to thankyou?
Dr. Karen Lamb (49:20):
Yeah, the 15% discount for anybody who puts
that in.
I think I can share that codeif I haven't already.
April Snow (49:28):
Perfect and I'll make sure I share that in our
outro so we folks can have thatWonderful.
Thank you so much, karen.
Thanks so much for joining meand Karen for today's
conversation.
What I hope you take away isthat you are the expert on your
(49:48):
own body and your own health.
Trust your intuition and findproviders that will listen.
If you're struggling withburnout, head to
thrivingsensitivitycom forKaren's sensitivity burnout quiz
and courses.
Links are in the show notes.
If you enjoyed this episode,subscribe to the Sensitive
(50:10):
Stories podcast so you don'tmiss our upcoming conversations.
Reviews and ratings are alsohelpful and appreciated For
behind-the-scenes content andmore HSP resources.
You can sign up for my emaillist or follow Sensitive
Strengths on Instagram, tiktokand YouTube.
Check out the show notes orsensitivestoriescom for all the
resources from today's episode.
Thanks for listening.
I do think that we have a very significant
susceptibility to burnoutsymptoms or some of these health
concerns that we're talkingabout, because we process the
world as deeply as we do, andevery experience of sensory data
requires a chemical reaction.
(00:20):
If we see light more brightly,hear sounds more intensely or
emotions more intensely, thosechemical reactions require
nutrients.
April Snow (00:38):
Welcome to Sensitive Stories, the podcast for the
people who live with hearts andeyes wide open.
I'm your host, psychotherapistand author, april Snow.
I invite you to join me as Ideep dive into rich
conversations with fellow highlysensitive people that will
inspire you to live a morefulfilling life as an HSP
(01:00):
without all the overwhelm.
In this episode, I talk with DrKaren Lam about why HSPs are
more susceptible to burnout andother health struggles, as well
as the importance of hydration,nutrient intake and sleep.
Karen is a naturopathic medicaldoctor and licensed counselor
specializing in helping highlysensitive and neurodivergent
(01:23):
individuals balance hormones,restore energy and truly thrive.
With a deep understanding ofthe unique needs of HSPs, she
blends integrative medicine andtrauma-informed counseling to
create personalized, sustainablewellness solutions.
Through her work, she empowerssensitive folks to honor their
bodies, overcome burnout andreclaim their vitality.
(01:46):
For more HSP resources and tosee behind-the-scenes video from
the podcast, join me onInstagram, tiktok or YouTube at
Sensitive Strengths or sign upfor my email list.
Links are in the show notes andat sensitivestoriescom.
And just a reminder that thisepisode is for educational
purposes only and is notintended as a substitute for
(02:08):
treatment with a mental healthor medical professional.
Let's dive in.
Hi Karen, I'm so happy to talkwith you today on the podcast.
Dr. Karen Lamb (02:36):
Thank you.
I am so happy to be here and toget to chat about one of my
all-time favorite thingssensitivity.
This is really exciting for me.
April Snow (02:46):
Yeah same.
And just hearing your expertiseand perspective on our sense of
experience with burnout andenergy management and I'm sure
there's so many other topics wecould cover Might have to have a
part two, but before we getinto that, I'd love to start off
and just hear a little bit moreabout your own HSP discovery
story, how and when you realizedthat you're a highly sensitive
(03:06):
person.
Dr. Karen Lamb (03:08):
Yeah, I appreciate that you say highly
sensitive, because I was told Iwas sensitive my whole life.
I mean, I'm sure so many of ushear that.
And growing up, I definitelyalways felt things deeply
emotions, energies in the room,or even just the way that my
body and other people's bodiesresponded to stress.
(03:28):
It was always very apparent tome and it wasn't until I read
Elaine's work, which was about20 years ago now, that I thought
, oh, oh.
April Snow (03:47):
Yeah, you get it.
Yes, the puzzle pieces startcoming together.
Wow, yes.
Dr. Karen Lamb (03:53):
I hope that someday I can I mean, maybe I
could just send her a thank you.
April Snow (03:57):
I mean, it just was so transformative, I mean it's
incredible just to have thatinsight of going from okay, I've
been called sensitive, justthat generic term, but then to
realize, oh, there's more to it,it's a trait, there's a
framework, there's language forit.
It is so illuminating to havethat light bulb come on like oh,
(04:19):
now it all makes sense.
At least that was what it wasfor me.
Finally, Absolutely.
Dr. Karen Lamb (04:25):
It really did.
So much came together for me atthat point.
And then, right around thattime is when I went to
naturopathic medical school andI started to notice that the
sensitive people in my programand I had different nutritional
needs.
And then I mean it was justvery serendipitous, you know,
(04:47):
like it was time for me toawaken that awareness.
And then I realized, okay, I'ma highly sensitive person and my
approach to wellbeing looksdifferent than others beyond the
bath and the downtime you knowall of these things.
It was also making sure that Iwas learning how to replenish
(05:11):
these nutrients, and it was justthe tip of the iceberg for
really passionate journey for me.
I'm really grateful to get todo these things in my work
because it just I feel like thisis my purpose and I think, as
sensitive people like ourconnection to our purpose.
I know it's important foreveryone.
(05:31):
I don't know why I just feel asbeing highly sensitive, it's
almost non-negotiable, you know,to really thrive.
April Snow (05:39):
Agreed, agreed, I think, because we are so
connected to our internalexperience, our emotional
landscape.
When there's that sense ofdisconnection or lack of purpose
or even boredom, we feel it somuch more deeply.
So I do.
I am in agreement with you.
I think purpose and alignmentwith what we're doing in kind of
our life's work is so much moreimportant for us.
Dr. Karen Lamb (06:02):
I think that's beautifully stated.
Yes, you feel it, you feel itright, so deeply we can't ignore
it.
And that's why not to get toofar off our topic, but I guess
it's not far off.
I think that there is thiswhatever anybody's beliefs are
like bigger reasons for us,aside from evolutionarilyarily
(06:25):
right.
I mean that that's clear, thatmakes sense.
I don't know.
I feel like we're kind of likethe heart and actually you
mentioned that in your podcast.
I love that.
We are the heart of our species, you know, and we can't ignore
certain things, and sometimesit's the canary in the coal mine
(06:45):
type of situation, andsometimes it's.
You know we can do better.
April Snow (06:51):
Yes, elevating the expectations or the standards.
That's part of our purpose here.
Dr. Karen Lamb (06:56):
Yes, I completely agree.
Sometimes it can almost sound alittle grandiose.
But I don't know, I don't thinkit's grandiose, I think we're
special, you know, in thatregard.
But other people will say we'renot special because we can't do
mass production of work, right,right.
April Snow (07:12):
But I see it as you know, everybody is special in
their own way.
The people that are non-HSP ismore extroverted.
Whatever it is, they have apurpose too.
It's just different than ours,right?
I mean, we're the noticers, thefeelers, the emotional leaders,
and let's not discredit that.
Dr. Karen Lamb (07:29):
Yeah, absolutely , and I think it's particularly
special in at least the way Isee it, because I love those
things, so I'm like that's sospecial, it's extra special,
right?
April Snow (07:42):
It's so meaningful to us, yeah, it is.
And, yeah, purpose is soimportant because of that.
Dr. Karen Lamb (07:48):
Yeah.
April Snow (07:49):
Yeah, you mentioned nutritional efficiencies and I
know we might talk about thislater, but I didn't want to lose
that moment.
You said, when you startedstudying naturopathic medicine,
you realized, oh, I havedifferent nutritional needs.
So I think that's an importantlayer to be able to find purpose
, to be able to live well, tonot feel like we are living
(08:10):
under that fog of overwhelm andburnout, which we'll talk about.
I mean, one of you could justsay a few things about that,
what you were noticing.
Dr. Karen Lamb (08:20):
Yeah, it first came to my awareness during
school when we were talkingabout vitamin C and one of the
ways that we naturopathicallyassess vitamin C.
Because you can do an expensivespecialty test that will do
like a micronutrient test thattells you you know what kinds of
nutrients you're low on or highon, and then that can have some
(08:41):
implications.
But there's a really easy wayto test it with your bowel
tolerance and and so you cantake certain.
You can do 500.
For sensitive people I usuallyrecommend like 250 to 500
milligram increments.
Non-hsps jump to one to threegrams, but sensitive people it
(09:01):
can go either way.
There can be a super highrequirement for it or really low
.
So I noticed that there wereabout a hundred of us in our
class and the people that I kindof had tagged as HFPs were all
talking about having had muchhigher bowel tolerance for
(09:22):
vitamin C, which is particularlyfascinating because vitamin C
is important in the conversionand the production of
epinephrine and thesestimulating fight or flight
types of brain chemicals andneurotransmitters.
And to me, once I put thattogether which was very similar
timing to Elaine's work, youknow, and me being exposed to it
(09:46):
I was like, oh man, there is somuch here.
Yes, yeah, so it started withvitamin C.
April Snow (09:54):
I mean there's so much because we talk a lot about
our emotional differences, ournervous system differences, but
why wouldn't there also then benutritional differences?
Of course, because I mean we'reliving in an interconnected
system.
I know we treat our bodies asthese separate silos, but it's
all part of the same system.
What an interesting discovery,I imagine you know.
(10:15):
Having worked with more andmore HSPs over the years, you've
been able to see more of that100%.
Yes, so we really do need totake care of our bodies
differently, as well as ouremotions 100%.
Dr. Karen Lamb (10:29):
Yeah, especially to be able to thrive in the way
that I want all HSPs to thrive,right Like what an amazing
world we would live in if wefelt really nourished and
grounded and in a place we canshine as brightly as we know is
possible.
April Snow (10:48):
Right, exactly, it's like we just need something
different to be able to do that.
So in your work with HSPs Iknow you've personally struggled
with burnout, but I imagine seethat a lot, whether it's
burnout or energy depletion orother physical symptoms.
I'm just curious if you couldshare a little bit more about
what those signs of burnoutmight be nutritionally or
(11:09):
physically or emotionally thatyou're picking up in your
practice.
Dr. Karen Lamb (11:13):
Yes, you know, the easiest way to answer that
and we can get into thespecifics but the easiest way to
answer that is the experienceof a highly sensitive person
when it becomes painful and issustained, right.
So the over-stimulation forsome of us, emotional reactivity
(11:34):
, emotional exhaustion,increased sensitivity, so all of
the things that can bewonderful.
Gifts kind of feel like they'reworking against us.
Gifts kind of feel like they'reworking against us.
And when we are there for anextended period of time, I think
as HSPs we always have, youknow, once a week or maybe at
the end of the day, where it'slike, okay, it's time, it's time
(11:55):
for me to, you know, stowmyself away, I will see you all
tomorrow.
But if that's the state thatsomebody is in, you know, really
continuously, then it's worthexploring.
Sleep issues become reallyprevalent during burnout.
A lack of joy or passion, whichis that light that I would love
(12:16):
all sensitive people to connectwith and shine system starts to
get really wonky.
So if we're exposed to highlevels of cortisol for an
extended period of time, thenthat has an immunosuppressive
effect and so we'll start to see, you know, frequent colds.
Or if somebody has anautoimmune condition, then more
(12:37):
flares of that autoimmunecondition.
Food cravings can also come upwith burnout, especially salty
or sweet, which is like, okay,well then, what's left?
Great.
But those are really common foradrenal fatigue, brain fog,
increased indecisiveness.
I know we all, as you know, wetend to be very intentional
(13:00):
about our choices and ourdecisions, but if it's just
feeling like you can't get to aconclusion or make a decision
and it's taking over, you know,in different elements like
procrastination or perfectionismalso tend to flare, and these
are all things that I think weas sensitive people will come in
and out of.
But it's that constant stateand what it really comes down to
(13:24):
is when the nervous system getsstuck in that sympathetic or
fight or flight state that leadsto burnout because it's just
the foot pressing on the gasconstantly and that is really
incompatible with sustainability, especially for a sensitive
person.
April Snow (13:42):
Absolutely.
You can't be in thatdysregulated state, that
depletive state for extendedperiods yeah, one day a week,
the end of days when you've gonethrough and you've done all
that you can.
Dr. Karen Lamb (13:53):
But if you're stuck in that, it sounds like
every system of the body is thenimpacted yeah yeah, exactly I
actually put together a littlequiz very, very old, like do it
manually, like those oldmagazine quizzes, and I put it
on my website because I'm justnot tech savvy and I wish I was,
but I'm not and it's a niceresource.
(14:14):
If people are curious aboutthat, I can give you that
information, because I don'tthink I mentioned it earlier.
April Snow (14:20):
Yeah, that would be great.
I'll put that in the show notes, for people Sounds good.
Yeah, yeah, cause I know therecan be a lot of different signs
that you're going throughburnout and they may not always
be obvious, right, or maybe whatyou would think.
Dr. Karen Lamb (14:35):
Yeah, yeah.
And I think that when we getinto that state of burnout and
things feel so stuck and I mean,I think I was in a constant
state of burnout until I learnedabout this, about how to take
care of myself so it was likefrom, I think, probably puberty,
right when hormones came on thescene and life got so much more
(14:57):
complicated especially with mysensitivity it was just
constantly feeling burnt out.
And when we get into that stateof stuckness, there is this we
feel so profoundlyunder-resourced that the idea of
anything changing feelsabsolutely impossible or
(15:26):
helplessness, and it's not thatright.
There is absolutely ways foreach individual sensitive person
to find a way out of it, and Ithink that's why I feel so
passionate about it, because Iknow what that feels like and
sometimes the solutions can feelso distant and impossible
because we're so under-resourced.
April Snow (15:40):
Yeah, we're living in that chronic under-resourced
space as HSPs, often eitherbecause of circumstances or we
do it to ourselves, notrealizing that we should or
could treat ourselvesdifferently.
So how do we start to come outif we're in that sense of
hopelessness?
Dr. Karen Lamb (15:57):
I mean knowing that there is a way For me.
I think that when I learnedthat there were different
nutritional needs for sensitivepeople, it was like a whole
world was opened up to me andall of a sudden I felt like I
needed to learn it, which wasquite the feat because I didn't
have anybody really there world.
(16:20):
There are many providers thatare certainly way more sensitive
than non-HSP you know,conventional medicine providers,
but not all naturopathicdoctors are highly sensitive and
oftentimes some are and don'tknow it or still kind of
function on a more conventionalparadigm.
(16:42):
And so I had a wonderfulnaturopathic doctor who
understood my sensitivity asbest as she could and honored it
, and that was already lightyears from the medical
gaslighting that I hadexperienced conventionally.
But it was really up to me, youknow, to lay that groundwork of
okay.
So now I know vitamin C andthat makes sense to me.
(17:03):
What about?
You know everything else, and Ikind of became a guinea pig for
myself and the work that I do.
And now I find it so empoweringto have you know my immune
system basket and my mentalhealth basket and my energy
basket, and knowing that I havethese resources whenever
(17:25):
something is feeling a littlebit off just feels really
empowering to me.
So kind of like in DBT, wewould teach people to have their
self-care basket, which when Ilearned that, was really
important for me as well.
So it's implementing thesedifferent concepts of self-care
(17:46):
that now include physical health, which was really revolutionary
for me.
April Snow (17:55):
Yeah, we often don't think about the physical health
in the context of emotionalstruggles like burnout.
We think of it more as you know, I'm overwhelmed, I'm
overstimulated.
But yeah, there's a physicalcomponent there.
You differentiate the mentalhealth basket, the immune system
basket, the energy basket.
Are you open to sharing maybean example from each of those?
Dr. Karen Lamb (18:17):
Yeah, so you know, obviously sensitive people
are very unique in our needs,but I can speak to the things
that are most comprehensivelywell-tolerated for sensitive
people.
It's just, you know, as you'vementioned, this is impossible to
(18:38):
be medical advice, because whenworking with sensitive people
it's so, so unique and thatfeedback that we get, that live
feedback from the body, isreally important to take note.
But vitamin C, of course.
So vitamin C it'santi-inflammatory, it's,
everybody knows, supports theimmune system and it can be
(19:00):
emotionally stabilizing, becauseanytime a nutrient is deficient
the alarm bells go off.
So anxiety, depression, fatigue, these are really really
general physical signs that ourbody's not getting what it needs
.
And vitamin C plays a role inso many.
(19:22):
It plays a role in the hormonesystem, so the endocrine system,
the neurological, mental health, brain chemistry system, the
immune system, the digestive.
I mean it is very, veryprevalent, so it's one that gets
you a lot of leverage andthat's why I love to start with
vitamin C.
There are some this is me goinginto, you know, the possibility
(19:45):
that it might not be good foryou, but if some people with
oxalate sensitivity, whichactually a lot of people do have
, might not respond well tovitamin C.
So, if ever you are introducingsomething new, always listen to
your body.
I can't stress that enough,especially for this population.
Right, like we have the abilityto be finely tuned instruments
(20:08):
and when we aren't I mean that'sthe experience of burnout right
, our music starts to sound alittle wonky.
Whenever your music starts tosound a little wonky, your body
isn't aligned.
Listen to that.
It does not matter what aprovider says.
Always prioritize that.
April Snow (20:24):
That's such a good reminder that we really need to
let it be subjective what isbest for me and in every area of
life.
Let's not look outward to whateveryone else is doing.
Let's look inward, and I'veexperienced that myself, just
having, over the last year,worked with a functional
medicine doctor and correctedsome deficiencies and seeing the
inflammation go down and mymental health shift.
(20:47):
It's like wow.
It's just a reminder thateverything is connected.
But to listen to what do I need?
Yes, so important, right.
Yeah, it's so powerful.
Dr. Karen Lamb (20:58):
Yes.
So vitamin C and what else isin my basket?
What other baskets do I have?
So that's going to be immune.
That's the really big one.
Magnesium you're hearing a lotabout magnesium.
We do tend to have a lot ofdeficiencies with magnesium,
because magnesium helps to relaxthings and, as sensitive people
(21:19):
, especially when we're in astate of burnout or are in this
kind of reactive fight or flightstate, everything gets really
constricted right Thoughts,bowels, blood vessels,
everything gets really tight andmagnesium can help to provide
some ease.
There's lots of different formsfor sleep, versus cognitive
(21:42):
anxiety or overthinking types oftension.
But generally speaking, you cando bowel tolerance for
magnesium as well.
So you could start withsomething like 100 milligrams
and add 50 to 100 milligramsevery day until there's loose
bowels, and then you take abreak and then you start back up
at one or 200 milligrams lowerthan what triggered the loose
(22:05):
stools.
Same with vitamin C.
So that's a really nice, easyway to test those for yourself.
If you have low blood pressure,be careful with that because it
can it will, you know relax theblood vessels, which can
decrease blood pressure, and ifthere's any kind of bone density
problems, because magnesium andcalcium will compete for one
(22:27):
another.
I'm going to pause here becauseI can talk about this oh yeah,
this forever, but I want to makesure that you know we have time
to cover the thing.
April Snow (22:37):
This is really helpful because there's so many
layers here.
Right, and I appreciate theunderlying message to like ease
in, test things along the way,reflect How's it going, make
adjustments.
Don't just take what you'vebeen told or what the common
dose is and you know we're kindof skirting around this issue.
But I want to bring it more tothe surface, which is HSPs often
(23:00):
have different reactions tomedication, to supplements, to
treatments in general, so it'sreally important to listen to
your body, to maybe start slowand then ramp up, yes, with
whatever you're taking yes yes,yes, I am so, so, so important,
(23:22):
and I've primarily focused mywork, my naturopathic work, with
on hsps for about 10 years.
Dr. Karen Lamb (23:30):
I've always done done it, but I wasn't
exclusively HSP until the last10 years and during this time,
every time somebody comes and doI have ideas of how something
might work out?
I have ideas but ultimately itis their body that is going to
dictate how quickly we gothrough.
(23:50):
That is going to dictate howquickly we go through you know,
any given protocol or whatdirection we take, and it's so,
so critical that people HSPsspecifically blank slate every
time you start something new,blank slate as a beginner's mind
, right, I know nothing aboutthis and I am here to learn what
(24:12):
my body has to tell me and thenproceed Because, just because
your neighbor, who's also an HSP, right, even within our own
trait, you know we experience alot of differences and that, I
think, is the foundation of themedical empowerment that I hope
that people HSPs start toexperience with these types of
(24:38):
messages.
April Snow (24:38):
Yes, empowerment is so important and I love that
reminder.
Your neighbor who's an HSP,your friend, your sister,
whoever, even if they're doingthis dose or taking this
protocol, whatever it is, startfrom scratch what works for you.
So in a naturopathics office, Iimagine there's more
(25:02):
conversation, there's more room,but what if you're getting a
message from a practitioner thatis more absolute, more
regimented?
Who's not thinking about asensitive nervous system?
What do you do then?
So, as you're talking, I'm likethis is amazing.
This is exactly how I want toshow up for my health, but I
know not every practitioner isaware of sensitivity or is
(25:23):
considering it.
Dr. Karen Lamb (25:24):
Yeah, yeah, I have a couple of thoughts about
that.
One is if you feel like yourprovider is constantly saying,
well, it can't possibly be that,or you know, just kind of
gaslit like your experience orwhat you are sharing is
completely negated orinvalidated, Then at that point
(25:46):
I would say I would highlyencourage that somebody find a
different provider.
And this can happen in thefunctional world, it can happen
in the naturopathic world.
I have worked with colleaguesand professors who were very
rigid about how they thoughtsomething you know, a protocol,
should be executed and I havesomething to say about that.
(26:08):
But to finish the first section, if you feel that you are
invalidated and not heard, Ithink that's the key If you feel
heard with a provider and theysay your situation is very
extreme and you're suffering alot, and I strongly recommend
that we do it this way and ifthings go sideways, then we can
(26:30):
reevaluate.
There's a dialogue.
April Snow (26:34):
Yep, they're actually hearing your experience
.
They're not shut off to it.
Dr. Karen Lamb (26:39):
Yes, yep, so that's a very important sign.
If you are not feeling heard, Ifeel like that is detrimental
to your health.
So forget about the fact thatyou know you haven't even
started the treatment right thatI think healing spaces in.
As a therapist, you know youunderstand the relationship is
(27:02):
the primary vehicle for healing,and that is no different in the
medical world.
April Snow (27:07):
No, it's the foundation.
You have to have that in placebefore anything else happens.
No, it's the foundation.
You have to have that in placebefore anything else happens,
completely agree.
Dr. Karen Lamb (27:16):
So that's one perspective.
If that doesn't feel, if youaren't even at neutral right,
like if you're starting offneutral and it's not an amazing
relationship, that can stillwork.
But if there's a sense ofinvalidation or medical
gaslighting, I do think thatthat is more problematic.
It's adding to the imbalancethat you're there to receive
(27:38):
help with.
So I would say find a newprovider.
If you're dealing withsomething that is really
disruptive to your life, right,and you are in a lot of pain,
like there is something that isprohibiting you from being able
to engage in work or family orjust quality of life, then it's
(27:59):
possible that a more robustprotocol may be in order.
And then at that point, ifyou're working with someone who
came really highly recommended,it might be an exception.
You know, to everything has tobe a conversation, but I would
still really emphasize theimportance of feeling heard.
April Snow (28:21):
Yeah, that's, I mean , essential right, and maybe
you're varying the degrees ofbeing heard or what you feel is
enough.
If there's other circumstances,it sounds like that has to be
there, at least in some level.
Yeah.
Dr. Karen Lamb (28:34):
I think so, without adding toxicity right to
a difficult situation.
Having said that, I think mostsensitive people can find
providers that hear them, youknow, and I think maybe even if
somebody is going throughsomething really complicated,
like a complex autoimmunecondition or something that's
(28:55):
not diagnosed yet but isdebilitating, maybe it's even
more important in thosecircumstances to find somebody
to work with you, because it'softentimes those cases that are
most sensitive to medicationsand supplements and vitamins and
herbs and all of that, and sothey need extra care to not feel
worse.
April Snow (29:15):
Yes, they really do.
You're talking about autoimmuneand energy levels.
Are we destined for thesethings, as HSPs Burnout, sleep
issues, autoimmune issues,digestive issues?
Because you see a lot of HSPstruggling with these issues.
Dr. Karen Lamb (29:35):
Yeah, I do think that we have a very significant
susceptibility to complexhealth pictures or burnout
symptoms or some of these healthconcerns that we're talking
about, because we process theworld as deeply as we do and
(29:56):
every experience of sensory datarequires a chemical reaction.
So if we, you know, if we seelight more brightly or hear
sounds more intensely oremotions more intensely,
depending on what yoursensitivity is or, in some cases
like myself, all of the above,you know, each of those is a
(30:19):
chemical reaction and thosechemical reactions require
nutrients and they require extradetoxification and a lot of
energy to run those chemicalreactions and replenish the
nutrients.
Once again, I like to think ofit as baking a cake.
So if you bake one cake, youneed your eggs and your oil and
your water and then you need theenergy to bake it and then the
(30:43):
experience of the cake, right?
So the emotion, the sadness orwhatever.
Or if it's a lot of sadness,then it's 10 cakes.
You know that you're baking.
Then you got to go back andclean the kitchen that's the
detoxification piece and restockyour pantry.
So these are elements that gointo physiological self-care for
sensitive person that you knowa non-HSP doesn't have to think
(31:06):
about they make one cake, maybefive in a day, right, like we're
like cake, cake, cake, cake,cake, cake cake you know this
little right, just a hamsterwheel of cake making.
Yes, a hamster wheel of cakemaking, yeah, and so they can
just eat their regular diet.
They can go about.
You know, they're 80% of thepopulation's self-care, which is
(31:31):
just existing really, you know.
And everything their pantrygets restocked, everything gets
cleaned up and they don't haveto think twice about it.
But we have a very differentinternal cellular experience.
So that makes it moresusceptible to answer.
April Snow (31:48):
No, this is making so much sense because I always
think about how much emotionalenergy we take from processing
our experiences.
I haven't extended that thingabout we need more nutrients or
physiological support Because,right, if we're having all these
different chemical reactions inour brain doing all this
processing, our brains are morelit up, taking in all this
(32:08):
information.
Of course our body is going toneed to pull that energy from
somewhere, and if we're depletedon that level, other systems
start to be impacted.
Yes, exactly so.
It's not that we're necessarilysusceptible or weak.
Yes, Physiologically, it's thatwe need a different level of
(32:28):
input.
Dr. Karen Lamb (32:29):
It seems very just basic we need a different
level of input.
It seems very just basic.
Yeah Right, it's not weakness,it's not a deficit, it's not I
was born to be ill or I was bornto be not well, it's, I was
born to be cared for in a verydifferent way than 80% of the
population, and whether or notwe had HSP parents, you know
(32:52):
we're just now at a place thatI'm able to change the story for
my son.
But my parents, who one, waskind of an HSP, but you know, an
officer in the military, likeright, he's going to be the one
to teach me.
I mean, poor man, like sodisconnected from his own needs
(33:14):
as a sensitive person.
So it's very common for, youknow, those of us in the
certainly 30s and 40s and beyondto not have had any kind of
guidance because they didn'tknow.
They didn't know, yeah, yeah,Even the self-care right of how
very empowering to shift thatmindset and just as, I think,
(33:54):
just as empowering as learning.
Oh my gosh.
This is a trait that benefitscommunities.
You know that has helpedsocieties to thrive and to
survive.
So is this understanding of thephysical piece that our bodies
are just doing more and so theyjust bring care.
That's it.
April Snow (34:14):
It's that basic Different body, different level
of care Right, and it issomething that our parents had
no clue about, right?
I mean, mental health ingeneral was not even on the
radar, let alone looking attemperament and nervous system
wiring and just thesephysiological needs.
So this is a good reminder thatwe need to take care of our
(34:39):
physical needs, so then we cantake our emotional needs and we
can show up for that purpose forour communities, because we do
have a very specific reason tobe here.
You know, this trait hassurvived, however long, for a
reason Exactly.
Yeah, so just to and there'ssome noise outside, I apologize
for listeners, just trying totake in what you're saying
(35:00):
because it's such an importantmessage.
So if we want to feel our best,we want to actually have energy
, we want to give ourselves abuffer against that almost seems
like a never burnout.
What are some of the basicsthat?
Dr. Karen Lamb (35:18):
we should be doing?
Would you say we talked aboutnutritional supplementation?
What else would you put on thatlist?
So before I go through some ofthis list, I just want to make a
blanket statement that verygentle and simple things go a
really, really long way forsensitive people.
So this might sound too basicor oversimplified, but sensitive
(35:39):
people most often thrive withthe most minimal and natural
interventions.
Is that always the case?
No, I certainly am not here topreach that natural approaches
are always the answer forsensitive people.
Absolutely not Integrative.
Use all the tools you know, butstart super, super basic and as
(36:00):
natural as possible and then gofrom there.
April Snow (36:03):
I mean it's such a good reminder because we are
more emotionally perceptive,visually perceptive.
I think our bodies are alsomore perceptive and just soak up
whatever we're giving it like asponge.
Yes, yeah, start small.
Dr. Karen Lamb (36:16):
Yes, yes, we have a very narrow window of
optimal functioning and you knowthat can feel really
frustrating when you're thesensitive person, and maybe even
to providers that are not, youknow, compassionate of that
experience, because that's wheremedical gaslighting comes into
play.
We know we're outside of thislittle window and so we're like
(36:38):
something's not right.
I don't feel well, I gotta talkto somebody.
Then they go talk to somebodyand they're like your labs are
perfect.
So we have such a fantastictool within us that is so
advanced that modern day sciencemost of modern day science,
certainly conventional labscannot identify what we are
(37:03):
feeling, and so we're greatcandidates for preventative
medicine because of that.
April Snow (37:08):
I mean truly, because we can detect something
before it shows up on the scan,on the blood test.
So I think there's a room thereto remind folks that
self-advocate right, find thatprovider that will listen to you
.
Like something feels off,because I've had that too where,
oh, my labs are all perfect,I'm like, but something is wrong
(37:28):
.
I'm having inflammation.
I need a closer look and that'swhy I went outside of the
traditional system to receivemedical care.
And yeah, just a reminder thatyou know listen to yourself.
But also the small, subtleintervention might be enough.
Dr. Karen Lamb (37:45):
Yes.
April Snow (37:45):
And we're really looking outside the box here in
every way.
Yes.
Dr. Karen Lamb (37:50):
And, if it's still present, keep bringing it
up.
If you keep bringing it up to aprovider and they get
frustrated or start invalidatingyou when maybe they didn't at
first, it's time for somebodynew, because the right provider
is always going to say we needto keep digging, we need to keep
looking until we find thatanswer.
(38:10):
If you feel like you'reburdening someone or don't go
into the people pleasing, sayokay, thank you, we've done our
work.
It's time to find somebody else.
April Snow (38:19):
This is not the time to people, please Right,
absolutely not.
Yes, because I've heard so manyHSPs share that they caught
something a major medical issueearly before their providers
would have caught it.
Dr. Karen Lamb (38:33):
Absolutely yes, a hundred percent, trust
yourself.
Yes, so to answer your question, I just wanted to make a
disclaimer.
You know that this might soundreally basic, but just
beginner's mind, right, onceagain, beginner's mind.
So, my, there's lots ofelements, there's many different
(39:00):
ways to optimize hydration, butthe reason that it's so
important and I like to includethis because my mom used to tell
me from a very young age youneed to drink more water, which
is interesting because now I'mthinking, oh wow, she was
teaching me how to take care ofmy age needs but I found it so
frustrating because I reallylike to understand why, and I
didn't feel thirsty, so it wasweird to me.
(39:22):
And so once I really understood,you know, going back to that
cake analogy, I have to go backand clean the kitchen.
So after each chemical reaction, after each cake that I bake,
which is constantly there, needsto be enough water, because
that's the most basic form ofcleaning our bodies, to get the
kitchen ready for my nextsensory experience.
(39:45):
And so there you can understandwhy HSPs have a high
requirement for water.
And it's not just drinking thewater, it's getting the water
into the cells and you know,electrolytes are important in
that process toxicity,mitochondrial function.
There's other elements of that,but just bare bones.
Most basic recommendation ishydration.
April Snow (40:08):
This makes a lot of sense because I drink a lot of
water every day, but there's asense of I feel like I'm
dehydrated, like my wife is.
She's not a big water drinkerand I was, like you know, I'm
drinking water all day long,from time I wake up till I go to
(40:29):
bed, and it's like, okay, thismakes sense because I'm thinking
about how the brain cleansitself while you sleep, but I
hadn't really thought about howyour body is needing to do that,
detoxing all day long.
And what's the vehicle for that?
It's water.
Yes, needs to flush through andthe more water I force myself
to drink more water and mydigestion is better, my energy
is better.
Like I notice a difference.
Dr. Karen Lamb (40:50):
Yes, yes, it was surprising In the energy module
of the program, of the ThrivingSensitivity Program.
That is the first thing that Italk about under energy, because
almost all people wish theycould have more.
April Snow (41:04):
That makes sense.
Dr. Karen Lamb (41:05):
Yes, yes, all right, and I too, you know, I'm
drinking water constantly andit's like I mean, the demand is
so high and I live at altitude,so that just adds a whole, a
whole other element ofcomplexity.
But it's so critical and it'sso basic and understanding.
I hope that explaining it inthat way is helpful for those
(41:28):
sensitive people out there likemyself who really like to
understand why am I doing this?
So hydration, first andforemost, and I love what you
said about regeneration andhealing of detoxification of the
brain and the body during sleep.
Dehydration can cause sleepdisruptions, because if you
(41:49):
don't have the water, you knowthe cleaning supplies then you
end up waking or not having veryrestful sleep, because the
whole purpose of sleep is todetoxify and regenerate tissue.
So if you don't have thenecessary tools to do that, it's
not going to feel restful.
So that's the next thing that Iwas going to mention is
(42:11):
optimizing your sleep, andthat's definitely sounds much
easier than it is right.
I mean, it's a checkbox, butit's a whole process underneath
it that we oftentimes do bestwhen we collaborate with a
provider that can help to use ascientific method to help go
through what's working, what'snot, systematically.
(42:34):
Bowel movements are anotherthing to keep track of.
Regular, easy, uneventful,fully formed bowel movements at
least once a day.
Every time our digestive tractturns on it is moving all the
way through from mouth to out.
So if you're eating a meal thentechnically we should be moving
(42:57):
another meal out.
So some people feel best whenthey have three bowel movements,
but my absolute minimum foreveryone is once a day.
So if you're not having a bowelmovement at least once a day,
that's a form of constipation,even if every other day it's an
easy bowel movement.
So people think of constipationas it needing to be difficult
(43:19):
to pass or dry.
It doesn't necessarily have tobe that.
It's more about how frequentlyare you removing waste from your
body, because the longer itstays in your intestines the
toxins get reabsorbed back inand that just puts extra burden
on your body to have to do thesame thing twice or three times.
April Snow (43:36):
It makes sense, right, as things come in, they
should go out.
Yes, yeah, feels pretty simple.
So we have in, they should goout.
Yes, yeah, it feels prettysimple.
Dr. Karen Lamb (43:50):
So we have hydration, sleep, bowel
movements, anything else thatfeels essential to focus on.
I mean, those are really superbasic and important, and I would
encourage people to take theirtime with this.
So that's one of the thingsthat I really like really pride
myself, and I had.
I saw somebody this morning andshe said I'm such a bad patient
.
I didn't do anything that wetalked about, and the first
thing I said to her wasabsolutely not, there are no bad
(44:11):
patients.
It's that we didn't identifyyour needs accurately and
because of that, we didn't makea plan that was actionable for
you, and so that's veryimportant.
With these three things that wejust discussed, it's you know
our brain can think oh, they'reso simple, I should be able to
(44:34):
incorporate them quickly, andthat is a disservice to your
process, especially as sensitivepeople, right?
So, starting with something assimple as adding two extra
ounces of water, starting bymeasuring the water that you're
consuming and then adding twoextra ounces and slowly building
up to what's ideal for you thatmakes sense.
April Snow (44:56):
Start small, something that you can actually
accomplish, instead of puttingall the pressure to do all the
things at once, cause, yes,sleep and digestion are pretty
foundational, but those are bigmountains to climb, depending on
what's going on.
But, starting with hydration,could impact both.
Dr. Karen Lamb (45:16):
Yes, yes, and sleep especially.
I mean sleep is notoriouslycomplex.
The only other thing I wouldadd is trying to rely on food as
much as possible for nutrientslike vitamin C and magnesium.
I'm not saying thatsupplementation, that there's
anything wrong withsupplementation, but there is a
certain leverage that we getfrom food because food comes
(45:37):
with the other nutrients thatmake it easier for those
vitamins to be absorbed intofunction.
April Snow (45:44):
Yeah, so you get the whole package, whole package,
all the components?
Yeah, that you need to actuallyutilize those nutrients?
Yeah, that makes sense.
Well, karen, we're gettingclose to time, so I just want to
see you know you've shared somany valuable pieces of
information today and really, Ithink, widen the scope of how do
we take care of ourselves asHSPs, how do we tap into the
(46:07):
strengths of our sensitivity,the value that we bring.
I just want to see if there'sany final messages that you want
to share.
Dr. Karen Lamb (46:13):
Definitely the burnout experience is solvable.
You know, even if you're inthat place of feeling really
helpless or hopeless, there isnothing wrong with you.
It's to be expected that, giventhe wear and tear, as we've
discussed today on our sensitivebodies, that burnout without
very specific intervention is.
(46:34):
I mean it sounds daunting butit's almost inevitable for all
of us as HSPs.
I mean it certainly has been myexperience, and so just knowing
that you know tuning yourinstrument as an HSP requires
special knowledge that we justit hasn't been given to us and
it is available for us andespecially finding that right
(46:56):
practitioner can make a world ofdifference.
I think that's a reallyimportant message because I hope
that sensitive people can startto fine tune their instruments,
because I feel like our world,more than ever at least it feels
that way in my lifetime is inneed of our beautiful melodies,
(47:17):
right that our tuned instrumentscan play.
So that's really an importantmessage and that's why I
developed the ThrivingSensitivity Program is to
systematically present thesethings in actionable steps in
ways that feel digestible andrun the gamut from, you know,
interpreting conventional labsand specialty labs and really
(47:41):
being able to feel empowered inour own health, because even
though there are providers thatcan help.
It is always my goal in workingwith sensitive people to get
them to a place where theybecome their own doctors, with
some guidance and someadjustment, always knowing that
they can come back.
But the idea is we have all ofthe information inside.
(48:04):
We just need that practitionerinformation of oh well, what
test is it or what nutrient isit and how do I assess that?
And that was my goal with theThriving Sensitivity Program is
for people sensitive people tofeel empowered with their health
and learn how to do that in amanageable, digestible way.
April Snow (48:24):
I love that, because so many clients that I work
with are trying to do that butnot having the guidance, the
resources or the understandingof being able to put that
clinician hat on, because wereally are so gifted at knowing
what our bodies need that we canreally heal ourselves.
(48:44):
And you're right that we areall susceptible to burnout just
because of the way our bodiesfunction and the world that we
live in and that mismatch.
But there's a lot we can do toactually find that balance and
we can actually thrive.
I just love that that's theword you put into the program
the thriving sensitivity,because it's true, I think we
(49:04):
think those two are opposite,but they can.
You know, sensitivity andthriving can coexist.
So I'll be sure to share thatlink in the show notes for folks
who are looking for thatsupport.
Also, share your social media,your website and the quiz as
well.
Yeah, so I just want to thankyou?
Dr. Karen Lamb (49:20):
Yeah, the 15% discount for anybody who puts
that in.
I think I can share that codeif I haven't already.
April Snow (49:28):
Perfect and I'll make sure I share that in our
outro so we folks can have thatWonderful.
Thank you so much, karen.
Thanks so much for joining meand Karen for today's
conversation.
What I hope you take away isthat you are the expert on your
(49:48):
own body and your own health.
Trust your intuition and findproviders that will listen.
If you're struggling withburnout, head to
thrivingsensitivitycom forKaren's sensitivity burnout quiz
and courses.
Links are in the show notes.
If you enjoyed this episode,subscribe to the Sensitive
(50:10):
Stories podcast so you don'tmiss our upcoming conversations.
Reviews and ratings are alsohelpful and appreciated For
behind-the-scenes content andmore HSP resources.
You can sign up for my emaillist or follow Sensitive
Strengths on Instagram, tiktokand YouTube.
Check out the show notes orsensitivestoriescom for all the
resources from today's episode.
Thanks for listening.
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