March 3, 2025 • 54 mins
In this emotionally harrowing episode, Sara - Juror #11 - walks us through Day 4 of the trial against Jason Chen — the day the jury came face to face with the most difficult evidence yet.
Forensic expert Dr. Steven Cogswell takes the stand, leading the courtroom through the grim details of Jasmine Pace’s autopsy. Through X-rays, photographs, and expert testimony, the jury sees exactly how Jasmine was found — restrained, contorted inside a suitcase, and bearing the marks of 60 separate stab wounds.
The evidence paints a chilling picture, not just of violence, but of deliberate cruelty. A broken knife blade lodged inside Jasmine’s lung. Blood evidence that suggests a desperate struggle. And hauntingly, the moment when Jasmine sent her mother a location pin — her final message — just minutes after a scream was heard from Jason Chen’s apartment.
Sara also reflects on the weight of what it means to see these images firsthand, and how jurors’ own questions helped piece together a clearer but more devastating timeline.
This is the day the reality of the case truly set in — and it’s a day no one in that courtroom will ever forget.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
Before we get into this episode,I want to give you a heads up.
It contains graphic descriptionsof violence, including details
from an autopsy. Out of respectfor Jasmine and her family,
we've chosen to hold back onsome of the more graphic
details, but what you will hearmay still be unsettling, so
please listen with care. It'sThursday, January 16, 2025, day
(00:28):
four of the trial. Before weeven stepped into the jury room
this morning, we could feel theweight of what was coming. I
went to bed last night bracingmyself for today, trying to
prepare my mind and my heart forwhat we were about to see. But
how do you prepare for somethinglike this? As jurors, part of
(00:51):
our job was to face the evidenceto see what no one should ever
have to see. Today we would seeimages of Jasmine paces lifeless
body, and with them theundeniable reality of what was
done to her. We already knew thefacts. She was stabbed 60 times,
restrained and stuffed into asuitcase, but knowing and seeing
(01:16):
those are two entirely differentthings no one should ever have
to witness another human beingin that state, and yet, here we
were.
This is sequestered a juror'sperspective on the murder trial
(01:37):
for Jasmine pace. I'm Sarah,juror number 11 each episode,
I'll take you inside thecourtroom, behind the scenes,
and into the weighty moments ofthis trial as we honor Jasmine's
life and navigate thecomplexities of seeking justice.
Let's begin.
(02:01):
This is Episode Five, the bodyin the suitcase.
I learned this only after thefact, but while we were waiting
in the jury room that morning,da Cody WAMP noticed that
defense attorney Weiss moved atrash can near Jason Chen at the
(02:23):
defense table, along with a boxof tissues. Here's a clip of how
that scene played out in thecourtroom just minutes before
the jury came in one second,
they moved the trash can insidethe defendant and they brought
little nappies over here. If itapplies to the gallery that
(02:43):
there can be no outburst, Mr.Chin also needs to be selling
posts during this testimony, orhe can exit the court as well.
Okay, well, the trash can movecloser to already indicated that
he's feeling he's feelingunwell. I'm just saying that's
prejudicial as well. Judge.
(03:06):
Everyone has to comportthemselves with the maintain the
court or this particularproceeding, so that includes
Council defendants. However,this is going to be very graphic
and personal testimony. Soeveryone needs to maintain their
composure. Courier questionstwice. If there is anyone the
(03:27):
gallery that feels they cannotmaintain their composure, it's
particular witness. It is bestto be going to leave right now.
You know what's happening aboutto be displayed on the screen.
So that mission does extend toMr. Chin,
as you can tell, da WAMP raisesher concerns to the judge about
Jason Chen receivingpreferential treatment. She
(03:49):
points out that Weiss moved thetrash can and tissues near their
table, implying that thedefendant may be trying to sway
the court's perception. JudgePatterson responds by
emphasizing that everyone in thecourtroom, including Chen, must
maintain composure, especiallygiven the graphic nature of the
upcoming testimony. JudgePatterson also warns the gallery
(04:11):
that anyone who is unable toremain composed should excuse
themselves from the courtroombefore this evidence is
presented. At this time,Jasmine's mother, Katrina bean
and Jason Chen's mother, ShuFang Chen, both leave the
courtroom. They already knewsome things once seen can never
be unseen. This all happenedbefore we even entered the
(04:39):
courtroom. Pre trial matterswere a regular occurrence, so we
never really knew what we'd bewalking into each day. But
something was noticeablydifferent this morning, as we
took our seats, despite thetension in the room, the
proceedings were officiallyunderway by 945 Hamilton County
medical exam. And forensicpsychologist, Dr Stephen
(05:02):
Cogswell was sworn in as thestate's first expert witness
with nearly 40 years ofexperience and 1000s of
autopsies to his name, includingover 100 cases involving fatal
stab wounds. Dr Stephencogswell's experience is
undeniable. His presence alonecommands respect as he takes the
(05:24):
stand Dr Cogswell, a middle agedman with a shaved head and a
neatly trimmed beard pepperedwith gray, carries himself with
quiet authority. He wears blackglasses and is dressed sharply
in a navy collared shirt, a bluepattern tie and a dark gray suit
jacket exuding professionalismand confidence General. Moyle
(05:47):
brings Doctor Cogswell to thescene of suck Creek Road on the
afternoon of December 1 2022Moyle asks him,
what did you see when you gotthere? Obviously, there were
quite a few law enforcementvehicles, and off to the side of
the road, adjacent to the river,was a hard shell suitcase. Just
(06:14):
off the shoulder of the road,near that area were actually a
couple of deer carcasses thathave been tossed out there after
butchering. But in particular,this suitcase was basically the
the time that you would take ona relatively extended trip,
large suitcase on wheels,handle, etcetera, after all of
(06:40):
the documentation, photographicand location issues were
resolved by police department sothat they could place it
exactly. Then the question cameup, well, what is in the
suitcase? And at that point, thecover of the suitcase, the lid
(07:02):
is open inside a black plastictrash bag. And so using
basically just hands, I couldfeel along the contents of the
bag and say, Yes, this is notanimal or something. This is a
good game inside out which pointthat the suitcase was closed
(07:26):
back up, it was transported toMedical Examiner's Office, and
at that point, further examine,not just the suitcase, but also
the contents.
Next Moyle asked Dr Cogswell,what did you do when you
returned to your office? Here'sa clip of Dr cogswell's
(07:46):
response.
At that point, before we doanything else, then we're going
to start doing photographs and Xrays, because we're going to
document everything we're doingas we're doing it in a step wise
fashion, because we don't wantto lose evidence. So in X ray,
we basically just lay thesuitcase on top of the X ray
(08:08):
plates and X rays through thesuitcase. And looking at those x
rays, it was evident that thereis a deceased person inside,
basically in a fetal positionthat is drawn with the knees
drawn up and the arms crossedaround, across the chest and
(08:31):
fitted into the suitcase. Inaddition, along with all of the
hardware in the suitcase thatshows up on X ray, there's also
a triangular metallic densitypiece that showed up in the area
of the chest, and it's somethingthat obviously didn't belong to
(08:52):
the suitcase, because there's avery regular arrangement of
support bars, rivets, etc, thatis fairly symmetrical. So after
the X raying was done, then thebody was lifted out of the
suitcase, and at that point,then the suitcase is laid off to
(09:16):
the side. That's no longer amedical examiner interest.
That's law enforcement interest.And then I proceeded to cut each
of the black plastic trash bagsalong one side and along the
bottom and remove each of thosein turn. Turns out there were
three, and that's happens to befairly common at least, at least
(09:44):
in the bodies that I've done incases in which you have autopsy,
where people have been disposedof in trash bags. It seems like
the interior bag is alwayspulled up from the feet toward
the head, and then there'sanother one down from the head
toward the feet, and then theremay. Your third one, again, feet
toward the head. In this case,turns out it was exactly the
(10:06):
same way. I guess that's justhow humans fit. But so each of
those bags is cut off, removed,and that reveals the body of a
young woman who is in a fetalposition, has no clothing on the
top. Body and is shackled andhandheld.
(10:30):
I think it's interesting thatCogswell mentions the direction
in which the bags were placedover Jasmine's body. Here, he
said the first bag was pulled upfrom her feet to her head. The
second place from her head downtowards her feet, and the third,
once again, from her feet overher head. Each bag was cinched
(10:51):
closed and tied with a knot. Atfirst, this might seem like a
minor detail, but his point ischilling. Cogswell has clearly
seen this pattern before, and itspeaks to something deeper,
something disturbinglyconsistent in human behavior
when attempting to conceal abody, Dr Cogswell then walks the
(11:15):
jury through the painstakingprocess of documenting all 60 of
the whims on Jasmine's body.Each injury is photographed,
first as it was found, thenagain after being cleaned. He
explains the key differencebetween incised wounds and stab
wounds in size, wounds are moresuperficial and have
(11:35):
directionality, appearing moreas a slice, while stab wounds
are as they sound, a strikepenetrating deeper and causing
more severe damage. The juryalso learns about three critical
time frames forensic experts useto classify injuries, ante
mortem, which is inflictedbefore death, perimortem, which
(11:58):
is inflicted around the time ofdeath, and post mortem, which is
inflicted after death, it's asobering moment as science
strips away the emotion andbreaks down the unimaginable
into cold clinical facts. DrCogswell then shares a lesson he
instills in his students whenteaching about sharp force
(12:21):
injuries, look for the blooduntil every drop is accounted
for. They truly don't know wherethe bleeding occurred. And until
you find this, you haven't foundthe crime scene.
Basically all stab wounds,unless they actually hit your
(12:41):
brain, your central nervoussystem, because of that, by
making you leave today, that'sthe mechanism. So we look at, I
what is the flow quality in youraverage person of this size, if
it goes by size? So a person whois the size of jasmine, PACE
(13:02):
just under 100 pounds. Her bloodvolume is approximately four
liters of four quarts of blood.So a gallon of blood. Now, if
you lose about 20 to 30% of yourblood volume, that is sufficient
to make you unconscious.Anything about 30% is sufficient
(13:23):
to actually cause death. So whenwe look at someone who has four
quarts of blood, if we lose fourand a half, that's sufficient to
cause death. So there shouldstill be some blood left inside
the body, but it's going to bespread around in the body and
capillaries, the blood that's inthe big toe is going to remain
(13:46):
in the big toe. So what we'reactually looking at is, where is
that quarter and a half ofblood? When I'm teaching classes
on sharp horse injuries, lookfor the blood, because a four
and a half blood goes a longway. Using an allergy, everyone
is painted a wall sometime intheir life that's a gallon of
(14:10):
blood. That's four quarts. Youcan paint a room with a gallon
of blood. So if you see a spotof blood this big, and someone
is dead, there's more bloodsomewhere else. Maybe it's
inside the body, but maybe it'salso another scene. So that's
why we say look for the blood,because until you have found all
(14:34):
that blood, you don't reallyknow where the bleeding
occurred.
You can paint a room with agallon of blood. That phrase
stuck with me the moment DrCogswell said it, I instantly
looked down at the carpet stilllaying out on the courtroom
floor stained with Jasmine'sblood. It wasn't just evidence,
(14:59):
it was a hunting. Reminder ofwhere her life ended. This feels
like a good time to remind youto take care while listening to
this episode, out of respect forJasmine's family, we're choosing
not to share every graphicdetail about her wounds, but we
do want to give enough contextto help you understand what
(15:20):
happened. Dr Cogswell beginswith X ray images, offering an
undeniable glimpse into howJasmine's body was positioned
inside of the suitcase. Her headtoward the handle and her feet
toward the wheels. He thenshifts to the evidence of
restraint. Jasmine's right wristwas handcuffed to the inside of
(15:45):
her left ankle, while her rightankle was shackled to her right
elbow. It was a restrictive,contorted position that suggests
deliberate immobilization in aneffort to better understand how
she was restrained. I actuallylaid on the floor of my living
room and tried to get into thisposition myself. And restrictive
(16:09):
and contortive, are greatdescriptions of the position she
was forced into. One criticaldetail stands out the chain on
the shackles was broken, apossible sign of a desperate
struggle. Yet, Dr Cogswell isquick to point out something
unexpected. There were noligature marks or abrasions on
(16:29):
Jasmine's ankles or wrists,raising even more questions
about how and when therestraints were applied, a
detail the defense will be sureto bring up later. Even more
telling is the pattern of herinjuries. The majority of
Jasmine's 60 wounds wereconcentrated on her upper right
side, reinforcing the theorythat she was in the fetal
(16:52):
position during the attack. Nowlet's return to the courtroom as
Dr Cogswell walks the jurythrough the X rays of the
suitcase
in the position the suitcase isright now her body is with the
head upward facing toward thecourtroom. So I'm now showing
(17:18):
you two of three, two. Sheorients us to this boat, right?
This photo is moving over alittle bit to, if I can point to
the suitcase, to this area herethat we're X ray and again, we
see another one of thesereinforcing ribs, a few more
(17:39):
rivets, etcetera, etcetera, azipper of a hole on the inside.
And here we have a knee. You cansee the kneecap here, and the
lower leg, the shin and thefibula that goes along with it.
This is the thigh bone. Here yousee a hand, or the bones of a
hand. And you can see the top ofthe skull as well. Here, 233,
(18:06):
and we're moving downward on thesuitcase in basically
counterclockwise fashion, tothis area, down toward the wheel
on the the style closest to thecourtroom, and we see again that
reinforcing ribs, zippers,rivets, etc. But we also see
(18:30):
handcuffs and shackles, as wellas a another metallic device
here, which is actuallyembraced, but you can see on
this one there is a chain thatextends here, and there is no
chain coming off of thisparticular one. And we're down
(18:52):
here to feet. These are the footbones, feet and ankle bones down
here. So we have forearm here,with the two forearm bones and
arm and forearm bones here. Andso we're down here. This is her
(19:12):
buttocks, 234, sir. And we'removing over obviously to the
last part, which is down here.And again, we have all the
hardware of the suitcase. We seea bit of pelvis bone here, the
lumbar spine here, again, one ofthose shackles that you saw in
(19:33):
the previous X ray. And so wehave, basically, by going
counterclockwise, we have acomplete picture of a small
individual at this point wedidn't know, male or female,
still inside the suitcase, stillinside those black plastic bags.
(19:54):
Yeah, you heard that correctly.Handcuffs and shackles for those
of you. Who are curious aboutthe difference between the two I
was handcuffs are designed torestrain a person's wrists
together. Shackles, on the otherhand, have a longer chain
between the cuffs and aretypically heavier metal
restraints used to securedifferent parts of the body,
(20:18):
usually the ankles. Think ofprisoners being transferred with
prosecutor Moyles instructions.Dr Cogswell puts on a pair of
blue gloves and opens theevidence bag containing the
handcuffs, showing them to thejury
(20:39):
they were still wrapped in thesurgical talent that came from
the medical examiner's office.Again, these are not the typical
law enforcement handcuffs.They're simply cheap steel
crumbling Thank you, and there'sthe same cups and songs. Yes, it
(21:02):
was
correct. Yes,
he goes through the same processwith the shackles.
In the case of the shackles, itwas not to the left arm, but it
(21:23):
was to the right elbow orforearm just below the elbow. So
her left hand and arm wereactually free. They were not
bound since two of 419 Could youtell us what we're looking at
this photograph. This is Jasminepaces right elbow area. You can
(21:50):
see this would be the tattoo onher shoulder. This is her actual
elbow here. And you can see twolines of rust, basically, along
with the pattern of that chain,again, with a rust pattern
showing where the shackle was.And in fact, you can see, I
(22:14):
think, where the double part ofthe shackle is, over here, right
at the inside.
Cogswell also pointed out ruststains on Jasmine's skin,
evidence of where the shacklesand chains pressed against her
(22:36):
for an extended period. He thenpresented a photo of the left
side of Jasmine's body, whichwas completely free of wounds,
but when her body was rolledover, it became clear that every
single injury was concentratedon her upper right side. This
pattern, he explained, isconsistent with someone being
trapped in the fetal position,further reinforcing the
(22:59):
prosecution's theory thatJasmine was confined and
immobilized during the attack.There was a moment during these
photos when I found myselfstaring down at my blank
notepad, my mind unable toprocess what I was seeing
without thinking, I silentlymuttered to myself, Oh, my God,
(23:19):
the sheer number of her injurieswas overwhelming. Each one a
brutal testament to what Jasmineendured. I just couldn't believe
it. This entire time, JasonChen's head is hanging down. At
first, it seems like he'savoiding the photos being shown
on the courtroom screen, but bynow, I had noticed a small
(23:41):
monitor mounted under the glasstop of the defense table
directly in front of him. Later,I asked the bailiff about it,
and he confirmed that every timesomething appeared on the large
screen in the courtroom, thesmaller screen in front of him
turns on and displays the samecontent. So while Jason appeared
(24:01):
downcast, maybe even remorseful,the truth was he was seeing
those images in even sharperdetail than the rest of us. As
images filled the screen, DrCogswell walked us through key
identifiers used duringJasmine's autopsy, markers that
helped confirm her identity.Among those identifiers were her
(24:25):
tattoos, permanent expressionsof who she was now preserved
only in these photos and in thememories of those who loved her.
You
(24:49):
You know, during sequestration,I had a lot of time to think,
and honestly, I kept wishing Ihad a speaker so that I could
just listen to a great book.That's why I love audiobooks.
And whether I'm driving, walkingthe dogs or traveling, I can
just press play and get lost inan amazing story anytime and
anywhere. One of my all timefavorites is New York by Edward
(25:12):
Rutherford. This epic historicalnovel spans over 400 years,
following generations offamilies through the city's most
pivotal moments from its Dutchsettlement days and all the way
to 911 it was one of the firstaudio books I had ever listened
to. It felt like the narratorwas reading the story, just for
(25:33):
me. I was completely hooked.Here's some good news. You can
listen to New York or any otherbook for free. Audible is giving
sequestered listeners a freeaudiobook with a 30 day trial.
Just go to audible trial.com.Forward slash sequestered,
that's one free book yours tokeep forever. So find something
(25:56):
you love and get listening. Goto audible trial.com. Forward
slash sequestered.
Dr cogswell's testimony didn'tjust outline the injuries, it
(26:19):
painted a vivid picture of theviolence Jasmine suffered. His
detailed observations providedthe jury with a clearer
understanding of thecircumstances surrounding her
death, emphasizing thedeliberate and confined nature
of the attack while they aretalking about Jasmine being in
the fetal position, Moyle goesback to the large carpet sample
(26:43):
on the floor of the courtroomand asks Dr Cogswell if he sees
any significance with the bloodstain in regards to the size of
Jasmine's body,
there any medical significanceto the stain that we see in item
127, to the physical evidencethat we have as 158, when I
(27:09):
first saw this photograph, itimmediately struck me, and I
think I actually blurted outthat looks like a shroud of
Turin, and what I saw here wasbasically a recreation of the
blood state pattern, or a bloodstate pattern that I would
expect to see if someone isbleeding in that fetal position
(27:33):
that we saw, because we have thefeet and legs down here, with
the knees drawn up, arm downhere, other arm here and here
and now. Obviously, it's notexact, because it's being
absorbed and spread a littlebit, but the shape is very, very
(27:56):
consistent with not only thepositioning of Jasmine faces
body, but also the size of herbody. And so if, if we look at
the size of her body, thepositioning of her body, and
look at the stain, way overlaythrough what actually dirty,
(28:20):
now, can I say that's absolutelyno. I don't know what testing
has done to match that to her,although the stain is extremely
consistent with her body, asfound
at this point, with Moylesdirecting Cogswell methodically
takes the jury through all 60stab wounds one by one, using
(28:44):
clinical, almost detachedterminology like curvilinear and
vertex. But behind thosetechnical words was a reality
that was impossible to detachfrom out of respect for Jasmine
and her family. We won't besharing all of this audio,
however, I will share this.Jasmine was stabbed 60 times
(29:08):
across her scalp, face, neck,upper back, chest, shoulder, arm
and torso, with the exception ofher free left hand, every single
wound was concentrated on theright side of her body. One of
the most chilling details theblade of the knife Jason Chen
(29:30):
used snapped when it struck oneof Jasmine's ribs, breaking off
inside of her chest. Dr Cogswelldiscovered it lodged between two
ribs and penetrating deep insideof her right lung. There was
also evidence of blunt force,impact to her chest, leaving a
large contusion or bruise. DrCogswell noted that this blow
(29:52):
could have rendered Jasmineunconscious or semi conscious,
making it even harder for her tofight back a. Occasionally there
were abrasions and bruising onthe front of her neck, which,
according to Cogswell, mayindicate manual strangulation,
though it was not officiallydocumented in the autopsy
report. This was not just anattack, it was a prolonged,
(30:16):
deliberate and brutal assault,reflecting a level of calculated
malice that is both shocking andincomprehensible. By this point
in the day, we had reached alunch break. Can you imagine
breaking for lunch after this,sitting through the forensic
breakdown of 60 stab wounds, abroken knife lodged in Jasmine's
(30:40):
lung and evidence of blunt forcetrauma, and then stepping
outside to grab a sandwich,somehow we all managed. What was
interesting to learn after thetrial was that while court was
adjourned during this particularafternoon, breaking news was
already hitting the media.Here's news channel nine's
(31:04):
latricia Thomas sharing thisdevelopment during the live
stream as we broke for lunch.
But actually, I do want to pausehere and go away from our normal
structure to talk about somebreaking news that was just into
our newsroom moments before webroke for lunch here, and that
is a wrongful death lawsuit hasbeen filed by Jasmine paces
(31:29):
family against Jason Chen andhis parents. Now we have not
heard them implicated by facingcriminal charges in this case,
but we now know that inNovember, attorney Ben McGowan,
who is representing the pacefamily, filed a wrongful death
lawsuit some of the things thatit claims here that there was
(31:51):
criminal conspiracy betweenJason Chen and his parents. They
claim the family helped him tocover up the murder and then
harbored him at theirnolensville, Tennessee home
while police were looking toarrest him. This lawsuit is
looking for $17 million our webteam right now is working on
(32:12):
getting that lawsuit and moredetails of it onto our website,
News Channel nine.com, you
the defense began their crossexamination, pressing Dr
Cogswell on a critical question,could the autopsy determine
(32:33):
whether Jasmine was unconsciousduring the attack? Dr Cogswell
remained firm while his findingswere extensive and detailed, he
explained that an autopsy can'tanswer every question about
Jasmine's state in that moment,whether she was fully conscious,
semi conscious or unconscious atthe time of the stabbing remains
(32:54):
unknown. At the end
of your testimony, there, youtalk about how long Jasmine pace
might have been along. Well,it's kind of like more than
three seconds, but
that's the kind of death thatthe title of the consciousness
(33:17):
could be different.
Well, in fact, she may have beenunconscious before she was
stabbed. There's no way to tellthat from an autopsy, but if
we're talking about justbleeding roughly half of that
time period, she would bepotentially conscious
(33:40):
when proceedings resume, DrCogswell returns to discuss the
toxicology report. He explainsthat Jasmine's heart and major
blood vessels were nearly emptyof blood, and notably, no
alcohol was detected, despiteclaims that wine had been
consumed on the night of hermurder. Here's latricia Thomas
of News Channel Nine again,
(34:02):
let's take a look quickly at onething that has kind of become
center stage here, and that isthe toxicology report from
Jasmine paces autopsy. DrCogswell, the one doing the
autopsy on Jasmine paces bodyafter she was found in that
suitcase on the side of suckCreek Road. One thing, and to
(34:23):
understand why there's so manyquestions about this toxicology
report, you have to go back tothe opening statements by the
defense. So if you'll rememberthe defense attorney Joshua
Weiss came out and said, We'renot going to waste your time. We
admit that Jason Chen killedJasmine pace, but instead of it
(34:44):
being a premeditated murder,which is what the prosecution is
claiming, they want the jury tobelieve that this was a crime of
passion, and they say this allwas sparked when Jasmine pace
saw text messages come in toJay. Jason's phone, and then she
got very angry. They said theywere together drinking wine.
(35:06):
They they mentioned the wine inthe opening statements several,
several times. They said, whenJasmine pace went in the kitchen
to get a second bottle of wine,she heard those text messages
come in. They say she then wentat him with a wine bottle. He
kicked her to get her to moveback, which she fell upon some
(35:28):
wine glasses, and then tried toattack Jason Chen with that
broken wine glass. Now why isthat important? Well, today it
becomes important that narrativethat the Defense says that they
will try to prove when it'stheir term, because now we see
the blood tests of Jasmine pacethat have been introduced by her
(35:51):
autopsy report that she, infact, did not have alcohol in
her system.
As Dr Cogswell continues histestimony. Moyo guides him
through the details of Jasmine'sinjuries. Dr Cogswell reiterates
that her injuries are consistentwith being in the fetal
position, a posture that made iteasier for her body to be forced
(36:15):
into a confined space during theattack. I want to pause here and
share something from myperspective as a juror, one
wound that stood out to me was adeep gash on Jasmine's left
forearm. Remember, this was herfree arm. I couldn't tell if it
came from a single strike or ifthe knife had hit the same spot
(36:37):
over and over, but it was clearto me that this was a defensive
wound. It looked as if Jasminehad instinctively raised her arm
to shield her face and head fromthe repeated blows of the knife.
My producer and I have spent alot of time piecing together
what we know about this attack,trying to understand how Jasmine
(36:57):
was restrained and what happenedinside that apartment. What
stands out to me is thehaphazard way she was cuffed. It
was a tangled, almost desperatearrangement, like they were put
on in the middle of a fight. Inmy opinion, Jason Chen wasn't
methodically restrainingJasmine. He was trying to gain
(37:18):
control of her, trying to keepher from kicking, fighting and
ultimately getting away. And nowthe autopsy photos confirmed it.
Jasmine was in the fetalposition during the attack, and
I'm bringing it up again becauseit's crucial to understanding
the wounds themselves. If shehad been in any other position,
(37:39):
the injuries would have beenscattered across her body, but
instead, every single stab woundwas concentrated in one small
area her upper right side. Thatkind of concentrated violence,
it says something. It tells usthis wasn't random, it wasn't
chaotic, it was intentional.When I close my eyes at night, I
(38:04):
can't help but visualize howthis happened, trying to piece
together the moments leading upto Jasmine's death. I'm certain
I'm not alone in this. Anyonewho's seen these photos, the
investigators, attorneys, Judge,Patterson, Dr Cogswell, my
fellow jurors, and especiallyJasmine's family, they all
(38:25):
likely confront similar visions,yet the only person who truly
knows what happened is JasonChen.
Here's what we've put togetherbased on the evidence presented
thus far. Though I want to beclear that these are my own
(38:47):
theories, not necessarily facts.We know that Jasmine went to
Jason's apartment by choice onNovember 22 arriving at 11:42pm
she was there for over two hoursbefore things went terribly
wrong on day six of the trial,Jason's downstairs neighbor will
testify that she heard a womanscream coming from his apartment
(39:09):
at 2:11am, on the early hours ofNovember 23 followed by the
sound of chasing movement fromthe back bedroom toward the
front door. Then she heard thefront door slam seven minutes
after that scream at 2:18am,Jasmine sends a pin drop
location to her mother, Katrinabean, not a text, not a call, a
(39:33):
location pin, that detail hauntsme. I've thought about how
sending a location pin works.It's not the most instinctive
thing to do under stress, butit's gotten easier to do in the
last couple of years on aniPhone, which Jasmine had at the
time. It used to require usersto open Apple Maps, Search the
(39:55):
location and then drop a pinmanually, but now all you have
to do is. Open your text messageapp, click the plus sign next to
the text field, scroll down tolocation and hit send. Still,
why a location pin to me, itfeels like she didn't have time
to type a message, as if thiswas all she could do. Her way of
(40:17):
saying, Mom, this is where I am.You. I've come to realize that
when people lie, they oftenweave in parts of the truth.
It's like they can't help butsprinkle in bits of reality, and
they'll almost always castthemselves as the victim, not
(40:38):
the one responsible for the harmdone. That's why the defense's
story during their openingstatement, stuck with me.
According to them, Jasmine wasthe aggressor chasing Jason, and
Jason was the one running fromher. They painted this almost
comical scene of Jason trying toslam the bathroom door shut,
(40:58):
only to be foiled by the bathmat. Then came the so called
impossible pocket door to thebedroom, as if this whole thing
was some sitcommisunderstanding. But what if
that story held a kernel oftruth just with the roles
reversed? What if Jason was theone chasing Jasmine through his
apartment? I mentioned thedefense's first witness. She was
(41:22):
the neighbor living in apartment110 directly below Jason's unit.
Although her testimony aimed tosupport the defense, she
inadvertently helped clarify thetime of the attack. Remember, at
2:11am, she was jolted awake bya woman's scream from the
apartment above. Following this,she described hearing sounds of
(41:43):
someone being chased from thebedroom to the front door,
culminating in the sharp Slam ofthe door itself. Something
provoked Jasmine's fear.Something made her scream. Maybe
she was trying to get out ofthere. Maybe Jason was behind
her, and before she could makeit out the front door, he
slammed it shut. Did she turnback toward the bedroom in a
(42:06):
panic? Did she try to barricadeherself in the bathroom, only to
be tripped up by the bath mat?And was it Jasmine, not Jason
desperately trying to pull thatpocket door closed between the
bathroom and the bedroom?Remember, at 2:18am, just seven
minutes after that scream,Jasmine sends her mom the
(42:27):
location pin, that tiny Act saysso much things were bad. She
knew she needed help. And Ican't stop wondering, when in
those terrifying moments, didJason retrieve the handcuffs and
shackles. Was it before or afterthat text was sent? Could
Jasmine have made it back to thebathroom just barely closing the
(42:49):
door, buying herself a fewprecious seconds to send her
location? I keep picturing herleaning against that wall, maybe
sitting on the floor, bracingfor whatever came next. Given
the layout of the bathroom, itcould make sense that her left
side was against the wall withJason towering above her,
(43:12):
especially when you consider thepattern of stab wounds to her
scalp, face, shoulders and herfree hand. We know there was a
pool of blood in the bathroom,some of it crossing the
threshold into the bedroom.There was blood spatter on the
wall, smears on the door,frames, all of it painting a
chilling picture of violence ina confined space. And that leads
(43:36):
us to one of the biggestquestions raised in the
courtroom. Was Jasmine alreadycuffed when she was being
stabbed, or as the defenseclaimed, were the restraints
only used after her death tomake her body fit into the trash
bags. We know her right wristwas handcuffed to the inside of
her left ankle, and her rightelbow was shackled to her right
(43:59):
ankle, leaving her left armcompletely free. Now try to
picture her left side pressedagainst the bathroom floor, her
right arm threaded between herlegs and bound to her ankles,
some kind of cruel game ofTwister it's almost impossible
to imagine, actually, let aloneendure. Then there's the blood
(44:21):
evidence found in Jason'sbedroom. Remember the massive,
five foot stain on the carpet?That stain tells us her body was
likely moved after the attack,or at the very least, the
violence ended there before shewas put inside the trash bags
and eventually into thesuitcase. This is the picture
we're left with, pieced togetherfrom evidence, testimony and
(44:45):
what we can only imagine,Jasmine endured that night. We'd
love to hear your thoughts onthis. If you've been following
the case or have your owntheories, we'd love to hear
them. Send us an email atsequesteredpod, at. Mail.com,
(45:05):
before the medical examinerstepped down from the stand, the
jurors had a chance to ask theirown questions. It's something
we've mentioned before, but it'sworth repeating because it's
pretty rare. Not every judgeallows this, but judge Patterson
does, and it gave us theopportunity to clarify facts
directly from the witnesses inreal time, rather than saving
(45:26):
them for the deliberation phase.I also think it gave the
courtroom, more specifically theattorneys, a unique window into
what the jury was really curiousabout throughout the trial. On
this particular day, ourquestions covered everything
from whether cleaning agentscould have altered the
appearance of Jasmine's woundsto whether any fibers or
(45:47):
fingerprints were recovered fromthe scene. Dr Cogswell responded
to each one, even opening thedoor to the possibility that a
second knife could have beenused, though he stopped short of
any firm conclusions we thoughtit might be interesting to share
a couple of the jury's actualquestions with you, so that you
can get a sense of what was onour minds as we work to piece
(46:10):
everything together. The
jury has some questions for you.I'll ask him if he faced a jury
with handling CSU use blue staragent that revealed blood in
other locations of theapartment. Based on your
autopsy, can you say that thevictim's injuries may have
occurred in more than just asingle bed?
(46:33):
Yes, they could have, if youactually think the most likely
is that the injuries wereinflicted in the position in
which she was found. That doesnot preclude some of those
injuries being inflictedelsewhere in the apartment, or
that when providing was beingmoved, that some blood leaked
(46:56):
out was found elsewhere in theapartment.
Are you able to identify any ofthe wounds were cleaned with
peroxide or alcohol? No, I'mnot. Would you be able to
identify if the carpet fiberswere found in any of the wounds
inflicted on the body oranywhere on
(47:17):
the I found no carpet fibers inthe wounds themselves, some
hairs were recovered off of herclothing and her body. Those
were all submitted to Kennedy's.PD, as to what the test results
showed, I don't know.
Does it appear that all of themwere inflicted by the same
(47:40):
knife?
It is certainly likely, but itis not possible, that a second
knife was used. However, thedimensions of the wounds don't
say categorically, this is twoknives, so there, there's going
to have to be some overlap. Forexample, a significantly smaller
(48:02):
knife, or a pocket knife, wouldnot be involved in
this does amount of bloodcollected impact percentages as
a result of contested IE, verysmall amount collected with more
blood confirmed more accurate
results? No, the amount of bloodcollected is sufficient to run
(48:23):
the test. If it's aninsufficient quantity, then the
toxicology lab will tell us notsufficient to run the test. We
suggest doing targeted testing.For this, they actually don't
need anywhere near the amount ofblood we give them. They can
actually make do with twomilliliters of blood. He usually
(48:45):
set a 10 milli or two, but asyou saw in this particular case,
it was just under sixmilliliters. So there was plenty
of blood, more blood would notactually change the results,
though,
the prosecution briefly recallscrime scene investigator Kristen
Schubert to the stand. Schubertis asked about the two sanitary
(49:07):
pads collected as evidence, onerecovered from Jasmine's body,
and the other found outside thedumpster at Jason Chen's
apartment complex. Since neitherpad was tested, we can't say
with certainty that they're amatch, but Schubert describes
the similarity between them asstriking. Next, the jury hears
(49:29):
from Kim Lau, a special agentand forensic scientist with the
Tennessee Bureau ofInvestigation, or TBI, garnering
over 20 years of experience,Agent Lau is straightforward
about the limitations her labfaces, including a six month
backlog and a policy thatrestricts testing to just 10
items per homicide case. AgentLau then walks the jury through
(49:53):
what was tested swabs from JasonChen and Jasmine's parents
Jasmine's toothbrush and. Carpetfrom Jason Chen's apartment. Her
testimony confirms several keypoints. The blood found in Jason
Chen's apartment matchesJasmine's DNA swabs from the
shackles handcuffs and even thegarbage bags linked back to
(50:14):
Jason and some evidence, like aswab from the suitcase handle
came back inconclusive undercross examination, Agent Lau
explains that not every piece ofevidence could be tested due to
limited resources, and whenjurors ask who decides which 10
items actually get tested, she'sclear the decision is hers based
(50:36):
on proximity to the crime andthe likelihood of finding DNA
evidence
by the time court adjourns forthe day, it's almost 7pm judge
Patterson reminds the jurors oftheir obligation not to be
exposed to the media or to speakto each other about the trial.
(50:59):
Then instructs us to return at10am the next morning, giving
everyone a chance to catch theirbreath after a long, heavy day,
the evidence, expert testimoniesand even the jurors, specific
questions have left us all withas many uncertainties as
clarifications, which feels likeA perfect reflection of the case
(51:20):
itself. Nothing is simple,nothing is clear cut, and with
every new detail, the truthfeels both closer and further
away as we conclude day four ofthis trial for Jasmine pace, the
profound weight of today'srevelations lingers heavily the
meticulous forensic analysispresented by the state's expert
(51:43):
witness, Dr Steven Cogswell, notonly detailed the horrifying
injuries Jasmine endured, butalso illuminated the calculated
nature of the violence shefaced. Each piece of evidence
and every expert insight addslayers to a narrative that is
anything but straightforward. Asjurors, we are tasked with
(52:04):
navigating this intricate web,seeking clarity amidst the
ambiguity, yet with every detailunveiled, the elusive nature of
truth becomes even moreapparent, reminding us of the
profound responsibility we bearin our pursuit of justice.
(52:28):
Next week on sequestered and thetwo prints
of quality to examine from thatgarbage bag around the body of
Jasmine pace were made by WHO,made by Jason the
prince of value,
the prints that were not a valuethat you received or this you
were able to extract from theother bags, they were
(52:54):
fingerprints, phone records andsurveillance footage weave
together A chilling timeline,one that may seal Jason Chen's
fate. Thanks for sticking withus. If today's episode resonated
with you, please subscribe.Leave a review and share it with
friends. We'll see you nextweek.
(53:22):
You I thank you for listening tosequestered a juror's
(53:43):
perspective on the murder trialfor Jasmine. Pace. Each episode
brings us closer tounderstanding the trial, the
people involved, and the weightof seeking justice. If this
story speaks to you, pleasefollow, share and continue the
conversation with us. Jasmine'sstory deserves to be remembered.
(54:04):
This is a BP production. Theshow is written, edited and
produced by me Sarah Reed, withCO production by Andrea Kleid.
News clips featured in thisepisode were sourced from wtbc
News Channel Nine local threenews Chattanooga and the law and
crime network, music and sounddesign are curated to reflect
(54:26):
the gravity and sensitivity ofthis story, and with the intent
to honor Jasmine, her family andthe community affected by her
death. For more information orto connect with us, visit
sequestered pod.com or follow uson Instagram at sequestered pot.
Thank you for listening untilnext time, stay curious and stay
(54:47):
safe. You.
Before we get into this episode,I want to give you a heads up.
It contains graphic descriptionsof violence, including details
from an autopsy. Out of respectfor Jasmine and her family,
we've chosen to hold back onsome of the more graphic
details, but what you will hearmay still be unsettling, so
please listen with care. It'sThursday, January 16, 2025, day
(00:28):
four of the trial. Before weeven stepped into the jury room
this morning, we could feel theweight of what was coming. I
went to bed last night bracingmyself for today, trying to
prepare my mind and my heart forwhat we were about to see. But
how do you prepare for somethinglike this? As jurors, part of
(00:51):
our job was to face the evidenceto see what no one should ever
have to see. Today we would seeimages of Jasmine paces lifeless
body, and with them theundeniable reality of what was
done to her. We already knew thefacts. She was stabbed 60 times,
restrained and stuffed into asuitcase, but knowing and seeing
(01:16):
those are two entirely differentthings no one should ever have
to witness another human beingin that state, and yet, here we
were.
This is sequestered a juror'sperspective on the murder trial
(01:37):
for Jasmine pace. I'm Sarah,juror number 11 each episode,
I'll take you inside thecourtroom, behind the scenes,
and into the weighty moments ofthis trial as we honor Jasmine's
life and navigate thecomplexities of seeking justice.
Let's begin.
(02:01):
This is Episode Five, the bodyin the suitcase.
I learned this only after thefact, but while we were waiting
in the jury room that morning,da Cody WAMP noticed that
defense attorney Weiss moved atrash can near Jason Chen at the
(02:23):
defense table, along with a boxof tissues. Here's a clip of how
that scene played out in thecourtroom just minutes before
the jury came in one second,
they moved the trash can insidethe defendant and they brought
little nappies over here. If itapplies to the gallery that
(02:43):
there can be no outburst, Mr.Chin also needs to be selling
posts during this testimony, orhe can exit the court as well.
Okay, well, the trash can movecloser to already indicated that
he's feeling he's feelingunwell. I'm just saying that's
prejudicial as well. Judge.
(03:06):
Everyone has to comportthemselves with the maintain the
court or this particularproceeding, so that includes
Council defendants. However,this is going to be very graphic
and personal testimony. Soeveryone needs to maintain their
composure. Courier questionstwice. If there is anyone the
(03:27):
gallery that feels they cannotmaintain their composure, it's
particular witness. It is bestto be going to leave right now.
You know what's happening aboutto be displayed on the screen.
So that mission does extend toMr. Chin,
as you can tell, da WAMP raisesher concerns to the judge about
Jason Chen receivingpreferential treatment. She
(03:49):
points out that Weiss moved thetrash can and tissues near their
table, implying that thedefendant may be trying to sway
the court's perception. JudgePatterson responds by
emphasizing that everyone in thecourtroom, including Chen, must
maintain composure, especiallygiven the graphic nature of the
upcoming testimony. JudgePatterson also warns the gallery
(04:11):
that anyone who is unable toremain composed should excuse
themselves from the courtroombefore this evidence is
presented. At this time,Jasmine's mother, Katrina bean
and Jason Chen's mother, ShuFang Chen, both leave the
courtroom. They already knewsome things once seen can never
be unseen. This all happenedbefore we even entered the
(04:39):
courtroom. Pre trial matterswere a regular occurrence, so we
never really knew what we'd bewalking into each day. But
something was noticeablydifferent this morning, as we
took our seats, despite thetension in the room, the
proceedings were officiallyunderway by 945 Hamilton County
medical exam. And forensicpsychologist, Dr Stephen
(05:02):
Cogswell was sworn in as thestate's first expert witness
with nearly 40 years ofexperience and 1000s of
autopsies to his name, includingover 100 cases involving fatal
stab wounds. Dr Stephencogswell's experience is
undeniable. His presence alonecommands respect as he takes the
(05:24):
stand Dr Cogswell, a middle agedman with a shaved head and a
neatly trimmed beard pepperedwith gray, carries himself with
quiet authority. He wears blackglasses and is dressed sharply
in a navy collared shirt, a bluepattern tie and a dark gray suit
jacket exuding professionalismand confidence General. Moyle
(05:47):
brings Doctor Cogswell to thescene of suck Creek Road on the
afternoon of December 1 2022Moyle asks him,
what did you see when you gotthere? Obviously, there were
quite a few law enforcementvehicles, and off to the side of
the road, adjacent to the river,was a hard shell suitcase. Just
(06:14):
off the shoulder of the road,near that area were actually a
couple of deer carcasses thathave been tossed out there after
butchering. But in particular,this suitcase was basically the
the time that you would take ona relatively extended trip,
large suitcase on wheels,handle, etcetera, after all of
(06:40):
the documentation, photographicand location issues were
resolved by police department sothat they could place it
exactly. Then the question cameup, well, what is in the
suitcase? And at that point, thecover of the suitcase, the lid
(07:02):
is open inside a black plastictrash bag. And so using
basically just hands, I couldfeel along the contents of the
bag and say, Yes, this is notanimal or something. This is a
good game inside out which pointthat the suitcase was closed
(07:26):
back up, it was transported toMedical Examiner's Office, and
at that point, further examine,not just the suitcase, but also
the contents.
Next Moyle asked Dr Cogswell,what did you do when you
returned to your office? Here'sa clip of Dr cogswell's
(07:46):
response.
At that point, before we doanything else, then we're going
to start doing photographs and Xrays, because we're going to
document everything we're doingas we're doing it in a step wise
fashion, because we don't wantto lose evidence. So in X ray,
we basically just lay thesuitcase on top of the X ray
(08:08):
plates and X rays through thesuitcase. And looking at those x
rays, it was evident that thereis a deceased person inside,
basically in a fetal positionthat is drawn with the knees
drawn up and the arms crossedaround, across the chest and
(08:31):
fitted into the suitcase. Inaddition, along with all of the
hardware in the suitcase thatshows up on X ray, there's also
a triangular metallic densitypiece that showed up in the area
of the chest, and it's somethingthat obviously didn't belong to
(08:52):
the suitcase, because there's avery regular arrangement of
support bars, rivets, etc, thatis fairly symmetrical. So after
the X raying was done, then thebody was lifted out of the
suitcase, and at that point,then the suitcase is laid off to
(09:16):
the side. That's no longer amedical examiner interest.
That's law enforcement interest.And then I proceeded to cut each
of the black plastic trash bagsalong one side and along the
bottom and remove each of thosein turn. Turns out there were
three, and that's happens to befairly common at least, at least
(09:44):
in the bodies that I've done incases in which you have autopsy,
where people have been disposedof in trash bags. It seems like
the interior bag is alwayspulled up from the feet toward
the head, and then there'sanother one down from the head
toward the feet, and then theremay. Your third one, again, feet
toward the head. In this case,turns out it was exactly the
(10:06):
same way. I guess that's justhow humans fit. But so each of
those bags is cut off, removed,and that reveals the body of a
young woman who is in a fetalposition, has no clothing on the
top. Body and is shackled andhandheld.
(10:30):
I think it's interesting thatCogswell mentions the direction
in which the bags were placedover Jasmine's body. Here, he
said the first bag was pulled upfrom her feet to her head. The
second place from her head downtowards her feet, and the third,
once again, from her feet overher head. Each bag was cinched
(10:51):
closed and tied with a knot. Atfirst, this might seem like a
minor detail, but his point ischilling. Cogswell has clearly
seen this pattern before, and itspeaks to something deeper,
something disturbinglyconsistent in human behavior
when attempting to conceal abody, Dr Cogswell then walks the
(11:15):
jury through the painstakingprocess of documenting all 60 of
the whims on Jasmine's body.Each injury is photographed,
first as it was found, thenagain after being cleaned. He
explains the key differencebetween incised wounds and stab
wounds in size, wounds are moresuperficial and have
(11:35):
directionality, appearing moreas a slice, while stab wounds
are as they sound, a strikepenetrating deeper and causing
more severe damage. The juryalso learns about three critical
time frames forensic experts useto classify injuries, ante
mortem, which is inflictedbefore death, perimortem, which
(11:58):
is inflicted around the time ofdeath, and post mortem, which is
inflicted after death, it's asobering moment as science
strips away the emotion andbreaks down the unimaginable
into cold clinical facts. DrCogswell then shares a lesson he
instills in his students whenteaching about sharp force
(12:21):
injuries, look for the blooduntil every drop is accounted
for. They truly don't know wherethe bleeding occurred. And until
you find this, you haven't foundthe crime scene.
Basically all stab wounds,unless they actually hit your
(12:41):
brain, your central nervoussystem, because of that, by
making you leave today, that'sthe mechanism. So we look at, I
what is the flow quality in youraverage person of this size, if
it goes by size? So a person whois the size of jasmine, PACE
(13:02):
just under 100 pounds. Her bloodvolume is approximately four
liters of four quarts of blood.So a gallon of blood. Now, if
you lose about 20 to 30% of yourblood volume, that is sufficient
to make you unconscious.Anything about 30% is sufficient
(13:23):
to actually cause death. So whenwe look at someone who has four
quarts of blood, if we lose fourand a half, that's sufficient to
cause death. So there shouldstill be some blood left inside
the body, but it's going to bespread around in the body and
capillaries, the blood that's inthe big toe is going to remain
(13:46):
in the big toe. So what we'reactually looking at is, where is
that quarter and a half ofblood? When I'm teaching classes
on sharp horse injuries, lookfor the blood, because a four
and a half blood goes a longway. Using an allergy, everyone
is painted a wall sometime intheir life that's a gallon of
(14:10):
blood. That's four quarts. Youcan paint a room with a gallon
of blood. So if you see a spotof blood this big, and someone
is dead, there's more bloodsomewhere else. Maybe it's
inside the body, but maybe it'salso another scene. So that's
why we say look for the blood,because until you have found all
(14:34):
that blood, you don't reallyknow where the bleeding
occurred.
You can paint a room with agallon of blood. That phrase
stuck with me the moment DrCogswell said it, I instantly
looked down at the carpet stilllaying out on the courtroom
floor stained with Jasmine'sblood. It wasn't just evidence,
(14:59):
it was a hunting. Reminder ofwhere her life ended. This feels
like a good time to remind youto take care while listening to
this episode, out of respect forJasmine's family, we're choosing
not to share every graphicdetail about her wounds, but we
do want to give enough contextto help you understand what
(15:20):
happened. Dr Cogswell beginswith X ray images, offering an
undeniable glimpse into howJasmine's body was positioned
inside of the suitcase. Her headtoward the handle and her feet
toward the wheels. He thenshifts to the evidence of
restraint. Jasmine's right wristwas handcuffed to the inside of
(15:45):
her left ankle, while her rightankle was shackled to her right
elbow. It was a restrictive,contorted position that suggests
deliberate immobilization in aneffort to better understand how
she was restrained. I actuallylaid on the floor of my living
room and tried to get into thisposition myself. And restrictive
(16:09):
and contortive, are greatdescriptions of the position she
was forced into. One criticaldetail stands out the chain on
the shackles was broken, apossible sign of a desperate
struggle. Yet, Dr Cogswell isquick to point out something
unexpected. There were noligature marks or abrasions on
(16:29):
Jasmine's ankles or wrists,raising even more questions
about how and when therestraints were applied, a
detail the defense will be sureto bring up later. Even more
telling is the pattern of herinjuries. The majority of
Jasmine's 60 wounds wereconcentrated on her upper right
side, reinforcing the theorythat she was in the fetal
(16:52):
position during the attack. Nowlet's return to the courtroom as
Dr Cogswell walks the jurythrough the X rays of the
suitcase
in the position the suitcase isright now her body is with the
head upward facing toward thecourtroom. So I'm now showing
(17:18):
you two of three, two. Sheorients us to this boat, right?
This photo is moving over alittle bit to, if I can point to
the suitcase, to this area herethat we're X ray and again, we
see another one of thesereinforcing ribs, a few more
(17:39):
rivets, etcetera, etcetera, azipper of a hole on the inside.
And here we have a knee. You cansee the kneecap here, and the
lower leg, the shin and thefibula that goes along with it.
This is the thigh bone. Here yousee a hand, or the bones of a
hand. And you can see the top ofthe skull as well. Here, 233,
(18:06):
and we're moving downward on thesuitcase in basically
counterclockwise fashion, tothis area, down toward the wheel
on the the style closest to thecourtroom, and we see again that
reinforcing ribs, zippers,rivets, etc. But we also see
(18:30):
handcuffs and shackles, as wellas a another metallic device
here, which is actuallyembraced, but you can see on
this one there is a chain thatextends here, and there is no
chain coming off of thisparticular one. And we're down
(18:52):
here to feet. These are the footbones, feet and ankle bones down
here. So we have forearm here,with the two forearm bones and
arm and forearm bones here. Andso we're down here. This is her
(19:12):
buttocks, 234, sir. And we'removing over obviously to the
last part, which is down here.And again, we have all the
hardware of the suitcase. We seea bit of pelvis bone here, the
lumbar spine here, again, one ofthose shackles that you saw in
(19:33):
the previous X ray. And so wehave, basically, by going
counterclockwise, we have acomplete picture of a small
individual at this point wedidn't know, male or female,
still inside the suitcase, stillinside those black plastic bags.
(19:54):
Yeah, you heard that correctly.Handcuffs and shackles for those
of you. Who are curious aboutthe difference between the two I
was handcuffs are designed torestrain a person's wrists
together. Shackles, on the otherhand, have a longer chain
between the cuffs and aretypically heavier metal
restraints used to securedifferent parts of the body,
(20:18):
usually the ankles. Think ofprisoners being transferred with
prosecutor Moyles instructions.Dr Cogswell puts on a pair of
blue gloves and opens theevidence bag containing the
handcuffs, showing them to thejury
(20:39):
they were still wrapped in thesurgical talent that came from
the medical examiner's office.Again, these are not the typical
law enforcement handcuffs.They're simply cheap steel
crumbling Thank you, and there'sthe same cups and songs. Yes, it
(21:02):
was
correct. Yes,
he goes through the same processwith the shackles.
In the case of the shackles, itwas not to the left arm, but it
(21:23):
was to the right elbow orforearm just below the elbow. So
her left hand and arm wereactually free. They were not
bound since two of 419 Could youtell us what we're looking at
this photograph. This is Jasminepaces right elbow area. You can
(21:50):
see this would be the tattoo onher shoulder. This is her actual
elbow here. And you can see twolines of rust, basically, along
with the pattern of that chain,again, with a rust pattern
showing where the shackle was.And in fact, you can see, I
(22:14):
think, where the double part ofthe shackle is, over here, right
at the inside.
Cogswell also pointed out ruststains on Jasmine's skin,
evidence of where the shacklesand chains pressed against her
(22:36):
for an extended period. He thenpresented a photo of the left
side of Jasmine's body, whichwas completely free of wounds,
but when her body was rolledover, it became clear that every
single injury was concentratedon her upper right side. This
pattern, he explained, isconsistent with someone being
trapped in the fetal position,further reinforcing the
(22:59):
prosecution's theory thatJasmine was confined and
immobilized during the attack.There was a moment during these
photos when I found myselfstaring down at my blank
notepad, my mind unable toprocess what I was seeing
without thinking, I silentlymuttered to myself, Oh, my God,
(23:19):
the sheer number of her injurieswas overwhelming. Each one a
brutal testament to what Jasmineendured. I just couldn't believe
it. This entire time, JasonChen's head is hanging down. At
first, it seems like he'savoiding the photos being shown
on the courtroom screen, but bynow, I had noticed a small
(23:41):
monitor mounted under the glasstop of the defense table
directly in front of him. Later,I asked the bailiff about it,
and he confirmed that every timesomething appeared on the large
screen in the courtroom, thesmaller screen in front of him
turns on and displays the samecontent. So while Jason appeared
(24:01):
downcast, maybe even remorseful,the truth was he was seeing
those images in even sharperdetail than the rest of us. As
images filled the screen, DrCogswell walked us through key
identifiers used duringJasmine's autopsy, markers that
helped confirm her identity.Among those identifiers were her
(24:25):
tattoos, permanent expressionsof who she was now preserved
only in these photos and in thememories of those who loved her.
You
(24:49):
You know, during sequestration,I had a lot of time to think,
and honestly, I kept wishing Ihad a speaker so that I could
just listen to a great book.That's why I love audiobooks.
And whether I'm driving, walkingthe dogs or traveling, I can
just press play and get lost inan amazing story anytime and
anywhere. One of my all timefavorites is New York by Edward
(25:12):
Rutherford. This epic historicalnovel spans over 400 years,
following generations offamilies through the city's most
pivotal moments from its Dutchsettlement days and all the way
to 911 it was one of the firstaudio books I had ever listened
to. It felt like the narratorwas reading the story, just for
(25:33):
me. I was completely hooked.Here's some good news. You can
listen to New York or any otherbook for free. Audible is giving
sequestered listeners a freeaudiobook with a 30 day trial.
Just go to audible trial.com.Forward slash sequestered,
that's one free book yours tokeep forever. So find something
(25:56):
you love and get listening. Goto audible trial.com. Forward
slash sequestered.
Dr cogswell's testimony didn'tjust outline the injuries, it
(26:19):
painted a vivid picture of theviolence Jasmine suffered. His
detailed observations providedthe jury with a clearer
understanding of thecircumstances surrounding her
death, emphasizing thedeliberate and confined nature
of the attack while they aretalking about Jasmine being in
the fetal position, Moyle goesback to the large carpet sample
(26:43):
on the floor of the courtroomand asks Dr Cogswell if he sees
any significance with the bloodstain in regards to the size of
Jasmine's body,
there any medical significanceto the stain that we see in item
127, to the physical evidencethat we have as 158, when I
(27:09):
first saw this photograph, itimmediately struck me, and I
think I actually blurted outthat looks like a shroud of
Turin, and what I saw here wasbasically a recreation of the
blood state pattern, or a bloodstate pattern that I would
expect to see if someone isbleeding in that fetal position
(27:33):
that we saw, because we have thefeet and legs down here, with
the knees drawn up, arm downhere, other arm here and here
and now. Obviously, it's notexact, because it's being
absorbed and spread a littlebit, but the shape is very, very
(27:56):
consistent with not only thepositioning of Jasmine faces
body, but also the size of herbody. And so if, if we look at
the size of her body, thepositioning of her body, and
look at the stain, way overlaythrough what actually dirty,
(28:20):
now, can I say that's absolutelyno. I don't know what testing
has done to match that to her,although the stain is extremely
consistent with her body, asfound
at this point, with Moylesdirecting Cogswell methodically
takes the jury through all 60stab wounds one by one, using
(28:44):
clinical, almost detachedterminology like curvilinear and
vertex. But behind thosetechnical words was a reality
that was impossible to detachfrom out of respect for Jasmine
and her family. We won't besharing all of this audio,
however, I will share this.Jasmine was stabbed 60 times
(29:08):
across her scalp, face, neck,upper back, chest, shoulder, arm
and torso, with the exception ofher free left hand, every single
wound was concentrated on theright side of her body. One of
the most chilling details theblade of the knife Jason Chen
(29:30):
used snapped when it struck oneof Jasmine's ribs, breaking off
inside of her chest. Dr Cogswelldiscovered it lodged between two
ribs and penetrating deep insideof her right lung. There was
also evidence of blunt force,impact to her chest, leaving a
large contusion or bruise. DrCogswell noted that this blow
(29:52):
could have rendered Jasmineunconscious or semi conscious,
making it even harder for her tofight back a. Occasionally there
were abrasions and bruising onthe front of her neck, which,
according to Cogswell, mayindicate manual strangulation,
though it was not officiallydocumented in the autopsy
report. This was not just anattack, it was a prolonged,
(30:16):
deliberate and brutal assault,reflecting a level of calculated
malice that is both shocking andincomprehensible. By this point
in the day, we had reached alunch break. Can you imagine
breaking for lunch after this,sitting through the forensic
breakdown of 60 stab wounds, abroken knife lodged in Jasmine's
(30:40):
lung and evidence of blunt forcetrauma, and then stepping
outside to grab a sandwich,somehow we all managed. What was
interesting to learn after thetrial was that while court was
adjourned during this particularafternoon, breaking news was
already hitting the media.Here's news channel nine's
(31:04):
latricia Thomas sharing thisdevelopment during the live
stream as we broke for lunch.
But actually, I do want to pausehere and go away from our normal
structure to talk about somebreaking news that was just into
our newsroom moments before webroke for lunch here, and that
is a wrongful death lawsuit hasbeen filed by Jasmine paces
(31:29):
family against Jason Chen andhis parents. Now we have not
heard them implicated by facingcriminal charges in this case,
but we now know that inNovember, attorney Ben McGowan,
who is representing the pacefamily, filed a wrongful death
lawsuit some of the things thatit claims here that there was
(31:51):
criminal conspiracy betweenJason Chen and his parents. They
claim the family helped him tocover up the murder and then
harbored him at theirnolensville, Tennessee home
while police were looking toarrest him. This lawsuit is
looking for $17 million our webteam right now is working on
(32:12):
getting that lawsuit and moredetails of it onto our website,
News Channel nine.com, you
the defense began their crossexamination, pressing Dr
Cogswell on a critical question,could the autopsy determine
(32:33):
whether Jasmine was unconsciousduring the attack? Dr Cogswell
remained firm while his findingswere extensive and detailed, he
explained that an autopsy can'tanswer every question about
Jasmine's state in that moment,whether she was fully conscious,
semi conscious or unconscious atthe time of the stabbing remains
(32:54):
unknown. At the end
of your testimony, there, youtalk about how long Jasmine pace
might have been along. Well,it's kind of like more than
three seconds, but
that's the kind of death thatthe title of the consciousness
(33:17):
could be different.
Well, in fact, she may have beenunconscious before she was
stabbed. There's no way to tellthat from an autopsy, but if
we're talking about justbleeding roughly half of that
time period, she would bepotentially conscious
(33:40):
when proceedings resume, DrCogswell returns to discuss the
toxicology report. He explainsthat Jasmine's heart and major
blood vessels were nearly emptyof blood, and notably, no
alcohol was detected, despiteclaims that wine had been
consumed on the night of hermurder. Here's latricia Thomas
of News Channel Nine again,
(34:02):
let's take a look quickly at onething that has kind of become
center stage here, and that isthe toxicology report from
Jasmine paces autopsy. DrCogswell, the one doing the
autopsy on Jasmine paces bodyafter she was found in that
suitcase on the side of suckCreek Road. One thing, and to
(34:23):
understand why there's so manyquestions about this toxicology
report, you have to go back tothe opening statements by the
defense. So if you'll rememberthe defense attorney Joshua
Weiss came out and said, We'renot going to waste your time. We
admit that Jason Chen killedJasmine pace, but instead of it
(34:44):
being a premeditated murder,which is what the prosecution is
claiming, they want the jury tobelieve that this was a crime of
passion, and they say this allwas sparked when Jasmine pace
saw text messages come in toJay. Jason's phone, and then she
got very angry. They said theywere together drinking wine.
(35:06):
They they mentioned the wine inthe opening statements several,
several times. They said, whenJasmine pace went in the kitchen
to get a second bottle of wine,she heard those text messages
come in. They say she then wentat him with a wine bottle. He
kicked her to get her to moveback, which she fell upon some
(35:28):
wine glasses, and then tried toattack Jason Chen with that
broken wine glass. Now why isthat important? Well, today it
becomes important that narrativethat the Defense says that they
will try to prove when it'stheir term, because now we see
the blood tests of Jasmine pacethat have been introduced by her
(35:51):
autopsy report that she, infact, did not have alcohol in
her system.
As Dr Cogswell continues histestimony. Moyo guides him
through the details of Jasmine'sinjuries. Dr Cogswell reiterates
that her injuries are consistentwith being in the fetal
position, a posture that made iteasier for her body to be forced
(36:15):
into a confined space during theattack. I want to pause here and
share something from myperspective as a juror, one
wound that stood out to me was adeep gash on Jasmine's left
forearm. Remember, this was herfree arm. I couldn't tell if it
came from a single strike or ifthe knife had hit the same spot
(36:37):
over and over, but it was clearto me that this was a defensive
wound. It looked as if Jasminehad instinctively raised her arm
to shield her face and head fromthe repeated blows of the knife.
My producer and I have spent alot of time piecing together
what we know about this attack,trying to understand how Jasmine
(36:57):
was restrained and what happenedinside that apartment. What
stands out to me is thehaphazard way she was cuffed. It
was a tangled, almost desperatearrangement, like they were put
on in the middle of a fight. Inmy opinion, Jason Chen wasn't
methodically restrainingJasmine. He was trying to gain
(37:18):
control of her, trying to keepher from kicking, fighting and
ultimately getting away. And nowthe autopsy photos confirmed it.
Jasmine was in the fetalposition during the attack, and
I'm bringing it up again becauseit's crucial to understanding
the wounds themselves. If shehad been in any other position,
(37:39):
the injuries would have beenscattered across her body, but
instead, every single stab woundwas concentrated in one small
area her upper right side. Thatkind of concentrated violence,
it says something. It tells usthis wasn't random, it wasn't
chaotic, it was intentional.When I close my eyes at night, I
(38:04):
can't help but visualize howthis happened, trying to piece
together the moments leading upto Jasmine's death. I'm certain
I'm not alone in this. Anyonewho's seen these photos, the
investigators, attorneys, Judge,Patterson, Dr Cogswell, my
fellow jurors, and especiallyJasmine's family, they all
(38:25):
likely confront similar visions,yet the only person who truly
knows what happened is JasonChen.
Here's what we've put togetherbased on the evidence presented
thus far. Though I want to beclear that these are my own
(38:47):
theories, not necessarily facts.We know that Jasmine went to
Jason's apartment by choice onNovember 22 arriving at 11:42pm
she was there for over two hoursbefore things went terribly
wrong on day six of the trial,Jason's downstairs neighbor will
testify that she heard a womanscream coming from his apartment
(39:09):
at 2:11am, on the early hours ofNovember 23 followed by the
sound of chasing movement fromthe back bedroom toward the
front door. Then she heard thefront door slam seven minutes
after that scream at 2:18am,Jasmine sends a pin drop
location to her mother, Katrinabean, not a text, not a call, a
(39:33):
location pin, that detail hauntsme. I've thought about how
sending a location pin works.It's not the most instinctive
thing to do under stress, butit's gotten easier to do in the
last couple of years on aniPhone, which Jasmine had at the
time. It used to require usersto open Apple Maps, Search the
(39:55):
location and then drop a pinmanually, but now all you have
to do is. Open your text messageapp, click the plus sign next to
the text field, scroll down tolocation and hit send. Still,
why a location pin to me, itfeels like she didn't have time
to type a message, as if thiswas all she could do. Her way of
(40:17):
saying, Mom, this is where I am.You. I've come to realize that
when people lie, they oftenweave in parts of the truth.
It's like they can't help butsprinkle in bits of reality, and
they'll almost always castthemselves as the victim, not
(40:38):
the one responsible for the harmdone. That's why the defense's
story during their openingstatement, stuck with me.
According to them, Jasmine wasthe aggressor chasing Jason, and
Jason was the one running fromher. They painted this almost
comical scene of Jason trying toslam the bathroom door shut,
(40:58):
only to be foiled by the bathmat. Then came the so called
impossible pocket door to thebedroom, as if this whole thing
was some sitcommisunderstanding. But what if
that story held a kernel oftruth just with the roles
reversed? What if Jason was theone chasing Jasmine through his
apartment? I mentioned thedefense's first witness. She was
(41:22):
the neighbor living in apartment110 directly below Jason's unit.
Although her testimony aimed tosupport the defense, she
inadvertently helped clarify thetime of the attack. Remember, at
2:11am, she was jolted awake bya woman's scream from the
apartment above. Following this,she described hearing sounds of
(41:43):
someone being chased from thebedroom to the front door,
culminating in the sharp Slam ofthe door itself. Something
provoked Jasmine's fear.Something made her scream. Maybe
she was trying to get out ofthere. Maybe Jason was behind
her, and before she could makeit out the front door, he
slammed it shut. Did she turnback toward the bedroom in a
(42:06):
panic? Did she try to barricadeherself in the bathroom, only to
be tripped up by the bath mat?And was it Jasmine, not Jason
desperately trying to pull thatpocket door closed between the
bathroom and the bedroom?Remember, at 2:18am, just seven
minutes after that scream,Jasmine sends her mom the
(42:27):
location pin, that tiny Act saysso much things were bad. She
knew she needed help. And Ican't stop wondering, when in
those terrifying moments, didJason retrieve the handcuffs and
shackles. Was it before or afterthat text was sent? Could
Jasmine have made it back to thebathroom just barely closing the
(42:49):
door, buying herself a fewprecious seconds to send her
location? I keep picturing herleaning against that wall, maybe
sitting on the floor, bracingfor whatever came next. Given
the layout of the bathroom, itcould make sense that her left
side was against the wall withJason towering above her,
(43:12):
especially when you consider thepattern of stab wounds to her
scalp, face, shoulders and herfree hand. We know there was a
pool of blood in the bathroom,some of it crossing the
threshold into the bedroom.There was blood spatter on the
wall, smears on the door,frames, all of it painting a
chilling picture of violence ina confined space. And that leads
(43:36):
us to one of the biggestquestions raised in the
courtroom. Was Jasmine alreadycuffed when she was being
stabbed, or as the defenseclaimed, were the restraints
only used after her death tomake her body fit into the trash
bags. We know her right wristwas handcuffed to the inside of
her left ankle, and her rightelbow was shackled to her right
(43:59):
ankle, leaving her left armcompletely free. Now try to
picture her left side pressedagainst the bathroom floor, her
right arm threaded between herlegs and bound to her ankles,
some kind of cruel game ofTwister it's almost impossible
to imagine, actually, let aloneendure. Then there's the blood
(44:21):
evidence found in Jason'sbedroom. Remember the massive,
five foot stain on the carpet?That stain tells us her body was
likely moved after the attack,or at the very least, the
violence ended there before shewas put inside the trash bags
and eventually into thesuitcase. This is the picture
we're left with, pieced togetherfrom evidence, testimony and
(44:45):
what we can only imagine,Jasmine endured that night. We'd
love to hear your thoughts onthis. If you've been following
the case or have your owntheories, we'd love to hear
them. Send us an email atsequesteredpod, at. Mail.com,
(45:05):
before the medical examinerstepped down from the stand, the
jurors had a chance to ask theirown questions. It's something
we've mentioned before, but it'sworth repeating because it's
pretty rare. Not every judgeallows this, but judge Patterson
does, and it gave us theopportunity to clarify facts
directly from the witnesses inreal time, rather than saving
(45:26):
them for the deliberation phase.I also think it gave the
courtroom, more specifically theattorneys, a unique window into
what the jury was really curiousabout throughout the trial. On
this particular day, ourquestions covered everything
from whether cleaning agentscould have altered the
appearance of Jasmine's woundsto whether any fibers or
(45:47):
fingerprints were recovered fromthe scene. Dr Cogswell responded
to each one, even opening thedoor to the possibility that a
second knife could have beenused, though he stopped short of
any firm conclusions we thoughtit might be interesting to share
a couple of the jury's actualquestions with you, so that you
can get a sense of what was onour minds as we work to piece
(46:10):
everything together. The
jury has some questions for you.I'll ask him if he faced a jury
with handling CSU use blue staragent that revealed blood in
other locations of theapartment. Based on your
autopsy, can you say that thevictim's injuries may have
occurred in more than just asingle bed?
(46:33):
Yes, they could have, if youactually think the most likely
is that the injuries wereinflicted in the position in
which she was found. That doesnot preclude some of those
injuries being inflictedelsewhere in the apartment, or
that when providing was beingmoved, that some blood leaked
(46:56):
out was found elsewhere in theapartment.
Are you able to identify any ofthe wounds were cleaned with
peroxide or alcohol? No, I'mnot. Would you be able to
identify if the carpet fiberswere found in any of the wounds
inflicted on the body oranywhere on
(47:17):
the I found no carpet fibers inthe wounds themselves, some
hairs were recovered off of herclothing and her body. Those
were all submitted to Kennedy's.PD, as to what the test results
showed, I don't know.
Does it appear that all of themwere inflicted by the same
(47:40):
knife?
It is certainly likely, but itis not possible, that a second
knife was used. However, thedimensions of the wounds don't
say categorically, this is twoknives, so there, there's going
to have to be some overlap. Forexample, a significantly smaller
(48:02):
knife, or a pocket knife, wouldnot be involved in
this does amount of bloodcollected impact percentages as
a result of contested IE, verysmall amount collected with more
blood confirmed more accurate
results? No, the amount of bloodcollected is sufficient to run
(48:23):
the test. If it's aninsufficient quantity, then the
toxicology lab will tell us notsufficient to run the test. We
suggest doing targeted testing.For this, they actually don't
need anywhere near the amount ofblood we give them. They can
actually make do with twomilliliters of blood. He usually
(48:45):
set a 10 milli or two, but asyou saw in this particular case,
it was just under sixmilliliters. So there was plenty
of blood, more blood would notactually change the results,
though,
the prosecution briefly recallscrime scene investigator Kristen
Schubert to the stand. Schubertis asked about the two sanitary
(49:07):
pads collected as evidence, onerecovered from Jasmine's body,
and the other found outside thedumpster at Jason Chen's
apartment complex. Since neitherpad was tested, we can't say
with certainty that they're amatch, but Schubert describes
the similarity between them asstriking. Next, the jury hears
(49:29):
from Kim Lau, a special agentand forensic scientist with the
Tennessee Bureau ofInvestigation, or TBI, garnering
over 20 years of experience,Agent Lau is straightforward
about the limitations her labfaces, including a six month
backlog and a policy thatrestricts testing to just 10
items per homicide case. AgentLau then walks the jury through
(49:53):
what was tested swabs from JasonChen and Jasmine's parents
Jasmine's toothbrush and. Carpetfrom Jason Chen's apartment. Her
testimony confirms several keypoints. The blood found in Jason
Chen's apartment matchesJasmine's DNA swabs from the
shackles handcuffs and even thegarbage bags linked back to
(50:14):
Jason and some evidence, like aswab from the suitcase handle
came back inconclusive undercross examination, Agent Lau
explains that not every piece ofevidence could be tested due to
limited resources, and whenjurors ask who decides which 10
items actually get tested, she'sclear the decision is hers based
(50:36):
on proximity to the crime andthe likelihood of finding DNA
evidence
by the time court adjourns forthe day, it's almost 7pm judge
Patterson reminds the jurors oftheir obligation not to be
exposed to the media or to speakto each other about the trial.
(50:59):
Then instructs us to return at10am the next morning, giving
everyone a chance to catch theirbreath after a long, heavy day,
the evidence, expert testimoniesand even the jurors, specific
questions have left us all withas many uncertainties as
clarifications, which feels likeA perfect reflection of the case
(51:20):
itself. Nothing is simple,nothing is clear cut, and with
every new detail, the truthfeels both closer and further
away as we conclude day four ofthis trial for Jasmine pace, the
profound weight of today'srevelations lingers heavily the
meticulous forensic analysispresented by the state's expert
(51:43):
witness, Dr Steven Cogswell, notonly detailed the horrifying
injuries Jasmine endured, butalso illuminated the calculated
nature of the violence shefaced. Each piece of evidence
and every expert insight addslayers to a narrative that is
anything but straightforward. Asjurors, we are tasked with
(52:04):
navigating this intricate web,seeking clarity amidst the
ambiguity, yet with every detailunveiled, the elusive nature of
truth becomes even moreapparent, reminding us of the
profound responsibility we bearin our pursuit of justice.
(52:28):
Next week on sequestered and thetwo prints
of quality to examine from thatgarbage bag around the body of
Jasmine pace were made by WHO,made by Jason the
prince of value,
the prints that were not a valuethat you received or this you
were able to extract from theother bags, they were
(52:54):
fingerprints, phone records andsurveillance footage weave
together A chilling timeline,one that may seal Jason Chen's
fate. Thanks for sticking withus. If today's episode resonated
with you, please subscribe.Leave a review and share it with
friends. We'll see you nextweek.
(53:22):
You I thank you for listening tosequestered a juror's
(53:43):
perspective on the murder trialfor Jasmine. Pace. Each episode
brings us closer tounderstanding the trial, the
people involved, and the weightof seeking justice. If this
story speaks to you, pleasefollow, share and continue the
conversation with us. Jasmine'sstory deserves to be remembered.
(54:04):
This is a BP production. Theshow is written, edited and
produced by me Sarah Reed, withCO production by Andrea Kleid.
News clips featured in thisepisode were sourced from wtbc
News Channel Nine local threenews Chattanooga and the law and
crime network, music and sounddesign are curated to reflect
(54:26):
the gravity and sensitivity ofthis story, and with the intent
to honor Jasmine, her family andthe community affected by her
death. For more information orto connect with us, visit
sequestered pod.com or follow uson Instagram at sequestered pot.
Thank you for listening untilnext time, stay curious and stay
(54:47):
safe. You.
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