September 16, 2025 • 46 mins
Bisila Bokoko is an international business woman who got her start in the corporate world in Spain and then eventually in the USA. Today she shares her journey from corporate executive to international entrepreneur, wine brand founder, and creator of the Bisila Bokoko African Literacy Project.
Born to African parents from Equatorial Guinea in Spain, she jokingly calls herself a Decaf African and had a tough time navigating her African identity within a European culture. She now sees herself as a a bridge between the two cultures. Over the years she has also learned to understand and embrace her own fears, and learned how to transform obstacles into opportunities.
Today, we get into the scope of her work as an entrepreneur, author and philanthropist. We discuss her latest book: The Fear and I: An Unexpected Story, how she founder her wine brand Bisila's Wines and her philanthropy work with the Bisila Bokoko African Literacy Project.
For the candid moments of our chat, she talks about mindset and how she rejects the phrases "I don't have time" and "I don't have money" to advance her aims. She also recommends surrounding yourself with cheerleaders, mentors, and accountability partners.
Find Bisila Bokoko on Instagram, LinkedIn, or through her website.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
I don't follow orders , I follow my dreams.
I didn't hear from someone, butthat I just applied to my life
and it became like really theway I do my life.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Welcome to Shades and Layers, the podcast that
celebrates Black and women ofcolor entrepreneurs across
beauty, fashion and beyond.
I'm your host, udwanosKosanarichi.
Join me for stories ofcreativity, resilience and the
layers of building somethingthat lasts.
Hello and welcome to today'sepisode of Shades and Layers.
(00:40):
My guest today is Bicela Bococo, an international businesswoman
with roots in Spain andEquatorial Guinea.
She's also an author andphilanthropist who got her start
in the corporate world both inSpain and the United States.
Today we discuss her latestbook, the Fear and I a story of
unexpected transformation.
We also discuss her very firstentrepreneurial venture into the
(01:03):
wine business.
She has a brand called BisilaWines.
We also get into herphilanthropic work through her
Bisila Bokoko African LiteracyProject.
Her story is a masterclass inself-awareness, ambition,
fearlessness and personalbranding.
Please enjoy the conversation.
Who is Bisila and what is itabout Spain that shaped your
(01:24):
outlook on the world andbusiness?
Speaker 1 (01:26):
Well, I have to start by the beginning, and it's the
roots.
Right, and just apuntualization my roots go back
to Equatorial Guinea, in Africa,my great-grandmother, I think.
She shaped my future becauseshe ran away from a marriage of
domestic violence and she made adecision to study, and at that
(01:46):
time Equatorial Guinea was acolony from Spain, so she was
able to just go to school there.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Right, okay, yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
And when she came back, she decided to create a
school for girls that she calledHuayso y Pola.
Huayso y Pola in the languageof my ancestors, bubi means
women raise up.
Okay, and thisgreat-grandmother I mean.
When she came back and createdthis school, she also decided to
(02:15):
buy a little apartment in Spain.
That's the reason why my rootsgo back to Spain.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
Right right.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
Because when my father, who is a grandson, went
to college, stayed in that houseand then he met my mother and I
was born there.
That's how I end up in Spainand that's the reason why this
kind of multiculturality startedover there.
And I think being raisedbetween two walls that did not
(02:43):
always understand each otheralso helped me to save my future
, because it was really thisthing that in my house I was
African and then I was Europeanoutside of the house, of course,
or I tried to be so I had a lotof identity crisis, because you
want to belong, and when youare young, you want to belong
Absolutely.
(03:04):
I think that I decided that Idon't have to be one thing or
another.
I could become a bridge and, atthe end of the day, this is
what it is.
And my entrepreneurial journeystarted not with a business plan
.
You know what I'm here to do?
Yeah, what is?
What is?
Why should do this?
And then I decided to launchVisillas as wines, because I
(03:29):
thought why we are not in thiskind of business?
Why?
Speaker 2 (03:30):
africans, we are not in this kind of business,
absolutely yeah, I want that.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
we have the best wines and we enjoy also life and
we are exposed to a specificlifestyle, and that was the
reason why I decided to start myjourney there.
And then I found BBLP to createlibraries in Africa, and this
is who I am.
I mean, I think that all thebusinesses that I did speak
(03:53):
about who I am and also whereI'm from.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
Okay, so this deeper meaning you attach to your work,
which is basically being abridge and creating belonging,
do you think it was a push or itwas something that happened
naturally for you Both?
Speaker 1 (04:11):
I think the push came because I've been raised to be
the best of my standards, beingthe only Black kid in the school
and coming home sometimescrying because some kids, you
know, insult me, or they justpointed out that the fact that I
was black and I didn'tunderstand all this make my
(04:32):
parents say you know what, youneed to understand who you are,
your story.
So they were very intentionalin the way I am and stop crying.
You're just going to do thebest you can and go and get it.
I had no choice, you know,because my father told me I'd
rather you hate me than you comeout, not right?
Oh, so this was clear andsuccess was not negotiable.
(04:59):
You must be successful.
If we came all the way fromAfrica to be here in Europe, you
, as a first generation, youhave no choice to make it better
.
So, yeah, I was pushed, but atthe same time, along the way,
you find the opportunitiesbecause the way you think it
(05:20):
shapes your reality.
At the beginning, many doorswere closed for me.
Yeah, because I'm talking about25 years ago, where diversity
didn't even exist.
Yeah, exactly Nobody knew whatwas that.
So back then, anytime I wantedto apply for a position, it was
like there is no place for you,so I also have to build that
(05:44):
doors.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
Yeah, and open them yourself.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
Open them myself.
Sometimes I have to sit myselfon those tables because I was
never being invited.
So I think it's both.
I mean, you also could bepushed, and it depends on many
factors.
But also you need to create theopportunities if they don't
come.
And this starts in the mind,because if you are thinking from
the victim mentality oh no,because I'm a woman, oh no
(06:09):
because I'm black, oh no becausethe background, economic
background that I come from, Ihave no choices, I didn't go to
these schools Then you'retelling a narrative that is not
going to help you.
So everything depends on thenarrative that is inside of you.
Your inner narrative is moreimportant than the narrative
that is out there.
Speaker 2 (06:28):
Yeah, tell me about some of the people, apart from
your parents, who encouraged youalong this path, because we all
have these angels, you know,who help us along on our way.
Speaker 1 (06:39):
Yes, I think I had several, and the first one that
came to my mind it was one of myfirst boss.
I remember that it was thefirst time that this
organization is going to have awoman being the general manager
of the organization.
And I read this in thenewspaper and I mean, for me,
(07:01):
we're talking about really longtime ago to have a woman just
being in charge.
And the national organizationwas like what is this?
So I read it that she's comingto lead us, and I met her in the
elevator the first day that shecame and I just asked her how
was your day?
And she asked me it was good,who are you?
(07:23):
So I encouraged a conversationand in this conversation I said
you know I'm an intern and Iknow that there is a blunt
distance between your office andmy office, but since I have you
here, I want you to tell mewhat have you done to be a
director, because one day Iwould like to be one In this
(07:43):
conversation that we have.
I was 23 years old and she tookthe time to tell me how she did.
I also told her I have a dream.
My dream is to go to the officethat we have in New York.
At that moment I was in theoffice in Spain, in Valencia.
Right, she said okay, tell yourboss to come to talk to me and
(08:04):
we'll see.
So I think that the mentorshipis important, because she was
the passport for the city of mylife and also for the job that I
wanted to do.
Sure, another person that comesto my mind is what I call the
ladder woman, the woman who putthe ladder for you what I call
(08:25):
the lather woman, the woman whoput the lather for you to go up.
And this was a peers of me.
I mean, we both came to NewYork at the same time like
interns, but we used to have avery good relationship.
We admire each other, sure, andwe had a conversation and when
she was leaving the Spain-USChamber of Commerce in a lunch
you know kind of bye-bye lunchshe said you know what you could
(08:46):
be the person who replaced me,and I said no, impossible,
because I know how you work andI don't think, but when someone
believe in you more than youbelieve in yourself, that person
also became essential becausethanks to her, I became the
executive director of the SpainUS Chamber of Commerce, just for
(09:07):
a conversation.
So I think that it is important, the networking, it is
important to really go and sayhello to the people who could
really inspire you or could havethe keys for the door that you
want to open.
I think that so many times wejust don't speak, we don't voice
out what we want.
So how we expect that peoplehave like a ball where they see
(09:32):
the future and they know thatyou want that position?
Speaker 2 (09:35):
Sure, yes, you have to put yourself forward.
In other words, yeah.
Right and you had thesuccessful corporate career and
then you decided to go intoentrepreneurship.
How did that leap happen?
Speaker 1 (09:51):
Well, it's interesting, I did not decide it
because, as a daughter ofimmigrants, what an immigrant is
looking for it's looking forsafety, for financial security.
So for me it was not natural tobecome an entrepreneur, to
become a businesswoman, it wasnot natural.
(10:11):
The first entrepreneurialadventure I had it was with
Zilla Wines.
But I did it while I have myposition secure, because I was
not ready to jump into the spaceof being an entrepreneur just
yet.
Yeah, because I needed thatmattress, you know where.
Oh, if something happens, Istill have my salary, I have my
bonuses and everything.
What happened was that I wasfired.
(10:35):
I was fired from my position.
Oh my goodness, it was veryinteresting because, you see,
the enemy of success isarrogance.
And I was arrogant because Ihad an amazing career in
corporate.
I did great things and thatcame to my head.
And I did not understand onething in the corporate world and
(10:58):
it's not your company, You'rejust an instrument for the goals
of our organization and becauseI had this liberty to do
whatever I want, because I had achairman at that moment, a
president, that allowed me togrow and do my projects the way
(11:18):
I wanted.
But when the organizationchanged, I did not understand
that it was not my organization.
So when the new management cameI was not really following the
rules.
I thought you know what.
I know what I'm doing.
Who are they to tell me what to?
do so I realized that I wasthinking because I know so much
(11:43):
and because I did all thisproject, I brought all this
money nobody would touch me.
And they did.
They put me in the street.
And that, for me, was a veryimportant moment because it
raised a question Know why me?
You know for what?
And realize that if you like todo whatever you want, maybe you
(12:04):
are an entrepreneur, maybeyou're a creator.
And I think this is why it'simportant to have self-knowledge
, Because if you don't reallyreact very well to management
and you don't like to be in anorganization and follow rules in
different directions, it mightbe that the culture of the
company it changed completely,but you will have to comply.
(12:26):
In this case, I did not want itto because I was comfortable
the way things were and I wasnot ready for that change.
And this is when I took thedecision and I realized you know
what, this is, who I am, andeven though that I'm having so
much fear, I was terrified.
I was really terrified because,at that moment.
(12:47):
It was a very difficult momentin my life, personally,
professionally and then Idecided you know I must go and
whatever happens, happens rightand just that's when I decided
to create my own company, my ownconsultancy firm, and I
reinvent myself.
Speaker 2 (13:05):
Yeah, Tell me about that process of reinvention.
You know what were the firstthree things that you did to set
yourself up for success as anindependent?
Speaker 1 (13:15):
The first thing I did is to really invest in personal
development.
I think that it's not what youdo, it's who you are.
Personal development I thinkthat it's not what you do, it's
who you are.
So, before I became the personthat you see today, I had to do
some inner work, and I did thiswith the help of mentors.
I think, that is instrumentalcoaches, mentors not try to do
(13:36):
it alone.
I think it's good to work withsomeone who has already the
experience and help you.
Then you have to decide really,what are you good at?
You know to understand yourtalent, your gift.
All of us we do have talentsand gifts right.
Once you embrace that, you'regoing to discover all the
talents and gifts that you mightthink that you're that you
(13:58):
didn't have it.
I mean, for example, I wasterrified of speaking in public.
I never Really You're so goodat it.
I might sound eloquent.
That's funny.
I might sound that I was, thatI'm really comfortable speaking,
but the truth is that when Iwas in college, I never, ever,
(14:21):
was able to have an oral exam,even with a teacher like here, I
was always having panic attacks.
Wow, yeah, I mean, I developedthis panic since I was a kid
because kids laugh about me.
One day that I have to do apoem in the middle of an event,
I completely forgot.
Everybody laughed in the middleof an event I completely forgot
(14:43):
.
Everybody laughed.
I saw my family being sodisappointed that I developed
this fear to speak in public.
And when you start working,then you realize all the
blockages, all the obstacles,all the things that you have and
you are that you didn'tdiscover.
So in this journey ofself-discovery I decided you
(15:05):
know, maybe I should try becauseI like it.
And sometimes what you fear,behind the fear is an
opportunity, and now it'ssomething that I do for a living
also.
So I think that it's importantto just do this self-discovery
journey to know what are yougood at, Because maybe you're
not good at something and if youtry and try it's not going to
(15:28):
work.
So I think also it's importantto know when also to stop
something right, right, it's notyour path and it's not your
path.
And then I think you need to besurrounded of people who are
really your cheerleaders.
You need to have this kind ofpeople who really, no matter
(15:49):
what, are going to be there foryou.
And I always say there is eighttypes of friends.
It's not a conversation becauseit's too long, but I just want
to just say that you needcheerle leaders, you need
mentors, you need the friend ofall your life, you need that
friend that holds youaccountable.
That is the pusher, you needthe adventurer, you need the
(16:10):
crazy friend, people whochallenge you to be the best
version of yourself, and I thinkyou will never, ever do what
you do without the right people,the right team the right people
who would inspire you.
I would say that this is thefirst three things that I did to
make that leap.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
That's great, and were there some challenges along
the way?
I mean starting a wine business.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
I did all the mistakes that it could be in a
business book, All the thingsthat you say, avoid this, I went
through.
But I think this is how youlearn you learn more from your
mistakes.
And my life has been shaped forall the mistakes I've made.
(17:00):
And then the first mistake Idid is because I did not know
the industry.
I didn't know really thebusiness.
I thought it's a beautifulbusiness because when I was
promoting Spain Spain is verybig in wines I had the
opportunity to create campaignsfor the Rioja wines for
different denominations oforigins, I traveled with
different winemakers and Iunderstood the wine, but one
(17:23):
thing is to see it from theoutside.
But we were not really informedand I didn't really have the
training that you need sometimesin the information about the
industry and a lot of peoplegrow up in these industries
because it comes fromgenerations of family.
In my case, it wasn't that case.
(17:44):
And I think I was not reallywell documented.
So I think, first of all, youneed to know about business.
I didn't know about business.
I was always in the corporatebut I never had a business on
myself.
In this case, I did a lot ofmistakes, I didn't do a good
budget and I thought also a lotof misperception.
I thought, because I alreadyhad a personal brand, somehow
(18:06):
that people will buy from mebecause I was busy.
Right, not happen.
It was a catastrophe.
I mean, we didn't have salesand I was giving away so much
wine.
I remember I sent wines to Ghanaand to Cameroon and different
places and China and we wantedto be international, but we
(18:29):
didn't know the regulations andthe taxes that you need to pay
all this bureaucracy.
So it's very important toreally understand the industry
that you are, make a very goodbudget and really get to people
and around people that they dobetter than you.
So what saved us and that thereason why still be sealant
wines is alive is only becauseof strategic partnerships.
(18:51):
Then we realized, when we weresinking and I had like a debt of
100 000 euros and we werereally about to close down, we
found the right partner.
So we really know how to do thebest wines, because the first
wines that were not so good,they did not represent that,
because I could not really judge, because I was not really a
(19:14):
person super documented andeducated in wine to understand
what is the best wine,documented and educated in wine
to understand what is the bestwine.
And we had this person who hadalready a winery His
great-grandfather had a winery.
They know wines and we createthis kind of authorship wines,
(19:35):
special.
The one I wanted to be SillaWines, it's day four, like wine
that it's's fun to drink, thatis feminine, and we diversify
also.
We have white wine, red winesand also we have like the
champagne wine right and westart to win in awards.
We won an award in a in ingermany and and then everything
(19:58):
changed.
But it happened when we had theright partner amazing.
Another thing that I learned isthat you don't have to walk
alone.
Yeah, you need to find theright person and be very, very
humble.
I don't know this, you knowthis.
Just do it.
And this is how we end up toright now, we're still surviving
(20:22):
okay, so you have a businesspartner in this venture yes, we
have a business partner in thisventure.
We have also a general manager.
That is very good and Irealized that I could not be in
the day-to-day and the businessI do, what I can do that is
promoted, being the face of thewine and, at the same time,
having experts doing what theydo well.
Speaker 2 (20:43):
Wonderful.
Yeah, we'll be back after thebreak.
And now back to the episode.
So that brings me to the BBALP,the literacy project that you
founded.
Tell me about the origins ofthat.
Speaker 1 (21:02):
The origins is incredible for me because it's a
beautiful story.
It happened because I was adecaf African.
Speaker 2 (21:11):
I like that.
Decaav African, I like that.
Speaker 1 (21:18):
I was born in Spain from African parents but I was
never in Africa Because when Iwas growing up my parents didn't
have the opportunity to reallytake me to the country.
So my exposure to Africa wasall through books, because ever
since I was nine years old I wasexposed to read about
(21:39):
Pan-Africanism, understandingthe scars that colonization,
slavery, had in Black people.
It has an impact, but it'sdifferent To understand the
reality of being a BlackEuropean, being a Black American
, being a Black in the Caribbean, of being a Black European,
being a Black American, being aBlack in the Caribbean, being a
Black African.
My parents really gave me allthese books to understand this.
(22:00):
I understood also thegeopolitical framework of what's
going on in Africa.
I grew up watching, readingabout Nelson Mandela, about the
apartheid.
My father makers make summariesto understand everything.
I like him, if not we would bepunished.
Like we understand what wasgoing on in the continent,
(22:23):
understanding also how all thecountries and tribes are
starting to be together and whythe tribalism problems started.
The ethnic problems happened.
So all of this I learned sincea very early age, but I was not
able to see it, to experience it.
So my gift when I turned 35 wasto go to the continent and I
(22:47):
also did international relationsand my teachers were from Ghana
and I had a project that it wasthe United States of Africa.
That was my thesis in theschool.
And when I was there, the firstthing it was, oh my God, all of
these children.
The only difference betweenthem and I is that they did not
(23:09):
have the opportunities that Ihave to go to school.
I saw so many children thatthey were not able to go to
school and for me that was areality that I never thought I
would encounter.
And then I realized thatsomebody said I never had a book
in my hands.
Can I hold this?
And I always travel with a book, right, and it was like it's
(23:32):
not possible that it's happening.
And I met a chief, the chief ofKokofu, and the chief of Kokofu.
We developed a greatrelationship and he made me the
queen development mother ofKokofu, which is a very small
place near to Kumasi in Ghana.
And of course, I just heard theword queen and I said, oh my
(23:52):
God, I love this title.
And then, when my vanityvanished and I said, okay, but
what this means?
Honestly, I love to be a queen,but what can I do for you?
He said that is your decision.
I'm going to give you a pieceof land and just do what you
feel that is the right thing todo.
(24:13):
And then I created a librarybecause I realized that if?
I knew Africa through books.
They could know about the worldthrough books and they could
shape their lives through books.
This became my life mission tomake sure that every kid has
some access to books, becausewith a book you're never alone.
Speaker 2 (24:33):
And are you only in Ghana, operating in Ghana, or do
you have other locations?
Speaker 1 (24:38):
We have other locations.
Actually, I have a project thatis going to go in South Africa
very soon.
Speaker 2 (24:44):
I've been there Yay.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
My home country.
I want to partner withdifferent storytellers because
the organization is shaping indifferent ways, because when we
speak about literacy in the eraof artificial intelligence,
literacy is more than that.
So I want to do also digitalliteracy so the project has
developed and also financialliteracy, because I realize that
(25:08):
literacy is much more than knowhow to read or get an education
.
It's different areas.
So we are in Uganda, we are inZimbabwe, we are in Kenya and we
are in Ghana.
We have collaborations withdifferent countries in
Equatorial Guinea, in Cameroon,in Nigeria, with different.
Now we're going to go to SouthAfrica is one of the places that
(25:29):
we also want to go, but we wantto develop and step further.
We don't want to be away fromthe artificial intelligence.
That's why I was partnering withdifferent organizations like
Dreams Hub.
We had a meeting with all thetechnological hubs in Africa,
also with the people of MountainValley in Cameroon, and we're
(25:52):
trying to work to create digitalliteracy and making programs
from people.
Children be exposed since veryearly age to the digital
revolution, because we've neverbeen involved in the industrial
revolution but we can beinvolved in the digital
revolution and I think Africaneeds a voice and we want to
(26:12):
develop that voice and, ofcourse, we don't want anyone
behind.
Yeah, and this requires boys andgirls to be able to be part of
this transformation, but I alsobelieve that without financial
education, you can have a lot ofknowledge, but you need really
to understand how to createbetter levels of prosperity for
(26:34):
you and your communities.
So that's the reason why, also,we have decided to work in
these areas.
Sure, yeah, I see itself like.
Yes, we want education.
I believe that in this digitalarea, in this artificial
intelligence time, what isreally important is to encourage
(26:57):
the kids to have creativity itis important Empathy and
curiosity, I think, andadaptability.
I think this is going to be askill that we're going to need
in this 21st century, and forthat reason, you need to read,
definitely, but you also need tounderstand financial
information and you need tounderstand also the language of
(27:20):
technology.
Speaker 2 (27:21):
Right, and you know how does this play out.
Do you have courses?
Do you have places wherechildren get taught?
You know, is it physicallocations?
How does it work?
Speaker 1 (27:33):
Through physical locations.
For example, in Zimbabwe wehave a spelling context and we
give a scholarship to thechildren who are in this context
.
So we encourage them also toread, to be connected, since
they are very small kids, andthen they have the opportunity
to really get the school paidfor the whole year.
We have a program, for example,in Kenya that is also a program
(27:56):
for technology.
They have classes every Fridayand we gave them some computers
and laptops and also tablets sothey could be exposed, and they
have this in the middle of thesavannah with the Maasai
children, right, I mean, theydon't have the same access as
other people, so we try to alsowork where there's no access.
(28:17):
We go where most people theynever even put a feet.
So we go in very rural areasand the kids that really have no
opportunity.
So we also have solar panels sothey could have also the
electricity that they need sothey could be connected, because
in some areas energy.
So we work with that.
(28:38):
And in uganda also we also havedifferent programs and now
we're going to do online severalprograms for financial literacy
, working with some of myfriends who are women bankers
who really know a lot aboutfinancial health basically, and
understanding also prosperityand abundance.
Speaker 2 (28:57):
Yeah, that's amazing.
Such great work.
So when do you envisage theSouth African project starting,
and which locations have youchosen for that?
Speaker 1 (29:07):
I started in the year 2017.
And the first time I was in theWorld Economic Forum in the
year 2012, I think, or 11, thefirst time that I was exposed to
South Africa and the realitiesof South Africa.
Of course, you are much moredeveloped than some other
countries, but then I learnedthat there is some communities
(29:27):
that also were in challengingsituations and the partnerships
at that time did not develop.
But the last time I foundsomeone who could really be a
good partner because we need apartner there.
We need the right person to dothese kind of projects, because
we want these projects to besustainable and we don't want a
(29:48):
stop and go, we want somethingthat will stay in the time.
So I think sometimes you have tokiss, kiss many frogs until you
find it absolutely but rightnow I think I kissed the right
one and hopefully I will be atthe end of this year going back
(30:09):
and and just um continue withthe project.
Sure, but it will be basicallynext to Pretoria and some of the
rural areas around that area.
That's the way that we do it,okay.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
And how are you financed?
How do you raise the money tosustain all of these projects?
Speaker 1 (30:27):
Well, I've been very slow through the years.
We started in the year 2010.
Now it's 15 years.
So, through the years, westarted in the year 2010,.
Now it's 15 years and alwayshas been part of the way that I
do business is we give part ofthe benefits of my business to
these projects.
So this is how we've beenfunding.
My organization is not about toraise funding through galas and
(30:50):
make big things and having aboard of super top people For me
, I was.
I mean, this is not my way ofliving but from the benefits
that I do from the wines, thewines profits go to libraries.
And also I released a book inthe year 2003, and now I'm
releasing one this year.
In September I'm going torelease my next book and all of
(31:13):
the benefits go also forlibraries.
I decided that this modelallows me to be free to do what
I can do and not rely on a boardor, you know, to having so many
problems.
So when there is no biasesbecause when my team and I we
decided to go somewhere, we'retrying to do the best we can we
(31:35):
find the partners and we just doit.
So I go slow, but the thing isthat we make more impact because
we don't have all the politics.
That implies to have bigorganizations yeah, and
everything and the people whocome with me.
I also do organized travels withme.
I also do organized travels.
I mean there's trips where Ibring 10 people, for example, up
(32:02):
to 18 people.
Now I'm going to go with agroup of Mexican businesswomen
and we're all going to go toKenya so they see the project
themselves.
I'm not asking them for money.
They see it and they want tocontribute because, living with
the communities, knowing thesechildren, they want to be part
of the narrative of thesechildren.
So my way of working isdifferent.
I don't ask for money.
You want to give the moneybecause you are there and you
(32:23):
realize that you can create theimpact.
So you do it yourself.
So my friends and my contacts,they do it with me because they
come with me and they see it, sothey get engaged from a
different perspective,interesting.
Speaker 2 (32:35):
Yeah, that's a really amazing approach.
So tell me about this bookthat's coming out in September.
What is it called and what isit about?
Speaker 1 (32:43):
Well the name.
We're still with the publisher,but for now and I think it's
going to stay this way is theFear and I an unexpected story.
The first book is called.
We All have a Story to Tell andI speak more about my journey.
And in this book I speak aboutmy relationship with fear, how
(33:04):
fear has been part of my lifesince my ancestors.
I started speaking from thefear that my great-grandmothers
experienced Some of them theywere killed, situations of
domestic violence and how thisfear traveled through my veins
and also blocked me in many ways.
The fear also of the unknownwhen you are an immigrant, like
(33:29):
my parents have experienced.
The fear of me being thedaughter of immigrants immigrate
myself to United States.
The fear of being who I am.
The fear of my own color of theskin, the fear of really
embrace entrepreneurship or Imean, be who I am just that fear
(33:50):
.
Speaker 2 (33:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:51):
Yeah, your roots.
So I speak about differentkinds of fears.
It's 12 chapters Speaking aboutalso the fear to be successful.
Speaker 2 (34:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:01):
On the Jonas complex.
A lot of women.
We have that fear about the,the syndrome of the wonder woman
.
I can do everything.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
All at the same time and still look great, and I'm
not sweating.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
I can do everything All at the same time and still
look great, and I'm not sweating.
I'm always great, no matterwhat, and I'm never tired.
That is also a sign of fear,the imposter syndrome that we
all know very well.
All these fears have names,have shapes and they are the
water.
They take all the forms, theperfectionism.
(34:37):
So I speak about this openlyand, of course, I studied this
for many, many years and I speakfrom my experience, also being
a mentor for CEOs, to understandthat all of us fear is
universal the fear of death, thefear of getting old.
(34:57):
Right now we are all talkingabout longevity.
You just go on Instagram,everybody talking about how we
could stay here forever.
And I just speak about Africans.
We see this fear differentlyBecause what I experienced with
my grandmothers that they wereso happy to be old, they were
really wisdom and they embracetheir age yeah, and right now
(35:18):
we're rejecting this.
So in the book I also speakabout cultural intelligence.
I mean how, from one culture oranother, we see the fears
differently, sure, yeah?
Speaker 2 (35:30):
so yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (35:32):
I had fun writing it.
Speaker 2 (35:34):
Yeah.
What did you discover aboutyourself through writing this
book?
Speaker 1 (35:38):
Well, first of all, that I have so much fears, all
the fears listed, except thefear of sickness.
I'd never been really a fear ofsickness because I always saw
myself healthy.
but you know, everybody knowshypochondriacs, people who you
know, they hear something andthey go to Google and have these
symptoms and some people in myfamily have this fear, I think,
(36:01):
except that one, a lot of thefears I just experienced through
myself, and I speak about how Iovercome that fear, how I make
friends with the fear of nothaving money, I mean it was one
of the fears that took my sleepso many times how am I going to
(36:21):
do this?
How am I going to take care ofmy children?
I mean, all of these fearsexist and I talk openly about
how do I experience them andwhat I did and I gave my tips.
I mean, this is how it helpedme to go from A to Z, what I did
and I just exposed and I gavepeople exercises to see how you
(36:42):
could definitely become a friendof fear, because fear is going
to be part of your life always.
So better for you if you becamefriends.
You're having a conversation,conversation that, instead of
blocking you, really it is atrampoline for you.
It's something that gives youthe impulse that you need.
Speaker 2 (37:04):
Nice.
Speaker 1 (37:05):
And that fear sometimes is trying to tell you
and it's trying to be a guide.
It's trying to be a compass,but we are used to run away from
the fear deny it deny it.
Speaker 2 (37:19):
So that's one thing I discovered yeah, that's nice,
and uh is, who is it aimed at?
Speaker 1 (37:25):
everyone.
I mean, I think it's made foreveryone because I speak about
different fears.
Ever since you're in the school, you know to choose a career
that you might think, oh no, no,I have to make money, I should
not do that.
You know that fear yeah choosewhat you want to do, how many
decisions we make looking formoney, not looking for a passion
(37:46):
, right so I think, from earlyage.
It will benefit you to read.
I also think that forentrepreneurs and people who
want to be in business, who wantto incorporate and would like
to do the jump, people also wantto incorporate that they are
stuck and they never moveforward.
So there is some fears thatdon't allow you because you have
(38:07):
the fear to be visible and thefear of being visible.
I mean, at the end of the dayit's like no one sees you, so
definitely you're never gonnaget that promotion that you want
.
So I speak also about and also,I think, for mothers or
stay-at-home mothers, you know,who really believe that they
could not do more, or people whohave certain age.
(38:30):
I mean mean ageism exists.
I mean everybody is likeeverything is about age.
Well, I did so many thingsafter 40.
My real journey is that after40.
And I'm in my 50s and I juststarted.
Speaker 2 (38:46):
Yeah yeah, it's just the beginning, right.
Speaker 1 (38:49):
Exactly so.
I think that it's men to men,women, and I was also surprised
of the first book.
I make a statistic my youngestreader was a girl of seven years
old from Moroccan origin, andthe other person was a man from
Valencia who was 78.
Speaker 2 (39:09):
Oh, wow.
Speaker 1 (39:10):
And he was a businessman.
Let's say he has a bigcorporation.
So I realized, wow, if my storywas.
I mean, he gave me such abeautiful feedback.
So we make any statistics andwe realize that I don't really
have an audience.
That is really a niche, Right.
Speaker 2 (39:30):
It's universal.
Speaker 1 (39:31):
It's a niche for anyone and actually fear who
doesn't have fear.
In this case, I think this bookwill be even more appealing to
a bigger, larger audiencewonderful, we'll be back after
the break.
Speaker 2 (39:51):
And now back to the episode.
And the other way that you tellyour story is through a podcast
called bb knows best.
Tell me what you discuss onthere and, uh, who should listen
?
Speaker 1 (40:06):
this podcast started because one of my great, great
sisters and person who has beenlonger working with me she is a
Congolese, french girl Amazingshe baptized me with BB and she
said oh, you know these bestpractices right, so you have to
do this and give them adviceabout different areas.
(40:27):
So we started in 2020, when itwas the time that we all went
home and I had a lot of time.
So we create this podcast.
I started in YouTube.
I did it in English and Spanish,because I have audience that
they speak both languages, andit started to pick up and it was
good.
And then, when we have to goback to work and I didn't have
(40:48):
so much time before, it wasreleasing an episode every week
and it was video, but then Ididn't have so much time.
So we releasing an episodeevery week and it was video, but
then I didn't have so much time, so we decided to just keep it
like an audio podcast andsometimes we do have videos and
interviews with people who arevery interesting, like now we
have one releasing in the middleof august.
That is going to be with someonewho works in the space agency,
(41:11):
the european space, yeah, and,but he's a very spiritual, deep
spiritual person.
Even though that he's anelectrical in the space agency
the European Space Agency ohnice, yeah.
But he's a very spiritual, deepspiritual person.
Even though that he's anelectrical engineer and he's a
PhD in physics, he still talksabout astrology, about Kabbalah
and about different spiritualthings.
But we have these kind ofconversations in the podcast and
(41:31):
it's always to bring people whoknow a lot about something Nice
, so it's not me knowingeverything, but I invite people
who know in different areas.
And the podcast we have two amonth and we release it in
English.
And also I have another podcast.
It's mostly in Spanish.
It's called Tu Mejor Yo, whichmeans the Best you, and that's
(41:54):
for the Spanish speakingaudience.
Speaker 2 (41:56):
Yes, you are very busy.
I like that.
Speaker 1 (42:00):
You see, I am, and a lot of people say that they have
24.
Yesterday, actually, someoneasked me that they have for you
24 hours.
I have children, I'm married, Ihave mother, father, brothers,
sisters, friends.
Speaker 2 (42:15):
Exactly yeah.
Speaker 1 (42:17):
Yes, I think that we need to be extremely careful,
and I speak about that the fearof time, I don't have time.
I never say that.
There's two things that youneed to remove from your
vocabulary immediately I don'thave money and I don't have time
, because that becomes yourmantras.
Every time you say I don't havetime, I don't have time, you
(42:37):
shorten your time.
So I always have time and neversay I don't have money.
We always have money forwhatever we want to have it.
Speaker 2 (42:45):
That is true.
Speaker 1 (42:46):
This is so powerful when you remove that two
sentences out of your vocabularyyou just reset your mindset in
a way and you start attracting adifferent reality.
So I do have time, I doexercise, I go to the gym.
I totally yesterday I was inthe gym with my kids.
We always working out, I meanthen we had dinner and I also
(43:10):
have several companies that Imanage.
I have a team of 12 people.
I mean I could do it, but Ithink it's a way and my advice
for everyone who is listening isjust have that time, give
yourself the opportunity to havetime, Say you have the time and
you will make it.
Speaker 2 (43:30):
Yeah, yeah, so a quick rapid fire.
Uh, first thing that comes tomind, just answer as you best
see fit which business woman doyou admire and why?
Speaker 1 (43:44):
I admire Oprah.
She was my first source ofinspiration because when I was
growing up I never really have areference point.
Yeah, I mean the firstbiography of a woman when I was
growing up.
I never really have a referencepoint yeah.
I mean the first biography of awoman that I read, that it was
someone.
It was Benazir Buto who was thefirst, and my parents gave me
that book and at that time inthe 80s, when I was growing up,
(44:08):
at that time it wasn't so thefirst time that I heard about a
black woman being a millionaire,billionaire.
In the 90s it was Oprah.
So she is still in the game.
So in this case, I would saythis is the first one that comes
to my mind.
Speaker 2 (44:23):
Great, and apart from Oprah, if you had to host
another famous black woman atdinner, who would it be, and why
?
Speaker 1 (44:31):
I would like to have Michelle Obama, you see, because
I also think that, being sosmart and being holding the
space the way she did in a verydifficult time, I think I would
love to have a wonderfulconversation with her, and I
also, if I could bring a womanthat is not in this dimension,
(44:53):
it would be Cleopatra, too.
I would love to have aconversation.
I heard that you speak a lot oflanguages, that she was an
extremely great diplomat, and Ialways had a lot of admirations
for people who are very worldly,that they are culturally
intelligent and they are able tobe people who shape different
(45:17):
narratives.
Speaker 2 (45:18):
Yeah, yeah, great.
And what is the one thing youcan't do without on any given
day?
Speaker 1 (45:24):
One thing I cannot do is reading.
I need to have a book with me.
I mean, I'm addicted to books.
If you tell me what is a bigaddiction, it's books.
Speaker 2 (45:39):
That's great.
And what's the best life adviceyou've received and still apply
to this day?
Speaker 1 (45:48):
I think, the best advice that I ever and actually
I don't know from where, but Ithink I read this sentence and
it's I don't follow orders, Ifollow my dreams.
I didn't hear from someone, butthat I just applied to my life
and it became like really theway I do my life, nice.
(46:17):
If people want to work with you,want to get in touch, and just
discover a lot more aboutBeZilla, where can they find you
?
Number one don't be shy, writeme.
A lot of people is like she'sso busy.
You're not the person who makethat decision.
I make that decision.
Yes, just write me, and you canwrite me through Instagram,
linkedin, and you can write methrough Instagram, linkedin.
I am, my name is here, bicelaBococo.
All the channels, my website,everywhere you can find me and I
(46:39):
will be there for you.
Speaker 2 (46:40):
Wonderful Thanks for listening to Shades and Layers.
If you enjoyed this episode,share it with a friend and
subscribe wherever you listen topodcasts.
Until next time, keepcelebrating the shades and
layers of your story.
I don't follow orders , I follow my dreams.
I didn't hear from someone, butthat I just applied to my life
and it became like really theway I do my life.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Welcome to Shades and Layers, the podcast that
celebrates Black and women ofcolor entrepreneurs across
beauty, fashion and beyond.
I'm your host, udwanosKosanarichi.
Join me for stories ofcreativity, resilience and the
layers of building somethingthat lasts.
Hello and welcome to today'sepisode of Shades and Layers.
(00:40):
My guest today is Bicela Bococo, an international businesswoman
with roots in Spain andEquatorial Guinea.
She's also an author andphilanthropist who got her start
in the corporate world both inSpain and the United States.
Today we discuss her latestbook, the Fear and I a story of
unexpected transformation.
We also discuss her very firstentrepreneurial venture into the
(01:03):
wine business.
She has a brand called BisilaWines.
We also get into herphilanthropic work through her
Bisila Bokoko African LiteracyProject.
Her story is a masterclass inself-awareness, ambition,
fearlessness and personalbranding.
Please enjoy the conversation.
Who is Bisila and what is itabout Spain that shaped your
(01:24):
outlook on the world andbusiness?
Speaker 1 (01:26):
Well, I have to start by the beginning, and it's the
roots.
Right, and just apuntualization my roots go back
to Equatorial Guinea, in Africa,my great-grandmother, I think.
She shaped my future becauseshe ran away from a marriage of
domestic violence and she made adecision to study, and at that
(01:46):
time Equatorial Guinea was acolony from Spain, so she was
able to just go to school there.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Right, okay, yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
And when she came back, she decided to create a
school for girls that she calledHuayso y Pola.
Huayso y Pola in the languageof my ancestors, bubi means
women raise up.
Okay, and thisgreat-grandmother I mean.
When she came back and createdthis school, she also decided to
(02:15):
buy a little apartment in Spain.
That's the reason why my rootsgo back to Spain.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
Right right.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
Because when my father, who is a grandson, went
to college, stayed in that houseand then he met my mother and I
was born there.
That's how I end up in Spainand that's the reason why this
kind of multiculturality startedover there.
And I think being raisedbetween two walls that did not
(02:43):
always understand each otheralso helped me to save my future
, because it was really thisthing that in my house I was
African and then I was Europeanoutside of the house, of course,
or I tried to be so I had a lotof identity crisis, because you
want to belong, and when youare young, you want to belong
Absolutely.
(03:04):
I think that I decided that Idon't have to be one thing or
another.
I could become a bridge and, atthe end of the day, this is
what it is.
And my entrepreneurial journeystarted not with a business plan
.
You know what I'm here to do?
Yeah, what is?
What is?
Why should do this?
And then I decided to launchVisillas as wines, because I
(03:29):
thought why we are not in thiskind of business?
Why?
Speaker 2 (03:30):
africans, we are not in this kind of business,
absolutely yeah, I want that.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
we have the best wines and we enjoy also life and
we are exposed to a specificlifestyle, and that was the
reason why I decided to start myjourney there.
And then I found BBLP to createlibraries in Africa, and this
is who I am.
I mean, I think that all thebusinesses that I did speak
(03:53):
about who I am and also whereI'm from.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
Okay, so this deeper meaning you attach to your work,
which is basically being abridge and creating belonging,
do you think it was a push or itwas something that happened
naturally for you Both?
Speaker 1 (04:11):
I think the push came because I've been raised to be
the best of my standards, beingthe only Black kid in the school
and coming home sometimescrying because some kids, you
know, insult me, or they justpointed out that the fact that I
was black and I didn'tunderstand all this make my
(04:32):
parents say you know what, youneed to understand who you are,
your story.
So they were very intentionalin the way I am and stop crying.
You're just going to do thebest you can and go and get it.
I had no choice, you know,because my father told me I'd
rather you hate me than you comeout, not right?
Oh, so this was clear andsuccess was not negotiable.
(04:59):
You must be successful.
If we came all the way fromAfrica to be here in Europe, you
, as a first generation, youhave no choice to make it better
.
So, yeah, I was pushed, but atthe same time, along the way,
you find the opportunitiesbecause the way you think it
(05:20):
shapes your reality.
At the beginning, many doorswere closed for me.
Yeah, because I'm talking about25 years ago, where diversity
didn't even exist.
Yeah, exactly Nobody knew whatwas that.
So back then, anytime I wantedto apply for a position, it was
like there is no place for you,so I also have to build that
(05:44):
doors.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
Yeah, and open them yourself.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
Open them myself.
Sometimes I have to sit myselfon those tables because I was
never being invited.
So I think it's both.
I mean, you also could bepushed, and it depends on many
factors.
But also you need to create theopportunities if they don't
come.
And this starts in the mind,because if you are thinking from
the victim mentality oh no,because I'm a woman, oh no
(06:09):
because I'm black, oh no becausethe background, economic
background that I come from, Ihave no choices, I didn't go to
these schools Then you'retelling a narrative that is not
going to help you.
So everything depends on thenarrative that is inside of you.
Your inner narrative is moreimportant than the narrative
that is out there.
Speaker 2 (06:28):
Yeah, tell me about some of the people, apart from
your parents, who encouraged youalong this path, because we all
have these angels, you know,who help us along on our way.
Speaker 1 (06:39):
Yes, I think I had several, and the first one that
came to my mind it was one of myfirst boss.
I remember that it was thefirst time that this
organization is going to have awoman being the general manager
of the organization.
And I read this in thenewspaper and I mean, for me,
(07:01):
we're talking about really longtime ago to have a woman just
being in charge.
And the national organizationwas like what is this?
So I read it that she's comingto lead us, and I met her in the
elevator the first day that shecame and I just asked her how
was your day?
And she asked me it was good,who are you?
(07:23):
So I encouraged a conversationand in this conversation I said
you know I'm an intern and Iknow that there is a blunt
distance between your office andmy office, but since I have you
here, I want you to tell mewhat have you done to be a
director, because one day Iwould like to be one In this
(07:43):
conversation that we have.
I was 23 years old and she tookthe time to tell me how she did.
I also told her I have a dream.
My dream is to go to the officethat we have in New York.
At that moment I was in theoffice in Spain, in Valencia.
Right, she said okay, tell yourboss to come to talk to me and
(08:04):
we'll see.
So I think that the mentorshipis important, because she was
the passport for the city of mylife and also for the job that I
wanted to do.
Sure, another person that comesto my mind is what I call the
ladder woman, the woman who putthe ladder for you what I call
(08:25):
the lather woman, the woman whoput the lather for you to go up.
And this was a peers of me.
I mean, we both came to NewYork at the same time like
interns, but we used to have avery good relationship.
We admire each other, sure, andwe had a conversation and when
she was leaving the Spain-USChamber of Commerce in a lunch
you know kind of bye-bye lunchshe said you know what you could
(08:46):
be the person who replaced me,and I said no, impossible,
because I know how you work andI don't think, but when someone
believe in you more than youbelieve in yourself, that person
also became essential becausethanks to her, I became the
executive director of the SpainUS Chamber of Commerce, just for
(09:07):
a conversation.
So I think that it is important, the networking, it is
important to really go and sayhello to the people who could
really inspire you or could havethe keys for the door that you
want to open.
I think that so many times wejust don't speak, we don't voice
out what we want.
So how we expect that peoplehave like a ball where they see
(09:32):
the future and they know thatyou want that position?
Speaker 2 (09:35):
Sure, yes, you have to put yourself forward.
In other words, yeah.
Right and you had thesuccessful corporate career and
then you decided to go intoentrepreneurship.
How did that leap happen?
Speaker 1 (09:51):
Well, it's interesting, I did not decide it
because, as a daughter ofimmigrants, what an immigrant is
looking for it's looking forsafety, for financial security.
So for me it was not natural tobecome an entrepreneur, to
become a businesswoman, it wasnot natural.
(10:11):
The first entrepreneurialadventure I had it was with
Zilla Wines.
But I did it while I have myposition secure, because I was
not ready to jump into the spaceof being an entrepreneur just
yet.
Yeah, because I needed thatmattress, you know where.
Oh, if something happens, Istill have my salary, I have my
bonuses and everything.
What happened was that I wasfired.
(10:35):
I was fired from my position.
Oh my goodness, it was veryinteresting because, you see,
the enemy of success isarrogance.
And I was arrogant because Ihad an amazing career in
corporate.
I did great things and thatcame to my head.
And I did not understand onething in the corporate world and
(10:58):
it's not your company, You'rejust an instrument for the goals
of our organization and becauseI had this liberty to do
whatever I want, because I had achairman at that moment, a
president, that allowed me togrow and do my projects the way
(11:18):
I wanted.
But when the organizationchanged, I did not understand
that it was not my organization.
So when the new management cameI was not really following the
rules.
I thought you know what.
I know what I'm doing.
Who are they to tell me what to?
do so I realized that I wasthinking because I know so much
(11:43):
and because I did all thisproject, I brought all this
money nobody would touch me.
And they did.
They put me in the street.
And that, for me, was a veryimportant moment because it
raised a question Know why me?
You know for what?
And realize that if you like todo whatever you want, maybe you
(12:04):
are an entrepreneur, maybeyou're a creator.
And I think this is why it'simportant to have self-knowledge
, Because if you don't reallyreact very well to management
and you don't like to be in anorganization and follow rules in
different directions, it mightbe that the culture of the
company it changed completely,but you will have to comply.
(12:26):
In this case, I did not want itto because I was comfortable
the way things were and I wasnot ready for that change.
And this is when I took thedecision and I realized you know
what, this is, who I am, andeven though that I'm having so
much fear, I was terrified.
I was really terrified because,at that moment.
(12:47):
It was a very difficult momentin my life, personally,
professionally and then Idecided you know I must go and
whatever happens, happens rightand just that's when I decided
to create my own company, my ownconsultancy firm, and I
reinvent myself.
Speaker 2 (13:05):
Yeah, Tell me about that process of reinvention.
You know what were the firstthree things that you did to set
yourself up for success as anindependent?
Speaker 1 (13:15):
The first thing I did is to really invest in personal
development.
I think that it's not what youdo, it's who you are.
Personal development I thinkthat it's not what you do, it's
who you are.
So, before I became the personthat you see today, I had to do
some inner work, and I did thiswith the help of mentors.
I think, that is instrumentalcoaches, mentors not try to do
(13:36):
it alone.
I think it's good to work withsomeone who has already the
experience and help you.
Then you have to decide really,what are you good at?
You know to understand yourtalent, your gift.
All of us we do have talentsand gifts right.
Once you embrace that, you'regoing to discover all the
talents and gifts that you mightthink that you're that you
(13:58):
didn't have it.
I mean, for example, I wasterrified of speaking in public.
I never Really You're so goodat it.
I might sound eloquent.
That's funny.
I might sound that I was, thatI'm really comfortable speaking,
but the truth is that when Iwas in college, I never, ever,
(14:21):
was able to have an oral exam,even with a teacher like here, I
was always having panic attacks.
Wow, yeah, I mean, I developedthis panic since I was a kid
because kids laugh about me.
One day that I have to do apoem in the middle of an event,
I completely forgot.
Everybody laughed in the middleof an event I completely forgot
(14:43):
.
Everybody laughed.
I saw my family being sodisappointed that I developed
this fear to speak in public.
And when you start working,then you realize all the
blockages, all the obstacles,all the things that you have and
you are that you didn'tdiscover.
So in this journey ofself-discovery I decided you
(15:05):
know, maybe I should try becauseI like it.
And sometimes what you fear,behind the fear is an
opportunity, and now it'ssomething that I do for a living
also.
So I think that it's importantto just do this self-discovery
journey to know what are yougood at, Because maybe you're
not good at something and if youtry and try it's not going to
(15:28):
work.
So I think also it's importantto know when also to stop
something right, right, it's notyour path and it's not your
path.
And then I think you need to besurrounded of people who are
really your cheerleaders.
You need to have this kind ofpeople who really, no matter
(15:49):
what, are going to be there foryou.
And I always say there is eighttypes of friends.
It's not a conversation becauseit's too long, but I just want
to just say that you needcheerle leaders, you need
mentors, you need the friend ofall your life, you need that
friend that holds youaccountable.
That is the pusher, you needthe adventurer, you need the
(16:10):
crazy friend, people whochallenge you to be the best
version of yourself, and I thinkyou will never, ever do what
you do without the right people,the right team the right people
who would inspire you.
I would say that this is thefirst three things that I did to
make that leap.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
That's great, and were there some challenges along
the way?
I mean starting a wine business.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
I did all the mistakes that it could be in a
business book, All the thingsthat you say, avoid this, I went
through.
But I think this is how youlearn you learn more from your
mistakes.
And my life has been shaped forall the mistakes I've made.
(17:00):
And then the first mistake Idid is because I did not know
the industry.
I didn't know really thebusiness.
I thought it's a beautifulbusiness because when I was
promoting Spain Spain is verybig in wines I had the
opportunity to create campaignsfor the Rioja wines for
different denominations oforigins, I traveled with
different winemakers and Iunderstood the wine, but one
(17:23):
thing is to see it from theoutside.
But we were not really informedand I didn't really have the
training that you need sometimesin the information about the
industry and a lot of peoplegrow up in these industries
because it comes fromgenerations of family.
In my case, it wasn't that case.
(17:44):
And I think I was not reallywell documented.
So I think, first of all, youneed to know about business.
I didn't know about business.
I was always in the corporatebut I never had a business on
myself.
In this case, I did a lot ofmistakes, I didn't do a good
budget and I thought also a lotof misperception.
I thought, because I alreadyhad a personal brand, somehow
(18:06):
that people will buy from mebecause I was busy.
Right, not happen.
It was a catastrophe.
I mean, we didn't have salesand I was giving away so much
wine.
I remember I sent wines to Ghanaand to Cameroon and different
places and China and we wantedto be international, but we
(18:29):
didn't know the regulations andthe taxes that you need to pay
all this bureaucracy.
So it's very important toreally understand the industry
that you are, make a very goodbudget and really get to people
and around people that they dobetter than you.
So what saved us and that thereason why still be sealant
wines is alive is only becauseof strategic partnerships.
(18:51):
Then we realized, when we weresinking and I had like a debt of
100 000 euros and we werereally about to close down, we
found the right partner.
So we really know how to do thebest wines, because the first
wines that were not so good,they did not represent that,
because I could not really judge, because I was not really a
(19:14):
person super documented andeducated in wine to understand
what is the best wine,documented and educated in wine
to understand what is the bestwine.
And we had this person who hadalready a winery His
great-grandfather had a winery.
They know wines and we createthis kind of authorship wines,
(19:35):
special.
The one I wanted to be SillaWines, it's day four, like wine
that it's's fun to drink, thatis feminine, and we diversify
also.
We have white wine, red winesand also we have like the
champagne wine right and westart to win in awards.
We won an award in a in ingermany and and then everything
(19:58):
changed.
But it happened when we had theright partner amazing.
Another thing that I learned isthat you don't have to walk
alone.
Yeah, you need to find theright person and be very, very
humble.
I don't know this, you knowthis.
Just do it.
And this is how we end up toright now, we're still surviving
(20:22):
okay, so you have a businesspartner in this venture yes, we
have a business partner in thisventure.
We have also a general manager.
That is very good and Irealized that I could not be in
the day-to-day and the businessI do, what I can do that is
promoted, being the face of thewine and, at the same time,
having experts doing what theydo well.
Speaker 2 (20:43):
Wonderful.
Yeah, we'll be back after thebreak.
And now back to the episode.
So that brings me to the BBALP,the literacy project that you
founded.
Tell me about the origins ofthat.
Speaker 1 (21:02):
The origins is incredible for me because it's a
beautiful story.
It happened because I was adecaf African.
Speaker 2 (21:11):
I like that.
Decaav African, I like that.
Speaker 1 (21:18):
I was born in Spain from African parents but I was
never in Africa Because when Iwas growing up my parents didn't
have the opportunity to reallytake me to the country.
So my exposure to Africa wasall through books, because ever
since I was nine years old I wasexposed to read about
(21:39):
Pan-Africanism, understandingthe scars that colonization,
slavery, had in Black people.
It has an impact, but it'sdifferent To understand the
reality of being a BlackEuropean, being a Black American
, being a Black in the Caribbean, of being a Black European,
being a Black American, being aBlack in the Caribbean, being a
Black African.
My parents really gave me allthese books to understand this.
(22:00):
I understood also thegeopolitical framework of what's
going on in Africa.
I grew up watching, readingabout Nelson Mandela, about the
apartheid.
My father makers make summariesto understand everything.
I like him, if not we would bepunished.
Like we understand what wasgoing on in the continent,
(22:23):
understanding also how all thecountries and tribes are
starting to be together and whythe tribalism problems started.
The ethnic problems happened.
So all of this I learned sincea very early age, but I was not
able to see it, to experience it.
So my gift when I turned 35 wasto go to the continent and I
(22:47):
also did international relationsand my teachers were from Ghana
and I had a project that it wasthe United States of Africa.
That was my thesis in theschool.
And when I was there, the firstthing it was, oh my God, all of
these children.
The only difference betweenthem and I is that they did not
(23:09):
have the opportunities that Ihave to go to school.
I saw so many children thatthey were not able to go to
school and for me that was areality that I never thought I
would encounter.
And then I realized thatsomebody said I never had a book
in my hands.
Can I hold this?
And I always travel with a book, right, and it was like it's
(23:32):
not possible that it's happening.
And I met a chief, the chief ofKokofu, and the chief of Kokofu.
We developed a greatrelationship and he made me the
queen development mother ofKokofu, which is a very small
place near to Kumasi in Ghana.
And of course, I just heard theword queen and I said, oh my
(23:52):
God, I love this title.
And then, when my vanityvanished and I said, okay, but
what this means?
Honestly, I love to be a queen,but what can I do for you?
He said that is your decision.
I'm going to give you a pieceof land and just do what you
feel that is the right thing todo.
(24:13):
And then I created a librarybecause I realized that if?
I knew Africa through books.
They could know about the worldthrough books and they could
shape their lives through books.
This became my life mission tomake sure that every kid has
some access to books, becausewith a book you're never alone.
Speaker 2 (24:33):
And are you only in Ghana, operating in Ghana, or do
you have other locations?
Speaker 1 (24:38):
We have other locations.
Actually, I have a project thatis going to go in South Africa
very soon.
Speaker 2 (24:44):
I've been there Yay.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
My home country.
I want to partner withdifferent storytellers because
the organization is shaping indifferent ways, because when we
speak about literacy in the eraof artificial intelligence,
literacy is more than that.
So I want to do also digitalliteracy so the project has
developed and also financialliteracy, because I realize that
(25:08):
literacy is much more than knowhow to read or get an education
.
It's different areas.
So we are in Uganda, we are inZimbabwe, we are in Kenya and we
are in Ghana.
We have collaborations withdifferent countries in
Equatorial Guinea, in Cameroon,in Nigeria, with different.
Now we're going to go to SouthAfrica is one of the places that
(25:29):
we also want to go, but we wantto develop and step further.
We don't want to be away fromthe artificial intelligence.
That's why I was partnering withdifferent organizations like
Dreams Hub.
We had a meeting with all thetechnological hubs in Africa,
also with the people of MountainValley in Cameroon, and we're
(25:52):
trying to work to create digitalliteracy and making programs
from people.
Children be exposed since veryearly age to the digital
revolution, because we've neverbeen involved in the industrial
revolution but we can beinvolved in the digital
revolution and I think Africaneeds a voice and we want to
(26:12):
develop that voice and, ofcourse, we don't want anyone
behind.
Yeah, and this requires boys andgirls to be able to be part of
this transformation, but I alsobelieve that without financial
education, you can have a lot ofknowledge, but you need really
to understand how to createbetter levels of prosperity for
(26:34):
you and your communities.
So that's the reason why, also,we have decided to work in
these areas.
Sure, yeah, I see itself like.
Yes, we want education.
I believe that in this digitalarea, in this artificial
intelligence time, what isreally important is to encourage
(26:57):
the kids to have creativity itis important Empathy and
curiosity, I think, andadaptability.
I think this is going to be askill that we're going to need
in this 21st century, and forthat reason, you need to read,
definitely, but you also need tounderstand financial
information and you need tounderstand also the language of
(27:20):
technology.
Speaker 2 (27:21):
Right, and you know how does this play out.
Do you have courses?
Do you have places wherechildren get taught?
You know, is it physicallocations?
How does it work?
Speaker 1 (27:33):
Through physical locations.
For example, in Zimbabwe wehave a spelling context and we
give a scholarship to thechildren who are in this context
.
So we encourage them also toread, to be connected, since
they are very small kids, andthen they have the opportunity
to really get the school paidfor the whole year.
We have a program, for example,in Kenya that is also a program
(27:56):
for technology.
They have classes every Fridayand we gave them some computers
and laptops and also tablets sothey could be exposed, and they
have this in the middle of thesavannah with the Maasai
children, right, I mean, theydon't have the same access as
other people, so we try to alsowork where there's no access.
(28:17):
We go where most people theynever even put a feet.
So we go in very rural areasand the kids that really have no
opportunity.
So we also have solar panels sothey could have also the
electricity that they need sothey could be connected, because
in some areas energy.
So we work with that.
(28:38):
And in uganda also we also havedifferent programs and now
we're going to do online severalprograms for financial literacy
, working with some of myfriends who are women bankers
who really know a lot aboutfinancial health basically, and
understanding also prosperityand abundance.
Speaker 2 (28:57):
Yeah, that's amazing.
Such great work.
So when do you envisage theSouth African project starting,
and which locations have youchosen for that?
Speaker 1 (29:07):
I started in the year 2017.
And the first time I was in theWorld Economic Forum in the
year 2012, I think, or 11, thefirst time that I was exposed to
South Africa and the realitiesof South Africa.
Of course, you are much moredeveloped than some other
countries, but then I learnedthat there is some communities
(29:27):
that also were in challengingsituations and the partnerships
at that time did not develop.
But the last time I foundsomeone who could really be a
good partner because we need apartner there.
We need the right person to dothese kind of projects, because
we want these projects to besustainable and we don't want a
(29:48):
stop and go, we want somethingthat will stay in the time.
So I think sometimes you have tokiss, kiss many frogs until you
find it absolutely but rightnow I think I kissed the right
one and hopefully I will be atthe end of this year going back
(30:09):
and and just um continue withthe project.
Sure, but it will be basicallynext to Pretoria and some of the
rural areas around that area.
That's the way that we do it,okay.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
And how are you financed?
How do you raise the money tosustain all of these projects?
Speaker 1 (30:27):
Well, I've been very slow through the years.
We started in the year 2010.
Now it's 15 years.
So, through the years, westarted in the year 2010,.
Now it's 15 years and alwayshas been part of the way that I
do business is we give part ofthe benefits of my business to
these projects.
So this is how we've beenfunding.
My organization is not about toraise funding through galas and
(30:50):
make big things and having aboard of super top people For me
, I was.
I mean, this is not my way ofliving but from the benefits
that I do from the wines, thewines profits go to libraries.
And also I released a book inthe year 2003, and now I'm
releasing one this year.
In September I'm going torelease my next book and all of
(31:13):
the benefits go also forlibraries.
I decided that this modelallows me to be free to do what
I can do and not rely on a boardor, you know, to having so many
problems.
So when there is no biasesbecause when my team and I we
decided to go somewhere, we'retrying to do the best we can we
(31:35):
find the partners and we just doit.
So I go slow, but the thing isthat we make more impact because
we don't have all the politics.
That implies to have bigorganizations yeah, and
everything and the people whocome with me.
I also do organized travels withme.
I also do organized travels.
I mean there's trips where Ibring 10 people, for example, up
(32:02):
to 18 people.
Now I'm going to go with agroup of Mexican businesswomen
and we're all going to go toKenya so they see the project
themselves.
I'm not asking them for money.
They see it and they want tocontribute because, living with
the communities, knowing thesechildren, they want to be part
of the narrative of thesechildren.
So my way of working isdifferent.
I don't ask for money.
You want to give the moneybecause you are there and you
(32:23):
realize that you can create theimpact.
So you do it yourself.
So my friends and my contacts,they do it with me because they
come with me and they see it, sothey get engaged from a
different perspective,interesting.
Speaker 2 (32:35):
Yeah, that's a really amazing approach.
So tell me about this bookthat's coming out in September.
What is it called and what isit about?
Speaker 1 (32:43):
Well the name.
We're still with the publisher,but for now and I think it's
going to stay this way is theFear and I an unexpected story.
The first book is called.
We All have a Story to Tell andI speak more about my journey.
And in this book I speak aboutmy relationship with fear, how
(33:04):
fear has been part of my lifesince my ancestors.
I started speaking from thefear that my great-grandmothers
experienced Some of them theywere killed, situations of
domestic violence and how thisfear traveled through my veins
and also blocked me in many ways.
The fear also of the unknownwhen you are an immigrant, like
(33:29):
my parents have experienced.
The fear of me being thedaughter of immigrants immigrate
myself to United States.
The fear of being who I am.
The fear of my own color of theskin, the fear of really
embrace entrepreneurship or Imean, be who I am just that fear
(33:50):
.
Speaker 2 (33:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:51):
Yeah, your roots.
So I speak about differentkinds of fears.
It's 12 chapters Speaking aboutalso the fear to be successful.
Speaker 2 (34:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:01):
On the Jonas complex.
A lot of women.
We have that fear about the,the syndrome of the wonder woman
.
I can do everything.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
All at the same time and still look great, and I'm
not sweating.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
I can do everything All at the same time and still
look great, and I'm not sweating.
I'm always great, no matterwhat, and I'm never tired.
That is also a sign of fear,the imposter syndrome that we
all know very well.
All these fears have names,have shapes and they are the
water.
They take all the forms, theperfectionism.
(34:37):
So I speak about this openlyand, of course, I studied this
for many, many years and I speakfrom my experience, also being
a mentor for CEOs, to understandthat all of us fear is
universal the fear of death, thefear of getting old.
(34:57):
Right now we are all talkingabout longevity.
You just go on Instagram,everybody talking about how we
could stay here forever.
And I just speak about Africans.
We see this fear differentlyBecause what I experienced with
my grandmothers that they wereso happy to be old, they were
really wisdom and they embracetheir age yeah, and right now
(35:18):
we're rejecting this.
So in the book I also speakabout cultural intelligence.
I mean how, from one culture oranother, we see the fears
differently, sure, yeah?
Speaker 2 (35:30):
so yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (35:32):
I had fun writing it.
Speaker 2 (35:34):
Yeah.
What did you discover aboutyourself through writing this
book?
Speaker 1 (35:38):
Well, first of all, that I have so much fears, all
the fears listed, except thefear of sickness.
I'd never been really a fear ofsickness because I always saw
myself healthy.
but you know, everybody knowshypochondriacs, people who you
know, they hear something andthey go to Google and have these
symptoms and some people in myfamily have this fear, I think,
(36:01):
except that one, a lot of thefears I just experienced through
myself, and I speak about how Iovercome that fear, how I make
friends with the fear of nothaving money, I mean it was one
of the fears that took my sleepso many times how am I going to
(36:21):
do this?
How am I going to take care ofmy children?
I mean, all of these fearsexist and I talk openly about
how do I experience them andwhat I did and I gave my tips.
I mean, this is how it helpedme to go from A to Z, what I did
and I just exposed and I gavepeople exercises to see how you
(36:42):
could definitely become a friendof fear, because fear is going
to be part of your life always.
So better for you if you becamefriends.
You're having a conversation,conversation that, instead of
blocking you, really it is atrampoline for you.
It's something that gives youthe impulse that you need.
Speaker 2 (37:04):
Nice.
Speaker 1 (37:05):
And that fear sometimes is trying to tell you
and it's trying to be a guide.
It's trying to be a compass,but we are used to run away from
the fear deny it deny it.
Speaker 2 (37:19):
So that's one thing I discovered yeah, that's nice,
and uh is, who is it aimed at?
Speaker 1 (37:25):
everyone.
I mean, I think it's made foreveryone because I speak about
different fears.
Ever since you're in the school, you know to choose a career
that you might think, oh no, no,I have to make money, I should
not do that.
You know that fear yeah choosewhat you want to do, how many
decisions we make looking formoney, not looking for a passion
(37:46):
, right so I think, from earlyage.
It will benefit you to read.
I also think that forentrepreneurs and people who
want to be in business, who wantto incorporate and would like
to do the jump, people also wantto incorporate that they are
stuck and they never moveforward.
So there is some fears thatdon't allow you because you have
(38:07):
the fear to be visible and thefear of being visible.
I mean, at the end of the dayit's like no one sees you, so
definitely you're never gonnaget that promotion that you want
.
So I speak also about and also,I think, for mothers or
stay-at-home mothers, you know,who really believe that they
could not do more, or people whohave certain age.
(38:30):
I mean mean ageism exists.
I mean everybody is likeeverything is about age.
Well, I did so many thingsafter 40.
My real journey is that after40.
And I'm in my 50s and I juststarted.
Speaker 2 (38:46):
Yeah yeah, it's just the beginning, right.
Speaker 1 (38:49):
Exactly so.
I think that it's men to men,women, and I was also surprised
of the first book.
I make a statistic my youngestreader was a girl of seven years
old from Moroccan origin, andthe other person was a man from
Valencia who was 78.
Speaker 2 (39:09):
Oh, wow.
Speaker 1 (39:10):
And he was a businessman.
Let's say he has a bigcorporation.
So I realized, wow, if my storywas.
I mean, he gave me such abeautiful feedback.
So we make any statistics andwe realize that I don't really
have an audience.
That is really a niche, Right.
Speaker 2 (39:30):
It's universal.
Speaker 1 (39:31):
It's a niche for anyone and actually fear who
doesn't have fear.
In this case, I think this bookwill be even more appealing to
a bigger, larger audiencewonderful, we'll be back after
the break.
Speaker 2 (39:51):
And now back to the episode.
And the other way that you tellyour story is through a podcast
called bb knows best.
Tell me what you discuss onthere and, uh, who should listen
?
Speaker 1 (40:06):
this podcast started because one of my great, great
sisters and person who has beenlonger working with me she is a
Congolese, french girl Amazingshe baptized me with BB and she
said oh, you know these bestpractices right, so you have to
do this and give them adviceabout different areas.
(40:27):
So we started in 2020, when itwas the time that we all went
home and I had a lot of time.
So we create this podcast.
I started in YouTube.
I did it in English and Spanish,because I have audience that
they speak both languages, andit started to pick up and it was
good.
And then, when we have to goback to work and I didn't have
(40:48):
so much time before, it wasreleasing an episode every week
and it was video, but then Ididn't have so much time.
So we releasing an episodeevery week and it was video, but
then I didn't have so much time, so we decided to just keep it
like an audio podcast andsometimes we do have videos and
interviews with people who arevery interesting, like now we
have one releasing in the middleof august.
That is going to be with someonewho works in the space agency,
(41:11):
the european space, yeah, and,but he's a very spiritual, deep
spiritual person.
Even though that he's anelectrical in the space agency
the European Space Agency ohnice, yeah.
But he's a very spiritual, deepspiritual person.
Even though that he's anelectrical engineer and he's a
PhD in physics, he still talksabout astrology, about Kabbalah
and about different spiritualthings.
But we have these kind ofconversations in the podcast and
(41:31):
it's always to bring people whoknow a lot about something Nice
, so it's not me knowingeverything, but I invite people
who know in different areas.
And the podcast we have two amonth and we release it in
English.
And also I have another podcast.
It's mostly in Spanish.
It's called Tu Mejor Yo, whichmeans the Best you, and that's
(41:54):
for the Spanish speakingaudience.
Speaker 2 (41:56):
Yes, you are very busy.
I like that.
Speaker 1 (42:00):
You see, I am, and a lot of people say that they have
24.
Yesterday, actually, someoneasked me that they have for you
24 hours.
I have children, I'm married, Ihave mother, father, brothers,
sisters, friends.
Speaker 2 (42:15):
Exactly yeah.
Speaker 1 (42:17):
Yes, I think that we need to be extremely careful,
and I speak about that the fearof time, I don't have time.
I never say that.
There's two things that youneed to remove from your
vocabulary immediately I don'thave money and I don't have time
, because that becomes yourmantras.
Every time you say I don't havetime, I don't have time, you
(42:37):
shorten your time.
So I always have time and neversay I don't have money.
We always have money forwhatever we want to have it.
Speaker 2 (42:45):
That is true.
Speaker 1 (42:46):
This is so powerful when you remove that two
sentences out of your vocabularyyou just reset your mindset in
a way and you start attracting adifferent reality.
So I do have time, I doexercise, I go to the gym.
I totally yesterday I was inthe gym with my kids.
We always working out, I meanthen we had dinner and I also
(43:10):
have several companies that Imanage.
I have a team of 12 people.
I mean I could do it, but Ithink it's a way and my advice
for everyone who is listening isjust have that time, give
yourself the opportunity to havetime, Say you have the time and
you will make it.
Speaker 2 (43:30):
Yeah, yeah, so a quick rapid fire.
Uh, first thing that comes tomind, just answer as you best
see fit which business woman doyou admire and why?
Speaker 1 (43:44):
I admire Oprah.
She was my first source ofinspiration because when I was
growing up I never really have areference point.
Yeah, I mean the firstbiography of a woman when I was
growing up.
I never really have a referencepoint yeah.
I mean the first biography of awoman that I read, that it was
someone.
It was Benazir Buto who was thefirst, and my parents gave me
that book and at that time inthe 80s, when I was growing up,
(44:08):
at that time it wasn't so thefirst time that I heard about a
black woman being a millionaire,billionaire.
In the 90s it was Oprah.
So she is still in the game.
So in this case, I would saythis is the first one that comes
to my mind.
Speaker 2 (44:23):
Great, and apart from Oprah, if you had to host
another famous black woman atdinner, who would it be, and why
?
Speaker 1 (44:31):
I would like to have Michelle Obama, you see, because
I also think that, being sosmart and being holding the
space the way she did in a verydifficult time, I think I would
love to have a wonderfulconversation with her, and I
also, if I could bring a womanthat is not in this dimension,
(44:53):
it would be Cleopatra, too.
I would love to have aconversation.
I heard that you speak a lot oflanguages, that she was an
extremely great diplomat, and Ialways had a lot of admirations
for people who are very worldly,that they are culturally
intelligent and they are able tobe people who shape different
(45:17):
narratives.
Speaker 2 (45:18):
Yeah, yeah, great.
And what is the one thing youcan't do without on any given
day?
Speaker 1 (45:24):
One thing I cannot do is reading.
I need to have a book with me.
I mean, I'm addicted to books.
If you tell me what is a bigaddiction, it's books.
Speaker 2 (45:39):
That's great.
And what's the best life adviceyou've received and still apply
to this day?
Speaker 1 (45:48):
I think, the best advice that I ever and actually
I don't know from where, but Ithink I read this sentence and
it's I don't follow orders, Ifollow my dreams.
I didn't hear from someone, butthat I just applied to my life
and it became like really theway I do my life, nice.
(46:17):
If people want to work with you,want to get in touch, and just
discover a lot more aboutBeZilla, where can they find you
?
Number one don't be shy, writeme.
A lot of people is like she'sso busy.
You're not the person who makethat decision.
I make that decision.
Yes, just write me, and you canwrite me through Instagram,
linkedin, and you can write methrough Instagram, linkedin.
I am, my name is here, bicelaBococo.
All the channels, my website,everywhere you can find me and I
(46:39):
will be there for you.
Speaker 2 (46:40):
Wonderful Thanks for listening to Shades and Layers.
If you enjoyed this episode,share it with a friend and
subscribe wherever you listen topodcasts.
Until next time, keepcelebrating the shades and
layers of your story.
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