October 1, 2023 • 27 mins
What if you had the power to guide lost spirits home? Would you dare to walk the path of the psychopomp? Join us in a daring exploration of the ethereal world of disembodied spirits, their connection with the living, and the delicate act of persuading them to cross over to the other side. We unveil the intricate puzzles surrounding these spirits, their fears, religious beliefs, feelings of unworthiness, unfinished business, and traumatic deaths that bind them to the middle world. And that's not all - we'll also touch upon the curious codependent relationships that can develop between spirits and humans, as well as the influence they can wield over human behavior and habits.
Ever wondered how to deal with traumatized spirits? We'll dissect the art of psychopomp work, a unique blend of compassion, non-judgment, understanding, and respect for spiritual free will. We'll address the necessity of conglomerate shamanic efforts in places scarred by mass trauma and the pivotal role of wisdom keepers in this sacred journey. We'll also share our insights on the significance of guiding these earthbound spirits home, and how the loss of ancient ways has amplified their plight. So, come along for this enchanting journey as we navigate the enigmatic world of spirits and the compassionate task of guiding them home.
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Bri's website: https://treehearthealing.com
Tina's website: https://3crowshealing.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
Hello illuminated souls.
I am Brie and Rione.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
And I'm Tina DeMore.
Welcome to Shaman's After Dark.
Today we'll be delving into thetopic of disembodied spirits,
so it's a fun one to talk about.
Yes, and I think a lot ofpeople might be interested in At
least our experiences and ourpoint of view of how to deal
with disembodied spirits is howto really see this phenomenon,
absolutely.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Yeah.
So let's talk about what do wemean when we're saying
disembodied spirits?
So when Tina and I are talkingabout disembodied spirits, we
are referring to earthboundspirits that were once human,
that are stuck in this world,the middle world, which is the
spiritual aspect of the world.
We embody our non-ordinaryreality of our everyday life In
(00:52):
our shamanic experience.
When animals, birds and humanspass on, their spirit goes to
another place, to mention thevoid, whatever you want to call
it, it's not.
We no longer are lingering herein the middle world generally,
but it isn't always the samedimension.
It's just a place we go, whereit's filled with love, belonging
, and we usually have ourancestors or the spirits of
(01:13):
others who have passed on thatgreet us when we come over and
return home, so to speak, butsometimes we get stuck, or
others get stuck and we don'tmake that transition, due to a
number of different things.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
A number of things, yes, and so how do they get
stuck?
Because I actually think a lotof people might be rather
curious about this.
Not all spirits go to the light, and it's from a variety of
factors.
Number one would be fear of theunknown.
They don't know what happensafter we pass.
Maybe they don't have a beliefsystem in place in their around
(01:51):
the time that they die thatmakes them have faith around
something.
Continuing on.
Speaker 1 (01:57):
Right and sometimes it's the opposite, but sometimes
you have really strongreligious beliefs that kind of
create some fear maybe aboutwhere you're going to go
depending on how you lived yourlife, like if you had a really
religious upbringing that saysyou might not be going to a
great place.
You might be reluctant to leaveand experience that because
there's some fear lingering foryou around what you're going to
(02:19):
experience or what's going tohappen.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Right and a lot of like.
Sometimes religions have thesejudgment types of dogmas really
around.
Well, I might not be worthgoing into the light, and so a
lot of them just hang aroundthinking that they've sinned and
they don't belong in the lightand all kinds of things like
that the feeling of notdeserving of the light, not
(02:42):
deserving of belonging, notdeserving of going home.
That can happen.
I've seen it a number of times.
There can also be unfinishedbusiness.
Something happens dramatically.
They want to figure out a wayto let other people know about
or somehow want to solve it.
They can also want to stayaround to say goodbye to loved
(03:06):
ones.
Or if they're worried aboutsomeone here, they might hang
around.
Or sometimes, if they pass atthe hands of someone else, they
may want some retaliation.
All kinds of things can happenbeyond our thoughts and what we
might think.
Speaker 1 (03:23):
And also traumatic death.
Sometimes you don't actuallyrealize if you were in a car
accident.
It happened unexpectedly.
You're kind of stunned and inthis space, like a soul loss can
happen in that traumatic event,and then the spirits just are
oriented.
It's kind of like what happenedand not really realizing they
are no longer embodied.
So you kind of just get stuckbecause you're in this cycle of
(03:44):
not really understanding thatsomething's taking place and
you're no longer existing as youwere and sometimes they just,
like I've said, they don't knowthat they've passed on.
So they're kind of stuck inthis dream-like state and they
still see themselves as livingand being embodied and going
about their day and trying toengage with the world in a way
that they used to and not fullyunderstanding why it's not maybe
happening in that way.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
And can you imagine how frightening that might be?
You're kind of stuck in thisdream state of sort, of this
repetition, and no one'sresponding to them.
They can't find the people intheir lives in a normal way.
It must be either frightening,frustrating or just really
disorienting for them,especially after an accident
like you described.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
Yep.
Or if something you know, youdie from a violent death, you
know, or you just.
Sometimes I think too.
Sometimes spirits are just likeI have so much more to do in
this life, especially if it'scut short unexpectedly.
You know there's a reason likeI'm not just not wanting to let
go of all that potential or allyou wanted to do or what you
came here to do.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
So we want to talk about the issues that might come
up, that we have personallydealt with or that we've learned
about in our own training.
Some of these disembodiedspirits need help, obviously
crossing over, they don't knowhow to get back home to the
light and some attach themselvesto people that they find a sort
of a commonality with.
I call in my work a woundresidence, like feeling unsafe
(05:10):
in the world.
If someone has this woundaround, feeling unworthy, or a
rejection wound or a wound ofabandonment, which can be a very
large wound, they feel thisresidence and will attach to the
human.
Usually it's not out of harm,it's just sort of.
Sometimes there's like a weirdcodependent relationship like,
(05:31):
oh, I can help them and thensomehow unconsciously the human
feels like a little safer, eventhough it's not really
benefiting either.
So that is an issue that cancome up.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
And I've sometimes seen as well like a spirit might
attach because you have habitsthat are similar to their habits
in life and it helps them tokind of feel embodied again.
They kind of feel not theenergy, like they might say
you're a smoker and that personwas a smoker in life and also
you notice you're smoking a lotmore heavily than you did, and
that's the influence of thatspirit that's kind of attached
itself to, energeticallyinfluencing, because it's that
(06:08):
habit that's resonating.
Whether so it could be that itcould be something else where
they're just identifying withsome of the things that you do
or how you present in the world,or even your energetic
vibration.
They're like, oh, this feelsfamiliar.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
There's something similar about it and that, oh
geez, I really miss smoking.
You know that's something Ican't do anymore, so I think I'm
going to hitch ride here andagain.
Most of the time it's notmalicious, it's really not.
It's sort of like this.
I think it's subconscious, itis just you're drawn to
something that feels familiarand safe.
Speaker 1 (06:39):
And something that I've seen when working with
clients too is sometimes thespirit of a child might attach
to a person who reminds them ofa parent, because that child,
that spirit's disoriented, it'sscared, it's lost.
So they again are being drawnto that sense of familiarity.
This person kind of feels likea parent to them.
I actually had a client who washaving pain in her knee and we
(07:01):
did this journey and she hadactually recently gone through
an old home where this child hadpassed away due to illness and
it attached itself to herbecause it looked like it
reminded her.
This disembodied spirit wasreminded of her mother and she
was scared.
So she was like, okay, this ismy mom, I'm attaching myself for
sense of security.
(07:21):
But that manifested for myclient in a pain in her knee and
you know so we were.
I did the work.
My helping spirits help this.
You know child spirit to returnhome and cross over and the
pain went away.
So it's just interestingbecause that when we have a
disembodied spirit that kind ofgets entangled up in our energy
body, it manifests in differentways for us.
(07:43):
Or you might experience like Idon't feel quite right or maybe
I'm having impulses don't feellike really like mine.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
Yes, and people will feel a little not centered, even
though at first it feels likethat having that attachment is
serving a purpose.
It's really not beneficial,like you said, like pains or
personality changes, orsometimes people even experience
thoughts or feelings that don'tfeel like theirs Right.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
They feel intrusive, you know, it's kind of like oh,
this doesn't feel right andagain I'm gonna we're going to
stress this a lot it's not amalicious like the spirit is
trying to harm you, like thischild wasn't trying to harm my
client, she was just drawn tothe sense of security.
And it's got to be verydisorienting to just be stuck
here and not reallyunderstanding where to go,
whether you're being held byfear or something else, or
(08:31):
you're just lost, or that spiritis just lost so it attached
itself.
And so this work really needsto be very compassionate when
you're dealing with theseentities or these spirits, these
disembodied spirits that justdon't know how to get home, so
to speak.
And it also they're drawnsometimes to attach themselves
(08:51):
because it reminds them of beingalive and in a body and it's a,
it's a drain on a person'senergy when that being kind of
attaches and so different thingslike we've discussed kind of
show up when that happens.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
And we don't want this to be scary for people.
We're hoping this isinteresting and intriguing.
The middle world, the aspect ofthis world that is a
non-ordinary reality, thespiritual aspect of this world,
is essentially safe if you'reusing safe and appropriate
practices.
You know that means if you knowhow to journey and you're
working with a helping spirit webonded with over time.
(09:23):
You always want to travel withthem, so that makes it safer.
There are lots of spirits inthis world that are benevolent.
There are trees, spirits oftrees, spirits of birds, like we
said before, spirits of animals, all kinds of beautiful beings
that want to connect with us andcommune with us, and so.
(09:44):
But a part of this work too, isdealing with spirits that become
lost.
So you know, when you'reworking in the middle world, in
this work, journeying you caneither merge with your helping
spirits or travel with them, butyou never want to go without.
They're like a tour guide inanother place and on the maybe
even time, and you don't want totravel alone.
Those are your safety, thoseare your comrades and allies.
(10:07):
So when you're doing thisjourney work, you know when I
teach this work and I know whenyou teach this work, Brie.
We always say to people tojourney with your helping
spirits, especially through themiddle world.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
Again, it's a beautiful, benevolent place, but
again it's a part of this workthat can be a little complicated
and just it's practice, it'swisdom, it's making sure, if
you're going to do this work,that you've trained in it so
that you're just for safetyreasons and just keep protecting
your energy body.
And when we say safety, it'sabout protecting your energy
body and your energy and justnot wanting to unknowingly have
(10:42):
something you know connect toyou.
Because Tina and I both, and Ithink anyone who's an energy
worker whether it's shamanicwork, reiki or whatnot if you
have a colleague or someone youknow that does the work, and
making sure you check in witheach other and do healing work
for each other, becausesometimes, when you're just
caught in this work, we can'talways be the best healer for
ourselves and we may not seethat something's going on.
(11:03):
So it's really I think it'simportant for our energetic
hygiene to just make sure you'vegot someone you know if you're
able to call on, yeah, to callon and say, hey, I'm feeling a
little off, or let's just checkin and let's just trade a
healing when.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
I hear about people doing work with spirits en masse
when they're dealing with, youknow, just one human being going
in without helping spirits andhelping like 50 spirits cross.
I get from from how I've workedand how I've trained and I know
you're you was well Brie I geta little nervous about that.
Speaker 1 (11:34):
Yeah, you can only handle so much and we're going
to talk a little bit more aboutlike if your large mass
casualties are doing kind of alarge cycle pump work.
But one thing we wanted to talkabout too a little bit is, you
know, if you're doing thispractice and you've got a good
practice of journeying, and wedefinitely, as Tina said,
encourage you to merge andthat's where you kind of become,
you and your helping spiritmerge your energetic vibrations
(11:58):
together, kind of creating athird unique vibration that just
makes you stronger and lesslikely to have any energetic
gaps, you know, or something,because your reverse doesn't
like avoid, yeah, and justgetting something stuck or
energetic intrusion or somethingelse.
So it's just merging is abeautiful practice that allows
you to kind of just be in astronger energetic vibration
(12:20):
than if you were doing that workon your own and it's just.
It's also great, it's helpfulpractice to to merge whether
you're journeying in the middleworld or maybe you're doing some
healing work for someone andyou just really need to power up
and just make sure that you'renot taking on anything
unintentionally when doing thatwork.
Speaker 2 (12:36):
And merging is just doing it, even in a lower world
of the upper world, isincredibly healing, just an in
and of itself, absolutely.
But then when you're like sortof a powerhouse, when you're
merged with your helping spiritsin the middle world and doing
this work and you know somepractitioners don't really like
this work so they choose not todo psychopomp work and some
people like you and I reallylike this work?
Speaker 1 (12:59):
Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah, we definitely.
I.
I really enjoy the psychopompwork.
That it's very I find it to bevery rewarding work to do.
And some people just aren'tcalled to it and that's okay.
There's no judgment around it.
I think we all have areas thatwe feel really drawn to and we
feel like we excel at and, doyou know, kind of specialize in,
and and I we have just foundover the years of training and
(13:21):
what our teachers have sharedwith us and what we've seen when
teaching and sharing this workwith others is that, yeah, you
know there feels good or it'sjust not resonant for you and
that's all okay.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
Yeah, that is okay.
If it's not something thatyou're supposed to do, that's
okay.
You might have some otherstrengths as a practitioner.
So we also want to give sometime to talk about land and
buildings that may be imprintedwith traumatic energy from
events occurring in the past.
The kind of traumatic energythat comes from violence of any
(13:54):
kind, an event that was shockingto the people who are once
living there energies of loss,death, grief, anger, anguish.
Just like us, disembodiedspirits are attracted to
frequencies that feelcomfortable to them and familiar
.
These spirits may have died atthe location and, like we said
before, may not realize they'redead due to the shocking
(14:15):
experience, potentially due tosoul loss.
I know years ago I joined upwith a bunch of shamanic
practitioners after the massshooting at the nightclub pulse
in Orlando, florida, back in2016.
And lots of people were stuckthere after this really huge
event.
So it's important to do what wecall a group psychopomp, but
(14:39):
there was a lot of stuck energythere and I learned a lot from
that.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Yeah, this is kind of where we're circling back to
and reiterating Don't take onplaces of mass trauma whether
it's a war zone, a tsunami, anearthquake or a place where a
lot of traumatic death has takenplace on your own, like don't
do that psychopomp.
But you're like I'm gonna gojourney and do psychopomp work
for these.
Definitely work with a group ofshamanic practitioners and go
(15:05):
together.
And yeah, they've been trained.
You are all knowing what you'redoing and going together to do
that work.
And if there's, like you know,if anything more than one to two
spirits in a place, it's reallybest to ask other psychopomps
for assistance.
Best practice is definitely toask for help and work with a
group, and there are quite a few, I think there's some different
shamanic groups out there thatcome together and kind of do
this work.
So when we're working with agroup, you know we power up the
(15:28):
verge and we start the work, andit's just also important to
remember when doing this workwe're really just a vessel.
Our helping spirits are doingthe work.
We are that conduit between ourhelping spirits and either our
client or you know, thesedisembodied spirits that we're
trying to do the work and assistin crossing over.
Speaker 2 (15:45):
You know, and we've mentioned this word a couple of
times we've mentioned the wordpsychopomp, which is a Greek
word from psychopompos,literally meaning the guide of
souls, and shamanicpractitioners that help these
spirits cross over.
Again, always with the help ofthe helping spirits, is called
psychopomping, and psychopompsare people that have been
(16:06):
trained, practitioners that havebeen trained to work in this
sort of way.
And you know, as a psychopomp,it's really important to
approach this work, like yousaid, brie, with empathy for the
situation and compassion, nojudgment, I mean.
There's a lot of suffering inthis world as far as disembodied
beings.
They are just people withoutthe skin and they haven't
(16:30):
crossed over and so they're lost.
We need to have compassion forhow shocking it might be for a
spirit that's been traumatizedor disoriented from other
worldly experiences and theymight be approached by us, the
first person to approach them inyears.
Can you imagine how that mightbe?
(16:50):
So if you are a psychopomp, itmight be daunting for these
spirits to understand, like theycan't stay.
It takes a lot of faith andcourage to go from a state of
fear and to take a risk that onespirit will not be annihilated
and if that belief is thatthey're sent to an eternal place
of suffering.
It takes a lot of trust if youhave that mindset before you
(17:10):
pass away.
And another thing it's reallynot ethical to force spirits to
cross.
We can't change free will.
We can encourage the spirit towant to cross over, but
sometimes they just aren't ready.
So you can come back and kindof try to talk them into it.
But that's an aspect we justreally want to talk about.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
Yeah, it's definitely something I've had somewhere
I've had to go back and just sayI've talked to the spirit and
they're just not ready.
And then I'll say, is it okayif I come back and talk with you
again in a couple of weeks or amonth and just keep working
until they're ready and justbeing compassionate and really
reminding them that they'regoing to be greeted by their
ancestors and their loved onesand they're going to a place of
(17:52):
light and love and compassion sothat they can evolve and
process their soul's journey inthat embodied lifetime that they
were experiencing.
And it's interesting, I think,as children we are so much more
open to the world of spirit andwe see so much more before we
become these adults that arekind of a little more like close
down.
Close down because the worlddoesn't, you know, it's, you
(18:13):
know, kind of always like a poopooed a bit when you're you talk
about doing this kind of workor the things that you see.
And my son, you know, when hewas little, used to just see
spirits, disembodied spirits,all the time.
I mean it was, it was it was hedidn't know what to make of it
and he used to have this.
(18:34):
We would wake up at night andsaying there was this shadow,
this black shadow of a manstanding at the foot of his bed
and it was just freak him out.
And I, because I was tooengaged with it, because it was
my son and the ideas that I everhad around it I reached out to
a friend who was a shamanicpractitioner and they came in
and journeyed and it was just aspirit and he didn't pass away
(18:54):
here, he just kind of got stuck.
It was attracted to my son'senergy and his.
You know that he could see himand so he was just showing up
and then she helped move himalong and cross him over and my
son no longer experiencedanything with that spirit
anymore.
And again, it wasn't harmful,it was just scary.
I wouldn't want to wake up witha shadow of someone standing at
(19:15):
the foot of my bed either.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
And you know, because both of us are psychopaths, I
know that both of us have had alot of personal experiences with
spirits.
So when I was initiated intoonto the shamanic path, I was
living in my grandfather's house, which was built in 1820 on the
coast of Maine, and even when Iwas growing up there, you know,
(19:40):
it'd come up in the summer andthere would be a spirit that I
would sense there.
I never saw it and I'm kind ofthankful that spirit doesn't
show up in, you know, before mywaking eyes like that on a
normal basis.
I really I sense it with mythird eye and I think some
people also will understand that.
You know this.
It just felt very often this oneroom that obviously I had to
(20:02):
stay in.
So you know, every time Istayed up there I was always
this really strange feeling inthis one room.
Years later my cousin went upthere to visit.
She could see the spirit.
She described it now because Inever saw it, I just sensed it.
I sent the since the emotionsand the offness and it was very
(20:22):
cold in there.
She described the spirit and Iknow my sister-in-law also slept
in that room years later andhad like a waking experience
with spirit.
Now again, I'm so thankful.
I don't normally have thatexperience but during my, I
think, my second year inApprenticing, learning about
death and dying, we had about 10shamanic practitioners, kind of
(20:44):
ghostbust that house and therewere a whole bunch of spirits in
there that had passed away overthe years, but they were, you
know, kept by this one spirit.
It was not a benevolent spirit,let's just put it that way, but
it was a disembodied spirit.
It was once human but we hadkind of lost his way.
(21:04):
So, as complicated as this workcan get, it's always to me,
since I was a child, intriguedme and I think that sort of that
Psycho-Pomp fingerprint thatyou know you and I have and
other people might have, Iactually do love this work.
It's not built for everyone,it's not meant for everyone, but
(21:25):
I know you love it as well, bri.
The one thing I love about it,I will say, is when a spirit
actually does surrender, itconcedes to go to the other side
, the release of suffering andthe rejoining and the reunion
with ancestors or any otherspirits that are benevolent,
(21:47):
when they're welcomed back.
It is such a beautifulexperience to be witnessed to,
and so when I see that, I almostcry.
Every single time I will gettears in my eyes, and I'm just
so grateful that there's lesssuffering.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
Absolutely.
I mean, it's such deep work itis.
Speaker 2 (22:05):
It is when you see that relief on their face and
they're like, oh my gosh, now Iwork to this fear and now I'm
back home and this is wonderful.
That's enough for me, Like I'min.
Speaker 1 (22:16):
Yeah, now, absolutely , I remember when I was learning
this work and we were doing,you know, the death and dying
work we had as a group journey,to place it a bit of war zone,
and we're as a you know, a groupdoing this Psycho-Pomp work,
and I remember the spirit that Ihad helped, this disembodied
spirit that I helped move over,who was looking for his daughter
(22:37):
in that, you know, just looking, looking, looking and that's
why he was still here and justseeing the relief and the
release when he were turned tohis ancestors and you know just
that wholeness that came backand, instead of being stuck in
that constant fear, was reallyamazing and it's, you know, when
you're in the work becauseyou're powered up with your
helping spirits, it's not asimpactful when you came out,
it's just crying mess after,because you then you can really
(23:00):
process it when you're sittingwith this work that you've done,
it's just it's really nice tobe able to be of service To
those that are stuck here andwant to cross over, not realize.
It's beautiful work if you callto it, definitely.
I really enjoy it and it's oneof the Pieces that I was most
fascinated when we were trainingand learning about this they
(23:21):
just felt really good to doingyeah, so what wisdom do our
helping spirits have to shareregarding earthbound spirits
free?
my helping spirit said since thetime humans came into existence
on this earth, there have beeninstances of spirits getting
stuck between planes for variousreasons.
In your early existence therewere less of you, and you had
those within your communitiesthat were in harmony with spirit
(23:43):
and the rhythm of mother nature, who are able to help care for
and shepherd those lost in thisguided spirits back home to all
that is in the arms of theirancestors.
This helped maintain a healthybalance between the embodied and
disembodied spirits.
As humanity has evolved andgrown, you've lost many of the
old ways and the wisdom keeperswho held the knowledge of how to
(24:04):
guide those lost and stuckspirits home.
Our great mother earth has seena great number of wars, plagues
and natural disasters,increasing the number of those
that get caught between theworlds for one reason or another
.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
We are all one.
Speaker 1 (24:17):
We are all connected.
Those stuck in fear andsuffering between planes can
have an impact on thoseinhabiting the earth now and
many unexpected and challengingways it can feed into the
collective suffering that istaking place in the world today.
Those who carry forward thework as a shepherd of souls help
to keep the balance between theembodied and disembodied.
It is not work for the fainthearted.
(24:37):
It takes knowledge of the work,compassion and a deep
understanding of the sufferingthose disembodied spirits may be
experiencing to truly be ableto step into the role.
One must remember that justbecause the spirit is no longer
embodied and is stuck does notmean they are wise or well.
They are often as they were inlife and have not had the chance
(24:58):
to evolve and learn from theirlife lesson when they have been
stuck between planes.
It is only when the soulreturns home that is able to
grow and evolve from theexperiences gained in a body to
life.
Speaker 2 (25:11):
You know, I it's interesting how our helping
spirits have very similarmessages, even though we did
this piece separately.
Thank you, brie.
So my helping spirits said inthe millions of years of the
existence of your planet, yourhuman can has been bored and has
died.
Most pass on in theirancestralized homelands, but
others do not find their way,whether this is from ties to the
(25:35):
earthly realm or not realizingthe spirit has separated from
the body, or simply havingresistance to being deserving of
the experience of oneness.
The spirits that have not foundtheir way are adding to the
collective suffering that humansfeel in their world.
For those were drawn to helpspirits crossover, it is vital
to come to this work with acompassionate heart, with
learned skills that canpowerfully communicate with
(25:58):
those who are disembodied sothat they can find the piece
that they deserve.
The veil is thin at this timeand the suffering of those who
are embodied are reflective ofthe suffering of the disembodied
.
So I'm just understanding thatone cannot question how
interconnected we all are.
Speaker 1 (26:13):
It is so interesting how they kind of echo each other
, because I remember when Ifirst sat down to do this
journey, my spirits were like no, not right now, like when I did
it again, they actually gave mea novel.
Speaker 2 (26:25):
I was like okay, I'm not a lot.
Speaker 1 (26:27):
Normally they're pretty short and sweet, to the
point.
Speaker 2 (26:32):
Isn't that interesting, because I even have
students, something like theyjourneyed, and I couldn't, I
didn't get much.
I'm like well, journey again onit.
I'm kind of giving you a blanklook like, yeah, I get it.
You got to go back to me too.
Speaker 1 (26:45):
And you can find us at wwwshamansefterdarkcom.
We hope you'll drop us a line.
We don't have a journey promptfor today because middle world
work can be for someone a littlemore advanced and really
comfortable in their skills.
Speaker 2 (26:57):
So but you can find free on treehearthealingcom and
myself on threegrowshealingcomwith a numeral three.
There's also links to ourpersonal pages on
shamansefterdarkcom.
Speaker 1 (27:08):
So until next time, everyone, keep on shining your
light.
Hello illuminated souls.
I am Brie and Rione.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
And I'm Tina DeMore.
Welcome to Shaman's After Dark.
Today we'll be delving into thetopic of disembodied spirits,
so it's a fun one to talk about.
Yes, and I think a lot ofpeople might be interested in At
least our experiences and ourpoint of view of how to deal
with disembodied spirits is howto really see this phenomenon,
absolutely.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Yeah.
So let's talk about what do wemean when we're saying
disembodied spirits?
So when Tina and I are talkingabout disembodied spirits, we
are referring to earthboundspirits that were once human,
that are stuck in this world,the middle world, which is the
spiritual aspect of the world.
We embody our non-ordinaryreality of our everyday life In
(00:52):
our shamanic experience.
When animals, birds and humanspass on, their spirit goes to
another place, to mention thevoid, whatever you want to call
it, it's not.
We no longer are lingering herein the middle world generally,
but it isn't always the samedimension.
It's just a place we go, whereit's filled with love, belonging
, and we usually have ourancestors or the spirits of
(01:13):
others who have passed on thatgreet us when we come over and
return home, so to speak, butsometimes we get stuck, or
others get stuck and we don'tmake that transition, due to a
number of different things.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
A number of things, yes, and so how do they get
stuck?
Because I actually think a lotof people might be rather
curious about this.
Not all spirits go to the light, and it's from a variety of
factors.
Number one would be fear of theunknown.
They don't know what happensafter we pass.
Maybe they don't have a beliefsystem in place in their around
(01:51):
the time that they die thatmakes them have faith around
something.
Continuing on.
Speaker 1 (01:57):
Right and sometimes it's the opposite, but sometimes
you have really strongreligious beliefs that kind of
create some fear maybe aboutwhere you're going to go
depending on how you lived yourlife, like if you had a really
religious upbringing that saysyou might not be going to a
great place.
You might be reluctant to leaveand experience that because
there's some fear lingering foryou around what you're going to
(02:19):
experience or what's going tohappen.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Right and a lot of like.
Sometimes religions have thesejudgment types of dogmas really
around.
Well, I might not be worthgoing into the light, and so a
lot of them just hang aroundthinking that they've sinned and
they don't belong in the lightand all kinds of things like
that the feeling of notdeserving of the light, not
(02:42):
deserving of belonging, notdeserving of going home.
That can happen.
I've seen it a number of times.
There can also be unfinishedbusiness.
Something happens dramatically.
They want to figure out a wayto let other people know about
or somehow want to solve it.
They can also want to stayaround to say goodbye to loved
(03:06):
ones.
Or if they're worried aboutsomeone here, they might hang
around.
Or sometimes, if they pass atthe hands of someone else, they
may want some retaliation.
All kinds of things can happenbeyond our thoughts and what we
might think.
Speaker 1 (03:23):
And also traumatic death.
Sometimes you don't actuallyrealize if you were in a car
accident.
It happened unexpectedly.
You're kind of stunned and inthis space, like a soul loss can
happen in that traumatic event,and then the spirits just are
oriented.
It's kind of like what happenedand not really realizing they
are no longer embodied.
So you kind of just get stuckbecause you're in this cycle of
(03:44):
not really understanding thatsomething's taking place and
you're no longer existing as youwere and sometimes they just,
like I've said, they don't knowthat they've passed on.
So they're kind of stuck inthis dream-like state and they
still see themselves as livingand being embodied and going
about their day and trying toengage with the world in a way
that they used to and not fullyunderstanding why it's not maybe
happening in that way.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
And can you imagine how frightening that might be?
You're kind of stuck in thisdream state of sort, of this
repetition, and no one'sresponding to them.
They can't find the people intheir lives in a normal way.
It must be either frightening,frustrating or just really
disorienting for them,especially after an accident
like you described.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
Yep.
Or if something you know, youdie from a violent death, you
know, or you just.
Sometimes I think too.
Sometimes spirits are just likeI have so much more to do in
this life, especially if it'scut short unexpectedly.
You know there's a reason likeI'm not just not wanting to let
go of all that potential or allyou wanted to do or what you
came here to do.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
So we want to talk about the issues that might come
up, that we have personallydealt with or that we've learned
about in our own training.
Some of these disembodiedspirits need help, obviously
crossing over, they don't knowhow to get back home to the
light and some attach themselvesto people that they find a sort
of a commonality with.
I call in my work a woundresidence, like feeling unsafe
(05:10):
in the world.
If someone has this woundaround, feeling unworthy, or a
rejection wound or a wound ofabandonment, which can be a very
large wound, they feel thisresidence and will attach to the
human.
Usually it's not out of harm,it's just sort of.
Sometimes there's like a weirdcodependent relationship like,
(05:31):
oh, I can help them and thensomehow unconsciously the human
feels like a little safer, eventhough it's not really
benefiting either.
So that is an issue that cancome up.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
And I've sometimes seen as well like a spirit might
attach because you have habitsthat are similar to their habits
in life and it helps them tokind of feel embodied again.
They kind of feel not theenergy, like they might say
you're a smoker and that personwas a smoker in life and also
you notice you're smoking a lotmore heavily than you did, and
that's the influence of thatspirit that's kind of attached
itself to, energeticallyinfluencing, because it's that
(06:08):
habit that's resonating.
Whether so it could be that itcould be something else where
they're just identifying withsome of the things that you do
or how you present in the world,or even your energetic
vibration.
They're like, oh, this feelsfamiliar.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
There's something similar about it and that, oh
geez, I really miss smoking.
You know that's something Ican't do anymore, so I think I'm
going to hitch ride here andagain.
Most of the time it's notmalicious, it's really not.
It's sort of like this.
I think it's subconscious, itis just you're drawn to
something that feels familiarand safe.
Speaker 1 (06:39):
And something that I've seen when working with
clients too is sometimes thespirit of a child might attach
to a person who reminds them ofa parent, because that child,
that spirit's disoriented, it'sscared, it's lost.
So they again are being drawnto that sense of familiarity.
This person kind of feels likea parent to them.
I actually had a client who washaving pain in her knee and we
(07:01):
did this journey and she hadactually recently gone through
an old home where this child hadpassed away due to illness and
it attached itself to herbecause it looked like it
reminded her.
This disembodied spirit wasreminded of her mother and she
was scared.
So she was like, okay, this ismy mom, I'm attaching myself for
sense of security.
(07:21):
But that manifested for myclient in a pain in her knee and
you know so we were.
I did the work.
My helping spirits help this.
You know child spirit to returnhome and cross over and the
pain went away.
So it's just interestingbecause that when we have a
disembodied spirit that kind ofgets entangled up in our energy
body, it manifests in differentways for us.
(07:43):
Or you might experience like Idon't feel quite right or maybe
I'm having impulses don't feellike really like mine.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
Yes, and people will feel a little not centered, even
though at first it feels likethat having that attachment is
serving a purpose.
It's really not beneficial,like you said, like pains or
personality changes, orsometimes people even experience
thoughts or feelings that don'tfeel like theirs Right.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
They feel intrusive, you know, it's kind of like oh,
this doesn't feel right andagain I'm gonna we're going to
stress this a lot it's not amalicious like the spirit is
trying to harm you, like thischild wasn't trying to harm my
client, she was just drawn tothe sense of security.
And it's got to be verydisorienting to just be stuck
here and not reallyunderstanding where to go,
whether you're being held byfear or something else, or
(08:31):
you're just lost, or that spiritis just lost so it attached
itself.
And so this work really needsto be very compassionate when
you're dealing with theseentities or these spirits, these
disembodied spirits that justdon't know how to get home, so
to speak.
And it also they're drawnsometimes to attach themselves
(08:51):
because it reminds them of beingalive and in a body and it's a,
it's a drain on a person'senergy when that being kind of
attaches and so different thingslike we've discussed kind of
show up when that happens.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
And we don't want this to be scary for people.
We're hoping this isinteresting and intriguing.
The middle world, the aspect ofthis world that is a
non-ordinary reality, thespiritual aspect of this world,
is essentially safe if you'reusing safe and appropriate
practices.
You know that means if you knowhow to journey and you're
working with a helping spirit webonded with over time.
(09:23):
You always want to travel withthem, so that makes it safer.
There are lots of spirits inthis world that are benevolent.
There are trees, spirits oftrees, spirits of birds, like we
said before, spirits of animals, all kinds of beautiful beings
that want to connect with us andcommune with us, and so.
(09:44):
But a part of this work too, isdealing with spirits that become
lost.
So you know, when you'reworking in the middle world, in
this work, journeying you caneither merge with your helping
spirits or travel with them, butyou never want to go without.
They're like a tour guide inanother place and on the maybe
even time, and you don't want totravel alone.
Those are your safety, thoseare your comrades and allies.
(10:07):
So when you're doing thisjourney work, you know when I
teach this work and I know whenyou teach this work, Brie.
We always say to people tojourney with your helping
spirits, especially through themiddle world.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
Again, it's a beautiful, benevolent place, but
again it's a part of this workthat can be a little complicated
and just it's practice, it'swisdom, it's making sure, if
you're going to do this work,that you've trained in it so
that you're just for safetyreasons and just keep protecting
your energy body.
And when we say safety, it'sabout protecting your energy
body and your energy and justnot wanting to unknowingly have
(10:42):
something you know connect toyou.
Because Tina and I both, and Ithink anyone who's an energy
worker whether it's shamanicwork, reiki or whatnot if you
have a colleague or someone youknow that does the work, and
making sure you check in witheach other and do healing work
for each other, becausesometimes, when you're just
caught in this work, we can'talways be the best healer for
ourselves and we may not seethat something's going on.
(11:03):
So it's really I think it'simportant for our energetic
hygiene to just make sure you'vegot someone you know if you're
able to call on, yeah, to callon and say, hey, I'm feeling a
little off, or let's just checkin and let's just trade a
healing when.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
I hear about people doing work with spirits en masse
when they're dealing with, youknow, just one human being going
in without helping spirits andhelping like 50 spirits cross.
I get from from how I've workedand how I've trained and I know
you're you was well Brie I geta little nervous about that.
Speaker 1 (11:34):
Yeah, you can only handle so much and we're going
to talk a little bit more aboutlike if your large mass
casualties are doing kind of alarge cycle pump work.
But one thing we wanted to talkabout too a little bit is, you
know, if you're doing thispractice and you've got a good
practice of journeying, and wedefinitely, as Tina said,
encourage you to merge andthat's where you kind of become,
you and your helping spiritmerge your energetic vibrations
(11:58):
together, kind of creating athird unique vibration that just
makes you stronger and lesslikely to have any energetic
gaps, you know, or something,because your reverse doesn't
like avoid, yeah, and justgetting something stuck or
energetic intrusion or somethingelse.
So it's just merging is abeautiful practice that allows
you to kind of just be in astronger energetic vibration
(12:20):
than if you were doing that workon your own and it's just.
It's also great, it's helpfulpractice to to merge whether
you're journeying in the middleworld or maybe you're doing some
healing work for someone andyou just really need to power up
and just make sure that you'renot taking on anything
unintentionally when doing thatwork.
Speaker 2 (12:36):
And merging is just doing it, even in a lower world
of the upper world, isincredibly healing, just an in
and of itself, absolutely.
But then when you're like sortof a powerhouse, when you're
merged with your helping spiritsin the middle world and doing
this work and you know somepractitioners don't really like
this work so they choose not todo psychopomp work and some
people like you and I reallylike this work?
Speaker 1 (12:59):
Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah, we definitely.
I.
I really enjoy the psychopompwork.
That it's very I find it to bevery rewarding work to do.
And some people just aren'tcalled to it and that's okay.
There's no judgment around it.
I think we all have areas thatwe feel really drawn to and we
feel like we excel at and, doyou know, kind of specialize in,
and and I we have just foundover the years of training and
(13:21):
what our teachers have sharedwith us and what we've seen when
teaching and sharing this workwith others is that, yeah, you
know there feels good or it'sjust not resonant for you and
that's all okay.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
Yeah, that is okay.
If it's not something thatyou're supposed to do, that's
okay.
You might have some otherstrengths as a practitioner.
So we also want to give sometime to talk about land and
buildings that may be imprintedwith traumatic energy from
events occurring in the past.
The kind of traumatic energythat comes from violence of any
(13:54):
kind, an event that was shockingto the people who are once
living there energies of loss,death, grief, anger, anguish.
Just like us, disembodiedspirits are attracted to
frequencies that feelcomfortable to them and familiar
.
These spirits may have died atthe location and, like we said
before, may not realize they'redead due to the shocking
(14:15):
experience, potentially due tosoul loss.
I know years ago I joined upwith a bunch of shamanic
practitioners after the massshooting at the nightclub pulse
in Orlando, florida, back in2016.
And lots of people were stuckthere after this really huge
event.
So it's important to do what wecall a group psychopomp, but
(14:39):
there was a lot of stuck energythere and I learned a lot from
that.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Yeah, this is kind of where we're circling back to
and reiterating Don't take onplaces of mass trauma whether
it's a war zone, a tsunami, anearthquake or a place where a
lot of traumatic death has takenplace on your own, like don't
do that psychopomp.
But you're like I'm gonna gojourney and do psychopomp work
for these.
Definitely work with a group ofshamanic practitioners and go
(15:05):
together.
And yeah, they've been trained.
You are all knowing what you'redoing and going together to do
that work.
And if there's, like you know,if anything more than one to two
spirits in a place, it's reallybest to ask other psychopomps
for assistance.
Best practice is definitely toask for help and work with a
group, and there are quite a few, I think there's some different
shamanic groups out there thatcome together and kind of do
this work.
So when we're working with agroup, you know we power up the
(15:28):
verge and we start the work, andit's just also important to
remember when doing this workwe're really just a vessel.
Our helping spirits are doingthe work.
We are that conduit between ourhelping spirits and either our
client or you know, thesedisembodied spirits that we're
trying to do the work and assistin crossing over.
Speaker 2 (15:45):
You know, and we've mentioned this word a couple of
times we've mentioned the wordpsychopomp, which is a Greek
word from psychopompos,literally meaning the guide of
souls, and shamanicpractitioners that help these
spirits cross over.
Again, always with the help ofthe helping spirits, is called
psychopomping, and psychopompsare people that have been
(16:06):
trained, practitioners that havebeen trained to work in this
sort of way.
And you know, as a psychopomp,it's really important to
approach this work, like yousaid, brie, with empathy for the
situation and compassion, nojudgment, I mean.
There's a lot of suffering inthis world as far as disembodied
beings.
They are just people withoutthe skin and they haven't
(16:30):
crossed over and so they're lost.
We need to have compassion forhow shocking it might be for a
spirit that's been traumatizedor disoriented from other
worldly experiences and theymight be approached by us, the
first person to approach them inyears.
Can you imagine how that mightbe?
(16:50):
So if you are a psychopomp, itmight be daunting for these
spirits to understand, like theycan't stay.
It takes a lot of faith andcourage to go from a state of
fear and to take a risk that onespirit will not be annihilated
and if that belief is thatthey're sent to an eternal place
of suffering.
It takes a lot of trust if youhave that mindset before you
(17:10):
pass away.
And another thing it's reallynot ethical to force spirits to
cross.
We can't change free will.
We can encourage the spirit towant to cross over, but
sometimes they just aren't ready.
So you can come back and kindof try to talk them into it.
But that's an aspect we justreally want to talk about.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
Yeah, it's definitely something I've had somewhere
I've had to go back and just sayI've talked to the spirit and
they're just not ready.
And then I'll say, is it okayif I come back and talk with you
again in a couple of weeks or amonth and just keep working
until they're ready and justbeing compassionate and really
reminding them that they'regoing to be greeted by their
ancestors and their loved onesand they're going to a place of
(17:52):
light and love and compassion sothat they can evolve and
process their soul's journey inthat embodied lifetime that they
were experiencing.
And it's interesting, I think,as children we are so much more
open to the world of spirit andwe see so much more before we
become these adults that arekind of a little more like close
down.
Close down because the worlddoesn't, you know, it's, you
(18:13):
know, kind of always like a poopooed a bit when you're you talk
about doing this kind of workor the things that you see.
And my son, you know, when hewas little, used to just see
spirits, disembodied spirits,all the time.
I mean it was, it was it was hedidn't know what to make of it
and he used to have this.
(18:34):
We would wake up at night andsaying there was this shadow,
this black shadow of a manstanding at the foot of his bed
and it was just freak him out.
And I, because I was tooengaged with it, because it was
my son and the ideas that I everhad around it I reached out to
a friend who was a shamanicpractitioner and they came in
and journeyed and it was just aspirit and he didn't pass away
(18:54):
here, he just kind of got stuck.
It was attracted to my son'senergy and his.
You know that he could see himand so he was just showing up
and then she helped move himalong and cross him over and my
son no longer experiencedanything with that spirit
anymore.
And again, it wasn't harmful,it was just scary.
I wouldn't want to wake up witha shadow of someone standing at
(19:15):
the foot of my bed either.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
And you know, because both of us are psychopaths, I
know that both of us have had alot of personal experiences with
spirits.
So when I was initiated intoonto the shamanic path, I was
living in my grandfather's house, which was built in 1820 on the
coast of Maine, and even when Iwas growing up there, you know,
(19:40):
it'd come up in the summer andthere would be a spirit that I
would sense there.
I never saw it and I'm kind ofthankful that spirit doesn't
show up in, you know, before mywaking eyes like that on a
normal basis.
I really I sense it with mythird eye and I think some
people also will understand that.
You know this.
It just felt very often this oneroom that obviously I had to
(20:02):
stay in.
So you know, every time Istayed up there I was always
this really strange feeling inthis one room.
Years later my cousin went upthere to visit.
She could see the spirit.
She described it now because Inever saw it, I just sensed it.
I sent the since the emotionsand the offness and it was very
(20:22):
cold in there.
She described the spirit and Iknow my sister-in-law also slept
in that room years later andhad like a waking experience
with spirit.
Now again, I'm so thankful.
I don't normally have thatexperience but during my, I
think, my second year inApprenticing, learning about
death and dying, we had about 10shamanic practitioners, kind of
(20:44):
ghostbust that house and therewere a whole bunch of spirits in
there that had passed away overthe years, but they were, you
know, kept by this one spirit.
It was not a benevolent spirit,let's just put it that way, but
it was a disembodied spirit.
It was once human but we hadkind of lost his way.
(21:04):
So, as complicated as this workcan get, it's always to me,
since I was a child, intriguedme and I think that sort of that
Psycho-Pomp fingerprint thatyou know you and I have and
other people might have, Iactually do love this work.
It's not built for everyone,it's not meant for everyone, but
(21:25):
I know you love it as well, bri.
The one thing I love about it,I will say, is when a spirit
actually does surrender, itconcedes to go to the other side
, the release of suffering andthe rejoining and the reunion
with ancestors or any otherspirits that are benevolent,
(21:47):
when they're welcomed back.
It is such a beautifulexperience to be witnessed to,
and so when I see that, I almostcry.
Every single time I will gettears in my eyes, and I'm just
so grateful that there's lesssuffering.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
Absolutely.
I mean, it's such deep work itis.
Speaker 2 (22:05):
It is when you see that relief on their face and
they're like, oh my gosh, now Iwork to this fear and now I'm
back home and this is wonderful.
That's enough for me, Like I'min.
Speaker 1 (22:16):
Yeah, now, absolutely , I remember when I was learning
this work and we were doing,you know, the death and dying
work we had as a group journey,to place it a bit of war zone,
and we're as a you know, a groupdoing this Psycho-Pomp work,
and I remember the spirit that Ihad helped, this disembodied
spirit that I helped move over,who was looking for his daughter
(22:37):
in that, you know, just looking, looking, looking and that's
why he was still here and justseeing the relief and the
release when he were turned tohis ancestors and you know just
that wholeness that came backand, instead of being stuck in
that constant fear, was reallyamazing and it's, you know, when
you're in the work becauseyou're powered up with your
helping spirits, it's not asimpactful when you came out,
it's just crying mess after,because you then you can really
(23:00):
process it when you're sittingwith this work that you've done,
it's just it's really nice tobe able to be of service To
those that are stuck here andwant to cross over, not realize.
It's beautiful work if you callto it, definitely.
I really enjoy it and it's oneof the Pieces that I was most
fascinated when we were trainingand learning about this they
(23:21):
just felt really good to doingyeah, so what wisdom do our
helping spirits have to shareregarding earthbound spirits
free?
my helping spirit said since thetime humans came into existence
on this earth, there have beeninstances of spirits getting
stuck between planes for variousreasons.
In your early existence therewere less of you, and you had
those within your communitiesthat were in harmony with spirit
(23:43):
and the rhythm of mother nature, who are able to help care for
and shepherd those lost in thisguided spirits back home to all
that is in the arms of theirancestors.
This helped maintain a healthybalance between the embodied and
disembodied spirits.
As humanity has evolved andgrown, you've lost many of the
old ways and the wisdom keeperswho held the knowledge of how to
(24:04):
guide those lost and stuckspirits home.
Our great mother earth has seena great number of wars, plagues
and natural disasters,increasing the number of those
that get caught between theworlds for one reason or another
.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
We are all one.
Speaker 1 (24:17):
We are all connected.
Those stuck in fear andsuffering between planes can
have an impact on thoseinhabiting the earth now and
many unexpected and challengingways it can feed into the
collective suffering that istaking place in the world today.
Those who carry forward thework as a shepherd of souls help
to keep the balance between theembodied and disembodied.
It is not work for the fainthearted.
(24:37):
It takes knowledge of the work,compassion and a deep
understanding of the sufferingthose disembodied spirits may be
experiencing to truly be ableto step into the role.
One must remember that justbecause the spirit is no longer
embodied and is stuck does notmean they are wise or well.
They are often as they were inlife and have not had the chance
(24:58):
to evolve and learn from theirlife lesson when they have been
stuck between planes.
It is only when the soulreturns home that is able to
grow and evolve from theexperiences gained in a body to
life.
Speaker 2 (25:11):
You know, I it's interesting how our helping
spirits have very similarmessages, even though we did
this piece separately.
Thank you, brie.
So my helping spirits said inthe millions of years of the
existence of your planet, yourhuman can has been bored and has
died.
Most pass on in theirancestralized homelands, but
others do not find their way,whether this is from ties to the
(25:35):
earthly realm or not realizingthe spirit has separated from
the body, or simply havingresistance to being deserving of
the experience of oneness.
The spirits that have not foundtheir way are adding to the
collective suffering that humansfeel in their world.
For those were drawn to helpspirits crossover, it is vital
to come to this work with acompassionate heart, with
learned skills that canpowerfully communicate with
(25:58):
those who are disembodied sothat they can find the piece
that they deserve.
The veil is thin at this timeand the suffering of those who
are embodied are reflective ofthe suffering of the disembodied
.
So I'm just understanding thatone cannot question how
interconnected we all are.
Speaker 1 (26:13):
It is so interesting how they kind of echo each other
, because I remember when Ifirst sat down to do this
journey, my spirits were like no, not right now, like when I did
it again, they actually gave mea novel.
Speaker 2 (26:25):
I was like okay, I'm not a lot.
Speaker 1 (26:27):
Normally they're pretty short and sweet, to the
point.
Speaker 2 (26:32):
Isn't that interesting, because I even have
students, something like theyjourneyed, and I couldn't, I
didn't get much.
I'm like well, journey again onit.
I'm kind of giving you a blanklook like, yeah, I get it.
You got to go back to me too.
Speaker 1 (26:45):
And you can find us at wwwshamansefterdarkcom.
We hope you'll drop us a line.
We don't have a journey promptfor today because middle world
work can be for someone a littlemore advanced and really
comfortable in their skills.
Speaker 2 (26:57):
So but you can find free on treehearthealingcom and
myself on threegrowshealingcomwith a numeral three.
There's also links to ourpersonal pages on
shamansefterdarkcom.
Speaker 1 (27:08):
So until next time, everyone, keep on shining your
light.
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