December 30, 2025 • 50 mins
A room full of uniforms. A visitation line where strangers know stories you’ve never heard. Dakota takes us into the disorienting days after her dad's suicide ,a state trooper, and the long, uneven path that followed.
We walk through the crowded rituals of grief and the quiet that follows. Dakota shares how plans to fight wildfires collapsed under the weight of mental health, and how she found new footing through the discipline of taxidermy, the challenge of falconry, and the living history of World War II reenacting. Along the way, horses become a steady mirror: they test confidence, reward clarity, and invite presence without pretense.
This conversation also reaches every first responder, veteran, and parent wrestling with the lie that distance protects your family. We talk openly about isolation, shame, and the ripple effects on children who still want your time, even when life is messy. Faith runs through the episode as a quiet strength, not a shortcut; an invitation to move from monologue to dialogue, to ask for help, and to model vulnerability that breaks generational patterns.
If you’ve ever wondered how to show up when you feel unworthy or how to heal when you’re angry at the past, this story offers both empathy and a way forward. Listen, share with someone who needs hope, and if this hits home, subscribe and leave a review so others can find it. Your presence matters more than your perfection.
If you or someone you know is in crisis and at risk of self-harm, please call or text 988, the suicide and crisis lifeline.
To contact us directly send an email to Dan@10-42project.org or call 515-350-6274
Visit our website! 10-42project.org
Check us out on social media!
Youtube: @1042project
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:00):
Let's pray real quick.
Heavenly Father, we just thankyou for this time.
God, we just put our minds,Father, in at ease.
God, we just set in yourpresence.
(00:21):
Calm nerves.
Father God, just give us thewords to say.
You know, the people that arelistening, the people that are
hurting, the people that need tohear the words that are being
said.
Father, give us the words thatthey need to hear to find out
about your love and to be drawncloser to you.
God, please allow this time tobe a healing time.
(00:44):
God, allow your name to be thehealing name over all of this
and the guidance over all ofthis.
God, we do this for you and inyour name.
Amen.
Welcome back to another episodeof the Shared Voices Podcast.
(01:08):
This is Daniel, and I've got auh special guest today.
My wife Christina is back withus today.
Hello.
SPEAKER_02 (01:14):
Hello, it's so good to be back.
SPEAKER_00 (01:16):
It's good to hear your voice.
Back on the podcast.
We used to hear before you'vebeen pretty busy with work and
it's been a minute.
Is it nice to be back?
SPEAKER_02 (01:25):
It is.
I've missed this so much.
So thank you for having metoday.
SPEAKER_00 (01:29):
Well, yeah, you're kind of a big part of the
organization.
And we're back out the horseranch today.
What do you think?
Pretty cool place.
A little muddy today.
We're gonna um record and thenwe're gonna do some um equine
assisted training after this.
Right now we're all looking outthe window at these beautiful
horses coming in.
(01:49):
But we're excited to be back.
Um if you've listened to ourepisodes in the past, we had a
couple episodes with LindyBrown.
Um, and she talked about um herlife experience and with her her
first husband who committedsuicide, who was a state
trooper, and we walked throughthat and the toughness of it, as
(02:10):
y'all could imagine.
Um, and she was so gracious tojust share her heart and to be
able to she wants to use hervoice to help bring the healing
name of Jesus to people and tobring healing and to let people
know that you you're not alone,you don't have to walk alone.
Um and those just her twoepisodes were amazing.
We thank her for that.
And today we have a specialtreat.
(02:31):
Um, we have her daughter Dakota,and Dakota, thank you for being
here.
SPEAKER_03 (02:36):
I'm glad to be here.
SPEAKER_00 (02:38):
And this is gonna be a unique perspective.
Um, as you can probably hear myvoice, I feel like I'm a little
bit on eggshells.
Um sometimes when I interviewpeople, it can be I'm always
afraid I'm gonna say stupidthings, and if you know me, you
understand why I would worryabout that.
As my wife is laughing.
SPEAKER_02 (02:54):
We still love you.
SPEAKER_00 (02:55):
Yeah.
But Dakota, thank you so muchfor being here.
Yeah, of course.
I've gotten to know you, and Ijust I love everything about
you.
Your smile, like your joy.
Um you just I'm trying to sayshe's a great person.
Yeah, you just bring joy likewhere you go.
I hope you know that.
And I see it in your mom too.
(03:16):
Like, yeah.
I see the Holy Spirit.
This is fantastic.
So thanks for being here.
And you went through um, youwent through some rough times
here over the last five years orso.
Yeah.
Um if you don't mind, I would itwe can just kind of jump right
into that.
You lost your dad to suicide.
Yeah, and you were a young girl,and you wanna I had just turned
(03:38):
18.
Just turned 18.
SPEAKER_03 (03:40):
So um I'm a September baby, and he committed
suicide in March of 2021.
So I had just turned 18, and Ihad just uh I was just getting
to the end of my second semesterof college, actually.
And so I wasn't at home at thetime.
I was not living at home at thetime.
(04:02):
Uh two weeks prior, I had thatwas the last time that I spoke
to him.
Um I had had a headlight out onmy truck for like a month and a
half, something like that.
It was a ridiculous long time,and I was he said that he would
take care of it, and I waswaiting for him to say that he'd
(04:23):
gotten the parts so that I couldcome up and he could fix it.
And I didn't hear from him, andI didn't hear from him, and I
didn't hear from him, so I wentover to my uncle's, and he's a
mechanic, so he justjerry-rigged it for me and
patched it up, and I was like,okay, well, I'm in the area, so
I might as well go stop at myparents and maybe spend the
night there.
(04:43):
And I got there and I came in,and I was also proud of myself
because it was the first timethat I'd taken the initiative to
pair some patch something up onmy truck, and I was like, Ryan
took care of it, you know, it'llhold me over until you get the
parts in, and he lost it.
He was so upset.
(05:03):
Um, because apparently he'd hadthe parts for a while and just
didn't get around to telling me.
And so I listened to him yellfor a little bit, and then I was
like, okay, I'm going back tograndma and grandpa's I'm not
dealing with this.
Yeah.
So um that was the last timethat I talked to him.
SPEAKER_00 (05:23):
And that was how many days before you got the
news?
SPEAKER_03 (05:26):
About two weeks.
SPEAKER_00 (05:27):
Two weeks.
SPEAKER_03 (05:28):
Yep.
SPEAKER_00 (05:29):
So So you were in college then when this occurred?
SPEAKER_03 (05:33):
Yep.
The night of, I remember veryvividly because I was actually
um having issues online.
Um, I was in like a big groupchat and there had been a fight,
and I was very anxious about it.
So I stayed up until like 1.30or so, and I finally fell
(05:57):
asleep.
And then and then my mom wasthere.
And I just woke up very slowly,and I was like, Oh, we're uh
what are you doing here?
And yeah, it didn't feel real,it felt like a dream.
Yeah, and she was like, Youshould come out to the kitchen,
(06:17):
and I walked out, and my grandmaand grandpa were at the counter
and they were crying, and therewere cops there, and I was like,
Okay, what's going on?
You know, something's happened,and I don't remember being told.
I remember standing around for awhile and just not feeling like
(06:38):
it was real, and then we gotinto one of the squad cars, and
we drove to my aunt's house andI fell asleep.
SPEAKER_00 (06:50):
Yeah, so you drove in this squad car over there?
SPEAKER_03 (06:53):
Yeah, it was a nice squad car.
It was one of the undercoverchargers.
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (06:56):
In the front seat, I hope.
I hope they were taken care of.
Yes, I was in the front seat.
SPEAKER_03 (07:01):
It was very cushy.
But yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (07:06):
So did you know when mom showed up?
Did you was did you kind of knowsomething right away?
SPEAKER_03 (07:11):
Not right away.
It was it was very foggy.
Yeah.
And I was like, uh, dream?
Is this a dream?
This has to be a dream becauseyou're not at grandma and
grandpa's house.
But yeah, no, it had a it thememory has a very dreamlike
quality to it.
It's very fuzzy.
(07:31):
Um doesn't quite feel real.
But then the next morning I gota call from the job that I had
applied to, and they were like,You've been accepted.
When can you start?
And I was like, Oh, no.
Uh I have had a familyemergency, and I I don't know
(07:52):
when I can start.
And she's like, Oh no, I totallyget it.
It's totally fine.
Uh, we'll call you back here ina couple days and see where
you're at.
Cool.
Okay, hung up, got right on thephone with my therapist because
I also had a therapyappointment.
And I was like, boy, how many amI glad that I have an
appointment with you today?
(08:14):
And uh explained to her whathappened, and she was like, Oh,
well, I'm not qualified forthis.
I am a college counselor, not alicensed therapist.
So I I can't really help youwith this, but I can recommend
that you get a therapist, andI'm like, Yeah, yeah, that's
(08:36):
probably a good idea.
So, yeah, and then it was it'skind of a blur from there.
I don't really remember a wholelot between then and the
visitation that we had, whichwas just the visitation was a
(08:57):
lot because there were just tonsand tons and tons of people.
It was probably four hours, fourhours of just dad's friends just
coming in and coming in andcoming in and coming in, and
family friends and family, andjust a blur and tons of stories
(09:19):
that I had never heard abouthim, and uh comments about how
he was so helpful to them allthe time, and he was always over
there helping them, and it waslike, wait a minute, he was
never at our place, and then hisbest friend's family came in,
and all the kids are crying likeit was their dad who died, and I
(09:42):
was like, We haven't seen you ina year and a half.
Well, it turns out he was overthere every single week having
dinner with them and helpingthem with stuff, and uh they
were more upset about this thanwe were, it was bizarre, it was
(10:03):
so bizarre, and uh and the uhthe funeral home couldn't get
the CD that we set up to work,so it was just one song on loop
for the entire four hours.
SPEAKER_00 (10:17):
Oh no, yeah, was it a good song?
SPEAKER_03 (10:21):
Yes, it was um yes, it was Pay No Rent by Turnpike
Troubadours over and over andover and over and over and over
for four hours straight.
Wow, it was wonderful, yeah, itwas terrible.
(10:41):
And uh yeah, I don't evenremember all the people that
came through.
A lot of them I didn't evenknow.
I didn't know their names, theyhadn't seen me since I was
little, and tons of people.
And yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (10:57):
Could you have done without all of that?
Um did you appreciate some ofit?
SPEAKER_03 (11:02):
I appreciated some of it.
One story that I remember veryvividly was the story of him at
the governor's ten, becauseapparently he had been invited
to shoot at the governor's ten,which is a shooting competition,
and he showed up late and hungover because he'd gone drinking
(11:22):
the night before, and he forgothis gun, and he borrowed
somebody's gun and won thecompetition.
Wow, you can shoot.
Yeah, I don't remember whorecounted the story to me.
I don't think that I knew them,but they were buddies of his
from when he was in themilitary, and they seemed like
(11:44):
they was a fond memory, so yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (11:48):
Was there any anything that stuck out to you
at that time as being um I guessfeeling particularly like
supportive, you know?
Is there anything that someonedid or said that did help you
during that time?
SPEAKER_03 (12:03):
I was very disconnected from it.
SPEAKER_02 (12:05):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (12:06):
I was distantly happy that so many people had
showed up.
Yeah.
And I was very happy that theywere taking care of mom.
Yeah.
But I was disconnected from it.
I didn't want anything to dowith it.
Yeah.
Um, especially since I didn'tknow most of them.
(12:26):
I was like, who are you?
Why are you here?
Right.
This is supposed to be family.
SPEAKER_00 (12:32):
But did mom feel like that too?
Like when because I'm justcurious, when that's going on,
is that are we helping thepeople or are we hurting the
people when we're showing up inmassive waves like that?
Because you all are trying togrieve as well.
You know what I mean?
We all try to show up and beloving, but at the same time,
you guys are stuck for fourhours trying to smile with
people you probably don't evenremember or know.
SPEAKER_01 (12:53):
Hey everybody, this is Lindy.
SPEAKER_00 (12:54):
Hi, Lindy.
SPEAKER_01 (12:55):
Hi.
So uh for me, it was it's a lot.
I mean, it's a lot, but it'sgood.
Like having people around isgood and and feeling that
support is really good.
Um looking back, I think I don'tknow if I mentioned this during
my interview, but um lookingback, I would have waited, I
(13:17):
would have waited longer to umthen have the visitation and the
celebration because there was itwas just such a shock uh factor.
And I was um in just uh planningand moving forward mode.
Um so yeah, to answer yourquestion, it's it's so good to
have people around.
But again, it was a blur thewhole night was Yeah, I can only
(13:41):
imagine it's a lot to deal with.
SPEAKER_00 (13:43):
Yeah, and then again, uh to me, I you have to
kind of put on these fakesmiles, and sometimes it can be
hard.
So I just wanted to ask, like,is that helpful or hurtful?
So thank you for answering that.
What were you saying?
SPEAKER_02 (13:53):
Well, and I'm just curious from you know, your
perspective, the the child'sperspective, where maybe you
weren't involved in as much ofthe planning and stuff, what
that I guess period of time waslike for you.
Because like I hear about youknow, people busy with the
planning, but like you don'thave that distraction.
SPEAKER_03 (14:13):
Yeah, I wasn't I don't have a good memory of it.
Yeah, I don't remember how longit was between when he died and
when we had the visitation, andthe time between when we had the
visitation and when we had thefuneral.
I don't know how long that was.
Yeah.
Even now, I don't know how longthat was.
So um there's no memories that Ican remember between then and
(14:37):
now, except for when mom told methe story um of what happened,
which is what she recounted onher last episode.
Um, and finding out that she hadcremated the body three days
prior.
And yeah.
So I do remember trying to pickan outfit for the visitation and
(15:04):
being like, this is so stupid.
This is so stupid, this is soweird.
Who cares what clothes I'mwearing?
SPEAKER_00 (15:14):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (15:16):
I did like the outfit that I picked out for it
though.
SPEAKER_00 (15:19):
Good.
SPEAKER_03 (15:20):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (15:20):
Well, I know when I was dealing with my addictions
and guilt and shame, and I wasvery suicidal, and I was pushing
my family away.
I did a lot, honestly, I did alot of the stuff that your dad
did.
Um because when I was around myfamily, I just felt like all I
would do was cause them pain.
So sometimes it felt easier togo hang out with somebody else's
family where I can put on myfake face and feel wanted and
(15:41):
needed, and you're funny, andyou're like that, and then go
back to my own family where Ididn't didn't know how to like
open up.
And I and I know that my kidswent through this a little bit,
and I I can hear it in in yourvoice is there's some anger
around why didn't dad spend thattime with me?
He spent all that time withother people like I did.
I was out fishing with otherpeople, doing going to the bars
(16:02):
doing these things, like thatwas stolen time.
SPEAKER_03 (16:06):
Um only a little bit of anger.
SPEAKER_00 (16:08):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (16:08):
Well and I'll touch on it more when we get to the
funeral part of this, but likethe visitation was like the
start of me realizing that oh,he wasn't just not here, he was
actively spending time withother people when we could have
used him on the farm, or I couldhave been well, hell, he could
(16:28):
have taken me with him.
A lot of these trips were liketo help go mow hay for people
and and bale their hay and stackfirewood and and stuff like
that.
And it's just like we used to dothings like that all the time.
And he used to take me huntingall the time.
(16:56):
And it's just and then to findout that he was doing it with
his best friend's kids instead.
It was just it was so upsetting.
SPEAKER_00 (17:12):
That's your daddy, he wanted his time.
SPEAKER_02 (17:15):
Thank you for sharing that.
Yeah.
And so from what I'm hearingfrom you, that I think really
resonates is that the truth ofthe matter is, even if he didn't
see it that way, the child stillwants that time with their
parent.
Like other hard stuff may begoing on.
Maybe to your point, Daniel, youknow, you felt like, how do I do
(17:38):
this?
How do I interact with myfamily?
You know, I've done thesethings, but the kid still wants
that time.
Like through the hard stuff, Iwant the time.
SPEAKER_04 (17:47):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (17:48):
Well, we didn't realize what was happening.
SPEAKER_02 (17:51):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (17:52):
Um, I do remember like a vague change in his
behavior.
It would have been looking back,it would have been after he came
back from his uh firstdeployment.
Um, which is consistent withwhat mom said, but I just I
(18:12):
remember like being daddy's girlall the time.
And he would play wrestle withme and take me hunting and do
all this stuff, and we would goto people's farms and and I was
his helper while we were runningerrands and stuff, and then it
stopped.
And he wasn't as affectionate,and I didn't understand why.
SPEAKER_04 (18:37):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (18:38):
And how would you, you know?
I was six.
Yeah, I wouldn't have known.
Yeah.
Um and even as I got older and Icould do those things.
We we would have good days.
I would go deer hunting withhim.
(19:00):
I would go we did a couple oftri small trail rides together.
Um but it just it wasn't thesame thing.
Yeah, he was gone all the time.
SPEAKER_02 (19:13):
So and so that that was the stuff that kind of
contributed to where you guyswere at in your relationship at
that point in time.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And you said so you were atyou'd gone to the you guys had
had the services.
SPEAKER_03 (19:33):
We'd had the visitation.
SPEAKER_02 (19:35):
Okay.
SPEAKER_03 (19:35):
And then sometime later was the funeral, and just
tons of people showed up.
Majority cops from like countyand state patrol, just tons of
them everywhere.
It was bizarre.
Yeah.
It was really bizarre.
And uh I mean, I don't want tosay anything bad about the
(20:02):
funeral home, but the guy thatthey gave us was kind of weird.
He uh he pretended to know dad,and he like took bits and pieces
of what we told him andextrapolated on it.
So like he said dad's favoritesong was Take Me Home Country
Roads and tried to sing it.
(20:24):
OD Yeah.
He got out a guitar andeverything.
SPEAKER_00 (20:29):
It was Are You Serious?
SPEAKER_03 (20:31):
It was so unserious.
It was hilarious.
SPEAKER_00 (20:33):
It sounds like a sitcom.
SPEAKER_03 (20:34):
It was it was he messed up the lyrics and
everything.
It was so bad.
SPEAKER_00 (20:42):
What was what is his favorite song?
Um not that one.
SPEAKER_03 (20:46):
No, not that one.
SPEAKER_00 (20:47):
The one that played on repeat at the visitation?
SPEAKER_03 (20:49):
One of them was that one, yeah.
He had like a a top 20 or sothat he would play all the time.
And yeah, so I don't know whathis favorite song was, but I
know that he had several.
SPEAKER_04 (21:04):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (21:05):
Take me home country was not it.
SPEAKER_01 (21:07):
Lily wants to jump in here.
But the funny thing is, is Iknow that like looking back now,
he would have been laughingabout that.
Yeah.
Because that was his sense ofhumor too.
Like, yeah, you're you don'tknow me.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (21:22):
So that kind of took me out of the sadness and
seriousness of it all.
I was like, who is this guy?
SPEAKER_00 (21:29):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (21:30):
Why is he saying these things?
This is so bizarre.
SPEAKER_00 (21:33):
And this is nowhere near what you went through, but
at my grandma's funeral, all ofa sudden we're sitting there and
they played a Kermit the Frogsong.
Like everybody's grieving all ofa sudden this Kermit the Frog
song came on.
And I mean, it went from toeverybody looking around and
laughing and like, what is this?
And then somebody said, Yourgrandma liked this song.
SPEAKER_05 (21:54):
Like from the mupple?
Kermit the Frog! Oh my gosh.
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (21:59):
It was it was like the bizarre, like, what just
happened?
Yeah.
It was yeah, so let's not dothose of two girls.
SPEAKER_03 (22:08):
I mean, the levity can be helpful.
I know it was helpful for mebecause I was like, I was like,
who are these people?
Why are they here?
Why are they all upset?
Yeah, dad did not know this manypeople.
Yeah.
Which he probably did.
He just never told us aboutthem.
SPEAKER_05 (22:24):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (22:25):
And yeah, all of them had stories about him.
Every single one of them waslike, oh yeah, we would sit on
the overpass and and and talkand kill time while we were on
shift together.
And oh, I saw him responding tothis accident this one time, and
he was great, and he did thisand that.
And it was like, okay.
(22:47):
He only told us the traumatizingstories.
So uh I don't know who you are,sorry.
Um oh yeah, he came over afterwork and and chopped wood with
me for hours and hours andhelped me stack all this wood,
and it was great, and we reallyappreciated him, and he was so
helpful to everybody, and it waslike, where was my dad?
SPEAKER_00 (23:07):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (23:12):
It was totally that way.
It was like, who was thisperson?
Because he never treated us likethat.
SPEAKER_05 (23:22):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (23:34):
So after the funeral, and kind of all that
busy season slows down, right?
Because that happens, you haveall these people coming and
going.
I know for me it was alwaysharder when like everybody left,
and then you now had to dealwith it.
Was going from that busyness tothat quietness of reality, was
that that had to be quite thejourney.
SPEAKER_03 (23:56):
Reality didn't hit.
SPEAKER_00 (23:57):
Okay.
SPEAKER_03 (23:58):
I was in denial for at least a month after that
because nobody else was around,and all of a sudden it was just
oh, yep, he's in his usualroutine of never coming home.
He's at work, he's helping otherpeople, he's not here.
SPEAKER_05 (24:12):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (24:13):
And yeah.
And I was working at the timetoo.
I'd taken that job, and so I waslike, I can start in two weeks,
and that was not good.
Don't do that.
Um I took a job and I was goneall the time because I was
working, and that was terrible.
(24:35):
Um, I don't remember a whole lotof this because my brain is
totally fried, but um it sucked.
SPEAKER_04 (24:43):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (24:44):
Even though it was a job that I really wanted to be
in, um, because I was going tocollege for parks and natural
resources.
And so I was at Benton CountyConservation, and I was, you
know, helping them with theiranimals in the nature center,
and I was interacting with thepublic, and I was doing all this
stuff that I really wanted todo.
And it was not there.
(25:06):
I wasn't there.
SPEAKER_05 (25:07):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (25:09):
So they decided that I wasn't motivated enough, and
they fired me like two monthsin.
SPEAKER_00 (25:17):
Well, I hope if that's what you want to do, you
get your foot back in theresomewhere else and I have
decided against it.
SPEAKER_03 (25:22):
I'm on a different track now.
But it'd be nice.
SPEAKER_05 (25:25):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (25:27):
So looking back on that, do you feel like you
needed more time?
Yeah.
Teach us?
SPEAKER_03 (25:31):
Absolutely.
Yeah.
It uh I'm still not exactly ontrack with anything.
It totally threw everything off.
Before he died, I was two weeksout from being certified as a
wildland firefighter.
And I was gonna go out toColorado and uh Nevada and Utah
(25:54):
and fight fires.
SPEAKER_00 (25:56):
You were brave.
SPEAKER_03 (25:58):
It looked like so much fun.
SPEAKER_00 (25:59):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (26:00):
And the instructor that I had for my wildland
firefighting class was so nice,he was so sweet.
He um he's so encouraging to mebecause I had a ton of anxiety,
and I was like, I can't doanything.
And he's like, You can do this,you got it.
Yeah, and uh I feel so bad thatI let him down.
(26:21):
But everything got thrown offthe track.
Absolutely everything that I hadgoing was just out.
SPEAKER_00 (26:27):
As for anybody, I I mean, you're when your world's
crushing down, it's hard to beable to focus on something
positive and feed a bunch oflife and passion into it when at
that point you're like, I don'teven know if I'm gonna be here,
let alone do somethingpassionate.
SPEAKER_03 (26:39):
Well, at the time I was determined to just keep
moving forward.
I was like, this isn't that bigof a deal.
He wasn't that big in my lifeanyway.
I was planning to leave as soonas possible anyway, so this is
fine.
And it was not actually fine,and I found that out very
quickly.
Yeah.
Uh my mental health was like,actually, you're done.
(27:02):
You've been running too hard fortoo long.
Yeah.
And uh yeah, everything hit meall at once.
It was a wonderful train wreck.
SPEAKER_00 (27:11):
Yeah.
So thank you for sharing this.
I know it can be easy.
And if you don't mind, from fromthat point to to like the time
that you and I met, um, what'sthat roller coaster been like
from you know the month or twobefore everything set in, or
afterwards everything kind ofset in and the reality came?
Like the four years or so afterthat, what's been what's
(27:35):
Dakota's life been like?
Because I know it's a rollercoaster for everybody when
you're dealing with this.
SPEAKER_03 (27:39):
Like it's been a lot of anger.
Okay.
It's been a lot of anger.
It's just so it hit me veryshortly after that he'd made us
into a statistic.
And I was like, oh, cool, we'repart of that statistic.
I love that.
My mom's now a widow, thanks forthat.
(28:01):
I'm now without a dad, thanksfor that.
And just like every new thingthat came across my table, like,
oh, that's another thing thatyou did to us.
Thank you for that.
And uh couldn't look anywhere inthe house without seeing
(28:22):
something, all the way down tomy hat, which I'm wearing today,
is it was his hat on deployment.
And all of the guns that he gaveme for deer hunting, and then
when I was working at the gunshop, uh they were all his
(28:42):
first.
And it's just like, wow, thanksfor that.
I can't get away from you evennow.
Which I've made my peace withthat now, and I'm fine with that
now.
I like having parts of himaround.
But then it pissed me off sobad.
I was so angry about it, and Ijust wanted something that was
(29:06):
mine that wasn't his first.
SPEAKER_05 (29:08):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (29:10):
But yeah.
Since then, I've tried multipletimes to get my life back on
track, and it's it's been aseries of coincidences that I
haven't been able to, but Imean, I've gotten into all sorts
of other stuff since then.
(29:31):
Um, I've tried taxidermy, andI've I started to get into
hawking, and I got intoreenacting, and I am looking
into gunsmithing.
Yes.
SPEAKER_00 (29:45):
What's hawking?
SPEAKER_03 (29:47):
Uh hunting with hawks.
Oh, legit, like hawking.
SPEAKER_00 (29:50):
Okay, I wonder if that's what you were talking
about.
That is cool.
That is really cool.
SPEAKER_03 (29:53):
Yeah, it's very difficult to get into though.
SPEAKER_00 (29:56):
Dang.
SPEAKER_03 (29:56):
Wow.
SPEAKER_00 (29:57):
That's really neat.
Yep.
So if what if you could havelike if money wasn't an issue
the rest of your life, like whatwould you do with your life?
Would it be the firefightingstuff?
SPEAKER_03 (30:04):
Would it be the um I mean firefighting seems fun, but
I don't think I would go back toit now.
SPEAKER_00 (30:13):
Okay.
SPEAKER_03 (30:13):
Um, I would probably do taxidermy.
Okay.
If it wasn't, if money wasn't anissue and I could just start my
studio right now, I'd dotaxidermy.
I love it.
It's so much fun.
SPEAKER_00 (30:26):
Have you been through the like the classes and
training and to be able to dothat?
SPEAKER_03 (30:31):
Uh I shadowed a couple of taxidermists.
Um I got like four months ofinstruction from one of them.
Three months into not even threeweeks into shadowing under him.
I elected to go to the statetaxidermy competition.
(30:51):
So I yeah, I mounted a doe.
It was the second deer that I'dmounted, and I took it to the
state cat taxidermy competition.
So I was very ambitious aboutit.
SPEAKER_00 (31:02):
That is so cool.
SPEAKER_03 (31:03):
That's amazing.
SPEAKER_00 (31:04):
But uh so to start a business like that, you just
kind of need all the equipmentand then it's a very high
initial overhead cost.
Hey, anybody that's listeningthat's uh that has anything to
do with taxidermy.
I know a bunch of you out there,because I know friends of mine.
Um let's just try to cometogether and get some equipment
for her.
Let's get you guys what I'mtalking about.
Yeah.
Like let's reach out, let's getsome let's get a hold of me.
(31:27):
Let me know what reps you guysuse.
I'll call them.
And let's try to make thishappen for her.
Um that's something that shouldbe pretty easy to get done.
So let's get that, let's getthat done.
And then if you guys are outthere that are taxidermis, um
with the schools you went to,get a hold of me and let me know
the training, the education,what that looks like, and who it
was.
And um, let's see if we canlet's see if we can make this
(31:50):
happen.
Um so let's get on that inJesus' name.
SPEAKER_02 (31:54):
Also, though, I want to say you have done so many
cool things.
Like, like I earlier you usedthe phrase like that you like
haven't got your life together,but let me just say, as a boring
person who has like a reallyboring, you know, like regular
life.
I guess no, you're yeah, you'rethe life of the party for sure
at our house, for sure.
SPEAKER_00 (32:15):
Yeah, that's the word.
SPEAKER_02 (32:16):
That's what we're gonna say.
But you've done so many coolthings, like so many fun things.
Wow, and I love that.
Like, I admire that adventurousheart, yes, yes.
Like you are like, I don't know,just a cool, fun person.
Like the things that you do islike that's amazing.
I I I mean, clearly, couldn't,wouldn't, I don't know.
(32:39):
Like, step out and do like afun, cool thing.
And I love that you do that.
Like, that's amazing to me.
That is a sign of like you livelife, and I love that.
SPEAKER_03 (32:50):
Yeah, it's me looking for a place because I
have tried to work a regular joband it was very hard on my
mental health.
So I was like, okay, I needsomewhere where I've got varied
work, but I have a routine andI'm being held accountable, but
also I'm my own boss, and it'slike the older trades and the
(33:15):
more lost arts, for lack of abetter word, seem to fit me a
lot better.
So I was like, oh well, I couldbecome a tax dermist.
And so I was like, okay, whattaxidermists are around here
that I could go pick theirbrains about it?
And uh I ended up with one, andthen he was like, I don't have
(33:36):
the time to teach you, so youknow, here's the school that I
went to, you should go look intothat.
And I was like, okay, cool.
But I felt really bad about itbecause it felt like rejection,
and I was like, oh, you know, hedidn't want to be around me
either.
And uh, so then it kind of satfor a bit, and then I got hooked
up with another taxidermist, andhe had more or less retired, and
(33:58):
he had a shop that I could justuse.
And he was like, Yep, you canhave all my old clients and you
can do this and that.
And I was like, wait a minute,you've already taken the money
for all of those clients.
So if I do those, I'm not gonnaget paid.
Um I was like, hey, I have aproblem with this, and he's
like, Oh, well, you weren'tmotivated, so I got you, I got a
(34:19):
different student.
SPEAKER_00 (34:20):
Whoa, wow, yeah, we'll find you let's find her a
different mentor.
Like hey, Rocky Schoolville.
If you're out there listening,or if you guys know Rocky, tell
Rocky to get a hold of me.
I'll call him too.
He's like one of the besttaxidermists around Rocky
Schoolville.
Oh, he's that dude is yeah, he'sgood.
Yeah.
So I'll find out what's cool andstuff, and let's get that
(34:41):
figured out.
SPEAKER_03 (34:42):
Oh, I made some friends at the state taxidermy
competition.
SPEAKER_00 (34:46):
Oh, cool.
SPEAKER_03 (34:47):
That was at um the casino.
Yeah.
It was hosted there, and I wassuper apprehensive walking in,
and just tons of super friendly,super sweet people who were so
excited to see me there andtotally wanted to help me.
And so a bunch of them had goneto the same school that that
(35:09):
first tax nervous had gone to,and they were like, She's
getting out of it, actually.
But if you want to, you can comeshadow us, and we'll teach you.
And I was like, that's awesome,absolutely.
And then everything happened,and I was like, Oh, okay, we'll
put this on the back burner.
And so I do intend to get backinto it eventually.
(35:30):
It's just I don't have the moneyto burn.
SPEAKER_00 (35:33):
So do you yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (35:36):
Most of the taxomists that I've met are
absolute sweethearts.
I love them.
SPEAKER_00 (35:40):
Yeah, well, you're sweet, so I'm sure when you walk
in, they're like, I mean,they're not gonna look at you
and be angry and say no.
Like, yeah, you're a sweetperson.
No.
Um, so do you do any hunting?
I don't use to with your dad.
Do you do it anymore?
SPEAKER_03 (35:52):
Yes.
I uh I deer hunt for the mostpart.
SPEAKER_00 (35:57):
Well, if you want to deer hunt this season, first
like we have some we have aperson who's donated some land
for us to hunt down in southernIowa.
I meant down by the LakeRathman.
It is amazing southern Iowa.
And if you want to come, you letme know, and I will like
literally, like we have thespot, the blinds are already out
there.
Excuse me.
We'll make it happen.
Yeah, we'll make it happen.
Yes, let's let's do that.
(36:18):
And bring mom down too.
Yeah, seriously.
When we get down to this, we'lltalk more about that because I
want to get you down.
And then I do want to ask youabout this.
Um last time when you and I werehere, we were doing some equine
assisted training stuff, and youand I spent some time kind of
riding together, and I got tohear a little bit about you.
I and correct me if I'm wrong, Ireally felt a spark in your
(36:40):
heart about your dad's your dadand when he did work with
horses.
Like that was there was when youwere talking about your dad so
deeply and lovely about how heworked with horses and he was a
natural and how he taught yousome things.
Tell me a little bit about that.
Let's talk about the joyful partof because I see the spark in
your eye with horses.
SPEAKER_03 (36:59):
Yeah.
So my dad was a city boy.
SPEAKER_00 (37:02):
Okay.
SPEAKER_03 (37:03):
And he met my mom, and she was a country girl, and
she brought him into horses.
Okay.
And so I might get some detailswrong here, but she bought him
his first horse.
Okay.
And she was just a halter brokeyearling, and I told you, green
plus green equals blue andblack.
(37:25):
But he worked through it and hehe learned how to train with
that horse.
And from there, he got anotherone and he started training for
other people.
And he from what mom said, andsome of mom's friends have said,
he just kind of took to it verynaturally.
(37:48):
And so growing up he neverseemed to have a problem with
his horses.
And I did.
SPEAKER_00 (37:58):
Um what do you mean by problem?
SPEAKER_03 (38:01):
So, like, horses will test you and horses will
test you and test you,especially if they can tell that
you're not super confident withthem.
And so when we moved and gothorses with the property, the
horse that I chose to staybehind when we got rid of the
(38:21):
rest of them, uh could tell thatI was not confident.
And he tested me all the time.
And then my dad would be like,This is not hard.
Just do this.
And he'd do the thing, and thehorse would do it perfectly.
And it's like, okay, I don'tknow how to do that.
And so, yeah, there's um there'sa lot of pressure to live up to
(38:48):
that, which I'm getting overbecause he wasn't actually that
good of a horseman.
Um, it's just my memories makehim seem like he was better than
he was.
Yeah.
Um, and I've spent time talkingto those friends of my mom's,
and they have pointed out thatvery clearly he wasn't that good
(39:09):
because the horse that he leftbehind is also not that good.
So clearly there were some gapsin the training.
SPEAKER_00 (39:16):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (39:17):
And so I'm letting go of that image and coming to
terms with the reality that Icould probably be better.
SPEAKER_00 (39:26):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (39:27):
Um, with time.
SPEAKER_00 (39:29):
You are very knowledgeable with horses.
Like when we heard last time,like you definitely have a gift
for it.
SPEAKER_03 (39:34):
Like I've done a lot of reading.
I've only had one horse that wasmy own in my lifetime.
All of the others that I'veridden have been other people's
horses.
I got started on my dad and mymom's horses, and they were
fantastic to start out on,except for they didn't listen to
(39:55):
me at all because they liked myparents.
And so it It didn't matter whatI did, as soon as my mom came
by, her horse would completelyignore me and just follow her.
SPEAKER_00 (40:07):
So do you have your own horse now?
SPEAKER_03 (40:08):
I do have my own horse.
Um he is just retired.
He just turned 30.
And uh he's the one that camewith the property.
Yeah.
And he has been a very goodteacher for me.
Um took my horsemanship forwardand lease leaves him down.
Um I'm a little emotionalbecause I've had him for 13
(40:35):
years.
Yeah.
And he's my buddy.
SPEAKER_05 (40:37):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (40:38):
And I I'm really worried that I'm gonna lose him
soon.
Not that he's in bad health oranything, he's doing great.
But he's old.
It's yeah, it's just the idea ofI'm going to lose him.
SPEAKER_00 (40:51):
Yeah.
You're losing something elsethat you loved, and that's
that's yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (40:58):
He's a very special boy.
SPEAKER_00 (40:59):
Yeah.
Question.
Why do you like tall horses?
You pick the tallest horse wehave out here.
I mean, like towering.
I look up at her, I'm like,whoa, she's like, I like tall
horses.
Dad's horse was tall, if Iremember right.
SPEAKER_03 (41:12):
Lola is 16 hands, so she's four inches shorter than
the horse out there.
Um there's two reasons.
First, I like to be able to seestuff.
SPEAKER_00 (41:23):
Okay.
SPEAKER_03 (41:23):
It's nice to be that tall because you can see things.
Um, and then uh I do World WarII reenacting.
And German cavalry horses werewarm bloods, and very, very few
of them were under 16 hands.
SPEAKER_00 (41:38):
Oh wow.
So didn't know that.
SPEAKER_03 (41:40):
I need a big horse.
SPEAKER_00 (41:41):
I like that.
And that well, that horse wasattached to you right away.
SPEAKER_03 (41:44):
Oh, he picked me.
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (41:46):
Like he was like I'm gonna lose my toenail over it.
SPEAKER_03 (41:48):
You need you need me today.
SPEAKER_00 (41:51):
Yeah, it is a wonderful horse that stepped on
my toe, but that wasn't thehorse's fault, though, because I
got in the way of a horse tryingto step on my toe.
Like, or I got in front of ahorse who was trying to step.
SPEAKER_03 (42:01):
Something like that.
SPEAKER_00 (42:02):
Yeah, yeah.
Well, thank you so much forbeing here.
I you're a blessing.
I I'm proud of you.
Thank you for coming on here.
And I've said this to you lasttime, and this is very
emotional, probably the mostemotional recording I've done
because I almost left my kidsthe way you got left.
(42:24):
And my kids would have had a lotof hurt and pain and been like,
dad was somewhere else, dad wasdoing that.
And so when I hear it, I hear, Ifeel the other side of it.
SPEAKER_03 (42:32):
And you see what could have been.
SPEAKER_00 (42:34):
Yeah.
And it wasn't that because I didspend a lot of time with my
kids, but not as much as Ineeded, and I and I loved them,
but I never felt I didn't feelthat I was safe around them.
So I thought I was protectingthem by not being home, by just
being there when I needed to be,get in, get out.
Like I felt like that was thebetter way of protecting.
That's why if you heard me tellmy story, I say I started to
(42:54):
shed my family because I knew Iwas gonna be the end of my life,
so I felt like if I could pushthem away, if I can make them
hate me, if I can make them, ifI can just stop communicating
with them, get them used to notme be me not being around, if I
can get then it, you know,things will be then I'll be able
to do it, and it won't be sohard on them.
That's the sick mind thoughtthat I had going through it.
And then I hear your side of it,which is what my kids would have
(43:16):
been, where what I literallythought I was doing, because
your your brain gets so twistedwhen you're dealing with trauma
and stuff, where I thought I washelping my family and me being
around, I didn't feel likeanybody wanted me around, even
though they did, right?
It's just a perceived thing thatwe feel.
Um, that I felt like to be agood dad, I needed to get away
from them and allow them to justhave a calm, safe house because
(43:38):
I know when I walk in thathouse, I cause anxiety, I cause
they walk on eggshells, theydon't know who they're gonna
get.
So for me, it was easier to getoff of work and go home, change
clothes, and be like, love youguys, and go and head out to go
be with somebody else.
And it was sick and wrong andtwisted the way I was doing it,
right?
Um, but in it it felt like loveat that time.
(44:00):
You know what I mean?
So, like that's what traumadoes, right?
That's the lies, right?
SPEAKER_02 (44:06):
Like in your in your mind, you are rationalizing the
choices that you make, whichpeople do.
Um, but that's why theseconversations are so important.
Yeah.
Because there is always anotherperson on the other side of that
decision.
Um, and that's why, you know,you talk to people a lot about
the importance of bringingmonologue to dialogue and
speaking it out uh for scenariosjust like this, you know, the
(44:31):
stuff that you were thinking andchoosing and your reasonings
behind your actions, but there'sa whole other experience that
your loved ones are having.
Um, and so that's why we're sograteful that you're here
sharing your story becausethat's the perspective that we
want to shed light to, you know,like Daniel can speak to that,
(44:53):
but also, you know, if you'reopen to it, do you want to speak
more about like what would whatwould you like to say in
response, like the truth of youknow, the what the child needs,
what the family needs, you know.
And only if you want to.
SPEAKER_03 (45:11):
I don't know how you guys want to cut this up because
I forgot a very important aspectof this.
Um, I think it was by the time Iwas 12 or 13, I was convinced
that either he was going to killus or he was gonna kill himself.
Okay.
So that's a very strange thingfor a 12 or 13 year old to come
(45:32):
to a very rock solid conclusionof.
SPEAKER_05 (45:36):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (45:36):
But it was not a surprise when he shot himself.
Okay.
I was like, oh okay.
Yeah, it finally happened.
Yeah.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (45:48):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (45:48):
And when my mom recounted the story to me and
she told me that he had askedher to go for a drive, even
though it was after the fact,and I was aware that things had
happened the way that they hadhappened, I had an immediate
irrational conviction that hehad gotten her into the car to
(46:11):
shoot her.
And I was convinced about that.
I was absolutely certain thatthat was the plan.
So nobody should get to thatpoint.
No kid should ever think that.
(46:32):
And uh I don't somebody can makeof that what they will, yeah.
But don't make your kids thinkthat.
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (46:44):
And that's why men and women are listening, first
responders, parents.
They're going through it.
You know, we get so stuck and wethink we're we're helping our
families by being away fromthem.
We're listening to the enemy'slies that they're better without
us.
Um it's it's a lie.
There is an impact that thatoccurs.
Like we have a role to fill hereas fathers, as mothers.
(47:07):
Um when we don't deal with ourmental health, when we're not
willing to go through theuncomfortableness of reaching
out and getting help forourselves, it causes a major
ripple effect throughout thefamily.
If we can just get past theuncomfortableness of just
reaching out to somebody, ifit's not our organization,
another organization, andgetting help for yourself.
If you don't feel like doing itfor yourself, then do it for
(47:28):
your family.
Because they're not betterwithout you.
unknown (47:33):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (47:34):
So please don't live in isolation, don't live in
guilt and shame.
Reach out.
If you don't know how to bearound your family because
you're afraid you're gonna hurtthem, if you don't know how to
show up for your family, if youfeel like the best ways to be
away from them in your sparetime, give me a call.
I want to talk to you aboutthat.
Because I've been there, I'vehad those thoughts, I've I've
done it.
(47:59):
God loves you too much to leaveyou there.
It matters what how we handleourselves, how we handle trauma
as as mothers and fathers.
How we handle trauma shows ourkids how to deal with trauma.
When we can be willing to bevulnerable, open, honest, and
(48:19):
transparent with our family,that it's that it's okay to not
be okay.
When we can show them how to howto how we talk out our feelings,
how to you're not just changingyou, you're changing your the
family generation.
You're teaching your childrenhow to deal with trauma and
stress.
So when they come across it,they can handle it in a healthy
(48:41):
way.
And sometimes we feel like we'rewe're helping in a healthy way.
And that's why we need others tocome along and help us see the
lies that are being told and thelies that are being said.
So please don't no guilt, noshame.
Reach out.
I'd love to talk to you aboutthis.
I'm not gonna guilt or shameyou.
I've been there.
Let's just have a conversationabout it.
(49:01):
Because it matters not just toyou, it matters to your spouse,
it matters to your kids, itmatters to your grandkids, it
matters to your family chain.
So please reach out.
Um if you're a child, if you'relistening and maybe your parent
gone through what Dakota hasgone through and you don't know
(49:23):
who to reach out to or who totalk, give us a call.
We'd love a talk with you.
And if if again, if ourorganization isn't a good fit
for you, we'll help you findsomeone who is.
We just want to get you help.
So, Dakota, before we start toclose out, is there anything
else you wanted to share?
Any closing thoughts?
SPEAKER_03 (49:41):
I think what you're doing here is very important.
SPEAKER_00 (49:44):
Thank you for being on.
SPEAKER_02 (49:46):
And what you shared is very important.
Thank you.
SPEAKER_00 (49:51):
And I think God had us all meet for a reason.
I know that for sure.
So, how about you and I go spendsome time on horses?
You want to go do that?
Sound good to me.
Giddy up.
We'll see you guys next week.
Let's pray real quick.
Heavenly Father, we just thankyou for this time.
God, we just put our minds,Father, in at ease.
God, we just set in yourpresence.
(00:21):
Calm nerves.
Father God, just give us thewords to say.
You know, the people that arelistening, the people that are
hurting, the people that need tohear the words that are being
said.
Father, give us the words thatthey need to hear to find out
about your love and to be drawncloser to you.
God, please allow this time tobe a healing time.
(00:44):
God, allow your name to be thehealing name over all of this
and the guidance over all ofthis.
God, we do this for you and inyour name.
Amen.
Welcome back to another episodeof the Shared Voices Podcast.
(01:08):
This is Daniel, and I've got auh special guest today.
My wife Christina is back withus today.
Hello.
SPEAKER_02 (01:14):
Hello, it's so good to be back.
SPEAKER_00 (01:16):
It's good to hear your voice.
Back on the podcast.
We used to hear before you'vebeen pretty busy with work and
it's been a minute.
Is it nice to be back?
SPEAKER_02 (01:25):
It is.
I've missed this so much.
So thank you for having metoday.
SPEAKER_00 (01:29):
Well, yeah, you're kind of a big part of the
organization.
And we're back out the horseranch today.
What do you think?
Pretty cool place.
A little muddy today.
We're gonna um record and thenwe're gonna do some um equine
assisted training after this.
Right now we're all looking outthe window at these beautiful
horses coming in.
(01:49):
But we're excited to be back.
Um if you've listened to ourepisodes in the past, we had a
couple episodes with LindyBrown.
Um, and she talked about um herlife experience and with her her
first husband who committedsuicide, who was a state
trooper, and we walked throughthat and the toughness of it, as
(02:10):
y'all could imagine.
Um, and she was so gracious tojust share her heart and to be
able to she wants to use hervoice to help bring the healing
name of Jesus to people and tobring healing and to let people
know that you you're not alone,you don't have to walk alone.
Um and those just her twoepisodes were amazing.
We thank her for that.
And today we have a specialtreat.
(02:31):
Um, we have her daughter Dakota,and Dakota, thank you for being
here.
SPEAKER_03 (02:36):
I'm glad to be here.
SPEAKER_00 (02:38):
And this is gonna be a unique perspective.
Um, as you can probably hear myvoice, I feel like I'm a little
bit on eggshells.
Um sometimes when I interviewpeople, it can be I'm always
afraid I'm gonna say stupidthings, and if you know me, you
understand why I would worryabout that.
As my wife is laughing.
SPEAKER_02 (02:54):
We still love you.
SPEAKER_00 (02:55):
Yeah.
But Dakota, thank you so muchfor being here.
Yeah, of course.
I've gotten to know you, and Ijust I love everything about
you.
Your smile, like your joy.
Um you just I'm trying to sayshe's a great person.
Yeah, you just bring joy likewhere you go.
I hope you know that.
And I see it in your mom too.
(03:16):
Like, yeah.
I see the Holy Spirit.
This is fantastic.
So thanks for being here.
And you went through um, youwent through some rough times
here over the last five years orso.
Yeah.
Um if you don't mind, I would itwe can just kind of jump right
into that.
You lost your dad to suicide.
Yeah, and you were a young girl,and you wanna I had just turned
(03:38):
18.
Just turned 18.
SPEAKER_03 (03:40):
So um I'm a September baby, and he committed
suicide in March of 2021.
So I had just turned 18, and Ihad just uh I was just getting
to the end of my second semesterof college, actually.
And so I wasn't at home at thetime.
I was not living at home at thetime.
(04:02):
Uh two weeks prior, I had thatwas the last time that I spoke
to him.
Um I had had a headlight out onmy truck for like a month and a
half, something like that.
It was a ridiculous long time,and I was he said that he would
take care of it, and I waswaiting for him to say that he'd
(04:23):
gotten the parts so that I couldcome up and he could fix it.
And I didn't hear from him, andI didn't hear from him, and I
didn't hear from him, so I wentover to my uncle's, and he's a
mechanic, so he justjerry-rigged it for me and
patched it up, and I was like,okay, well, I'm in the area, so
I might as well go stop at myparents and maybe spend the
night there.
(04:43):
And I got there and I came in,and I was also proud of myself
because it was the first timethat I'd taken the initiative to
pair some patch something up onmy truck, and I was like, Ryan
took care of it, you know, it'llhold me over until you get the
parts in, and he lost it.
He was so upset.
(05:03):
Um, because apparently he'd hadthe parts for a while and just
didn't get around to telling me.
And so I listened to him yellfor a little bit, and then I was
like, okay, I'm going back tograndma and grandpa's I'm not
dealing with this.
Yeah.
So um that was the last timethat I talked to him.
SPEAKER_00 (05:23):
And that was how many days before you got the
news?
SPEAKER_03 (05:26):
About two weeks.
SPEAKER_00 (05:27):
Two weeks.
SPEAKER_03 (05:28):
Yep.
SPEAKER_00 (05:29):
So So you were in college then when this occurred?
SPEAKER_03 (05:33):
Yep.
The night of, I remember veryvividly because I was actually
um having issues online.
Um, I was in like a big groupchat and there had been a fight,
and I was very anxious about it.
So I stayed up until like 1.30or so, and I finally fell
(05:57):
asleep.
And then and then my mom wasthere.
And I just woke up very slowly,and I was like, Oh, we're uh
what are you doing here?
And yeah, it didn't feel real,it felt like a dream.
Yeah, and she was like, Youshould come out to the kitchen,
(06:17):
and I walked out, and my grandmaand grandpa were at the counter
and they were crying, and therewere cops there, and I was like,
Okay, what's going on?
You know, something's happened,and I don't remember being told.
I remember standing around for awhile and just not feeling like
(06:38):
it was real, and then we gotinto one of the squad cars, and
we drove to my aunt's house andI fell asleep.
SPEAKER_00 (06:50):
Yeah, so you drove in this squad car over there?
SPEAKER_03 (06:53):
Yeah, it was a nice squad car.
It was one of the undercoverchargers.
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (06:56):
In the front seat, I hope.
I hope they were taken care of.
Yes, I was in the front seat.
SPEAKER_03 (07:01):
It was very cushy.
But yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (07:06):
So did you know when mom showed up?
Did you was did you kind of knowsomething right away?
SPEAKER_03 (07:11):
Not right away.
It was it was very foggy.
Yeah.
And I was like, uh, dream?
Is this a dream?
This has to be a dream becauseyou're not at grandma and
grandpa's house.
But yeah, no, it had a it thememory has a very dreamlike
quality to it.
It's very fuzzy.
(07:31):
Um doesn't quite feel real.
But then the next morning I gota call from the job that I had
applied to, and they were like,You've been accepted.
When can you start?
And I was like, Oh, no.
Uh I have had a familyemergency, and I I don't know
(07:52):
when I can start.
And she's like, Oh no, I totallyget it.
It's totally fine.
Uh, we'll call you back here ina couple days and see where
you're at.
Cool.
Okay, hung up, got right on thephone with my therapist because
I also had a therapyappointment.
And I was like, boy, how many amI glad that I have an
appointment with you today?
(08:14):
And uh explained to her whathappened, and she was like, Oh,
well, I'm not qualified forthis.
I am a college counselor, not alicensed therapist.
So I I can't really help youwith this, but I can recommend
that you get a therapist, andI'm like, Yeah, yeah, that's
(08:36):
probably a good idea.
So, yeah, and then it was it'skind of a blur from there.
I don't really remember a wholelot between then and the
visitation that we had, whichwas just the visitation was a
(08:57):
lot because there were just tonsand tons and tons of people.
It was probably four hours, fourhours of just dad's friends just
coming in and coming in andcoming in and coming in, and
family friends and family, andjust a blur and tons of stories
(09:19):
that I had never heard abouthim, and uh comments about how
he was so helpful to them allthe time, and he was always over
there helping them, and it waslike, wait a minute, he was
never at our place, and then hisbest friend's family came in,
and all the kids are crying likeit was their dad who died, and I
(09:42):
was like, We haven't seen you ina year and a half.
Well, it turns out he was overthere every single week having
dinner with them and helpingthem with stuff, and uh they
were more upset about this thanwe were, it was bizarre, it was
(10:03):
so bizarre, and uh and the uhthe funeral home couldn't get
the CD that we set up to work,so it was just one song on loop
for the entire four hours.
SPEAKER_00 (10:17):
Oh no, yeah, was it a good song?
SPEAKER_03 (10:21):
Yes, it was um yes, it was Pay No Rent by Turnpike
Troubadours over and over andover and over and over and over
for four hours straight.
Wow, it was wonderful, yeah, itwas terrible.
(10:41):
And uh yeah, I don't evenremember all the people that
came through.
A lot of them I didn't evenknow.
I didn't know their names, theyhadn't seen me since I was
little, and tons of people.
And yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (10:57):
Could you have done without all of that?
Um did you appreciate some ofit?
SPEAKER_03 (11:02):
I appreciated some of it.
One story that I remember veryvividly was the story of him at
the governor's ten, becauseapparently he had been invited
to shoot at the governor's ten,which is a shooting competition,
and he showed up late and hungover because he'd gone drinking
(11:22):
the night before, and he forgothis gun, and he borrowed
somebody's gun and won thecompetition.
Wow, you can shoot.
Yeah, I don't remember whorecounted the story to me.
I don't think that I knew them,but they were buddies of his
from when he was in themilitary, and they seemed like
(11:44):
they was a fond memory, so yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (11:48):
Was there any anything that stuck out to you
at that time as being um I guessfeeling particularly like
supportive, you know?
Is there anything that someonedid or said that did help you
during that time?
SPEAKER_03 (12:03):
I was very disconnected from it.
SPEAKER_02 (12:05):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (12:06):
I was distantly happy that so many people had
showed up.
Yeah.
And I was very happy that theywere taking care of mom.
Yeah.
But I was disconnected from it.
I didn't want anything to dowith it.
Yeah.
Um, especially since I didn'tknow most of them.
(12:26):
I was like, who are you?
Why are you here?
Right.
This is supposed to be family.
SPEAKER_00 (12:32):
But did mom feel like that too?
Like when because I'm justcurious, when that's going on,
is that are we helping thepeople or are we hurting the
people when we're showing up inmassive waves like that?
Because you all are trying togrieve as well.
You know what I mean?
We all try to show up and beloving, but at the same time,
you guys are stuck for fourhours trying to smile with
people you probably don't evenremember or know.
SPEAKER_01 (12:53):
Hey everybody, this is Lindy.
SPEAKER_00 (12:54):
Hi, Lindy.
SPEAKER_01 (12:55):
Hi.
So uh for me, it was it's a lot.
I mean, it's a lot, but it'sgood.
Like having people around isgood and and feeling that
support is really good.
Um looking back, I think I don'tknow if I mentioned this during
my interview, but um lookingback, I would have waited, I
(13:17):
would have waited longer to umthen have the visitation and the
celebration because there was itwas just such a shock uh factor.
And I was um in just uh planningand moving forward mode.
Um so yeah, to answer yourquestion, it's it's so good to
have people around.
But again, it was a blur thewhole night was Yeah, I can only
(13:41):
imagine it's a lot to deal with.
SPEAKER_00 (13:43):
Yeah, and then again, uh to me, I you have to
kind of put on these fakesmiles, and sometimes it can be
hard.
So I just wanted to ask, like,is that helpful or hurtful?
So thank you for answering that.
What were you saying?
SPEAKER_02 (13:53):
Well, and I'm just curious from you know, your
perspective, the the child'sperspective, where maybe you
weren't involved in as much ofthe planning and stuff, what
that I guess period of time waslike for you.
Because like I hear about youknow, people busy with the
planning, but like you don'thave that distraction.
SPEAKER_03 (14:13):
Yeah, I wasn't I don't have a good memory of it.
Yeah, I don't remember how longit was between when he died and
when we had the visitation, andthe time between when we had the
visitation and when we had thefuneral.
I don't know how long that was.
Yeah.
Even now, I don't know how longthat was.
So um there's no memories that Ican remember between then and
(14:37):
now, except for when mom told methe story um of what happened,
which is what she recounted onher last episode.
Um, and finding out that she hadcremated the body three days
prior.
And yeah.
So I do remember trying to pickan outfit for the visitation and
(15:04):
being like, this is so stupid.
This is so stupid, this is soweird.
Who cares what clothes I'mwearing?
SPEAKER_00 (15:14):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (15:16):
I did like the outfit that I picked out for it
though.
SPEAKER_00 (15:19):
Good.
SPEAKER_03 (15:20):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (15:20):
Well, I know when I was dealing with my addictions
and guilt and shame, and I wasvery suicidal, and I was pushing
my family away.
I did a lot, honestly, I did alot of the stuff that your dad
did.
Um because when I was around myfamily, I just felt like all I
would do was cause them pain.
So sometimes it felt easier togo hang out with somebody else's
family where I can put on myfake face and feel wanted and
(15:41):
needed, and you're funny, andyou're like that, and then go
back to my own family where Ididn't didn't know how to like
open up.
And I and I know that my kidswent through this a little bit,
and I I can hear it in in yourvoice is there's some anger
around why didn't dad spend thattime with me?
He spent all that time withother people like I did.
I was out fishing with otherpeople, doing going to the bars
(16:02):
doing these things, like thatwas stolen time.
SPEAKER_03 (16:06):
Um only a little bit of anger.
SPEAKER_00 (16:08):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (16:08):
Well and I'll touch on it more when we get to the
funeral part of this, but likethe visitation was like the
start of me realizing that oh,he wasn't just not here, he was
actively spending time withother people when we could have
used him on the farm, or I couldhave been well, hell, he could
(16:28):
have taken me with him.
A lot of these trips were liketo help go mow hay for people
and and bale their hay and stackfirewood and and stuff like
that.
And it's just like we used to dothings like that all the time.
And he used to take me huntingall the time.
(16:56):
And it's just and then to findout that he was doing it with
his best friend's kids instead.
It was just it was so upsetting.
SPEAKER_00 (17:12):
That's your daddy, he wanted his time.
SPEAKER_02 (17:15):
Thank you for sharing that.
Yeah.
And so from what I'm hearingfrom you, that I think really
resonates is that the truth ofthe matter is, even if he didn't
see it that way, the child stillwants that time with their
parent.
Like other hard stuff may begoing on.
Maybe to your point, Daniel, youknow, you felt like, how do I do
(17:38):
this?
How do I interact with myfamily?
You know, I've done thesethings, but the kid still wants
that time.
Like through the hard stuff, Iwant the time.
SPEAKER_04 (17:47):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (17:48):
Well, we didn't realize what was happening.
SPEAKER_02 (17:51):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (17:52):
Um, I do remember like a vague change in his
behavior.
It would have been looking back,it would have been after he came
back from his uh firstdeployment.
Um, which is consistent withwhat mom said, but I just I
(18:12):
remember like being daddy's girlall the time.
And he would play wrestle withme and take me hunting and do
all this stuff, and we would goto people's farms and and I was
his helper while we were runningerrands and stuff, and then it
stopped.
And he wasn't as affectionate,and I didn't understand why.
SPEAKER_04 (18:37):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (18:38):
And how would you, you know?
I was six.
Yeah, I wouldn't have known.
Yeah.
Um and even as I got older and Icould do those things.
We we would have good days.
I would go deer hunting withhim.
(19:00):
I would go we did a couple oftri small trail rides together.
Um but it just it wasn't thesame thing.
Yeah, he was gone all the time.
SPEAKER_02 (19:13):
So and so that that was the stuff that kind of
contributed to where you guyswere at in your relationship at
that point in time.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And you said so you were atyou'd gone to the you guys had
had the services.
SPEAKER_03 (19:33):
We'd had the visitation.
SPEAKER_02 (19:35):
Okay.
SPEAKER_03 (19:35):
And then sometime later was the funeral, and just
tons of people showed up.
Majority cops from like countyand state patrol, just tons of
them everywhere.
It was bizarre.
Yeah.
It was really bizarre.
And uh I mean, I don't want tosay anything bad about the
(20:02):
funeral home, but the guy thatthey gave us was kind of weird.
He uh he pretended to know dad,and he like took bits and pieces
of what we told him andextrapolated on it.
So like he said dad's favoritesong was Take Me Home Country
Roads and tried to sing it.
(20:24):
OD Yeah.
He got out a guitar andeverything.
SPEAKER_00 (20:29):
It was Are You Serious?
SPEAKER_03 (20:31):
It was so unserious.
It was hilarious.
SPEAKER_00 (20:33):
It sounds like a sitcom.
SPEAKER_03 (20:34):
It was it was he messed up the lyrics and
everything.
It was so bad.
SPEAKER_00 (20:42):
What was what is his favorite song?
Um not that one.
SPEAKER_03 (20:46):
No, not that one.
SPEAKER_00 (20:47):
The one that played on repeat at the visitation?
SPEAKER_03 (20:49):
One of them was that one, yeah.
He had like a a top 20 or sothat he would play all the time.
And yeah, so I don't know whathis favorite song was, but I
know that he had several.
SPEAKER_04 (21:04):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (21:05):
Take me home country was not it.
SPEAKER_01 (21:07):
Lily wants to jump in here.
But the funny thing is, is Iknow that like looking back now,
he would have been laughingabout that.
Yeah.
Because that was his sense ofhumor too.
Like, yeah, you're you don'tknow me.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (21:22):
So that kind of took me out of the sadness and
seriousness of it all.
I was like, who is this guy?
SPEAKER_00 (21:29):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (21:30):
Why is he saying these things?
This is so bizarre.
SPEAKER_00 (21:33):
And this is nowhere near what you went through, but
at my grandma's funeral, all ofa sudden we're sitting there and
they played a Kermit the Frogsong.
Like everybody's grieving all ofa sudden this Kermit the Frog
song came on.
And I mean, it went from toeverybody looking around and
laughing and like, what is this?
And then somebody said, Yourgrandma liked this song.
SPEAKER_05 (21:54):
Like from the mupple?
Kermit the Frog! Oh my gosh.
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (21:59):
It was it was like the bizarre, like, what just
happened?
Yeah.
It was yeah, so let's not dothose of two girls.
SPEAKER_03 (22:08):
I mean, the levity can be helpful.
I know it was helpful for mebecause I was like, I was like,
who are these people?
Why are they here?
Why are they all upset?
Yeah, dad did not know this manypeople.
Yeah.
Which he probably did.
He just never told us aboutthem.
SPEAKER_05 (22:24):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (22:25):
And yeah, all of them had stories about him.
Every single one of them waslike, oh yeah, we would sit on
the overpass and and and talkand kill time while we were on
shift together.
And oh, I saw him responding tothis accident this one time, and
he was great, and he did thisand that.
And it was like, okay.
(22:47):
He only told us the traumatizingstories.
So uh I don't know who you are,sorry.
Um oh yeah, he came over afterwork and and chopped wood with
me for hours and hours andhelped me stack all this wood,
and it was great, and we reallyappreciated him, and he was so
helpful to everybody, and it waslike, where was my dad?
SPEAKER_00 (23:07):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (23:12):
It was totally that way.
It was like, who was thisperson?
Because he never treated us likethat.
SPEAKER_05 (23:22):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (23:34):
So after the funeral, and kind of all that
busy season slows down, right?
Because that happens, you haveall these people coming and
going.
I know for me it was alwaysharder when like everybody left,
and then you now had to dealwith it.
Was going from that busyness tothat quietness of reality, was
that that had to be quite thejourney.
SPEAKER_03 (23:56):
Reality didn't hit.
SPEAKER_00 (23:57):
Okay.
SPEAKER_03 (23:58):
I was in denial for at least a month after that
because nobody else was around,and all of a sudden it was just
oh, yep, he's in his usualroutine of never coming home.
He's at work, he's helping otherpeople, he's not here.
SPEAKER_05 (24:12):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (24:13):
And yeah.
And I was working at the timetoo.
I'd taken that job, and so I waslike, I can start in two weeks,
and that was not good.
Don't do that.
Um I took a job and I was goneall the time because I was
working, and that was terrible.
(24:35):
Um, I don't remember a whole lotof this because my brain is
totally fried, but um it sucked.
SPEAKER_04 (24:43):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (24:44):
Even though it was a job that I really wanted to be
in, um, because I was going tocollege for parks and natural
resources.
And so I was at Benton CountyConservation, and I was, you
know, helping them with theiranimals in the nature center,
and I was interacting with thepublic, and I was doing all this
stuff that I really wanted todo.
And it was not there.
(25:06):
I wasn't there.
SPEAKER_05 (25:07):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (25:09):
So they decided that I wasn't motivated enough, and
they fired me like two monthsin.
SPEAKER_00 (25:17):
Well, I hope if that's what you want to do, you
get your foot back in theresomewhere else and I have
decided against it.
SPEAKER_03 (25:22):
I'm on a different track now.
But it'd be nice.
SPEAKER_05 (25:25):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (25:27):
So looking back on that, do you feel like you
needed more time?
Yeah.
Teach us?
SPEAKER_03 (25:31):
Absolutely.
Yeah.
It uh I'm still not exactly ontrack with anything.
It totally threw everything off.
Before he died, I was two weeksout from being certified as a
wildland firefighter.
And I was gonna go out toColorado and uh Nevada and Utah
(25:54):
and fight fires.
SPEAKER_00 (25:56):
You were brave.
SPEAKER_03 (25:58):
It looked like so much fun.
SPEAKER_00 (25:59):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (26:00):
And the instructor that I had for my wildland
firefighting class was so nice,he was so sweet.
He um he's so encouraging to mebecause I had a ton of anxiety,
and I was like, I can't doanything.
And he's like, You can do this,you got it.
Yeah, and uh I feel so bad thatI let him down.
(26:21):
But everything got thrown offthe track.
Absolutely everything that I hadgoing was just out.
SPEAKER_00 (26:27):
As for anybody, I I mean, you're when your world's
crushing down, it's hard to beable to focus on something
positive and feed a bunch oflife and passion into it when at
that point you're like, I don'teven know if I'm gonna be here,
let alone do somethingpassionate.
SPEAKER_03 (26:39):
Well, at the time I was determined to just keep
moving forward.
I was like, this isn't that bigof a deal.
He wasn't that big in my lifeanyway.
I was planning to leave as soonas possible anyway, so this is
fine.
And it was not actually fine,and I found that out very
quickly.
Yeah.
Uh my mental health was like,actually, you're done.
(27:02):
You've been running too hard fortoo long.
Yeah.
And uh yeah, everything hit meall at once.
It was a wonderful train wreck.
SPEAKER_00 (27:11):
Yeah.
So thank you for sharing this.
I know it can be easy.
And if you don't mind, from fromthat point to to like the time
that you and I met, um, what'sthat roller coaster been like
from you know the month or twobefore everything set in, or
afterwards everything kind ofset in and the reality came?
Like the four years or so afterthat, what's been what's
(27:35):
Dakota's life been like?
Because I know it's a rollercoaster for everybody when
you're dealing with this.
SPEAKER_03 (27:39):
Like it's been a lot of anger.
Okay.
It's been a lot of anger.
It's just so it hit me veryshortly after that he'd made us
into a statistic.
And I was like, oh, cool, we'repart of that statistic.
I love that.
My mom's now a widow, thanks forthat.
(28:01):
I'm now without a dad, thanksfor that.
And just like every new thingthat came across my table, like,
oh, that's another thing thatyou did to us.
Thank you for that.
And uh couldn't look anywhere inthe house without seeing
(28:22):
something, all the way down tomy hat, which I'm wearing today,
is it was his hat on deployment.
And all of the guns that he gaveme for deer hunting, and then
when I was working at the gunshop, uh they were all his
(28:42):
first.
And it's just like, wow, thanksfor that.
I can't get away from you evennow.
Which I've made my peace withthat now, and I'm fine with that
now.
I like having parts of himaround.
But then it pissed me off sobad.
I was so angry about it, and Ijust wanted something that was
(29:06):
mine that wasn't his first.
SPEAKER_05 (29:08):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (29:10):
But yeah.
Since then, I've tried multipletimes to get my life back on
track, and it's it's been aseries of coincidences that I
haven't been able to, but Imean, I've gotten into all sorts
of other stuff since then.
(29:31):
Um, I've tried taxidermy, andI've I started to get into
hawking, and I got intoreenacting, and I am looking
into gunsmithing.
Yes.
SPEAKER_00 (29:45):
What's hawking?
SPEAKER_03 (29:47):
Uh hunting with hawks.
Oh, legit, like hawking.
SPEAKER_00 (29:50):
Okay, I wonder if that's what you were talking
about.
That is cool.
That is really cool.
SPEAKER_03 (29:53):
Yeah, it's very difficult to get into though.
SPEAKER_00 (29:56):
Dang.
SPEAKER_03 (29:56):
Wow.
SPEAKER_00 (29:57):
That's really neat.
Yep.
So if what if you could havelike if money wasn't an issue
the rest of your life, like whatwould you do with your life?
Would it be the firefightingstuff?
SPEAKER_03 (30:04):
Would it be the um I mean firefighting seems fun, but
I don't think I would go back toit now.
SPEAKER_00 (30:13):
Okay.
SPEAKER_03 (30:13):
Um, I would probably do taxidermy.
Okay.
If it wasn't, if money wasn't anissue and I could just start my
studio right now, I'd dotaxidermy.
I love it.
It's so much fun.
SPEAKER_00 (30:26):
Have you been through the like the classes and
training and to be able to dothat?
SPEAKER_03 (30:31):
Uh I shadowed a couple of taxidermists.
Um I got like four months ofinstruction from one of them.
Three months into not even threeweeks into shadowing under him.
I elected to go to the statetaxidermy competition.
(30:51):
So I yeah, I mounted a doe.
It was the second deer that I'dmounted, and I took it to the
state cat taxidermy competition.
So I was very ambitious aboutit.
SPEAKER_00 (31:02):
That is so cool.
SPEAKER_03 (31:03):
That's amazing.
SPEAKER_00 (31:04):
But uh so to start a business like that, you just
kind of need all the equipmentand then it's a very high
initial overhead cost.
Hey, anybody that's listeningthat's uh that has anything to
do with taxidermy.
I know a bunch of you out there,because I know friends of mine.
Um let's just try to cometogether and get some equipment
for her.
Let's get you guys what I'mtalking about.
Yeah.
Like let's reach out, let's getsome let's get a hold of me.
(31:27):
Let me know what reps you guysuse.
I'll call them.
And let's try to make thishappen for her.
Um that's something that shouldbe pretty easy to get done.
So let's get that, let's getthat done.
And then if you guys are outthere that are taxidermis, um
with the schools you went to,get a hold of me and let me know
the training, the education,what that looks like, and who it
was.
And um, let's see if we canlet's see if we can make this
(31:50):
happen.
Um so let's get on that inJesus' name.
SPEAKER_02 (31:54):
Also, though, I want to say you have done so many
cool things.
Like, like I earlier you usedthe phrase like that you like
haven't got your life together,but let me just say, as a boring
person who has like a reallyboring, you know, like regular
life.
I guess no, you're yeah, you'rethe life of the party for sure
at our house, for sure.
SPEAKER_00 (32:15):
Yeah, that's the word.
SPEAKER_02 (32:16):
That's what we're gonna say.
But you've done so many coolthings, like so many fun things.
Wow, and I love that.
Like, I admire that adventurousheart, yes, yes.
Like you are like, I don't know,just a cool, fun person.
Like the things that you do islike that's amazing.
I I I mean, clearly, couldn't,wouldn't, I don't know.
(32:39):
Like, step out and do like afun, cool thing.
And I love that you do that.
Like, that's amazing to me.
That is a sign of like you livelife, and I love that.
SPEAKER_03 (32:50):
Yeah, it's me looking for a place because I
have tried to work a regular joband it was very hard on my
mental health.
So I was like, okay, I needsomewhere where I've got varied
work, but I have a routine andI'm being held accountable, but
also I'm my own boss, and it'slike the older trades and the
(33:15):
more lost arts, for lack of abetter word, seem to fit me a
lot better.
So I was like, oh well, I couldbecome a tax dermist.
And so I was like, okay, whattaxidermists are around here
that I could go pick theirbrains about it?
And uh I ended up with one, andthen he was like, I don't have
(33:36):
the time to teach you, so youknow, here's the school that I
went to, you should go look intothat.
And I was like, okay, cool.
But I felt really bad about itbecause it felt like rejection,
and I was like, oh, you know, hedidn't want to be around me
either.
And uh, so then it kind of satfor a bit, and then I got hooked
up with another taxidermist, andhe had more or less retired, and
(33:58):
he had a shop that I could justuse.
And he was like, Yep, you canhave all my old clients and you
can do this and that.
And I was like, wait a minute,you've already taken the money
for all of those clients.
So if I do those, I'm not gonnaget paid.
Um I was like, hey, I have aproblem with this, and he's
like, Oh, well, you weren'tmotivated, so I got you, I got a
(34:19):
different student.
SPEAKER_00 (34:20):
Whoa, wow, yeah, we'll find you let's find her a
different mentor.
Like hey, Rocky Schoolville.
If you're out there listening,or if you guys know Rocky, tell
Rocky to get a hold of me.
I'll call him too.
He's like one of the besttaxidermists around Rocky
Schoolville.
Oh, he's that dude is yeah, he'sgood.
Yeah.
So I'll find out what's cool andstuff, and let's get that
(34:41):
figured out.
SPEAKER_03 (34:42):
Oh, I made some friends at the state taxidermy
competition.
SPEAKER_00 (34:46):
Oh, cool.
SPEAKER_03 (34:47):
That was at um the casino.
Yeah.
It was hosted there, and I wassuper apprehensive walking in,
and just tons of super friendly,super sweet people who were so
excited to see me there andtotally wanted to help me.
And so a bunch of them had goneto the same school that that
(35:09):
first tax nervous had gone to,and they were like, She's
getting out of it, actually.
But if you want to, you can comeshadow us, and we'll teach you.
And I was like, that's awesome,absolutely.
And then everything happened,and I was like, Oh, okay, we'll
put this on the back burner.
And so I do intend to get backinto it eventually.
(35:30):
It's just I don't have the moneyto burn.
SPEAKER_00 (35:33):
So do you yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (35:36):
Most of the taxomists that I've met are
absolute sweethearts.
I love them.
SPEAKER_00 (35:40):
Yeah, well, you're sweet, so I'm sure when you walk
in, they're like, I mean,they're not gonna look at you
and be angry and say no.
Like, yeah, you're a sweetperson.
No.
Um, so do you do any hunting?
I don't use to with your dad.
Do you do it anymore?
SPEAKER_03 (35:52):
Yes.
I uh I deer hunt for the mostpart.
SPEAKER_00 (35:57):
Well, if you want to deer hunt this season, first
like we have some we have aperson who's donated some land
for us to hunt down in southernIowa.
I meant down by the LakeRathman.
It is amazing southern Iowa.
And if you want to come, you letme know, and I will like
literally, like we have thespot, the blinds are already out
there.
Excuse me.
We'll make it happen.
Yeah, we'll make it happen.
Yes, let's let's do that.
(36:18):
And bring mom down too.
Yeah, seriously.
When we get down to this, we'lltalk more about that because I
want to get you down.
And then I do want to ask youabout this.
Um last time when you and I werehere, we were doing some equine
assisted training stuff, and youand I spent some time kind of
riding together, and I got tohear a little bit about you.
I and correct me if I'm wrong, Ireally felt a spark in your
(36:40):
heart about your dad's your dadand when he did work with
horses.
Like that was there was when youwere talking about your dad so
deeply and lovely about how heworked with horses and he was a
natural and how he taught yousome things.
Tell me a little bit about that.
Let's talk about the joyful partof because I see the spark in
your eye with horses.
SPEAKER_03 (36:59):
Yeah.
So my dad was a city boy.
SPEAKER_00 (37:02):
Okay.
SPEAKER_03 (37:03):
And he met my mom, and she was a country girl, and
she brought him into horses.
Okay.
And so I might get some detailswrong here, but she bought him
his first horse.
Okay.
And she was just a halter brokeyearling, and I told you, green
plus green equals blue andblack.
(37:25):
But he worked through it and hehe learned how to train with
that horse.
And from there, he got anotherone and he started training for
other people.
And he from what mom said, andsome of mom's friends have said,
he just kind of took to it verynaturally.
(37:48):
And so growing up he neverseemed to have a problem with
his horses.
And I did.
SPEAKER_00 (37:58):
Um what do you mean by problem?
SPEAKER_03 (38:01):
So, like, horses will test you and horses will
test you and test you,especially if they can tell that
you're not super confident withthem.
And so when we moved and gothorses with the property, the
horse that I chose to staybehind when we got rid of the
(38:21):
rest of them, uh could tell thatI was not confident.
And he tested me all the time.
And then my dad would be like,This is not hard.
Just do this.
And he'd do the thing, and thehorse would do it perfectly.
And it's like, okay, I don'tknow how to do that.
And so, yeah, there's um there'sa lot of pressure to live up to
(38:48):
that, which I'm getting overbecause he wasn't actually that
good of a horseman.
Um, it's just my memories makehim seem like he was better than
he was.
Yeah.
Um, and I've spent time talkingto those friends of my mom's,
and they have pointed out thatvery clearly he wasn't that good
(39:09):
because the horse that he leftbehind is also not that good.
So clearly there were some gapsin the training.
SPEAKER_00 (39:16):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (39:17):
And so I'm letting go of that image and coming to
terms with the reality that Icould probably be better.
SPEAKER_00 (39:26):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (39:27):
Um, with time.
SPEAKER_00 (39:29):
You are very knowledgeable with horses.
Like when we heard last time,like you definitely have a gift
for it.
SPEAKER_03 (39:34):
Like I've done a lot of reading.
I've only had one horse that wasmy own in my lifetime.
All of the others that I'veridden have been other people's
horses.
I got started on my dad and mymom's horses, and they were
fantastic to start out on,except for they didn't listen to
(39:55):
me at all because they liked myparents.
And so it It didn't matter whatI did, as soon as my mom came
by, her horse would completelyignore me and just follow her.
SPEAKER_00 (40:07):
So do you have your own horse now?
SPEAKER_03 (40:08):
I do have my own horse.
Um he is just retired.
He just turned 30.
And uh he's the one that camewith the property.
Yeah.
And he has been a very goodteacher for me.
Um took my horsemanship forwardand lease leaves him down.
Um I'm a little emotionalbecause I've had him for 13
(40:35):
years.
Yeah.
And he's my buddy.
SPEAKER_05 (40:37):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (40:38):
And I I'm really worried that I'm gonna lose him
soon.
Not that he's in bad health oranything, he's doing great.
But he's old.
It's yeah, it's just the idea ofI'm going to lose him.
SPEAKER_00 (40:51):
Yeah.
You're losing something elsethat you loved, and that's
that's yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (40:58):
He's a very special boy.
SPEAKER_00 (40:59):
Yeah.
Question.
Why do you like tall horses?
You pick the tallest horse wehave out here.
I mean, like towering.
I look up at her, I'm like,whoa, she's like, I like tall
horses.
Dad's horse was tall, if Iremember right.
SPEAKER_03 (41:12):
Lola is 16 hands, so she's four inches shorter than
the horse out there.
Um there's two reasons.
First, I like to be able to seestuff.
SPEAKER_00 (41:23):
Okay.
SPEAKER_03 (41:23):
It's nice to be that tall because you can see things.
Um, and then uh I do World WarII reenacting.
And German cavalry horses werewarm bloods, and very, very few
of them were under 16 hands.
SPEAKER_00 (41:38):
Oh wow.
So didn't know that.
SPEAKER_03 (41:40):
I need a big horse.
SPEAKER_00 (41:41):
I like that.
And that well, that horse wasattached to you right away.
SPEAKER_03 (41:44):
Oh, he picked me.
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (41:46):
Like he was like I'm gonna lose my toenail over it.
SPEAKER_03 (41:48):
You need you need me today.
SPEAKER_00 (41:51):
Yeah, it is a wonderful horse that stepped on
my toe, but that wasn't thehorse's fault, though, because I
got in the way of a horse tryingto step on my toe.
Like, or I got in front of ahorse who was trying to step.
SPEAKER_03 (42:01):
Something like that.
SPEAKER_00 (42:02):
Yeah, yeah.
Well, thank you so much forbeing here.
I you're a blessing.
I I'm proud of you.
Thank you for coming on here.
And I've said this to you lasttime, and this is very
emotional, probably the mostemotional recording I've done
because I almost left my kidsthe way you got left.
(42:24):
And my kids would have had a lotof hurt and pain and been like,
dad was somewhere else, dad wasdoing that.
And so when I hear it, I hear, Ifeel the other side of it.
SPEAKER_03 (42:32):
And you see what could have been.
SPEAKER_00 (42:34):
Yeah.
And it wasn't that because I didspend a lot of time with my
kids, but not as much as Ineeded, and I and I loved them,
but I never felt I didn't feelthat I was safe around them.
So I thought I was protectingthem by not being home, by just
being there when I needed to be,get in, get out.
Like I felt like that was thebetter way of protecting.
That's why if you heard me tellmy story, I say I started to
(42:54):
shed my family because I knew Iwas gonna be the end of my life,
so I felt like if I could pushthem away, if I can make them
hate me, if I can make them, ifI can just stop communicating
with them, get them used to notme be me not being around, if I
can get then it, you know,things will be then I'll be able
to do it, and it won't be sohard on them.
That's the sick mind thoughtthat I had going through it.
And then I hear your side of it,which is what my kids would have
(43:16):
been, where what I literallythought I was doing, because
your your brain gets so twistedwhen you're dealing with trauma
and stuff, where I thought I washelping my family and me being
around, I didn't feel likeanybody wanted me around, even
though they did, right?
It's just a perceived thing thatwe feel.
Um, that I felt like to be agood dad, I needed to get away
from them and allow them to justhave a calm, safe house because
(43:38):
I know when I walk in thathouse, I cause anxiety, I cause
they walk on eggshells, theydon't know who they're gonna
get.
So for me, it was easier to getoff of work and go home, change
clothes, and be like, love youguys, and go and head out to go
be with somebody else.
And it was sick and wrong andtwisted the way I was doing it,
right?
Um, but in it it felt like loveat that time.
(44:00):
You know what I mean?
So, like that's what traumadoes, right?
That's the lies, right?
SPEAKER_02 (44:06):
Like in your in your mind, you are rationalizing the
choices that you make, whichpeople do.
Um, but that's why theseconversations are so important.
Yeah.
Because there is always anotherperson on the other side of that
decision.
Um, and that's why, you know,you talk to people a lot about
the importance of bringingmonologue to dialogue and
speaking it out uh for scenariosjust like this, you know, the
(44:31):
stuff that you were thinking andchoosing and your reasonings
behind your actions, but there'sa whole other experience that
your loved ones are having.
Um, and so that's why we're sograteful that you're here
sharing your story becausethat's the perspective that we
want to shed light to, you know,like Daniel can speak to that,
(44:53):
but also, you know, if you'reopen to it, do you want to speak
more about like what would whatwould you like to say in
response, like the truth of youknow, the what the child needs,
what the family needs, you know.
And only if you want to.
SPEAKER_03 (45:11):
I don't know how you guys want to cut this up because
I forgot a very important aspectof this.
Um, I think it was by the time Iwas 12 or 13, I was convinced
that either he was going to killus or he was gonna kill himself.
Okay.
So that's a very strange thingfor a 12 or 13 year old to come
(45:32):
to a very rock solid conclusionof.
SPEAKER_05 (45:36):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (45:36):
But it was not a surprise when he shot himself.
Okay.
I was like, oh okay.
Yeah, it finally happened.
Yeah.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (45:48):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (45:48):
And when my mom recounted the story to me and
she told me that he had askedher to go for a drive, even
though it was after the fact,and I was aware that things had
happened the way that they hadhappened, I had an immediate
irrational conviction that hehad gotten her into the car to
(46:11):
shoot her.
And I was convinced about that.
I was absolutely certain thatthat was the plan.
So nobody should get to thatpoint.
No kid should ever think that.
(46:32):
And uh I don't somebody can makeof that what they will, yeah.
But don't make your kids thinkthat.
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (46:44):
And that's why men and women are listening, first
responders, parents.
They're going through it.
You know, we get so stuck and wethink we're we're helping our
families by being away fromthem.
We're listening to the enemy'slies that they're better without
us.
Um it's it's a lie.
There is an impact that thatoccurs.
Like we have a role to fill hereas fathers, as mothers.
(47:07):
Um when we don't deal with ourmental health, when we're not
willing to go through theuncomfortableness of reaching
out and getting help forourselves, it causes a major
ripple effect throughout thefamily.
If we can just get past theuncomfortableness of just
reaching out to somebody, ifit's not our organization,
another organization, andgetting help for yourself.
If you don't feel like doing itfor yourself, then do it for
(47:28):
your family.
Because they're not betterwithout you.
unknown (47:33):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (47:34):
So please don't live in isolation, don't live in
guilt and shame.
Reach out.
If you don't know how to bearound your family because
you're afraid you're gonna hurtthem, if you don't know how to
show up for your family, if youfeel like the best ways to be
away from them in your sparetime, give me a call.
I want to talk to you aboutthat.
Because I've been there, I'vehad those thoughts, I've I've
done it.
(47:59):
God loves you too much to leaveyou there.
It matters what how we handleourselves, how we handle trauma
as as mothers and fathers.
How we handle trauma shows ourkids how to deal with trauma.
When we can be willing to bevulnerable, open, honest, and
(48:19):
transparent with our family,that it's that it's okay to not
be okay.
When we can show them how to howto how we talk out our feelings,
how to you're not just changingyou, you're changing your the
family generation.
You're teaching your childrenhow to deal with trauma and
stress.
So when they come across it,they can handle it in a healthy
(48:41):
way.
And sometimes we feel like we'rewe're helping in a healthy way.
And that's why we need others tocome along and help us see the
lies that are being told and thelies that are being said.
So please don't no guilt, noshame.
Reach out.
I'd love to talk to you aboutthis.
I'm not gonna guilt or shameyou.
I've been there.
Let's just have a conversationabout it.
(49:01):
Because it matters not just toyou, it matters to your spouse,
it matters to your kids, itmatters to your grandkids, it
matters to your family chain.
So please reach out.
Um if you're a child, if you'relistening and maybe your parent
gone through what Dakota hasgone through and you don't know
(49:23):
who to reach out to or who totalk, give us a call.
We'd love a talk with you.
And if if again, if ourorganization isn't a good fit
for you, we'll help you findsomeone who is.
We just want to get you help.
So, Dakota, before we start toclose out, is there anything
else you wanted to share?
Any closing thoughts?
SPEAKER_03 (49:41):
I think what you're doing here is very important.
SPEAKER_00 (49:44):
Thank you for being on.
SPEAKER_02 (49:46):
And what you shared is very important.
Thank you.
SPEAKER_00 (49:51):
And I think God had us all meet for a reason.
I know that for sure.
So, how about you and I go spendsome time on horses?
You want to go do that?
Sound good to me.
Giddy up.
We'll see you guys next week.
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