January 7, 2025 • 50 mins
Elana Frank's journey from Atlanta to Israel and back is nothing short of inspiring, as she intertwines her personal history with her professional mission. With roots tracing back to Holocaust survivors and tales of resilience from her father, Ilana's story is deeply moving and thought-provoking. Her adventurous chapter in Israel during the 2009 recession adds a layer of cultural richness, ultimately bringing her back to Atlanta where her passion for supporting those facing fertility challenges took root.
In our conversation, Elana opens up about the profound disparities in access to fertility treatments between Israel and the United States and how these shaped the founding of the Jewish Fertility Foundation. As we explore the foundation's expansion and the impactful Fertility Buddies program, it's clear how essential community and understanding are in navigating the emotional complexities of infertility. We also dive into the social and financial pressures individuals face and why having a dedicated support system can make all the difference.
This episode isn't just about Ilana's narrative; it's a testament to the power of support and connection. With insights into the role of clergy, interfaith inclusivity, and the importance of postpartum resources, we cover a spectrum of topics that champion empathy and understanding. Nicole also shares her aspirations, reminding us of the transformative impact philanthropy can have. This conversation underscores the resilience of the human spirit and the necessity of community in overcoming life's challenges.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Nicole Kelly (00:00):
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Hi, I'm Nicole Kelly and thisis Shebrew in the City, and
(00:33):
today I am talking to ElanaFrank, who is the founder and
CEO of the Jewish FertilityFoundation.
How are you doing today, Elana?
Elana Frank (00:42):
Good Thanks for having me.
Nicole Kelly (00:44):
Of course, this is a pleasure.
I just moved, so I lookterrible today, so I don't know
if we're going to be using thevideo on this.
Elana Frank (00:51):
Don't knock yourself, come on.
No, no, no.
Nicole Kelly (00:54):
It's because I can't find my makeup.
I don't know what I did with mymakeup and I try to judge
myself up a little bit, but Idon't think that's happening
today.
Elana Frank (01:02):
You look great, thank you.
Nicole Kelly (01:04):
So I usually start by asking my guests about where
they grew up, their Jewishupbringing, if they had any
those kind of things.
So can you tell me a little bitabout that?
Elana Frank (01:15):
Yeah, sure, I was born and raised in Atlanta,
georgia.
I have an Israeli father and auh, a Yaki or German mother.
Um, my dad is a first, um, he'san immigrant.
He came um 48 years ago.
I went to Jewish day school.
(01:37):
We were part of a synagogue,not not super observant, but
very, very traditional growingup.
Nicole Kelly (01:45):
Okay.
What part of Israel is yourfather from?
Elana Frank (01:50):
He grew up in Bat Yam oh okay.
And then his family moved alittle bit more north.
Nicole Kelly (01:56):
Okay, and why did he end up coming to the United
States?
Elana Frank (02:00):
Kind of crazy, especially with everything going
on now, but he was in anaccident in the army and was in
a coma for three days oh um,this is the famous story that he
woke up and he spoke english.
I'm not exactly sure how muchof that is true, but, um, from
that incident he knew he wantedto travel to america, get his
(02:22):
degree here, and he did, and henever left.
Nicole Kelly (02:25):
Oh wow, and your mom is from Germany or of German
descent.
Elana Frank (02:28):
No, German descent.
She grew up in WashingtonHeights, New York.
Nicole Kelly (02:32):
Oh, that's a little bit north of where I am
right now.
Elana Frank (02:34):
Ooh, yes, and her dad was a butcher.
They needed butchers in theSouth, so she came in high
school.
Nicole Kelly (02:41):
Okay.
Elana Frank (02:43):
Down to Atlanta.
Okay, so she came in highschool down to Atlanta.
Nicole Kelly (02:44):
Okay, do you know what part of Germany your
family's from?
Elana Frank (02:47):
Oh Lord, so my grandfather was from actually
Belgium.
Nicole Kelly (02:54):
Okay.
Elana Frank (02:59):
And then my grandmother I don't know exactly
in Germany, where she was from.
Horrible, horrible.
My grandmother came, who'sstill, thankfully, around 89
years old.
Horrible, horrible.
My grandmother came, who'sstill, thankfully, around 89
years old.
She came from when she was likethree.
And then my grandfather has ahorrible Auschwitz.
Parents shooed him away when hewas 13 and ended up coming to
(03:20):
America by himself.
Nicole Kelly (03:21):
Oh, my goodness.
Elana Frank (03:23):
Crazy stories.
I have a 13-year-old it's a.
It's a, it's crazy.
Nicole Kelly (03:27):
Yeah, no, no, no.
So you're a 4G.
I guess would be if your greatgrandparents were, uh, in the
Holocaust.
Elana Frank (03:34):
Yeah, so yeah, what it does to our generation,
that's a whole nother podcastepisode.
Nicole Kelly (03:39):
Yes, I'm very.
I just got into, uh, theprogram at Gratz for Holocaust
and Genocide Studies for mymaster's and I'm very interested
in the concept of generationaltrauma.
I've had a couple guests whoare 3Gs and there's a class I
can take that has to do with theeffect of, you know, relatives
(04:00):
being in the Holocaust, and thefamily unit is something I'm
super interested in.
I've taken.
Elana Frank (04:03):
A Bipolar yes, my family has serious bipolar.
We lost my aunt to suicide 10years ago.
She was the one who was asinterested and I really think
something in our DNA shifted andit's like it's in us.
Yeah, it's really sad andinteresting.
Nicole Kelly (04:25):
All right, so let's jump to something, maybe a
little bit happier.
I hope so.
Yeah, you spent some time inIsrael yourself.
Can you talk a little bit aboutwhat brought you over there and
what it was like living thereat the time?
Elana Frank (04:36):
Yeah, so we're talking now, almost 16 years ago
my husband and I met we gotmarried and I it was like in 20,
2009,.
Recession going on some, somehard economic times in in
America.
My husband had just moved fromIsrael in Jerusalem he's by way
(04:58):
of Chicago American and I waslike Jason, we let's go to
Israel.
Like we were having a hard timefiguring out our place.
We had met in Atlanta and wedidn't like Atlanta at that time
and I said, let's, let's do it.
He's like I'll go back, but Iwon't go to Jerusalem or Tel
Aviv.
We're going to be like pioneers, we're going to be Israelis
(05:22):
like the olden days.
And so I was like OK, whatever.
And so we actually lived in theNorth and we were part of Nefesh
B'Nefesh, a program that helpsimmigrants move, and we lived in
the mountains for five years.
We were Israeli like reallyliving, not the, you know, Anglo
(05:44):
life.
Nicole Kelly (05:45):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
That's crazy.
Why did you end up coming backto the United States?
Elana Frank (05:50):
So we actually had a good life in Israel.
We both had jobs in our field.
I mean, we had two cars, webought a house.
That's a big deal forimmigrants.
Nicole Kelly (05:58):
Yeah.
Elana Frank (05:59):
Many Israelis don't have two cars.
They aren't buying homes, butmy husband works in the casino
industry and he got recruitedback to America and we made our
way back.
Nicole Kelly (06:13):
And you ended up back in Atlanta.
Elana Frank (06:15):
Yes, so, no, so, by way of Atlantic City.
Nicole Kelly (06:19):
Okay.
Elana Frank (06:20):
I came back with a one-year-old and a six-week-old.
He didn't even have his shotsyet.
Long story, but we ended upnear Atlantic City and then
Cherry Hill.
He got recruited again in theBahamas and I said I love you
but I'm not moving to theBahamas.
Nicole Kelly (06:36):
Even the Chabad rabbi there.
Elana Frank (06:38):
I called him and he's like what kind of Jew are
you?
I'm like we're somewhatobservant.
He's like don't come.
He's like, if you want to raiseyour kids in an observant
lifestyle, bahamas is not theplace.
And so he commuted for a whilefrom Atlanta.
Nicole Kelly (06:54):
Oh my gosh, that's a commute.
Yes, it is, but you ended up inAtlanta, where you started from
.
Elana Frank (07:02):
Yeah, yeah, nice to be around family.
Nicole Kelly (07:05):
Yes, it's definitely a good thing.
So, speaking of you, know,coming from Israel with two
small children, the main thingthat I want to talk to you about
today is your journey withinfertility and you starting
this great organization.
So I want to start out bytalking about your personal
story involving infertility.
Elana Frank (07:26):
Yeah, well, israel is where my husband and I went
after we got married and thoughtwe were going to have a million
babies and it just did not goas planned.
We were also new immigrantsnavigating socialized medicine
in Israel, you know, figuringout how the system worked.
And I mean we had already beenmarried about a year by the time
(07:50):
we moved to Israel, so, and wewere not using birth control.
And after like three months ofreally trying, I didn't
understand what was going on.
Went to the gynecologistquickly.
She put me on Clomid.
Nothing was happening.
I thought I was going to getpregnant right away.
I was so excited, month aftermonth.
(08:10):
I remember my aunt is Israeli.
I remember my father's Israeli.
So we would go out with mycousins and all their kids
regularly and she would tell meIlana what's going on Like why
aren't you having kids?
And I'm like.
I didn't even know what to sayand I remember she's like do you
know how to have sex?
(08:31):
Like do you need to go on avacation.
There's really, do you need togo on a vacation and relax?
Like all the things that arethe worst things to say.
And I was like, well, maybe Idon't know how to have sex, like
I really was like, am I doingit wrong?
I don't know?
Like what is going on.
Ultimately she found us adoctor and I trusted her.
He was a professor, which is abig deal in Israel, and I wasn't
(08:56):
part of his insurance coverage.
But we're American, we're usedto writing checks, so we would
go to his house, his, hisprivate office at night, which
is not so uncommon.
But he started doing IUIs orlike the turkey baster method.
My husband would go to thebathroom do his business, come
out with sperm.
He would look under themicroscope in his house and then
(09:19):
I would get on the table aproper doctor's table and he
would put it in me.
Month after month we wouldwrite a check, but he never
checked my body.
He never did any medicalprocedures to check my body and
we felt like after a whilesomething was weird.
But we wanted a baby andultimately, after time wasted
time we're like let's get asecond opinion.
(09:41):
And we did, and my tubes areblocked.
I am not going to get pregnantthrough an IUI.
If anything, I could have anectopic pregnancy which is scary
.
Nicole Kelly (09:52):
Very dangerous.
Elana Frank (09:53):
And I just it was such wasted money and wasted
time and I didn't know anybetter.
I mean, just at that time therewas like no resources online.
There was a baby center which Icouldn't connect to and
(10:13):
ultimately I was able to findthis great doctor and because I
lived in Israel and because theyvalue families and reproductive
access and they have socializedmedicine, I was able to do IVF
for free and ended up with twochildren through the process.
Nicole Kelly (10:27):
Wow, ivf is extremely expensive.
It's kind of crazy that it isno cost in Israel and it's such
a contentious issue right now.
Even with it costing like$30,000 to get IVF, I have.
I I took Clomid to get pregnantwith my daughter and the
pregnancy that um, and thatunfortunately ended, uh, back in
(10:51):
July.
So I have a little bit ofinsight into kind of what you
went through and but I knewgoing into it that there were
problems because I don't ovulateregularly.
So even before we got pregnantI was kind of mentally prepared
to go through the whole processbut thankfully Clomid worked the
first month for my daughter.
So, um, like the base level thebasis level, the lowest level
(11:15):
of fertility treatments, is whatI was on Um, but it's, it's
scary, you know, like facingthat and not knowing what's
wrong, and I think it'ssomething that affects so many
people.
So this organization youstarted is amazing.
Can we talk about what inspiredthat and how that all happened?
Elana Frank (11:31):
Yeah, I mean, listen, in Israel it was free,
which is huge.
It's tremendous.
Also, I went through over ayear of having to go to work,
where I worked at an immigrantyouth village.
It was a religious community, Imean people.
It's Israel also, so they haveno, no filters.
(11:53):
Um, and people were like and Iwas gaining weight, I was on
medications while I was doing.
Nicole Kelly (11:58):
IUI.
Elana Frank (11:58):
Like people were literally like asking me number
one are you pregnant?
Because I was gaining weight.
What's going on?
Like I would really not wait solong.
Like people love to give theiropinions.
Nicole Kelly (12:09):
And like.
Elana Frank (12:09):
I didn't know what to say.
It was really hard.
It was super hard with myhusband and our marriage.
He wanted to make me happy andget me a baby and I was broken,
like I didn't know what to do.
And you know, just connectingwith people back in America like
who are all having their babiesand you know not, them not
(12:30):
wanting to say something to mebecause they didn't know I
wasn't really talking about it,but like I also wasn't pregnant,
like what, who?
Who gets married at my age anddoesn't want to have a family in
our community?
Like right away, that's justwasn't who I was, um, and I was.
(12:52):
So I didn't know how to talk tomy family, like my family back
in America, um, so, even thoughit was amazing what Israel
offered, when I came back toAmerica with two babies, I was
sitting in a baby pool at a JCCwith some old friends from
growing up and they had their.
One person had twins, anotherperson had one child and we
(13:14):
started talking about IVF andthey're like, yeah, these are my
$80,000 twins, these are my.
You know, this is my child Ispent so much money on.
Nicole Kelly (13:22):
Yeah.
Elana Frank (13:22):
And I was like, well, I did IVF too and it was
free.
And just hearing this sparkedan idea.
We're almost 10 years ago nowand I was like, wow, I've been
in nonprofit my whole life,fundraising or doing community
organizing and coalitionbuilding.
Wouldn't it be great if I couldhelp these people financially?
(13:42):
And that's kind of where theidea started.
Nicole Kelly (13:45):
That's crazy $88,000.
Elana Frank (13:47):
They must have gone through two or three rounds if
that was just because you do IVFdoes not guarantee a child at
the end.
You have to.
Sometimes there's surgeryinvolved.
Sometimes you know lots ofthings can be part of the
process.
Nicole Kelly (14:01):
Yeah, I think that's a common misconception
that IVF works a hundred percentof the time, because even
during egg retrieval might notget enough.
You know there's so manydifferent steps to the process
that there's something that canI don't want to say go wrong,
that cannot go perfectly, thatwould not.
You know.
The outcome would not be a baby.
I think that's a hugemisconception a lot of people
(14:21):
have with any fertilitytreatment, but definitely with
IVF.
Have, yeah, with any fertilitytreatment, but definitely with
IVF.
So do you, do you have,statistically, just in case
people are curious, whatpercentage of families
experience some form ofinfertility?
Elana Frank (14:34):
So when I started in the biz it was one in eight
and we would always nationally.
So we would always.
Our doctors would share with usthat actually within the Jewish
community it's a little bithigher, closer to one in six.
Nicole Kelly (14:48):
Really For various reasons.
Elana Frank (14:49):
Listen, like we're genetically a smaller population
, we're marrying each other.
There's some genetic factorsinvolved.
Also, we're a population thatis educated, so we're going to
college, we're going to gradschool, then we're trying to get
married and have babies andunfortunately biology does not
wait and those contribute tothose factors.
(15:11):
But actually I think two yearsago the statistics changed and
nationally the rate is one insix.
So still I think in the Jewishcommunity it is more prevalent.
But that's where we're atthat's a pretty high number.
Nicole Kelly (15:30):
Yeah, that's you know I I feel like correct me if
I'm wrong.
My husband told me once thatmen are less fertile than of
this generation, less fertilethan their grandfathers were,
for various reasons because, uh,male and male factor
infertility is also somethingthat I think people don't
realize Usually, unfortunately,they blame the woman.
(15:50):
There's something wrong withthe woman, but.
But the father also plays alittle bit, a little bit of a
part in in that as well.
Elana Frank (15:58):
It's actually like you break it into four there's
female factor, male factor,there's unexplained and then
there's male and female, don'tmesh up together.
So it's like one fourth, onefourth.
So really it's not, it's reallynot a woman's issue.
Nicole Kelly (16:14):
Yeah, yeah.
I think it's important to tospread that information because,
you know, people tend to blamewomen for a lot of things,
including this, which I think isincorrect and unfair.
So, going back to Jewishcouples in particular, why do
you think the infertilityjourney can be especially
difficult for Jewish couples?
Elana Frank (16:33):
Yeah, so, and I'll correct you by saying couples,
because we do work withindividuals.
Nicole Kelly (16:39):
Okay, perfect.
Elana Frank (16:40):
Yeah, I mean single moms by choice, even single
dads by choice.
Now it's really a huge growingpopulation and you know it's
part of our culture, you knowour first of all, like starting
with intended grandparents, likenew what are?
we going to have the grandkidslike.
Think about all the holidaysthat are coming up right now.
What is Passover?
(17:01):
Passover is telling yourchildren the story of how we
left Egypt.
Everything in our culture, evenif you're not super observant,
is we're a family based cultureand the pressure is on.
I mean be fruitful and multiply, Right, that's like.
That's who we are.
You were talking about theHolocaust.
(17:23):
Like it's our job to you knowbuild back the Jewish community.
But what if you can't?
How does that feel?
Nicole Kelly (17:31):
Yeah, no, that makes a lot of sense.
So, going back to JFF, whatresources do you provide to
those experiencing infertilityor, as you said, choosing to be
single moms or single dads bychoice?
Elana Frank (17:46):
So we say, on their path to parenthood.
So we offer three main services.
One is financial assistance,Two is emotional support and
three are educational trainings.
So the first, financialassistance money, really really
important.
We offer one IUI grant of$1,000.
(18:08):
Sucks are going through this Hugfrom the Jewish community.
It is not needs-based.
And then we offer up to sorryup to $10,000 grants.
With all of the grants comes adiscount of up to 20% from the
fertility clinic in yourcommunity.
Okay, and then we partner withlocal interest-free loan
(18:31):
associations, Because even ifyou're getting our maximum grant
and the clinic discount, it'sstill not going to cover
everything.
So, we really want to make itaccessible.
And then, in terms of emotionalsupport, we offer a
(18:56):
peer-to-peer mentorship program,a Fertility Buddies program,
which is now national, open toanybody anywhere in the US, and
we offer local support groups aswell as national peer-to-peer
support.
Nicole Kelly (19:04):
Yeah, you mentioned that the Buddies is
nationally.
I know that the clinics andyou're in specific cities, so
can you tell me what you knowfor people listening if they're
interested in your organization?
What cities you're currently in?
Elana Frank (19:18):
Sure, you're putting me on the spot.
I'm sorry.
I should know this by heart.
I'm going to Jewish FertilityFoundation.
Nicole Kelly (19:25):
If you've got more than enough cities that you
can't remember, then that's agood thing.
Elana Frank (19:29):
Good problem.
So we are in specificcommunities nationally where we
go really, really deep in thosecommunities, but we also have a
national program so you are ableto join for emotional support
and education, regardless whereyou're living.
All right, I'll give you therundown Atlanta, birmingham,
(19:50):
cincinnati, cleveland, denver,detroit, greater DC, maryland,
dc, virginia, miami, pittsburghand then national.
Nicole Kelly (20:01):
Wow, how long has it taken you to get to this many
cities?
The entire decade.
Elana Frank (20:08):
No, we started scaling.
We wanted to really understandour services and our model, so
we opened in 2015 and we startedexpanding piloting in 2019.
Once we figured it out like forthe past four years we've been
growing, that's a pretty quickexpansion for an organization
(20:29):
yeah, I mean it's been awonderful process.
Also, I am excited to take 2025,our 10th year, to take a pause.
We want to go and understandour listen.
We figured out the model ofgoing into a city.
Are there other opportunitiesto help more people nationally
(20:50):
and we've been a direct serviceorganization for all these years
?
In order to grow and help morepeople, we need to also be a
fundraising organization.
Yes, that is the 2025 pivot andfocus in order for us to really
make a deeper impact.
I have a dream of helpingpeople from a financial
(21:14):
perspective to really grow ourimpact and how much money and
how many people we're helping.
Nicole Kelly (21:22):
It's nonprofits that cost a lot of money to run.
I took some extension coursesat ucla a long time ago a
non-profit fundraising and it isa whole machine to keep an
organization running.
You mentioned the buddiesprogram.
Um is available nationally.
Can you tell me a little bitmore about that?
Elana Frank (21:41):
yeah, sure.
So the idea is that, um, we alot, we love our social workers,
we love our therapist in-house.
We have a program that wecreated and the idea is that
listen when you're going throughthis.
Sometimes you don't want toreach out to your close friends
and family all the time.
Maybe it feels a burden, ormaybe you want somebody who just
(22:02):
gets what you're going through.
And so we created a program.
It's not about the veteran wecall them the person who's on
the other side.
It's about you, the personwho's experiencing infertility
and what you're going through.
And so we try to match upsomebody for this approximately
year-long journey, and they canbe anyone to you Like you guys
(22:29):
can kind of set your ownboundaries and expectations.
Are you grabbing coffee monthly?
Are you talking on the phoneweekly?
Do you just need to text everyonce in a while?
Do you want them to come toappointments with you, like,
really understanding who theyare and what they are?
Ideally, the geography will bewhere close to where you live,
and the diagnosis should besimilar.
(22:51):
Gender should be similar.
And now we have off, we havejust opened it up nationally,
meaning really, in thiswonderful world of the worldwide
web and zoom and phone andtexting Yep, there are
opportunities.
I do think it's best to belocal and have the opportunity
(23:12):
to meet in person, but that'snot available for everybody.
We want to give an opportunityto those who are not in our
communities to also benefit fromthis, really this support.
Nicole Kelly (23:25):
Yeah, no, I having gone through a loss in July, um
, like under a very specificcircumstance, it I, I'm.
I don't know anybody who's gonethrough what I went through.
So, it can be really helpfuljust to have someone, even for
just like a check-in, whodoesn't even need to talk about
it.
But you know, they know whatyou're going through, so you
(23:45):
don't feel so alone.
Elana Frank (23:47):
You need to register now.
Literally go to our website andjust sign up for a buddy Again,
it's not selfish, it's like weget it and there are people who
can really support you throughthis time.
Nicole Kelly (23:59):
Oh, so you talked about the different types of
people who work with yourorganization.
You mentioned doctors andsocial workers.
What kind of team works?
You know, cohesive team workswith the people who take
advantage of your organization.
Elana Frank (24:15):
Sure.
So the structure of ourorganization is we're a
non-profit, first and foremost.
We have a board of directors.
We work a lot with localvolunteers.
I have an executive committee,or executive team, I should say
and then in each of ourlocations we have a local
manager.
The manager is not providingthe direct services.
(24:35):
What they're doing is they'reintroducing the client to the
right services.
So if they need to go meet atherapist at a support group,
they're going to make sure thatthey have that information.
If they're going to work with avolunteer for the Fertility
Buddies program, they'll hookthem up and they help them
(24:56):
through the grant applicationprocess.
We have a financialqualifications committee that is
assessing the grants from afinancial point of view and a
medical advisory council who isworking number one to keep us up
to date with what's going onfrom the medical world.
It's changing rapidly andthey're also looking at two
(25:16):
things when we're consideringoffering a grant the likelihood
of pregnancy and the likelihoodof having residual embryos or
extra embryos to put in thefreezer because, that process is
less expensive.
And then we love our graduateschool social work interns.
(25:38):
That's a program we startednine years ago with different
graduate schools in New York,with different graduate schools
in New York, in Georgia allaround.
Nicole Kelly (25:51):
I think that's it.
Yeah, if someone was interestedin, like you said, being a grad
student volunteer, would theybe not volunteer working as a
social worker with yourorganization?
Where would they findinformation on that?
Elana Frank (26:05):
Yeah, sure, so they probably would do it through
their graduate program.
Okay, they would need todevelop that relationship.
They have a coordinator andwe're open at this point to you
know, outside of our like totalking with students we really
rely right now we have three.
(26:26):
We really love working withthem.
I mean it's a seriouscommitment, it's a serious job
and it's also part of their.
You know their curriculum inorder to graduate from the
program.
But just they need to speakwith their coordinator at their
program.
Nicole Kelly (26:43):
Cool.
So jumping to something alittle more political, um,
because you know, anythinginvolving uteruses and babies
has now, unfortunately, becomepolitical.
What are your thoughts onregulations regarding fertility
treatments?
Because I know right now theyreally don't exist.
And you know, we hear aboutsensationalized stories of a
(27:03):
single sperm donor fatheringhundreds of people.
My husband had a guest on oneof our tours that is her father.
It was the doctor who helpedher mother get pregnant, was the
father of hundreds of kids, andit leads to all sorts of
problems and concerns.
So what are your thoughts onhaving regulations within the
fertility industry?
Elana Frank (27:25):
So Jewish Fertility Foundation is not a political
organization.
What we do is to make sure thatour clients have access to
information in order to make thebest decisions, and so we
really rely on American Societyof Reproductive Medicine and
resolve to be the four, you know, in the forefront of working
(27:50):
with decision makers, and youknow like when everything was
going on in February in Alabamaand fertility clinics were
closing we actually have anoffice in Alabama and I mean the
doctors in our clinics werecalling us the night before they
were going to have to shuttheir doors, like, can you help
(28:11):
us?
What we very quickly were ableto pivot and do is offer direct
support that's what we do andmake sure that the people who
are currently going throughtheir treatment could quickly
come and pivot to Atlanta right,like we didn't want to deal
with everything going on.
We're very solution oriented.
Nicole Kelly (28:32):
What can?
Elana Frank (28:32):
we do the next day.
We got our attorneys, our localattorneys, on an Instagram with
hundreds of people.
This is the situation we don'tknow what's going on.
We know that even the doctors,at this stage, aren't returning
phone calls because legally,they don't know what's going on
and we just put information outthere and keep our clients
(28:55):
updated, and so that was veryreactive what we do today.
We actually just got a grantfrom the Jewish Women's Fund of
Atlanta to do just this.
We want to be proactive inunderstanding well, what are
some of the states that aresafer right now?
Do people need to be movingtheir embryos?
(29:15):
Should we not be creatingembryos?
There are lots of questionsthat are coming up.
We follow the guidelines ofASRM and Resolve, and you know
the people who are doing theadvocacy, but really work with
our clients to share what'sgoing on.
And then one of the pieces thatwe're using some of our grant
(29:36):
funds for are is reallytestimonials.
That's what reporters andnewspapers have been really
interested in is really gettingthe word out that, like you know
, our community, the fertilitycommunity, abortion is part of
our language, unfortunately,even for very wanted people
(30:00):
babies and pregnancies andlosses and you know access to
treatment and really justsharing actual human stories of
family building is how weapproach that space.
Nicole Kelly (30:15):
Gotcha.
So I saw that your website haspostpartum support resources.
As me personally, as someonewho's dealt with severe
postpartum, I know how importantthis issue is as a fertility
organization.
Why do you think this isimportant to provide for
families after the birth?
(30:36):
Because really you know on thesurface what it looks like
you're focusing on is gettingpeople pregnant.
At that you know.
Then maybe that should be theend of it, so why do you
continue resources after apregnancy has started and has
ended in birth?
Elana Frank (30:51):
I mean, you know we want, just like we want to
bring in healthy babies into theworld and we really promote
genetic screening andorganizations like J-Screen.
It's the same.
How can you not support thefamily post-birth Our work is in
the middle and really trying tohelp families grow their
(31:11):
families but to not be able topass along resources to our moms
when there's real, you know,postpartum, post, you know,
anxiety disorders that arise,would be really scary for us.
So it's very important for usto share resources, make sure
(31:32):
that moms know it's okay andwhen they need to seek help and
what other resources areavailable after.
Nicole Kelly (31:39):
And even beyond that.
Let's say, you know someonereceives a grant from you.
They have a successful birth.
If they would like to continueto grow their family, are they
able to come back to yourorganization?
Elana Frank (31:50):
Yeah, we do offer up to two grants and we do
support secondary infertility.
Nicole Kelly (31:56):
Can you explain what secondary infertility is
Secondary?
Elana Frank (31:59):
infertility.
So perhaps you even had.
You know you had sex and yougot pregnant with your first or
second, and then all of a sudden, you want additional children.
We're happy and you're nothaving success.
We're happy to step in ifneeded.
Nicole Kelly (32:18):
Great.
Your website also gives sometips on how to handle going to
the mikvah during infertility.
Can you talk a little bit aboutthe mitzvah of going to the
mikvah and why this might bedifficult for those going
through infertility?
Elana Frank (32:33):
Yeah, as somebody who observes family purity lots
of rules there but when I wastrying to get pregnant for all
three of my children, I would goto the mikvah and ritually
immerse once a month andremember I was trying to get
pregnant for so many years andit's exhausting and emotional
(32:59):
and every time I would go thereas a reminder that I got my
period and I'm not pregnant.
It sucked and to have people whoperhaps didn't understand that
as part of the mikvah communityit was really disappointing.
We've done a lot of trainingsfor the observant community,
(33:19):
which has been helpful andwell-received, but also one of
the things that we do that's sospecial for perhaps the
non-orthodox community is, oralso the orthodox community is
something we call the ninthmonth dunk, and there are
certain cities that havecommunity mikvahs where somebody
who maybe haven't hasn't everbeen to the mikvah can, somebody
(33:44):
in their ninth month can dunkfor, you know, an easy labor, an
easy birth and then anonymouslyfollowing somebody struggling
with infertility, can dunk rightafter them and there's certain
special prayers that have beencreated really connecting you in
this moment of hope, and it's abeautiful ritual.
(34:06):
I did it when I was pregnant inmy ninth month.
I did it before I was pregnant.
It really is just a momentwhere you can like connect with
all the matriarchs who struggledwith infertility and kind of
just feel hopeful.
Nicole Kelly (34:23):
Now that you're bringing it up.
Yes, infertility is a themewith the matriarch, so it's
something that I think has beenaddressed within Judaism for
thousands of years.
So what you're doing iscontinuing that and it's a.
It's a really beautiful thing.
No, no, no, no, it's not new,it's just we have resources to
assist with that.
I, I don't know what we werewatching, but I was thinking
(34:44):
about, you know the.
You know millions of people whoare never able to have children
because the, the medicine,didn't exist at the time, and it
was actually curious about,like, the population growth in
regards to fertility treatments.
I'm sure if somebody haswritten a paper on that
somewhere, I could find.
Elana Frank (35:02):
I don't have an answer.
Nicole Kelly (35:04):
No, no, I don't know.
I know It'd be interestingbecause you know, I feel like
you know, historically it's likethey never had children.
You know, for example, like agoverness, like George
Washington and his wife neverhad children because the theory
is that he had a childhoodillness that made him infertile.
Maybe if he was born, you know,in 1993, you know in 1993, you
(35:28):
know that that would have beendifferent.
Elana Frank (35:29):
So it's interesting that there are great procedures
to remove sperm right now.
Nicole Kelly (35:32):
Really.
Elana Frank (35:33):
There are some, really there's a lot of
innovation actually out ofIsrael.
Nicole Kelly (35:37):
Really.
Elana Frank (35:37):
Yeah, very interesting.
Nicole Kelly (35:39):
It makes sense that Israel will be kind of the
innovator in that because youknow, as we talked about Jews
and babies being a huge thing.
So, going back to the religiousaspect of what you know, your
organization working with theclergy you have tips on your
site as well about how theclergy members can help people
who are experiencing infertility.
I think it is so important tobe able to lean on clergy in
(36:01):
difficult times.
I love the clergy at mysynagogue and when we lost our
baby in July, it was like one ofthe first things that we did
was to reach out to our head.
Rabbi.
Have you found that most peoplearen't comfortable going to
their clergy members, that theclergy is maybe not necessarily
knowing what to say?
Why provide tips, you know, andadditional?
Elana Frank (36:21):
support.
So yes to all of that.
Yes, sometimes people do notfeel comfortable going to their
clergy.
Sometimes people you know wework a lot in the interfaith
population unaffiliated, likepeople, don't have clergy to go
to.
And I think that in you know theearly days, we love our
(36:43):
synagogues and the relationshipswe've created.
Also, clergy are used tooffering pastoral care.
This is not something new tothem, but there was a gap.
There is a gap sometimes in theinformation they know to offer,
and so you know everything fromlike basic biology of making a
(37:05):
baby is something that we try toreally educate, because it's
not always basic Right.
There are other just speakingthe language of the infertile,
like what other alternativesthere are, and most of them are
totally fine in the Jewishcommunity.
Understanding that,understanding perhaps what is
(37:28):
helpful to say and what isn'thelpful to say and, most
importantly, knowing that thereare resources out there and
where to guide your audience, isreally important.
Nicole Kelly (37:40):
So I want to touch on two things you just
mentioned.
You say you work a lot with theinterfaith community, so what
are the I guess qualificationsyou have to have to apply
Because both partners don't haveto be Jewish.
How does that work?
Elana Frank (37:52):
Yeah, sure.
So we accept the reformmovement's definition of who is
a Jew.
Nicole Kelly (37:56):
Okay.
Elana Frank (37:57):
And so true, one of the partners needs to be Jewish
.
Listen, you need to raise yourkid Jewish.
Whatever that means to you isfine with us.
There is absolutely, you know,background information that we
ask for in terms ofunderstanding what your thoughts
(38:17):
are about raising this childLike.
We want to make sure that thereis a Jewish continuity element
to all of this, and I'm shockedwe just actually did a research
project with a consulting agencyabout the impact that we're
having within the interfaithpopulation, who are mostly
(38:38):
feeling isolated from thetraditional Jewish community,
and we're bringing them in at areally critical time in their
life, providing them a Jewishexperience, sometimes their
first, and then, you know,they're going on to really
understand the Jewishcommunities there for them.
We're introducing them toJewish people, jewish friends,
(39:01):
other Jewish organizations, andthe findings were really, really
validating and fascinating andhopeful.
Nicole Kelly (39:10):
That's beautiful.
Second thing you kind oftouched upon what not to say.
So let's say I'm not goingthrough infertility, but I know
someone who is.
What are some ways that peoplecan support family and friends
who are experiencing infertility, and what should they not say
or do?
Elana Frank (39:27):
Yeah, I'd say we actually just did a national
program last night.
That is recorded and on ourwebsite.
Nicole Kelly (39:33):
Amazing.
Elana Frank (39:34):
And we had a clergy come, we had couples who
experienced infertility, we hadour male therapist who runs our
national male support group andyou know, I think one of the
themes of last night was likesharing that you care, but then
kind of backing off.
And you can ask, like, how can I?
(39:55):
Is there a way that you know Ican support you?
Um, do you want me to justdistract you during this time?
Do you want to go to a movieand not talk about anything to
you during this time?
Do you want to go to a movieand not talk about anything,
like for parents or likeintended grandparents?
Stop asking me if I've, youknow, thought of X, y and Z.
Of course I thought of X, y andZ.
(40:16):
Of course we're talking aboutit.
And stop asking me where we'reat in the process.
Like one time you can say I amhere for you whatever you need.
I think, like, if you're afamily member or friend, you
know what are things that aretriggering, like baby showers
and brises and kids' birthdayparties, siblings' birthday
(40:37):
kids' birthday parties, peopleyou love like it can be really
triggering.
So what can you do in a momentlike that, except if they say no
, thank you, I'm going to optout or sit out of this.
If they end up going to one ofthese events, like and you
recognize they're having a hardtime, you're the mom or the
friend or the sibling say hey,like do you want to come outside
(40:59):
for a minute, like be reallysupportive.
You know, check in and it'sokay if they don't respond.
Texting is welcome.
I mean I'll turn it back to youwhen you had your loss, what
was helpful and what was nothelpful.
Nicole Kelly (41:18):
I have friends that have consistently checked
in on me and none of them havechildren have consistently
checked in on me and none ofthem have children, and I feel
like that's helpful becausethey're coming from a place of
just being here for me, not frompersonal experience, and that's
been very helpful.
The clergy at my synagogue hadgreat suggestions and provided
(41:40):
support, you know, but also itjust it's time I mean, this
isn't necessarily you know,something that would kind of
cross over to infertility,because time doesn't help with
that.
But you know, just, things doget easier, hopefully, you know.
I know you probably deal with alot of people who have losses
as well, you know.
Um, so you know, grief is.
(42:00):
Grief is, uh, something that youkind of just have to work
through.
And grief for anything grieffor infertility, grief for
pregnancy loss, grief for adeath of someone that you
actually know it's not, you know, lean into it, I guess, is the
way that I deal with it.
You know I'd rather spend aweek feeling sad and feeling
than, you know, for five yearskind of have this weird thing
(42:23):
hanging over my head, you know.
So that's my, you know, two,five years kind of have this
weird thing hanging over my head, you know so.
So that's that's my.
You know two cents with that,um.
So I'm a big reader and if Iwas going through the process of
going through, you know,fertility treatments past what I
did, I would want to look atbooks and do some research
online.
So, other than your website,are there books and resources
that you direct people to?
Elana Frank (42:45):
I mean so I'm, I'm the opposite that's not where I
I prefer um really askingquestions, okay, um working with
doctors first of all tounderstand, like, are they the
right expert for you?
So there are doctors who arelike don't have the best bedside
(43:06):
manner, versus like going toshare everything with you.
Um, I like to do the researchabout that doctor.
There's a great site calledfertility IQ where you can
really like learn about thedoctor before you go.
I also recommend um like it'sokay to interview two doctors.
This is going to be they'regoing to be with you for the
(43:27):
long haul.
You need to trust them.
So I I don't know, this is justme personally I prefer to trust
the professionals than to comein with like Dr Google and be
like I want to do X, y and Z Interms of like understanding the
emotional side.
Same thing, like there are somany therapists in this space
(43:51):
who are certified in third-partyreproduction or reproduction.
Like we want to make sure thatthey have the training.
They don't just say theyspecialize in infertility, they
really understand.
And on our website, there'scertain criteria that we look
for um and then they're they'regreat now, like podcasts, and
(44:13):
they're great.
I have a podcast and they'regreat um websites where you can
really just learn, so I don'twant to knock any books no, no,
no, of course.
Over here.
You'll see I have a whole likelist and and we really encourage
um, encourage that like libraryof great.
(44:35):
But there's also so muchinformation coming out in other
ways today that I would alsolook into.
Nicole Kelly (44:42):
I'm also a fan of trusting your doctors.
I'm of the thought that if youdon't trust your doctors and
what they say, you should findanother doctor.
Elana Frank (44:51):
And I'm not saying don't ask questions.
Nicole Kelly (44:53):
No, of course, advocate for yourself, of course
, but lean into the medicalprofessional, because I know
there's a lot of people whothink they know better.
Like well, I saw this on theinternet, yes, but this person,
this is their job, but like,also, I was doing IUIs in the
basement of this guy's house.
Elana Frank (45:11):
It was weird and I should have.
I wouldn't have known to askthe questions now, but there's
so many resources today to kindof help you know what is sketchy
versus not and trust your gut.
Like when it comes to thosethings, trust your gut.
If it feels icky, likely, it isicky.
Nicole Kelly (45:28):
There's a happy medium, I think, between being
informed and trusting yourdoctors.
Yeah, so you mentioned yourpodcast, so what do you talk
about and how did that end uphappening?
Elana Frank (45:39):
Yeah, so I have really incredible conversations
with people, not necessarilyaround their own infertility
journey, but there is so muchgoing on in the femtech space,
which is the space where, like Iwas saying about, like Israeli
innovation, there's so muchinnovation happening today in
(46:02):
the reproductive space andthat's my jam.
I love hearing about anythingrelated to even adoption,
fostering like new innovation,innovative ways to grow your
family, and so we've had theopportunity to just have
incredible speakers share whatthey're doing, how they're
(46:23):
looking at things and howthey're really helping our
community.
Nicole Kelly (46:28):
I love.
I love the idea that specificfertility innovations I love
that a lot of that's coming fromIsrael, because a lot I know
and hopefully a lot of people doa lot of tech in general comes
from Israel.
So that's why I think the ideaof these banning Israeli
products is really ironic, aspeople are posting about it on
their iPhones where the chipsare made from.
(46:50):
It's just really funny to me.
So if someone is interested indonating to JFF or getting
involved as a volunteer, howwould they go about that?
Elana Frank (47:00):
Yeah, go online.
We make it very easy andaccessible.
We do operate because of ourdonors and our volunteer base.
All the information if you'rein one of our specific locations
, you can find our manager andstaff information on our website
.
Reach out.
I mean, we've met some of thebest people best donors, best
(47:22):
volunteers, sometimes both.
In that way, please just reachout or info.
I-n-f-o atjewishfertilityfoundationorg.
Nicole Kelly (47:31):
Amazing.
So this last part of theinterview is what I like to call
my version of the actor'sstudio.
So these are short formquestions, so you don't need to
go into big explanations unlessyou want to.
So the first question is iswhat is your favorite Yiddish
word?
Elana Frank (47:50):
Oh my God, I have like three boys.
Right now I'm trying to thinkSorry, hold on, give me one
second.
Nicole Kelly (47:59):
No, no, no.
Elana Frank (48:00):
I feel like my life revolves around poop and I'm
trying to be, but I like felling, like I.
Felling is when I really feellike my life revolves around
poop and I'm trying to be, but Ilike felling like I.
Felling is when I really feellike somebody in my world has
done something that just likemelts my heart.
I'll get away from the poop andjust like be proud.
Nicole Kelly (48:18):
What is your favorite Jewish holiday?
Elana Frank (48:22):
I think Rosh Hashanah coming up next week.
I think Rosh Hashanah coming upnext week.
I think it's just again abouthope and gratitude and looking
forward and kind of analyzingthe past year.
Nicole Kelly (48:33):
Which it goes along with what you do very
beautifully.
If you had a bat mitzvah todayand you had a big party, what
would the theme be?
Elana Frank (48:41):
Okay, my theme, can we just say, was telephones.
I am not that girl Like I thinkit would be about paying it
forward.
I really I'm doing a course ata philanthropy training at my
kid's school in sixth andseventh grade and it's all about
teaching our kids today aboutphilanthropy.
I don't care what intereststhem, it's understanding and
(49:04):
figuring out what their passionsare.
To pay it forward.
Nicole Kelly (49:08):
I love that.
I love pay it forward.
What profession other than yourown would you want to attempt?
Elana Frank (49:18):
I want to be a philanthropist.
I want to be on the other side.
I want to like to have anactual foundation to be able to
help people, help the people.
That would be really fun.
Nicole Kelly (49:35):
If heaven is real and God is there to welcome you,
what would you like to hear himsay?
Elana Frank (49:43):
Like you've done your best.
Oh, my God, you're going tomake me cry.
Nicole Kelly (49:46):
It's very contemplative, that question,
you know.
Elana Frank (49:49):
Yeah, like, like give me a hug and say you've
tried.
Nicole Kelly (49:55):
So is there anything else that we didn't
touch on?
That you want to talk aboutaspects of the organization,
something about your personalstory, your personal connection
to Judaism, anything like that?
Elana Frank (50:06):
No, I think you've done great.
I think really just making surepeople who are listening, if
they're going through it,they're not alone, and if people
on the other side want tosupport our cause, reach out.
Nicole Kelly (50:20):
Well, thank you so much for joining me.
This was Nicole Kelly and thisis she Brewing the City.
© transcript Emily Beynon.
Visiting a city for the first time and not sure
what to do.
A walking tour is a great placeto start.
Top Dog Tours is in Boston,Toronto, Philadelphia and New
York City.
To book a walking tour, you canvisit us at topdogtours.
com, and be sure to check outour social media accounts for
offers and discounts.
Hi, I'm Nicole Kelly and thisis Shebrew in the City, and
(00:33):
today I am talking to ElanaFrank, who is the founder and
CEO of the Jewish FertilityFoundation.
How are you doing today, Elana?
Elana Frank (00:42):
Good Thanks for having me.
Nicole Kelly (00:44):
Of course, this is a pleasure.
I just moved, so I lookterrible today, so I don't know
if we're going to be using thevideo on this.
Elana Frank (00:51):
Don't knock yourself, come on.
No, no, no.
Nicole Kelly (00:54):
It's because I can't find my makeup.
I don't know what I did with mymakeup and I try to judge
myself up a little bit, but Idon't think that's happening
today.
Elana Frank (01:02):
You look great, thank you.
Nicole Kelly (01:04):
So I usually start by asking my guests about where
they grew up, their Jewishupbringing, if they had any
those kind of things.
So can you tell me a little bitabout that?
Elana Frank (01:15):
Yeah, sure, I was born and raised in Atlanta,
georgia.
I have an Israeli father and auh, a Yaki or German mother.
Um, my dad is a first, um, he'san immigrant.
He came um 48 years ago.
I went to Jewish day school.
(01:37):
We were part of a synagogue,not not super observant, but
very, very traditional growingup.
Nicole Kelly (01:45):
Okay.
What part of Israel is yourfather from?
Elana Frank (01:50):
He grew up in Bat Yam oh okay.
And then his family moved alittle bit more north.
Nicole Kelly (01:56):
Okay, and why did he end up coming to the United
States?
Elana Frank (02:00):
Kind of crazy, especially with everything going
on now, but he was in anaccident in the army and was in
a coma for three days oh um,this is the famous story that he
woke up and he spoke english.
I'm not exactly sure how muchof that is true, but, um, from
that incident he knew he wantedto travel to america, get his
(02:22):
degree here, and he did, and henever left.
Nicole Kelly (02:25):
Oh wow, and your mom is from Germany or of German
descent.
Elana Frank (02:28):
No, German descent.
She grew up in WashingtonHeights, New York.
Nicole Kelly (02:32):
Oh, that's a little bit north of where I am
right now.
Elana Frank (02:34):
Ooh, yes, and her dad was a butcher.
They needed butchers in theSouth, so she came in high
school.
Nicole Kelly (02:41):
Okay.
Elana Frank (02:43):
Down to Atlanta.
Okay, so she came in highschool down to Atlanta.
Nicole Kelly (02:44):
Okay, do you know what part of Germany your
family's from?
Elana Frank (02:47):
Oh Lord, so my grandfather was from actually
Belgium.
Nicole Kelly (02:54):
Okay.
Elana Frank (02:59):
And then my grandmother I don't know exactly
in Germany, where she was from.
Horrible, horrible.
My grandmother came, who'sstill, thankfully, around 89
years old.
Horrible, horrible.
My grandmother came, who'sstill, thankfully, around 89
years old.
She came from when she was likethree.
And then my grandfather has ahorrible Auschwitz.
Parents shooed him away when hewas 13 and ended up coming to
(03:20):
America by himself.
Nicole Kelly (03:21):
Oh, my goodness.
Elana Frank (03:23):
Crazy stories.
I have a 13-year-old it's a.
It's a, it's crazy.
Nicole Kelly (03:27):
Yeah, no, no, no.
So you're a 4G.
I guess would be if your greatgrandparents were, uh, in the
Holocaust.
Elana Frank (03:34):
Yeah, so yeah, what it does to our generation,
that's a whole nother podcastepisode.
Nicole Kelly (03:39):
Yes, I'm very.
I just got into, uh, theprogram at Gratz for Holocaust
and Genocide Studies for mymaster's and I'm very interested
in the concept of generationaltrauma.
I've had a couple guests whoare 3Gs and there's a class I
can take that has to do with theeffect of, you know, relatives
(04:00):
being in the Holocaust, and thefamily unit is something I'm
super interested in.
I've taken.
Elana Frank (04:03):
A Bipolar yes, my family has serious bipolar.
We lost my aunt to suicide 10years ago.
She was the one who was asinterested and I really think
something in our DNA shifted andit's like it's in us.
Yeah, it's really sad andinteresting.
Nicole Kelly (04:25):
All right, so let's jump to something, maybe a
little bit happier.
I hope so.
Yeah, you spent some time inIsrael yourself.
Can you talk a little bit aboutwhat brought you over there and
what it was like living thereat the time?
Elana Frank (04:36):
Yeah, so we're talking now, almost 16 years ago
my husband and I met we gotmarried and I it was like in 20,
2009,.
Recession going on some, somehard economic times in in
America.
My husband had just moved fromIsrael in Jerusalem he's by way
(04:58):
of Chicago American and I waslike Jason, we let's go to
Israel.
Like we were having a hard timefiguring out our place.
We had met in Atlanta and wedidn't like Atlanta at that time
and I said, let's, let's do it.
He's like I'll go back, but Iwon't go to Jerusalem or Tel
Aviv.
We're going to be like pioneers, we're going to be Israelis
(05:22):
like the olden days.
And so I was like OK, whatever.
And so we actually lived in theNorth and we were part of Nefesh
B'Nefesh, a program that helpsimmigrants move, and we lived in
the mountains for five years.
We were Israeli like reallyliving, not the, you know, Anglo
(05:44):
life.
Nicole Kelly (05:45):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
That's crazy.
Why did you end up coming backto the United States?
Elana Frank (05:50):
So we actually had a good life in Israel.
We both had jobs in our field.
I mean, we had two cars, webought a house.
That's a big deal forimmigrants.
Nicole Kelly (05:58):
Yeah.
Elana Frank (05:59):
Many Israelis don't have two cars.
They aren't buying homes, butmy husband works in the casino
industry and he got recruitedback to America and we made our
way back.
Nicole Kelly (06:13):
And you ended up back in Atlanta.
Elana Frank (06:15):
Yes, so, no, so, by way of Atlantic City.
Nicole Kelly (06:19):
Okay.
Elana Frank (06:20):
I came back with a one-year-old and a six-week-old.
He didn't even have his shotsyet.
Long story, but we ended upnear Atlantic City and then
Cherry Hill.
He got recruited again in theBahamas and I said I love you
but I'm not moving to theBahamas.
Nicole Kelly (06:36):
Even the Chabad rabbi there.
Elana Frank (06:38):
I called him and he's like what kind of Jew are
you?
I'm like we're somewhatobservant.
He's like don't come.
He's like, if you want to raiseyour kids in an observant
lifestyle, bahamas is not theplace.
And so he commuted for a whilefrom Atlanta.
Nicole Kelly (06:54):
Oh my gosh, that's a commute.
Yes, it is, but you ended up inAtlanta, where you started from
.
Elana Frank (07:02):
Yeah, yeah, nice to be around family.
Nicole Kelly (07:05):
Yes, it's definitely a good thing.
So, speaking of you, know,coming from Israel with two
small children, the main thingthat I want to talk to you about
today is your journey withinfertility and you starting
this great organization.
So I want to start out bytalking about your personal
story involving infertility.
Elana Frank (07:26):
Yeah, well, israel is where my husband and I went
after we got married and thoughtwe were going to have a million
babies and it just did not goas planned.
We were also new immigrantsnavigating socialized medicine
in Israel, you know, figuringout how the system worked.
And I mean we had already beenmarried about a year by the time
(07:50):
we moved to Israel, so, and wewere not using birth control.
And after like three months ofreally trying, I didn't
understand what was going on.
Went to the gynecologistquickly.
She put me on Clomid.
Nothing was happening.
I thought I was going to getpregnant right away.
I was so excited, month aftermonth.
(08:10):
I remember my aunt is Israeli.
I remember my father's Israeli.
So we would go out with mycousins and all their kids
regularly and she would tell meIlana what's going on Like why
aren't you having kids?
And I'm like.
I didn't even know what to sayand I remember she's like do you
know how to have sex?
(08:31):
Like do you need to go on avacation.
There's really, do you need togo on a vacation and relax?
Like all the things that arethe worst things to say.
And I was like, well, maybe Idon't know how to have sex, like
I really was like, am I doingit wrong?
I don't know?
Like what is going on.
Ultimately she found us adoctor and I trusted her.
He was a professor, which is abig deal in Israel, and I wasn't
(08:56):
part of his insurance coverage.
But we're American, we're usedto writing checks, so we would
go to his house, his, hisprivate office at night, which
is not so uncommon.
But he started doing IUIs orlike the turkey baster method.
My husband would go to thebathroom do his business, come
out with sperm.
He would look under themicroscope in his house and then
(09:19):
I would get on the table aproper doctor's table and he
would put it in me.
Month after month we wouldwrite a check, but he never
checked my body.
He never did any medicalprocedures to check my body and
we felt like after a whilesomething was weird.
But we wanted a baby andultimately, after time wasted
time we're like let's get asecond opinion.
(09:41):
And we did, and my tubes areblocked.
I am not going to get pregnantthrough an IUI.
If anything, I could have anectopic pregnancy which is scary
.
Nicole Kelly (09:52):
Very dangerous.
Elana Frank (09:53):
And I just it was such wasted money and wasted
time and I didn't know anybetter.
I mean, just at that time therewas like no resources online.
There was a baby center which Icouldn't connect to and
(10:13):
ultimately I was able to findthis great doctor and because I
lived in Israel and because theyvalue families and reproductive
access and they have socializedmedicine, I was able to do IVF
for free and ended up with twochildren through the process.
Nicole Kelly (10:27):
Wow, ivf is extremely expensive.
It's kind of crazy that it isno cost in Israel and it's such
a contentious issue right now.
Even with it costing like$30,000 to get IVF, I have.
I I took Clomid to get pregnantwith my daughter and the
pregnancy that um, and thatunfortunately ended, uh, back in
(10:51):
July.
So I have a little bit ofinsight into kind of what you
went through and but I knewgoing into it that there were
problems because I don't ovulateregularly.
So even before we got pregnantI was kind of mentally prepared
to go through the whole processbut thankfully Clomid worked the
first month for my daughter.
So, um, like the base level thebasis level, the lowest level
(11:15):
of fertility treatments, is whatI was on Um, but it's, it's
scary, you know, like facingthat and not knowing what's
wrong, and I think it'ssomething that affects so many
people.
So this organization youstarted is amazing.
Can we talk about what inspiredthat and how that all happened?
Elana Frank (11:31):
Yeah, I mean, listen, in Israel it was free,
which is huge.
It's tremendous.
Also, I went through over ayear of having to go to work,
where I worked at an immigrantyouth village.
It was a religious community, Imean people.
It's Israel also, so they haveno, no filters.
(11:53):
Um, and people were like and Iwas gaining weight, I was on
medications while I was doing.
Nicole Kelly (11:58):
IUI.
Elana Frank (11:58):
Like people were literally like asking me number
one are you pregnant?
Because I was gaining weight.
What's going on?
Like I would really not wait solong.
Like people love to give theiropinions.
Nicole Kelly (12:09):
And like.
Elana Frank (12:09):
I didn't know what to say.
It was really hard.
It was super hard with myhusband and our marriage.
He wanted to make me happy andget me a baby and I was broken,
like I didn't know what to do.
And you know, just connectingwith people back in America like
who are all having their babiesand you know not, them not
(12:30):
wanting to say something to mebecause they didn't know I
wasn't really talking about it,but like I also wasn't pregnant,
like what, who?
Who gets married at my age anddoesn't want to have a family in
our community?
Like right away, that's justwasn't who I was, um, and I was.
(12:52):
So I didn't know how to talk tomy family, like my family back
in America, um, so, even thoughit was amazing what Israel
offered, when I came back toAmerica with two babies, I was
sitting in a baby pool at a JCCwith some old friends from
growing up and they had their.
One person had twins, anotherperson had one child and we
(13:14):
started talking about IVF andthey're like, yeah, these are my
$80,000 twins, these are my.
You know, this is my child Ispent so much money on.
Nicole Kelly (13:22):
Yeah.
Elana Frank (13:22):
And I was like, well, I did IVF too and it was
free.
And just hearing this sparkedan idea.
We're almost 10 years ago nowand I was like, wow, I've been
in nonprofit my whole life,fundraising or doing community
organizing and coalitionbuilding.
Wouldn't it be great if I couldhelp these people financially?
(13:42):
And that's kind of where theidea started.
Nicole Kelly (13:45):
That's crazy $88,000.
Elana Frank (13:47):
They must have gone through two or three rounds if
that was just because you do IVFdoes not guarantee a child at
the end.
You have to.
Sometimes there's surgeryinvolved.
Sometimes you know lots ofthings can be part of the
process.
Nicole Kelly (14:01):
Yeah, I think that's a common misconception
that IVF works a hundred percentof the time, because even
during egg retrieval might notget enough.
You know there's so manydifferent steps to the process
that there's something that canI don't want to say go wrong,
that cannot go perfectly, thatwould not.
You know.
The outcome would not be a baby.
I think that's a hugemisconception a lot of people
(14:21):
have with any fertilitytreatment, but definitely with
IVF.
Have, yeah, with any fertilitytreatment, but definitely with
IVF.
So do you, do you have,statistically, just in case
people are curious, whatpercentage of families
experience some form ofinfertility?
Elana Frank (14:34):
So when I started in the biz it was one in eight
and we would always nationally.
So we would always.
Our doctors would share with usthat actually within the Jewish
community it's a little bithigher, closer to one in six.
Nicole Kelly (14:48):
Really For various reasons.
Elana Frank (14:49):
Listen, like we're genetically a smaller population
, we're marrying each other.
There's some genetic factorsinvolved.
Also, we're a population thatis educated, so we're going to
college, we're going to gradschool, then we're trying to get
married and have babies andunfortunately biology does not
wait and those contribute tothose factors.
(15:11):
But actually I think two yearsago the statistics changed and
nationally the rate is one insix.
So still I think in the Jewishcommunity it is more prevalent.
But that's where we're atthat's a pretty high number.
Nicole Kelly (15:30):
Yeah, that's you know I I feel like correct me if
I'm wrong.
My husband told me once thatmen are less fertile than of
this generation, less fertilethan their grandfathers were,
for various reasons because, uh,male and male factor
infertility is also somethingthat I think people don't
realize Usually, unfortunately,they blame the woman.
(15:50):
There's something wrong withthe woman, but.
But the father also plays alittle bit, a little bit of a
part in in that as well.
Elana Frank (15:58):
It's actually like you break it into four there's
female factor, male factor,there's unexplained and then
there's male and female, don'tmesh up together.
So it's like one fourth, onefourth.
So really it's not, it's reallynot a woman's issue.
Nicole Kelly (16:14):
Yeah, yeah.
I think it's important to tospread that information because,
you know, people tend to blamewomen for a lot of things,
including this, which I think isincorrect and unfair.
So, going back to Jewishcouples in particular, why do
you think the infertilityjourney can be especially
difficult for Jewish couples?
Elana Frank (16:33):
Yeah, so, and I'll correct you by saying couples,
because we do work withindividuals.
Nicole Kelly (16:39):
Okay, perfect.
Elana Frank (16:40):
Yeah, I mean single moms by choice, even single
dads by choice.
Now it's really a huge growingpopulation and you know it's
part of our culture, you knowour first of all, like starting
with intended grandparents, likenew what are?
we going to have the grandkidslike.
Think about all the holidaysthat are coming up right now.
What is Passover?
(17:01):
Passover is telling yourchildren the story of how we
left Egypt.
Everything in our culture, evenif you're not super observant,
is we're a family based cultureand the pressure is on.
I mean be fruitful and multiply, Right, that's like.
That's who we are.
You were talking about theHolocaust.
(17:23):
Like it's our job to you knowbuild back the Jewish community.
But what if you can't?
How does that feel?
Nicole Kelly (17:31):
Yeah, no, that makes a lot of sense.
So, going back to JFF, whatresources do you provide to
those experiencing infertilityor, as you said, choosing to be
single moms or single dads bychoice?
Elana Frank (17:46):
So we say, on their path to parenthood.
So we offer three main services.
One is financial assistance,Two is emotional support and
three are educational trainings.
So the first, financialassistance money, really really
important.
We offer one IUI grant of$1,000.
(18:08):
Sucks are going through this Hugfrom the Jewish community.
It is not needs-based.
And then we offer up to sorryup to $10,000 grants.
With all of the grants comes adiscount of up to 20% from the
fertility clinic in yourcommunity.
Okay, and then we partner withlocal interest-free loan
(18:31):
associations, Because even ifyou're getting our maximum grant
and the clinic discount, it'sstill not going to cover
everything.
So, we really want to make itaccessible.
And then, in terms of emotionalsupport, we offer a
(18:56):
peer-to-peer mentorship program,a Fertility Buddies program,
which is now national, open toanybody anywhere in the US, and
we offer local support groups aswell as national peer-to-peer
support.
Nicole Kelly (19:04):
Yeah, you mentioned that the Buddies is
nationally.
I know that the clinics andyou're in specific cities, so
can you tell me what you knowfor people listening if they're
interested in your organization?
What cities you're currently in?
Elana Frank (19:18):
Sure, you're putting me on the spot.
I'm sorry.
I should know this by heart.
I'm going to Jewish FertilityFoundation.
Nicole Kelly (19:25):
If you've got more than enough cities that you
can't remember, then that's agood thing.
Elana Frank (19:29):
Good problem.
So we are in specificcommunities nationally where we
go really, really deep in thosecommunities, but we also have a
national program so you are ableto join for emotional support
and education, regardless whereyou're living.
All right, I'll give you therundown Atlanta, birmingham,
(19:50):
cincinnati, cleveland, denver,detroit, greater DC, maryland,
dc, virginia, miami, pittsburghand then national.
Nicole Kelly (20:01):
Wow, how long has it taken you to get to this many
cities?
The entire decade.
Elana Frank (20:08):
No, we started scaling.
We wanted to really understandour services and our model, so
we opened in 2015 and we startedexpanding piloting in 2019.
Once we figured it out like forthe past four years we've been
growing, that's a pretty quickexpansion for an organization
(20:29):
yeah, I mean it's been awonderful process.
Also, I am excited to take 2025,our 10th year, to take a pause.
We want to go and understandour listen.
We figured out the model ofgoing into a city.
Are there other opportunitiesto help more people nationally
(20:50):
and we've been a direct serviceorganization for all these years
?
In order to grow and help morepeople, we need to also be a
fundraising organization.
Yes, that is the 2025 pivot andfocus in order for us to really
make a deeper impact.
I have a dream of helpingpeople from a financial
(21:14):
perspective to really grow ourimpact and how much money and
how many people we're helping.
Nicole Kelly (21:22):
It's nonprofits that cost a lot of money to run.
I took some extension coursesat ucla a long time ago a
non-profit fundraising and it isa whole machine to keep an
organization running.
You mentioned the buddiesprogram.
Um is available nationally.
Can you tell me a little bitmore about that?
Elana Frank (21:41):
yeah, sure.
So the idea is that, um, we alot, we love our social workers,
we love our therapist in-house.
We have a program that wecreated and the idea is that
listen when you're going throughthis.
Sometimes you don't want toreach out to your close friends
and family all the time.
Maybe it feels a burden, ormaybe you want somebody who just
(22:02):
gets what you're going through.
And so we created a program.
It's not about the veteran wecall them the person who's on
the other side.
It's about you, the personwho's experiencing infertility
and what you're going through.
And so we try to match upsomebody for this approximately
year-long journey, and they canbe anyone to you Like you guys
(22:29):
can kind of set your ownboundaries and expectations.
Are you grabbing coffee monthly?
Are you talking on the phoneweekly?
Do you just need to text everyonce in a while?
Do you want them to come toappointments with you, like,
really understanding who theyare and what they are?
Ideally, the geography will bewhere close to where you live,
and the diagnosis should besimilar.
(22:51):
Gender should be similar.
And now we have off, we havejust opened it up nationally,
meaning really, in thiswonderful world of the worldwide
web and zoom and phone andtexting Yep, there are
opportunities.
I do think it's best to belocal and have the opportunity
(23:12):
to meet in person, but that'snot available for everybody.
We want to give an opportunityto those who are not in our
communities to also benefit fromthis, really this support.
Nicole Kelly (23:25):
Yeah, no, I having gone through a loss in July, um
, like under a very specificcircumstance, it I, I'm.
I don't know anybody who's gonethrough what I went through.
So, it can be really helpfuljust to have someone, even for
just like a check-in, whodoesn't even need to talk about
it.
But you know, they know whatyou're going through, so you
(23:45):
don't feel so alone.
Elana Frank (23:47):
You need to register now.
Literally go to our website andjust sign up for a buddy Again,
it's not selfish, it's like weget it and there are people who
can really support you throughthis time.
Nicole Kelly (23:59):
Oh, so you talked about the different types of
people who work with yourorganization.
You mentioned doctors andsocial workers.
What kind of team works?
You know, cohesive team workswith the people who take
advantage of your organization.
Elana Frank (24:15):
Sure.
So the structure of ourorganization is we're a
non-profit, first and foremost.
We have a board of directors.
We work a lot with localvolunteers.
I have an executive committee,or executive team, I should say
and then in each of ourlocations we have a local
manager.
The manager is not providingthe direct services.
(24:35):
What they're doing is they'reintroducing the client to the
right services.
So if they need to go meet atherapist at a support group,
they're going to make sure thatthey have that information.
If they're going to work with avolunteer for the Fertility
Buddies program, they'll hookthem up and they help them
(24:56):
through the grant applicationprocess.
We have a financialqualifications committee that is
assessing the grants from afinancial point of view and a
medical advisory council who isworking number one to keep us up
to date with what's going onfrom the medical world.
It's changing rapidly andthey're also looking at two
(25:16):
things when we're consideringoffering a grant the likelihood
of pregnancy and the likelihoodof having residual embryos or
extra embryos to put in thefreezer because, that process is
less expensive.
And then we love our graduateschool social work interns.
(25:38):
That's a program we startednine years ago with different
graduate schools in New York,with different graduate schools
in New York, in Georgia allaround.
Nicole Kelly (25:51):
I think that's it.
Yeah, if someone was interestedin, like you said, being a grad
student volunteer, would theybe not volunteer working as a
social worker with yourorganization?
Where would they findinformation on that?
Elana Frank (26:05):
Yeah, sure, so they probably would do it through
their graduate program.
Okay, they would need todevelop that relationship.
They have a coordinator andwe're open at this point to you
know, outside of our like totalking with students we really
rely right now we have three.
(26:26):
We really love working withthem.
I mean it's a seriouscommitment, it's a serious job
and it's also part of their.
You know their curriculum inorder to graduate from the
program.
But just they need to speakwith their coordinator at their
program.
Nicole Kelly (26:43):
Cool.
So jumping to something alittle more political, um,
because you know, anythinginvolving uteruses and babies
has now, unfortunately, becomepolitical.
What are your thoughts onregulations regarding fertility
treatments?
Because I know right now theyreally don't exist.
And you know, we hear aboutsensationalized stories of a
(27:03):
single sperm donor fatheringhundreds of people.
My husband had a guest on oneof our tours that is her father.
It was the doctor who helpedher mother get pregnant, was the
father of hundreds of kids, andit leads to all sorts of
problems and concerns.
So what are your thoughts onhaving regulations within the
fertility industry?
Elana Frank (27:25):
So Jewish Fertility Foundation is not a political
organization.
What we do is to make sure thatour clients have access to
information in order to make thebest decisions, and so we
really rely on American Societyof Reproductive Medicine and
resolve to be the four, you know, in the forefront of working
(27:50):
with decision makers, and youknow like when everything was
going on in February in Alabamaand fertility clinics were
closing we actually have anoffice in Alabama and I mean the
doctors in our clinics werecalling us the night before they
were going to have to shuttheir doors, like, can you help
(28:11):
us?
What we very quickly were ableto pivot and do is offer direct
support that's what we do andmake sure that the people who
are currently going throughtheir treatment could quickly
come and pivot to Atlanta right,like we didn't want to deal
with everything going on.
We're very solution oriented.
Nicole Kelly (28:32):
What can?
Elana Frank (28:32):
we do the next day.
We got our attorneys, our localattorneys, on an Instagram with
hundreds of people.
This is the situation we don'tknow what's going on.
We know that even the doctors,at this stage, aren't returning
phone calls because legally,they don't know what's going on
and we just put information outthere and keep our clients
(28:55):
updated, and so that was veryreactive what we do today.
We actually just got a grantfrom the Jewish Women's Fund of
Atlanta to do just this.
We want to be proactive inunderstanding well, what are
some of the states that aresafer right now?
Do people need to be movingtheir embryos?
(29:15):
Should we not be creatingembryos?
There are lots of questionsthat are coming up.
We follow the guidelines ofASRM and Resolve, and you know
the people who are doing theadvocacy, but really work with
our clients to share what'sgoing on.
And then one of the pieces thatwe're using some of our grant
(29:36):
funds for are is reallytestimonials.
That's what reporters andnewspapers have been really
interested in is really gettingthe word out that, like you know
, our community, the fertilitycommunity, abortion is part of
our language, unfortunately,even for very wanted people
(30:00):
babies and pregnancies andlosses and you know access to
treatment and really justsharing actual human stories of
family building is how weapproach that space.
Nicole Kelly (30:15):
Gotcha.
So I saw that your website haspostpartum support resources.
As me personally, as someonewho's dealt with severe
postpartum, I know how importantthis issue is as a fertility
organization.
Why do you think this isimportant to provide for
families after the birth?
(30:36):
Because really you know on thesurface what it looks like
you're focusing on is gettingpeople pregnant.
At that you know.
Then maybe that should be theend of it, so why do you
continue resources after apregnancy has started and has
ended in birth?
Elana Frank (30:51):
I mean, you know we want, just like we want to
bring in healthy babies into theworld and we really promote
genetic screening andorganizations like J-Screen.
It's the same.
How can you not support thefamily post-birth Our work is in
the middle and really trying tohelp families grow their
(31:11):
families but to not be able topass along resources to our moms
when there's real, you know,postpartum, post, you know,
anxiety disorders that arise,would be really scary for us.
So it's very important for usto share resources, make sure
(31:32):
that moms know it's okay andwhen they need to seek help and
what other resources areavailable after.
Nicole Kelly (31:39):
And even beyond that.
Let's say, you know someonereceives a grant from you.
They have a successful birth.
If they would like to continueto grow their family, are they
able to come back to yourorganization?
Elana Frank (31:50):
Yeah, we do offer up to two grants and we do
support secondary infertility.
Nicole Kelly (31:56):
Can you explain what secondary infertility is
Secondary?
Elana Frank (31:59):
infertility.
So perhaps you even had.
You know you had sex and yougot pregnant with your first or
second, and then all of a sudden, you want additional children.
We're happy and you're nothaving success.
We're happy to step in ifneeded.
Nicole Kelly (32:18):
Great.
Your website also gives sometips on how to handle going to
the mikvah during infertility.
Can you talk a little bit aboutthe mitzvah of going to the
mikvah and why this might bedifficult for those going
through infertility?
Elana Frank (32:33):
Yeah, as somebody who observes family purity lots
of rules there but when I wastrying to get pregnant for all
three of my children, I would goto the mikvah and ritually
immerse once a month andremember I was trying to get
pregnant for so many years andit's exhausting and emotional
(32:59):
and every time I would go thereas a reminder that I got my
period and I'm not pregnant.
It sucked and to have people whoperhaps didn't understand that
as part of the mikvah communityit was really disappointing.
We've done a lot of trainingsfor the observant community,
(33:19):
which has been helpful andwell-received, but also one of
the things that we do that's sospecial for perhaps the
non-orthodox community is, oralso the orthodox community is
something we call the ninthmonth dunk, and there are
certain cities that havecommunity mikvahs where somebody
who maybe haven't hasn't everbeen to the mikvah can, somebody
(33:44):
in their ninth month can dunkfor, you know, an easy labor, an
easy birth and then anonymouslyfollowing somebody struggling
with infertility, can dunk rightafter them and there's certain
special prayers that have beencreated really connecting you in
this moment of hope, and it's abeautiful ritual.
(34:06):
I did it when I was pregnant inmy ninth month.
I did it before I was pregnant.
It really is just a momentwhere you can like connect with
all the matriarchs who struggledwith infertility and kind of
just feel hopeful.
Nicole Kelly (34:23):
Now that you're bringing it up.
Yes, infertility is a themewith the matriarch, so it's
something that I think has beenaddressed within Judaism for
thousands of years.
So what you're doing iscontinuing that and it's a.
It's a really beautiful thing.
No, no, no, no, it's not new,it's just we have resources to
assist with that.
I, I don't know what we werewatching, but I was thinking
(34:44):
about, you know the.
You know millions of people whoare never able to have children
because the, the medicine,didn't exist at the time, and it
was actually curious about,like, the population growth in
regards to fertility treatments.
I'm sure if somebody haswritten a paper on that
somewhere, I could find.
Elana Frank (35:02):
I don't have an answer.
Nicole Kelly (35:04):
No, no, I don't know.
I know It'd be interestingbecause you know, I feel like
you know, historically it's likethey never had children.
You know, for example, like agoverness, like George
Washington and his wife neverhad children because the theory
is that he had a childhoodillness that made him infertile.
Maybe if he was born, you know,in 1993, you know in 1993, you
(35:28):
know that that would have beendifferent.
Elana Frank (35:29):
So it's interesting that there are great procedures
to remove sperm right now.
Nicole Kelly (35:32):
Really.
Elana Frank (35:33):
There are some, really there's a lot of
innovation actually out ofIsrael.
Nicole Kelly (35:37):
Really.
Elana Frank (35:37):
Yeah, very interesting.
Nicole Kelly (35:39):
It makes sense that Israel will be kind of the
innovator in that because youknow, as we talked about Jews
and babies being a huge thing.
So, going back to the religiousaspect of what you know, your
organization working with theclergy you have tips on your
site as well about how theclergy members can help people
who are experiencing infertility.
I think it is so important tobe able to lean on clergy in
(36:01):
difficult times.
I love the clergy at mysynagogue and when we lost our
baby in July, it was like one ofthe first things that we did
was to reach out to our head.
Rabbi.
Have you found that most peoplearen't comfortable going to
their clergy members, that theclergy is maybe not necessarily
knowing what to say?
Why provide tips, you know, andadditional?
Elana Frank (36:21):
support.
So yes to all of that.
Yes, sometimes people do notfeel comfortable going to their
clergy.
Sometimes people you know wework a lot in the interfaith
population unaffiliated, likepeople, don't have clergy to go
to.
And I think that in you know theearly days, we love our
(36:43):
synagogues and the relationshipswe've created.
Also, clergy are used tooffering pastoral care.
This is not something new tothem, but there was a gap.
There is a gap sometimes in theinformation they know to offer,
and so you know everything fromlike basic biology of making a
(37:05):
baby is something that we try toreally educate, because it's
not always basic Right.
There are other just speakingthe language of the infertile,
like what other alternativesthere are, and most of them are
totally fine in the Jewishcommunity.
Understanding that,understanding perhaps what is
(37:28):
helpful to say and what isn'thelpful to say and, most
importantly, knowing that thereare resources out there and
where to guide your audience, isreally important.
Nicole Kelly (37:40):
So I want to touch on two things you just
mentioned.
You say you work a lot with theinterfaith community, so what
are the I guess qualificationsyou have to have to apply
Because both partners don't haveto be Jewish.
How does that work?
Elana Frank (37:52):
Yeah, sure.
So we accept the reformmovement's definition of who is
a Jew.
Nicole Kelly (37:56):
Okay.
Elana Frank (37:57):
And so true, one of the partners needs to be Jewish
.
Listen, you need to raise yourkid Jewish.
Whatever that means to you isfine with us.
There is absolutely, you know,background information that we
ask for in terms ofunderstanding what your thoughts
(38:17):
are about raising this childLike.
We want to make sure that thereis a Jewish continuity element
to all of this, and I'm shockedwe just actually did a research
project with a consulting agencyabout the impact that we're
having within the interfaithpopulation, who are mostly
(38:38):
feeling isolated from thetraditional Jewish community,
and we're bringing them in at areally critical time in their
life, providing them a Jewishexperience, sometimes their
first, and then, you know,they're going on to really
understand the Jewishcommunities there for them.
We're introducing them toJewish people, jewish friends,
(39:01):
other Jewish organizations, andthe findings were really, really
validating and fascinating andhopeful.
Nicole Kelly (39:10):
That's beautiful.
Second thing you kind oftouched upon what not to say.
So let's say I'm not goingthrough infertility, but I know
someone who is.
What are some ways that peoplecan support family and friends
who are experiencing infertility, and what should they not say
or do?
Elana Frank (39:27):
Yeah, I'd say we actually just did a national
program last night.
That is recorded and on ourwebsite.
Nicole Kelly (39:33):
Amazing.
Elana Frank (39:34):
And we had a clergy come, we had couples who
experienced infertility, we hadour male therapist who runs our
national male support group andyou know, I think one of the
themes of last night was likesharing that you care, but then
kind of backing off.
And you can ask, like, how can I?
(39:55):
Is there a way that you know Ican support you?
Um, do you want me to justdistract you during this time?
Do you want to go to a movieand not talk about anything to
you during this time?
Do you want to go to a movieand not talk about anything,
like for parents or likeintended grandparents?
Stop asking me if I've, youknow, thought of X, y and Z.
Of course I thought of X, y andZ.
(40:16):
Of course we're talking aboutit.
And stop asking me where we'reat in the process.
Like one time you can say I amhere for you whatever you need.
I think, like, if you're afamily member or friend, you
know what are things that aretriggering, like baby showers
and brises and kids' birthdayparties, siblings' birthday
(40:37):
kids' birthday parties, peopleyou love like it can be really
triggering.
So what can you do in a momentlike that, except if they say no
, thank you, I'm going to optout or sit out of this.
If they end up going to one ofthese events, like and you
recognize they're having a hardtime, you're the mom or the
friend or the sibling say hey,like do you want to come outside
(40:59):
for a minute, like be reallysupportive.
You know, check in and it'sokay if they don't respond.
Texting is welcome.
I mean I'll turn it back to youwhen you had your loss, what
was helpful and what was nothelpful.
Nicole Kelly (41:18):
I have friends that have consistently checked
in on me and none of them havechildren have consistently
checked in on me and none ofthem have children, and I feel
like that's helpful becausethey're coming from a place of
just being here for me, not frompersonal experience, and that's
been very helpful.
The clergy at my synagogue hadgreat suggestions and provided
(41:40):
support, you know, but also itjust it's time I mean, this
isn't necessarily you know,something that would kind of
cross over to infertility,because time doesn't help with
that.
But you know, just, things doget easier, hopefully, you know.
I know you probably deal with alot of people who have losses
as well, you know.
Um, so you know, grief is.
(42:00):
Grief is, uh, something that youkind of just have to work
through.
And grief for anything grieffor infertility, grief for
pregnancy loss, grief for adeath of someone that you
actually know it's not, you know, lean into it, I guess, is the
way that I deal with it.
You know I'd rather spend aweek feeling sad and feeling
than, you know, for five yearskind of have this weird thing
(42:23):
hanging over my head, you know.
So that's my, you know, two,five years kind of have this
weird thing hanging over my head, you know so.
So that's that's my.
You know two cents with that,um.
So I'm a big reader and if Iwas going through the process of
going through, you know,fertility treatments past what I
did, I would want to look atbooks and do some research
online.
So, other than your website,are there books and resources
that you direct people to?
Elana Frank (42:45):
I mean so I'm, I'm the opposite that's not where I
I prefer um really askingquestions, okay, um working with
doctors first of all tounderstand, like, are they the
right expert for you?
So there are doctors who arelike don't have the best bedside
(43:06):
manner, versus like going toshare everything with you.
Um, I like to do the researchabout that doctor.
There's a great site calledfertility IQ where you can
really like learn about thedoctor before you go.
I also recommend um like it'sokay to interview two doctors.
This is going to be they'regoing to be with you for the
(43:27):
long haul.
You need to trust them.
So I I don't know, this is justme personally I prefer to trust
the professionals than to comein with like Dr Google and be
like I want to do X, y and Z Interms of like understanding the
emotional side.
Same thing, like there are somany therapists in this space
(43:51):
who are certified in third-partyreproduction or reproduction.
Like we want to make sure thatthey have the training.
They don't just say theyspecialize in infertility, they
really understand.
And on our website, there'scertain criteria that we look
for um and then they're they'regreat now, like podcasts, and
(44:13):
they're great.
I have a podcast and they'regreat um websites where you can
really just learn, so I don'twant to knock any books no, no,
no, of course.
Over here.
You'll see I have a whole likelist and and we really encourage
um, encourage that like libraryof great.
(44:35):
But there's also so muchinformation coming out in other
ways today that I would alsolook into.
Nicole Kelly (44:42):
I'm also a fan of trusting your doctors.
I'm of the thought that if youdon't trust your doctors and
what they say, you should findanother doctor.
Elana Frank (44:51):
And I'm not saying don't ask questions.
Nicole Kelly (44:53):
No, of course, advocate for yourself, of course
, but lean into the medicalprofessional, because I know
there's a lot of people whothink they know better.
Like well, I saw this on theinternet, yes, but this person,
this is their job, but like,also, I was doing IUIs in the
basement of this guy's house.
Elana Frank (45:11):
It was weird and I should have.
I wouldn't have known to askthe questions now, but there's
so many resources today to kindof help you know what is sketchy
versus not and trust your gut.
Like when it comes to thosethings, trust your gut.
If it feels icky, likely, it isicky.
Nicole Kelly (45:28):
There's a happy medium, I think, between being
informed and trusting yourdoctors.
Yeah, so you mentioned yourpodcast, so what do you talk
about and how did that end uphappening?
Elana Frank (45:39):
Yeah, so I have really incredible conversations
with people, not necessarilyaround their own infertility
journey, but there is so muchgoing on in the femtech space,
which is the space where, like Iwas saying about, like Israeli
innovation, there's so muchinnovation happening today in
(46:02):
the reproductive space andthat's my jam.
I love hearing about anythingrelated to even adoption,
fostering like new innovation,innovative ways to grow your
family, and so we've had theopportunity to just have
incredible speakers share whatthey're doing, how they're
(46:23):
looking at things and howthey're really helping our
community.
Nicole Kelly (46:28):
I love.
I love the idea that specificfertility innovations I love
that a lot of that's coming fromIsrael, because a lot I know
and hopefully a lot of people doa lot of tech in general comes
from Israel.
So that's why I think the ideaof these banning Israeli
products is really ironic, aspeople are posting about it on
their iPhones where the chipsare made from.
(46:50):
It's just really funny to me.
So if someone is interested indonating to JFF or getting
involved as a volunteer, howwould they go about that?
Elana Frank (47:00):
Yeah, go online.
We make it very easy andaccessible.
We do operate because of ourdonors and our volunteer base.
All the information if you'rein one of our specific locations
, you can find our manager andstaff information on our website
.
Reach out.
I mean, we've met some of thebest people best donors, best
(47:22):
volunteers, sometimes both.
In that way, please just reachout or info.
I-n-f-o atjewishfertilityfoundationorg.
Nicole Kelly (47:31):
Amazing.
So this last part of theinterview is what I like to call
my version of the actor'sstudio.
So these are short formquestions, so you don't need to
go into big explanations unlessyou want to.
So the first question is iswhat is your favorite Yiddish
word?
Elana Frank (47:50):
Oh my God, I have like three boys.
Right now I'm trying to thinkSorry, hold on, give me one
second.
Nicole Kelly (47:59):
No, no, no.
Elana Frank (48:00):
I feel like my life revolves around poop and I'm
trying to be, but I like felling, like I.
Felling is when I really feellike my life revolves around
poop and I'm trying to be, but Ilike felling like I.
Felling is when I really feellike somebody in my world has
done something that just likemelts my heart.
I'll get away from the poop andjust like be proud.
Nicole Kelly (48:18):
What is your favorite Jewish holiday?
Elana Frank (48:22):
I think Rosh Hashanah coming up next week.
I think Rosh Hashanah coming upnext week.
I think it's just again abouthope and gratitude and looking
forward and kind of analyzingthe past year.
Nicole Kelly (48:33):
Which it goes along with what you do very
beautifully.
If you had a bat mitzvah todayand you had a big party, what
would the theme be?
Elana Frank (48:41):
Okay, my theme, can we just say, was telephones.
I am not that girl Like I thinkit would be about paying it
forward.
I really I'm doing a course ata philanthropy training at my
kid's school in sixth andseventh grade and it's all about
teaching our kids today aboutphilanthropy.
I don't care what intereststhem, it's understanding and
(49:04):
figuring out what their passionsare.
To pay it forward.
Nicole Kelly (49:08):
I love that.
I love pay it forward.
What profession other than yourown would you want to attempt?
Elana Frank (49:18):
I want to be a philanthropist.
I want to be on the other side.
I want to like to have anactual foundation to be able to
help people, help the people.
That would be really fun.
Nicole Kelly (49:35):
If heaven is real and God is there to welcome you,
what would you like to hear himsay?
Elana Frank (49:43):
Like you've done your best.
Oh, my God, you're going tomake me cry.
Nicole Kelly (49:46):
It's very contemplative, that question,
you know.
Elana Frank (49:49):
Yeah, like, like give me a hug and say you've
tried.
Nicole Kelly (49:55):
So is there anything else that we didn't
touch on?
That you want to talk aboutaspects of the organization,
something about your personalstory, your personal connection
to Judaism, anything like that?
Elana Frank (50:06):
No, I think you've done great.
I think really just making surepeople who are listening, if
they're going through it,they're not alone, and if people
on the other side want tosupport our cause, reach out.
Nicole Kelly (50:20):
Well, thank you so much for joining me.
This was Nicole Kelly and thisis she Brewing the City.
© transcript Emily Beynon.
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