"Don't Dream It, Be It" - An Interview with Rabbi-Cantor Judy Greenfeld - Shebrew in the City

Episode Transcript
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Nicole Kelly (00:01):
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Hello, I'm Nicole Kelly andthis is Shebrew in the City, and

(00:33):
tonight I am having aconversation with Rabbi- Cantor
Judy Greenfeld, which I'mexcited because I've never
talked to you at all.
So I'm excited to learn so muchabout you and your story.
How are you tonight?

Judy Greenfeld (00:44):
I am doing wonderful.
How are you doing tonight?

I'm doing good.
Like I said, I've had a busyday but I feel like I still have
a lot of energy, so that'sgreat for an interview.
So I always start off by askingabout my guest's background,
where they're from, how theywere raised, how religious kind
of all the regular stuff.
So spiel me with that.

Okay, so I grew up in Cleveland, ohio Yay,
cleveland and I lived there for18 years, went to college and
went to school in Arizona andthen met my husband there my
ex-husband there and moved toLos Angeles where I lived for 40
years and now I'm in Texas foreight months.

Oh my goodness, what part of LA.

First Encino, a lot of different places, Studio
City, Encino and now Westwood.

My parents.
I'm originally from Northridge.
So my parents live like fiveminutes from CSUN, Okay so you
know where Heschel is.

Yes, oh yeah, that's right, I went to TRZ so.

Jewish geography was all like there's like five
of us.
That's really funny.

Anyway, I grew up very conservative.
I grew up in a conservativehousehold.
Shabbat on Friday nights wentto Hebrew school after school
from age first grade to boysixth grade and then went to
Hebrew high school after schooltwo to three days a week and so
I could read Hebrew and that'sreally what they focused on back

(02:19):
then and we were taught bymostly by Israelis and old
ladies.

I had an old Israeli lady, though looking
back she might not have beenthat old Right, she might have
been in her like early 50s, butshe's very ancient at the time.

And I.
I didn't find a lot ofspirituality in conservative
Judaism.
In fact I found that it wasrather on the hypocritical side.
I felt that there was a lot ofdogma, patriarchy that I wasn't
thrilled with, so I was a littleturned off to it, especially

(03:01):
when I was 16, my father wasmurdered and at that point I,
you know, went out of respect tohim.
He was an avid Zionist, he wason the national, he was the vice
president of the nationalconference of Zionism, of
Zionists, and but there wasalways such a pride to be Jewish

(03:23):
.
I absolutely knew who I was as aJew, but I never went to Hebrew
school.
I didn't really go to serviceson Shabbat and especially after
you're 13, you don't really go.
So my Judaism was really when Iwent to summer camp.

(03:44):
My Judaism was connected to thepeople I knew from my Hebrew
school.
And at age 16, when somethinglike that happens, it causes you
to question everything.
And for me, because it didn'tsay anything comforting for me
at that time I'm the youngest offive I had no idea in my mind.

(04:10):
Why would God let somethinghappen to a nice Jewish man and
a nice family that lived in thesuburbs and celebrated Rosh
Hashanah and Yom Kippur andPassover and all of those things
.
What could I have done?
What was happening?

(04:30):
So in many ways, I think I wasangry at God and at Judaism for
many years, and so what I didwas I was still a spiritual
person and I was seeking and Ilooked everywhere and I listened
to my Christian friends and Iwent to Buddhism and I went
seeking and I looked everywhereand I went to, I listened to my
Christian friends and I went toBuddhism and I went to listen to
, um, people who were more ofthe new age group I mean, this

(04:55):
is going to age me, but Ram Dassand, uh, stephen Halpern, and I
felt like psychology was ananswer as well, um, to dealing
to dealing with trauma and allof those things, and they all
helped me.
They all helped me.
But there came a day when I wasand I, you know, I had a Jewish

(05:15):
wedding.
There was no question about allthose things.
But I remember I was pregnantwith my daughter and I must have
been in a yoga class and Iheard the teacher say find your
Christ consciousness now.
And I'd heard that so manytimes and I just kind of let
that wash over me, but this wasthe first time where I thought

(05:38):
to myself I don't have a Christconsciousness.
You know, in, in, in what I,you know, I know today that a
Christ consciousness is a higherconsciousness.
It doesn't mean Jesus Christ.
However, at that time, Ithought, you know, I'm going to
go back to my original religion,which is Judaism, and let me

(06:03):
find out what I don't believe,and let me find out what are the
things that have turned me offof my own, of finding my own
identity and embracing my ownidentity.

It's so interesting that you're saying
this because I was that trainingthat I did this afternoon.
It was a Lower East Side tourand the guide is not Jewish, so
I was explaining a lot ofdifferent things to him and I
said something about how Ididn't really know a lot about
other religions until I wasolder.
And I think it's important,because you can't really decide
what you believe or don'tbelieve if you're not exposed to

(06:37):
other religions.
And I think a lot of peoplethey grow up for like well, this
is just what it is, and they'reso unfamiliar with other belief
systems and I can't really saywhat I believe and affirm that
unless I know what other peoplebelieve.
And I love that you bring thatup, Because I think a lot of
people just go through life likewell, this is what it is, and
they don't really, you know,experiment a little bit.

Well, I can't express how important I think it
is to listen to what otherreligions, how other religions
practice and and, as a result,I've done a lot of traveling and
I am involved in a lot ofhealing work and, as a result,
it's taken me to places that Inever thought I would go like to
Egypt and to Bali and to Peru,where I've met very spiritual

(07:18):
people and they're the way theyexpress their spirituality is
not that different from Judaism,and that's what I kept finding
is that we were all talkingabout the same thing and growing
up okay, I'm a child of the 60sand growing up as a

(07:39):
conservative Jew there was asense of, well, you don't date
non-Jews and you don't mix, andthere isn't the embracing
adversity, even though I went tohigh school and I went to and I
lived out in the suburbs wherethere are very few Jews, and so
now there's a lot of Jews, butat that time there weren't, and
so most of my friends to thisday, my closest friends aren't

(08:00):
Jewish, they're Methodist andthey are Lutheran and you know
they're from all differentbackgrounds.
So I got to have wonderfulconversations and find out how
similar we are and how differentwe are, and two of my best

(08:21):
friends are children ofProtestant ministers.
Two of my best friends arechildren of Protestant ministers
and we had like a wholediscussion at Passover about all
sorts of things.
So I love, I love that that'ssomething that you have as well,

(08:43):
that part of our world that is.
So there's so muchintermarriage and the children
are products of a great deal ofintermarriage, because they were
looking for their identity,which is really a product of
both of their parents, and myjob was to show them where we
come together, that we all sharethe same Ten Commandments, the

(09:05):
same original books.
Our fathers were Abraham, allof Arab world, jewish world.
We shared the same father.
I mean, there are just so manysimilarities and growing up at
that time it was don't look atanyone, don't even go to anyone
else's synagogue, let alone, youknow, ask go into a church or

(09:25):
go into a Buddhist temple or anyof those things.
There was like this great fear,and I think some of it was
because it was post-World War IIand all of that you know
brought to the table.

Well, the mid-20th century was like the height of
conservative Judaism and I feellike when I have discussions
with my husband about what Ithink Judaism is, he's like, is
that Judaism or conservativeJudaism or just the synagogue
you grew up in?
Because things that I think arenormal.
I'm like, well, maybe this wasjust that specific synagogue and
I, you know, I was having aconversation with one of our
rabbis on Friday about the, youknow, reform Judaism just sold a

(10:05):
building.
So we were talking about reformJudaism and conservative
Judaism and she's like I grew upconservative and there's a
reason I decided to become areform rabbi, because there were
a lot of issues that I saw andjust the way things that were
changing in the world.

Well, I love that she explained that to you.
And also I think that reformJudaism was given a bad rap
because a lot of the Hebrew wastaken out and it's been adopted
back in and same, withtraditions and wearing tallit,
if you and if, and kippah I meanif you wore a kippah, which is

(10:39):
a head covering for those of youwho don't know, in a
conservative synagogue theywould throw you out as a woman.
They would go.
Well, who does she think she is?
You wore a doily on your head.
Yeah, there were thesedifferent things.
And reformed.

I still see women go up on the bima not covering
and I'm like, oh, I can't likemy mother.
I like see the whole thing,like I think back to like the
fights we had about bat mitzvah,attire um with the.
I see some of these girls go upand I'm like, oh, it's like the
early 90s like yeah, I mean,there's been so much change.

We're sitting at such an interesting time in our
world right now, and you and Iespecially, as just our
generations, because we've livedseeing how um liturgy has
changed and how feminism hasaffected Judaism in a good way
and how there's so many morewomen rabbis than there ever

(11:35):
were and how it's acceptable.
And I worked with Lori Geller,who was probably the second
rabbi, reform rabbi and she hadso many stories to tell me about
how difficult it was for her.
I mean, we had those pioneeringwomen changed the world for us
debbie friedman, all of them.
They really changed the worldfor us and we were just coming

(11:56):
right up on their.
You know, on their.
You know, yeah, following them.
And we now it's like nothing,you know, yeah, following them.
And we now it's like nothing.
You know, in my congregationit's like nothing to sit with
the rabbi.
I mean, I never even talked tomy rabbi, I say the same thing.

I like I hug my clergy members Like we lost a
baby last year and the firstthing my husband said was do you
need me to call Ben?
And then we sent him an emailand he's like is so amazing, and
I love that you're talkingabout specifically women.
There's a professor who endedup leaving the rabbinate to
become like a PhD and sheteaches like Holocaust and

(12:37):
Jewish studies.
Now, um, she was a rabbi, um,and this would have been God,
probably the early eighties, andshe's like.
My first time on the Bema I woreopen toed shoes and half the
congregation decided I waspersona non grata because I wore
open toeded shoes.
It's crazy how much things havechanged.
And like my synagogue last atthe end of March, because it was
a little earlier than Passoverhad an all-women Seder where

(13:01):
there was like a woman, therewas like a female-led group and
they focused on the matriarchsof Passover and like I cried at
one point.
It was so lovely, but that'snot something that would have
existed when I grew up,especially within the
conservative movement.
It was all men.
My mom was convinced, because Ilater became a singer, that I
wanted to be a cantor, but maybeif I had seen a woman as a

(13:22):
religious leader, my life mighthave gone a different way, and I
love that my daughter grows upseeing that and thinks it's
normal Right right.

What synagogue are you at?
We're at Rodef Shalom, I justthink.
No.
I know some of the clergy thatare obviously in California
because I lived there for solong, and I think that the fact
that we have torn down thatfourth wall and made ourselves
accessible is what's keepingJudaism alive and together is

(13:52):
what's keeping Judaism alive andtogether.
I also felt that I don't knowif you know this, but growing up
in the conservative movement,women were not allowed to have
bat mitzvah on Saturday.

And so we had it on Friday nights where you don't
take the Torah out usually.
Yeah, I was the first woman inmy family to have a bat mitzvah
and I didn't think I realizedthat until I met my husband and
I was like, oh, because my mom,we'll get into this when we talk
about trauma.
Um, my mom did not go to Hebrewschool because of things that
happened with her family, so shenever had even that, but she
had cousins who did.
They did the candle blessing onFriday.
So I I guess I never realizedthat because by the early 90s

(14:30):
they were allowing that tohappen.
So when I had my bat mitzvah in1999, like I actually read from
the Torah and everything and Iguess I didn't realize at the
time what a big deal that wasRight Historical.

Yes, of course, of course, and you'll get to
tell your daughter that someday.

Yes, and your son.
Hopefully it'll be.

Your nieces and nephews, because that is a big
deal and I will.
What, hopefully, your niecesand nephews, because that is a
big deal and I will, and what Ido.
One of the rituals I do is Ihave the kids bring their whole
family right before their barbat mitzvah grandparents and
extended family and I say I wantto go around the table and I
want you, kids, because we areat such an interesting time in

(15:11):
history and because ourgrandparents and
great-grandparents live longer,you're going to see in our
lifetime, in my lifetime, howJudaism has changed in the last
80 years, I guess I mean, or 90years.
We are on the cusp of completechange.
Judaism never looked like thisanywhere, and so your great,
your grandmother or your greatgrandmother never had a bat

(15:34):
mitzvah because it wasn'tsomething girls did.
And so when you know you get tohave a bat mitzvah, it's a big
deal because you're setting anew standard for your children
and upcoming generations andthis is making history and we
need to emphasize that becauseit's a big deal and it's a

(15:57):
beautiful big deal because it'snot women or men, it's this
place in between.
We need each other.
We really do.
There's a beautifulcomplementing of the feminine
and the masculine, and I thinkJudaism is really at least in
the reform movement, I can say,and in the circles that I've
been in we've really been ableto embrace it and have respect

(16:18):
for that.
I don't think the same thing forthe Orthodox circles.
I do respect them greatly, butI don't respect how they treat a
woman rabbi and I also don'trespect how sometimes when you
say you're a reform rabbi, itdoesn't mean anything To them.
It's as if you were trained, Idon't know, like online.

(16:40):
I went through 10 years ofseminary because I became a
cantor first and then I became arabbi because it was something
that I felt would make me moreauthentic and real and I wanted
to be a role model for our kids,for people like you, nicole,

(17:00):
who maybe would have been acantor because you didn't see
those yeah, you didn't see womencantors.
They have, and for me, womencantors came into my life much
later and I really went back toschool at age 40, you know, and
so, um, it's whenever you couldbe like Rabbi Akiva.
Whenever it's time you stillcan do it and you can do it as a

(17:22):
second career, because we'regoing to live longer.

I'm going through a career transition right now.
I have like a whole I'm.
I started a master's program inJanuary and I'm turning 40 next
year and I'm like, well, Iguess this is just what we're
doing and I'm very passionateabout what I'm going to be
working in.
But it's nothing I saw myselfdoing and I try to tell people
like you don't know where yourlife is going to take you, and I
feel like I look back.

(17:46):
I was I.
You know I still keep my toe intheater and I look back on that
and part of my heart willalways be there.
But I'm really passionate aboutwhat I'm doing and the people
I'm working with.
So I want to jump back to whenyou were 16 and talk about what
happened to your father, ifyou're comfortable talking about
it.
I want to know a little moreabout it.
And you said it changed yourviewpoint on life and Judaism,

(18:09):
and does this continue to affectthe way you look at things
today in?

Judaism, and does this continue to affect the
way you look at things today?
Yeah, I think that that is.
You know that.
I think when we have trauma inour lives, it shifts us into
seeing the world in a differentway.
You don't cruise through lifeanymore.
You start to ask those bigquestions very early on.
So my father and mother theyliterally was were going to see

(18:36):
a Broadway show, you know, or ashow downtown, and they were
held up by three, uh, juveniledelinquents and, and one and the
one had a shotgun.
It went off.
That was it.
Now my mother was in herforties, so you know, that was
bizarre to me when I was her age, when I turned her age, and I

(18:57):
thought, oh my gosh, your wholelife changed.
You were just starting to goback to school, you know, kind
of women's liberate days andfive children I'm the youngest
of five and she really neverimagined herself as a woman
taking care of herself or beingself-reliant, any of that.

(19:17):
And she ended up finishingschool and she ended up becoming
a grief counselor.
So she taught me somethingreally important without saying
it, which is a Jewish concept ofyou turn your greatest traumas,
I guess, or your greatestlessons, into your strengths.
You know where you've been hitthe hardest.

(19:38):
When that becomes your strength, you have something to teach.
And it's not about a PhD.
It's about being able to reallyovercome something terrible in
your life and turn it into yourstrength.
And I saw her do that and I wasright, in line with what she
did.
Now, um, you asked me what thatwas like and I felt different

(20:02):
than everybody else.
I have to say that I, um, Ididn't think people would really
understood how I felt.
You know and that's somethingthat happens when anybody goes
through trauma you feel so alone, even though I had brothers and
sisters.
No one wants to want to talkabout it, and it was really like

(20:25):
, you know, move on.
Well, we have learned throughtime.
You don't.
You can't just move on.
And, of course, I went through alot of therapy and all kinds of
healing modalities to freemyself of that trauma.
And I do want to say that lateron in my life, after being
married for 30 years, I got adivorce and it traumatized me

(20:50):
and all that trauma came back.
It was, you know, I felt likemy whole world had shattered.
It did Everything that I builtup in the Jewish community,
everything that I knew mychildren, although they were
grown up.
It just shatters your entiresocial life, all the Jewish
organizations I was in.

(21:11):
I felt so much shame and I feltlike I didn't belong anymore and
I really wondered well, arepeople going to even want a
rabbi who's?
Or a cantor rabbi who's beendivorced?
Are people going to respect meanymore?
All of that came, you know,racing forward and I think that
the greatest thing was that Iremember one of my teachers said

(21:34):
to me just keep coming tofinish up your rabbinic degree,
it's going to make you an evenbetter rabbi.
And he was right because ithealed me.
There is so much in Judaismthat is so healing.
We certainly have foremothersand we certainly have biblical
patriarchs that went throughtraumas and taught us and really

(21:59):
have left messages for us topick up on as to how we handle
these dark times.
And we are people of resilience.
And when people have come to meand said, well, what do you
think of trauma?
I said I'm from a tribe oftrauma through, you know,

(22:22):
through and through.
So, yeah, they just keep goingand that's what you have to do,
even you know, despite how youfeel.

Did your mother also kind of start to distance
herself from judaism?
Because I know my mom had asister that died when she was a
child and my mom was five yearsold and her parents, who were
pseudo-orthodox at that time,kind of just washed their hands
all of that.
They said, if god's gonna takemy child, I don't believe this
anymore.
And I know that's kind of apeople kind of go one of two

(22:54):
ways usually and like it's that,or they just dive deep into
religion.
Is that something the rest ofyour family did as well?
That they kind of were justlike I don't understand why God
would take this person who was agreat person.

It's so funny that you ask that, because the
first thing we kept koshergrowing up, the first thing we
kept kosher growing up in a home, the first thing we did my
mother did when my, after myfather died was like throughout
all the kashrut, it was let'sbring in the shrimp.
You know, not even that Iwanted to anyone wanted to eat
that but bring in thecheeseburgers or whatever it is.

(23:29):
Yeah, um, yeah.
There was a very deep rejectionof from all of my family
members.
In fact, you know me, comingback into Judaism was really
shocking, and if you would havetold me that I was going to do
this for a living, I never wouldhave believed you, because I
too had a theater background.
I too have a dancer background.

(23:50):
I did all of that Never in mylife.
If you had told me this, Iwould have said you're
absolutely crazy.
So I think that what you'resaying is really interesting,
and this is what we also learnedand I remember one of my rabbi
teachers saying this to me too,when we talked about the feeling

(24:11):
.
Even when somebody gets adisease, we talked about the
feeling.
Even when somebody gets adisease, right, the feeling is
God.
What did I do?
Why are you punishing me?
And there's two things thathappened.
One of my colleagues said youknow, god doesn't do that.
God doesn't come into our livesin that way.

(24:31):
Do that.
God doesn't come into our livesin that way.
God is not out to punish youeven though, by the way, I grew
up with a punishing God but Goddoesn't give you an ailment and
God does not strike you down orpunish you for whatever you're

(24:52):
going through or your family.
God is the good that you canfind in it.
God is the strength that youfind.
God is you being able to cope.
And that really struck mebecause I began to believe in a
God that wanted me to get up thenext day and use this as

(25:14):
something that was going tostrengthen me and that was
helping me cope.
And I, to this day, trulybelieve that.
The other thing is and I think Idon't know if it was Harold
Kushner in his book you know whybad things happen to good
people, but he also, I think hesaid something that well, first

(25:37):
of all, trauma happens to allpeople, and the truth is and
most and most of the time, I'llget the question well, if
there's a God, then how did theHolocaust happen?
That's always the firstquestion you get.
Yes, that's where everyone goesRight, and I think that's what
Harold Kushner did respond to,and if I'm wrong that it was him
.
Forgive me, but the discussionabout that was God was in the

(26:03):
resilience, god was in thedesire to live, god was in the
stubbornness from many of thosesurvivors who said God was in
the stubbornness from many ofthose survivors who said if I
died and if I allowed myself todie, it was.
It meant that Hitler achievedhis goal and I was not going,
and it meant that evil reignedon earth and I, as long as I was

(26:26):
alive, I knew there was good onearth.
And that's a very high level ofthinking.
I mean that was incredible thatthere was this altruistic idea.
I mean even in Frankl's bookMan's Search for Meaning right,
that's the book he came out with.

(26:46):
He was saying that he lived forother people.
He lived in order to tell hisstory.
He lived for other people.
He lived in order to tell hisstory, and that affected me
greatly and I think that thataffects many Jewish people and I
think it gives them a lot ofhope that they make a difference
, that their experience and whatthey do means something, and

(27:07):
we're all looking for meaning inour lives like that.

I want to jump into something you mentioned
earlier about finding your wayback into Judaism and then
deciding to become a member ofthe clergy.
So you, as you mentioned,you're both a rabbi and a cantor
.
Yes, I want to know what thedecision behind all that was
kind of what the deciding?
Because I think when you make acareer change, there's like an
aha moment that you have,because I know what my aha

(27:31):
moment was and I feel like Itell it all the time.
But what was the aha moment foryou?
What made you decide that youwanted to do both and what was
that process like?
Because it's a very strenuousprocess, I know that.

Yeah, I think that I had met friends of mine
who were clergy and I started togo back to synagogue and found
people who were close to my ageor women and men who I just
thought were really great people.
I loved hanging out with them,I loved things that they had to

(28:08):
say and I saw them as modernJews.
And I saw them as modern Jewsthat my thought of a rabbi or
cantor with a beard and one ofthose hats and that wasn't what
was happening anymore and thatthey could have a life.
And these friends of mine didgo out to the movies and they

(28:29):
were normal people.
Yes, they exist and when I wouldgo to workshops, I saw who they
were and they were wonderfulpeople and I think that I began
to think well, and my aha momentis what do you want to leave on

(28:50):
this planet?
What really is my sole purpose?
And I was at the time doing alot of dream work almost for 30
years with a teacher, connieKaplan, with my co-author, tamar
Frankel, and this dreaming wasnot the dreaming that you find
in Jungian therapy.
This was more Native American,based, where there are circles

(29:13):
of women who come together andthey give parts of their dream
to this circle and they begin tosee how it's like a puzzle, how
they are dreaming in reality ofwork.

(29:37):
I took very seriouslytraditions.
I took very seriously when Iwould see ceremony and I saw how
incredible that was and howpowerful even just a dream
circle was, and so, as a dreamcircle, I feel like I don't know
very much.

I know a lot about , like Judeo Christian religions
, but a part of me is myhusband's, and my psychiatrist
always tell me to meditate and Ifeel like my brain does not
work.
My brain does not work withthat Um and I won't hear but he,
but I feel like I don't know asmuch about Eastern or native
American ritual and ceremonies.

I'm happy to tell you about it and I've, and
my books that I've written areconnecting a lot of that to
Judaism.
I mean, then I wrote thosebooks 20, with Tamar Frankel
almost 25 years ago, so theywere very cutting edge at the
time.
But when you ask me what is adream circle?
And in the second book thatTamar and I wrote, it was called

(30:27):
Entering the Temple of Dreams,and at that time I never
realized that our patriarchsalways saw God in the dream.
And if you think about it, okay, right, but we don't think of
it that way because we just say,oh, and Joseph was a dreamer,
but it doesn't occur to us thatthe same dreams that we have at

(30:48):
night may have power.
So when Ramar and I exploredthis and wanted to talk about
Jewish dreaming, we studiedTalmud and we looked at all
these sources and because themen were really connected to
writing Talmud, theirinterpretation was very stilted.

(31:13):
They didn't.
Some of it was stilted, Ishould say they were worried
about nocturnal emissions andthose kinds of things.
However, the most brilliantrabbis, who were spiritual and
were connected Kabbalistically,talked about the fact that
dreaming is a 60th.
Now, a 60th is a measurement inkashrut.
That's just enough to count,but it doesn't really count.

(31:35):
So if something is a 60th ofnon-kosher it still counts, but
if you don't kashrut, you cankind of get by with it.
You should kashrut, but youcould get by with it.
One 60th is just like justenough to count.
So there's all of thesemeasurements that are in the

(32:03):
Talmud about 1 60th and 1 60thof dreaming is prophecy and 1
60th of dreaming.

It's fast and make me cry, because I'm going to
tell you a story.
My family makes fun of mebecause I have very vivid dreams
, very vivid that I remember.
Like I will remember a dream Ihad years ago and then I dream
about friends that have passedaway a lot.
And the night I got engaged Ihad a dream that my grandmother,
who was gone, we were in likesome hospital situation and she

(32:29):
was trying to touch me and thesepeople were holding her back
and she couldn't talk.
So I always felt like she wastrying to come through and I
have never had dreamed about herbefore or since and I all I
have a lot of I know like that'swhy I've been crying, because I
dreams are very much a part ofmy life and I, like my sister's,
like I never remember my dreams.

(32:50):
I'm like you're crazy because Ihave such vivid dreams that I
remember years later.
So I am obsessed with thisconcept now, ok, I love this.

You'll love Connie Kaplan's books on
dreaming.
Ok, that's number two.
You'll love my book Enteringthe Temple of Dreams, because
I'll have to check that out.
Yeah, things that you feel, butso if so, dreaming there are.
there's the bedtime shema thatwe say at night, and the last
prayer says that you step intothe.

(33:20):
It's called the hamapio and youstep into the pupil of your eye
is what it says, and the beliefis that at night your soul
unties itself and travels inlike a grid of the dream realm,
which is very ethereal, that canhave maybe people from your
past, people who are notembodied, and think about it.

(33:43):
When the morning comes, thevery first prayer you say is
Thank you, god for returning mysoul to this physical body.
And so there's confirmationwhich is in my books, and our
books are really well, wellnotated.
You can find anything where wegot the material and it's very,

(34:05):
very Talmud based.
And what's so interesting is wedon't we've never, I never, but
many people don't see, neversaw it that way or don't see it
that way.
Mainstream Judaism doesn'tteach it that way, and you find
it more in Kabbalah andmysticism.

Native Americans have something similar?

yes, and what the Native Americans believe is
that also, their soul travels atnight and it heals and it does,
it's, it does work, you know,and that sometimes there are
different kinds of dreaming andit's all connected to the moon.
Now, judaism, as jews, werepeople of the moon.

(34:46):
That's what we are governed by,because our calendar is a moon
calendar versus the romancalendar a sun calendar.
So every month, basically,you're going to have different
kinds of dreaming and there's 12types of dreaming.
Some dreams are more prophetic,some have your ancestors in them
, but everybody's dreaming has adifferent language.

(35:09):
That's why it's not Jungian,that's why you can't look it up
language, that's why it's notJungian, that's why you can't
look it up and that's why youtalk about it in a circle,
because you can't really uminterpret your own dreams.
So, uh, women, native Americanwomen, would come together and
they would share their dream andthey would start and they would
also pass a stone around andcreate this, this vortex of

(35:31):
energy where they were reallybringing in other consciousness.
You know of what they weremeant to know.
Number one and when I sayprophecy too, it doesn't mean
that if you dream you're dying,or that someone dies, that
they're going to die.

That's very rare my great grandmother was like
that though she literally shewould have a dream.
My mom was like.
She was like a witch.
She'd have a dream the lastFriday of every month and it
would always come true, and sheknew that my mom's sister was
going to die.

Well, she knew Some people are gifted with
certain things.
Maybe that wasn't such a giftand I do believe that there are
look, I know, many Jewishpsychics.
They're just sensitive andthey're very, very attuned.
And I am not psychic, but I dowant to say, and I'll tell you
my experience with dreaming, andI'm not unlike your sister, I

(36:22):
could not remember a dream atall and where you have to write
down your dream in the morning,so that number one, you don't
lose it during the day and soyou can share it in dream circle
.
I could never remember mydreams and I never thought I was
a dreaming woman.
And when I went to my teacher,connie, I said I want you to
help me stop dreaming, becausemy dreams are scaring me.

(36:43):
You know they're either aboutsomeone chasing me, or you know
those typical dreams that youwould have that would just like
make you go, or I would wake upin the dream and I have those
two.

It's like night terrors.
And children before adults LikeI will.
Literally this doesn't happenas much anymore.
I would wake up screaming.

Right, and what she taught me.
She laughed and she said you'rea dreaming woman.
And I said no, but she said,okay, tell me what your dream
was.
So I had this dream that I wasin the bathroom and all these
spiders were coming out of thetoilet and I was like like what
kind of?
Why would I have a dream likethat?
And she, she said, judy, whatare spiders?

(37:25):
They're when they're thefeminine, and they can create a
web out of nowhere.
You, you've seen the webs thatthey create.
They're weavers of the web.
And that's what a dreamingwoman is.
She weaves reality.
And she said that.
And so she said that is kind oflike your spider medicine is

(37:46):
your strength as a woman and assomebody who's able to weave
these different parts of thesedifferent educations together.
And the other thing is, if youhave a bathroom dream, the
bathroom is the one place thinkabout it where we are all
connected.
We're all connected throughplumbing and that's the weave
underground.
So it's it.

(38:09):
And that I'd never heardanything like that.
And and I was like, oh, okay.
So over the years, oh, I triedeverything to remember and write
down my dreams, and I do have alot of journals.
There's much more to it thanthat.
However, in that work, we alsobegan to do soul contract
readings, and your soul contractis based on your astrological

(38:32):
chart, because it's like acookie cutter in time and space.
Boom, there's energy in that,and right now, actually, I'm
teaching a class on Judaism,monthly Judaism, that Judaism,
every month, has energy, everyholiday has energy, but every
month of the Jewish calendaryear is filled with energy.

(38:53):
That is documented.
It is.
You have an astrology signthat's connected to it.
There's Gematria connected toit, there are Hebrew letters
connected to it, there areholidays connected to it.
There are Torah portionsconnected to it.
There's a winter, spring,summer, fall energy to all of
this and it's ancient, but it'svery relevant and it's so much a

(39:17):
part of my how I live my life.
Um, you know, I createdsomething like this years ago
and this is how I teach.
Judaism is oops, I'll turn itaround the other way was the
cyclical nature of the Jewishcalendar which was grounded.
In two weeks we're going tohave the Torah portion and more.

(39:39):
Our holidays were set, time wasset for the Jewish people and
around agriculture and aroundnature and the natural steady
rhythm of nature that we'reasked to go back to.
So we're not so anxious and youknow.
So, you know, I'm talking aboutfour different things at once.

Yeah, we've got a whole lot of yeah, just great.

I want to talk to you about even meditation.
You know there are meditationsin a service let's just say a
Jewish service and there'stalking, or if there's silence,
at the Kedusha, people don'tknow what to do with themselves.
And there are so many ways oflearning how to meditate.
There's so many kinds ofmeditation.
I always liked someone guidingme through meditation, but there

(40:26):
is breath work.
You're a singer, you'reconnected to vibration.
I worked with sound bowls duringthe time of COVID because I
wanted to bring my vibration up,so to speak, and if you sing,
your vibration is higher.
That's why we sing the Torahright when we sing in trope,

(40:51):
shabbat, shiril, adonai, all ofit, the song of the sea.
It was on a shot level, simplelevel.
Yes, it was song, but on ahigher level, it was sound waves
that changed the world.
And so these are the beautifullevels of studying Judaism that

(41:12):
my mind was already open to,from meditation, kundalini yoga,
you know, and all the breathwork connected to that.
I did somatic dancing.
I still do things where I amconnecting my body and what my
body's going through to prayer,to singing, and what my body's

(41:37):
going through to prayer, tosinging, to all of this because
it has an effect on myphysicality.
You know your body's made outof water.
It's affected, yes, right.
And you know that as a mom andas a singer, you can only sing
as you, you know, because itfloats along your Um, when was

(41:57):
that?

So you're doing a, a dream circle.

Yes, and I began to ask the bigger questions,
like what my sole purpose is,what is my life purpose?
What does my soul yearn for?
And then there's the Jewishpiece that went what do I want
to leave here after me?
And this was after I had mychildren and I realized that I

(42:22):
wanted to bring all the thingsthat I love together, and that
happened with my books.
Working with Tamar Frankelhelped me to understand that.
I had a mind that you know, andI could teach about something
because I was a physical trainerand I was a dancer, and so I

(42:44):
knew things about the physicalbody that made sense to me
through my training in thosefields, and I help people heal
their bodies.
So after those it really the ahamoment was a combination of the
dream work of writing two bookswith Tamar Frankel and going

(43:05):
into the Jewish world and seeingthat people were really tough
on me because they asked me well, what are your credentials and
how do you come to know this,all this stuff?
And I, you know I was young atthe time and that shocked me and
I explained what my credentialswere, but in the Jewish world

(43:27):
that didn't mean anything.
So when I, what I decided isthat I wanted a voice out in the
world because I had somethingto teach that no one else was
teaching and there was nocantorial school in California.
And I again was friends withcantors and I went to some of
the cantors assembly conferencesand there were enough people in

(43:52):
there who wanted to be ordained, who couldn't leave their
families, move to New York, goto Cincinnati.
We came together and we formedthe Academy of Jewish Religion,
which it took a couple of years,but it came together and became
a viable school, an accreditedschool, and I went, I went and I

(44:15):
finally had the money to do it.
I didn't before.
In my forties my ex-husband, allof a sudden was making enough
money and he said go to school,go become a cantor.
You love this, you believe init and you're creating your
Judaism as a spirituality thatis really fulfilling to you.
So go be a cantor, cause I sangfirst.

(44:36):
So I went back to school and Ithought that was it, you know,
and I was working at TempleEmanuel in Beverly Hills and
there wasn't enough room for twocantors that were myself and
another cantor that was there,and so when I left that job I

(44:56):
was really sad and again here'smy epiphany was really sad.
And again here's my epiphanystart your own.
So I started my own minion andpeople came and I made a promise
to God.
I said as long as you bring 10,I'm there.
That spiraled into having a highholidays and then I realized if

(45:18):
I didn't have temple membership, no one was there after high
holidays and you know I'd haveto build that back up again.
So I, and then 10 women came tome and said I want to study
Torah with you.
So I studied in my home andtens kept showing up me and 200

(45:39):
later over 15 years, theNachshon Minyan thrived on
people who did not fit into themold of the conservative Judaism
you and I talk about even thereformed Judaism.
I wanted to create a spacewhere people could belong.
They could be divorced, theycould be intermarried, they

(46:04):
could be divorced, they could beintermarried.
And then their children startedcoming and I never wanted to
teach children.
And again the mama came whereGod said you know, this is, this
is 10 more.
And every time 10 showed up.
I was there and it was the mostbeautiful experience of my life
hundreds of children, bar andbat mitzvah, high holidays, with
all of them singing all the waythrough.

(46:26):
Just incredible stories ofpeople feeling rejected by
Judaism, coming back becausetheir children made them come
back.
So many Bar Mitzvah kids.
It just was really.
You know, I worked with a greata woman, a great executive
director.
It was creative, we were on thecutting edge and after COVID

(46:49):
even though we survived and allof that, I then got the message
I was done.
However, I want to go backreally quick About seven years
in to being to not shown.
I brought rabbis and cantorsand different rabbis and nobody
liked them.
I never had the confidence thatI could become a rabbi and

(47:13):
didn't have many women modelsand I realized that people would
say, well, where's the rabbi?
And I decided to go backbecause I wanted my people to
feel that they got the realthing.
And so I went back to my schooland I said is there a
possibility that I can go back?

(47:33):
I know I've taken a lot of thecourses already that rabbis take
, because cantors and rabbistake a lot of the same courses,
and they said, absolutely, take,because cantors and rabbis take
a lot of the same courses andthey said absolutely.
In fact, we're having our firstyear where we are ordaining
people to be rabbis and cantors.
It's because they could see it.
We could see it in the futurethat the future of synagogues is

(47:54):
.
They couldn't afford both andthey were expensive right, and
so they were hiring one or theother usually a rabbi, who could
sing, sort of, and so that'swhat happened is I joined.
I told them I'm going to haveto do this slowly because I have
a family and I have acongregation.
They were fine with it.

(48:15):
In 2015, I handed in mydissertation and graduated, so I
was in seminary for about 10years and I loved it.

I love going to school.
I feel like I'm already likeI'm going to get my PhD, I plan
to finish to get my PhD and I'mlike, and then I'll get a second
master's in psychology and I'mreally interested in
intergenerational trauma.
So it was like I'llspecifically be a therapist
catering to three G's and I'mlike I'm creating these.

Yeah, I've.

I'm like I'm going to be in school till I'm 90
years old, so I totallyunderstand.
It's so funny You're talkingabout not affording clergy,
because this is part of theconversation I was having about
Union for Reform, judaismselling the building.
They have low like studentcount and we were talking about
how back in the day, rabbis andcan they used to give them
houses and that's not somethingthat happens anymore, Could you

(49:12):
imagine getting like a job as arabbi and then like use your
house and that was somethingthat was common amongst all
religions?
Like my friend, my friend Matt,his father father was a minister
and they lived in a house thatwas given to them by the church.
That doesn't exist anymore.

That was right next door probably.

Yeah, exactly it was.
You know it was the parishhouse.
They don't do that anymore.
I feel like I don't know ifit's declining membership or
people are just not paying asmuch, or whatever it is is it's.

You know, you have to run a single like a
business at some point and itgets expensive for some people
and it's very difficult, likeyou were saying a very different
um body of people who aredonating and who are validating
synagogues and clergy becauseclergy are expendable and the

(49:56):
clergy that you may have hadgrowing up, they were treated in
a very different way too.
And I remember the clergy thatyou may have had growing up,
they were treated in a verydifferent way too, and I
remember the day that they werejust that clergy was coming to
our workshops and things, justsaying I was just discarded like
an old man, old cloth orwhatever.
There was a lot of covet andrespect and care that was taken

(50:20):
towards the clergy that does noteven exist at all anymore.

Yeah, a lot of.
Especially I noticed reformrabbis.
There's a lot of jumping around, maybe because they're trying
to like, they're trying to toget better or in higher
positions, but there's a lot ofjumping around, I've noticed,
which I think would be reallystressful.

Yeah, I mean, I, I wanted a home.
The congregation that I'm withnow I didn't think I was going
to go with another congregation,and there's my aha moment is
the man who I am my partner.
He's a canter.
He was in Los Angeles and hewas offered a temporary job in

(51:00):
Fort Worth, texas.
They loved him, they hired himon the spot, basically, and I
came out here to teach at hissynagogue, the class I'm talking
to you about the monthly energy, and on top of that, I was
teaching my books there, all thedifferent prayers, the
traditional Jewish prayersconnected to spirituality and

(51:22):
and Kabbalah and movement, causeI created movement to these,
these prayers, and I just thisis so weird.
I was in the Jewish community,we were doing a Yom HaShoah and
this man saw me and he saidwe've been looking for a rabbi
for you know, the last fiveyears.

(51:44):
Um, would you maybe beinterested?
Um, we don't like anyone thatwe've had.
And I was literally hired lastJune.
You know, it was just like boomand I moved here in July and
started in August.
So, and I'm here in Fort Worth,texas, in Colleyville, and talk

(52:05):
about trauma.
Nicole, this is interesting foryou.
I don't know what happened inColleyville, but they had a
hostage incident in 2022.
And they there were fourcongregants, and there were four
congregants five congregantswho were held and the rabbi were
held up by a terrorist and itwas a horrible, horrible

(52:30):
situation and they sufferedbecause of.
You know how the whole thingpanned out is that it was during
COVID.
It was a time where their rabbiwas transitioning out and this
happened and it drove peopleaway and they're just having a
renaissance now.

This is at your synagogue that this happened.
I remember this and the rabbikind of like talked him down and
I remember because anything badhappens in the Jewish community
I feel like it's just inundated.
I know my husband's always likewhat are you watching on social
media?
That I'm getting these videosand I'm like, well, the same
things I'm always watching, butof all places to be asked to
work somebody who hadexperienced trauma, gun violence

(53:11):
, those kinds of things thatyou're talking about.
What was that transition likemoving to Texas?
I feel like, as someone whospent so much time in California
, that must have been a hugeculture shock.
I'm still in it.

I I did a program for the daughters of
Abraham.
It's an.
It's an incredible group ofwomen, like 50 women from every
type of Christianity Muslimgroup, um that have come
together, that are daughters ofAbraham and they want to find
their commonalities.
And there is such a diversegroup of Christianity.

(53:51):
I didn't even know they allexisted and there's a real
desire to you know, haveinterfaith dialogues, interfaith
experiences.
Just on Sunday we showed themovie October 8th, which just
came out, to the Methodistchurch across the street.

(54:12):
First, I was thrilled.
They were interested.
There were about 50 people, 80people that showed up, half
their congregation, half ours,and they just didn't know and
that they trusted our communityto bring something that was
about democracy in america andbigger than judaism.
Also, they didn't know sothere's so much going on.

Here is what I'm trying to say good because I
feel like I hear things abouttex.
I'm like, oh Texas.
The interfaith dialogue is soimportant because a lot of the
kids I work with at the museumhave never met a Jewish person
before and, being in the NewYork metropolitan area, you can
ask how is that possible.
They lived in really insularcommunities and I'm the first
Jewish person they've ever met.

(54:59):
There's a lot of research.
I was fighting with somebodytoday on Instagram about this
because they were like where isthis study?
And I said, well, it's new.
It's literally brand new.
It's not even been publishedyet about how Holocaust
education does not preventantisemitism.
You need to humanize Jewishpeople, you need to introduce
Jewish culture and values andsay this is literally what you

(55:19):
do and a lot of what you believein, and I love that you're
making that happen in a placelike Texas where it can.
There's so much divisive stuffhappening there.

Well, also, it's so interesting again, and I had
this epiphany just over YomHaZikaron and Yom Ha'atzma'ut.
Really, I mean I love TheodorHerzl.
I was just blown away.
That Theodor Herzl Museum inIsrael just woke me up and I
just thought to myself the leastlikely Jew who did this work.

(55:53):
He was a journalist, he was notinterested, he was not a
religious Jew.
He's the last one interested.
He was not a religious Jew,he's the last one.
I mean, that's how we are inthis day and age People who
really they get grabbed by theneck.
I'm one of those people, youknow, and I wanted my
congregation to love TheodorHerzl as much as I did and I've

(56:14):
researched so many things abouthim.
But here's the thing thatstruck me First of all, the word
Zionism, I know for manyChristians is very scary because
they've been convinced thatit's become a dirty word, it's
become an ism.
And I will say don't even usethe word Zionism, just mean the

(56:35):
belief that we, that the Jewishpeople, should have a homeland,
because that word I can see is atrigger, that the Jewish people
should have a homeland, becausethat word I can see as a
trigger.
But I realized that I grew upand maybe you did too believing
that Israel was the antidote tothe Holocaust.
I really believe that, that ifIsrael exists, the Holocaust

(56:56):
would never happen.
Yeah Right, I believe that withall my heart and soul.
And when I taught about Israel,I would never happen.
Yeah Right, I believe that withall my heart and soul.
And when I taught about Israel,I would teach that.
And now, and this was the firsttime I said this, I said you
know, that was Herzl's dream andhe died at 44.
40 years later, israel becomesa state.

(57:17):
We all think that.
And now it isn't the truth,because anti-Semitism is worse
than ever and it's becomeanti-Zionism.
And that was the first time Iwas a little scared.
I thought, wow, when the Jewishpeople are strong, the world

(57:37):
wants to kill them.

That's what Dara Horn says.
Is that people love dead Jews?
Is that the Jews?

who are?

dead?
Yes, they're not.
And, Lord Rabbi Jonathan Sachs,I was at a Yom HaShoah event
with 3GNY and it was reallyinteresting.
It was a Seder for Yom HaShoah,it was like an order of events
and it was really interesting.
It was like an order of eventsand there was a.

It was really interesting they had a an
excerpt of a speech that he gaveabout how in the medieval times
they hated us because of ourreligion and then in the late
19th century became a race, andnow it is a hatred of the fact
that we have Israel.
That's become the newanti-Semitism.
And did you see his little?
The cartoon thing that he hasof anti-Semitism is anti-Judaism
or anti-Semitism isanti-Zionism.
No, I haven't seen that.
Look on his website.
It's amazing.
But anyway, go ahead.

It's crazy, and I've a lot of people I think
think well, no, I'm not, I'm notanti-Semitic, I'm just
anti-Israel, and it's the onlycountry I think I'm not.
I'm not anti-Semitic, I'm justanti-Israel, and it's the only
country I think.
But it's the only country youthink shouldn't exist.
And they've kind of becomewrapped up in this literal
terrorist rhetoric.
And I'm several blocks fromColumbia, so I feel like I'm in
the middle of this and thesekids are walking around and they
just want to shake them and sayplease, you know, wait till

(58:54):
your frontal lobe is developedto make these choices that
you're making.
And it's a very scary time.
It's very scary and I think theonly good thing that has come
from that is people areembracing their Judaism in a way
that I don't think I've everseen before.
People are learning.
I think people are converting.
I think you know my guest thatI talked to last week.
She was in the middle of herconversion when October 7th

(59:16):
happened and she said her.
She thought the rabbi who washelping her with her conversion
thought she was going to leave.

Well, one of the men who was who wanted to
convert in my congregation, uh,who went through the hostage
experience.
The rabbi said to him I betyou're not going to want to
convert anymore.
He said, even more so.
And I've converted many.
And there's at least five rightnow that have come to me over

(59:45):
the last year in Colleyville inTexas that want to convert.
And I said and the first thingI say to them is are you sure,
do you know what's going on withanti-Semitism?
And they said, even more soit's in my soul.
It's time now even more so.

Nicole Kelly (01:00:05):
It's in my soul.
It's time now.
I think that's the only goodthings come out of this is we've
shown we can rally together.
And what's beautiful is, Jewsof every background are
experiencing the same thing andthey are saying the same things
and I feel it's much more of alike we're talking about there's
separation of everything.
I think it's much more of atribe and community feel than it
ever has been before, becausewe've done this before a couple

(01:00:25):
times and we know how it can endand we're going to make sure
that that never literally neveragain, never happens again.
And I love that the convertsare coming on.
If you're interested inconverting and listening, please
call Rabbi Cantor Judy.
So I want to touch on a couplethings.
I want to talk a little bitabout what your advice would be

(01:00:46):
to Jews who are interested inexploring other non-Jewish
aspects of their spirituality,because that's obviously
something that you've done.
But let's say, you come from aJewish background, you grew up
Jewish, but you're interested inexploring things like Buddhism
or things like meditation orNative American spirituality.
Is there a place where that canlive together?
What is your advice to that?

Judy Greenfeld (01:01:08):
Yeah, and I remember feeling, is this
sacrilegious?
And is studying soul contracts?
And is this conflictedinformation?
The truth is, the reason why alot of jews love buddhism is
because there's no deity,there's no deity that you are

(01:01:32):
giving yourself to.
So buddhism is fine.
It's his beautiful philosophy,I think it especially about life
and death, and Judaism shares alot of it.
So, you know, don't it willteach you meditation, and it's a
different kind of meditationthat you'll find, maybe in your

(01:01:53):
um, in your Jewish services.
Um, because we, you know theJewish services, don't have a
lot of silence, at least theones that I've gone to.

We're afraid of silence.

obviously Try to bring meditation in.
People get a little frightenedwhen it gets quiet.
They don't know what to do.
So yoga, kundalini, all ofthose things Wonderful,
wonderful practices, not onlyfor your physical body but your
mind and your soul.
When you're dealing with a soulyou're not dealing with, you
know.
That's where we come together.

(01:02:24):
That's why people love the wordspirituality, because it talks
about soul.
We all have souls and theydon't have a religion as far as
other kinds.
Because I love healing and Ihave gone through all types of
healing and many of us want toheal our souls and our hearts

(01:02:45):
that get broken, and there's alot of different ways to do it.
So I say have your Jewishidentity and search, be a
searcher and a seeker, and don'tjust take my word for it or
Nicole's word for it there.
There's so much online today.
Find out for yourself, look upon Safaria things that I've said

(01:03:07):
that you might question.
One of the reasons, by the way,nicole, the reason I went to
Cantoral school and to rabbinicschool, is because I wanted to
know if what I was taught wastrue.
Is it true that you can't beburied in a graveyard, in a
Jewish graveyard, if you have atattoo?
And what about the women whohave tattooed eyebrows and

(01:03:30):
tattoos on their you know lipsand their eyes?
What about them?
You know, and I found, and Iwanted to know if, just because
my, my rabbi said this, if thisis what Judaism thought, and
what do the Orthodoxconservative reform?
And are you allowed to pick andchoose and are you called the
pick and choose Jew?

(01:03:50):
Guess what?
Everyone's a pick and chooseJew.
I don't care who you are, andwe need to respect each other.

Thank you for saying that, because I feel like
this is my problem with a lotof people who identify as modern
Orthodox.
We lived in a building with alot of them and they would get
in the elevator and ask us topush the button, which I said
I'm not allowed to push thebutton, I'm Jewish.
And then they were like oh, butthey were, but it was fine if
someone else pushed the button.
And that's very pick and chooseand I feel like yeah it's also

(01:04:18):
making people feel bad.

You know, yeah, it's also making people feel bad
.
You know, we're not supposed tocreate discomfort for somebody
else because of what our beliefsare.
There's a lot of hypocrisy andthe truth and I wanted to know I
I would ask these rabbis andcantors, what's going on in your
head when you're so fast?
Are you really taking in whatthat prayer says?
And we were in a situationwhere they could say well, we

(01:04:43):
don't need that, we just the.
The exercise of it is just.
You know, it's like doingcalisthenics for many it was and
being in rhythm with everybodyelse.
But in today's world they,people, need to know what
they're saying.
You know it doesn't fly by theway with the next generation.
You know it doesn't fly by theway with the next generation.

(01:05:05):
I was told to go and I went.
Kids are not going to gobecause you tell them to go.
They just aren't.
They're too rebellious and youshould hear some of the things
these bar mitzvah kids say.
But I embrace it because I sayyou know, if you don't want to
be here, go, go.
I, I don't.
I don't want to be here, go.
I don't want to be here withyou.
But I do happen to get thechildren who are serious and who

(01:05:26):
want to be there.
And I tell the parents, ifyou're making your kid do this,
don't.
It's not worth it, let themcome back later Because if it's
forced on you, there's so manystories that I heard, you know,
with adults crying because theywere forced to do it, they hated
it, you know and that, how doyou know?
That's the thing that that needs.

(01:05:48):
You can't force anyone to dothis.
You have to love it.
And I love, I love what I do, Ilove teaching Judaism from that
open standpoint where peopleget to discover it.
They have the dignity ofdiscovering it for themselves
and what feels good and that is,um, that's a gift.

(01:06:09):
So you know, kind of, what youwere talking about with.
Well, the smart questions yourhusband would say well, is it
what your rabbi said?
Is it what the conservative?
You know?
You have to ask those questions.

What are your hopes and goals for your new
congregation, because you'vebeen there less than a year?
What are the things that you'rehoping to accomplish.

I want to accomplish some stability
because the congregation's beenthrough so much, so many changes
and different rabbis and all ofthat.
And I want to.
I want to bring that nextgeneration.
There's a lot of young peoplecoming because I'm there,
because they see a woman, theysee something new, they see

(01:06:56):
something refreshing to them andmy hope is to bring to this
congregation and they do lovetheir Judaism music.
They didn't have ever have acantor before.
So I want to bring them alldifferent kinds of music and
teach about the music and it'sbeautiful.
And I want to teach.

(01:07:19):
I want to give them anotherlayer to what they already know
and not have them feelintimidated.
I want them to ask thequestions so that they can own
their Judaism and in a differentway, in an even stronger way.
That those are, I mean thoseare my goals, that those are, I
mean those are my goals and Ithink really encouraging that

(01:07:45):
next generation is a biggie.

It's really important.

It's really important.
I think that our future restswith them loving it.
And if and if.
I just felt that if the nextgeneration is raised the way I
was raised, they're not going tolove it and they're not going
to go Because it becomes like achore.

You know nobody wants to.
You need to bring the joy and Ifeel like, especially with a
lot of religious Jews, I feellike it's not a joy because it's
a chore and it shouldn't be.
Something like religionshouldn't be.
Sometimes it can feel like achore when it's, you know, the
third day of the holidays, butin general it should not feel
like that, right?

(01:08:24):
So this last portion of theinterview is going to be short
form, like the actor's studio,so these don't require long
answers.
What is your favorite?

Yiddish word.
Oh boy, my mother speaks fluentYiddish.
The first thing that came to myhead was kvetch.
But I don't know if that's myfavorite Moishe Kapoyer is.
I don't even know if I'm sayingit right, but I think there's
just some hysterical soundingwords that I make my mother say

(01:08:59):
because she has the accent of it.
So for any of your listenersand you know, all of those are
great, great words.

The Yiddish world was just brilliant.
What is?

your favorite Jewish holiday?
Hmm, I really love Passover andhow it goes into the Omer and
how it goes into all the Yom'sand Shavuot.
It's a very rich time and it'svery similar to the high

(01:09:46):
holidays on the on the oppositeend.
But I I love the, the, the, thefamily connection to Passover,
all the different versions ofPassover, I love all the music
and all the various ways thatyou can engage children and
adults.
And then afterwards there'sspiritual work for you to do and
because I love Musar, I loveyou know that it kind of, for me

(01:10:10):
, begins with the counting ofthe Omer and then Shavuot.

If you were to have a bat mitzvah today and
have a big blowout party whatwould the theme be?

The theme would be all the brilliant people,
teachers, that I love.
I mean, there'd be a Hescheltable, there'd be a Herzl table,
there'd be a, you know, rabbiSachs table.
There would be, you know, aGolda table.
There would be, you know just,you know, nechama Leibowitz
table, aviva Zornberg table,that's you know.
I would just want people toknow who these brilliant minds
were, who have shaped Judaism.

What profession other than your own would you
want to attempt?
None.

That's the first time I've gotten that answer no
, this is what I wanted to be,and it took a long time to get
here, but this is exactly what Iwanted.

So if heaven is real and God is there to welcome
you, what would you like tohear them say?

good job, thank you.

I know it wasn't easy, just I would like to hear
you know.
Good job, it's time to rest.
Thank you so much for joiningme this evening.
This has been amazing and Ionly cried like twice.
I feel like I always cry withmy good interviews.
This is Nicole Kelly and thishas been she Brewed in the City.

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"Don't Dream It, Be It" - An Interview with Rabbi-Cantor Judy Greenfeld

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}"Don't Dream It, Be It" - An Interview with Rabbi-Cantor Judy Greenfeld