Ep. 255 Best of 2024: Favorite Movies with Elijah Davidson and Craig Detweiler

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Unknown (00:01):
I thought we had your support. If we liberals are not
united, Tedesco will becomePope. You have no idea how bad
it became. Thomas the way he andhis circle attacked the Holy
Father towards the end, thesmears, the leaks to the press,
it was savage. He fought himevery single day of his
pontificate, and now that he'sdead, he wants to destroy his

(00:22):
life's work. If Tedesco becomesPope, he will undo 60 years of
progress.
You talk as if you're the onlyalternative, but adai, Amy has
the wind behind him. A day. Amyadayami,
the man who believes thathomosexuals should be sent to
prison in this world and hell inthe next a damn, he's not the
answer to anything, and you knowit, if you want

(00:46):
to defeat this is a conclaveAldo. It's not a war. It is
a war, and you have to commit toa side. You Joshua,

Joshua Johnson (01:09):
hello and welcome to the shifting culture
podcast in which we haveconversations about the culture
we create and the impact we canmake. We long to see the body of
Christ look like Jesus. I'm yourhost. Joshua Johnson, welcome to
the second of our best of 2024,episodes. In this one, we are
counting down our favoritemovies of the year with Elijah
Davidson and Craig Detweiler.
You are in for a treat. As theyspeak about movies a lot more

(01:32):
articulately than I do. This isa fun one. If you have been
enjoying the podcast this year,I'd love it if you would go to
Apple podcasts and leave arating and review. It helps us
out a lot. Thank you so much.
I'm also starting an arts mediaand storytelling company in the
new year. If you are interestedin letting the creative arts
emerge so that the body ofChrist can look more like Jesus,

(01:55):
then connect with me. You canemail me at Jay
johnson@allnations.us I'mlooking for people to make this
happen with me. So let's get tothe episode. Here is the best of
2024 favorite movies Edition.
Welcome to our favorite moviesof 2024 Podcast. I'm so excited
to have you, Elijah and youCraig on to join me, and we

(02:17):
could discuss our films, ourfavorite films of the year. So
to get going, I just a couple ofthings I'd love to hear. Like,
what was your your film goingexperience this year like for
you, just in general, what wasthat like? And then like, what
did your your list end up being?

(02:38):
What were some criterias for youand your list as you were
thinking about putting thesemovies together, that's

Craig Detweiler (02:45):
good. Hit it.
Hit it. Elijah, ooh,

Elijah Davidson (02:48):
what was my film going year like? Well, I
have, I have two very smallchildren. One is, one is soon to
be five, and the other is soonto be two. And so my film going
near was, let's say, at one ofprofound gratitude, because
anytime I was able to get outand see a movie, I was

(03:09):
profoundly grateful, because wewere busy with other stuff a lot
of times. So most of the most ofthe time that was late at night,
after the kids were in bed. Andso alongside being grateful to
be out seeing a movie, I alsokind of wished I was at home
with my wife, because that was,like the only time we got to
hang out together, too. So thatwas my that was my dynamic of

(03:33):
the year. I I felt like not alot of movies were released this
year, that it was kind of a downrelease year. I think coming off
of both, like, still come off alittle bit of pandemic stuff,
but then, like, the strikes andstuff that this year was kind of
a down year. I also readsomewhere that they were a lot
of the market analysts weresaying that, in addition to

(03:54):
those things, people were still,like, kind of working their way
back into life, and a lot of sothat. So a lot of movie studios
kind of knew that and heldmovies back and for next year,
when they expect theatricalattendance to be up a whole lot.
So a lot of movies are supposedto come out next year, a lot
more movies. So I had theexperience of constantly being

(04:15):
like, okay, tonight I can go seea movie. What's out? I've
already seen all those movies atthe new day. So, so I liked, I
liked, I liked the movies that Isaw. And I wish that there were
more of them. That was my thatwas my year.

I'd say my year kind of starts off with a bang,
because I try to get to Sunday'sfilm festival every year. And so
I'll watch, you know, 15 or 20films in a week, and, and, and
you're hard to process that manywhen you get that many stories
kicking around in your head. Butit's actually helpful, because
then as those films roll outover the year, you know, over

(04:53):
the months to come, then you'relike, Oh yeah, I did see that.
Oh yeah. What was that? What wasthat about? And then maybe I'll
go back. I could see it again.
So you get maybe a secondviewing, a deeper dive. And it's
weird. The way that I guess filmreleases now are tricky as well,
because it's like, is it on? Isit is it premiering? Is it

(05:13):
streaming? Is it in theaters fortwo weeks, two days, two cities.
You know, there's all it's justso many irregularities in the
release cycle that I think it'sactually hard to gather around
any one film, or any two films.
It's hard to have aconversation, because
everybody's seeing them atirregular times, in irregular

(05:36):
places. And I think that's oneof the downfalls, is one of the
problems of the streaming era,like it's all available, but
nobody's necessarily watching itat the same time, and so you
can't quite discuss it the waymaybe you used to, where there
was only one film a month, ortwo films a month that maybe
everybody was seeing andinteracting with. There's still,

(05:58):
of course, the big summerreleases, you know, you're gonna
have your Wolverines, yourdeadpools, etc, but they don't
maybe invite as much reflectionafterwards. It's like, yeah,
that disposable pop. And what'snext? You know, I need some, you
know, some gummy bears to chaseit down with, or something. More

(06:20):
sweet, disposable, sweet. So,

yeah, I mean, for me, Elijah, I'm a little bit
with you on that is, you know, Ihave a younger son, and my
mother in law passed away earlythis year, in January, and so
she lived with us for sevenyears, and she was our built in
babysitter. And so going outwith my wife wasn't as possible

(06:45):
going to the movies. And so Iwould sneak out, like during the
day and go find, find a movie,and go seek things out. And, you
know, I showed her my list. Ithink I've a list of about 16
that I was thinking about, likeputting in my top 10 I showed
her, and she's like, I've seentwo of those with you. That was

(07:05):
great. But, yeah, it was you hadto see seek things out and try
to go. It wasn't always likewhen I'm available, oh, there's
a movie that I actually reallywant to see So, but there were
some, some great ones this year.
So some some really good filmsthat I really enjoyed. So it'd
be fun to think about discussit. My my criteria with my list,

(07:26):
if I was just going through, wasbasically, what are the films
that resonated most with me?
What? How did I have a reactionto it myself, not necessarily,
these were the best films of theyear. I'm not a professional
critic, but I am somebody thatthat loves, loves film, loves

(07:48):
movies. I love to see them, andI love to discuss them and and
think about them. But I was justwhat really resonated with me.
And so these are the thingswhere either I had a good time,
it made me, made me cry thewhole time through something
that it really touched meemotionally in one way or

(08:09):
another. And so that was my bigcriteria for me. What resonated
with with me? How about you?
Elijah,

yeah, I'm, I'm kind of always I over the years
of doing this and puttingtogether lists every year I've
I've kind of come to a kind of acentral thing I'm always looking
for, and tomorrow aligned fromHamilton. I'm looking for a mind
at work when I go to when I goto the movies. And so I want to
see like, it may not necessarilybe like the director or

(08:37):
whatever, often it can be thedirector, but I'm just looking
for something where things see,things seem in very intentional,
like they're trying to dosomething. The filmmakers are
trying to get at something, dosomething, discuss something,
explore something. That might bein there might be an idea, the
idea needs to be expressedvisually, sonically, you know,

(08:58):
like it's I like to seeintention and the sometimes that
equals what people might calluneven films, or films that are
kind of hard to hard to getinto, because there can be a lot
of intention there that's comingfrom a very odd place or a very
particular place. But I lovethat. I just love to see, love

(09:19):
to see a mind at work. And Ithink it gives, it gives you
something to respond to when youcan see a lot of intention
there. So I'm always looking forthat nice.

How about you, Craig,

I would say, for me, you know, if you go to
the roots of drama, it's, it'stears and laughter. So in some
cases, things made me laugh. Insome cases, things made me cry.
Unfortunately, I feel like a lotof what movies would now is just
really be pure provocation. Youknow, they're just like, trying

(09:53):
to get any response out of you,and they'll go to any length to
move you out of sort of stasis,of like. I've seen that before.
I've thought that before, andI'm not sure that creates better
humans or better film going itcreates a reaction, but I'm not
sure that that reaction isdrawing me into a place of

(10:15):
reflection, or, you know, selfassessment, that causes me to
maybe say, How do I how do Ilove and serve people better?
Instead? It's like, oh, thatmade me angry and confused, and
I'm I'm raging even more, andit's like, I don't think I need
more of that. That's kind ofcalled the nightly news, you
know. So I don't know if I wantto go to the movies to get more

(10:38):
provocation, but I can see why,in an age of kind of over
stimulation, that's maybe thedefault of a lot of

Unknown (10:48):
filmmakers. Great.

Well, I'm excited to see see the list and
what you guys have on so let'sget started. We're just going to
go down our lists one at a time.
And so we're going to start withnumber 10, and we'll start with
you, Elijah, what is your number10 film of

the year? This was, like I said, it was kind of
a funny year for me for gettingout and seeing movies I didn't,
maybe I didn't see as many as Ias I wanted to. That's not an
apology for my list, exactly,but a way of saying that when I
the I had nine films I wasreally sure about, and I keep a
list running all year, and I'lllike move movies onto it and off

(11:24):
of it as see other stuff, youknow. So I have, I've been
running lists, and I had, I hadnine movies on that list about a
month ago that I was that I waspretty, pretty certain about
that, you know, I like thesemovies, but that 10th movie was
a little bit tricky. There werenot because they weren't good
movies. It was just because Ifelt like a lot of the movies I

(11:44):
liked them for similar reasons.
And which 1am I gonna make?
Finally put in that 10 spot, andI finally decided on the piano
lesson, the Malcolm Washingtondirected adaptation of the John
August Wilson play. I guess it'sthe third in Denzel Washington's
goal of adapting all 10 of thethe American cycle, August

(12:08):
Wilson. August Wilson's Americancycle. Yeah, of place. So it's
not, it's on Netflix. Now, I wasable to see it pretty easy, but
it was, it was what I expectedit to be, and then it also
really wasn't, because it was ait was a ghost story as well.
And I if you don't, if you don'tknow, it's about a brother and

(12:32):
sister, who are you over whetheror not to sell a piano that's
been handed down to theirfamily? And this is the 1930s
except the 1930s and the pianohas a lot of very complicated
history, family history attachedto it. And kind of discovering
that is a lot of the fun of themovie. Fun is maybe not the
right word, but a lot of theemotional pull of the film. And

(12:55):
I love a good ghost story, and Ithink when filmmakers can use
that conceit to to bring out theother themes that they're
working working with. Del Torois really good at that kind of
thing. But I just, I kind ofloved how it came together. And,

(13:15):
you know, the mind at work piecehere. I think Malcolm is a is a
new filmmaker. I think this ishis directorial debut. I think I
should look that up. And therewas, there was, there was a lot
of, a lot of intent here. Therewere a lot of, like, you know,
interesting shots, but not justinteresting for their own sake,
shots that, like, gave the pianoitself a sense of life, and some

(13:40):
good some, I don't know, Iappreciated some of the staging
of some of the I guess you callthem flashbacks. They kind of
occur in narrative sequence, butthey're also kind of flashbacks,
I don't know. I just thought it.
It was really interesting. Iwanted to see more. It made me
want to go, you know, watchfences and maurin is black
bottom, the other two thatthey've done. Watch those again
and kind of understand moreabout the plays and everything.

(14:02):
So anyway, the piano lessonnumber 10. Yeah,

awesome. Good.
Craig,

well, Joshua, I like a good action picture. So
my number 10, my original number10, was the beekeeper, because
in a year without John Wick,this was the biggest, dumbest
revenge action picture that Icould think of and that. But
then I went and I thought, well,the John wake director actually

(14:32):
made another great, dumb actionpicture called the fall guy made
about a really bad 80s picture.
So I was like, you know RyanGosling, that was super
charming. Love that. Andultimately I said, if it has to
be the best rather than theworst of the best, I had to
shift. And so I went for apicture called Rebel ridge on
Netflix. I don't know if youhear of

you. Sound good? Yeah. So

I. Know, I loved it because it's, I would
call it a southern slow burn. Itis a revenge pick, but it's
rooted, I think, in thattradition of things like walking
tall, where you know, you know,you got a character who doesn't
want to resort to violence isdoing everything they can to
resist it. But you also, ofcourse, have the bad southern

(15:20):
sheriff and the racism rollingthrough it. I thought Aaron
Pierre is a great actor, greatfind as the lead in that and the
director, Jeremy sonier, youknow, he's done Blue Ruin, he's
done Green Room. They're alwaysthese very simmering things that
result in cathartic violence, oreven in this case, maybe some

(15:43):
non violence. And I thought itwas just a smart pick, yeah,

yeah. Really good, really good pick. I love
the opening scene of that filmwith with him on the bicycle,
and then going through and justlike it all ramped up, your
anxiety is starting to to comeup and move. I thought it was
just, you know, very, very deaffilmmaker that he's he's doing

(16:08):
some great things, great work.
And Aaron Pierre needs to be ina lot more movies. He's
fantastic. He's really good.

And that was almost my number 10. That was
one of the ones I was worryingwith to put in my number 10
spot. I It's the kind of moviethat's, like my favorite kind of
anything, whereas where someonewho is really good at something,
they show you in great detailhow they do that thing, and,
like a procedural kind of thing.
And I eat those movies up.

(16:38):
That's, that's the best thing.
That was a good one. Yeah, nice,

nice. Well, my number 10 is small things like
these. Sets back in the in the80s in Ireland, and Killian
Murphy plays a coal worker thatgoes and delivers coal during
Christmas time and Christmasseason, and he's seen a lot of
injustice happening around histown, and he is moved, wants to

(17:06):
speak it out, take care of thepeople being abused. Man,
Killian Murphy, it's such aquiet film, and Killian Murphy
knows how to act with his eyes.
I mean, it's just like his eyesare the most mesmerizing eyes I
think we have right now. And hecan, can really act with his
eyes. And it just really drew mein. I think one of the things it

(17:29):
tells the story of the Magdalenesisters, true stories of the
abuse that was happening in theschools that the nuns were
putting on girls schools there.
And I think part of it is one ofthe very first festival films
that I was able to go to, isthat at the Seattle

(17:50):
International Film Festival wasthe Magdalene sisters, and I
just walked in blind. And itjust stuck with me, one for the
experience that I had, you know,the first festival film for me.
And just, you know, getting thatthe sense of justice and care
for people in the marginalized.
So I really love that. And Ilove Claire Keegan's really

(18:11):
short novel that the movie wasbased on, and was really good.
So, yeah, small things likethese, my number 10, Elijah,
number nine, number

nine. So this is so my number nine film is a
film that I I've that Iabsolutely hated watching, that
hated every, almost every momentof watching it. But I hated it
because it was so good at whatit was doing and the way it was
telling a story. So the film isbetween the temples. Ah, yes,

(18:48):
yeah. So sorry, Sundance, Craig,did you see it there as well? I
did. I did, yeah, maybe in thesame screening I was in. But
hopefully you were much lessuncomfortable than I was. But
it's, it's one of those. So themovies about a cantor, played by
Jason swartzman, who's kind ofgoing through a personal crisis.

(19:09):
He He meets, or re meets, thewoman who was his music teacher
in school, played by Carol Kanein my favorite performance of
the year, and she's kind of likea Manic Pixie septuagintarian or
something like that. She kind oflike brings new life to his
life. And she's so incredible inthe movie. But it's one of

(19:34):
those, like anxiety comedies,where everything, every moment,
is just like amped up. And yeah,and I hate those kind of movies,
I just, I just like it. I sitlike in a ball, like in the
theater, like trying not towatch what I have to watch, kind
of thing. And it's a really goodone. So if you like those kind
of things, they it's great. AndI said, Carol Kane's awesome.

(19:58):
Um. The it asks all thesequestions about about religion
and about and about friendshipand love and grief and trauma
and how you get through thosethings, and what how religion is
part of that. So it has allthese great ideas running
through it, and it's just like Isaid, really well told in the

(20:19):
way that Nathan silver wanted totell that story. I will never
watch it again. But otherpeople, should I

I'd put it at, like, a solid, like, maybe
number 15 for me, you know, isit absolutely, definitely worth
watching total, total trainwreck of a movie, right? Just,
it's just, it's just, it's justhaving all the laughs are at
characters, expenses, justcringe inducing, yeah, painful
every step of the way.

It does have a teasing all this talk of
miserable, miserableness. It hasa fantastic final shot and
fantastic ending that you reallyneed. It's like, it's like the
it's like the opposite of thatSchrader thing, where you like
to withhold everything and thengive some kind of release at the
end. It's not withholdinganything, but it still gives you

(21:09):
like a moment of just reallybeautiful release at the end. So
between the symbols perfect,Craig

number nine, I've got a comedy as well. But
mine would be a real pain withJesse Heisenberg as director and
Kieran Culkin as maybe the paininducing cousin, who, you know,
both of them are going to lookat something in real pain. It's
interesting. I've chosen a veryJewish comedy as well for my

(21:39):
number nine. And again, to mineboth comedy and pathos out of an
ancestry trip to Poland to tracethe grandmother's route out. And
to, you know, to actually visitsome of the internment camps.

(22:00):
And to remember the Holocaust,it's just really beautifully
done. I really also like thefact it was just 90 minutes, it
was small, it was tight, it waspacked. It didn't didn't need to
draw things out. It scored itspoints. Made them really well.
And I'm just like, Well doneboys, you know, well done. They
won Best Screenplay at Sundance,I think for a reason, because it

(22:24):
was tight, well constructed, andI just admired it. So a real
pain, thumbs up,

nice. A real pain was not a real pain at
theater. It might come up alittle bit later on my list as
well. And I love, and Iespecially love Kieran Culkin in
this movie. I think one of myfavorite performances of the
year. He was fantastic. He's sogood. But my number nine is the
wild robot. I really enjoyed.
This is one of the movies that Iwas able to go with my son and

(22:54):
my wife, and we were able toenjoy it together. But I love
the animation. The animation isjust gorgeous, and it's
beautiful. And the story itselfreminds me a little bit about of
your book, Craig is honestcreativity. Of you know how to
be creative in this world andnot just rely on the machines
and AI and be in the world to bea maker, because that's who we

(23:17):
are. And I think that really, Ithink it helped us be better
humans in the world is watchingthis film, even though we get to
see it through the lens of arobot that is the robot. But we
do get to actually know, hey,what does it actually look like
to be human, to connect to eachother, to nature, to the things

(23:38):
of this, this earth, that arereal. And so I loved it for all
of those things, debatingwhether to put it in my top 10.
It just snuck in there thismorning, so it got something
off. But I love wild robots. Itwas fantastic. I think a lot of
people should, should watch it.

(24:00):
And got my son into reading allthe books too, which is great,
fantastic. Yeah,

yeah. I love that, that those had such a fun
sense of humor, yes, like, veryalmost, almost a dark sense of
humor, but kind of just, youknow, all this stuff about, like
the animals dying and stuff. Ilike that. I mean, like, you
think, like a movie aboutnature, it needs to have
something in there about, likethe fragility of life,
especially in the wild. So Iloved how he handled that. That

(24:27):
was so good.

Yep, great. All right, number eight,

my number eight film Night is a big bowl of
fondue, a big bowl of fun dudethat they call conclave. Ah,

yes, cheesy delight. Yeah. It is so
wonderfully cheesy, but it is sorich and good too. And I have my
number seven, so I'm right herewith you. Let's get into it,
yeah or

nice, yeah. I mean, if you're gonna, if

you're gonna.
Have something that cheesy youwant it to be like, acted that
well and shot that well, andhave actual like things to say,
like ideas on his mind, and forthe plot to be just doled out
like an Agatha Christie novel,you know, just like the right
twist when you when you needthem, and when you're like, it
just so much fun.

Boiler, pot boiler, right? But it's Apple
stew. Yeah, it's so much fun,and it has

some really interesting ideas and
interesting theological ideasunderneath that are that are fun
to discuss and and talk about sobig bullfin do best kind of
thing.

It was actually my favorite election story of
the year. You know, I didn'treally enjoy the other one, but
this one was fine. Yeah, thatwas a good election story. I
also liked all the, I would callthem, kind of the peacocks,
preening and positioning, right?
Like it was, yeah. And then, youknow, I also like how they
basically kind of let IsabellaRossellini kind of come in and

(26:01):
maybe steal the movie, maybethe, you know, the twist, the
turn that with inside scoop, andthat was kind of fun as well.
So, yeah,

yeah, I don't know Ray fines is, and I think
that this was probably his bestperformance of his career. I
just loved Ray finds in this. Hewas so compelling. The costumes,
the cinematography was justgorgeous. Edward Berger knows
how to how to direct a film like

sound design, right? Yeah, super quiet movie.
It's

really movies, but with the shots where, like
it has, it has moments of kindof like ostentatious framing and
shots, you know, it has momentsof that. The rest of it's, like,
very soundly put together andnever not interesting to look
at. But it doesn't do that all,and it doesn't do that all the
time. It doesn't do big shotsall the time. It is the right
balance of both those things. Iit just, yeah, good stuff.

I want to acknowledge right, that if I was
Catholic, I might have adifferent feeling, you know, and
I not really want my, myconclave turned into, you know,
a big, big bowl of stew, ofcheesy stew. So just an
acknowledgement, right? Yeah, wecan laugh. We can laugh. They
might not find it funny, andthat's okay. I get

I get it. Okay.
So good, all right, numbereight, Craig,

number eight for me, I'm going back to
action, and that would be toFuriosa.

Unknown (27:31):
He took everything from me, my mother, my childhood.
I want them back.

You know, not, not up to right, the the level
of carry around, yeah, yeah. ButGeorge Miller's origin story,
you know, I thought it was, itwas deeply satisfying. I liked
the five chapters, thedistinctiveness of it. I liked
how it came around in the end,once she took down dementias,

(28:06):
you know, obviously all of us,any of us raised by wolves or
motorcycle gangs, would have atough time, you know, and be be
tough. I didn't always believeAndrew Taylor joy as an action
hero. I think I like the littleFuriosa better than the, you
know, the adolescent Brown, I

think is her name, yeah, yeah, yeah, good,

so, but, but still a deeply satisfying, you
know, maybe not masterpiece, butcertainly excellent, excellent
action

pick, yeah, yeah. Such a great movie. I
think that I actually,personally, I think I like
Furiosa better than Fury Road,and I think that sacrilege to
say, but I do, because I thinkthere's more heart in Furiosa to
me, like it feels more likethere's a there is a human
there. And I think we getFuriosa later in Fury Road,

(29:01):
where she has, like, a, I can'tbe that anymore, like I'm just,
it's just a revenge flick thatis masterfully made, but it's
just the the little bit of heartthere for me, made it more of a
human story. And I just, yeah, Ilove Furiosa. That was such a
good one. Good pick. It

is. It is on my list too. I'm not gonna say
where it is, but since we'retalking we're talking about it,
I'll go ahead and talk about it,so it'll come up later on my
list. I I actually also like Ilike it better than Fury Road,
because I am I admire Fury Road,but I feel like free road is
like one tone the whole time.
And I I've watched it a lot, alot of times, because I do it.

(29:41):
Still enjoy it. Watch it a lotof times, and I just find it
kind of numbing after a while,Fury Road and I I love sagas,
like reading Icelandic sagas andall those kind of old stories.
And I love, I love how the MadMax franchise has always been
about stories and storytelling,and how we because. It's always
been a series that set likesomeone telling me about the
past, you know, these legends ofthese characters, or whatever.

(30:05):
So I like how he worked in theidea of always worked in the
idea of storytelling, and, like,makes a big saga out of it. And
it were it, it obeys the rulesof sagas and all that I'm I
just, I adored it. I also wanteda big, Mad Max kick this year,
kicked off by my love ofFuriosa. And watched all the
what's all the the older films,what's all the special features,

(30:28):
everything I get my hands on.
And it was just kind of a Gog atwhat George Miller and team
create, and how much of it is,you know, practical stunt work
and all the things they buildand just incredible, you know.
And there's like nothing elselike it in in movie history or
anywhere. And I just adored it.
Yeah, I also thought it was avery compelling, interesting

(30:52):
idea of a revenge narrative. AndI and like the end of it, I
think the end is, like,beautifully vague about how
dementias feels about hissituation at the end, and what
that suggests about the kind ofrevenge redemption thing

(31:14):
happened there. And you know,the best, the best sagas, the
best old sagas, are like thattoo. They they leave you a
little unsettled. And I lovethat Miller electrics unsettled.
I hope we get the wasteland, thethe other film he wants to make
in this, like late trilogy,we'll see. But I'm gonna tell
you what number it is on mylist, but it will come on nine,

(31:35):
five.

Joshua, what's your number eight? My

number eight. So we live in time. Andrew
Garfield, Florence, Pugh,relationship drama. I love the
editing in this, this movie, itfeels like, you know, as Andrew
Garfield's telling the story tohis his child is basically what
i i See, telling the story oftheir relationship and who they

(32:01):
are, and it feels like this,this jazz improvisational type
of storytelling where one memoryleads to another memory. And
it's not a linear storytelling,it's it is like we're jumping
back and forth in time. And Ireally I like that. I like how
they play with time. I like thethe relationship of the core,

(32:23):
and I like that. You know,people realize that connection
and family and people areactually more important than our
ambition and being producers inthis world, but it's the people
that we're with in the end thatmake life worth living. So I
loved we live in time. It wasfun. It was a good, good, good,

(32:47):
good time at the theater. Forme,

I was that was, that's my number one movie that
I just missed. I kept trying togo see it, and things kept
happening, and it was just gonebefore I could, before I could
get to that. I still intend tosee that soon. Nice. All right.
Number seven, my next numberseven for me is a dune, part
two,

second part of the dune. I'm always just a step
ahead of you. I keep rate andminus a little higher than
yours, just a little higher. Igot this higher. That was my
that was my five. That was myfive. No four. I gotta do this
four. Number four

dude. Yeah, I liked the first dude. I did the
first part of this film wellenough, like I thought it was
really good world building. Butthis second movie, like it just
the new just once you geteverything set up, just went
with it, and I just found itjust thrilling, like every
moment that, you know, the bookis an unwieldy thing, unwieldy

(33:49):
weird thing, and they let theweirdness be weird, and just
told the story the way it is.
You know, I kind of somewhereCOVID, some of the Furiosa
stuff, like, it's, it's one ofthese, like, stories that we
tell again and again and againin different forms, you know.
And it's a movie that's awarethat we tell these stories, and,
like, has ideas. And it's ideasabout, like, why, why do we tell

(34:10):
these stories, and how do theyshape us? And in particular,
religious stories, how do theyshape communities, and how do
they, how they move us forward?
And and then but setting allthat aside is just like
spectacle, the highest degreeTimothy

Chalamet on a sand worm that will live in
infamy, right? Yeah, it'll allbe on highlight reels throughout
cinema history. Gary, yeah,yeah, as it should be, as it
should

amazing, yeah,

I needed it until I got it right. Yes,

it's fantastic.
So good. Yeah, I lived in theArab world for, you know, for
many years. And so even all thestuff that is actually taken
from the desert, from Arabtribes, from Islamic law.
Islamic world. I really likedthat aspect of it for me, just
personally, as it just remindedme of the place that I lived. It

(35:07):
was shot. It was shot in Jordan,where, you know, and I lived in
Jordan, and so it was very itjust also to me, it was a
personal connection. But themovie itself, man, Oh, such a
such a fun one. I love to needVilleneuve like he is. Man, he
is a filmmaker that I'll, I'llget excited about and watch

(35:30):
anything he does, just thespectacle that he brings. I

also feel like it could have that Star Wars
effect where it's like, why wasthe middle one the best, you
know, and I also, I, actually, Ifeel that way even about the
two, the two towers in The Lordof the Rings apology. I feel
like it's the best of the three.
I don't know exactly why thatis. Maybe it's because you start
to see and it when it starts tomake its turn, you start to see
the full implications. So we'renot quite at the at the holy war

(36:00):
false messiah moment, right? Butyou're but you're seeing it. And
I certainly feel like we'll callit geopolitically, the search
for messiahs, and the amount offalse Messiahs and autocrats
stepping up full of falsepromises and bravado. It's, it's

(36:21):
almost endless. And so it couldbe by the time the third one
arrives that it's going to be sospot on as the ultimate
commentary on, like where wewere the last decade. And, you
know, so false. You know, peoplefall following, uh, charlatans
into battle. You know, for forempty victories. We'll see. You

(36:42):
know,

yeah, that's good. Craig, hey, if I have it
right, you have conclave here atnumber seven. I do conclave.
Anything else you want to sayabout conclave?

No, I'm gonna eat my bowl of cheesy stew that
a lot just served up. Gonna turnthe fondue a little more

nice? Well, my number seven, we've already
talked about it as well, is areal pain. And so, yeah, just
this, yeah, this littlerelationship drama, going back
to find their roots back inPoland, to go seek out their
grandmother's house where shelives, and go to Holocaust
sites, I think, man, I again.
Kieran culkins performance isoutstanding. It's, it is

(37:28):
something like, he just commandsyour attention on screen every
single moment that he's there.
And he, man, he is an enigma asan actor, like he's just gonna
show up, get his lines memorizedin five minutes and just go, and
he's like, Who is this guy? Buthe goes out to how to command.

(37:53):
He has something on screen, thischarisma that you just can't
look away. That's

a little of, I think, how it came together.
Like he actually didn't want togo. And it was just like, No,
you're going. And he was like,Okay, I'll show up, you know. So
a little of that, like, whereare we going and what we're
doing that was not acting, maybethat was real, you know, what
are we doing? What's next? Yeah.

And I heard, you know, Jesse Heisenberg was just
telling him, just, just followKieran. Just follow him around.
See, see what happens. Allright, Elijah, number six.
Number six

for me was a documentary called fly that Nat
Geo put it out, but it was thefilmmakers behind it are
Christina classy out, I thinkthat's how you say her name, and
then Charles Schwartz, and it'son Disney plus, so you can watch
it there. But it's a, it's adocumentary about BASE jumpers

(38:46):
and people, like, wear wingsuits and, like, fly through
canyons and all that. And itstarts out, you know? And I felt
like, when it started out, I waslike, Oh, this is going to be
one of those kind of, like, Idon't know, just kind of, like,
not interesting, basic, like,extreme sports documentaries,
not interesting in the sensethat they don't really like
investigate the drive of thesepeople and just kind of show you

(39:06):
amazing footage of people flyingthrough canyons and wingsuits,
which is cool. And theydefinitely do that. You get to
see, like some of that helmetcam stuff that people do and
whatnot. But it really like, asit went on, it kind of became
kind of a gentle Herzog filmfilmmakers were are very
interested in what drives thesepeople and kind of the the death

(39:32):
impulse, or how it hurts theirfamily relationships or doesn't,
explores all that they theyfollowed these BASE jumpers over
eight years of their life, andyou know, very dangerous sports.
So you know, you don't knowwho's going to survive and who's
not as the years go by. So itwas really good. I I love nature
documentaries. I love likenature sports documentaries,

(39:54):
yeah, too. And they, I find thatthey tell the same story over
and over and over again, thestory of. So in order to have a
transcendent experience innature, you must leave behind
your friends and family, unlessyou have to break relationship
in order to have a goodrelationship with nature. And I
don't know why we keep tellingthat story, but we do, and this,

(40:16):
this tells that story, but italso shows how being involved in
the natural world or in sport,in this case, can also be a
communal experience, and how itcan contribute to stronger
community and communal life. Soand also, it's just amazing to
watch these people fly games andstuff. I mean, just incredible.

(40:38):
Sure, yeah, awesome. Well, thetechnology of the sport
developed over the time thatthey were making the film. So
like we start out, you're seeingone kind of base jumping, and
then by the end, they can dowhole new things because of the
kind of suits they can wear atstuff. So cool.

Great. That's fly fly, and see it on Disney.
Plus you can nice, all right,Craig, you're number six. Uh,
Number

Six for me, I think one of the biggest
cinematic themes of the year, ithad to do with the body, and
discomfort, with our body,wanting to change our body,
disfigurement, all that kind ofstuff. It ranged from films like
the substance, which was pureprovocation, just did not let
up, just trying to blast theaudience out of theater with

(41:23):
with rage, but I thinkcompletely lacked empathy. So
did not work for me, really atall. Amelia Perez, I was, like,
also trying to be empathetic,but it's like, made by a
Frenchman about Mexican Narcowars, and something that I don't
think it captured Mexico Citywhatsoever. So I felt like that

(41:43):
was a miss. I haven't seen adifferent man, although I've
heard that one's veryinteresting and empathetic. The
one that got inside my skin themost was I saw the TV glow.
That's my number six. Director,Jane schoenbrun. It for for the
director, I believe it's youknow about what it feels like to

(42:11):
need to pursue a trans life, toto change, and what happens if
you don't. So it's the the oddsof resisting a calling and and
the regret that may come fromthat the feeling of being
trapped. And the film feels veryinternal, feels very trapping. I

(42:35):
also love just how much ittrafficked in. I would call it
like 90 pop culture. So it's atribute to Buffy the Vampire
Slayer through a an imaginaryFilm TV show in the and I saw
the TV glow called the pinkopaque and and in the pink
opaque, you have teenagersbattling Mr. Melancholy, Mr.

(42:58):
Melancholy. And I think that'swhat all teens do. All teens are
battling Mr. Melancholy all thetime, and so you have Divergent
Paths in the film. I just thinkit will, over time, be viewed as
a real classic of the genre.
Kind of update, you know whatJohn Hughes might make if he was

(43:18):
still making films 30 or 40years later, really gets inside
the teen experience, and thatdysphoria that many kids feel

nice good as I saw the TV glow, my number six
is, I think, maybe the most funI had at the theater this year,
and that was this, this big,bombastic musical, wicked. I
just, I really, I really enjoyedwicked. I The affinity for this,

(43:52):
for the stage musical, I mysister's friends worked on
wicked on Broadway, and so I gotto go backstage, take a tour, be
on stage, wicked, and then see,see the show. I love that. But
Cynthia Revo and Ariana Grandeperformances both were
spectacular, fantastic. I loveJohn Chu's direction, and I love

(44:18):
the choreography, the the whole,whole scene in the library, when
people are dancing around thethe library is spinning, and
it's all shot. Practically it'sthere. You can see people move.
It's just like one of those oldschool musicals. We actually

(44:38):
appreciate people dance like youcould actually see it. It's not,
you know, we're gonna cut hereand here, and you can't
appreciate the the dance, whichhas been happening a lot in
musicals lately. So I just, Iloved wicked. Had a lot of fun
with it. I think the the palettewas a little muted for my
liking, but the the actual filmitself and the performances,

(44:59):
the. The choreography, thedancing, all of that was a lot
of fun for me. So wicked is mynumber six.

It's also a film about skin, right? And
being judged, you know, and andgetting comfortable in your own
skin. Similar themes, similarthemes.

I didn't like wicked at all, but, but I'm glad
you did. I've got so many otherpeople did I agree with you, the
library scene was the best scenein the whole moon. Yeah, for,
for, for, I think, clearreasons. It was one of the only

(45:38):
dance scenes where I felt a realsense of place, and I knew where
people were and what they weredoing and how they interact, we
interact with one another. Yeah,I love that scene. I really love
that scene, and I agree withyou. I think the actors are
great. The songs, of course, areas catchy as anything. Yeah,

yeah, all right, well, I'm glad I gotta put
wicket on there for but you,Elijah, what is number five for
you? My

five. Number five is the most fun I had in a
theater this year, which, youknow, maybe y'all hate it, you
know, we'll find out, but it wasa Francis Ford Coppola's
megalopolis. You

Unknown (46:20):
want to help me, yeah.
And while I while I want tolearn.
And you think one year ofmedical school entitles you to
plow through the riches of myEmersonian mind, entitles
me Yes, entitles me Yes,entitles me Yes. You have no

(46:41):
idea about me. You think I amnothing, just a socialite. No,
not nothing, but I reserve mytime for people who can think
about science and literature andarchitecture and art. You find
me cruel, selfish and unfeeling.
I am, I work without caring whathappens to either of us. So go

(47:03):
back to the club, bear it alland stalk the kind of people
that you enjoy.
Fine. I will

the most fun choice here this year. Yeah, I
this was this movie is fun forme, because I never had any clue
moment to moment, what was goingto

happen next. It worked out. It was like,

and it was, I mean, I did. I laughed and just
had so much fun the entire timebecause of that. It it was like
entering into a dream to adreamscape where, where dreams
you don't know what's going tohappen next. Random stuff
happens all the time, but I did.
I still felt like even though itwas everywhere, it was all of a
piece, like it did kind of allfit together. It felt, it felt

(47:51):
emotionally consistentthroughout and like it was aimed
at something very particular.
This is, this is the mind atwork thing right, where there is
definitely a vision here. It maynot be anyone else would ever
have, and it may be so personalthat it's hard to get into, but
it's definitely there, and Ijust love to see that it is also

(48:16):
something. I feel like. We'vehad this with a lot of our older
filmmakers lately where theykind of make these big passion
projects, and often they're at aplace in their, I guess, in
their life and their career,where they don't really care if
everyone likes it so much. Imean, it seems that way, and not
in a bad way. It's just more oflike, this is the story I want
to tell. This is how I want totell it. So I feel like Furious

(48:38):
is kind of the same thing. Like,this is the way George Miller
wants to do this thing. He'sgoing to do what he wants. Or I
he wants. Or horizon KevinCostner's Western thing, you
know, which is a movie I thoughtabout putting on my list because
I admire the scope of it andwhat he's trying to do there.
But man, megalopolis, it wasalso one where I was watching it
and then loving it so much, andI thought, I can't recommend

(48:58):
this to anybody. Like, there'snobody in the world who I know
who would like this as much as Ido, and almost didn't review it.
And then I thought, you know, ifI can't review this movie, like,
what am I even doing? If I can'tsit down and try to express why
I love this and why? Why? Yeah,why? In my hair, then what am I
doing? So it's also a reviewchallenge to me, and I like a

(49:20):
good review challenge. So, so

Elijah. I'm old enough that I saw Apocalypse Now
in theaters in 79 and it wasvery divisive. A lot of people
were like, No, this is too much.
What is that whole last hour?
Actually? What's the first hour?
What's the last hour? Why isthere a great movie in the
middle that you know is hiding,trying to get out and and, of

(49:45):
course, only over time, whenpeople have allowed themselves
to be immersed in it and for itto do what it wants to do,
rather than what we want it todo, have people said, well, that
movie is a classic. That's amassive. Would be one of the 10
best films of this 70s and maybeone of the 10 best of all time.
And so I sort of feel like thiswill be a similar situation

(50:05):
where it's like, yeah, give it10 to 20 years, when people will
then kind of go, what was thatdidn't understand it at the
time. Maybe I understand it now.
Maybe I'm not supposed to. Youknow, big play, big bets, it

is. I think you're right, and I it reminded
me most of Star Wars EpisodeOne, Phantom minutes, in the
sense that like it, it, it's sodifferent than what we expect to
see at the movies. It's also abig Roman epic, which Star Wars
Episode One is as well, likecommon Roman epic, but it's

(50:43):
like, so different than what weexpect to see that I think it's
a lot of time for us to, like,get comfortable enough with it,
and even the the very, veryfake, very fake CGI thing going
through the movie, I

think it's like, there's your Jar Jar,
that's your jar, jar. Elements,right? Like these, jar, jar,
right?

But, but in time, like, you can get past
that, or not even get past it,but like, really see it for what
it is, which is kind of a it, itkind of distances you, just
enough that you see the artificethe entire time that you're
watching it, which I thinkprompts you should prompt you to
consider the ideas at play toknow you're being told a story,
to enjoy it for that reason,whatever, something megalopolis,

(51:27):
buddy, but I think everybodyshould see it

nice. That was the one that I really wanted to
see in theaters, but just thetiming never worked out, because
it was in and out so quick, andI just didn't want to watch it
at home. It was just one ofthose movies I wanted to see in
on the big screen. So I actuallyam disappointed I didn't get to
have that joyful experiencelaughing along with megalopolis

(51:50):
the whole time. Craig, you'renumber

five. Number Number Five. I got to put a
documentary on my top 10 list.
And they were, it was, therewere many, good ones this year.
I'm very dismayed how manydocumentaries you can't even
really see. There was adocumentary called union that
because it attacked Amazon andtheir their practices with their
workers and warehouses, therewas no way any any distributor

(52:16):
was going to pick it up, becausethey're also embedded in
Amazon's ability to delivermovies that they're like, we
can't attack Amazon. They'd becutting off our own noses. And
there's kind of the nature ofthe beast right there. There's
another film called sugar canethat's just gonna come out maybe
in another week or so onNational Geographic, that gets

(52:38):
into abuses at Catholic schools.
Again, hard film to watch, notgoing to be popular. There's a
beautiful documentary calledDahomey about the repatriation
of artifacts, statues, Royalcarvings, all those things, to

(53:01):
the nation of Benin. So it'sabout colonialism and how France
took things out, very hard filmto see, beautifully rendered. So
all of that's to say, like seekthese out if you can find them.
The one documentary I know youcan see that will break your
heart and put it back togetherin beautiful ways. Is called

(53:22):
daughters. It's available onNetflix. Won the Audience Award
at Sundance, and it's aboutDaddy daughter dance in a
prison. Yeah? I mean, that'sjust a recipe for just buckets
of tears, yeah, on multiplelevels. And so I just just want

(53:44):
to give a shout out to AngelaPatton, what the co director of
the film, who's also thedirector of the nonprofit and
that program that they've puttogether there, you know, we, we
know we've got a prisonindustrial complex problem in
America. We know that it'sprofitable for far too many
people, and this is a film aboutthe people paying a price over

(54:06):
and over and over. So pleasecheck out daughters on Netflix.
Yes, it

is so good.
It's so good. It was another onewith beside it, Sundance. Craig,
yeah. And it is, it is, it isevery bit as heart wrenching as
you expect it to be. It's also,like, clear eyed and challenging
to like, it's, it's not justlike a sentimental like talking
to heart screen things it hasreally, I mean it, they know
what's they know what's going onand how hard this is for

(54:36):
everyone. So it's really, reallygood,

excellent, excellent film. I saw it. Loved
it as well. Lots of tears, lotsof tears, but it was such a good
one. This one, my number five,is a movie that has stuck in my
body for the whole year, and itwouldn't let me go, and it's
just risen on my list. And justbecause it was experience, like,

(55:02):
the experience that I had wasjust so immersive, and that's
Alex Garland's civil war.

Unknown (55:09):
I didn't take a single photo. I didn't even remember I
had cameras on me. Like, oh mygod. Like, like, why didn't I
just tell him not to shootthey're
probably gonna kill theirmanuals. How do you know it
doesn't, no, but that's besidesthe point. Once you start asking
yourself those questions, youcan't stop. So we don't ask, we
record. So other people ask.
Wanna be a journalist? That'sthe job. Hey, Lee, what? Back

(55:32):
off. Whatam I saying? That's wrong. I'm
not saying it's wrong. She'sjust shook up. Lee, it doesn't
understand shoe cup. Whoa, I'mnot being protective of her.
You'rethe idiot who let her in this
car.

Story wise, it wasn't my favorite story. The
script wasn't but it wasvisceral, immersive, like
experiential. It was fearinducing of how close we might
be to a civil war, just to beput into this place with war
journalists trying to documentwhat's been going on and just

(56:12):
man to even the sound design,probably is the thing that is
stuck with me more thananything, just the bullets and
the Things that and my wifewanted to go with me. I saw it
without her, and I came home, Iwas like, I'm so glad you didn't
see this with me. That was itwould be way too much for you. I
also saw another movie about awar journalist this year, Lee,

(56:35):
and I found I really enjoyed Leea lot. Kate Winslet does a
fantastic job. And it was, forme, it was really interesting to
see two movies about warjournalists. One that takes,
like a first person perspective,like you're in it, you're
immersed. It's experiential. Andthen one actually just is, like
a storytelling thing, thatthey're looking back on the

(56:57):
story, remember? And I justdidn't feel like the stakes were
as high, and so I wasn't feelingit as much, but I loved Kate
Winston's performance and Lee aswell. But Civil War is my number
five.

Once you start asking yourself, Lee, is it's a,
it's a biopic, right? And isn't,isn't in Civil War, Chris Dutch
character idolizes her, right?
Is this mentioned? Like,

Unknown (57:23):
what am I saying?
That's

wrong. No, that's a good pairing. I think
it doesn't understand sugar.
It's also interesting to me thatyou've got, of course, a Brit
kind of doing a comment on us,right? So it's the outsider who
perhaps can see more clearly theprecipice that we have remained
perched on. And so, yeah, that'sthe kind of film, depending on

(57:47):
how things go, could become moreprescient

with time. I hope it's not exactly related
too early. I pray it's not. Yes,all right, Elijah, number four,

my number four film, I'm gonna, I don't know if
it's a cheat or not, but it's ashort film. But this filmmaker
pretty much only makes shortfilms, but it's Don Hertzfeld.
Me, you know, Don Hertzfeld isan animator. He's, he, if you,
if you've, if you've, you'veprobably seen some of his stuff

(58:23):
before. He usually has littlestick figures as his characters,
and he does, like pretty much,all the work himself on his
films, all the animation, allthe sound wall everything, and
he distributes themindependently from his own
website and stuff. And he's beennominated for Oscars, though his

(58:43):
he has a, maybe his most famousone film is, might be such a
beautiful day, which is justover an hour long. And then he
has world tomorrow, and then acouple of sequels, world
tomorrow that are out there,but, but me as his newest one.
And it's a, it's a The film hadits it started as was supposed

(59:04):
to be a animated kind of musicvideo for an unnamed bands
album. And then stuff happenedthat made that not happen. So we
had basically a film made, butno music behind it. And so then
they took and they he, he founda musician to work with, and
they built music. And hereworked the thing, reworked the
film that he made. But the filmDon here put up is weird. It's

(59:26):
like, because the little stickfigures are little stick
drawings, but then like, therest of the world around it
becomes like cosmic and huge,and all this stuff, like he
experiments all over the place.
Mia's about a how do you explainit? It's about a father who gets
obsessed with an idea of thisthing he wants to make. He pours

(59:47):
himself into that, neglectinghis family in the process, and
that invention kind of takesover the world. And. Is also a
thing about his child and howthe child is a handful and is
neglected. This all sounds veryreal, realistic. And there's

(01:00:08):
nothing realistic about me atall. It is. It is experimental
in fantasy and sci fi, like,like Fritz Lang's Metropolis
would be a big touch point.
There two in a row. That two ina row movie, for me, that touch
on metropolis. The movie is only22 minutes long. You can rent it
on Don hertzfield Vimeo, but itis quite an emotional

(01:00:30):
experience. Don hertfel can putin much emotion in 20 minutes
than most people can put in,like their entire lives. It's
incredible. Me by Don Hertzfeld.

Craig Detweiler (01:00:41):
It's self distributed, then it's not
streaming anywhere or anythinglike that,

Elijah Davidson (01:00:44):
distributed.
You can watch it on Vimeo. Hehas a Vimeo channel where you
can rent it for like $5 and hisown website is where he sells
blu rays of his films. Itactually he's been touring with
the film, kind of like amusician he like sets up like
screens around the country hasbeen touring with it. So I think
the most recent screens were inNovember, so maybe he's taken
December off, but and they'vebeen showing it along with it's

(01:01:07):
such a beautiful day. His hisfilm from the early 2000s that's
just over an hour long.
Fantastic. Yeah, great.

Joshua Johnson (01:01:19):
Way to go. Way to get me to to a place,
something that I need to go seekout and go find that I haven't
heard of. So that is great.
Thanks. Elijah, all right, you.
Is it true? Greg Dune, part two,number four,

yeah. Dune Part Two isn't my number four, so, so
I'm gonna defer right back toyou. Joshua,

what's what's on your list? Well, my number four
is conclave. So we've, we'vetalked about the crossover
conclave a lot already, and thenjust such, such fun in theater.
I want more movies like that is,like, adult scripts, just, you
know, people in a room,procedural like, it's just, it's

(01:02:00):
just fun. I love Conclave,everything about it. It was fun
for me. So, yeah, so then thatbrings us to number

three. Number three for me, we'll swing right
back around. So my number threefilm is Sean Baker's and Nora

Unknown (01:02:16):
Eddie. I got a kid who wants someone who speaks
Russian. Let's go. No, no, I'meating my food. You're killing
me.
Let's go, Hello. This is thebeautiful Annie. Hi, I'm Annie.
I am Ivan.
He was really weird. I love him,No way, yes way, and I'm seeing

(01:02:39):
him again tonight. Cheers.
Will you man, seriously,seriously?

Three carrots?
What about four Sean bakers andNora? I think, like a lot of
people, I first became aware ofSean Baker with tangerine which
and then have watched his filmsthat he's released since then, a
Nora won palm to or I love thathe's getting attention. He's
been making movies for a longtime, but love he's getting
attention now. But a Nora soNorthland number three, it

(01:03:18):
almost wasn't on my list at all.
It because I, I love what SeanBaker does so much like I feel
like he's he's doing likeItalian Neo realism, but for now
where he, he wants to show youpeople that society overlooks or

(01:03:40):
or takes advantage of peoplethat we often maybe don't want
to look at, look away from if weencounter them. And he kind of,
he shows you the struggles oftheir lives, and kind of dares
you to empathize with them. Youknow, he shows you, like the
Italian real estate, like both,like their their glory, but also
like why they have problems inlife too. You know, these are

(01:04:03):
not easy portraits of people inhis movies, and a Nora is not an
easy person to love. She'sdefinitely a person who wants
love, but Kevin doesn't believethat she'll refine it. And the
tension in the film is betweenlike so Mikey Madsen plays plays
in Nora, and she plays her like,kind of so, like, held back in

(01:04:24):
reserve, protected from theworld, that you often like, you
want to know more of her, andlike what she's feeling and what
she's she's very vocal, butlike, you know she's protected
the entire time. So you want toknow more about her, but you
also fear for her heart, and soyou don't also, you also don't
want her to reveal herself likein the context of the story at

(01:04:45):
the same time, because you knowit's gonna, she's gonna get hurt
when she does. So it's thattension between and I find that
to be a very like challengingmoral filmmaker, because it it
asks a lot of the audience. You.
Um, and, you know, in around allthat, it's also kind of like a
slapstick comedy. It's kind oflike a One Crazy Night Movie.

(01:05:06):
It's, it's, it's got, like,sweeping romance, like, like,
and, and just, yeah, it's a lotof things. And it also, it also
just like, let left me, like,emotionally devastated at the
end as well, where I just brokedown, finally Greg, when the
tension in the film finallyreleased. I just like, broke

(01:05:28):
down sobbing and sobbing inlike, I guess it was like
happiness for her, sort of, butalso like a very mixed happiness
for her, where I'm not sure ifI'm supposed to be happy for her
or not. And I know she feltsomething. I definitely felt
something like, I don't knowwhat a movie and what a Sean
Baker is, just, yeah, again,just doing the most exciting

(01:05:52):
filmmaking. I think,

yeah, I think you've given a great argument
for why it's number one on mylist. Nice. I, I think, ignores
the best film of the year,because very few things can do
screwball comedy for an hour andthen turn it into this
incredible pathos and and socialcommentary, and I and then at

(01:06:19):
the end, to me, it had had oneof the base, I would say, one of
the more healing, almostbiblical discussions of like,
what, what is her name, and who,who, and how is she seen, and
what kind of love does she need?
And and it's, you know, it'shard to recommend this film

(01:06:40):
because it's very R rated,right? It begins in strip clubs
and involves mafios, Russianmafiosos, you know, so it's
there's nothing wholesome aboutthe entertainment. And yet, to
me, it was the closest, I think,to how you might feel Jesus
would have interacted with someof the prostitutes of his day

(01:07:03):
who had certain expectations andcertain ways of relating and
certain ways of getting whatthey wanted. And how does he
diffuse that and reframe thatand rename that? I feel like
Nora did the best job of ofrehumanizing Someone who we
could easily dismiss and turn itto either a joke or a victim or

(01:07:24):
someone who got what shedeserved, and instead, it did
something completely different.
Yeah, which is, which is showingher as as loved and cared for,
despite it all

been like. So I anyone about the movie, I've,
like, not talked about her nameand the part of the movie about
her name, because I found that,because they it's like going on
throughout the movie, peoplewill call her a Nora. She says
her name is Ani, and you get,you find out why, towards the
end of the movie. And it's sucha it's almost like the only real

(01:08:02):
character reveal that you getabout her, and it's so it's so
weighty, amazing. I think that'swhat elevated

it to this biblical level for me. Yeah,
right, whether it's, you know,Simon and Peter, Saul and Paul,
I just sort of have this feelingthat we've watched that kind of
crisis point in a person's life.

Wow, it's also, I like what you said about,
like, about Jesus, because Ikind of feel like, like walking,
one thing I felt walking out ofa Nora is, like, you know, if
Jesus was a filmmaker, he'dprobably make the kind of movie
Sean Baker makes, movies thatare very aware of the cultural
context that we're in reallywant us to see people that we

(01:08:46):
that are that are pushed down orthat we don't want to look at
and challenge us to love themway that Sean Baker does.

It's deep empathy. Deep empathy. Yeah, and
hard,

hard to watch, hard to watch.

And I can't say anything else. So you guys, you
did it. Craig, what's yournumber three?

My number three, I'm going back to another
prison story, and that is Sing.
Sing, nice. It deals with, youknow, a real life program,
rehabilitation through the arts,RTA, that takes place in the New
York prison system. And youknow, stars real incarcerated

(01:09:31):
folks who've been through thatprogram, people like Clarence
Macklin, who I hope is nominatedfor a Best sporting actor.
Really, it's about the power ofof art and plays and theater and
acting to imagine a differentfuture for ourselves, for us to

(01:09:51):
get outside of our situation andand maybe write a different
ending. I think Coleman. AndDomingo's performance was my
favorite of the year. Again,such deep empathy at the core of
this film is the word beloved,and that's and you see that
lived out.

Unknown (01:10:18):
We here to become human again and enjoy the things that
is not in our reality.
Thank you. Guys are becomingreal with each other,
vulnerable.
Listen, I ain't know what you'redoing. Know who you are, what
you about, bro, what you don'tget to tell me what I need in
prison. You don't get to do thatand don't bring me in. No dark

(01:10:40):
corners, no more.
The world expects brothers likeyou and I to walk in with our
heads held down. Now, what yougotta walk in like a king.
Everythingis yours. I'm defined now,
dirty,your most perfect spot. Do you
hear anything? Are you withsomebody? Are you outside? Hold

(01:11:11):
that feeling.

(01:11:31):
You gotta admit that I murderedthat Hamlet, bro Shakespeare is
in his grave right now he rolledover you did
your thing, beloved.

I also admire the filmmakers. Greg Codd, who
was part of a film calledjockey, also deeply empathetic
film. He and the producersdecided to make everyone equal
partners in this film, soeverybody's paid the same
everybody has an equity stake init. So again, they're practicing

(01:12:05):
that communal work that you'reseeing on screen, that beloved
community that they're trying toform on screen. They're also
doing that off screen. Yeah, sorare. And of course, you don't
want review a film based onwhat's off screen, but the the
the integrity that I think, isat the heart of the production,
comes through in each frame, andit feels earned rather than

(01:12:26):
manipulative. The tears are arejust so deeply felt and and come
from such a deep hurt that italso gets you to a place of deep
healing. So I can't, I can'trecommend and love Sing. Sing. I
don't think anymore than I do,

yeah, well, I love Sing. Sing. It's my number
two. And man, those performancesClarence Macklin is a
revelation, just to see himactually almost reenact what he
went through in the Presidenthimself in that program to
actually then go and see the thehealing power of of art and

(01:13:07):
being this beloved community,the community together, to as
they're making things together,they could actually see
themselves in A totallydifferent light, that they are
human again. And, you know, Idon't think that our prison
system does, does much otherthan than that program right

(01:13:29):
there to let people know thatthey are human in the midst of
we treat a lot of, you know, alot of prisoners like caged
animals. So to actually have aprogram like that, to be able to
open people up, to open theirhearts up, to say, Hey, I am
actually somebody that isbeloved, made in the image of
God, that could actuallyreignite my humanity. That is

(01:13:52):
why the recidivism is reallylow. They don't actually come
back into prison. It's one ofthe best programs out there that
we have in the United States. Ilove Sing. Sing. Highly
recommend, fantastic. I

just saw that the song, original song that was
written for the film like abird, by Alexander Abraham, was
just on the Oscar shortlist, atleast of one of the 15 best
songs of the year. Nice as well.
And so he'd never listen toAbraham Alexander's songs. I
really recommend his whole hisdebut album. He's, he's got, I

(01:14:28):
think, Nigerian Greek and now,like Texas roots, that he's kind
of merged together in realbeautiful ways, cool,

cool. Yeah.
Well, my number three was dunepart two. We have talked a lot
about dune and how amazing itis, so we'll just jump into your
number two. Elijah, look

at this alignment we got, I know, a lot
of overlap, very interesting.
Well,

well, my number two is Furiosa. Saga. So I
didn't say what number that wasgonna fall so when I talked
about in here, but yeah, that'smy number two. And really hard
for me not to make it my numberone. This is also true. Menorah,
I also thought about being thatmy number one too eat up at the
top. It's kind of all Don hertzfills me. That could be my

(01:15:18):
number one as well, but mynumber two is which we've said.
Enough about

excellent, good.
All right, Craig,

number my number two, it's interesting,
Elijah, you were talking aboutNeo realism, and how much you
appreciated that. My number twois what I would call the most
felliniesque film of the year,and that's La La chimera, or you
might look at and go, is that LAChimera? No, I think it's la
Chimera. It's rooted in in GrecoRoman mythology. It's an Italian

(01:15:53):
fable by a director named Aliceroar Walker. So that's a German
sounding name for an Italiandirector. So there's a lot of
European history at the root ofthis film and and it does such a
great job of literallyexcavating history and thinking
about the underworld that we allneed to perhaps explore as we

(01:16:18):
deal with grief and loss andlonging. So it has roots in
Orpheus and Eurydice with JoshuaConnor, the British actor in the
Orpheus role mourning for lovelost, and he has a very strange
gift of being able to findburied treasures, very Greco

(01:16:43):
Roman, Italian treasures. And soit's a lot about how you deal
with the past. He has a merryband of mitzvahs, almost like
clowns who accompany Him in thegrave robbing. And you won't
even know, really what's goingon for the first 45 minutes.
It's not even clear, like,what's the plot? It's one of the
it's one of those kinds offilms. But once you get on, it's

(01:17:05):
very, very off kilter vibe, itjust takes over and does
something magical, I think, intransporting you across time and
space and and brings thoseancient myths to life in a new
way. You can find it on Hulu,although it's hiding like you'd
have to look it up, like they'renot going to show you, like this

(01:17:28):
is something that we own. So youlike, look up and spell it. La,
you know, underscore CH, I, youknow, you'll find it that way.
But

heard of this.
This sounds amazing. Well,

her, her films are really these magical
favorites, Celeste and happy asthose are happy as Lazaro, which
I think had some lovelybiblical, yeah, you know,
affirmations of the fool. Soshe's just working in, I think
that long European tradition,myths and legends and Bible and

(01:18:03):
and primal things, andexcavating them in new ways.
Yeah,

so I've heard incredible things about it.
Looking forward to going on Huluchecking it out.

What a weird world where someone who's made
movies like, like, the moviesshe's made, could have a movie
come out, and I don't even hearabout it, and it's just sitting
there, like,

I This is a weird movie world we live in.
It's, it's, I think that's thegreatest challenge of our time.
There's plenty of greatindependent films being made.
You can't figure out where tofind them. You know where
they're playing. There's anotherfilm called ghost light that I
think echoes Sing, sing quitewell. It's about the power of
theater and and all of that. Andit's like, yeah, where do you

(01:18:42):
find it really trick, yeah.

All right, Elijah, we're down to your
number one. Here

we can, we can continue the Joshua Connor love
for my number one, because mynumber one film in the year is
challengers, all right, whichConnor somehow, somehow steals
from his, in my opinion, fromhis two very capable co stars.
But they're all real greatmovie. So challengers, the the

(01:19:10):
tennis threesome movie from LucaGuadagnino,

which was a challenge for me.

I'm with you.
You can have it

advertised as this, like sexy threesome movie
or whatever, and there's, like,very little sex in the movie,
but there's tons of tennis, andtennis has an esthetic
experience, not so much even asporting experience. But I, I
was just completely carried awayby this thing. I feel like it.
It felt like a Hitchcock movieas much as anything else he's

(01:19:41):
caught, movie with no murders,and that score just, I think
it's still playing in my earssomewhere. This is so
overwhelming, it, but it, it,you know, like I said at the
beginning, like I look for amind at work, and I definitely
saw a complete vision there withchallenger. Years, like in every
moment and and with, like Isaid, Just carry away by and

(01:20:04):
then, the more I thought aboutit afterwards, the more I the
more I just loved or enjoyedwhat it was after. Because these
are, these are people who, thesethree people live in a world
where money is everything. Theydon't even call it money. It's
so like, so everything to theirlife. They call it access to
capital. And they are becausethey've completely given

(01:20:29):
themselves over to this world.
They they have, like, cutthemselves off from love, and
they like seek out these kind ofextreme experiences because
they, they, they feel the, theyfeel the the void in themselves.
Um, and you know it, I thoughtit did. You can take like, could
take like, First Corinthians, 13passions of love and like, flip

(01:20:52):
everything over and make itabout money. And you know you
have, you have the opposite ofall those good things that love
is and money greeds, all theseother things in their lives. And
and the Sendai is charactersmachinations to give these two
guys together, like is reallyabout wanting to open up the
possibility of love in theirlives, just in the world,

(01:21:14):
because they, they just exist ina world that has none of it. And
I, I just, I complete vision,fully carried out all the way
through the even, even withmovies like like conclave and
Anora and Mad Max free road,which have these just

(01:21:34):
ostentatious endings that justlike calling me on a high as I
live this one, I was the mostlike ending of anything I saw. I
just, yeah, I I loved it. It'salso, I also really love
ambitious movies. As you may,can tell from my list movies
where filmmakers really reachfor something. This is one of

(01:21:57):
those where guadalino was like,I'm just gonna do this all the
way, and hopefully people likeit, and I'm gonna do it all the
way. So I

guess I'm those other people, you know? I think
for me, maybe it's because whenyou have something this stylish,
right, and that surface, I thinkthat's where I get I get
worried, right? Like, like, Iknow so many young people who
are like, Wolf of Wall Street.
Yes, I want to be Leonardo. AndI'm like, I'm not sure that's

(01:22:31):
what that movie was saying.
Yeah. And I sort of like, thisis going to be the same thing.
Like, you've basically spawnedan entire generation who now
wants to play tennis and lookreally good on the court, and
it's just like they miss thethey miss that. The whole point
is that no, these, these, thesefolks have zero. They got

(01:22:52):
nothing, right? They havenothing. They missed that. So
it's hard with the stylishcautionary tale to feel like
it's actually landing inpeople's hearts and minds
because the style is sobeautiful. These are three
gorgeous people, you know, theyare. It was lovely, Euro trash
music, you know, throughout. So

it's like, a it's like, it's like Verhoeven,
right? Like, Verhoeven,satirical films

where another person that I hate, yeah, I
can't stand this film. You

just, like, I admire miracle filmmakers who,
like, will just go all in on it,and, like, almost, almost trust
the audience to understand thatthey're not supposed to like
these people or want to be this.
Did you Did you see thesubstance? Did you see the
substance? I don't

like body horror, so there was no way I
was gonna, well, you won't likethat one then either. But I'm
just saying it's all substance,right? It's all surfaced, but
it's completely hollowunderneath it. And I guess
that's my fear in some of thesethings, is that the dimension of
hollowness done in a beautifulesthetic style can leave the
audience going, Hmm, yes, let'sbe hollow together. It looks

(01:24:00):
amazing. Look at my brand, lookat my endorsements.

It looked amazing. Like the esthetic was
amazing. The filmmaking wasgreat. The tennis scenes, I love
the way that those were shot.
Were were great. The score wasamazing. I just did not enjoy
being with these characters. Andso for me, I know that's, that's
what they were trying to do, andI didn't like it and so and it
was just because I just didn'twant to spend time with these

(01:24:25):
people like I, I appreciated thefilmmaking. I appreciated the
acting, just everything that wason screen I just had, just did
not want to spend time withthese people. See,

I just, I admire filmmakers who will give
you that right, who will, like,who will so completely render
the surface and so, like,totally give you the hollow
characters and all that kind ofstuff. And, like, almost, it's
because it's like satire. It'slike, almost. Us to dare and

(01:25:01):
like, if it was just thatwithout, without like, I think,
very clear thematic intent ofbeing like, this is the world
you get if all you pursue ismoney and fame and this stuff.
This is who, this is who you endup being. If it didn't have that
underneath it, if it was justsurface, I wouldn't like it. But
I just feel like it has that, ithas that core that you're

(01:25:24):
hopefully see, and maybe I alsolike the idea that, like, well,
then that's my job to tellpeople that that's what it's
about, so that they won't be,won't be swayed by the by the
Wolf of Wall Street, and willrealize you're not supposed to
want to be that

guy you know, same as Joshua. Take us out of
this. This the surfers finale.
Give us some depth. Anything

else you want to say about a Nora? You're number
one? Craig, no, I think I'vesaid it, I've said it, I've said
it. Yeah, beautiful. Well, mynumber one was just mentioned by
you, Craig, and that is ghostlight, which is a nice little
companion piece to sing. Sing.

Unknown (01:26:04):
I think it's really great that you found a place
where you feel welcome, Daisy. Ijust don't want to screw that up
for you. You should have toldme, I know I won't judge. The
lines are the easy part. Hardpart is the emotional journey.
What happens to them?
Here's a hit. It's a tragedy.

(01:26:26):
You're shaking. It seemed likeyou might want a chance of being
somebody else.
I mean, things get hard. Youeither blow
up or bail. It's a bad habit.
There you go. You're happy,okay, weirdo,
many of us live our livesrepressing our emotions, because

(01:26:47):
out there, they can be aliability, but in here, we can
put those into good use.
Good luck, honey. You don't saygood luck. It's break a leg,
break a leg.

Maybe it was the like going through and walking
through the grief of the loss ofmy mother in law this year, and
seeing that the healing power ofart, engaging in in play,
engaging in being in community.
Once again, when you're you feellike everything is broken and
hollow and like there is nothingleft in your family, in your

(01:27:35):
soul, but then something thencomes alive again. And when
you're like playing with otherpeople and that you could find a
community once again, you couldfind love again. When everything
is is broken, you're grievingand you think that life is

(01:27:56):
hopeless, there's nothing left.
I just, I adored this movie.
Cried a lot in this film. Therewas a lot of tear shed. I just
couldn't stop. It was like, Idon't know if I've cried that
hard in a movie in a long time.
It was moving. It was powerful.
And it seemed very, very naturalreal world, like there's no, no

(01:28:20):
extra style needed. It was justlike, let's enter in with these
characters. I loved ghost light.
Ghost lights. My number one,

beautiful, beautiful. Can I reserve an
asterisk for nickel boys, whichI haven't seen? Yes either.
Yeah, it may pop up, you know,into that list, but it's like, I
don't know. It's just opening inLA, I think this weekend, so, oh
yeah, my

asterisk would be Nosferatu, and not wait to
see Robert Eggers Nosferatu.
I've wanted, I've wanted thatmovie to exist from before I
knew he was making it, and well,like I live in the best possible
timeline where the thing that Iwanted so much is going to
actually exist. So yeah, it willprobably be my number one movie
of the year after I see it.
Yeah,

nose for a to see that. I'm looking forward to
seeing Timothy Chalamet try tofigure out how to play Bob
Dylan. I know that that it'sgoing to be another biopic.
That's probably not going to besome sort of great little movie,
but it, I've heard that theperformance is fantastic, so I'm
looking forward to that. AndNicholas make bad movies,
though. No, he doesn't make badI don't think it's gonna be a

(01:29:32):
bad movie. I just think that itmay not elevate to the top of of
my list, but I am really lookingforward to that one with
Nosferatu and Nicholas Holt ishaving a having a day. I just
saw him in the order last week.
Went to the order, which isanother fantastic film. This
really well made. You know, JudeLaw, FBI agent, going after some
white supremacists that aretrying to cause a civil war in

(01:29:53):
the United States. True story.
And. Nicholas Holton in jurornumber two as well. I love the
moral quandary of that film, ofwhat? And just actually then
trying to think, like, whatwould I do in that situation
with juror number two? And thenthen I was for autu. So he's

(01:30:16):
Nicholas Holt man. He's having ayeah, having a day. It's good.
Any honorable mentions, anythingthat didn't quite make your top
10?

There's, there's two for me. And one is
it gonna feel a little bit likeself promotion, though I don't
feel it. I don't feel that wayabout it, but I, I produced a
film this year, but really, oneof my colleagues did all, like,
all the work on it. I've mainlyworked on how we're distributing
it afterwards. So he my, mycolleague Patrick Duff, did most

(01:30:47):
of the work. But it's, it's afilm you made about a professor
at Fuller and in Bill Pannell.
And the documentary is calledthe gospel, according to Bill
Pinel, and it's Bill. Bill is ablack evangelical. He recently
died just about a month ago.
He's a black evangelical leaderwho was part of civil rights
movement and has his his lifeand ministry was really like

(01:31:09):
speaking to the whiteEvangelical Church and trying to
get them to pay attention tothings that they should have
been paying attention to. And mymy friend Patrick, he, he can he
put this documentary togetherusing a tremendous amount of
research that he did to buildarchival content of Bill talking
about his life and then put itin order. And so it's all in

(01:31:31):
Bill's words the entire time,and just Bill telling his story
about what happened, when andwhy. And that is the kind of
model for it was, listen to me,Marlon, do you don't see that
document? Documentary aboutMarlon Brando that was all from
his recordings? So that was kindof the idea, the kind of the
formal idea behind it. And Ithink Patrick made just an

(01:31:52):
amazing film that really givesyou a central window into
evangelicalism over the past,you know, 60 years, and how
things changed and why and allthat. So love that movie. And
then the other one kind of goeslike a cheat too, because made
by a friend. But twisters. Ilove twisters. Super fun, like

(01:32:16):
the perfect 90s throwback thing.
He did that perfect and lovedthat movie. He's a friend. So I
feel, again, like it feels weirdto put friends movies on your
list, but

it's a good movie. It's fun movie, love
twisters,

good friends.
I've got a few that I justrecommend that I think are fun.
Thelma, I thought was super fun.
My son, yeah, 23 year old JuneSquibb on on the revenge trail,
hit man, I thought had had somegreat moments and ideas in it.
Wildcat, very thorny depictionof the thorny character, flair

(01:32:55):
O'Connor. DD is a fun coming ofage film, remarkable life of
ebelin, documentary that's onNetflix that's quite touching.
And then there's a couple that Ihaven't seen yet that I still
want to see, seed of the sacredfig, yeah, really. Ground
border. All we imagine is light.
It's very hard to do these yearend list with films that haven't

(01:33:20):
come out

yet this year Exactly. Those are all four of
those I really want to see.
Yeah, looking forward to it. Ithink anything that you haven't
mentioned yet, I think Iactually really enjoyed my old
ass. That was a great little,little movie coming of age
story. But really, you know, forsomebody in their late 30s, 40s,

(01:33:42):
about to go through a midlifecrisis, to look back on your
younger self and figure out, Oh,what is it that it's really
worth living for in this life?
So I actually really enjoyed myold ass inside out too as well.
I we put it on there because ithelped. It helped my son talk

(01:34:04):
about his emotions. And it'shis, his favorite film of the
year. He just, he really lovedinside out too, a lot. And so he
and I were able to actually havethose discussions now. And what
are you feeling and what, whatare the emotions on the inside
saying? And so I liked insideout too as well. Beautiful.
That's fun. Yeah, guys, thankyou. This was fantastic. Where

(01:34:29):
would you like to point peopleto working on anything? Or you
have anything out that you'dlove to let people know about
Elijah?

You can just people go to my website, just
Elijah davidson.com and you canfind stuff there. So I was
working on something. I'mreading a lot, reading a lot
these days, like gearing up fora new writing project, and I'm
reading a ton, and that's been alot of fun. I've been I've been
rereading. I made a list of allthe books that have been most
influential to me or impactfulfor me over the course of my
life, and I've been rereadingthrough all those books, like in

(01:34:59):
chronological. Older which hasbeen fun to reread the books.
And it's also been like visitingmy past self, my younger self,
you know, and like where I waswhen I read those books the
first time and all. So that'sbeen a lot of fun. But yeah, go
to my website for the stuff thatI do easy,

and thank you, Joshua, for the chance to talk
earlier this year about honestcreativity. I'm still enjoying
talking about it, speaking aboutit, anything that's dealing with
the reality and the threat of AIfor creatives, I think is
important to me. It's not goingto go away as an issue. And so

(01:35:36):
I'm encouraging people to get goin for that long play of being
honest about their struggles,their triumphs. I think, I think
that's what we saw in thesefilms, right? A lot of hard,
honest films that broke througha lot of special effects and a
lot of visual clutter and startspoke straight to the heart. So

(01:35:56):
that's why I think honestcreativity is a good long play
for all creatives, pastors,teachers, etc, to double down
on. Yeah,

great. Well, Elijah and Craig, thank you.
This is a lot of fun. This is alot of fun for me. So thank you
for this. This conversationgoing down our list. So here's
to more great movies in 2025 sothanks guys.

Thanks. You.
Right? You?

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Ep. 255 Best of 2024: Favorite Movies with Elijah Davidson and Craig Detweiler

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