July 4, 2025 • 43 mins
Today, Jackson TerKeurst joins me to share his extraordinary journey from the rural simplicity of a Liberian village to the chaos and trauma of war, and finally, to discovering a profound sense of belonging through faith, community, and adoption. Jackson recounts the harrowing experience of surviving as a child during Liberia’s brutal civil conflict, the transformative power of music and worship in his healing, and how God orchestrated a miraculous meeting that led to finding his adoptive family in America. Through his powerful story, Jackson invites us to confront our past traumas, embrace our identity in Christ, and experience true healing and hope in community. So join us because all our stories matter, and our greatest pains can become our most impactful ministries.
Jackson TerKeurst is an entrepreneur and leader who continues to defy the odds as a first-generation immigrant from West Africa who owns and runs a small business. The adopted son of bestselling author and speaker Lysa TerKeurst, Jackson is passionate about drawing together people from diverse backgrounds to experience authentic community. He lives with his wife and their two children outside Nashville, Tennessee.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Jackson TerKeurst (00:00):
And he said the best thing in his case would
(00:01):
be to take you to this orphanagewhere you have safety and refuge
for now and when the war isover, I will send your family,
if I found them, to come get youand bring you back home. And
that never happened, and here Iam. You. Joshua,
Joshua Johnson (00:30):
hello and welcome to the shifting culture
podcast in which we haveconversations about the culture
we create and the impact we canmake. We long to see the body of
Christ look like Jesus. I'm yourhost. Joshua Johnson, today,
Jackson turkhurst joins me toshare his extraordinary journey
from the rural simplicity of aLiberian village to the chaos
and trauma of war and finally todiscovering a profound sense of
(00:52):
belonging through faithcommunity and adoption. Jackson
recounts the harrowingexperience of surviving as a
child during Liberia's brutalcivil conflict, the
transformative power of musicand worship in his healing and
how God orchestrated amiraculous meeting that led to
finding his adoptive family inAmerica through his powerful
(01:13):
story, Jackson invites us toconfront our past traumas,
embrace our identity in Christand experience true healing and
hope and community. So join us,because all our stories matter
and our greatest pains canbecome our most impactful
ministries. Here's myconversation with Jackson.
Turkhurst, Jackson, welcome toshifting culture. Excited to
(01:36):
have you on thanks for joiningme. Thank you. It's good to be
here, man. I'm excited to diginto your story. Dig into your
book. The only way forward isback. Your story is unique to
you, but I think we could allrelate that God has been with us
in different moments of ourlives, even when we felt
abandoned and alone and scaredthat God is still present. Take
(01:58):
us into your story as a youngkids. What was happening? Where
were you? How were you growingup?
Jackson TerKeurst (02:04):
Yeah, so just sharp in the beginning, huh?
Well, I would talk to you aboutmy early childhood. So my early
childhood started peaceful inthe village in Liberia, where I
grew up. We were very, verypoor, poor farmers, but life was
very simple and full of a lot ofrhythm for us. So it was very
simple. We loved it. My familyand I lived in a small village
(02:28):
in a small home, small, humblehome, and we grew everything we
ate. So we were farmers. Mybrother and I were in charge of
the rice farm, so our job was tomake sure that the birds don't
come and eat the rice. So everyday we go to the farm and make
sure that, you know, we washover the rice farm that was life
(02:49):
for us. Every day, that waslife, you know, just to just
villages, just to inform life,and just living simple and poor
and whatever. Until one night,all of that turned around. It
just Swift, real quick in theblack of midnight, around three,
4am one night, we were all justasleep, you know, humble home,
(03:10):
and out of nowhere, we hearpeople screaming, yelling,
crying. That was abnormal forus, because we never hear sounds
like Daytona village. It'spretty quiet out there at
nighttime, and when we heard asign of chaos, everyone freaked
out. Everyone woke up, and I,for once, was scared out of my
(03:31):
mind, because I was just a sevenyear old child and having to
experience what it felt like tohear a Grenier launcher or a
bomb going off in ak 47 justshooting left and right and
watching people die. And thatwas the beginning of my
childhood, and that's when mytrauma all started.
Joshua Johnson (03:51):
I can't imagine, you know, my son is seven years
old at the moment, and just tothink about seeing all of that
through his own eyes, nobodyshould have to see that no
matter how old you are, right?
The world is broken. Itshouldn't be like that. But to
have a seven year old, how doyou respond to that as a seven
year old, what were what washappening in that moment for
(04:12):
you?
Jackson TerKeurst (04:14):
I mean, like any seven year old, would, I
mean, you cry, you know, youscream, and you'll freak out.
Your panic, obviously. Andthat's exactly the mode I went
into, you know, panic mode,scared, afraid, and then scream
from my parents, obviously,scream for my mom and dad, but
they were nowhere to be found.
Because, I mean, the war hasalready erupted in the village,
(04:36):
and I was the only one in myroom, in my room by myself, and
I jumped off my bamboo bedstraight onto the dirt floor and
started to crawl in the hallwaybecause there was bullets flying
and I want to stand up and gethit. Luckily, my aunt, who lived
in a house with us, saw mecrawling, and she came, just
(04:56):
grabbed me, threw me on herback. And then we ran straight
into the safety of the jungle. Iwas freaking out, scared,
afraid. And then I looked to myleft, my neighbor, who was close
with growing up, he came to joinus on our way to the bush to
hide the jungle. And then Ilooked left to see him, and then
I just saw him, his eye just gobig, and he just dropped. I
(05:17):
didn't have time to stop. I sawhim just running, running, and
looking back as I run, lookingback, and I just can't imagine
what's happening. I was soscared, but my body was also
very numb. I was so numb to whatwas happening, to where we jump
into this jungle, into thisdense jungle with thorns and
just cutting out flesh andskins. But we didn't care. I
(05:38):
didn't care. You didn't care. Itdidn't cut to my mind. All I was
thinking about was survival.
Like, let's go, let's grow innext place. I mean, that was
That was intense for seven yearexperience at three, 4am the
morning
Joshua Johnson (05:51):
in the next, next few days. What? What was
happening? Where was your whathappened your family and what
happened to you after, yeah,running for your life. Well,
Jackson TerKeurst (06:01):
I mean, obviously, you know, we all went
different directions, family,some, some got taken, and some
got, you know, I don't want totalk about that part, but me and
my aunt were the only ones whomade it out. And we, you know,
we ran to the jungle, where welook for safety, and we ran way,
way, way, way back deep in thejungle, where there was really
(06:23):
no life besides animals thatlive out there. And we were
there for a while, for a verylong time, and we had to learn
how to survive on our own inthere, trying to feed ourselves,
create shelter and just be quietto where we don't want to hear
making a noise or start a fire,because the rebels are very
(06:43):
smart, you know, if they see asmoke for somewhere, they would
definitely go in our route tofind where that smoke is coming
from, and they'll goinvestigate. And we didn't want
to do that. So we just stick toeating anything we can find that
was that will not require us tocook a meal. Plus, we didn't
have a pots and pans cook a mealin a way, so, but yeah, we were
stuck back there for a while.
She and I,
Joshua Johnson (07:05):
that's a that's a tough thing. We'll get into
some of your later story. Butnow, as as we see, you got out
of the jungle. I did. You're notthere, not anymore. You're
you're looking back on thosethose times. That's right, how
did you not get stuck in thatplace? How did you not stay in
(07:26):
the in the trauma and the fearof war and loss and chaos, and
if you look back on your lifenow,
Jackson TerKeurst (07:35):
well, I mean looking bad my life, my life, I
always, you know I was my lifewas defined by chaos and
obviously trauma and war andloss, those were the things that
define me back then. So but nowI see my identity in Christ, in
God. So God, you know, he seesme as his son. Because back
(07:57):
then, I didn't know who I was. Ididn't know what I was called to
be, or I knew was, I was just anorphan kid trying to survive and
find family and find love. ButGod had a bigger plan for my
life. God told me that you aremy son. I love you, I protect
you. I'm here with you, youknow. And through that time, I
(08:18):
connected with him a lot, and Iprayed a lot. You know, my aunt
and I prayed a lot during thesetimes. But when I came to
America, to overcome thistraumas, I had to seek a lot of
help, and my parents helped alot with that, you know, putting
me in the right community aroundother people, great people to be
around. And they got me to youthcamps, to youth groups, mission
(08:40):
trips and working at Chick fil Aand serving at a restaurant. So
all those states contributed tome overcoming some of this
trauma I have dealt with mylife.
Joshua Johnson (08:50):
Yeah, it seems, seems to be identity in Christ
and community, the rightcommunity, the people around you
really, really helps. It does.
So did. Where did you start tofind your identity in Christ?
What happened to you? Where didJesus come into the picture? To
know that you were found in Himand not on
Jackson TerKeurst (09:11):
your own?
What Jesus came in a picture? Imean, way before I was born. But
when I was when I was born in avillage, we were not aware of
Christianity, of God, becausewe're just villagers. When I
have the gospel out there, wejust tribal people. But then
later on, when I got introducedto, uh, to church and Christian
and by my dad, we he and I usedto walked about three to four
(09:32):
miles on Sundays to go to churchand on a dirt road. So that's
kind of how I learned about God.
And then when I got into theorphanages, I lived in four or
five different orphanages. Ilived in those orphanages were
Christian orphanages, andbecause of that, I began to
learn more about God in theorphanages. You know, went to
(09:54):
church. We had devotions everymorning. We were taught to be
grateful because, you. We couldhave been one dead, but we are
still alive and breathing, youknow? And we were taught to
approach everything from agratitude perspective and
mindset, right? So this, despitewe're in pain, we're hurting so
much, things going alive that'sagainst us. But we were taught
(10:16):
to be the light in the dark, andthrough that, I was able to see
God shines light through me, andI was able to use my story and
testimony in Liberia to ministerto other churches, as well being
my friends will go to churchesand sing, you know, and give our
testimony at churches to share,to share our story of people, to
encourage them. And throughthat, I saw God working my life
(10:39):
when he says, Son, it's time foryou to go America, to go share
this story with everybody else.
And I would say, Thank You Lord,it's time. It's about time, man,
Joshua Johnson (10:52):
yeah, we're gonna get into you coming into
America. But before I do that,how did you get into an
orphanage, and what did thatlook like? Because you actually
went to different orphanages.
Where did you and your maybeyour aunt split up and you went
into an orphanage?
Jackson TerKeurst (11:10):
We split whenever we got to my dad's
village in Joe town, rebels cameto our to that, to that village
as well, and attacked as well.
And because of that, I lost alot of family members as well
with the accident, and then myfamily, my siblings and I would
just disperse into the woods.
You know, that's how I losteverybody. I went one direction.
They went one direction. Theywent one direction. And after
(11:33):
that, we all got dispersed witheach other. And based on
familiarity, I was able tonavigate my way through the
woods onto the dirt road where Iwas able to walk into another
town where my uncle lives. So myuncle Jerry lived another town,
maybe about it's pretty far.
Actually took me a while to getthere, but when I got there, he
was still there. He was stillthe house, uh, hiding,
(11:54):
obviously. And he just knew thatsomebody gonna show up. And
that's the house we all go to.
Our family goes to, sometimes tosee other families. But he was
there, and I told him whathappened, and he was so sad,
instructing Give me a hug,because he's been attacked by
the wars, where he's beenaffected also, but he was just
trying to hide until it passedover. And then in he and I met
(12:18):
now, and I was like, Oh, UncleJerry, so good to see you. Man,
not hugging him and holding himtight and crying and screaming
and miss. And he just hugging meback. And he told me that, hey,
man, um, after bad news, I'mgonna have to take you to a
children's home or orphanage.
And I was like, what is that? Isthat? Is that? Is that where
everybody is our families,they're hanging out. And he
(12:40):
said, No, it's where other kids,like you go and hang out onto
the wars over the Go back toyour families. I said, Oh, well,
I didn't want to, I didn't wantto go. I said, No, almost I was,
I'm gonna stick with you. Isaid, No, no, no, I don't want
that. No, I don't want that. I'mgonna stay here with you. And he
said, no, like, I can't protectyou, and I can barely protect
myself. And he said, the bestthing in his case would be to
(13:01):
take you to this orphanage whereyou have safety and refuge for
now and when the war is over. Iwas sent your family, but found
them to come get you and bringyou back home. And that never
happened. And here I am.
Joshua Johnson (13:16):
It's rough that you have to get there. It's it's
hard, and why, why did you movefrom like you went to Ford, five
different places
Jackson TerKeurst (13:27):
in the first orphanage I went to, it was
attacked by the rebels as well.
So it got attacked and livedestruction happened. So when
that war, when that's cool down,we all load up in a van and head
to another city, where we wereat for a few weeks, and then
another war broke out again, andthen we ran to another area.
We're there for a while no food.
(13:51):
All we had was hot water todrink every day for breakfast,
lunch and dinner, and eatingroots or leaves or dead mouse or
lasers and anything we can findin the woods we eat it. You
know, that was several weeks andseveral months of doing that.
And then when the war seizeddown, we then came back to the
city to another orphanage again,and then that's when I got
(14:15):
transferred to another orphanageagain. So it was just one thing
after another, like it was waror there was no food, there was
no food. It was war of sickness.
It was all those thingscombined, and it's and I kept
moving around until I ended upin the last orphanage where my
life changed forever.
Joshua Johnson (14:33):
One of the things that you did you You
joined an acapella choir aswell. You started to sing, yeah,
how did, how did music and thechoir and singing, how did that
help ground you as somebody thatactually was was going in lots
of different directions,different places, had to run and
(14:54):
flee. How did music help? Howdid the choir help?
Jackson TerKeurst (14:58):
Well, you know, in times of hard. Are
times and struggles, you know,you just can sit in that you
have to do something, you know,and for us, like I said, we were
taught to be grateful and havegratitude mindset. Therefore we
we sung a lot of songs. We singa lot, we dance a lot, we praise
a lot. We praise God a lot,because it shifted our mindset.
(15:18):
It helps to take our mind up ofour current situation and what
we're going to what we'reexperiencing, right? So we use
music and fellowship with eachother, to sing, to laugh, to
joke, to worship, just to passtime. And because of that, music
play a vital part of my lifegrowing up, you know? But it was
(15:40):
not meant to be my finaldestination, right? It was a
bridge that brought me toAmerica, but I'm gonna find a
destination. But music, at thetime, was the only remedy that
we had for our chaos. Do
Joshua Johnson (15:51):
you see that even now? How has music carried
you through the rest of yourlife? Does music do something in
your soul, in your
Jackson TerKeurst (16:00):
hearts, absolutely, man, you know
honesty. I still, I still up tothis day, listen to my acapella
music every morning. Everymorning I blast in the morning,
in out of shower, I'm gettingready, and I play my acapella
music. And sometimes I play,what's his name, Brandon lake. I
like Brandon lake a lot.
Elevation worship, Hillsong,just to name a few, my wife and
(16:21):
I play that every morning, evenwith the kids. So even just on a
drive, you know, because we justknow that being the presence of
God every day and doing thesethings, it really does shift
your mind and it shifts yourheart into the right
perspective. And
Joshua Johnson (16:39):
being a part of this choir, you got an
opportunity to fly to America,to go and to tour. What was that
like, and what says, How did youso take us into this journey of
you, this boys choir, landing inDC. What was it like to to
actually land in America
Jackson TerKeurst (17:01):
first time cold. It was so cold. It was so
cold my man, oh man, we havesome African boys. We're used to
the heat in the ocean and thewater and in a warm breeze. But
we had a dream to come America,and we were aware that America
was cold. And our friends usedto refer to America as the cold,
(17:24):
sorry, Africa, Koi America, thecold. In my country, the cold
so. But we had no idea it wasthat extreme. We just thought
was just a little chilly. Butthen when we got there, it was
like beautiful, an airplanelooking out. I mean, the city
just laid out lights everywhere.
I mean, it looks so like alittle heavy to us, because in
my country where I come from,you've been an airplane, you
(17:45):
will not see a light. It's verydark. Yeah, the country is still
struggling so and then landingin DC, and it's in the airport
that big was so many people ofdifferent races, and I mean,
different ethnicity andbackground. Were just
overwhelmed by all these amazingpeople and amazing things. And
they got food over here, foodover here, food over there. It
(18:07):
was like there was foodeverywhere. Oh, we were
overwhelmed. And then we gotoutside the gates, and we were
greeted by something very, veryunwelcoming, and that was the
American winter cold. You knowthat that slap was right back
into the terminal, and we puteverything we had on us and came
(18:27):
back out, and we all just jokedat each other for the rest of
the trip about how crazy thatwas. And you know, we never knew
the American weather and it wasthis harsh?
Joshua Johnson (18:42):
How did you end up staying in America? What was
that journey in that processlike?
Jackson TerKeurst (18:48):
So how to get to America was this so, as I
mentioned earlier, my friendsand I, former boys choir and we,
because of what we were doing atorphanage, we were actually
number one in an orphanage. Soeverybody wanted to be like us,
because we were so good andwe're so young and very talented
and very energetic. And otherguys, when we create a choir
(19:09):
just like us, and we travel inthe country to other churches,
where we perform a lot of otherchurches and share our testimony
other churches as well. So wewere almost kind of new in the
area for just our heart and theway we want to worship God,
despite of our pain, what'sgoing on. And one day, Pastor
kofi, he is the one who runs theorphanage. He has great
(19:32):
connections with some incrediblepeople in the States and Canada
and other countries. He broughtsome missionaries to see us in
the orphanage, and he asked usto perform for this
missionaries, you know. And wewere thrilled. We were like, Oh
my gosh, yes, we'd love to, youknow. And we did that. We did
our thing, we got on stage, weperformed for them with our
(19:54):
hearts out. And the next day hecame back to us. He was like,
You. Boys, you guys did a greatjob. I'm so proud of you guys. I
have another news for you guys.
I'm taking y'all to America, andyou guys can be ambassadors and
missionaries for your brothersand sisters here in the
orphanage, right? And your yourgoal would be to share the
(20:18):
struggle our country is dealingwith, with our Christian
brothers and sisters in Americato see if they can help our
country, not just for money butprayer and support. And that's
when everything changed, and wewere so excited about the
opportunity to where we said,Heck yeah. And we started
practicing and writing moresongs and getting more excited.
(20:38):
And then next, you know, is likewe run an airplane a few months
later here to the States. Idreamed my whole life, my whole
life. Man, to come to America,not just that, but to be adopted
and to have a family and to feellove and to feel belong, and
just to know what it feels liketo, you know, to have someone
your corner. Because I was allby myself. Man, I was always
(21:00):
alone and I didn't have nosiblings, and having to defend
other people to fill in thosegaps, and my brothers in the
boys choir or my family, thoseguys were my family. We did life
together, and we held each othertogether, and we laughed a lot,
we joked a lot and prayed a lot.
So yeah, that's my family forlife. That's kind of how I
(21:22):
started. That's why I came toAmerica.
Joshua Johnson (21:24):
You have this, your family with the boys choir.
You're here, you're you're inAmerica, and you find your your
adoptive family as well inAmerica on that tour. How did
that happen? How in the world isthis connection made where
you're ended up eventually beingadopted into this family.
Jackson TerKeurst (21:45):
Well, it's a very wise story. It's a wild
one. So my sister, right now,one of my sisters, she was a
girl scout, and one of thecountries that had a study she
had a study was Liberia, and shechose to study my country,
Liberia? Well, we knew shepicked Liberia all the countries
in the world, right? She pickedlike she picked Liberia, and
(22:07):
then came to find out theLiberian acapella boys choir was
right next door to her housedoing a concert at a local
church. We're doing localchurch. And then her my mom and
my other sisters, they all wentthere to hear us perform. And
during, during that time, that'swhen our visas were expiring,
actually, it was time for us tohead back to Liberia. But then
(22:30):
there was also war going on inLiberia as well. So we couldn't
go back to Liberia, because ifyou step on an airport, we could
have been dead and gone easy asthat so, so our manager, he was
so gracious, and he got on stageand, you know, shared an update
with the congregation. Washappening in our case and
(22:52):
gospel, God did his thing. Andfrom that experience, from that
night, my life changed forever,and that's how I met my mom and
my sisters and all of us. And mylife changed, and I am adopted
now, you know, and I have a homenow, and I am grateful,
grateful, grateful for thatmoment and the blessing that I
(23:12):
get to be a part of the family,and that God did hear me answer
my prayer to bring me my mom,Lisa. So I'm grateful. Yes,
Joshua Johnson (23:22):
you know, in your book, you wrote a little
bit as you saw Lisa that nightyou you ran up and called her
mom, yes, before, before youknew her, before I knew it, what
was so what was happening inthat moment for you, and then
what is what was happening forher, as you've talked to your
mom now about that moment, whatwas happening between both of
(23:46):
you calling her mom when youhaven't met before?
Jackson TerKeurst (23:50):
Yeah. I mean, it was just a God thing, man. I
just, I just saw her. You knowhow you see somebody, you see
something. It just makes sense.
It makes sense. Like it just, itjust clicks. And then when I
turn out, first of all, we wereplaying in the pews with her,
the girls, or daughters who werehanging out, hanging out,
playing around. And then I hadno idea that was the mom, first
(24:11):
of all. And then I just lookedup, and then the lady came
walking out, just like it, justlike it feels so glorious, like,
you know, like, like an angel,like glorious and I just, it's
the world. The words just cameout of my mouth. He said, Mom,
it just like happened, you know,and just God just knew that I
was a divine, divine calling.
(24:32):
That's divine moment. And heorchestrated that. She didn't
know me, I didn't know her, buthe put that, he put it in my
heart and in her heart as wellto receive that. You know,
she'll lay hesitant about it,but they eventually, God spoke
to her, right and then she andshe listened and she obeyed,
which is, she's really good atdoing things like that.
Joshua Johnson (24:52):
So as you know, like you just said, your mom's
really good at listening to Godand obeying. Saying, yes. How?
Is that translated into your ownlife? How is that type of
mentality of hearing from God,of obeying, of saying, yes, what
does that? What does that looklike in your life? How is that
transferred to you?
Jackson TerKeurst (25:12):
Yeah, it transferred as like she's a
great role model, you know, andshe leads by example, and she's
a great godly mother who wantsher kids to walk in faith and
know and know God and beobedient to him, and she
displayed that every day in ourhousehold he still does today,
right? So her doing that had ledme to even do things on my own
(25:37):
to allow my heart to be opened,right? My heart to be open to
God, to say yes to to him, usingme however he see pleases to
him. So I'm just an instrumentto him, and this story is giving
me. It's not my story, it's hisstory, and he just chose me to
be the one to deliver thismessage, right? So, and that's
(25:59):
my mom there. She's in sheobeyed God, and she said yes to
him, and he used her in aspecial way and blessed her in a
special way. And he is using mein the same way as well, because
I'm opening my heart and sayingyes, use me. I'm here. Just use
me. And my mom taught me how todo that, and it was great.
Joshua Johnson (26:16):
As you've moving cultures. You're getting used to
school in America, you'regetting used to family in
America, church, it's a totallydifferent world than it were.
You were what was reallydifficult as you are, somebody
moving cross culturally into atotally different culture when
you first started, what wasreally hard? How did the people
(26:39):
around you make it harder foryou than it actually needed to
be. The people who were
Jackson TerKeurst (26:44):
around us growing up, they didn't make
life too hard for us. They wereactually really on board to help
us, you know. And those peoplereally understood our situation
and where we came from, and likeI said, my mom, my parents, did
a really good job by surroundingus with incredible people, going
to youth group, going to churchand mission trips and other
(27:05):
things like that. But some ofthe challenges I faced when I
first got here was the languagebarrier was a huge thing, you
know, because in my country, wespeak colloqua. It's called
colloquia. So it's a brokenEnglish. Someone said Jamaicans
and I would talk was, it'sEnglish was broken English. So
and me trying to deviate fromspeaking broken English to a
(27:29):
more civilized English, or, youknow, standard English, it was
difficult. And certain wordswere very hard for me to
pronounce or say. Householditems. We didn't have all these
things, like, it's a pantry, hasa closet. Here's this, here's
that surprise, a pan, you know.
Here's utensils. I don't saywhat is a utensil? What does
that mean, you know? So justlittle things like that. The
(27:53):
food was very different. Like Isaid, my brother and I struggle
a lot with the American food. Sowe, oftentimes our mom will take
her to grocery store, and wewill get our own things. We get
chicken and rice and bring itback, and it will make our own
rice and chicken. And sometimeswe put chicken feet in the
house,
Unknown (28:16):
and then those tell that my parents would be like
boys. Why you eating chickenfeet, you know? And we're just
loud because we love chickenfeet. It's good, you know?
Jackson TerKeurst (28:28):
There was no meat on it. No, there's me
somewhere on there, you know. Sothis is some of the things we
dealt with and but I alsolearned about, like, one of the
challenges, like I heard aboutthat are really serious to me
was that in American schoolsthat like there are bullies in
school, bullies, you know. Andautomatically, for me, coming
(28:49):
from a traumatic background, Ijump straight to protective
mode, right? And I would say,I'm not gonna let no one mess
with me. I've been through a lotalready. It's when I mess with
me. I'm going to take them out,you know. So my brother and I
made a pat at each other thatwe're going to work out every
day after school. So he and Iworked out every day for 30
minutes or hour every day at thehouse, and ran about one to two
(29:12):
miles, sometimes just to keepjust to keep healthy, that and
strong, that no one messed withus in school, you know. But it
turns out, when we got toschool, it was not as bad as we
expected. No, it was a goodschool. But we also faced
another challenge, where peoplewould make fun of us because we
were so dark, you know, becauseAfrica is hot, you know, I was,
(29:35):
I mean, I'm a little lighter. Ifeel, I feel like I'm light
skinned now, you know, but I waslike, I was like, midnight, man,
I was at 12am you know, dark so,and these guys would make fun of
me, and I will make joke. Belike, man, you so black. Man,
you so African. He's an accent.
I bet you feel weird havingclothes, huh? I bet you feel
weird having days, huh? Youknow, and all this thing made me
(29:56):
feel very insecure and inferior.
Year, you know, and I gotreally, really mad, and because
of that, I kind of isolatedmyself a little bit. But I
didn't want to get in a fightwith somebody, because I'm not a
physical person, you know. I'veseen a lot physical things in my
life in Liberia or the killingsand the brutality, and I did not
(30:17):
want to bring that over with methis way. So I just kind of
stepped back and told myselfthat, you know what, it's okay
if they say that, because theydo not understand where I come
from. They don't understand myculture. They don't know what's
happening. So I always just letthem have the lab, because at
the end of the day, I'm the onewith the culture. They're not
the one with the culture.
Joshua Johnson (30:35):
Was there anybody outside of your family,
brothers that would reach out toyou that you made friends, that
you didn't have to be defensive,put up a barrier, you didn't
have to feel inferior, but youcould actually connect. Did
anybody actually then, thenreach across and connect with
you at a deeper level? Oh,
Jackson TerKeurst (30:57):
yes, I connected with amazing people at
from church, my youth group fromChick fil A, my own family
friends and I met two incrediblefriends at my school, Kevin and
Tim. The book of my two friendsI made in school when I first
came to America, and the booktook me in. I played basketball
with them at school and hung outwith them at a YMCA after school
(31:20):
and play ball and work out. Sothose my two American friends I
made. You know two guys, andthey are incredible people. I'm
still friends with them up tothis day, my best friends, man.
So they took me in as their ownand asked the little brother and
we did life, we worked out, wedid sports and we hung out,
(31:41):
watch movies, and came to myhouse, I went to the house and
jump in the pool, and we justdid life growing up, and they
helped give me some kind ofsecurity and help change my
perspective about what I wasexperiencing for other people
who were not very welcoming,right? So, and I'm grateful to
these two guys for opening thatpath for me to be able to open
(32:02):
up myself to people in Americabecause I was very scared, and
to open up to Americans becauseI didn't know them. I didn't
know people. I know how toaccept me or respond to me, you
know, and this guy's made itvery easy for me to transition.
So
Joshua Johnson (32:14):
if you could talk to people right now that
either know people that havebeen adopted from other
countries, churches that andcommunities that would come
around people that have beenadopted. What would you want
people to know about people inyour situation coming from
another country being adoptedinto America? What What kind of
(32:36):
posture should we take withpeople that are being adopted.
How do we How should theyinteract? What are things that
they may not know, that theyshould know?
Jackson TerKeurst (32:48):
I would say someone from my situation, you
know, they have lot of trauma,and they'll allow loss in a
lifetime. So I would say thebest thing to do for someone
like me would be to get theminvolved in a community where
they can find support andcelebrate their culture in the
home or at the church. So theway they don't feel like they're
(33:09):
being Americanized or they'rebeing changed or something, they
are not, you know, and also, Iwould say, doing a lot of
activities for them. So this waythey are exposed to have more
exposure, because we are notused to American Activities.
They're so different from whatwe used to having, you know, and
we want to learn. We want togrow. We are so excited, and we
(33:30):
need somebody to teach ussomething. Teach me. Please
teach me something. Teach me theAmerican stuff, the good stuff
about America. Teach me that.
Get me involved with some greatfriends I can connect with and
build good community with thesepeople that can help me to
overcome this trauma, and that'sone way I overcame I'm still
overcoming my trauma, by havingcommunity, by having
conversations, and my parentschecking in on me, my pastor
(33:53):
checking up on me, and just beinvolved in being a community
where you're Alwayscommunication with them, talking
to them, asking questions. Ask alot of questions about them. How
you doing? Ask life, how youadjusting. Is anything I can
help you with? Do you miss yourfamily? You know, just be more
personable. Ask those questionsbecause you know they want to be
(34:13):
able to express those things aswell. But if you don't ask,
they'll never know. You neverknow
Joshua Johnson (34:21):
in your relationship with your wife, is
there anything that you realizethat man, I need to deal with my
past. I haven't dealt with mypast enough. I need to actually
go a little deeper with Jesus sothat we can can heal some parts
of me in the past that Iactually am maybe exhibiting
(34:41):
some unhealthy things within mymarriage or in other
relationships in your life. Howdid you start to to go into the
past to deal with things so thatrelationships now in your life,
you could still stay rooted inChrist and you could have strong
health. Relationships.
Jackson TerKeurst (35:00):
Yeah, so my wife, Amanda, she's a very, very
strong Christian woman, and shehas a very strong, strong faith,
so she has helped in a light inthat area, and we both have
grown together. But when I firstgot to here and in my relations
with Amanda, some things Istruggled with. It just was
communication, a lot of, a lotof communication because, uh, I
(35:22):
mean, it's two differentcultures, you know, she's
American, I'm African, soobviously it's going to be very
difficult for her to understandwhere I'm coming from with
certain things. And likewise, I,you know, it's hard to
understand as well. So in thebeginning of our relationship,
the the communication was veryoff, because I would say
(35:42):
something else and mean it likehow we would say in Africa,
right? And then she'll take itother way, and I be a no, it's
not like that. And she'd belike, but that's how I'm taking
it, you know, you know, after awhile, I realized that, you know
what? Yeah, you know, maybe Ican change my communication
style a little bit better, youknow, and try to try to speak in
(36:02):
a way where I'm not speaking outof anger or frustration, because
I have so much anger built in mefrom the past, so much anger and
so much fear, so much, I mean,everything built up. And if
someone makes me mad, I'll gooff of them. You know, I just
get angry real quick. I hadthat, and she knew about it. So
after a while, you know, itaffected sharing our
(36:24):
relationship a lot. And one day,we just decided that, hey, the
best thing to do is like, God,want us to be together, but we
have to take steps and and Iwant us to be together. So we,
what we did was we went tocounseling, went to therapy,
right? And therapy help us a lotwith that, and just being
surrounded by my family and herfamily and very close friends
(36:47):
and having this conversation andlots of private time prayers
together has helped us a lot todeepen our relationship, my
relationship with God, to whereshe and I have better
communications Now so and I lovethat. I'm so happy that I was
able to heal from that andlisten to all this advice in the
encouragement from families andfriends throughout the years
(37:10):
that has helped me to be whereI'm at, that I can be a great
father, a great leader to mywife and our kids. What
Joshua Johnson (37:17):
does it look like then, I think that's that's
fantastic, as you're, you'rewalking through those, those
things, in that process. I mean,it's, I think we all, we all
have to grow and learn in that.
It doesn't matter who you are.
This is what we have to do. Butas you now, you know are
running, you're doing business,or an entrepreneur, things. How
do you integrate faith Jesuswithin business. What does that
(37:41):
look like within the community?
In your
Jackson TerKeurst (37:43):
business?
Well, I mean, it starts with meas a person. You know, it's
where my heart is and mystandards and my foundation is
within Christ. So therefore,anything I do in regards to
business or work, and I see itfrom the perspective of serving
other people, not trying to say,Hey, I'm going to do this for
(38:04):
you, but I'm here to serveright? So from that perspective
and that mindset, I'll go aboutit to where I want to help other
people. I want to serve otherpeople. And because of that, it
has shifted my mindset, myheart, to where I'm actually
doing this thing out of honesty,out of love, out of care,
because I truly care, you know,and I truly want to help these
(38:25):
people, not because I want aquick check or book The money is
not. Money is not. Money iseverywhere, but it's all about
how you serve other people.
Because Jesus came to serve,right? He was a servant leader,
and that's who I want to be. Iwant to be a servant leader. I
want to lead and serve otherpeople. And that's going to have
(38:45):
I've like, you know, taking thatperspective in my business and
in my life all around Yeah,
Joshua Johnson (38:50):
Jackson, if you could talk to your readers, the
people that would read yourbook, the only way forward is
back. What's What do you hopeyour readers would get from
this? What do you hope that thisbook is going to do?
Jackson TerKeurst (39:02):
Well? I really hope that in this book,
that each person will rememberthat God gave us all stories,
not just to carry, but to share,right and if my story, if my
testimony, can help anybody tokeep moving forward, to embrace
their own journey of whatever itis they're going through, then I
(39:24):
know for a fact that I'm doingwhat God has called me to do,
right? So my encouragement toyou is that embrace the journey,
embrace what's happening to you,embrace the the in season, the
in betweens, embrace that seekout God. Get on your knees and
pray and be humble, bevulnerable. Seek community, seek
people. Don't do this byyourself. It's not going to
(39:46):
happen by yourself. Bevulnerable with people about
what you're going through, andbe honest and open, and God will
work through your lifemiraculously.
Joshua Johnson (39:54):
Jackson, a couple of questions I have for
you. One, if you go back to your21 year old self, what advice
would
Jackson TerKeurst (39:59):
you give? I.
Ah, my two more year. Whatadvice I would tell myself, Oh,
man, oh, wow. I don't even know.
I would just say, keep pushing,man, you know, keep pushing.
Keep pushing. Don't stop thereare a lot of people, you know,
counting on you, so just keepbeing a, you know, the person
you've been alone and, yeah, I'dbe nice to people. Little nicer.
(40:24):
21 year, I was into, I was intonice. You know, I was, I was
into nice. I was too focused onmyself and I didn't care. But
now guys changed my life, so I'mgood. So
Joshua Johnson (40:34):
how can people go get the only way forward is
back, and is there anywhere elseyou'd like to point people to?
Jackson TerKeurst (40:39):
Yes, so it's on Amazon, just tap in Jackson
turkhurst, or the only way offour is back on Amazon, books, a
million Barnes and Nobles. Youcan even find me on social
media, on Instagram at JacksonTurks. You find me on there. I
would love to connect with youon there. Well,
Joshua Johnson (40:57):
Jackson, thank you for your story. Thank you
for sharing your story. Thankyou for helping us know that,
hey, we all have stories, and wedon't just have to carry them.
That's right. We get to sharethem, to let people know that
God is is with us. He is for us.
We could be rooted, find ouridentity in Christ, and we could
heal from our our trauma and ourpain, and we could move forward
(41:17):
in Christ with community and inrelationships and so Jackson was
great. It's fantasticconversation. Really enjoyed it.
So thank you so much. Thank
Jackson TerKeurst (41:30):
you, Josh.
Good to meet you, man. Thank youfor your time. Sir. Appreciate
you. You
And he said the best thing in his case would
(00:01):
be to take you to this orphanagewhere you have safety and refuge
for now and when the war isover, I will send your family,
if I found them, to come get youand bring you back home. And
that never happened, and here Iam. You. Joshua,
Joshua Johnson (00:30):
hello and welcome to the shifting culture
podcast in which we haveconversations about the culture
we create and the impact we canmake. We long to see the body of
Christ look like Jesus. I'm yourhost. Joshua Johnson, today,
Jackson turkhurst joins me toshare his extraordinary journey
from the rural simplicity of aLiberian village to the chaos
and trauma of war and finally todiscovering a profound sense of
(00:52):
belonging through faithcommunity and adoption. Jackson
recounts the harrowingexperience of surviving as a
child during Liberia's brutalcivil conflict, the
transformative power of musicand worship in his healing and
how God orchestrated amiraculous meeting that led to
finding his adoptive family inAmerica through his powerful
(01:13):
story, Jackson invites us toconfront our past traumas,
embrace our identity in Christand experience true healing and
hope and community. So join us,because all our stories matter
and our greatest pains canbecome our most impactful
ministries. Here's myconversation with Jackson.
Turkhurst, Jackson, welcome toshifting culture. Excited to
(01:36):
have you on thanks for joiningme. Thank you. It's good to be
here, man. I'm excited to diginto your story. Dig into your
book. The only way forward isback. Your story is unique to
you, but I think we could allrelate that God has been with us
in different moments of ourlives, even when we felt
abandoned and alone and scaredthat God is still present. Take
(01:58):
us into your story as a youngkids. What was happening? Where
were you? How were you growingup?
Jackson TerKeurst (02:04):
Yeah, so just sharp in the beginning, huh?
Well, I would talk to you aboutmy early childhood. So my early
childhood started peaceful inthe village in Liberia, where I
grew up. We were very, verypoor, poor farmers, but life was
very simple and full of a lot ofrhythm for us. So it was very
simple. We loved it. My familyand I lived in a small village
(02:28):
in a small home, small, humblehome, and we grew everything we
ate. So we were farmers. Mybrother and I were in charge of
the rice farm, so our job was tomake sure that the birds don't
come and eat the rice. So everyday we go to the farm and make
sure that, you know, we washover the rice farm that was life
(02:49):
for us. Every day, that waslife, you know, just to just
villages, just to inform life,and just living simple and poor
and whatever. Until one night,all of that turned around. It
just Swift, real quick in theblack of midnight, around three,
4am one night, we were all justasleep, you know, humble home,
(03:10):
and out of nowhere, we hearpeople screaming, yelling,
crying. That was abnormal forus, because we never hear sounds
like Daytona village. It'spretty quiet out there at
nighttime, and when we heard asign of chaos, everyone freaked
out. Everyone woke up, and I,for once, was scared out of my
(03:31):
mind, because I was just a sevenyear old child and having to
experience what it felt like tohear a Grenier launcher or a
bomb going off in ak 47 justshooting left and right and
watching people die. And thatwas the beginning of my
childhood, and that's when mytrauma all started.
Joshua Johnson (03:51):
I can't imagine, you know, my son is seven years
old at the moment, and just tothink about seeing all of that
through his own eyes, nobodyshould have to see that no
matter how old you are, right?
The world is broken. Itshouldn't be like that. But to
have a seven year old, how doyou respond to that as a seven
year old, what were what washappening in that moment for
(04:12):
you?
Jackson TerKeurst (04:14):
I mean, like any seven year old, would, I
mean, you cry, you know, youscream, and you'll freak out.
Your panic, obviously. Andthat's exactly the mode I went
into, you know, panic mode,scared, afraid, and then scream
from my parents, obviously,scream for my mom and dad, but
they were nowhere to be found.
Because, I mean, the war hasalready erupted in the village,
(04:36):
and I was the only one in myroom, in my room by myself, and
I jumped off my bamboo bedstraight onto the dirt floor and
started to crawl in the hallwaybecause there was bullets flying
and I want to stand up and gethit. Luckily, my aunt, who lived
in a house with us, saw mecrawling, and she came, just
(04:56):
grabbed me, threw me on herback. And then we ran straight
into the safety of the jungle. Iwas freaking out, scared,
afraid. And then I looked to myleft, my neighbor, who was close
with growing up, he came to joinus on our way to the bush to
hide the jungle. And then Ilooked left to see him, and then
I just saw him, his eye just gobig, and he just dropped. I
(05:17):
didn't have time to stop. I sawhim just running, running, and
looking back as I run, lookingback, and I just can't imagine
what's happening. I was soscared, but my body was also
very numb. I was so numb to whatwas happening, to where we jump
into this jungle, into thisdense jungle with thorns and
just cutting out flesh andskins. But we didn't care. I
(05:38):
didn't care. You didn't care. Itdidn't cut to my mind. All I was
thinking about was survival.
Like, let's go, let's grow innext place. I mean, that was
That was intense for seven yearexperience at three, 4am the
morning
Joshua Johnson (05:51):
in the next, next few days. What? What was
happening? Where was your whathappened your family and what
happened to you after, yeah,running for your life. Well,
Jackson TerKeurst (06:01):
I mean, obviously, you know, we all went
different directions, family,some, some got taken, and some
got, you know, I don't want totalk about that part, but me and
my aunt were the only ones whomade it out. And we, you know,
we ran to the jungle, where welook for safety, and we ran way,
way, way, way back deep in thejungle, where there was really
(06:23):
no life besides animals thatlive out there. And we were
there for a while, for a verylong time, and we had to learn
how to survive on our own inthere, trying to feed ourselves,
create shelter and just be quietto where we don't want to hear
making a noise or start a fire,because the rebels are very
(06:43):
smart, you know, if they see asmoke for somewhere, they would
definitely go in our route tofind where that smoke is coming
from, and they'll goinvestigate. And we didn't want
to do that. So we just stick toeating anything we can find that
was that will not require us tocook a meal. Plus, we didn't
have a pots and pans cook a mealin a way, so, but yeah, we were
stuck back there for a while.
She and I,
Joshua Johnson (07:05):
that's a that's a tough thing. We'll get into
some of your later story. Butnow, as as we see, you got out
of the jungle. I did. You're notthere, not anymore. You're
you're looking back on thosethose times. That's right, how
did you not get stuck in thatplace? How did you not stay in
(07:26):
the in the trauma and the fearof war and loss and chaos, and
if you look back on your lifenow,
Jackson TerKeurst (07:35):
well, I mean looking bad my life, my life, I
always, you know I was my lifewas defined by chaos and
obviously trauma and war andloss, those were the things that
define me back then. So but nowI see my identity in Christ, in
God. So God, you know, he seesme as his son. Because back
(07:57):
then, I didn't know who I was. Ididn't know what I was called to
be, or I knew was, I was just anorphan kid trying to survive and
find family and find love. ButGod had a bigger plan for my
life. God told me that you aremy son. I love you, I protect
you. I'm here with you, youknow. And through that time, I
(08:18):
connected with him a lot, and Iprayed a lot. You know, my aunt
and I prayed a lot during thesetimes. But when I came to
America, to overcome thistraumas, I had to seek a lot of
help, and my parents helped alot with that, you know, putting
me in the right community aroundother people, great people to be
around. And they got me to youthcamps, to youth groups, mission
(08:40):
trips and working at Chick fil Aand serving at a restaurant. So
all those states contributed tome overcoming some of this
trauma I have dealt with mylife.
Joshua Johnson (08:50):
Yeah, it seems, seems to be identity in Christ
and community, the rightcommunity, the people around you
really, really helps. It does.
So did. Where did you start tofind your identity in Christ?
What happened to you? Where didJesus come into the picture? To
know that you were found in Himand not on
Jackson TerKeurst (09:11):
your own?
What Jesus came in a picture? Imean, way before I was born. But
when I was when I was born in avillage, we were not aware of
Christianity, of God, becausewe're just villagers. When I
have the gospel out there, wejust tribal people. But then
later on, when I got introducedto, uh, to church and Christian
and by my dad, we he and I usedto walked about three to four
(09:32):
miles on Sundays to go to churchand on a dirt road. So that's
kind of how I learned about God.
And then when I got into theorphanages, I lived in four or
five different orphanages. Ilived in those orphanages were
Christian orphanages, andbecause of that, I began to
learn more about God in theorphanages. You know, went to
(09:54):
church. We had devotions everymorning. We were taught to be
grateful because, you. We couldhave been one dead, but we are
still alive and breathing, youknow? And we were taught to
approach everything from agratitude perspective and
mindset, right? So this, despitewe're in pain, we're hurting so
much, things going alive that'sagainst us. But we were taught
(10:16):
to be the light in the dark, andthrough that, I was able to see
God shines light through me, andI was able to use my story and
testimony in Liberia to ministerto other churches, as well being
my friends will go to churchesand sing, you know, and give our
testimony at churches to share,to share our story of people, to
encourage them. And throughthat, I saw God working my life
(10:39):
when he says, Son, it's time foryou to go America, to go share
this story with everybody else.
And I would say, Thank You Lord,it's time. It's about time, man,
Joshua Johnson (10:52):
yeah, we're gonna get into you coming into
America. But before I do that,how did you get into an
orphanage, and what did thatlook like? Because you actually
went to different orphanages.
Where did you and your maybeyour aunt split up and you went
into an orphanage?
Jackson TerKeurst (11:10):
We split whenever we got to my dad's
village in Joe town, rebels cameto our to that, to that village
as well, and attacked as well.
And because of that, I lost alot of family members as well
with the accident, and then myfamily, my siblings and I would
just disperse into the woods.
You know, that's how I losteverybody. I went one direction.
They went one direction. Theywent one direction. And after
(11:33):
that, we all got dispersed witheach other. And based on
familiarity, I was able tonavigate my way through the
woods onto the dirt road where Iwas able to walk into another
town where my uncle lives. So myuncle Jerry lived another town,
maybe about it's pretty far.
Actually took me a while to getthere, but when I got there, he
was still there. He was stillthe house, uh, hiding,
(11:54):
obviously. And he just knew thatsomebody gonna show up. And
that's the house we all go to.
Our family goes to, sometimes tosee other families. But he was
there, and I told him whathappened, and he was so sad,
instructing Give me a hug,because he's been attacked by
the wars, where he's beenaffected also, but he was just
trying to hide until it passedover. And then in he and I met
(12:18):
now, and I was like, Oh, UncleJerry, so good to see you. Man,
not hugging him and holding himtight and crying and screaming
and miss. And he just hugging meback. And he told me that, hey,
man, um, after bad news, I'mgonna have to take you to a
children's home or orphanage.
And I was like, what is that? Isthat? Is that? Is that where
everybody is our families,they're hanging out. And he
(12:40):
said, No, it's where other kids,like you go and hang out onto
the wars over the Go back toyour families. I said, Oh, well,
I didn't want to, I didn't wantto go. I said, No, almost I was,
I'm gonna stick with you. Isaid, No, no, no, I don't want
that. No, I don't want that. I'mgonna stay here with you. And he
said, no, like, I can't protectyou, and I can barely protect
myself. And he said, the bestthing in his case would be to
(13:01):
take you to this orphanage whereyou have safety and refuge for
now and when the war is over. Iwas sent your family, but found
them to come get you and bringyou back home. And that never
happened. And here I am.
Joshua Johnson (13:16):
It's rough that you have to get there. It's it's
hard, and why, why did you movefrom like you went to Ford, five
different places
Jackson TerKeurst (13:27):
in the first orphanage I went to, it was
attacked by the rebels as well.
So it got attacked and livedestruction happened. So when
that war, when that's cool down,we all load up in a van and head
to another city, where we wereat for a few weeks, and then
another war broke out again, andthen we ran to another area.
We're there for a while no food.
(13:51):
All we had was hot water todrink every day for breakfast,
lunch and dinner, and eatingroots or leaves or dead mouse or
lasers and anything we can findin the woods we eat it. You
know, that was several weeks andseveral months of doing that.
And then when the war seizeddown, we then came back to the
city to another orphanage again,and then that's when I got
(14:15):
transferred to another orphanageagain. So it was just one thing
after another, like it was waror there was no food, there was
no food. It was war of sickness.
It was all those thingscombined, and it's and I kept
moving around until I ended upin the last orphanage where my
life changed forever.
Joshua Johnson (14:33):
One of the things that you did you You
joined an acapella choir aswell. You started to sing, yeah,
how did, how did music and thechoir and singing, how did that
help ground you as somebody thatactually was was going in lots
of different directions,different places, had to run and
(14:54):
flee. How did music help? Howdid the choir help?
Jackson TerKeurst (14:58):
Well, you know, in times of hard. Are
times and struggles, you know,you just can sit in that you
have to do something, you know,and for us, like I said, we were
taught to be grateful and havegratitude mindset. Therefore we
we sung a lot of songs. We singa lot, we dance a lot, we praise
a lot. We praise God a lot,because it shifted our mindset.
(15:18):
It helps to take our mind up ofour current situation and what
we're going to what we'reexperiencing, right? So we use
music and fellowship with eachother, to sing, to laugh, to
joke, to worship, just to passtime. And because of that, music
play a vital part of my lifegrowing up, you know? But it was
(15:40):
not meant to be my finaldestination, right? It was a
bridge that brought me toAmerica, but I'm gonna find a
destination. But music, at thetime, was the only remedy that
we had for our chaos. Do
Joshua Johnson (15:51):
you see that even now? How has music carried
you through the rest of yourlife? Does music do something in
your soul, in your
Jackson TerKeurst (16:00):
hearts, absolutely, man, you know
honesty. I still, I still up tothis day, listen to my acapella
music every morning. Everymorning I blast in the morning,
in out of shower, I'm gettingready, and I play my acapella
music. And sometimes I play,what's his name, Brandon lake. I
like Brandon lake a lot.
Elevation worship, Hillsong,just to name a few, my wife and
(16:21):
I play that every morning, evenwith the kids. So even just on a
drive, you know, because we justknow that being the presence of
God every day and doing thesethings, it really does shift
your mind and it shifts yourheart into the right
perspective. And
Joshua Johnson (16:39):
being a part of this choir, you got an
opportunity to fly to America,to go and to tour. What was that
like, and what says, How did youso take us into this journey of
you, this boys choir, landing inDC. What was it like to to
actually land in America
Jackson TerKeurst (17:01):
first time cold. It was so cold. It was so
cold my man, oh man, we havesome African boys. We're used to
the heat in the ocean and thewater and in a warm breeze. But
we had a dream to come America,and we were aware that America
was cold. And our friends usedto refer to America as the cold,
(17:24):
sorry, Africa, Koi America, thecold. In my country, the cold
so. But we had no idea it wasthat extreme. We just thought
was just a little chilly. Butthen when we got there, it was
like beautiful, an airplanelooking out. I mean, the city
just laid out lights everywhere.
I mean, it looks so like alittle heavy to us, because in
my country where I come from,you've been an airplane, you
(17:45):
will not see a light. It's verydark. Yeah, the country is still
struggling so and then landingin DC, and it's in the airport
that big was so many people ofdifferent races, and I mean,
different ethnicity andbackground. Were just
overwhelmed by all these amazingpeople and amazing things. And
they got food over here, foodover here, food over there. It
(18:07):
was like there was foodeverywhere. Oh, we were
overwhelmed. And then we gotoutside the gates, and we were
greeted by something very, veryunwelcoming, and that was the
American winter cold. You knowthat that slap was right back
into the terminal, and we puteverything we had on us and came
(18:27):
back out, and we all just jokedat each other for the rest of
the trip about how crazy thatwas. And you know, we never knew
the American weather and it wasthis harsh?
Joshua Johnson (18:42):
How did you end up staying in America? What was
that journey in that processlike?
Jackson TerKeurst (18:48):
So how to get to America was this so, as I
mentioned earlier, my friendsand I, former boys choir and we,
because of what we were doing atorphanage, we were actually
number one in an orphanage. Soeverybody wanted to be like us,
because we were so good andwe're so young and very talented
and very energetic. And otherguys, when we create a choir
(19:09):
just like us, and we travel inthe country to other churches,
where we perform a lot of otherchurches and share our testimony
other churches as well. So wewere almost kind of new in the
area for just our heart and theway we want to worship God,
despite of our pain, what'sgoing on. And one day, Pastor
kofi, he is the one who runs theorphanage. He has great
(19:32):
connections with some incrediblepeople in the States and Canada
and other countries. He broughtsome missionaries to see us in
the orphanage, and he asked usto perform for this
missionaries, you know. And wewere thrilled. We were like, Oh
my gosh, yes, we'd love to, youknow. And we did that. We did
our thing, we got on stage, weperformed for them with our
(19:54):
hearts out. And the next day hecame back to us. He was like,
You. Boys, you guys did a greatjob. I'm so proud of you guys. I
have another news for you guys.
I'm taking y'all to America, andyou guys can be ambassadors and
missionaries for your brothersand sisters here in the
orphanage, right? And your yourgoal would be to share the
(20:18):
struggle our country is dealingwith, with our Christian
brothers and sisters in Americato see if they can help our
country, not just for money butprayer and support. And that's
when everything changed, and wewere so excited about the
opportunity to where we said,Heck yeah. And we started
practicing and writing moresongs and getting more excited.
(20:38):
And then next, you know, is likewe run an airplane a few months
later here to the States. Idreamed my whole life, my whole
life. Man, to come to America,not just that, but to be adopted
and to have a family and to feellove and to feel belong, and
just to know what it feels liketo, you know, to have someone
your corner. Because I was allby myself. Man, I was always
(21:00):
alone and I didn't have nosiblings, and having to defend
other people to fill in thosegaps, and my brothers in the
boys choir or my family, thoseguys were my family. We did life
together, and we held each othertogether, and we laughed a lot,
we joked a lot and prayed a lot.
So yeah, that's my family forlife. That's kind of how I
(21:22):
started. That's why I came toAmerica.
Joshua Johnson (21:24):
You have this, your family with the boys choir.
You're here, you're you're inAmerica, and you find your your
adoptive family as well inAmerica on that tour. How did
that happen? How in the world isthis connection made where
you're ended up eventually beingadopted into this family.
Jackson TerKeurst (21:45):
Well, it's a very wise story. It's a wild
one. So my sister, right now,one of my sisters, she was a
girl scout, and one of thecountries that had a study she
had a study was Liberia, and shechose to study my country,
Liberia? Well, we knew shepicked Liberia all the countries
in the world, right? She pickedlike she picked Liberia, and
(22:07):
then came to find out theLiberian acapella boys choir was
right next door to her housedoing a concert at a local
church. We're doing localchurch. And then her my mom and
my other sisters, they all wentthere to hear us perform. And
during, during that time, that'swhen our visas were expiring,
actually, it was time for us tohead back to Liberia. But then
(22:30):
there was also war going on inLiberia as well. So we couldn't
go back to Liberia, because ifyou step on an airport, we could
have been dead and gone easy asthat so, so our manager, he was
so gracious, and he got on stageand, you know, shared an update
with the congregation. Washappening in our case and
(22:52):
gospel, God did his thing. Andfrom that experience, from that
night, my life changed forever,and that's how I met my mom and
my sisters and all of us. And mylife changed, and I am adopted
now, you know, and I have a homenow, and I am grateful,
grateful, grateful for thatmoment and the blessing that I
(23:12):
get to be a part of the family,and that God did hear me answer
my prayer to bring me my mom,Lisa. So I'm grateful. Yes,
Joshua Johnson (23:22):
you know, in your book, you wrote a little
bit as you saw Lisa that nightyou you ran up and called her
mom, yes, before, before youknew her, before I knew it, what
was so what was happening inthat moment for you, and then
what is what was happening forher, as you've talked to your
mom now about that moment, whatwas happening between both of
(23:46):
you calling her mom when youhaven't met before?
Jackson TerKeurst (23:50):
Yeah. I mean, it was just a God thing, man. I
just, I just saw her. You knowhow you see somebody, you see
something. It just makes sense.
It makes sense. Like it just, itjust clicks. And then when I
turn out, first of all, we wereplaying in the pews with her,
the girls, or daughters who werehanging out, hanging out,
playing around. And then I hadno idea that was the mom, first
(24:11):
of all. And then I just lookedup, and then the lady came
walking out, just like it, justlike it feels so glorious, like,
you know, like, like an angel,like glorious and I just, it's
the world. The words just cameout of my mouth. He said, Mom,
it just like happened, you know,and just God just knew that I
was a divine, divine calling.
(24:32):
That's divine moment. And heorchestrated that. She didn't
know me, I didn't know her, buthe put that, he put it in my
heart and in her heart as wellto receive that. You know,
she'll lay hesitant about it,but they eventually, God spoke
to her, right and then she andshe listened and she obeyed,
which is, she's really good atdoing things like that.
Joshua Johnson (24:52):
So as you know, like you just said, your mom's
really good at listening to Godand obeying. Saying, yes. How?
Is that translated into your ownlife? How is that type of
mentality of hearing from God,of obeying, of saying, yes, what
does that? What does that looklike in your life? How is that
transferred to you?
Jackson TerKeurst (25:12):
Yeah, it transferred as like she's a
great role model, you know, andshe leads by example, and she's
a great godly mother who wantsher kids to walk in faith and
know and know God and beobedient to him, and she
displayed that every day in ourhousehold he still does today,
right? So her doing that had ledme to even do things on my own
(25:37):
to allow my heart to be opened,right? My heart to be open to
God, to say yes to to him, usingme however he see pleases to
him. So I'm just an instrumentto him, and this story is giving
me. It's not my story, it's hisstory, and he just chose me to
be the one to deliver thismessage, right? So, and that's
(25:59):
my mom there. She's in sheobeyed God, and she said yes to
him, and he used her in aspecial way and blessed her in a
special way. And he is using mein the same way as well, because
I'm opening my heart and sayingyes, use me. I'm here. Just use
me. And my mom taught me how todo that, and it was great.
Joshua Johnson (26:16):
As you've moving cultures. You're getting used to
school in America, you'regetting used to family in
America, church, it's a totallydifferent world than it were.
You were what was reallydifficult as you are, somebody
moving cross culturally into atotally different culture when
you first started, what wasreally hard? How did the people
(26:39):
around you make it harder foryou than it actually needed to
be. The people who were
Jackson TerKeurst (26:44):
around us growing up, they didn't make
life too hard for us. They wereactually really on board to help
us, you know. And those peoplereally understood our situation
and where we came from, and likeI said, my mom, my parents, did
a really good job by surroundingus with incredible people, going
to youth group, going to churchand mission trips and other
(27:05):
things like that. But some ofthe challenges I faced when I
first got here was the languagebarrier was a huge thing, you
know, because in my country, wespeak colloqua. It's called
colloquia. So it's a brokenEnglish. Someone said Jamaicans
and I would talk was, it'sEnglish was broken English. So
and me trying to deviate fromspeaking broken English to a
(27:29):
more civilized English, or, youknow, standard English, it was
difficult. And certain wordswere very hard for me to
pronounce or say. Householditems. We didn't have all these
things, like, it's a pantry, hasa closet. Here's this, here's
that surprise, a pan, you know.
Here's utensils. I don't saywhat is a utensil? What does
that mean, you know? So justlittle things like that. The
(27:53):
food was very different. Like Isaid, my brother and I struggle
a lot with the American food. Sowe, oftentimes our mom will take
her to grocery store, and wewill get our own things. We get
chicken and rice and bring itback, and it will make our own
rice and chicken. And sometimeswe put chicken feet in the
house,
Unknown (28:16):
and then those tell that my parents would be like
boys. Why you eating chickenfeet, you know? And we're just
loud because we love chickenfeet. It's good, you know?
Jackson TerKeurst (28:28):
There was no meat on it. No, there's me
somewhere on there, you know. Sothis is some of the things we
dealt with and but I alsolearned about, like, one of the
challenges, like I heard aboutthat are really serious to me
was that in American schoolsthat like there are bullies in
school, bullies, you know. Andautomatically, for me, coming
(28:49):
from a traumatic background, Ijump straight to protective
mode, right? And I would say,I'm not gonna let no one mess
with me. I've been through a lotalready. It's when I mess with
me. I'm going to take them out,you know. So my brother and I
made a pat at each other thatwe're going to work out every
day after school. So he and Iworked out every day for 30
minutes or hour every day at thehouse, and ran about one to two
(29:12):
miles, sometimes just to keepjust to keep healthy, that and
strong, that no one messed withus in school, you know. But it
turns out, when we got toschool, it was not as bad as we
expected. No, it was a goodschool. But we also faced
another challenge, where peoplewould make fun of us because we
were so dark, you know, becauseAfrica is hot, you know, I was,
(29:35):
I mean, I'm a little lighter. Ifeel, I feel like I'm light
skinned now, you know, but I waslike, I was like, midnight, man,
I was at 12am you know, dark so,and these guys would make fun of
me, and I will make joke. Belike, man, you so black. Man,
you so African. He's an accent.
I bet you feel weird havingclothes, huh? I bet you feel
weird having days, huh? Youknow, and all this thing made me
(29:56):
feel very insecure and inferior.
Year, you know, and I gotreally, really mad, and because
of that, I kind of isolatedmyself a little bit. But I
didn't want to get in a fightwith somebody, because I'm not a
physical person, you know. I'veseen a lot physical things in my
life in Liberia or the killingsand the brutality, and I did not
(30:17):
want to bring that over with methis way. So I just kind of
stepped back and told myselfthat, you know what, it's okay
if they say that, because theydo not understand where I come
from. They don't understand myculture. They don't know what's
happening. So I always just letthem have the lab, because at
the end of the day, I'm the onewith the culture. They're not
the one with the culture.
Joshua Johnson (30:35):
Was there anybody outside of your family,
brothers that would reach out toyou that you made friends, that
you didn't have to be defensive,put up a barrier, you didn't
have to feel inferior, but youcould actually connect. Did
anybody actually then, thenreach across and connect with
you at a deeper level? Oh,
Jackson TerKeurst (30:57):
yes, I connected with amazing people at
from church, my youth group fromChick fil A, my own family
friends and I met two incrediblefriends at my school, Kevin and
Tim. The book of my two friendsI made in school when I first
came to America, and the booktook me in. I played basketball
with them at school and hung outwith them at a YMCA after school
(31:20):
and play ball and work out. Sothose my two American friends I
made. You know two guys, andthey are incredible people. I'm
still friends with them up tothis day, my best friends, man.
So they took me in as their ownand asked the little brother and
we did life, we worked out, wedid sports and we hung out,
(31:41):
watch movies, and came to myhouse, I went to the house and
jump in the pool, and we justdid life growing up, and they
helped give me some kind ofsecurity and help change my
perspective about what I wasexperiencing for other people
who were not very welcoming,right? So, and I'm grateful to
these two guys for opening thatpath for me to be able to open
(32:02):
up myself to people in Americabecause I was very scared, and
to open up to Americans becauseI didn't know them. I didn't
know people. I know how toaccept me or respond to me, you
know, and this guy's made itvery easy for me to transition.
So
Joshua Johnson (32:14):
if you could talk to people right now that
either know people that havebeen adopted from other
countries, churches that andcommunities that would come
around people that have beenadopted. What would you want
people to know about people inyour situation coming from
another country being adoptedinto America? What What kind of
(32:36):
posture should we take withpeople that are being adopted.
How do we How should theyinteract? What are things that
they may not know, that theyshould know?
Jackson TerKeurst (32:48):
I would say someone from my situation, you
know, they have lot of trauma,and they'll allow loss in a
lifetime. So I would say thebest thing to do for someone
like me would be to get theminvolved in a community where
they can find support andcelebrate their culture in the
home or at the church. So theway they don't feel like they're
(33:09):
being Americanized or they'rebeing changed or something, they
are not, you know, and also, Iwould say, doing a lot of
activities for them. So this waythey are exposed to have more
exposure, because we are notused to American Activities.
They're so different from whatwe used to having, you know, and
we want to learn. We want togrow. We are so excited, and we
(33:30):
need somebody to teach ussomething. Teach me. Please
teach me something. Teach me theAmerican stuff, the good stuff
about America. Teach me that.
Get me involved with some greatfriends I can connect with and
build good community with thesepeople that can help me to
overcome this trauma, and that'sone way I overcame I'm still
overcoming my trauma, by havingcommunity, by having
conversations, and my parentschecking in on me, my pastor
(33:53):
checking up on me, and just beinvolved in being a community
where you're Alwayscommunication with them, talking
to them, asking questions. Ask alot of questions about them. How
you doing? Ask life, how youadjusting. Is anything I can
help you with? Do you miss yourfamily? You know, just be more
personable. Ask those questionsbecause you know they want to be
(34:13):
able to express those things aswell. But if you don't ask,
they'll never know. You neverknow
Joshua Johnson (34:21):
in your relationship with your wife, is
there anything that you realizethat man, I need to deal with my
past. I haven't dealt with mypast enough. I need to actually
go a little deeper with Jesus sothat we can can heal some parts
of me in the past that Iactually am maybe exhibiting
(34:41):
some unhealthy things within mymarriage or in other
relationships in your life. Howdid you start to to go into the
past to deal with things so thatrelationships now in your life,
you could still stay rooted inChrist and you could have strong
health. Relationships.
Jackson TerKeurst (35:00):
Yeah, so my wife, Amanda, she's a very, very
strong Christian woman, and shehas a very strong, strong faith,
so she has helped in a light inthat area, and we both have
grown together. But when I firstgot to here and in my relations
with Amanda, some things Istruggled with. It just was
communication, a lot of, a lotof communication because, uh, I
(35:22):
mean, it's two differentcultures, you know, she's
American, I'm African, soobviously it's going to be very
difficult for her to understandwhere I'm coming from with
certain things. And likewise, I,you know, it's hard to
understand as well. So in thebeginning of our relationship,
the the communication was veryoff, because I would say
(35:42):
something else and mean it likehow we would say in Africa,
right? And then she'll take itother way, and I be a no, it's
not like that. And she'd belike, but that's how I'm taking
it, you know, you know, after awhile, I realized that, you know
what? Yeah, you know, maybe Ican change my communication
style a little bit better, youknow, and try to try to speak in
(36:02):
a way where I'm not speaking outof anger or frustration, because
I have so much anger built in mefrom the past, so much anger and
so much fear, so much, I mean,everything built up. And if
someone makes me mad, I'll gooff of them. You know, I just
get angry real quick. I hadthat, and she knew about it. So
after a while, you know, itaffected sharing our
(36:24):
relationship a lot. And one day,we just decided that, hey, the
best thing to do is like, God,want us to be together, but we
have to take steps and and Iwant us to be together. So we,
what we did was we went tocounseling, went to therapy,
right? And therapy help us a lotwith that, and just being
surrounded by my family and herfamily and very close friends
(36:47):
and having this conversation andlots of private time prayers
together has helped us a lot todeepen our relationship, my
relationship with God, to whereshe and I have better
communications Now so and I lovethat. I'm so happy that I was
able to heal from that andlisten to all this advice in the
encouragement from families andfriends throughout the years
(37:10):
that has helped me to be whereI'm at, that I can be a great
father, a great leader to mywife and our kids. What
Joshua Johnson (37:17):
does it look like then, I think that's that's
fantastic, as you're, you'rewalking through those, those
things, in that process. I mean,it's, I think we all, we all
have to grow and learn in that.
It doesn't matter who you are.
This is what we have to do. Butas you now, you know are
running, you're doing business,or an entrepreneur, things. How
do you integrate faith Jesuswithin business. What does that
(37:41):
look like within the community?
In your
Jackson TerKeurst (37:43):
business?
Well, I mean, it starts with meas a person. You know, it's
where my heart is and mystandards and my foundation is
within Christ. So therefore,anything I do in regards to
business or work, and I see itfrom the perspective of serving
other people, not trying to say,Hey, I'm going to do this for
(38:04):
you, but I'm here to serveright? So from that perspective
and that mindset, I'll go aboutit to where I want to help other
people. I want to serve otherpeople. And because of that, it
has shifted my mindset, myheart, to where I'm actually
doing this thing out of honesty,out of love, out of care,
because I truly care, you know,and I truly want to help these
(38:25):
people, not because I want aquick check or book The money is
not. Money is not. Money iseverywhere, but it's all about
how you serve other people.
Because Jesus came to serve,right? He was a servant leader,
and that's who I want to be. Iwant to be a servant leader. I
want to lead and serve otherpeople. And that's going to have
(38:45):
I've like, you know, taking thatperspective in my business and
in my life all around Yeah,
Joshua Johnson (38:50):
Jackson, if you could talk to your readers, the
people that would read yourbook, the only way forward is
back. What's What do you hopeyour readers would get from
this? What do you hope that thisbook is going to do?
Jackson TerKeurst (39:02):
Well? I really hope that in this book,
that each person will rememberthat God gave us all stories,
not just to carry, but to share,right and if my story, if my
testimony, can help anybody tokeep moving forward, to embrace
their own journey of whatever itis they're going through, then I
(39:24):
know for a fact that I'm doingwhat God has called me to do,
right? So my encouragement toyou is that embrace the journey,
embrace what's happening to you,embrace the the in season, the
in betweens, embrace that seekout God. Get on your knees and
pray and be humble, bevulnerable. Seek community, seek
people. Don't do this byyourself. It's not going to
(39:46):
happen by yourself. Bevulnerable with people about
what you're going through, andbe honest and open, and God will
work through your lifemiraculously.
Joshua Johnson (39:54):
Jackson, a couple of questions I have for
you. One, if you go back to your21 year old self, what advice
would
Jackson TerKeurst (39:59):
you give? I.
Ah, my two more year. Whatadvice I would tell myself, Oh,
man, oh, wow. I don't even know.
I would just say, keep pushing,man, you know, keep pushing.
Keep pushing. Don't stop thereare a lot of people, you know,
counting on you, so just keepbeing a, you know, the person
you've been alone and, yeah, I'dbe nice to people. Little nicer.
(40:24):
21 year, I was into, I was intonice. You know, I was, I was
into nice. I was too focused onmyself and I didn't care. But
now guys changed my life, so I'mgood. So
Joshua Johnson (40:34):
how can people go get the only way forward is
back, and is there anywhere elseyou'd like to point people to?
Jackson TerKeurst (40:39):
Yes, so it's on Amazon, just tap in Jackson
turkhurst, or the only way offour is back on Amazon, books, a
million Barnes and Nobles. Youcan even find me on social
media, on Instagram at JacksonTurks. You find me on there. I
would love to connect with youon there. Well,
Joshua Johnson (40:57):
Jackson, thank you for your story. Thank you
for sharing your story. Thankyou for helping us know that,
hey, we all have stories, and wedon't just have to carry them.
That's right. We get to sharethem, to let people know that
God is is with us. He is for us.
We could be rooted, find ouridentity in Christ, and we could
heal from our our trauma and ourpain, and we could move forward
(41:17):
in Christ with community and inrelationships and so Jackson was
great. It's fantasticconversation. Really enjoyed it.
So thank you so much. Thank
Jackson TerKeurst (41:30):
you, Josh.
Good to meet you, man. Thank youfor your time. Sir. Appreciate
you. You
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