April 17, 2025 • 41 mins
Victor is a retired American music industry executive who has contributed to the sale of over 30 Million Albums, 9 Billion Streams, with 6 Grammy nominations and 2 wins. Victor has 33 years sober and is a staple in Los Angeles Recovery. Victor is very special to me, he’s one of the few people who kept me close when I couldn’t get 10 days sober. He never judged me, never made me feel less than, he just wanted to see me “get it.” Victor’s story is inspiring as we discuss the true “gift” of Sobriety and what that actually means, including how he prevailed from his life-altering stroke at age 44. To find out more about Victor, go to www.victormurgatroyd.com
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Host: Seb Webber
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David,Hi and welcome to sicker than
(01:09):
others. The podcast brought toyou from within a treatment
center in Los Angeles.
Very excited about my guest ontoday. Big part of my sobriety
and myand my general life. Overall
Victor, welcome to the show.
Thank you, Seb, happy to behere.
I'm really surprised you'redoing this. Me too. I
(01:33):
mean, you got a prettyphenomenal story. We were just
talking about how you were bornin Brooklyn. You couldn't be
anymore New Yorkif all, there's a picture I wish
I could maybe we'll find it forthe Instagram, but there's a
picture Victor sent me once ofthe lobby in your apartment
where you were growing up. Itwas just like every it was it
couldn't summed up that burgundydoor. It just couldn't be any
(01:56):
more like working class newBrooklyn, right? Just couldn't
be but, um, yeah, you have 33years sober, almost 34 which is
crazy. And yeah, tell us how yougot sober.
Well, tell us you know what.
Tell us whatever you want youwant to start a little early.
(02:16):
You can start earlier. No, Ithink that's actually a good
place to start, becauseit's kind of a miracle, you
know, and actually kind of hasvery little to do with the
circumstance and me,let me say this,
(02:38):
Forgive me, there was a womannamed Liz lapresti,
who is a therapist. She'samazing. She I was about seven
years sober,and I said to her, I said, Why
do I have to be the one to breakthe chains? Why did my father
get sober? Like, why do I haveto do this? And she said to me,
(02:59):
she goes,Oh, you're so sad. I feel so
sorry for you. And she was kindof mocking me, and I laughed,
and she did it in a reallyloving way. She was amazing
woman, amazing therapist. She'snow moved on old age, and I
(03:20):
kind of looked at her funny,like,
What do you mean? She goes, letme ask you something. I go, what
she goes,Why didn't you get sober a week
before you did?
And I go, I don't know. Shegoes, No, think about it. Why
didn't you get sober a weekbefore you did?
(03:40):
And I thought about it, and Iwas like, I don't know.
I guess I wasn't ready. Shegoes, Okay, so what did you do
between the day you got soberand a week before you got sober
to get ready? She pointed at me.
She goes, What did you do to getready?
And I go,I don't know. She goes, No,
(04:02):
think about it. What did you do?
And I go, nothing.
And she goes,Okay, so you did nothing. I go,
yeah. She goes, fair to say youwere given a gift.
And I go, yeah.
(04:26):
She goes, Well, your father wasnever given that gift. Stop
taking credit for it.
And that was the first momentthat I was like, wow, something
higher really happened to me theday that I got sober. Because
so the night before I got sober,somebody hit me on the head with
a hammer in an after hours bar,which is pretty brutal, but it
(04:48):
wasn't the first time somethingthat extreme had happened to me.
I'd been beaten up before by abiker gang, like a real one,
pretty badly. I had beenstabbed. I had been a.
Um,I've been hospitalized countless
times in New York, just growingup like, you know, like when you
grow up the way that I grew up,like I didn't come from a bad
(05:09):
family at all, like my motherwas a good woman, my father was
a good guy, but I grew up like astreet kid, like a real street
kid, and my dad drove a cementtruck. And I don't want to say
we had no money, but we had nomoney like there was food on the
table, but we were lower income,working class. My dad was a blue
(05:30):
collar guy who got up everymorning and went to work. We
weren't poor than anybody elsein our neighborhood. We
certainly weren't richer. Mydad, he did what he could.
You know, there's two stories Ican tell. I could tell the story
of how he was a raging tough guywho was really brutal in the
house, and I could tell thestory about how he was a hard
(05:51):
working guy who did what hecould. And it really the story
would vary depending upon howlong I'm sober. If I was a year
sober, I'd tell you how awful hewas, and how abusive he was. If
I'm who I am today, I'll tellyou how hard working he was,
because when I really look atit, he was 28 when he had me,
(06:12):
and I'm the youngest of five.
I mean me at 28 when I wasdrinking, forget it. I couldn't
have taken care of a dog.
This guy had five kids and wasdrinking and using and got up at
five in the morning every dayand drove a cement truck. It's
pretty crazy. So back to yourquestion of the day that I got
(06:33):
sober, I had a really bad night,and I was hit on the head with a
hammer and a bar fight. And themiracle of that story, there's
two miracles in that story. Oneis
it was, first of all, was at aclub in New York, a famous rock
club called La Moors,that every notable rock band
played at. I guess this was like1990 and 90, no 91 it was 1991
(06:59):
and the miracle of that story isthat the ambulance took me to
the hospital, and he took me tothe hospital that my mother
worked at.
She wasn't there at the time. Itwas just a coincidence.
So they took me to thathospital,
and I had since left queens,where I was living.
I'm now living in Manhattan,bouncing around from place to
(07:22):
place, and now I'm in thehospital. My mother works at
recovering from being hit on thehead with a hammer,
and I was pretty homeless at thetime, just like couch surfing.
And so I get released from thehospital. It's now six, seven in
the morning.
(07:43):
I got nowhere to go. I havenothing in my pocket, not a
quarter, no money, no job. I'mkind of detoxing. I want to
drink. I need food. I gotnowhere to go, and I'm eight
blocks from my parents house,because they took me to that
hospital.
So I walked to my parents house,and I rang the doorbell. My
(08:06):
father answers the door, takesone look at me. I got blood in
my hair,and he looks at me, and he goes,
hadn't seen him for years. Hegoes, Why don't you go to bed?
First thing he said to me, Ijust walked past them and I went
to bed. I stayed in that bed forpretty for the most part of a
month.
(08:26):
By the way, I took anantihistamine this morning.
That's why I'm like so.
Anyhow, we could UA you, if youwant.
You might need a de Esser,though, anyhow, though, so.
So when I woke up that day, Iwas like, I have to stop
(08:49):
drinking. I have to stopdrinking because it was a bad
night, and it was obvious to me,like I was 23 my life was going
nowhere. And I was like,What am I going to do? I mean,
my heart was broken in half. Ihad nowhere to go.
I couldn't be a part of anythingthat was around me, my friends,
(09:12):
my family.
I had nothing, nowhere to go. Iwas what am I going to do?
But I did have theself awareness
or self reflection to thinkI need to do something here,
even at 23 and completelyuneducated, I dropped out in the
(09:32):
sixth grade. Like no educationwhatsoever. I didn't complete
what? No, I completed the sixthgrade. I did, like three months
of the seventh grade, that's thehighest I ever went in school. I
was like, I can't keep knockingaround.
Gotta do something. So I calleda friend of mine who's actually
(09:53):
doing well these days.
Jesse Malin is an artist in NewYork.
Yeah, the Springsteen guy,right? Yeah,
we're still friends. Amazingguy. Love him
anyway. So I called Jesse. Hewas doing, like a man with a van
type thing,and I asked him he was living in
(10:15):
Brooklyn, and I asked him if Icould help him in the van, like,
move stuff around, furniture,things like that. Bands make
some money. And I did. He helpedme.
And I made a little bit ofmoney, like a little bit of
money, like $100 maybe $125or something like that. Do you
know Jesse? You know that is andI bought a one way ticket to LA.
(10:39):
It was LA or Florida, and I hadbeen in bands. I had had a
record deal or two. Actually hadhad two record deals at that
point. I was in a band calledThe Four Horsemen that was on
Def Jam. Oh, Deaf American atthat time, and
oh, it was band called SoulKitchen that was on giant Irving
(11:03):
Seb. Oh, wow. I had messed bothof those up with my drinking.
So I decided on La becauseI just wanted to make music. So
I bought a one way ticket to LAwith the money.
I think it was $80 or somethinglike that. I think I use this
place called supersonic travel.
It's amazing. I remember that Icame out here,
(11:25):
I cut off the plane,and I had nowhere to go. I
didn't know anybody. I had $30and a base, and I had a laundry
bag for all my clothes.
Literally, I traveled with alaundry bag. That's how I
transported my clothes.
And nothing like nothing. I tooka bus to downtown LA
(11:50):
and I went to a pay phone. And Idon't even know where I got this
idea, but I asked him wherethere was an AA meeting. I have
no idea where I got that idea.
I just did. Oh, but you knowwhat I did? Forget one thing,
very important thing, about amonth before I got sober for no
good reason that I could thinkof,
(12:11):
I went to St Patrick's Cathedralon Fifth Avenue, and I got on my
knees and I begged God to helpme get sober. About a month
before I got sober,I mean, I was baptized and
confirmed, but that didn't meananything to me. Didn't mean
anything to my parents either. Ithink they just did it because
you were supposed to, like,Italian Catholic. My mother's
Italian, my dad's English. Theywere like, yeah, have him do
(12:33):
that thing, you know? So I wentto St Patrick's Cathedral. For
me, I probably thought it was acinematic moment. I don't know
what I thought it was, but I didit. Yeah, and it worked.
It's still working, which iscrazy. I have not had a desire
on any level to drink or dodrugs for almost 34 years. It'll
(12:59):
be 34 next month. It wascompletely removed from me. You
really had a white light moment,like they talk about in the
book. Well, maybe it didn't feellike that at the time. Yeah, I
wouldn't say that, because itdoesn't feel like that to me.
No, the way that I wouldcharacterize it is it was
removed. The desire wascompletely removed, whereas
(13:21):
before it was a compulsion,like, I could not not drink for
three days. Like, if I wentthree days, I would boast about
a week. I'd be like, I haven'tdrank in like 10 days, and it
would be like two and a half.
Yeah, I did that for a while.
Yeah, I was drinking every dayby one in the afternoon, or I
(13:42):
would shake anybody who knows mefrom back then would be like, I
remember, JB, from Bucha. Youknow him, one of the man in
Bucha? Yeah, yeah. So. JB, Iknow him since I'm 14.
JB, gave me my first cake, myfirst AA meeting. And I remember
we were walking up to themeeting, and he goes, he calls
(14:02):
me, VM. He goes, VM, they'regiving you a cake. I said, Yeah.
He goes, they should give you aCadillac.
So when you landed in LA though,I mean, it's a pretty bold thing
to do in your first year ofgetting sober. What do you mean
move? Yeah, well, I had nowhereto go. I mean, I couldn't stay
at my parents house, right? Youwent to the log cabin, right? A
(14:23):
lot that I did, but that waslike, later, you know, my first
meeting, something really kindof special happened for me. Um,
well, first of all, I hated it.
I really hated it, like,because I was just so New York.
I was like, right off the boat,you're still pretty new york,
buddy. You think, oh yeah, 100%okay. So I was very New York,
(14:46):
then internally, as well asexternally. And I was just like,
What is this? This is just notlike, you know, I hated it. I
hated El.
I hated the people, was it? Getme out of here? So halfway
through the meeting, I got upand I walked out
(15:06):
and, oh, you know what? I can'tsay this, because I can't it's
an anonymous program. I was justgoing to name two people, one of
which is a rock star, but twopeople walked out of the
meeting. And I'll tell you aftertwo people walked out of the
meeting and said to me, whereare you going?
And I was like, I'm leaving. Andthey were like, why? And I was
(15:28):
like, What do you care? And theywere like, Well, come back in.
And I was like, No, this placeis stupid. And they were like,
come back. He wasn't a rock starat the time, by the way, come
back in. And I was like, No. Andthey talked me back into the
meeting, and had they not donethat,
I probably would be somewherepretty pathetic. Right now, I
don't want to say I'd be dead,because that's a little
(15:49):
glamorous. I probably would justbe pathetic. Probably just be
living on somebody's couch,like, 80 pounds heavier,
you know, I don't think I'd bedead. I think or in jail,
probably not. I think I'd justbe losing in a big way. How
much, obviously, we don't wantto touch too much on career
stuff. But do you you had a veryprolific career in the music
(16:12):
industry. How do you think that?
How do you think sobriety affectthat? Oh, my God. Well, because
you really went from them, youknow, you went from the
mailroom, you were a mailroomintern to probably one of the
biggest ANR guys in the world,yeah. And
how did sobriety play a role inthat? Because you're in an
(16:33):
industry where it's not, youknow, it's a lot easier to not
be the sober guy in thatindustry, speaking from
experience, you know, what'sinteresting?
I didn't realize this until afriend said this to me recently.
She said, you know, a lot ofpeople are afraid to get sober
because they think they're goingto lose their creativity, but
(16:55):
all of your creativity happenedin sobriety.
And I was like, That's reallytrue, actually. I mean, I was in
bands and I made music, but Imean, just to be real, like I
was kind of terrible as amusician. I mean, it would for
me, it was more like I wanted tobe in a band, so I kind of self
(17:15):
willed it, like I was clever asa person, so I figured out how
to be in a band and how to play,but it wasn't my gifting. I'm
not a gifted musician, so Iwasn't particularly creative. I
don't think on an instrument.
But then the way that I kind ofworked my way up in the industry
(17:35):
was eventually from gettingsober. So when I first went to
AA, I didn't have a place tolive, so I literally slept in a
park at night and went to AAmeetings in the morning for a
while, until I eventually got ajob and then got a place to live
and a car and then from the mailroom. Well, actually, I guess I
(17:55):
just started talking about bandsand telling everybody about
bands. And then eventuallyI started liking bands that
started getting signed to otherlabels. This back in the day
when you have to go see thebands there wasn't like, MySpace
or like, this was like, youfound out about shit by hanging
out at the mint or fuckingYeah, Sunset Boulevard, 1993
(18:19):
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. So how didsobriety play a role? I mean, I
was, I was all in with bothfeet,
but also I was inspired to I wasterrified of ending up back in
Queens or Brooklyn.
You know, Queens and Brooklynweren't then what they are now,
(18:43):
Queens and Brooklyn, for me, itwas like being sent to the
Eastern European block. Like itwasn't like, no offense to the
Eastern European block the wall,or my perception of what that
might have been like. I'mtalking bread lines and soup
kitchens, and it was rough.
Yeah, it was like, I just didn'twant to go back there. So I
worked like I was terrified ofbeing having to go back there
(19:04):
and be like, I don'twant to become my father,
because he just looked somiserable. And I just, I would
do anything to avoid that. So Iwould drive around listening to
Anthony Robbins. And also,fortunately for me,
(19:25):
I was very sensitive, and I fellinto a community of people in AA
that were young,and they became my family,
and we attended weddings andfunerals, and we had Christmases
and we had birthdays, and we allloved each other, and we were
(19:47):
all orphans, so to speak. Imean, I had a living family, but
they weren't really in my life,but these people in AA that were
my age, we became a community,and I became a part.
Of that fabric. So it's almostnot even fair to say how much
did sobriety play a role. I wassobriety through and through.
(20:11):
Yeah. I mean, I lived this. Ilived in the steps and worked
the steps, and so did myfriends, and that's all we did
was go to meetings. Went frommeetings to coffee to lunch to
dinner, to meetings, to coffee,to lunch to dinner. We worked on
the steps at home. I went towork. I worked my way up in the
record company. And theneventually I left that company.
(20:32):
I went to another company. Iwent to wind up, because it was
a better opportunity for me,because I did so well at that
company had hit, a hit, a hit.
And then when I went to wind up,there was an amazing opportunity
for me there, because wind upwas wasn't really a label. It
was they had creed,finger 11 and 30 bands nobody
(20:54):
ever heard of. And at that time,finger 11 wasn't successful.
They had, well, they had, Ithink they had one record that
had sold 100,000 copies, and thesecond one sold like 90,000 and
that was it. It was veryfragmented. They had R B albums,
they had comedy albums. They hadno other rock bands. Yeah, it
(21:15):
was run by an entrepreneur,right? It was a very successful
independent, probably one of thebiggest Indie labels of the 90s,
for sure. Well, yeah, for sure.
So. Alan Meltzer, yeah.
He had a thing called CD onestop. And
(21:36):
he was an entrepreneur. He was amarketing guy. He was very, very
brilliant man. He was amarketing guy, and I believe it
was Bill mcgathy had who was aradio guy, had discovered creed,
and creed had a finished album,and McAfee brought this finished
album with this band, creed, whowas a Christian band, to Alan
Meltzer, who was a brilliantmarketing guy with a lot of
(21:57):
money, and Alan just marketedthe hell out of it, and Bill
promoted the hell out of it onthe radio. I believe that's the
story. Pretty accurate. That'sthe story. And it blew up. So
now they have all the money fromCreed,
Creed success and the money theyhad before creed, and they've
never made a record, because thealbum was made when they got it
(22:19):
right. So what a goodopportunity. So here I come. I
have a lifetime of being inbands, making records. At this
point, I had been in maybe 1015,bands, two that were signed,
been at Sony for four years,made three or four albums for
Sony. I'm 30, and I've beenplaying in band since I'm 14, so
(22:44):
I've got a lot of experience.
And I know everybody in LAbecause everybody in my AA
community is either a musicianor in a band or whatever. So now
I'm kind of networked into LosAngeles. I'm think I'm getting
the years right. So we go intoit becomes kind of a think tank
the signing process. It's AlanMeltzer, his wife, Diana
Meltzer, and the President,Steve Lerner and I. That's it.
(23:07):
And there was a CFO named EdVetri who just did the money.
And that was it. And there wesigned as a team, Drowning Pool,
Evanescence, finger 11.
See there?
That's it, basically the soundof 96 to 2004 Exactly. It's
(23:28):
crazy. Yeah. You know, one ofthe things I really admire about
you is you have a really greatconnection with God, and you've
also studied a lot of differentreligions, which I was pretty,
pretty impressed with. You wantto talk about that? Sure, so
things that I've read is I'veread a lot of the Torah. I've
(23:51):
read The Tibetan Book of theDead. I've read a lot of the
Quran. I've read the Biblemultiple times, Old Testament
and New Testament, a lot of newage books, Buddhism.
Um, yeah, I practiced Nisha inBuddhism for a while. I like, a
long while, I'm gonna say 16years. They call it SGI. You
(24:15):
see, what else I read up? Well,I guess the Tibetan Book of the
Dead is Tibetan Buddhism. Isthat just out of curiosity, or
was that out of like a soberthing, or was it just, you know?
Was it you didn't have a god?
Were you not sure on your God?
Were you exploring everything?
I'm interested to know. Not manypeople do that. Really.
I don't know many people thathave decided to dedicate reading
(24:38):
certain points of their life tosix religions. I think that's
interesting. Well, I mean, thismorning I read the Bible. I read
Bible in 365, days. And there'sthis other book I have. I think
it's called, maybe it's calledJesus speaks. Was reading that
this morning. Why? I guess.
(25:00):
I started out in the 90s. I usedto go to this place called the
body tree on Melrose. And I wasthat was by the LA Pat as an old
bookstore by the lepan, exactly,of cafe I remember, yeah. So I
started reading things likeMarianne Williamson and Deepak
the fourth seven spiritual lawsof success and the Four
(25:24):
Agreements. Andthen there were chant books of
channeled writing, likeConversations with God, books
one and two. I read those, and Ijust started eating books, like
I said, because I was souneducated, I just, you know,
I've always, or I guess later inlife, I started to feel like I'm
kind of a nerdy, quiet guy who'slike an academic who never went
(25:47):
to school, right? AndI'm just interested, I'm
interested in what we are.
BecauseI don't think, obviously, I'm
not this body. I don't think I'mthis mind. And if you think
about just,let's say what we suffer from,
an addiction. Big Book would sayit's an allergy of the body and
(26:10):
an obsession of the mind. Myopinion,
I believe that's one thing. Youknow, it's like, if I ingest
alcoholI have it starts a compulsion of
my obsessive mind because of theallergy of the body. It's kind
of like one thing, right? Andthat's all mind stuff, mind and
(26:30):
body stuff. But who am I reallylike? What's going on underneath
that? What? What's going onunderneath all that mind stuff?
Even if you look at traumatherapy, that's all me centered
stuff, which is all mind stuff.
And if we really have aspiritual solution, then what
(26:51):
does that really mean? Like, ifthe big book was released or
written in 1938 39what has come along since then
that is trumped, forgive theword that is trumped or made
that much of a cultural impact.
Nothing called AA, the fourthmost important thing of the 20th
(27:13):
century, sure. So what has comealong since then?
Nothing. Nothing has come alongthat I'm aware of that's made,
as you put it, so Well, suchcultural impact. No, I mean,
after, Oh, yeah. But I meanwhat? I mean, what's the top
what's, yeah, right. So itreally is a God based solution.
So if we're dealing, if my wholelife is about a God based
(27:36):
solution, then what's reallygoing on here? That is
fascinating to me. Yeah, that iswhat my whole life must be
dedicated to. Forget about thefirst what let's call it, 44
years of my life.
And let's talk about the next 44years of my life, about giving
(27:57):
and serving.
And the reason why I put it thatway, with 44 years is because
that's when I had the stroke,which we should probably talk
about, yeah, that's, that was,right, yeah. Okay, so you have
this big career. Things aregoing well. You're doing, you
know, you're not just made animpact in the music business,
you did other stuff, and,I mean, you're ahead of the game
(28:17):
on blogs and all that kind ofstuff, right? Really, probably
one of the top culturalengineers probably ever. And
you're living this big life.
You're living in Woodland Hills,1000 Oaks. Yeah, 1000 Oaks. It's
all the same shit to me, of thatfar up, but you're in 1000 Oaks.
So you want to tell the storyof, sure, it's great story. It's
(28:42):
crazy. It's beyond crazy. So,yeah, so I was living in this
big house, millions of dollarsin the bank, right from like,
where I came from, to like,millions of dollars in the bank
in this beautiful house that Icompletely designed like every
(29:02):
bolt, every screw. It was like adream place. It was like a
fantasyI still can't believe it. So one
day I wake up normal dayworkout. Ride my motorcycle from
1000 Oaks to West Hollywood. Iwork out with a friend. It's
about a 35 mile rideworkout with a friend. Ride my
(29:26):
motorcycle home. So it's 70miles round trip on a
motorcycle. Normal day workedout. I go to bed. I was married
at the time, and about fiveo'clock in the morning, my ex
wife says to me, wake up. I'mdreaming, right? I'm dead
asleep. It's five o'clock in themorning. She nudges me, wake up.
Groggy. I'm like what she said,wake up. At the moment, I was
(29:49):
having a dream that I had fallendown in Grand Central Station,
and I was trying to grab peopleby the leg to tell them that I
couldn't speak. And I.
Couldn't move, but I wasparalyzed, and I couldn't move,
and I couldn't speak, and peoplewere walking all around me in
Grand Central Station, and I wastrying to reach them, and I hear
my ex wife in the back, way inthe background, going, wake up,
(30:11):
wake up, Victor, wake up, wakeup. And finally I say, what? She
goes, wake up. And she's gettinglouder and louder and louder.
I'm like when I kind of comeback into the moment, out of the
dream, and I'm like, what? Shegoes, you're talking in your
sleep. And I said, okay, so Andshe goes, something's wrong. And
(30:33):
I go, I'm fine. She goes, you'rehaving a stroke. What are you
talking about? She goes, you'rehaving a stroke. Something's
wrong. I said, No, I'm fine. Shegoes, something's wrong. Stand
up. So I got out of bed, and myknees buckled and I hit the
ground. She called 911 ambulancecame. They said he's having a
stroke. They took me the ER, andthey gave me this clot buster
(30:54):
drug, and it didn't take. Andthey made an incision in my
lower abdomen, and then went upmy artery to my brain, and they
pulled the clot out, saved mylife. I was in ICU for a month,
but the surgeon was a miracle,wasn't it? And it wasn't there a
story about the availability ofthe surgeon there is, yeah. So
the crazy thing about that storyis, well, there's many crazy
(31:17):
things about it. The first thingis that she knew I was having a
stroke. I mean, there's noreason in the world she should
have known I was having astroke. First of all, second of
all, there's no reason in theworld she should have woken me
up. If the situation werereversed and she would talk me
in her sleep, I would haverolled right over and went to
sleep. I would have been like,Ah, she's talking in her sleep,
whatever. Who cares, right? Sothe hospital, los Robles
(31:39):
Hospital, in 1000 Oaks. It was512 in the morning. There was no
traffic, and the hospital wasthree miles from me, so it was
just down Jan's Road, absolutelyno traffic. They got there
quickly took me right in, andthe hospital had just instituted
a Stroke Program three monthsbefore I got there, and because
(32:00):
they had done that, there was asurgeon in the hospital waiting
for my arrival. Had he not beenthere, they would have had to
airlift me to UCLA or something,and they said I would have died
totally crazy. I mean, I camewithin like, a minute or two of
dying completely saved my life.
And they just, like, he justwent up through, just, yeah,
basically, like, went in my Whatis it, carotid artery, whatever
(32:27):
it's called, right up in theartery, into the brain, and pull
the clot right out. I mean,yeah. I mean, it was a major
stroke. Like, I was messed upfor a while, for, like, yeah,
five years, I just shut my wholecareer down when that happened,
when I got home from thehospital, like, if you would
have said to me, What color isyour car, it would have taken
(32:48):
me, like, three minutes toanswer you. I'd have been like,
uh, like, my face was like this,hmm. I was messed up for a
while. I just told my ex wifesaid, call these four people,
tell them what happened and notto call me.
How did did aa show up for you?
(33:10):
Yeah, yeah. A has always shownup for me.
A has always shown up for me. Ais always there. A is always
there. Yeah, that's amazing.
Did, since we've talked a lotabout God today, after the after
the stroke, did it change yourviews on God?
It's interesting. You know, Iwent through a lot of different
(33:33):
phases of it. You know, when yousee movies where somebody gets
into like, kind of like a planecrash, or, you know, an
experience where they almostdie, they kind of have this
white light experience wherethey they love life again. It
didn't do that to me. It kindof, it kind of did the opposite,
(33:53):
because what definitely made mesofter. I mean, see how big my
ego is now. I mean, before that,I was insufferable. It took a
lot of the edge off of me, whichis a good thing. Mortality will
do that, yeah, for sure. Butwhat it did was it, there was a
(34:15):
period there for about, think itwas about two or three weeks
where it looked like I mightdie, like I might have another
stroke, or it was pretty like, Iwas pretty cognizant of the
fact, like I might not walk. Wedidn't know what was going to
happen. And I felt like I faceddeath, like, pretty squarely in
(34:36):
the eye, like, what we're allgoing to go through, if we're
lucky enough at the end of ourlife, to actually be looking at
death rather than just go in ahospital bed. I kind of got so
okay with dyingthat it made the discomfort of
life, it gave me like a littlebit of suicidal ideation, like
feelings of like, I don't wantto be here. I.
(35:00):
I'm good with dying. Like I justfelt so okay with leaving here
and so so, like, I know that Godis good, and I have a God in my
life and looking forward to theafterlife. That I was ready to
go. I was like, where's therocket ship? I'm ready to go.
Get me out of here. I don't wantto deal with the traffic and the
people and this and the that Iwant to go. So how does one get
(35:24):
over that? And the way that Idid for me, life had to take a
natural shift. Actually, I'llsay that sino helped me a lot
with that because and he did itknowingly and intuitively. I
would say, the way he did it wasafter about
(35:45):
five or six years, when I got myfaculty back, I went to the back
to the music business for oneyear. And it was, I hate I was
like, it was like drinking aglass of vomit. I was like, get
me out of here. I can't do this.
I hate this. It had changed sodramatically. I went from kind
of the top of the game workingfor Clive Davis and having, you
know, this wouldn't be a goodpodcast for me if I didn't say
(36:07):
what I have to say about Clive,which is, having worked for that
guy as long as I did, he wasjust unbelievably elegant and
incredibly good to me. Yeah, itwas a great time working for
him, being around him, and whata mentoring him, yeah, I mean,
like observing that man work,and the way he treated me, it
(36:27):
serious amounts of compassion,right? I'm sorry, Pat
compassion. He was verycompassionate to me and
everybody. He's just a mensch,yeah, it's a beautiful man. So
anyway, so having worked forhim, and then going back and
seeing how the industry hadchanged in those six years,
actually, at that point, it hadbeen like eight or nine years,
(36:50):
because I had kind of moved out.
I moved out into 1000 Oaks, andI had had, at that point my own
label, my own publishingcompany. I'm just kind of being
more entrepreneurial. My ownlabel through Sony that he gave
me,I was just like, I don't want to
do this. So I did it for a year,and then COVID hit, and then
(37:11):
when COVID hit, I was just like,really,
are you kidding me now, like,fucking kidding me. Like, this
is gonna take me out now.
Like, could you imagine goingthrough that, yeah, and then a
divorce, yeah? And then COVIDhits, yeah? It was just like,
(37:33):
not to mention writing thedivorce check, yeah, which was
painful, yeah,as painful as the stroke or
different? Yeah, different kindof scary.
Um, stings differently. I harborno resentment toward my ex. We
(37:58):
parted as friends.
You know, here's how I thinkabout that. And since you
mentioned it, I thought I havetwo choices here. I can make
sure she's set up, yeah, or Ican get the phone calls where
her life's falling apart and bein that position. It's the
better position to be in. Well,yeah, 100%
(38:18):
Yeah. Hey, we'll be right back.
But before we do please considerhelping us grow this podcast.
You could do that a number ofdifferent ways. You can hit
follow on Spotify. You can rateus, review us. But what would be
really awesome would be if youcould share this with one other
addict or alcoholic that youthink could get something out
this podcast. If everyone didthat, we would grow this thing
tremendously. But as always,thank you for listening, and
(38:39):
thank you for your support. Sowe we ask every guest this as we
come to an end,and I feel like we could be
talking for hours, dude, I loveyou so much. You've made such a
fucking big difference in mylife. Dude, you're one of my
best friends, and you've seen myjourney up and down. And just
just, I relate to you on so manylevels. And I want to tell one
story before I get into thefinal question. But I think it's
(39:03):
amazing how, when I was a kid inmy bedroom, I distinctively
remember listening to science byIncubus and on my CD and and
being like and see the andprobably Evanescence and being
like, I want to work in themusic business. Now, I wasn't
(39:23):
living in London, but I lived ina little village outside of
London. So imagine this kid in avillage of 60 people listening
to the CD, looking at the jewelcase,
reading all the line of notes,and being like, this is what I
want to do. And then now one ofmy best friends is the guy
responsible for that. That'spretty fucking amazing, isn't
(39:47):
that? Like, I get it, I mean, Imean, what? Well, I get that.
I'm nobody from nowhere, yeah,and Ian Asprey is my friend.
Yeah, you know? Like, I.
I'm nobody from nowhere, likeliterally, I'm as uneducated as
it gets, and I'm not a fancyperson, and I don't want to be.
(40:11):
I'm I mean, you know, I oncesaid to Clive, he said to me, he
kind of was taking the piss outof me. He goes, Oh, so I see
you're an expert. And I said,Well, I mean, I did wait online
for Aussie tickets all night inthe snow. And
he looked at me like my it's agood point.
(40:34):
So, so our final question, ifyou could say one thing to
little Victor today, that kidhim, that kid in Brooklyn,
behind the burgundy door withthe dad that drives a cement
truck. What would you say tohim?
Pay the IRSthanks for coming in.
(41:01):
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on the ups and downs of recoverybrought to you from within a
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(00:44):
you're lucky, triggering youhave been warned.
David,Hi and welcome to sicker than
(01:09):
others. The podcast brought toyou from within a treatment
center in Los Angeles.
Very excited about my guest ontoday. Big part of my sobriety
and myand my general life. Overall
Victor, welcome to the show.
Thank you, Seb, happy to behere.
I'm really surprised you'redoing this. Me too. I
(01:33):
mean, you got a prettyphenomenal story. We were just
talking about how you were bornin Brooklyn. You couldn't be
anymore New Yorkif all, there's a picture I wish
I could maybe we'll find it forthe Instagram, but there's a
picture Victor sent me once ofthe lobby in your apartment
where you were growing up. Itwas just like every it was it
couldn't summed up that burgundydoor. It just couldn't be any
(01:56):
more like working class newBrooklyn, right? Just couldn't
be but, um, yeah, you have 33years sober, almost 34 which is
crazy. And yeah, tell us how yougot sober.
Well, tell us you know what.
Tell us whatever you want youwant to start a little early.
(02:16):
You can start earlier. No, Ithink that's actually a good
place to start, becauseit's kind of a miracle, you
know, and actually kind of hasvery little to do with the
circumstance and me,let me say this,
(02:38):
Forgive me, there was a womannamed Liz lapresti,
who is a therapist. She'samazing. She I was about seven
years sober,and I said to her, I said, Why
do I have to be the one to breakthe chains? Why did my father
get sober? Like, why do I haveto do this? And she said to me,
(02:59):
she goes,Oh, you're so sad. I feel so
sorry for you. And she was kindof mocking me, and I laughed,
and she did it in a reallyloving way. She was amazing
woman, amazing therapist. She'snow moved on old age, and I
(03:20):
kind of looked at her funny,like,
What do you mean? She goes, letme ask you something. I go, what
she goes,Why didn't you get sober a week
before you did?
And I go, I don't know. Shegoes, No, think about it. Why
didn't you get sober a weekbefore you did?
(03:40):
And I thought about it, and Iwas like, I don't know.
I guess I wasn't ready. Shegoes, Okay, so what did you do
between the day you got soberand a week before you got sober
to get ready? She pointed at me.
She goes, What did you do to getready?
And I go,I don't know. She goes, No,
(04:02):
think about it. What did you do?
And I go, nothing.
And she goes,Okay, so you did nothing. I go,
yeah. She goes, fair to say youwere given a gift.
And I go, yeah.
(04:26):
She goes, Well, your father wasnever given that gift. Stop
taking credit for it.
And that was the first momentthat I was like, wow, something
higher really happened to me theday that I got sober. Because
so the night before I got sober,somebody hit me on the head with
a hammer in an after hours bar,which is pretty brutal, but it
(04:48):
wasn't the first time somethingthat extreme had happened to me.
I'd been beaten up before by abiker gang, like a real one,
pretty badly. I had beenstabbed. I had been a.
Um,I've been hospitalized countless
times in New York, just growingup like, you know, like when you
grow up the way that I grew up,like I didn't come from a bad
(05:09):
family at all, like my motherwas a good woman, my father was
a good guy, but I grew up like astreet kid, like a real street
kid, and my dad drove a cementtruck. And I don't want to say
we had no money, but we had nomoney like there was food on the
table, but we were lower income,working class. My dad was a blue
(05:30):
collar guy who got up everymorning and went to work. We
weren't poor than anybody elsein our neighborhood. We
certainly weren't richer. Mydad, he did what he could.
You know, there's two stories Ican tell. I could tell the story
of how he was a raging tough guywho was really brutal in the
house, and I could tell thestory about how he was a hard
(05:51):
working guy who did what hecould. And it really the story
would vary depending upon howlong I'm sober. If I was a year
sober, I'd tell you how awful hewas, and how abusive he was. If
I'm who I am today, I'll tellyou how hard working he was,
because when I really look atit, he was 28 when he had me,
(06:12):
and I'm the youngest of five.
I mean me at 28 when I wasdrinking, forget it. I couldn't
have taken care of a dog.
This guy had five kids and wasdrinking and using and got up at
five in the morning every dayand drove a cement truck. It's
pretty crazy. So back to yourquestion of the day that I got
(06:33):
sober, I had a really bad night,and I was hit on the head with a
hammer and a bar fight. And themiracle of that story, there's
two miracles in that story. Oneis
it was, first of all, was at aclub in New York, a famous rock
club called La Moors,that every notable rock band
played at. I guess this was like1990 and 90, no 91 it was 1991
(06:59):
and the miracle of that story isthat the ambulance took me to
the hospital, and he took me tothe hospital that my mother
worked at.
She wasn't there at the time. Itwas just a coincidence.
So they took me to thathospital,
and I had since left queens,where I was living.
I'm now living in Manhattan,bouncing around from place to
(07:22):
place, and now I'm in thehospital. My mother works at
recovering from being hit on thehead with a hammer,
and I was pretty homeless at thetime, just like couch surfing.
And so I get released from thehospital. It's now six, seven in
the morning.
(07:43):
I got nowhere to go. I havenothing in my pocket, not a
quarter, no money, no job. I'mkind of detoxing. I want to
drink. I need food. I gotnowhere to go, and I'm eight
blocks from my parents house,because they took me to that
hospital.
So I walked to my parents house,and I rang the doorbell. My
(08:06):
father answers the door, takesone look at me. I got blood in
my hair,and he looks at me, and he goes,
hadn't seen him for years. Hegoes, Why don't you go to bed?
First thing he said to me, Ijust walked past them and I went
to bed. I stayed in that bed forpretty for the most part of a
month.
(08:26):
By the way, I took anantihistamine this morning.
That's why I'm like so.
Anyhow, we could UA you, if youwant.
You might need a de Esser,though, anyhow, though, so.
So when I woke up that day, Iwas like, I have to stop
(08:49):
drinking. I have to stopdrinking because it was a bad
night, and it was obvious to me,like I was 23 my life was going
nowhere. And I was like,What am I going to do? I mean,
my heart was broken in half. Ihad nowhere to go.
I couldn't be a part of anythingthat was around me, my friends,
(09:12):
my family.
I had nothing, nowhere to go. Iwas what am I going to do?
But I did have theself awareness
or self reflection to thinkI need to do something here,
even at 23 and completelyuneducated, I dropped out in the
(09:32):
sixth grade. Like no educationwhatsoever. I didn't complete
what? No, I completed the sixthgrade. I did, like three months
of the seventh grade, that's thehighest I ever went in school. I
was like, I can't keep knockingaround.
Gotta do something. So I calleda friend of mine who's actually
(09:53):
doing well these days.
Jesse Malin is an artist in NewYork.
Yeah, the Springsteen guy,right? Yeah,
we're still friends. Amazingguy. Love him
anyway. So I called Jesse. Hewas doing, like a man with a van
type thing,and I asked him he was living in
(10:15):
Brooklyn, and I asked him if Icould help him in the van, like,
move stuff around, furniture,things like that. Bands make
some money. And I did. He helpedme.
And I made a little bit ofmoney, like a little bit of
money, like $100 maybe $125or something like that. Do you
know Jesse? You know that is andI bought a one way ticket to LA.
(10:39):
It was LA or Florida, and I hadbeen in bands. I had had a
record deal or two. Actually hadhad two record deals at that
point. I was in a band calledThe Four Horsemen that was on
Def Jam. Oh, Deaf American atthat time, and
oh, it was band called SoulKitchen that was on giant Irving
(11:03):
Seb. Oh, wow. I had messed bothof those up with my drinking.
So I decided on La becauseI just wanted to make music. So
I bought a one way ticket to LAwith the money.
I think it was $80 or somethinglike that. I think I use this
place called supersonic travel.
It's amazing. I remember that Icame out here,
(11:25):
I cut off the plane,and I had nowhere to go. I
didn't know anybody. I had $30and a base, and I had a laundry
bag for all my clothes.
Literally, I traveled with alaundry bag. That's how I
transported my clothes.
And nothing like nothing. I tooka bus to downtown LA
(11:50):
and I went to a pay phone. And Idon't even know where I got this
idea, but I asked him wherethere was an AA meeting. I have
no idea where I got that idea.
I just did. Oh, but you knowwhat I did? Forget one thing,
very important thing, about amonth before I got sober for no
good reason that I could thinkof,
(12:11):
I went to St Patrick's Cathedralon Fifth Avenue, and I got on my
knees and I begged God to helpme get sober. About a month
before I got sober,I mean, I was baptized and
confirmed, but that didn't meananything to me. Didn't mean
anything to my parents either. Ithink they just did it because
you were supposed to, like,Italian Catholic. My mother's
Italian, my dad's English. Theywere like, yeah, have him do
(12:33):
that thing, you know? So I wentto St Patrick's Cathedral. For
me, I probably thought it was acinematic moment. I don't know
what I thought it was, but I didit. Yeah, and it worked.
It's still working, which iscrazy. I have not had a desire
on any level to drink or dodrugs for almost 34 years. It'll
(12:59):
be 34 next month. It wascompletely removed from me. You
really had a white light moment,like they talk about in the
book. Well, maybe it didn't feellike that at the time. Yeah, I
wouldn't say that, because itdoesn't feel like that to me.
No, the way that I wouldcharacterize it is it was
removed. The desire wascompletely removed, whereas
(13:21):
before it was a compulsion,like, I could not not drink for
three days. Like, if I wentthree days, I would boast about
a week. I'd be like, I haven'tdrank in like 10 days, and it
would be like two and a half.
Yeah, I did that for a while.
Yeah, I was drinking every dayby one in the afternoon, or I
(13:42):
would shake anybody who knows mefrom back then would be like, I
remember, JB, from Bucha. Youknow him, one of the man in
Bucha? Yeah, yeah. So. JB, Iknow him since I'm 14.
JB, gave me my first cake, myfirst AA meeting. And I remember
we were walking up to themeeting, and he goes, he calls
(14:02):
me, VM. He goes, VM, they'regiving you a cake. I said, Yeah.
He goes, they should give you aCadillac.
So when you landed in LA though,I mean, it's a pretty bold thing
to do in your first year ofgetting sober. What do you mean
move? Yeah, well, I had nowhereto go. I mean, I couldn't stay
at my parents house, right? Youwent to the log cabin, right? A
(14:23):
lot that I did, but that waslike, later, you know, my first
meeting, something really kindof special happened for me. Um,
well, first of all, I hated it.
I really hated it, like,because I was just so New York.
I was like, right off the boat,you're still pretty new york,
buddy. You think, oh yeah, 100%okay. So I was very New York,
(14:46):
then internally, as well asexternally. And I was just like,
What is this? This is just notlike, you know, I hated it. I
hated El.
I hated the people, was it? Getme out of here? So halfway
through the meeting, I got upand I walked out
(15:06):
and, oh, you know what? I can'tsay this, because I can't it's
an anonymous program. I was justgoing to name two people, one of
which is a rock star, but twopeople walked out of the
meeting. And I'll tell you aftertwo people walked out of the
meeting and said to me, whereare you going?
And I was like, I'm leaving. Andthey were like, why? And I was
(15:28):
like, What do you care? And theywere like, Well, come back in.
And I was like, No, this placeis stupid. And they were like,
come back. He wasn't a rock starat the time, by the way, come
back in. And I was like, No. Andthey talked me back into the
meeting, and had they not donethat,
I probably would be somewherepretty pathetic. Right now, I
don't want to say I'd be dead,because that's a little
(15:49):
glamorous. I probably would justbe pathetic. Probably just be
living on somebody's couch,like, 80 pounds heavier,
you know, I don't think I'd bedead. I think or in jail,
probably not. I think I'd justbe losing in a big way. How
much, obviously, we don't wantto touch too much on career
stuff. But do you you had a veryprolific career in the music
(16:12):
industry. How do you think that?
How do you think sobriety affectthat? Oh, my God. Well, because
you really went from them, youknow, you went from the
mailroom, you were a mailroomintern to probably one of the
biggest ANR guys in the world,yeah. And
how did sobriety play a role inthat? Because you're in an
(16:33):
industry where it's not, youknow, it's a lot easier to not
be the sober guy in thatindustry, speaking from
experience, you know, what'sinteresting?
I didn't realize this until afriend said this to me recently.
She said, you know, a lot ofpeople are afraid to get sober
because they think they're goingto lose their creativity, but
(16:55):
all of your creativity happenedin sobriety.
And I was like, That's reallytrue, actually. I mean, I was in
bands and I made music, but Imean, just to be real, like I
was kind of terrible as amusician. I mean, it would for
me, it was more like I wanted tobe in a band, so I kind of self
(17:15):
willed it, like I was clever asa person, so I figured out how
to be in a band and how to play,but it wasn't my gifting. I'm
not a gifted musician, so Iwasn't particularly creative. I
don't think on an instrument.
But then the way that I kind ofworked my way up in the industry
(17:35):
was eventually from gettingsober. So when I first went to
AA, I didn't have a place tolive, so I literally slept in a
park at night and went to AAmeetings in the morning for a
while, until I eventually got ajob and then got a place to live
and a car and then from the mailroom. Well, actually, I guess I
(17:55):
just started talking about bandsand telling everybody about
bands. And then eventuallyI started liking bands that
started getting signed to otherlabels. This back in the day
when you have to go see thebands there wasn't like, MySpace
or like, this was like, youfound out about shit by hanging
out at the mint or fuckingYeah, Sunset Boulevard, 1993
(18:19):
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. So how didsobriety play a role? I mean, I
was, I was all in with bothfeet,
but also I was inspired to I wasterrified of ending up back in
Queens or Brooklyn.
You know, Queens and Brooklynweren't then what they are now,
(18:43):
Queens and Brooklyn, for me, itwas like being sent to the
Eastern European block. Like itwasn't like, no offense to the
Eastern European block the wall,or my perception of what that
might have been like. I'mtalking bread lines and soup
kitchens, and it was rough.
Yeah, it was like, I just didn'twant to go back there. So I
worked like I was terrified ofbeing having to go back there
(19:04):
and be like, I don'twant to become my father,
because he just looked somiserable. And I just, I would
do anything to avoid that. So Iwould drive around listening to
Anthony Robbins. And also,fortunately for me,
(19:25):
I was very sensitive, and I fellinto a community of people in AA
that were young,and they became my family,
and we attended weddings andfunerals, and we had Christmases
and we had birthdays, and we allloved each other, and we were
(19:47):
all orphans, so to speak. Imean, I had a living family, but
they weren't really in my life,but these people in AA that were
my age, we became a community,and I became a part.
Of that fabric. So it's almostnot even fair to say how much
did sobriety play a role. I wassobriety through and through.
(20:11):
Yeah. I mean, I lived this. Ilived in the steps and worked
the steps, and so did myfriends, and that's all we did
was go to meetings. Went frommeetings to coffee to lunch to
dinner, to meetings, to coffee,to lunch to dinner. We worked on
the steps at home. I went towork. I worked my way up in the
record company. And theneventually I left that company.
(20:32):
I went to another company. Iwent to wind up, because it was
a better opportunity for me,because I did so well at that
company had hit, a hit, a hit.
And then when I went to wind up,there was an amazing opportunity
for me there, because wind upwas wasn't really a label. It
was they had creed,finger 11 and 30 bands nobody
(20:54):
ever heard of. And at that time,finger 11 wasn't successful.
They had, well, they had, Ithink they had one record that
had sold 100,000 copies, and thesecond one sold like 90,000 and
that was it. It was veryfragmented. They had R B albums,
they had comedy albums. They hadno other rock bands. Yeah, it
(21:15):
was run by an entrepreneur,right? It was a very successful
independent, probably one of thebiggest Indie labels of the 90s,
for sure. Well, yeah, for sure.
So. Alan Meltzer, yeah.
He had a thing called CD onestop. And
(21:36):
he was an entrepreneur. He was amarketing guy. He was very, very
brilliant man. He was amarketing guy, and I believe it
was Bill mcgathy had who was aradio guy, had discovered creed,
and creed had a finished album,and McAfee brought this finished
album with this band, creed, whowas a Christian band, to Alan
Meltzer, who was a brilliantmarketing guy with a lot of
(21:57):
money, and Alan just marketedthe hell out of it, and Bill
promoted the hell out of it onthe radio. I believe that's the
story. Pretty accurate. That'sthe story. And it blew up. So
now they have all the money fromCreed,
Creed success and the money theyhad before creed, and they've
never made a record, because thealbum was made when they got it
(22:19):
right. So what a goodopportunity. So here I come. I
have a lifetime of being inbands, making records. At this
point, I had been in maybe 1015,bands, two that were signed,
been at Sony for four years,made three or four albums for
Sony. I'm 30, and I've beenplaying in band since I'm 14, so
(22:44):
I've got a lot of experience.
And I know everybody in LAbecause everybody in my AA
community is either a musicianor in a band or whatever. So now
I'm kind of networked into LosAngeles. I'm think I'm getting
the years right. So we go intoit becomes kind of a think tank
the signing process. It's AlanMeltzer, his wife, Diana
Meltzer, and the President,Steve Lerner and I. That's it.
(23:07):
And there was a CFO named EdVetri who just did the money.
And that was it. And there wesigned as a team, Drowning Pool,
Evanescence, finger 11.
See there?
That's it, basically the soundof 96 to 2004 Exactly. It's
(23:28):
crazy. Yeah. You know, one ofthe things I really admire about
you is you have a really greatconnection with God, and you've
also studied a lot of differentreligions, which I was pretty,
pretty impressed with. You wantto talk about that? Sure, so
things that I've read is I'veread a lot of the Torah. I've
(23:51):
read The Tibetan Book of theDead. I've read a lot of the
Quran. I've read the Biblemultiple times, Old Testament
and New Testament, a lot of newage books, Buddhism.
Um, yeah, I practiced Nisha inBuddhism for a while. I like, a
long while, I'm gonna say 16years. They call it SGI. You
(24:15):
see, what else I read up? Well,I guess the Tibetan Book of the
Dead is Tibetan Buddhism. Isthat just out of curiosity, or
was that out of like a soberthing, or was it just, you know?
Was it you didn't have a god?
Were you not sure on your God?
Were you exploring everything?
I'm interested to know. Not manypeople do that. Really.
I don't know many people thathave decided to dedicate reading
(24:38):
certain points of their life tosix religions. I think that's
interesting. Well, I mean, thismorning I read the Bible. I read
Bible in 365, days. And there'sthis other book I have. I think
it's called, maybe it's calledJesus speaks. Was reading that
this morning. Why? I guess.
(25:00):
I started out in the 90s. I usedto go to this place called the
body tree on Melrose. And I wasthat was by the LA Pat as an old
bookstore by the lepan, exactly,of cafe I remember, yeah. So I
started reading things likeMarianne Williamson and Deepak
the fourth seven spiritual lawsof success and the Four
(25:24):
Agreements. Andthen there were chant books of
channeled writing, likeConversations with God, books
one and two. I read those, and Ijust started eating books, like
I said, because I was souneducated, I just, you know,
I've always, or I guess later inlife, I started to feel like I'm
kind of a nerdy, quiet guy who'slike an academic who never went
(25:47):
to school, right? AndI'm just interested, I'm
interested in what we are.
BecauseI don't think, obviously, I'm
not this body. I don't think I'mthis mind. And if you think
about just,let's say what we suffer from,
an addiction. Big Book would sayit's an allergy of the body and
(26:10):
an obsession of the mind. Myopinion,
I believe that's one thing. Youknow, it's like, if I ingest
alcoholI have it starts a compulsion of
my obsessive mind because of theallergy of the body. It's kind
of like one thing, right? Andthat's all mind stuff, mind and
(26:30):
body stuff. But who am I reallylike? What's going on underneath
that? What? What's going onunderneath all that mind stuff?
Even if you look at traumatherapy, that's all me centered
stuff, which is all mind stuff.
And if we really have aspiritual solution, then what
(26:51):
does that really mean? Like, ifthe big book was released or
written in 1938 39what has come along since then
that is trumped, forgive theword that is trumped or made
that much of a cultural impact.
Nothing called AA, the fourthmost important thing of the 20th
(27:13):
century, sure. So what has comealong since then?
Nothing. Nothing has come alongthat I'm aware of that's made,
as you put it, so Well, suchcultural impact. No, I mean,
after, Oh, yeah. But I meanwhat? I mean, what's the top
what's, yeah, right. So itreally is a God based solution.
So if we're dealing, if my wholelife is about a God based
(27:36):
solution, then what's reallygoing on here? That is
fascinating to me. Yeah, that iswhat my whole life must be
dedicated to. Forget about thefirst what let's call it, 44
years of my life.
And let's talk about the next 44years of my life, about giving
(27:57):
and serving.
And the reason why I put it thatway, with 44 years is because
that's when I had the stroke,which we should probably talk
about, yeah, that's, that was,right, yeah. Okay, so you have
this big career. Things aregoing well. You're doing, you
know, you're not just made animpact in the music business,
you did other stuff, and,I mean, you're ahead of the game
(28:17):
on blogs and all that kind ofstuff, right? Really, probably
one of the top culturalengineers probably ever. And
you're living this big life.
You're living in Woodland Hills,1000 Oaks. Yeah, 1000 Oaks. It's
all the same shit to me, of thatfar up, but you're in 1000 Oaks.
So you want to tell the storyof, sure, it's great story. It's
(28:42):
crazy. It's beyond crazy. So,yeah, so I was living in this
big house, millions of dollarsin the bank, right from like,
where I came from, to like,millions of dollars in the bank
in this beautiful house that Icompletely designed like every
(29:02):
bolt, every screw. It was like adream place. It was like a
fantasyI still can't believe it. So one
day I wake up normal dayworkout. Ride my motorcycle from
1000 Oaks to West Hollywood. Iwork out with a friend. It's
about a 35 mile rideworkout with a friend. Ride my
(29:26):
motorcycle home. So it's 70miles round trip on a
motorcycle. Normal day workedout. I go to bed. I was married
at the time, and about fiveo'clock in the morning, my ex
wife says to me, wake up. I'mdreaming, right? I'm dead
asleep. It's five o'clock in themorning. She nudges me, wake up.
Groggy. I'm like what she said,wake up. At the moment, I was
(29:49):
having a dream that I had fallendown in Grand Central Station,
and I was trying to grab peopleby the leg to tell them that I
couldn't speak. And I.
Couldn't move, but I wasparalyzed, and I couldn't move,
and I couldn't speak, and peoplewere walking all around me in
Grand Central Station, and I wastrying to reach them, and I hear
my ex wife in the back, way inthe background, going, wake up,
(30:11):
wake up, Victor, wake up, wakeup. And finally I say, what? She
goes, wake up. And she's gettinglouder and louder and louder.
I'm like when I kind of comeback into the moment, out of the
dream, and I'm like, what? Shegoes, you're talking in your
sleep. And I said, okay, so Andshe goes, something's wrong. And
(30:33):
I go, I'm fine. She goes, you'rehaving a stroke. What are you
talking about? She goes, you'rehaving a stroke. Something's
wrong. I said, No, I'm fine. Shegoes, something's wrong. Stand
up. So I got out of bed, and myknees buckled and I hit the
ground. She called 911 ambulancecame. They said he's having a
stroke. They took me the ER, andthey gave me this clot buster
(30:54):
drug, and it didn't take. Andthey made an incision in my
lower abdomen, and then went upmy artery to my brain, and they
pulled the clot out, saved mylife. I was in ICU for a month,
but the surgeon was a miracle,wasn't it? And it wasn't there a
story about the availability ofthe surgeon there is, yeah. So
the crazy thing about that storyis, well, there's many crazy
(31:17):
things about it. The first thingis that she knew I was having a
stroke. I mean, there's noreason in the world she should
have known I was having astroke. First of all, second of
all, there's no reason in theworld she should have woken me
up. If the situation werereversed and she would talk me
in her sleep, I would haverolled right over and went to
sleep. I would have been like,Ah, she's talking in her sleep,
whatever. Who cares, right? Sothe hospital, los Robles
(31:39):
Hospital, in 1000 Oaks. It was512 in the morning. There was no
traffic, and the hospital wasthree miles from me, so it was
just down Jan's Road, absolutelyno traffic. They got there
quickly took me right in, andthe hospital had just instituted
a Stroke Program three monthsbefore I got there, and because
(32:00):
they had done that, there was asurgeon in the hospital waiting
for my arrival. Had he not beenthere, they would have had to
airlift me to UCLA or something,and they said I would have died
totally crazy. I mean, I camewithin like, a minute or two of
dying completely saved my life.
And they just, like, he justwent up through, just, yeah,
basically, like, went in my Whatis it, carotid artery, whatever
(32:27):
it's called, right up in theartery, into the brain, and pull
the clot right out. I mean,yeah. I mean, it was a major
stroke. Like, I was messed upfor a while, for, like, yeah,
five years, I just shut my wholecareer down when that happened,
when I got home from thehospital, like, if you would
have said to me, What color isyour car, it would have taken
(32:48):
me, like, three minutes toanswer you. I'd have been like,
uh, like, my face was like this,hmm. I was messed up for a
while. I just told my ex wifesaid, call these four people,
tell them what happened and notto call me.
How did did aa show up for you?
(33:10):
Yeah, yeah. A has always shownup for me.
A has always shown up for me. Ais always there. A is always
there. Yeah, that's amazing.
Did, since we've talked a lotabout God today, after the after
the stroke, did it change yourviews on God?
It's interesting. You know, Iwent through a lot of different
(33:33):
phases of it. You know, when yousee movies where somebody gets
into like, kind of like a planecrash, or, you know, an
experience where they almostdie, they kind of have this
white light experience wherethey they love life again. It
didn't do that to me. It kindof, it kind of did the opposite,
(33:53):
because what definitely made mesofter. I mean, see how big my
ego is now. I mean, before that,I was insufferable. It took a
lot of the edge off of me, whichis a good thing. Mortality will
do that, yeah, for sure. Butwhat it did was it, there was a
(34:15):
period there for about, think itwas about two or three weeks
where it looked like I mightdie, like I might have another
stroke, or it was pretty like, Iwas pretty cognizant of the
fact, like I might not walk. Wedidn't know what was going to
happen. And I felt like I faceddeath, like, pretty squarely in
(34:36):
the eye, like, what we're allgoing to go through, if we're
lucky enough at the end of ourlife, to actually be looking at
death rather than just go in ahospital bed. I kind of got so
okay with dyingthat it made the discomfort of
life, it gave me like a littlebit of suicidal ideation, like
feelings of like, I don't wantto be here. I.
(35:00):
I'm good with dying. Like I justfelt so okay with leaving here
and so so, like, I know that Godis good, and I have a God in my
life and looking forward to theafterlife. That I was ready to
go. I was like, where's therocket ship? I'm ready to go.
Get me out of here. I don't wantto deal with the traffic and the
people and this and the that Iwant to go. So how does one get
(35:24):
over that? And the way that Idid for me, life had to take a
natural shift. Actually, I'llsay that sino helped me a lot
with that because and he did itknowingly and intuitively. I
would say, the way he did it wasafter about
(35:45):
five or six years, when I got myfaculty back, I went to the back
to the music business for oneyear. And it was, I hate I was
like, it was like drinking aglass of vomit. I was like, get
me out of here. I can't do this.
I hate this. It had changed sodramatically. I went from kind
of the top of the game workingfor Clive Davis and having, you
know, this wouldn't be a goodpodcast for me if I didn't say
(36:07):
what I have to say about Clive,which is, having worked for that
guy as long as I did, he wasjust unbelievably elegant and
incredibly good to me. Yeah, itwas a great time working for
him, being around him, and whata mentoring him, yeah, I mean,
like observing that man work,and the way he treated me, it
(36:27):
serious amounts of compassion,right? I'm sorry, Pat
compassion. He was verycompassionate to me and
everybody. He's just a mensch,yeah, it's a beautiful man. So
anyway, so having worked forhim, and then going back and
seeing how the industry hadchanged in those six years,
actually, at that point, it hadbeen like eight or nine years,
(36:50):
because I had kind of moved out.
I moved out into 1000 Oaks, andI had had, at that point my own
label, my own publishingcompany. I'm just kind of being
more entrepreneurial. My ownlabel through Sony that he gave
me,I was just like, I don't want to
do this. So I did it for a year,and then COVID hit, and then
(37:11):
when COVID hit, I was just like,really,
are you kidding me now, like,fucking kidding me. Like, this
is gonna take me out now.
Like, could you imagine goingthrough that, yeah, and then a
divorce, yeah? And then COVIDhits, yeah? It was just like,
(37:33):
not to mention writing thedivorce check, yeah, which was
painful, yeah,as painful as the stroke or
different? Yeah, different kindof scary.
Um, stings differently. I harborno resentment toward my ex. We
(37:58):
parted as friends.
You know, here's how I thinkabout that. And since you
mentioned it, I thought I havetwo choices here. I can make
sure she's set up, yeah, or Ican get the phone calls where
her life's falling apart and bein that position. It's the
better position to be in. Well,yeah, 100%
(38:18):
Yeah. Hey, we'll be right back.
But before we do please considerhelping us grow this podcast.
You could do that a number ofdifferent ways. You can hit
follow on Spotify. You can rateus, review us. But what would be
really awesome would be if youcould share this with one other
addict or alcoholic that youthink could get something out
this podcast. If everyone didthat, we would grow this thing
tremendously. But as always,thank you for listening, and
(38:39):
thank you for your support. Sowe we ask every guest this as we
come to an end,and I feel like we could be
talking for hours, dude, I loveyou so much. You've made such a
fucking big difference in mylife. Dude, you're one of my
best friends, and you've seen myjourney up and down. And just
just, I relate to you on so manylevels. And I want to tell one
story before I get into thefinal question. But I think it's
(39:03):
amazing how, when I was a kid inmy bedroom, I distinctively
remember listening to science byIncubus and on my CD and and
being like and see the andprobably Evanescence and being
like, I want to work in themusic business. Now, I wasn't
(39:23):
living in London, but I lived ina little village outside of
London. So imagine this kid in avillage of 60 people listening
to the CD, looking at the jewelcase,
reading all the line of notes,and being like, this is what I
want to do. And then now one ofmy best friends is the guy
responsible for that. That'spretty fucking amazing, isn't
(39:47):
that? Like, I get it, I mean, Imean, what? Well, I get that.
I'm nobody from nowhere, yeah,and Ian Asprey is my friend.
Yeah, you know? Like, I.
I'm nobody from nowhere, likeliterally, I'm as uneducated as
it gets, and I'm not a fancyperson, and I don't want to be.
(40:11):
I'm I mean, you know, I oncesaid to Clive, he said to me, he
kind of was taking the piss outof me. He goes, Oh, so I see
you're an expert. And I said,Well, I mean, I did wait online
for Aussie tickets all night inthe snow. And
he looked at me like my it's agood point.
(40:34):
So, so our final question, ifyou could say one thing to
little Victor today, that kidhim, that kid in Brooklyn,
behind the burgundy door withthe dad that drives a cement
truck. What would you say tohim?
Pay the IRSthanks for coming in.
(41:01):
You.
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