November 7, 2025 ā¢ 38 mins
šļø Leading with Intention: Human Development, Culture, and Coaching Growth with Dr. Greg Lott (Otterbein University)Ā
In this episode of the Significant Coaching Podcast, Matt Rogers sits down with Dr. Greg Lott, Director of Athletics at Otterbein University, to explore what it means to lead with intention in collegiate athletics. Dr. Lott shares how a single message from his own college years shaped his approach to coaching, leadership, and student-athlete developmentālearn as much outside the classroom as inside it.Ā
The conversation dives into identity, emotional intelligence, and mental health in college athletics, and how coaches can create environments where young people grow as whole human beings. Dr. Lott also breaks down his practical framework for hiring coaches based on program needsāwhether the moment calls for a recruiter, a tactician, or a culture-builderāand shares how Otterbeinās coaching pods foster collaboration, reflection, and continued professional growth.Ā
Learn more about Dr. Lott and his work at Otterbein University here:
Ā https://otterbeincardinals.com/staff-directory/dr-greg-lott/434
Ā
For more weekly coaching and leadership insight, and to subscribe to both the Significant Coaching & Significant Recruiting podcasts, visit:
Ā https://coachmattrogers.com/
Learn more and connect with Matt Rogers here: https://linktr.ee/coachmattrogers
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:10):
Welcome back to The SignificantCoaching Podcast.
I'm your host, Matt Rogers.
Today's guest is someone whosits right at the intersection
of athletics and education, Dr.
Greg Lot, director of Athleticsat Otterbein University.
In our conversation, Dr.
Lot takes us back to a singlesentence from his freshman
orientation.
Learn as much outside of theclassroom as inside it.
(00:32):
That idea shaped his entire pathas an athlete, a coach, a
scholar, and now as an athleticdirector.
We talk about helping athletesunderstand the place of sport in
their lives, the reality ofidentity and balance, and the
incredible range of experienceswithin division three itself
from programs that are justtrying to compete to those built
(00:54):
to win at the highest level.
Greg was officially announced asOtterbein Director of Athletics
in July of 2023 after asuccessful tenure at Denison
University, where he led theInstitute for Development
through Sport and served asAssociate AD and a faculty
member.
He holds a doctorate degree fromthe Ohio State University with
(01:15):
research focused on emotionalintelligence and the mental
health of student athletes.
Before moving intoadministration, He coached at
the NCAA division one and thedivision three level.
mentoring, conferencechampionships, a national
champion and also he competedhimself as a hall of fame, all
American from Dickinson College,and later as a professional
(01:37):
athlete with Team USA.
He now serves nationally andinternationally in coach
development, including work withthe ncaa, the True Athlete
Project, and British Gymnastics.
before we begin, don't forget tosubscribe@coachmattrogers.com
for weekly coaching andrecruiting tips, and check out
my new recruiting blog whileyou're there.
(01:59):
And be sure to come back forpart two on the significant
recruiting podcast, droppingthis Monday, November 11th,
where Dr.
Lot and I talk about whatfamilies and athletes really
need to understand about theDivision three recruiting
landscape.
Alright, let's get into it.
Here's my conversation with Dr.
Greg Lot.
Dr.
Lot.
So great to see you.
(02:20):
Thanks for being on the show.
My pleasure.
Excited.
I want to dive in'cause I loveyour track record.
I love your background and yourfocus is on, on development of
young people and really helpingthem find their path and you've
done so much work, not only inyour academics, but on the
athletic side with helping themreally understand who they are
(02:43):
and their mental balance.
Where did that start for you,where you knew you wanted to be
a teacher and an educator?
It's funny I actually canremember the moment where this
concept really started to seepinto my conscious.
I was actually a freshman incollege and I was at our new
student orientation our thendean of students, Joyce
(03:03):
Bylander.
She came up to the podium andshe said a whole bunch of
things.
And honestly, I wasn't payingall that.
Much attention.
I was scoping out my new socialsurroundings and trying to
figure out what I was gonna dothat night.
But at some point in herremarks, she said this statement
that I genuinely hope that youlearn as much outside of the
classroom as you do inside theclassroom.
And I don't know why but thatmoment it hit me like a ton of
(03:26):
bricks because I had always,thought that I had so much of my
development and my educationthrough my co-curriculars,
namely sport but other things aswell.
And no one had ever told me thatit was supposed to be part of my
education before.
And so when she said that, itjust, like something clicked and
it really helped me be veryintentional with my sport
(03:49):
experience at the collegiatelevel and trying to use it to
become the person that I wantedto become and try to integrate
the stuff that's happening inthe classroom with other types
of things.
And then I guess because I waspaying such close attention to
it, I started to notice that thelearning and growth and
development that I was receivingthrough sport wasn't.
(04:11):
Happening uniformly with all ofmy peers.
I think probably when I startedbecoming like a team captain,
maybe my junior, senior year Istarted noticing some of my
peers were navigating theexperience, not really changing
all that much.
And it really started to get tome and I wanted to figure this
out and, then later after I, Ispent some time running
professionally and got involvedin coaching and I started
(04:31):
experiencing the same things orsome of my athletes incredible
growth.
Development, maturation, othersnot so much.
If only they could do this, thenall these other things would
happen.
And every coach I talked to,same kinds of conversations,
they bang their head against thewall.
Man, if I could just get thisone person to do this thing,
they would really excel in theclassroom.
They'd really excelathletically.
And really it got to the pointto where I decided to put
(04:53):
coaching aside and go back andtry to study that phenomenon
within my PhD.
And so it's really beensomething that started as a
collegiate athlete and hasspawned into something that's
really taken over myprofessional life.
Isn't it amazing if you talk toanybody our age and I think
we're around the same age, but Ithink.
(05:13):
When I've been telling storiesto my, my, my kids that, my, my
son and daughter, and I've beentelling stories to the kids I
work with, and I'm having thesememories that are popping up and
I haven't thought about in 25,30 years.
And the impact those things hadon me and who I am today.
And I'm, I haven't thought aboutit, but it equates so, so easily
(05:38):
to the development of me as aperson.
With the work you've done onyour doctorate, have you figured
out some paths that we can getkids on, especially when they're
athletes?
Or does it bother you whenthat's their life?
That's their identity.
Is just their runner, justthey're a football player, a
basketball player.
(05:59):
Do you encourage them to getmore engaged with the community
or is that enough just being ona campus and being a student
athlete?
I really don't, there's a lot oflayers to that question.
Yeah, I guess so.
First let me jump in and say atOtterbein in this particular
context, I really don't like forour student athletes and the
particular teams to feel siloed.
(06:21):
I really like for them to bevisible, be part of campus,
really be trying to, engage allthe different types of things
that they can while they havethis opportunity as a student.
But I will say that's, maybewhat I personally believe in and
value what I think is right formost of the students here at
Otterbein.
But maybe that's not the case inevery context.
I genuinely believe that it'simportant for young athletes and
(06:46):
honestly, they can really startdoing this, I don't know, middle
school, junior high into highschool, somewhere around that
age.
They can start exploring theirvalues.
And as they grow, they canreally start thinking about the
nuances of those and how theywanna prioritize in relationship
to those values.
And I don't ever wanna be, thekind of administrator that tells
(07:08):
people what they need to valueand then tells people what their
experience needs to be like.
I think it's really importantthat people come to grips with
the place of sport in theirlives.
And that doesn't have to be thesame for everyone.
And so I really try, because Iwork with so many different
athletes, outside of Otterbinetoo, with, my mentorship and the
True athlete project and my workin the community with the Grand
(07:30):
Belt Rec District and thingslike that.
And I, when I have theseconversations, I try to get
people to think about what theyvalue, what place sport is in
their life, what they want thatto look like, and then they have
to realize that there areramifications of those
decisions.
And I don't mean positive ornegative ramifications, I just
(07:50):
mean if they decide that theywant sport to be X, it's going
to impact them in these ways,and they need to be okay with
that's part of that decisionprocess.
So while I don't think, goingback to this identity question
that you asked I don't thinkthat it is ideal by any means
for one's identity to get verywrapped up in their sport.
(08:12):
I'm fully cognizant that ifsomeone has aspirations of
playing at the highest levels,it really needs to be a
substantial part of theiridentity.
And there needs to be lots ofother supporting things.
But I, I can't be completelyidealistic and say, Hey, if
you're gonna be an NBA draftpick, basketball can be one of
the many things that you do.
(08:33):
It doesn't quite work that way,and so I think that we just need
to be able to be honest and havethose kinds of conversations.
Yeah.
I agree.
And I didn't phrase the questionreally well, but you handled it
much better than the questionwas you were a professional
runner.
Let's talk a little bit aboutthat.
Where was your mindset in thattransition from college to being
a professional runner?
(08:53):
Because I don't know if there'sa lot of people out there that
understand.
You know what a professionalfootball player is and a
professional basketball player.
What does a professional runnerlook like?
What's that day to day?
Yeah.
And how did you make thattransition?
To be honest, it was a toughtransition for me to move from
being a division threecollegiate athlete.
Where it was, all about the teamessentially.
(09:16):
To now all of a sudden, if I wasat a meet, I could walk off the
track and it wouldn't impactanybody but myself.
My agent would be pissed at me.
But I, like it wasn't gonnaimpact team standings or
something like that.
I, and I was amazed at how muchmore selfish I needed to become
to start to excel in that space.
And I didn't like it.
(09:37):
It was one of those kinds ofthings that I wanted to see if I
could do it.
I wanted to have thatexperience.
But I only did it for two years.
I got to the point, I came upshort for for the US Olympic
team in 2008, and, I had to thenmake the decision, do I, give it
another four years or not, and,I, I just didn't really want.
My existence to be that selfish,that focus, that wrapped up in
(10:01):
that one particular thing.
And so then I made the decisionto, to move on.
But that was me.
Like I said I really, I enjoyedthe experience.
I valued it so much and what itdid for me.
But it's it just it wasn't whatI went on long term.
Yeah.
I, I.
I think we, at the end of theday, I think we're all healthier
when we're a bit of aRenaissance man or woman.
(10:22):
We're, yeah, we're, we can have,we kinda have the best of both
worlds.
We can have our professionallife, we can have our personal
life, we can have something inbetween.
And I think the more we're ableto get out of our own way and
get out of our own comfort zone.
The, just like your professionalexperience, the more you
probably grew and you figuredout who you are and you figured
(10:44):
out it's okay to be selfishsometimes.
Yeah, I bet.
Matt, I will tell you right.
Some of my teammates, they wereincredibly happy with track and
field being their life for aslong as it could be, right?
So and so for some of them.
I don't know that they would'vebeen as happy, like backing off
their sport.
(11:04):
They wanted to put everythinginto that and they wanted their
existence to be thatprofessional athlete.
Yeah.
And that's okay too, right?
That's, yeah, it's, that's whatI'm talking about.
When you have to explore thosevalues and what you explore,
what you want your life to looklike in this the place that
sport plays in it.
Let's talk a little bit about Dthree.
'cause there's a lot going on,and I know your president's
(11:24):
starting to play a big role inthe D three president's Council.
Yeah, and I think we've beenworking towards this.
What makes the D three landscapeso unique in your eyes?
And you can't, I think you canbe that kid that says, I'm all
in with my sport.
I know I'm a D three athlete.
I know I'm not on, I might notbe on athletic scholarship, but
(11:45):
I'm gonna ride this as far as Ican.
If I can play overseas.
If I can get an agent and get acontract somewhere, I wanna do
it.
What does that landscape looklike today and where do you see
it going to be a D threeathlete?
Gosh the where I see it going,that, that could be a whole
podcast in I agree.
Yeah.
Itself.
What's really unique aboutdivision three is just how much
(12:08):
difference that you find withinthe division.
And that's what I think so manypeople outside of college sport
just they're not aware of.
There really are some divisionthree experiences.
That maybe the programs, thecoaches, the student athletes
aren't all that dedicated.
When you look at that bottomquadrant of the division as hard
(12:28):
as that is for you to say,'causeyou're so respectful, there's a
huge amount of truth to that.
Yes.
Yeah.
Yes.
And so I.
I think that for the most part,if you are a moderately
successful high school athlete,you could def, you could find a
place to continue competing atthe division three level
(12:49):
somewhere.
But on the other side of thecoin, the top quadrant of
division three.
Man, it's tough's.
We had, where I'm from theplayer of the year for boys
basketball in his conference.
So one of the top players in ahandful of schools was having
(13:09):
trouble landing a spot at thedivision three level when he was
pursuing a basketball program.
Otter or something along thoselines.
You have to be, a top levelplayer to be able to be
recruited and find a spot on thebetter programs in division
three.
(13:30):
And so you just have this thisvaried mix of resources whether
that's like operational fundscoaching staffs, there are in,
there are institutions that maynot have.
Full-time coaches in somesports.
And then there are some thathave three or four full-time
coaches for a particular sport.
And all of that is withindivision three.
There's roughly 450 schools justunder, within division three,
(13:53):
which is more than division oneand two combined.
Yeah.
And so there's just suchincredible variation and like
understanding that landscape isI mean you can't blame people
that aren't involved in it tonot know but it's.
That's really, I think, the mostunique thing about division
three.
And there's certain principlesthat govern all of division
three.
But trying to get everyone incomplete alignment sometimes can
(14:15):
be challenging.
And the experience of a Divisionthree athlete could be vastly
different from one institutionto another.
In my experience, I'm theperfect example of that.
'cause when I was in AD for thefirst time at Maryville in 2002
or 2003, I was the onlyfull-time person on the entire
(14:37):
athletic department.
Wow.
My secretary was part-time, myhead coaches were part-time.
Yeah.
We didn't, I don't if when Itook the job.
And I changed all this'cause Ibarked and yelled as till No,
everyone but I don't think I hada head coach making more than
12,000 a year.
And I was head men's basketballcoach as, as well as ad trying
(15:00):
to do this.
So you, to your point, I thinkif you're a kid, if you're a
family and you've got a teenagerthat wants to play in college,
part of this conversation.
Is thinking about, do you wantto be a small fish in a big
pond?
Do you want to be a big fish ina small pond?
(15:21):
Yeah.
Do you wanna walk into someplace and go, I'll create that
legacy?
Or do I need to walk into aplace that's already got a
legacy created?
And then there's 90 differentversions of that in between,
right?
Yep.
So I love your take on thatbecause it's so important for
families to embrace.
What college really is.
(15:42):
And there's a different color,there's a different range for
everybody that wants to go into.
So don't think D three is Dthree, right?
Correct.
Correct.
And it's funny, I, so I've got ason that he's in eighth grade
now and we brought his lastyear, his seventh grade
basketball team to an Otterbinegame.
(16:02):
Nice.
And it was, it's funny because.
12, 13-year-old kids have acertain perception of what
college basketball should belike, of what division one's of
what division three is and sowhen the team got in the gym.
All right guys, I just want youto go underneath the basket
where our team's getting readyto warm up.
And I just want you to walk.
I want you to see what thebodies are like.
(16:25):
I want you to see what theathleticism is like.
Just let me know what you think.
And so they're over there andthey're watching our guys that
are like.
6, 8, 6, 7 guys that are jumpingout of the gym, coming through
doing all different kinds ofcrazy dunks and just knocking
down one three after another.
And they're looking over at melike, oh my gosh this is not
what we expected.
(16:46):
And so to be able to say yeahlike this is a good division
three basketball program, right?
And so if you all are thinkingabout playing in high school,
thinking about playing incollege, this is a good way for
you to start learning what thelandscape is like and Yeah, if
you wanna be a collegebasketball player, you gotta
work your tail off.
It's not just oh, yeah.
(17:06):
It's gonna happen.
Yeah.
It.
But it what's cool about thatis, is that doesn't probably
happen the size and the elitismof your program, of your
athletic program.
It probably doesn't happen theway it does if you don't have
certain things in place, if youdon't have certain budget in
(17:26):
place, if you don't have certainstaff.
You look at the Otterbineathletic staff directory online.
It looks like a division twoprogram.
Yes.
You are well funded, you'represident, makes sure you're
taken care of, speaks to theboard on how important athletics
is to driving the entireuniversity.
So full-time assistant coacheshaving athletic trainers that
(17:49):
can travel with your teams.
How much effect does that haveon your head coaches knowing
that you're supporting them?
Yeah.
And I try to be honest though,with all of my head coaches,
yeah.
You can't just say oh, I expectyou to win a national
championship.
I expect you to win a conferencechampionship.
You've you hit the nail on thehead where resources do impact
(18:11):
what your ceiling can be.
And I'll be perfectly honest,some of my sports are better
situated than others in theoverall landscape.
When you think about.
Location the type of sportwithin our conference facility,
coaching staff, things likethat.
And it's really important as anathletic director to, to be able
to have those transparentconversations with your coaches
(18:32):
about what you expect from themholistically.
But, winning, competition,recruiting, all that's a part of
that.
And so yeah, I'm doing my bestto try to help each coach.
Keep moving that needle in theright direction and keep being
able to pursue the top end oftheir sport.
But you also have to be arealist and we're funded nicely
(18:53):
and we have good resources, but.
There are also those that arefunded better, with better
resources.
That's right.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's you look at the hopes andthe Illinois Wesleyans of the
world and the Washingtonuniversities and, some of those
schools have endowments that arein the billions with a b.
Yep.
So if you're a school that hasan endowment that's a hundred
(19:15):
million, that's fantastic thatyou know you're doing really
well.
If you have a hundred milliondollars endowment, but you're
competing against schools thathave 10 times the money.
Yep.
So it's, we talked about thedifferences in division threes
within that division.
It's the same thing within yourdepartment.
There's certain things that youcan give to certain sports that
(19:37):
Yeah, you don't have the abilityto give to other coaches in
other sports, right?
And that's just the reality ofathletics.
Talk a little bit about,'causeI'm building an athletic
department right now for acollege that's starting
athletics, so I Oh, very cool.
I'm pick, I'm gonna pick yourbrain on this and I'm actually
gonna be hiring a cross countrycoach at a couple of soccer
coaches in the next month.
(19:57):
Okay.
So this is a great conversationfor us to be having when you're
thinking about hiring a newcoach.
Where does it begin with you?
What are some of those thingsthat you're like, I've got to
have this, I wanna make sure Idon't have this.
Are there anything like thatimmediately comes to mind?
Yeah, it's, I think a differentkind of a conversation when
(20:19):
you're starting from scratch.
Yeah.
Than when you're not for sure.
Because I may make a completelydifferent hire depending on
where that particular program issituated.
I'm talking about the culture ofthat program, the
competitiveness of that program,the robustness of the roster in
that program and Right.
(20:39):
So I always try to ask myself,I, I try to step back and look
without bias, what are weworking with right now?
Do I need, because realisticallyI can get a coach that's really
good in an area.
I can't get a coach very often.
That comes to me, that'sexceptional in every area.
(21:00):
If they were exceptional inevery area, they would be able
to demand a salary that is, I'mpriced out of that market.
So I've gotta step back and askmyself do I need someone that is
an exceptional recruiter that,can drive relationships in high
schools, that can talk tofamilies that, that knows the
best way to connect.
With all the perspective studentathletes and can cultivate their
(21:23):
social media in a certain way,that's really attractive.
So they've got this kind of likemarketing PR type feel to'em.
Do I need someone that is agreat tactician, someone that,
has a lot of pieces, but theyneed to be able to put those
pieces together in unique ways.
Essentially that can OutCo thecompetitors between the lines.
(21:45):
Do I need someone that is acultural builder that, the
culture may not be in a greatspace and they've gotta have.
That kind of background that canreally try to establish the
values and can establish thebehaviors that are associated
with those values and are, isgreat on the accountability side
of things, right?
So I always try to say okay,what is the primary skillset
(22:09):
that I need when I'm making thishigher?
And then I start there.
And kind of work backwards and,look at the strengths and
weaknesses of differentcandidates.
And I always try to target aswell.
If I've got a head coach openingI'll start to get into my
network.
Or even I just try to keep agood handle on the landscape and
I may just straight up hold,call someone say Hey, I've heard
(22:30):
these things about you.
Like these attributes that seemto be really strong with you are
exactly what I'm looking for inthis role.
Can we have a conversation?
So that's how I go about it.
I think if I'm in your shoes andI'm starting something from
scratch it's gonna be probablynumber one factor of can I get
people in the door?
Can I make this thing exciting?
(22:52):
Am I more, I don't know, am Imore outspoken, outgoing?
Am I a good connector?
Can I just get some excitement?
Going here because I've alwaysfound that you need some kind of
like a critical mass on a teamto start exciting better
players.
It's tough to go out and getthat.
(23:13):
Stud player right off the bat.
They need to be able to come fora visit and say, oh, that's a
fun group.
I may be the best player in thatgroup, but I at least I wanna
hang out, I wanna roll mysleeves and get to work with
this group.
I wanna go be a part of it.
So if you're starting fromscratch, you need to have
someone that can build thatinitial group from which to
build.
Y You're right on you it's great'cause you're confirming the way
(23:34):
I was thinking.
'cause as an athletic director Ialways put more weight into
college experience.
Anything else than, but forthese roles I'm hiring now I'm
really diving in.
Okay.
Who are the top club coaches inthat area?
Yeah.
Who's got their hands into acouple hundred kids runner.
Exactly.
Soccer players that maybe willwanna come with them.
(23:55):
'cause there's already areputation there, where we can
build from there.
So I'm thinking about thatdifferently than I ever have
before as a Yeah, for sure.
Yeah.
So I love that.
That's great.
That really helps me.
And I think it gives familiesand high school coaches some in
some perspective too.
And I love the fact that you'repipelining and you're sourcing
(24:18):
and you're not just vettingapplications.
Because I think that's whereathletic programs stop growing.
When our, the hiring peoplearen't going out and going, man,
I've been hearing great thingsabout this person.
I'm gonna give them a call.
I'm gonna see what theirthoughts on our program.
So I love that.
Give us some things that you'redoing with your coaches to help
(24:39):
them grow professionally.
Sure.
This is something that'scrucial.
We ask so much out of ourcoaches.
But most coaches aren't reallytaught how to facilitate deep
engagement with an experience ina way that has particular
outcomes.
At least they're not taught in aformal way.
(24:59):
They figure it out.
Maybe they see other coaches doit.
And so I think it's reallyimportant.
To help coaches learn really howto get their athletes to be
intentional with thinking abouttheir sport as a me, as a
mechanism for growth anddevelopment.
How to teach them to thinkabstractly about how to do
things differently, about howthings might translate into
(25:21):
other concepts, to teach themhow to experi.
Kind of those thought exercisesto create mental models of,
okay, I'm gonna try it out inthis way.
I'm gonna I'm gonna try thesebreathing techniques to help
calm my heart rate before Ishoot foul shots.
And then I'm getting ready to gotake a test or go have an
interview.
Maybe I can try the same thingsthere and then teach them how to
(25:43):
reflect upon those, that didn'twork so well.
Maybe it ain't to go about it inthis way.
And so I think it's important toreally arm and equip.
Our coaches with that.
And then likewise, because weask so much out of them, it's
really important that we givethem support.
We give them access to oneanother.
We try to cultivate ways thatthey can interact with one
another, learn from one anotherbecause, a lot of them are that
(26:05):
they just have such expertiseand they're so great in some
areas and they're so busy,there's not a lot of natural
opportunities for them to engageone another and share that and
help.
Specifically at Otterbein.
We've put together head coachingpods where we match a group up
and, they have the autonomy todecide we wanna meet over lunch,
(26:26):
or we wanna meet over coffee, orthings like that.
And I'm not very prescriptive.
Every now and then I'll throwsomething at'em and say, Hey
here's a thing.
Like I really want coaching podsto talk about the ideal
on-campus recruiting visit.
And I want us to try to createsome commonalities with how we
do that here.
But more often than not, use thespace in the way that you want
it.
That you need it.
(26:47):
You can put someone in the hotseat like, Ooh, this coach does
this one thing really well, andwe wanna just pick her brain
and, learn everything we canabout it.
Or someone may be strugglingwith.
Interaction with a player or aparent or whatever it is, and,
and so they have the opportunityto say, Hey guys I need this
time today, I'm gonna, I'm gonnatalk to you about an issue that
(27:07):
I'm going through and just, anyadvice, any guidance that you
all have.
So they can do that.
We have a resource bank wherepeople can throw in podcasts,
books, images, whatever,something that they've found
meaningful, impactful,inspirational.
And so if they want to grab ontothat.
Know they can.
And oftentimes it's about thingsthat don't even seem like
(27:28):
they're sport specific, but canreally create some great
conversations about work-lifebalance, about prioritization,
about, things like that to justhelp them flourish as human
beings in this coachingenvironment.
So the head coaching pods arebig.
Love that.
We also do like a consistentcurriculum for our younger
coaches our GA's and things likethat to, to really just, help
(27:49):
them learn in areas that theyjust haven't had a lot of
exposure to yet.
And it's of course, open to anycoaches but mandated for the
newer, yeah.
Coaches.
It's awesome because if you'renot thinking about your people
that you have below your headcoaches, if you're not helping
grow them, you're really hurtingyour long-term pipeline to
replace head coaches.
Oh, heck yeah.
Yeah.
(28:09):
Oftentimes that's your easiesthire is that assistant coach
that's been there for five to 10years and already knows the kids
already knows the system alreadyis rolling down that road you
wanna stay on.
Yeah.
For sure.
And you know what, like on.
On the other hand too I wanteveryone that works in my
department to know that mepersonally and Otterbein
structurally, genuinely wantsthem to be able to pursue
(28:33):
whatever their aspirations arein their field.
And so we wanna help with thatgrowth and development.
And if it's to be the best coachthat can be at Otterbein, that's
phenomenal.
But if it's to open up doors toa different level, whatever it
is that's fine too.
In fact, I just gave aprofessional development session
for my GA's on interviewinggetting your foot in the door
(28:56):
like we're trying to coach.
Coach.
That's awesome.
I had some of my full-timecoaches that wanted to come into
the room and I started off withI hope you all know I will not
be offended if you come to meand say, oh, this is the
phenomenal opportunity,whatever.
So great down the road.
That is so great.
'cause if we get the reputationof really trying to help our
people develop and pursue it is,it's important to them.
(29:17):
And that's out there.
More people wanna come workhere, they wanna come coach here
and it does, it grows the tree,the pipeline, whatever you wanna
call it.
Coach, you've been so great withyour time and I know how busy
you are.
Let's end with some advice toyounger coaches out there that
wanna coach at the college leveland wanna make that jump.
(29:38):
Sure.
It depends on where they'recoming from, right?
It's probably different kind ofadvice if you are, just
finishing your career as acollegiate athlete or
professional athlete and youwanna transition into coaching
or if you're.
Coming from the high schoolranks or something along those
lines at the club level, and youwanna get into college coaching
you've I'd say you've got tofigure out how you want to brand
(30:01):
yourself.
I know that sounds I don't know,maybe not authentic, but, you
need to decide are you theperson that wants to be known as
an educator?
Are you the person that wants tobe known as a recruiter?
Are you the person that wants tobe known as whatever it is, and
keep developing holistically thebest you can.
(30:21):
As our earlier conversation,explored, I try to look for
something specific based on whatI need.
And it's really good if you cancome into an interview and say,
I do a phenomenal job athelping, student athletes excel
in the classroom, and here's howI recruit the type of people
that do that.
And here's the structures that Iput in place and that's the
(30:43):
thing I care most about, orsomething different, right?
So I guess like figure out, yourbrand your niche.
Do your best to start connectingwith as many people as possible.
Help them get to know you.
There's, coaching conventions.
You'd be surprised.
Here's like an untapped thing.
How many college coaches arevery willing to let new coaches
(31:05):
just come observe practices?
And so that's a huge opportunityif you can identify, three, four
or five programs that are inyour area that are doing well,
and reach out to the head coachand say, Hey.
This is really cool.
You've had this success, or I'veheard you've been doing these
things in your programs.
I'd really like to learn fromyou.
Would you mind if I came andwatched a practice and picked
(31:26):
your brain a little bit beforeor afterwards?
97 times out of a hundred,they're gonna say yes.
And if you get a no, you just,move on.
But that starts to open up a lotof doors.
It starts to help with your own.
Knowledge base just, meetingpeople and they're gonna
introduce you to people.
And also if you get into aninterview and you can talk about
I observe this coach, and theydo this thing well, but here's
(31:49):
how I put my spin on it.
Now all of a sudden, if you'rean ad, you're like, Ooh, okay.
That person's hustling, they'regetting after it.
They're trying to learn, they'rereflecting.
That's the kind of person Iwanna bring into my program.
I'd really encourage youngcoaches trying to get their foot
in the door to to do that.
I told you this was the lastquestion, but I'm gonna, I'm
gonna ask a follow up to thisone.
What does the cover letter dofor you when you read it that
says, all right, the resume'simportant.
(32:11):
It's huge.
And this is actually one of thethings that we just spent a lot
of time talking about in thatprofessional development session
that I just mentioned.
You would be amazed at how manycover letters I get that I can
tell they just changed the name,like whatever, like maybe it was
to Illinois Wesley and announcedit says Otterbein and sent it
off.
Matt, I, I.
(32:32):
I don't know.
At least 65, 70% of the coverletters I get are like that.
Oh no.
For jobs at a minimum.
Oh, that hurts my soul to hearthat.
But because you're not trying,you're not caring about where
you're going.
Exactly.
Exactly.
So yeah, I'm saying probably twothirds of apps that come in
that's the case.
Probably 99 times out of ahundred.
(32:53):
I push those aside and don'tengage them unless I know that's
a person that I wanna engagewith.
But even then, like all of asudden they've got a strike
against them.
As I start to to review that.
I would say that like for coverletter.
Just put in your homework andthink about what is it that
institution is trying to do,that athletic department is
(33:14):
trying to do, and that programdoes uniquely, and how does that
connect to you as an individualbased on what you care about and
what you bring to the table?
You need to show that you are agood fit for this role, that you
want to be at this institution.
You want to learn from thiscoach.
You want to be in this program.
(33:35):
That's the kind of thing thatmakes me say, okay, all right I
should take this personseriously.
So that's that kind of like thatpersonalization, that care, that
homework has gotta be numberone.
Then number two, I need to seehow their marketing and branding
themselves, what is it that theywant to be the thing that sets
(33:56):
them apart?
And there needs to be a couplesentences that jump off that
paper and say okay.
That's the thing that makes thisindividual special.
And if I don't see that thatgives me pause.
What kind of self-awareness dothey have?
Are they really a good fit orare they not?
I have to start then reallydoing some digging versus if
they at least can initiate thatconversation about what they're
(34:18):
gonna bring to the tableuniquely.
And then you also touched onthat notion of.
I really do appreciate this one.
In a cover letter isn't like anon-negotiable, but I do
appreciate seeing something thatshows they don't think they know
everything.
They have confidence and belief,but they're still trying to hone
(34:39):
their craft and get better as ahuman, as a coach and right.
That's, to me, something that'sreally important, especially
because of the culture thatwe're really, trying to build
here at Otterbein.
I love your points on research,and I think it's so important
the other side of that,'causethere's been so many times over
the last 30 years that I'veapplied for a job and in doing
my research I've said, no, I'mgonna stop applying for this.
(35:03):
It's not, yeah, it doesn't goodfor you.
I'm gonna fail here, or they'regonna make me miserable.
Yeah.
Their value system doesn't matchwith mine.
Yep.
It goes back to what we weretalking about, all the levels of
division three.
Every school has a differentvalue system.
Every school has a differentpurpose, and I try to tell kids
this.
I go, okay.
Maybe you're Christian, but doyou want to go to Bible study
(35:24):
every Wednesday and have a dresscode and you can never have a
boy or a girl in your dormitoryafter eight o'clock?
You might be Christian, youmight like going to church and
your faith might be important toyou, but are you willing to
sacrifice some of those thingsthat you wanted out of a
college?
Or do you appreciate some ofthose things or do you
appreciate that?
And that's what you want, right?
So I love that, and I thinkthat's such great advice.
(35:47):
I don't think we can talk toyoung people, not just young
coaches.
I don't think we can talk toyoung people enough about that
journey they're on, aboutfiguring out who you are.
Whether it's a partner or a job,or a career or a culture or a
geographic location, you gottathink about those things because
(36:07):
there might be the perfect bossand the perfect title, but
everything else around it mightbe terrible for you.
Yep.
So it's such great advice, Dr.
Lot.
You are so good at what you do.
Thank you for continuing tobring your heart and your soul
to your job.
Thank you for sharing it withnot only your people, but the
community and my audience.
(36:29):
And you've got a big fan in meand I'll be cheering for
Otterbein and so long as youthank you.
As long as you and Dr.
Erford are there.
I'm an Otter buying fan.
I appreciate it, Matt.
I appreciate the kind words.
Thank you.
We've had such a memorableseason two of the significant
coaching podcast, but I keephaving conversations that end
with me having more hope for thefuture of college athletics than
(36:51):
when we started.
And today's conversation withDr.
Greg Lott from OtterbeinUniversity was no different.
I am so impressed with his focuson human development and the
mental health of his studentathletes.
His commitment to buildingchampionship level programs at
Otterbein is clear, but whatstands out even more is how he
centers everything on the growthof people, helping coaches stay
(37:13):
healthy, and ensuring studentathletes leave the university
with self-worth confidence andmaturity as they step into the
real world.
If this conversation resonated,make sure you're
subscribed@coachmattrogers.comso you don't miss new episodes
and you get the weekly blog ofsignificance.
And remember, part two of thisconversation drops Monday,
(37:36):
November 11th on the SignificantRecruiting podcast where we dig
into the division threerecruiting landscape and what
families really need tounderstand about that transition
from high school to college.
Until next time, stay focused onwhat you can control.
Stay humble and keep chasingsignificance.
Welcome back to The SignificantCoaching Podcast.
I'm your host, Matt Rogers.
Today's guest is someone whosits right at the intersection
of athletics and education, Dr.
Greg Lot, director of Athleticsat Otterbein University.
In our conversation, Dr.
Lot takes us back to a singlesentence from his freshman
orientation.
Learn as much outside of theclassroom as inside it.
(00:32):
That idea shaped his entire pathas an athlete, a coach, a
scholar, and now as an athleticdirector.
We talk about helping athletesunderstand the place of sport in
their lives, the reality ofidentity and balance, and the
incredible range of experienceswithin division three itself
from programs that are justtrying to compete to those built
(00:54):
to win at the highest level.
Greg was officially announced asOtterbein Director of Athletics
in July of 2023 after asuccessful tenure at Denison
University, where he led theInstitute for Development
through Sport and served asAssociate AD and a faculty
member.
He holds a doctorate degree fromthe Ohio State University with
(01:15):
research focused on emotionalintelligence and the mental
health of student athletes.
Before moving intoadministration, He coached at
the NCAA division one and thedivision three level.
mentoring, conferencechampionships, a national
champion and also he competedhimself as a hall of fame, all
American from Dickinson College,and later as a professional
(01:37):
athlete with Team USA.
He now serves nationally andinternationally in coach
development, including work withthe ncaa, the True Athlete
Project, and British Gymnastics.
before we begin, don't forget tosubscribe@coachmattrogers.com
for weekly coaching andrecruiting tips, and check out
my new recruiting blog whileyou're there.
(01:59):
And be sure to come back forpart two on the significant
recruiting podcast, droppingthis Monday, November 11th,
where Dr.
Lot and I talk about whatfamilies and athletes really
need to understand about theDivision three recruiting
landscape.
Alright, let's get into it.
Here's my conversation with Dr.
Greg Lot.
Dr.
Lot.
So great to see you.
(02:20):
Thanks for being on the show.
My pleasure.
Excited.
I want to dive in'cause I loveyour track record.
I love your background and yourfocus is on, on development of
young people and really helpingthem find their path and you've
done so much work, not only inyour academics, but on the
athletic side with helping themreally understand who they are
(02:43):
and their mental balance.
Where did that start for you,where you knew you wanted to be
a teacher and an educator?
It's funny I actually canremember the moment where this
concept really started to seepinto my conscious.
I was actually a freshman incollege and I was at our new
student orientation our thendean of students, Joyce
(03:03):
Bylander.
She came up to the podium andshe said a whole bunch of
things.
And honestly, I wasn't payingall that.
Much attention.
I was scoping out my new socialsurroundings and trying to
figure out what I was gonna dothat night.
But at some point in herremarks, she said this statement
that I genuinely hope that youlearn as much outside of the
classroom as you do inside theclassroom.
And I don't know why but thatmoment it hit me like a ton of
(03:26):
bricks because I had always,thought that I had so much of my
development and my educationthrough my co-curriculars,
namely sport but other things aswell.
And no one had ever told me thatit was supposed to be part of my
education before.
And so when she said that, itjust, like something clicked and
it really helped me be veryintentional with my sport
(03:49):
experience at the collegiatelevel and trying to use it to
become the person that I wantedto become and try to integrate
the stuff that's happening inthe classroom with other types
of things.
And then I guess because I waspaying such close attention to
it, I started to notice that thelearning and growth and
development that I was receivingthrough sport wasn't.
(04:11):
Happening uniformly with all ofmy peers.
I think probably when I startedbecoming like a team captain,
maybe my junior, senior year Istarted noticing some of my
peers were navigating theexperience, not really changing
all that much.
And it really started to get tome and I wanted to figure this
out and, then later after I, Ispent some time running
professionally and got involvedin coaching and I started
(04:31):
experiencing the same things orsome of my athletes incredible
growth.
Development, maturation, othersnot so much.
If only they could do this, thenall these other things would
happen.
And every coach I talked to,same kinds of conversations,
they bang their head against thewall.
Man, if I could just get thisone person to do this thing,
they would really excel in theclassroom.
They'd really excelathletically.
And really it got to the pointto where I decided to put
(04:53):
coaching aside and go back andtry to study that phenomenon
within my PhD.
And so it's really beensomething that started as a
collegiate athlete and hasspawned into something that's
really taken over myprofessional life.
Isn't it amazing if you talk toanybody our age and I think
we're around the same age, but Ithink.
(05:13):
When I've been telling storiesto my, my, my kids that, my, my
son and daughter, and I've beentelling stories to the kids I
work with, and I'm having thesememories that are popping up and
I haven't thought about in 25,30 years.
And the impact those things hadon me and who I am today.
And I'm, I haven't thought aboutit, but it equates so, so easily
(05:38):
to the development of me as aperson.
With the work you've done onyour doctorate, have you figured
out some paths that we can getkids on, especially when they're
athletes?
Or does it bother you whenthat's their life?
That's their identity.
Is just their runner, justthey're a football player, a
basketball player.
(05:59):
Do you encourage them to getmore engaged with the community
or is that enough just being ona campus and being a student
athlete?
I really don't, there's a lot oflayers to that question.
Yeah, I guess so.
First let me jump in and say atOtterbein in this particular
context, I really don't like forour student athletes and the
particular teams to feel siloed.
(06:21):
I really like for them to bevisible, be part of campus,
really be trying to, engage allthe different types of things
that they can while they havethis opportunity as a student.
But I will say that's, maybewhat I personally believe in and
value what I think is right formost of the students here at
Otterbein.
But maybe that's not the case inevery context.
I genuinely believe that it'simportant for young athletes and
(06:46):
honestly, they can really startdoing this, I don't know, middle
school, junior high into highschool, somewhere around that
age.
They can start exploring theirvalues.
And as they grow, they canreally start thinking about the
nuances of those and how theywanna prioritize in relationship
to those values.
And I don't ever wanna be, thekind of administrator that tells
(07:08):
people what they need to valueand then tells people what their
experience needs to be like.
I think it's really importantthat people come to grips with
the place of sport in theirlives.
And that doesn't have to be thesame for everyone.
And so I really try, because Iwork with so many different
athletes, outside of Otterbinetoo, with, my mentorship and the
True athlete project and my workin the community with the Grand
(07:30):
Belt Rec District and thingslike that.
And I, when I have theseconversations, I try to get
people to think about what theyvalue, what place sport is in
their life, what they want thatto look like, and then they have
to realize that there areramifications of those
decisions.
And I don't mean positive ornegative ramifications, I just
(07:50):
mean if they decide that theywant sport to be X, it's going
to impact them in these ways,and they need to be okay with
that's part of that decisionprocess.
So while I don't think, goingback to this identity question
that you asked I don't thinkthat it is ideal by any means
for one's identity to get verywrapped up in their sport.
(08:12):
I'm fully cognizant that ifsomeone has aspirations of
playing at the highest levels,it really needs to be a
substantial part of theiridentity.
And there needs to be lots ofother supporting things.
But I, I can't be completelyidealistic and say, Hey, if
you're gonna be an NBA draftpick, basketball can be one of
the many things that you do.
(08:33):
It doesn't quite work that way,and so I think that we just need
to be able to be honest and havethose kinds of conversations.
Yeah.
I agree.
And I didn't phrase the questionreally well, but you handled it
much better than the questionwas you were a professional
runner.
Let's talk a little bit aboutthat.
Where was your mindset in thattransition from college to being
a professional runner?
(08:53):
Because I don't know if there'sa lot of people out there that
understand.
You know what a professionalfootball player is and a
professional basketball player.
What does a professional runnerlook like?
What's that day to day?
Yeah.
And how did you make thattransition?
To be honest, it was a toughtransition for me to move from
being a division threecollegiate athlete.
Where it was, all about the teamessentially.
(09:16):
To now all of a sudden, if I wasat a meet, I could walk off the
track and it wouldn't impactanybody but myself.
My agent would be pissed at me.
But I, like it wasn't gonnaimpact team standings or
something like that.
I, and I was amazed at how muchmore selfish I needed to become
to start to excel in that space.
And I didn't like it.
(09:37):
It was one of those kinds ofthings that I wanted to see if I
could do it.
I wanted to have thatexperience.
But I only did it for two years.
I got to the point, I came upshort for for the US Olympic
team in 2008, and, I had to thenmake the decision, do I, give it
another four years or not, and,I, I just didn't really want.
My existence to be that selfish,that focus, that wrapped up in
(10:01):
that one particular thing.
And so then I made the decisionto, to move on.
But that was me.
Like I said I really, I enjoyedthe experience.
I valued it so much and what itdid for me.
But it's it just it wasn't whatI went on long term.
Yeah.
I, I.
I think we, at the end of theday, I think we're all healthier
when we're a bit of aRenaissance man or woman.
(10:22):
We're, yeah, we're, we can have,we kinda have the best of both
worlds.
We can have our professionallife, we can have our personal
life, we can have something inbetween.
And I think the more we're ableto get out of our own way and
get out of our own comfort zone.
The, just like your professionalexperience, the more you
probably grew and you figuredout who you are and you figured
(10:44):
out it's okay to be selfishsometimes.
Yeah, I bet.
Matt, I will tell you right.
Some of my teammates, they wereincredibly happy with track and
field being their life for aslong as it could be, right?
So and so for some of them.
I don't know that they would'vebeen as happy, like backing off
their sport.
(11:04):
They wanted to put everythinginto that and they wanted their
existence to be thatprofessional athlete.
Yeah.
And that's okay too, right?
That's, yeah, it's, that's whatI'm talking about.
When you have to explore thosevalues and what you explore,
what you want your life to looklike in this the place that
sport plays in it.
Let's talk a little bit about Dthree.
'cause there's a lot going on,and I know your president's
(11:24):
starting to play a big role inthe D three president's Council.
Yeah, and I think we've beenworking towards this.
What makes the D three landscapeso unique in your eyes?
And you can't, I think you canbe that kid that says, I'm all
in with my sport.
I know I'm a D three athlete.
I know I'm not on, I might notbe on athletic scholarship, but
(11:45):
I'm gonna ride this as far as Ican.
If I can play overseas.
If I can get an agent and get acontract somewhere, I wanna do
it.
What does that landscape looklike today and where do you see
it going to be a D threeathlete?
Gosh the where I see it going,that, that could be a whole
podcast in I agree.
Yeah.
Itself.
What's really unique aboutdivision three is just how much
(12:08):
difference that you find withinthe division.
And that's what I think so manypeople outside of college sport
just they're not aware of.
There really are some divisionthree experiences.
That maybe the programs, thecoaches, the student athletes
aren't all that dedicated.
When you look at that bottomquadrant of the division as hard
(12:28):
as that is for you to say,'causeyou're so respectful, there's a
huge amount of truth to that.
Yes.
Yeah.
Yes.
And so I.
I think that for the most part,if you are a moderately
successful high school athlete,you could def, you could find a
place to continue competing atthe division three level
(12:49):
somewhere.
But on the other side of thecoin, the top quadrant of
division three.
Man, it's tough's.
We had, where I'm from theplayer of the year for boys
basketball in his conference.
So one of the top players in ahandful of schools was having
(13:09):
trouble landing a spot at thedivision three level when he was
pursuing a basketball program.
Otter or something along thoselines.
You have to be, a top levelplayer to be able to be
recruited and find a spot on thebetter programs in division
three.
(13:30):
And so you just have this thisvaried mix of resources whether
that's like operational fundscoaching staffs, there are in,
there are institutions that maynot have.
Full-time coaches in somesports.
And then there are some thathave three or four full-time
coaches for a particular sport.
And all of that is withindivision three.
There's roughly 450 schools justunder, within division three,
(13:53):
which is more than division oneand two combined.
Yeah.
And so there's just suchincredible variation and like
understanding that landscape isI mean you can't blame people
that aren't involved in it tonot know but it's.
That's really, I think, the mostunique thing about division
three.
And there's certain principlesthat govern all of division
three.
But trying to get everyone incomplete alignment sometimes can
(14:15):
be challenging.
And the experience of a Divisionthree athlete could be vastly
different from one institutionto another.
In my experience, I'm theperfect example of that.
'cause when I was in AD for thefirst time at Maryville in 2002
or 2003, I was the onlyfull-time person on the entire
(14:37):
athletic department.
Wow.
My secretary was part-time, myhead coaches were part-time.
Yeah.
We didn't, I don't if when Itook the job.
And I changed all this'cause Ibarked and yelled as till No,
everyone but I don't think I hada head coach making more than
12,000 a year.
And I was head men's basketballcoach as, as well as ad trying
(15:00):
to do this.
So you, to your point, I thinkif you're a kid, if you're a
family and you've got a teenagerthat wants to play in college,
part of this conversation.
Is thinking about, do you wantto be a small fish in a big
pond?
Do you want to be a big fish ina small pond?
(15:21):
Yeah.
Do you wanna walk into someplace and go, I'll create that
legacy?
Or do I need to walk into aplace that's already got a
legacy created?
And then there's 90 differentversions of that in between,
right?
Yep.
So I love your take on thatbecause it's so important for
families to embrace.
What college really is.
(15:42):
And there's a different color,there's a different range for
everybody that wants to go into.
So don't think D three is Dthree, right?
Correct.
Correct.
And it's funny, I, so I've got ason that he's in eighth grade
now and we brought his lastyear, his seventh grade
basketball team to an Otterbinegame.
(16:02):
Nice.
And it was, it's funny because.
12, 13-year-old kids have acertain perception of what
college basketball should belike, of what division one's of
what division three is and sowhen the team got in the gym.
All right guys, I just want youto go underneath the basket
where our team's getting readyto warm up.
And I just want you to walk.
I want you to see what thebodies are like.
(16:25):
I want you to see what theathleticism is like.
Just let me know what you think.
And so they're over there andthey're watching our guys that
are like.
6, 8, 6, 7 guys that are jumpingout of the gym, coming through
doing all different kinds ofcrazy dunks and just knocking
down one three after another.
And they're looking over at melike, oh my gosh this is not
what we expected.
(16:46):
And so to be able to say yeahlike this is a good division
three basketball program, right?
And so if you all are thinkingabout playing in high school,
thinking about playing incollege, this is a good way for
you to start learning what thelandscape is like and Yeah, if
you wanna be a collegebasketball player, you gotta
work your tail off.
It's not just oh, yeah.
(17:06):
It's gonna happen.
Yeah.
It.
But it what's cool about thatis, is that doesn't probably
happen the size and the elitismof your program, of your
athletic program.
It probably doesn't happen theway it does if you don't have
certain things in place, if youdon't have certain budget in
(17:26):
place, if you don't have certainstaff.
You look at the Otterbineathletic staff directory online.
It looks like a division twoprogram.
Yes.
You are well funded, you'represident, makes sure you're
taken care of, speaks to theboard on how important athletics
is to driving the entireuniversity.
So full-time assistant coacheshaving athletic trainers that
(17:49):
can travel with your teams.
How much effect does that haveon your head coaches knowing
that you're supporting them?
Yeah.
And I try to be honest though,with all of my head coaches,
yeah.
You can't just say oh, I expectyou to win a national
championship.
I expect you to win a conferencechampionship.
You've you hit the nail on thehead where resources do impact
(18:11):
what your ceiling can be.
And I'll be perfectly honest,some of my sports are better
situated than others in theoverall landscape.
When you think about.
Location the type of sportwithin our conference facility,
coaching staff, things likethat.
And it's really important as anathletic director to, to be able
to have those transparentconversations with your coaches
(18:32):
about what you expect from themholistically.
But, winning, competition,recruiting, all that's a part of
that.
And so yeah, I'm doing my bestto try to help each coach.
Keep moving that needle in theright direction and keep being
able to pursue the top end oftheir sport.
But you also have to be arealist and we're funded nicely
(18:53):
and we have good resources, but.
There are also those that arefunded better, with better
resources.
That's right.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's you look at the hopes andthe Illinois Wesleyans of the
world and the Washingtonuniversities and, some of those
schools have endowments that arein the billions with a b.
Yep.
So if you're a school that hasan endowment that's a hundred
(19:15):
million, that's fantastic thatyou know you're doing really
well.
If you have a hundred milliondollars endowment, but you're
competing against schools thathave 10 times the money.
Yep.
So it's, we talked about thedifferences in division threes
within that division.
It's the same thing within yourdepartment.
There's certain things that youcan give to certain sports that
(19:37):
Yeah, you don't have the abilityto give to other coaches in
other sports, right?
And that's just the reality ofathletics.
Talk a little bit about,'causeI'm building an athletic
department right now for acollege that's starting
athletics, so I Oh, very cool.
I'm pick, I'm gonna pick yourbrain on this and I'm actually
gonna be hiring a cross countrycoach at a couple of soccer
coaches in the next month.
(19:57):
Okay.
So this is a great conversationfor us to be having when you're
thinking about hiring a newcoach.
Where does it begin with you?
What are some of those thingsthat you're like, I've got to
have this, I wanna make sure Idon't have this.
Are there anything like thatimmediately comes to mind?
Yeah, it's, I think a differentkind of a conversation when
(20:19):
you're starting from scratch.
Yeah.
Than when you're not for sure.
Because I may make a completelydifferent hire depending on
where that particular program issituated.
I'm talking about the culture ofthat program, the
competitiveness of that program,the robustness of the roster in
that program and Right.
(20:39):
So I always try to ask myself,I, I try to step back and look
without bias, what are weworking with right now?
Do I need, because realisticallyI can get a coach that's really
good in an area.
I can't get a coach very often.
That comes to me, that'sexceptional in every area.
(21:00):
If they were exceptional inevery area, they would be able
to demand a salary that is, I'mpriced out of that market.
So I've gotta step back and askmyself do I need someone that is
an exceptional recruiter that,can drive relationships in high
schools, that can talk tofamilies that, that knows the
best way to connect.
With all the perspective studentathletes and can cultivate their
(21:23):
social media in a certain way,that's really attractive.
So they've got this kind of likemarketing PR type feel to'em.
Do I need someone that is agreat tactician, someone that,
has a lot of pieces, but theyneed to be able to put those
pieces together in unique ways.
Essentially that can OutCo thecompetitors between the lines.
(21:45):
Do I need someone that is acultural builder that, the
culture may not be in a greatspace and they've gotta have.
That kind of background that canreally try to establish the
values and can establish thebehaviors that are associated
with those values and are, isgreat on the accountability side
of things, right?
So I always try to say okay,what is the primary skillset
(22:09):
that I need when I'm making thishigher?
And then I start there.
And kind of work backwards and,look at the strengths and
weaknesses of differentcandidates.
And I always try to target aswell.
If I've got a head coach openingI'll start to get into my
network.
Or even I just try to keep agood handle on the landscape and
I may just straight up hold,call someone say Hey, I've heard
(22:30):
these things about you.
Like these attributes that seemto be really strong with you are
exactly what I'm looking for inthis role.
Can we have a conversation?
So that's how I go about it.
I think if I'm in your shoes andI'm starting something from
scratch it's gonna be probablynumber one factor of can I get
people in the door?
Can I make this thing exciting?
(22:52):
Am I more, I don't know, am Imore outspoken, outgoing?
Am I a good connector?
Can I just get some excitement?
Going here because I've alwaysfound that you need some kind of
like a critical mass on a teamto start exciting better
players.
It's tough to go out and getthat.
(23:13):
Stud player right off the bat.
They need to be able to come fora visit and say, oh, that's a
fun group.
I may be the best player in thatgroup, but I at least I wanna
hang out, I wanna roll mysleeves and get to work with
this group.
I wanna go be a part of it.
So if you're starting fromscratch, you need to have
someone that can build thatinitial group from which to
build.
Y You're right on you it's great'cause you're confirming the way
(23:34):
I was thinking.
'cause as an athletic director Ialways put more weight into
college experience.
Anything else than, but forthese roles I'm hiring now I'm
really diving in.
Okay.
Who are the top club coaches inthat area?
Yeah.
Who's got their hands into acouple hundred kids runner.
Exactly.
Soccer players that maybe willwanna come with them.
(23:55):
'cause there's already areputation there, where we can
build from there.
So I'm thinking about thatdifferently than I ever have
before as a Yeah, for sure.
Yeah.
So I love that.
That's great.
That really helps me.
And I think it gives familiesand high school coaches some in
some perspective too.
And I love the fact that you'repipelining and you're sourcing
(24:18):
and you're not just vettingapplications.
Because I think that's whereathletic programs stop growing.
When our, the hiring peoplearen't going out and going, man,
I've been hearing great thingsabout this person.
I'm gonna give them a call.
I'm gonna see what theirthoughts on our program.
So I love that.
Give us some things that you'redoing with your coaches to help
(24:39):
them grow professionally.
Sure.
This is something that'scrucial.
We ask so much out of ourcoaches.
But most coaches aren't reallytaught how to facilitate deep
engagement with an experience ina way that has particular
outcomes.
At least they're not taught in aformal way.
(24:59):
They figure it out.
Maybe they see other coaches doit.
And so I think it's reallyimportant.
To help coaches learn really howto get their athletes to be
intentional with thinking abouttheir sport as a me, as a
mechanism for growth anddevelopment.
How to teach them to thinkabstractly about how to do
things differently, about howthings might translate into
(25:21):
other concepts, to teach themhow to experi.
Kind of those thought exercisesto create mental models of,
okay, I'm gonna try it out inthis way.
I'm gonna I'm gonna try thesebreathing techniques to help
calm my heart rate before Ishoot foul shots.
And then I'm getting ready to gotake a test or go have an
interview.
Maybe I can try the same thingsthere and then teach them how to
(25:43):
reflect upon those, that didn'twork so well.
Maybe it ain't to go about it inthis way.
And so I think it's important toreally arm and equip.
Our coaches with that.
And then likewise, because weask so much out of them, it's
really important that we givethem support.
We give them access to oneanother.
We try to cultivate ways thatthey can interact with one
another, learn from one anotherbecause, a lot of them are that
(26:05):
they just have such expertiseand they're so great in some
areas and they're so busy,there's not a lot of natural
opportunities for them to engageone another and share that and
help.
Specifically at Otterbein.
We've put together head coachingpods where we match a group up
and, they have the autonomy todecide we wanna meet over lunch,
(26:26):
or we wanna meet over coffee, orthings like that.
And I'm not very prescriptive.
Every now and then I'll throwsomething at'em and say, Hey
here's a thing.
Like I really want coaching podsto talk about the ideal
on-campus recruiting visit.
And I want us to try to createsome commonalities with how we
do that here.
But more often than not, use thespace in the way that you want
it.
That you need it.
(26:47):
You can put someone in the hotseat like, Ooh, this coach does
this one thing really well, andwe wanna just pick her brain
and, learn everything we canabout it.
Or someone may be strugglingwith.
Interaction with a player or aparent or whatever it is, and,
and so they have the opportunityto say, Hey guys I need this
time today, I'm gonna, I'm gonnatalk to you about an issue that
(27:07):
I'm going through and just, anyadvice, any guidance that you
all have.
So they can do that.
We have a resource bank wherepeople can throw in podcasts,
books, images, whatever,something that they've found
meaningful, impactful,inspirational.
And so if they want to grab ontothat.
Know they can.
And oftentimes it's about thingsthat don't even seem like
(27:28):
they're sport specific, but canreally create some great
conversations about work-lifebalance, about prioritization,
about, things like that to justhelp them flourish as human
beings in this coachingenvironment.
So the head coaching pods arebig.
Love that.
We also do like a consistentcurriculum for our younger
coaches our GA's and things likethat to, to really just, help
(27:49):
them learn in areas that theyjust haven't had a lot of
exposure to yet.
And it's of course, open to anycoaches but mandated for the
newer, yeah.
Coaches.
It's awesome because if you'renot thinking about your people
that you have below your headcoaches, if you're not helping
grow them, you're really hurtingyour long-term pipeline to
replace head coaches.
Oh, heck yeah.
Yeah.
(28:09):
Oftentimes that's your easiesthire is that assistant coach
that's been there for five to 10years and already knows the kids
already knows the system alreadyis rolling down that road you
wanna stay on.
Yeah.
For sure.
And you know what, like on.
On the other hand too I wanteveryone that works in my
department to know that mepersonally and Otterbein
structurally, genuinely wantsthem to be able to pursue
(28:33):
whatever their aspirations arein their field.
And so we wanna help with thatgrowth and development.
And if it's to be the best coachthat can be at Otterbein, that's
phenomenal.
But if it's to open up doors toa different level, whatever it
is that's fine too.
In fact, I just gave aprofessional development session
for my GA's on interviewinggetting your foot in the door
(28:56):
like we're trying to coach.
Coach.
That's awesome.
I had some of my full-timecoaches that wanted to come into
the room and I started off withI hope you all know I will not
be offended if you come to meand say, oh, this is the
phenomenal opportunity,whatever.
So great down the road.
That is so great.
'cause if we get the reputationof really trying to help our
people develop and pursue it is,it's important to them.
(29:17):
And that's out there.
More people wanna come workhere, they wanna come coach here
and it does, it grows the tree,the pipeline, whatever you wanna
call it.
Coach, you've been so great withyour time and I know how busy
you are.
Let's end with some advice toyounger coaches out there that
wanna coach at the college leveland wanna make that jump.
(29:38):
Sure.
It depends on where they'recoming from, right?
It's probably different kind ofadvice if you are, just
finishing your career as acollegiate athlete or
professional athlete and youwanna transition into coaching
or if you're.
Coming from the high schoolranks or something along those
lines at the club level, and youwanna get into college coaching
you've I'd say you've got tofigure out how you want to brand
(30:01):
yourself.
I know that sounds I don't know,maybe not authentic, but, you
need to decide are you theperson that wants to be known as
an educator?
Are you the person that wants tobe known as a recruiter?
Are you the person that wants tobe known as whatever it is, and
keep developing holistically thebest you can.
(30:21):
As our earlier conversation,explored, I try to look for
something specific based on whatI need.
And it's really good if you cancome into an interview and say,
I do a phenomenal job athelping, student athletes excel
in the classroom, and here's howI recruit the type of people
that do that.
And here's the structures that Iput in place and that's the
(30:43):
thing I care most about, orsomething different, right?
So I guess like figure out, yourbrand your niche.
Do your best to start connectingwith as many people as possible.
Help them get to know you.
There's, coaching conventions.
You'd be surprised.
Here's like an untapped thing.
How many college coaches arevery willing to let new coaches
(31:05):
just come observe practices?
And so that's a huge opportunityif you can identify, three, four
or five programs that are inyour area that are doing well,
and reach out to the head coachand say, Hey.
This is really cool.
You've had this success, or I'veheard you've been doing these
things in your programs.
I'd really like to learn fromyou.
Would you mind if I came andwatched a practice and picked
(31:26):
your brain a little bit beforeor afterwards?
97 times out of a hundred,they're gonna say yes.
And if you get a no, you just,move on.
But that starts to open up a lotof doors.
It starts to help with your own.
Knowledge base just, meetingpeople and they're gonna
introduce you to people.
And also if you get into aninterview and you can talk about
I observe this coach, and theydo this thing well, but here's
(31:49):
how I put my spin on it.
Now all of a sudden, if you'rean ad, you're like, Ooh, okay.
That person's hustling, they'regetting after it.
They're trying to learn, they'rereflecting.
That's the kind of person Iwanna bring into my program.
I'd really encourage youngcoaches trying to get their foot
in the door to to do that.
I told you this was the lastquestion, but I'm gonna, I'm
gonna ask a follow up to thisone.
What does the cover letter dofor you when you read it that
says, all right, the resume'simportant.
(32:11):
It's huge.
And this is actually one of thethings that we just spent a lot
of time talking about in thatprofessional development session
that I just mentioned.
You would be amazed at how manycover letters I get that I can
tell they just changed the name,like whatever, like maybe it was
to Illinois Wesley and announcedit says Otterbein and sent it
off.
Matt, I, I.
(32:32):
I don't know.
At least 65, 70% of the coverletters I get are like that.
Oh no.
For jobs at a minimum.
Oh, that hurts my soul to hearthat.
But because you're not trying,you're not caring about where
you're going.
Exactly.
Exactly.
So yeah, I'm saying probably twothirds of apps that come in
that's the case.
Probably 99 times out of ahundred.
(32:53):
I push those aside and don'tengage them unless I know that's
a person that I wanna engagewith.
But even then, like all of asudden they've got a strike
against them.
As I start to to review that.
I would say that like for coverletter.
Just put in your homework andthink about what is it that
institution is trying to do,that athletic department is
(33:14):
trying to do, and that programdoes uniquely, and how does that
connect to you as an individualbased on what you care about and
what you bring to the table?
You need to show that you are agood fit for this role, that you
want to be at this institution.
You want to learn from thiscoach.
You want to be in this program.
(33:35):
That's the kind of thing thatmakes me say, okay, all right I
should take this personseriously.
So that's that kind of like thatpersonalization, that care, that
homework has gotta be numberone.
Then number two, I need to seehow their marketing and branding
themselves, what is it that theywant to be the thing that sets
(33:56):
them apart?
And there needs to be a couplesentences that jump off that
paper and say okay.
That's the thing that makes thisindividual special.
And if I don't see that thatgives me pause.
What kind of self-awareness dothey have?
Are they really a good fit orare they not?
I have to start then reallydoing some digging versus if
they at least can initiate thatconversation about what they're
(34:18):
gonna bring to the tableuniquely.
And then you also touched onthat notion of.
I really do appreciate this one.
In a cover letter isn't like anon-negotiable, but I do
appreciate seeing something thatshows they don't think they know
everything.
They have confidence and belief,but they're still trying to hone
(34:39):
their craft and get better as ahuman, as a coach and right.
That's, to me, something that'sreally important, especially
because of the culture thatwe're really, trying to build
here at Otterbein.
I love your points on research,and I think it's so important
the other side of that,'causethere's been so many times over
the last 30 years that I'veapplied for a job and in doing
my research I've said, no, I'mgonna stop applying for this.
(35:03):
It's not, yeah, it doesn't goodfor you.
I'm gonna fail here, or they'regonna make me miserable.
Yeah.
Their value system doesn't matchwith mine.
Yep.
It goes back to what we weretalking about, all the levels of
division three.
Every school has a differentvalue system.
Every school has a differentpurpose, and I try to tell kids
this.
I go, okay.
Maybe you're Christian, but doyou want to go to Bible study
(35:24):
every Wednesday and have a dresscode and you can never have a
boy or a girl in your dormitoryafter eight o'clock?
You might be Christian, youmight like going to church and
your faith might be important toyou, but are you willing to
sacrifice some of those thingsthat you wanted out of a
college?
Or do you appreciate some ofthose things or do you
appreciate that?
And that's what you want, right?
So I love that, and I thinkthat's such great advice.
(35:47):
I don't think we can talk toyoung people, not just young
coaches.
I don't think we can talk toyoung people enough about that
journey they're on, aboutfiguring out who you are.
Whether it's a partner or a job,or a career or a culture or a
geographic location, you gottathink about those things because
(36:07):
there might be the perfect bossand the perfect title, but
everything else around it mightbe terrible for you.
Yep.
So it's such great advice, Dr.
Lot.
You are so good at what you do.
Thank you for continuing tobring your heart and your soul
to your job.
Thank you for sharing it withnot only your people, but the
community and my audience.
(36:29):
And you've got a big fan in meand I'll be cheering for
Otterbein and so long as youthank you.
As long as you and Dr.
Erford are there.
I'm an Otter buying fan.
I appreciate it, Matt.
I appreciate the kind words.
Thank you.
We've had such a memorableseason two of the significant
coaching podcast, but I keephaving conversations that end
with me having more hope for thefuture of college athletics than
(36:51):
when we started.
And today's conversation withDr.
Greg Lott from OtterbeinUniversity was no different.
I am so impressed with his focuson human development and the
mental health of his studentathletes.
His commitment to buildingchampionship level programs at
Otterbein is clear, but whatstands out even more is how he
centers everything on the growthof people, helping coaches stay
(37:13):
healthy, and ensuring studentathletes leave the university
with self-worth confidence andmaturity as they step into the
real world.
If this conversation resonated,make sure you're
subscribed@coachmattrogers.comso you don't miss new episodes
and you get the weekly blog ofsignificance.
And remember, part two of thisconversation drops Monday,
(37:36):
November 11th on the SignificantRecruiting podcast where we dig
into the division threerecruiting landscape and what
families really need tounderstand about that transition
from high school to college.
Until next time, stay focused onwhat you can control.
Stay humble and keep chasingsignificance.
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