November 20, 2025 âą 37 mins
𧠠Heather Macy on Leadership & Culture Building
 In todayâs episode of the Significant Coaching Podcast, Matt sits down with Heather Macy, the new Head Womenâs Basketball Coach at Nova Southeastern University and one of college basketballâs most respected program builders. With over 350 career wins, championship-level turnarounds, and a national reputation for her work in leadership and emotional intelligence, Coach Macy shares the standards and habits that have shaped her coaching career.
From culture building and accountability to developing resilient athletes and creating elite daily environments, this conversation gives coaches practical takeaways they can apply right away.
Before you go, visit CoachMattRogers.com to schedule a free recruiting strategy session, explore the Significant Recruiting book, and check out the brand-new Basketball Recruitâs Journal.
And donât miss Mondayâs Significant Recruiting episode with Brian Olehyâa former coach and a dad using the Significant Recruiting tools and resources to help his daughter Kelsey navigate her recruiting journey with clarity and confidence.
Learn more and connect with Matt Rogers here: https://linktr.ee/coachmattrogers
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:10):
Welcome back to The SignificantCoaching Podcast.
I'm your host, Matt Rogers.
Today's guest is someone who hasbuilt winning cultures
everywhere.
She's gone, coach Heather Macy,the new head women's basketball
coach at Nova Southeastern.
If you know her story, you knowwhat?
She brings over 350 career wins,multiple championship runs,
(00:31):
program rebuilds, and a nationalreputation for emotional
intelligence, leadership, andelite.
Player development.
She's coached at every level,spoken on some of the biggest
stages in our profession.
Authored a number one rankedleadership book, and she
continues to pour into coachesall over the country.
In this conversation, we getinto what makes her teams
(00:53):
compete, how she builds trust,the standards that never change,
and why emotional intelligencemight be the most important
separator in today's game.
Before we dive in, make sure youcheck out coach matt rogers.com
where you'll find my book,significant Recruiting and the
brand new Basketball recruitsjournal.
If you're a coach, a parent, orrecruit, those tools will help
(01:15):
you stay organized, stayintentional in your recruiting
process, and stay ahead of thegame.
Let's get into it.
Here's my conversation withCoach Heather Macy.
I.
Coach Macy, so great to talk toyou.
Thanks for being on the show.
Hey, Matt, thank you so much forhaving me.
I really appreciate it.
Coach, can we just talk hoopsfor a little bit?
(01:37):
We can talk hoops all day, everyday.
I was the head college coach fora long time.
I got out to raise my kids andthis is my basketball Jones
being doing this podcast.
But I've been going to lots ofpractices and things like that.
And if you were closer, I livein Colorado.
I'd be at your practice tomorrowif you'd let me.
When you wake up in the morning.
(01:58):
What drives you to keep doingthis?
Because you've been doing thisat a really high level for a
long time.
Is it practices, is it offense?
Is it defense?
Is it relationships?
Is it recruiting?
Is there that one thing thatyou're like, I always have
energy to do this?
I'll tell you, it's reallyevolved for me.
This is your 26 in collegecoaching and I, embarrassingly
(02:21):
will tell you that early in mycareer it probably drove me to.
Get the next best job.
Sign a top recruiting class, winanother championship.
And those were really my driversand I learned a long time ago
that's really how that lightwill burn out very quickly.
And I had an athletic directortell me, love things that will
(02:43):
love you back.
And I thought that wasincredible advice for a young.
Driven coach, and I wish Iwould've learned that quicker.
But now my perspective, mywisdom, I love things that love
me back.
So my driving force, ourplayers, our staff the amazing
people that I get to work withevery single day, that's what
(03:04):
gets me up.
It gets me really fired up andexcited.
And I will tell you here in DavyFort Lauderdale the weather is
about 85.
So I'm not envious of you beingin Colorado.
We're actually having abeautiful day.
It's in the mid sixties, almost70 today, but I'm with you.
I hear you.
In, in about three weeks.
I'm gonna be wishing I was onyour staff.
(03:25):
I'll tell you that.
I was a run and gun press untilI can run'em off the floor kind
of coach.
Tell me if I'm wrong, but you'vegot a little bit of that in you.
I think we did it really well.
Way back in the old days, wewere at one point leading the
country in scoring, leading thecountry in steals, and I
(03:47):
jokingly say in leading thecountry in fouls.
But that's the problem with thatsystem.
Yes, I do think we need to shootit before we turn it over, and I
think if we can get it to therim and send a bunch of them to
go offensive, rebound, we aremuch better.
Historically, we have been areally good basketball team.
Our whole idea here is to do thesame.
(04:10):
And I think that we can attractthe quality caliber athlete to
really do that at an elitelevel.
And you've done it everywhereyou've gone.
For you, how much of it isbasketball players?
How much of it is, I've gottahave that balance between
toughness shooters.
(04:31):
Smarts.
Where is that at for you, in, inbuilding the teams that score so
high for you?
You, your teams typically areone or two in scoring in your
conference.
Where does that all begin foryou?
I think it, it all starts withthe players, but understanding.
What type of player and whattype of people you want to coach
(04:51):
and what fits best inside thesystem.
So we look for two types ofplayers, what we call are
switchable and dependables.
And so a switchable for us isthe kid that's somewhere 5, 10,
6 foot tall or so that can guardin multiple positions in
multiple ways.
Offensively.
Able to stick to open three, butat the same time be able to take
(05:15):
her in and post up a smallerplayer.
So those are like switchable andallows us to generate offense
from our defense and then thedependables.
And so the dependables are thekids that we always can count on
to set the right screens, topull the rebounds when we need
it, and to go make the rightplace.
So when we're on the roadrecruiting, our staff is
constantly communicating inthose same terms.
(05:38):
I found a great switchable or Ifound an amazing dependable, and
I think we need probably abalance of switchable and
dependables.
And then we leave inside of ourroster somewhere, two to three
players that are what we callspecialists.
And so those are kids that a,shoot it way better than
(05:59):
everybody else.
Or be a bigger kid that we canthrow it to the post when we
need a bucket.
And so I think what we've beenable to do in just a relatively
short amount of time is to beable to really create a 15
player roster that every singleone of those kids fit inside of
this blueprint.
And our staff all played in thisexact same system.
(06:21):
And so their ability to identifyhas been just absolutely
tremendous.
And what they've been able todo.
And then I know who I can coachand who I can.
Yeah.
And what their personalitieslook like, what their work ethic
looks like.
And I'm in a stage right nowwhere I really won't compromise
that.
Meaning that kid who just reallytoughs to be around every day
(06:44):
and doesn't wanna work as hardas it takes to be successful.
We have the ability not to.
Go down that path and we've beenable to, I think, put a lot of
like-mindedness and a lot ofalignment in the human beings
together.
And then they all from a talentperspective, fit under those
three different criteria.
I love that.
(07:04):
I always sent my staff out tofind a junkyard dog.
I wanted that kid that couldjust, that was just gonna
outwork everybody out.
Rebound everybody, defend.
To the point that they wouldscare the person they were
defending.
Does that person fit into thatswitchable, dependable
specialist area?
I guess it depends what they're,if they're six foot tall and
(07:25):
they're long and athletic andable to shoot the three to do
it.
But no I think to be able to sitdown and guard is I think we can
teach a lot of those things.
I think it's also a willingness.
I also think if you have aplayer who has incredibly high
competitive index.
The competitive index willoverride anything else.
So if the competitive index isreally high and what it requires
(07:47):
to win is to sit down and guardlike crazy and rebound like
crazy, people with highcompetitive indexes in those
moments will rise to thoseoccasion.
Absolutely.
And I, and that's where mythought process was with the
junkyard dog.
Give me a competitor.
(08:08):
I'll teach'em how to doeverything else.
I know, quite honest with you,I've been doing it so long, I'm
not gonna teach'em how to do theother stuff.
And it's interesting I've had somuch experience that an
assistant may bring a player tothe table and go.
Oh, coach, you can teach'em howto do X, whatever that looks
(08:29):
like.
And I go no.
We go recruit X.
That they know how to do it.
Can we refine this and can wetake that percentage up right by
seven 10% sure.
With some of the things we do,but to bring it up 30%?
Probably not.
And the funny thing, when I wasan assistant, it would the, in
(08:49):
the recruiting process, the headcoach would never end.
Hey, what's their free throwshooting percentage in
recruiting?
Yeah.
And so we would get'em and theywould be a terrible free throw
shooter and never be able toget, be in the game, late game
because they weren't making freethrows.
And so I learned as an assistantthat like if you've got a, if
part of this whole equation andyou're in a league that you know
(09:12):
is gonna be a two or threepossession game every night,
because most of the time four tofive bid NCAA Tournament League
are going to be as such.
They better make sure that therotational players are a certain
percentage so that they canclose games for you.
What does that recruiting looklike for you guys?
(09:33):
When you're out on the road?
Are you looking for areplacement or are you looking
for a player and then you'lladapt?
What does that look like for youguys?
When you're sitting at a on acourt and you're watching a kid
play?
Are there things that like,okay, that kid does, what does A
or does B, is that important toyou?
(09:53):
Oh, there's no question aboutit, and I think what we've gotta
do is continue.
We feel is get better playersthan what we have on the roster.
Right?
And then our challenge to thekids at home on that roster is
to, can you outwork our abilityto recruit and identify talent?
(10:14):
So if we can get both groupsworking together, so our staff
working like crazy to have moretalent that is on the current
roster and our current roster,recognizing.
That I'm gonna outwork my talentevery day, and then these two
groups come together.
It can really be magical.
I agree.
And it's, and it's the best wayto recruit too, because your
(10:38):
upperclassmen know that there'sno slouches coming in.
They've gotta be, they've gottatake that next step every year
too.
I think that as you recruithighly competitive people who
understand that they joining theprogram that.
It's striving in the nationalspotlight every single year.
Yeah.
I think that competitiveadvantage is huge.
(10:58):
I think the kids' work ethic ishuge because otherwise, simply
talented players don't wanna bein this kind of an environment.
We're in a elite environmentthat if you're not striving
every day in your life to beelite, not only your, the
basketball practice or thebasketball element, like we're
looking for people.
(11:19):
Who wanna be elite in every areaof life, whether it be
academically or socially.
It's just, it's who they areevery day.
What does it mean to you whenyou were interviewing for this
job, knowing that the men'sprogram was so successful?
Did that, was that somethingthat you looked at and go,
(11:39):
they're doing this right?
This is the school that I wantto be at because of how they're
competing.
Did that do anything for you?
Coach Crutchfield is the one ofthe most amazing people that
I've ever met.
And so to be able to work withhim every day and watch his
practices, I feel like I'm in abasketball school and, I'm
(12:00):
learning, I'm taking away, I'mstalling and implementing it.
And no, it was a huge element ofme knowing that this was the
right fit because of.
Such similarities in, we, wewanna play fast.
And they've proven that thesystem works and I've I was
picking his brain every chance Icould get and begging him to
teach me the intricacies of thesystem.
(12:21):
And yeah, I guess workingalongside him every day allows
me to do that, which has beensuch an advantage.
And we've installed so many ofthe different things that I'm
just really appreciative of him.
He's been nothing but incrediblykind and.
The way that they run theirprogram and the way their guys
are, and their staff, andthere's just really great
alignment with with both themen's and women's staffs here at
(12:42):
Nova.
I I think there's more trophiesto come for both of you.
I'm so excited about thatpartnership and what you're
bringing down there.
Coach, when you look at yourbackground, when you look at
your history you've been at anumber of schools, you look at
Pfeiffer, your first year, youwent 14 and 15.
You look at East Carolina, youhad a 12 and 19 year.
Early on Greensboro, you had asix and nine year.
(13:04):
Barry, you went nine and 19, andthen that following year, you're
one of the most dominantprograms, not only in your
league, but in the country.
What do you feel like you aredoing that you can go in and
build a program that quickly?
'cause that's so rare.
If you can improve your win-lossrecord from year one to year two
(13:24):
by four or five wins, it's alot.
You've had seasons where you'veimproved by 8, 10, 12 wins.
What do you feel like you'redoing differently when you're
taking over a program?
First I think you gotta infusethe passion behind it, and then
you've gotta make sure you'vegot the right people behind it.
And so sometimes that takes ayear.
Yeah.
(13:44):
And I understand that sometimesit takes longer and I know a lot
of coaches are saying, Hey, weneed some patience.
But that's really not thebusiness that we're in college
athletics For sure.
Our big thing is, let's behonest with people, and I think
that has shown some of thereasons that we're able to turn
programs around relativelyquickly is the honesty.
(14:05):
And we tell the truth in therecruiting process.
We tell the kids the truth everyday, and I think that they can
appreciate that.
Combined with that, we're superconsistent as coaching staff and
we're consistent in our decisionmaking.
We're consistent in ourcommunication, and I think
because of that, even if itdidn't work out and we made
(14:27):
changes, I think the respect isthere on, hey, that makes sense
to do it.
And then the way that we workand the way that we prepare.
Absolutely not for everybody.
And so identifying the peoplethat it's for and the people,
it's not that make'em bad, thatmake'em good but we do different
types stuff.
Yeah.
And we need that same kind ofmindset and that same kind of
(14:49):
mentality, but we also know whowe are and what we want to do.
And every year we aren'tchanging everything.
And it's, so I think some ofthat is really important as
well.
Is that when kids are in oursystem for one year, they get
pretty good when they're in itfor two man, they're really
(15:10):
good.
And so then all of a sudden, ifthey're in it two and three and
four years, you're starting tosee some incredible things.
Audrey Jennings, who was with ustwo years at Greensboro then was
with us and her final two yearsat Barry.
So she played inside the systemfor four years.
She's currently playingprofessional basketball, but she
scored 1700 points in how weplay.
(15:31):
Wow.
Four year period of time.
And so that kind of thing Ithink speaks to the system that
the longer that players play init, the better that they
continue to grow and get.
And I think that's really allyoung people wanna do is see
growth, see improvement.
And I think because we know whowe are, they know what we do
(15:53):
every day.
They start to get.
Incredibly comfortable in how weplay, and then they start to get
better and better inside of it.
And I think you start to seethat maybe with some of the
win-loss records.
You've definitely proven thatcoach.
Without a doubt.
I love that philosophy.
Let's do a little snapshot withyou.
A little masterclass.
(16:13):
I'm gonna, I'm gonna give youjust something that happens in
practice.
I'm always intrigued.
We have so many high schoolcoaches and college coaches that
listen to this.
I'm always intrigued how a coachhandles.
The little things because Ithink most great coaches they
teach and coach the littlethings so well that you don't
even realize that's the reasonthey're winning games.
(16:35):
So you're watching practice andone of your players doesn't turn
and hit on a three pointer.
They just, their hands are up.
They're looking at the rim.
How do you respond to that?
Okay, so first in our press, allfive press, and then secondly,
in our rebounding, all fiverebound.
(16:57):
So I think based upon that,everyone on the court
understands we don't do thingsin twos and threes and fours.
We do things in fives.
Everyone understands that.
So whether you're guarding atthe three point line or you're
boxing out at the block.
Everyone's expected to reboundand defensive rebounding for us,
Matt, we call'em tough defensiveboards, so we call'em TD Bs.
(17:19):
Yep.
'cause nobody this day and ageis simply going to rebounding
the bulk.
If you're rebounding with yourhands.
People are coming through that.
You gotta rebound, be willing torebound outside of area and with
your body.
So if you're checking out from acloseout, we call it a checkout.
So you're simply turning andlooking to make sure that
shooter's not going right, butyou've gotta go pursue with your
(17:40):
hands above your shoulders, soyou are alert and ready to grab
it with two hands.
So I think when you go into itevery single time and you go all
five, press all five, T, D, b,period.
Now, interesting enough for us,we also send all five to the
offensive glass.
The big, my big thing withrebounding, and we really
(18:01):
emphasize it, is it's the onething in basketball that you do
on both ends of the court.
Yep.
So the rebounding perspective isoffensive rebounding and
defensive rebounding.
So it must be really importantto win and how you rebound.
So we emphasize it, we stressit, and we reward it.
And I think that you seeconsistently, our offensive
(18:22):
rebounding numbers get reallygawdy.
That's how basketball games arewon.
That's how championships arewon.
So I love it, but I'll press youa little bit.
How do you handle it as a coach?
Do you let it go?
Are you coaching?
Are you coaching the whole, arewill you stop a practice?
What?
What will you do when you seesomebody not buying into that
(18:44):
five or not playing their role?
We have segments of practice.
So our segments of practice.
Consist of segments where we'recompeting, like today was a
competing practice.
They knew what we're doing andwe were all five oh dry stuff
last night and some fitnessthings inside of it.
So it's also the rhythm.
It's more around like a footballpractice.
(19:07):
So Sunday we talked, and todaywe competed.
Okay.
And so inside of a competingpractice, no, I'm not gonna blow
the whistle for that.
Okay.
And stop.
I'm looking for the responseafter you give up the offensive
rebound.
And how quickly can we move onto the next thing?
Now we'll debrief, and duringthe debrief we'll go back
(19:29):
through and visit on some ofthose kinds of things.
Now, if we start to see thatplayer made one mistake, we move
on from that.
But if that player isconsistently doing that and
giving up offensive rebounds.
We'll work individually withthem.
We'll stress and emphasize thatwhile we're live coaching.
And if that doesn't adjust andthat becomes a repetitive
problem, it's very difficult toplay when you're doing that and
(19:52):
not really buying into beingable to rebound it.
The way you just explained itwas that who you were 20 years
ago, would you have respondedthe same way?
Oh man.
No I'm proud to say that I'm noteven who I am.
Who I'm not even the same coachI was a year ago.
Yes.
Let alone 20 years ago.
I think that's the evolution ofwhat you want as a professional,
(20:15):
right?
Is growing, maturing.
Evolving with the times.
That's the, everybody's losingtheir minds about this transfer
portal stuff.
And yeah I jokingly laugh andgo, we were doing the transfer
portal a decade ago.
This is how we were buildingprograms and doing it then.
And so I really think we havealways been.
(20:38):
A type of program that it's not,this is how we've always done
it, this is what we're gonna do.
I think we've continued toevolve and continue to grow, and
definitely I have.
Yeah.
Individually as a head coach.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
You have to have the successyou've had now you've got Auburn
Montgomery coming up here theend of the week, right?
That's your first one.
(20:58):
We do.
What are you doing differentlyin practices this week in
preparing for them?
Or are you that coach that says,this is what we do, we're gonna
prepare for, to do what we doreally well?
Or how much time are you settingaside to prepare for Auburn
Montgomery's offense anddefense?
I am notorious for the level ofpreparation.
(21:22):
Meaning I'm like no stoneunturned.
I probably watch more film andlook at more stats and analytics
more, probably more than Ireally need to.
But it's just super importantfor me that we give our team the
best possible chance to win.
And I think the way our coachingstaff prepares is really
important is specifically me asthe head coach.
(21:43):
Our assistants will have thescouting report, but.
I pretty, that's, I joke with'em.
I'm like, you guys are typing upthe scalp.
But I do every scalp, right?
Meaning I am watching full gametape when, right now, it's very
different than it was in the olddays, Matt, where everybody was
driving wherever and exchangingDVDs and BH s tapes and this
(22:05):
software and the way that.
We're able to get into thesynergies and all the other
analytical software that we'vegot.
It's just really lazy.
You could just click and playand so you could put these
scouts together relativelyquickly.
But I am pretty meticulousrelative to watching full game
tape.
So we'll go back and look at.
Their last year stuff andreturning players and then where
(22:28):
players transferred in from andpull their individual clips from
those schools.
I think we do a really nice jobhaving our team prepared at the
same time focusing on what weknow we do well that we've gotta
do every single night.
Emphasizing that, is there apoint where you worry about.
Overwhelming your kids.
(22:48):
This was always my concern thatI was giving them too much to
remember, to think about insteadof, this is what we do, we're
gonna go do it.
Yes, we're gonna be ready forthis pick and roll.
We're gonna be ready for thistype of press, a trap or this
type of screening that they do.
Do you ever worry about givingthe girls too much?
(23:09):
Not really.
Okay.
To be quite honest with you, Ithink that I think they embrace
it.
I think that they go.
They want to know.
I think that they they cravethat.
And I think it also calms someof their nerves.
Yeah.
Like they're going in it andthey're saying true.
No, there's no surprises.
Like we are well prepared.
Things that would happen on thefringe we're well prepared.
(23:30):
And I would tell them like,we've got game goals, numerical
game goals.
So we have six of those.
And I'll go into and go, guys,we're gonna have to reach all
six of these goals to win thisgame.
There's some games, we go intoit and I go, listen, we could go
two of six and still win.
But they know as we're going inthese numbers and we'll show'em.
It's crazy through the yearsthat the players know that these
(23:53):
game goal numbers are indicativeof whether or not we win the
game or not.
So don't get so caught up withwhat's happening at the
scoreboard.
Stay focused inside of ourtimeout and staying with this
process of.
We are right on track in thegame goals, and if you'll stay
focused on the game goals, theend result will take care of
itself, even though maybe in thesecond quarter.
(24:15):
Yeah.
It doesn't quite seem like itwould.
Yeah.
There's a ton of significance tothat.
Would you mind sharing your sixnumerical goals?
Sure.
I'd be glad to.
So we look at how we'rerebounding and now we do this
every year.
So if coaches are payingattention to this you've gotta
go through it and look at whatkind of team do you have
relative to your competition,right?
(24:37):
And where the rebounding marginshould, could be, and set
something that makes sense.
Sure, I would like to be plus 10and rebounding, but depending
upon the kind of team I have,maybe plus five would be
successful this year or pluseight.
Yeah.
So you would need to set that init.
Then we have a deflection goal.
(24:57):
And so a similar thing, like ifwe're playing really up tempo,
the deflection goal could beplus 40.
If you know that you're gonnaplay a little more of a matchup
zone the majority of the year,you don't wanna set that number
weirdly, and you also don'twanna set that number that it
doesn't fit the tempo of yourteam.
The same thing with what we'redoing charges.
(25:18):
So we feel like a charge is.
Kinda like a dunk in the men'sgame.
Absolutely.
It, the ability to take acharge.
Not only do you get the ballback, you give the other team a
foul.
And right now women's collegebasketball's four quarters and
you're shooting two after thefifth.
(25:39):
That's so significant.
How huge, quickly can you getinto the bonus is a really big
deal.
And then.
I think that teams thatunderstand value, understand
winning.
So the less than 15 turnovers,whatever that number is for the
coach at that year.
And even though we're playingfast we wanna shoot it before we
(26:01):
turn it over and get it to therim.
So we need to turn it less than15 times to get the amount of
shot attempts that we wanna getevery single night.
So teams that understandwinning, understand value, they
also understand free throws.
So that's our fifth one is thefree throw percentage, and our
final one is fill goalpercentage.
So I think those are the sixthat we have factored in as
(26:24):
winning and losing.
And how many have really gottahit?
What do you, is free throws howmany you attempts or are you
looking for a percentage above75%.
And then obviously we do areally interesting thing I, we
implemented this year in CoachCrutchfield.
Really stresses it, and it'sbeen huge for us.
(26:44):
We keep fouled individual foulsthroughout practice.
I love that.
And then we've got our twoteams.
And so we, when we get into ourlive segments, we'll go ahead
and say okay, and we learn ourplayers like you're going into
the live segment with threefouls because we'll give
thousand the drills.
You're three s going into thelive segment to, to train that
(27:05):
kid and how to.
Practice and play with threefouls.
And then the other part I thinkhas been really cool in how we
are gonna play uptempo wise isthat, so we are in a live
segment and now individual foulsare now team fouls because we do
divide the teams and we don'tswitch'em up as we go.
So we have the teams divided andwe'll start the live segment by
(27:26):
saying, Hey, you guys have oneteam file, or you guys are
already at five.
So that every everything in livesegment, every foul is two free
throws.
Which will adjust what we'rerunning defensively.
And it's also adjusting like howaggressive they can be in
passing lanes or inside oftraffic.
And it speaks volumes'cause it'ssame thing they're gonna be
(27:49):
hearing in timeouts and at theend of quarters.
But the problem is that ascoaches.
We tend to only talk about thatstuff inside of the games.
Yeah.
Smart.
So for us, yeah we coach 20 someyears, but these kids, play, I
dunno, play 30 games a year.
They're playing 120 total careergames.
And that's the only time thatreally the coaches are talking
(28:10):
about some of the strategy orthat they learn how to play it
without trouble and then wewonder why they're outta rhythm.
Yep.
So I think one of the bestthings that we've really done a
nice job of this year.
Is creating a practiceenvironment that will simulate
game days.
I love that.
Yeah it's so huge and it's sonecessary in terms of getting
(28:30):
the kids to understand whatwe're really after and what
we're doing.
You can't expect them to learnthat in the middle of a game, so
I love that.
What was the field goal numbercoach that you're looking for?
45%.
45 or higher?
What have you found since you'veimplemented that?
It makes your players thinkingabout good shots and what a good
(28:52):
shot is.
Has that helped?
Oh, I think you can tell theplayers who are gonna be better
scorers, those guys in drills inpractice with no defense and
they don't miss, and that thekids who probably aren't gonna
score the ball very well thatthey miss open looks in the
paint.
No one guard'em.
So you can see those percentagesand we have a shooting off
(29:15):
season workout plan and, we cantell'em like, listen, if you're
not shooting at 70% with no Dbehind the three point line,
like you're not gonna beanywhere close to taking shots
and games.
So that's the part that youngpeople have gotta figure out is
how to practice at game pace.
How to hit an appropriatepercentage that will translate
(29:37):
to success inside of games.
So that's not some arbitrarynumber, like we know our league
and how good our league is andif you're shooting in the
thirties you're not gonna win.
It's just it's a simplemathematical equation.
And yes, coaches do we need tobe thinking about who's taking
the shot and are they, are wegetting high quality?
(29:59):
Percentage shots.
All of those things obviouslyfactor in games, but it also
factors in what kind of shotsthey're taking.
When they're in getting extrashots up on their own or with
one of our coaches.
Does that then transfer intowhat we call system shots and it
shots that kid will see insideof a game?
Love it.
Coach, I wanna respect yourtime.
(30:20):
I know you're limited today.
Would you mind giving one pieceof advice to parents that are
going through the recruitingprocess and what you recommend
they focus on if they want, iftheir child wants to play at the
next level?
Yeah, I'd be glad to.
Recruiting is an inexact scienceand there is not the same
(30:41):
process.
One kid goes through that, thenext one or the one or two or
five after that will go through,which I understand is difficult
for families to understand.
The other part that familiestend to have a hard time with is
that, they go through thisprocess one time maybe.
Maybe they have two kids in thefamily that were college
athletes, which doesn't happenthat often.
(31:02):
So maybe you go through it twicein your lifetime.
Whereas college coaches we'resigning somewhere between three
to 10 probably.
Players every single year,right?
So it's a scenario where youstart looking into the
communities that people live in.
And the advice that parents aregetting are advice from people
(31:23):
who, A, may have never playedcollege sports, or B, never
coach college sports.
And that's who you're seekingadvice from and guidance.
And I can imagine it would beoverwhelming.
I can also imagine that that itwould be some anxiety to it.
I would tell you this, if youcould take all of the people
you're asking advice from andsuggestions from and remove the
(31:47):
noise of it, and be relentlesswith distractions and simply
keep your kid working at thecraft and getting better, you
won't have to worry about therecruiting process, because the
recruiting process will come toyou And, let's just be really
direct, in a.
A dating relationship, when heis really into you, he is really
(32:10):
into you.
Recruiting is the same way.
It sure is.
If that staff is into you andthat school's into you, you are
not gonna have to question ifthey're into you or have someone
else double check.
You are gonna clearly know thatis occurring.
And I do suggest having arelationship with.
It be your high school coach oryour club coach, and too many
(32:32):
parents and too many playersright now had adversarial
relationships with those folks.
And I do think that's a mistakebecause it is nice to have
someone that can call on yourbehalf.
It's no different than going tointerview for a job and your
current boss is given you agreat reference.
I think it's super importantthat high school coach is able
to say incredible hard workertotally a competitor, whatever
(32:56):
those things are is reallyimportant.
And that's really how you showup every single day and do
things because the majority ofcollege coaches are doing their
due diligence and there's notgonna be a lot of secrets.
And there's definitely notsecrets on if you're a good
player or a bad player becausethe way that we're able to see
video and look at the stats andthings online.
(33:19):
Similar question.
Last one.
For that 16, 17-year-old playerthat would love to play at
Inova, love to play at that highlevel D two level in that great
conference.
How do they get your attentioncoach if they live in California
and you're not just gonna runinto'em, or they live in
Minnesota and you're not justgonna run into'em you may not
(33:39):
find them know about them.
How do they let you know theywanna be recruited?
I think the best thing for usanyway is to have your coach
call me and tell me about youand that you understand that to
play at a level like this youcould have played division one
basketball if you'd chosen to,because to really compete at
(34:00):
what we're doing.
We're a four bid league.
So we are kinda like the SEC ACCvery much Yeah.
Of division one.
And so there's not players inour league that didn't have an
opportunity, haven't already.
Played division one basketballand they've chosen a different
memorial rewarding path to behere with us.
So I think a simple phone callmakes sense and it makes sense
(34:21):
why you wanna come fromCalifornia or come from
Minnesota to Florida.
It makes sense because there'ssome sort of reason behind it.
It's a great academic model.
There's family in here.
Because whatever that looks likeis that, Hey, I took said, who's
top 25 in the country and we'recalling everybody top 25 in the
country because this kid is thatcompetitive that she wants to
(34:42):
jump into an establishedprogram.
Whatever the reasoning may be, Ithink it needs to make sense.
Yeah.
To go and do that.
But a direct phone call, I thinkgreater than a mass.
I agree.
I agree.
And you wanna know that they'vedone their research.
You wanna know that they'recalling you for a reason because
you want, you wanna have'em forfour years if you can have'em,
right?
(35:03):
Yeah, no question.
And there's no guarantees rightnow with the climate of
recruiting, how long you'regonna have.
But as long as we may have'em,we just want the greatest impact
that we can get.
And and so we put a lot of pridein recruiting the family,
recruiting the kid.
And having that relationship,regardless if they're with us a
year, or four years, is thatit's gonna be a life lifelong
(35:24):
relationship.
Coach, thank you so much foryour time today.
It's an honor to talk to you.
I've been following your careerfor a long time and it's just so
impressive what you continue todo and I think Nova just lock
themselves up another futurehall of famer.
You guys are gonna have a, a lotof fun over the next few years,
so good luck the rest of theyear.
But thank you again for yourtime.
(35:44):
Thanks for the kind words andthanks so much for having me on.
And I'm gonna tell yousomething, I'm the lucky one to
be here because NSU, they'vetreated me incredibly kind and
given us the resources to go andbe super successful.
So again thank you so much forhaving me on.
My pleasure coach.
Good luck and with AuburnMontgomery this week.
And we'll be cheering for you.
(36:05):
Okay, thanks.
Go sharks.
That'll do it for today'sepisode with Coach Heather Macy.
Anytime you get to learn fromsomeone who has rebuilt
programs, elevated cultures, andcommitted her life to teaching
leadership at the highest level,it's a gift.
I hope you took as much fromthis conversation as I did.
If you're a parent, a coach, ora student athlete looking for
(36:26):
clarity in the recruitingprocess, remember you can
schedule a free recruitingstrategy session with
me@coachmattrogers.com.
You'll also find the significantrecruiting book and my brand new
Basketball recruits Journal, twotools designed to help families
stay organized, confident, andintentional through every part
(36:46):
of their recruiting journey.
And make sure you come back onMonday for our special
significant recruiting episodewith Brian Olo.
A former coach and a dad who hasspent the past year using the
significant recruiting tools andresources to help his daughter
Kelsey navigate her recruitingpath.
It's a powerful conversation andone that will help every family
(37:08):
understand what this processlooks like when it's done with
purpose.
Until next time, stay focused onwhat you can control.
Stay humble and keep chasingsignificance.
Welcome back to The SignificantCoaching Podcast.
I'm your host, Matt Rogers.
Today's guest is someone who hasbuilt winning cultures
everywhere.
She's gone, coach Heather Macy,the new head women's basketball
coach at Nova Southeastern.
If you know her story, you knowwhat?
She brings over 350 career wins,multiple championship runs,
(00:31):
program rebuilds, and a nationalreputation for emotional
intelligence, leadership, andelite.
Player development.
She's coached at every level,spoken on some of the biggest
stages in our profession.
Authored a number one rankedleadership book, and she
continues to pour into coachesall over the country.
In this conversation, we getinto what makes her teams
(00:53):
compete, how she builds trust,the standards that never change,
and why emotional intelligencemight be the most important
separator in today's game.
Before we dive in, make sure youcheck out coach matt rogers.com
where you'll find my book,significant Recruiting and the
brand new Basketball recruitsjournal.
If you're a coach, a parent, orrecruit, those tools will help
(01:15):
you stay organized, stayintentional in your recruiting
process, and stay ahead of thegame.
Let's get into it.
Here's my conversation withCoach Heather Macy.
I.
Coach Macy, so great to talk toyou.
Thanks for being on the show.
Hey, Matt, thank you so much forhaving me.
I really appreciate it.
Coach, can we just talk hoopsfor a little bit?
(01:37):
We can talk hoops all day, everyday.
I was the head college coach fora long time.
I got out to raise my kids andthis is my basketball Jones
being doing this podcast.
But I've been going to lots ofpractices and things like that.
And if you were closer, I livein Colorado.
I'd be at your practice tomorrowif you'd let me.
When you wake up in the morning.
(01:58):
What drives you to keep doingthis?
Because you've been doing thisat a really high level for a
long time.
Is it practices, is it offense?
Is it defense?
Is it relationships?
Is it recruiting?
Is there that one thing thatyou're like, I always have
energy to do this?
I'll tell you, it's reallyevolved for me.
This is your 26 in collegecoaching and I, embarrassingly
(02:21):
will tell you that early in mycareer it probably drove me to.
Get the next best job.
Sign a top recruiting class, winanother championship.
And those were really my driversand I learned a long time ago
that's really how that lightwill burn out very quickly.
And I had an athletic directortell me, love things that will
(02:43):
love you back.
And I thought that wasincredible advice for a young.
Driven coach, and I wish Iwould've learned that quicker.
But now my perspective, mywisdom, I love things that love
me back.
So my driving force, ourplayers, our staff the amazing
people that I get to work withevery single day, that's what
(03:04):
gets me up.
It gets me really fired up andexcited.
And I will tell you here in DavyFort Lauderdale the weather is
about 85.
So I'm not envious of you beingin Colorado.
We're actually having abeautiful day.
It's in the mid sixties, almost70 today, but I'm with you.
I hear you.
In, in about three weeks.
I'm gonna be wishing I was onyour staff.
(03:25):
I'll tell you that.
I was a run and gun press untilI can run'em off the floor kind
of coach.
Tell me if I'm wrong, but you'vegot a little bit of that in you.
I think we did it really well.
Way back in the old days, wewere at one point leading the
country in scoring, leading thecountry in steals, and I
(03:47):
jokingly say in leading thecountry in fouls.
But that's the problem with thatsystem.
Yes, I do think we need to shootit before we turn it over, and I
think if we can get it to therim and send a bunch of them to
go offensive, rebound, we aremuch better.
Historically, we have been areally good basketball team.
Our whole idea here is to do thesame.
(04:10):
And I think that we can attractthe quality caliber athlete to
really do that at an elitelevel.
And you've done it everywhereyou've gone.
For you, how much of it isbasketball players?
How much of it is, I've gottahave that balance between
toughness shooters.
(04:31):
Smarts.
Where is that at for you, in, inbuilding the teams that score so
high for you?
You, your teams typically areone or two in scoring in your
conference.
Where does that all begin foryou?
I think it, it all starts withthe players, but understanding.
What type of player and whattype of people you want to coach
(04:51):
and what fits best inside thesystem.
So we look for two types ofplayers, what we call are
switchable and dependables.
And so a switchable for us isthe kid that's somewhere 5, 10,
6 foot tall or so that can guardin multiple positions in
multiple ways.
Offensively.
Able to stick to open three, butat the same time be able to take
(05:15):
her in and post up a smallerplayer.
So those are like switchable andallows us to generate offense
from our defense and then thedependables.
And so the dependables are thekids that we always can count on
to set the right screens, topull the rebounds when we need
it, and to go make the rightplace.
So when we're on the roadrecruiting, our staff is
constantly communicating inthose same terms.
(05:38):
I found a great switchable or Ifound an amazing dependable, and
I think we need probably abalance of switchable and
dependables.
And then we leave inside of ourroster somewhere, two to three
players that are what we callspecialists.
And so those are kids that a,shoot it way better than
(05:59):
everybody else.
Or be a bigger kid that we canthrow it to the post when we
need a bucket.
And so I think what we've beenable to do in just a relatively
short amount of time is to beable to really create a 15
player roster that every singleone of those kids fit inside of
this blueprint.
And our staff all played in thisexact same system.
(06:21):
And so their ability to identifyhas been just absolutely
tremendous.
And what they've been able todo.
And then I know who I can coachand who I can.
Yeah.
And what their personalitieslook like, what their work ethic
looks like.
And I'm in a stage right nowwhere I really won't compromise
that.
Meaning that kid who just reallytoughs to be around every day
(06:44):
and doesn't wanna work as hardas it takes to be successful.
We have the ability not to.
Go down that path and we've beenable to, I think, put a lot of
like-mindedness and a lot ofalignment in the human beings
together.
And then they all from a talentperspective, fit under those
three different criteria.
I love that.
(07:04):
I always sent my staff out tofind a junkyard dog.
I wanted that kid that couldjust, that was just gonna
outwork everybody out.
Rebound everybody, defend.
To the point that they wouldscare the person they were
defending.
Does that person fit into thatswitchable, dependable
specialist area?
I guess it depends what they're,if they're six foot tall and
(07:25):
they're long and athletic andable to shoot the three to do
it.
But no I think to be able to sitdown and guard is I think we can
teach a lot of those things.
I think it's also a willingness.
I also think if you have aplayer who has incredibly high
competitive index.
The competitive index willoverride anything else.
So if the competitive index isreally high and what it requires
(07:47):
to win is to sit down and guardlike crazy and rebound like
crazy, people with highcompetitive indexes in those
moments will rise to thoseoccasion.
Absolutely.
And I, and that's where mythought process was with the
junkyard dog.
Give me a competitor.
(08:08):
I'll teach'em how to doeverything else.
I know, quite honest with you,I've been doing it so long, I'm
not gonna teach'em how to do theother stuff.
And it's interesting I've had somuch experience that an
assistant may bring a player tothe table and go.
Oh, coach, you can teach'em howto do X, whatever that looks
(08:29):
like.
And I go no.
We go recruit X.
That they know how to do it.
Can we refine this and can wetake that percentage up right by
seven 10% sure.
With some of the things we do,but to bring it up 30%?
Probably not.
And the funny thing, when I wasan assistant, it would the, in
(08:49):
the recruiting process, the headcoach would never end.
Hey, what's their free throwshooting percentage in
recruiting?
Yeah.
And so we would get'em and theywould be a terrible free throw
shooter and never be able toget, be in the game, late game
because they weren't making freethrows.
And so I learned as an assistantthat like if you've got a, if
part of this whole equation andyou're in a league that you know
(09:12):
is gonna be a two or threepossession game every night,
because most of the time four tofive bid NCAA Tournament League
are going to be as such.
They better make sure that therotational players are a certain
percentage so that they canclose games for you.
What does that recruiting looklike for you guys?
(09:33):
When you're out on the road?
Are you looking for areplacement or are you looking
for a player and then you'lladapt?
What does that look like for youguys?
When you're sitting at a on acourt and you're watching a kid
play?
Are there things that like,okay, that kid does, what does A
or does B, is that important toyou?
(09:53):
Oh, there's no question aboutit, and I think what we've gotta
do is continue.
We feel is get better playersthan what we have on the roster.
Right?
And then our challenge to thekids at home on that roster is
to, can you outwork our abilityto recruit and identify talent?
(10:14):
So if we can get both groupsworking together, so our staff
working like crazy to have moretalent that is on the current
roster and our current roster,recognizing.
That I'm gonna outwork my talentevery day, and then these two
groups come together.
It can really be magical.
I agree.
And it's, and it's the best wayto recruit too, because your
(10:38):
upperclassmen know that there'sno slouches coming in.
They've gotta be, they've gottatake that next step every year
too.
I think that as you recruithighly competitive people who
understand that they joining theprogram that.
It's striving in the nationalspotlight every single year.
Yeah.
I think that competitiveadvantage is huge.
(10:58):
I think the kids' work ethic ishuge because otherwise, simply
talented players don't wanna bein this kind of an environment.
We're in a elite environmentthat if you're not striving
every day in your life to beelite, not only your, the
basketball practice or thebasketball element, like we're
looking for people.
(11:19):
Who wanna be elite in every areaof life, whether it be
academically or socially.
It's just, it's who they areevery day.
What does it mean to you whenyou were interviewing for this
job, knowing that the men'sprogram was so successful?
Did that, was that somethingthat you looked at and go,
(11:39):
they're doing this right?
This is the school that I wantto be at because of how they're
competing.
Did that do anything for you?
Coach Crutchfield is the one ofthe most amazing people that
I've ever met.
And so to be able to work withhim every day and watch his
practices, I feel like I'm in abasketball school and, I'm
(12:00):
learning, I'm taking away, I'mstalling and implementing it.
And no, it was a huge element ofme knowing that this was the
right fit because of.
Such similarities in, we, wewanna play fast.
And they've proven that thesystem works and I've I was
picking his brain every chance Icould get and begging him to
teach me the intricacies of thesystem.
(12:21):
And yeah, I guess workingalongside him every day allows
me to do that, which has beensuch an advantage.
And we've installed so many ofthe different things that I'm
just really appreciative of him.
He's been nothing but incrediblykind and.
The way that they run theirprogram and the way their guys
are, and their staff, andthere's just really great
alignment with with both themen's and women's staffs here at
(12:42):
Nova.
I I think there's more trophiesto come for both of you.
I'm so excited about thatpartnership and what you're
bringing down there.
Coach, when you look at yourbackground, when you look at
your history you've been at anumber of schools, you look at
Pfeiffer, your first year, youwent 14 and 15.
You look at East Carolina, youhad a 12 and 19 year.
Early on Greensboro, you had asix and nine year.
(13:04):
Barry, you went nine and 19, andthen that following year, you're
one of the most dominantprograms, not only in your
league, but in the country.
What do you feel like you aredoing that you can go in and
build a program that quickly?
'cause that's so rare.
If you can improve your win-lossrecord from year one to year two
(13:24):
by four or five wins, it's alot.
You've had seasons where you'veimproved by 8, 10, 12 wins.
What do you feel like you'redoing differently when you're
taking over a program?
First I think you gotta infusethe passion behind it, and then
you've gotta make sure you'vegot the right people behind it.
And so sometimes that takes ayear.
Yeah.
(13:44):
And I understand that sometimesit takes longer and I know a lot
of coaches are saying, Hey, weneed some patience.
But that's really not thebusiness that we're in college
athletics For sure.
Our big thing is, let's behonest with people, and I think
that has shown some of thereasons that we're able to turn
programs around relativelyquickly is the honesty.
(14:05):
And we tell the truth in therecruiting process.
We tell the kids the truth everyday, and I think that they can
appreciate that.
Combined with that, we're superconsistent as coaching staff and
we're consistent in our decisionmaking.
We're consistent in ourcommunication, and I think
because of that, even if itdidn't work out and we made
(14:27):
changes, I think the respect isthere on, hey, that makes sense
to do it.
And then the way that we workand the way that we prepare.
Absolutely not for everybody.
And so identifying the peoplethat it's for and the people,
it's not that make'em bad, thatmake'em good but we do different
types stuff.
Yeah.
And we need that same kind ofmindset and that same kind of
(14:49):
mentality, but we also know whowe are and what we want to do.
And every year we aren'tchanging everything.
And it's, so I think some ofthat is really important as
well.
Is that when kids are in oursystem for one year, they get
pretty good when they're in itfor two man, they're really
(15:10):
good.
And so then all of a sudden, ifthey're in it two and three and
four years, you're starting tosee some incredible things.
Audrey Jennings, who was with ustwo years at Greensboro then was
with us and her final two yearsat Barry.
So she played inside the systemfor four years.
She's currently playingprofessional basketball, but she
scored 1700 points in how weplay.
(15:31):
Wow.
Four year period of time.
And so that kind of thing Ithink speaks to the system that
the longer that players play init, the better that they
continue to grow and get.
And I think that's really allyoung people wanna do is see
growth, see improvement.
And I think because we know whowe are, they know what we do
(15:53):
every day.
They start to get.
Incredibly comfortable in how weplay, and then they start to get
better and better inside of it.
And I think you start to seethat maybe with some of the
win-loss records.
You've definitely proven thatcoach.
Without a doubt.
I love that philosophy.
Let's do a little snapshot withyou.
A little masterclass.
(16:13):
I'm gonna, I'm gonna give youjust something that happens in
practice.
I'm always intrigued.
We have so many high schoolcoaches and college coaches that
listen to this.
I'm always intrigued how a coachhandles.
The little things because Ithink most great coaches they
teach and coach the littlethings so well that you don't
even realize that's the reasonthey're winning games.
(16:35):
So you're watching practice andone of your players doesn't turn
and hit on a three pointer.
They just, their hands are up.
They're looking at the rim.
How do you respond to that?
Okay, so first in our press, allfive press, and then secondly,
in our rebounding, all fiverebound.
(16:57):
So I think based upon that,everyone on the court
understands we don't do thingsin twos and threes and fours.
We do things in fives.
Everyone understands that.
So whether you're guarding atthe three point line or you're
boxing out at the block.
Everyone's expected to reboundand defensive rebounding for us,
Matt, we call'em tough defensiveboards, so we call'em TD Bs.
(17:19):
Yep.
'cause nobody this day and ageis simply going to rebounding
the bulk.
If you're rebounding with yourhands.
People are coming through that.
You gotta rebound, be willing torebound outside of area and with
your body.
So if you're checking out from acloseout, we call it a checkout.
So you're simply turning andlooking to make sure that
shooter's not going right, butyou've gotta go pursue with your
(17:40):
hands above your shoulders, soyou are alert and ready to grab
it with two hands.
So I think when you go into itevery single time and you go all
five, press all five, T, D, b,period.
Now, interesting enough for us,we also send all five to the
offensive glass.
The big, my big thing withrebounding, and we really
(18:01):
emphasize it, is it's the onething in basketball that you do
on both ends of the court.
Yep.
So the rebounding perspective isoffensive rebounding and
defensive rebounding.
So it must be really importantto win and how you rebound.
So we emphasize it, we stressit, and we reward it.
And I think that you seeconsistently, our offensive
(18:22):
rebounding numbers get reallygawdy.
That's how basketball games arewon.
That's how championships arewon.
So I love it, but I'll press youa little bit.
How do you handle it as a coach?
Do you let it go?
Are you coaching?
Are you coaching the whole, arewill you stop a practice?
What?
What will you do when you seesomebody not buying into that
(18:44):
five or not playing their role?
We have segments of practice.
So our segments of practice.
Consist of segments where we'recompeting, like today was a
competing practice.
They knew what we're doing andwe were all five oh dry stuff
last night and some fitnessthings inside of it.
So it's also the rhythm.
It's more around like a footballpractice.
(19:07):
So Sunday we talked, and todaywe competed.
Okay.
And so inside of a competingpractice, no, I'm not gonna blow
the whistle for that.
Okay.
And stop.
I'm looking for the responseafter you give up the offensive
rebound.
And how quickly can we move onto the next thing?
Now we'll debrief, and duringthe debrief we'll go back
(19:29):
through and visit on some ofthose kinds of things.
Now, if we start to see thatplayer made one mistake, we move
on from that.
But if that player isconsistently doing that and
giving up offensive rebounds.
We'll work individually withthem.
We'll stress and emphasize thatwhile we're live coaching.
And if that doesn't adjust andthat becomes a repetitive
problem, it's very difficult toplay when you're doing that and
(19:52):
not really buying into beingable to rebound it.
The way you just explained itwas that who you were 20 years
ago, would you have respondedthe same way?
Oh man.
No I'm proud to say that I'm noteven who I am.
Who I'm not even the same coachI was a year ago.
Yes.
Let alone 20 years ago.
I think that's the evolution ofwhat you want as a professional,
(20:15):
right?
Is growing, maturing.
Evolving with the times.
That's the, everybody's losingtheir minds about this transfer
portal stuff.
And yeah I jokingly laugh andgo, we were doing the transfer
portal a decade ago.
This is how we were buildingprograms and doing it then.
And so I really think we havealways been.
(20:38):
A type of program that it's not,this is how we've always done
it, this is what we're gonna do.
I think we've continued toevolve and continue to grow, and
definitely I have.
Yeah.
Individually as a head coach.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
You have to have the successyou've had now you've got Auburn
Montgomery coming up here theend of the week, right?
That's your first one.
(20:58):
We do.
What are you doing differentlyin practices this week in
preparing for them?
Or are you that coach that says,this is what we do, we're gonna
prepare for, to do what we doreally well?
Or how much time are you settingaside to prepare for Auburn
Montgomery's offense anddefense?
I am notorious for the level ofpreparation.
(21:22):
Meaning I'm like no stoneunturned.
I probably watch more film andlook at more stats and analytics
more, probably more than Ireally need to.
But it's just super importantfor me that we give our team the
best possible chance to win.
And I think the way our coachingstaff prepares is really
important is specifically me asthe head coach.
(21:43):
Our assistants will have thescouting report, but.
I pretty, that's, I joke with'em.
I'm like, you guys are typing upthe scalp.
But I do every scalp, right?
Meaning I am watching full gametape when, right now, it's very
different than it was in the olddays, Matt, where everybody was
driving wherever and exchangingDVDs and BH s tapes and this
(22:05):
software and the way that.
We're able to get into thesynergies and all the other
analytical software that we'vegot.
It's just really lazy.
You could just click and playand so you could put these
scouts together relativelyquickly.
But I am pretty meticulousrelative to watching full game
tape.
So we'll go back and look at.
Their last year stuff andreturning players and then where
(22:28):
players transferred in from andpull their individual clips from
those schools.
I think we do a really nice jobhaving our team prepared at the
same time focusing on what weknow we do well that we've gotta
do every single night.
Emphasizing that, is there apoint where you worry about.
Overwhelming your kids.
(22:48):
This was always my concern thatI was giving them too much to
remember, to think about insteadof, this is what we do, we're
gonna go do it.
Yes, we're gonna be ready forthis pick and roll.
We're gonna be ready for thistype of press, a trap or this
type of screening that they do.
Do you ever worry about givingthe girls too much?
(23:09):
Not really.
Okay.
To be quite honest with you, Ithink that I think they embrace
it.
I think that they go.
They want to know.
I think that they they cravethat.
And I think it also calms someof their nerves.
Yeah.
Like they're going in it andthey're saying true.
No, there's no surprises.
Like we are well prepared.
Things that would happen on thefringe we're well prepared.
(23:30):
And I would tell them like,we've got game goals, numerical
game goals.
So we have six of those.
And I'll go into and go, guys,we're gonna have to reach all
six of these goals to win thisgame.
There's some games, we go intoit and I go, listen, we could go
two of six and still win.
But they know as we're going inthese numbers and we'll show'em.
It's crazy through the yearsthat the players know that these
(23:53):
game goal numbers are indicativeof whether or not we win the
game or not.
So don't get so caught up withwhat's happening at the
scoreboard.
Stay focused inside of ourtimeout and staying with this
process of.
We are right on track in thegame goals, and if you'll stay
focused on the game goals, theend result will take care of
itself, even though maybe in thesecond quarter.
(24:15):
Yeah.
It doesn't quite seem like itwould.
Yeah.
There's a ton of significance tothat.
Would you mind sharing your sixnumerical goals?
Sure.
I'd be glad to.
So we look at how we'rerebounding and now we do this
every year.
So if coaches are payingattention to this you've gotta
go through it and look at whatkind of team do you have
relative to your competition,right?
(24:37):
And where the rebounding marginshould, could be, and set
something that makes sense.
Sure, I would like to be plus 10and rebounding, but depending
upon the kind of team I have,maybe plus five would be
successful this year or pluseight.
Yeah.
So you would need to set that init.
Then we have a deflection goal.
(24:57):
And so a similar thing, like ifwe're playing really up tempo,
the deflection goal could beplus 40.
If you know that you're gonnaplay a little more of a matchup
zone the majority of the year,you don't wanna set that number
weirdly, and you also don'twanna set that number that it
doesn't fit the tempo of yourteam.
The same thing with what we'redoing charges.
(25:18):
So we feel like a charge is.
Kinda like a dunk in the men'sgame.
Absolutely.
It, the ability to take acharge.
Not only do you get the ballback, you give the other team a
foul.
And right now women's collegebasketball's four quarters and
you're shooting two after thefifth.
(25:39):
That's so significant.
How huge, quickly can you getinto the bonus is a really big
deal.
And then.
I think that teams thatunderstand value, understand
winning.
So the less than 15 turnovers,whatever that number is for the
coach at that year.
And even though we're playingfast we wanna shoot it before we
(26:01):
turn it over and get it to therim.
So we need to turn it less than15 times to get the amount of
shot attempts that we wanna getevery single night.
So teams that understandwinning, understand value, they
also understand free throws.
So that's our fifth one is thefree throw percentage, and our
final one is fill goalpercentage.
So I think those are the sixthat we have factored in as
(26:24):
winning and losing.
And how many have really gottahit?
What do you, is free throws howmany you attempts or are you
looking for a percentage above75%.
And then obviously we do areally interesting thing I, we
implemented this year in CoachCrutchfield.
Really stresses it, and it'sbeen huge for us.
(26:44):
We keep fouled individual foulsthroughout practice.
I love that.
And then we've got our twoteams.
And so we, when we get into ourlive segments, we'll go ahead
and say okay, and we learn ourplayers like you're going into
the live segment with threefouls because we'll give
thousand the drills.
You're three s going into thelive segment to, to train that
(27:05):
kid and how to.
Practice and play with threefouls.
And then the other part I thinkhas been really cool in how we
are gonna play uptempo wise isthat, so we are in a live
segment and now individual foulsare now team fouls because we do
divide the teams and we don'tswitch'em up as we go.
So we have the teams divided andwe'll start the live segment by
(27:26):
saying, Hey, you guys have oneteam file, or you guys are
already at five.
So that every everything in livesegment, every foul is two free
throws.
Which will adjust what we'rerunning defensively.
And it's also adjusting like howaggressive they can be in
passing lanes or inside oftraffic.
And it speaks volumes'cause it'ssame thing they're gonna be
(27:49):
hearing in timeouts and at theend of quarters.
But the problem is that ascoaches.
We tend to only talk about thatstuff inside of the games.
Yeah.
Smart.
So for us, yeah we coach 20 someyears, but these kids, play, I
dunno, play 30 games a year.
They're playing 120 total careergames.
And that's the only time thatreally the coaches are talking
(28:10):
about some of the strategy orthat they learn how to play it
without trouble and then wewonder why they're outta rhythm.
Yep.
So I think one of the bestthings that we've really done a
nice job of this year.
Is creating a practiceenvironment that will simulate
game days.
I love that.
Yeah it's so huge and it's sonecessary in terms of getting
(28:30):
the kids to understand whatwe're really after and what
we're doing.
You can't expect them to learnthat in the middle of a game, so
I love that.
What was the field goal numbercoach that you're looking for?
45%.
45 or higher?
What have you found since you'veimplemented that?
It makes your players thinkingabout good shots and what a good
(28:52):
shot is.
Has that helped?
Oh, I think you can tell theplayers who are gonna be better
scorers, those guys in drills inpractice with no defense and
they don't miss, and that thekids who probably aren't gonna
score the ball very well thatthey miss open looks in the
paint.
No one guard'em.
So you can see those percentagesand we have a shooting off
(29:15):
season workout plan and, we cantell'em like, listen, if you're
not shooting at 70% with no Dbehind the three point line,
like you're not gonna beanywhere close to taking shots
and games.
So that's the part that youngpeople have gotta figure out is
how to practice at game pace.
How to hit an appropriatepercentage that will translate
(29:37):
to success inside of games.
So that's not some arbitrarynumber, like we know our league
and how good our league is andif you're shooting in the
thirties you're not gonna win.
It's just it's a simplemathematical equation.
And yes, coaches do we need tobe thinking about who's taking
the shot and are they, are wegetting high quality?
(29:59):
Percentage shots.
All of those things obviouslyfactor in games, but it also
factors in what kind of shotsthey're taking.
When they're in getting extrashots up on their own or with
one of our coaches.
Does that then transfer intowhat we call system shots and it
shots that kid will see insideof a game?
Love it.
Coach, I wanna respect yourtime.
(30:20):
I know you're limited today.
Would you mind giving one pieceof advice to parents that are
going through the recruitingprocess and what you recommend
they focus on if they want, iftheir child wants to play at the
next level?
Yeah, I'd be glad to.
Recruiting is an inexact scienceand there is not the same
(30:41):
process.
One kid goes through that, thenext one or the one or two or
five after that will go through,which I understand is difficult
for families to understand.
The other part that familiestend to have a hard time with is
that, they go through thisprocess one time maybe.
Maybe they have two kids in thefamily that were college
athletes, which doesn't happenthat often.
(31:02):
So maybe you go through it twicein your lifetime.
Whereas college coaches we'resigning somewhere between three
to 10 probably.
Players every single year,right?
So it's a scenario where youstart looking into the
communities that people live in.
And the advice that parents aregetting are advice from people
(31:23):
who, A, may have never playedcollege sports, or B, never
coach college sports.
And that's who you're seekingadvice from and guidance.
And I can imagine it would beoverwhelming.
I can also imagine that that itwould be some anxiety to it.
I would tell you this, if youcould take all of the people
you're asking advice from andsuggestions from and remove the
(31:47):
noise of it, and be relentlesswith distractions and simply
keep your kid working at thecraft and getting better, you
won't have to worry about therecruiting process, because the
recruiting process will come toyou And, let's just be really
direct, in a.
A dating relationship, when heis really into you, he is really
(32:10):
into you.
Recruiting is the same way.
It sure is.
If that staff is into you andthat school's into you, you are
not gonna have to question ifthey're into you or have someone
else double check.
You are gonna clearly know thatis occurring.
And I do suggest having arelationship with.
It be your high school coach oryour club coach, and too many
(32:32):
parents and too many playersright now had adversarial
relationships with those folks.
And I do think that's a mistakebecause it is nice to have
someone that can call on yourbehalf.
It's no different than going tointerview for a job and your
current boss is given you agreat reference.
I think it's super importantthat high school coach is able
to say incredible hard workertotally a competitor, whatever
(32:56):
those things are is reallyimportant.
And that's really how you showup every single day and do
things because the majority ofcollege coaches are doing their
due diligence and there's notgonna be a lot of secrets.
And there's definitely notsecrets on if you're a good
player or a bad player becausethe way that we're able to see
video and look at the stats andthings online.
(33:19):
Similar question.
Last one.
For that 16, 17-year-old playerthat would love to play at
Inova, love to play at that highlevel D two level in that great
conference.
How do they get your attentioncoach if they live in California
and you're not just gonna runinto'em, or they live in
Minnesota and you're not justgonna run into'em you may not
(33:39):
find them know about them.
How do they let you know theywanna be recruited?
I think the best thing for usanyway is to have your coach
call me and tell me about youand that you understand that to
play at a level like this youcould have played division one
basketball if you'd chosen to,because to really compete at
(34:00):
what we're doing.
We're a four bid league.
So we are kinda like the SEC ACCvery much Yeah.
Of division one.
And so there's not players inour league that didn't have an
opportunity, haven't already.
Played division one basketballand they've chosen a different
memorial rewarding path to behere with us.
So I think a simple phone callmakes sense and it makes sense
(34:21):
why you wanna come fromCalifornia or come from
Minnesota to Florida.
It makes sense because there'ssome sort of reason behind it.
It's a great academic model.
There's family in here.
Because whatever that looks likeis that, Hey, I took said, who's
top 25 in the country and we'recalling everybody top 25 in the
country because this kid is thatcompetitive that she wants to
(34:42):
jump into an establishedprogram.
Whatever the reasoning may be, Ithink it needs to make sense.
Yeah.
To go and do that.
But a direct phone call, I thinkgreater than a mass.
I agree.
I agree.
And you wanna know that they'vedone their research.
You wanna know that they'recalling you for a reason because
you want, you wanna have'em forfour years if you can have'em,
right?
(35:03):
Yeah, no question.
And there's no guarantees rightnow with the climate of
recruiting, how long you'regonna have.
But as long as we may have'em,we just want the greatest impact
that we can get.
And and so we put a lot of pridein recruiting the family,
recruiting the kid.
And having that relationship,regardless if they're with us a
year, or four years, is thatit's gonna be a life lifelong
(35:24):
relationship.
Coach, thank you so much foryour time today.
It's an honor to talk to you.
I've been following your careerfor a long time and it's just so
impressive what you continue todo and I think Nova just lock
themselves up another futurehall of famer.
You guys are gonna have a, a lotof fun over the next few years,
so good luck the rest of theyear.
But thank you again for yourtime.
(35:44):
Thanks for the kind words andthanks so much for having me on.
And I'm gonna tell yousomething, I'm the lucky one to
be here because NSU, they'vetreated me incredibly kind and
given us the resources to go andbe super successful.
So again thank you so much forhaving me on.
My pleasure coach.
Good luck and with AuburnMontgomery this week.
And we'll be cheering for you.
(36:05):
Okay, thanks.
Go sharks.
That'll do it for today'sepisode with Coach Heather Macy.
Anytime you get to learn fromsomeone who has rebuilt
programs, elevated cultures, andcommitted her life to teaching
leadership at the highest level,it's a gift.
I hope you took as much fromthis conversation as I did.
If you're a parent, a coach, ora student athlete looking for
(36:26):
clarity in the recruitingprocess, remember you can
schedule a free recruitingstrategy session with
me@coachmattrogers.com.
You'll also find the significantrecruiting book and my brand new
Basketball recruits Journal, twotools designed to help families
stay organized, confident, andintentional through every part
(36:46):
of their recruiting journey.
And make sure you come back onMonday for our special
significant recruiting episodewith Brian Olo.
A former coach and a dad who hasspent the past year using the
significant recruiting tools andresources to help his daughter
Kelsey navigate her recruitingpath.
It's a powerful conversation andone that will help every family
(37:08):
understand what this processlooks like when it's done with
purpose.
Until next time, stay focused onwhat you can control.
Stay humble and keep chasingsignificance.
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