February 27, 2024 • 38 mins
Remember the times when tucking away a snack in your apron pocket was the highlight of your workday? That's just a taste of the reminiscence Caroline and I serve up alongside a heaping dollop of pageant sparkle, as we're joined by Courtney, a former beauty queen whose tiara is polished with both charm and wisdom. Our conversation spirals from the sugar-dusted memories of our cupcake shop days, trading pastries for chapstick, to the bittersweet goodbye of its closing doors. It's a journey through the evanescent world of food fads, where gourmet cupcakes give way to the next big thing.
Courtney, with the poise only a title like Miss Catfish Stomp could bestow, graciously leads us through the sequined archway into the pageant realm—a place where familial bonds outshine the competitive glitz. She debunks the myths, bringing forth a narrative strewn with quirky local festival titles and a camaraderie that extends beyond the stage. Our chat uncovers a side of pageantry that's more potluck than cutthroat, where community and friendship are the true crowning glories.
Wrapping up our walk down the runway, we confront the double-edged sword that is the child beauty pageant world. We laugh and wince at the investment in dresses and coaching, weighing the cost against the sheen of confidence gained under the spotlight. Our musings go beyond the surface, probing into the motivations fueling this glittering industry and the indelible mark it leaves on childhood. It's a candid look at the tapestry of experiences woven through the pageant sash—stitched with nostalgia, sparkles, and a touch of controversy.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Hello, hello, hello I'm.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Meredith.
I'm Meredith, I'm Caroline andthis is sister shit.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
This is sister shit and we have a guest this week
BAM, bam, bam.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
So, excited to this week we're talking beauty
pageants.
Caroline and I have neither ofus have participated in a beauty
pageant and we felt like we hadto deliver you guys At least
someone with some knowledge andbackground, since the last week,
we did a whole episode about aplace that we've never, ever
(00:49):
been to and did no research on,so we stepped it up a little bit
, just a little and by little.
We need miniature beauty queen.
Give it up for.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
Starling past.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Beauty.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
Yeah, tell us how you .
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Well, okay.
First of all, let's say hello,I want to know how you guys know
each other.
Speaker 3 (01:09):
Hi, thanks for having me, yeah.
Speaker 4 (01:14):
You guys met working at the cake cupcake shop.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
Right, we did.
Speaker 3 (01:18):
Yes, years ago Back in college days yeah, so what
year was?
Speaker 2 (01:24):
that Like 20.
It was right when I got engagedbecause our boss asked me if I
was pregnant and told me Ididn't need to get married.
Oh, what Shit.
Wait, who was?
Was it Heidi?
Speaker 3 (01:33):
Yeah, Heidi she was like I think she was very like
genuine.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
But she was like are you pregnant?
And I was like no, because Iwas so young, I was 21.
So it was 2011.
When I was back, when cupcakeswere all the rage yes, yes, and
Meredith was saying, I think acouple episodes ago, that she
used to like keep snacks and herapron pocket.
Speaker 3 (01:58):
And she was like I don't know, I don't know, I
don't know.
She used to keep snacks in herapron pocket.
Speaker 4 (02:04):
Yes, I forever will know Meredith as the one who cut
these weird little meltingchocolate discs in her pocket.
They were like oh, body heatfrom body heat, they would start
to melt in her pocket, butshe'd still be like eating the
little melty chips throughoutthe show.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
It was nasty, like melting chocolate that we'd used
for like cake pops and likethat chocolate should not be
eaten as like a treat.
Speaker 3 (02:26):
And shouldn't be raw dog in it in your pocket.
Speaker 4 (02:30):
It was probably a little linty, you know, but it's
fine, it's fine.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
I also would eat the Lisa would.
Our boss would be peeling theapples with an apple like one of
those like little apple peelersthat like does the long strand
of peel and I would just likeeat the apple peel and she'd be
like that's garbage and I waslike I kind of like it.
Speaker 4 (02:49):
That's so funny.
I don't remember that one, butI love that story.
Healthy I mean it was collegeyears.
It was tough times, you knowdoing a little raccoon and
living for a snack.
Speaker 2 (02:59):
We were scavengers there, so we were, when we got
one free kick every shift.
Speaker 3 (03:06):
Oh, but I don't want it yeah.
Speaker 4 (03:10):
I mean really you want to use your free cupcake to
like put everybody's freecupcakes together to trade with
somewhere that has yes.
Food and meals that is nearbyfor sure.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
I traded this guy that worked at the outdoor store
across the street one time.
He brought me a tube ofchapstick for a cupcake.
Speaker 4 (03:27):
What?
That is probably the strangesttrading story I've ever heard.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Yeah, I mean, I think it was, because I think for him
it was more about the thrill ofthe trade, because he had to
like steal from his store and Ihad a free merchandise to give
and he would just like take thepoint of purchase or what do you
call like the little countertop things.
Yeah, like the thing.
Speaker 4 (03:48):
How did this even come up?
Speaker 2 (03:49):
Where did he come from?
Speaker 4 (03:54):
He was a.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
He dated my friend, oh, okay, Okay, he was a friend
and we just worked across thestreet, so I think he just like,
thought it was fun to tradethings.
Speaker 3 (04:01):
That's hilarious.
Got it Okay?
Last cupcake topic before wemove on to the real topic all
time favorite flavor.
Speaker 4 (04:13):
I think mine might have to be salted caramel
chocolate.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
I don't know, it's a classic.
I can taste that when you saythe name.
Speaker 4 (04:21):
It's hard to mess up.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 4 (04:24):
I think it's just like a good easy.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
It was my favorite too, it was good.
Speaker 3 (04:28):
Is cupcake still there?
No, no.
Speaker 4 (04:32):
So we changed to owners and COVID hit hard and
the owner kind of backed out.
You know I don't completely buythem, but at the same time he
was a little shady.
So it is like this it was inthe breath dumping, yes, Like we
found out on Thanksgiving thatwe were closing like two weeks
later.
Speaker 1 (04:50):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 4 (04:52):
I had to tell my staff on Thanksgiving oh no, so
it was not the best ending andwe don't still talk that's what
I'm saying, but you know it iswhat it is.
We looked out the whole cupcakebag.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
It had a good run.
It did, that's a long run.
It was a long run.
Yes, it really was.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
Longer than the frozen yogurt.
True, it was like I don't thinkI'm gonna be able to go back to
the last year.
I was like I've been in adifferent continent that like
there's those popped up on everycorner and now I can't name one
that's left.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
I went to a new one the other week.
You guys, my friend, knew one.
Speaker 3 (05:35):
I don't think it's new, but I, my friend, was like
do you want to go get frozenyogurt after we pick up the kids
from school?
Speaker 2 (05:38):
And I was like uh-huh , but like wait, wait, wait.
And she's like this is myfavorite, it's the best.
Like she's like and I'm like Ilove that you are.
She like managed multiplefrozen yogurt places, like in
high school and then in college.
She's like Interesting, yeah,and she's a classic flavor, like
(05:59):
the yogurt flavor.
When we go she's like a pure,purest purest wild, but I was
like it has been over a decadesince I've had frozen yogurt.
Speaker 3 (06:10):
I remember the first time going I was like this is
the future and now?
And now it's crumbled.
Yeah, like dip in dots yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Oh my gosh, but did?
That was the future, you guys.
It still is, if I go to.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
Like I'm trying to think of places that have
dipping dots like a baseballgame.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
I'm like, yeah, I'm saving my, I'm saving the room
in my tummy there are marginshave to be absolutely insane,
because the amount of dots youget in the container is like so
few, yeah, like there's a lot ofair in there, and there it's
about eight dollars a pop, soit's it's kind of wild if you
(06:51):
think about it a whole episodeon sweets.
Speaker 3 (06:53):
If you haven't yet sweet trend.
Yeah, maybe we'll do that.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
No, okay, we'll get a question.
Okay, you guys feel aboutcrumble cookie, you guys?
Speaker 3 (07:04):
already know how I feel about their uh guest
experience.
Speaker 2 (07:08):
Wait, did we talk about?
Speaker 3 (07:09):
it I thought we did about how you like the robots
are taking over because you walkup and you like order on an
iPad.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
And it's like do you want to leave a?
Speaker 3 (07:17):
25% tip for nothing.
Speaker 4 (07:22):
Yeah, I've never been in a crumble cookies oh.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
I've had other people's like their Um chocolate
chip.
It's the only one I like.
Speaker 3 (07:32):
I've had another one that I liked I will okay.
So at work, a couple months ago, my boss had like had a meeting
with a potential like person,like a vendor that we were gonna
use, and within like threehours we got a giant delivery,
like giant, like 12 crumblecookies, which is a lot.
And we were like, who sent usthese cookies?
(07:54):
And it came with a note thatsaid thanks for meeting with us
earlier.
We're so excited and hope themomentum doesn't crumble.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
I respect that Did you end up going with them?
Speaker 3 (08:10):
I honestly never followed up.
I just ate the cookies.
I mean it wasn't my job tofollow up.
I just was there for thecookies.
Let me be clear.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
I don't even know what they were.
I didn't drop the ball.
Speaker 4 (08:23):
It's like oh no, she didn't like that very much.
Now Okay let's get into it.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
We are talking about beauty pageants.
Where do we wanna start?
So, courtney, I guess we justwanna know what was your
experience?
Well, like, tell us about yourpersonal history with the
industry.
Yes and why you got involved,and I do feel like I need to
preface this by saying you can'tsee Courtney, but if you met
(08:52):
her you would never in a millionyears think I bet she used to
be a child.
Beauty queen Just doesn't fitthe bill, which I think is the
thing I love most about you.
It is like the best fun factever.
Speaker 3 (09:07):
And not that you're not absolutely stunning.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
I'm not saying that, I'm just saying we don't have
the nears and like I'm notwearing a tiara right now.
Speaker 4 (09:16):
You're not wearing a tiara.
You're not like bleach blonde.
Speaker 3 (09:19):
You don't have the yeah.
Speaker 4 (09:22):
Not anymore.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
Okay so you were in.
Okay, okay, tell us everything.
Speaker 4 (09:28):
Okay, so my story starts at the ripe age of nine
months old.
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (09:36):
Already on the phone.
Coach so clearly.
Speaker 4 (09:37):
I chose this life.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
No.
Speaker 4 (09:41):
Yeah, so my first pageant.
I was about nine months old.
It's so funny because I wonsome big trophy, Like I don't
know if I was overall or justwhatever, but it's the funniest
picture because I can't.
Like they just sat me down inmy dress on this like little
couch or whatever bench and youjust I can't even hold my neck
up and I have like this littletiara on and this huge trophy
(10:05):
that's like three times myheight.
Like this is ridiculous.
Speaker 3 (10:07):
Oh my gosh, we need pictures.
What are the?
Speaker 2 (10:09):
qualifications for like entering as a baby.
Speaker 4 (10:13):
Well, wait, can I tell you, as you said, you need
pictures.
I can't find it, but that wasin the state newspaper, that's
so.
So I have to try to find it,but I do have a picture, so
you're basically famous.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
You're famous from birth 1993, I was in the
newspaper Miss Miss Baby, missBaby 1993.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
Baby, Are we talking national level state?
Speaker 4 (10:36):
level county level state I did a lot of really
small ones around South Carolinaand okay, to give you more
information on that, I think Iwas like little miscollared and
like Little Miss Peanut, becausethere's like the peanut
festival and the collaredfestival.
(10:57):
At one point I was Miss CatfishStomp Because that is a local,
miss Catfish Stomp.
Yes.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Go on, that is a local.
Speaker 4 (11:06):
Yes, so I did a little bit of everything, but
then there's some that's likethe pageants model after like
Valentine's Day, so it'll belike Little Miss Valentine or
you know, like.
Speaker 3 (11:16):
What was your favorite title?
Like which one are you like man?
I'm proud of this title.
Speaker 4 (11:22):
I love telling people about the Catfish Stomp one,
because probably they could hearit yeah that's a good one.
Speaker 2 (11:27):
Have you updated your LinkedIn profile Because?
They have to be on it.
Okay, so this is the firstpageant where I can't hold my
You're showing us an incrediblepicture that we want we're gonna
share on Instagram.
Speaker 3 (11:41):
We'll share on Instagram, because this is
amazing.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
The dress is huge, you look great.
Speaker 4 (11:46):
Oh gosh.
So yeah, that's not even theone with the trophy.
So what's like the?
Speaker 3 (11:49):
baby culture.
I'm like.
I guess, when does it getsomewhat like funky?
I'm assuming it gets funky,does it?
Speaker 4 (11:58):
So I sort of had to pull my brother into this on
this one, because he's sevenyears older than me.
So, he remembers a lot of thisbetter than I do.
At least the early years, youknow.
So he thinks that this allstarted because one of my mom's
like work friends, had adaughter that she was putting in
pageants and was like it'd befun if we did this together.
Speaker 2 (12:19):
Okay, okay.
Speaker 4 (12:19):
So it was like, okay, let's just do it for fun.
And my grandma got involved andshe was like, oh, love this,
this is so cute.
And so it became like a familyand friends event and it was
like every once in a while we'lldo it.
And then I got a little bitolder and I guess I just started
making friends with other girlsthat were in my age group at
(12:40):
these pageants and then my mombecame friends with their moms
and so it would be like we wouldgo over to their house and just
hang out on a normal day.
Or maybe we would join the samewhat do you call it?
Like the person who teaches usroutines to do on stage Coat.
Sometimes it would be like,yeah, we would join the same
(13:03):
studio for that person.
Speaker 3 (13:05):
And go to the sponsors together.
Speaker 4 (13:06):
I saw the movie Dumplin' I don't know why you
remember that part.
I do.
I forgot about that movie.
I did see that.
I did not see toddlers in TRS.
I watched an episode the othernight to see if it brought
anything back.
Speaker 3 (13:16):
I haven't seen any of it either.
Look at you doing it.
You did so much research.
Speaker 4 (13:19):
I love it, I do have to tell y'all, though, that my
experience is not from theviewpoint of some of the people
that I saw on toddlers in TRS,where the parents were like, oh
well, they won first place intheir age group.
They just they lost the pageant, like they're not gonna get the
overall, they're not gonna getthe $10,000 or whatever.
We were more so in it for, like, the fun aspect.
(13:41):
I mean, of course, if I likewon money or something awesome,
we can put that toward the nextone or something.
But, it was never like oh, youwon first place or second place,
you lost.
Like.
It was always like oh, did youhave fun?
Like oh, great.
Speaker 3 (13:55):
Okay, okay, so it helps me.
So your mom wasn't like one ofthose like toddlers in TRS,
those moms are like it can beintense, Intense, yes.
And the kids are crying andthey're like forcing the
flippers in their mouth.
Speaker 4 (14:11):
Yes, and I did know parents that were like that.
I remember having friends inthe circuit whose moms were like
a little scary to be around andthey would be like.
I can't believe you didn't getoverall or whatever, like it was
a whole thing.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
Which like happens in any like, it's not just in
pageants.
You always get in any childhoodthing.
There's the parents that liketake it way too seriously.
Like we were in plays growingup and we literally had like a
girl whose grandma was likeshe's, this is showbiz baby.
(14:46):
Like took it so like would getmad if this girl was not front
and center.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
Yeah, there's one in every bunch, at least one in
every bunch, for sure yeah.
So what was your first pageant?
You remember, like how old wereyou?
When you like, have memories ofit.
Speaker 4 (15:04):
So I did them from when I was nine months old to
when I was like 12 years old.
So it was a very long time and,to be honest with you, it all
sort of just blends together.
Speaker 2 (15:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (15:14):
But for me things that like stand out are like
places that I've been, more sothan like the pageant itself.
So a lot of the pageants, atleast in this area I don't know
how it is everywhere else, butlike the peanut pageant, for
example, I do remember that onebeing here.
(15:36):
It was in a high school, so itwas like in the high school
auditorium and then we therewere like dressing, get ready
rooms in like classrooms.
Speaker 2 (15:46):
Uh-huh.
Speaker 1 (15:47):
Like a dancer's title .
Speaker 4 (15:48):
Yeah.
So we would be like giving ourcurlers, putting our hair and
doing our makeup, and likechanging clothes in classrooms,
yeah, and we would line up likeoutside of the auditorium and
like go up the back part of thestage onto the stage.
And then you know audiencewould be sitting auditorium
judges would be in front of them.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
Who's in the audience ?
Like is it which families right, I want to get on this later
because I do.
Speaker 4 (16:10):
I also have something to say about this, because I
have been thinking about it alot in adulthood.
Of course, as a child I didn'treally think about it but, so
most of the time it would justbe family members, so like
siblings, parents, grandparentscousins, you know all that fun
stuff.
Every once in a while peoplewould bring their friends, but I
feel like that was very minimal, like I didn't really I don't
(16:31):
think anybody really knew ofmany outsiders that were around
at least I don't know sort ofBecause.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
I don't feel like they advertised them.
Speaker 3 (16:39):
Exactly.
These are so cool and it's kindof like an all day affair,
right, correct?
Speaker 4 (16:45):
So you have to be like from like first thing in
the morning all day, likethey'll notice if somebody just
like creeps along inside Likeand a lot of people know each
other, and so you kind of get tothe point where it's like, oh,
that's so-and-so's grandma, likewe know her, Like you know just
kind of you're in the circuitdoing all these pageants.
However, the group of peoplethat I always get confused about
(17:06):
and I wish that I knew more on,are the judges.
Speaker 2 (17:10):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (17:10):
Like who is the judge In any beauty?
Speaker 2 (17:12):
pageant yes, like when I was watching-.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
What makes them qualified?
Exactly what makes themqualified?
Yes, but when I was?
Speaker 4 (17:18):
watching toddlers in TRs the other day.
You know they're like lookingat the girls on stage and
looking so seriously down attheir paper and taking their
notes and I'm like what are theywriting?
What are they so serious about,or like why is a?
Speaker 2 (17:29):
strange man looking at these.
Yes, it's the men that weird meout.
Speaker 4 (17:35):
Yeah, like the older middle-aged to older men that
are not somebody's grandpa Like.
Even if they were, that wouldstill be a little weird.
But at least there's like someconnection.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (17:44):
I just don't understand.
Speaker 2 (17:45):
Very odd.
So were the category I knowthere's like different
categories of pageants Was causelike toddlers in TRs is like
glitz right, it's like you'redoing the flipper you're doing
the hair.
So were yours.
What's like?
The opposite of that, or what'sthe other options?
Speaker 4 (18:00):
No, so I mostly did glitz.
Oh, okay, I didn't know.
They recalled that until Iwatched toddlers TRs the other
night.
Speaker 2 (18:07):
honestly, so does that look like?
In the 90s, when you were doingit, was it as crazy as it is
now?
Speaker 4 (18:12):
Yes, when I was watching it, but like the first
episode, I was like, did I havethat dress?
Like it is very much the samesomehow.
Speaker 3 (18:20):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 4 (18:21):
Which is really interesting to me, because I
would think that it would haveevolved more than a half.
Speaker 2 (18:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (18:27):
So there's glitz and then there's natural, and then I
didn't keep watching.
But I think the second episodehad a little girl who was in
natural pageants.
So they didn't do hair, theydidn't do makeup, and I think
the clothing was way more likejust a little bit more
no-transcript.
I don't know.
That's a good question.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
Sorry keep going.
That's the biggest question.
Speaker 4 (18:47):
That's the biggest question that everyone asked me,
and I didn't have a talent.
We didn't do talent like that.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
Oh, it was just Beauty Baby.
Speaker 4 (18:54):
Yeah, so you would go and you would just have
different outfits.
I know you've seen my famousblue Western wear outfit the
tiny cowboy boots.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
I think I have that photo actually too.
Speaker 3 (19:05):
So I'll find that Western wear that was.
I'm telling you these thingsare ridiculous, you'd be popular
.
You'd probably win now with theWestern wear.
It's bad, it's the same Texas.
Speaker 4 (19:15):
So we had here's one, but this isn't the one that.
Speaker 2 (19:19):
Oh.
Speaker 3 (19:20):
Oh my gosh, when did you win that?
Speaker 2 (19:22):
pageant.
It's amazing, it looks amazing.
Speaker 4 (19:24):
I don't know.
I can't remember which ones Idid and didn't.
Speaker 2 (19:26):
Was that your real hair?
Speaker 4 (19:28):
No, this is the bleach blonde face.
Speaker 1 (19:30):
So these are the little boots.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
Oh my, I want this outfit.
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 4 (19:37):
So, this move that I'm doing, I have my arm or my
hand on a hip and then my otherarm is out with my Western wear
coat across it and that's one ofmy moves that I did on stage.
So you, when I did the coaching, you would go and it would be
like we're going to do this toDixie Chicks, and so we had yes,
you did.
Speaker 3 (19:56):
How will I take me?
Speaker 4 (19:56):
away or something, and I would like have a coat on
to start, but then I would likerip it off and like do it around
my head and then put it on myarm and like walk around.
Speaker 2 (20:05):
I wish we had footage .
Speaker 4 (20:07):
I know that's the one thing.
I don't have any videos of anyof this, so your brother.
Speaker 3 (20:11):
Did he have to go to all these and sit through all
these and watch them, and whatare his feelings?
Speaker 4 (20:16):
He had to go through quite a few of them, but I think
once he got Because he's sevenyears older than me, so I want
to say once he hit that like 12to 13 year old time frame, he
was like I'm just going to go toa friend's house or something.
Speaker 2 (20:31):
Like I don't want to do this Good for him.
Speaker 4 (20:33):
And then for him, like my mom and my grandma were
really into it, so we would alldo the whole thing together, but
then, like my parents divorcedwhen I was like super young,
right, so my dad wasn'tnaturally a part of all of that
anyway, but like I have photosof him leading me on stage when
I was really little and stuff onsome of it and like coming to
(20:54):
them.
But the older I got like, Iremember arguments and him being
like why is she doing this?
Like, why are we.
Like he was, definitely like.
I don't know about thesepageants.
You know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (21:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (21:06):
And then the older I got like he was like what is
going on?
But then, when you think aboutit too, I started in like 1993.
Gombane Ramsey happened in like96.
Yeah, and so I continued overthe course of all of that, and
then there was this whole likethat was a national line.
Speaker 2 (21:21):
And that like brought this to the forefront because I
before her I feel like pageantsthey were happening but it was
quiet.
Speaker 4 (21:29):
It was quiet, yeah, and then it was like mass
concern.
Yes, and I was going to say,and it brought a lot of people's
feelings to it, especially notknowing what it was, seeing all
the pictures and everything andsaying, oh no, what are we doing
?
Which?
I understand it's totally aright concern to have.
Speaker 2 (21:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
So when did you stop?
At 12?
Was it your?
Speaker 2 (21:53):
decision?
Was it your mom's decision?
Was your dad's?
Speaker 4 (21:56):
Yeah.
So I think I just startedgetting, I don't know.
I started getting older andthen you're just kind of like
this isn't fun anymore, and so Ikind of got to that point where
I didn't feel like there wasmany the younger categories, I
think, because more parents tendto put their kids in younger,
just had more kids, so like fiveto seven age group would have
(22:17):
like 12 kids or something a lotof times.
But then when I got to like 11to 13 or whatever age group it
was, there were only like threeof us.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
And so it's like I didn't have as many friends.
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (22:29):
I didn't have any as many friends that kept up with
it, but I started with and then.
So when you start seeing yourfriends drop out and then when
you get to the point whereyou're like I don't want to make
new friends with these randompeople and I don't think I like
this anymore.
And why are we still tugging onmy hair and doing my makeup?
Yeah, you know it's like youstart sort of getting more
self-aware, I guess at that age,Totally, Totally.
(22:52):
And so I think I just got tothe point where I was like no
thanks.
And I remember like telling mymom and I was like we're dying
my hair brown.
So I had bleach blonde hair foryears.
Speaker 2 (23:02):
Oh, that was real or that wasn't real.
The bleach blonde that I had,bleach blonde hair.
Speaker 4 (23:07):
Yeah, oh, 100%.
Yes, I got my hair dyed all thetime.
So I think, I had naturalblonde hair up until I was about
four years old.
Speaker 1 (23:15):
Okay, and then it started changing.
Speaker 4 (23:17):
It started getting darker, and so then I started
getting dyed, mm-hmm.
Speaker 1 (23:21):
Whoa.
Speaker 4 (23:23):
So I didn't get my hair highlighted or like dyed at
all for the first time untilmaybe like three years ago and
I'm 31.
Speaker 2 (23:29):
So you were like go somewhere to get it done, or
would your mom do it?
Speaker 4 (23:32):
Usually my mom would do it or something.
Speaker 2 (23:34):
Okay, okay, wow, so it wasn't like out of salon.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
It was just like out of the box Like yeah, it was not
good.
Speaker 4 (23:43):
I remember like over the summer, going to people's
pools and swimming, and it wouldturn green because of the rain.
It was not good and it was likeI'm telling you guys, hold on.
I got to find this other, likeit was a well-known thing that
people didn't touch my hair andI would throw fits like at home
because my hair was so likedamaged, yeah, and it was just
like I don't know if you can see.
Speaker 1 (24:04):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 4 (24:05):
That's in the middle of one of the rooms getting my
hair like teased.
Cause they would like teaseyour hair out like terribly.
Speaker 1 (24:13):
Is that your mom in the picture?
Speaker 4 (24:15):
No, that's a random person that did hair and makeup.
Speaker 2 (24:18):
I love it.
Just like yeah, I don't know,so oh, my God.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
Are you friends with any of the?
Speaker 2 (24:24):
girls from your childhood?
Speaker 4 (24:26):
No, I'm like Facebook friends with a couple of them.
They found me.
Speaker 1 (24:31):
Are they still?
Speaker 4 (24:31):
doing pageants.
Speaker 2 (24:33):
No, okay, interesting .
Speaker 4 (24:36):
And I don't think any of them have kids that are
either.
Okay.
So pageants are still happening, but I think they in the
Columbia, I think in the samelike area, like the circuits
that I would do I don't thinkstill exist, I think.
Speaker 2 (24:53):
No more, ms Collard.
Speaker 4 (24:55):
Around here.
I think they just a lot.
There's a lot fewer of them andthey're they're different.
Now I don't know.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
I don't know how to say that the correct way, but
yeah, interesting, so okay, soup to speed, you're like 30
something.
What are your thoughts onpageants?
Now, I guess what are yourthoughts on, what are your
thoughts on the pageant industryin general and what are your
thoughts on?
Speaker 1 (25:22):
your own child category.
Speaker 4 (25:26):
I don't know.
I guess for me it's like one ofthose things where it's just
it's like weird and it's a lotof feelings, because I totally
get how much, how much I enjoyedhaving like friendship and
meeting people when I wasyounger and it was a lot of fun,
Like you'd go stay in a hoteland you'd like run around the
(25:47):
hotel with your friends.
You'd be able to go in the poollater and you'd wake up and then
go straight to the conferenceroom or whatever that everything
would be in, and it was like afun sleepover sort of.
Speaker 2 (26:00):
Yeah, reminds me a lot.
I didn't do dance competitionuntil I was in like later high
school, but it reminds me a lotof that culture.
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (26:09):
Yeah, so I guess that would be.
Yeah, that would be similar.
So there's things about it thatI'm like oh yeah, that was a
lot of fun, that was like a coolthing.
But then I start thinking aboutlike the amount of money that's
put into it, the amount ofmoney that I, that's like lost
to it, I guess.
Yeah, for a lot of people, formost people, um, so that's kind
(26:29):
of crazy to think about.
Speaker 3 (26:31):
And then also, it's just like Cause, like what's an
average prize, cut Like what's aI honestly don't know $10,000
is a lot of money.
Yeah, I honestly don't know.
I don't think it's that much.
Okay, I well, I have no idea Idid a little wiki.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
I did a little wiki research earlier, but I don't
remember what the I know it issaid that costs between $508,000
for like, on top of an entryfee of a couple hundred dollars
the hair, the makeup, thedresses like all that is like an
additional.
Speaker 4 (27:01):
Probably that's what I was going to say, Cause you
have to like, find a person wholike makes the dresses and you
have to get a custom dress madebecause you can't show up
looking like someone else, right, so you're throwing money into
that, cause it's like a ton oftime and rhinestones and
whatever else, um, and then alot of people get pageant
coaches, so you have to spendtime, um, going to someone's
(27:23):
studio to learn like dances andstuff to do on stage, um, and
then, yeah, hair and makeup is alot of money You're paying for
each outfit and a lot of theseones that I did are like the
most random.
Like I told you, western, where, like, that's a whole
interesting thing that has a lotof rhinestones too.
So that's a whole thing on itsown.
And, yeah, I think entryprobably when I was doing it
(27:45):
when I was younger, it wasprobably between like $75 and
$200, I would guess just forentry.
So then, yeah, you're thinkinghundreds of dollars on top of
that for everything else and theamount of people that win is so
like, if you're winning moneytoddlers and TRs I'm using for
background, um they had if youwin your group, then you don't
(28:06):
get any money.
But if you wait and win, likethe overall or whatever there
was like a thousand for likeSupreme and then like 5,000 for
like big Supreme.
I don't know what it was called, but those were like the cash
prizes and those were like thebig, only cash prizes.
Speaker 3 (28:21):
So whenever you're saying earlier, like the people
that went first in theircategory, the parents are like,
oh, that doesn't even countbecause it's like not a cash
prize.
Speaker 4 (28:29):
Yeah, because you're immediately like taken out of
the running to then get.
Oh okay, okay, which I don'tunderstand how that makes sense.
Speaker 2 (28:38):
But yeah, hmm.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
Hmm.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
Yeah, I think it's definitely.
People don't do it for themoney, that's for sure.
Speaker 4 (28:45):
Right, right, I think that was probably.
That's probably a problem witha lot of couples who have kids
that do it too, like I assume,because you know any couple has
arguments about money here inthere as it is.
Yeah, Like oh, you're spendingmoney to do what now?
Speaker 3 (28:59):
And oh my gosh, I'm like I can't even believe that
there's that many people outthere that can afford them.
Like right, right.
I just know, I was just gripingabout paying $100 for some to
play soccer Exactly.
Speaker 4 (29:13):
So it's like what money are you like?
What are you not paying forevery day that you're funneling
that money into this?
Right, I don't know, it's awhole interesting thing.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
It is interesting.
So do you feel like I mean,there's a ton of controversy
around it Do you feel like childbeauty patents should be
allowed Like?
Do you think that they're likepositive in any way?
Speaker 4 (29:34):
So one of the things that I was thinking about when I
was watching toddlers and tearsthe other day was how they were
saying like, oh, this is, thisis helpful, it's giving them
confidence, things like that.
I think that's like the mainargument, yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:47):
Right, I'm like I could see that, I could see
confidence, I could see presence.
You're having, you know, thechance to go in front of people
and just get more comfortablebeing in front of people.
Speaker 4 (29:56):
So maybe you're better with speaking, Maybe
you're just better with stagepresence, whatever that'll do.
But there's a lot of peoplethat are like, oh, I'm going to
get, there's other ways toachieve that.
Yeah, I think the whole idea ofit is just I don't want to say
that it's like a brought meshame to talk about over the
(30:17):
years, but it's one of thosethings where it's just like an
icky like.
If I go somewhere and they askfor a fun fact, I'm not like oh,
I did pageants.
Right Because it's like such aweird thing to just talk about
to any stranger.
You know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (30:30):
Right, I personally, and I think that I feel that way
.
Speaker 4 (30:33):
Yeah, I think I feel that way because it's like.
It's like not something that Iwant to present about myself,
because it's kind of icky.
It comes with a lot ofpreconceived Like yes, but also,
it is like it's a weird conceptYou're telling your little kid
that they need to be prettierthan the other ones and they
need to get on the stage andshow themselves off in front of
(30:55):
strangers.
Speaker 3 (30:57):
There are a lot of great yeah.
Speaker 4 (30:59):
There's a lot of weird parts to it and I have a
thing.
Speaker 3 (31:02):
There's a girl that I know from high school is like
she's like she doesn't go to thesame high school or didn't go
to the same high school as me,but I like know her adjacently
through other people but she isputting her like baby and
pageants and I had never seenthat before, Like baby, baby,
(31:22):
yeah, and I was like I this isso such a strange concept to me,
I guess that this is stillhappening.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (31:31):
I just it's interesting, I feel like back in
the day, a lot of things likewere I don't know.
Like like you're saying youwere doing it in the phase of
John Bonnet Ramsey and that waslike kind of when think people
were like, oh wait, this is kindof weird.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
Yeah, it's weird that it outlasted.
It's like it is strange.
Speaker 4 (31:48):
People have had so much to learn about it.
Speaker 2 (31:51):
Yeah, but I think it's because I think it's like
some of those things that peoplelove to hate.
I mean, like Tyler's and Tira'swas huge, like a massive show,
so it's like I think it's kindof like a car wreck, Like you
can't look away, but it's awful.
Speaker 3 (32:05):
You know when Tyler's and Tira has also made everyone
be like.
Speaker 1 (32:08):
This is disgusting because it's show, you know it's
drama, it's like, it's liketrue.
Speaker 3 (32:14):
It's the mom screaming at their kids, which
like obviously wasn't yourexperience, but like that's what
they're going to show on TVbecause it makes good TV.
Speaker 2 (32:24):
Yeah, you're right, it like kind of made a blanket
over like everyone's experiencemaybe, whereas like some like
there are, like you were saying,there's like a lot of positives
in your personal experience.
I yeah, but the buildingconfidence argument is
interesting to me because I'mlike what about like acting Like
yeah, like people who aren't?
Speaker 4 (32:42):
winning and then you're tearing their confidence.
Yeah, I was going to say I'mlike if, like what?
Speaker 3 (32:48):
if the person gets doesn't even rank, and then
they're like I'm ugly.
There's like so many differentways.
It's like not even natural.
Speaker 2 (32:55):
I don't know what's worse, the glitz or the natural
Cause.
If you're winning glitz, it'slike teaching your kid, maybe,
that they have to like do all ofthese extra things to be
presented as beautiful.
But if it's a natural pageantand you lose, it's like, oh, am
I not like good enough?
Speaker 4 (33:11):
And my nap with the glitz pageants.
I feel like it was presented toall of us doing them a lot more
as like um, you're like alittle Barbie doll, like it was
very much like.
This is just for fun.
Speaker 2 (33:23):
Like fun yeah.
Speaker 4 (33:24):
Like this is not how you would be in everyday life,
but like this is, you know, likewhen you play with Barbies,
like you're dressing up andwe're put, like you're getting
makeup put on you which is alsoanother weird concept to it,
though, Because it's like, likeyou said, like a mom having
their baby in it.
Now it's like you're justplaying dolls with your child.
Speaker 2 (33:40):
Yeah, I get that.
Yeah, it starts for a lot ofpeople I can imagine of like I
mean everyone.
I have two girls.
I loved her Like I loved.
That was like my favorite hobbywhen they were babies was like
finding cute outfits for them.
So, yeah, I get the appeal, butyeah, yeah, the contest part is
so interesting.
Speaker 4 (33:57):
Yeah, interesting.
Well, did you guys watch MissAmerica growing up?
Speaker 3 (34:01):
No, really not my only concept of pageants until,
like I was in high school,really was the like pageant
scene of Miss congeniality.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
Yes, that was my first exposure to it too.
Yeah, Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3 (34:16):
And then I had a friend that did them in high
school and I for like twoseconds, whenever I was like
Friends with her, I was like mom, can I do a pageant with her?
My mom was like I'm not payingfor that.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:29):
Yeah, you know, the money aspect is it's just, it's
like a big investment, it's infor what it's like?
Yeah, it's like the investmentwith sports or anything else.
You're like learning a skill.
Speaker 3 (34:40):
Yeah, it could be argued that you're learning a
skill, but it just feels likethe return well, the thing is
like the, the thing that theyyou're learning a skill, but
you're also paying a hundreddollars for a dress and like
it's just a lot of extras that alot of sports Don't have
everything like once you've beenin pageants and they've seen it
like.
Speaker 4 (34:57):
You can't keep wearing the same stuff.
You have to get new ones.
It's so interesting.
Speaker 3 (35:01):
So what's the average cost of a dress?
Because it's like custom.
Speaker 4 (35:06):
I don't know Because I mean the, the only thought I
have this like in 1998 orsomething.
Speaker 3 (35:10):
Yeah sure inflation baby.
Speaker 4 (35:14):
I'm sure but even then you know, I was like six
years old, so I wasn't likemommy.
How much is the stress?
Yeah right, yeah, I'm workingit.
Speaker 1 (35:22):
Yeah, I would.
I wish there was footage.
So.
Speaker 2 (35:25):
Badly.
I want the cowboy outfitfootage.
Speaker 4 (35:30):
I also want that outfit wait, you guys Like so
they'd had like 70s wear.
Wait, this is adorable oh mygosh.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Oh, it's for amazing yeah great designer I love it
and then another positive.
Speaker 4 (35:47):
Oh, I didn't share this with y'all.
I got to do like floats andparades.
Like waving, so you know yourcrap in movies where they're
just like waving at crowds andstuff.
Yeah, the little pageant wavelove it you know, and I was
gonna show you to my little, Idon't have any of my trophies or
(36:07):
Anything anymore.
Like, honestly, I got older andI was like throw it all away.
Speaker 3 (36:12):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 4 (36:13):
That's how I feel about.
Like I looked up the net or theindustry the
Speaker 2 (36:18):
industry oh my gosh, all your trophies.
Speaker 3 (36:21):
I know.
Speaker 2 (36:23):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (36:23):
Courtney.
Speaker 2 (36:23):
I'm not gonna lie I invited you on here, thinking
that you like, just dabbled andwe brought on a freaking like,
like you.
You slayed, I think they, sheslayed you guys, I, I did not
know, I did not know how.
Speaker 4 (36:42):
I told you, it's like another lifetime.
It's like I just have halfphotos as memories.
Speaker 2 (36:47):
I fully thought the cowgirl pageant was like the
only one.
Oh no, I did not know, it was alifestyle.
I, I'm, I'm just.
This is, I'm just chuffedamazing.
Speaker 3 (36:57):
Okay, what were you gonna say?
The?
Speaker 2 (36:58):
industry is worth approximately.
Do you want to guess?
And then?
We got a year are running outof time, so we have to go soon,
but this could be our lastlittle okay, okay, let's guess
Not just the children, the whole, like the whole pageant and can
you give us like no, this isjust children, so under 13.
(37:19):
Okay, this is just children.
Speaker 4 (37:23):
It's gonna be like millions, right.
Speaker 2 (37:27):
You know, this is being really unique.
Up what Naviar's five billionannually Wow.
And it's according money.
Over 50% of parents believethat beauty pageants have a
generally positive impact ontheir child self-esteem.
Okay, okay, so wow, okay, crazy.
Speaker 1 (37:56):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (37:57):
Okay.
Well, if any of our 10listeners are also fellow
pageant girlies, please let usknow.
I am like so.
I just think it's crazy how Idon't know I'm so.
It's been so interesting seeingwhat it's like in the 90s.
So thank you so much, courtney,for coming on, it's been so fun
(38:18):
.
Speaker 2 (38:19):
Yeah, thank you.
Thank you, guys for being hereand we will see you next Tuesday
.
Yay, see you next.
Speaker 3 (38:27):
Tuesday.
Speaker 1 (38:28):
Bye, okay.
Hello, hello, hello I'm.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Meredith.
I'm Meredith, I'm Caroline andthis is sister shit.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
This is sister shit and we have a guest this week
BAM, bam, bam.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
So, excited to this week we're talking beauty
pageants.
Caroline and I have neither ofus have participated in a beauty
pageant and we felt like we hadto deliver you guys At least
someone with some knowledge andbackground, since the last week,
we did a whole episode about aplace that we've never, ever
(00:49):
been to and did no research on,so we stepped it up a little bit
, just a little and by little.
We need miniature beauty queen.
Give it up for.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
Starling past.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Beauty.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
Yeah, tell us how you .
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Well, okay.
First of all, let's say hello,I want to know how you guys know
each other.
Speaker 3 (01:09):
Hi, thanks for having me, yeah.
Speaker 4 (01:14):
You guys met working at the cake cupcake shop.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
Right, we did.
Speaker 3 (01:18):
Yes, years ago Back in college days yeah, so what
year was?
Speaker 2 (01:24):
that Like 20.
It was right when I got engagedbecause our boss asked me if I
was pregnant and told me Ididn't need to get married.
Oh, what Shit.
Wait, who was?
Was it Heidi?
Speaker 3 (01:33):
Yeah, Heidi she was like I think she was very like
genuine.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
But she was like are you pregnant?
And I was like no, because Iwas so young, I was 21.
So it was 2011.
When I was back, when cupcakeswere all the rage yes, yes, and
Meredith was saying, I think acouple episodes ago, that she
used to like keep snacks and herapron pocket.
Speaker 3 (01:58):
And she was like I don't know, I don't know, I
don't know.
She used to keep snacks in herapron pocket.
Speaker 4 (02:04):
Yes, I forever will know Meredith as the one who cut
these weird little meltingchocolate discs in her pocket.
They were like oh, body heatfrom body heat, they would start
to melt in her pocket, butshe'd still be like eating the
little melty chips throughoutthe show.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
It was nasty, like melting chocolate that we'd used
for like cake pops and likethat chocolate should not be
eaten as like a treat.
Speaker 3 (02:26):
And shouldn't be raw dog in it in your pocket.
Speaker 4 (02:30):
It was probably a little linty, you know, but it's
fine, it's fine.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
I also would eat the Lisa would.
Our boss would be peeling theapples with an apple like one of
those like little apple peelersthat like does the long strand
of peel and I would just likeeat the apple peel and she'd be
like that's garbage and I waslike I kind of like it.
Speaker 4 (02:49):
That's so funny.
I don't remember that one, butI love that story.
Healthy I mean it was collegeyears.
It was tough times, you knowdoing a little raccoon and
living for a snack.
Speaker 2 (02:59):
We were scavengers there, so we were, when we got
one free kick every shift.
Speaker 3 (03:06):
Oh, but I don't want it yeah.
Speaker 4 (03:10):
I mean really you want to use your free cupcake to
like put everybody's freecupcakes together to trade with
somewhere that has yes.
Food and meals that is nearbyfor sure.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
I traded this guy that worked at the outdoor store
across the street one time.
He brought me a tube ofchapstick for a cupcake.
Speaker 4 (03:27):
What?
That is probably the strangesttrading story I've ever heard.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Yeah, I mean, I think it was, because I think for him
it was more about the thrill ofthe trade, because he had to
like steal from his store and Ihad a free merchandise to give
and he would just like take thepoint of purchase or what do you
call like the little countertop things.
Yeah, like the thing.
Speaker 4 (03:48):
How did this even come up?
Speaker 2 (03:49):
Where did he come from?
Speaker 4 (03:54):
He was a.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
He dated my friend, oh, okay, Okay, he was a friend
and we just worked across thestreet, so I think he just like,
thought it was fun to tradethings.
Speaker 3 (04:01):
That's hilarious.
Got it Okay?
Last cupcake topic before wemove on to the real topic all
time favorite flavor.
Speaker 4 (04:13):
I think mine might have to be salted caramel
chocolate.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
I don't know, it's a classic.
I can taste that when you saythe name.
Speaker 4 (04:21):
It's hard to mess up.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 4 (04:24):
I think it's just like a good easy.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
It was my favorite too, it was good.
Speaker 3 (04:28):
Is cupcake still there?
No, no.
Speaker 4 (04:32):
So we changed to owners and COVID hit hard and
the owner kind of backed out.
You know I don't completely buythem, but at the same time he
was a little shady.
So it is like this it was inthe breath dumping, yes, Like we
found out on Thanksgiving thatwe were closing like two weeks
later.
Speaker 1 (04:50):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 4 (04:52):
I had to tell my staff on Thanksgiving oh no, so
it was not the best ending andwe don't still talk that's what
I'm saying, but you know it iswhat it is.
We looked out the whole cupcakebag.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
It had a good run.
It did, that's a long run.
It was a long run.
Yes, it really was.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
Longer than the frozen yogurt.
True, it was like I don't thinkI'm gonna be able to go back to
the last year.
I was like I've been in adifferent continent that like
there's those popped up on everycorner and now I can't name one
that's left.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
I went to a new one the other week.
You guys, my friend, knew one.
Speaker 3 (05:35):
I don't think it's new, but I, my friend, was like
do you want to go get frozenyogurt after we pick up the kids
from school?
Speaker 2 (05:38):
And I was like uh-huh , but like wait, wait, wait.
And she's like this is myfavorite, it's the best.
Like she's like and I'm like Ilove that you are.
She like managed multiplefrozen yogurt places, like in
high school and then in college.
She's like Interesting, yeah,and she's a classic flavor, like
(05:59):
the yogurt flavor.
When we go she's like a pure,purest purest wild, but I was
like it has been over a decadesince I've had frozen yogurt.
Speaker 3 (06:10):
I remember the first time going I was like this is
the future and now?
And now it's crumbled.
Yeah, like dip in dots yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Oh my gosh, but did?
That was the future, you guys.
It still is, if I go to.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
Like I'm trying to think of places that have
dipping dots like a baseballgame.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
I'm like, yeah, I'm saving my, I'm saving the room
in my tummy there are marginshave to be absolutely insane,
because the amount of dots youget in the container is like so
few, yeah, like there's a lot ofair in there, and there it's
about eight dollars a pop, soit's it's kind of wild if you
(06:51):
think about it a whole episodeon sweets.
Speaker 3 (06:53):
If you haven't yet sweet trend.
Yeah, maybe we'll do that.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
No, okay, we'll get a question.
Okay, you guys feel aboutcrumble cookie, you guys?
Speaker 3 (07:04):
already know how I feel about their uh guest
experience.
Speaker 2 (07:08):
Wait, did we talk about?
Speaker 3 (07:09):
it I thought we did about how you like the robots
are taking over because you walkup and you like order on an
iPad.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
And it's like do you want to leave a?
Speaker 3 (07:17):
25% tip for nothing.
Speaker 4 (07:22):
Yeah, I've never been in a crumble cookies oh.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
I've had other people's like their Um chocolate
chip.
It's the only one I like.
Speaker 3 (07:32):
I've had another one that I liked I will okay.
So at work, a couple months ago, my boss had like had a meeting
with a potential like person,like a vendor that we were gonna
use, and within like threehours we got a giant delivery,
like giant, like 12 crumblecookies, which is a lot.
And we were like, who sent usthese cookies?
(07:54):
And it came with a note thatsaid thanks for meeting with us
earlier.
We're so excited and hope themomentum doesn't crumble.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
I respect that Did you end up going with them?
Speaker 3 (08:10):
I honestly never followed up.
I just ate the cookies.
I mean it wasn't my job tofollow up.
I just was there for thecookies.
Let me be clear.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
I don't even know what they were.
I didn't drop the ball.
Speaker 4 (08:23):
It's like oh no, she didn't like that very much.
Now Okay let's get into it.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
We are talking about beauty pageants.
Where do we wanna start?
So, courtney, I guess we justwanna know what was your
experience?
Well, like, tell us about yourpersonal history with the
industry.
Yes and why you got involved,and I do feel like I need to
preface this by saying you can'tsee Courtney, but if you met
(08:52):
her you would never in a millionyears think I bet she used to
be a child.
Beauty queen Just doesn't fitthe bill, which I think is the
thing I love most about you.
It is like the best fun factever.
Speaker 3 (09:07):
And not that you're not absolutely stunning.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
I'm not saying that, I'm just saying we don't have
the nears and like I'm notwearing a tiara right now.
Speaker 4 (09:16):
You're not wearing a tiara.
You're not like bleach blonde.
Speaker 3 (09:19):
You don't have the yeah.
Speaker 4 (09:22):
Not anymore.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
Okay so you were in.
Okay, okay, tell us everything.
Speaker 4 (09:28):
Okay, so my story starts at the ripe age of nine
months old.
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (09:36):
Already on the phone.
Coach so clearly.
Speaker 4 (09:37):
I chose this life.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
No.
Speaker 4 (09:41):
Yeah, so my first pageant.
I was about nine months old.
It's so funny because I wonsome big trophy, Like I don't
know if I was overall or justwhatever, but it's the funniest
picture because I can't.
Like they just sat me down inmy dress on this like little
couch or whatever bench and youjust I can't even hold my neck
up and I have like this littletiara on and this huge trophy
(10:05):
that's like three times myheight.
Like this is ridiculous.
Speaker 3 (10:07):
Oh my gosh, we need pictures.
What are the?
Speaker 2 (10:09):
qualifications for like entering as a baby.
Speaker 4 (10:13):
Well, wait, can I tell you, as you said, you need
pictures.
I can't find it, but that wasin the state newspaper, that's
so.
So I have to try to find it,but I do have a picture, so
you're basically famous.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
You're famous from birth 1993, I was in the
newspaper Miss Miss Baby, missBaby 1993.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
Baby, Are we talking national level state?
Speaker 4 (10:36):
level county level state I did a lot of really
small ones around South Carolinaand okay, to give you more
information on that, I think Iwas like little miscollared and
like Little Miss Peanut, becausethere's like the peanut
festival and the collaredfestival.
(10:57):
At one point I was Miss CatfishStomp Because that is a local,
miss Catfish Stomp.
Yes.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Go on, that is a local.
Speaker 4 (11:06):
Yes, so I did a little bit of everything, but
then there's some that's likethe pageants model after like
Valentine's Day, so it'll belike Little Miss Valentine or
you know, like.
Speaker 3 (11:16):
What was your favorite title?
Like which one are you like man?
I'm proud of this title.
Speaker 4 (11:22):
I love telling people about the Catfish Stomp one,
because probably they could hearit yeah that's a good one.
Speaker 2 (11:27):
Have you updated your LinkedIn profile Because?
They have to be on it.
Okay, so this is the firstpageant where I can't hold my
You're showing us an incrediblepicture that we want we're gonna
share on Instagram.
Speaker 3 (11:41):
We'll share on Instagram, because this is
amazing.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
The dress is huge, you look great.
Speaker 4 (11:46):
Oh gosh.
So yeah, that's not even theone with the trophy.
So what's like the?
Speaker 3 (11:49):
baby culture.
I'm like.
I guess, when does it getsomewhat like funky?
I'm assuming it gets funky,does it?
Speaker 4 (11:58):
So I sort of had to pull my brother into this on
this one, because he's sevenyears older than me.
So, he remembers a lot of thisbetter than I do.
At least the early years, youknow.
So he thinks that this allstarted because one of my mom's
like work friends, had adaughter that she was putting in
pageants and was like it'd befun if we did this together.
Speaker 2 (12:19):
Okay, okay.
Speaker 4 (12:19):
So it was like, okay, let's just do it for fun.
And my grandma got involved andshe was like, oh, love this,
this is so cute.
And so it became like a familyand friends event and it was
like every once in a while we'lldo it.
And then I got a little bitolder and I guess I just started
making friends with other girlsthat were in my age group at
(12:40):
these pageants and then my mombecame friends with their moms
and so it would be like we wouldgo over to their house and just
hang out on a normal day.
Or maybe we would join the samewhat do you call it?
Like the person who teaches usroutines to do on stage Coat.
Sometimes it would be like,yeah, we would join the same
(13:03):
studio for that person.
Speaker 3 (13:05):
And go to the sponsors together.
Speaker 4 (13:06):
I saw the movie Dumplin' I don't know why you
remember that part.
I do.
I forgot about that movie.
I did see that.
I did not see toddlers in TRS.
I watched an episode the othernight to see if it brought
anything back.
Speaker 3 (13:16):
I haven't seen any of it either.
Look at you doing it.
You did so much research.
Speaker 4 (13:19):
I love it, I do have to tell y'all, though, that my
experience is not from theviewpoint of some of the people
that I saw on toddlers in TRS,where the parents were like, oh
well, they won first place intheir age group.
They just they lost the pageant, like they're not gonna get the
overall, they're not gonna getthe $10,000 or whatever.
We were more so in it for, like, the fun aspect.
(13:41):
I mean, of course, if I likewon money or something awesome,
we can put that toward the nextone or something.
But, it was never like oh, youwon first place or second place,
you lost.
Like.
It was always like oh, did youhave fun?
Like oh, great.
Speaker 3 (13:55):
Okay, okay, so it helps me.
So your mom wasn't like one ofthose like toddlers in TRS,
those moms are like it can beintense, Intense, yes.
And the kids are crying andthey're like forcing the
flippers in their mouth.
Speaker 4 (14:11):
Yes, and I did know parents that were like that.
I remember having friends inthe circuit whose moms were like
a little scary to be around andthey would be like.
I can't believe you didn't getoverall or whatever, like it was
a whole thing.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
Which like happens in any like, it's not just in
pageants.
You always get in any childhoodthing.
There's the parents that liketake it way too seriously.
Like we were in plays growingup and we literally had like a
girl whose grandma was likeshe's, this is showbiz baby.
(14:46):
Like took it so like would getmad if this girl was not front
and center.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
Yeah, there's one in every bunch, at least one in
every bunch, for sure yeah.
So what was your first pageant?
You remember, like how old wereyou?
When you like, have memories ofit.
Speaker 4 (15:04):
So I did them from when I was nine months old to
when I was like 12 years old.
So it was a very long time and,to be honest with you, it all
sort of just blends together.
Speaker 2 (15:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (15:14):
But for me things that like stand out are like
places that I've been, more sothan like the pageant itself.
So a lot of the pageants, atleast in this area I don't know
how it is everywhere else, butlike the peanut pageant, for
example, I do remember that onebeing here.
(15:36):
It was in a high school, so itwas like in the high school
auditorium and then we therewere like dressing, get ready
rooms in like classrooms.
Speaker 2 (15:46):
Uh-huh.
Speaker 1 (15:47):
Like a dancer's title .
Speaker 4 (15:48):
Yeah.
So we would be like giving ourcurlers, putting our hair and
doing our makeup, and likechanging clothes in classrooms,
yeah, and we would line up likeoutside of the auditorium and
like go up the back part of thestage onto the stage.
And then you know audiencewould be sitting auditorium
judges would be in front of them.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
Who's in the audience ?
Like is it which families right, I want to get on this later
because I do.
Speaker 4 (16:10):
I also have something to say about this, because I
have been thinking about it alot in adulthood.
Of course, as a child I didn'treally think about it but, so
most of the time it would justbe family members, so like
siblings, parents, grandparentscousins, you know all that fun
stuff.
Every once in a while peoplewould bring their friends, but I
feel like that was very minimal, like I didn't really I don't
(16:31):
think anybody really knew ofmany outsiders that were around
at least I don't know sort ofBecause.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
I don't feel like they advertised them.
Speaker 3 (16:39):
Exactly.
These are so cool and it's kindof like an all day affair,
right, correct?
Speaker 4 (16:45):
So you have to be like from like first thing in
the morning all day, likethey'll notice if somebody just
like creeps along inside Likeand a lot of people know each
other, and so you kind of get tothe point where it's like, oh,
that's so-and-so's grandma, likewe know her, Like you know just
kind of you're in the circuitdoing all these pageants.
However, the group of peoplethat I always get confused about
(17:06):
and I wish that I knew more on,are the judges.
Speaker 2 (17:10):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (17:10):
Like who is the judge In any beauty?
Speaker 2 (17:12):
pageant yes, like when I was watching-.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
What makes them qualified?
Exactly what makes themqualified?
Yes, but when I was?
Speaker 4 (17:18):
watching toddlers in TRs the other day.
You know they're like lookingat the girls on stage and
looking so seriously down attheir paper and taking their
notes and I'm like what are theywriting?
What are they so serious about,or like why is a?
Speaker 2 (17:29):
strange man looking at these.
Yes, it's the men that weird meout.
Speaker 4 (17:35):
Yeah, like the older middle-aged to older men that
are not somebody's grandpa Like.
Even if they were, that wouldstill be a little weird.
But at least there's like someconnection.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (17:44):
I just don't understand.
Speaker 2 (17:45):
Very odd.
So were the category I knowthere's like different
categories of pageants Was causelike toddlers in TRs is like
glitz right, it's like you'redoing the flipper you're doing
the hair.
So were yours.
What's like?
The opposite of that, or what'sthe other options?
Speaker 4 (18:00):
No, so I mostly did glitz.
Oh, okay, I didn't know.
They recalled that until Iwatched toddlers TRs the other
night.
Speaker 2 (18:07):
honestly, so does that look like?
In the 90s, when you were doingit, was it as crazy as it is
now?
Speaker 4 (18:12):
Yes, when I was watching it, but like the first
episode, I was like, did I havethat dress?
Like it is very much the samesomehow.
Speaker 3 (18:20):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 4 (18:21):
Which is really interesting to me, because I
would think that it would haveevolved more than a half.
Speaker 2 (18:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (18:27):
So there's glitz and then there's natural, and then I
didn't keep watching.
But I think the second episodehad a little girl who was in
natural pageants.
So they didn't do hair, theydidn't do makeup, and I think
the clothing was way more likejust a little bit more
no-transcript.
I don't know.
That's a good question.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
Sorry keep going.
That's the biggest question.
Speaker 4 (18:47):
That's the biggest question that everyone asked me,
and I didn't have a talent.
We didn't do talent like that.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
Oh, it was just Beauty Baby.
Speaker 4 (18:54):
Yeah, so you would go and you would just have
different outfits.
I know you've seen my famousblue Western wear outfit the
tiny cowboy boots.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
I think I have that photo actually too.
Speaker 3 (19:05):
So I'll find that Western wear that was.
I'm telling you these thingsare ridiculous, you'd be popular
.
You'd probably win now with theWestern wear.
It's bad, it's the same Texas.
Speaker 4 (19:15):
So we had here's one, but this isn't the one that.
Speaker 2 (19:19):
Oh.
Speaker 3 (19:20):
Oh my gosh, when did you win that?
Speaker 2 (19:22):
pageant.
It's amazing, it looks amazing.
Speaker 4 (19:24):
I don't know.
I can't remember which ones Idid and didn't.
Speaker 2 (19:26):
Was that your real hair?
Speaker 4 (19:28):
No, this is the bleach blonde face.
Speaker 1 (19:30):
So these are the little boots.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
Oh my, I want this outfit.
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 4 (19:37):
So, this move that I'm doing, I have my arm or my
hand on a hip and then my otherarm is out with my Western wear
coat across it and that's one ofmy moves that I did on stage.
So you, when I did the coaching, you would go and it would be
like we're going to do this toDixie Chicks, and so we had yes,
you did.
Speaker 3 (19:56):
How will I take me?
Speaker 4 (19:56):
away or something, and I would like have a coat on
to start, but then I would likerip it off and like do it around
my head and then put it on myarm and like walk around.
Speaker 2 (20:05):
I wish we had footage .
Speaker 4 (20:07):
I know that's the one thing.
I don't have any videos of anyof this, so your brother.
Speaker 3 (20:11):
Did he have to go to all these and sit through all
these and watch them, and whatare his feelings?
Speaker 4 (20:16):
He had to go through quite a few of them, but I think
once he got Because he's sevenyears older than me, so I want
to say once he hit that like 12to 13 year old time frame, he
was like I'm just going to go toa friend's house or something.
Speaker 2 (20:31):
Like I don't want to do this Good for him.
Speaker 4 (20:33):
And then for him, like my mom and my grandma were
really into it, so we would alldo the whole thing together, but
then, like my parents divorcedwhen I was like super young,
right, so my dad wasn'tnaturally a part of all of that
anyway, but like I have photosof him leading me on stage when
I was really little and stuff onsome of it and like coming to
(20:54):
them.
But the older I got like, Iremember arguments and him being
like why is she doing this?
Like, why are we.
Like he was, definitely like.
I don't know about thesepageants.
You know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (21:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (21:06):
And then the older I got like he was like what is
going on?
But then, when you think aboutit too, I started in like 1993.
Gombane Ramsey happened in like96.
Yeah, and so I continued overthe course of all of that, and
then there was this whole likethat was a national line.
Speaker 2 (21:21):
And that like brought this to the forefront because I
before her I feel like pageantsthey were happening but it was
quiet.
Speaker 4 (21:29):
It was quiet, yeah, and then it was like mass
concern.
Yes, and I was going to say,and it brought a lot of people's
feelings to it, especially notknowing what it was, seeing all
the pictures and everything andsaying, oh no, what are we doing
?
Which?
I understand it's totally aright concern to have.
Speaker 2 (21:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
So when did you stop?
At 12?
Was it your?
Speaker 2 (21:53):
decision?
Was it your mom's decision?
Was your dad's?
Speaker 4 (21:56):
Yeah.
So I think I just startedgetting, I don't know.
I started getting older andthen you're just kind of like
this isn't fun anymore, and so Ikind of got to that point where
I didn't feel like there wasmany the younger categories, I
think, because more parents tendto put their kids in younger,
just had more kids, so like fiveto seven age group would have
(22:17):
like 12 kids or something a lotof times.
But then when I got to like 11to 13 or whatever age group it
was, there were only like threeof us.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
And so it's like I didn't have as many friends.
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (22:29):
I didn't have any as many friends that kept up with
it, but I started with and then.
So when you start seeing yourfriends drop out and then when
you get to the point whereyou're like I don't want to make
new friends with these randompeople and I don't think I like
this anymore.
And why are we still tugging onmy hair and doing my makeup?
Yeah, you know it's like youstart sort of getting more
self-aware, I guess at that age,Totally, Totally.
(22:52):
And so I think I just got tothe point where I was like no
thanks.
And I remember like telling mymom and I was like we're dying
my hair brown.
So I had bleach blonde hair foryears.
Speaker 2 (23:02):
Oh, that was real or that wasn't real.
The bleach blonde that I had,bleach blonde hair.
Speaker 4 (23:07):
Yeah, oh, 100%.
Yes, I got my hair dyed all thetime.
So I think, I had naturalblonde hair up until I was about
four years old.
Speaker 1 (23:15):
Okay, and then it started changing.
Speaker 4 (23:17):
It started getting darker, and so then I started
getting dyed, mm-hmm.
Speaker 1 (23:21):
Whoa.
Speaker 4 (23:23):
So I didn't get my hair highlighted or like dyed at
all for the first time untilmaybe like three years ago and
I'm 31.
Speaker 2 (23:29):
So you were like go somewhere to get it done, or
would your mom do it?
Speaker 4 (23:32):
Usually my mom would do it or something.
Speaker 2 (23:34):
Okay, okay, wow, so it wasn't like out of salon.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
It was just like out of the box Like yeah, it was not
good.
Speaker 4 (23:43):
I remember like over the summer, going to people's
pools and swimming, and it wouldturn green because of the rain.
It was not good and it was likeI'm telling you guys, hold on.
I got to find this other, likeit was a well-known thing that
people didn't touch my hair andI would throw fits like at home
because my hair was so likedamaged, yeah, and it was just
like I don't know if you can see.
Speaker 1 (24:04):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 4 (24:05):
That's in the middle of one of the rooms getting my
hair like teased.
Cause they would like teaseyour hair out like terribly.
Speaker 1 (24:13):
Is that your mom in the picture?
Speaker 4 (24:15):
No, that's a random person that did hair and makeup.
Speaker 2 (24:18):
I love it.
Just like yeah, I don't know,so oh, my God.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
Are you friends with any of the?
Speaker 2 (24:24):
girls from your childhood?
Speaker 4 (24:26):
No, I'm like Facebook friends with a couple of them.
They found me.
Speaker 1 (24:31):
Are they still?
Speaker 4 (24:31):
doing pageants.
Speaker 2 (24:33):
No, okay, interesting .
Speaker 4 (24:36):
And I don't think any of them have kids that are
either.
Okay.
So pageants are still happening, but I think they in the
Columbia, I think in the samelike area, like the circuits
that I would do I don't thinkstill exist, I think.
Speaker 2 (24:53):
No more, ms Collard.
Speaker 4 (24:55):
Around here.
I think they just a lot.
There's a lot fewer of them andthey're they're different.
Now I don't know.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
I don't know how to say that the correct way, but
yeah, interesting, so okay, soup to speed, you're like 30
something.
What are your thoughts onpageants?
Now, I guess what are yourthoughts on, what are your
thoughts on the pageant industryin general and what are your
thoughts on?
Speaker 1 (25:22):
your own child category.
Speaker 4 (25:26):
I don't know.
I guess for me it's like one ofthose things where it's just
it's like weird and it's a lotof feelings, because I totally
get how much, how much I enjoyedhaving like friendship and
meeting people when I wasyounger and it was a lot of fun,
Like you'd go stay in a hoteland you'd like run around the
(25:47):
hotel with your friends.
You'd be able to go in the poollater and you'd wake up and then
go straight to the conferenceroom or whatever that everything
would be in, and it was like afun sleepover sort of.
Speaker 2 (26:00):
Yeah, reminds me a lot.
I didn't do dance competitionuntil I was in like later high
school, but it reminds me a lotof that culture.
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (26:09):
Yeah, so I guess that would be.
Yeah, that would be similar.
So there's things about it thatI'm like oh yeah, that was a
lot of fun, that was like a coolthing.
But then I start thinking aboutlike the amount of money that's
put into it, the amount ofmoney that I, that's like lost
to it, I guess.
Yeah, for a lot of people, formost people, um, so that's kind
(26:29):
of crazy to think about.
Speaker 3 (26:31):
And then also, it's just like Cause, like what's an
average prize, cut Like what's aI honestly don't know $10,000
is a lot of money.
Yeah, I honestly don't know.
I don't think it's that much.
Okay, I well, I have no idea Idid a little wiki.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
I did a little wiki research earlier, but I don't
remember what the I know it issaid that costs between $508,000
for like, on top of an entryfee of a couple hundred dollars
the hair, the makeup, thedresses like all that is like an
additional.
Speaker 4 (27:01):
Probably that's what I was going to say, Cause you
have to like, find a person wholike makes the dresses and you
have to get a custom dress madebecause you can't show up
looking like someone else, right, so you're throwing money into
that, cause it's like a ton oftime and rhinestones and
whatever else, um, and then alot of people get pageant
coaches, so you have to spendtime, um, going to someone's
(27:23):
studio to learn like dances andstuff to do on stage, um, and
then, yeah, hair and makeup is alot of money You're paying for
each outfit and a lot of theseones that I did are like the
most random.
Like I told you, western, where, like, that's a whole
interesting thing that has a lotof rhinestones too.
So that's a whole thing on itsown.
And, yeah, I think entryprobably when I was doing it
(27:45):
when I was younger, it wasprobably between like $75 and
$200, I would guess just forentry.
So then, yeah, you're thinkinghundreds of dollars on top of
that for everything else and theamount of people that win is so
like, if you're winning moneytoddlers and TRs I'm using for
background, um they had if youwin your group, then you don't
(28:06):
get any money.
But if you wait and win, likethe overall or whatever there
was like a thousand for likeSupreme and then like 5,000 for
like big Supreme.
I don't know what it was called, but those were like the cash
prizes and those were like thebig, only cash prizes.
Speaker 3 (28:21):
So whenever you're saying earlier, like the people
that went first in theircategory, the parents are like,
oh, that doesn't even countbecause it's like not a cash
prize.
Speaker 4 (28:29):
Yeah, because you're immediately like taken out of
the running to then get.
Oh okay, okay, which I don'tunderstand how that makes sense.
Speaker 2 (28:38):
But yeah, hmm.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
Hmm.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
Yeah, I think it's definitely.
People don't do it for themoney, that's for sure.
Speaker 4 (28:45):
Right, right, I think that was probably.
That's probably a problem witha lot of couples who have kids
that do it too, like I assume,because you know any couple has
arguments about money here inthere as it is.
Yeah, Like oh, you're spendingmoney to do what now?
Speaker 3 (28:59):
And oh my gosh, I'm like I can't even believe that
there's that many people outthere that can afford them.
Like right, right.
I just know, I was just gripingabout paying $100 for some to
play soccer Exactly.
Speaker 4 (29:13):
So it's like what money are you like?
What are you not paying forevery day that you're funneling
that money into this?
Right, I don't know, it's awhole interesting thing.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
It is interesting.
So do you feel like I mean,there's a ton of controversy
around it Do you feel like childbeauty patents should be
allowed Like?
Do you think that they're likepositive in any way?
Speaker 4 (29:34):
So one of the things that I was thinking about when I
was watching toddlers and tearsthe other day was how they were
saying like, oh, this is, thisis helpful, it's giving them
confidence, things like that.
I think that's like the mainargument, yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:47):
Right, I'm like I could see that, I could see
confidence, I could see presence.
You're having, you know, thechance to go in front of people
and just get more comfortablebeing in front of people.
Speaker 4 (29:56):
So maybe you're better with speaking, Maybe
you're just better with stagepresence, whatever that'll do.
But there's a lot of peoplethat are like, oh, I'm going to
get, there's other ways toachieve that.
Yeah, I think the whole idea ofit is just I don't want to say
that it's like a brought meshame to talk about over the
(30:17):
years, but it's one of thosethings where it's just like an
icky like.
If I go somewhere and they askfor a fun fact, I'm not like oh,
I did pageants.
Right Because it's like such aweird thing to just talk about
to any stranger.
You know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (30:30):
Right, I personally, and I think that I feel that way
.
Speaker 4 (30:33):
Yeah, I think I feel that way because it's like.
It's like not something that Iwant to present about myself,
because it's kind of icky.
It comes with a lot ofpreconceived Like yes, but also,
it is like it's a weird conceptYou're telling your little kid
that they need to be prettierthan the other ones and they
need to get on the stage andshow themselves off in front of
(30:55):
strangers.
Speaker 3 (30:57):
There are a lot of great yeah.
Speaker 4 (30:59):
There's a lot of weird parts to it and I have a
thing.
Speaker 3 (31:02):
There's a girl that I know from high school is like
she's like she doesn't go to thesame high school or didn't go
to the same high school as me,but I like know her adjacently
through other people but she isputting her like baby and
pageants and I had never seenthat before, Like baby, baby,
(31:22):
yeah, and I was like I this isso such a strange concept to me,
I guess that this is stillhappening.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (31:31):
I just it's interesting, I feel like back in
the day, a lot of things likewere I don't know.
Like like you're saying youwere doing it in the phase of
John Bonnet Ramsey and that waslike kind of when think people
were like, oh wait, this is kindof weird.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
Yeah, it's weird that it outlasted.
It's like it is strange.
Speaker 4 (31:48):
People have had so much to learn about it.
Speaker 2 (31:51):
Yeah, but I think it's because I think it's like
some of those things that peoplelove to hate.
I mean, like Tyler's and Tira'swas huge, like a massive show,
so it's like I think it's kindof like a car wreck, Like you
can't look away, but it's awful.
Speaker 3 (32:05):
You know when Tyler's and Tira has also made everyone
be like.
Speaker 1 (32:08):
This is disgusting because it's show, you know it's
drama, it's like, it's liketrue.
Speaker 3 (32:14):
It's the mom screaming at their kids, which
like obviously wasn't yourexperience, but like that's what
they're going to show on TVbecause it makes good TV.
Speaker 2 (32:24):
Yeah, you're right, it like kind of made a blanket
over like everyone's experiencemaybe, whereas like some like
there are, like you were saying,there's like a lot of positives
in your personal experience.
I yeah, but the buildingconfidence argument is
interesting to me because I'mlike what about like acting Like
yeah, like people who aren't?
Speaker 4 (32:42):
winning and then you're tearing their confidence.
Yeah, I was going to say I'mlike if, like what?
Speaker 3 (32:48):
if the person gets doesn't even rank, and then
they're like I'm ugly.
There's like so many differentways.
It's like not even natural.
Speaker 2 (32:55):
I don't know what's worse, the glitz or the natural
Cause.
If you're winning glitz, it'slike teaching your kid, maybe,
that they have to like do all ofthese extra things to be
presented as beautiful.
But if it's a natural pageantand you lose, it's like, oh, am
I not like good enough?
Speaker 4 (33:11):
And my nap with the glitz pageants.
I feel like it was presented toall of us doing them a lot more
as like um, you're like alittle Barbie doll, like it was
very much like.
This is just for fun.
Speaker 2 (33:23):
Like fun yeah.
Speaker 4 (33:24):
Like this is not how you would be in everyday life,
but like this is, you know, likewhen you play with Barbies,
like you're dressing up andwe're put, like you're getting
makeup put on you which is alsoanother weird concept to it,
though, Because it's like, likeyou said, like a mom having
their baby in it.
Now it's like you're justplaying dolls with your child.
Speaker 2 (33:40):
Yeah, I get that.
Yeah, it starts for a lot ofpeople I can imagine of like I
mean everyone.
I have two girls.
I loved her Like I loved.
That was like my favorite hobbywhen they were babies was like
finding cute outfits for them.
So, yeah, I get the appeal, butyeah, yeah, the contest part is
so interesting.
Speaker 4 (33:57):
Yeah, interesting.
Well, did you guys watch MissAmerica growing up?
Speaker 3 (34:01):
No, really not my only concept of pageants until,
like I was in high school,really was the like pageant
scene of Miss congeniality.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
Yes, that was my first exposure to it too.
Yeah, Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3 (34:16):
And then I had a friend that did them in high
school and I for like twoseconds, whenever I was like
Friends with her, I was like mom, can I do a pageant with her?
My mom was like I'm not payingfor that.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:29):
Yeah, you know, the money aspect is it's just, it's
like a big investment, it's infor what it's like?
Yeah, it's like the investmentwith sports or anything else.
You're like learning a skill.
Speaker 3 (34:40):
Yeah, it could be argued that you're learning a
skill, but it just feels likethe return well, the thing is
like the, the thing that theyyou're learning a skill, but
you're also paying a hundreddollars for a dress and like
it's just a lot of extras that alot of sports Don't have
everything like once you've beenin pageants and they've seen it
like.
Speaker 4 (34:57):
You can't keep wearing the same stuff.
You have to get new ones.
It's so interesting.
Speaker 3 (35:01):
So what's the average cost of a dress?
Because it's like custom.
Speaker 4 (35:06):
I don't know Because I mean the, the only thought I
have this like in 1998 orsomething.
Speaker 3 (35:10):
Yeah sure inflation baby.
Speaker 4 (35:14):
I'm sure but even then you know, I was like six
years old, so I wasn't likemommy.
How much is the stress?
Yeah right, yeah, I'm workingit.
Speaker 1 (35:22):
Yeah, I would.
I wish there was footage.
So.
Speaker 2 (35:25):
Badly.
I want the cowboy outfitfootage.
Speaker 4 (35:30):
I also want that outfit wait, you guys Like so
they'd had like 70s wear.
Wait, this is adorable oh mygosh.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Oh, it's for amazing yeah great designer I love it
and then another positive.
Speaker 4 (35:47):
Oh, I didn't share this with y'all.
I got to do like floats andparades.
Like waving, so you know yourcrap in movies where they're
just like waving at crowds andstuff.
Yeah, the little pageant wavelove it you know, and I was
gonna show you to my little, Idon't have any of my trophies or
(36:07):
Anything anymore.
Like, honestly, I got older andI was like throw it all away.
Speaker 3 (36:12):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 4 (36:13):
That's how I feel about.
Like I looked up the net or theindustry the
Speaker 2 (36:18):
industry oh my gosh, all your trophies.
Speaker 3 (36:21):
I know.
Speaker 2 (36:23):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (36:23):
Courtney.
Speaker 2 (36:23):
I'm not gonna lie I invited you on here, thinking
that you like, just dabbled andwe brought on a freaking like,
like you.
You slayed, I think they, sheslayed you guys, I, I did not
know, I did not know how.
Speaker 4 (36:42):
I told you, it's like another lifetime.
It's like I just have halfphotos as memories.
Speaker 2 (36:47):
I fully thought the cowgirl pageant was like the
only one.
Oh no, I did not know, it was alifestyle.
I, I'm, I'm just.
This is, I'm just chuffedamazing.
Speaker 3 (36:57):
Okay, what were you gonna say?
The?
Speaker 2 (36:58):
industry is worth approximately.
Do you want to guess?
And then?
We got a year are running outof time, so we have to go soon,
but this could be our lastlittle okay, okay, let's guess
Not just the children, the whole, like the whole pageant and can
you give us like no, this isjust children, so under 13.
(37:19):
Okay, this is just children.
Speaker 4 (37:23):
It's gonna be like millions, right.
Speaker 2 (37:27):
You know, this is being really unique.
Up what Naviar's five billionannually Wow.
And it's according money.
Over 50% of parents believethat beauty pageants have a
generally positive impact ontheir child self-esteem.
Okay, okay, so wow, okay, crazy.
Speaker 1 (37:56):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (37:57):
Okay.
Well, if any of our 10listeners are also fellow
pageant girlies, please let usknow.
I am like so.
I just think it's crazy how Idon't know I'm so.
It's been so interesting seeingwhat it's like in the 90s.
So thank you so much, courtney,for coming on, it's been so fun
(38:18):
.
Speaker 2 (38:19):
Yeah, thank you.
Thank you, guys for being hereand we will see you next Tuesday
.
Yay, see you next.
Speaker 3 (38:27):
Tuesday.
Speaker 1 (38:28):
Bye, okay.
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