August 12, 2025 • 38 mins
What drives seemingly ordinary people to commit horrific acts? In this episode, we uncover the dark psychology behind notorious true crime cases—from a deadly Tokyo subway attack and a shocking family murders to years-long captivity of three women. We examine how cult leaders manipulate even the most educated minds, the unsettling contrast between criminal justice systems in the U.S. and Germany, and why our fascination with these stories reveals deeper truths about human nature, morality, and vulnerabilities.
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Website: https://www.buzzsprout.com/2279605
Big shoutout to Allison Gray for generously granting us permission to feature her song, "Off My Mind" (from Ep 05).
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I gotta get you out of my system.
I gotta get you off of my mind.
But how do I move on when noone compares?
They only keep me occupied.
I gotta break these chains thatbind me.
I try to shake them off sodesperately, but you pull them
(00:24):
tighter, string me along.
It's sad, but I'm so gone.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Okay, you guys Question what do you think is
the most popular type of podcast?
Speaker 3 (00:38):
Out there.
Yeah, personally well, I listento politics, but aside from
that, I love to read and listento crime stories.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Yeah, so it's true crime.
It's interesting because I feellike that kind of blew up in
the podcast world.
Speaker 3 (00:57):
Really.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
I don't personally listen to them, but I've read
someplace that it was.
Do you know anything about it?
Any of these true crime podcastshows?
Speaker 3 (01:05):
Yeah, yeah, I think I've listened to a couple.
Isn't it like actually airedonline, but then they just air
what was aired online throughpodcast?
It's not, or is it gearedtowards podcast?
Speaker 2 (01:17):
I think it's geared towards podcast like podcasting
I wonder why that is.
Netflix has tons of these truecrime docu-series.
I started watching it I thinkback like 10 years ago.
Stephen Avery case came up andwe kind of got hooked.
There are two seasons.
The first season took place, Ithink, in 2015 and then did a
(01:38):
follow-up for season two.
But basically he was wrongfullyaccused of murder and I think
police officers were in on itand so he got out and then he
went back to jail and I thinkhe's still there.
Oh, so no one was able to gethim out.
I think I mean they showed likeseveral trials um on the show.
(02:00):
But yeah, he's still there.
What was he being charged for?
Murder?
And what's interesting also isthat his nephew got somehow
wrapped up in it.
Also, like he confessedalthough they say that he's
mentally disabled that he didn'tknow what he was saying.
Like you know, duringinterrogation it gets quite
(02:22):
intense and I think he gotnervous or something and he
wrongfully said, admitted thatyes, he helped out in this
murder, but what his lawyer saidwas that you know, it was that
spur of the moment thing that hefelt guilt and that he had to
just kind of say that he did it,although he didn't do it.
So anyway, that was back in like2015 when it came out and I
(02:44):
feel like after that, like Ithink that got kind of blown up.
It was quite big.
I remember watching it and Ifeel like after that or so, all
these different shows started toshow up.
It's always in my queue becauseI think I watch it often and I
don't know why it's sofascinating, because my
husband's always like why areyou watching these?
I don't know why, because youknow my husband's always like
(03:05):
why are you watching these?
Speaker 3 (03:06):
I don't know.
Why are we drawn to crimes?
Speaker 4 (03:07):
Yeah, I'm not.
Speaker 3 (03:08):
It's just in our nature.
I guess it's like mystery, goodstorytelling perhaps.
Yeah, maybe because it's so farfrom our world I can't relate
whatsoever that it makes us socurious about it.
Why do these people do thesecrime, will commit these crimes,
like why it does?
Why, like curiosity, right,like I can't relate at all.
(03:32):
Why do you think this way?
Why?
Maybe that's where it stemsfrom yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
So you said you have no interest no what?
Yeah, I think for me too is acuriosity, like like movies if
they're like made-up stories, Ican watch them but.
Speaker 4 (03:46):
If it's based on a true story, then I don't really
like to watch them yeah, I thinkit's like reality shows, right.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
I feel like I know that some people love it.
It's one of those things likeguilty pleasure kind of things.
It's not a crime, but I, tomo,you were talking about somebody
disappearing at OSU.
I don't think I was there whilethis happened.
Speaker 3 (04:09):
You still lived in Ohio at the time, but I was
technically still a student atOhio State my last year.
Yeah, it's like mystery BrianSchaefer, who went missing.
He went to the bar Ugly Tuna oncampus, ohio State campus.
For who went missing?
He went to the bar ugly tuna oncampus, ohio state campus.
He was seen on surveillancecamera arriving at the bar but
was never seen leaving the bar.
(04:31):
His friends had no idea wherehe went.
Nobody knew where he went andstill to this day it's not been
resolved.
That was 2006.
So, and then the next day hewas supposed to take a vacation
with his girlfriend and heobviously didn't show up.
And you know a lot of red flags.
But it's not like his bodyturned up either.
That's the weird thing.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
You know, do you think the ugly tuna is still
there?
Probably not.
Speaker 3 (04:56):
I have no idea.
And where was it?
It's on campus.
Where, oh it was?
On high street, okay, likeSouth or North or South, okay,
south, okay, south campus, southcampus.
I've heard of it and I used tofrequent there, but not the day
that he went missing, I don'tthink yeah, wish you has changed
so much.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
I'm not sure if it's still there.
Speaker 3 (05:17):
Yeah, I'm not sure it was a newer bar at the time.
Yeah, ugly tuna, yeah that's aninteresting name.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
Yeah, anything that you guys can think of that's
sort of got stuck in your head.
Any bigger crimes?
That's happened.
Speaker 4 (05:31):
I did a deep dive in one of the notorious crimes in
Japan, which is the Tokyo subwayattack.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
That was like decades ago, right.
I feel like we were teenagers.
Speaker 4 (05:45):
It was in 1995.
Wow.
Speaker 2 (05:48):
Forever ago, so that was a couple years after.
Speaker 3 (05:51):
Moved to the.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
US.
Yeah, I just remember this cultleader.
I still can picture his facelike his mugshot.
He had long dark hair that wassplit in the center and he had
very narrow eyes.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
Okay, but can you describe the crimes to me?
Speaker 4 (06:09):
Yes, so this attack was a chemical.
Domestic terrorist attack wasperpetrated on March 20th 1995
in Tokyo, japan, by members ofthe Aum Shinrikyo cult.
The perpetrators released it'seither sarin or sarin.
I'm going to go with sarin yeahsarin gas to, which is a highly
toxic nerve agent, on threelines of the tokyo metro during
(06:31):
rush hour, which ended upkilling 13 people, severely
injuring 50, some of whom laterdied, and causing temporary
vision problems for nearly 1 000others.
The attack was orchestrated byShoko Asahara, the leader of
this cult, and the members ofthe cult believed in an
apocalyptic vision and sought totrigger a global war which they
(06:54):
thought would bring about aspiritual salvation.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
Right.
Is he still alive to this day?
Speaker 4 (07:00):
No, they executed him .
Speaker 3 (07:02):
Oh, okay.
Speaker 4 (07:03):
Over 200 members were arrested, including Asahara.
13 of the senior all management, including Asahara himself,
were sentenced to death andlater executed, and many others
were given prison sentences upto life.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Oh, the members.
So execution in Japan is Ithink it's only one method right
Hanging.
Oh really, that's where thefloor opens.
Opens up oh wow, you know, Ikind of remember this when this
happened and now that you talkabout it a little bit more in
detail it kind of brings backmemories.
(07:36):
It was unheard of, it was sucha big deal, international news,
yeah so just to give you alittle overview of this cult
national news.
Speaker 4 (07:46):
Yeah, so just to give you a little overview of this
cult.
The name Aum is a sacredsyllable in Hinduism, buddhism
and other Indian religions.
Shinrikyo roughly meansteaching of supreme truth.
It was founded in 1984 by ShokoAsahara.
His real name is ChizuoMatsumoto.
Wow, okay, I don't know ifthat's necessary, but it was
founded in japan, but it alsohad branches in other countries,
such as the us and russia,really, yeah, and apparently it
(08:10):
was renamed to aleph in 2000after being outlawed okay, oh so
even after he.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
So he was the founder , yet he was able to reach
people globally, apparentlybefore internet.
I don't know how he did it, andit was still ongoing after he
died.
Speaker 4 (08:26):
That's interesting, yeah to give you a little
background of this asahara guy.
He studied various religionsand claimed to be a figure
related to the messiah.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
He claimed he was christ, the lamb of god and the
only fully enlightened beingsince buddha, but aren't the,
aren't the cult leaders usuallylike worship me, yeah, like
narcissistic and have thistendency?
Speaker 4 (08:49):
he, he claimed that the world would end in a global
nuclear war between the us andjapan and only his followers
would survive to rebuild it.
But um, he was apparently verycharismatic.
Um he, he attracted many young,educated, educated followers,
including scientists, doctorsand engineers who later helped
him produce siren and othernerve agents.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
So he was very influential.
He would have done real well intoday's world with TikTok and
stuff, huh.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
Probably.
I feel like it's like.
Charles Manson in the US.
Charles Manson in the USBecause I think in the late 60s
this also happened where CharlesManson had a cult and he had a
family of these young followers,I think mostly female and, yeah
, they worshipped him andsomehow he brainwashed them to.
Speaker 3 (09:37):
I wonder what his background was like his
childhood.
Was he an only child?
I don't know.
Were his parents present?
Speaker 4 (09:45):
I don't know about his childhood, but he also
apparently well.
The reason why he has so manyfollowers is because, like what
Cody said, he used brainwashing.
He forced drug use and violentrituals, and his followers
practice strict disciplines,including fasting, meditation,
as well as sleep and sensorydeprivation Wow, disciplines
(10:06):
including fasting, meditation aswell as sleep and sensory
deprivation.
And so, for example, they wouldisolate you in dark or silent
rooms for a long period of time,sometimes using blindfolds,
earplugs, full body restraints,and, as part of their spiritual
training, members were subjectedto fasting, sleep deprivation
and sensory deprivationsimultaneously, and, of course,
the goal was to obviously breakindividual willpower and create
(10:27):
psychological dependence on thecult and its leader, which
Asahara.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
He's a savior.
Speaker 4 (10:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
Wow, when you were talking about that, it just made
me think of the ex-Japan singer.
He was a high-profile figure inJapan.
He fell into cult and thenended up leaving the band that
was so successful for this cult.
Speaker 4 (10:49):
Yeah, they say he was brainwashed.
Speaker 3 (10:51):
He was brainwashed, obviously completely, and it was
very similar story, Like he wasdeprived of sleep and food a
lot of times.
And you know he said he fullybelieved that he was doing good
things in the world.
But he was brainwashed for 12years and he was a very
successful X-Japan was a verysuccessful band at the time and
(11:12):
he left that band.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
Yeah, even in the US they've done concerts too.
Speaker 3 (11:17):
Oh, x-japan, yeah, yeah I mean he was successful.
Speaker 4 (11:20):
He's on TV shows now these days.
Speaker 3 (11:22):
Really Well.
I'm so glad he left that cultand it was scary.
I remember him talking abouthow he left the cult and he was
beaten.
He tried escaping multipletimes and every time they would
find him bring him back, beathim up and just brainwash him
completely all over again and Idon't know.
It's just crazy.
Speaker 4 (11:41):
Yeah, apparently the methods that this Asahara guy
used.
They caused psychologicaltrauma in many members, so some
remained loyal even after theTokyo attack Right, but others
who escaped described theirexperience as brainwashing and
psychological torture.
Speaker 3 (11:56):
Yeah, the singer he mentioned, like even if you
escape the cult mentally, it washard for him to break it, the
cycle of like what he believedin all those years.
He said he went through a lotof trauma and flashbacks.
I don't know what it's like tobe brainwashed, but that's going
to be hard.
Speaker 4 (12:16):
I feel like I could easily be brainwashed.
You think what?
I think I could be easilybrainwashed.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
I feel that these people know who to target right,
Because not everyone can bebrainwashed.
Speaker 3 (12:31):
Yes, I hear that it's really weaker people target
vulnerable people.
Speaker 2 (12:35):
So not everyone can be brainwashed.
These people know who they'relooking for.
Speaker 3 (12:40):
I heard that it's kind of similar to hypnosis.
Sometimes hypnosis doesn't workon people that are like really
strong willed.
Speaker 4 (12:47):
I actually once got hypnotized by a YouTube video.
Speaker 3 (12:52):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (12:56):
How do you know that you got?
Speaker 4 (12:57):
hypnotized.
Well, my friend introduced meto this hypnotizing video and
she was like try it out, Like itdidn't work on me but it might
work on you.
And I was like, okay, likewhatever I'll do, try it out.
Like it didn't work on me butit might work on you.
And I was like, okay, likewhatever I'll do it, it's not
gonna work on me.
And then it it worked, like Icouldn't.
My thumb and my index fingergot stuck together.
Are you serious?
And you can separate them.
Speaker 3 (13:16):
Yeah, and I can separate them.
Wow, that is funny yeah, okay,I thought you meant like you
fell asleep and then you woke upand you were somewhere else or
something Somewhere else, oh mygosh, no, that would be scary.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
Yeah, oh, my gosh yeah.
Speaker 4 (13:32):
So I also looked into other tactics that were used,
include forced drug use,electroshock therapy, psi
headsets, which apparently aredevices that allegedly
transmitted Asahara's brainwaves.
Oh, my goodness, whatever thatmeans Okay, and members were
constantly monitored and harshlypunished for disobedience.
Speaker 2 (13:56):
Wow.
Speaker 4 (13:57):
Yeah, and aside from this Tokyo subway attack, the
cult was also involved in othercriminal activities, such as the
Sasaran attack in Matsumoto in1994, which killed eight people
and injured hundreds.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
So this was before the Tokyo subway station
situation Okay.
Speaker 4 (14:16):
One year before they kind of tested it out on that,
and then, production of chemicaland biological weapons, arms
trafficking and attempts toacquire nuclear material,
kidnapping and extortion.
So why did he commit thesecrimes?
(14:37):
In summary, he wanted to forcetheir apocalyptic vision into
reality.
He wanted to avoid prosecution.
He wanted to prove their power,and he wanted to well.
The cult wanted to elevate Asah.
Wanted to prove their power,and he want to well.
The cult wanted to elevateasahara as a global savior,
which obviously all failed.
And regarding its impact.
So the attack exposedvulnerabilities in public
(15:00):
transportation and led toincreased security in japan.
It prompted changes in lawsrelated to chemical weapons and
religious organizations, and itdeeply shocked the japanese
public and remains one of themost notorious acts of domestic
terrorism in history.
Speaker 3 (15:14):
Well, when you mentioned about weapon, it did
make me think about.
In Japan guns are not allowedas many other countries, so
crimes are not usually.
Unless it is a makeshift gun,it's always usually with a knife
, or I guess in this case it wasgas, but chemical.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
Yeah, true, okay.
So I looked up his childhoodlike what he was like.
Let's see if we can figure outwhy he became a cult leader.
So it says here that he wasborn in a very poor rural family
of tatami mat makers.
Speaker 3 (15:53):
Okay, like the Japanese bamboo mat.
Speaker 4 (15:56):
It's made from sewn together rice straw.
Speaker 3 (15:59):
Rice straw.
Okay, okay, so his parents didthat.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
He was born with infantile glaucoma.
He was blind in one eye and hadlimited vision in the other and
I think that's why, like Ithought, he had narrow eyes.
But that's right Now that Iread this.
I remember he had some kind ofissues with his eye, Attended a
school for the blind, oftenbullied and showed signs of
(16:25):
manipulation.
Early on he was described ascontrolling and aggressive
toward weaker students.
He wanted to study medicine butfailed to enter university.
So I think all of this added onto his persona Interesting.
It says here that in his youthand early childhood he began
(16:46):
exploring Chinese medicine, yogaand mysticism, and his physical
disability, poverty, academicfailure contributed to a growing
resentment and desire for poweryeah, so he had resentment
towards society in general andpeople in general.
Speaker 3 (17:04):
yeah, okay, that makes sense.
Well, one of the crimes that Iwas I mean there's so many
crimes that you know theypublicize in the U S over and
over, and currently it's P DiddyUm it's not a laughing matter,
but yes, no it's not, it'sreally not.
But, um, I mean he has so manynames puff Sean Combs, what,
(17:26):
what is that Diddy?
I mean he has so many namesPuff Sean Combs, what is that
Diddy?
But one of the ones that I wasreally, really intrigued was
about Chris Watts' case.
He raised his family inColorado.
He killed his wife, pregnantwife Shanann, and his two young
daughters.
It was very, very intriguingfor me at the time because,
first of all, he looked like anormal guy.
(17:46):
He went on television askingfor public's help.
He didn't seem too flustered orworried or anything.
He just looked very calm.
And he killed his two daughterstoo.
They were young.
So obviously me having twodaughters, I was like what makes
(18:08):
a person want to do anythinglike this?
His motive was, you know, hehad a mistress and he was
secretly seeing her, dating herand talking to her, had a
relationship with her and allthis stuff.
Speaker 4 (18:21):
Why didn't you just get a divorce, so stupid?
Speaker 3 (18:23):
I know I don't, I don't understand.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
I think he wanted to or something like this, and I
got into this like fight orargument.
Speaker 3 (18:32):
He claimed that his wife was always controlling.
Still, no reason to kill her,but that's what his defense was
that she was controlling.
Yeah, he felt like he wasn'tallowed to do whatever he wanted
, or that drove him to want toget rid of his family.
Yeah, he felt like he wasn'tallowed to do whatever he wanted
, or that drove him to want toget rid of his family.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
Yeah, he suffocated her, I think with his unborn son
.
What he?
Speaker 3 (18:58):
suffocated her with his all and inside of her is
what she means.
Okay.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
Yeah, he buried her.
Yes, I think the girls wereyoung, right, the two girls.
Yeah, I buried her, yes, and Ithink the girls were young,
right, the two girls yeah.
I think he also suffocated bothof them and then I think he
dumped both of them in aseparate oil tank and I think
that's where his workplace was.
Yes, that's where he worked.
Speaker 3 (19:24):
Oh gosh, yeah, and I heard that like he even had to.
I mean, they were already deadbefore he shoved them in, but
the hole of the tank was smalland he had to break their
shoulders and stuff.
Speaker 2 (19:36):
Oh my gosh.
Oh you mean that I think thetank itself was big?
Maybe the actual hole, the holefor it?
Oh jeez.
Speaker 3 (19:42):
So crazy.
But I was so intrigued with thisstory Obviously sick, sick into
my stomach but at the same time.
But I just didn't understand,like, and you know, he just
looks like a normal person, likea nice father, and they showed
a lot of videos of him playingwith his girls and his wife used
(20:03):
to say how blessed she wasbecause he was such an amazing
father, amazing husband, andused to always praise him.
But days leading up to hermurder she was messaging her
best friend, you know, sayinglike he hasn't been acting right
and all this stuff.
Her best friend was the onethat actually called the cops
(20:28):
because she couldn't get a holdof her.
She knew her friend is pregnant, also was on medication and had
doctor's appointment, and Ibelieve she was supposed to go
with the friend to the doctor'sappointment or she was just
following up to see how it wentor something, but she couldn't
get a hold of her friend.
So she went to her house andand this was only hours after
she was killed by her husbandher best friend went and knocked
(20:51):
on her door.
She looked inside and didn'tsee anything, but she became
very, very worried and calledthe cops.
I have a question.
And then the husband showed upfrom work yeah, was his mistress
involved in any way?
so she claimed she had no idea,but I mean so many.
There were so many differentangles to the story, like there
(21:15):
were some that speculated shewas involved, that she was aware
that she was in on this as well, but I don't believe she was um
convicted of anything.
Some say she was a mastermindbehind this and no one could
prove anything with her.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
I've read this crime online and then I think I
watched it on Netflix in aseries called American Murder.
So there's one about ShannonWatts, there's one about Gabby
Petito I think this is morerecent where her boyfriend ends
up killing her.
He kills himself later on, andthere's one about lacey peterson
(21:54):
.
I don't know so much about hercase, but I know that her
husband, uh, was convicted.
Speaker 3 (22:00):
I think she was also pregnant yeah, and then they
ended up digging his previouswife's body out of the ground
too to an autopsy, secondautopsy or something, because
they thought, okay, he, I think,was linked to her murder or it
was a homicide.
Speaker 2 (22:18):
Yeah, there are tons of Netflix shows Like Dahmer
case.
He also what's his first name?
Jeffrey Dahmer.
He sounds very normal.
He looks normal.
He doesn't look or sound like akiller.
If you watch his interviews.
He was a womanizer, right?
No, he killed many men, youngmen.
(22:38):
He lured them in to his houseand he killed them and he
tortured them.
He also ate some of theirorgans.
He wanted to create a shrinewith their body parts.
Yeah, very messed up, and therewere younger men, so he was
like a psychopath Mm.
Hmm.
But you know, I've seen hisinterviews documentary and he
(23:00):
sounds normal and I mean he'sadmitting to everything that
he's done.
He's very honest about it.
I think he also had a verylonely childhood.
His parents got divorced, Ithink while he was in high
school.
He lived by himself.
After he graduated, his fatherleft the house.
His mother took his youngerbrother.
They also left the house, so hewas left alone in the home and
(23:24):
I don't think his dad knew aboutthat.
Like, how old was he?
I think he was in high school,like 17, 18.
Okay, and his first murder wasdone at the house and he didn't
mean to kill him, this man thathe killed, but he had obsession
with a certain type of man?
Was he gay?
Speaker 3 (23:44):
Is he alive?
I don't even know.
Speaker 2 (23:46):
No, he got killed while he was in jail.
Speaker 4 (23:48):
He got killed by other another inmate, one of
them.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
Well, he said that because he was so lonely, he
didn't want him to leave.
He was a hitchhiker.
This man he killed, he pickedhim up on the road, he brought
him home and he wanted to hangout.
And so, you know, the guy wasgoing to a concert, some kind of
outdoor concert or somethinglike this, and he didn't want
him to leave.
So he ends up killing him,because then if you kill him,
(24:14):
just get a pet.
If you kill him, then he canhave full control of this dead
man.
Speaker 4 (24:21):
Quick question Going back to Chris Watt's case.
What was his sentence?
I think he's still in jail.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
I remember.
Speaker 3 (24:27):
Yeah, I believe so.
Yeah, it wasn't too old.
It's not too old.
Speaker 4 (24:32):
Is it life?
Speaker 3 (24:32):
So yeah, he was sentenced to multiple life
sentences.
Speaker 4 (24:35):
Okay, so he's not getting out.
Speaker 3 (24:37):
Okay, never getting out.
Speaker 2 (24:39):
The Menendez brothers is also big right.
I don't know that one.
Do you know about it?
Yeah, it's these two brothers.
They've been in jail for Ithink I want to say 30 years or
something for killing theirparents.
However, they're claiming theirinnocence because they say that
they were abused, especially byhis father, and it was them
(25:02):
protecting themselves.
I think one of the brothersshared that he was getting
abused by his dad and I knowthat both of them were, but I
think one younger brother he wasabused a lot longer for
self-protection.
Speaker 3 (25:15):
So they killed both of them.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3 (25:18):
Why did they have to kill the mom too?
Speaker 2 (25:20):
I feel that I think again.
I saw a Netflix show and Ithink they said that she
wouldn't have been able to livewithout him or something,
brother, so she had his backbasically yeah, so was it a
lighter sentence, I wonder.
No, they've been in jail for 30years or something.
Speaker 3 (25:37):
What was the nature of death?
What did they?
Speaker 2 (25:40):
do they shot them both.
I think they're going toretrial because again this
Netflix show got big and peoplewere talking about it and I
think that kind of initiated it.
So I think they're going to gothrough trial again.
After all these years, therewas this guy near Cleveland,
cleveland Ohio.
Yeah, cleveland Ohio.
Speaker 3 (26:01):
Ariel Castro, that's his name.
I remembered it now.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
Yes, there were three ladies.
I think he also had a daughter.
One or some of them were hisdaughter's friends or someone
that they knew in high school.
I think he was a bus driver andhe, one by one, lured these
girls in and I think he heldthem captive for over a decade.
That was a huge news that alsostands out because it's happened
(26:29):
in Ohio.
Speaker 3 (26:30):
So it says between 2002 and 2004,.
He abducted Michelle Knight,amanda Berry and Gina DeJesus
and held them captive, I believe.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
Or he lived in Cuyahoga or something.
Speaker 3 (26:42):
I don't know where he lived.
Yeah, and then he killedhimself in prison, oh right, but
yeah, yeah, him hanging himselfwith best sheets in prison hill
.
The first one he kidnapped wasmichelle knight.
So she was held captive alone,I think for a year, before the
others joined, and she was onher way home from work like she
(27:04):
worked at a fast food restaurant.
She got pregnant with with him.
He few times right Times, Ibelieve.
Yeah, he kicked her and abortedthe baby.
The second one he kidnapped,amanda Berry.
He took a liking to her whenshe was pregnant.
He let her have the baby, sothe baby was born in the house.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
Never seen outside, though, because they were all in
the basement the entire time.
Speaker 3 (27:30):
The girl was allowed to be outside, I guess oh, you
mean daughter, okay yeah, so theneighbor used to see sometimes
a little girl like running inthe yard and it was her mom that
had escaped, I think right andcalled for help yeah, yeah year
was this?
Speaker 2 (27:49):
I remember hearing this too.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
So between 2002 and 2004 is when he kidnapped all
three.
When were they found.
At least a decade ago 2013.
Okay, may 6, 2013.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
Yeah, this was also in the news.
I remember.
Yeah, that was also in the news.
I remember.
Yeah, that was pretty big, yeah, so in Germany I don't really
know so much of these crimeshappening, or I feel like the
crimes that often happen seem tobe more in the US that I know
(28:27):
about.
But there was one case, and Ithink I found out about this
again through US media, notGermany, because in Germany when
you commit a crime, the legalsystem here places a strong
emphasis on protecting personalprivacy, especially criminal
(28:50):
investigation and trials.
So there's a lot of things thatare held from the public right.
So like their full names arenever exposed.
Usually only the first and theinitial of the last name are
published, same for bothsuspects and convicted criminals
, especially in the early stages, if the case is not or
(29:12):
overwhelming public interest,and the aim is to protect
individuals from long-termdamage, particularly if they're
acquitted or not yet convicted.
And same goes for photos,usually a blurred mask and you
won't be able to see what theylook like or anything.
And photos are only shown ifthe person is convicted or has
(29:33):
given explicit consent or ifthere's an urgent public
interest, like if there's amanhunt or something.
Speaker 3 (29:39):
But I thought you said even if they're convicted a
lot of times, their privacy isprotected.
Their faces are still blurred.
Speaker 2 (29:45):
No, Right, and the background information.
So pretty much you will not beable to find out that much about
the person.
Because, again, pretty much youwill not be able to find out
that much about the personbecause, again, the background
information is also concealed,so details about the person's
past, including family,background, employment,
psychological history.
They're also treated carefully.
(30:05):
So you don't find much aboutthe person.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
In Germany, when you apply for a job, do they not do
background checks?
Speaker 2 (30:13):
So in Germany, employees are not legally
required to conduct backgroundchecks.
However, they may requestcertain information under
specific conditions, providedthey have the applicant's
explicit consent and theirrequest is relevant to the
position.
For instance, a criminal recordcheck might be justified for
(30:33):
positions in finance.
That is so crazy.
Okay, but there is criminalrecord.
Applicants can provide acertificate of conduct if
relevant to the job.
Employers cannot request thisdocument directly from
(30:55):
authorities.
Speaker 3 (30:56):
yeah, so it's not mandatory in germany that's
crazy, because even in the us,like in the us, even if you're
just volunteering obviously itdepends on where, but a lot of
times they'll do backgroundcheck.
If you're volunteering atschool, if you're volunteering
at church, you know they want toput people that you can trust
around their children, orwhatever.
(31:18):
Yeah, yeah, wow.
Speaker 2 (31:21):
Anyway.
So I don't know much aboutcrimes here, but you may have
heard and I've read this againthrough probably articles
Someone named Anna Delvey.
She is a German woman, I thinkshe's in her mid-30s now.
She posed as a wealthy New Yorksocialite to fraud banks,
(31:45):
hotels and individuals out ofhundreds of thousands of dollars
.
You know, you've heard of itand individuals out of hundreds
of thousands of dollars.
You know, you've heard of it,yeah.
So between 2013 and 17, sheposed as a heiress with a $67
million trust fund.
She convinced banks, hotels,individuals to provide services
(32:08):
and loans which she never repaid.
Her fraudulent activitiesincluded attention to secure a
$22 million loan for a privatearts club, defrauding a private
jet operator of $35,400,convincing a friend to pay a
$62,000 bill for a trip toMorocco, using fake financial
(32:30):
documents to deceiveinstitutions.
So in 2019, she was convictedof all of this and she was
sentenced to four to 12 years inprison in the US and ordered to
pay restitution.
After two years, she wasreleased on parole, but was
later detained by US Immigrationand Customs Enforcement for
(32:53):
overstaying her visa Becauseshe's technically German.
Speaker 3 (32:56):
I was just going to say she's probably not here
anymore with Trump'sadministration she's probably
gone In 2022,.
Speaker 2 (33:05):
She was released to house arrest under strict
conditions, including wearing anankle monitor.
No, I think she's stilldetained in the US, and I read
also that she was in Dancingwith the Stars with her ankle
monitor.
No, I think she's stilldetained in the US, and I read
also that she was in Dancingwith the Stars with her ankle
bracelet.
I don't know what year, but itmust be somewhat recent.
So, sumi, you know her, you'veheard of her, did?
Speaker 3 (33:25):
you read about her.
Speaker 4 (33:26):
No, they were doing a TV documentary about her In
Japan Just recently.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, and how she'slike an influencer or something
.
Now, right, yeah, that's crazy.
How about speaking ofinfluencers?
What's that girl?
Gypsy, gypsy, rose Blanchard.
(33:49):
Oh yeah, you guys know.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Yes, she murdered her mother.
Speaker 4 (33:54):
Right.
Speaker 2 (33:55):
Murdered her mom?
Yeah, because I think she wasmedicated for some illness she
didn't have, so like her motherwas drugging her, abusing her
that way, right?
Speaker 4 (34:06):
Yeah, and she went to prison and she was recently
well, not recently, maybe acouple years ago, I don't know
Released, and she was recently,not recently, maybe a couple
years ago, I don't know releasedand now she has her own reality
show.
It's in the.
Speaker 2 (34:19):
US right.
Yeah, this is the American way.
Speaker 4 (34:22):
Yeah, it's crazy what other crime stuff there's so
many.
Speaker 3 (34:28):
Oh, madeline McCann or McCain, however they
pronounce it.
Madeline McCain, the Britishgirl that went missing when she
was on vacation with her family.
She was only three at the time.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
Is she the blonde girl?
Speaker 3 (34:41):
Yeah, blonde girl, and she had twin brothers,
younger brothers she was onlythree.
Brothers and her were sleepingin a room, hotel room, while the
parents were dining withfriends nearby at a nearby
restaurant, or like at therestaurant outside at the hotel
and where they could see thedoor to their hotel room, I
(35:04):
guess and um, so the kids wereasleep, but the three-year-old
girl was abducted.
She's still missing.
She's still missing, she, she'sstill missing.
She was never found.
That was in 2007, one weekbefore her birthday.
So I think she was supposed toturn four.
But yeah, it was the.
It was the most heavilyreported missing person case in
(35:24):
modern history.
They were vacationing inPortugal.
They kept her story alive for along time, many so I mean, what
is that crime that comes upevery year?
Speaker 2 (35:36):
uh, not crime that comes up every year.
The show that that takes placearound new year's.
Speaker 4 (35:43):
It's not a show that comes around towards the end of
the year.
It's they just do like this, isit reporting?
Yeah, so I don't know how manyyears ago this was, but some
years back there was this crimewhere this person they've never
been caught, so we don't know ifit's a man or a woman.
It's apparently a guy.
(36:05):
But this person went into house, a family of four, killed all
of them, right, and yeah, he gotaway.
He got away with the world likehe's never been caught, and
each year around new year's theyjust do a follow-up on this
(36:25):
incident like they retrace whatthey think happened yeah, right.
Speaker 2 (36:30):
Right In detail.
Speaker 4 (36:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (36:32):
I think when we were there this past Christmas New
Year's, I watched it a littlebit and I think either you or
our dad told us that this comesback up every year because it
happened around that timeChristmas or New Year's yeah.
Speaker 4 (36:48):
And it's weird because, like apparently after
this guy murdered the entirefamily, he spent like a couple
of hours, maybe longer, in theirhouse.
That's right, he ate ice creamfrom their fridge.
He surfed internet and justhung out for a while.
Speaker 3 (37:05):
So bizarre Shows, there was no remorse.
Speaker 2 (37:08):
Maybe he just wanted to use the internet and eat the
ice cream.
Oh my gosh, I've read thatstatistically the victims
usually gets killed by somebodythat they know.
Speaker 3 (37:19):
Yeah yeah, usually it's somebody you know.
Thanks for joining us today.
Don't forget to review SisterVibes and make sure to subscribe
on the app of your choice soyou don't miss our upcoming
episodes.
Until next time.
Speaker 1 (37:36):
Ja ne of your choice, so you don't miss our upcoming
episodes.
Until next time, johnna.
I've been waiting for so long.
Bye.
I gotta get you out of my system.
I gotta get you off of my mind.
But how do I move on when noone compares?
They only keep me occupied.
I gotta break these chains thatbind me.
I try to shake them off sodesperately, but you pull them
(00:24):
tighter, string me along.
It's sad, but I'm so gone.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Okay, you guys Question what do you think is
the most popular type of podcast?
Speaker 3 (00:38):
Out there.
Yeah, personally well, I listento politics, but aside from
that, I love to read and listento crime stories.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Yeah, so it's true crime.
It's interesting because I feellike that kind of blew up in
the podcast world.
Speaker 3 (00:57):
Really.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
I don't personally listen to them, but I've read
someplace that it was.
Do you know anything about it?
Any of these true crime podcastshows?
Speaker 3 (01:05):
Yeah, yeah, I think I've listened to a couple.
Isn't it like actually airedonline, but then they just air
what was aired online throughpodcast?
It's not, or is it gearedtowards podcast?
Speaker 2 (01:17):
I think it's geared towards podcast like podcasting
I wonder why that is.
Netflix has tons of these truecrime docu-series.
I started watching it I thinkback like 10 years ago.
Stephen Avery case came up andwe kind of got hooked.
There are two seasons.
The first season took place, Ithink, in 2015 and then did a
(01:38):
follow-up for season two.
But basically he was wrongfullyaccused of murder and I think
police officers were in on itand so he got out and then he
went back to jail and I thinkhe's still there.
Oh, so no one was able to gethim out.
I think I mean they showed likeseveral trials um on the show.
(02:00):
But yeah, he's still there.
What was he being charged for?
Murder?
And what's interesting also isthat his nephew got somehow
wrapped up in it.
Also, like he confessedalthough they say that he's
mentally disabled that he didn'tknow what he was saying.
Like you know, duringinterrogation it gets quite
(02:22):
intense and I think he gotnervous or something and he
wrongfully said, admitted thatyes, he helped out in this
murder, but what his lawyer saidwas that you know, it was that
spur of the moment thing that hefelt guilt and that he had to
just kind of say that he did it,although he didn't do it.
So anyway, that was back in like2015 when it came out and I
(02:44):
feel like after that, like Ithink that got kind of blown up.
It was quite big.
I remember watching it and Ifeel like after that or so, all
these different shows started toshow up.
It's always in my queue becauseI think I watch it often and I
don't know why it's sofascinating, because my
husband's always like why areyou watching these?
I don't know why, because youknow my husband's always like
(03:05):
why are you watching these?
Speaker 3 (03:06):
I don't know.
Why are we drawn to crimes?
Speaker 4 (03:07):
Yeah, I'm not.
Speaker 3 (03:08):
It's just in our nature.
I guess it's like mystery, goodstorytelling perhaps.
Yeah, maybe because it's so farfrom our world I can't relate
whatsoever that it makes us socurious about it.
Why do these people do thesecrime, will commit these crimes,
like why it does?
Why, like curiosity, right,like I can't relate at all.
(03:32):
Why do you think this way?
Why?
Maybe that's where it stemsfrom yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
So you said you have no interest no what?
Yeah, I think for me too is acuriosity, like like movies if
they're like made-up stories, Ican watch them but.
Speaker 4 (03:46):
If it's based on a true story, then I don't really
like to watch them yeah, I thinkit's like reality shows, right.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
I feel like I know that some people love it.
It's one of those things likeguilty pleasure kind of things.
It's not a crime, but I, tomo,you were talking about somebody
disappearing at OSU.
I don't think I was there whilethis happened.
Speaker 3 (04:09):
You still lived in Ohio at the time, but I was
technically still a student atOhio State my last year.
Yeah, it's like mystery BrianSchaefer, who went missing.
He went to the bar Ugly Tuna oncampus, ohio State campus.
For who went missing?
He went to the bar ugly tuna oncampus, ohio state campus.
He was seen on surveillancecamera arriving at the bar but
was never seen leaving the bar.
(04:31):
His friends had no idea wherehe went.
Nobody knew where he went andstill to this day it's not been
resolved.
That was 2006.
So, and then the next day hewas supposed to take a vacation
with his girlfriend and heobviously didn't show up.
And you know a lot of red flags.
But it's not like his bodyturned up either.
That's the weird thing.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
You know, do you think the ugly tuna is still
there?
Probably not.
Speaker 3 (04:56):
I have no idea.
And where was it?
It's on campus.
Where, oh it was?
On high street, okay, likeSouth or North or South, okay,
south, okay, south campus, southcampus.
I've heard of it and I used tofrequent there, but not the day
that he went missing, I don'tthink yeah, wish you has changed
so much.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
I'm not sure if it's still there.
Speaker 3 (05:17):
Yeah, I'm not sure it was a newer bar at the time.
Yeah, ugly tuna, yeah that's aninteresting name.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
Yeah, anything that you guys can think of that's
sort of got stuck in your head.
Any bigger crimes?
That's happened.
Speaker 4 (05:31):
I did a deep dive in one of the notorious crimes in
Japan, which is the Tokyo subwayattack.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
That was like decades ago, right.
I feel like we were teenagers.
Speaker 4 (05:45):
It was in 1995.
Wow.
Speaker 2 (05:48):
Forever ago, so that was a couple years after.
Speaker 3 (05:51):
Moved to the.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
US.
Yeah, I just remember this cultleader.
I still can picture his facelike his mugshot.
He had long dark hair that wassplit in the center and he had
very narrow eyes.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
Okay, but can you describe the crimes to me?
Speaker 4 (06:09):
Yes, so this attack was a chemical.
Domestic terrorist attack wasperpetrated on March 20th 1995
in Tokyo, japan, by members ofthe Aum Shinrikyo cult.
The perpetrators released it'seither sarin or sarin.
I'm going to go with sarin yeahsarin gas to, which is a highly
toxic nerve agent, on threelines of the tokyo metro during
(06:31):
rush hour, which ended upkilling 13 people, severely
injuring 50, some of whom laterdied, and causing temporary
vision problems for nearly 1 000others.
The attack was orchestrated byShoko Asahara, the leader of
this cult, and the members ofthe cult believed in an
apocalyptic vision and sought totrigger a global war which they
(06:54):
thought would bring about aspiritual salvation.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
Right.
Is he still alive to this day?
Speaker 4 (07:00):
No, they executed him .
Speaker 3 (07:02):
Oh, okay.
Speaker 4 (07:03):
Over 200 members were arrested, including Asahara.
13 of the senior all management, including Asahara himself,
were sentenced to death andlater executed, and many others
were given prison sentences upto life.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Oh, the members.
So execution in Japan is Ithink it's only one method right
Hanging.
Oh really, that's where thefloor opens.
Opens up oh wow, you know, Ikind of remember this when this
happened and now that you talkabout it a little bit more in
detail it kind of brings backmemories.
(07:36):
It was unheard of, it was sucha big deal, international news,
yeah so just to give you alittle overview of this cult
national news.
Speaker 4 (07:46):
Yeah, so just to give you a little overview of this
cult.
The name Aum is a sacredsyllable in Hinduism, buddhism
and other Indian religions.
Shinrikyo roughly meansteaching of supreme truth.
It was founded in 1984 by ShokoAsahara.
His real name is ChizuoMatsumoto.
Wow, okay, I don't know ifthat's necessary, but it was
founded in japan, but it alsohad branches in other countries,
such as the us and russia,really, yeah, and apparently it
(08:10):
was renamed to aleph in 2000after being outlawed okay, oh so
even after he.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
So he was the founder , yet he was able to reach
people globally, apparentlybefore internet.
I don't know how he did it, andit was still ongoing after he
died.
Speaker 4 (08:26):
That's interesting, yeah to give you a little
background of this asahara guy.
He studied various religionsand claimed to be a figure
related to the messiah.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
He claimed he was christ, the lamb of god and the
only fully enlightened beingsince buddha, but aren't the,
aren't the cult leaders usuallylike worship me, yeah, like
narcissistic and have thistendency?
Speaker 4 (08:49):
he, he claimed that the world would end in a global
nuclear war between the us andjapan and only his followers
would survive to rebuild it.
But um, he was apparently verycharismatic.
Um he, he attracted many young,educated, educated followers,
including scientists, doctorsand engineers who later helped
him produce siren and othernerve agents.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
So he was very influential.
He would have done real well intoday's world with TikTok and
stuff, huh.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
Probably.
I feel like it's like.
Charles Manson in the US.
Charles Manson in the USBecause I think in the late 60s
this also happened where CharlesManson had a cult and he had a
family of these young followers,I think mostly female and, yeah
, they worshipped him andsomehow he brainwashed them to.
Speaker 3 (09:37):
I wonder what his background was like his
childhood.
Was he an only child?
I don't know.
Were his parents present?
Speaker 4 (09:45):
I don't know about his childhood, but he also
apparently well.
The reason why he has so manyfollowers is because, like what
Cody said, he used brainwashing.
He forced drug use and violentrituals, and his followers
practice strict disciplines,including fasting, meditation,
as well as sleep and sensorydeprivation Wow, disciplines
(10:06):
including fasting, meditation aswell as sleep and sensory
deprivation.
And so, for example, they wouldisolate you in dark or silent
rooms for a long period of time,sometimes using blindfolds,
earplugs, full body restraints,and, as part of their spiritual
training, members were subjectedto fasting, sleep deprivation
and sensory deprivationsimultaneously, and, of course,
the goal was to obviously breakindividual willpower and create
(10:27):
psychological dependence on thecult and its leader, which
Asahara.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
He's a savior.
Speaker 4 (10:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
Wow, when you were talking about that, it just made
me think of the ex-Japan singer.
He was a high-profile figure inJapan.
He fell into cult and thenended up leaving the band that
was so successful for this cult.
Speaker 4 (10:49):
Yeah, they say he was brainwashed.
Speaker 3 (10:51):
He was brainwashed, obviously completely, and it was
very similar story, Like he wasdeprived of sleep and food a
lot of times.
And you know he said he fullybelieved that he was doing good
things in the world.
But he was brainwashed for 12years and he was a very
successful X-Japan was a verysuccessful band at the time and
(11:12):
he left that band.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
Yeah, even in the US they've done concerts too.
Speaker 3 (11:17):
Oh, x-japan, yeah, yeah I mean he was successful.
Speaker 4 (11:20):
He's on TV shows now these days.
Speaker 3 (11:22):
Really Well.
I'm so glad he left that cultand it was scary.
I remember him talking abouthow he left the cult and he was
beaten.
He tried escaping multipletimes and every time they would
find him bring him back, beathim up and just brainwash him
completely all over again and Idon't know.
It's just crazy.
Speaker 4 (11:41):
Yeah, apparently the methods that this Asahara guy
used.
They caused psychologicaltrauma in many members, so some
remained loyal even after theTokyo attack Right, but others
who escaped described theirexperience as brainwashing and
psychological torture.
Speaker 3 (11:56):
Yeah, the singer he mentioned, like even if you
escape the cult mentally, it washard for him to break it, the
cycle of like what he believedin all those years.
He said he went through a lotof trauma and flashbacks.
I don't know what it's like tobe brainwashed, but that's going
to be hard.
Speaker 4 (12:16):
I feel like I could easily be brainwashed.
You think what?
I think I could be easilybrainwashed.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
I feel that these people know who to target right,
Because not everyone can bebrainwashed.
Speaker 3 (12:31):
Yes, I hear that it's really weaker people target
vulnerable people.
Speaker 2 (12:35):
So not everyone can be brainwashed.
These people know who they'relooking for.
Speaker 3 (12:40):
I heard that it's kind of similar to hypnosis.
Sometimes hypnosis doesn't workon people that are like really
strong willed.
Speaker 4 (12:47):
I actually once got hypnotized by a YouTube video.
Speaker 3 (12:52):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (12:56):
How do you know that you got?
Speaker 4 (12:57):
hypnotized.
Well, my friend introduced meto this hypnotizing video and
she was like try it out, Like itdidn't work on me but it might
work on you.
And I was like, okay, likewhatever I'll do, try it out.
Like it didn't work on me butit might work on you.
And I was like, okay, likewhatever I'll do it, it's not
gonna work on me.
And then it it worked, like Icouldn't.
My thumb and my index fingergot stuck together.
Are you serious?
And you can separate them.
Speaker 3 (13:16):
Yeah, and I can separate them.
Wow, that is funny yeah, okay,I thought you meant like you
fell asleep and then you woke upand you were somewhere else or
something Somewhere else, oh mygosh, no, that would be scary.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
Yeah, oh, my gosh yeah.
Speaker 4 (13:32):
So I also looked into other tactics that were used,
include forced drug use,electroshock therapy, psi
headsets, which apparently aredevices that allegedly
transmitted Asahara's brainwaves.
Oh, my goodness, whatever thatmeans Okay, and members were
constantly monitored and harshlypunished for disobedience.
Speaker 2 (13:56):
Wow.
Speaker 4 (13:57):
Yeah, and aside from this Tokyo subway attack, the
cult was also involved in othercriminal activities, such as the
Sasaran attack in Matsumoto in1994, which killed eight people
and injured hundreds.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
So this was before the Tokyo subway station
situation Okay.
Speaker 4 (14:16):
One year before they kind of tested it out on that,
and then, production of chemicaland biological weapons, arms
trafficking and attempts toacquire nuclear material,
kidnapping and extortion.
So why did he commit thesecrimes?
(14:37):
In summary, he wanted to forcetheir apocalyptic vision into
reality.
He wanted to avoid prosecution.
He wanted to prove their power,and he wanted to well.
The cult wanted to elevate Asah.
Wanted to prove their power,and he want to well.
The cult wanted to elevateasahara as a global savior,
which obviously all failed.
And regarding its impact.
So the attack exposedvulnerabilities in public
(15:00):
transportation and led toincreased security in japan.
It prompted changes in lawsrelated to chemical weapons and
religious organizations, and itdeeply shocked the japanese
public and remains one of themost notorious acts of domestic
terrorism in history.
Speaker 3 (15:14):
Well, when you mentioned about weapon, it did
make me think about.
In Japan guns are not allowedas many other countries, so
crimes are not usually.
Unless it is a makeshift gun,it's always usually with a knife
, or I guess in this case it wasgas, but chemical.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
Yeah, true, okay.
So I looked up his childhoodlike what he was like.
Let's see if we can figure outwhy he became a cult leader.
So it says here that he wasborn in a very poor rural family
of tatami mat makers.
Speaker 3 (15:53):
Okay, like the Japanese bamboo mat.
Speaker 4 (15:56):
It's made from sewn together rice straw.
Speaker 3 (15:59):
Rice straw.
Okay, okay, so his parents didthat.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
He was born with infantile glaucoma.
He was blind in one eye and hadlimited vision in the other and
I think that's why, like Ithought, he had narrow eyes.
But that's right Now that Iread this.
I remember he had some kind ofissues with his eye, Attended a
school for the blind, oftenbullied and showed signs of
(16:25):
manipulation.
Early on he was described ascontrolling and aggressive
toward weaker students.
He wanted to study medicine butfailed to enter university.
So I think all of this added onto his persona Interesting.
It says here that in his youthand early childhood he began
(16:46):
exploring Chinese medicine, yogaand mysticism, and his physical
disability, poverty, academicfailure contributed to a growing
resentment and desire for poweryeah, so he had resentment
towards society in general andpeople in general.
Speaker 3 (17:04):
yeah, okay, that makes sense.
Well, one of the crimes that Iwas I mean there's so many
crimes that you know theypublicize in the U S over and
over, and currently it's P DiddyUm it's not a laughing matter,
but yes, no it's not, it'sreally not.
But, um, I mean he has so manynames puff Sean Combs, what,
(17:26):
what is that Diddy?
I mean he has so many namesPuff Sean Combs, what is that
Diddy?
But one of the ones that I wasreally, really intrigued was
about Chris Watts' case.
He raised his family inColorado.
He killed his wife, pregnantwife Shanann, and his two young
daughters.
It was very, very intriguingfor me at the time because,
first of all, he looked like anormal guy.
(17:46):
He went on television askingfor public's help.
He didn't seem too flustered orworried or anything.
He just looked very calm.
And he killed his two daughterstoo.
They were young.
So obviously me having twodaughters, I was like what makes
(18:08):
a person want to do anythinglike this?
His motive was, you know, hehad a mistress and he was
secretly seeing her, dating herand talking to her, had a
relationship with her and allthis stuff.
Speaker 4 (18:21):
Why didn't you just get a divorce, so stupid?
Speaker 3 (18:23):
I know I don't, I don't understand.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
I think he wanted to or something like this, and I
got into this like fight orargument.
Speaker 3 (18:32):
He claimed that his wife was always controlling.
Still, no reason to kill her,but that's what his defense was
that she was controlling.
Yeah, he felt like he wasn'tallowed to do whatever he wanted
, or that drove him to want toget rid of his family.
Yeah, he felt like he wasn'tallowed to do whatever he wanted
, or that drove him to want toget rid of his family.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
Yeah, he suffocated her, I think with his unborn son
.
What he?
Speaker 3 (18:58):
suffocated her with his all and inside of her is
what she means.
Okay.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
Yeah, he buried her.
Yes, I think the girls wereyoung, right, the two girls.
Yeah, I buried her, yes, and Ithink the girls were young,
right, the two girls yeah.
I think he also suffocated bothof them and then I think he
dumped both of them in aseparate oil tank and I think
that's where his workplace was.
Yes, that's where he worked.
Speaker 3 (19:24):
Oh gosh, yeah, and I heard that like he even had to.
I mean, they were already deadbefore he shoved them in, but
the hole of the tank was smalland he had to break their
shoulders and stuff.
Speaker 2 (19:36):
Oh my gosh.
Oh you mean that I think thetank itself was big?
Maybe the actual hole, the holefor it?
Oh jeez.
Speaker 3 (19:42):
So crazy.
But I was so intrigued with thisstory Obviously sick, sick into
my stomach but at the same time.
But I just didn't understand,like, and you know, he just
looks like a normal person, likea nice father, and they showed
a lot of videos of him playingwith his girls and his wife used
(20:03):
to say how blessed she wasbecause he was such an amazing
father, amazing husband, andused to always praise him.
But days leading up to hermurder she was messaging her
best friend, you know, sayinglike he hasn't been acting right
and all this stuff.
Her best friend was the onethat actually called the cops
(20:28):
because she couldn't get a holdof her.
She knew her friend is pregnant, also was on medication and had
doctor's appointment, and Ibelieve she was supposed to go
with the friend to the doctor'sappointment or she was just
following up to see how it wentor something, but she couldn't
get a hold of her friend.
So she went to her house andand this was only hours after
she was killed by her husbandher best friend went and knocked
(20:51):
on her door.
She looked inside and didn'tsee anything, but she became
very, very worried and calledthe cops.
I have a question.
And then the husband showed upfrom work yeah, was his mistress
involved in any way?
so she claimed she had no idea,but I mean so many.
There were so many differentangles to the story, like there
(21:15):
were some that speculated shewas involved, that she was aware
that she was in on this as well, but I don't believe she was um
convicted of anything.
Some say she was a mastermindbehind this and no one could
prove anything with her.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
I've read this crime online and then I think I
watched it on Netflix in aseries called American Murder.
So there's one about ShannonWatts, there's one about Gabby
Petito I think this is morerecent where her boyfriend ends
up killing her.
He kills himself later on, andthere's one about lacey peterson
(21:54):
.
I don't know so much about hercase, but I know that her
husband, uh, was convicted.
Speaker 3 (22:00):
I think she was also pregnant yeah, and then they
ended up digging his previouswife's body out of the ground
too to an autopsy, secondautopsy or something, because
they thought, okay, he, I think,was linked to her murder or it
was a homicide.
Speaker 2 (22:18):
Yeah, there are tons of Netflix shows Like Dahmer
case.
He also what's his first name?
Jeffrey Dahmer.
He sounds very normal.
He looks normal.
He doesn't look or sound like akiller.
If you watch his interviews.
He was a womanizer, right?
No, he killed many men, youngmen.
(22:38):
He lured them in to his houseand he killed them and he
tortured them.
He also ate some of theirorgans.
He wanted to create a shrinewith their body parts.
Yeah, very messed up, and therewere younger men, so he was
like a psychopath Mm.
Hmm.
But you know, I've seen hisinterviews documentary and he
(23:00):
sounds normal and I mean he'sadmitting to everything that
he's done.
He's very honest about it.
I think he also had a verylonely childhood.
His parents got divorced, Ithink while he was in high
school.
He lived by himself.
After he graduated, his fatherleft the house.
His mother took his youngerbrother.
They also left the house, so hewas left alone in the home and
(23:24):
I don't think his dad knew aboutthat.
Like, how old was he?
I think he was in high school,like 17, 18.
Okay, and his first murder wasdone at the house and he didn't
mean to kill him, this man thathe killed, but he had obsession
with a certain type of man?
Was he gay?
Speaker 3 (23:44):
Is he alive?
I don't even know.
Speaker 2 (23:46):
No, he got killed while he was in jail.
Speaker 4 (23:48):
He got killed by other another inmate, one of
them.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
Well, he said that because he was so lonely, he
didn't want him to leave.
He was a hitchhiker.
This man he killed, he pickedhim up on the road, he brought
him home and he wanted to hangout.
And so, you know, the guy wasgoing to a concert, some kind of
outdoor concert or somethinglike this, and he didn't want
him to leave.
So he ends up killing him,because then if you kill him,
(24:14):
just get a pet.
If you kill him, then he canhave full control of this dead
man.
Speaker 4 (24:21):
Quick question Going back to Chris Watt's case.
What was his sentence?
I think he's still in jail.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
I remember.
Speaker 3 (24:27):
Yeah, I believe so.
Yeah, it wasn't too old.
It's not too old.
Speaker 4 (24:32):
Is it life?
Speaker 3 (24:32):
So yeah, he was sentenced to multiple life
sentences.
Speaker 4 (24:35):
Okay, so he's not getting out.
Speaker 3 (24:37):
Okay, never getting out.
Speaker 2 (24:39):
The Menendez brothers is also big right.
I don't know that one.
Do you know about it?
Yeah, it's these two brothers.
They've been in jail for Ithink I want to say 30 years or
something for killing theirparents.
However, they're claiming theirinnocence because they say that
they were abused, especially byhis father, and it was them
(25:02):
protecting themselves.
I think one of the brothersshared that he was getting
abused by his dad and I knowthat both of them were, but I
think one younger brother he wasabused a lot longer for
self-protection.
Speaker 3 (25:15):
So they killed both of them.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3 (25:18):
Why did they have to kill the mom too?
Speaker 2 (25:20):
I feel that I think again.
I saw a Netflix show and Ithink they said that she
wouldn't have been able to livewithout him or something,
brother, so she had his backbasically yeah, so was it a
lighter sentence, I wonder.
No, they've been in jail for 30years or something.
Speaker 3 (25:37):
What was the nature of death?
What did they?
Speaker 2 (25:40):
do they shot them both.
I think they're going toretrial because again this
Netflix show got big and peoplewere talking about it and I
think that kind of initiated it.
So I think they're going to gothrough trial again.
After all these years, therewas this guy near Cleveland,
cleveland Ohio.
Yeah, cleveland Ohio.
Speaker 3 (26:01):
Ariel Castro, that's his name.
I remembered it now.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
Yes, there were three ladies.
I think he also had a daughter.
One or some of them were hisdaughter's friends or someone
that they knew in high school.
I think he was a bus driver andhe, one by one, lured these
girls in and I think he heldthem captive for over a decade.
That was a huge news that alsostands out because it's happened
(26:29):
in Ohio.
Speaker 3 (26:30):
So it says between 2002 and 2004,.
He abducted Michelle Knight,amanda Berry and Gina DeJesus
and held them captive, I believe.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
Or he lived in Cuyahoga or something.
Speaker 3 (26:42):
I don't know where he lived.
Yeah, and then he killedhimself in prison, oh right, but
yeah, yeah, him hanging himselfwith best sheets in prison hill
.
The first one he kidnapped wasmichelle knight.
So she was held captive alone,I think for a year, before the
others joined, and she was onher way home from work like she
(27:04):
worked at a fast food restaurant.
She got pregnant with with him.
He few times right Times, Ibelieve.
Yeah, he kicked her and abortedthe baby.
The second one he kidnapped,amanda Berry.
He took a liking to her whenshe was pregnant.
He let her have the baby, sothe baby was born in the house.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
Never seen outside, though, because they were all in
the basement the entire time.
Speaker 3 (27:30):
The girl was allowed to be outside, I guess oh, you
mean daughter, okay yeah, so theneighbor used to see sometimes
a little girl like running inthe yard and it was her mom that
had escaped, I think right andcalled for help yeah, yeah year
was this?
Speaker 2 (27:49):
I remember hearing this too.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
So between 2002 and 2004 is when he kidnapped all
three.
When were they found.
At least a decade ago 2013.
Okay, may 6, 2013.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
Yeah, this was also in the news.
I remember.
Yeah, that was also in the news.
I remember.
Yeah, that was pretty big, yeah, so in Germany I don't really
know so much of these crimeshappening, or I feel like the
crimes that often happen seem tobe more in the US that I know
(28:27):
about.
But there was one case, and Ithink I found out about this
again through US media, notGermany, because in Germany when
you commit a crime, the legalsystem here places a strong
emphasis on protecting personalprivacy, especially criminal
(28:50):
investigation and trials.
So there's a lot of things thatare held from the public right.
So like their full names arenever exposed.
Usually only the first and theinitial of the last name are
published, same for bothsuspects and convicted criminals
, especially in the early stages, if the case is not or
(29:12):
overwhelming public interest,and the aim is to protect
individuals from long-termdamage, particularly if they're
acquitted or not yet convicted.
And same goes for photos,usually a blurred mask and you
won't be able to see what theylook like or anything.
And photos are only shown ifthe person is convicted or has
(29:33):
given explicit consent or ifthere's an urgent public
interest, like if there's amanhunt or something.
Speaker 3 (29:39):
But I thought you said even if they're convicted a
lot of times, their privacy isprotected.
Their faces are still blurred.
Speaker 2 (29:45):
No, Right, and the background information.
So pretty much you will not beable to find out that much about
the person.
Because, again, pretty much youwill not be able to find out
that much about the personbecause, again, the background
information is also concealed,so details about the person's
past, including family,background, employment,
psychological history.
They're also treated carefully.
(30:05):
So you don't find much aboutthe person.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
In Germany, when you apply for a job, do they not do
background checks?
Speaker 2 (30:13):
So in Germany, employees are not legally
required to conduct backgroundchecks.
However, they may requestcertain information under
specific conditions, providedthey have the applicant's
explicit consent and theirrequest is relevant to the
position.
For instance, a criminal recordcheck might be justified for
(30:33):
positions in finance.
That is so crazy.
Okay, but there is criminalrecord.
Applicants can provide acertificate of conduct if
relevant to the job.
Employers cannot request thisdocument directly from
(30:55):
authorities.
Speaker 3 (30:56):
yeah, so it's not mandatory in germany that's
crazy, because even in the us,like in the us, even if you're
just volunteering obviously itdepends on where, but a lot of
times they'll do backgroundcheck.
If you're volunteering atschool, if you're volunteering
at church, you know they want toput people that you can trust
around their children, orwhatever.
(31:18):
Yeah, yeah, wow.
Speaker 2 (31:21):
Anyway.
So I don't know much aboutcrimes here, but you may have
heard and I've read this againthrough probably articles
Someone named Anna Delvey.
She is a German woman, I thinkshe's in her mid-30s now.
She posed as a wealthy New Yorksocialite to fraud banks,
(31:45):
hotels and individuals out ofhundreds of thousands of dollars
.
You know, you've heard of itand individuals out of hundreds
of thousands of dollars.
You know, you've heard of it,yeah.
So between 2013 and 17, sheposed as a heiress with a $67
million trust fund.
She convinced banks, hotels,individuals to provide services
(32:08):
and loans which she never repaid.
Her fraudulent activitiesincluded attention to secure a
$22 million loan for a privatearts club, defrauding a private
jet operator of $35,400,convincing a friend to pay a
$62,000 bill for a trip toMorocco, using fake financial
(32:30):
documents to deceiveinstitutions.
So in 2019, she was convictedof all of this and she was
sentenced to four to 12 years inprison in the US and ordered to
pay restitution.
After two years, she wasreleased on parole, but was
later detained by US Immigrationand Customs Enforcement for
(32:53):
overstaying her visa Becauseshe's technically German.
Speaker 3 (32:56):
I was just going to say she's probably not here
anymore with Trump'sadministration she's probably
gone In 2022,.
Speaker 2 (33:05):
She was released to house arrest under strict
conditions, including wearing anankle monitor.
No, I think she's stilldetained in the US, and I read
also that she was in Dancingwith the Stars with her ankle
monitor.
No, I think she's stilldetained in the US, and I read
also that she was in Dancingwith the Stars with her ankle
bracelet.
I don't know what year, but itmust be somewhat recent.
So, sumi, you know her, you'veheard of her, did?
Speaker 3 (33:25):
you read about her.
Speaker 4 (33:26):
No, they were doing a TV documentary about her In
Japan Just recently.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, and how she'slike an influencer or something
.
Now, right, yeah, that's crazy.
How about speaking ofinfluencers?
What's that girl?
Gypsy, gypsy, rose Blanchard.
(33:49):
Oh yeah, you guys know.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Yes, she murdered her mother.
Speaker 4 (33:54):
Right.
Speaker 2 (33:55):
Murdered her mom?
Yeah, because I think she wasmedicated for some illness she
didn't have, so like her motherwas drugging her, abusing her
that way, right?
Speaker 4 (34:06):
Yeah, and she went to prison and she was recently
well, not recently, maybe acouple years ago, I don't know
Released, and she was recently,not recently, maybe a couple
years ago, I don't know releasedand now she has her own reality
show.
It's in the.
Speaker 2 (34:19):
US right.
Yeah, this is the American way.
Speaker 4 (34:22):
Yeah, it's crazy what other crime stuff there's so
many.
Speaker 3 (34:28):
Oh, madeline McCann or McCain, however they
pronounce it.
Madeline McCain, the Britishgirl that went missing when she
was on vacation with her family.
She was only three at the time.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
Is she the blonde girl?
Speaker 3 (34:41):
Yeah, blonde girl, and she had twin brothers,
younger brothers she was onlythree.
Brothers and her were sleepingin a room, hotel room, while the
parents were dining withfriends nearby at a nearby
restaurant, or like at therestaurant outside at the hotel
and where they could see thedoor to their hotel room, I
(35:04):
guess and um, so the kids wereasleep, but the three-year-old
girl was abducted.
She's still missing.
She's still missing, she, she'sstill missing.
She was never found.
That was in 2007, one weekbefore her birthday.
So I think she was supposed toturn four.
But yeah, it was the.
It was the most heavilyreported missing person case in
(35:24):
modern history.
They were vacationing inPortugal.
They kept her story alive for along time, many so I mean, what
is that crime that comes upevery year?
Speaker 2 (35:36):
uh, not crime that comes up every year.
The show that that takes placearound new year's.
Speaker 4 (35:43):
It's not a show that comes around towards the end of
the year.
It's they just do like this, isit reporting?
Yeah, so I don't know how manyyears ago this was, but some
years back there was this crimewhere this person they've never
been caught, so we don't know ifit's a man or a woman.
It's apparently a guy.
(36:05):
But this person went into house, a family of four, killed all
of them, right, and yeah, he gotaway.
He got away with the world likehe's never been caught, and
each year around new year's theyjust do a follow-up on this
(36:25):
incident like they retrace whatthey think happened yeah, right.
Speaker 2 (36:30):
Right In detail.
Speaker 4 (36:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (36:32):
I think when we were there this past Christmas New
Year's, I watched it a littlebit and I think either you or
our dad told us that this comesback up every year because it
happened around that timeChristmas or New Year's yeah.
Speaker 4 (36:48):
And it's weird because, like apparently after
this guy murdered the entirefamily, he spent like a couple
of hours, maybe longer, in theirhouse.
That's right, he ate ice creamfrom their fridge.
He surfed internet and justhung out for a while.
Speaker 3 (37:05):
So bizarre Shows, there was no remorse.
Speaker 2 (37:08):
Maybe he just wanted to use the internet and eat the
ice cream.
Oh my gosh, I've read thatstatistically the victims
usually gets killed by somebodythat they know.
Speaker 3 (37:19):
Yeah yeah, usually it's somebody you know.
Thanks for joining us today.
Don't forget to review SisterVibes and make sure to subscribe
on the app of your choice soyou don't miss our upcoming
episodes.
Until next time.
Speaker 1 (37:36):
Ja ne of your choice, so you don't miss our upcoming
episodes.
Until next time, johnna.
I've been waiting for so long.
Bye.
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