December 20, 2024 • 56 mins
Ever wondered about the profound connection between humans and animals? Steven Koyle, a passionate zoologist and elephant advocate, shares his remarkable 23-year journey working with elephants. From his early days at the Phoenix Zoo to navigating the complex cultural landscapes of India, Steven's heartfelt stories reveal the unique spiritual bond he forms with these majestic creatures. His insights challenge us to rethink our relationship with wildlife and inspire us to foster compassion for these gentle giants.
Animal rescue and activism take center stage as we recount an emotional adoption event, spotlighting the dramatic rescue of a dog named Ted from the brink of euthanasia. We also delve into the fiery world of anti-whaling activism, discussing Paul Watson's release from Sea Shepherd and his relentless fight against Japanese whalers. Our discussions shed light on the need for ethical tourism, urging travelers to choose non-invasive wildlife experiences and drawing hope from successful transformations like animal-free circuses.
Musicians know the struggle of airborne travel woes all too well, especially when it involves precious instruments. We share the frustrating tales of navigating unfriendly airline policies, highlighted by the story of British cellist Sheku Kenne Mason. Meanwhile, our Gen Z correspondent, Asher Freidberg, adds a refreshing perspective with insights on the pop culture phenomenon "Stranger Things." Join us for an episode brimming with inspiration, advocacy, and a touch of humor, as we journey through the fascinating intersection of animal welfare, travel, and activism.
AMAZON
Compassion Kind
PATREON
SLAP the Power is written and produced by Rick Barrio Dill (@rickbarriodill) and Aja Nikiya (@compassioncurator). Associate Producer Bri Coorey (@bri_beats). Audio and Video engineering and studio facilities provided by SLAP Studios LA (@SLAPStudiosLA) with distribution through our collective home for progress in art and media, SLAP the Network (@SLAPtheNetwork).
If you have ideas for a show you want to hear or see, or you would like to be a featured guest artist on our show, please email us at info@slapthepower.com
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
There's so many.
Every country is different.
You can't say it's this or that, but for me, the biggest
challenge is simply gettingaccess to the elephants, because
my only intention is to helpthe elephant.
It's not my fight to say,remove the elephant from the
temple in Sri Lanka or India.
It's a whole other, becausethat's me criticizing religion
now.
Now we've got a whole otherobstacle to deal sure.
(00:23):
It has nothing to do with that.
Speaker 4 (00:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
It's going to a camp somewhere in Thailand, or going
to a camp in India, or going toa camp in Vietnam, and just
wanting to help.
Speaker 4 (00:43):
What we call slap.
Today, the world may not needanother podcast, but it can
definitely use a slap.
Welcome to Slap to Power, theshow that lifts artists who use
their powers for positiveprogress.
I am Rick Barrio-Dill and I'mAsia.
Speaker 5 (01:00):
Nakia On the show today.
We touch base on Paws forProgress with our recent
adoption event and newest rescue, Ted, who was spared just seven
minutes before his euthanasiadate yes, Seven minutes.
And then we're also going totalk about our heroic
anti-whaling activist, PaulWatson, who was just released
from jail in Greenland.
Speaker 4 (01:20):
That's right and you know, of course we have to talk
about Steve Bannon, as he ofcourse floats day Donald Trump
running for president in 2028.
Speaker 5 (01:28):
Of course, and can New York City's traffic cameras
also be used for personal selfiestudios?
Speaker 4 (01:35):
Yeah, this story is incredible and our amazing,
amazing interview is withzoologist and friend to the
elephant, Stephen Coyle,discussing his life-saving work
with the Elephant Care UnchainedFoundation around the globe.
Speaker 5 (01:48):
Yes, and then we're going to talk about musicians
buying seats for cellos onplanes.
I mean, have you ever had tobuy a seat for an instrument?
I got a couple of stories aboutinstruments on a plane when we
get to that.
I want to hear some more aboutthat.
Speaker 4 (02:02):
That's right.
And last but not least, ourresident Gen Zer Asher is here
again for another segment ofMake this Ish Make Sense.
Speaker 5 (02:10):
But first we are going to talk about Paws for
Progress.
We had a very nice adoptionevent this past week.
Great turnout.
We didn't have any adoptions,which we don't usually expect
like a full-on adoption from anadoption event, even though that
would sound like that's whatit's for right but we got a lot
of interest and our sweet littleaddy, our little girl with the
cherry eyes, she just got a new,foster, um.
So you know, overall supersuccess.
(02:32):
You know, getting our names outthere, getting the doggies out
there, yeah so, yeah, it wasgood.
And then we did take on a newrescue this week.
Speaker 4 (02:39):
His name is ted and great name for a dog, let's be
honest, I I love names like thatsame for dogs, same yeah so so
little.
Speaker 5 (02:47):
Ted was facing his final hour and I actually got
contacted at 3 17 and hiseuthanasia date and time was 3
30 pm and I was like on thefence, I mean I I was emailing,
we were calling, we were reallytrying Last minute foster came
(03:08):
in, everyone was pledging forthis dog to be rescued and then
we weren't hearing back and itwas like 3.23.
We're like down to the wirelooking every minute, minute by
minute.
Finally they responded like3.27.
Then they were like, oh, canyou be here by 3.30 to pick him
up?
And we're like, no, no, pleaseextend this.
(03:28):
But we did save the dog's lifeby three minutes.
So, oh, my God, yeah we werejust going a little bit of back
and forth at the shelters.
But you know I mean.
His life is just so differentnow.
You know I'm seeing his photoin, you know, his kennel to now,
like we have this really cutephoto which we'll post, with his
(03:52):
little reindeer ears and he'sjust enjoying his life and it's
like, within seven minutes, sucha different story for this kid,
you know.
Speaker 4 (03:58):
Yes.
Speaker 5 (03:59):
Ted, yeah, all right, did you hear about Paul Watson
and Sea Shepherd's like biggestnotorious whale activist?
He just got out of jail.
Wait, wait, what this?
Okay, so I have known about SeaShepherd since I don't know.
I was like five years old.
I've always been obsessed withthem.
They are like combating whalekillings, like all over the
(04:22):
world.
They work especially in Japanand Antarctica and they're an
anti-whaling nonprofitorganization doing absolutely
amazing work.
I have had the honor andprivilege of actually doing some
work with them in the past.
We did a whole stint in Bahamasfor Hurricane Dorian, where we
brought back on the Sea Shepherdvessel this huge, massive
(04:43):
research vessel that they havewe brought back dogs and cats
from the Bahamas after HurricaneDorian on the Sea Shepherd
vessel, this huge, massiveresearch vessel that they have,
we brought back dogs and catsfrom the Bahamas after Hurricane
Dorian and it was like thecoolest experience ever, like
everybody.
You know all the what do youcall people that work on the
crew.
Speaker 4 (04:58):
On the boats.
Speaker 5 (04:59):
Yeah, but yeah, I mean.
So he was actually arrested onsome old charges back from 2012
by the Japanese government forcausing injury to one of their
workers and damage to one oftheir boats.
Speaker 4 (05:13):
So not for whaling.
Speaker 5 (05:15):
Not for whaling, no, but he's fighting against the
whalers.
Speaker 3 (05:19):
Yeah, sure, so.
Speaker 5 (05:20):
Sea Shepherd is out there in the middle of the,
literally trying to track downboats and end whaling.
Speaker 4 (05:26):
I should say that again, not for his vigilante
work as an anti-whaler.
Speaker 5 (05:32):
Well, yes, but Japan is mad because he's interrupting
their whaling.
So they find him guilty forsomething else, so they find him
guilty and he was in jail forfive months, which was just
crazy.
We couldn't believe it.
And then he was supposed to beextradited to japan for a
15-year sentence.
(05:52):
So this was like big news inthe animal rescue community.
We were all like freaking out.
We all are huge fans of paulyeah very like amazing, amazing
human being, um.
But yeah, so he got released,which has been like such great
news, and now the anti-whalingcontinues.
Speaker 4 (06:04):
Look at that, yeah two stories off the top that are
good.
Nice, positive palate cleanserscome on.
That's great, that's reallygreat.
Well, uh, I'm gonna end thatright now.
I'm gonna stop the good news.
Speaker 5 (06:16):
Yeah, yeah, all right , let me take a sip.
Speaker 4 (06:18):
I'm ready, I'm ready the 22nd amendment of our
Constitution clearly states thatno person shall be elected to
office of the president morethan twice.
Now who here, in a show ofhands, who here, thinks that the
president-elect is going toobey that four years from now?
Speaker 5 (06:39):
The room is silent, everyone there are no hands in
the air for those of us who arejust listening everyone there
are no hands in the air.
Speaker 4 (06:45):
For those of us who are just listening, the funny
thing is is like I was like, oh,how long is it going to take,
once he gets elected, for theystart floating it and softening
the ground so that the peoplestart having this discussion and
stuff like that?
And it's, he's not even in anoffice yet, and, of course, of
course is goon steve bannon uh,put out the suggestion, of
course, and it came from him.
And then, uh, you know, they'regonna test the feasibility and
(07:05):
legality of such a move.
While some view this as astrategic play to keep trump's
political influence alive,others see it as a direct
challenge to constitutionalnorms.
So, yeah, you don't think?
Yeah, uh, but as the wholelandscape kind of continues to
evolve, this definitely adds aninteresting thing, because he's
(07:25):
just going to push on this opendoor.
And how are we going to reactto it?
We're going to have to see.
But it didn't take long, no,and it's in the it's in the it's
in the sphere of discussion.
Speaker 5 (07:37):
So where does the line get drawn?
Like I'm waiting to see wherethe where the line is?
There's no line, it's an.
The line is no, no, no, there'sno line, it's gone.
It's gone, it's an imaginaryline.
Now, what are amendments andlaws?
Speaker 4 (07:48):
There was a line and he was in the union, okay, there
was a line and he was in aunion worker, okay, and he got
let go.
And so now he's at home on thatsweet, sweet gummit cheese,
right.
And meanwhile somebody's aboutto be plowing over with no lines
, no lines out there for foritself.
It's gonna be good times, it'sgonna be fun times coming up.
Speaker 5 (08:09):
Yeah, well, you know, in in, you know, for the sheer
sake of chaos, yeah, um, we'llgo into talking about this
artist, maury coleman, who did atraffic cam photo booth project
which gave surveillance a verycheeky twist.
So this is this is a reallyinteresting story.
I I want to hear your take onthis all right, lay it on me.
Speaker 4 (08:29):
I yeah, I saw it in the in the breakdown and I was
like I yeah, no, I have thoughts.
Speaker 5 (08:34):
I mean, it's just one of those things we're in like I
just go straight to like thisselfie world that we're in, and
then I also go into ai, and thenI also go into like
surveillance rights and and thecombination of all of those
things and how this artist isusing the traffic the traffic
booth as a source for his artand then he got sent.
Speaker 4 (08:55):
So, for those who don't know, he's an artist in in
New York, right?
Yep, yeah, and he basically hasbeen using the street cam as as
kind of hey, let me have funwith this on the, on the selfie
cam, and the city was like yeah,nah, and they sent him a, they
sent him a cease and desistorder, which he wasn't really
hurting anything but New York,you know, whatever.
Uh, and so what he did is hetook the cease and desist letter
(09:18):
and put it on a 15foot pole andheld it in front of the traffic
cam which I got to give himprops.
Speaker 5 (09:26):
It's bold, it's bold.
Speaker 4 (09:28):
Respect.
Speaker 5 (09:28):
And then, I think, his art made it into a Miami art
show.
He brought the art to Miami foran art show or something,
because—.
Speaker 4 (09:35):
So yeah, I think he was collecting images on what he
was doing on the selfie showbefore they gave him the cease
and desist letter yeah, yeahyeah, so he was turning it into
art and that's really cool.
It is.
I like it.
Let's see what he's going to do.
If he's just going to, let'ssee where this standoff goes.
I'm curious you heard it herefirst and we're going to keep
you posted.
Speaker 5 (09:52):
This is literally like for me.
This is when people ask like,what is the definition of modern
art?
Hey, this would be yes, yes,this is the definition of modern
art.
So we'll see what happens.
Speaker 4 (10:03):
We'll see what happens.
All right, I am so excited.
Coming up after the break,we're going to have our
interview here in studio withthe Elephant Care Unchained
Stephen Coyle.
Speaker 3 (10:15):
Yes, gambling is part of the culture of America,
since even before we wereAmerica.
I'm Norman Chad.
I know gambling.
I've played blackjack and poker.
I've bet sports and horse races.
I've even hit the slot machinesat a Pahrump Nevada 7-Eleven.
You say gambling, I sayGambling Mad.
(10:35):
So join me on Gambling Mad withNorman Chad wherever you find
your podcasts.
Follow us on socials atGambling Mad Show or at Gambling
Mad Norman Chad at YouTube.
Speaker 4 (10:48):
Joining us in studio today.
We are honored to have SteveCoyle from the Elephant Care
Unchained.
They're dedicated toeliminating cruelty and
improving elephant welfare intheir native countries.
Welcome to Slap the Power,steve.
Thank you for being here.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
Thank you for having me.
Thank you for having me.
It's a pleasure.
It's a pleasure to be here.
Speaker 4 (11:06):
It's funny because you we were right before we
started recording.
You said I'll talk aboutelephants forever, and you know
what's great is?
They're magical in a way that Ifeel warrants that kind of a
comment, and we have a lot offriends that have hipped me to
just the tip of the iceberg onhow dope elephants are.
(11:27):
So, in addition to your workhelping the elephants, please
set up what set your love forelephants into motion.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
Well, I spent right now it would be 23 years working
for elephants.
That's what I say.
I got my career with elephantsat the Phoenix Zoo in Arizona,
arizona um, never really wantedto work in a zoo, but I knew I
wanted to work with animals andso, and doing you know I still I
was living here in californiatraining dogs for two years
prior to taking a job in phoenix.
Um, anyway, um, I've alwayssaid that elephants are
(12:01):
incredibly soulful, you know,and either you are an elephant
person or you're not an elephantperson.
In my experience, when talkingto zookeepers, you know
something oh, I'm so scared ofelephants because they're so big
and scary, you know, and theydo hurt people, they do kill
people, right, so they are.
But when you spend time withthem and you see them and they
know exactly what's going on,but they look nothing like us,
(12:22):
you know, but, but they looknothing like us.
But they're incrediblysophisticated, incredibly
intelligent, just the greatestthing on the planet.
Speaker 4 (12:39):
And so over these past 23 years, I've dedicated my
life trying to do everything Ican to help them in any way that
I can.
How did you get into morespecifically eliminating cruelty
and and specifically, welfare,because it's one thing to be on
the zoo side, I would imagineright where that's maintenance
and yeah yep, what is?
What?
What sort of drew you to thisincredible work?
Speaker 1 (12:56):
um, well, I was at the zoo for 14 and a half years
total, but after 10 years, andevery time I would, I would take
a vacation like I've been tothe la zoo, I've been to all the
zoos all around because it'sjust getting research and
gaining knowledge and trying toimprove, uh, the the lives of
the elephants that I cared forat the zoo.
Sure, um, and so eventually Iactually borrowed money from my
(13:18):
retirement at the zoo, because,you know, the zoo pays a lot of
money.
Yeah, so I I couldn't go toindia, but I wanted to go to
india, and so I met some, somepeople who had a place in india.
So I borrowed money out of myretirement fund, okay, and spent
a month in india and then wasin awe in a bad way, okay, uh,
because we have these fantasiesabout, oh, these elephants are,
(13:40):
they love, their love, they'recared for.
It's amazing.
And then you go there andyou're like what, what fucking
planet am I on?
This is crazy.
So I spent time with thisorganization and I showed them
things with the elephants.
I said, okay, let's not hitthem, let's get some food, let's
be compassionate.
How do we teach compassion?
We'll get into that in a minute.
But that's the million dollarquestion.
(14:00):
Yeah, compassion.
And a million dollar question,yeah, compassion.
And so, and the elephants?
The elephants are amazing.
They always come through foryou.
Yeah, give them a pile of dirt,they'll lay in the dirt,
they'll dust.
They do what they do, you know,like any animals, you give them
the proper environment to behealthy and flourish.
We step back and enjoy that.
Yeah, and so that was the whole.
That's what changed my wholemindset.
I always felt bad for theelephants at the zoo, but then
(14:22):
you go to see the the oppositeend of the spectrum, like, wow,
well, the zoo is kind of likedisneyland, yeah, you know,
compared to these elephants onfour leg chains, bleeding,
getting hit every day and allthese other things that I
witnessed and can continue towitness, unfortunately their
consciousness.
Speaker 4 (14:37):
You know, I'm sure that's and just I.
I grew up in tampa and so we.
We had bush gardens.
It was kind of like right whenI went to school there and they
would have elephants and thatwas really my only experience
would be in the little thingkind of next to them, but
there's, unlike any other sortof animal and I think even
humans almost Like there'ssomething when you look an
(14:58):
elephant in the eye that justdoes not.
Speaker 1 (14:59):
If humans were better beings, they'd be elephants.
Speaker 4 (15:03):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I concur, I mean were
better beings, yeah, they'd beelephants.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I, yeah, Ican, I mean honest to god.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
I mean yeah they're too good of a species and we
frankly don't deserve them, andwe sure as hell don't uh deserve
to be treating them the way wedo no, they're, they're almost
like your, like spiritual, likegrandmother, like there's this,
like very this aura about themwhere I just want to like bow my
head and just sit, like I meanliterally my favorite thing to
(15:28):
do.
Speaker 5 (15:28):
I mean I can watch many different species all day,
but there's something about likesitting at the watering hole
like I can you, you literallyhave to like pull me away from
watching elephants.
I can sit there all day longand watch elephants.
They're one of my favoritespecies, they're one of my
favorite soul animals.
There's just, yeah, there'ssomething about them, and for me
(15:49):
to even picture someone beingable to cause harm towards this
soulful, spiritual, grandmother,indigenous-type vibe animal
that just brings so much respect, I mean they literally are
foresting the planet all day.
I mean they have such animportant role, they're a
keystone species and you knowfor dummies like me, what's a
(16:13):
keystone species?
Speaker 1 (16:14):
yeah, tell us, steve.
They basically support theecosystem that they're in, so
like even everything from theirpoop.
Dung beetles roll up, theydisperse seeds.
Elephants only absorb about 40%of the food they eat, so when
they go to the bathroom, thosethe rest of it is used by
everybody else, exactly, andthey only eat the best of the
(16:35):
plants.
Speaker 5 (16:35):
So you know you're getting just constant like
reforestation activity withelephants Uprooting trees.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
Other animals get to trees, they uproot, they do
different things.
Yeah, it's like the sharks ofthe ocean you know we need
sharks.
Speaker 5 (16:48):
Sharks are a huge indicator species of
biodiversity and of health ofthe ocean.
So we, in like biology andzoology, you know, we use these
key indicator species to sort ofassess the health of an
environment.
Speaker 4 (17:02):
And so you from India take me.
So that, was that really theimpetus.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
Well, like so I was all you know.
I always had a loud mouth and Ialways was outspoken at the zoo
.
That's why we like each other.
On behalf of the elephants.
It wasn't like the zoo isterrible, fuck the zoo.
Yeah yeah was like we can domore, let's be better.
We need to be better.
Let's you know that's.
I'm spending time in indifferent zoos in southeast asia
right now doing doing the same,having the same talks like,
(17:28):
yeah, this is unacceptable yeahthis is not what an elephant is
yeah you know, can we at leastchain them?
instead of four chains, can wejust chain them on one chain in
a tree to a tree over there,instead of this concrete box
that they're in?
Yeah yeah right um, and so whatwas?
I didn't know oh, india oh soindia?
I was like, wow, this is crazy.
So then I went back to the zooand you know we were talking
(17:51):
about expanding the facility andit was always like some little
nickel and dime.
It wasn't, it was.
I said, why can't we do this,why don't we do this?
Why don't we have theorangutans climb across, you
know, you know, across above theelephants, and why don't you?
Why we're better than this, whycan't we just do these things?
So you know, I fight, fight,fight, and I continued to go to
India like once a year, and thenI went like every six months
(18:13):
for a couple of times, and thenthe zoo fired me, not because I
went to India, but because of myoutspokenness, if I you know,
I'm okay with it, because myintention was never to hurt the
zoo or sabotage the zoo.
It was to fight for theelephants and that was the
decision that the zoo made,which is where elephant care,
unchained, comes from.
Uh, I'm unchained to help theelephants, yeah, right.
(18:37):
So, yes, it's unchainedelephants, but in southeast asia
that's not always, uh, anoption, because you have to
build these things for theseanimals.
It's just different ways to dothings.
And so, being free from the zoonow, because I knew I would
never leave the elephants at thezoo, because you know, I love
them to death.
Only one is still alive.
And they inspired me and I wasnever going to leave.
(19:00):
I remember, you know, raking thepoop up in the yard every
morning.
Oh, you know, those elephantsin India, god it's terrible.
And these other places it's sobad, I don't know.
I mean, you guys are good here,you guys are doing good with
the elephants, I don't know.
And one of my coworkers, mygood friend, she, says well,
could you ever leave them?
Talking about the elephants,and I says no.
So the zoo made the decisionfor me, which allowed me now to
(19:25):
be in eight different countries,to continue to have
conversations as my phone isblowing up now.
Talk to Indonesia or Vietnam orthings I would never have done.
Speaker 4 (19:38):
So now I have a huge opportunity because of those
elephants at the zoo and, Iwould imagine, because of your
sort of pedigree at that point.
That's why the other zoos andthe other sort of sanctuaries
and places around the worldprobably.
How did you get such a networkso fast?
Speaker 1 (19:54):
Well, I think integrity is number one and I
think work is number two.
Well, work is probably one andthen integrity is second.
My work kind of speaks foritself.
You know I have a good resume,if you will.
So when I go to places theyhave no idea who I am, what I'm
talking about, think I'm full ofshit.
What does Whitey from the Westknow about elephants?
(20:17):
They don't even have elephants.
What is he a zookeeper?
They don't even have elephantsin their country.
Speaker 4 (20:20):
We've got to work on that branding the Whitey from
the whitey from the west.
Speaker 1 (20:25):
It's just, you know, workshop that a little bit but
this is what this is as I speak,but this is, but this is what
they feel right and so I'm like,okay, well, that's okay, I get
it.
I don't.
And if you get, ever knows, Inever publicly criticize on
social media, I never say blah,blah, blah, because you have to
work with these cultures, youknow sure and so you have to
convince them that number one,you know what you're talking
(20:46):
about.
So I walk around with my littletablet and I'll say how about
this, how about this, how aboutthis?
And they don't really evenstill get it at that point.
And so you constantly have totry to fight and I have people
in different countries that willcontact me and say let's go
here, let's go here.
You hey, let's go here, let'sgo here.
Unfortunately, the governmentis involved in a lot of these
countries and a lot of theseplaces.
(21:06):
Our government, or you mean the?
Speaker 4 (21:08):
local governments, the local governments, the
country, yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
The native governments.
Speaker 4 (21:12):
What's your biggest challenge right now?
Country-wise.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
There's so many.
Every country is different.
You can't say it's this or that.
But for me, the biggestchallenge is simply getting
access to the elephants, becausemy, my only intention is to
help the elephant.
It's not my fight to say,remove the elephant from the
temple in Sri Lanka or India,it's a.
It's a whole nother, becausethat's me criticizing religion
now.
Now we've got a whole notherobstacle to come across.
(21:40):
Has nothing.
It's going to a camp somewhereIn Thailand, or going to a camp
in India, or going to a camp inVietnam and just wanting to help
.
But they always think there'ssome sort of angle.
I don't ask them for money.
That's why I have to getdonations, because if I ask them
for money, this guy's justtrying to.
Speaker 4 (21:55):
You're never going to get money.
You really are whitey from thewest.
Speaker 1 (21:59):
I've actually been to places and spent my own money
to Buy enrichment things andthings like these and you know,
buy things to help the elephantsand then would talk about it on
social media and then theywould say this guy's using our
elephants to make money, eventhough I paid the money to do it
and you're just like what.
(22:20):
You know so many stories.
Yeah, when you're coming.
We can pick a country.
We can go into any rabbit holewe would like, but there's just
so much to do For me.
I just want to help.
Speaker 5 (22:30):
Yeah, I just want to help, I mean.
Something that I think of, toois we just had legislation
passed in Ojai, california,where elephants are now given
personhood.
Shout out to Ojai yeah, ojai isis so next level and it's funny
cause I got to go visit thereand there is such a next level
(22:51):
vibe about it that I love.
But on the legislation part, Imean, what is your, you know,
involvement or take on assistingon the government side of
changing the laws in thesecountries?
Speaker 1 (23:03):
Well, I put my whatever I'm allowed to do.
I do like I'm literally havingconversations with india and
indonesia.
Uh, indonesia is kind of hotright now but, um, as far as I'm
going to contact the governmentof the forest departments and,
uh, I'm going to send them aletter from my observations of a
place and say this isunacceptable.
(23:24):
You're better than this.
I would like to help you maketheir elephants' lives better
without publicly shaming them.
Right, because that's a hugething In India.
Me and my Indian brother, wetook our whole road trip around
this entire state.
I don't want to be too specific, but and we saw all the
(23:45):
elephants- in that entire stateand of the state inside India.
Speaker 4 (23:49):
Inside India, yes, inside India, a particular state
going, going into templestrying to find elephants.
Speaker 1 (23:56):
You know not, there's elephants over there.
It's not there waiting daystrying to find you know they're
all moved secretly illegally,but waiting days trying to find.
You know they're all movedsecretly illegally but nobody
follows up, nobody knows.
And so what we did?
We went there, you know, withdonated money.
We took these road trips, wedrove all around in his personal
vehicle, we drove and submitteda 10-page report about all the
(24:21):
elephants and ourrecommendations of what should
happen with all these elephantsthat are in these temples and
these different places, which islooking like Indonesia is going
to be the same thing.
So I did my part.
And another funny thing is thatwe say you know white of way,
in a sense.
Speaker 5 (24:39):
I mean, but there are some advantages.
Speaker 1 (24:42):
If I'm sitting in an office in another country, I'm
going to get a little bit moreattention.
I'm not by myself granted, butthere's going to be some more
attention as to why is this guyhere, as opposed to.
They might just step over mybuddy who spent hours, days both
of my guys in Indonesia, samething.
Speaker 5 (24:58):
A friend of mine made a point to me one day and it
really hit me one day and itreally like it really hit me.
Um, he said he's, he's aNigerian man and um, we've
worked together on some povertyissues and and throughout Africa
.
And he said to me he's likeAsia, he's like you're just
white enough for Africa, butyou're not black enough for
(25:22):
America, no for America Right.
Speaker 3 (25:30):
And it was like oh, and it like hit me to my core
and he's so right because I amable to move around Africa as a
continent we all.
Speaker 5 (25:37):
Just, I always hate when I say Africa because I want
everyone to know that it is acontinent with many countries in
it, but I work in too manycountries to reference all of
them in one sentence.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
So Africa is what I'm saying.
Speaker 5 (25:49):
But you know, it does give you this edge, I mean,
people will listen.
Speaker 3 (25:55):
It gives you a second look.
Speaker 5 (25:56):
It gives you a second look.
I've been able to get in theroom.
I've been able to get inconversations that a lot of my
team, my, you know, my sistersand brothers in Africa are not
able to do.
But then you come here and youtry to talk about, you know,
racism issues and things, andthen you're not enough to be in
the room you know, and it wasjust so.
it was so interesting, but it'salso why I'm literally busting
(26:18):
my butt to get a PhD, becauseyou know as much as I know, when
you have a doctorate and you'removing around in developing
countries, not only do you get asecond look, you get a first
look, and then on top of that,you get to actually make some
things happen.
Speaker 1 (26:35):
So, I'm doing my best so that I can travel around
with this doctor's title whenyou go there, do you say no, let
me show you what is possibleand you have all of your
experience, so that they're likeokay.
As opposed to you say no, letme show you what is possible and
you have all of your experience, yes, so that they're like okay
, that is, as opposed to justwaving your finger at them,
right.
Right, I don't have aveterinary degree, but I teach a
lot of vets foot care.
Speaker 5 (26:54):
Same.
Speaker 1 (26:54):
I teach a lot of vets how to take care of elephants'
feet.
It started at the zoo.
We had an elephant there whohad a kind of grew inward so she
developed abscesses on her feetbecause they didn't move
normally naturally, so they hadabnormal pressure.
So when I say elephant footabscess, to simplify the term
for everybody listening, it'sbasically a bruise that forms
(27:19):
inside the foot from abnormalpressure and so that pressure
builds up over time and thenruptures and when that ruptures
and we're talking 20, 30 yearsof this being chained on
concrete.
Speaker 4 (27:30):
So it's kind of like if you go like this to your nail
yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:34):
Well, if you keep doing this to your nail, well
what happens?
Well, that's going to bruise,right, and then the nail is
going to fall off, then it'sgoing to go into your bone and
then you've got all kinds ofissues, right?
Yeah, osteomyelitis is what wecall it with elephants.
So the idea is, what you wantto do?
Is you kind of want to dosomething like that?
So it's still vascular, so youtake the pressure off the nails.
It's a whole thing behind ityeah, yeah.
But basically elephants that arekept in terrible environments
(27:55):
over many, many, many years.
You know about age 25, 20, 25,30.
Like us, the body starts tobreak down.
So every terrible place thatthey've been in or continue to
be in starts to show signs.
So I can go and look atelephant feet and say the
elephant lays down on theconcrete every night, mostly on
(28:18):
the left side, yeah, blah, blah,blah, blah.
Or yeah, those abscesses formbecause she's chained and she
can't move so she's swaying, soconstantly going like this for
years, right, and it's.
Speaker 5 (28:31):
and it's interesting because, you know, sometimes you
have to flip the the discourseof the conversation to something
like you know, I was dealingwith a situation in botswana
with the herd dogs and they wereso mistreated, so abused, so
thin, not being fed, but thenthey were expected to go out
(28:52):
every day and fight the lionsand hyenas off.
And I knew that I wasn't goingto get them to care about the
dogs, but if I could get them tocare about keeping their pack
of dogs alive, so that they cankeep their cattle alive and they
don't have as many kills, thenyou can start to have a
conversation.
So it's the same with that.
You know, in this situationwith the elephants, I feel like
(29:14):
if you can get them tounderstand that you're going to
to us.
we don't care If you take bettercare of these animals' feet,
then you're going to get moreyears out of them, which is not
what we ever want.
We want them free in the jungledoing what they want to do.
But sometimes you have to cometo this middle ground where
you're like at least I can maketheir life better for the next
(29:34):
10 years, while they are a slavestuck in this captivity
situation.
But you have to know that andyou have to be able to talk that
language and lingo to thepeople that you're working with,
because you have to understandthat not everyone has the same
heart, not everyone has the sameintentions for these animals so
what is this, this, this, ifthey're in captivity, what is it
(29:54):
for?
Speaker 4 (29:54):
because I know for, as somebody again, kind of
really really being on theoutside and shout out to my
friend dennis.
Uh, shout out to dennis becausehe lives in thailand and spends
a lot of time at the elephantsanctuaries there and stuff like
that.
He's obsessed.
But the tusk issue was thething.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
Right, it was like that, that's more Africans.
Speaker 4 (30:13):
That's Africa.
Speaker 1 (30:14):
That's poaching Okay.
Speaker 4 (30:17):
So on the slavery, but on the slavery side of
things are why you would hold on.
Speaker 1 (30:21):
Why you would have an elephant in slavery.
Speaker 4 (30:22):
Yeah, quote unquote.
Speaker 1 (30:23):
Well, again, we pick a country we can have the
arguments so.
Thailand.
We just mentioned Thailand.
That's all tourism stuff.
All those elephants used to bebasically logging working
elephants.
Then they banned logging andpeople had their elephants.
And now what do you do withthem?
Speaker 5 (30:43):
So now they're painting pictures riding
tricycles, getting hugs andkisses from people doing all the
things.
Exploitive tourism is one ofthe biggest issues we face in
wildlife across the planet rightnow.
Speaker 4 (30:50):
Okay, fair question.
Speaker 1 (30:53):
I think it's amazing that there's Hold on, hold on,
hold on.
Speaker 4 (30:57):
If an elephant paints something and then they sell
the paintings to help for thesanctuary as somebody who
doesn't know, it looks on thesurface like oh, hey, wow, this
is really cool.
Speaker 1 (31:10):
It looks cute.
Yeah, it looks cute.
Speaker 3 (31:12):
You're giving money that's supposed to help, but I
have a nail in my hand righthere, yeah I'm coaching you and
telling you how to paint thatpicture.
Speaker 5 (31:18):
Okay a lot of these are forced behaviors, so what
you're not when you're notseeing, because we've got so
many different tourism avenuesfor elephants which you can talk
about this.
But this is like.
This is my thing is thisvolunteerism, all of these you
know exploitive ways that we,you know these countries, are
bringing in money for tourism by, you know, appealing to people
(31:38):
being able to hug and take aphoto with an animal?
This is something that ishappening.
Tigers disgusting Tigers, Imean the tigers are literally
drugged and then they're soldoff for canned hunting after.
I mean, these are major issues,but I'm glad we're bringing
this up because this is how youcan help.
This is how, when you aresomeone sitting at home in Los
(32:01):
Angeles, in Ohio, and you'remaking travel plans and you're
deciding to go to thesecountries, you can opt out of
these exploitive touristicattractions.
Change the demand.
The shift in the demand wouldallow these animals to be
retired, would allow them to atleast be have an attempt at a
sanctuary.
We're not going to have asanctuary for all of the animals
, but it's a step in the rightdirection.
(32:22):
But if the demand changes,we're not going to be putting
new elephants into sitting ontheir backs for a ride, doing
photos, because they're dealingwith cowhooks and prods and all
kinds of horrible trainingmethods.
I mean the babies, I won't evengo into that.
Speaker 4 (32:38):
So is there a place where it is?
It almost is like um, you knowwhere the the question of dogs.
We, we all love dogs and butthere's there's kind of a a
relationship, there's asymbiotic relationship.
Right, it's like it's just dogsare unconditional love, but at
the same time, we'vedomesticated them right.
(32:59):
Right, they're, they're thenatural part of them would be
hey, let let me take off and goto Griffith Park.
That's where my dog would wantto go, that's correct.
So is there a world, though,where there's a happy medium and
this actually does functioncorrectly, or just nowhere?
Just don't do it anywhere.
Don't do it at Busch Gardens,don't do it in.
Speaker 5 (33:18):
Thailand.
Okay, I'll let you answer, butthen I'm going to go on a rant
answer, but then I'm going to goon a rant.
Speaker 1 (33:22):
Well, the thing is with the elephant-wise.
I've always told people twothings.
One put yourself in theelephant's, put yourself in the
animal's place.
Would you want 30 peoplehugging, kissing you, scrubbing
you?
Speaker 4 (33:34):
down three or four times a day.
Speaker 1 (33:36):
The answer would be no, right.
This is the question I pose toall these places that I visit
and I say look at at this, ifyou were an elephant, would you
want to live here?
Yeah, every one of them tellsme no.
I said then, what are we doing?
We're better than this, sure,right, we are.
And so what I tell people?
I said you change the demand?
Yeah, so I don't tell people toboycott the elephant riding
places.
I say you want to go, go, butyou give them 20 bucks and you
(33:59):
say no, I just want to walk withthe elephant because, those
elephants need food, they needcare, they need money coming in
the door that's what I was gonnasay.
You're just gonna sit back rightand and yes, and whittle away.
The people who own the elephantsare business people.
Yep, they, they just want money.
They don't give a shit, right,they don't give a shit about you
know.
Right, if the elephant can walk, okay we're gonna.
We're gonna walk it till thewheels fall off.
(34:21):
Yep, basically, and that's what.
You changed the demand.
Yeah, I don't think boycottingis the answer.
You changed the demand, yeah,but the problem is so many other
I mean there's Westerners also,but a lot of the natives still
support these things.
So if I go to an elephant showin another country, it's packed
(34:42):
with natives yeah, they love it,yeah, and in another country.
It's packed with natives, theylove it, and I'm like what are
we doing, guys?
So how do you have thatdiscussion?
So that's why you make whateverthis is for the elephant better
or whatever this is for theanimal better, and then you work
on the outside influence tochange the culture.
Speaker 5 (34:59):
And you can shift these things right, like we've
seen circuses shift away from.
You know they're getting thesame, if not more, of an
audience without the animals.
We look at situations because Iworked in circus law for such a
long time and trying to getthese elephants out of ringling
we were so, you know, knee deepin it that you got to see every
(35:21):
day.
You got to see the changes.
But what I loved about that asan example, is that Cirque du
Soleil came about and we see howfamous and you know those shows
are jam-packed.
We're seeing circusestransforming.
No, no these are all human-basedcircuses.
I'll give you an example.
Give people a good show they'regonna go.
Speaker 4 (35:43):
You don't need to exploit an elephant.
Part of the presentation on theCirque du Soleil stuff that
I've been to is they'reprofessing off the back.
The disclaimer is we're puttinga lot of this money into trying
to make the situation better,so presumably I'm not being lied
to there.
Speaker 5 (36:02):
You are being lied to when they say we're taking
money and also and can we talkabout all the lies that Ringling
said about putting all of theelephants into retirement at a
sanctuary.
Speaker 1 (36:11):
I'm not going to go there, but I will go there
there's all kinds of things, butto give you an example, give me
some hope, just to bring itback.
There's in Sri Lanka.
They have this, this festival,it's called the Parahara and
it's an amazing thing.
It's beautiful, people aredancing, drums, fire amazing.
And then they spoil it withthese elephants that are lit up,
(36:33):
walking Real life elephantsspoiled and ruined this amazing
experience.
That's not even necessary to doit right.
But how do you tell somebodythat their entire family that's
all they've ever known, the pairof hair has to have elephants?
So, now we're going to.
Robotic elephants is kind ofthe new trend now which is
happening.
So hopefully that'll grab holdand you know, because India is
(36:54):
starting to put more and morerobotic elephants out there, but
they spoil these amazing thingsby putting these animals in.
Speaker 5 (37:05):
It them to be elephants could be anything.
No, and, and now I mean on thezoo side, I mean looking at the
capabilities of the um virtualreality.
I mean you can create an entireimmersive experience it's an
amazing thing where you're inthe jungle with the elephants,
you know, getting the experiencethat you want, because I, I
think you know this goes back tolike my doctoral work.
I think that you know we havethis to our core.
We want to be connected tonature, right?
(37:25):
And somebody going to take aphoto with an elephant, they're
not thinking, oh, I want toexploit this elephant and hurt
this elephant.
Speaker 1 (37:34):
Elephants are human magnets.
They're a magnet, we crave ityou know, just like our.
Speaker 5 (37:40):
You know circadian rhythm and being grounded and
like we are supposed to be innature.
We're supposed to be connectedwith animals and plants and it
is in our core.
But what we're doing wrong iswe're going about it in the
wrong ways.
We're going about it in a waythat's exploitive, taking away
from the experience of thisother being right To self-serve
ourselves, but there are waysaround that, and I mean
(38:02):
supporting sanctuaries is agreat way to get around that.
But you really have to do yourresearch.
What I would tell people is ifyou are traveling and you can
add to this but if you'relooking for a place that you can
go and see elephants I had anexperience.
I wanted to go check outShildrick Wildlife.
They are an elephant orphanagein Kenya.
They have one hour a day thatpeople are allowed to view the
(38:26):
elephants One hour a day.
You're not going inside andtaking photos with the elephants
in their pen, and these animalshave a free range.
They don't have to come if theydon't want to, but they're
coming and they're doing a mudbath.
It's a fun experience for theelephants.
It's like their party time.
They get to socialize with allthe other groups of babies.
Speaker 4 (38:47):
Plus, their skin looks great.
Speaker 5 (38:49):
Yeah, they're doing their mud bath in.
They're getting extra snacks,all the bottles.
They've created a positiveexperience for the elephants,
but then they go off and dotheir thing.
If you find a sanctuary whereall day long you can find a time
slot, from like 7 am to 5 pm,there is a time slot for you to
takea photo opportunity to, togo pet an elephant, to go stand
with an elephant, give them abath it's probably not the
(39:12):
sanctuary that you want to begoing to.
You want sanctuaries that haveminimal human interaction time,
because then that to me says, ohthey're, they're taking into
account that these animalsaren't exploited all day, but
yes, 100.
Speaker 1 (39:24):
The only issue is that people don't care.
People want their experience.
You know, I've given talks topeople and they still go to
Thailand and ride an elephant.
Speaker 5 (39:30):
I have gotten into arguments, so I failed.
Speaker 1 (39:33):
I failed in not emphasizing those things enough.
It's not.
People love elephants and wecan't help.
People love dogs.
You know, like people, theylove dogs, but they still chain
them up and they keep them in ashitty place.
People love elephants.
We have to be better abouthaving them look at it a
different way.
Speaker 5 (39:53):
It is.
It's really changing theperspective.
They want their experience.
That's the hard part.
They love them.
Speaker 1 (40:01):
They don't mean anything bad by going and
hugging and kissing.
I want to just give my love tothe elephant Meanwhile, it's all
chained up.
Speaker 4 (40:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (40:08):
You get your or it's not.
Chained up, you hug and kiss itand it goes back in and it goes
around a corner and it's on achain this long for the next 18
hours a day.
They don't know that it's nottheir fault, so it's my.
In a sense, it's people who areout there.
Speaker 5 (40:22):
It's us that know.
Speaker 1 (40:24):
We have to educate more People want their
experience.
We have to step back for aminute and think about the
animals that we want ourexperience with.
Speaker 4 (40:31):
Yes, that's a great point.
That's a great way Before welet you go, that's a great way
to think about it.
What is your, what's next foryou?
How can people help and?
Speaker 1 (40:43):
yeah, I am a official 501c3 nonprofit charity.
So if people want to help thecause, help elephants all over
the world.
This is a never-ending.
You know, we're helping todayfor those elephants fighting for
their tomorrows.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4 (40:58):
And so.
Speake (41:00):
Elephantcareunchainedcom .
Yes, you guys can donate.
Check out my YouTube channel.
There's a lot of informationthere.
Really, just spread the wordand step back.
If you're out and about withany animal anywhere in this
world, you step back and thinkabout those animals.
Speaker 4 (41:15):
I think that would be a way to look at it, tell me
about it, and if anybody wantsto get a hold of you directly,
what's the easiest way?
Speaker 1 (41:23):
Email.
You can go to my websiteelephantcareunchainedcom.
Everythingelephantcareunchained is me, so
if there's a message onInstagram, Facebook, anywhere,
I'll respond.
Speaker 4 (41:34):
And lastly, this could be actually this is great.
We'd love to keep checking upwith you and everything.
If you have specific projectsthat you're working on and
everything, would you see uspost I?
Speaker 1 (41:47):
well, aja is on my uh private email list, but there's
actually.
Speaker 5 (41:51):
I'm very up to date.
Speaker 1 (41:52):
There's actually a little buy-in to that one,
because I share a lot ofintimate, behind the scenes not
so nice videos of the journey,um.
So if people want to be a partof that, then you might have to
have a buy-in, just because Ihave to have a safe forum in
order to share these things,because if the things that I
share go public then it's kindof curtains for the work that we
(42:14):
do, because you don't want anybad perception of what is
actually going on, because if Isay something bad, they'll say
we don't want you here anymore.
Speaker 4 (42:22):
Can you do what we do here, which is, we don't talk
about it until we've done it?
Speaker 1 (42:26):
Can you hit us up and be like hey, yo, I just did
this, If you wish like I said,Aja's on the list and so if she
sees something, she'll be likethis is amazing.
Can I talk about it?
I'm always on that line, I'mlike what's going on today.
You know it never ends, sothere's always a new challenge,
there's always another elephantsuffering, unfortunately, and
until those stop, I won't.
Speaker 4 (42:48):
Hey, I will leave it at that.
Thank you so much, Steve Coyle.
All the work you do Pleasure.
Speaker 5 (42:53):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (42:55):
Thank you so much Pleasure.
Speaker 2 (42:59):
Join me Sasha Peters, on Women in the New Season 2,
where we bear it all except forour bodies.
Leave that to your imagination.
My wish for women is that westrip away the fear of judgment
and really embrace the fullspectrum of who we are.
I don't know if you were comingto terms with being pregnant on
the show.
Yeah, I think she was a littledepressed.
Let's live boldly and openlyand change the narratives that
define us.
I called my doctor.
(43:20):
I'm like I want to drive my car.
Speaker 5 (43:31):
Wow, yeah, wow, wow, yeah.
I mean I have known Stephen forquite some time through social
media and we have not gotten tomeet in person, but yet I feel
like we've been such goodfriends for all these years
because of the work that he does.
I mean it's just fascinating,it's soul work.
Speaker 4 (43:48):
He's got a vibe?
Yeah, he's got a vibe, andhaving the vibe next to us, yeah
and I just love the focus onthe animal's feet.
Speaker 5 (43:58):
It's just so important and you don't really
think about that when you thinkof elephant care.
Speaker 4 (44:02):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (44:03):
It was just an amazing interview.
I mean props to all the amazingwork he's doing.
I mean we have his links andeverything if anybody wants to
help.
Speaker 4 (44:09):
But wow, amen, blow it away.
Yeah, he's incredible.
Speaker 5 (44:12):
So now I want to know from a musician standpoint have
you ever had to purchase aninstrument to get on a plane?
A seat for an instrument to geton a plane.
Yes.
Okay, yeah, and what does thatlook like?
Speaker 4 (44:29):
It's frustrating.
I bet.
Yeah and we stopped doing thatafter a while.
It's frustrating, I bet, and westopped doing that after a
while.
On one level it's like you know, nolly, and we all kind of hold
on to certain instruments.
We have a relationship withthem.
Speaker 3 (44:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (44:51):
And at the same time it just became such a pain in
the ass and it became sort ofpot luck.
It was up to who was at thegate.
And that's what's so cool aboutthis story is because even our
instruments I mean, it's toughif you have a $50,000, les Paul
or something like that, Iunderstand like Nolly brings it
with him, brings it in a hardcase, but then it takes up a
good part of the thing.
So if you show up late,sometimes they'll make you check
(45:15):
it at the gate and so then youhave to be there early and
everything like that.
And what's so interesting aboutthis story?
It brought me back Because thisis a $3.5 million, 300-year-old
cello and they bought a seatfor it and they still weren't
(45:36):
allowed, uh, on the plane, andit just feels like how much
harder you're gonna make it forus, you know.
Speaker 5 (45:41):
And the airlines like no one is sitting in that seat
like they already bought theseat.
So what, like?
What is the dilemma?
Air canada, like I need to knowand and I feel, like you know,
like I deal with this stuff onthe dog front, all the time yeah
.
Like always, somebody has aproblem with something at the
gate or you know something withour cargo flights.
But this was just interestingbecause I'm like wow, even
instruments can't get a break ona flight.
Speaker 4 (46:03):
Yeah, it's crazy.
Hopefully I'm not killing thisname, but he's a famed British
cellist, sheku Kenne Mason, andhe had to cancel a sold-out show
in Toronto.
Yeah, that's horrible, and thisis on Air Canada, right, and
because he bought a seat forthis incredible instrument and
yet still couldn't get it on,and apparently you know it's
(46:27):
still, even when they asked himafterwards.
You know, to comment on this.
Like he was saying, this is acommon problem.
Even when you buy a seat webought stuff we we had now a lot
of times in japan what they'lldo is they'll make you buy a
seat for, like inner you.
We won't have to buy it ifyou're going intercontinental,
because we'll check it at acertain point.
(46:48):
We do the instruments check andthen you're crossing your
fingers, hoping it shows upbecause sometimes it doesn't
show up, but, um, moreimportantly, when you're doing
inner flying in within japan, solike if we're going from tokyo
to osaka and having to fly, orsomething like that, instead of
taking the train, uh, they makeus buy, you know, seats for the
instruments and stuff like that.
So, but even when you buy aseat, you should be able to have
(47:09):
it.
Like if people buy seats fortheir dog, they should be able
to have it.
Like if people buy seats fortheir dog, they should be able
to have it.
Speaking of which, I saw a guywith a pit bully on the bus this
morning.
And I was like I did think.
I was like I don't care, I hopehe didn't buy a seat for him.
But because the both of themwere sitting there on the bus, I
was like.
I was like that's cool, did he?
I digress, I digress.
(47:30):
But you know, if you've gotreally, really expensive
instruments, it is.
That's the nerve wracking thingof touring.
It's just like you'reconstantly in a state of I don't
know.
Is this going to make it, or youknow, or is it going to?
Are they going to?
Let me have it on the plane.
Speaker 5 (47:46):
And not everybody can be flying around on private
jets even though that would benice.
Commercial airlines need tofigure figure out a way to,
especially if you're going topay a whole seat.
Yeah, yeah, just to sticksomething there.
Speaker 4 (47:59):
Yeah, there's a lot of times where we got on and
they would count it as one ofour carry-ons.
So shout out to when Americanwas cool with us for a while.
There was a lot of airlines,there was a rule, but I think
they've softened that up overthe last couple of years because
it's just gotten so bad youknow, air travel with everything
, from just everything yeah, no,I mean so, yeah, facts, but
(48:22):
okay, and as promised, and backby popular demand, we bring
another segment of make this ishmake sense with our resident
Gen Z expert, asher Freidberg.
Make this ish make sense, asher.
If we just say Stranger Things,stranger Things, stranger
Things three times and click ourheels, asher will show up.
(48:43):
So are you ready?
Speaker 5 (48:44):
I'm ready.
Speaker 4 (48:45):
Okay, let's do it Ready.
Speaker 5 (48:46):
Stranger Things.
Speaker 4 (48:47):
Stranger.
Speaker 6 (48:48):
Things, Stranger Things.
Speaker 5 (48:50):
Oh.
Speaker 6 (48:51):
Oh, I was about to.
I was a blockbuster, I don'thave to pay now, just sit down
you were at the checkout.
Yeah, I was at the registerabout to go meet my guy.
Speaker 4 (49:01):
Oh, okay nice, nice, it's free now for those that
don't know, that's code for drugdeal.
It's okay, though.
Speaker 5 (49:07):
It's okay, it's okay we never know what this gets
into, okay, so Well done Allright, okay, so I love this
story, I love Muppets, I loveeverything about psychotherapy.
Speaker 4 (49:19):
Tell me.
Speaker 6 (49:20):
So there's this new trend going on on TikTok.
So I don't know if you guys arefamiliar.
Obviously you're familiar withthe Muppets, but there was Pepe
the King Prawn.
Growing up he was my favoriteMuppet.
Speaker 4 (49:30):
He was a funny guy.
Loved him.
Speaker 6 (49:31):
So yes, pepe the King Prawn is a character in the
Muppets.
And there's this new meme goingaround.
It's not even much of a meme,but more of a means of coping.
I'm not going to say this is aGen Z thing.
I think all generations in thepast I would say even 100, 200
years have had ways of copingthrough humor.
You know, it's an easy way tosay the things that are on our
mind sure just jokingly enoughso we don't have to set off
(49:54):
alarms or, you know, make awhole moment really dark and sad
you know, sure.
So the new thing people aredoing is there's this picture of
pepe the frog, pepe the prawn.
There's this new picture ofpepe the prawn going around and
I'm going to show on the screen,and people are just dumping
their all their trauma, all oftheir worst stories on it and
what, what makes it just alittle bit funnier is.
(50:16):
it's playing the Like a Prayerchoir version from Deadpool and
Wolverine, so it's got such adramatic Madonna song playing in
the background, chef's kissWhile you hear these mortifying
stories, so I'm going to shareone with you right now.
So I'm going to do anabbreviated one because these
are long.
Okay, all right.
So this is the story of.
So when it was their first, itwas five minutes in their first
(50:37):
lecture and they were going upon the stage to essentially
introduce themselves and do twotruths and a lie.
So they know we're all veryfamiliar with.
Speaker 4 (50:42):
Sure.
Speaker 6 (50:48):
Only we have it better with and as they were
climbing, they couldn't,essentially avoid being picked
to answer a question.
They were hiding.
It was mandatory participation.
They were zipping their bag,trying to leave.
They're choosing a perfectmoment to leave and the
professor switches off thelights.
This is their chance.
Essentially, they've reachedthe top of the spiral staircase
texting their friend about howthey'd rather fail than get up
and say that they're 21, have adog, dog and their dad invented
(51:21):
the saxophone or some bullshit.
The lights are out.
They're about to leave.
They fall down the spiralstaircase.
Been there, yes.
Essentially.
Then the professor yells someone, help that man, he's hurt
himself.
So every 200 person here, theyare all looking at this person
falling down the spiralstaircase.
A crowd of people gather aroundthem.
They see he's in so much pain,how mortified and the soul
leaving their body.
The lights are all turned on.
They want to take this personto the hospital.
The person insists they're fine, they can carry them back to
the car.
And they actually carry them tothe car and they awkwardly lay
(51:44):
them in the backseat of theirown car.
And when they get home theyimmediately drop the class and
change campuses.
Speaker 4 (51:50):
Okay, I have a lot.
Please start, please.
I got a lot.
Speaker 5 (51:54):
I got a lot.
That was me abbreviating it.
I am like sweating right now.
Yeah, exactly Because this.
Okay, you know what.
I'm not even going to go intowhat I was going to say, but
what I need everyone to do isjust come follow me for one day
of rescue?
Speaker 4 (52:09):
Yeah, exactly, if this is traumatic.
Speaker 5 (52:13):
I don't have enough words.
I don't even understand howanyone would read all of that.
I don't have the time for it.
I'm not a scroller anyways, butfor me to scroll through 10
carousels to talk about a storylike that, where's the humor?
Help me.
Speaker 4 (52:27):
No, it's not.
And what I appreciate is thatthis is somebody's personal
trauma that they're putting outthere in a long carousel.
What I can appreciate is it'snot traumatic, like where is the
trauma on?
And I don't want to soundinsensitive, I really really do
not, but it's making me realizethat trauma is on a spectrum.
(52:50):
It is on such a big spectrum,it's on a spectrum Because go
with you one day in Skid Rowdowntown.
Speaker 5 (52:58):
You want to see trauma every 10 seconds of your
life.
Exactly, I mean.
Speaker 4 (53:01):
And it's interesting though, because I do love the
forum of a Muppet and Madonna,to try to put this kind of in
context, and so you know, inthat respect, that respect it's.
This is somebody's trauma, sorespect, respect to their trauma
respect to your trauma.
But but yeah, on the spectrumwe're not all gonna be like deep
(53:23):
, deep trauma you know,sometimes it's affected you.
Speaker 6 (53:26):
You know we've all had stories that you know aren't
like.
We were in vietnam.
Or you know we were shot in thestreet.
We don't all have those stories, no sure but you know things
are gonna affect people indifferent ways.
You know we were shot in thestreet.
We don't all have those stories, no sure, but you know things
are going to affect people indifferent ways.
You know, for all we know, thisaffected this person positively
when I was like, well, I'vegotten that out of the way.
Speaker 4 (53:40):
Yeah, now you should be confident I called down a
spiral staircase.
Speaker 6 (53:42):
Yeah, but it's also a story worth telling.
As I fell, I fractured my arm.
I didn't get shot or anything,but I was part of all the buses.
Speaker 4 (53:59):
They were all watching me.
That's character building.
It's character building, and soyou should put it over the
prawn and Madonna.
Speaker 6 (54:08):
It's going to be a combination of things that are
silly and some things that arejust weird, or it's going to be
things that are actually dark.
It's about how you want to usethis to express what's going on
with you.
Speaker 5 (54:18):
Or this is how I look like at the end of 2024, which
is probably my favorite.
That's kind of how I'm feelingtoo.
Speaker 6 (54:23):
I think that's the funniest part of it we should
all be King Prawns.
Just for the end of the lasttwo weeks.
Speaker 4 (54:27):
And don't kink King Prawn.
Shame that King Prawn.
Shame that's the lesson.
Speaker 6 (54:32):
Don't King Prawn Shame Don't.
Speaker 4 (54:34):
King Prawn Shame.
That's the lesson that we'velearned here today.
I feel like we've accomplishedso much in this session.
Speaker 5 (54:40):
This has been like a therapeutic session for everyone
.
Speaker 6 (54:43):
I'm going to get Pepe to come in for the next episode
.
That would be really nice.
Perfect Cool.
All right Well that's going todo it for this week.
Speaker 4 (54:50):
Yes, before we head out, make sure to comment.
Share.
It's an easy thing.
Please just subscribe.
Share it with your peoples.
It's a simple agreement.
We're providing this for you.
You can share it around.
Share it around.
Spread the love.
Yes, do all that.
Speaker 5 (55:06):
Or or you can always help out with fostering or
adopting any of our wonderfulrescues that we discuss on our
Paws for Progress segment.
Speaker 4 (55:14):
Including.
Speaker 5 (55:15):
Ted, including Ted.
Speaker 4 (55:17):
Right, yes, that's it .
My mission is to pimp Ted to agood home.
Speaker 5 (55:20):
We got to pimp Ted out.
You guys are going to see hiscute little face, that's right.
Speaker 4 (55:23):
All right, sonics.
Speaker 5 (55:24):
Love.
Speaker 4 (55:25):
Action Progress.
See you guys next week.
Bye, Slap Network Production.
It's written and produced byRick Vario-Dill and Asia Nakia.
Our senior producer is BreeCorey, Audio and video editing
by Asher Freidberg and BreeCorey and studio facilities
provided by Slap Studios LA and360 Pod Studios.
(55:46):
If you're into online powerscrolling, like we are, don't
forget to follow Slap the Poweron Instagram, Twitter, TikTok,
YouTube and probably Pinterestsoon for access to full episodes
, bonus content and more.
And if you're as full of hottakes and crazy ideas as we are,
please think about dropping usa review to help boost this
episode.
And you can help blow up thegroup chat by sharing with
friends, family or random shitposters on the internet you want
in on the conversation.
(56:07):
And if you're interested inbeing a guest on the show,
please email info at slap thepowercom.
There's so many.
Every country is different.
You can't say it's this or that, but for me, the biggest
challenge is simply gettingaccess to the elephants, because
my only intention is to helpthe elephant.
It's not my fight to say,remove the elephant from the
temple in Sri Lanka or India.
It's a whole other, becausethat's me criticizing religion
now.
Now we've got a whole otherobstacle to deal sure.
(00:23):
It has nothing to do with that.
Speaker 4 (00:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
It's going to a camp somewhere in Thailand, or going
to a camp in India, or going toa camp in Vietnam, and just
wanting to help.
Speaker 4 (00:43):
What we call slap.
Today, the world may not needanother podcast, but it can
definitely use a slap.
Welcome to Slap to Power, theshow that lifts artists who use
their powers for positiveprogress.
I am Rick Barrio-Dill and I'mAsia.
Speaker 5 (01:00):
Nakia On the show today.
We touch base on Paws forProgress with our recent
adoption event and newest rescue, Ted, who was spared just seven
minutes before his euthanasiadate yes, Seven minutes.
And then we're also going totalk about our heroic
anti-whaling activist, PaulWatson, who was just released
from jail in Greenland.
Speaker 4 (01:20):
That's right and you know, of course we have to talk
about Steve Bannon, as he ofcourse floats day Donald Trump
running for president in 2028.
Speaker 5 (01:28):
Of course, and can New York City's traffic cameras
also be used for personal selfiestudios?
Speaker 4 (01:35):
Yeah, this story is incredible and our amazing,
amazing interview is withzoologist and friend to the
elephant, Stephen Coyle,discussing his life-saving work
with the Elephant Care UnchainedFoundation around the globe.
Speaker 5 (01:48):
Yes, and then we're going to talk about musicians
buying seats for cellos onplanes.
I mean, have you ever had tobuy a seat for an instrument?
I got a couple of stories aboutinstruments on a plane when we
get to that.
I want to hear some more aboutthat.
Speaker 4 (02:02):
That's right.
And last but not least, ourresident Gen Zer Asher is here
again for another segment ofMake this Ish Make Sense.
Speaker 5 (02:10):
But first we are going to talk about Paws for
Progress.
We had a very nice adoptionevent this past week.
Great turnout.
We didn't have any adoptions,which we don't usually expect
like a full-on adoption from anadoption event, even though that
would sound like that's whatit's for right but we got a lot
of interest and our sweet littleaddy, our little girl with the
cherry eyes, she just got a new,foster, um.
So you know, overall supersuccess.
(02:32):
You know, getting our names outthere, getting the doggies out
there, yeah so, yeah, it wasgood.
And then we did take on a newrescue this week.
Speaker 4 (02:39):
His name is ted and great name for a dog, let's be
honest, I I love names like thatsame for dogs, same yeah so so
little.
Speaker 5 (02:47):
Ted was facing his final hour and I actually got
contacted at 3 17 and hiseuthanasia date and time was 3
30 pm and I was like on thefence, I mean I I was emailing,
we were calling, we were reallytrying Last minute foster came
(03:08):
in, everyone was pledging forthis dog to be rescued and then
we weren't hearing back and itwas like 3.23.
We're like down to the wirelooking every minute, minute by
minute.
Finally they responded like3.27.
Then they were like, oh, canyou be here by 3.30 to pick him
up?
And we're like, no, no, pleaseextend this.
(03:28):
But we did save the dog's lifeby three minutes.
So, oh, my God, yeah we werejust going a little bit of back
and forth at the shelters.
But you know I mean.
His life is just so differentnow.
You know I'm seeing his photoin, you know, his kennel to now,
like we have this really cutephoto which we'll post, with his
(03:52):
little reindeer ears and he'sjust enjoying his life and it's
like, within seven minutes, sucha different story for this kid,
you know.
Speaker 4 (03:58):
Yes.
Speaker 5 (03:59):
Ted, yeah, all right, did you hear about Paul Watson
and Sea Shepherd's like biggestnotorious whale activist?
He just got out of jail.
Wait, wait, what this?
Okay, so I have known about SeaShepherd since I don't know.
I was like five years old.
I've always been obsessed withthem.
They are like combating whalekillings, like all over the
(04:22):
world.
They work especially in Japanand Antarctica and they're an
anti-whaling nonprofitorganization doing absolutely
amazing work.
I have had the honor andprivilege of actually doing some
work with them in the past.
We did a whole stint in Bahamasfor Hurricane Dorian, where we
brought back on the Sea Shepherdvessel this huge, massive
(04:43):
research vessel that they havewe brought back dogs and cats
from the Bahamas after HurricaneDorian on the Sea Shepherd
vessel, this huge, massiveresearch vessel that they have,
we brought back dogs and catsfrom the Bahamas after Hurricane
Dorian and it was like thecoolest experience ever, like
everybody.
You know all the what do youcall people that work on the
crew.
Speaker 4 (04:58):
On the boats.
Speaker 5 (04:59):
Yeah, but yeah, I mean.
So he was actually arrested onsome old charges back from 2012
by the Japanese government forcausing injury to one of their
workers and damage to one oftheir boats.
Speaker 4 (05:13):
So not for whaling.
Speaker 5 (05:15):
Not for whaling, no, but he's fighting against the
whalers.
Speaker 3 (05:19):
Yeah, sure, so.
Speaker 5 (05:20):
Sea Shepherd is out there in the middle of the,
literally trying to track downboats and end whaling.
Speaker 4 (05:26):
I should say that again, not for his vigilante
work as an anti-whaler.
Speaker 5 (05:32):
Well, yes, but Japan is mad because he's interrupting
their whaling.
So they find him guilty forsomething else, so they find him
guilty and he was in jail forfive months, which was just
crazy.
We couldn't believe it.
And then he was supposed to beextradited to japan for a
15-year sentence.
(05:52):
So this was like big news inthe animal rescue community.
We were all like freaking out.
We all are huge fans of paulyeah very like amazing, amazing
human being, um.
But yeah, so he got released,which has been like such great
news, and now the anti-whalingcontinues.
Speaker 4 (06:04):
Look at that, yeah two stories off the top that are
good.
Nice, positive palate cleanserscome on.
That's great, that's reallygreat.
Well, uh, I'm gonna end thatright now.
I'm gonna stop the good news.
Speaker 5 (06:16):
Yeah, yeah, all right , let me take a sip.
Speaker 4 (06:18):
I'm ready, I'm ready the 22nd amendment of our
Constitution clearly states thatno person shall be elected to
office of the president morethan twice.
Now who here, in a show ofhands, who here, thinks that the
president-elect is going toobey that four years from now?
Speaker 5 (06:39):
The room is silent, everyone there are no hands in
the air for those of us who arejust listening everyone there
are no hands in the air.
Speaker 4 (06:45):
For those of us who are just listening, the funny
thing is is like I was like, oh,how long is it going to take,
once he gets elected, for theystart floating it and softening
the ground so that the peoplestart having this discussion and
stuff like that?
And it's, he's not even in anoffice yet, and, of course, of
course is goon steve bannon uh,put out the suggestion, of
course, and it came from him.
And then, uh, you know, they'regonna test the feasibility and
(07:05):
legality of such a move.
While some view this as astrategic play to keep trump's
political influence alive,others see it as a direct
challenge to constitutionalnorms.
So, yeah, you don't think?
Yeah, uh, but as the wholelandscape kind of continues to
evolve, this definitely adds aninteresting thing, because he's
(07:25):
just going to push on this opendoor.
And how are we going to reactto it?
We're going to have to see.
But it didn't take long, no,and it's in the it's in the it's
in the sphere of discussion.
Speaker 5 (07:37):
So where does the line get drawn?
Like I'm waiting to see wherethe where the line is?
There's no line, it's an.
The line is no, no, no, there'sno line, it's gone.
It's gone, it's an imaginaryline.
Now, what are amendments andlaws?
Speaker 4 (07:48):
There was a line and he was in the union, okay, there
was a line and he was in aunion worker, okay, and he got
let go.
And so now he's at home on thatsweet, sweet gummit cheese,
right.
And meanwhile somebody's aboutto be plowing over with no lines
, no lines out there for foritself.
It's gonna be good times, it'sgonna be fun times coming up.
Speaker 5 (08:09):
Yeah, well, you know, in in, you know, for the sheer
sake of chaos, yeah, um, we'llgo into talking about this
artist, maury coleman, who did atraffic cam photo booth project
which gave surveillance a verycheeky twist.
So this is this is a reallyinteresting story.
I I want to hear your take onthis all right, lay it on me.
Speaker 4 (08:29):
I yeah, I saw it in the in the breakdown and I was
like I yeah, no, I have thoughts.
Speaker 5 (08:34):
I mean, it's just one of those things we're in like I
just go straight to like thisselfie world that we're in, and
then I also go into ai, and thenI also go into like
surveillance rights and and thecombination of all of those
things and how this artist isusing the traffic the traffic
booth as a source for his artand then he got sent.
Speaker 4 (08:55):
So, for those who don't know, he's an artist in in
New York, right?
Yep, yeah, and he basically hasbeen using the street cam as as
kind of hey, let me have funwith this on the, on the selfie
cam, and the city was like yeah,nah, and they sent him a, they
sent him a cease and desistorder, which he wasn't really
hurting anything but New York,you know, whatever.
Uh, and so what he did is hetook the cease and desist letter
(09:18):
and put it on a 15foot pole andheld it in front of the traffic
cam which I got to give himprops.
Speaker 5 (09:26):
It's bold, it's bold.
Speaker 4 (09:28):
Respect.
Speaker 5 (09:28):
And then, I think, his art made it into a Miami art
show.
He brought the art to Miami foran art show or something,
because—.
Speaker 4 (09:35):
So yeah, I think he was collecting images on what he
was doing on the selfie showbefore they gave him the cease
and desist letter yeah, yeahyeah, so he was turning it into
art and that's really cool.
It is.
I like it.
Let's see what he's going to do.
If he's just going to, let'ssee where this standoff goes.
I'm curious you heard it herefirst and we're going to keep
you posted.
Speaker 5 (09:52):
This is literally like for me.
This is when people ask like,what is the definition of modern
art?
Hey, this would be yes, yes,this is the definition of modern
art.
So we'll see what happens.
Speaker 4 (10:03):
We'll see what happens.
All right, I am so excited.
Coming up after the break,we're going to have our
interview here in studio withthe Elephant Care Unchained
Stephen Coyle.
Speaker 3 (10:15):
Yes, gambling is part of the culture of America,
since even before we wereAmerica.
I'm Norman Chad.
I know gambling.
I've played blackjack and poker.
I've bet sports and horse races.
I've even hit the slot machinesat a Pahrump Nevada 7-Eleven.
You say gambling, I sayGambling Mad.
(10:35):
So join me on Gambling Mad withNorman Chad wherever you find
your podcasts.
Follow us on socials atGambling Mad Show or at Gambling
Mad Norman Chad at YouTube.
Speaker 4 (10:48):
Joining us in studio today.
We are honored to have SteveCoyle from the Elephant Care
Unchained.
They're dedicated toeliminating cruelty and
improving elephant welfare intheir native countries.
Welcome to Slap the Power,steve.
Thank you for being here.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
Thank you for having me.
Thank you for having me.
It's a pleasure.
It's a pleasure to be here.
Speaker 4 (11:06):
It's funny because you we were right before we
started recording.
You said I'll talk aboutelephants forever, and you know
what's great is?
They're magical in a way that Ifeel warrants that kind of a
comment, and we have a lot offriends that have hipped me to
just the tip of the iceberg onhow dope elephants are.
(11:27):
So, in addition to your workhelping the elephants, please
set up what set your love forelephants into motion.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
Well, I spent right now it would be 23 years working
for elephants.
That's what I say.
I got my career with elephantsat the Phoenix Zoo in Arizona,
arizona um, never really wantedto work in a zoo, but I knew I
wanted to work with animals andso, and doing you know I still I
was living here in californiatraining dogs for two years
prior to taking a job in phoenix.
Um, anyway, um, I've alwayssaid that elephants are
(12:01):
incredibly soulful, you know,and either you are an elephant
person or you're not an elephantperson.
In my experience, when talkingto zookeepers, you know
something oh, I'm so scared ofelephants because they're so big
and scary, you know, and theydo hurt people, they do kill
people, right, so they are.
But when you spend time withthem and you see them and they
know exactly what's going on,but they look nothing like us,
(12:22):
you know, but, but they looknothing like us.
But they're incrediblysophisticated, incredibly
intelligent, just the greatestthing on the planet.
Speaker 4 (12:39):
And so over these past 23 years, I've dedicated my
life trying to do everything Ican to help them in any way that
I can.
How did you get into morespecifically eliminating cruelty
and and specifically, welfare,because it's one thing to be on
the zoo side, I would imagineright where that's maintenance
and yeah yep, what is?
What?
What sort of drew you to thisincredible work?
Speaker 1 (12:56):
um, well, I was at the zoo for 14 and a half years
total, but after 10 years, andevery time I would, I would take
a vacation like I've been tothe la zoo, I've been to all the
zoos all around because it'sjust getting research and
gaining knowledge and trying toimprove, uh, the the lives of
the elephants that I cared forat the zoo.
Sure, um, and so eventually Iactually borrowed money from my
(13:18):
retirement at the zoo, because,you know, the zoo pays a lot of
money.
Yeah, so I I couldn't go toindia, but I wanted to go to
india, and so I met some, somepeople who had a place in india.
So I borrowed money out of myretirement fund, okay, and spent
a month in india and then wasin awe in a bad way, okay, uh,
because we have these fantasiesabout, oh, these elephants are,
(13:40):
they love, their love, they'recared for.
It's amazing.
And then you go there andyou're like what, what fucking
planet am I on?
This is crazy.
So I spent time with thisorganization and I showed them
things with the elephants.
I said, okay, let's not hitthem, let's get some food, let's
be compassionate.
How do we teach compassion?
We'll get into that in a minute.
But that's the million dollarquestion.
(14:00):
Yeah, compassion.
And a million dollar question,yeah, compassion.
And so, and the elephants?
The elephants are amazing.
They always come through foryou.
Yeah, give them a pile of dirt,they'll lay in the dirt,
they'll dust.
They do what they do, you know,like any animals, you give them
the proper environment to behealthy and flourish.
We step back and enjoy that.
Yeah, and so that was the whole.
That's what changed my wholemindset.
I always felt bad for theelephants at the zoo, but then
(14:22):
you go to see the the oppositeend of the spectrum, like, wow,
well, the zoo is kind of likedisneyland, yeah, you know,
compared to these elephants onfour leg chains, bleeding,
getting hit every day and allthese other things that I
witnessed and can continue towitness, unfortunately their
consciousness.
Speaker 4 (14:37):
You know, I'm sure that's and just I.
I grew up in tampa and so we.
We had bush gardens.
It was kind of like right whenI went to school there and they
would have elephants and thatwas really my only experience
would be in the little thingkind of next to them, but
there's, unlike any other sortof animal and I think even
humans almost Like there'ssomething when you look an
(14:58):
elephant in the eye that justdoes not.
Speaker 1 (14:59):
If humans were better beings, they'd be elephants.
Speaker 4 (15:03):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I concur, I mean were
better beings, yeah, they'd beelephants.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I, yeah, Ican, I mean honest to god.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
I mean yeah they're too good of a species and we
frankly don't deserve them, andwe sure as hell don't uh deserve
to be treating them the way wedo no, they're, they're almost
like your, like spiritual, likegrandmother, like there's this,
like very this aura about themwhere I just want to like bow my
head and just sit, like I meanliterally my favorite thing to
(15:28):
do.
Speaker 5 (15:28):
I mean I can watch many different species all day,
but there's something about likesitting at the watering hole
like I can you, you literallyhave to like pull me away from
watching elephants.
I can sit there all day longand watch elephants.
They're one of my favoritespecies, they're one of my
favorite soul animals.
There's just, yeah, there'ssomething about them, and for me
(15:49):
to even picture someone beingable to cause harm towards this
soulful, spiritual, grandmother,indigenous-type vibe animal
that just brings so much respect, I mean they literally are
foresting the planet all day.
I mean they have such animportant role, they're a
keystone species and you knowfor dummies like me, what's a
(16:13):
keystone species?
Speaker 1 (16:14):
yeah, tell us, steve.
They basically support theecosystem that they're in, so
like even everything from theirpoop.
Dung beetles roll up, theydisperse seeds.
Elephants only absorb about 40%of the food they eat, so when
they go to the bathroom, thosethe rest of it is used by
everybody else, exactly, andthey only eat the best of the
(16:35):
plants.
Speaker 5 (16:35):
So you know you're getting just constant like
reforestation activity withelephants Uprooting trees.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
Other animals get to trees, they uproot, they do
different things.
Yeah, it's like the sharks ofthe ocean you know we need
sharks.
Speaker 5 (16:48):
Sharks are a huge indicator species of
biodiversity and of health ofthe ocean.
So we, in like biology andzoology, you know, we use these
key indicator species to sort ofassess the health of an
environment.
Speaker 4 (17:02):
And so you from India take me.
So that, was that really theimpetus.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
Well, like so I was all you know.
I always had a loud mouth and Ialways was outspoken at the zoo
.
That's why we like each other.
On behalf of the elephants.
It wasn't like the zoo isterrible, fuck the zoo.
Yeah yeah was like we can domore, let's be better.
We need to be better.
Let's you know that's.
I'm spending time in indifferent zoos in southeast asia
right now doing doing the same,having the same talks like,
(17:28):
yeah, this is unacceptable yeahthis is not what an elephant is
yeah you know, can we at leastchain them?
instead of four chains, can wejust chain them on one chain in
a tree to a tree over there,instead of this concrete box
that they're in?
Yeah yeah right um, and so whatwas?
I didn't know oh, india oh soindia?
I was like, wow, this is crazy.
So then I went back to the zooand you know we were talking
(17:51):
about expanding the facility andit was always like some little
nickel and dime.
It wasn't, it was.
I said, why can't we do this,why don't we do this?
Why don't we have theorangutans climb across, you
know, you know, across above theelephants, and why don't you?
Why we're better than this, whycan't we just do these things?
So you know, I fight, fight,fight, and I continued to go to
India like once a year, and thenI went like every six months
(18:13):
for a couple of times, and thenthe zoo fired me, not because I
went to India, but because of myoutspokenness, if I you know,
I'm okay with it, because myintention was never to hurt the
zoo or sabotage the zoo.
It was to fight for theelephants and that was the
decision that the zoo made,which is where elephant care,
unchained, comes from.
Uh, I'm unchained to help theelephants, yeah, right.
(18:37):
So, yes, it's unchainedelephants, but in southeast asia
that's not always, uh, anoption, because you have to
build these things for theseanimals.
It's just different ways to dothings.
And so, being free from the zoonow, because I knew I would
never leave the elephants at thezoo, because you know, I love
them to death.
Only one is still alive.
And they inspired me and I wasnever going to leave.
(19:00):
I remember, you know, raking thepoop up in the yard every
morning.
Oh, you know, those elephantsin India, god it's terrible.
And these other places it's sobad, I don't know.
I mean, you guys are good here,you guys are doing good with
the elephants, I don't know.
And one of my coworkers, mygood friend, she, says well,
could you ever leave them?
Talking about the elephants,and I says no.
So the zoo made the decisionfor me, which allowed me now to
(19:25):
be in eight different countries,to continue to have
conversations as my phone isblowing up now.
Talk to Indonesia or Vietnam orthings I would never have done.
Speaker 4 (19:38):
So now I have a huge opportunity because of those
elephants at the zoo and, Iwould imagine, because of your
sort of pedigree at that point.
That's why the other zoos andthe other sort of sanctuaries
and places around the worldprobably.
How did you get such a networkso fast?
Speaker 1 (19:54):
Well, I think integrity is number one and I
think work is number two.
Well, work is probably one andthen integrity is second.
My work kind of speaks foritself.
You know I have a good resume,if you will.
So when I go to places theyhave no idea who I am, what I'm
talking about, think I'm full ofshit.
What does Whitey from the Westknow about elephants?
(20:17):
They don't even have elephants.
What is he a zookeeper?
They don't even have elephantsin their country.
Speaker 4 (20:20):
We've got to work on that branding the Whitey from
the whitey from the west.
Speaker 1 (20:25):
It's just, you know, workshop that a little bit but
this is what this is as I speak,but this is, but this is what
they feel right and so I'm like,okay, well, that's okay, I get
it.
I don't.
And if you get, ever knows, Inever publicly criticize on
social media, I never say blah,blah, blah, because you have to
work with these cultures, youknow sure and so you have to
convince them that number one,you know what you're talking
(20:46):
about.
So I walk around with my littletablet and I'll say how about
this, how about this, how aboutthis?
And they don't really evenstill get it at that point.
And so you constantly have totry to fight and I have people
in different countries that willcontact me and say let's go
here, let's go here.
You hey, let's go here, let'sgo here.
Unfortunately, the governmentis involved in a lot of these
countries and a lot of theseplaces.
(21:06):
Our government, or you mean the?
Speaker 4 (21:08):
local governments, the local governments, the
country, yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
The native governments.
Speaker 4 (21:12):
What's your biggest challenge right now?
Country-wise.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
There's so many.
Every country is different.
You can't say it's this or that.
But for me, the biggestchallenge is simply getting
access to the elephants, becausemy, my only intention is to
help the elephant.
It's not my fight to say,remove the elephant from the
temple in Sri Lanka or India,it's a.
It's a whole nother, becausethat's me criticizing religion
now.
Now we've got a whole notherobstacle to come across.
(21:40):
Has nothing.
It's going to a camp somewhereIn Thailand, or going to a camp
in India, or going to a camp inVietnam and just wanting to help
.
But they always think there'ssome sort of angle.
I don't ask them for money.
That's why I have to getdonations, because if I ask them
for money, this guy's justtrying to.
Speaker 4 (21:55):
You're never going to get money.
You really are whitey from thewest.
Speaker 1 (21:59):
I've actually been to places and spent my own money
to Buy enrichment things andthings like these and you know,
buy things to help the elephantsand then would talk about it on
social media and then theywould say this guy's using our
elephants to make money, eventhough I paid the money to do it
and you're just like what.
(22:20):
You know so many stories.
Yeah, when you're coming.
We can pick a country.
We can go into any rabbit holewe would like, but there's just
so much to do For me.
I just want to help.
Speaker 5 (22:30):
Yeah, I just want to help, I mean.
Something that I think of, toois we just had legislation
passed in Ojai, california,where elephants are now given
personhood.
Shout out to Ojai yeah, ojai isis so next level and it's funny
cause I got to go visit thereand there is such a next level
(22:51):
vibe about it that I love.
But on the legislation part, Imean, what is your, you know,
involvement or take on assistingon the government side of
changing the laws in thesecountries?
Speaker 1 (23:03):
Well, I put my whatever I'm allowed to do.
I do like I'm literally havingconversations with india and
indonesia.
Uh, indonesia is kind of hotright now but, um, as far as I'm
going to contact the governmentof the forest departments and,
uh, I'm going to send them aletter from my observations of a
place and say this isunacceptable.
(23:24):
You're better than this.
I would like to help you maketheir elephants' lives better
without publicly shaming them.
Right, because that's a hugething In India.
Me and my Indian brother, wetook our whole road trip around
this entire state.
I don't want to be too specific, but and we saw all the
(23:45):
elephants- in that entire stateand of the state inside India.
Speaker 4 (23:49):
Inside India, yes, inside India, a particular state
going, going into templestrying to find elephants.
Speaker 1 (23:56):
You know not, there's elephants over there.
It's not there waiting daystrying to find you know they're
all moved secretly illegally,but waiting days trying to find.
You know they're all movedsecretly illegally but nobody
follows up, nobody knows.
And so what we did?
We went there, you know, withdonated money.
We took these road trips, wedrove all around in his personal
vehicle, we drove and submitteda 10-page report about all the
(24:21):
elephants and ourrecommendations of what should
happen with all these elephantsthat are in these temples and
these different places, which islooking like Indonesia is going
to be the same thing.
So I did my part.
And another funny thing is thatwe say you know white of way,
in a sense.
Speaker 5 (24:39):
I mean, but there are some advantages.
Speaker 1 (24:42):
If I'm sitting in an office in another country, I'm
going to get a little bit moreattention.
I'm not by myself granted, butthere's going to be some more
attention as to why is this guyhere, as opposed to.
They might just step over mybuddy who spent hours, days both
of my guys in Indonesia, samething.
Speaker 5 (24:58):
A friend of mine made a point to me one day and it
really hit me one day and itreally like it really hit me.
Um, he said he's, he's aNigerian man and um, we've
worked together on some povertyissues and and throughout Africa
.
And he said to me he's likeAsia, he's like you're just
white enough for Africa, butyou're not black enough for
(25:22):
America, no for America Right.
Speaker 3 (25:30):
And it was like oh, and it like hit me to my core
and he's so right because I amable to move around Africa as a
continent we all.
Speaker 5 (25:37):
Just, I always hate when I say Africa because I want
everyone to know that it is acontinent with many countries in
it, but I work in too manycountries to reference all of
them in one sentence.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
So Africa is what I'm saying.
Speaker 5 (25:49):
But you know, it does give you this edge, I mean,
people will listen.
Speaker 3 (25:55):
It gives you a second look.
Speaker 5 (25:56):
It gives you a second look.
I've been able to get in theroom.
I've been able to get inconversations that a lot of my
team, my, you know, my sistersand brothers in Africa are not
able to do.
But then you come here and youtry to talk about, you know,
racism issues and things, andthen you're not enough to be in
the room you know, and it wasjust so.
it was so interesting, but it'salso why I'm literally busting
(26:18):
my butt to get a PhD, becauseyou know as much as I know, when
you have a doctorate and you'removing around in developing
countries, not only do you get asecond look, you get a first
look, and then on top of that,you get to actually make some
things happen.
Speaker 1 (26:35):
So, I'm doing my best so that I can travel around
with this doctor's title whenyou go there, do you say no, let
me show you what is possibleand you have all of your
experience, so that they're likeokay.
As opposed to you say no, letme show you what is possible and
you have all of your experience, yes, so that they're like okay
, that is, as opposed to justwaving your finger at them,
right.
Right, I don't have aveterinary degree, but I teach a
lot of vets foot care.
Speaker 5 (26:54):
Same.
Speaker 1 (26:54):
I teach a lot of vets how to take care of elephants'
feet.
It started at the zoo.
We had an elephant there whohad a kind of grew inward so she
developed abscesses on her feetbecause they didn't move
normally naturally, so they hadabnormal pressure.
So when I say elephant footabscess, to simplify the term
for everybody listening, it'sbasically a bruise that forms
(27:19):
inside the foot from abnormalpressure and so that pressure
builds up over time and thenruptures and when that ruptures
and we're talking 20, 30 yearsof this being chained on
concrete.
Speaker 4 (27:30):
So it's kind of like if you go like this to your nail
yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:34):
Well, if you keep doing this to your nail, well
what happens?
Well, that's going to bruise,right, and then the nail is
going to fall off, then it'sgoing to go into your bone and
then you've got all kinds ofissues, right?
Yeah, osteomyelitis is what wecall it with elephants.
So the idea is, what you wantto do?
Is you kind of want to dosomething like that?
So it's still vascular, so youtake the pressure off the nails.
It's a whole thing behind ityeah, yeah.
But basically elephants that arekept in terrible environments
(27:55):
over many, many, many years.
You know about age 25, 20, 25,30.
Like us, the body starts tobreak down.
So every terrible place thatthey've been in or continue to
be in starts to show signs.
So I can go and look atelephant feet and say the
elephant lays down on theconcrete every night, mostly on
(28:18):
the left side, yeah, blah, blah,blah, blah.
Or yeah, those abscesses formbecause she's chained and she
can't move so she's swaying, soconstantly going like this for
years, right, and it's.
Speaker 5 (28:31):
and it's interesting because, you know, sometimes you
have to flip the the discourseof the conversation to something
like you know, I was dealingwith a situation in botswana
with the herd dogs and they wereso mistreated, so abused, so
thin, not being fed, but thenthey were expected to go out
(28:52):
every day and fight the lionsand hyenas off.
And I knew that I wasn't goingto get them to care about the
dogs, but if I could get them tocare about keeping their pack
of dogs alive, so that they cankeep their cattle alive and they
don't have as many kills, thenyou can start to have a
conversation.
So it's the same with that.
You know, in this situationwith the elephants, I feel like
(29:14):
if you can get them tounderstand that you're going to
to us.
we don't care If you take bettercare of these animals' feet,
then you're going to get moreyears out of them, which is not
what we ever want.
We want them free in the jungledoing what they want to do.
But sometimes you have to cometo this middle ground where
you're like at least I can maketheir life better for the next
(29:34):
10 years, while they are a slavestuck in this captivity
situation.
But you have to know that andyou have to be able to talk that
language and lingo to thepeople that you're working with,
because you have to understandthat not everyone has the same
heart, not everyone has the sameintentions for these animals so
what is this, this, this, ifthey're in captivity, what is it
(29:54):
for?
Speaker 4 (29:54):
because I know for, as somebody again, kind of
really really being on theoutside and shout out to my
friend dennis.
Uh, shout out to dennis becausehe lives in thailand and spends
a lot of time at the elephantsanctuaries there and stuff like
that.
He's obsessed.
But the tusk issue was thething.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
Right, it was like that, that's more Africans.
Speaker 4 (30:13):
That's Africa.
Speaker 1 (30:14):
That's poaching Okay.
Speaker 4 (30:17):
So on the slavery, but on the slavery side of
things are why you would hold on.
Speaker 1 (30:21):
Why you would have an elephant in slavery.
Speaker 4 (30:22):
Yeah, quote unquote.
Speaker 1 (30:23):
Well, again, we pick a country we can have the
arguments so.
Thailand.
We just mentioned Thailand.
That's all tourism stuff.
All those elephants used to bebasically logging working
elephants.
Then they banned logging andpeople had their elephants.
And now what do you do withthem?
Speaker 5 (30:43):
So now they're painting pictures riding
tricycles, getting hugs andkisses from people doing all the
things.
Exploitive tourism is one ofthe biggest issues we face in
wildlife across the planet rightnow.
Speaker 4 (30:50):
Okay, fair question.
Speaker 1 (30:53):
I think it's amazing that there's Hold on, hold on,
hold on.
Speaker 4 (30:57):
If an elephant paints something and then they sell
the paintings to help for thesanctuary as somebody who
doesn't know, it looks on thesurface like oh, hey, wow, this
is really cool.
Speaker 1 (31:10):
It looks cute.
Yeah, it looks cute.
Speaker 3 (31:12):
You're giving money that's supposed to help, but I
have a nail in my hand righthere, yeah I'm coaching you and
telling you how to paint thatpicture.
Speaker 5 (31:18):
Okay a lot of these are forced behaviors, so what
you're not when you're notseeing, because we've got so
many different tourism avenuesfor elephants which you can talk
about this.
But this is like.
This is my thing is thisvolunteerism, all of these you
know exploitive ways that we,you know these countries, are
bringing in money for tourism by, you know, appealing to people
(31:38):
being able to hug and take aphoto with an animal?
This is something that ishappening.
Tigers disgusting Tigers, Imean the tigers are literally
drugged and then they're soldoff for canned hunting after.
I mean, these are major issues,but I'm glad we're bringing
this up because this is how youcan help.
This is how, when you aresomeone sitting at home in Los
(32:01):
Angeles, in Ohio, and you'remaking travel plans and you're
deciding to go to thesecountries, you can opt out of
these exploitive touristicattractions.
Change the demand.
The shift in the demand wouldallow these animals to be
retired, would allow them to atleast be have an attempt at a
sanctuary.
We're not going to have asanctuary for all of the animals
, but it's a step in the rightdirection.
(32:22):
But if the demand changes,we're not going to be putting
new elephants into sitting ontheir backs for a ride, doing
photos, because they're dealingwith cowhooks and prods and all
kinds of horrible trainingmethods.
I mean the babies, I won't evengo into that.
Speaker 4 (32:38):
So is there a place where it is?
It almost is like um, you knowwhere the the question of dogs.
We, we all love dogs and butthere's there's kind of a a
relationship, there's asymbiotic relationship.
Right, it's like it's just dogsare unconditional love, but at
the same time, we'vedomesticated them right.
(32:59):
Right, they're, they're thenatural part of them would be
hey, let let me take off and goto Griffith Park.
That's where my dog would wantto go, that's correct.
So is there a world, though,where there's a happy medium and
this actually does functioncorrectly, or just nowhere?
Just don't do it anywhere.
Don't do it at Busch Gardens,don't do it in.
Speaker 5 (33:18):
Thailand.
Okay, I'll let you answer, butthen I'm going to go on a rant
answer, but then I'm going to goon a rant.
Speaker 1 (33:22):
Well, the thing is with the elephant-wise.
I've always told people twothings.
One put yourself in theelephant's, put yourself in the
animal's place.
Would you want 30 peoplehugging, kissing you, scrubbing
you?
Speaker 4 (33:34):
down three or four times a day.
Speaker 1 (33:36):
The answer would be no, right.
This is the question I pose toall these places that I visit
and I say look at at this, ifyou were an elephant, would you
want to live here?
Yeah, every one of them tellsme no.
I said then, what are we doing?
We're better than this, sure,right, we are.
And so what I tell people?
I said you change the demand?
Yeah, so I don't tell people toboycott the elephant riding
places.
I say you want to go, go, butyou give them 20 bucks and you
(33:59):
say no, I just want to walk withthe elephant because, those
elephants need food, they needcare, they need money coming in
the door that's what I was gonnasay.
You're just gonna sit back rightand and yes, and whittle away.
The people who own the elephantsare business people.
Yep, they, they just want money.
They don't give a shit, right,they don't give a shit about you
know.
Right, if the elephant can walk, okay we're gonna.
We're gonna walk it till thewheels fall off.
(34:21):
Yep, basically, and that's what.
You changed the demand.
Yeah, I don't think boycottingis the answer.
You changed the demand, yeah,but the problem is so many other
I mean there's Westerners also,but a lot of the natives still
support these things.
So if I go to an elephant showin another country, it's packed
(34:42):
with natives yeah, they love it,yeah, and in another country.
It's packed with natives, theylove it, and I'm like what are
we doing, guys?
So how do you have thatdiscussion?
So that's why you make whateverthis is for the elephant better
or whatever this is for theanimal better, and then you work
on the outside influence tochange the culture.
Speaker 5 (34:59):
And you can shift these things right, like we've
seen circuses shift away from.
You know they're getting thesame, if not more, of an
audience without the animals.
We look at situations because Iworked in circus law for such a
long time and trying to getthese elephants out of ringling
we were so, you know, knee deepin it that you got to see every
(35:21):
day.
You got to see the changes.
But what I loved about that asan example, is that Cirque du
Soleil came about and we see howfamous and you know those shows
are jam-packed.
We're seeing circusestransforming.
No, no these are all human-basedcircuses.
I'll give you an example.
Give people a good show they'regonna go.
Speaker 4 (35:43):
You don't need to exploit an elephant.
Part of the presentation on theCirque du Soleil stuff that
I've been to is they'reprofessing off the back.
The disclaimer is we're puttinga lot of this money into trying
to make the situation better,so presumably I'm not being lied
to there.
Speaker 5 (36:02):
You are being lied to when they say we're taking
money and also and can we talkabout all the lies that Ringling
said about putting all of theelephants into retirement at a
sanctuary.
Speaker 1 (36:11):
I'm not going to go there, but I will go there
there's all kinds of things, butto give you an example, give me
some hope, just to bring itback.
There's in Sri Lanka.
They have this, this festival,it's called the Parahara and
it's an amazing thing.
It's beautiful, people aredancing, drums, fire amazing.
And then they spoil it withthese elephants that are lit up,
(36:33):
walking Real life elephantsspoiled and ruined this amazing
experience.
That's not even necessary to doit right.
But how do you tell somebodythat their entire family that's
all they've ever known, the pairof hair has to have elephants?
So, now we're going to.
Robotic elephants is kind ofthe new trend now which is
happening.
So hopefully that'll grab holdand you know, because India is
(36:54):
starting to put more and morerobotic elephants out there, but
they spoil these amazing thingsby putting these animals in.
Speaker 5 (37:05):
It them to be elephants could be anything.
No, and, and now I mean on thezoo side, I mean looking at the
capabilities of the um virtualreality.
I mean you can create an entireimmersive experience it's an
amazing thing where you're inthe jungle with the elephants,
you know, getting the experiencethat you want, because I, I
think you know this goes back tolike my doctoral work.
I think that you know we havethis to our core.
We want to be connected tonature, right?
(37:25):
And somebody going to take aphoto with an elephant, they're
not thinking, oh, I want toexploit this elephant and hurt
this elephant.
Speaker 1 (37:34):
Elephants are human magnets.
They're a magnet, we crave ityou know, just like our.
Speaker 5 (37:40):
You know circadian rhythm and being grounded and
like we are supposed to be innature.
We're supposed to be connectedwith animals and plants and it
is in our core.
But what we're doing wrong iswe're going about it in the
wrong ways.
We're going about it in a waythat's exploitive, taking away
from the experience of thisother being right To self-serve
ourselves, but there are waysaround that, and I mean
(38:02):
supporting sanctuaries is agreat way to get around that.
But you really have to do yourresearch.
What I would tell people is ifyou are traveling and you can
add to this but if you'relooking for a place that you can
go and see elephants I had anexperience.
I wanted to go check outShildrick Wildlife.
They are an elephant orphanagein Kenya.
They have one hour a day thatpeople are allowed to view the
(38:26):
elephants One hour a day.
You're not going inside andtaking photos with the elephants
in their pen, and these animalshave a free range.
They don't have to come if theydon't want to, but they're
coming and they're doing a mudbath.
It's a fun experience for theelephants.
It's like their party time.
They get to socialize with allthe other groups of babies.
Speaker 4 (38:47):
Plus, their skin looks great.
Speaker 5 (38:49):
Yeah, they're doing their mud bath in.
They're getting extra snacks,all the bottles.
They've created a positiveexperience for the elephants,
but then they go off and dotheir thing.
If you find a sanctuary whereall day long you can find a time
slot, from like 7 am to 5 pm,there is a time slot for you to
takea photo opportunity to, togo pet an elephant, to go stand
with an elephant, give them abath it's probably not the
(39:12):
sanctuary that you want to begoing to.
You want sanctuaries that haveminimal human interaction time,
because then that to me says, ohthey're, they're taking into
account that these animalsaren't exploited all day, but
yes, 100.
Speaker 1 (39:24):
The only issue is that people don't care.
People want their experience.
You know, I've given talks topeople and they still go to
Thailand and ride an elephant.
Speaker 5 (39:30):
I have gotten into arguments, so I failed.
Speaker 1 (39:33):
I failed in not emphasizing those things enough.
It's not.
People love elephants and wecan't help.
People love dogs.
You know, like people, theylove dogs, but they still chain
them up and they keep them in ashitty place.
People love elephants.
We have to be better abouthaving them look at it a
different way.
Speaker 5 (39:53):
It is.
It's really changing theperspective.
They want their experience.
That's the hard part.
They love them.
Speaker 1 (40:01):
They don't mean anything bad by going and
hugging and kissing.
I want to just give my love tothe elephant Meanwhile, it's all
chained up.
Speaker 4 (40:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (40:08):
You get your or it's not.
Chained up, you hug and kiss itand it goes back in and it goes
around a corner and it's on achain this long for the next 18
hours a day.
They don't know that it's nottheir fault, so it's my.
In a sense, it's people who areout there.
Speaker 5 (40:22):
It's us that know.
Speaker 1 (40:24):
We have to educate more People want their
experience.
We have to step back for aminute and think about the
animals that we want ourexperience with.
Speaker 4 (40:31):
Yes, that's a great point.
That's a great way Before welet you go, that's a great way
to think about it.
What is your, what's next foryou?
How can people help and?
Speaker 1 (40:43):
yeah, I am a official 501c3 nonprofit charity.
So if people want to help thecause, help elephants all over
the world.
This is a never-ending.
You know, we're helping todayfor those elephants fighting for
their tomorrows.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4 (40:58):
And so.
Speake (41:00):
Elephantcareunchainedcom .
Yes, you guys can donate.
Check out my YouTube channel.
There's a lot of informationthere.
Really, just spread the wordand step back.
If you're out and about withany animal anywhere in this
world, you step back and thinkabout those animals.
Speaker 4 (41:15):
I think that would be a way to look at it, tell me
about it, and if anybody wantsto get a hold of you directly,
what's the easiest way?
Speaker 1 (41:23):
Email.
You can go to my websiteelephantcareunchainedcom.
Everythingelephantcareunchained is me, so
if there's a message onInstagram, Facebook, anywhere,
I'll respond.
Speaker 4 (41:34):
And lastly, this could be actually this is great.
We'd love to keep checking upwith you and everything.
If you have specific projectsthat you're working on and
everything, would you see uspost I?
Speaker 1 (41:47):
well, aja is on my uh private email list, but there's
actually.
Speaker 5 (41:51):
I'm very up to date.
Speaker 1 (41:52):
There's actually a little buy-in to that one,
because I share a lot ofintimate, behind the scenes not
so nice videos of the journey,um.
So if people want to be a partof that, then you might have to
have a buy-in, just because Ihave to have a safe forum in
order to share these things,because if the things that I
share go public then it's kindof curtains for the work that we
(42:14):
do, because you don't want anybad perception of what is
actually going on, because if Isay something bad, they'll say
we don't want you here anymore.
Speaker 4 (42:22):
Can you do what we do here, which is, we don't talk
about it until we've done it?
Speaker 1 (42:26):
Can you hit us up and be like hey, yo, I just did
this, If you wish like I said,Aja's on the list and so if she
sees something, she'll be likethis is amazing.
Can I talk about it?
I'm always on that line, I'mlike what's going on today.
You know it never ends, sothere's always a new challenge,
there's always another elephantsuffering, unfortunately, and
until those stop, I won't.
Speaker 4 (42:48):
Hey, I will leave it at that.
Thank you so much, Steve Coyle.
All the work you do Pleasure.
Speaker 5 (42:53):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (42:55):
Thank you so much Pleasure.
Speaker 2 (42:59):
Join me Sasha Peters, on Women in the New Season 2,
where we bear it all except forour bodies.
Leave that to your imagination.
My wish for women is that westrip away the fear of judgment
and really embrace the fullspectrum of who we are.
I don't know if you were comingto terms with being pregnant on
the show.
Yeah, I think she was a littledepressed.
Let's live boldly and openlyand change the narratives that
define us.
I called my doctor.
(43:20):
I'm like I want to drive my car.
Speaker 5 (43:31):
Wow, yeah, wow, wow, yeah.
I mean I have known Stephen forquite some time through social
media and we have not gotten tomeet in person, but yet I feel
like we've been such goodfriends for all these years
because of the work that he does.
I mean it's just fascinating,it's soul work.
Speaker 4 (43:48):
He's got a vibe?
Yeah, he's got a vibe, andhaving the vibe next to us, yeah
and I just love the focus onthe animal's feet.
Speaker 5 (43:58):
It's just so important and you don't really
think about that when you thinkof elephant care.
Speaker 4 (44:02):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (44:03):
It was just an amazing interview.
I mean props to all the amazingwork he's doing.
I mean we have his links andeverything if anybody wants to
help.
Speaker 4 (44:09):
But wow, amen, blow it away.
Yeah, he's incredible.
Speaker 5 (44:12):
So now I want to know from a musician standpoint have
you ever had to purchase aninstrument to get on a plane?
A seat for an instrument to geton a plane.
Yes.
Okay, yeah, and what does thatlook like?
Speaker 4 (44:29):
It's frustrating.
I bet.
Yeah and we stopped doing thatafter a while.
It's frustrating, I bet, and westopped doing that after a
while.
On one level it's like you know, nolly, and we all kind of hold
on to certain instruments.
We have a relationship withthem.
Speaker 3 (44:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (44:51):
And at the same time it just became such a pain in
the ass and it became sort ofpot luck.
It was up to who was at thegate.
And that's what's so cool aboutthis story is because even our
instruments I mean, it's toughif you have a $50,000, les Paul
or something like that, Iunderstand like Nolly brings it
with him, brings it in a hardcase, but then it takes up a
good part of the thing.
So if you show up late,sometimes they'll make you check
(45:15):
it at the gate and so then youhave to be there early and
everything like that.
And what's so interesting aboutthis story?
It brought me back Because thisis a $3.5 million, 300-year-old
cello and they bought a seatfor it and they still weren't
(45:36):
allowed, uh, on the plane, andit just feels like how much
harder you're gonna make it forus, you know.
Speaker 5 (45:41):
And the airlines like no one is sitting in that seat
like they already bought theseat.
So what, like?
What is the dilemma?
Air canada, like I need to knowand and I feel, like you know,
like I deal with this stuff onthe dog front, all the time yeah
.
Like always, somebody has aproblem with something at the
gate or you know something withour cargo flights.
But this was just interestingbecause I'm like wow, even
instruments can't get a break ona flight.
Speaker 4 (46:03):
Yeah, it's crazy.
Hopefully I'm not killing thisname, but he's a famed British
cellist, sheku Kenne Mason, andhe had to cancel a sold-out show
in Toronto.
Yeah, that's horrible, and thisis on Air Canada, right, and
because he bought a seat forthis incredible instrument and
yet still couldn't get it on,and apparently you know it's
(46:27):
still, even when they asked himafterwards.
You know, to comment on this.
Like he was saying, this is acommon problem.
Even when you buy a seat webought stuff we we had now a lot
of times in japan what they'lldo is they'll make you buy a
seat for, like inner you.
We won't have to buy it ifyou're going intercontinental,
because we'll check it at acertain point.
(46:48):
We do the instruments check andthen you're crossing your
fingers, hoping it shows upbecause sometimes it doesn't
show up, but, um, moreimportantly, when you're doing
inner flying in within japan, solike if we're going from tokyo
to osaka and having to fly, orsomething like that, instead of
taking the train, uh, they makeus buy, you know, seats for the
instruments and stuff like that.
So, but even when you buy aseat, you should be able to have
(47:09):
it.
Like if people buy seats fortheir dog, they should be able
to have it.
Like if people buy seats fortheir dog, they should be able
to have it.
Speaking of which, I saw a guywith a pit bully on the bus this
morning.
And I was like I did think.
I was like I don't care, I hopehe didn't buy a seat for him.
But because the both of themwere sitting there on the bus, I
was like.
I was like that's cool, did he?
I digress, I digress.
(47:30):
But you know, if you've gotreally, really expensive
instruments, it is.
That's the nerve wracking thingof touring.
It's just like you'reconstantly in a state of I don't
know.
Is this going to make it, or youknow, or is it going to?
Are they going to?
Let me have it on the plane.
Speaker 5 (47:46):
And not everybody can be flying around on private
jets even though that would benice.
Commercial airlines need tofigure figure out a way to,
especially if you're going topay a whole seat.
Yeah, yeah, just to sticksomething there.
Speaker 4 (47:59):
Yeah, there's a lot of times where we got on and
they would count it as one ofour carry-ons.
So shout out to when Americanwas cool with us for a while.
There was a lot of airlines,there was a rule, but I think
they've softened that up overthe last couple of years because
it's just gotten so bad youknow, air travel with everything
, from just everything yeah, no,I mean so, yeah, facts, but
(48:22):
okay, and as promised, and backby popular demand, we bring
another segment of make this ishmake sense with our resident
Gen Z expert, asher Freidberg.
Make this ish make sense, asher.
If we just say Stranger Things,stranger Things, stranger
Things three times and click ourheels, asher will show up.
(48:43):
So are you ready?
Speaker 5 (48:44):
I'm ready.
Speaker 4 (48:45):
Okay, let's do it Ready.
Speaker 5 (48:46):
Stranger Things.
Speaker 4 (48:47):
Stranger.
Speaker 6 (48:48):
Things, Stranger Things.
Speaker 5 (48:50):
Oh.
Speaker 6 (48:51):
Oh, I was about to.
I was a blockbuster, I don'thave to pay now, just sit down
you were at the checkout.
Yeah, I was at the registerabout to go meet my guy.
Speaker 4 (49:01):
Oh, okay nice, nice, it's free now for those that
don't know, that's code for drugdeal.
It's okay, though.
Speaker 5 (49:07):
It's okay, it's okay we never know what this gets
into, okay, so Well done Allright, okay, so I love this
story, I love Muppets, I loveeverything about psychotherapy.
Speaker 4 (49:19):
Tell me.
Speaker 6 (49:20):
So there's this new trend going on on TikTok.
So I don't know if you guys arefamiliar.
Obviously you're familiar withthe Muppets, but there was Pepe
the King Prawn.
Growing up he was my favoriteMuppet.
Speaker 4 (49:30):
He was a funny guy.
Loved him.
Speaker 6 (49:31):
So yes, pepe the King Prawn is a character in the
Muppets.
And there's this new meme goingaround.
It's not even much of a meme,but more of a means of coping.
I'm not going to say this is aGen Z thing.
I think all generations in thepast I would say even 100, 200
years have had ways of copingthrough humor.
You know, it's an easy way tosay the things that are on our
mind sure just jokingly enoughso we don't have to set off
(49:54):
alarms or, you know, make awhole moment really dark and sad
you know, sure.
So the new thing people aredoing is there's this picture of
pepe the frog, pepe the prawn.
There's this new picture ofpepe the prawn going around and
I'm going to show on the screen,and people are just dumping
their all their trauma, all oftheir worst stories on it and
what, what makes it just alittle bit funnier is.
(50:16):
it's playing the Like a Prayerchoir version from Deadpool and
Wolverine, so it's got such adramatic Madonna song playing in
the background, chef's kissWhile you hear these mortifying
stories, so I'm going to shareone with you right now.
So I'm going to do anabbreviated one because these
are long.
Okay, all right.
So this is the story of.
So when it was their first, itwas five minutes in their first
(50:37):
lecture and they were going upon the stage to essentially
introduce themselves and do twotruths and a lie.
So they know we're all veryfamiliar with.
Speaker 4 (50:42):
Sure.
Speaker 6 (50:48):
Only we have it better with and as they were
climbing, they couldn't,essentially avoid being picked
to answer a question.
They were hiding.
It was mandatory participation.
They were zipping their bag,trying to leave.
They're choosing a perfectmoment to leave and the
professor switches off thelights.
This is their chance.
Essentially, they've reachedthe top of the spiral staircase
texting their friend about howthey'd rather fail than get up
and say that they're 21, have adog, dog and their dad invented
(51:21):
the saxophone or some bullshit.
The lights are out.
They're about to leave.
They fall down the spiralstaircase.
Been there, yes.
Essentially.
Then the professor yells someone, help that man, he's hurt
himself.
So every 200 person here, theyare all looking at this person
falling down the spiralstaircase.
A crowd of people gather aroundthem.
They see he's in so much pain,how mortified and the soul
leaving their body.
The lights are all turned on.
They want to take this personto the hospital.
The person insists they're fine, they can carry them back to
the car.
And they actually carry them tothe car and they awkwardly lay
(51:44):
them in the backseat of theirown car.
And when they get home theyimmediately drop the class and
change campuses.
Speaker 4 (51:50):
Okay, I have a lot.
Please start, please.
I got a lot.
Speaker 5 (51:54):
I got a lot.
That was me abbreviating it.
I am like sweating right now.
Yeah, exactly Because this.
Okay, you know what.
I'm not even going to go intowhat I was going to say, but
what I need everyone to do isjust come follow me for one day
of rescue?
Speaker 4 (52:09):
Yeah, exactly, if this is traumatic.
Speaker 5 (52:13):
I don't have enough words.
I don't even understand howanyone would read all of that.
I don't have the time for it.
I'm not a scroller anyways, butfor me to scroll through 10
carousels to talk about a storylike that, where's the humor?
Help me.
Speaker 4 (52:27):
No, it's not.
And what I appreciate is thatthis is somebody's personal
trauma that they're putting outthere in a long carousel.
What I can appreciate is it'snot traumatic, like where is the
trauma on?
And I don't want to soundinsensitive, I really really do
not, but it's making me realizethat trauma is on a spectrum.
(52:50):
It is on such a big spectrum,it's on a spectrum Because go
with you one day in Skid Rowdowntown.
Speaker 5 (52:58):
You want to see trauma every 10 seconds of your
life.
Exactly, I mean.
Speaker 4 (53:01):
And it's interesting though, because I do love the
forum of a Muppet and Madonna,to try to put this kind of in
context, and so you know, inthat respect, that respect it's.
This is somebody's trauma, sorespect, respect to their trauma
respect to your trauma.
But but yeah, on the spectrumwe're not all gonna be like deep
(53:23):
, deep trauma you know,sometimes it's affected you.
Speaker 6 (53:26):
You know we've all had stories that you know aren't
like.
We were in vietnam.
Or you know we were shot in thestreet.
We don't all have those stories, no sure but you know things
are gonna affect people indifferent ways.
You know we were shot in thestreet.
We don't all have those stories, no sure, but you know things
are going to affect people indifferent ways.
You know, for all we know, thisaffected this person positively
when I was like, well, I'vegotten that out of the way.
Speaker 4 (53:40):
Yeah, now you should be confident I called down a
spiral staircase.
Speaker 6 (53:42):
Yeah, but it's also a story worth telling.
As I fell, I fractured my arm.
I didn't get shot or anything,but I was part of all the buses.
Speaker 4 (53:59):
They were all watching me.
That's character building.
It's character building, and soyou should put it over the
prawn and Madonna.
Speaker 6 (54:08):
It's going to be a combination of things that are
silly and some things that arejust weird, or it's going to be
things that are actually dark.
It's about how you want to usethis to express what's going on
with you.
Speaker 5 (54:18):
Or this is how I look like at the end of 2024, which
is probably my favorite.
That's kind of how I'm feelingtoo.
Speaker 6 (54:23):
I think that's the funniest part of it we should
all be King Prawns.
Just for the end of the lasttwo weeks.
Speaker 4 (54:27):
And don't kink King Prawn.
Shame that King Prawn.
Shame that's the lesson.
Speaker 6 (54:32):
Don't King Prawn Shame Don't.
Speaker 4 (54:34):
King Prawn Shame.
That's the lesson that we'velearned here today.
I feel like we've accomplishedso much in this session.
Speaker 5 (54:40):
This has been like a therapeutic session for everyone
.
Speaker 6 (54:43):
I'm going to get Pepe to come in for the next episode
.
That would be really nice.
Perfect Cool.
All right Well that's going todo it for this week.
Speaker 4 (54:50):
Yes, before we head out, make sure to comment.
Share.
It's an easy thing.
Please just subscribe.
Share it with your peoples.
It's a simple agreement.
We're providing this for you.
You can share it around.
Share it around.
Spread the love.
Yes, do all that.
Speaker 5 (55:06):
Or or you can always help out with fostering or
adopting any of our wonderfulrescues that we discuss on our
Paws for Progress segment.
Speaker 4 (55:14):
Including.
Speaker 5 (55:15):
Ted, including Ted.
Speaker 4 (55:17):
Right, yes, that's it .
My mission is to pimp Ted to agood home.
Speaker 5 (55:20):
We got to pimp Ted out.
You guys are going to see hiscute little face, that's right.
Speaker 4 (55:23):
All right, sonics.
Speaker 5 (55:24):
Love.
Speaker 4 (55:25):
Action Progress.
See you guys next week.
Bye, Slap Network Production.
It's written and produced byRick Vario-Dill and Asia Nakia.
Our senior producer is BreeCorey, Audio and video editing
by Asher Freidberg and BreeCorey and studio facilities
provided by Slap Studios LA and360 Pod Studios.
(55:46):
If you're into online powerscrolling, like we are, don't
forget to follow Slap the Poweron Instagram, Twitter, TikTok,
YouTube and probably Pinterestsoon for access to full episodes
, bonus content and more.
And if you're as full of hottakes and crazy ideas as we are,
please think about dropping usa review to help boost this
episode.
And you can help blow up thegroup chat by sharing with
friends, family or random shitposters on the internet you want
in on the conversation.
(56:07):
And if you're interested inbeing a guest on the show,
please email info at slap thepowercom.
Popular Podcasts
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com