September 4, 2024 • 51 mins
One person’s curiosity can change the world! Aarati tells the story of a grade school dropout whose drive to learn how things work resulted in the invention of the microwave oven.
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Episode Transcript
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Arpita (00:10):
Hi everyone.
And welcome back to the SmartTea podcast, where we talk about
the lives of scientists andinnovators who shape our world.
How are you, Aarati?
Happy Friday!
Aarati (00:20):
Yeah, happy Friday, Arpita.
I'm doing pretty well.
Um, I'm tired.
I'm just, it's been a week.
It's been a long week, and I'mso glad we have the three day
weekend coming up.
Arpita (00:31):
Yeah, I am right there with you.
We were supposed to recordyesterday and I frantically
texted Aarati being like, can weplease reschedule?
I've had such a busy week atwork and I was scrambling to
meet a deadline yesterday and Iwas like, there is no way I can
get my act together in the next30 minutes as planned.
(00:53):
So...
Aarati (00:53):
I know how it is.
Arpita (00:54):
But yeah, agree with you.
It has been quite a week.
My only agenda item for the next3 days is to not leave my couch
and I can't
Aarati (01:04):
Good.
Arpita (01:05):
wait.
This year has been so busy.
Um, we have had...eightweddings, uh, including my own,
Aarati (01:14):
Including your own, yeah.
I was gonna say.
Arpita (01:16):
and had just like a ton of travel in between that.
And so it's like, all like,really good things, like, all
really fun things and like, veryexciting things.
But it's just like, I'm just sotired.
Work has been really busy andjust I feel like I'm coming
home.
Unpacking my suitcase and thenlike so quickly after just
(01:37):
pulling my suitcase back out andrepacking it.
Um, Which is like, again, likeit just all really wonderful,
fun things, but also just likeso tiring after a while.
And
Aarati (01:48):
Yeah.
Arpita (01:49):
anyway, so that's where I'm at and I just cannot wait to
Aarati (01:52):
Yes.
Arpita (01:53):
not leave my couch this weekend.
Aarati (01:55):
sounds like a good plan.
I like it.
We have kind of, the oppositething happening where I'm not
going anywhere, but a lot ofpeople are coming to our house.
And so we're like constantlyentertaining.
So like last weekend, uh, myaunt and uncle from Singapore
were here and it was just, Youknow, like how Indian people do
(02:16):
when you have guests over.
It's like, we have to cook allthe food.
Yeah.
We have to clean the wholehouse.
We have to cook all the food.
And, um, right now my room iskind of like the nicest room.
So it's now become the slashguest bedroom room in the house.
So I ended up getting kicked outof my own room so I can sleep on
the couch.
Arpita (02:35):
dear.
I feel like that's like a such aspecific brand of stress too and
it's like there's one thingwhere you're leaving your home,
but there's also this like thisis your space and it's now no
longer your space and then theproduction value of like Indian
families visiting.
You're just like, Oh, this iswhat our house looks like all
the time.
You're just like, Oh, welcome.
It's like, this is what italways looks like.
Aarati (02:58):
Everything.
And then it's even worse,because like, they're in my
bedroom, so I'm like, you know,Okay, my bedroom is always
immaculate.
Yes.
My, it always looks like a hotelroom.
Absolutely.
Arpita (03:09):
There's always mints on the pillows.
Aarati (03:11):
G et the dog smell out of my room.
Arpita (03:14):
Yeah, how is Kyro doing with all the guests?
Aarati (03:16):
Oh, he loves them.
He loves having people over.
It's like his favorite thing inthe world.
It's kind of hard becausesometimes they're a little bit
scared of him because he's sobig, um, and they're just like,
oh, I don't know about this big,scary, German shepherd looking
dog that's coming at me, youknow?
And I'm like, he's coming atwith you with love, like you
(03:36):
gotta just get in there, pethim, and then he'll calm down.
And he's so happy to see gueststhough, and by the end of it.
They're all like reallyimpressed by him.
They're like, Oh, he's so lovingand he's so calm.
And I'm like, yeah, you justgive him a chance.
Arpita (03:54):
He is.
I get that though, if you'relike, not used to dogs, or like,
you haven't spent a lot of timearound dogs, like, he is big and
excited.
he's big.
and he's excited.
So he's like running at you likehello.
I love you be my friend.
Aarati (04:09):
And then when they leave, he's so sad.
He like hangs his head and helooks at you like, are you
seriously abandoning me rightnow?
Like,
Arpita (04:18):
My heart.
Aarati (04:19):
Even if they've been there for only three hours or
something, like, you know, my,my aunt and uncle stayed for a
couple days, but, like, evenguests that stay for three
hours, he's like, is the partyover already?
Oh, man.
So,
Arpita (04:32):
He's like all my friends are leaving.
Aarati (04:34):
yeah, exactly.
So, yeah, he, he loves itthough.
So, um, he's happy witheverything.
He's happy when we have guestsover.
So, he's a pretty chill dog.
Arpita (04:44):
Oh, yeah, he's cutie.
Aarati (04:46):
Yeah, um, in podcast news, I wanted to tell you, we
got our first, like, writtenreview on Apple Podcasts.
Arpita (04:55):
Wait, did we really I did not see this.
Aarati (04:58):
We did! And this is what kicked off my whole, like,
motivational push to get alittle, short video out on,
Tiktok and on YouTube.
So I've started a YouTubechannel, I've started a TikTok
channel for our podcast solelybecause of this review because
it like motivated me so much.
But it's like by somebody namedsmnumber1.
(05:22):
And they gave us five stars.
And they wrote, Albert Hoffmanand Emmy Noether episodes were
great.
Now I'm listening to the firstdinosaur fossil episode.
And I'm pleasantly surprised tohear Auburn mentioned in the
beginning as I grew up in PlacerCounty and absolutely love
Auburn.
Will be sharing with friends.
Arpita (05:42):
Amazing
Aarati (05:43):
and it's highly motivational, so please, if you
listen to this podcast and youlike it, please leave us a
review, we love it.
Arpita (05:49):
I loved it.
It was great news.
And we also got our thousandthdownload, didn't we?
Aarati (05:54):
Yes, we did, yes, we did, a lot of milestones that
we're achieving,
Arpita (05:58):
Big milestones, yeah.
On that note, who are we talkingabout today, Aarati?
Aarati (06:03):
Today we are talking about Percy Spencer who is the
inventor of the microwave.
Arpita (06:11):
Whoa, fun.
I'm excited.
I use my microwave a stupidamount, so I can't wait.
Aarati (06:16):
I know, right?
Me too.
And I was like, I actually don'tknow how microwaves work.
And I know there's a lot ofstuff about, are microwaves
dangerous?
And do they, you know, hurt thenutritional value of food?
And can you get radiation?
And there's all this stuff.
And I'm like, I don't actuallyknow anything about microwaves.
So let's do, Percy Spencer, whoinvented the microwave, and
(06:38):
learn about it a little bit.
Arpita (06:40):
I can't wait.
My husband's favorite cookingmethod is to put it in the
microwave.
Like his, if he's cookingdinner, he is not using the
stove.
He's using the microwave.
Aarati (06:49):
Oh, really?
Like a fully microwaved meal?
Arpita (06:51):
Fully microwaved meal.
He's like microwaved blocks oftofu.
He's microwaved tortillas.
He's microwaved everything.
Aarati (06:59):
I don't know if I told you this, but my grandma's
living with us now.
Arpita (07:02):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Aarati (07:04):
And she's completely the opposite.
She like, she's like, what isthis device?
A microwave?
Like, no, everything must befreshly cooked.
And there's no such thing asmeal prepping with her.
She makes exactly the amount ofportions that, you know, the
family needs.
And if it's not finished by theend of the meal, she's highly
stressed out, like who's goingto finish this old rice or this
Arpita (07:26):
Because it doesn't go in the fridge?
Aarati (07:27):
Yeah, it has to go in the fridge and you have to
microwave it No, just finish itnow while it's fresh.
Arpita (07:34):
This feels like such a,, like, Indian grandma thing to
do, like, extremely, I had thiswe're on a tangent, but this is
related.
I promise.
Um, I knew this guy in collegewho was like, from a very well
off family, and they had a cook,who lived with it or like
whatever.
And this cook would always makehim fresh food every day, and he
(08:00):
never had to like cook.
Put away leftovers or whatever.
Like the end of the meal, wasjust like, he was done and he
would like leave the table andthat would be the end of the
story for him.
And so when he got to college,many of us, you know, we would
go, if we went and got dinner,we would all get takeout boxes
and then take it home to eat,which I'd still do, I just want
to, I just want to like, we donot throw away the food that is
Aarati (08:21):
don't throw away.
Arpita (08:21):
incorrect.
You've never throw away thefood.
Yeah.
You never throw away the food.
You have to take it home, but hewould just leave it.
Ever.
He would like give us hisleftovers and he was of the same
mindset where he basically said,I only eat fresh food and this
will no longer be fresh.
And we were just like, are youjoking?
Aarati (08:39):
you kidding?
Yeah.
Oh my god.
It's like a different taxbracket entirely.
Arpita (08:46):
just like a different, like, like I don't even.
I have a hard time with leavingfood on my plate to go and,
like, if it's still on my plateand I can't finish it, it's
going in the fridge.
Like, that's the only option.
Like, putting it in the trash isnot an option unless it's
actively bad.
Like, it's moldy or like,something like that.
Aarati (09:05):
Yeah, exactly.
I'm the same exact way.
And sometimes I even order foodknowing that I'm not going to be
able to finish it all.
And so that kind of likedictates what I'm going to order
because I'm like, oh, if I getlike a salad or something that
has lettuce in it or somethinglike that.
It's not going to be as good thenext day.
So I'm not going to get thatreheat it in the microwave.
(09:27):
And so it's like, it's a wholeprocess, you know, it's
Arpita (09:30):
Or, or I will like justify the price of something.
So it's like a really big bowlor something is$15.
I'm like, actually, this is only$7.50 because I'm going to eat
it twice.
Aarati (09:40):
Yes, exactly.
Oh my gosh.
Yes.
It's so, it's so true.
Yeah.
The microwave is justindispensable.
Arpita (09:48):
The way that we live our lives.
Yeah.
I can't wait to hear about it.
Aarati (09:52):
Okay.
So, Percy LeBron Spencer, wasborn in Howland, Maine, on July
9th, 1894, Some sources say hewas born on the 19th, but I read
an article by Monica M.
Smith, who wrote a piece for theSmithsonian where she literally
just went through and looked atpublicly available government
(10:13):
records, like military and U.
S.
Census records, and sheconfirmed certain dates and
details about his life.
So if there was ever any, like,discrepancy online about the
dates that things happened, I'mjust going with what she said.
Arpita (10:26):
Yeah.
Aarati (10:28):
Um, so Percy was born to Jasper and Myrtle Spencer, and
he had one older brother calledJohn Alby, who was nicknamed Al.
We don't know a lot about hisparents, because when Percy was
18 months old, his father died,and his mother sent Percy to
live with his aunt and uncle.
I'm not really sure what she didwith Al because it kind of
(10:51):
sounds like their mom basicallyabandoned them both and the two
brothers got separated.
Like, it doesn't sound like theyended up living together.
But they were still very close,even, even though they weren't
living together, they still likestayed in touch and even lived
together as adults at one point.
Arpita (11:07):
Did they get raised by family members?
If the mom left them?
Aarati (11:10):
I'm guessing?
Like, Percy definitely wasraised by his aunt and uncle.
Um, Al, I don't know where hewent.
So I don't know what happened tohim, but it didn't sound like on
based on the research that I wasreading, it didn't sound like
they both went to the aunt anduncle.
It sounded like Al wentsomewhere else, maybe, maybe to
some other family members orfriends or something.
(11:31):
I don't know, but it does soundlike they got, you know,
separated.
a bit.
Arpita (11:35):
Wait, sorry.
What happened to the mom though?
She just, she abandoned them.
Aarati (11:38):
just, yeah, she just bounced.
She was like, okay, bye.
I'm not doing this...
Arpita (11:41):
Okay, and we don't really know what her story is.
Aarati (11:44):
Yeah.
Arpita (11:45):
We don't, we don't really know.
Um, so like that's, that'sbasically all we know about her
parents is that father died andmom said, I'm out.
And so he was basically orphanedwhen he was like 18 months old
or something, so, his Al went onto actually be an inventor
himself.
(12:05):
He invented something called theSpencer disk, which was also
known as a Klixon and basicallyit's a circuit breaker that
switches off the electricitywhen things get too hot inside
of a machine.
So it acted a lot like those, Idon't know if you've played with
those like curved rubber disctoys that you kind of like
(12:27):
flatten or you turn inside outand you put it on a flat surface
and after a few seconds it likeshoots up in the air.
And returns back to its originalposition, and you keep doing
that.
Have you ever played with thoseas a kid?
Is it the thing that you turninside out and then you put it
down and then it pops?
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes, I do know what you'retalking about.
Aarati (12:47):
yeah.
So that's basically, like, whata Klixon is.
It's like a curved disc that'spart of an electric circuit, and
so electricity is runningthrough it, and when it gets too
hot, the disc reverses itscurvature.
Yeah.
And it breaks the electriccurrent, so that the electricity
shuts off.
Arpita (13:03):
That's very simple.
I like that.
Aarati (13:05):
Yeah very simple.
And it was very valuable becauseit helped prevent a lot of
fires.
But, um, Al never became asfamous as his brother, Percy.
But later, Percy's grandson saidthat Percy would always carry a
Klixon in his pocket.
And as soon as someone askedhim, What's in your pocket?
He would whip it out anddemonstrate how it worked.
(13:25):
So, he was like, Yeah, reallyproud of his brother.
Okay, but back to Percy who'sstill a child being brought up
by his aunt and uncle.
When Percy was seven, his uncle,who's basically now his father
figure, also died.
And, this is extremely hard onhis aunt because they were
already poor to begin with.
(13:47):
So Percy started helping with asmany chores as he could and
learned how to chop wood, skin adeer, preserve meat, and many
other like very survival typethings, and he credits this with
helping him develop what hecalled a Yankee mentality of
just like making things worksomehow with whatever he was
(14:09):
able to get his hands on.
Arpita (14:11):
This feels very, this feels like the quintessential
Americana, like pull yourself upby your bootstraps, which for
the record, I not necessarilyagree with, but I just, it does
feel like that.
Aarati (14:22):
It is very much.
It's just like, what do youhave?
How do you put it to the bestpossible use, and survive and
make it happen?
And this was how he was able tocome up with his innovations in
science also later, which wewill see.
So at the age of 12, Percy dropsout of school and he starts
working at a spool mill to makemoney to support him and his
(14:45):
aunt.
So he basically becomes a 5thgrade dropout and he never
formally goes back to school,ever.
Like, that was it.
Arpita (14:54):
Wow.
It's such a difference from alot of the other people we've
talked because even though a lotof other people had similar
upbringings, many of them becamethe generational breakers where
they were the first ones to goto college or the first ones to
become educated or, you know,pave this path.
But it is interesting that henever actually did go back to
(15:15):
school.
So
Aarati (15:15):
Yeah.
He never, yeah, he never got aformal education after that.
He just, and he couldn't, I waslike, what a burden that must
have been to be 12 years old andhave to work full time to
support yourself and your aunt.
L ike, that's crazy to me.
But he was a very intenselycurious person and he was always
(15:38):
trying to figure out how thingsworked.
Arpita (15:40):
Mm hmm.
Aarati (15:41):
And so case in point, four years later when Percy was
16, he learned that a localpaper mill had decided to
install electricity, which wasstill a very new kind of concept
at the time.
So for context, Thomas Edison isstill alive at this time and
working on electricitydistribution and had patented a
system for using electricity asa utility in the 1880s.
(16:05):
But Percy was in this very smalltown so the infrastructure to
have electricity power buildingswas really just being put into
place in many of these smallcities and small towns.
Arpita (16:16):
Hmm.
Aarati (16:17):
But when he heard about this, he became really curious
about it.
He was like fascinated with theidea of electricity.
And so he started learning asmuch as he could about it by
reading about it.
And then he applied to helpinstall the system himself at
the local mill so that he couldget hands on experience.
And despite not even havingcompleted grade school
(16:40):
education, and of course he hadno formal training as an
electrical engineer, he wasstill one of three people chosen
to help install the system.
Arpita (16:49):
When you say install the system, is this circuits and the
wiring?
Aarati (16:54):
Yes.
So, he basically, through a lotof trial and error, helped
install the electricity systemand came out having gained a lot
of first hand knowledge aboutcircuits and electricity.
Arpita (17:09):
Sure.
And then was there, I guess, aplaybook for how this would be
done in general?
Like did, had this been alreadybeing used in other buildings
and then what he had to do inthis situation
Aarati (17:20):
Yeah,
Arpita (17:20):
replicate it to some degree?
Aarati (17:22):
I think to some degree.
Yes, like again, he's like in avery small town So, I I mean
people had been working it outbut it's still a very new
concept like Edison had onlypatented this like 20 years ago.
So it's like the infrastructurenow is slowly being built.
And so I'm sure there were a lotof problems they were still
trying to figure out.
(17:42):
So I think to an extent, yes,they kind of knew what they were
doing, but, maybe notcompletely.
It wasn't like...
Arpita (17:50):
There was a lot of troubleshooting.
Aarati (17:52):
Yeah.
Yeah, so specifically, Percywould have learned about
alternating current or AC, andwe still use AC power today to
power buildings, houses, andappliances because it can easily
travel through transmissionlines.
We get electric energy from themovement or flow of electrons
(18:14):
and in AC current, that flowwill periodically change
directions as the electrons inthe current changes directions.
So I read a really greatmetaphor that helped me
understand this because I waslike, I don't understand
electricity at all.
Like, what are we doing?
Um, so I turned to Reddit as onedoes.
(18:35):
Yeah, and there's a user withthe fantastic handle
toodlesandpoodles.
Arpita (18:41):
That's fantastic.
Aarati (18:42):
Yeah, and they said you can imagine AC power like a
water wheel that you place inthe ocean tide.
And so as the tide comes in, thewater moves in one direction,
and the wheel will turn one way.
And as the tide goes out, allthe water moves in the opposite
direction, and so the wheelturns in the opposite direction.
(19:03):
And so it doesn't matter whichway the wheel is turning.
As long as the water is flowing,the wheel will be turning.
And so it's the same thing withAC power.
As long as the electrons aremoving and flowing the appliance
or the building or whatever willhave power and will be on and
working.
Arpita (19:21):
That's so interesting.
I really like that metaphor.
Aarati (19:23):
Yes, it helps make so much sense.
I was like, ah, got it.
Okay, so the other good thingabout AC power is that we can
easily regulate the voltage.
So a transmission line may havethousands of volts running
through it, but by using atransformer, we can change it to
the standard 120 volts that allour normal house outlets use or
(19:44):
240 volts that all our largeappliances like dishwashers and
washing machines use.
So.
This is probably kind of likethe basics of what Percy learned
installing power at the papermill, and it's going to be
important context for the restof his career.
So, on April 15th, 1912, whenPercy is 18 years old, the world
(20:07):
is stunned by the news that theRMS Titanic...
Arpita (20:09):
Titanic! I knew that.
Aarati (20:11):
The unsinkable ship, yeah, had hit an iceberg and
sank.
Arpita (20:16):
You know, this is such a random story, but the only
reason I know that is because,God knows what year this was,
but April 15th was the day thatI got my learner's permit.
And I remember getting mylearner's permit at the DMV.
And the man at the DMV was like,today is a really inauspicious
day and let's hope that youdon't crash the car.
(20:37):
And I was like, what are youtalking about?
And I was 15.
So I was just like, a child.
And I was like, what are youtalking about?
And he's like, this is the daythat Titanic sank.
So at least like, let's hope youdon't crash the car.
Aarati (20:46):
Oh my god,
Arpita (20:47):
I was shook by this as a young child.
And for some, for now, April15th is burned into my memory as
the day
Aarati (20:55):
my
Arpita (20:55):
sank because of that traumatic memory.
So thank you, whatever your atthe
Aarati (21:00):
you know.
April 15th, yeah, 1912.
Oh my gosh.
Arpita (21:04):
Anyway, carry on.
That's the
Aarati (21:05):
Yes.
Okay.
Yeah, so we learn about theTitanic sinking and Percy again
becomes really curious aboutthis specifically about their
wireless system, their radiowireless system.
The Titanic had a state of theart Marconi wireless radio to
signal other ships and wirelessstations on land, and especially
(21:28):
when it was sinking, it wassending out all these SOS
signals, um, and then after itsank, there was a lot of inquiry
about, like, who responded tothe wireless signals, who was
nearby, could they have gottenthere faster?
Things like that.
So there was a lot of inquiryaround that.
So he became really interestedand part of the reason he became
interested in this is becauseradio waves are a type of
(21:51):
electromagnetic wave.
Arpita (21:52):
Right.
Aarati (21:54):
The idea here is that, okay, we're going to do a little
picturing exercise.
So imagine you have a metal barthat has an AC electric current
running through it.
So if you have that, then theelectrons in the metal bar would
be changing direction andoscillating back and forth
inside the bar, like wementioned earlier.
(22:17):
So just like the ocean tideflowing in and out, these
electrons are moving back andforth and they create an
electric field.
around themselves as they moveback and forth.
And so the direction of theelectric field that they're
generating is changing as theelectrons are moving.
Arpita (22:36):
Okay.
Yeah.
Aarati (22:37):
When you map this out, when you map out these
oscillations and the change inthe direction of the electric
field, you get a sinusoidalshape that's going up and down
at regular intervals.
Arpita (22:49):
That makes sense, because the electrons are
changing directions, which meansthat the field is changing
directions, which
Aarati (22:54):
Yeah,
Arpita (22:55):
you kind of get that
Aarati (22:55):
Yeah, up and down.
Arpita (22:57):
Cartoony wave of something coming out of a radio
tower, which it kind of lookslike, like a ridge, basically.
Aarati (23:04):
Exactly.
Yeah.
So now, suppose you have asecond metal bar that's near the
first metal bar, but it's nottouching it.
It's not part of the circuit andit's not connected to the
electric current.
But it can still feel theeffects of the oscillating
electric field that's beinggenerated by the first bar,
(23:25):
right?
So it's close enough.
So when the electrons in thesecond bar are within an
oscillating electric field, theywill start to oscillate too.
And so effectively what you'vedone is you've transmitted this
oscillating signal throughspace.
And that's basically what aradio signal is.
Arpita (23:48):
so even if there isn't, even if that second bar doesn't
have its own current, it's ableto be influenced, I guess, by
the waves that are coming fromthe first one.
Okay.
And so then it's passing it tothe next, the third bar and so
forth and so on in order to geta signal somewhere.
Aarati (24:05):
Yeah, exactly.
And so like, that's exactly thebasis of radio technology where
you have like one metal antennaor metal bar that's connected to
the AC power signal, and itemits this wave like signal that
the second metal bar or antenna.
That is far away, but is stillwithin the electric field, is
(24:25):
able to receive.
Arpita (24:26):
Got it.
Aarati (24:28):
So Percy wants to learn more about this.
And so he decides to join the U.
S.
Navy so he can learn more aboutwireless radio systems.
Percy only spent two years atthe Navy before he was medically
discharged due to a chronic eardisease.
Um, but during that time, yeah,that just kind of popped up out
(24:48):
of nowhere.
I don't know.
Arpita (24:49):
Okay.
I was like, I would like to knowmore
Aarati (24:51):
apparently.
Yeah, but during this time hestudied at their radio school
and he also taught himself abunch of other subjects
including trigonometry,calculus, chemistry, physics,
and metallurgy.
Arpita (25:06):
Wait, what does"taught himself" mean?
Aarati (25:08):
So he said, quote, I just got hold of a lot of
textbooks and taught myselfwhile I was standing watch at
night, end quote, that'sit.Bruh.
I know.
Arpita (25:19):
If nothing else, doing this podcast has made me feel
incredibly lazy.
Aarati (25:23):
Oh, I know.
Right.
And he's just like, Oh yeah,well.
I'm just going to do this whileI'm in the Navy at night.
Arpita (25:30):
Also, not comparing, but I guess like also reinforcing
the fact that we both startedthis episode being like, I'm so
tired.
Aarati (25:37):
Yes.
Oh my God.
I know.
We're so lazy.
Arpita (25:41):
We're weak.
God's weakest soldiers.
Aarati (25:45):
Seriously.
So
Arpita (25:46):
A little
Aarati (25:47):
geniuses we're talking about.
Um, So after being dischargedfrom the Navy, he and his
brother Al both found jobs atthe Wireless Specialty Apparatus
Company in Boston, which madecommercial and military radio
equipment.
Here, Percy's co workers noticedhow incredibly curious Percy was
(26:07):
about everything.
They said he would often staylate at night, testing that
day's production.
And they said, quote,"Many's thetime the gang would come back in
the morning and find Percy stillthere.
He had stayed up all night justto figure out how things
worked." End quote.
Arpita (26:23):
I wonder if he had some sort of genetic anomaly that
allowed him to function with solittle sleep because whatever
that anomaly is, I have theopposite of that.
So
Aarati (26:33):
Just.
Arpita (26:34):
I require an inordinate amount of sleep.
Aarati (26:37):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I don't know.
He's just, he's just thisintensely curious guy.
I know people like that, and itkind of makes me feel, I don't
know, inferior in some ways, butso many scientists that I know
are exactly like that, you know,they're just like super curious,
(26:57):
um, it doesn't matter what thetime of the day is, it doesn't
matter, like, what else is goingon in the world, they need to
figure whatever it is out, theyneed to, you know, Do their data
collection.
They need to do their experimentand you know, the world can end.
It doesn't matter.
They're in lab figuring thingsout.
Arpita (27:14):
Is the person you're referring to your brother?
Aarati (27:16):
oh, there's multiple, but he's definitely one.
Yes, he's definitely one.
Oh my God.
Absolutely.
He's, he's absolutely one ofthose people who can work 16
hours a day and be like, yeah,it's just how life is.
Are
Arpita (27:32):
No, no.
Aarati (27:33):
no.
Yeah.
So, Percy spends most of WorldWar I making wireless equipment
and working with the Navy tohelp troubleshoot their systems
whenever there was an issue.
So, around this time, Percy metand married a woman named Louise
Larson, and similar to yourstory about Sasha Shulgin, I
(27:54):
really couldn't find outanything about Louise or how
they met.
Like...
Arpita (27:59):
That cracked me up.
She just like appeared.
Aarati (28:01):
Yeah, this is literally the same story with Louise.
Literally, all I know is thatthey got married sometime
between 1918 and 1922.
Arpita (28:11):
We don't even have a date.
We don't even have a date.
Aarati (28:13):
don't even have a date.
I know that they had three sons,John, James and George.
And then, 30 ish years later, in1956, Louise died.
And that's it.
That's That's the limit ofinformation that we have about
Larson.
So
Arpita (28:31):
Women should be seen and not heard and also not recorded
in history.
Aarati (28:36):
absolutely not.
It doesn't, it doesn't matterapparently.
But I thought it was worth themention still.
Arpita (28:42):
He did have wife.
Aarati (28:43):
Did, he did have a wife.
Arpita (28:44):
He did.
Aarati (28:45):
and.
And sons, yes.
Arpita (28:47):
sentence.
Aarati (28:48):
Yeah, and sons, and then she died.
Yep.
So, after World War I, Percy'sbrother Al went to work for a
company called Raytheon, andPercy soon followed him there.
It was a tiny startup company atthe time, and Percy was only the
fifth employee.
At Raytheon, Percy was workingon power tubes, or vacuum tubes.
(29:11):
So, until now, we've beentalking about alternating
current, or AC power.
Vacuum tubes are important fordirect current, or DC power.
So, in DC power, the electronsare not oscillating and changing
direction, they are alwaysmoving in one direction.
And vacuum tubes help achievethat one directional flow of
(29:34):
electrons.
So if you think about like thewater wheel analogy thing, this
time it's like putting the waterwheel in a river where
Arpita (29:42):
It's only going in one
Aarati (29:43):
going in one direction.
Yeah, so vacuum tubes or powertubes are basically glass tubes
that have a cathode or anegatively charged electrode at
one end and an anode, thepositively charged electrode at
the other end and the space inbetween is a vacuum.
So the system doesn't catch onfire and burn up because there's
(30:04):
no oxygen inside for that tohappen.
Arpita (30:07):
Okay.
That makes sense.
Aarati (30:08):
Yeah, And this is important because we're about to
heat up the cathode so hot thatelectrons start to fall off of
it.
And these electrons arenegatively charged, so they will
be attracted to the positivelycharged anode on the other end
of the tube.
So because of this, theelectrons will only ever flow in
one direction, from the negativecathode to the positive anode.
Arpita (30:32):
And then that flow of the electrons falling off, going
towards the anode is the directcurrent.
And the
Aarati (30:38):
middle part
Arpita (30:38):
is the vacuum.
There's no oxygen there.
So then
Aarati (30:40):
Yeah,
Arpita (30:41):
on their journey, they cannot catch anything on fire.
Aarati (30:44):
Create a spark or catch fire.
Yeah.
And then there's one morecomponent that you can add to a
vacuum tube, which is called agrid, which you can use to
transform a weak oscillating ACsignal and amplify it into a
strong one directional DCsignal.
And this works with radio wavesand light waves, so vacuum tubes
(31:07):
become a crucial part of radios,TVs, radar, telephones, and even
the very earliest computers.
And when I was looking up, like,DC signals and vacuum tubes and
stuff I got a lot of hits aboutguitar amps, so I'm guessing
they're used in guitar amps toamplify sound as well.
Arpita (31:27):
Interesting.
Okay.
Definitely not my of expertise,but Yeah, interesting.
Aarati (31:32):
Mine either.
But yeah, it was like, are youlooking this up because you're
interested in guitar amps?
And I'm like, no, not really,but apparently that's the main,
one of the main uses right now.
So, Percy became an expert atdesigning these vacuum tubes for
all purposes.
Some of his power tubeinventions helped radios become
(31:54):
a common plug in household itemwhich apparently they weren't
before so now people could justhave radios in their house
Arpita (32:01):
I guess that would require their homes to be wired
and for there to be place forthem to be plugged in.
So I guess that does make sense.
Aarati (32:08):
Mm hmm He also created a photoelectric tube that was a
major step forward in developingthe television tube.
So just a couple of hisinventions while he was at
Raytheon
Arpita (32:19):
Was the television called a tube before?
Because that would make so muchsense.
That's why it's called YouTube.
Aarati (32:25):
Yeah, I think A television tube.
A cathode ray tube consisting ofa
Arpita (32:31):
Oh, a cathode ray TV.
Yes.
That makes a lot of sensebecause like old TVs used to be
cathode ray and that's why itwould be like flashing really
quickly.
Definitely.
Aarati (32:39):
Mm.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Arpita (32:41):
Wow.
Okay.
Anyway, I feel like there's alight bulb above my head right
Aarati (32:44):
Yeah, like ding, figured it out.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And so he's, he's basicallyhelping like create all of these
things.
So as the company grew, Percybecame chief of the power tube
division.
His colleagues at Raytheon, manyof whom were affiliates working
at MIT's radiation laboratory,were amazed that despite never
(33:07):
having a formal education, Percywas really able to hold his own
in scientific discussions.
And in fact, that's what Like Imentioned before, that's part of
what made him so innovative.
Since he had never been taughtthe rules of how things should
work, he didn't know what wasand wasn't possible.
(33:28):
And so he was just trying stuffand like figuring it out.
and trying to make it work theway he wanted using that Yankee
mentality that he had developed.
And his co worker said thatPercy could have built a working
tube out of a sardine can.
Arpita (33:43):
That's like a very apt way to phrase that.
Aarati (33:46):
Yeah.
One of his most notableachievements came about when
World War II started.
Percy was working on cavitymagnetrons.
which are a high powered vacuumtube that control and amplify
microwaves.
So microwaves, and we're talkingabout the waves here now, um,
they have a frequency rangingbetween 300 megahertz and 300
(34:10):
gigahertz, which is shorter thanradio waves, but longer than
infrared waves.
Arpita (34:16):
Yeah.
And also.
Between radio and visible light.
Visible light is a faster,
Aarati (34:24):
Yes.
So it goes radio waves,microwaves, Infrared waves, and
then visible light.
Yeah.
So, at the time, detecting andamplifying microwaves was
primarily used in radar systems,and could be used to detect
objects at a distance.
So, anything from monitoringships at sea, or planes in the
(34:46):
air, to detecting incomingmissiles.
Arpita (34:49):
Mm hmm.
Aarati (34:50):
And this, of course, became of great importance
during World War II, and therewas huge demand from the Allied
forces for radar technology.
But in 1941, magnetrons couldonly be produced at a rate of
one per week, which was reallynot enough for the war effort.
So, Percy helped Raytheon land ahuge government contract to help
(35:12):
develop radar equipment for themilitary.
And in fact, this project becamethe U.
S.
military's second most importantproject during World War II,
just behind the ManhattanProject.
Arpita (35:23):
Wow.
Aarati (35:24):
Yeah.
Arpita (35:25):
I do imagine there is quite a big gap between number
one and number two there, but
Aarati (35:29):
yes, yes.
I mean, that's why we don't hearabout Number two.
Arpita (35:33):
Number two.
Aarati (35:33):
We only ever hear about number one, but I still thought
that was quite notable.
Arpita (35:39):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
There is quite a chasm there,but
Aarati (35:42):
Yes.
So as part of this project,Percy redesigned the magnetrons
so that they could be builtusing less precision
engineering.
So you didn't need expertengineers to build a magnetron.
And his version used morereadily accessible materials and
used this conveyor belt likesystem to build one so that they
(36:02):
could be mass produced morequickly and get more radar
equipment into the field.
So soon they went from producingone magnetron per week to
producing 2600 magnetrons perday.
Arpita (36:17):
What?
Aarati (36:18):
Yeah.
Yes.
Arpita (36:22):
Like, I had no idea what you were gonna say.
I thought you were gonna belike, one magretron a week to,
you know, like
Aarati (36:28):
like,
Arpita (36:28):
10 a week or something.
Yeah.
Aarati (36:32):
Yeah.
Arpita (36:34):
And then you said 2000 something and then I was like,
Oh, per month.
Yeah,
Aarati (36:42):
I did read another source that said, like, they
were able to produce seven perday or something.
Um, so I'm not sure if it wasseven per day or one per week
but either way, going from sevenper day to 2,600 a day is huge.
Arpita (36:58):
Exponential for sure.
Aarati (37:00):
yeah, So this achievement undoubtedly helped
the Allies win the war, and forthis work, the Navy awarded him
the Distinguished Public ServiceAward, which is the highest
award that they can give acivilian.
Arpita (37:13):
Oh, cause he's not actually in the Navy anymore
because of his ear thing.
Okay.
I was like, why
Aarati (37:17):
Yeah, yeah.
Arpita (37:18):
I thought he was in the Navy.
Okay.
Continue.
Aarati (37:19):
Yeah, yeah, no, he's working for Raytheon.
Arpita (37:21):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Aarati (37:22):
So, yeah, ear thing, yeah.
Um, yeah, that random ear thingthat just came out of nowhere.
But while he was working onthese cavity magnetrons during
the war, he once again gotcurious about something.
He had been noticing for a whilethat when it got cold in the
building that they were workingin, his workers would warm their
(37:45):
hands up by holding them overthe magnetrons.
And there's also kind of thislegend that one day, Percy was
standing next to an active radarset that had a magnetron in it,
and he noticed that a Mr.
Goodbar chocolate bar that hehad in his pocket had melted.
And, uh, That's when he startedwondering if he could harness
(38:08):
the radiation energy coming fromthe magnetrons to cook food.
He had to wait until World WarII was over, but after the war
was done, Percy startedexperimenting with this.
So he started by placing popcornkernels in front of the
magnetron's waveguide, and theypopped, and so it was the
world's first microwave popcorn.
Arpita (38:31):
Which is really like a key use for a microwave.
I would say that's, you know,in, in the top five for sure.
Aarati (38:39):
Absolutely.
Um, he next placed an egg insideof a tea kettle in front of the
magnetron, and when one of hisco workers tried to look inside
the kettle to see what washappening, the egg exploded all
over his face.
But it was soft boiled, so pointproven.
Like, yeah, it did get cooked.
Arpita (39:02):
Oh, like a whole egg.
Aarati (39:04):
Yeah, like he,
Arpita (39:05):
Oh, I was like, why did it explode?
I was trying to figure that out.
Aarati (39:07):
Yeah.
Arpita (39:07):
Like a whole egg, not like an egg that was cracked.
Aarati (39:10):
Yeah.
No, it was a whole egg.
Arpita (39:11):
It.
Got it.
Got it.
Okay.
Okay.
Okay.
Sorry.
That took me a second.
Okay.
I'm, I'm, following now.
I was like, why?
Okay.
Aarati (39:19):
Yeah.
So, The question is, what ishappening?
How is this working?
Microwaves today still have acavity magnetron inside of them.
And that's the thing thatproduces electromagnetic waves.
These waves bounce around insidethe metal box of the oven where
you keep your food, and areabsorbed by the molecules of
(39:40):
water, sugar, and fat in yourfood.
This excites the molecules andcauses them to vibrate, which
generates heat, and that cooksyour food.
So, it's kind of similar to astove or an oven, where the
waves are traveling in throughthe surface of your food, so the
outside of the food gets hotterfaster than the inside, and
(40:02):
that's why sometimes if youstart, heating up a frozen
burrito or a frozen dinner orsomething that's really dense,
the outside becomes super hot,but it's still really cold
inside.
And this also explains why youshouldn't put metal utensils or
containers in a microwavebecause the electromagnetic
waves will not be absorbed bymetal.
(40:22):
It will deflect the waves awayfrom the food and cause the
electromagnetic waves to bouncearound like crazy, which can
damage the inside of themicrowave.
Arpita (40:31):
Yeah.
I, I, I do know this frompersonal experience.
I do remember really young, Icovered something Instead of
covering it with, like, a plate,I covered it with foil...
microwaved the foil.
That was crazy.
There's sparks flying all overthe microwave.
But, you know, modern microwavesare actually quite good at, you
know, the inside of themicrowave was not well.
But it really does a good job ofkeeping the bad contained.
Aarati (40:55):
Yes.
Yes.
Arpita (40:56):
Because I think they know that children are probably
prone to something like this.
Aarati (41:00):
Probably.
Yeah.
So, to that point, um, thereason that, like, sparks were
being created is because theelectromagnetic waves were
creating an electric currentthat is running through the
metal, and that's what causedthe spark and could have
potentially caused a fire or,um, Or even caused the microwave
(41:21):
to explode, so I'm really gladthat didn't happen in your case.
Arpita (41:25):
me too.
Aarati (41:26):
And one more interesting thing I learned is that, you
know how the door of microwavesare always covered in this kind
of like mesh material, so it'snot completely a clear window?
Yeah, so you can see the foodinside.
That mesh is specificallydesigned to prevent microwaves
from leaving the inside of theoven, so you don't absorb any
microwaves and you don't getcooked.
Arpita (41:47):
Yeah, I actually did know that and I think it's so
crazy that those holes are verybig.
Like you think about like awave, it's like those waves are
huge and moving very slowlybecause they can't escape
through that grid, even thoughthe grid, the holes are like
quite big, I would
Aarati (42:06):
Yeah.
I did not know this.
And so, like, as soon as Ilearned this, I went and ran to
my microwave and I was like,Whoa, those holes are huge.
Like,
Arpita (42:13):
they are really?
Aarati (42:14):
really?
Oh my gosh.
But it, yeah.
So it doesn't allow microwavesto get out, but it does allow
visible light.
So you can see what's inside.
Arpita (42:22):
Because they're smaller and sorry, higher frequency.
Yeah.
Aarati (42:25):
Yeah.
And this is also why there is asafety switch built into
microwaves, so if you pull thedoor open while it's still
running, the microwave will shutoff immediately.
So none of the radiation wavesget out.
But microwaves are a hundredpercent safe.
Like you're not going to radiateyour food and then ingest it or
something like that.
And, you know, there it'sperfectly safe to eat microwaved
(42:45):
food.
As long as you're not in themicrowave somehow, you're good.
So, yeah.
So, Percy and his team atRaytheon started developing a
magnetron powered oven forcooking food, and in 1945, they
applied for a patent for a,quote,"Method of treating
foodstuffs".
(43:05):
The first commercial microwavesmade by Raytheon, called Radar
Ranges, hit the shelves in 1947.
It was six feet tall and weighed750 pounds
Arpita (43:19):
Six feet tall?!
Aarati (43:21):
Yes.
Arpita (43:22):
That's crazy.
Aarati (43:24):
Yeah, and it cost$5,000, which I looked up the equivalent
today, it is$73,000 today for amicrowave.
Arpita (43:34):
Okay, so this is like a, like a fancy pants thing.
Like only, only super fancyhouseholds are getting it.
Okay.
Aarati (43:39):
I don't even think it was for households.
I think it was really moreintended for like restaurants or
like big commercial kitchens.
Cause I can't imagine, I can'timagine a household being able
to afford that or want that?
The first microwave oven forhome use came on the market in
1955 and it was still prettybig.
(44:00):
It was about the size of aconventional regular oven today.
So it had to be wall mounted.
And it was also still veryexpensive.
It cost$1,295, which in today'smoney is over$15,000.
So you had to be like wealthy toget a microwave in your house at
(44:20):
the time.
But, Percy was really not awareof how monumental what he had
created was.
It took a really long time formicrowaves to become small
enough and affordable enough forhouseholds to afford them.
So, Percy never realized howpopular and mainstream it would
become.
He never envisioned this.
(44:43):
He also didn't receive anyroyalties from it.
Raytheon gave him a one time$2bonus that was typical for when
employees patented something.
And that's all he ever reallygot from inventing the
microwave.
Arpita (44:56):
That's wild.
Aarati (44:57):
Yeah, isn't that crazy?
Arpita (44:59):
But didn't microwaves eventually catch on in a really
crazy way?
And that's why we ended up withTV dinners and all of these
different things that weremicrowaved.
I feel like I remember readingat some point that it became
this great way for housewives tomanage their households.
Like, everything was futuristic.
Like, they had an electricvacuum cleaner.
(45:20):
They had, you know, microwavesto like cook all their food.
And then everything was a laJetsons from.
Aarati (45:28):
Yes.
Arpita (45:28):
Yes.
Yes.
Aarati (45:29):
Yeah.
Well, like you said, like, itdid take a long time for
microwaves to become mainstream.
Countertop microwaves first madetheir way onto the market.
Just three years before Percydied in 1967.
So they were still pretty priceyat$495, but it, it was like a
brand new technology, so it tooka while for people to adopt
(45:52):
them.
Um, but yeah, it, it did catchon eventually and now we have.
A microwave practically in everyhousehold.
Arpita (46:01):
Oh yeah, it was like very gendered marketing.
Um, so there was kind oftwofold.
So early advertisements formicrowaves show well coiffed,
well heeled housewives happilypulling burnished roasts from
their fancy new ovens of thefuture.
So what started out as thiswartime technology, but it
eventually became marketed fordomestic use.
(46:23):
So it assured housewives andworking mothers that the
appliance would streamline thelaborious process of getting
dinner on the table.
Um, yeah, so it was like, verymuch like widely marketed to
women, but then in the 90s, itbecame marketed to women also,
but in a very different way.
(46:44):
There was this very famouscookbook that came out called
"Microwave Cooking for One" andit had this connotation that it
was like sad, single ladyreferences.
So a woman living by herself andshe didn't cook.
She just microwave things forherself.
So it's this idea that there'sthis like busy feminist woman
who is a career person anddoesn't have.
(47:07):
The capacity to cook herselfdinner.
So she is her things, which is
Aarati (47:13):
And that was like, supposed to entice you to buy a
microwave because you're a sad,single, career driven lady.
Arpita (47:21):
I don't think it was necessarily the marketing, but
it was more of the connotationthat it came with.
Sorry.
I maybe misspoke.
So the marketing was reallymeant to be for housewives, but
then the connotation of having amicrowave changed in the 90s and
it was this idea that, you couldfeed yourself because it was so
fast and the only people whoreally use microwaves were sad
(47:43):
single ladies.
Aarati (47:44):
Yeah.
That, that makes a lot of sensebecause I remember, my mom got a
lot of um, heat in the 90s whenshe was warming up dinner for us
using a microwave because shehad a career and so she couldn't
stay at home all day like
Arpita (48:00):
Totally.
Aarati (48:01):
cooking for our family.
So she would just come home, zapsomething in the microwave, put
it on the table because we werehungry as soon as we got home
from school, you know.
And it, it was kind of frownedupon by people around her
because they were just like, youshould be cooking fresh food for
your family, you know,
Arpita (48:18):
The fresh food thing is crazy.
Aarati (48:20):
Yeah, it's like...
I did look up that actuallywarming up your food in the
microwave does not affect thenutritional value of your food
at all.
And in some cases might actuallybe better than doing it in a
stove or oven because it goesfaster.
So there's less time for thenutrients to break down in your
food.
Arpita (48:39):
Also, it's probably less likely to burn in any kind of
way or get crispy bits, eventhough I do like crispy bits
because those are carcinogenicand so you're getting less
carcinogens.
Aarati (48:48):
Yeah.
So a lot of benefits tomicrowaves.
Arpita (48:51):
I, I'm fully supportive.
Aarati (48:53):
So Percy continued working for Raytheon, becoming a
Senior Vice President and SeniorMember of the Board of
Directors.
Over his career, he receivedover 100 patents.
Raytheon even named one of theirfacilities that manufactured
vacuum tubes, Spencer Labs,after him.
And despite having dropped outof school in fifth grade, the
(49:14):
University of Massachusetts gavehim an honorary Doctor of
Science degree.
So just a side note here again,in 1960, Percy married again,
this time to a woman namedLillian Ottenheimer, who is just
as mysterious as Louise.
We don't know anything abouther.
So just.
Mentioned.
(49:35):
We've mentioned her.
Yeah.
Um, he retired from Raytheon in1964.
And in 1970, Percy dies at theage of 76.
And I couldn't find the cause ofhis death, but I think it was
just Old fashioned old age.
Arpita (49:51):
Old fashioned old age.
Aarati (49:54):
Yep.
Arpita (49:56):
What a crazy way to say that.
Aarati (49:59):
Nothing special, nothing exciting.
Yeah, just good old
Arpita (50:03):
He just kicked
Aarati (50:04):
Yep.
I'm pretty sure that's it,because like, again, I'm
looking, I'm like, scouring theinternet for information on his
wife and his children, and hiscause of death, and his father's
cause of death, and it's justlike, nope, they just don't
know.
I'm just like, all right, theyjust died one day, I guess.
Like, um, he was 76 though.
(50:24):
So I guess that's a pretty goodlife.
Arpita (50:27):
But didn't he die in 1970?
Like that doesn't feel, I guessmaybe 76.
Okay.
I don't know.
Aarati (50:32):
Yeah.
Arpita (50:32):
I don't know.
Aarati (50:33):
Um, and my last note here is that posthumously in
1999, Percy was inducted intothe inventor's hall of fame for
his patent of the highefficiency magnetron, which is
what makes the microwaves.
Yeah, in a microwave oven.
Arpita (50:48):
Cool.
Yeah.
We've had quite a, we've hadquite a few inventor hall of
fames.
Aarati (50:52):
Yes, we have.
So yeah, that's the story ofPercy Spencer the grade school
dropout who invented, like, themost miraculous machine ever,
the microwave.
Arpita (51:04):
Great story.
I loved it.
that was so fun.
Aarati (51:07):
Thank you.
Thank you very much.
I feel so much more enlightenednow about the microwave.
Arpita (51:14):
Thanks for listening! If you have a suggestion for a
story we should cover or
Hi everyone.
And welcome back to the SmartTea podcast, where we talk about
the lives of scientists andinnovators who shape our world.
How are you, Aarati?
Happy Friday!
Aarati (00:20):
Yeah, happy Friday, Arpita.
I'm doing pretty well.
Um, I'm tired.
I'm just, it's been a week.
It's been a long week, and I'mso glad we have the three day
weekend coming up.
Arpita (00:31):
Yeah, I am right there with you.
We were supposed to recordyesterday and I frantically
texted Aarati being like, can weplease reschedule?
I've had such a busy week atwork and I was scrambling to
meet a deadline yesterday and Iwas like, there is no way I can
get my act together in the next30 minutes as planned.
(00:53):
So...
Aarati (00:53):
I know how it is.
Arpita (00:54):
But yeah, agree with you.
It has been quite a week.
My only agenda item for the next3 days is to not leave my couch
and I can't
Aarati (01:04):
Good.
Arpita (01:05):
wait.
This year has been so busy.
Um, we have had...eightweddings, uh, including my own,
Aarati (01:14):
Including your own, yeah.
I was gonna say.
Arpita (01:16):
and had just like a ton of travel in between that.
And so it's like, all like,really good things, like, all
really fun things and like, veryexciting things.
But it's just like, I'm just sotired.
Work has been really busy andjust I feel like I'm coming
home.
Unpacking my suitcase and thenlike so quickly after just
(01:37):
pulling my suitcase back out andrepacking it.
Um, Which is like, again, likeit just all really wonderful,
fun things, but also just likeso tiring after a while.
And
Aarati (01:48):
Yeah.
Arpita (01:49):
anyway, so that's where I'm at and I just cannot wait to
Aarati (01:52):
Yes.
Arpita (01:53):
not leave my couch this weekend.
Aarati (01:55):
sounds like a good plan.
I like it.
We have kind of, the oppositething happening where I'm not
going anywhere, but a lot ofpeople are coming to our house.
And so we're like constantlyentertaining.
So like last weekend, uh, myaunt and uncle from Singapore
were here and it was just, Youknow, like how Indian people do
(02:16):
when you have guests over.
It's like, we have to cook allthe food.
Yeah.
We have to clean the wholehouse.
We have to cook all the food.
And, um, right now my room iskind of like the nicest room.
So it's now become the slashguest bedroom room in the house.
So I ended up getting kicked outof my own room so I can sleep on
the couch.
Arpita (02:35):
dear.
I feel like that's like a such aspecific brand of stress too and
it's like there's one thingwhere you're leaving your home,
but there's also this like thisis your space and it's now no
longer your space and then theproduction value of like Indian
families visiting.
You're just like, Oh, this iswhat our house looks like all
the time.
You're just like, Oh, welcome.
It's like, this is what italways looks like.
Aarati (02:58):
Everything.
And then it's even worse,because like, they're in my
bedroom, so I'm like, you know,Okay, my bedroom is always
immaculate.
Yes.
My, it always looks like a hotelroom.
Absolutely.
Arpita (03:09):
There's always mints on the pillows.
Aarati (03:11):
G et the dog smell out of my room.
Arpita (03:14):
Yeah, how is Kyro doing with all the guests?
Aarati (03:16):
Oh, he loves them.
He loves having people over.
It's like his favorite thing inthe world.
It's kind of hard becausesometimes they're a little bit
scared of him because he's sobig, um, and they're just like,
oh, I don't know about this big,scary, German shepherd looking
dog that's coming at me, youknow?
And I'm like, he's coming atwith you with love, like you
(03:36):
gotta just get in there, pethim, and then he'll calm down.
And he's so happy to see gueststhough, and by the end of it.
They're all like reallyimpressed by him.
They're like, Oh, he's so lovingand he's so calm.
And I'm like, yeah, you justgive him a chance.
Arpita (03:54):
He is.
I get that though, if you'relike, not used to dogs, or like,
you haven't spent a lot of timearound dogs, like, he is big and
excited.
he's big.
and he's excited.
So he's like running at you likehello.
I love you be my friend.
Aarati (04:09):
And then when they leave, he's so sad.
He like hangs his head and helooks at you like, are you
seriously abandoning me rightnow?
Like,
Arpita (04:18):
My heart.
Aarati (04:19):
Even if they've been there for only three hours or
something, like, you know, my,my aunt and uncle stayed for a
couple days, but, like, evenguests that stay for three
hours, he's like, is the partyover already?
Oh, man.
So,
Arpita (04:32):
He's like all my friends are leaving.
Aarati (04:34):
yeah, exactly.
So, yeah, he, he loves itthough.
So, um, he's happy witheverything.
He's happy when we have guestsover.
So, he's a pretty chill dog.
Arpita (04:44):
Oh, yeah, he's cutie.
Aarati (04:46):
Yeah, um, in podcast news, I wanted to tell you, we
got our first, like, writtenreview on Apple Podcasts.
Arpita (04:55):
Wait, did we really I did not see this.
Aarati (04:58):
We did! And this is what kicked off my whole, like,
motivational push to get alittle, short video out on,
Tiktok and on YouTube.
So I've started a YouTubechannel, I've started a TikTok
channel for our podcast solelybecause of this review because
it like motivated me so much.
But it's like by somebody namedsmnumber1.
(05:22):
And they gave us five stars.
And they wrote, Albert Hoffmanand Emmy Noether episodes were
great.
Now I'm listening to the firstdinosaur fossil episode.
And I'm pleasantly surprised tohear Auburn mentioned in the
beginning as I grew up in PlacerCounty and absolutely love
Auburn.
Will be sharing with friends.
Arpita (05:42):
Amazing
Aarati (05:43):
and it's highly motivational, so please, if you
listen to this podcast and youlike it, please leave us a
review, we love it.
Arpita (05:49):
I loved it.
It was great news.
And we also got our thousandthdownload, didn't we?
Aarati (05:54):
Yes, we did, yes, we did, a lot of milestones that
we're achieving,
Arpita (05:58):
Big milestones, yeah.
On that note, who are we talkingabout today, Aarati?
Aarati (06:03):
Today we are talking about Percy Spencer who is the
inventor of the microwave.
Arpita (06:11):
Whoa, fun.
I'm excited.
I use my microwave a stupidamount, so I can't wait.
Aarati (06:16):
I know, right?
Me too.
And I was like, I actually don'tknow how microwaves work.
And I know there's a lot ofstuff about, are microwaves
dangerous?
And do they, you know, hurt thenutritional value of food?
And can you get radiation?
And there's all this stuff.
And I'm like, I don't actuallyknow anything about microwaves.
So let's do, Percy Spencer, whoinvented the microwave, and
(06:38):
learn about it a little bit.
Arpita (06:40):
I can't wait.
My husband's favorite cookingmethod is to put it in the
microwave.
Like his, if he's cookingdinner, he is not using the
stove.
He's using the microwave.
Aarati (06:49):
Oh, really?
Like a fully microwaved meal?
Arpita (06:51):
Fully microwaved meal.
He's like microwaved blocks oftofu.
He's microwaved tortillas.
He's microwaved everything.
Aarati (06:59):
I don't know if I told you this, but my grandma's
living with us now.
Arpita (07:02):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Aarati (07:04):
And she's completely the opposite.
She like, she's like, what isthis device?
A microwave?
Like, no, everything must befreshly cooked.
And there's no such thing asmeal prepping with her.
She makes exactly the amount ofportions that, you know, the
family needs.
And if it's not finished by theend of the meal, she's highly
stressed out, like who's goingto finish this old rice or this
Arpita (07:26):
Because it doesn't go in the fridge?
Aarati (07:27):
Yeah, it has to go in the fridge and you have to
microwave it No, just finish itnow while it's fresh.
Arpita (07:34):
This feels like such a,, like, Indian grandma thing to
do, like, extremely, I had thiswe're on a tangent, but this is
related.
I promise.
Um, I knew this guy in collegewho was like, from a very well
off family, and they had a cook,who lived with it or like
whatever.
And this cook would always makehim fresh food every day, and he
(08:00):
never had to like cook.
Put away leftovers or whatever.
Like the end of the meal, wasjust like, he was done and he
would like leave the table andthat would be the end of the
story for him.
And so when he got to college,many of us, you know, we would
go, if we went and got dinner,we would all get takeout boxes
and then take it home to eat,which I'd still do, I just want
to, I just want to like, we donot throw away the food that is
Aarati (08:21):
don't throw away.
Arpita (08:21):
incorrect.
You've never throw away thefood.
Yeah.
You never throw away the food.
You have to take it home, but hewould just leave it.
Ever.
He would like give us hisleftovers and he was of the same
mindset where he basically said,I only eat fresh food and this
will no longer be fresh.
And we were just like, are youjoking?
Aarati (08:39):
you kidding?
Yeah.
Oh my god.
It's like a different taxbracket entirely.
Arpita (08:46):
just like a different, like, like I don't even.
I have a hard time with leavingfood on my plate to go and,
like, if it's still on my plateand I can't finish it, it's
going in the fridge.
Like, that's the only option.
Like, putting it in the trash isnot an option unless it's
actively bad.
Like, it's moldy or like,something like that.
Aarati (09:05):
Yeah, exactly.
I'm the same exact way.
And sometimes I even order foodknowing that I'm not going to be
able to finish it all.
And so that kind of likedictates what I'm going to order
because I'm like, oh, if I getlike a salad or something that
has lettuce in it or somethinglike that.
It's not going to be as good thenext day.
So I'm not going to get thatreheat it in the microwave.
(09:27):
And so it's like, it's a wholeprocess, you know, it's
Arpita (09:30):
Or, or I will like justify the price of something.
So it's like a really big bowlor something is$15.
I'm like, actually, this is only$7.50 because I'm going to eat
it twice.
Aarati (09:40):
Yes, exactly.
Oh my gosh.
Yes.
It's so, it's so true.
Yeah.
The microwave is justindispensable.
Arpita (09:48):
The way that we live our lives.
Yeah.
I can't wait to hear about it.
Aarati (09:52):
Okay.
So, Percy LeBron Spencer, wasborn in Howland, Maine, on July
9th, 1894, Some sources say hewas born on the 19th, but I read
an article by Monica M.
Smith, who wrote a piece for theSmithsonian where she literally
just went through and looked atpublicly available government
(10:13):
records, like military and U.
S.
Census records, and sheconfirmed certain dates and
details about his life.
So if there was ever any, like,discrepancy online about the
dates that things happened, I'mjust going with what she said.
Arpita (10:26):
Yeah.
Aarati (10:28):
Um, so Percy was born to Jasper and Myrtle Spencer, and
he had one older brother calledJohn Alby, who was nicknamed Al.
We don't know a lot about hisparents, because when Percy was
18 months old, his father died,and his mother sent Percy to
live with his aunt and uncle.
I'm not really sure what she didwith Al because it kind of
(10:51):
sounds like their mom basicallyabandoned them both and the two
brothers got separated.
Like, it doesn't sound like theyended up living together.
But they were still very close,even, even though they weren't
living together, they still likestayed in touch and even lived
together as adults at one point.
Arpita (11:07):
Did they get raised by family members?
If the mom left them?
Aarati (11:10):
I'm guessing?
Like, Percy definitely wasraised by his aunt and uncle.
Um, Al, I don't know where hewent.
So I don't know what happened tohim, but it didn't sound like on
based on the research that I wasreading, it didn't sound like
they both went to the aunt anduncle.
It sounded like Al wentsomewhere else, maybe, maybe to
some other family members orfriends or something.
(11:31):
I don't know, but it does soundlike they got, you know,
separated.
a bit.
Arpita (11:35):
Wait, sorry.
What happened to the mom though?
She just, she abandoned them.
Aarati (11:38):
just, yeah, she just bounced.
She was like, okay, bye.
I'm not doing this...
Arpita (11:41):
Okay, and we don't really know what her story is.
Aarati (11:44):
Yeah.
Arpita (11:45):
We don't, we don't really know.
Um, so like that's, that'sbasically all we know about her
parents is that father died andmom said, I'm out.
And so he was basically orphanedwhen he was like 18 months old
or something, so, his Al went onto actually be an inventor
himself.
(12:05):
He invented something called theSpencer disk, which was also
known as a Klixon and basicallyit's a circuit breaker that
switches off the electricitywhen things get too hot inside
of a machine.
So it acted a lot like those, Idon't know if you've played with
those like curved rubber disctoys that you kind of like
(12:27):
flatten or you turn inside outand you put it on a flat surface
and after a few seconds it likeshoots up in the air.
And returns back to its originalposition, and you keep doing
that.
Have you ever played with thoseas a kid?
Is it the thing that you turninside out and then you put it
down and then it pops?
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes, I do know what you'retalking about.
Aarati (12:47):
yeah.
So that's basically, like, whata Klixon is.
It's like a curved disc that'spart of an electric circuit, and
so electricity is runningthrough it, and when it gets too
hot, the disc reverses itscurvature.
Yeah.
And it breaks the electriccurrent, so that the electricity
shuts off.
Arpita (13:03):
That's very simple.
I like that.
Aarati (13:05):
Yeah very simple.
And it was very valuable becauseit helped prevent a lot of
fires.
But, um, Al never became asfamous as his brother, Percy.
But later, Percy's grandson saidthat Percy would always carry a
Klixon in his pocket.
And as soon as someone askedhim, What's in your pocket?
He would whip it out anddemonstrate how it worked.
(13:25):
So, he was like, Yeah, reallyproud of his brother.
Okay, but back to Percy who'sstill a child being brought up
by his aunt and uncle.
When Percy was seven, his uncle,who's basically now his father
figure, also died.
And, this is extremely hard onhis aunt because they were
already poor to begin with.
(13:47):
So Percy started helping with asmany chores as he could and
learned how to chop wood, skin adeer, preserve meat, and many
other like very survival typethings, and he credits this with
helping him develop what hecalled a Yankee mentality of
just like making things worksomehow with whatever he was
(14:09):
able to get his hands on.
Arpita (14:11):
This feels very, this feels like the quintessential
Americana, like pull yourself upby your bootstraps, which for
the record, I not necessarilyagree with, but I just, it does
feel like that.
Aarati (14:22):
It is very much.
It's just like, what do youhave?
How do you put it to the bestpossible use, and survive and
make it happen?
And this was how he was able tocome up with his innovations in
science also later, which wewill see.
So at the age of 12, Percy dropsout of school and he starts
working at a spool mill to makemoney to support him and his
(14:45):
aunt.
So he basically becomes a 5thgrade dropout and he never
formally goes back to school,ever.
Like, that was it.
Arpita (14:54):
Wow.
It's such a difference from alot of the other people we've
talked because even though a lotof other people had similar
upbringings, many of them becamethe generational breakers where
they were the first ones to goto college or the first ones to
become educated or, you know,pave this path.
But it is interesting that henever actually did go back to
(15:15):
school.
So
Aarati (15:15):
Yeah.
He never, yeah, he never got aformal education after that.
He just, and he couldn't, I waslike, what a burden that must
have been to be 12 years old andhave to work full time to
support yourself and your aunt.
L ike, that's crazy to me.
But he was a very intenselycurious person and he was always
(15:38):
trying to figure out how thingsworked.
Arpita (15:40):
Mm hmm.
Aarati (15:41):
And so case in point, four years later when Percy was
16, he learned that a localpaper mill had decided to
install electricity, which wasstill a very new kind of concept
at the time.
So for context, Thomas Edison isstill alive at this time and
working on electricitydistribution and had patented a
system for using electricity asa utility in the 1880s.
(16:05):
But Percy was in this very smalltown so the infrastructure to
have electricity power buildingswas really just being put into
place in many of these smallcities and small towns.
Arpita (16:16):
Hmm.
Aarati (16:17):
But when he heard about this, he became really curious
about it.
He was like fascinated with theidea of electricity.
And so he started learning asmuch as he could about it by
reading about it.
And then he applied to helpinstall the system himself at
the local mill so that he couldget hands on experience.
And despite not even havingcompleted grade school
(16:40):
education, and of course he hadno formal training as an
electrical engineer, he wasstill one of three people chosen
to help install the system.
Arpita (16:49):
When you say install the system, is this circuits and the
wiring?
Aarati (16:54):
Yes.
So, he basically, through a lotof trial and error, helped
install the electricity systemand came out having gained a lot
of first hand knowledge aboutcircuits and electricity.
Arpita (17:09):
Sure.
And then was there, I guess, aplaybook for how this would be
done in general?
Like did, had this been alreadybeing used in other buildings
and then what he had to do inthis situation
Aarati (17:20):
Yeah,
Arpita (17:20):
replicate it to some degree?
Aarati (17:22):
I think to some degree.
Yes, like again, he's like in avery small town So, I I mean
people had been working it outbut it's still a very new
concept like Edison had onlypatented this like 20 years ago.
So it's like the infrastructurenow is slowly being built.
And so I'm sure there were a lotof problems they were still
trying to figure out.
(17:42):
So I think to an extent, yes,they kind of knew what they were
doing, but, maybe notcompletely.
It wasn't like...
Arpita (17:50):
There was a lot of troubleshooting.
Aarati (17:52):
Yeah.
Yeah, so specifically, Percywould have learned about
alternating current or AC, andwe still use AC power today to
power buildings, houses, andappliances because it can easily
travel through transmissionlines.
We get electric energy from themovement or flow of electrons
(18:14):
and in AC current, that flowwill periodically change
directions as the electrons inthe current changes directions.
So I read a really greatmetaphor that helped me
understand this because I waslike, I don't understand
electricity at all.
Like, what are we doing?
Um, so I turned to Reddit as onedoes.
(18:35):
Yeah, and there's a user withthe fantastic handle
toodlesandpoodles.
Arpita (18:41):
That's fantastic.
Aarati (18:42):
Yeah, and they said you can imagine AC power like a
water wheel that you place inthe ocean tide.
And so as the tide comes in, thewater moves in one direction,
and the wheel will turn one way.
And as the tide goes out, allthe water moves in the opposite
direction, and so the wheelturns in the opposite direction.
(19:03):
And so it doesn't matter whichway the wheel is turning.
As long as the water is flowing,the wheel will be turning.
And so it's the same thing withAC power.
As long as the electrons aremoving and flowing the appliance
or the building or whatever willhave power and will be on and
working.
Arpita (19:21):
That's so interesting.
I really like that metaphor.
Aarati (19:23):
Yes, it helps make so much sense.
I was like, ah, got it.
Okay, so the other good thingabout AC power is that we can
easily regulate the voltage.
So a transmission line may havethousands of volts running
through it, but by using atransformer, we can change it to
the standard 120 volts that allour normal house outlets use or
(19:44):
240 volts that all our largeappliances like dishwashers and
washing machines use.
So.
This is probably kind of likethe basics of what Percy learned
installing power at the papermill, and it's going to be
important context for the restof his career.
So, on April 15th, 1912, whenPercy is 18 years old, the world
(20:07):
is stunned by the news that theRMS Titanic...
Arpita (20:09):
Titanic! I knew that.
Aarati (20:11):
The unsinkable ship, yeah, had hit an iceberg and
sank.
Arpita (20:16):
You know, this is such a random story, but the only
reason I know that is because,God knows what year this was,
but April 15th was the day thatI got my learner's permit.
And I remember getting mylearner's permit at the DMV.
And the man at the DMV was like,today is a really inauspicious
day and let's hope that youdon't crash the car.
(20:37):
And I was like, what are youtalking about?
And I was 15.
So I was just like, a child.
And I was like, what are youtalking about?
And he's like, this is the daythat Titanic sank.
So at least like, let's hope youdon't crash the car.
Aarati (20:46):
Oh my god,
Arpita (20:47):
I was shook by this as a young child.
And for some, for now, April15th is burned into my memory as
the day
Aarati (20:55):
my
Arpita (20:55):
sank because of that traumatic memory.
So thank you, whatever your atthe
Aarati (21:00):
you know.
April 15th, yeah, 1912.
Oh my gosh.
Arpita (21:04):
Anyway, carry on.
That's the
Aarati (21:05):
Yes.
Okay.
Yeah, so we learn about theTitanic sinking and Percy again
becomes really curious aboutthis specifically about their
wireless system, their radiowireless system.
The Titanic had a state of theart Marconi wireless radio to
signal other ships and wirelessstations on land, and especially
(21:28):
when it was sinking, it wassending out all these SOS
signals, um, and then after itsank, there was a lot of inquiry
about, like, who responded tothe wireless signals, who was
nearby, could they have gottenthere faster?
Things like that.
So there was a lot of inquiryaround that.
So he became really interestedand part of the reason he became
interested in this is becauseradio waves are a type of
(21:51):
electromagnetic wave.
Arpita (21:52):
Right.
Aarati (21:54):
The idea here is that, okay, we're going to do a little
picturing exercise.
So imagine you have a metal barthat has an AC electric current
running through it.
So if you have that, then theelectrons in the metal bar would
be changing direction andoscillating back and forth
inside the bar, like wementioned earlier.
(22:17):
So just like the ocean tideflowing in and out, these
electrons are moving back andforth and they create an
electric field.
around themselves as they moveback and forth.
And so the direction of theelectric field that they're
generating is changing as theelectrons are moving.
Arpita (22:36):
Okay.
Yeah.
Aarati (22:37):
When you map this out, when you map out these
oscillations and the change inthe direction of the electric
field, you get a sinusoidalshape that's going up and down
at regular intervals.
Arpita (22:49):
That makes sense, because the electrons are
changing directions, which meansthat the field is changing
directions, which
Aarati (22:54):
Yeah,
Arpita (22:55):
you kind of get that
Aarati (22:55):
Yeah, up and down.
Arpita (22:57):
Cartoony wave of something coming out of a radio
tower, which it kind of lookslike, like a ridge, basically.
Aarati (23:04):
Exactly.
Yeah.
So now, suppose you have asecond metal bar that's near the
first metal bar, but it's nottouching it.
It's not part of the circuit andit's not connected to the
electric current.
But it can still feel theeffects of the oscillating
electric field that's beinggenerated by the first bar,
(23:25):
right?
So it's close enough.
So when the electrons in thesecond bar are within an
oscillating electric field, theywill start to oscillate too.
And so effectively what you'vedone is you've transmitted this
oscillating signal throughspace.
And that's basically what aradio signal is.
Arpita (23:48):
so even if there isn't, even if that second bar doesn't
have its own current, it's ableto be influenced, I guess, by
the waves that are coming fromthe first one.
Okay.
And so then it's passing it tothe next, the third bar and so
forth and so on in order to geta signal somewhere.
Aarati (24:05):
Yeah, exactly.
And so like, that's exactly thebasis of radio technology where
you have like one metal antennaor metal bar that's connected to
the AC power signal, and itemits this wave like signal that
the second metal bar or antenna.
That is far away, but is stillwithin the electric field, is
(24:25):
able to receive.
Arpita (24:26):
Got it.
Aarati (24:28):
So Percy wants to learn more about this.
And so he decides to join the U.
S.
Navy so he can learn more aboutwireless radio systems.
Percy only spent two years atthe Navy before he was medically
discharged due to a chronic eardisease.
Um, but during that time, yeah,that just kind of popped up out
(24:48):
of nowhere.
I don't know.
Arpita (24:49):
Okay.
I was like, I would like to knowmore
Aarati (24:51):
apparently.
Yeah, but during this time hestudied at their radio school
and he also taught himself abunch of other subjects
including trigonometry,calculus, chemistry, physics,
and metallurgy.
Arpita (25:06):
Wait, what does"taught himself" mean?
Aarati (25:08):
So he said, quote, I just got hold of a lot of
textbooks and taught myselfwhile I was standing watch at
night, end quote, that'sit.Bruh.
I know.
Arpita (25:19):
If nothing else, doing this podcast has made me feel
incredibly lazy.
Aarati (25:23):
Oh, I know.
Right.
And he's just like, Oh yeah,well.
I'm just going to do this whileI'm in the Navy at night.
Arpita (25:30):
Also, not comparing, but I guess like also reinforcing
the fact that we both startedthis episode being like, I'm so
tired.
Aarati (25:37):
Yes.
Oh my God.
I know.
We're so lazy.
Arpita (25:41):
We're weak.
God's weakest soldiers.
Aarati (25:45):
Seriously.
So
Arpita (25:46):
A little
Aarati (25:47):
geniuses we're talking about.
Um, So after being dischargedfrom the Navy, he and his
brother Al both found jobs atthe Wireless Specialty Apparatus
Company in Boston, which madecommercial and military radio
equipment.
Here, Percy's co workers noticedhow incredibly curious Percy was
(26:07):
about everything.
They said he would often staylate at night, testing that
day's production.
And they said, quote,"Many's thetime the gang would come back in
the morning and find Percy stillthere.
He had stayed up all night justto figure out how things
worked." End quote.
Arpita (26:23):
I wonder if he had some sort of genetic anomaly that
allowed him to function with solittle sleep because whatever
that anomaly is, I have theopposite of that.
So
Aarati (26:33):
Just.
Arpita (26:34):
I require an inordinate amount of sleep.
Aarati (26:37):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I don't know.
He's just, he's just thisintensely curious guy.
I know people like that, and itkind of makes me feel, I don't
know, inferior in some ways, butso many scientists that I know
are exactly like that, you know,they're just like super curious,
(26:57):
um, it doesn't matter what thetime of the day is, it doesn't
matter, like, what else is goingon in the world, they need to
figure whatever it is out, theyneed to, you know, Do their data
collection.
They need to do their experimentand you know, the world can end.
It doesn't matter.
They're in lab figuring thingsout.
Arpita (27:14):
Is the person you're referring to your brother?
Aarati (27:16):
oh, there's multiple, but he's definitely one.
Yes, he's definitely one.
Oh my God.
Absolutely.
He's, he's absolutely one ofthose people who can work 16
hours a day and be like, yeah,it's just how life is.
Are
Arpita (27:32):
No, no.
Aarati (27:33):
no.
Yeah.
So, Percy spends most of WorldWar I making wireless equipment
and working with the Navy tohelp troubleshoot their systems
whenever there was an issue.
So, around this time, Percy metand married a woman named Louise
Larson, and similar to yourstory about Sasha Shulgin, I
(27:54):
really couldn't find outanything about Louise or how
they met.
Like...
Arpita (27:59):
That cracked me up.
She just like appeared.
Aarati (28:01):
Yeah, this is literally the same story with Louise.
Literally, all I know is thatthey got married sometime
between 1918 and 1922.
Arpita (28:11):
We don't even have a date.
We don't even have a date.
Aarati (28:13):
don't even have a date.
I know that they had three sons,John, James and George.
And then, 30 ish years later, in1956, Louise died.
And that's it.
That's That's the limit ofinformation that we have about
Larson.
So
Arpita (28:31):
Women should be seen and not heard and also not recorded
in history.
Aarati (28:36):
absolutely not.
It doesn't, it doesn't matterapparently.
But I thought it was worth themention still.
Arpita (28:42):
He did have wife.
Aarati (28:43):
Did, he did have a wife.
Arpita (28:44):
He did.
Aarati (28:45):
and.
And sons, yes.
Arpita (28:47):
sentence.
Aarati (28:48):
Yeah, and sons, and then she died.
Yep.
So, after World War I, Percy'sbrother Al went to work for a
company called Raytheon, andPercy soon followed him there.
It was a tiny startup company atthe time, and Percy was only the
fifth employee.
At Raytheon, Percy was workingon power tubes, or vacuum tubes.
(29:11):
So, until now, we've beentalking about alternating
current, or AC power.
Vacuum tubes are important fordirect current, or DC power.
So, in DC power, the electronsare not oscillating and changing
direction, they are alwaysmoving in one direction.
And vacuum tubes help achievethat one directional flow of
(29:34):
electrons.
So if you think about like thewater wheel analogy thing, this
time it's like putting the waterwheel in a river where
Arpita (29:42):
It's only going in one
Aarati (29:43):
going in one direction.
Yeah, so vacuum tubes or powertubes are basically glass tubes
that have a cathode or anegatively charged electrode at
one end and an anode, thepositively charged electrode at
the other end and the space inbetween is a vacuum.
So the system doesn't catch onfire and burn up because there's
(30:04):
no oxygen inside for that tohappen.
Arpita (30:07):
Okay.
That makes sense.
Aarati (30:08):
Yeah, And this is important because we're about to
heat up the cathode so hot thatelectrons start to fall off of
it.
And these electrons arenegatively charged, so they will
be attracted to the positivelycharged anode on the other end
of the tube.
So because of this, theelectrons will only ever flow in
one direction, from the negativecathode to the positive anode.
Arpita (30:32):
And then that flow of the electrons falling off, going
towards the anode is the directcurrent.
And the
Aarati (30:38):
middle part
Arpita (30:38):
is the vacuum.
There's no oxygen there.
So then
Aarati (30:40):
Yeah,
Arpita (30:41):
on their journey, they cannot catch anything on fire.
Aarati (30:44):
Create a spark or catch fire.
Yeah.
And then there's one morecomponent that you can add to a
vacuum tube, which is called agrid, which you can use to
transform a weak oscillating ACsignal and amplify it into a
strong one directional DCsignal.
And this works with radio wavesand light waves, so vacuum tubes
(31:07):
become a crucial part of radios,TVs, radar, telephones, and even
the very earliest computers.
And when I was looking up, like,DC signals and vacuum tubes and
stuff I got a lot of hits aboutguitar amps, so I'm guessing
they're used in guitar amps toamplify sound as well.
Arpita (31:27):
Interesting.
Okay.
Definitely not my of expertise,but Yeah, interesting.
Aarati (31:32):
Mine either.
But yeah, it was like, are youlooking this up because you're
interested in guitar amps?
And I'm like, no, not really,but apparently that's the main,
one of the main uses right now.
So, Percy became an expert atdesigning these vacuum tubes for
all purposes.
Some of his power tubeinventions helped radios become
(31:54):
a common plug in household itemwhich apparently they weren't
before so now people could justhave radios in their house
Arpita (32:01):
I guess that would require their homes to be wired
and for there to be place forthem to be plugged in.
So I guess that does make sense.
Aarati (32:08):
Mm hmm He also created a photoelectric tube that was a
major step forward in developingthe television tube.
So just a couple of hisinventions while he was at
Raytheon
Arpita (32:19):
Was the television called a tube before?
Because that would make so muchsense.
That's why it's called YouTube.
Aarati (32:25):
Yeah, I think A television tube.
A cathode ray tube consisting ofa
Arpita (32:31):
Oh, a cathode ray TV.
Yes.
That makes a lot of sensebecause like old TVs used to be
cathode ray and that's why itwould be like flashing really
quickly.
Definitely.
Aarati (32:39):
Mm.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Arpita (32:41):
Wow.
Okay.
Anyway, I feel like there's alight bulb above my head right
Aarati (32:44):
Yeah, like ding, figured it out.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And so he's, he's basicallyhelping like create all of these
things.
So as the company grew, Percybecame chief of the power tube
division.
His colleagues at Raytheon, manyof whom were affiliates working
at MIT's radiation laboratory,were amazed that despite never
(33:07):
having a formal education, Percywas really able to hold his own
in scientific discussions.
And in fact, that's what Like Imentioned before, that's part of
what made him so innovative.
Since he had never been taughtthe rules of how things should
work, he didn't know what wasand wasn't possible.
(33:28):
And so he was just trying stuffand like figuring it out.
and trying to make it work theway he wanted using that Yankee
mentality that he had developed.
And his co worker said thatPercy could have built a working
tube out of a sardine can.
Arpita (33:43):
That's like a very apt way to phrase that.
Aarati (33:46):
Yeah.
One of his most notableachievements came about when
World War II started.
Percy was working on cavitymagnetrons.
which are a high powered vacuumtube that control and amplify
microwaves.
So microwaves, and we're talkingabout the waves here now, um,
they have a frequency rangingbetween 300 megahertz and 300
(34:10):
gigahertz, which is shorter thanradio waves, but longer than
infrared waves.
Arpita (34:16):
Yeah.
And also.
Between radio and visible light.
Visible light is a faster,
Aarati (34:24):
Yes.
So it goes radio waves,microwaves, Infrared waves, and
then visible light.
Yeah.
So, at the time, detecting andamplifying microwaves was
primarily used in radar systems,and could be used to detect
objects at a distance.
So, anything from monitoringships at sea, or planes in the
(34:46):
air, to detecting incomingmissiles.
Arpita (34:49):
Mm hmm.
Aarati (34:50):
And this, of course, became of great importance
during World War II, and therewas huge demand from the Allied
forces for radar technology.
But in 1941, magnetrons couldonly be produced at a rate of
one per week, which was reallynot enough for the war effort.
So, Percy helped Raytheon land ahuge government contract to help
(35:12):
develop radar equipment for themilitary.
And in fact, this project becamethe U.
S.
military's second most importantproject during World War II,
just behind the ManhattanProject.
Arpita (35:23):
Wow.
Aarati (35:24):
Yeah.
Arpita (35:25):
I do imagine there is quite a big gap between number
one and number two there, but
Aarati (35:29):
yes, yes.
I mean, that's why we don't hearabout Number two.
Arpita (35:33):
Number two.
Aarati (35:33):
We only ever hear about number one, but I still thought
that was quite notable.
Arpita (35:39):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
There is quite a chasm there,but
Aarati (35:42):
Yes.
So as part of this project,Percy redesigned the magnetrons
so that they could be builtusing less precision
engineering.
So you didn't need expertengineers to build a magnetron.
And his version used morereadily accessible materials and
used this conveyor belt likesystem to build one so that they
(36:02):
could be mass produced morequickly and get more radar
equipment into the field.
So soon they went from producingone magnetron per week to
producing 2600 magnetrons perday.
Arpita (36:17):
What?
Aarati (36:18):
Yeah.
Yes.
Arpita (36:22):
Like, I had no idea what you were gonna say.
I thought you were gonna belike, one magretron a week to,
you know, like
Aarati (36:28):
like,
Arpita (36:28):
10 a week or something.
Yeah.
Aarati (36:32):
Yeah.
Arpita (36:34):
And then you said 2000 something and then I was like,
Oh, per month.
Yeah,
Aarati (36:42):
I did read another source that said, like, they
were able to produce seven perday or something.
Um, so I'm not sure if it wasseven per day or one per week
but either way, going from sevenper day to 2,600 a day is huge.
Arpita (36:58):
Exponential for sure.
Aarati (37:00):
yeah, So this achievement undoubtedly helped
the Allies win the war, and forthis work, the Navy awarded him
the Distinguished Public ServiceAward, which is the highest
award that they can give acivilian.
Arpita (37:13):
Oh, cause he's not actually in the Navy anymore
because of his ear thing.
Okay.
I was like, why
Aarati (37:17):
Yeah, yeah.
Arpita (37:18):
I thought he was in the Navy.
Okay.
Continue.
Aarati (37:19):
Yeah, yeah, no, he's working for Raytheon.
Arpita (37:21):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Aarati (37:22):
So, yeah, ear thing, yeah.
Um, yeah, that random ear thingthat just came out of nowhere.
But while he was working onthese cavity magnetrons during
the war, he once again gotcurious about something.
He had been noticing for a whilethat when it got cold in the
building that they were workingin, his workers would warm their
(37:45):
hands up by holding them overthe magnetrons.
And there's also kind of thislegend that one day, Percy was
standing next to an active radarset that had a magnetron in it,
and he noticed that a Mr.
Goodbar chocolate bar that hehad in his pocket had melted.
And, uh, That's when he startedwondering if he could harness
(38:08):
the radiation energy coming fromthe magnetrons to cook food.
He had to wait until World WarII was over, but after the war
was done, Percy startedexperimenting with this.
So he started by placing popcornkernels in front of the
magnetron's waveguide, and theypopped, and so it was the
world's first microwave popcorn.
Arpita (38:31):
Which is really like a key use for a microwave.
I would say that's, you know,in, in the top five for sure.
Aarati (38:39):
Absolutely.
Um, he next placed an egg insideof a tea kettle in front of the
magnetron, and when one of hisco workers tried to look inside
the kettle to see what washappening, the egg exploded all
over his face.
But it was soft boiled, so pointproven.
Like, yeah, it did get cooked.
Arpita (39:02):
Oh, like a whole egg.
Aarati (39:04):
Yeah, like he,
Arpita (39:05):
Oh, I was like, why did it explode?
I was trying to figure that out.
Aarati (39:07):
Yeah.
Arpita (39:07):
Like a whole egg, not like an egg that was cracked.
Aarati (39:10):
Yeah.
No, it was a whole egg.
Arpita (39:11):
It.
Got it.
Got it.
Okay.
Okay.
Okay.
Sorry.
That took me a second.
Okay.
I'm, I'm, following now.
I was like, why?
Okay.
Aarati (39:19):
Yeah.
So, The question is, what ishappening?
How is this working?
Microwaves today still have acavity magnetron inside of them.
And that's the thing thatproduces electromagnetic waves.
These waves bounce around insidethe metal box of the oven where
you keep your food, and areabsorbed by the molecules of
(39:40):
water, sugar, and fat in yourfood.
This excites the molecules andcauses them to vibrate, which
generates heat, and that cooksyour food.
So, it's kind of similar to astove or an oven, where the
waves are traveling in throughthe surface of your food, so the
outside of the food gets hotterfaster than the inside, and
(40:02):
that's why sometimes if youstart, heating up a frozen
burrito or a frozen dinner orsomething that's really dense,
the outside becomes super hot,but it's still really cold
inside.
And this also explains why youshouldn't put metal utensils or
containers in a microwavebecause the electromagnetic
waves will not be absorbed bymetal.
(40:22):
It will deflect the waves awayfrom the food and cause the
electromagnetic waves to bouncearound like crazy, which can
damage the inside of themicrowave.
Arpita (40:31):
Yeah.
I, I, I do know this frompersonal experience.
I do remember really young, Icovered something Instead of
covering it with, like, a plate,I covered it with foil...
microwaved the foil.
That was crazy.
There's sparks flying all overthe microwave.
But, you know, modern microwavesare actually quite good at, you
know, the inside of themicrowave was not well.
But it really does a good job ofkeeping the bad contained.
Aarati (40:55):
Yes.
Yes.
Arpita (40:56):
Because I think they know that children are probably
prone to something like this.
Aarati (41:00):
Probably.
Yeah.
So, to that point, um, thereason that, like, sparks were
being created is because theelectromagnetic waves were
creating an electric currentthat is running through the
metal, and that's what causedthe spark and could have
potentially caused a fire or,um, Or even caused the microwave
(41:21):
to explode, so I'm really gladthat didn't happen in your case.
Arpita (41:25):
me too.
Aarati (41:26):
And one more interesting thing I learned is that, you
know how the door of microwavesare always covered in this kind
of like mesh material, so it'snot completely a clear window?
Yeah, so you can see the foodinside.
That mesh is specificallydesigned to prevent microwaves
from leaving the inside of theoven, so you don't absorb any
microwaves and you don't getcooked.
Arpita (41:47):
Yeah, I actually did know that and I think it's so
crazy that those holes are verybig.
Like you think about like awave, it's like those waves are
huge and moving very slowlybecause they can't escape
through that grid, even thoughthe grid, the holes are like
quite big, I would
Aarati (42:06):
Yeah.
I did not know this.
And so, like, as soon as Ilearned this, I went and ran to
my microwave and I was like,Whoa, those holes are huge.
Like,
Arpita (42:13):
they are really?
Aarati (42:14):
really?
Oh my gosh.
But it, yeah.
So it doesn't allow microwavesto get out, but it does allow
visible light.
So you can see what's inside.
Arpita (42:22):
Because they're smaller and sorry, higher frequency.
Yeah.
Aarati (42:25):
Yeah.
And this is also why there is asafety switch built into
microwaves, so if you pull thedoor open while it's still
running, the microwave will shutoff immediately.
So none of the radiation wavesget out.
But microwaves are a hundredpercent safe.
Like you're not going to radiateyour food and then ingest it or
something like that.
And, you know, there it'sperfectly safe to eat microwaved
(42:45):
food.
As long as you're not in themicrowave somehow, you're good.
So, yeah.
So, Percy and his team atRaytheon started developing a
magnetron powered oven forcooking food, and in 1945, they
applied for a patent for a,quote,"Method of treating
foodstuffs".
(43:05):
The first commercial microwavesmade by Raytheon, called Radar
Ranges, hit the shelves in 1947.
It was six feet tall and weighed750 pounds
Arpita (43:19):
Six feet tall?!
Aarati (43:21):
Yes.
Arpita (43:22):
That's crazy.
Aarati (43:24):
Yeah, and it cost$5,000, which I looked up the equivalent
today, it is$73,000 today for amicrowave.
Arpita (43:34):
Okay, so this is like a, like a fancy pants thing.
Like only, only super fancyhouseholds are getting it.
Okay.
Aarati (43:39):
I don't even think it was for households.
I think it was really moreintended for like restaurants or
like big commercial kitchens.
Cause I can't imagine, I can'timagine a household being able
to afford that or want that?
The first microwave oven forhome use came on the market in
1955 and it was still prettybig.
(44:00):
It was about the size of aconventional regular oven today.
So it had to be wall mounted.
And it was also still veryexpensive.
It cost$1,295, which in today'smoney is over$15,000.
So you had to be like wealthy toget a microwave in your house at
(44:20):
the time.
But, Percy was really not awareof how monumental what he had
created was.
It took a really long time formicrowaves to become small
enough and affordable enough forhouseholds to afford them.
So, Percy never realized howpopular and mainstream it would
become.
He never envisioned this.
(44:43):
He also didn't receive anyroyalties from it.
Raytheon gave him a one time$2bonus that was typical for when
employees patented something.
And that's all he ever reallygot from inventing the
microwave.
Arpita (44:56):
That's wild.
Aarati (44:57):
Yeah, isn't that crazy?
Arpita (44:59):
But didn't microwaves eventually catch on in a really
crazy way?
And that's why we ended up withTV dinners and all of these
different things that weremicrowaved.
I feel like I remember readingat some point that it became
this great way for housewives tomanage their households.
Like, everything was futuristic.
Like, they had an electricvacuum cleaner.
(45:20):
They had, you know, microwavesto like cook all their food.
And then everything was a laJetsons from.
Aarati (45:28):
Yes.
Arpita (45:28):
Yes.
Yes.
Aarati (45:29):
Yeah.
Well, like you said, like, itdid take a long time for
microwaves to become mainstream.
Countertop microwaves first madetheir way onto the market.
Just three years before Percydied in 1967.
So they were still pretty priceyat$495, but it, it was like a
brand new technology, so it tooka while for people to adopt
(45:52):
them.
Um, but yeah, it, it did catchon eventually and now we have.
A microwave practically in everyhousehold.
Arpita (46:01):
Oh yeah, it was like very gendered marketing.
Um, so there was kind oftwofold.
So early advertisements formicrowaves show well coiffed,
well heeled housewives happilypulling burnished roasts from
their fancy new ovens of thefuture.
So what started out as thiswartime technology, but it
eventually became marketed fordomestic use.
(46:23):
So it assured housewives andworking mothers that the
appliance would streamline thelaborious process of getting
dinner on the table.
Um, yeah, so it was like, verymuch like widely marketed to
women, but then in the 90s, itbecame marketed to women also,
but in a very different way.
(46:44):
There was this very famouscookbook that came out called
"Microwave Cooking for One" andit had this connotation that it
was like sad, single ladyreferences.
So a woman living by herself andshe didn't cook.
She just microwave things forherself.
So it's this idea that there'sthis like busy feminist woman
who is a career person anddoesn't have.
(47:07):
The capacity to cook herselfdinner.
So she is her things, which is
Aarati (47:13):
And that was like, supposed to entice you to buy a
microwave because you're a sad,single, career driven lady.
Arpita (47:21):
I don't think it was necessarily the marketing, but
it was more of the connotationthat it came with.
Sorry.
I maybe misspoke.
So the marketing was reallymeant to be for housewives, but
then the connotation of having amicrowave changed in the 90s and
it was this idea that, you couldfeed yourself because it was so
fast and the only people whoreally use microwaves were sad
(47:43):
single ladies.
Aarati (47:44):
Yeah.
That, that makes a lot of sensebecause I remember, my mom got a
lot of um, heat in the 90s whenshe was warming up dinner for us
using a microwave because shehad a career and so she couldn't
stay at home all day like
Arpita (48:00):
Totally.
Aarati (48:01):
cooking for our family.
So she would just come home, zapsomething in the microwave, put
it on the table because we werehungry as soon as we got home
from school, you know.
And it, it was kind of frownedupon by people around her
because they were just like, youshould be cooking fresh food for
your family, you know,
Arpita (48:18):
The fresh food thing is crazy.
Aarati (48:20):
Yeah, it's like...
I did look up that actuallywarming up your food in the
microwave does not affect thenutritional value of your food
at all.
And in some cases might actuallybe better than doing it in a
stove or oven because it goesfaster.
So there's less time for thenutrients to break down in your
food.
Arpita (48:39):
Also, it's probably less likely to burn in any kind of
way or get crispy bits, eventhough I do like crispy bits
because those are carcinogenicand so you're getting less
carcinogens.
Aarati (48:48):
Yeah.
So a lot of benefits tomicrowaves.
Arpita (48:51):
I, I'm fully supportive.
Aarati (48:53):
So Percy continued working for Raytheon, becoming a
Senior Vice President and SeniorMember of the Board of
Directors.
Over his career, he receivedover 100 patents.
Raytheon even named one of theirfacilities that manufactured
vacuum tubes, Spencer Labs,after him.
And despite having dropped outof school in fifth grade, the
(49:14):
University of Massachusetts gavehim an honorary Doctor of
Science degree.
So just a side note here again,in 1960, Percy married again,
this time to a woman namedLillian Ottenheimer, who is just
as mysterious as Louise.
We don't know anything abouther.
So just.
Mentioned.
(49:35):
We've mentioned her.
Yeah.
Um, he retired from Raytheon in1964.
And in 1970, Percy dies at theage of 76.
And I couldn't find the cause ofhis death, but I think it was
just Old fashioned old age.
Arpita (49:51):
Old fashioned old age.
Aarati (49:54):
Yep.
Arpita (49:56):
What a crazy way to say that.
Aarati (49:59):
Nothing special, nothing exciting.
Yeah, just good old
Arpita (50:03):
He just kicked
Aarati (50:04):
Yep.
I'm pretty sure that's it,because like, again, I'm
looking, I'm like, scouring theinternet for information on his
wife and his children, and hiscause of death, and his father's
cause of death, and it's justlike, nope, they just don't
know.
I'm just like, all right, theyjust died one day, I guess.
Like, um, he was 76 though.
(50:24):
So I guess that's a pretty goodlife.
Arpita (50:27):
But didn't he die in 1970?
Like that doesn't feel, I guessmaybe 76.
Okay.
I don't know.
Aarati (50:32):
Yeah.
Arpita (50:32):
I don't know.
Aarati (50:33):
Um, and my last note here is that posthumously in
1999, Percy was inducted intothe inventor's hall of fame for
his patent of the highefficiency magnetron, which is
what makes the microwaves.
Yeah, in a microwave oven.
Arpita (50:48):
Cool.
Yeah.
We've had quite a, we've hadquite a few inventor hall of
fames.
Aarati (50:52):
Yes, we have.
So yeah, that's the story ofPercy Spencer the grade school
dropout who invented, like, themost miraculous machine ever,
the microwave.
Arpita (51:04):
Great story.
I loved it.
that was so fun.
Aarati (51:07):
Thank you.
Thank you very much.
I feel so much more enlightenednow about the microwave.
Arpita (51:14):
Thanks for listening! If you have a suggestion for a
story we should cover or
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