Into Darkness: Suicide and Grief

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CAUTION: TODAY'S EPISODE DISCUSSES SUICIDE, PLEASE TAKE CARE OF YOURSELF AND SKIP TODAY IF THE SUBJECT SEEMS TOO INTENSE.

Today, we explore the concept of "self-death" as an alternative term for suicide, reflecting onmy recent experiences supporting those grieving after suicide. The topic emerges from a week filled with suicide-related grief conversations and the loss of a work colleague, leading to deeper questions about how we support survivors and understand this form of loss.

• Unlike other losses, suicide involves someone taking themselves away rather than being "taken"
• The belief that God embraces those who die by suicide without judgment or limits
• Survivors of suicide loss often report having no safe place to discuss their grief
• The metaphor of "dismemberment" helps frame how suicide severs connections with loved ones
• Modern medicine has blurred the line between life and death, complicating our understanding and empathy
• Certainty lies only in divine love; everything else remains complicated and nuanced

Remember I'm always available for spiritual direction by Zoom to those who are grieving.
Listen every Friday on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and Amazon Music for spiritual direction, art, and workshops shared through Santa Clara University, https://events.scu.edu/markey-center/event/344943-spiritual-accompaniment

You can reach us at: [e-mail].
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Episode Transcript

Chaplain Candee (00:09):
Welcome back to Solace
I'm Candee Lucas, your griefchaplain.
We understand that the loss ofa loved one can be especially
wounding and calls for support.
When we started this podcast,that was our goal and aim and we

(00:34):
seek to continue to do that.
Remember you're always welcomein our circle of healing, love
and support.
.
A caution about today's episode.
It deals with suicide and youmay find that the topic is too

(00:57):
uncomfortable for you, so I urgecaution while listening.
I wanted to share a piece todaythat I found in my notes from
the past.

(01:17):
Dismembered.
soSo.
It has been a week .
.
A work associate committed anact of self-death.
I think I made that word up,but I was getting bombarded with

(01:38):
people's grief about suicidesand that word seemed too harsh
for that act.
Suicide" and that word seemedtoo harsh for that act seems
absent of any compassion for theperson choosing self-death.
Of course it was bound to comeup in my grief group but all of
a sudden we had two or threefolks where before we had had

(02:02):
none.
Then in Death Cafe, where themanner of people's deaths rarely
comes up, had two or three more.
Then this colleague walks infront of a commuter train very
near my home ten days ago.

(02:22):
While it seems that all deathhas a sense of dismembering
about it, cast as they are fromtheir dear ones, this
"dismembering seems especiallyharsh.
Unlike an illness, it rarelyhas an ounce of pre-grief about
it.
So part of the reaction seemsto be bound up in the shock both

(02:47):
of the event itself and theloss of the person.
It gives lie to the sentimentthat this person was taken from
us.
No, this person took themselves.
This person took themselves.
I wonder where God is in this.

(03:09):
I know he is determinedly inthe moment with them all waiting
, with his arms wide open,holding them in his sweet
embrace.
But that does nothing to dispelthe darkness we experience when
imagining what that person wasor had to be thinking about just

(03:34):
before.
I know the church gives atechnical overview of a person
not being in their right mind orhaving a mental illness to
cover the sin aspect, but Idon't believe this is enough for
the living to do honor to thosewho make this choice.

(03:56):
That's why the idea of theperson committing the self-death
as one who takes their owndismemberment in hand seems
right to me.
I will dismember my life fromyours, from the world, from God,

(04:17):
if he wishes, I will blink.
First O death, first O death.
When I have had to offer upwords to mourners of those who
dismember, I have repeated thatbelief of mine that they were
with God in a most intimate wayin the very moment of their

(04:39):
death, not abandoned at all butembraced warmly.
I am not sure those words wereof any solace to those who
remained.
I have been going over in mymind trying to reflect on the
way I listened to each of thosestories.

(05:01):
I was at first, on one level,fascinated, as if this would
somehow color my response.
I realized I should have beenfocused on how the person
telling the story was reacting,how they were telling the story,
what was their affect?

(05:22):
Body language.
These all happened in a groupsetting and in that setting I
just let people talk as much asthey want.
They almost, to a person,reported that they are unable to
talk about the event to friendsor loved ones.
Giving them a place and a spaceto do that seems vitally

(05:44):
important.
But what place do I go withthem next?
Do you want to tell the storyover and over again until it
loses some of its power?
Is that even possible.
I have long believed that peoplewith terminal illnesses should

(06:07):
be able to reject treatmentsthat unnecessarily prolong
technical living.
When my own mother was dying ofcancer, I know I would have
found the drugs necessary tohelp her die had she asked that
of me, but she didn't.
M uch like the debate onabortion, medical science has

(06:31):
intervened to make thingspossible that not only were not
possible before, but highlyunlikely.
Babies born as early as 22weeks have survived and people
have lived to 119 years.
Each and every day in thiscountry, elderly people with two

(06:52):
or more chronic diseases areadmitted to ICUs to support a
heart or some lungs, until thepoint where one or more of the
chronic diseases will overwhelmthe body and there can be no
further retreat from death.
The temporal physical body, asit shuts down --organ system by

(07:16):
organ system--, isn't dead untilits brain function ceases.
Do our souls lie in our braintissue, in our hearts?
So, hearing about variousdeaths; sitting through ethics

(07:38):
consults and rehashes withhospital ethics committee; that
line of death seems less andless sharp, more like the
weaving of two edges together,giving way string by string
until there is a rupture, yes,but the entire thing does not

(07:58):
unravel simultaneously, nor evenon a rigid schedule, just over
a period of time that may last(who knows how many minutes,
hours or days)?
I think I have to understandmore than this self-death to be

(08:21):
of service to anyone, I want tobe of real comfort to those who
suffer this type of loss.
I want them to be assured theirloved one is in the warm,
loving embrace of one who loveswithout limits or judgment.
This work colleague of mine hadtwo teenage children.

(08:45):
All indications are she wasutterly devoted to them and I
thought of them the morning Iheard the news, knowing they
were waking up to the darkestday they will ever have to live
in their lives.
How could their motherdismember them like this?

(09:06):
I think some darkness sucked herunder, a darkness she had no
resistance to.
That had nothing to do with herchildren or her God.
We live complicated, nuancedlives in fraught times.
Others cannot always support usthrough the harrows, through

(09:30):
the harrows that haunt our minds, some dark imaginings.
I am certain she is with Godnow and He is comforting her.
That is the end of my certainty.

(09:57):
That concludes another episode.
You can find us every Friday onAmazon, Spotify or Apple
Podcasts.
I'm always available forspiritual direction while
grieving over Zoom, Pleasecontact me at the email in the
show notes.
Remember be safe; travel withGod.

(10:22):
Vaya con Dios.