March 21, 2025 • 15 mins
EXPLORE with us profound ideas about brokenness and healing through Father Greg Boyle's wisdom, offering insights for anyone navigating loss or feeling disconnected in today's divisive world.
• Explore how the image reflects how God welcomes us with enthusiastic love
• Uncover the universal feeling of brokenness that accompanies grief and loss
• Examineour collective societal brokenness and division in current times
• Reflecting on Father Greg's philosophy that "no one is healed until everyone is healed"
• Learning how recognizing the inherent worth in others can transform both them and ourselves
Feel free to send any questions you might have about grieving to my email.
As you listen, consider sending me your thoughts and questions on grief, both spiritual and practical, so we can walk this path together.
SPIRITUAL DIRECTION WHILE GRIEVING IS AVAILABLE FREE OF CHARGE
You can reach us at: candeelucas@soulplusgrace.com to arrange personal spiritual direction and for questions and concerns.
Music and sound effects today by: via Pixabay
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
CANDEE (00:11):
I welcome you to Solace: Soul + Grief.
My name's Candee Lucas and I'ma grief chaplain.
(00:32):
I accompany those who aregrieving any kind of loss and I
ask that you let me accompanyyou today.
You're always welcome in thiscircle of healing, love and
support.
Remember, we are all on thisjourney together.
I want you to start with thatstory about Greg Boyle, his mom
(00:58):
dying, because that's such agood story.
TERRY (01:02):
Okay, my favorite story about Father Greg Boyle.
I've been to many of hisretreats.
I've worked at many of hisretreats.
I've seen him at LA Congress anumber of times.
But one year I was fortunate togo down to LA Congress when he
had a very different kind oftalk.
Usually he talks about homeboysand he relates stories about
(01:23):
people that are there, but thistime he had just lost his mother
.
So I go in to packed auditoriumand he started talking about his
mother just passing away and hesaid the best thing was she
lived very close by and when hewould go to see her in her last
few months, the minute he wouldwalk into the room she would
spread her arms up in a V uptowards the sky and say you're
(01:47):
here, you're here and she'd beso excited to see him.
And he told a lot ofinteresting stories about.
You know she was.
She was really excited actuallyabout this new journey, about
dying.
She said you know I've neverdone this before, about this new
journey about dying.
She said you know, I've neverdone this before.
(02:08):
And then another time he wentover there and she was very, she
was asleep and he was sittingat the end of the bed and she
woke up and she goes oh damn,I'm still here.
So she, you know, she wastotally at peace with the end of
her life, and the Greek boiltalked about this.
And the thing that was sostriking to me was that I had
just lost my mother, just a fewmonths before, and the last time
(02:30):
I saw her and I live on theWest coast and she's in Columbus
we finally had to move her toan assisted living and she was
sitting up in a chair.
I had planned on going backthere in just a week and she
raised her arms up in that sameV to give me a big hug and to
look at me and said when are youcoming back?
And I said I'll be back in lessthan a week and she actually
(02:52):
unfortunately passed away beforeI was able to get back, but
that she made that same movementthat Greg made.
And it was just so amazing tothink that we kind of shared
this, that we both had thesememories of our mothers.
But what Greg said towards theend of his talk that really
struck me was it was all aboutyou know, raising your arms and
you're here, you're here.
And he said you know, that'swhat I think God is doing up in
(03:15):
heaven.
He's just waiting up there andwhen we turn to him or go to him
or call upon him, he raises hisarms and just looks at us and
says you're here, and he's soexcited.
And he said all that God wantsus to do is to do that same
thing for another person, tojust be excited, to greet them,
to raise our arms and be excitedand say you're here.
(03:38):
And that just I mean I was justin tears throughout that whole
talk.
It was the most moving thing Ihad ever heard.
It was awesome.
It was really awesome.
CANDEE (03:48):
I think maybe you did talk a little bit about that
when we talked about your mompassing.
I wanted to bring up FatherGreg because we were all talking
before we went on air about hisnew book called "Cherished
Belonging.
Cherished Belonging, I don'tknow.
(04:08):
You've listened to a little bit, so I really like and I'm only
about two chapters in, so I willstart with what I was just
hearing about.
When he's talking about thebrokenness of everyone, about
how in a speech or something,somebody referred to somebody as
a good Jesuit and that sooffends him because if there's a
(04:32):
good Jesuit there's a badJesuit, and how we are all whole
and all in this swimming in theocean of God.
I think that's another one ofthose things he used.
So I kind of wanted to talkabout that brokenness part,
because it's both general andspecific to grieving and I think
(04:53):
one of the things that grieversdescribe and they describe it
differently but this sense ofbrokenness.
Grievers describe and theydescribe it differently.
But this sense of brokenness,this sense of being separated
from their, not only the lovedones, but being separated from
the life that was then and thatit all feels broken and that you
(05:14):
can't get it back together.
And we've all seen in ourspiritual direction, in our own
formation, in the talks we'vehad with each other, that that
brokenness is such a theme ineverybody's life, even though it
may be not taught.
It's not.
Yes, I can function, I can goto my job, I can take care of my
(05:38):
kids, I can get groceries, butat night when the lights go out
I feel like, you know, I'm goingto fall off the end of the
earth.
So everybody kind of identifiesthat with that, that brokenness
.
And so that's what I want totalk about today, and how that
kind of both informs our griefjourneys and how we kind of get
(06:01):
people to see that wholeness andbask in that wholeness and the
healing.
I had a directee recently thatwas very upset because she had a
Christian friend who said sheshouldn't do centering prayer
because that would bring inSatan.
I'm sure this woman seriouslybelieves it, but I was trying to
(06:24):
explain to her that in ZenBuddhism, that meditation of
trying to make a nothingness,meditate so that there's nothing
, is a different, different taskthan the way we meditate for
prayer.
You know, we are breathing withGod and our heart is opening
with God and it's very different.
And I said, just tell hermeditation is kind of a
(06:46):
shorthand, it's not really verydescriptive, and tell her we're
doing centering prayer, becausethat's really what it is and
it's just making a quiet spacefor God.
So what do you think about thatconcept of both the brokenness
and the healing?
Talk about that.
Start anywhere.
TERRY (07:07):
I just think there's so much brokenness, not even within
the individual, but within ourworld today, and especially, I
don't know, somehow it seemslike it.
I don't know if it started wayback at 9-11 or if it certainly
started during COVID, and itjust seems like it has just sped
up and everything feels to melike it's just out of control
(07:29):
anymore and really no matter.
Well, what political sideyou're on one side makes the
other side feel like they'recompletely broken and everything
that they do is completelywrong.
And I think now, with this newadministration coming in and
undoing and changing everything,you feel like, well, were we
really that broken before?
Was everything that wrong thatwe have to throw everything out?
(07:49):
It's just, it's verydisconcerting.
You feel like the groundunderneath you is just like
quicksand.
You know it's really, reallyhard.
CANDEE (07:58):
I think it's like big grief, BIG grief that a lot of
us are experiencingsimultaneously.
It's like I don't know who tofeel worse for the people that
are getting laid off by an email.
My sister's working in thenational parks right now and she
has all these friends that youknow.
(08:20):
One person was packing up to goto a new park and got fired in
an email and now she's alreadyquit her job and sold her house
and I mean and there's lots ofindividual stories like that so
how do we heal?
I mean, what's our step forhealing?
I mean I keep listening to himsay you know, oh, he's learned
(08:40):
from homeboys that all thepeople that are making the, all
the people the gang members, thegang members come from all this
brokenness and that's one ofthe reasons he concentrates, and
homeboys concentrates on thishealing and this making people
understand that they're loved.
(09:01):
You look around and you go.
How are we doing that now?
How are we manifesting that?
Now?
The brokenness seems real,clear.
TERRY (09:10):
Yeah, I think that that's so true, because I think now,
with all this divisiveness, it'sjust, you know, we're just
focusing on that, we're focusingon all the differences and
we're not focusing on thesimilarities, we're not focusing
on reaching out and sayingyou're here to a fellow person,
maybe that in your family, orthat you see on the street or
(09:32):
any place, and there's so much,there's divisiveness within
families because of the wholeevents of recent political
election, and it's just.
I wish we could just, you know,concentrate maybe on Greg
Boyle's philosophy, which is allabout, like this book,
cherished belonging, like thatwe belong to each other.
And he says all the time and Ilove this that no one is healed
(09:55):
until everyone is healed and noone is kind of fixed until
everyone's fixed is healed, andno one is kind of fixed until
everyone's fixed.
And we, we just we have tofocus on that other, that other
side of things.
You know, it's just.
I had this is kind ofinteresting too.
I don't know how this relatesto, but I recently went to a
lecture Fr.
John Dear, and he writes allthese books.
(10:17):
He's very into nonviolence andhe like Gandhi.
Mahatma Gandhi's big thing wasthat he believed that Jesus was
the most nonviolent person thatever walked on the face of the
earth and that he was just.
He goes through.
His latest book is about thesynoptic gospels and going
(10:40):
through each one of the threeauthors, each chapter and verse,
and how it shows Jesus isnonviolent, but he really is
focused on the Beatitudes andthat's what Gandhi said.
Every day he got up and readthe Beatitudes and this is
something that just never reallystruck me, but it's how, in the
Old Testament, Moses came downand presented, you know, the
(11:03):
commandments, the TenCommandments, but they're all
negative.
They'll show this, they'll shownot that, but the Beatitudes
are completely different.
They're very positive, likeblessed be the peacemakers,
blessed be you know all thesepeople, and I think it's just
that's the folks that we have tohave now.
You know on, let's somehow tryto get over all this negative
stuff and what can we do to worktogether?
(11:25):
Because and it has to start, Ithink, from the ground level.
You know you get reallyfrustrated and think, well, what
can we do, because so many badthings are happening?
But I think if each personturned to another person and
thought, what is there onelittle thing I could do for that
person that they come incontact with, or how can I just
listen to that person instead ofjust turning and shutting them
(11:47):
out?
What a different place it wouldbe.
You know, it's just, we have toget back on a more positive,
loving, cherished track.
Right, and I think that's whatGreg would do.
He he talks a lot about traumaand he said there, you know, I
love that's what Greg would do.
He talks a lot about trauma andhe said I love that.
He says everybody was createdby God in goodness.
Everything was created good.
(12:08):
There are no bad people.
But there is mental illness andthere's trauma.
And he talks a lot about thatACEs.
I don't know what it stands for, but there's a scoring system
where it's from one to 10.
And each one of these things isa point, like if you were from
(12:29):
an alcoholic family, if you wereabused as a child, all these
traumas that you could suffer.
That's why you turn to crimeand drugs and become a gang
member.
And Greg always says on thatscale, I'm a zero, and I'll bet
most of us at this conferenceare a zero.
But he said there's nobody thatwalks through the door of
Homeboys.
(12:49):
That's not at least a seven oran eight.
They've been so traumatized.
And he also says and I lovethis he says there's so many
people there that have a hole intheir heart the size of their
missing father or their missingmother because they didn't grow
up with a complete family.
You know, that's why thesepeople become traumatized,
because they have horriblethings happen to them.
(13:10):
It's not that they're not goodpeople, but he's able to sit
down and by looking at them andgiving them sort of this
cherished like you belong here,you are innately good.
He looks at them with tattoosall over their face and all this
you know they've been in jailand they've killed people.
Maybe he can look at them andsee deep inside and see this
(13:33):
little kernel of goodness andhelp bring that out, just by
listening to these people, byrecognizing it and helping them
look in this mirror where theycan see something good inside of
them instead of all thisbadness and trauma that they've
grown up with.
And that's why he's successful.
CANDEE (13:56):
That concludes this week's episode.
You can find us on Apple,spotify or Amazon.
Feel free to send any questionsyou might have about grieving
to my email.
In the show notes I'll try toanswer any questions you have in
the future.
Remember I'm always availablefor spiritual direction by Zoom
(14:22):
to those who are grieving.
Please reach out to me if youhave this need.
Be safe Travel with God alwaysat your side.
Vaya con Dios.
I welcome you to Solace: Soul + Grief.
My name's Candee Lucas and I'ma grief chaplain.
(00:32):
I accompany those who aregrieving any kind of loss and I
ask that you let me accompanyyou today.
You're always welcome in thiscircle of healing, love and
support.
Remember, we are all on thisjourney together.
I want you to start with thatstory about Greg Boyle, his mom
(00:58):
dying, because that's such agood story.
TERRY (01:02):
Okay, my favorite story about Father Greg Boyle.
I've been to many of hisretreats.
I've worked at many of hisretreats.
I've seen him at LA Congress anumber of times.
But one year I was fortunate togo down to LA Congress when he
had a very different kind oftalk.
Usually he talks about homeboysand he relates stories about
(01:23):
people that are there, but thistime he had just lost his mother
.
So I go in to packed auditoriumand he started talking about his
mother just passing away and hesaid the best thing was she
lived very close by and when hewould go to see her in her last
few months, the minute he wouldwalk into the room she would
spread her arms up in a V uptowards the sky and say you're
(01:47):
here, you're here and she'd beso excited to see him.
And he told a lot ofinteresting stories about.
You know she was.
She was really excited actuallyabout this new journey, about
dying.
She said you know I've neverdone this before, about this new
journey about dying.
She said you know, I've neverdone this before.
(02:08):
And then another time he wentover there and she was very, she
was asleep and he was sittingat the end of the bed and she
woke up and she goes oh damn,I'm still here.
So she, you know, she wastotally at peace with the end of
her life, and the Greek boiltalked about this.
And the thing that was sostriking to me was that I had
just lost my mother, just a fewmonths before, and the last time
(02:30):
I saw her and I live on theWest coast and she's in Columbus
we finally had to move her toan assisted living and she was
sitting up in a chair.
I had planned on going backthere in just a week and she
raised her arms up in that sameV to give me a big hug and to
look at me and said when are youcoming back?
And I said I'll be back in lessthan a week and she actually
(02:52):
unfortunately passed away beforeI was able to get back, but
that she made that same movementthat Greg made.
And it was just so amazing tothink that we kind of shared
this, that we both had thesememories of our mothers.
But what Greg said towards theend of his talk that really
struck me was it was all aboutyou know, raising your arms and
you're here, you're here.
And he said you know, that'swhat I think God is doing up in
(03:15):
heaven.
He's just waiting up there andwhen we turn to him or go to him
or call upon him, he raises hisarms and just looks at us and
says you're here, and he's soexcited.
And he said all that God wantsus to do is to do that same
thing for another person, tojust be excited, to greet them,
to raise our arms and be excitedand say you're here.
(03:38):
And that just I mean I was justin tears throughout that whole
talk.
It was the most moving thing Ihad ever heard.
It was awesome.
It was really awesome.
CANDEE (03:48):
I think maybe you did talk a little bit about that
when we talked about your mompassing.
I wanted to bring up FatherGreg because we were all talking
before we went on air about hisnew book called "Cherished
Belonging.
Cherished Belonging, I don'tknow.
(04:08):
You've listened to a little bit, so I really like and I'm only
about two chapters in, so I willstart with what I was just
hearing about.
When he's talking about thebrokenness of everyone, about
how in a speech or something,somebody referred to somebody as
a good Jesuit and that sooffends him because if there's a
(04:32):
good Jesuit there's a badJesuit, and how we are all whole
and all in this swimming in theocean of God.
I think that's another one ofthose things he used.
So I kind of wanted to talkabout that brokenness part,
because it's both general andspecific to grieving and I think
(04:53):
one of the things that grieversdescribe and they describe it
differently but this sense ofbrokenness.
Grievers describe and theydescribe it differently.
But this sense of brokenness,this sense of being separated
from their, not only the lovedones, but being separated from
the life that was then and thatit all feels broken and that you
(05:14):
can't get it back together.
And we've all seen in ourspiritual direction, in our own
formation, in the talks we'vehad with each other, that that
brokenness is such a theme ineverybody's life, even though it
may be not taught.
It's not.
Yes, I can function, I can goto my job, I can take care of my
(05:38):
kids, I can get groceries, butat night when the lights go out
I feel like, you know, I'm goingto fall off the end of the
earth.
So everybody kind of identifiesthat with that, that brokenness
.
And so that's what I want totalk about today, and how that
kind of both informs our griefjourneys and how we kind of get
(06:01):
people to see that wholeness andbask in that wholeness and the
healing.
I had a directee recently thatwas very upset because she had a
Christian friend who said sheshouldn't do centering prayer
because that would bring inSatan.
I'm sure this woman seriouslybelieves it, but I was trying to
(06:24):
explain to her that in ZenBuddhism, that meditation of
trying to make a nothingness,meditate so that there's nothing
, is a different, different taskthan the way we meditate for
prayer.
You know, we are breathing withGod and our heart is opening
with God and it's very different.
And I said, just tell hermeditation is kind of a
(06:46):
shorthand, it's not really verydescriptive, and tell her we're
doing centering prayer, becausethat's really what it is and
it's just making a quiet spacefor God.
So what do you think about thatconcept of both the brokenness
and the healing?
Talk about that.
Start anywhere.
TERRY (07:07):
I just think there's so much brokenness, not even within
the individual, but within ourworld today, and especially, I
don't know, somehow it seemslike it.
I don't know if it started wayback at 9-11 or if it certainly
started during COVID, and itjust seems like it has just sped
up and everything feels to melike it's just out of control
(07:29):
anymore and really no matter.
Well, what political sideyou're on one side makes the
other side feel like they'recompletely broken and everything
that they do is completelywrong.
And I think now, with this newadministration coming in and
undoing and changing everything,you feel like, well, were we
really that broken before?
Was everything that wrong thatwe have to throw everything out?
(07:49):
It's just, it's verydisconcerting.
You feel like the groundunderneath you is just like
quicksand.
You know it's really, reallyhard.
CANDEE (07:58):
I think it's like big grief, BIG grief that a lot of
us are experiencingsimultaneously.
It's like I don't know who tofeel worse for the people that
are getting laid off by an email.
My sister's working in thenational parks right now and she
has all these friends that youknow.
(08:20):
One person was packing up to goto a new park and got fired in
an email and now she's alreadyquit her job and sold her house
and I mean and there's lots ofindividual stories like that so
how do we heal?
I mean, what's our step forhealing?
I mean I keep listening to himsay you know, oh, he's learned
(08:40):
from homeboys that all thepeople that are making the, all
the people the gang members, thegang members come from all this
brokenness and that's one ofthe reasons he concentrates, and
homeboys concentrates on thishealing and this making people
understand that they're loved.
(09:01):
You look around and you go.
How are we doing that now?
How are we manifesting that?
Now?
The brokenness seems real,clear.
TERRY (09:10):
Yeah, I think that that's so true, because I think now,
with all this divisiveness, it'sjust, you know, we're just
focusing on that, we're focusingon all the differences and
we're not focusing on thesimilarities, we're not focusing
on reaching out and sayingyou're here to a fellow person,
maybe that in your family, orthat you see on the street or
(09:32):
any place, and there's so much,there's divisiveness within
families because of the wholeevents of recent political
election, and it's just.
I wish we could just, you know,concentrate maybe on Greg
Boyle's philosophy, which is allabout, like this book,
cherished belonging, like thatwe belong to each other.
And he says all the time and Ilove this that no one is healed
(09:55):
until everyone is healed and noone is kind of fixed until
everyone's fixed is healed, andno one is kind of fixed until
everyone's fixed.
And we, we just we have tofocus on that other, that other
side of things.
You know, it's just.
I had this is kind ofinteresting too.
I don't know how this relatesto, but I recently went to a
lecture Fr.
John Dear, and he writes allthese books.
(10:17):
He's very into nonviolence andhe like Gandhi.
Mahatma Gandhi's big thing wasthat he believed that Jesus was
the most nonviolent person thatever walked on the face of the
earth and that he was just.
He goes through.
His latest book is about thesynoptic gospels and going
(10:40):
through each one of the threeauthors, each chapter and verse,
and how it shows Jesus isnonviolent, but he really is
focused on the Beatitudes andthat's what Gandhi said.
Every day he got up and readthe Beatitudes and this is
something that just never reallystruck me, but it's how, in the
Old Testament, Moses came downand presented, you know, the
(11:03):
commandments, the TenCommandments, but they're all
negative.
They'll show this, they'll shownot that, but the Beatitudes
are completely different.
They're very positive, likeblessed be the peacemakers,
blessed be you know all thesepeople, and I think it's just
that's the folks that we have tohave now.
You know on, let's somehow tryto get over all this negative
stuff and what can we do to worktogether?
(11:25):
Because and it has to start, Ithink, from the ground level.
You know you get reallyfrustrated and think, well, what
can we do, because so many badthings are happening?
But I think if each personturned to another person and
thought, what is there onelittle thing I could do for that
person that they come incontact with, or how can I just
listen to that person instead ofjust turning and shutting them
(11:47):
out?
What a different place it wouldbe.
You know, it's just, we have toget back on a more positive,
loving, cherished track.
Right, and I think that's whatGreg would do.
He he talks a lot about traumaand he said there, you know, I
love that's what Greg would do.
He talks a lot about trauma andhe said I love that.
He says everybody was createdby God in goodness.
Everything was created good.
(12:08):
There are no bad people.
But there is mental illness andthere's trauma.
And he talks a lot about thatACEs.
I don't know what it stands for, but there's a scoring system
where it's from one to 10.
And each one of these things isa point, like if you were from
(12:29):
an alcoholic family, if you wereabused as a child, all these
traumas that you could suffer.
That's why you turn to crimeand drugs and become a gang
member.
And Greg always says on thatscale, I'm a zero, and I'll bet
most of us at this conferenceare a zero.
But he said there's nobody thatwalks through the door of
Homeboys.
(12:49):
That's not at least a seven oran eight.
They've been so traumatized.
And he also says and I lovethis he says there's so many
people there that have a hole intheir heart the size of their
missing father or their missingmother because they didn't grow
up with a complete family.
You know, that's why thesepeople become traumatized,
because they have horriblethings happen to them.
(13:10):
It's not that they're not goodpeople, but he's able to sit
down and by looking at them andgiving them sort of this
cherished like you belong here,you are innately good.
He looks at them with tattoosall over their face and all this
you know they've been in jailand they've killed people.
Maybe he can look at them andsee deep inside and see this
(13:33):
little kernel of goodness andhelp bring that out, just by
listening to these people, byrecognizing it and helping them
look in this mirror where theycan see something good inside of
them instead of all thisbadness and trauma that they've
grown up with.
And that's why he's successful.
CANDEE (13:56):
That concludes this week's episode.
You can find us on Apple,spotify or Amazon.
Feel free to send any questionsyou might have about grieving
to my email.
In the show notes I'll try toanswer any questions you have in
the future.
Remember I'm always availablefor spiritual direction by Zoom
(14:22):
to those who are grieving.
Please reach out to me if youhave this need.
Be safe Travel with God alwaysat your side.
Vaya con Dios.
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