College Degree? 83% Never Use It in Their Job (Full)

Episode Transcript
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Alex (00:00):
[thoughtful] Welcome to Solving America’s Problems.

(00:03):
[serious] Jeremy Hritz spent sevenyears as a high school principal, racked
up five college degrees—including adoctorate—and walked away with a mountain
of debt… only to leave education entirelyand become a full-time stock trader
who says, straight up, he isn’t usinga single one of those degrees today.
[leaning in] Across the table, RobWallace—Virginia Tech and Johns Hopkins

(00:27):
electrical engineering grad—built acompany that trains thousands in solar
installation across seven states andabroad, yet the highest-paid people
he hires never set foot on a collegecampus and clear six figures straight
out of a thirteen-week program.
[low, deliberate] Jerremy and Davedig into the $1.7 trillion question

nobody wants to ask out loud (00:47):
if the people inside the system admit it’s
this broken, why are we still pushingevery kid through the same door?

jerremynewsome (00:58):
Dave, what are we doing today?
My man,

Dave Conley (01:01):
In this episode of Solving America's Problems,
we're asking a question millionsof families are grappling with.
Is college worth the cost?
For decades, a degree was seenas the surest path to success.
But rising costs and shifting careeropportunities have left many wondering
if there's a better way forward.
We'll explore college, careers, andthe road not taken, looking for how

(01:24):
education is evolving and the valueof alternative paths and what it
all means for the next generation.
And that's this week onSolving America's Problems.
Is college worth the cost?
With Rob Wallace and Jeremy Ritz.

Listeners from around the world.
Welcome back to solvingAmerica's problems.
I am Jeremy Alexander Newsome,and as always, I'm joined by my
incredible co host, Dave Conley.
Today, we're tackling a topicthat impacts millions of families
across this beautiful country.
The value of higher education.

(01:59):
So essentially, is collegestill worth it in a world where
student debt has ballooned to?
Ready for this?
1. 7 trillion and more than half of thegraduates end up in jobs that does not
even require a degree or use the degreethat they paid all that money for.
So in this episode,we're breaking it down.

(02:22):
We're going to hear some personalstories from two amazing guests, Rob
Wallace and Jeremy Ritz both haveseen the academics and they work close
up and they're going to be sharingtheir insights on how education
and work either intersect or don't.
Together, we're going to explore bigquestions like is the traditional college

(02:42):
path still the best route to success?
What alternatives are out there?
And how can we reimagineeducation for the next generation?
Rob, Jeremy, welcome to the show.
It's great to have my guys here.

Robert Wallace (02:57):
for having us.

Of course.
So both of you have a lotof experience in this.
If you don't mind, just hit mewith a quick background on you.
As it relates to college, let's gowith Jeremy Ritz and then Robert
first 60 seconds to both of you.

Jeremy Hritz (03:15):
First of all, thanks for having me on Dave and Jeremy.
So my background former high schoolprincipal was in that role for seven
years before that assistant principal,before that high school English teacher.
And I have five college degrees.
So a bachelor's degree inEnglish from Penn state.
I have three, three master's degrees,liberal arts, which I know that I

(03:36):
saw some of the statistics here.
We're going to talk about schoolleadership and special education.
I also have my doctorate ininnovation and leadership.
My ultimate goal was to become asuperintendent of schools, but now I
am a trader of the market, so I'm noteven in what I went to school for.
So that's my background.

Yeah.
Beautiful take Wallace hit me.

Yeah, man.
A little bit different background,but also not in my field.
Undergrad from Virginia tech, electricalengineering masters, Johns Hopkins,
electrical engineering, got intosolar Freddie Gray rise happened
in Baltimore, started a workforcedevelopment and training program for
folks who didn't have access to college.
And now we have schools across sevenstates, three countries training, Folks

(04:19):
on the technical skills to build andconstruct and maintain solar farms.
So totally different fieldthan where I started.

But still using a little bit of the
education that you had for sure.
And I know we all do education is reallythe cornerstone of my entire campaign.
Whereas if we can change the educationalsystem, we change our future.
We create so many more opportunitiesand so much more awareness.
And that's really the discussionthat we're going to have today.
So as I mentioned just a moment agocollege debt in America is over 1.

(04:48):
7 trillion, which with the total debt ofthe country, At around 36 to 37 trillion,
depending on when people are hearing this,it goes up like a trillion a quarter.
It's wild.
Half of the graduates ending up injobs that don't even require a degree
or use the degree that they have.
So let's go with Rob.

(05:09):
Based on your experiences, Is thesystem broken or is it misunderstood?

This is a tough one, right?
So I was thinking about this earlierbefore this call, because one of the
things there's two different perspectives.
One is from where college fits inthe ecosystem, but I also think
there's a difference being a minorityversus being not minority, right?
And so what I was taught.
Back when I was younger was that youhave to have a college degree to be able

(05:38):
to even compete and on global scale.
So both my parents went toUPenn, both of them engineers.
All my siblings are all engineers.
And we were taught if you want tocompete, you got to go to play the game.
You got that education.
The challenging part for me is a lotof my counterparts, especially when
I was doing solar development in thatsector, did not have the same education.
And we were still either at thesame level or they exceeded me in

(06:01):
income starting out in the industry.
And so as I look back, I say really,did education really help me get
to the level where they were ableto get some without education?
And so we look at it and say, I thinkwhat education does to a lot of, for
a lot of folks is give them access.
And that's why I think it'sespecially powerful for the black
and brown communities becausesome of these rooms you can't even

(06:22):
get into if I have an education.
And I don't believe that's consistentback then across every group.
But I do think it's shifting now.
This generation now is a little different.
And so we got a lot of differentCEOs and executives with totally
different backgrounds, somewith education and some without.
Look, full stop.
The richest and wealthiest peopleI know did not go to college.

(06:43):
That's an interesting fact, right?
Whether it be folks that are AfricanAmerican who are now athletes or in the
recording industry or so on and so forth,or sport players, a lot of folks didn't.
And it's a challenge that we're facing.
I will tell you this from my perspective,in the inner cities, Where the option
is only drugs or F or athletics.

(07:05):
If you're not an athlete, you have togo back to technical trades in order
to get them out and give them skills,carpentry, electrical plumbing, because
that's the thing that's never going togo away without AI or anything else.
That piece of will never go away.
That's my thoughts.

Yeah.
I think I love that youbrought the technical schools
and technical components.
We will definitely be touching on thatand the future of this episode because.
I think we all understandthe importance of it.
And I think you're ahundred percent correct.
Those are skills that arenever going to go away.
And people that learn how tointeract with that are going to
be even better suited for creatingjobs in the future and creating

(07:41):
the infrastructure of this country.
Jeremy, you've got a ton ofdegrees and leadership experience.
Looking back, was the cost and timeinvested in education worth it for you?

That's a difficult question to answer because I think.
There are some parts of it that Ilook back on and it was worth it.
Some of the intangible things thatI was able to pull from, dedicating
that effort to achieving the degree,what I learned along the way.
But then, you're looking at yourbill at the end of that because
I did have to take student loans.
Nobody in my family had goneto college prior to, to me.

(08:19):
So I had to take all that on and,as a young adult looking at, This
number that I owed to pay for myeducation was a bit daunting and,
the question about whether or not thesystem's broken or just misunderstood.
I wouldn't say that it's broken.
I would just say that it's outdated.
And I think one of the things, at leastfrom my perspective, that I especially

(08:43):
saw as a high school principal is thatthere aren't choices for kids or for
young adults, it's, and this is what Iwas taught is that college is the only
way that you're going to be successful.
And now.
In terms of what I do just from tradingand an entrepreneurial perspective, that's
inaccurate, but that's the narrativethat we force on kids to say, Hey, all

(09:06):
right if you don't go to college youcan't succeed in this world, but you can.
There, there are so manydifferent pathways and avenues.
And I think part of whatneeds to be changed is just.
Just our perspectives and how we pitchit to our community our citizens,
that there are several differentways to be successful in this
world and college is one of them.

(09:27):
And that's great.
If you want to go that way, but Hey,you have these five or six different
pathways that you can take and bejust as successful and fulfilled.

Yeah you mentioned an interesting word there, right?
The thing that you said, the balancewas daunting because my version of
this world, I'm really trying tofigure out ultimately, maybe even this
podcast and future episodes, but howdo we make the general educational
experience in college debt free?

(09:57):
Essentially, how can we requireit where it's not such a humongous
financial risk to go to college?
Because all of us on this podcastdid, including myself, believe it or
not, I have a bachelor's degree fromthe University of Florida, go Gators.
And the fact, I did,I got financial loans.

(10:20):
I had a job during my college tenure.
So I still worked full time and wentto school full time and was able
to pay off my student loans and myfinancial aid before I graduated or
right around the time I graduated.
But the unique piece of that is, I thinkthere has to be some level at some stage

(10:42):
of a solution that we can talk aboutin the future of this exact episode
where it's like, how can we solve thatwhere college students do not have debt?
What does that look like?
Because right now I'm viewingcolleges as more of a business, right?
They're a really good business andthey're trying to make a lot of
revenue and they're using the students.

(11:03):
As revenue generators.
So with that question or that statementbeing asked, the question that I'll
throw out to Jeremy and then to Rob,do you think that most students really
understand the financial risk of college?

mean, if I just go back in time and think of myself and I'll
bring it to current day and the currentstudent population, I didn't have a clue.
I was just like, all right,I'm supposed to go to college.
I'm going to go to college.
Yeah, it costs some money.
I have grants.
I'll take out some loans, whatever.
I didn't know any better, but myparents didn't know any better.
To educate me.
So I think the student population is onlygoing to be as informed as their parents

(11:45):
are or their family that they're aroundor their extended family, their friends.
And I think my experience as a principal,it's not a stretch to go out on a limb
to say that There probably isn't a greatawareness unless you come from a family
where college is part of your culture.
There's not a great awareness ofwhat it costs and what the impact

(12:07):
of that is once you graduate.
And there, that should be includedin what's taught in schools.
On the periphery, it's taught or it'soffered through your counseling offices,
but it's not part of the curriculum.
So really kids are going into it blindly.
The majority of them, because.
Not everybody has that type of family.

(12:29):
I know I didn't.

Yeah.
So what about you, Rob?
To that point, did your parents whoboth were extremely successful in
their educational career and justtheir careers in general, did you think
Did they have conversations with youabout the financial risks of college?
Did they help you understandthat from a number standpoint?

Yeah, so that was, that's a tough one, Jeremy.
Not tough, but interesting, right?
Because it's unique.
Our conversation with my parents was, asyour parent, our responsibility is to make
sure you get out of college with no debt.
So my parents made sure thatall my siblings got out of
college with no debt because theyknew the impact it would have.
On us after college tryingto grow in different sectors.

(13:08):
However, as part of that, it wasinteresting because they said, but you
have to study something that will be ableto support you and your family and justify
the costs for us to pay for school.
So for example, we couldn't go and donot to psychology or anything else, but
if you can't spend a hundred thousanddollars or whatever on a tuition
and you get a job making 50 or 40,You'll never, it doesn't make sense.

(13:32):
Not a good investment.
So part of their structure was we'llinvest in you, but you have to invest in
something that will be able to take careof you and your family going forward.

But were you allowed to say no to that?
Could you have said, nah, Idon't wanna go to college.
Keep your money, give me themoney that you would spend on
that, and let me do X, Y, z,

No, it was not optional.
So here's what's funny, right?
So I'm the oldest of five, five kids.
The first four of us, it was not optional.
My sister came alongand it became optional.
So she was the one that was able topick what she wants to do in life.
And this is 16 years after me.
And so I think they began tosee even regardless of that

(14:10):
piece, everyone turned out fine.
But if you look at our pedigree,my next younger brother went
to Georgia tech and Stanford.
One of my brothers is in medical fieldand one of them went to tuck and Dartmouth
school and my sister went to Amherst andpart of the agreement was like you said
that there'd be no college that, however,I can remember having conversations.
Cause my parents alsohelped a lot of my cousins.

(14:31):
And one of the challenging thingswas my parents said, look, we're
going to help you get into college,but here's the risk, right?
This is what it costs you.
These are the, is the impactit has after you get out.
And this will be part of yourongoing debt for X amount of years.
And if you're okay withthat, fine, we'll help you.
If not, maybe you should consider.
Barber school.

(14:52):
Maybe you should become a mechanic.
Maybe you should go to one of thesetechnical trades where you can get up
to a career faster and with less debt.
So we've had both conversations, butour path is a little bit different.

Sure.
But I love that.
I love the fact that they were.
Aware of the numbers, right?
You said it's a good investment.
I think that's a fantastic way toconsider it because, myself and Jeremy
Ritz being full time market interactors,like we are pretty adapt to the, Hey,
if you spend whatever 500, 000 on aposition, that's a large sum of capital.

(15:27):
If you can get back 560, 000.
Have a 60, 000 return on500, 000 investment and your,
what was your risk, right?
And if your risk was 10, 000,you made 60, 000, it's a good
return on your investment.
So it from that perspective, I thinkis really unique because if A lot
of parents sit down today and say tothemselves, am I prepared, willing,

(15:51):
able, and capable to actually payfor my child to go to college, right?
What that does in my mindis it sets a standard.
And if parents have that standard goingforward and they say, all right, if you
do go to college, we will cover the costs.
If you do not go to college, here's adifferent routes for you, which I got

(16:13):
to have a great question coming up now.
I think just being aware of as parents,hey, this is and should be a standard.
What that does is when you raise yourstandards, it raises your quality of life.
It raises the questionsthat you have to ask, right?
Because, oh my gosh, now wehave to pay an extra 100, 000.
From our income for our two or threechildren every year for three years

(16:36):
when they get into college, how can Icreate more value in the marketplace
to be worth that amount of money?
That's a different questionthat has to be asked.
So I'm just going to throwthis up for whoever wants it.
What's a better route, fullstop, technical college or
a four year degree college.

When you say better, Jeremy, what do you mean?
Define better for me.

Better success.
Everyone who goesthrough it will get jobs.
They will have less debt.
They will be more primed andset up for the future for
the success for their family.

Choices.
I'd put it as choices.
Like that, that somebody hasmore choices in their life.

Oh, it's challenging.
Because there's certain folks who don'thave choices right now, and they need
to stop the bleed now, meaning in thenext 12 months, they need to create
some kind of income or have a skillso they can stabilize because not to
bleed where they can have simple healthcare access to food, safe communities.

(17:36):
And there's a piece that says after that,then you can begin to think about what
success looks like and so on and so forth.
So if I were to, if I were to lookat the per dollar return, I would
say technical school right now.
I would say if I look at whatour carpenters, and I built
a lot of solar farms, right?
And so looking at what I pay our masterelectricians, 125 to 150 an hour.

(17:57):
To come on a site and connect ourlaborers to that, do the installation.
If you use prevailing wage, $52 an hour.
I got 18-year-old kids after comingthrough our program, 13 weeks, making
$52 an hour plus time and a half.
So not saying that's like thecap they're their pinnacle.
They want to get to, 20 years from now.

(18:18):
But in terms of resources now andstopping the bleed and stabilizing
family now, I believe the technicalskills, the technical schools are
the best return on investment.
At this junction,

All right, Rich, let's hear your point of

Yeah.
So I actually just want topiggyback off what Rob said.
And I agree with Rob,but here's the thing.
And this is something that wefought against in my school is
technical schools are stigmatized.
If you decide to go the routeof vocational technical school
you're seen as a, a techie.
Yeah.
Yeah.

(18:50):
Yeah.
Like you

make it.
Not

do anything else,

But you're throwing out those figures there that these
kids are making in these professions,these are good professions.
This is great work.
And they don't realize that it'sstigmatized for whatever reason.
But there's tremendous reward there.
Whereas if you go the route ofcollege depending on what your
degree is in, you're not guaranteedthat same type of outcome.

(19:17):
So I would have to agree that,the the trades are powerful.

Can I add something there, Jeremy?
And I think part of thechallenge is that people don't
look at trees and sexy, right?
With social media, my mindwas social media has done.
It's showing people like,Oh, you can get rich quick.
If you do this and this andthis, and it lives like this.
But if you ever noticed, they don'thighlight the plumbers, the carpenters,
the folks who, and I know some ofthe most successful people I know

(19:44):
work with builders, home builders,church builders, home builders.
And this was all based offof carpentry and hand skills.
So right now, though, we don't seethe young people don't see the sexy.
They want to get into tech.
They want to get intosomething that's online.
Bye.
And they're not looking at these hands onskills that no one can ever take from you.
So regardless of where you go, whatcountry, whatever happens to your

(20:05):
background, you can always build somethingwhen you have a technical skill that
you can leverage anywhere in the world,

Correct.
What I heard you saying really,Rob, is speed and efficiency.
If you want to go and create a differentlifestyle for your family, if you need
to create more income for you and yourchildren let's say in the next year, and
I would argue that there's a humongous.

(20:33):
Group of our population whowould probably fit that category.
Technical college is the route to go.
And to Jeremy's point, if we makeit less, less weak or pathetic to
go, it's not like a second choice.
If we find a way.
As a country or as a social media populaceto highlight, highlight the power and

(20:57):
the the proficiency of technical college,the pervasive way for that to generate
and help provide not only more jobs,but higher paying jobs now, because you
have to ask the question, we all knowthat artificial intelligence is coming.
We all know that.
A lot of people thought it was going totake the McDonald's worker job, the very

(21:21):
front end low level, burger flipping job.
Like we thought that was the onesthat AI was going to take immediately.
But what we've seen happen is it startsto also take a lot of the creative jobs,
very fast video makers, photographs.
specialists, bookkeepers,sometimes even lawyers, right?

(21:44):
AI going to be somereally big shifts there.
And it reminds me of when we startedgoing from an agrarian culture where,
you know, 99 percent of the world,not to mention 99 percent of the U.
S., but 99 percent of the world wasfocused on how can we create food?
That was the industry.
And once you started once the cotton gingets created and a few other powerful

(22:07):
inventions, then you start to speedup the need or the lack of people that
actually work in the fields that actuallygo out and create food for our country.
That was a huge shift.
Which is one of the things, one ofthe aspects that caused the dust bowl
and the great depression, because youhad so many people that were jobless.
And I say so many people, by theway, it's about 25 percent in

(22:30):
the great depression was the potwas the amount of unemployment.
So we still had one out of everyfour was unemployed, but three
out of every four were employed.
And that's also a big thing tokeep in mind as we had this huge
shift technology technologically.
But I think the big piece thata lot of people are overlooking.
Yeah.
Is the value, the cost of tuition.

(22:53):
So let's just ask this question.
Just want to have fun with it.
Jeremy, how do you think, or whydo you think, or could we decrease
the cost of higher education sothat it gives people either better
value or at least keeps up with.
how much the livingwage is in the country.

That's a great question.
And I'm so sorry, guys, I'm havinga little issue here on my computer.
Let me

That's okay.

Took care of that.
Wow.
That's.
That's a banger of a question.

it

you come back to me on that?
Let me let me, I need tothink on that one, man.

Think on it.

and I actually was thinking about that last night.
But come back to me.

Yeah.
I'm gonna come back to you, Wallace.
How do we lower the costof higher education?
Because that's the other piecewith technical schools, right?
Technical schools are less expensivethan higher education as well.
So not only are they faster, Butthey cost supremely less money.
It's staggering.
80 percent less than a four year degree.

I think there's a company out of New York that I work with called
FedCap and I think they got it right.
And what they have created waswhat's called stackable credentials.

Okay.

So you would start with an entry level credential that covers
your basic life skills, balancing acheckbook, safety, stuff like that.
And then you can add basicconstruction, everything from hand
tools, power tools, you name it.
Then you can layer off.
It's called a bridgeway program.
Then you can bridge off into.
Electrical, you can bridge offinto other technical skills.

(24:28):
You can bridge off into plumbing.
Then after that, you can add anotherlayer where you become a journeyman.
Then you can add anotherlayer, you become a master.
And my point is each layer equatesto a different layer of wealth,
which allows you to pay down some ofthe costs as you build versus going
through four years of, 50, 000 ayear, which I paid my door tuition.

(24:53):
So on and so forth.
You have 200, 000 by the timeyou get out making no income.
And so I think what it does, two things.
One, it builds the the successof the student and that it gives
them time to mature in terms ofwhat direction they want to go.
Number two, they can also adjustto the market conditions, right?
So something else is becoming hot.
AI started.
So this.
This software program might not bethe route now, let's look this way.

(25:15):
And then the last piece isthey can make money as they go.
If they need to work two years tosave some more money before they go to
next level, fine, but at least they'renot capped out at some total income.
So I like the stackablecredential approach.
And I think if we look at that, that it'llbe an easier way to minimize the cost, but
also reach the same academic and financiallevels that they're looking to get to.

Okay.
Yeah.
One of my, one of my takes, whichis actually in a way happening,
and this is a big, probably likesystem wide change or shift.
And again, maybe this will spur yourthoughts Ritz, but one of my big ideas
that I had at some point was The peoplethat need long, longer, larger education

(26:01):
packages shouldn't go into debt for those.
Case in point, doctors.
Doctors, potentially someengineers, potentially some
architects, or individuals thathave to go eight years plus.
So not a choice, but they have to inorder to really become proficient.

(26:23):
So how would you do thatwould be a question, right?
Because that's really the ultimate peoplethat I probably at this point, from a
career standpoint, care the most aboutdecreasing the cost is our doctors.
Because doctors have to go, theyhave to go, they can't go to a
technical college and become a doctor.
You can't do that in a year.
So you have to go six, eight,12 years in the college system

(26:46):
to learn at a higher level.
And that's going to putyou into a lot of debt.
And then if they're in a lot ofdebt, they have tons of stress.
They're already working 12, 18 hour days.
You have not only medical insurance, youhave to pay for malpractice insurance,
so many different aspects that there'sa lot of stress on our doctors.
And therefore a lot of peopledon't want that profession anymore.
And that's not going to be good forthe country if we have no doctors.

(27:08):
So what if gentlemen, we do not allowthose careers or certain careers,
let's just call it the medicalfield to pursue to pursue any debt
obligations as they go through theireducational career, the people that
are not allowed to get scholarships.
Ready for this one would be businessand finance and entrepreneurship.

(27:30):
If you go to a college, which I did toget a finance degree, which I did and
was able to apply for some scholarships,trying to get a finance degree from a
top 10 business college in the country.
Now, if you think if you're going togo to finance, the goal is to make
as much money as possible to help aslittle people as possible, ultimately.

(27:51):
What do you need?
What do you need a scholarship forlike you should you're the ones that
should be making as much like you don'tneed to pay less money for college.
So if you're going to get a liberalarts degree, if you're going to get a
business degree, an entrepreneurshipdegree, colleges should just
disallow from scholarships fromthose particular careers, taking
that money and doing what being ableto apply it towards the doctorate

(28:14):
or the longer term degree needers.
Thoughts on that Ritz?

Yeah.
I think that makes a lot of sense becauseyou're prioritizing those professions
that are making the greatest contributionto society which is important.
And you're right, finance or business.
There's not a lot of.
Philanthropy in the beginning,maybe toward the end there
Coming back to what you asked me.

(28:41):
How do we make college cheaper?
I had an epiphany here.
What's the one thing that youngadults don't have a lot of?
Money.
What do they have a lot of?
Energy productivity.
And so this kind of ties into somethingwe were attempting to do my final
years as principal, which is wherewe were trying to create internships

(29:04):
or onsite work based opportunities.
And so the best way to learn aprofession or to learn a trade
or a skill is to actually do it.
You can sit in a classroom all youwant, but until you're thrown in
the fire and you're forced to learnit, you're not going to learn it.
So maybe a model can be created towhere, Hey we can help you pay for

(29:29):
your college by having a role tocontribute to this business, this
corporation, this company, this college.
And I know we have some of that outthere that exists now, but if you would
amplify it and scale it up, maybe thatwipes out 50 percent of the tuition
because you're adding value to thecollege or to the business connections

(29:53):
that they have in the community.
And so it's a, it's anindirect way to get around.
Yeah.
Hey.
I don't have the money to pay forthe tuition, but I have the effort
that I can give you my time, myvalue to help your business, your
organization, the college grow.
So that could be a creative solutionand it benefits the student because

(30:13):
they're getting on site training.

I like that take.
What do you think, Robert Wallace?

I like your idea.
I do.
I don't Jay.
I'm honestly because I think that thedoctors when they come out, they're making
so much money that's why they do the eightyears so they can make the million dollars
or 2 million a year and salary to do.
So I think there has to be some type.
Let me say this.
My counter would be if we'regoing to do it for the doctors.
We got to do it for teachers.
Because I believe they're just as valuable

(30:41):
As the doctors are in terms of theoverall ecosystem of the United

Sure.
Totally.

would have to stabilize it.
Maybe, and maybe that's your point, isthat for all those critical functions,
police, military the teachers, wewould have to do the same thing
across all those sectors, I think,

Yeah, agreed.
Agreed.
It really, it's just precisely my man.
This is, it's really a discussionor awareness of, can we start
shifting where the money to,from these colleges go to, right?
Where does it go to andwho needs it the most?
Because if you are throwing outscholarships, just willy nilly.
And you're having all this capital thatdoesn't need to be spent on individuals

(31:22):
that probably Aka would never use itnot to bring out Belmont too strongly,
but Belmont is a college in Asheville,Tennessee that is one of the largest
private colleges in the country.
The Dean of Belmont is the secondhighest paid Dean in the country.
And the tuition there can rangeanywhere between 125, 000 a year

(31:44):
to a quarter million a year.
And the majority of the studentsthere, they get degrees in like
commercial flute playing or commercialsaxophone or audio engineering.
And there's a lot of.
Students, they're going throughBelmont every year that are going
into crazy amounts of debt that again,maybe would or would not have to, but

(32:07):
specifically, there's also a lot ofthem that are getting scholarships
again, that probably shouldn't.
It's if you have the wherewithal tobe understanding of the cost of this
degree, to your point, Rob, the costof the degree and how much are you
going to make as a commercial floutist.
40, 000 a year max for 99.

(32:29):
9999999 percent is it worth going tothat particular college and spending
that particular amount of money?
Probably not, but there does need, in myopinion, there, there really does need
to be a conversation about this, whichis why I'm glad that we're having it.
And I think ultimately being aware thatthere needs to be some level of change

(32:51):
because the amount of students thatalways argue or fuss or get upset about
the amount of student loan debt, eventhough they may or may not have been
aware of it, to Jeremy's point earlier,and to then your point, Rob, like a
doctor, you have the best of the best,the top 1 percent in the world probably
would make a million dollars as a salary.
The vast majority of doctors after.

(33:14):
Eight years, 10 year workingis probably somewhere between
200 and 350, 000 on average.
Even that, having to outpace the amountof debt because debt's not something
that can be wrote off as bankruptcy.
There's a lot there.
There's a lot there.

Jay, back to your point real quick before we move on.
There's another interestingmodel that we should consider,
which is the online model.
Because if you see what happenedafter Kobe, a lot of the brick
and mortar institutions went away.
Cost came down across some of theschools because now there's no room in
board because you're studying virtually.
But the number of thestudents enrolling went up.

(33:49):
If you look at New Hampshire University,which offers a degree of all kind of
degrees online, Their tuition cost isa fraction of what you would pay to go
to a brick and mortar school and theirenrollment rates have gone up 600%.
I believe it is.
And so I wonder how that affects yourmodel in terms of bringing the cost down,
but still being able to offer degreesin certain sectors, but minimizing the

(34:13):
cost because now part of is virtual.
And maybe your last two years are inperson, or maybe, there's one semester
every one month, every quarter you go.
And do that part in person

go for it.

Yeah.
So looking at this from a differentperspective but to Rob's point and talking
about educators, 100%, I agree that,if we're going to do this for doctors,
we have to do it for educators as well.
But I think that this.
This pokes at a deeper conversationthat needs to be had about
what we value as a country.

a side.

Yes.
And we talked before about, the stigmaassociated with technical schools.
There's a stigmaassociated with education.
If you're a teacher, if you're a principalyou're looked at as, Oh, or what's
the quote, those that can't do teach.
But when we think about it, maybethis is a, And I don't know how
this could be done, but throughresearch, how do we quantify which

(35:12):
professions create the greatest impact?
On our

Society.
Yeah.

And then from there you have an equation.
We, you make it mathematical that somehowinfluences how much support or help is
provided going for those professions,because online school is great and I
do believe there's a place for it, butthe human connection that comes through
teaching those relationships, I'msure all of us can think of somebody.

(35:42):
Who if it wasn't for that person whotaught us something that we wouldn't
have achieved what we have so youknow that's really what comes to
me and thinking about that deeply

. jerremynewsome (35:53):
No.
So that's a great perspective,is essentially figuring out a
quantification model for whichvalues we need to focus on the most.
And I think that word has come up a lotin past podcasts as our listeners will
know specifically one with the debt.
Of the nations right now we'refocusing on student debt and
educational debt But from a debt ofthe nation that word came up a bunch.

(36:16):
What are we spending moneyon shows our truest values?
And for you bringing that word up,Ritz, of saying we need to focus
on teachers I think is one of myfavorite topics because as you being
a teacher in the, in your past life,essentially, and seeing the struggle
and the wildly unequal pay structure.

(36:39):
for spending so much time andso much energy and being a
cornerstone of this country.
I do think 100 percent that teachers neednot only either more pay on the back end
or less expenses on the front end, becausethat's a profession that a lot of people
love to overlook as being extremely.

(37:01):
Valuable to this nation because everyone of us that has children, where
do we put them right during the week?
Who's spending time withthem during the week?
It's like teachers are

And Jeremy can I add something

Please.

The impact of a great teacher on a child

Priceless.

It's priceless.
And here's the thing.
If you're putting shitty teachers,just to be candid, in front of kids,
and I've seen them, they're out there,they exist, you're hurting kids.
And not to go on a tangent to Promoteteachers getting paid more, but

(37:41):
great teachers don't want to teachanymore because it's financially,
they can't provide for their families.
And a lot of peoplewill make the argument.
It's only a 10 month, a year job.
They have the summers off great teachers.
The job doesn't stop attwo 45 or three o'clock.
Your great teachers are makingconnections with parents.
They're calling home.
They're making sure that theyhave food that they have a jacket.

(38:05):
They're preparing materials.
They're all in for these kids andthose people are special and the
impact that they can have on thelife of a child and influencing the
trajectory of their quality of life.
You can't put a price tag on it.
If you want to create the greatestcountry ever or the, our best state of

(38:30):
existence ever, that's what it takes.

Yep, it does.
And that was a visionthat I've had for a while.
I think some of our previousepisodes talk about how do we
change the educational system.
Changing the educational system reallydoes look like putting the best teachers
in front of the students the most.
It doesn't matter if it's a blend ofvirtual and also definitely in person,
but if you have, and I'm just going topick a person that's taught me a lot,

(38:53):
although I wouldn't specifically say he'sa teacher, but let's just say Tony Robbins
has the ability to be in front of 12, 000people physically with another 20, 000
people online over a week, just one week.
giving them for 12 hours a day, extremelyintense, very immersive learning

(39:14):
experiences to help the individuals,the grown individuals, and also
kids be aware of how to change theirinternal composition, how to change
their physical and emotional states.
But let's just imagine foryou, Jeremy, again, I would
call you an incredible teacher.
Both you and I love teachingat our core and you've heard me
say it a million times, right?

(39:34):
If a high school history teachercan make 600, 000 a year, travel the
world, live wherever they want tolive and do whatever they want to do.
And so important to the world,I'd probably be a high school
history teacher right now.
But to that point, There are certainhis teachers like John Green who
did just that, where he's like, allright I can't do this in person, so
I'm going to create YouTube channelsand pour in on a massive scale.

(39:59):
So ironically, the answer to thequestion I asked earlier, which was
like, how can we decrease some ofthe costs of some of these schools
really would be get better teachers.
Decrease the cost of the amount ofteachers that we currently have, who
are not amazing, who are not reachingcertain standards, who are not pouring
in their heart and soul into becomingan amazing teacher, and then take the

(40:20):
ones who are just absolutely terrificand find ways to put them on a larger
pedestal so they can impact and influencemore case in point, Jordan Peterson,
going from a teacher that no one knewabout, except the people in class to now
being able to impact millions of peopleevery single month, what's your take on

yeah, again, amplifying, bringing up your best
teachers and putting your resources

To support them.
Yeah.

support them.
I think that makes so much sense.
And just the flip side of that too, justto paint a just the other side here to
consider is, For every great teacherthat you have and not to focus on the
negative, but you have your bad teacherswho the good teachers look at and say,
all right this person right at two 45,they're walking right out, out the door.

(41:08):
They're not doing a damn thing in home.
They're not calling home to the parents.
They're not doing anything.
And they're gettingpaid the same that I am.
And if you're going to start doingthings to reward your teachers who are
succeeding at a high level, then you alsohave to take into account the teacher's
unions who protect these shitheads.
That's the other part of it.
As we're talking about solvingthese problems that exist in public

(41:30):
education, I know this is more,your high school, middle school,
elementary, but you can do that.
But there has to be somethingto that into account and
overcome that obstacle as well.

Rob, let's hear your take on that.

I agree with what Rich said.
I think that it is important thatyou be able to levelize, but that's
the same across any industry.
You got shitheads that are doctors.
Some are good.
Some are bad.
You got the same thing.
They're engineers, CEOs, you name it.
So I think what you're saying though, isbecause the education piece is so critical
to our success, we should put extra focuson making sure that we're pouring into our

(42:09):
kids in a way that will build the country.
One of the epiphanies or ideas Ihad as part of this conversation
was, how do we flip it a little bit?
Is there a world where we not onlyreduce the cost, But we also have some
type of federal subsidy, maybe reducetax bracket or tax taxable income for
those to those who decide to be teachersor those who go in the fields that are

(42:32):
more critical for our infrastructure.
Maybe they get a, maybe they pay10 percent versus the 38 percent
or whatever that number is.
So we can make up.
The Delta, but not just maybe notincreasing their salaries, but also
reducing some of their debt or costs.
And that's something we can controlas a nation because the folks who make
it more cool to pay into the bucket.
Great.

(42:52):
The folks who are making less,but are critical, we reduce
their tax taxable income.
So they pay less in taxes, whichmeans they keep more money.
And now we help stabilizethe ship a little bit.
That could be somethingthat we can consider.

it is, that's a, that's an interesting proposition
because, one of my things that Ilove a flat tax system personally.
I really do.
I think it's like you, you gotta pay.
And believe it or not, when I hada ginormous panel of entrepreneurs
talking about America's debt.
I proposed a flat tax and they'reall like, yeah, it makes sense.
Whereas like you, you can't not for thedouble negatives lovers of the world.

(43:30):
You not do it.
Like you have to pay, we all know asentrepreneurs, you have ways to skirt
around the tax code with the IRS andbuy depreciation and pay less taxes.
No.
You pay this amount as an individual,a corporation, an S corp, a SQL, you
pay this amount of taxes, high five.
Thanks for playing the game.
And to your point, how awesome wouldit be as like, all right, if you are

(43:54):
registered as a teacher, if that isyour profession, if you list that as
a. Your primary focus for income andfor creation, you could pay less taxes.
I think that's a really unique idea.
I

That comes back again to discussions about what we value
because that has to be, everybodywould have to be on board with that and
agree with those greater principles sothat it can then funnel down into the
practicality component, the brass tacks.

mean, it's, the big thing is also that the reason this
is so important for my listeners is85 percent of student loan borrowers.
are delaying home ownership.
So if you have this ginormous debt ifyou are a student loan situation, and
that's something we can talk aboutnow too, is how do we just essentially

(44:50):
for those who have debt now, isthere something that we should do?
We know that Biden at leastattempted to do something with it.
Which was if you have student loan overa certain amount and over a certain
age that everyone across the board gotlike a 10, 000 reduction, 85 percent
of those who have student loans aresimply not going to pay or buy a home.

(45:13):
Now they're going to continue to rentand then random statistic, 33 percent
of those who have student loan debt andwe're also Hispanic, they delay marriage.
And that same statistic, right?
37 percent of Hispanic borrowersare also delaying having children.
So if you can see this and that'sjust one one economic statistic where

(45:36):
it's like the people that are in debt,you all know how much debt sucks.
And the pressure and the stressthat brings on, and then you know
that you don't want to add to it.
So then getting additional degreesdecreases, and then getting married,
having children decreases, and buyinghomes decrease because it's just debt on
top of debt on top of debt on top of debt.

(45:57):
Is there a world where the majority ofcollege kids could graduate something
without Any real debt, or can we makeit where it is less targeted and less
focused where you can potentially filebankruptcy if you have too much debt?

(46:21):
Should that be a possibility?
Should it be a possibility whereThe debt structure is created
where it's not as egregious.
It's not as amateur immortalizedwhere it's really just
battling against the end user.
And there's so many things that wehave to address and we have to really
take up on here because ultimately.
If we can start getting down to thereal core issue, which is if you go

(46:45):
to college, regardless of your currentcareer, and you're getting a four year
degree, the likelihood that you'regoing to go into debt is over 90%.
And if you're going into debt,that's going to create a cause, a
huge financial strain continuallygoing forward in the future.
And we can say that universities areexperiencing more debt for or raising

(47:06):
their prices for a large sum of Reasons.
So I'm asked a systemic question,Robert, if every college went away in
the nation right now, the major maincolleges, if they just were closed and
could no longer operate, where wouldthe children go and what impact do
you think would have on the nation?

Great question.
It's a great question.
I think you would see a lotmore homeschooling, right?
So you'd have individuals where theparents, whatever sector they're in,
they begin to pull more into theirchildren to get them prepared either
for that sector, because they know it.
I still go back to the technicalschools because you're always going
to have infrastructure challenges,whether it be fixing your water

(47:46):
heater, whether it be building a home,whether it be generating electricity.
There's a whole, there's somany technical hands on pieces
that would have to take place.
But I think you would see alot more homeschooling, man.
It's like you, you would just like, forexample, if you and your kids you'd be
pouring into them on how to do trades,to invest in real estate, all the things
that took you 20 years to learn, youwould package it up and try and teach

(48:09):
to them in four years or two years.
And then give them the resourcesto actually go take advantage of
it so they can build from there.
And I think it would also makemore families responsible for
educating their kids, man.
So we should do two things.
One, make you thinktwice about having kids.
To make sure there's something thatyou can do and you can invest in.
But two, you're going to pickcareers and or sectors that you
know that your kids can have asustainable life after you're gone.

(48:33):
And so I think you would see bothof those kind of shift across
the country if that was the case.
But that's a great question.

Yeah, just an interesting one to pose.
What's your thoughts, Ritz?
Colleges go away tomorrow.
What happens?

So the first thing that jumped into my mind was YouTube.

Yeah.
Yeah.

you can learn anything and everything on YouTube and, going along
with what Rob said, the homeschooling,there would just be more ownership and
responsibilities that families wouldhave to take for their children, which
there's going to be a family strain there.
To take on that responsibility.

(49:10):
Because that's not somethingthat's part of the common practice.
I think there would be some unintendedconsequences that we would have
to manage that way, but yeah,just, Taking that responsibility.

We would change the standard of the American families.
That's for sure.
Yep.
Dave, I know you had a question.

All right, I want you to put on your like American
taxpayer hat on a moment.

Yeah, I'll put it on.

There you go.
Rob said that Rob has a hat now.

I don't think we'd even be having much of a question
or much of a discussion hereif college wasn't so expensive.
We'd be like yeah, whatever.
And in most countries, almost allof them, it's not that expensive.
So the inflation of this thing, it'sgone up 196 percent outpacing regular

(50:02):
inflation in the last 20 years.
Average cost for bachelors is 50k.
a year.
That means that there's plenty of degreesthat are a lot more expensive than that.
And that's just for bachelors.
If you go for an advanceddegree, look out.
And then average debtfor bachelors is 32K.

(50:25):
So I think inflation is the question.
And I think that comes from whereinflation comes from, which is
too much money in the system.
This is coming from beingable to get these huge loans.
Like, why are we lettingAnybody who's 18 years old to

(50:47):
take out these enormous loans.
The other place that this comes fromis research grants from the government.
So it seems to me that here aresome two, two of the policy issues.
One is.
We can cancel all this debtthat's already been floated and
or we could cancel all loans andgrants What would you say to that?

Or we could also reduce or to your points, I call subsidy loans
and grants that will help offset the cost.
I'm going to correlate it to thesolar industry is the industry.
So what I've noticed is the moresubsidy we have on the federal level,
the higher the subsidy, the higherthe price to construct goes up.

(51:32):
The lower the subsidy, we had thismagical way of figuring it out so that
it works with the number that we had.
And I think we could apply thatsame thing across the school loans.
Like for them, if you know you're goingto get the Pell Grant and other grants
and your overall cost will shrinkby, let's call it 7, 000 on average.
I think the school will say, okay,we can charge 7, 000 more because we

(51:54):
know we're going to get that piece.
And then now we can still cover our costs.
I've seen it in the solar industry wherewith the inflation Reduction Act and
the ITC, if we can give a 50 percenttax credit, you would think that savings
passes on to the end user, where we givethem a 50 percent savings on energy cost.
It doesn't.
It just causes the price ofconstruction to go up and development

(52:16):
fees Profitability to go up, butthat end value to the user is the
same, even with all the subsidies.
And so what I'm looking forward toin this new generation, starting
January is stabilizing the market.
I don't think we need all these subsidies.
I think if you pull them back.
It'll stabilize the cost, whichmeans now you're paying for value.

(52:36):
And I think that same thing can beapplied to the education system, is
that if it should create enough valuewhere it can stand on its own two
feet, not be as expensive as it isright now, but cover the cost, right?
The cost of the cost.
And I think that's somethingwe could look at as a nation.

Oh, wait.
Okay.
Let's talk about this cost is thecost I get it But you know going up
196 percent right having these thingsbeing like 50 50 50, 000 a year.
That money is not going to professors.
I know plenty of professorsand they are in poverty.
Harvard's endowment is 50 billion dollars.

(53:12):
Why anybody is paying fortuition as Harvard is beyond me.
So like

It

I throw it?
Yeah.

And I'm agreeing with you, Dave.
When I say for clarity I'm sayingexactly what you're saying is
that, the cost is the hard cost.
The cost should be the cost for theteachers, eight hours a day cost for
the facility, electrical bill and thevendor facility and the cost of food.
That's what I'm saying.
So if you look at I'm agreeing withyou and the cost should be the fixed
actual cost to operate, not all theadditional benefits of the subsidies

(53:44):
Raise subsidy and then say,okay, now student pay more.
I know you're getting 10 grand free.
So I'm going to increasetuition by 10 grand.
That's I'm so I'm agreeing with you.
There's been a clarify that point.
But

so what about having controls and checks and balances in place?
And what I mean by that is okay.
50, 000 a year for a bachelor'sdegree, a hundred thousand dollars
a year, whatever, over four years.
Great.
You can charge that.
However, we want to see the returnon investment for your graduate in

(54:15):
the equivalent of this amount orpercentage of what they are paying in.
Okay.
If that is not met, there is some sortof government control, some sort of
sanction that penalizes that institutionor university, because what accountability
is there for these institutions of higherlearning, their graduates are actually

(54:35):
achieving or earning at the level ofwhat the institution is earning at.
Now that's a level of accountability.
Would they be willing to puttheir money where their mouth is?

you create I'm not going to call it segregation, but I'm going to
call it back to what's a good investment.
If I know I'm accountable for this personand their ability to create wealth after
college, I'm going to start scrutinizingSATs more, PSATs more, your family
pedigree, probably your credit scoreand see, okay, is this person like.
Even if they get adegree, can I place them?

(55:09):
We look at, we see this in thetechnical side in our SOAR training.
We do a TAE test when theyfirst come in and see if they
understand basic math and English.
Then we go through a one on onetest to make sure that they are,
the individual themselves can learn.
Then we have them do a sample hands onpiece to see, are you scared of heights?
Can you use power tools?
And to your point, it costs us17, 000 per student to train them.

(55:31):
But I know they're going to getout and make it 60, 000 a year if
they can't complete the course.
And so we spent a lot of time onthe beginning side, weeding out.
Those folks who may not cut it so thatwe can get that return on investment.
And I think if we did that, thesame thing would apply to colleges
now, where you start looking atother factors to see if the person
would be able to cover their end.

(55:52):
Otherwise, there would be some costs.
So I think it's a great idea.
I'm just trying to think how you would.
How you can roll that out and make sureit's apples to apples across the board.
Do you know what I mean?

Yeah, but it doesn't have to be apples.
Apples don't necessarily, you can havecertain colleges that are hard to get
into that scrutinize their studentsmore that make it more of a challenge,
just any, anything else, right?
Like you have the NBA and you have otherleagues, you have professional baseball
and you have minor league baseball.
There, there can certainly be.
Standards that are are moregeared towards those that have

(56:24):
better learning capacities, right?
You said, you mentionedSATs and credit scores.
I don't think that has to be terrifying.
We don't have to be afraid of thosethat have the awareness Or the
capacity or the mental bandwidth toscore higher or to do better either.

comes down to upbringing now.
So if you didn't have access to goodschools as a youth, cause you lived
in a Baltimore city, now you have noshot at getting into a good school.
And so I think if we want to take thatapproach, we have to take it all the
way back to like sixth grade and kindof really rebuild those pieces to make
sure that when they get to collegelevel, they're ready to compete.

Exactly.
And back to my point, because the thingis, every single time every discussion
that we have and that we will continue tohave in solving America's problems, always
is going to come back to better education.
Better schools, better education.
Like it always comes back to that.
You said sixth grade,but that's middle school.

(57:20):
Like how important isit for us as a nation?
Rich, you mentioned value.
Is it time for us to start valuing ourchildren at the number one value system?
Yes.
Where I, yeah.
So where I was like, that has to be,if that can become at some point,
the forefront Or a campaign or forour awareness as a country where

(57:43):
it's this is what we need to do.
We need to change what we're being taught,who is teaching it, how it's being taught,
where it's being taught making sure ourschools are extremely safe and doing that.
across the board, right?
An inner city school in Baltimore, toyour point, Rob, should have almost the
exact same, if not even the same standardof a school in the suburbans of Atlanta

(58:09):
or Nashville, Tennessee, because it'slike the government and the local state
cares so much that it's protected, thatit's cared for, that it's provided for,
that we spread out Awarenesses and wealthand help and teachers and infrastructure

(58:30):
that makes it situationally easy.
So that the best of the best can be inthe schools that need it to be the best
of the best and you have the best of thebest in schools that have easier access
as well because they have access tomore wealth and more awareness at home.
So yes, and yes, to yourpoint, Rob, I totally agree.
Quick question.
I think this will be fun fortheir listeners who may be in

(58:52):
financial debt or student loandebt at this exact moment in time.
Dave Colling mentioned, shouldwe just wipe it all away?
I'm actually a huge advocate of no onthat personally because I do believe
that debt and income and wealth issecond grade math repeated consistently.
So we do have to sit down and learnhow that this problem happens.

(59:13):
And so just instead of.
Fixing the problem because it's here.
We changed the problem at the rootcore and that root core probably
stems from the awareness of debt.
So Jeremy, this is going to bea question that's going to be
potentially directed towards just you.
Tell me how much debt did you have andhow the heck did you get out of it?

(59:34):
150 grand.
And trump, Biden, or Obamadidn't wave a wand for you.
How did you get out of that much debt?
You got kids, bro.
You got a wife.
You got a house.

yeah, there's this beautiful thing called the stock
market it has blessed me abundantlyand continues to bless me abundantly.
And had it not been for that, my lastyear As high school principal, I made
157, 000, which was a great salary.
I thought it was great.
And my goal superintendent, I'm goingto make, 200, 250, 280, maybe max out

(01:00:07):
at 300, but this other world that existsin trading and investing, those numbers.
Don't scratch the surfaceof what is available.
So the markets made it ablefor me to, take care of that.
And then some, so

jerremynewsome (01:00:26):
But how though?
How'd you do it?
So there's a stock market okay.
But how though?
You just looked at it and made more

Jeremy Hritz (01:00:32):
No.
Obviously you're part of that personalstory with me and teaching me the
ropes of how to trade the markets, butstudying and learning and really giving.
Giving myself an education outside ofwhat I learned through courses, through
coaching you and just studying andbecoming obsessed with it and practicing
back trading, paper trading, and beingin the market and exposed to the risk,

(01:00:58):
even though you can lose, you protectyour downside, but when you have that
opportunity sometimes you're goingto have these incredible moments.
And I had an incredible moment.
I haven't, I had some this year,but none like this one where, you
make a half a million dollars ona trade and life changes forever.

Sure.
So walk me through then the very,very first interaction that you have
with the stock market as again this,for the listeners out there, this can
be, should be, is a tool for you tounderstand wealth and understand money
expansion in currency expansion, becausethe smartest people in the world.

(01:01:38):
Still find the stock market mysterious.
And that's what myprofessional was for 15 years.
So what was the very first interactionthat you had with the stock market?
Rich, the very, very first one.
What did it look like?
Walk us through that picture.

So was it, was this just buying a stock and just
holding it or like actual trading?

Either one.
Yeah.

school principal at the time.
The reason why I left education wasbecause as high school principal,
you're working 60, 70 hours a week.
You're gone at nights.
I have three young kids.
I wanted to prioritize my family.
So something had to change.
And so starting to learn trading,I had the the Robin Hood app on
my phone, which is just a broker.
I took a trade on Snapchat in myoffice as high school principal.

(01:02:29):
I had a little bit of downtime.
This was a day trade and Imade 284 in five minutes.
I saw this happen righton my phone, five minutes.
And I made about 396 a day.
When you break it down asprincipal, I called my wife.
I said, I'm done.
Like this is it.
I, and I'm not, there'sno way this is stupid.

(01:02:52):
And so you just, you there's fear aroundthe markets because everybody says
that the market's going to go to zero.
You can lose all your money.
And that's true if you're anidiot and you're a gambler and
you don't protect your risk.
But what is available every single day,even on weekends, if you're a crypto

(01:03:12):
trader, even on the, in the evenings, ifyou're a futures trader it's incredible,
and so we need to, in talking abouteducation, we need to make sure that our
constituents, our population understandshow this works, because there's enough.
Out there for everyone.
And then some and ittruly is life changing.

(01:03:34):
It

Yeah, absolutely.
100 percent agree.
So I'm gonna walk peoplethrough it, right?
So Jeremy gets an app ona phone, which is free.
It's called Robin hood.
It's free application to cost 0.
You download this application for 0.
He's sitting there behind his principaldesk and opens up Robin hood, transfers

(01:03:55):
some cash that he had saved from hischecking account in the Robin hood
and places a trade on Robin hood.
Guess how much that trade costs.
0 and purchases a stock of a companythat he knows uses and probably
every single one of his studentsinteracts with on a daily basis.

(01:04:16):
So his whole job as principalis to get kids off of Snapchat.
That was his job as a principal.
So he goes, all right, whyis everyone using this thing?
If everyone's using it, what's thestock price probably going to do?
Every single person thatI'm teaching uses it.
It's probably going to go higher.
So he buys some Snapchat shares.

(01:04:36):
The stock goes up a little bit that day,sells it, makes almost 300 bucks in that
five minute trade, fascinating to see.
But what the reason I want to bringthat up is because every single
person who's listening has theability and has access to do that.
It doesn't matter if you're black,brown, what skin color you got, or if
you are a felon, if you have gottenout of prison, if you have gotten out

(01:04:59):
of jail, the stock market does notcare if you're a Jehovah's witness, a
Catholic, a Protestant, or a Mormon.
It is welcoming you with openarms to increase your wealth and
or force you to study it becauseyou can lose a bunch of money.
I've done it.

(01:05:19):
It has happened, but it's not becausethe market did something that I was
unaware of it because I simply hadnot taken time or energy to truly
study and understand the downsides,the upsides and the math behind it.
So I know Dave has a question, butI want to share all that with you.
Whereas after Jeremystarts interacting with.

(01:05:40):
A free application.
Every single person listeningto this podcast can use to start
with 12 and you start with 12 andtake a trade, make a dollar a day.
Obviously this doesn't change youreconomics at all, but what it does
do is it starts telling your brain.
Wait a minute me, Ideserve to make more money.

(01:06:01):
I deserve to be more wealthy.
I just took money and made itbigger, pressing buttons and using
my mind, thinking and growing rich.
It starts to expand the opportunitiesof what's really available.
So Dave, go ahead.

Dave Conley (01:06:15):
So what's working about college?
We're pumping out Nobel prizes.
We're creating an enormousamount of wealth in America.
America is like the leaderin global innovation.
What's working?

Start with Rob.
Rob, what's working in college?
You have brothers that arejust absolutely crushing it.

Robert Wallace (01:06:36):
I think one of the biggest Pieces of them attending
the schools they went to is thenetwork of people they met, right?
So beyond just the education they got,their circle of friends come from an
influential group now who not onlylearn to think together, but also
maintain relationships after school.
And a lot of those deals and wealththey created was through those

(01:06:58):
relationships after they got out.
So beyond just learning how to thinkin school, the networking, That
came through that school is nowwhat's also helped sustain them.
So I think that part is huge, right?
Cause if you go to Stanford businessschool, you're probably going to be
in a room with 20 something otherCEOs who of which two are going to
hit blockbusters of which you couldget a small piece by just being in a

(01:07:20):
room and investing at the right time.
And a lot of those decisionshappen in that room.
So I do think that part is working.
I also think.
That that the educational pieces thatwe've seen across the country has helped
stabilize, how we look at help equalize.
I'm sorry.
I should say a lot of the sexism andracism and other isms we see across the
country I think education is the key tobreaking a lot of those things Because

(01:07:44):
creating wealth whether it be educationthrough Whether it be through trading,
it helps stabilize a lot of those things.
So I think those pieces are working.

Which brings me back to, I said, Tony Robbins earlier,
he taught me something a long timeago that proximity is power and
your network is your net worth.
So if you're bringing amazing men andwomen together and a a close or close
facility, AKA a classroom, a lunchroom, and you are in Stanford, you're

(01:08:14):
in UCLA, you were in university ofFlorida, you're in Miami Dade, you're
in these places where information.
Innovation is brewing.
What Dave mentioned earlier, thetechnology that is being created inside
our college systems through thesethink tanks, through these masterminds,

(01:08:35):
through these student led unions.
We're talking DoorDash, right?
We're talking Uber Eats,we're talking Uber, Airbnb.
There's a lot of these companiesthat get spurred off by individuals
being together, building something,creating something, open table.
It's a large list.
That has become innovatedcompanies that have been created

(01:08:57):
ideas that have been created.
What's working in college, Ritz?
You

So I would have to agree with Rob, just the networking
the social component the alumnigroups, as a Penn state graduate,
I know that's massive in terms of,graduates taking advantage of that.
I also think there is.
A component of soft skills thatare developed during that time,
because in high school, you'refollowing a bell schedule.

(01:09:26):
You have adults guiding you alongthe way, whereas in college, you
become really, it's your firsttaste of true responsibility where.
You have to manage yourself.
Do you have to manage your time?
You have to manage your schedule.
You can't go getting sloshed ona Tuesday night and then wake up
and take an exam the next day.
Although that's debatable, right?

You can,

Yeah.
You can't, you

laughed.
All four of us laugh becauseall four of us did that.

Yeah.
So I think there's an element of that.
And then I think as well, justthe social element where you're
bringing young people together thatare similar stages of their lives.
They're learning how to interactrelationships with each other.
So I think there's power and benefitof that, but I think what you're
seeing here, the one thing that'sabsent from all the benefits that we

(01:10:14):
talked about is the true learning.
The more learning that we're talkingabout here is more social or the
altruistic, communal components.
It's not so much the academics,really calls into question.
It's an outdated system.
It needs updated.
It's almost obsolete.

Cause you're, you bring me back in Ritz, you bring me
back in with a statement like that,because then I would just simply say,
can we create our own units like that?
Can we create our own systems and ourown groups and our own masterminds and
our own think tanks, totally outsideof college, where you start building
companies, corporations, ideas.

(01:10:55):
opportunities without college, right?
Because again, is it reallythe ultimate academics?
Wow, Professor Jones taught methis thing that I had no idea.
And I took that thing and then mademore money with it or grew my net worth
with it or help my family with it.
Or was it Oh man, ProfessorJones is really cool.
And he introduced me to Stephanie andI ended up creating this really awesome

(01:11:18):
web application because she taught me howto go on YouTube and study and research.
It is, man, it is a little bit ofan outdated system because YouTube
University is a very real thing.
Jordan Peterson, who taught atHarvard, who taught at Toronto College.
Is building and has built his own onlinecollege for the academics for the people

(01:11:42):
who want to learn But he also putstogether these groups and these small
mentorships and these masterminds so thatpeople can do just that Where education
can be free And experiences can cost money

I think education for whatever reason
is very resistant to change.
Especially at the K through 12 level.
I'm sure it's probably just the sameat the collegiate level, but they're
the old heads that are protectingthe cannon and don't want to let go.

(01:12:17):
And I think COVID forced someof that innovation to occur and
to, really, we learned that.
It wasn't perfect, right?
I saw some of the after effectsof that in our students, but
you can make, you can change it.
It just, there has to be a collectiveagreement that, hey, it's time.

Come on.

We've got to break it down.
It, that's what has to happen.

Dave, help our listeners and myself put on a tinfoil hat.

I never take mine off.

Is this whole thing systemic?
Is it starting from some place?
Some family, some corporation that'sreally trying to keep the populace
dumb broke and working for a living.

No I think it's been tradition.
We started this conversationwith it was the pathway.
for prosperity.
And that was true for my my,not quite my dad's generation.
They were just talking aboutthat, that he was a bit older.
So it was my mother.
So almost no one got college degrees.
And then it was like, okay, now if youget a college degree, you are guaranteed

(01:13:24):
a solid middle class, upper middleclass, And then that went away because
with so much money in the system, somany options, so many different things,
not a lot of guidance, I think, on,where people can spend their time and
their money and also devaluing otheroptions Going and doing gap years, or

(01:13:47):
going into the military, or going intoservice or trade schools, or all of the
other options, and then elevating those.
I think we've created alaptop class, which has some
value, but not all the value.
I think this is just.
This was grown from a lot ofdifferent things that said this
is the American dream and that wasbeing sold really a bill of goods.

(01:14:11):
It's not true today.
And so we have to redefinewhat this America dream is.

Gotta redefine it.
Robert, where do you think that redredefinition, where does it begin?

Think it begins in the homes.
But I also think it begins with theopportunities we got to look at where
we're where this opportunity for growthin this country and where the country
is going so we can begin to preparethe next generation of folks for that.
And I think if we streamline that processand which means educating folks at a young
age in terms of what the opportunities onwhere they can go, I think we can fix it.

(01:14:46):
But going back to your first comment,one of your comments, Jay, is it
starts like when they're elementaryschool, like middle school, it
doesn't start like in high school.
And so we're really going to haveto cut the pipe, cut the hose,
tie a knot in it for those folkswho like, I'm going to say nice.
We're going to be on there.
All right.
Sorry, too late.
And then you're going to have to go allthe way back down and begin to rebuild

(01:15:06):
that process starting at elementaryschool, and it's a painful process.
And so we may not see the benefitsof it right now, but I think if we
can begin to right the ship now,10, 15, 20 years from now, the
conversation is totally different.
At that point,

love that.
Alright, then, since we're stilllistening to your perfect voice,
Robert, what's one lesson that youwould want a high school senior?
Which you have one or approaching, right?
What's one lesson you would want ahigh school senior or their parents
to take from this conversation?

think it's so important to look at both sides of the coin.
There's a certain sector that sayseducation is key, but you have to do
a real assessment of your student.
And their strengths and seewhat's the best path for them.
And I think that changes per personper household because what's good
for my son Zion, for example, who'sinterlocking art boarding school.

(01:16:05):
He wants to go into theater,totally different sector.
When I was young, that wasn'tan option to go to theater.
My parents said, you're goingto be an engineer or you're
not going to do anything.
And so giving him thatflexibility is totally different
than where we were back then.
But back to your point, Jay, twothings, two words of advice, one,
and this is, I don't want to takeit too spiritual, but as a parent,
what your kids dreams are, right?

(01:16:27):
And each child has a purpose.
God given purpose as opposedto achieving their lives.
It's our responsibility as parents to helpprepare them for whatever that purpose is.
The challenge is that thekids don't see it yet.
The parents may know what it is,but the kids that, that, that
relaying that mission is challenging.
So as a student, I wouldsay, listen to your parents.

(01:16:48):
They're trying to help and guide you.
They see things differentlythan you see at the moment.
And as a parent, I would say, it'sour responsibility to do the research,
And where the future is 10, 20 yearsfrom now, so that our child's prepared
to take full advantage of that whenthey get out of school, otherwise
we'll set them up for failure.
And so I, that would be my adviceto both the student and the parent.

I'm going to guess that would cost somewhere between half a million and
three quarters of a million, maybe evena million dollars to get all of those.
I heard you guys say, Hey, the benefit.
Benefits have been networking, changingminds, soft skills, some opportunities.
So would you do this again?
Would you go back anddo all those degrees?

Not me.
I only have one.
From a degree point, I'm the bottom,I'm the lowest tiered person here.
I wouldn't know.
I think college was anabsolute waste of my time.
And the thing that it gave me wasa direction of what not to do.
I didn't really meet anyone in my collegethat I currently talk to these days.
I had no professors that wereincredible that I still communicate

(01:18:01):
with that changed my life.
I think overall, it gave me more to do,aka probably kept me out of a little
bit more, less trouble, but not really.
I still try to find my wayinto plenty of trouble.
And again, for me, college, personally,that's the reason that I want to continue.
To do this where I'm focused so heavilyon changing the educational system because

(01:18:25):
I think the educational system failed me.
Meaning how far along would I be?
How much would I know?
How much could I have poured intothe world and even a bigger capacity
if I had known and had been taughtwhat I got taught in my late
twenties by mentors, by books, andby online motivational personalities.
Versus college professors,school professors, high school,

(01:18:47):
high school teachers, educationsystem failed me dramatically.
And to the point of, I hadto do most of it myself.
And I had to do a lot of it where, whenI got out, I didn't know what I did.
I didn't know what I took.
I didn't know why I took it.
I didn't know the point of it.
I didn't know the value of it.
In fact, I actually wentto my boss at the time.
His name was Tom.
After I graduated, I waslike, bro, I got my degree.

(01:19:08):
He was like, cool, congrats.
And pat me on the shoulderand started walking away.
And I was like hold on.
Do we have a meeting about this now?
At what point do I get a raise?
And he literally laughed in my face.
He laughed, he was like,what are you talking about?
I just got a business degree and Iwas working at Nationwide Insurance
and I did not get a pay raise.

(01:19:29):
Again, this is not a slap toNationwide, it's a slap to degrees
are relatively worthless, I think.
And this is a made up statistic,totally off my head, has no
relevancy and no research.
87 percent of all degrees are worthlessand you can probably get everything
that you need on line through YouTubeUniversity, through networking, through

(01:19:50):
books, through mentorships, withoutever paying a single dime for college.
Ritz, what's your thanks?
Would you do this again?

So I, I gotta say the past is the path and I wouldn't change
anything cause I'm here today and who'sto say, had I not done that, I wouldn't
have met the people who were in my life.
I wouldn't have met.
You wouldn't have,interacted with the markets.
However, I will say that had Ihad a some insight into what my

(01:20:18):
future was and what was coming.
Hell no.
I know because it was expensive andhonestly, I'm not using, I'm not using my
degrees now the soft skills the leadershipelements of that the organization.
Yeah.
But yeah I'm a trader and investor.
I'm not, supervisingand evaluating teachers.

(01:20:39):
I'm not so I'm giving, I'm speakingout of both sides of my mouth here.
Yes.
No.

Yes.
I love that quote.
Actually.
I think it's amazing.
The path, the past is the path.
And I regret nothing.
I'm just to that point.
Wouldn't do it again.
Knowing what I know.
And me having kids, me having threeboys presently where it's I'm not going
to have them go to college at all.
In fact, I'll do everything I can to notget them to go to college trade schools.
Yeah, absolutely.
High five.
Totally.

And if I could do it all over again, I would be, I'd be
studying the markets at 12 years oldor 10 years old, eight years old.
And that's it be like rain man.
When I look at a

yes, dude, before I go, before we go to Rob Jeremy, is
there a point in your life financiallywhere you go, all right, I got the
money now, let me go back into theschool system and figure out a way
to change this from the inside out.

Yeah.
I think that's one thing that's,Probably missing right now because that
was such a huge part of what I did.
It was helping kids and familiesand I do it a little bit now through
trading, teaching people how to trade.
But yeah that, that willhappen at some point.
Cause I want to be a part ofchanging how we teach kids and the

(01:21:55):
opportunities that we give kids.
So that'll definitely besomething that I will do.

Love it.
Love it.
Rob, we know that you love college.
Would you do it again?

I'm sitting here and thinking, I remember my, one of my two
main reasons for going to school wasnumber one, to get away from my parents.
And so I don't care where I was going.
I went and got the house.
So that was cool.
And I think Jeremy, it matters for me.
If you were to ask me if Iwould, was 18 now, would I go?
No, because like to yourpoint, everything is online.

(01:22:30):
Everything is, you have access to things.
You have access to resources, but totallydifferent though, than when it was.
46 now.
So 28 years ago, when internet wasnot in the place where it is now,
you didn't have access to as much.
And the only thing you saw was whatwas in your, at your community.
I grew up in Columbia, Maryland, right?
The most diverse.

(01:22:51):
County, probably in theworld or in the country.
And so my friends were Asian black, theycalled their mom, and so on and so forth.
I didn't really give an idea ofculture and of the country until
I went to Virginia tech, which istotally different background and
total segregation around that piece.
And if I look at the experiences I had, Itreally did prepare me for the real world.

(01:23:12):
And I don't, I think if I did not havethat and stayed at home, especially if
my parents weren't investing in me, likewe're talking about doing in terms of the
training and mentorship, it would havebeen really challenging for me to hit
the real world and be taken seriously.
The second thing that came outof it was, but this is all from
a position of no debt, right?
So I came out of no debt, whichis like, why would you not go?

(01:23:32):
It's a party.
You learn it's everything's paid for.
It's great.
It's great.
The other piece, though, was thatif I look back over my life, there
were a lot of doors that were opened.
Because of my background and becausethat door was opened, I was able to get
in and then show that, yes, I am sharp.
I am smart.
So on and so forth.
And I'm not sure what thosesame doors would have opened.
If I say I'm a electrical engineerfrom Virginia tech, there's a certain

(01:23:55):
amount of access you get just fromcompleting that process, right?
And so my job interview for my firstjob, we didn't even talk about.
We talked about parties, becausehe was a Virginia Tech alumni.
He stayed in the samedorm Niall stayed in.
We talked about the throwing theCoke machine down the elevator shaft,
which everyone does every year.
And that was my interview, whichgot me into Northrop Grumman.

(01:24:17):
And if you were to pull those experiencesout, would I be where I am now?
Probably not.
Was it worth it?
It was worth it for me, becauseit didn't cost me anything.
But would it be worth itfor someone back then?
I don't know, man.
It went a long way for me.
Even getting my firstloans, my first business.
They say what's your occupation?
Electrical engineer.
Oh worst case, you'll make 150, 000a year for the rest of your life.

(01:24:38):
We'll give you this 100, 000 loanto start your first business.
Versus if I said I was apsychologist, they might have said,
no, we're not giving you this loan.
And so how much did that actuallyplayed into where I am now?
I don't know, but it did give mesome access and through some doors
that I don't think I would havebeen able to get through without it.

Yeah valid.
And again, I think over time thatcan or might or could shift depending
on what, again, the country's value.
Because at the same level, if you said,Hey, I created a startup incubator,
never went to college and I got 4million asset under management to
go ahead and build an energy fund.
Do you still get in the door?

Correct.

the answer is probably maybe not.
And again, it's absolutely goingto change who you connect with and
how you connect with them for sure.
And what you talk about,you're absolutely right.
But it's going to be like thevalue system of if you go into
any job interview now, could youlook, could you be looked at more?
If you go, Hey, I built on,I built an online community.
I have 25, 000 followers on XYZ platform.

(01:25:37):
I have three or four onlinebusinesses I've launched that
have each done a million dollars.
I want to come into this organizationand do the same at a bigger scale, right?
That's on the job training, essentially,maybe not on the job training, but it's
a example that you've already done thework that you've done the building.
Cause that's really, and I own abusiness, you own a business, Jeremy

(01:25:57):
owns a business, Dave owns a business.
We all know businesses.
When we are hiring people, that'swhat we want to see is have
you gotten kicked in the face.
through some adversity anddid you quit and cry about it?
Or did you say, I'm going to figure this

threw it.

And did you work on completing the task that was
given to you no matter the obstacle?
And that's really whatemployers are looking for.
Dave, You have to do it all over again.
Go back through college.
Everything you had was worth it.
Would you do

answers.
I would have gone, I got into agood, a really good state school.
And like Robert, I just neededto get away from my parents.
I needed to get off the East Coast.
He grew up in Columbia.
I grew up in Falls Church.
I gotta, I know, I just had to get outof the Washington DC bubble for sure.
But saying that I got into a goodstate school, I was really immature.

(01:26:51):
And I was coming from a really smallall boys school and being dropped
into one of the largest schools onthe planet and known party school.
No matter how good thatschool was, I lost my mind.
And so I would have appliedto a really good school.

(01:27:15):
Like a really top tier school to getthat networking and to get that world
and to be around those folks and reallyexplore in a much more structured
way, maybe a smaller school or justa really high end Ivy League school.
And if I couldn't get into those toget that maturity that I needed, it

(01:27:37):
would have been a couple of gap yearsor a gap year or going into service or
getting an internship or getting a jobwith the knowledge that I would learn
something there and proceed from there.
I'd either go back and go get a degreea little bit later, and military
would have been really good for me.
It would have given mea lot of discipline.
So I, it would have been.

(01:27:58):
Go to the best and best schoolI could get into and a high end
school or a couple of gap yearsand then figure it out from there.

Yeah, I'll take squad listeners from all around the world.
Thank you so much for being a partof solving America's problems.
Is college truly worth it?
The answer here in this podcastis probably not, but there'll be

(01:28:27):
certain situations where it could be.
But what is beautiful is when this countrygets together as a consensus and we
start realizing that our number one valuein this country needs to be education,
it needs to be safety of our children.
It needs to be the expansion andthe beauty and the grace and the
spirituality and the abundance of.

(01:28:49):
our family unit intertwined in throughour colleges and through our schools
and then through the educational system.
We start making the changes there.
We all know that the rippleeffects will be monumental.
Robert Wallace, Jeremy Ritz.
Thank you so much for joining us today.
On this episode of solvingAmerica's problems.

Appreciate it.
Thank you.

Thanks, Dave.
Thanks, Jeremy.

All right, Dave, man, two remarkable American citizens who
have gone through the educationalsystem in out backwards through it and
sideways, what did you learn in thisepisode of solving America's problems?

I think okay, one, this is not to be king of the obvious,
but this is a clear problem, right?
Nobody's standing up and saying,hey, this is working great.
For our students and for America,and it's, I don't think it's failing
because there's a lot of benefits to,how people get into the workplace,
how people get through collegeand it's not working real well.

(01:29:49):
The other thing I learned iscollege absolutely doesn't work.
Does matter.
College degrees matter.
And as long as they're at the rightschools, as long as it's the right
degrees, and then outside of thatyou're taking a much bigger gamble.
And what we're not doing as a society,as Americans we're not, There are a lot

(01:30:11):
of other paths, and we are not elevatingthose, either in our consciousness
we're not elevating them as far asprestige goes, and value goes, and there
are so many other paths, other thangoing to a college degree, or going
to get a college degree right away.
that are critical, and that, I think is,that's where the rubber hits the road.

(01:30:35):
What about you?

Man.
One of my takeaways is that.
There's obviously really uniqueand different perspectives from a
race standpoint, from an economicstandpoint, from a family household
standpoint, there's obviously goingto be a lot of things to consider.
But one of the points thatI really loved the most is.
That it is changeable and that everysingle person that we bring this up

(01:31:01):
to your point, they are aware of this.
Yeah, it's not going awesome.
And there's definitely some type ofradical change that needs to happen.
Both of our guests reallyelaborate to the fact that.
Yeah, it's not perfect.
And it's probably far from perfect.
And to speak on that for just a moment,like numerically, the average federal
loan debt per borrower is 37, 853.

(01:31:25):
The total average loan debt, includingprivate loans is just north of 40, 000.
Student loan debt has grown by 52percent since 2013, and then 16
percent of the American adults haveoutstanding undergraduate student debt.
16%! Dude, that's really high.

(01:31:46):
And then factoring in the tuitionand fees have increased 192
percent faster than inflation.
So there has to be some issue there.
And then the fact that you bringup the general populace of this
country and you ask a collegestudent, are you using your degree?
83 percent say no.

(01:32:06):
And that is probablypretty astronomical too.
So you're going to college, you're payingfor college, you're getting a degree.
And you still don't use it in thejob force and it's not necessary.
I shared my own personalexample of that too.
And then ultimately having the awareness,having the notion that there needs

(01:32:27):
to be some level of distinction orseparation of who gets the money.
Who gets scholarships having bothRobert and Jeremy be like, yeah, I think
that's a unique perspective, right?
Being able to assist them systematizeor create some level of industries or
sectors of our job force that shouldget a reprieve from student loans.

(01:32:51):
or that should at least get sometype of lesser impact on the front
or the back end was was a point andwas a policy that was pretty widely
accepted in our conversation as well.
So what I'm learning is that it's anincredible opportunity right now to
get a groundswell of people to cometogether and go, all right, it all is

(01:33:12):
going to stem to education once again.
And this is a component of education.
It is something that we canbroadly bring to the forefront
that, Hey, this is a problem.
Hey, we can make a change.
Yes, we are having some success,but that's very similar to, in my

(01:33:33):
opinion having a U. S. basketballteam after they win a series say
that they're world champions.
When they beat everyone in the U. S.It's are we competing with ourselves?
And it's I feel like we are.
And because if we start comparingourselves to other countries, we are
losing in 96 percent of every, in anycategory that we would deem beneficial.

(01:33:59):
So to that point, and to yourpoint that you said, there's a
lot of countries that are far lessexpensive than the U. S. And that are
getting potentially better results.
So it is a problem.
That's what I've learned.
I've learned that we are onthe right track to solving it.
We are bringing on amazing guests.
We have incredible guests comingforward and putting their names down

(01:34:20):
to be on this podcast so that they toocan begin to solve America's problems.

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