March 24, 2024 • 17 mins
Ever wondered about the deeper meanings screamed and growled at you through the fierce winds of black metal? Tune in as we strip back the layers of Spectral Lore's 'III', revealing a complex tapestry of lyrics that touch on the existential musings akin to Kubrick's '2001: A Space Odyssey'. The raw emotion of black metal often masks the poetry within, but we're here to uncover the philosophical undercurrents that challenge our place in the cosmos and the nature of our moral compass. Let's unpack the intricate vocal techniques that not only convey power but also a depth of expression that can be overlooked amidst the genre's aggressive soundscapes.
We'll also explore the visual dimensions of black metal artistry, focusing on how one artist's decision to eschew live performances in favor of a meticulously crafted narrative can still profoundly resonate with audiences, akin to the leap from a primitive tool to an interstellar craft. The evolution of music videos in the rock scene and their nuanced role today takes center stage, as we discuss the unique presence of musicians who navigate their creativity without the traditional trappings of live gigs and mass-market appeal. Join us for this philosophical and musical journey that promises to expand not just your playlist, but your very perception of artistry within the universe of sound and meaning.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Andrew (00:00):
Super cash.
Hey will let me tell you abouta black metal song.
I'm all ears.
Yes, thank you.
There's a particular song inthe heavy metal space where the
lyrics I think in that case, inthe in its case do matter right.
So like Isn't the perception ofheavy metal sometimes like with
(00:21):
all the unintelligible lyrics,that maybe the lyrics don't
actually matter?
I mean, that's what I hear.
Yeah more or less right, like ifit's Screamed or guttural or
growl.
You can't really make out whatthey're saying.
You, it's up to you, it's up tothe listener to go to the book,
right to the pamphlet, and readfor themselves sometimes what
the Artist is saying, do you?
Will (00:43):
think it's a majority of people in that space who, like,
don't expect to dig into lyricsor it's so hard to say.
Andrew (00:51):
I think it's more than a lot.
I mean it's more.
I don't know if it's more than50%, but it's a lot.
It's a lot of people who, yeah,for them, the emotion and the
kind of the message of the musiccomes from the intensity or the
variances and Intensity thatthe vocalist might use in
projecting their voice, or themusic itself, and it's all of
(01:11):
its varying intensities.
Will (01:13):
I mean, I know a lot of people go to those shows just to
hear the like Kind of dynamicguttural noises right.
Yeah, so I don't know if thatcounts for lyrics.
I guess in the way it does.
Andrew (01:22):
But sort of yeah, but it yeah that it does like.
Point at a misconception aboutHarsh vocals is that they're
monotone or monolithic.
Right, that's just one soundwhere what metalheads love to do
is appreciate vocalists who canachieve a sound or a noise with
their vocal cords that no oneelse can really replicate.
(01:45):
That means there's like theselayers or these dynamics of
sounds they could make.
Will (01:49):
Yeah, and then, I'm sorry, start more like classes or
something on that like there arepeople teach that, yeah.
Andrew (01:55):
Yeah, there are a couple like heavy metal vocal coaches
that work on Correctlyprojecting your voice harshly
yeah, so it's not to damage yourvocal cords over time.
Will (02:05):
Right, I know it's a big thing in rock like yeah, a lot
of rock artists like damagetheir vocal cords because
they're just screaming oryelling yeah whereas it's not
like the harsh kind of gutturalgrowls of metal and rock that's
screaming, it's yelling, it'sloud, mm-hmm.
Andrew (02:20):
Loud voice.
Well, so you have that dynamic.
Of course, then you have thelyrics themselves, and I wanted
to share this particular songslyrics with you because I found
them cinematic and fitting forthe, fitting for the music
itself, which is, as I would say, as close as you can get
musically to 2001 Space Odyssey,yeah, and it's Spectral Lore.
(02:42):
Spectral Lore.
He's a black metal artist outof Greece.
It's one of his many projects,but this is from the album 3,
which came out in 2014.
I think considered probably tobe his biggest or most broad
stroke, though he's a verydynamic artist and has created a
(03:04):
lot of different styles of, Iguess, mostly black metal, but
also some other types too.
But specifically for this songand as part of this album as a
whole story, this is like theclimax, this is like the big
song where the album sort ofhits its peak intensity.
Would you call it like?
Will (03:22):
a single for the record.
No, this record couldn't everhave a single.
Andrew (03:26):
Yeah, it would be hard.
Every song is like, just like achapter.
I guess the first song could bea single.
Will (03:34):
And he said it's like 2001 .
Do you mean like what would yousay?
The theme is Is it like afuturistic nihilistic?
Andrew (03:43):
look.
It's questioning, I think, the2001 and the Space Odyssey.
I wouldn't call it message butnarrative is one of unknowing
and one of confusion sometimes,but one of opposing forces or
opposing ideas, that both mightbe true and that doesn't make
(04:06):
sense.
Right, like anything, thatmovie is very symbolic and makes
you question like what's real,what's not, yep.
(04:33):
So the lyrics start like thewind, I sweep through majestic
landscapes, wandering lost amongendless deserts, forests, deep
seas and high mountains.
They rise glorious butmelancholic around me, as if
knowing their own impermanence,how small and insignificant they
make me feel.
I mean, right there, you havethe experience of like going to
the Grand Canyon, for instance,and seeing how absolutely
(04:55):
massive it is, and you feelimmensely tiny.
Will (04:58):
Yeah, that was kind of the thematic I was talking about
where it's like very visual,like I don't know.
There's not a lot of like, Iguess, putting an opinion on it.
Andrew (05:10):
Right right, he's not really telling you anything.
He's basically just saying,like how he feels.
Will (05:14):
Yeah, setting us in.
Andrew (05:18):
Then time creeps in and I remember death, capital D
death, and questions do notleave me.
Why did the force organicmolecule copy itself?
Hey buddy.
Will (05:27):
Oh, he's coming.
Yep, he's on video.
Andrew (05:30):
Hey, come here, buddy, you want to read some lyrics?
Yeah, you're doing so.
Well, All right, we'll start.
How did the first organicmolecule copy itself?
How did it think it couldretain its consciousness that
way, or hope that its offspringwould someday, someday escape
mortality, maybe throughconstant change and evolution?
So now he's like, he's likealmost being scientific.
(05:54):
He's there, there's no rhymes.
This is almost like him justgoing through, like some mental
questions, yeah, which I findfascinating.
He continues, gaea, screams andcoils around me, the organic
and inorganic in union,affecting and redefining each
other.
Is it complete that way orstill void as ourselves seeking
(06:14):
for fulfillment?
I see the pain andmeaninglessness.
I feel it, deep inside thecycle of renewal, that the
demise of individual existenceis still one of tragedy.
Why would we have attainedconsciousness if we were always
supposed to adhere to theeternal law?
So it's almost like ourconsciousness is.
If it's a gift, it's a damningone.
Will (06:36):
Like, can I see?
It as like coming back tooneness, yeah, yeah, which isn't
good or bad, I guess, but no,there's no real good or bad
about it.
Andrew (06:49):
In the singularity, there's no good or bad.
There's no polar opposites,right yeah?
There's no paradigms or polesor any of that shit.
I think that's what he's saying.
Here is like why do we divergefrom that Exactly?
Why are we, as far as we know,the strangest things in the
universe, right?
Yeah, or at least the mostpeculiar and complicated, as far
(07:11):
as we can tell, as far asarrangements and atoms I mean.
He says how does the firstorganic molecule copy itself?
What do you think he means byeternal law here?
I think that of basicallyDarwinian theory, right, like
natural selection and this tosearch for survival.
The only reason that we exist,or any idea exists for that
(07:32):
matter, is because it's geareditself to survive.
Will (07:36):
I wonder if I kind of read that as like yeah, kind of
going back to that same idea oflike if we're meant to live this
way, it's kind of a tragedy,like why do we diverge from
oneness to begin with, which Iguess is kind?
Andrew (07:50):
of a concept already, but that's what I like about
these lyrics and we'll finishthem off in a second, but like
this is very black metal.
This is very like big thinking,like big picture sort of like.
I mean, this is space blackmetal, but like like cosmic
ideas and like thinking big andgrand about the meaning of life
like but that's like a theme inblack metal is to like take big
(08:12):
ideas and work through them.
I think, I think being Homericis sort of how I describe it,
like being all encompassing andlike in your writing, being like
not necessarily I know it all,but I'm questioning everything
within context.
Anything is on the table.
Seeing, trying to see the wholeworld at once, will continue.
Is my will opposite to that ofthe outer, or can we forge paths
(08:36):
of harmony in between us?
If I can dream, therefore, Ican transform.
That's where the this is wherethe song, like the lyrics, shift
right.
We are warriors of the universe.
We are here for a reason, Ibelieve.
It wants us to change it.
It wants us to evolve ourselvesthan our surroundings.
But how and what direction?
Where is right and wrong in thecosmic scale?
(08:57):
Right, is it good?
Is it enough to be, quoteunquote good human beings, or is
this feat of such anunimaginable difficulty that
every human must absolutelysurpass the limits of one
existence toward greater andgreater understanding,
complexity, continuity,fulfillment?
He ends in a great mission todefeat gravity, to liberate once
(09:19):
and forever all existence fromthe cycle of birth and death,
bang and crunch, to extend intoall dimensions, physical and
temporal, right.
So he's.
Will (09:28):
I think he is taking a stance here.
Andrew (09:30):
I think he's arguing for like this is where this is
where he's like pivoting andsaying there's actually like,
there's actually a point right.
Will (09:39):
I think it's, but I think he's arguing for the point to be
singularity, like one mess,like for points to be irrelevant
, unless I'm misinterpretingthere.
No, I mean there's multipleinterpretations.
But yeah, no, I think you'reright.
Andrew (09:55):
Like yeah, I don't think he's like, I don't think he's
saying like now we have a reasonto live.
But he's saying like I thinkhe's saying he's giving.
Will (10:04):
Divorcing yourself from those reasons.
Yeah, yeah is the reason tolive, like to work toward not
even even have a reason.
Andrew (10:11):
Right and even questioning right and wrong
seems futile sometimes, and Ithink he's kind of pointing that
out right Like yeah, and moralsare, you know, societal centric
, like time centric, like yeah.
Will (10:24):
You can get into a whole argument of like the constructs
we built as individuals.
Andrew (10:28):
And I think part of his point is that, no matter how big
we build, no matter how far wetake our minds and understanding
and how far we evolve ordevelop like, it's almost
totally impossible to likebecome smarter than the universe
or more than it or in controlof it.
Right, he's?
Saying there's always a cosmosthat's beyond whatever we can
(10:51):
become.
Will (10:52):
Well, I think he's saying we're less a part of it by being
individualistic like that too,which you can get into like an
argument against America, forthat too.
Like yeah.
American society is veryindividualistic and like at the
cost of others, I mean you caneven see that within other
communities in the world, likesingularity seems like a better
(11:14):
option.
You know, like or like having amore like one society.
So that's an interesting yeah,I know.
Andrew (11:23):
That's what I like about these grand lyrics is that they
can be taken like if you painta big picture, you can like, you
can zoom into it and finddetail.
I think sometimes maybe notintentional, but you can like
take a theory like that or whathe's saying and, as you're doing
, apply it to specific, specificinstances or actual real
situations in reality andanalyze it and say, like is it
(11:47):
wrong to be so certain thatwe're right or is it wrong to be
so certain that we're wrong?
Right, yeah.
Will (11:52):
Yeah that's.
I mean you could almost publishthat as like a poem or
something like there's a lot ofstuff to talk about there that's
outside music and outside youknow, even is it just record and
stuff absolutely and I I thinkthis.
Andrew (12:09):
I'm glad we talked about this because this highlights,
like I mean, I think most peoplewould be surprised if they had
a conception of black metal andthen I read those lyrics to them
and told them that was like oneof the best black metal songs
I've ever heard and it's if youwere to listen to it and I
recommend you do have links.
It's intense, fast, has hugeclimaxes, there's lots of
(12:29):
screaming, it's very like, it'svery wall of sound, cinematic,
but there's texture and nuanceto it.
Will (12:35):
The song and the music is, I think, just as interesting
and compelling as the lyrics arethe vocals like very audible
and like the performance, orlike the Ziva buried on them?
Andrew (12:45):
they're buried.
They're like you wouldn't beable to decipher what he's
actually saying in any way.
Huh, interesting, they'realmost like.
They're almost like a synth.
Will (12:53):
I wonder why he doesn't do them more permanently.
Is that just a product of thegenre.
Andrew (12:57):
It's probably the genre where, as black metal is usually
like the screen, the screamingis usually like almost like a
constant wavelength, theconstant sound, and then it's
like buried in the sound, buriedin the music.
So you're not really, you'renot really deciphering a human
voice in that way.
You're not recognized like thatsomeone speaking or telling me
something.
It's more of like if someonewas holding down keys on a
(13:19):
keyboard yeah, like a bit of aquarter exactly.
It's an atmospheric sort ofprojection.
I mean I guess I get that as acreative choice.
It's done quite often in blackmetal specifically.
It is a creative choice.
It's purely, I think, aestheticor stylistic.
Will (13:34):
I wish he would do like, or people who spend that much
time on lyrics.
I wish they would write like,do a split, where, like, there's
an alternate version, whereit's very lyric centric, because
that's like I would listen tothose lyrics, you know that is a
cool idea.
Andrew (13:49):
Like same song, two different vocal performances.
Do a split seven, yeah, withyour record sound saga, sound
tip when you write your nextalbum.
So record it twice.
Just once with clean vocals,instead of scream vocal see, but
that's actually a cool idea.
I very few artists release thesame music in different formats
or different styles.
Will (14:09):
I mean there is a tradition of that kind of in
some music like, I guess, indianRock, where, like you have a
cutting room floor version, orlike a side version yeah,
usually it's not that drastic ofa switch like, sometimes it's
just acoustic version or likealternate lyrics or something
like that, and then, slightlydifferently, you have remixes in
electronic music that are quiteyeah, quite
(14:31):
common yeah and the yeah yeahguys were actually great at that
where they did a bunch of danceremixes of their songs with
different DJs and stuff.
That can be a cool thing.
I'm surprised no one does thatin the metal space, where, like
they do, like I don't know, likean R&B version of the metal
song or like I'm sure theysomeone has, but I just it's
just not like common or talkedabout because they were a more
(14:53):
commonplace thing that would be,yeah, beans is like on his
beans is part of this video.
Andrew (14:58):
Well, welcome, welcome beans.
I don't know if he's on camerabecause he's pretty low to the
ground, but I don't know likeI'm so excited you talk about
the battle.
Talk, yeah last thing I want tomention about the lyrics.
I like the way they're writtenthey're.
They're just like they don'treally read like poem, poetry or
lyrics.
It's just like asking questions.
Will (15:15):
I get a poetry vibe well, yeah, I mean it's about.
It depends on how you read ittoo.
Andrew (15:20):
I if I, if I were to read it as a as it was a
paragraph, it would feel lessflowy.
But, like you know things likehow, why did the first, first
organic molecule copy itself?
Like that's not like typicallyrical juice, it's just why did
the first organic molecule copyitself?
It's like a scientific question, but he's posing in the context
(15:42):
of like a bigger, biggerdiscussion right, I like how
literal, he just states it, butit totally makes sense with the
theme.
Will (15:49):
It's like he's asking that because, like, was that a first
act of individualism?
Andrew (15:54):
you know, like stuff like that like in 2001, when the
, when the primate or the, theape or whatever was, his first
act of individualism was to takethat bone and scare the other
apes, yeah, and then use it tokill one of them yeah, and of
course that bone goes in the airand becomes a spaceship.
But I mean like, I mean that'sprobably the.
(16:14):
Is that not the greatesttransition in all film?
Will (16:17):
but like, you can do that.
He's got a lot.
Of it's pretty good one.
Andrew (16:20):
Yeah, I see the same sort of like Big narrative, like
statements like that, like thebone going to their turning in
the spaceship.
That is such like a grand Posit.
Yeah, it's a huge.
Yeah, it's a huge.
It's like okay, whoa, you justsaid a lot, let's think about
this.
Yeah, I get that feeling fromthis album, has he?
Will (16:39):
done a music video for any of the songs.
Andrew (16:41):
No, he has like a visualizer.
Will (16:44):
Okay.
Andrew (16:44):
Yeah, typically in this like underground black metal
space, you don't see much audiovisual content or, sorry, like
video content to a company, themusic in fact.
He's never played, as far as Iknow, any of his music live.
Will (16:59):
Okay, so I know he's never played this live.
Andrew (17:01):
It's and there's.
He wrote this himself that heprogrammed the drums, for
instance.
Will (17:06):
Like it's all right, it's a one-man black metal band,
that's also interesting though,because, like in the rock space
too, it's like Like videosaren't as big as they used to be
like general.
Yeah, I see a lot of indieartists who take time to like
make a video, even if it's withtheir friends, or they film with
themselves or something it's.
Andrew (17:23):
I'd say it's generally important just for, like Band
cred and just free advertising,but you're not gonna make money
on it.
Will (17:30):
No, yeah, it's nice to have yeah.
Yeah, anyway, hey man what youdo my myself.
Hey man, what you do my self ishey man, what you do I myself.
A bit, that is it.
Oh, I say hey man, what you dowhen I myself his巾.
Super cash.
Hey will let me tell you abouta black metal song.
I'm all ears.
Yes, thank you.
There's a particular song inthe heavy metal space where the
lyrics I think in that case, inthe in its case do matter right.
So like Isn't the perception ofheavy metal sometimes like with
(00:21):
all the unintelligible lyrics,that maybe the lyrics don't
actually matter?
I mean, that's what I hear.
Yeah more or less right, like ifit's Screamed or guttural or
growl.
You can't really make out whatthey're saying.
You, it's up to you, it's up tothe listener to go to the book,
right to the pamphlet, and readfor themselves sometimes what
the Artist is saying, do you?
Will (00:43):
think it's a majority of people in that space who, like,
don't expect to dig into lyricsor it's so hard to say.
Andrew (00:51):
I think it's more than a lot.
I mean it's more.
I don't know if it's more than50%, but it's a lot.
It's a lot of people who, yeah,for them, the emotion and the
kind of the message of the musiccomes from the intensity or the
variances and Intensity thatthe vocalist might use in
projecting their voice, or themusic itself, and it's all of
(01:11):
its varying intensities.
Will (01:13):
I mean, I know a lot of people go to those shows just to
hear the like Kind of dynamicguttural noises right.
Yeah, so I don't know if thatcounts for lyrics.
I guess in the way it does.
Andrew (01:22):
But sort of yeah, but it yeah that it does like.
Point at a misconception aboutHarsh vocals is that they're
monotone or monolithic.
Right, that's just one soundwhere what metalheads love to do
is appreciate vocalists who canachieve a sound or a noise with
their vocal cords that no oneelse can really replicate.
(01:45):
That means there's like theselayers or these dynamics of
sounds they could make.
Will (01:49):
Yeah, and then, I'm sorry, start more like classes or
something on that like there arepeople teach that, yeah.
Andrew (01:55):
Yeah, there are a couple like heavy metal vocal coaches
that work on Correctlyprojecting your voice harshly
yeah, so it's not to damage yourvocal cords over time.
Will (02:05):
Right, I know it's a big thing in rock like yeah, a lot
of rock artists like damagetheir vocal cords because
they're just screaming oryelling yeah whereas it's not
like the harsh kind of gutturalgrowls of metal and rock that's
screaming, it's yelling, it'sloud, mm-hmm.
Andrew (02:20):
Loud voice.
Well, so you have that dynamic.
Of course, then you have thelyrics themselves, and I wanted
to share this particular songslyrics with you because I found
them cinematic and fitting forthe, fitting for the music
itself, which is, as I would say, as close as you can get
musically to 2001 Space Odyssey,yeah, and it's Spectral Lore.
(02:42):
Spectral Lore.
He's a black metal artist outof Greece.
It's one of his many projects,but this is from the album 3,
which came out in 2014.
I think considered probably tobe his biggest or most broad
stroke, though he's a verydynamic artist and has created a
(03:04):
lot of different styles of, Iguess, mostly black metal, but
also some other types too.
But specifically for this songand as part of this album as a
whole story, this is like theclimax, this is like the big
song where the album sort ofhits its peak intensity.
Would you call it like?
Will (03:22):
a single for the record.
No, this record couldn't everhave a single.
Andrew (03:26):
Yeah, it would be hard.
Every song is like, just like achapter.
I guess the first song could bea single.
Will (03:34):
And he said it's like 2001 .
Do you mean like what would yousay?
The theme is Is it like afuturistic nihilistic?
Andrew (03:43):
look.
It's questioning, I think, the2001 and the Space Odyssey.
I wouldn't call it message butnarrative is one of unknowing
and one of confusion sometimes,but one of opposing forces or
opposing ideas, that both mightbe true and that doesn't make
(04:06):
sense.
Right, like anything, thatmovie is very symbolic and makes
you question like what's real,what's not, yep.
(04:33):
So the lyrics start like thewind, I sweep through majestic
landscapes, wandering lost amongendless deserts, forests, deep
seas and high mountains.
They rise glorious butmelancholic around me, as if
knowing their own impermanence,how small and insignificant they
make me feel.
I mean, right there, you havethe experience of like going to
the Grand Canyon, for instance,and seeing how absolutely
(04:55):
massive it is, and you feelimmensely tiny.
Will (04:58):
Yeah, that was kind of the thematic I was talking about
where it's like very visual,like I don't know.
There's not a lot of like, Iguess, putting an opinion on it.
Andrew (05:10):
Right right, he's not really telling you anything.
He's basically just saying,like how he feels.
Will (05:14):
Yeah, setting us in.
Andrew (05:18):
Then time creeps in and I remember death, capital D
death, and questions do notleave me.
Why did the force organicmolecule copy itself?
Hey buddy.
Will (05:27):
Oh, he's coming.
Yep, he's on video.
Andrew (05:30):
Hey, come here, buddy, you want to read some lyrics?
Yeah, you're doing so.
Well, All right, we'll start.
How did the first organicmolecule copy itself?
How did it think it couldretain its consciousness that
way, or hope that its offspringwould someday, someday escape
mortality, maybe throughconstant change and evolution?
So now he's like, he's likealmost being scientific.
(05:54):
He's there, there's no rhymes.
This is almost like him justgoing through, like some mental
questions, yeah, which I findfascinating.
He continues, gaea, screams andcoils around me, the organic
and inorganic in union,affecting and redefining each
other.
Is it complete that way orstill void as ourselves seeking
(06:14):
for fulfillment?
I see the pain andmeaninglessness.
I feel it, deep inside thecycle of renewal, that the
demise of individual existenceis still one of tragedy.
Why would we have attainedconsciousness if we were always
supposed to adhere to theeternal law?
So it's almost like ourconsciousness is.
If it's a gift, it's a damningone.
Will (06:36):
Like, can I see?
It as like coming back tooneness, yeah, yeah, which isn't
good or bad, I guess, but no,there's no real good or bad
about it.
Andrew (06:49):
In the singularity, there's no good or bad.
There's no polar opposites,right yeah?
There's no paradigms or polesor any of that shit.
I think that's what he's saying.
Here is like why do we divergefrom that Exactly?
Why are we, as far as we know,the strangest things in the
universe, right?
Yeah, or at least the mostpeculiar and complicated, as far
(07:11):
as we can tell, as far asarrangements and atoms I mean.
He says how does the firstorganic molecule copy itself?
What do you think he means byeternal law here?
I think that of basicallyDarwinian theory, right, like
natural selection and this tosearch for survival.
The only reason that we exist,or any idea exists for that
(07:32):
matter, is because it's geareditself to survive.
Will (07:36):
I wonder if I kind of read that as like yeah, kind of
going back to that same idea oflike if we're meant to live this
way, it's kind of a tragedy,like why do we diverge from
oneness to begin with, which Iguess is kind?
Andrew (07:50):
of a concept already, but that's what I like about
these lyrics and we'll finishthem off in a second, but like
this is very black metal.
This is very like big thinking,like big picture sort of like.
I mean, this is space blackmetal, but like like cosmic
ideas and like thinking big andgrand about the meaning of life
like but that's like a theme inblack metal is to like take big
(08:12):
ideas and work through them.
I think, I think being Homericis sort of how I describe it,
like being all encompassing andlike in your writing, being like
not necessarily I know it all,but I'm questioning everything
within context.
Anything is on the table.
Seeing, trying to see the wholeworld at once, will continue.
Is my will opposite to that ofthe outer, or can we forge paths
(08:36):
of harmony in between us?
If I can dream, therefore, Ican transform.
That's where the this is wherethe song, like the lyrics, shift
right.
We are warriors of the universe.
We are here for a reason, Ibelieve.
It wants us to change it.
It wants us to evolve ourselvesthan our surroundings.
But how and what direction?
Where is right and wrong in thecosmic scale?
(08:57):
Right, is it good?
Is it enough to be, quoteunquote good human beings, or is
this feat of such anunimaginable difficulty that
every human must absolutelysurpass the limits of one
existence toward greater andgreater understanding,
complexity, continuity,fulfillment?
He ends in a great mission todefeat gravity, to liberate once
(09:19):
and forever all existence fromthe cycle of birth and death,
bang and crunch, to extend intoall dimensions, physical and
temporal, right.
So he's.
Will (09:28):
I think he is taking a stance here.
Andrew (09:30):
I think he's arguing for like this is where this is
where he's like pivoting andsaying there's actually like,
there's actually a point right.
Will (09:39):
I think it's, but I think he's arguing for the point to be
singularity, like one mess,like for points to be irrelevant
, unless I'm misinterpretingthere.
No, I mean there's multipleinterpretations.
But yeah, no, I think you'reright.
Andrew (09:55):
Like yeah, I don't think he's like, I don't think he's
saying like now we have a reasonto live.
But he's saying like I thinkhe's saying he's giving.
Will (10:04):
Divorcing yourself from those reasons.
Yeah, yeah is the reason tolive, like to work toward not
even even have a reason.
Andrew (10:11):
Right and even questioning right and wrong
seems futile sometimes, and Ithink he's kind of pointing that
out right Like yeah, and moralsare, you know, societal centric
, like time centric, like yeah.
Will (10:24):
You can get into a whole argument of like the constructs
we built as individuals.
Andrew (10:28):
And I think part of his point is that, no matter how big
we build, no matter how far wetake our minds and understanding
and how far we evolve ordevelop like, it's almost
totally impossible to likebecome smarter than the universe
or more than it or in controlof it.
Right, he's?
Saying there's always a cosmosthat's beyond whatever we can
(10:51):
become.
Will (10:52):
Well, I think he's saying we're less a part of it by being
individualistic like that too,which you can get into like an
argument against America, forthat too.
Like yeah.
American society is veryindividualistic and like at the
cost of others, I mean you caneven see that within other
communities in the world, likesingularity seems like a better
(11:14):
option.
You know, like or like having amore like one society.
So that's an interesting yeah,I know.
Andrew (11:23):
That's what I like about these grand lyrics is that they
can be taken like if you painta big picture, you can like, you
can zoom into it and finddetail.
I think sometimes maybe notintentional, but you can like
take a theory like that or whathe's saying and, as you're doing
, apply it to specific, specificinstances or actual real
situations in reality andanalyze it and say, like is it
(11:47):
wrong to be so certain thatwe're right or is it wrong to be
so certain that we're wrong?
Right, yeah.
Will (11:52):
Yeah that's.
I mean you could almost publishthat as like a poem or
something like there's a lot ofstuff to talk about there that's
outside music and outside youknow, even is it just record and
stuff absolutely and I I thinkthis.
Andrew (12:09):
I'm glad we talked about this because this highlights,
like I mean, I think most peoplewould be surprised if they had
a conception of black metal andthen I read those lyrics to them
and told them that was like oneof the best black metal songs
I've ever heard and it's if youwere to listen to it and I
recommend you do have links.
It's intense, fast, has hugeclimaxes, there's lots of
(12:29):
screaming, it's very like, it'svery wall of sound, cinematic,
but there's texture and nuanceto it.
Will (12:35):
The song and the music is, I think, just as interesting
and compelling as the lyrics arethe vocals like very audible
and like the performance, orlike the Ziva buried on them?
Andrew (12:45):
they're buried.
They're like you wouldn't beable to decipher what he's
actually saying in any way.
Huh, interesting, they'realmost like.
They're almost like a synth.
Will (12:53):
I wonder why he doesn't do them more permanently.
Is that just a product of thegenre.
Andrew (12:57):
It's probably the genre where, as black metal is usually
like the screen, the screamingis usually like almost like a
constant wavelength, theconstant sound, and then it's
like buried in the sound, buriedin the music.
So you're not really, you'renot really deciphering a human
voice in that way.
You're not recognized like thatsomeone speaking or telling me
something.
It's more of like if someonewas holding down keys on a
(13:19):
keyboard yeah, like a bit of aquarter exactly.
It's an atmospheric sort ofprojection.
I mean I guess I get that as acreative choice.
It's done quite often in blackmetal specifically.
It is a creative choice.
It's purely, I think, aestheticor stylistic.
Will (13:34):
I wish he would do like, or people who spend that much
time on lyrics.
I wish they would write like,do a split, where, like, there's
an alternate version, whereit's very lyric centric, because
that's like I would listen tothose lyrics, you know that is a
cool idea.
Andrew (13:49):
Like same song, two different vocal performances.
Do a split seven, yeah, withyour record sound saga, sound
tip when you write your nextalbum.
So record it twice.
Just once with clean vocals,instead of scream vocal see, but
that's actually a cool idea.
I very few artists release thesame music in different formats
or different styles.
Will (14:09):
I mean there is a tradition of that kind of in
some music like, I guess, indianRock, where, like you have a
cutting room floor version, orlike a side version yeah,
usually it's not that drastic ofa switch like, sometimes it's
just acoustic version or likealternate lyrics or something
like that, and then, slightlydifferently, you have remixes in
electronic music that are quiteyeah, quite
(14:31):
common yeah and the yeah yeahguys were actually great at that
where they did a bunch of danceremixes of their songs with
different DJs and stuff.
That can be a cool thing.
I'm surprised no one does thatin the metal space, where, like
they do, like I don't know, likean R&B version of the metal
song or like I'm sure theysomeone has, but I just it's
just not like common or talkedabout because they were a more
(14:53):
commonplace thing that would be,yeah, beans is like on his
beans is part of this video.
Andrew (14:58):
Well, welcome, welcome beans.
I don't know if he's on camerabecause he's pretty low to the
ground, but I don't know likeI'm so excited you talk about
the battle.
Talk, yeah last thing I want tomention about the lyrics.
I like the way they're writtenthey're.
They're just like they don'treally read like poem, poetry or
lyrics.
It's just like asking questions.
Will (15:15):
I get a poetry vibe well, yeah, I mean it's about.
It depends on how you read ittoo.
Andrew (15:20):
I if I, if I were to read it as a as it was a
paragraph, it would feel lessflowy.
But, like you know things likehow, why did the first, first
organic molecule copy itself?
Like that's not like typicallyrical juice, it's just why did
the first organic molecule copyitself?
It's like a scientific question, but he's posing in the context
(15:42):
of like a bigger, biggerdiscussion right, I like how
literal, he just states it, butit totally makes sense with the
theme.
Will (15:49):
It's like he's asking that because, like, was that a first
act of individualism?
Andrew (15:54):
you know, like stuff like that like in 2001, when the
, when the primate or the, theape or whatever was, his first
act of individualism was to takethat bone and scare the other
apes, yeah, and then use it tokill one of them yeah, and of
course that bone goes in the airand becomes a spaceship.
But I mean like, I mean that'sprobably the.
(16:14):
Is that not the greatesttransition in all film?
Will (16:17):
but like, you can do that.
He's got a lot.
Of it's pretty good one.
Andrew (16:20):
Yeah, I see the same sort of like Big narrative, like
statements like that, like thebone going to their turning in
the spaceship.
That is such like a grand Posit.
Yeah, it's a huge.
Yeah, it's a huge.
It's like okay, whoa, you justsaid a lot, let's think about
this.
Yeah, I get that feeling fromthis album, has he?
Will (16:39):
done a music video for any of the songs.
Andrew (16:41):
No, he has like a visualizer.
Will (16:44):
Okay.
Andrew (16:44):
Yeah, typically in this like underground black metal
space, you don't see much audiovisual content or, sorry, like
video content to a company, themusic in fact.
He's never played, as far as Iknow, any of his music live.
Will (16:59):
Okay, so I know he's never played this live.
Andrew (17:01):
It's and there's.
He wrote this himself that heprogrammed the drums, for
instance.
Will (17:06):
Like it's all right, it's a one-man black metal band,
that's also interesting though,because, like in the rock space
too, it's like Like videosaren't as big as they used to be
like general.
Yeah, I see a lot of indieartists who take time to like
make a video, even if it's withtheir friends, or they film with
themselves or something it's.
Andrew (17:23):
I'd say it's generally important just for, like Band
cred and just free advertising,but you're not gonna make money
on it.
Will (17:30):
No, yeah, it's nice to have yeah.
Yeah, anyway, hey man what youdo my myself.
Hey man, what you do my self ishey man, what you do I myself.
A bit, that is it.
Oh, I say hey man, what you dowhen I myself his巾.
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