For three decades, both Phil Koopman and Steve Wilson have been working in AI. They joined us on Making AI Work for You for a conversation about health tech safety and security.
With exceptional backgrounds and unparalleled experience, they share their perspectives on:
- Why cybersecurity is an “arms race”
- How safety standards differ from machine learning testing
- The considerations about the level of agency you give an AI system
- Why there needs to be a human “captain of the ship”
- Struggles with the software supply chain
- Why it’s critical to have rigorous engineering processes
Phil is an associate professor at Carnegie Mellon University, is the originator of UL 4600, and has been working on self-driving cars for 30 years.
Steve is CPO of Exabeam, is an author, a member of the TTIC, and is an expert in machine learning, LLMs, and cybersecurity. He’s been working in AI since 1992.
Topical time codes:
1:47 - Phil - The importance of humans in autonomous technology
5:10 - Phil - You need a captain of the ship for safety
7:04 - Steve - Agentic systems
11:09 - Steve - Software supply chains
15:39 - Phil - The challenge of making sure software is safe
17:54 - Phil - Testing doesn’t prove safety
20:27 - Phil - The purpose & value of UL 4600
23:06 - Phil - You can’t wait until something is on fire to put out the fire
24:16 - Steve - Culture of the Product environment
25:27 - Steve - Need for focus around safety and security for good decisions
26:07 - Phil - In embedded AI, there are real people on the other side
27:36 - Steve - Cybersecurity is an arms race
29:38 - Phil - People short-cut safety when they’re in a rush
Connect with Phil Koopman: https://www.linkedin.com/in/philip-koopman-0631a4116/
Learn more about UL 4600: https://ulse.org/ul-standards-engagement/autonomous-vehicle-technology
Connect with Steve Wilson: https://www.linkedin.com/in/wilsonsd/
Learn more about Exabeam: https://www.linkedin.com/company/exabeam/
Connect with Sherri Douville: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sdouville/
Learn more about TTIC: https://medium.com/@news_52674/about
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Special Summer Offer: Exclusively on Apple Podcasts, try our Dateline Premium subscription completely free for one month! With Dateline Premium, you get every episode ad-free plus exclusive bonus content.
The Breakfast Club
The World's Most Dangerous Morning Show, The Breakfast Club, With DJ Envy, Jess Hilarious, And Charlamagne Tha God!
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.