March 3, 2025 • 53 mins
If you've ever hesitated to step onto a stage or doubted the power of your voice, this episode is for you. Today, we’re joined by Bobbie Carlton, founder of Innovation Women, a game-changer in the world of public speaking. Bobbie shares her personal journey from being a nervous speaker to becoming a sought-after expert on stages worldwide.
We’re tackling some big topics today, why visibility equals opportunity, how women can break into the public speaking space, and the systemic barriers that still keep too many voices unheard. Whether you’re an introvert, a seasoned speaker, or just starting to explore public speaking, Bobbie’s insights will help you take the stage with confidence.
What You’ll Learn in This Episode:
✅ The biggest public speaking challenges and how to overcome them
✅ Why practice and preparation are the key to confidence
✅ How to handle interruptions and take control of the stage
✅ The power of diverse voices in public speaking
✅ How women can gain visibility and recognition in leadership
✅ The impact of virtual events and how they’ve changed speaking opportunities
✅ Why saying “yes” to speaking opportunities can unlock career growth
Key Takeaways:
🎤 Public speaking is a skill anyone can develop with the right mindset and practice.
🎤 Visibility leads to opportunities—speaking on stage can open doors in your career.
🎤 Introverts can be incredible speakers with preparation and confidence-building strategies.
🎤 Women are still underrepresented in speaking roles—it's time to change that!
🎤 Diversity on panels matters—it leads to richer conversations and better solutions.
🎤 Men can be allies in promoting gender diversity in speaking events.
🎤 Virtual events have created more speaking opportunities than ever before.
Whether you're looking to level up your communication skills, gain credibility, or step into leadership, this conversation with Bobbie Carlton will inspire you to take action.
📣 Ready to become a more powerful communicator? Tune in now!
Resources & Links:
Website - https://innovationwomen.com
LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/bobbiecarlton
X - https://twitter.com/WomenInno
TikTok - https://tiktok.com/@womeninno
🚀 Want to become a more confident and impactful communicator? Visit TimNewmanSpeaks.com for free resources and coaching opportunities!
Want to be a guest on Speaking With Confidence? Send Tim Newman a message on PodMatch
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Tim (00:07):
Welcome to Speaking with Confidence.
The podcast is here to help youunlock the power of effective
public speaking.
I'm your host, tim Newman, andI'm excited to take you on a
journey to become a betterpublic speaker.
Today's guest, bobbi Carlton,is the founder of Innovation
Women, an online speakerplatform that was created to
help get more women on stage atconferences and events.
(00:28):
She's an entertainingtell-it-like-it-is speaker who
speaks extensively andpassionately about public
speaking and how it can be thedriving force behind career
growth and business success.
She's a TEDx speaker, anentertaining startup event host.
She's spoken at the UnitedNations.
She's shared the stage with astorytelling legend and NPR's
(00:48):
Snap Judgment host, glennWashington, and she's been on
the main stage for some of theworld's best-known conferences
for technical and professionalwomen.
Bobbi has inspired thousands oftechnical and entrepreneurial
executive women to take controlof their own speaking careers
and has worked with eventmanagers around the world to
deliver diverse and inclusiveevents.
Let's go ahead and welcomeBobby to the show.
(01:11):
Bobby, welcome to the show, andI'm really excited to talk with
you today.
Bobbie (01:16):
Thanks, tim, me too.
Tim (01:19):
You know you have a long history in the speaking space,
but I want to take, before weget really started into talk
about what you're doing now,let's go back to where it all
started, Talk about yourspeaking journey and,
specifically, you know, werethere any times that you know
(01:41):
you messed up and you feltembarrassed about it, and how
did you handle that?
You know you messed up and youfelt embarrassed about it, and
how did you handle that.
Bobbie (01:48):
I think all of them were mess ups early on.
Just for background, I actuallyhave a broadcasting degree.
I went to school for radio andtelevision, but I kind of
immediately jumped into my roleas a public relations person and
so it was my job to get otherpeople on stage, and I spent a
(02:11):
lot of time working withexecutives, often at big
enterprise software companies,to help them get on stage.
So when I started my secondcompany Innovation Night, I kind
of feel like I blocked the factthat I would have to be the
(02:34):
emcee and the host for thesemonthly events.
That first night everyoneexpected me to be that emcee and
the host and to speak to theassembled 200 or so people, at
which point I immediatelysweated through my blouse thank
(02:59):
God for blazers and it was awful.
I mean, I was just absolutely aliteral hot mess on stage and
of course this was a socialmedia-powered event.
In other words, we wereencouraging people to have their
(03:21):
phones out to take video andpictures.
So there is ample evidence ofme being that literal hot mess.
And afterwards I saw all ofthose pictures.
I saw all of those videos.
I looked at every one of themand I looked at it and said, oh
God, I'm going to either have tostop this immediately or I'm
(03:44):
going to have to get better.
Now we did 130 events withInnovation Nights before we ran
into the pandemic.
You know 11 years of monthlyevents and I got.
Better, I had to, it was asurvival thing.
Better, I had to, it was asurvival thing.
(04:04):
And you know it does show thatpractice is so important.
You can read all the stuff youwant, you can get all kinds of
advice, but until you put itinto practice.
Tim (04:21):
You are never going to get better and it's so important to
be able to share this becauseeverybody goes through this.
You know, even the bestspeakers in the world, I would
say everybody.
Let's just say 99% of thepopulation goes through this.
Even the best speakers in theworld had to start somewhere and
they had to practice.
They had to.
(04:41):
I would say everybody who spokein public has said something
embarrassing or done something.
They had to.
I would say everybody who spokein public has said something
embarrassing or done something.
And to me, it's important foryoung professionals to
understand that that they're notalone in this.
It's not just about them.
Everybody goes through this and, like you said, you have to get
out and do it, you have topractice it.
Bobbie (04:58):
You have to put yourself out there Absolutely, and you
know it took a while to get tothe point where I felt
comfortable with it.
I'm naturally an introvert andpeople now they kind of scoff at
me when I say that I'm like no,I am absolutely, 100% an
introvert and I think there's alot of well, I'm an introvert,
(05:21):
so I shouldn't be a publicspeaker.
I have actually made it mymission to tell people if I'm an
introvert, so I shouldn't be apublic speaker.
I have actually made it mymission to tell people if you
are an introvert.
I encourage you to take uppublic speaking, because we need
more introverts on stage,because I feel that introverts
have some natural things thatthey do extremely well, and one
(05:45):
of them is they practice, theyprepare because they are a
little nervous about getting onstage.
Meanwhile, extroverts haveprobably been told their entire
lives oh you should get intopublic speaking because you're
an extrovert, or oh, this comesnaturally to you.
(06:06):
And a lot of times thoseextroverted people or more
extroverted people, they don'tput in the time, they don't
practice as much as someone whois more introverted and they may
be less likely to finish ontime, for example.
Tim (06:27):
Exactly.
I mean that's.
You know, most people areintroverts.
They really are.
And you know, I think if wejust understood, if we
understood who we are asindividuals and really thought
about who we are as individuals,you know what makes us tick,
what makes us, what do webelieve and why do we believe in
those types of things I thinkwe'd be better off all across
(06:50):
the board, but especially withpublic speaking, because then we
can know how to overcome theseobstacles which aren't
necessarily obstacles, it's justwho we are, but how we can be
better at being who we are to beable to share the information.
So when did you realize thatyou actually had a gift?
(07:10):
Because you're really, reallygood I mean, there's no doubt,
there's no question about thatyou are good at communication.
You're good at sharinginformation how it comes across.
You always seem like it comesnatural to you now.
So when did you realize you hada gift?
Bobbie (07:30):
Gift or curse.
I don't think I have a gift.
I just think that I'vepracticed enough that the things
I want to say come out in fullyformed sentences.
To say come out in fully formedsentences, they come out in
(08:11):
ways that again, so that nowthere are very well-practiced
answers to some things and Ihave a funny little sense of
humor that I employ when I amdoing public speaking.
One of my kids actually told methat I am funny because nobody
(08:35):
expects me to be funny.
That's a good one.
And I was like whoa, that'sinteresting.
Actually he at first saidyou're funny because you're not
funny.
What does that mean?
Tim (08:46):
What does that even?
Bobbie (08:47):
mean.
What do you even mean by that?
And he's like it's really theincongruity of being a not
expected to be funny person withthe little side commentary.
I also know how to use a pause.
Pauses are power Pauses andemphasis with a pause gives
(09:12):
people's brains a moment tocatch up.
But it also means that you'renot inserting extra words.
Filler words are kind of thebane of every speaker's
existence.
When you don't know exactlywhat you want to say, you insert
extra words the ums, the sos,things like that and I did a
(09:40):
TEDx talk with three days noticeand someone afterwards
commented that they were soimpressed by the fact that I did
it without filler words.
And I said well, of course Idid.
I knew what I was going to sayand so if you know what you're
going to say, you are lesslikely to use filler.
Tim (10:05):
And that comes with practice.
I mean, that's something that Iharp on all the time.
Again, I come from the sportbackground and there's no team,
no individual goes intocompetition without practice,
and this public speaking is nodifferent.
You know, if you're going to ajob interview, if you're going
to stand on stage, if you'regoing to a networking event,
(10:28):
there are certain things thatyou should be practicing.
Knowing who you're going to betalking to is paramount.
Bobbie (10:36):
Absolutely.
Tim (10:39):
But it really comes across when you've practiced and when
you haven't practiced, and theaudience will be able to tell
that almost right away.
You know, in terms of beingauthentic you are in terms of,
like you said, the filler words,the pauses, all those types of
things do come across and theaudience is going to find you
(11:01):
out really, really quick, andit's just so important.
Now let's get into what you'vebeen doing lately, and I really
like the way that you put things.
You've got three businesses.
You've got what you call yourday job, your night job and your
dream job.
Tell us a little bit about thedream job.
(11:24):
Tell us a little bit about thedream job, because this is where
I think we really need tounderstand the power of public
speaking and how that affectswomen in particular and how we
can help elevate them intoone-stage roles, into the
(11:44):
boardrooms, those types ofthings.
Bobbie (11:46):
Absolutely, and I've always seen public speaking as a
path to many things.
Two-thirds of all conferencespeakers are men, which leaves
women out of career and businessopportunities that come from
speaking.
(12:06):
When you are on stage, you havethe ability to tell your story,
to share your ideas.
You will never be seen as aleader if you're just sitting in
the audience.
So when you're on stage, youget those opportunities.
Sitting in the audience, sowhen you're on stage, you get
(12:27):
those opportunities.
I actually have a little phraseI use visibility equals
opportunity, and the day job,the night job and the dream job
are all focused around drivingvisibility.
My day job is I run a marketingfirm.
My night job for many years wasMass Innovation Nights, which
is a monthly new product launchevent, driving visibility for
(12:50):
startups.
And then Innovation Women.
The dream job is the dream ofgetting more women on stage at
conferences and events.
Tim (13:30):
No-transcript no-transcript , when women get to the point of
being on stage, number onebeing seen as leaders.
But you also talk about thepower of being the one.
(13:52):
What does that mean and how canbeing the one really elevate
you from even just being onstage to becoming a CEO and
becoming on a board?
Because let's just leave it atthat, because I want you to make
another point here in just aminute.
Bobbie (14:12):
All right.
So the one is the one thatpeople immediately think of when
they need to fill a role, andmy personal experience with the
becoming the one was what Imentioned earlier.
I did a TEDx talk with very,very little notice.
(14:34):
The TEDx organizers for TEDxSuffolk University reached out
to me and said we want to inviteyou to be one of our TEDx
speakers.
And, of course, as a speaker,it's like oh, my goodness, ted,
tedx, great brands.
People know what you're talkingabout when you say TED.
(14:59):
And I was at first like, soexcited.
And I was like, of course, I'dlove to like so excited.
And I was like, of course, I'dlove to.
When is it?
And the answer was Tuesday.
Like, as a speaker, that'shorrifying.
That gives you days to do whatmost people do in months.
(15:21):
Very few people just jump up onstage and go ta-, I'm gonna do
a tedx talk.
It takes practice.
You often get extensivecoaching.
Uh, you get input on your ideas.
And I was like uh, no, no,that's a really bad idea.
Um, but you know, I have thisdatabase with thousands of
(15:45):
speakers.
Maybe there's a speaker inthere who is prepared to do a
TEDx talk.
With only a few days notice, Iwent and I collected five names,
five names of people who wereperhaps rash enough to go and
say yes to something like this,enough to go and say yes to
something like this, and theevent organizers are like no,
(16:10):
none of them is in our theme.
And I'm like well, what's yourtheme?
They said innovation.
Like ah, now I get it.
Now I understand why you askedme.
I started two companies withthe word innovation in the name.
(16:33):
I'm also a relatively well-knownspeaker in the Boston community
because I was running at thetime a monthly event where I'm
the emcee.
You felt comfortable ininviting me.
I was a known quantity and mybrand fit your theme.
(16:54):
That's part of becoming the oneImmediate recognition of that
person as being a good fit foryour event.
That's what you want to achieveas a speaker.
But it's also helping you withyour career options.
(17:16):
Like, hey, I need to hire adesigner, I need to hire a chief
revenue officer.
Oh, I just saw somebody and Irecognize them and I know their
name and they're well known forthat thing.
That's part of it.
Tim (17:39):
And to take that just a step further right, step further
right, when, when you're theone, again, you're going to
start being looked at for CEOroles.
Talk about the, the, the beingelevated to positions on a board
, and how, how, when women areon boards, the, the roles that
(18:04):
that they have to take and maybesome of the kind of
disadvantages that they have ofbeing on a board.
And again, why is it soimportant to get that one stage
so that they can get on to moreboards?
Bobbie (18:19):
Absolutely, and being on stage gives you all kinds of
advantages in the career andbusiness world.
You know, people know you, theyknow your ideas, they know your
story.
They feel more comfortable withyou because they have seen you
in person talking.
That's important.
(18:41):
People do business with peoplethey know.
People do business with peoplethey know and people feel like
they know you when you've beenup on stage telling your stories
.
So being on stage also gets youaccess to new jobs and
sometimes board seats could be apart of that, could be a part
(19:10):
of that.
I think it's incrediblyimportant for women to be on
boards because they are in aposition of power.
They are able to makesuggestions to people who are
running companies.
If you look at the Fortune 500,how many of those organizations
are led by women?
It's still a very small number.
How many of those organizationshave women on their boards?
(19:36):
Again, a smaller number.
So if we look at a board seat,there is new legislation that
has been happening in Californiaand I believe it is up for
consideration in some otherstates as well, about the number
(19:57):
of women on boards.
Just having a single woman on aboard is really not making the
impact that we would like it tohave.
Because when you are the lonewoman in the room, whether it's
a board or any other location,you are being expected to kind
(20:22):
of carry the flag for yourgender and that can be
problematic, like you are in aprecarious position when you are
by yourself in any group,whether it's a person of color,
whether it's a woman, whetherit's a non-binary individual,
(20:45):
like you're being expected torepresent and you may feel like
you can't do that if it is justyou.
So sometimes there's safety innumbers.
You need a second woman or athird, and there have been
(21:05):
studies done about the makeup ofboards that say women don't
have the impact we expect themto have until there are three
women in that room, then theyare not being there as a token
woman.
They not, they're justrepresenting their gender.
(21:27):
They are there and theexpectations are very different
yeah, that's a.
Tim (21:37):
That's a very interesting and kind of disturbing data set
there for me.
Know the whole idea that let'sjust take imposter syndrome as a
, for example.
Right, you know the wholefeeling of I don't belong here.
I don't belong here, I don'tbelong here.
That's something that we tellourselves.
But then you get to this where,okay, now you have earned we all
(22:02):
earn things, right, you earnbeing on stage, you earn being
the CEO, you earn the positionon the board, but but now you're
not even.
You're not, you're not evenreally a part of the board
because you're not takingsomething maybe not be taken
seriously, you're not going tobe listened to.
What have you?
Even at that level it's, it'skind of disturbing, you know,
(22:24):
because we tell, we tell, wetell our young professionals,
our people, that we're lookingfor leaders all the time.
Right, we want people to standout, we want people to speak out
, we want people to take chargeof situations and move us
forward and lead us, and nowwe're on a board as a woman and
you're not making any differencebecause you're not being taken
(22:45):
seriously.
Bobbie (22:47):
It's just a little disturbing.
Yeah, it's that degree ofinfluence that you have as a
single person or a singlerepresentative when you're
talking about board seats or anyother group that you're a
minority in.
So you want to have a quorum,you want to have kind of a
(23:10):
critical mass, and that criticalmass for women on boards is, I
guess, three.
You know, you're not just asingle woman by herself.
Tim (23:22):
There's a group of you, you and even if you have have, have
a, have a male, you know thatis um championing you or
agreeing with you, orencouraging you.
My guess is it's still.
It may have some effect, but itdoesn't really have the effect
that we're that we want to haveanyway.
(23:43):
Is that accurate?
Bobbie (23:44):
yeah, I mean you don't want to be seen as the token
woman.
Um, having a male champion,having a male ally, can be
helpful, but that's almost likeyou need the support to be
effective.
That can be, you know, notgreat either.
Tim (24:03):
Right, yeah, I just, and I go.
I know I live in a world withrose-colored glasses.
I just wish we could just be ata point where we're hired
because we've earned it, wedeserve it, we're the best
person for the job, not the bestmale, not the best female, not
the best African-American, notthe best whatever.
(24:24):
We're the best person for thejob and we move forward.
Uh, on that and yeah, butunfortunately there are still
places where it's equity, notequality, exactly.
Bobbie (24:39):
And you know, when you are constantly dealing with
flights or systemic issues, youare kind of taking your starting
blocks to go.
And use the athletic comparison, your starting blocks are a
(25:03):
little bit further back Right,or maybe you're running the
hurdles race while everybodyelse is on the flat track.
Tim (25:11):
Yeah, yeah, and we have to be better.
I'll just put it that way.
Bobbie (25:20):
I mean one of the things that I've talked about with a
lot of people in terms of thespeaking game is there are some
systemic issues when it comes toseeing women on stage, and this
is all from the Bureau of LaborStatistics.
Women are more likely to workpart-time.
(25:41):
Women are more likely to workfor smaller organizations.
Women are more likely to workfor smaller organizations.
Women are still more likely tobe responsible for kids and home
, and all of those are reasonswhy, when invited, women are
less likely to say yes.
Number one like you know, wetalked about part-time.
(26:05):
So if I only work three days aweek and I get invited to speak
at a conference, maybe I've gota day of travel.
The conference is a day longand then I have to get back.
That could mean that I'm out ofwork for an entire week, for an
(26:30):
entire week, and if I'm workingfor a smaller organization,
there might not be anybody tobackfill for me or that smaller
organization doesn't have it intheir budget to send me to that
conference.
I might have to pay for mytravel and my hotel out of my
own pocket, because half of allevent managers have no budget
(26:51):
whatsoever for speakers.
They look at speaking at theirconference.
As a gift that we're giving you,we're putting hundreds of
people in the audience for you.
You want us to pay you too.
Like not everybody gets aid tospeak at conferences and events,
(27:13):
and if you're a woman andyou're not speaking as often,
you might not be the keynote.
42% of some of event managerspay some speakers.
They might only have budget forkeynotes, so that means that
(27:33):
you're being left out of thecompensation from the organizers
and your company isn't payingfor you as well.
So lots of systemic things arekeeping women from the stages.
Tim (27:50):
Yeah.
So I'm going to ask an absurdquestion here because I already
know the answer.
So we should tell women to justkind of wait to be asked to be
a speaker, right?
No, no, no, no, sorry, no, thatno, no, sorry, no, that's okay,
keep going.
No, you go ahead with that,because that's it.
(28:13):
I mean, if women are only onthe stage a third of the time,
we should just accept it and noteven bother asking, not even
start searching those out.
Let's just sit back and wait tobe asked.
Bobbie (28:28):
No, okay.
So understand that the basiccurrency of getting on stage for
a lot of conferences and eventsis something called the call
for speakers, which is literallyevent managers standing up
waving their arms and sayingcome at me with your ideas, come
(28:54):
to me and tell me why youshould be a speaker at my event
to be invited, so you might haveto apply.
You might have to pitchyourself as a speaker at that
(29:15):
conference and, understandinghow people get on stage, only a
very small percentage of peopleare getting invited.
The Innovation Women platformone of the things that we do is
we have a database of speakingopportunities and these are all
calls for speakers.
(29:36):
I think right now on theplatform there's like 1,500
calls for speakers that arecurrently open, like right now,
looking for speakers, and theychange all the time.
Once the deadline is passed,they leave the platform, and
(29:56):
that's just a small percentageof the opportunities that are
out there.
We add, like I don't know,between 50 and 100 a week to our
platform and you don't need ourplatform.
Like I'd love to have you onour platform, ladies, but you
don't need it.
You can literally just go andsearch on Google and put in the
(30:18):
words call for speakers and youwill see all of the
opportunities that are out therebegging for you to come and
pitch that's insane and it so.
Tim (30:33):
Is there a certain time of year where there's where there's
more conferences?
Obviously my guess is aroundchristmas.
Bobbie (30:40):
You know the holiday time there's probably not as
many, but yeah, but um, so, likean annual conference, they are
probably putting up their callfor speakers right after the
previous conference.
But I always say that there arekind of some what I call event
silly seasons where it is superbusy September, october, also
(31:08):
April and May.
Those times are extra busybecause all of the conferences
and events are trying to get inbefore the holidays and get in
their event before summer, whenthey might lose some people to
vacations.
So there's an extra likepredominance of events during
(31:33):
April, may and September andOctober, but there are events
year round all over the place.
I've done speaking at oneparticular event every year for
like four years in a row andit's in August.
You know it's like people whoare scheduling events.
(31:53):
They look at the calendar andthey say, okay, when is it?
We're getting together.
Little side note here A lot oforganizations actually have it
written into their bylaws thatthey have to have an annual
event, like that's part of theirinternal rules, which means
(32:16):
that when the pandemic hit, alot of those same organizations
had to.
Like they didn't have a lot ofchoices.
They could either cancel theirevent and run up against their
own bylaws, or they couldpostpone, and somewhat
indefinitely when the pandemichit, or they could go online.
(32:38):
And going online was afantastic opportunity for women
in particular, because it meantthat we could do our speaking
from right here.
We didn't have to travel, wedidn't have to find a babysitter
, we didn't have to findsomebody to take care of our
(33:00):
parents or whatever it is we do.
We could do it from our homes.
Tim (33:06):
So that was a really good thing for us.
Yeah, not even lose a full dayof work, right?
Yeah, because it's an hour,maybe an hour and a half, two
hours tops of you still had toprepare Right.
Bobbie (33:19):
You still had to practice, but that could be all
done on your own time and youdidn't have to hop on a plane.
Tim (33:24):
That could be all done on your own time and you didn't
have to hop on a plane.
Yeah, that's.
And you know even still nowthat the pandemic is over.
You know there are still a lotof conferences that stayed
virtual, which is great orhybrid.
You know, and I think it's, Ithink everybody here's Tim talk
(33:45):
now.
I think everybody should findthe way that suits them the best
and then become good at that,become the one at that you
really do.
As a speaker, you really doneed to be seen at both virtual
(34:07):
and in person.
Even if you're better atvirtual, you still need to be
doing both.
Bobbie (34:14):
And there's a real power in speaking in person on a
stage.
Interesting side note here aswell when you are on a stage,
you are actually physicallyelevated above an audience.
There's something that happenspsychologically when we're
(34:34):
sitting in an audience and we'relooking at someone who is above
us, there's a little extra likecredibility that gets added,
because that person is on astage and we are looking up at
them literally.
Tim (34:56):
And you know, from the audience perspective, that is a
psychological phenomenon, right?
I mean, it's something that weas, even as experts in our own
right when somebody else is upon stage, we still see them as
elevated.
That's just the way it is.
(35:16):
Yeah, we see them as elevated.
That's just the way it is.
Bobbie (35:18):
Yeah, we see them as experts.
Tim (35:19):
Yeah.
Bobbie (35:20):
The expectation is they've been vetted by the
organization.
They are experts because theyare on stage and we are in the
audience.
There's that extra layer ofcredibility that gets added to
them when they are on that stage.
Credibility that gets added tothem when they are on that stage
.
Tim (35:39):
So let's talk about another word that you use a lot, that I
didn't know what it meant, youknow, until just the other day
the mantle.
I thought the mantle wassomething that went above the
fireplace that you put, you know, your elf on a shelf.
Bobbie (35:55):
But what's a mantle A?
mantle, not a mantle, exactlythat's by baltimore accent yes,
so a mantle is, uh, thederogatory term for an all-male
panel.
And uh, these days, you know,we all run around and and we've
(36:17):
got our phones, slash cameras inour hand and there is a, you
know, very easy for us to take apicture of the all-male panel
in front of us and share that onsocial media saying, hey, they
(36:38):
couldn't find a woman expert forthis.
We have a term that we use aswell.
We call it the all male, allpale, because often they are all
white, all stale, because it'soften the same people.
So, all male, all pale, allstale.
(36:59):
Because we understand, you know,like event managers, they see
somebody on stage who does agood job and they say, okay, I'm
going to use that person again,or I'm going to use that person
at my event.
Which means that if you go tomultiple events in an industry
(37:20):
or a category, you might beseeing the same speakers over
and over and over again.
And that's because speakingbegets speaking.
The more speaking you do, themore speaking you will do.
And often the all-male,all-pale aspects of that are
(37:42):
because industry leadership isall-male and all-pale and, by
the way, I don't have anythingagainst old white guys, I happen
to be married to one.
It's just that we need thatdiversity on stage in order to
present diverse viewpoints anddiverse life experiences.
(38:06):
My experience as a woman isgoing to be different.
Tim (38:17):
And if we have those different experiences and
they're actually shared, thenyou know, what I told you a
couple days ago is you know, wemay actually learn something, we
may actually want to changepolicy, we may actually want to
change direction, or we may wantto keep doing what we're doing,
or we may want to keep doingwhat we're doing.
You know, I think there's somuch to getting feedback from
(38:42):
you know, from different people.
Now, the page you told me aboutwhere you know there's the
ridiculous mantles Eddie,congrats, you've got an all-male
panel Tumblr.
Bobbie (38:58):
Um why, congrats, you've got an all male panel Tumblr.
Tim (39:02):
Yeah, that's Tumblr.
Yeah, that Tumblr is, is a is aresource for, for, for a lot,
for a lot of things, especiallyif you want to laugh, but but
but tell us about that again.
The resource for for, uh, allmale for all-male panels.
Bobbie (39:21):
Yeah, so I mean, this Tumblr page has been up for many
years and it's called Congrats,you have an All-Male Panel and
it's a tongue-in-cheek poking atevent managers who create
mantles, and each picture of amantle is stamped with a picture
(39:41):
of David Hasselhoff from theKnight Rider.
I mean, we're going back a wayshere, giving the event manager
that big thumbs up.
Good job, event manager.
You once again managed to putup an all-male panel.
Once again managed to put up anall-male panel.
(40:03):
Now, my personal favorite isthe all-male panel on
breastfeeding.
I mean, yes, they're all doctors, but not one of them has had
personal experience with thephenomena, so you would think
that they could have possiblyfound some other expert on
breastfeeding who might perhapshave been female.
Tim (40:24):
Exactly.
Just maybe it's killing youhave to shake your head.
I mean, you would think, though, that there would be somebody
would see this and say you knowwhat?
Bobbie (40:37):
Something's just not right here, yeah we've got a
problem folks, a little bit of aproblem, yeah, and there's
actually things that men can doas well.
Um, I recently gave apresentation and one of the
pieces of feedback I got from amember of the audience is I am
one of the male and pale folks,how do I help out?
(40:58):
And there are various pledgesthat you can take, gentlemen,
where you can say I will notappear on a mantle or I will not
appear on a panel, that is allCaucasians panel, that is all
Caucasians.
And as you take this pledge,then you need to kind of deliver
(41:23):
on it.
So if you are asked to be on apanel, you need to raise up to
the event organizers the issueand say hey, folks, I've noticed
that this panel that you askedme to be on is all men currently
.
What can we do about this?
(41:43):
Can we invite women?
Do you need to replace me?
Now, this is a big ask of men,because what they are being
asked to do is to step down fromtheir own speaking
(42:04):
opportunities and, quite frankly, somebody who takes that pledge
and is prepared to step down isprobably enough of a male ally
that I do want them to get theiropportunities.
So you know there's a littlebit of a thing going on there.
I actually wanted to um give ashout out to another
organization as well.
Uh, they have an app called thega tally, and ga stands for
(42:30):
gender avenger, and the ga tallyis an app that you can download
and you can create a socialmedia ready image that shows the
gender balance and also thenumber of people of color on a
(42:51):
speaking slate for a conferenceor an event.
Oh, wow.
It also has a really neatfeature where you can sit in the
audience during a talk orduring a presentation,
especially a panel, and you canpush a button two buttons on
(43:12):
this screen.
One is labeled Dude and one islabeled not a dude and you can
actually look at the share ofvoice, because having women on
stage isn't necessarily the end,it's only the beginning.
They have to be able to speak,and a lot of panels you'll
(43:37):
notice this.
If the moderator isn't likeright on people, some people get
more opportunity to speak thanothers.
So you need that share of voiceas well as you need the
presence.
Tim (43:52):
Speaking of that number one , we're looking for leaders.
So, man, if you're, if you'resigning this, good on you, but
obviously follow through.
But it goes back to we'relooking for leaders to affect
change.
And you know what I?
I I get that it may, it mayhurt a little bit, but I think
(44:13):
in the end it will actually help.
Be be a leader.
That's what we're looking for,right?
I mean, that's to me, that'swhat it's all about.
And how do you coach women towhen they're on a panel or
they're in a discussion?
Let's just talk about panels,for example, when they're
(44:36):
talking, they're finally giventheir opportunity to talk and
then they're interrupted.
Bobbie (44:43):
Yeah, unfortunately that happens quite a bit, and
sometimes you just need to beprepared.
You know, if you getinterrupted in the moment,
sometimes it's kind of hard tospeak up unless you're prepared
for it.
So I invite people to practicetheir preparation, especially if
(45:08):
they're going to be on a panelwhere there are one of the only
women or the only women or onlywoman.
So, for example, one of thethings I love to use myself is
wow, I really appreciate yourenthusiasm, but just let me
finish my point and then I'dlove to hear your thoughts, or
(45:30):
hold that thought.
I'll be wrapped up in just amoment.
Or maybe you need to be alittle bit stronger.
I'd like to finish what I wassaying and then we can discuss
your perspective.
So practice your response aheadof time, especially if it's
happened to you before, orperhaps you're anticipating the
(45:53):
interruptions.
Tim (45:54):
Yeah, those are a lot more less abrasive than I would
handle it, but then again that'sjust me and my style.
When I get interrupted, Ipretty much say thank you for
(46:16):
interrupting me while I was,Thank you for talking while I
was interrupting you.
You know, it is what it is youknow, I think as women.
Bobbie (46:28):
we have less leeway.
If we are at all assertive, weare called abrasive If or worse.
Tim (46:42):
Worse.
Bobbie (46:43):
Or worse, you know.
So we have to be careful.
Even being funny, even beinghumorous, you can end up in
trouble.
Tim (46:56):
Yeah, I don't understand that.
I just Neither do I, but has astory right.
Everybody has something thatthey want to share about.
(47:17):
Everybody has has theirexpertise and experience and if
if we're not willing to toaccept that and listen to it,
then we've got all kinds ofother issues.
Let that person be who they are.
If you don't, if you don't likethat personality, you don't
(47:38):
have to like that person out.
Let them be them and move on.
Bobbie (47:44):
Yeah, I think that people forget that when we shut
down someone else's perspective,we also lose.
What if that's the person thathad the answer to your problem?
What if that's the person thathad the cure for cancer?
(48:04):
What if that is the person thatcould make a difference in your
industry, and yet they werenever allowed on stage, they
were never invited to be onstage.
Like we are all losing when welose the opportunity to hear
from everyone.
Tim (48:28):
Is there anything else that you think we need to talk about
that we haven't talked about?
Bobbie (48:34):
I could talk about this topic for days.
Tim (48:40):
I understand, I really do.
What about one piece of advicefor women outside of stand up
and do it now.
Which would you give them?
Bobbie (48:51):
Yeah, I often tell people from the stage during my
own presentations just say yesto public speaking and we'll
figure it out later on.
Okay, yes, absolutely Say yesto any opportunities that you
get and figure out how you canmake it happen.
But I think being prepared andpracticing for public speaking
(49:16):
opportunities is the biggestlesson that people need to hear.
You know you are not expectedto be an expert the first time
you jump up on stage, but youcan do things that will make you
better, whether it's asking aquestion from the audience,
(49:40):
getting your practice there.
I think we tend to think aboutpublic speaking very narrowly,
like what we're doing right now,that's public speaking.
Being on a panel, that ispublic speaking.
And, by the way, being on apanel, that is public speaking.
And, by the way, greatopportunity, because you usually
(50:01):
don't have to do a wholepresentation and you're sitting
in the comfy chairs on stageLike you're just having a
conversation and there happensto be an audience.
But if you really are lookingfor a way to practice public
speaking in a very small way,dipping your toe in the next
(50:24):
time you go to a conference oran event, ask a question from
the audience, you get tointroduce yourself.
You get to tell people who youwork with or what it is you do.
You ask your question and,ta-da, you are now a public
speaker, because you spoke tothe exact same audience that the
(50:50):
speakers on stage spoke to.
Tim (51:08):
No applications, no preparation necessary, you just
did it.
So give that a try the speakerthat's on stage, or whether it's
other audience members.
And now you've just grown yournetwork, you've just grown your
influence with very littleeffort by you.
Bobbie (51:26):
Yeah, I actually tell people that every time you ask a
question from the audience, youjust became the speaker on
stage's hero, because there isnothing more disheartening as a
speaker to finishing up yourpresentation asking for
questions and no one in theaudience cares enough to ask a
(51:51):
question.
It's like I'm dying.
You know crickets and it'sawkward.
So ask a question that showsthat you're interested in the
topic.
Tim (52:04):
You're interested.
You listened Again.
We're looking for leaders.
That's to me.
That's what it comes back to aswell.
So, bobby, where can peoplefind you if they want to work
with you?
Bobbie (52:16):
Absolutely Innovationwomencom.
Tim (52:19):
Awesome and I'll put that in the show notes for everybody.
Bobbie (52:22):
Thank you.
Tim (52:22):
So, bobbi, thank you so much for joining us today.
I really do appreciate it.
I love what you're doing, Ienjoy the conversation and
hopefully we can connect soonand if I could be of any help,
I'd love to be able to do thatfor you.
Excellent, thanks so much.
Be sure to visitspeakingwithconfidencecom to
join our growing.
I should know my own website.
(52:44):
You know that's the third timethis week.
That's the third time this weekI've messed up my own freaking
website.
That's what editors are for.
Oh, my goodness gracious, goagain.
Be sure to visitspeakingwithconfidencepodcastcom
(53:05):
to join a growing community andregister for the Formula for
Public Speaking course.
Always remember your voice hasthe power to change the world.
We'll talk to you next time,take care.
Welcome to Speaking with Confidence.
The podcast is here to help youunlock the power of effective
public speaking.
I'm your host, tim Newman, andI'm excited to take you on a
journey to become a betterpublic speaker.
Today's guest, bobbi Carlton,is the founder of Innovation
Women, an online speakerplatform that was created to
help get more women on stage atconferences and events.
(00:28):
She's an entertainingtell-it-like-it-is speaker who
speaks extensively andpassionately about public
speaking and how it can be thedriving force behind career
growth and business success.
She's a TEDx speaker, anentertaining startup event host.
She's spoken at the UnitedNations.
She's shared the stage with astorytelling legend and NPR's
(00:48):
Snap Judgment host, glennWashington, and she's been on
the main stage for some of theworld's best-known conferences
for technical and professionalwomen.
Bobbi has inspired thousands oftechnical and entrepreneurial
executive women to take controlof their own speaking careers
and has worked with eventmanagers around the world to
deliver diverse and inclusiveevents.
Let's go ahead and welcomeBobby to the show.
(01:11):
Bobby, welcome to the show, andI'm really excited to talk with
you today.
Bobbie (01:16):
Thanks, tim, me too.
Tim (01:19):
You know you have a long history in the speaking space,
but I want to take, before weget really started into talk
about what you're doing now,let's go back to where it all
started, Talk about yourspeaking journey and,
specifically, you know, werethere any times that you know
(01:41):
you messed up and you feltembarrassed about it, and how
did you handle that?
You know you messed up and youfelt embarrassed about it, and
how did you handle that.
Bobbie (01:48):
I think all of them were mess ups early on.
Just for background, I actuallyhave a broadcasting degree.
I went to school for radio andtelevision, but I kind of
immediately jumped into my roleas a public relations person and
so it was my job to get otherpeople on stage, and I spent a
(02:11):
lot of time working withexecutives, often at big
enterprise software companies,to help them get on stage.
So when I started my secondcompany Innovation Night, I kind
of feel like I blocked the factthat I would have to be the
(02:34):
emcee and the host for thesemonthly events.
That first night everyoneexpected me to be that emcee and
the host and to speak to theassembled 200 or so people, at
which point I immediatelysweated through my blouse thank
(02:59):
God for blazers and it was awful.
I mean, I was just absolutely aliteral hot mess on stage and
of course this was a socialmedia-powered event.
In other words, we wereencouraging people to have their
(03:21):
phones out to take video andpictures.
So there is ample evidence ofme being that literal hot mess.
And afterwards I saw all ofthose pictures.
I saw all of those videos.
I looked at every one of themand I looked at it and said, oh
God, I'm going to either have tostop this immediately or I'm
(03:44):
going to have to get better.
Now we did 130 events withInnovation Nights before we ran
into the pandemic.
You know 11 years of monthlyevents and I got.
Better, I had to, it was asurvival thing.
Better, I had to, it was asurvival thing.
(04:04):
And you know it does show thatpractice is so important.
You can read all the stuff youwant, you can get all kinds of
advice, but until you put itinto practice.
Tim (04:21):
You are never going to get better and it's so important to
be able to share this becauseeverybody goes through this.
You know, even the bestspeakers in the world, I would
say everybody.
Let's just say 99% of thepopulation goes through this.
Even the best speakers in theworld had to start somewhere and
they had to practice.
They had to.
(04:41):
I would say everybody who spokein public has said something
embarrassing or done something.
They had to.
I would say everybody who spokein public has said something
embarrassing or done something.
And to me, it's important foryoung professionals to
understand that that they're notalone in this.
It's not just about them.
Everybody goes through this and, like you said, you have to get
out and do it, you have topractice it.
Bobbie (04:58):
You have to put yourself out there Absolutely, and you
know it took a while to get tothe point where I felt
comfortable with it.
I'm naturally an introvert andpeople now they kind of scoff at
me when I say that I'm like no,I am absolutely, 100% an
introvert and I think there's alot of well, I'm an introvert,
(05:21):
so I shouldn't be a publicspeaker.
I have actually made it mymission to tell people if I'm an
introvert, so I shouldn't be apublic speaker.
I have actually made it mymission to tell people if you
are an introvert.
I encourage you to take uppublic speaking, because we need
more introverts on stage,because I feel that introverts
have some natural things thatthey do extremely well, and one
(05:45):
of them is they practice, theyprepare because they are a
little nervous about getting onstage.
Meanwhile, extroverts haveprobably been told their entire
lives oh you should get intopublic speaking because you're
an extrovert, or oh, this comesnaturally to you.
(06:06):
And a lot of times thoseextroverted people or more
extroverted people, they don'tput in the time, they don't
practice as much as someone whois more introverted and they may
be less likely to finish ontime, for example.
Tim (06:27):
Exactly.
I mean that's.
You know, most people areintroverts.
They really are.
And you know, I think if wejust understood, if we
understood who we are asindividuals and really thought
about who we are as individuals,you know what makes us tick,
what makes us, what do webelieve and why do we believe in
those types of things I thinkwe'd be better off all across
(06:50):
the board, but especially withpublic speaking, because then we
can know how to overcome theseobstacles which aren't
necessarily obstacles, it's justwho we are, but how we can be
better at being who we are to beable to share the information.
So when did you realize thatyou actually had a gift?
(07:10):
Because you're really, reallygood I mean, there's no doubt,
there's no question about thatyou are good at communication.
You're good at sharinginformation how it comes across.
You always seem like it comesnatural to you now.
So when did you realize you hada gift?
Bobbie (07:30):
Gift or curse.
I don't think I have a gift.
I just think that I'vepracticed enough that the things
I want to say come out in fullyformed sentences.
To say come out in fully formedsentences, they come out in
(08:11):
ways that again, so that nowthere are very well-practiced
answers to some things and Ihave a funny little sense of
humor that I employ when I amdoing public speaking.
One of my kids actually told methat I am funny because nobody
(08:35):
expects me to be funny.
That's a good one.
And I was like whoa, that'sinteresting.
Actually he at first saidyou're funny because you're not
funny.
What does that mean?
Tim (08:46):
What does that even?
Bobbie (08:47):
mean.
What do you even mean by that?
And he's like it's really theincongruity of being a not
expected to be funny person withthe little side commentary.
I also know how to use a pause.
Pauses are power Pauses andemphasis with a pause gives
(09:12):
people's brains a moment tocatch up.
But it also means that you'renot inserting extra words.
Filler words are kind of thebane of every speaker's
existence.
When you don't know exactlywhat you want to say, you insert
extra words the ums, the sos,things like that and I did a
(09:40):
TEDx talk with three days noticeand someone afterwards
commented that they were soimpressed by the fact that I did
it without filler words.
And I said well, of course Idid.
I knew what I was going to sayand so if you know what you're
going to say, you are lesslikely to use filler.
Tim (10:05):
And that comes with practice.
I mean, that's something that Iharp on all the time.
Again, I come from the sportbackground and there's no team,
no individual goes intocompetition without practice,
and this public speaking is nodifferent.
You know, if you're going to ajob interview, if you're going
to stand on stage, if you'regoing to a networking event,
(10:28):
there are certain things thatyou should be practicing.
Knowing who you're going to betalking to is paramount.
Bobbie (10:36):
Absolutely.
Tim (10:39):
But it really comes across when you've practiced and when
you haven't practiced, and theaudience will be able to tell
that almost right away.
You know, in terms of beingauthentic you are in terms of,
like you said, the filler words,the pauses, all those types of
things do come across and theaudience is going to find you
(11:01):
out really, really quick, andit's just so important.
Now let's get into what you'vebeen doing lately, and I really
like the way that you put things.
You've got three businesses.
You've got what you call yourday job, your night job and your
dream job.
Tell us a little bit about thedream job.
(11:24):
Tell us a little bit about thedream job, because this is where
I think we really need tounderstand the power of public
speaking and how that affectswomen in particular and how we
can help elevate them intoone-stage roles, into the
(11:44):
boardrooms, those types ofthings.
Bobbie (11:46):
Absolutely, and I've always seen public speaking as a
path to many things.
Two-thirds of all conferencespeakers are men, which leaves
women out of career and businessopportunities that come from
speaking.
(12:06):
When you are on stage, you havethe ability to tell your story,
to share your ideas.
You will never be seen as aleader if you're just sitting in
the audience.
So when you're on stage, youget those opportunities.
Sitting in the audience, sowhen you're on stage, you get
(12:27):
those opportunities.
I actually have a little phraseI use visibility equals
opportunity, and the day job,the night job and the dream job
are all focused around drivingvisibility.
My day job is I run a marketingfirm.
My night job for many years wasMass Innovation Nights, which
is a monthly new product launchevent, driving visibility for
(12:50):
startups.
And then Innovation Women.
The dream job is the dream ofgetting more women on stage at
conferences and events.
Tim (13:30):
No-transcript no-transcript , when women get to the point of
being on stage, number onebeing seen as leaders.
But you also talk about thepower of being the one.
(13:52):
What does that mean and how canbeing the one really elevate
you from even just being onstage to becoming a CEO and
becoming on a board?
Because let's just leave it atthat, because I want you to make
another point here in just aminute.
Bobbie (14:12):
All right.
So the one is the one thatpeople immediately think of when
they need to fill a role, andmy personal experience with the
becoming the one was what Imentioned earlier.
I did a TEDx talk with very,very little notice.
(14:34):
The TEDx organizers for TEDxSuffolk University reached out
to me and said we want to inviteyou to be one of our TEDx
speakers.
And, of course, as a speaker,it's like oh, my goodness, ted,
tedx, great brands.
People know what you're talkingabout when you say TED.
(14:59):
And I was at first like, soexcited.
And I was like, of course, I'dlove to like so excited.
And I was like, of course, I'dlove to.
When is it?
And the answer was Tuesday.
Like, as a speaker, that'shorrifying.
That gives you days to do whatmost people do in months.
(15:21):
Very few people just jump up onstage and go ta-, I'm gonna do
a tedx talk.
It takes practice.
You often get extensivecoaching.
Uh, you get input on your ideas.
And I was like uh, no, no,that's a really bad idea.
Um, but you know, I have thisdatabase with thousands of
(15:45):
speakers.
Maybe there's a speaker inthere who is prepared to do a
TEDx talk.
With only a few days notice, Iwent and I collected five names,
five names of people who wereperhaps rash enough to go and
say yes to something like this,enough to go and say yes to
something like this, and theevent organizers are like no,
(16:10):
none of them is in our theme.
And I'm like well, what's yourtheme?
They said innovation.
Like ah, now I get it.
Now I understand why you askedme.
I started two companies withthe word innovation in the name.
(16:33):
I'm also a relatively well-knownspeaker in the Boston community
because I was running at thetime a monthly event where I'm
the emcee.
You felt comfortable ininviting me.
I was a known quantity and mybrand fit your theme.
(16:54):
That's part of becoming the oneImmediate recognition of that
person as being a good fit foryour event.
That's what you want to achieveas a speaker.
But it's also helping you withyour career options.
(17:16):
Like, hey, I need to hire adesigner, I need to hire a chief
revenue officer.
Oh, I just saw somebody and Irecognize them and I know their
name and they're well known forthat thing.
That's part of it.
Tim (17:39):
And to take that just a step further right, step further
right, when, when you're theone, again, you're going to
start being looked at for CEOroles.
Talk about the, the, the beingelevated to positions on a board
, and how, how, when women areon boards, the, the roles that
(18:04):
that they have to take and maybesome of the kind of
disadvantages that they have ofbeing on a board.
And again, why is it soimportant to get that one stage
so that they can get on to moreboards?
Bobbie (18:19):
Absolutely, and being on stage gives you all kinds of
advantages in the career andbusiness world.
You know, people know you, theyknow your ideas, they know your
story.
They feel more comfortable withyou because they have seen you
in person talking.
That's important.
(18:41):
People do business with peoplethey know.
People do business with peoplethey know and people feel like
they know you when you've beenup on stage telling your stories
.
So being on stage also gets youaccess to new jobs and
sometimes board seats could be apart of that, could be a part
(19:10):
of that.
I think it's incrediblyimportant for women to be on
boards because they are in aposition of power.
They are able to makesuggestions to people who are
running companies.
If you look at the Fortune 500,how many of those organizations
are led by women?
It's still a very small number.
How many of those organizationshave women on their boards?
(19:36):
Again, a smaller number.
So if we look at a board seat,there is new legislation that
has been happening in Californiaand I believe it is up for
consideration in some otherstates as well, about the number
(19:57):
of women on boards.
Just having a single woman on aboard is really not making the
impact that we would like it tohave.
Because when you are the lonewoman in the room, whether it's
a board or any other location,you are being expected to kind
(20:22):
of carry the flag for yourgender and that can be
problematic, like you are in aprecarious position when you are
by yourself in any group,whether it's a person of color,
whether it's a woman, whetherit's a non-binary individual,
(20:45):
like you're being expected torepresent and you may feel like
you can't do that if it is justyou.
So sometimes there's safety innumbers.
You need a second woman or athird, and there have been
(21:05):
studies done about the makeup ofboards that say women don't
have the impact we expect themto have until there are three
women in that room, then theyare not being there as a token
woman.
They not, they're justrepresenting their gender.
(21:27):
They are there and theexpectations are very different
yeah, that's a.
Tim (21:37):
That's a very interesting and kind of disturbing data set
there for me.
Know the whole idea that let'sjust take imposter syndrome as a
, for example.
Right, you know the wholefeeling of I don't belong here.
I don't belong here, I don'tbelong here.
That's something that we tellourselves.
But then you get to this where,okay, now you have earned we all
(22:02):
earn things, right, you earnbeing on stage, you earn being
the CEO, you earn the positionon the board, but but now you're
not even.
You're not, you're not evenreally a part of the board
because you're not takingsomething maybe not be taken
seriously, you're not going tobe listened to.
What have you?
Even at that level it's, it'skind of disturbing, you know,
(22:24):
because we tell, we tell, wetell our young professionals,
our people, that we're lookingfor leaders all the time.
Right, we want people to standout, we want people to speak out
, we want people to take chargeof situations and move us
forward and lead us, and nowwe're on a board as a woman and
you're not making any differencebecause you're not being taken
(22:45):
seriously.
Bobbie (22:47):
It's just a little disturbing.
Yeah, it's that degree ofinfluence that you have as a
single person or a singlerepresentative when you're
talking about board seats or anyother group that you're a
minority in.
So you want to have a quorum,you want to have kind of a
(23:10):
critical mass, and that criticalmass for women on boards is, I
guess, three.
You know, you're not just asingle woman by herself.
Tim (23:22):
There's a group of you, you and even if you have have, have
a, have a male, you know thatis um championing you or
agreeing with you, orencouraging you.
My guess is it's still.
It may have some effect, but itdoesn't really have the effect
that we're that we want to haveanyway.
(23:43):
Is that accurate?
Bobbie (23:44):
yeah, I mean you don't want to be seen as the token
woman.
Um, having a male champion,having a male ally, can be
helpful, but that's almost likeyou need the support to be
effective.
That can be, you know, notgreat either.
Tim (24:03):
Right, yeah, I just, and I go.
I know I live in a world withrose-colored glasses.
I just wish we could just be ata point where we're hired
because we've earned it, wedeserve it, we're the best
person for the job, not the bestmale, not the best female, not
the best African-American, notthe best whatever.
(24:24):
We're the best person for thejob and we move forward.
Uh, on that and yeah, butunfortunately there are still
places where it's equity, notequality, exactly.
Bobbie (24:39):
And you know, when you are constantly dealing with
flights or systemic issues, youare kind of taking your starting
blocks to go.
And use the athletic comparison, your starting blocks are a
(25:03):
little bit further back Right,or maybe you're running the
hurdles race while everybodyelse is on the flat track.
Tim (25:11):
Yeah, yeah, and we have to be better.
I'll just put it that way.
Bobbie (25:20):
I mean one of the things that I've talked about with a
lot of people in terms of thespeaking game is there are some
systemic issues when it comes toseeing women on stage, and this
is all from the Bureau of LaborStatistics.
Women are more likely to workpart-time.
(25:41):
Women are more likely to workfor smaller organizations.
Women are more likely to workfor smaller organizations.
Women are still more likely tobe responsible for kids and home
, and all of those are reasonswhy, when invited, women are
less likely to say yes.
Number one like you know, wetalked about part-time.
(26:05):
So if I only work three days aweek and I get invited to speak
at a conference, maybe I've gota day of travel.
The conference is a day longand then I have to get back.
That could mean that I'm out ofwork for an entire week, for an
(26:30):
entire week, and if I'm workingfor a smaller organization,
there might not be anybody tobackfill for me or that smaller
organization doesn't have it intheir budget to send me to that
conference.
I might have to pay for mytravel and my hotel out of my
own pocket, because half of allevent managers have no budget
(26:51):
whatsoever for speakers.
They look at speaking at theirconference.
As a gift that we're giving you,we're putting hundreds of
people in the audience for you.
You want us to pay you too.
Like not everybody gets aid tospeak at conferences and events,
(27:13):
and if you're a woman andyou're not speaking as often,
you might not be the keynote.
42% of some of event managerspay some speakers.
They might only have budget forkeynotes, so that means that
(27:33):
you're being left out of thecompensation from the organizers
and your company isn't payingfor you as well.
So lots of systemic things arekeeping women from the stages.
Tim (27:50):
Yeah.
So I'm going to ask an absurdquestion here because I already
know the answer.
So we should tell women to justkind of wait to be asked to be
a speaker, right?
No, no, no, no, sorry, no, thatno, no, sorry, no, that's okay,
keep going.
No, you go ahead with that,because that's it.
(28:13):
I mean, if women are only onthe stage a third of the time,
we should just accept it and noteven bother asking, not even
start searching those out.
Let's just sit back and wait tobe asked.
Bobbie (28:28):
No, okay.
So understand that the basiccurrency of getting on stage for
a lot of conferences and eventsis something called the call
for speakers, which is literallyevent managers standing up
waving their arms and sayingcome at me with your ideas, come
(28:54):
to me and tell me why youshould be a speaker at my event
to be invited, so you might haveto apply.
You might have to pitchyourself as a speaker at that
(29:15):
conference and, understandinghow people get on stage, only a
very small percentage of peopleare getting invited.
The Innovation Women platformone of the things that we do is
we have a database of speakingopportunities and these are all
calls for speakers.
(29:36):
I think right now on theplatform there's like 1,500
calls for speakers that arecurrently open, like right now,
looking for speakers, and theychange all the time.
Once the deadline is passed,they leave the platform, and
(29:56):
that's just a small percentageof the opportunities that are
out there.
We add, like I don't know,between 50 and 100 a week to our
platform and you don't need ourplatform.
Like I'd love to have you onour platform, ladies, but you
don't need it.
You can literally just go andsearch on Google and put in the
(30:18):
words call for speakers and youwill see all of the
opportunities that are out therebegging for you to come and
pitch that's insane and it so.
Tim (30:33):
Is there a certain time of year where there's where there's
more conferences?
Obviously my guess is aroundchristmas.
Bobbie (30:40):
You know the holiday time there's probably not as
many, but yeah, but um, so, likean annual conference, they are
probably putting up their callfor speakers right after the
previous conference.
But I always say that there arekind of some what I call event
silly seasons where it is superbusy September, october, also
(31:08):
April and May.
Those times are extra busybecause all of the conferences
and events are trying to get inbefore the holidays and get in
their event before summer, whenthey might lose some people to
vacations.
So there's an extra likepredominance of events during
(31:33):
April, may and September andOctober, but there are events
year round all over the place.
I've done speaking at oneparticular event every year for
like four years in a row andit's in August.
You know it's like people whoare scheduling events.
(31:53):
They look at the calendar andthey say, okay, when is it?
We're getting together.
Little side note here A lot oforganizations actually have it
written into their bylaws thatthey have to have an annual
event, like that's part of theirinternal rules, which means
(32:16):
that when the pandemic hit, alot of those same organizations
had to.
Like they didn't have a lot ofchoices.
They could either cancel theirevent and run up against their
own bylaws, or they couldpostpone, and somewhat
indefinitely when the pandemichit, or they could go online.
(32:38):
And going online was afantastic opportunity for women
in particular, because it meantthat we could do our speaking
from right here.
We didn't have to travel, wedidn't have to find a babysitter
, we didn't have to findsomebody to take care of our
(33:00):
parents or whatever it is we do.
We could do it from our homes.
Tim (33:06):
So that was a really good thing for us.
Yeah, not even lose a full dayof work, right?
Yeah, because it's an hour,maybe an hour and a half, two
hours tops of you still had toprepare Right.
Bobbie (33:19):
You still had to practice, but that could be all
done on your own time and youdidn't have to hop on a plane.
Tim (33:24):
That could be all done on your own time and you didn't
have to hop on a plane.
Yeah, that's.
And you know even still nowthat the pandemic is over.
You know there are still a lotof conferences that stayed
virtual, which is great orhybrid.
You know, and I think it's, Ithink everybody here's Tim talk
(33:45):
now.
I think everybody should findthe way that suits them the best
and then become good at that,become the one at that you
really do.
As a speaker, you really doneed to be seen at both virtual
(34:07):
and in person.
Even if you're better atvirtual, you still need to be
doing both.
Bobbie (34:14):
And there's a real power in speaking in person on a
stage.
Interesting side note here aswell when you are on a stage,
you are actually physicallyelevated above an audience.
There's something that happenspsychologically when we're
(34:34):
sitting in an audience and we'relooking at someone who is above
us, there's a little extra likecredibility that gets added,
because that person is on astage and we are looking up at
them literally.
Tim (34:56):
And you know, from the audience perspective, that is a
psychological phenomenon, right?
I mean, it's something that weas, even as experts in our own
right when somebody else is upon stage, we still see them as
elevated.
That's just the way it is.
(35:16):
Yeah, we see them as elevated.
That's just the way it is.
Bobbie (35:18):
Yeah, we see them as experts.
Tim (35:19):
Yeah.
Bobbie (35:20):
The expectation is they've been vetted by the
organization.
They are experts because theyare on stage and we are in the
audience.
There's that extra layer ofcredibility that gets added to
them when they are on that stage.
Credibility that gets added tothem when they are on that stage
.
Tim (35:39):
So let's talk about another word that you use a lot, that I
didn't know what it meant, youknow, until just the other day
the mantle.
I thought the mantle wassomething that went above the
fireplace that you put, you know, your elf on a shelf.
Bobbie (35:55):
But what's a mantle A?
mantle, not a mantle, exactlythat's by baltimore accent yes,
so a mantle is, uh, thederogatory term for an all-male
panel.
And uh, these days, you know,we all run around and and we've
(36:17):
got our phones, slash cameras inour hand and there is a, you
know, very easy for us to take apicture of the all-male panel
in front of us and share that onsocial media saying, hey, they
(36:38):
couldn't find a woman expert forthis.
We have a term that we use aswell.
We call it the all male, allpale, because often they are all
white, all stale, because it'soften the same people.
So, all male, all pale, allstale.
(36:59):
Because we understand, you know,like event managers, they see
somebody on stage who does agood job and they say, okay, I'm
going to use that person again,or I'm going to use that person
at my event.
Which means that if you go tomultiple events in an industry
(37:20):
or a category, you might beseeing the same speakers over
and over and over again.
And that's because speakingbegets speaking.
The more speaking you do, themore speaking you will do.
And often the all-male,all-pale aspects of that are
(37:42):
because industry leadership isall-male and all-pale and, by
the way, I don't have anythingagainst old white guys, I happen
to be married to one.
It's just that we need thatdiversity on stage in order to
present diverse viewpoints anddiverse life experiences.
(38:06):
My experience as a woman isgoing to be different.
Tim (38:17):
And if we have those different experiences and
they're actually shared, thenyou know, what I told you a
couple days ago is you know, wemay actually learn something, we
may actually want to changepolicy, we may actually want to
change direction, or we may wantto keep doing what we're doing,
or we may want to keep doingwhat we're doing.
You know, I think there's somuch to getting feedback from
(38:42):
you know, from different people.
Now, the page you told me aboutwhere you know there's the
ridiculous mantles Eddie,congrats, you've got an all-male
panel Tumblr.
Bobbie (38:58):
Um why, congrats, you've got an all male panel Tumblr.
Tim (39:02):
Yeah, that's Tumblr.
Yeah, that Tumblr is, is a is aresource for, for, for a lot,
for a lot of things, especiallyif you want to laugh, but but
but tell us about that again.
The resource for for, uh, allmale for all-male panels.
Bobbie (39:21):
Yeah, so I mean, this Tumblr page has been up for many
years and it's called Congrats,you have an All-Male Panel and
it's a tongue-in-cheek poking atevent managers who create
mantles, and each picture of amantle is stamped with a picture
(39:41):
of David Hasselhoff from theKnight Rider.
I mean, we're going back a wayshere, giving the event manager
that big thumbs up.
Good job, event manager.
You once again managed to putup an all-male panel.
Once again managed to put up anall-male panel.
(40:03):
Now, my personal favorite isthe all-male panel on
breastfeeding.
I mean, yes, they're all doctors, but not one of them has had
personal experience with thephenomena, so you would think
that they could have possiblyfound some other expert on
breastfeeding who might perhapshave been female.
Tim (40:24):
Exactly.
Just maybe it's killing youhave to shake your head.
I mean, you would think, though, that there would be somebody
would see this and say you knowwhat?
Bobbie (40:37):
Something's just not right here, yeah we've got a
problem folks, a little bit of aproblem, yeah, and there's
actually things that men can doas well.
Um, I recently gave apresentation and one of the
pieces of feedback I got from amember of the audience is I am
one of the male and pale folks,how do I help out?
(40:58):
And there are various pledgesthat you can take, gentlemen,
where you can say I will notappear on a mantle or I will not
appear on a panel, that is allCaucasians panel, that is all
Caucasians.
And as you take this pledge,then you need to kind of deliver
(41:23):
on it.
So if you are asked to be on apanel, you need to raise up to
the event organizers the issueand say hey, folks, I've noticed
that this panel that you askedme to be on is all men currently
.
What can we do about this?
(41:43):
Can we invite women?
Do you need to replace me?
Now, this is a big ask of men,because what they are being
asked to do is to step down fromtheir own speaking
(42:04):
opportunities and, quite frankly, somebody who takes that pledge
and is prepared to step down isprobably enough of a male ally
that I do want them to get theiropportunities.
So you know there's a littlebit of a thing going on there.
I actually wanted to um give ashout out to another
organization as well.
Uh, they have an app called thega tally, and ga stands for
(42:30):
gender avenger, and the ga tallyis an app that you can download
and you can create a socialmedia ready image that shows the
gender balance and also thenumber of people of color on a
(42:51):
speaking slate for a conferenceor an event.
Oh, wow.
It also has a really neatfeature where you can sit in the
audience during a talk orduring a presentation,
especially a panel, and you canpush a button two buttons on
(43:12):
this screen.
One is labeled Dude and one islabeled not a dude and you can
actually look at the share ofvoice, because having women on
stage isn't necessarily the end,it's only the beginning.
They have to be able to speak,and a lot of panels you'll
(43:37):
notice this.
If the moderator isn't likeright on people, some people get
more opportunity to speak thanothers.
So you need that share of voiceas well as you need the
presence.
Tim (43:52):
Speaking of that number one , we're looking for leaders.
So, man, if you're, if you'resigning this, good on you, but
obviously follow through.
But it goes back to we'relooking for leaders to affect
change.
And you know what I?
I I get that it may, it mayhurt a little bit, but I think
(44:13):
in the end it will actually help.
Be be a leader.
That's what we're looking for,right?
I mean, that's to me, that'swhat it's all about.
And how do you coach women towhen they're on a panel or
they're in a discussion?
Let's just talk about panels,for example, when they're
(44:36):
talking, they're finally giventheir opportunity to talk and
then they're interrupted.
Bobbie (44:43):
Yeah, unfortunately that happens quite a bit, and
sometimes you just need to beprepared.
You know, if you getinterrupted in the moment,
sometimes it's kind of hard tospeak up unless you're prepared
for it.
So I invite people to practicetheir preparation, especially if
(45:08):
they're going to be on a panelwhere there are one of the only
women or the only women or onlywoman.
So, for example, one of thethings I love to use myself is
wow, I really appreciate yourenthusiasm, but just let me
finish my point and then I'dlove to hear your thoughts, or
(45:30):
hold that thought.
I'll be wrapped up in just amoment.
Or maybe you need to be alittle bit stronger.
I'd like to finish what I wassaying and then we can discuss
your perspective.
So practice your response aheadof time, especially if it's
happened to you before, orperhaps you're anticipating the
(45:53):
interruptions.
Tim (45:54):
Yeah, those are a lot more less abrasive than I would
handle it, but then again that'sjust me and my style.
When I get interrupted, Ipretty much say thank you for
(46:16):
interrupting me while I was,Thank you for talking while I
was interrupting you.
You know, it is what it is youknow, I think as women.
Bobbie (46:28):
we have less leeway.
If we are at all assertive, weare called abrasive If or worse.
Tim (46:42):
Worse.
Bobbie (46:43):
Or worse, you know.
So we have to be careful.
Even being funny, even beinghumorous, you can end up in
trouble.
Tim (46:56):
Yeah, I don't understand that.
I just Neither do I, but has astory right.
Everybody has something thatthey want to share about.
(47:17):
Everybody has has theirexpertise and experience and if
if we're not willing to toaccept that and listen to it,
then we've got all kinds ofother issues.
Let that person be who they are.
If you don't, if you don't likethat personality, you don't
(47:38):
have to like that person out.
Let them be them and move on.
Bobbie (47:44):
Yeah, I think that people forget that when we shut
down someone else's perspective,we also lose.
What if that's the person thathad the answer to your problem?
What if that's the person thathad the cure for cancer?
(48:04):
What if that is the person thatcould make a difference in your
industry, and yet they werenever allowed on stage, they
were never invited to be onstage.
Like we are all losing when welose the opportunity to hear
from everyone.
Tim (48:28):
Is there anything else that you think we need to talk about
that we haven't talked about?
Bobbie (48:34):
I could talk about this topic for days.
Tim (48:40):
I understand, I really do.
What about one piece of advicefor women outside of stand up
and do it now.
Which would you give them?
Bobbie (48:51):
Yeah, I often tell people from the stage during my
own presentations just say yesto public speaking and we'll
figure it out later on.
Okay, yes, absolutely Say yesto any opportunities that you
get and figure out how you canmake it happen.
But I think being prepared andpracticing for public speaking
(49:16):
opportunities is the biggestlesson that people need to hear.
You know you are not expectedto be an expert the first time
you jump up on stage, but youcan do things that will make you
better, whether it's asking aquestion from the audience,
(49:40):
getting your practice there.
I think we tend to think aboutpublic speaking very narrowly,
like what we're doing right now,that's public speaking.
Being on a panel, that ispublic speaking.
And, by the way, being on apanel, that is public speaking.
And, by the way, greatopportunity, because you usually
(50:01):
don't have to do a wholepresentation and you're sitting
in the comfy chairs on stageLike you're just having a
conversation and there happensto be an audience.
But if you really are lookingfor a way to practice public
speaking in a very small way,dipping your toe in the next
(50:24):
time you go to a conference oran event, ask a question from
the audience, you get tointroduce yourself.
You get to tell people who youwork with or what it is you do.
You ask your question and,ta-da, you are now a public
speaker, because you spoke tothe exact same audience that the
(50:50):
speakers on stage spoke to.
Tim (51:08):
No applications, no preparation necessary, you just
did it.
So give that a try the speakerthat's on stage, or whether it's
other audience members.
And now you've just grown yournetwork, you've just grown your
influence with very littleeffort by you.
Bobbie (51:26):
Yeah, I actually tell people that every time you ask a
question from the audience, youjust became the speaker on
stage's hero, because there isnothing more disheartening as a
speaker to finishing up yourpresentation asking for
questions and no one in theaudience cares enough to ask a
(51:51):
question.
It's like I'm dying.
You know crickets and it'sawkward.
So ask a question that showsthat you're interested in the
topic.
Tim (52:04):
You're interested.
You listened Again.
We're looking for leaders.
That's to me.
That's what it comes back to aswell.
So, bobby, where can peoplefind you if they want to work
with you?
Bobbie (52:16):
Absolutely Innovationwomencom.
Tim (52:19):
Awesome and I'll put that in the show notes for everybody.
Bobbie (52:22):
Thank you.
Tim (52:22):
So, bobbi, thank you so much for joining us today.
I really do appreciate it.
I love what you're doing, Ienjoy the conversation and
hopefully we can connect soonand if I could be of any help,
I'd love to be able to do thatfor you.
Excellent, thanks so much.
Be sure to visitspeakingwithconfidencecom to
join our growing.
I should know my own website.
(52:44):
You know that's the third timethis week.
That's the third time this weekI've messed up my own freaking
website.
That's what editors are for.
Oh, my goodness gracious, goagain.
Be sure to visitspeakingwithconfidencepodcastcom
(53:05):
to join a growing community andregister for the Formula for
Public Speaking course.
Always remember your voice hasthe power to change the world.
We'll talk to you next time,take care.
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