May 12, 2025 • 52 mins
Ever feel like the fear of public speaking is holding you back from being the leader, teammate, or communicator you know you can be?
In this episode of Speaking With Confidence, Tim Newman welcomes Harriet Bratt—international speaker, firewalk facilitator, and fierce advocate for authenticity—to unpack what it really takes to become a powerful communicator.
From walking across fire to navigating ADHD, Harriet shares how confidence isn’t about being fearless, it’s about feeling the fear and showing up anyway. Together, Tim and Harriet dive into active listening skills, leadership communication, and storytelling techniques that help speakers, and humans show up more fully in every room they enter.
This isn’t just about presentation skills development. It’s about transforming how you connect with others, lead with love, and own your voice on stage and off.
In this episode, you’ll discover:
- How firewalking becomes a metaphor for overcoming fear of public speaking
- Why ADHD can be a superpower in powerful communication
- Tools for emotional management and building self-awareness
- The truth about overcoming speaking anxiety (spoiler: it’s messy and real)
- What “leading with love” actually looks like in personal and professional communication
- Why honest feedback and knowing when to shut up are underrated superpowers
- How to embrace authenticity without losing your edge
Whether you’re prepping for your first keynote or simply trying to speak up with more clarity and confidence at work, this conversation will help you tap into the mindset, strategy, and soul of effective communication skills.
Connect with Harriet:
Grab Harriet’s free masterclass on the 5 Pillars of Public Speaking at harrietbratt.com
Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/harrietbrattspeaker/
Speak with Soul - public speaking group - https://www.facebook.com/groups/HBWarriors
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/harrietbrattspeaker/
Linked In - https://www.linkedin.com/in/harriet-bratt-429b1b1a6/
Visit TimNewmanSpeaks.com to grab your free resource, The Top 21 Challenges for Public Speakers and How to Overcome Them, and start building the confidence you deserve.
Want to be a guest on Speaking With Confidence? Send Tim Newman a message on PodMatch
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Episode Transcript
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Tim (00:08):
Welcome to Speaking with Confidence, the podcast
dedicated to helping you unlockthe power of effective public
speaking.
I'm Tim Newman, a recoveringcollege professor, jury
communication coach, and I'mthrilled to guide you on your
journey to becoming a powerfulcommunicator.
I want to thank each and everyone of you for your support.
It truly means the world to me.
Please visit timnewmanspeakscomto get your free ebook the top
(00:29):
21 challenges for publicspeakers and how to overcome
them.
Today's guest is Harriet Bratt.
She's a powerhouse speaker andmentor on a mission to help
ambitious entrepreneurs own thestage, elevate their income and
make a serious impact, all whilehaving a lot of fun along the
way.
Harriet, welcome to the show.
I'm really appreciative of youbeing here and I think we're
going to have a good time.
Harriet (00:51):
I'm super excited.
Thank you so much, tim.
Thank you to all the listenersand speaking with confidence,
what a topic, what an insightful, valuable information for
people, and I just want to saythank you for being on this
podcast and everything that youare doing with Speaking With
Confidence.
Tim (01:07):
Harry, thank you so much.
I really appreciate you sayingthat and you know, as you can
see, I'm not in my normal studio, I'm traveling and visiting
grandkids.
But I did not want to put thisoff, primarily because anytime
that unless for the listener,anytime you can hear Harriet
speak, I would suggest that yougo do it.
She is a fireball, she alwaysbrings it and what I really like
(01:35):
about it is, you know, in theintroduction, she does it while
having fun and you know, Harriet, for me that's part of it as
well, because we spend so muchof our life, you know, in
serious, this serious, that wegot to learn to have some fun
with this.
Harriet (01:48):
Absolutely.
I think it's so important and Idon't know about anybody
listening or yourself, tim, butfor me you know that playfulness
, that having fun, having fun indoing what you do, but also
taking time to do fun things.
I think it's so easy to forgetthat as we grow up having fun in
doing what you do, but alsotaking time to do fun things.
I think it's so easy to forgetthat as we grow up and it
happens at different ages fordifferent people but it's so
(02:11):
easy to get caught up in the ratrace, in the hamster wheel, you
know whatever terminology youwant to use but it's so easy to
get caught up in seriously doing, doing, doing rather than
actually taking that time toenjoy and have fun with what
we're doing.
So I think that's a greathighlight and it's really
important.
Tim (02:29):
Yeah, it really is.
And one of the things thatreally strikes me about some of
the stuff that you do is thewhole firewalk, and I've talked
to people that have done itbefore and they say you have to
do it, you have to do it, youhave to do it.
And I'm like I don't know, man,that's kind of pushing for me.
So tell us about the firewalkand how you go about the process
(02:53):
of coaching people to let go,to be able to do something like
that.
Harriet (03:00):
Absolutely, I think, and I love your openness in
sharing that no-transcript.
Tim (03:25):
That's it that takes care of it, right there.
Harriet (03:26):
Yeah, right, but I think that's the point.
And you know, firewalking it'snot new.
Firewalking's been done forthousands of years.
But it was a gentleman over inthe US, actually in California,
tolly Buchan and his wife PeggyDillon, that brought it into the
Western world as more of anexperiential breakthrough.
(03:47):
Now, if we just pause for asecond and you think in life,
how many times fear shows up?
You know you quit your job as ateacher to start your own
business.
I'm sure there was some fear,some challenges, some
uncertainty.
We have to have difficultconversations with loved ones,
with family, with bosses askinga boss for a pay rise, telling a
(04:08):
boss that you're leaving to dosomething else you know there's
so many different examples.
We could do a whole podcast onexamples of when fear shows up.
So the idea with the fire isputting yourself in that intense
environment where fear willshow up.
I don't care who you are, whereyou're from, when you stand in
front of that fire, particularlyfor the first time fear shows
(04:33):
up.
But when we are able to feel Ithink it was Susan Jeffries that
wrote that amazing book feelthe fear and do it anyway.
Feel the fear and walk the fire.
When we feel that fear and wemake a conscious choice and of
course, we spend a few hoursbefore the fire walk with
sequenced activities andexercises that support someone,
to be able to make that choicein spite of fear.
(04:55):
So when you stand in front ofthat fire and you start
trembling and the fear shows up,but you're able to take that
breath, look after yourpsychology and your physiology
and make a conscious choice towalk, that celebration, that
feeling, when you've crossedthat fire, you can't take that
away right.
It's like an elastic band whenyou pull it so far, it will
(05:16):
never go back to exactly thesame size because it's been
stretched, because it's expanded.
So now we take that samefeeling back into our everyday
life.
And when fear shows up, youknow, oh, I need to have a
difficult conversation with mypartner.
I'm not sure how they're goingto take what I want to share
with them.
I am asking a customer for asale.
I'm walking into a bar andasking someone out on a date.
Tim (05:38):
You know, whatever it, is Whatever, it is right yeah
exactly.
Harriet (05:40):
We can feel the fear and walk the fire.
Feel the fear and show upanyway.
Tim (05:58):
So, exactly, we can feel the fear and walk the fire, feel
the fear and show up anyway.
So that's the premise behind it, and you've done something that
was, at least from myperspective, terrifying to begin
with, and you've gone throughit and you've accomplished it,
and you achieved that goal.
What's it like?
You know talking to thesepeople after they've done that.
Harriet (06:19):
I'd love you know if we were here, live, or if we were
in front of an audience.
I'd ask people to startguessing now, like how you feel
elation, satisfaction,excitement, enthusiasm, but on a
much deeper level,understanding of your true
capability, connecting the dots,that you can feel that fear and
(06:39):
you have a choice in thatmoment.
Do you let the niggling voiceof oh, I don't think I could do
this like take over, or do youstep into that power, do you
make that choice that serves you, even though it's scary and for
many, you know, differentvocabulary will come up,
different feelings, differentmessages.
It's such an individualexperience, but as a general,
(07:01):
but as a general, everybodyfeels grateful, feels
accomplished, feels like theyhave achieved something they did
not think was possible before.
They did it, and that's anincredible feeling.
Tim (07:15):
And you know I'm guessing that you know there's to be able
to, to do, to do that.
If there's got to be a greatdeal of introspection right to
to understand, to do that, ifthere's got to be some a great
deal of introspection right toto understand who you are and
whatever, because our fears arecome from many different areas
and they they affect each of usindividually differently.
(07:37):
But to truly get to what tothat, it takes some
introspection, um, to be able toaddress that and then overcome
it.
We can't say this is whysomebody else fears it, so
that's why I fear it, and it'llbe easy to overcome.
You really have to get downdeep inside of yourself and
figure that out.
Harriet (07:54):
Exactly and you really hit the nail on the head there.
Beautiful insight.
And that's one of the reasons Ilove whether it's firewalking
or glasswalking or the arrowbreak I just love experiential
breakthroughs.
And don't get me wrong, I thinkcoaching, mentoring, therapy,
hypnotherapy there are so manydifferent modalities and they
all have their place.
I'm not here to knock any ofthem and, as you just said, most
(08:17):
importantly, people need tofind what works for them and I
particularly think having acoach or a mentor with you on a
journey is immensely powerful.
But what I love about theexperiential breakthroughs is
what you've just said.
You feel it yourself.
You have that experience.
It's not externally being told,it's not someone cheering you
on, although everybodycelebrates when you've walked.
(08:37):
You feel that and therefore youcan't take it away.
Once you've hit that level ofconsciousness, once you felt
that knowing about yourself, ifyou continue in the old pattern,
it just leads to discomfort.
It allows you a space to stepinto the truer version, the more
authentic version.
These have all become buzzwordsthese days, but it's true that
(09:00):
the real core of who you are,yeah, and you know, just take
that one step further.
Tim (09:07):
You know, I know that there's days for me, right At
the end of the day, I, I, I goback, I do a lot of
introspection, thinking you know, what did I do today?
What'd I do?
What'd I do?
Well, what do I need to proveon?
What did I put off, what haveyou?
And I know there are days thatI look back and say you know
what?
There was something holding meback from doing this and I
(09:28):
didn't do it.
And damn it, tim, just effingdo it.
Just get up in the morning andjust do it.
Do you ever have those days?
And how do you coach peoplethrough that?
Because, again, I think it'salso important to understand
that we're not perfect.
Harriet (09:51):
We're going to make mistakes and we have to give
ourselves a certain amount ofgrace, but we still have to do
it Absolutely.
I, I completely agree.
I'd love to sit here and say no, I never get that face.
I'm always on top floor, thefire is burning.
No, you know, like you said andI, I, that's part of being a
human and I I don't use thisterm a lot myself, but I think
often people talk about toxicpositivity and I have to say
that I used to be in that campand I wouldn't allow myself to
(10:14):
feel all of those differentemotions and I was that person
that almost pretended everythingwas okay, it's going to be fine
, let's crack on, let's do it,let's do it.
And ultimately it never servedme.
In fact, it just led to sort ofburnout and a lack of emotional
management.
But I think, as you say,there's a beautiful balance
between knowing yourself andknowing when you're just having
(10:36):
an off day and using certaintools.
Maybe it's journaling, maybeit's a conversation with an
empowered friend, coach ormentor.
It's a conversation with anempowered friend, coach or
mentor.
Maybe it's music.
Music's a massive one for me IfI'm feeling a little bit lazy,
a little bit groggy, maybe, ifI'm procrastinating, if I put
some of my favorite songs onespecially if they're my stage
songs instantly, that changes mystate.
(10:57):
Music is an amazing way ofchanging both your physiology
and your emotional state.
So you could have certain toolsthat, if you're having one of
those days, you use them and, asTim says, you just crack on
with it, get on with it.
But I also think that somethingwe miss a lot and, tim, I'd
love to hear your thoughts onthis is absolutely.
There are days where I know I'mjust being lazy and a good kick
(11:20):
up the gets me going again.
But there's also times whereperhaps there is something
really challenging going on.
Perhaps I am ill or I've got aninjury on my body, or perhaps
I'm really just genuinely nothaving a great day, and I would
really encourage people never toforce themselves back into
action in those moments.
I'm also not someone that'ssaying go and get ice cream
(11:43):
Doritos, sit on the sofa andhave a pity party for two weeks.
You know work on reducing yourrecovery period, but sometimes
you just need to let yourselfhave that space, and maybe it's
a hug with your grandkids, maybeit's going out for a walk in
nature, maybe it's having ashower, maybe it's dancing for
half an hour, but just doingsomething for a period of time
(12:04):
that enables you to change yourstate, because I don't agree
with just forcing ourselves todo something in a negative state
of mind.
I believe in shifting thatstate, coming back to some sort
of calm, some sort of content,some sort of normal-ish, to then
action.
Put yourself back into actionagain.
Does that make sense, tim?
Tim (12:24):
100% agree with you, because if you continue to force
yourself to do something,number one, it's not going to be
done well, there's going to bemistakes, you're going to come
back and you're going to becritical of it and then you're
going to have to redo it anyway.
It's so much better to just sayyou know what, move on, like
you said, move on to somethingelse to you know.
(12:45):
Just just say you know what,move on, like you said, move on
to something else, go, go, dosomething.
Clear your head.
Even it's for for the day.
You know what, at noon it's,it's I got all kinds of other
things going on up up in hereand, for whatever reason,
today's not the day for me to dothis.
Let's go clear that and that way, when I come back, I'm fresh
(13:07):
and I can truly do the thingsthat need to be done and it's
everything's going to be better.
You know that yourinterpersonal relationships are
going to be better because youknow what.
You're going to be angry orupset or whatever.
So take the time that we need.
And you know, that's somethingthat I've learned, tim, today
and obviously, if we're notgrowing as we get older, we're
doing it wrong, right, tim?
(13:28):
Today is very different thanthe Tim five years ago, five
years before that, five yearsbefore that, and what we've
learned, and or what I'velearned, and how to approach
things Tim 20 years ago wouldnot know this Tim at all and I
would say, for the most part,that's a, that's a good thing.
Harriet (13:51):
In terms of having that space to grow and keep learning
.
Tim (13:55):
And learning and giving myself grace and giving others
grace, because you know, if Iwas always let me back up for a
second you as an individualcannot have expectations of
others.
I mean you can if you want.
I mean that's up to you.
If you want to haveexpectations of others, go ahead
(14:15):
.
Let me know how that works outfor you.
And that's one of the thingsthat I've learned.
Okay, ok, I always expectedpeople to put forth the effort
and the passion into what theywere doing at the same level
that I was doing it, and if youdidn't look out and I was the
(14:37):
judge and jury of whether youwere doing what you were
supposed to do or not, and sothat that that to me, is a is a
very good thing.
That that, that that I'velearned.
Harriet (14:47):
Um, and you know, yeah, so I was just going to say I
think that's a phenomenal thingfor anybody listening at the
moment that that has that moment.
Um, it does take time, it doestake a shift.
I really resonate with what Timwas saying.
(15:08):
I was also that person thatjust had really high
expectations, high highstandards on what I was doing
and therefore what I expectedothers to do too.
And yeah, that's just the truth.
You cannot control whatsomebody else does.
You can only choose how yourespond to it, and if you
constantly try and live by thatexpectation, then you're going
(15:30):
to find yourself in a state ofdisappointment a lot.
I can really relate to that,tim.
I think it's a beautiful share.
Tim (15:36):
And so that's so.
I still have the expectationmyself.
I still have that expectationthat I'm going to produce, that
I'm still going to have thosehigh standards, and I hope that
you do, and if you don't, that'sfine, we move on and that's
that.
But you know that's kind of adifferent discussion, you know.
(15:56):
So, number one give yourselfgrace, give others grace,
because, again, we don'tnecessarily know what's going on
in their lives either, and ifwe show them caring and support,
then we can better help themget over whatever it is.
Help them, give them the toolsthat they need, whatever it is
that they need to be successful,because that's, in my view,
(16:19):
that's why we're here.
I'm here to help you, or you orwhoever it is, be successful
and get what you want out ofyour life and out of your career
, out of your personalrelationships.
Harriet (16:30):
And I can really see, from the moment we had our very
first conversation, your passionand embodiment of that.
So again, I just want toacknowledge you and your work,
tim.
It's outstanding.
Tim (16:43):
Thank you so much.
I appreciate it.
You know I've got ADHD, really,really bad, and I mean and I
mean it's bad.
And so you know I've learned to, I've learned some coping
mechanisms that you know I wishI had when I was younger.
(17:05):
Right, you know, when I wasyounger it was oh he just he's
hyper, he doesn't know how tosit down and listen.
And you know, I learned some ofthese coping mechanisms as an
adult and again, I wish I hadwhen I was younger.
But how, for you, has livingwith ADHD influenced your
journey as a speaker andentrepreneur?
(17:26):
Because it's, at least for me,it's tough sometimes, you know,
like I can't work outside at all.
I mean, if I go outside to work, forget it, day's done.
Harriet (17:48):
I'm inside shades, know , like I can't work outside at
all.
I mean, if I go outside to work, forget it, day's done.
I'm inside shades, drawn dark,interesting.
Interesting For those thatdon't know I also have ADHD.
I often joke and say I'm the.
Harriet in the ADHD um, but it'sagain.
We've said this a couple oftimes, you know it's really
finding what works for you,because I'm the opposite if it's
a nice day outside and I'minside, I will spend the entire
time wanting to be out.
(18:09):
So we've actually built a spacewith a shelter that goes over
the the computer, so the laptopcan be in the shade but I can
still see in the sun.
And for me that was an absolutegame changer and I actually sat
and worked rather than justmaking any excuse I could to get
outside.
It's finding what works for us,but I think for me, you know
(18:31):
particularly you said about as aspeaker and an entrepreneur.
Well, I had my diagnosis at avery, very young age and for me
I always say that it was neverthe diagnosis, it was never
having ADHD.
It was the way in which peopleapproached me, and even my own
parents, and I understand itcame from a space of love, it
(18:52):
came from a space of themwanting the best for me.
But you know, as soon as I wastold I had ADHD, everything
changed very quickly and myusual sort of Harriet energetic
bursts that before were almostlaughed about, joked about,
cheered on, suddenly became goand take your tablets, stop
showing off, stop seekingattention.
(19:14):
You can't concentrate, you know.
All of these statements weresuddenly being thrown at me.
So that's actually what I foundreally difficult.
So I think before I learned tomanage or understand how having
ADHD can serve me, but also howit can hold me back, especially
as an entrepreneur, I actuallyneeded to learn and understand
(19:34):
my feeling towards having ADHDand my choice in how I was going
to show up, not havingeverybody tell me what I needed
to do and more often than not itwas just negative statements.
No solutions, just negativestatements.
So by the time I started my ownbusiness, I'd really started to
see ADHD as a superpower and Isee the areas it can hold me
(19:57):
back.
I see the areas that I can getvery easily distracted and be
running in the complete oppositedirection than my goal.
But, as you say, in time I justlearned to do certain things.
If I'm doing my admin oraccounts, I'm at a standing desk
and I've got like music on inthe background.
If I'm doing content orrecording, I will record for 45
(20:17):
minutes and then I'll take 15minutes to go do something else,
put some music on and then comeback to record again.
So I found different ways thatit can work for me, but I'm
still very aware that I needthose particular methods to
support me in staying focused.
Tim (20:34):
Yeah, you know it's.
It's funny that you know how we, you know.
This is just an example of howdifferent people approach it
different ways.
If I, if again, if I'm outsidehere the birds chirp or see a
rabbit, yeah there goes, timchasing a rabbit, you know.
Or, or somebody, or somebodywalks by, I'll start talking to
them, or or whatever.
And then you know an hour later, man, I didn't get, I didn't
(20:56):
get anything done.
And then here comes that, thatnegative self-talk, right, all
because I didn't, you know, Ididn't do the things that I know
I should be doing to to stopthose things from happening.
But but it's, it's so importantto you know we can take the
medication and and, yes, ithelps, but we also have to know
who we are and what makes ustick and and put ourselves.
(21:19):
Whether you have ADHD, add orwhatever, um, you, if you don't
have any of that stuff, we stillhave to have the, the strategy,
strategies and techniques toput ourselves in position.
That is going to put us in tobe successful.
That's going to make ussuccessful.
It doesn't matter If, even ifyou don't have those things, you
know what, what's, how do youwork the best?
(21:41):
You know, how do you, you know,develop the thoughts?
How do you, how do you producethe best work product or the
best conversations with, withyour, your, your partners or,
you know, your friendships andthose types of things?
And I think it's.
I just really think that it's alost art, because people don't
necessarily think about who theyare and how they tick, and I
(22:03):
keep coming back to that.
But to me that's what it comesdown to.
Harriet (22:09):
I completely agree and I love that you keep coming back
to it, because I do believethat is where it all begins.
You know, when we look at ourlives, no matter who you are,
you are the dot in every.
You're the center of every areaof your life, whether it's your
romantic relationships, yourfamily, your work, your health,
your business.
Everything starts from you.
And I completely agree, youknow whether you're neurodiverse
(22:31):
, whether you're not I like totalk a bit of it in personality
traits.
I think that's less labeling forpeople, but either way, it is
understanding yourself and thereare certain you know whether
it's autism, adhd, dyslexiathere are certain terms that
have a greater depth of research, information that you can go in
(22:55):
and read and research and getto know yourself more.
But ultimately, as you justsaid, Tim, everybody has
strengths and areas ofimprovement.
Everybody has these light,magical, amazing qualities about
themselves and everybody hasthe doubt, the fear, the
procrastination, thedisempowered habits, whatever
(23:17):
that might be.
We all have that as humanbeings.
So again, I completely agreewith you and I'd love us to
maybe even tap into differentways to do that Because again, I
think you hear that so oftenget to know yourself, sit with
your feelings, but what doesthat really mean and what does
that really look like Like foryou, tim?
How did you really connect withwhat works for you and who you
(23:39):
are?
Tim (23:40):
Well, I, you know, I had a lot of help, just a lot of
professional help, a lot ofnon-professional help, and one
of the things that I did is Iasked the people in my inner
circle what they notice.
You know, how do they see me,how do they see?
You know, when do they see thatI've produced the best?
(24:03):
And you know, a lot of timesthey came at, came back with
when it's when you're doing this, it's when you're doing this,
it's when you're doing this.
And I said, okay, that thatthat makes a lot of sense
because I see it.
And I said, okay, that makes alot of sense because I see it.
And so you know, what we see inourselves is one thing, but
(24:27):
what others in our inner circlesee is something very different.
Because, again, we have ourtalk and we say we're good at
this, when we may notnecessarily be good, we may like
doing it, but we may not begood at it, and that's something
different that we can talkabout later.
But when are we producing andwhen are we the most effective?
It's when we're doing thesethings, and I think we see it's
(24:49):
our inner circle that sees thatbetter than us, and that's
really kind of how I started,because, you know, when I
started my doctoral program andnobody really knows this, so
this is going to be the firsttime coming out.
My wife knows I was never trulytaught how to read.
I figured it out on my ownright.
(25:09):
So I had gone through anundergraduate degree never being
taught how to read, finished amaster's degree, never being
taught how to read.
I mean I could read, but Inever being taught how to read,
finished a master's degree,never being taught how to read.
I mean I could read, but I wasnever taught how to read.
There's a difference there,right?
And what I found.
You know, when I started thedoctoral program, I went to my
wife I said, look, I'm fallingbehind and I can't figure it out
(25:30):
.
I don't know why.
I don't know why.
And that was when I wasdiagnosed with ADHD as I was
going through my doctoralprogram, and that's when I truly
learned how to how to read.
And you know when that happened, man, the light bulb, like that
, and I went forward so quickly.
And that's why I say you know,I really wish that I had learned
(25:54):
some of these things when I wasyounger.
But think about that 30 yearsold and again, I don't want that
.
I couldn't read.
There's a difference, right?
So when I was reading everysingle word and I would have to
read a sentence four or fivetimes, as opposed to, you know,
(26:15):
just reading and understanding.
So that for me was a light bulbmoment.
Harriet (26:21):
Yeah, I can very much imagine that, and again, though,
I think your approach and yourattitude and the way you've just
shared that.
You know, I've met a lot ofpeople or not a lot, but
certainly a few people thathaven't been able to read and
that's become their story Ican't read, and you've taken
(26:43):
something that you weren'ttaught but you clearly knew or
wanted to be able to.
You knew it was important, knewit could benefit you, whatever
your driving force was for doingit, and you've taught yourself,
and I think that that's such apowerful and also vulnerable
share of yours.
You know, reading is somethingthat we think of as sort of that
everyday skill, and I thinkpeople take it for granted that
(27:04):
they can do it, but actually, ifyou've never been taught it or
you don't know how to, thenreally it can.
It can affect your life in ahuge way, and I just want to
honor your approach and youryour attitude in that, and I
think there's a big lesson forlisteners.
You know, just because youweren't taught something doesn't
mean you can't find a way to dothat for yourself.
Tim (27:26):
Yeah, and, and you know I don't want I'm not throwing
anybody under the bus but Ithink a lot of it had to do when
I was younger, having ADHD.
It wasn't, it was Tim can't sitdown and learn there was there
and so there was no.
You know, we didn't have thetools that back then that we
(27:47):
have today to to understandcertain things and um and and
it's.
And again, it's okay.
Yeah, there's, it's.
Just figure out who you are.
Lean into it, because you know,it doesn't matter how many
billion people on this earth, weall have our thing.
Everybody has has their thingor things, or multiple things,
(28:09):
whatever it is, but we all havethat thing that makes us who we
are.
Lean it, it's okay.
You know, I had a conversation.
I had a conversation yesterdaywith with a, with a lady, and uh
, we, you know, we were doingthe pre-interview, like like you
and I had done, and she said oh, I hope this isn't the
interview.
I don't have makeup on, I don'tlook good.
I said.
I said, maybe you look, youlook beautiful.
(28:30):
I said, you know it.
I mean, look at me, this is,this is just my face, I'm not
putting makeup on anyway.
And she said well, you know,females have a different
expectation and I said, well,that's part of the problem.
That's part of the problem.
You know, we put so much valueon what other people think of us
(28:54):
.
If we just started to.
You know, I just met, I justmet you.
Why would you care if you, Ithink, if you got makeup on, if
I think you're pretty orbeautiful, whatever, and I think
I think you're, I think you aregreat, just however you are,
and just own it and come withthat, and people, people are
(29:19):
craving that authenticity andthat, that, that humanness.
That's just what I think,anyway, and and and I think we
as a society need to get to, toto get some hold on that idea of
why do we, why do I care whatsomebody else thinks, what I
(29:39):
look like, what I'm wearing,what have you?
It doesn't make, it doesn'tmake any difference on anything
anyway.
Harriet (29:44):
It's so true and I think it's a nice almost sort
round to we spoke earlier about.
Everybody has different fears,everybody has different things,
and fear of judgment was amassive one of mine.
And I laugh sometimes now whenI get dressed and I put so much
thought into my outfit and thenI walk out and see everybody
walking around wearing totallydifferent outfits and I'm not
(30:06):
there thinking, oh, shouldn'twear that, don't do that, we're
just out enjoying the day.
So I think you're right, we cansort of allow ourselves to get
consumed by a fear of judgment,a fear of rejection, perfection,
trying to be right all the time, whatever it might be.
And I think this couples nicelyinto what we started this
wonderful conversation with, isalso that element of bringing
(30:29):
the fun back.
You know I haven't quitefigured out how I'm speaking
about this, from live or virtualstages, so you've got it fresh
from me right now here, tim.
But I think that there's almostand again I have to be careful
how I word this, but there'salmost a disempowerment if you
become too addicted to personaldevelopment.
(30:51):
Now, let me just back that up alittle bit, because I am
obsessed with personaldevelopment and I think it is
absolutely can benefit and bringmonumental changes, fulfillment
, happiness to everybody.
That takes the time to whateverlanguage you want to use, work
on yourself, develop yourself,expand yourself.
So I'm absolutely in that camp.
(31:12):
But what I've started to see andwhat I went through in a
massive way myself you knowevery expert comes from a
different angle.
Right, you need to meditate,you need to journal, you need to
exercise, you need to visualize, you need to read, you need to
listen, you need to make sureyou're not using plastic bottles
.
You need to drink water, butnot fizzy water, normal water.
Right, I could just keeplistening.
(31:34):
Brush your teeth.
All of all of these, thesedifferent things in different
areas, whether it's for theenvironment, whether it's for
yourself, whether it's for yourhealth, whether it's for your
family, your business.
There's so many things that wecan be doing, and I don't know
about anybody else, but Iactually found I was starting to
get more stressed and almostput myself down, self-sabotage
(31:55):
myself in a bigger way, becauseI became so obsessed with
needing to be the person thatdid all of those things and I
think it's just remembering thatwhere is the area of most
importance?
Like you spoke to that ladyyesterday that had a fear of
judgment.
You know that's showing up inher everyday life.
Focus in that area right now.
(32:16):
I think having thatconversation with you was
probably a real light bulb,insightful moment for her.
And if she took that moment toreflect, as we spoke about
earlier, to go inside and thinkabout what you've just shared
and, slowly but surely, keepseeding that ease of letting it
go, of not worrying what otherpeople think, of understanding
(32:38):
that you'll naturally care whatsome people think, but who are
you giving the mic to?
Whose opinion are you reallylistening to?
And if we just focus in like aone or two particular areas of
our life at a time and justremember to enjoy that process
rather than becoming so consumedand trying to get everything
right all the time, I thinkyou'll find that your
(32:58):
progression is actually faster.
But it's also and this is moremeaningful so much more
enjoyable and so much more easyto continue with if you do it
that way.
What are your thoughts on that,tim?
Tim (33:11):
I 100% agree with everything that you just said,
and, as I'm listening to you,I'm thinking, you know, for you
and my perspective, right, Ilove your voice, I love it and
the power that you have when youspeak.
It's I mean not just here, butyou know, when you're on stage,
(33:31):
or you know the the things thatI've seen you say, that it, it,
it.
For me it's overwhelming.
I mean, you've, you've got suchpower, and you've obviously
developed that, as you know, asyour career has gone on, but
there's, you've you've probablyalways had that in you, right?
I mean, I would think, I wouldthink that, because there's I
(33:55):
mean it again I love therethere's just something,
something that's there, and howdid you, how did you develop
that, though?
Was that something that wasencouraged?
Was that something that thatyou that you know again, people
that you care about said youknow, harriet, you've got
something here.
Harriet (34:16):
Being honest, I think when I was younger, I was told
that I was either going to be afamous actress, the prime
minister, or I was going to runa brothel.
Tim (34:28):
You know, harriet, I'm not sure which one's worse, which
one's better um.
Harriet (34:35):
So yeah, I had an interesting uh projection there
of what I'd become, but I thinksuffice to say, especially when
it came, I think everyonethought I was going to be on
stage, like even from ayoungster.
I loved, loved, performing,singing, telling stories to the
group.
So I think it was very obviousthat I was going to be on stage.
(34:56):
But nobody, at least of allmyself, had any idea that it
would be as a as a publicspeaker, and in fact my family
and myself had absolutely noidea what this, this world oh no
right, you know, were you thesame oh yeah, yeah, they still
don't.
Tim (35:15):
Um, I'm not sure I'm, I don't say I'm not sure I do, but
but you know, they definitelydon't I'm still heavily learning
, but I now understand a littlebit more.
Harriet (35:24):
And again, I think this is really important, because
sometimes you know, if peoplesay, I want to become an
international speaker or I wantto become an author, whatever it
might be, sometimes you getresistance from loved ones and
from family members oh, I don'tthink you can do that.
Oh, no, that's not a greatcareer and it doesn't mean it's
true, it just means they don'thave experience in it.
(35:44):
So I would ask everyone just topause and again, think for
yourself, but also go to someonewho's doing the thing that you
want to do and have aconversation with them, because
it is possible.
But it might be that you needcertain insights, certain
know-how, certain skill, etcetera, et cetera, and really,
for me, that's what it was.
That was the original question,tim, you know.
(36:05):
Did you know that you were goingto become that?
And then, how did you?
Well, I was running a care home.
I was in a completely differentworld and I got to that point,
you know, I think, like many.
One day I was just sitting atmy desk and I this the tears and
I mean like ugly tears mascaradown my face, snot dripping out
my nose like smoothing tears andI just realized enough is
(36:32):
enough.
I can't do this anymore.
I'm not enjoying it, I'm nothappy, I don't feel valued.
Everything is a paperwork tickbox system rather than true
person centered care.
And I just had enough.
So I actually saw a littleadvert that said do you want
more positivity, do you wantmore flexibility, do you want to
be your own boss?
And I just said yes.
I was the most naive Tasmaniandevil running a million miles
(36:53):
towards something that I had noidea what it was.
I just knew it felt good and Ineeded to get away from what I
was currently doing, and thatwas actually for network
marketing, but of course, withinnetwork marketing.
I then found public speaking, Ifound personal development and
I just absolutely committedmyself to events, programs,
mentors, courses that allowed meto develop the skill.
(37:17):
So I would say, yes, I was anatural speaker, but also now
I'm a very skillful speaker.
When you put talent and work,effort, energy together, that's
when you become an unstoppableand impactful speaker.
Tim (37:32):
Yeah, and I'm glad you said that, because to be good at
anything it takes work.
It's not a you know, at leastfor most people it takes work.
It's not something that's justgoing to happen overnight.
You may have some talent to it,but to be good at it it takes
work.
It takes practice, talent to it, but to be good at it.
It takes work, it takes practice, and you know, that's that, I
(37:57):
think, is also something thatthat, especially from the
younger professional perspective, they need to to understand and
embrace that just because youdon't get it the first or second
time doesn't mean you shouldquit.
It means you should lean intoit.
It means you should try and andpractice more or or find a
different way to go about doingit.
Don't quit.
Harriet (38:14):
Work harder.
Yes, say it louder for thepeople at the back.
You pick up your phone and youcan have nearly anything
delivered to you either the sameday or the next day, or
certainly within a short amountof time.
You can order anything you want, you can connect, you can learn
(38:37):
, you can do so much instantlyfrom the devices that we have
around us that I think sometimes, especially younger generations
, forget the process, forget thesteps, and I know it's a little
bit cliche, but I'm going tosay it loudly and proudly yes,
set that goal.
Yes, have that vision.
Yes, have that mountaintopachievement that you're excited
(38:58):
to do, but please immerseyourself in the process, step by
step, the journey up themountain, the views, the rivers
that you cross, the people thatyou meet, whatever it might be.
Just hold that vision, butimmerse yourself in the
day-to-day steps and theday-to-day process.
Tim (39:15):
Yeah, it's so important and , and you said, the people that
you meet, I say I think it's.
You know, we're so in intechnology is so ingrained in
everything that we do.
And I had this conversationyesterday with that same same
lady.
You know, since I haven't beenteaching, I miss that
(39:38):
interpersonal relationship.
I mean I do five or six of zoomcalls or these types of things
a day, which is great.
I'm talking to people and I'mmeeting people.
You know it's great.
But I miss shaking somebody'shand, I miss, I miss sitting
down, having a coffee or havinglunch or breakfast, and you know
those types of conversationsand what we have to understand
(40:00):
that it doesn't matter whatindustry you get into, it's
people, it's relationships, it'sthe connections AI, this AI
that it's all good, it's allwell, but at the end of the day,
it's still.
It's the connections AI, thisAI that it's all good, it's all
well, but at the end of the day,it's still going to be about
people, it's still going to beabout the relationships, it's
still going to be about thosepersonal connections and we
cannot forget about that.
Harriet (40:21):
I so so agree, and there's an expression that I
think is really true it's notwhat you know, it's who you know
.
But I think if you can couplethe two, then, uh yes, you're
onto a winning path, but again,that's a process in itself.
As you say um, I'm sure you'rethe same, tim.
You know you open your, yourFacebook or your Instagram and
you are bombarded with coldmessages of people pitching, but
(40:45):
then you also are.
You also have people that opena conversation, that start a
dialogue and allow a space for arelationship to build.
And I've never seen results orinstant shifts from meeting
somebody in one moment andhaving that first initial
conversation, but in time,through building relationships,
(41:07):
I've seen doors open in places Iwould have thought were
impossible.
So I think relationships are soimportant, but it's bringing
value, love, patience and whatyou said earlier no expectation
to the meeting.
Tim (41:25):
Right and that's what works for me.
And you know, I think if youdon't have to, everybody has
their own way of doing things.
But understand that it'srelationships, it doesn't really
matter.
And you know you use the term.
I believe it's lead with love.
What does that mean for you?
Harriet (41:49):
What does that mean for you?
So Lead With Love is actuallyour logo and for people watching
, not listening, I'm trying toshow a little.
I've got it tattooed on areminder, but it's also our logo
.
So it's a heart with a littlearrow at the bottom pointing
into the heart.
And, essentially, lead WithLove is a breakdown of our
entire conversation.
(42:09):
So, first of all, it starts withyourself.
Lead with love for you.
You know, as we said earlier,you're the number one in every
single area of your life.
If you can give yourself thatlove for all of you Listeners,
make sure you heard that All ofyou, not just the wonderful,
amazing in the spotlight parts,but all of you, the bits that
make mistakes, the bits thatmess up, the bits that are still
(42:32):
learning.
If you can lead with love forall of who you are and keep
expanding, then of course thatwill naturally ripple out.
And then the obvious lead withlove for your family, for your
friends, for your localcommunity, for your customers,
for your team, for whoever youmeet in the streets.
And then, of course, at thebigger level, lead with love
from your stages, lead with lovewherever you are, lead with
(42:54):
love for our environment, forhumanity, for the universe.
So it kind of starts with anintrospective view, but it's
really just walking and leadingand especially speaking with
love, kindness and compassionfor all.
Tim (43:08):
Yeah, that's amazing and I really like that.
It's not just from a businessperspective and I think we get
so caught up in that.
You know, even from thecoaching business and
self-development business, likeyou said, that we forget about
some of the most important parts.
To me, the most important partof our life is our personal life
(43:29):
.
It's our personal relationships, it's our, you know, our friend
group, our spouse, our family.
You know, those types of thingsare way more important, at
least from my perspective, thanthan the business side.
Now, I get it, I understandthere, you got to have both.
But if we're not happy in one,we're not going to be happy in
(43:49):
the other and we can be happy athome and not happy at work.
Harriet (44:03):
But it's very rare to be happy at work if we're not
happy at home.
It's so true, and that's one ofour most meaningful connections
and spaces, isn't it?
So it's immensely important andI think sometimes it's
especially that with, likefamily and friends, sometimes
that's the bit that gets missed,and I'm really talking about in
a healthy manner.
I'm not talking about peoplethat just say yes to everything
(44:23):
and people please and are alwaysdoing for others.
I really mean leading in thatexample, being able to say no,
being able to, to set boundaries, but also, of course, leading
with love and sometimes havingthose tougher conversations.
We talk about speaking withconfidence.
That's not just from live andvirtual stages, that's in your
everyday life, and I reallybelieve some of the
(44:47):
conversations I've had with myhusband if we hadn't had them, I
believe it would have led downa totally different path and we
might not have been together.
But because we led with lovefor ourselves, understood who we
were and what we wanted, andthen were able to communicate
that with love and understandingto each other, without
expectation, without trying tocontrol, just an open
(45:07):
conversation, it's completelyshifted the dynamic that we have
in our marriage and I believethat we're much happier because
of our communication and beingable to speak up.
So it's truly important, anddon't just think about doing it
for you or doing it for yourbusiness.
Do it for those around you.
Tim (45:23):
Around you Exactly.
You know it's so important.
And you know another example Itell people I don't want, yes,
people around me, I want peoplethat are going to shoot me
straight.
And you know, as I was drivingup it's, it's about a 12 hour
drive from where I live to tosee the kids.
That's the time when I I spenta lot of time on the phone
(45:47):
because I can talk and drive andit's not taking away from some
other things.
And I was talking to my bestfriend and he's in the process
of he's got a business.
He's still working the business, but he's not sure if he wants
to sell it or if he wants tobranch off.
So we've been having thoseconversations and I told him one
(46:11):
of the things that he was doing.
I said, dude, that's, that's,that's a horrible idea, that's
not a good idea.
Don't do that.
And I told him, I asked him whyhe was thinking it and I told
him why it wasn't a good idea.
And he was so thankful becauseeverybody else has been telling
him it's.
It was a good idea to do.
When it would have been,without looking at from the
(46:34):
perspective that I gave him, itwould have been a disaster.
So you know you've got to havepeople in your inner circle that
are willing to shoot youstraight and say look, dude,
you're doing it wrong, youmessed up over here.
You need to need to go makeamends, um, or or whatever.
It's okay to have those peoplein your life that's important to
have those people in your life.
(46:55):
It really is so I completelyagree.
Harriet (46:59):
Sounds like you're.
Tim (46:59):
You're a good friend to him in that moment well, I, I try,
and you know he's, he'sdefinitely done the same for me,
and you know, as of others, andand just like you said in your
marriage, you know what I lovemy wife dearly, but I don't want
her to just agree and not.
I mean, that doesn't serveanybody, because all that does
is build resentment, you know.
(47:21):
But it really builds resentmenton both sides because, okay,
you're just going to agree witheverything I say I, you know,
that's it.
No discussion, no, nothing.
I can do whatever I want.
That's, that's not, that's notlife.
Harriet (47:35):
So you, know, and often if they are just agreeing with
everything.
It's, I mean, I'm sure thatcouples or I would hope that
couples can agree on a lot.
But you're right, we're twodifferent human beings existing
in the same space, so naturallythere's going to be differences,
different opinions, differentthoughts.
So, yes, I do believe it'sreally important to to voice
(47:56):
those and actually I, I thinkyou can see, sometimes you know,
I've worked with with leadersthat I I respect, that I admire,
but once I've been with themfor a certain amount of time, I
can sort of see you've neverbeen challenged, you always get
your own way.
And it's interesting thepitfalls that we can fall into
by always needing to be the onethat's right or by not enjoying
(48:19):
being challenged by others.
And actually being challenged,as long as you can stay calm,
understanding and receive it,can be one of the most powerful
accelerations within yourjourney.
Tim (48:31):
Exactly, exactly.
So part of that requireseverybody put their ego aside.
Harriet (48:44):
And that is definitely easier said than done.
Tim (48:47):
Way easier said than done.
But again, if you, I think, ifyou approach it, you know, from
the lead with love idea, itmakes it a lot easier because
it's you know.
I explain it.
It's not about me, you know,it's about the collective.
What's best for everybody,what's best for the family,
(49:09):
what's best for the relationship, what's best for the family,
what's best for the relationship, what's best for the business,
what's best for the team,whatever it is?
You know, sometimes it may bewhat's best for you, but
sometimes it's not and you'vegot to be okay with that.
Harriet (49:19):
Yeah, yeah, and I think it's being able to choose.
You know, you and I both speakabout speaking up, sharing,
speaking up with confidence,saying what's on your mind, and
maybe this is another podcastfor another time.
But I think the best speakersand the best communicators are
also the ones that know when notto speak, Exactly when to just
(49:39):
listen.
And you know, again, it's acommon quote, but choosing your
battles and I was somebody,especially with my feistiness,
my fire inside.
You know I needed to get myopinion out and I needed people
to hear me.
I needed people to know what'swrong, what's right, and it
wasn't even necessarily what waswrong or right, it was just in
my opinion.
(50:01):
So you know, you said about thelead with love.
It's no coincidence that it'sthere on my wrist and it's very
much a tangible tool for me nowthat I look at it.
I place my thumb on it Ifsomeone's saying something or
I'm in a disagreement, but it'snot.
I don't need to be involved inthis battle, or they're not
looking for support.
They don't want my feedback inthe moment.
Instead of trying to have thatfight, instead of forcing we
(50:24):
spoke earlier about thedifference between forcing and
allowing, or forcing andchoosing to do something.
You know, I found that so oftennow in life.
I'm able just to take thatbreath, sit back and just be and
use my energy in focuses whereit matters, where it serves,
(50:46):
where it's more helpful, and tonot spend the next day or two
days going oh my God, I can'tbelieve they said this, they did
that, but actually just justputting your energy into into
something that serves in themoment.
So, yes, speak up, but alsoallow yourself to not need to
speak up all the time.
Tim (50:58):
Exactly Well, harry, thank you so much for spending some
time with us today.
Where can people find with youand connect with you and and and
work with you?
Harriet (51:06):
I am on all the socials , so Instagram, facebook I
invite you to find me, harrietBratt, drop into my inbox, share
an insight that you've takenfrom this podcast or ask any
questions.
Just connect with me.
And, of course, my website isHarriet Bratt dot com, where
there is also a free masterclasson mastering the five pillars
of public speaking.
And, tim, I just want to saythank you, thank you for a
(51:29):
wonderful conversation.
Thank you to all of yourspeaking and, tim, I just want
to say thank you, thank you fora wonderful conversation, thank
you to all of your listeners and, again, thank you for this
platform that you've created tosupport and help others.
Tim (51:37):
I really do appreciate it.
I love the conversation.
I'll put all those links in theshow notes and again for
listeners out there searchHarriet out.
She is phenomenal, harriet out,she is phenomenal Again.
Harriet, I love your voice, andthat means it's not just your
(51:58):
voice, it's what you say and howyou say it, and you are a true
gem.
Thank you so much.
Harriet (52:01):
I appreciate you and I appreciate your heart, Ted.
Let's continue rising together.
Tim (52:06):
Absolutely.
Welcome to Speaking with Confidence, the podcast
dedicated to helping you unlockthe power of effective public
speaking.
I'm Tim Newman, a recoveringcollege professor, jury
communication coach, and I'mthrilled to guide you on your
journey to becoming a powerfulcommunicator.
I want to thank each and everyone of you for your support.
It truly means the world to me.
Please visit timnewmanspeakscomto get your free ebook the top
(00:29):
21 challenges for publicspeakers and how to overcome
them.
Today's guest is Harriet Bratt.
She's a powerhouse speaker andmentor on a mission to help
ambitious entrepreneurs own thestage, elevate their income and
make a serious impact, all whilehaving a lot of fun along the
way.
Harriet, welcome to the show.
I'm really appreciative of youbeing here and I think we're
going to have a good time.
Harriet (00:51):
I'm super excited.
Thank you so much, tim.
Thank you to all the listenersand speaking with confidence,
what a topic, what an insightful, valuable information for
people, and I just want to saythank you for being on this
podcast and everything that youare doing with Speaking With
Confidence.
Tim (01:07):
Harry, thank you so much.
I really appreciate you sayingthat and you know, as you can
see, I'm not in my normal studio, I'm traveling and visiting
grandkids.
But I did not want to put thisoff, primarily because anytime
that unless for the listener,anytime you can hear Harriet
speak, I would suggest that yougo do it.
She is a fireball, she alwaysbrings it and what I really like
(01:35):
about it is, you know, in theintroduction, she does it while
having fun and you know, Harriet, for me that's part of it as
well, because we spend so muchof our life, you know, in
serious, this serious, that wegot to learn to have some fun
with this.
Harriet (01:48):
Absolutely.
I think it's so important and Idon't know about anybody
listening or yourself, tim, butfor me you know that playfulness
, that having fun, having fun indoing what you do, but also
taking time to do fun things.
I think it's so easy to forgetthat as we grow up having fun in
doing what you do, but alsotaking time to do fun things.
I think it's so easy to forgetthat as we grow up and it
happens at different ages fordifferent people but it's so
(02:11):
easy to get caught up in the ratrace, in the hamster wheel, you
know whatever terminology youwant to use but it's so easy to
get caught up in seriously doing, doing, doing rather than
actually taking that time toenjoy and have fun with what
we're doing.
So I think that's a greathighlight and it's really
important.
Tim (02:29):
Yeah, it really is.
And one of the things thatreally strikes me about some of
the stuff that you do is thewhole firewalk, and I've talked
to people that have done itbefore and they say you have to
do it, you have to do it, youhave to do it.
And I'm like I don't know, man,that's kind of pushing for me.
So tell us about the firewalkand how you go about the process
(02:53):
of coaching people to let go,to be able to do something like
that.
Harriet (03:00):
Absolutely, I think, and I love your openness in
sharing that no-transcript.
Tim (03:25):
That's it that takes care of it, right there.
Harriet (03:26):
Yeah, right, but I think that's the point.
And you know, firewalking it'snot new.
Firewalking's been done forthousands of years.
But it was a gentleman over inthe US, actually in California,
tolly Buchan and his wife PeggyDillon, that brought it into the
Western world as more of anexperiential breakthrough.
(03:47):
Now, if we just pause for asecond and you think in life,
how many times fear shows up?
You know you quit your job as ateacher to start your own
business.
I'm sure there was some fear,some challenges, some
uncertainty.
We have to have difficultconversations with loved ones,
with family, with bosses askinga boss for a pay rise, telling a
(04:08):
boss that you're leaving to dosomething else you know there's
so many different examples.
We could do a whole podcast onexamples of when fear shows up.
So the idea with the fire isputting yourself in that intense
environment where fear willshow up.
I don't care who you are, whereyou're from, when you stand in
front of that fire, particularlyfor the first time fear shows
(04:33):
up.
But when we are able to feel Ithink it was Susan Jeffries that
wrote that amazing book feelthe fear and do it anyway.
Feel the fear and walk the fire.
When we feel that fear and wemake a conscious choice and of
course, we spend a few hoursbefore the fire walk with
sequenced activities andexercises that support someone,
to be able to make that choicein spite of fear.
(04:55):
So when you stand in front ofthat fire and you start
trembling and the fear shows up,but you're able to take that
breath, look after yourpsychology and your physiology
and make a conscious choice towalk, that celebration, that
feeling, when you've crossedthat fire, you can't take that
away right.
It's like an elastic band whenyou pull it so far, it will
(05:16):
never go back to exactly thesame size because it's been
stretched, because it's expanded.
So now we take that samefeeling back into our everyday
life.
And when fear shows up, youknow, oh, I need to have a
difficult conversation with mypartner.
I'm not sure how they're goingto take what I want to share
with them.
I am asking a customer for asale.
I'm walking into a bar andasking someone out on a date.
Tim (05:38):
You know, whatever it, is Whatever, it is right yeah
exactly.
Harriet (05:40):
We can feel the fear and walk the fire.
Feel the fear and show upanyway.
Tim (05:58):
So, exactly, we can feel the fear and walk the fire, feel
the fear and show up anyway.
So that's the premise behind it, and you've done something that
was, at least from myperspective, terrifying to begin
with, and you've gone throughit and you've accomplished it,
and you achieved that goal.
What's it like?
You know talking to thesepeople after they've done that.
Harriet (06:19):
I'd love you know if we were here, live, or if we were
in front of an audience.
I'd ask people to startguessing now, like how you feel
elation, satisfaction,excitement, enthusiasm, but on a
much deeper level,understanding of your true
capability, connecting the dots,that you can feel that fear and
(06:39):
you have a choice in thatmoment.
Do you let the niggling voiceof oh, I don't think I could do
this like take over, or do youstep into that power, do you
make that choice that serves you, even though it's scary and for
many, you know, differentvocabulary will come up,
different feelings, differentmessages.
It's such an individualexperience, but as a general,
(07:01):
but as a general, everybodyfeels grateful, feels
accomplished, feels like theyhave achieved something they did
not think was possible before.
They did it, and that's anincredible feeling.
Tim (07:15):
And you know I'm guessing that you know there's to be able
to, to do, to do that.
If there's got to be a greatdeal of introspection right to
to understand, to do that, ifthere's got to be some a great
deal of introspection right toto understand who you are and
whatever, because our fears arecome from many different areas
and they they affect each of usindividually differently.
(07:37):
But to truly get to what tothat, it takes some
introspection, um, to be able toaddress that and then overcome
it.
We can't say this is whysomebody else fears it, so
that's why I fear it, and it'llbe easy to overcome.
You really have to get downdeep inside of yourself and
figure that out.
Harriet (07:54):
Exactly and you really hit the nail on the head there.
Beautiful insight.
And that's one of the reasons Ilove whether it's firewalking
or glasswalking or the arrowbreak I just love experiential
breakthroughs.
And don't get me wrong, I thinkcoaching, mentoring, therapy,
hypnotherapy there are so manydifferent modalities and they
all have their place.
I'm not here to knock any ofthem and, as you just said, most
(08:17):
importantly, people need tofind what works for them and I
particularly think having acoach or a mentor with you on a
journey is immensely powerful.
But what I love about theexperiential breakthroughs is
what you've just said.
You feel it yourself.
You have that experience.
It's not externally being told,it's not someone cheering you
on, although everybodycelebrates when you've walked.
(08:37):
You feel that and therefore youcan't take it away.
Once you've hit that level ofconsciousness, once you felt
that knowing about yourself, ifyou continue in the old pattern,
it just leads to discomfort.
It allows you a space to stepinto the truer version, the more
authentic version.
These have all become buzzwordsthese days, but it's true that
(09:00):
the real core of who you are,yeah, and you know, just take
that one step further.
Tim (09:07):
You know, I know that there's days for me, right At
the end of the day, I, I, I goback, I do a lot of
introspection, thinking you know, what did I do today?
What'd I do?
What'd I do?
Well, what do I need to proveon?
What did I put off, what haveyou?
And I know there are days thatI look back and say you know
what?
There was something holding meback from doing this and I
(09:28):
didn't do it.
And damn it, tim, just effingdo it.
Just get up in the morning andjust do it.
Do you ever have those days?
And how do you coach peoplethrough that?
Because, again, I think it'salso important to understand
that we're not perfect.
Harriet (09:51):
We're going to make mistakes and we have to give
ourselves a certain amount ofgrace, but we still have to do
it Absolutely.
I, I completely agree.
I'd love to sit here and say no, I never get that face.
I'm always on top floor, thefire is burning.
No, you know, like you said andI, I, that's part of being a
human and I I don't use thisterm a lot myself, but I think
often people talk about toxicpositivity and I have to say
that I used to be in that campand I wouldn't allow myself to
(10:14):
feel all of those differentemotions and I was that person
that almost pretended everythingwas okay, it's going to be fine
, let's crack on, let's do it,let's do it.
And ultimately it never servedme.
In fact, it just led to sort ofburnout and a lack of emotional
management.
But I think, as you say,there's a beautiful balance
between knowing yourself andknowing when you're just having
(10:36):
an off day and using certaintools.
Maybe it's journaling, maybeit's a conversation with an
empowered friend, coach ormentor.
It's a conversation with anempowered friend, coach or
mentor.
Maybe it's music.
Music's a massive one for me IfI'm feeling a little bit lazy,
a little bit groggy, maybe, ifI'm procrastinating, if I put
some of my favorite songs onespecially if they're my stage
songs instantly, that changes mystate.
(10:57):
Music is an amazing way ofchanging both your physiology
and your emotional state.
So you could have certain toolsthat, if you're having one of
those days, you use them and, asTim says, you just crack on
with it, get on with it.
But I also think that somethingwe miss a lot and, tim, I'd
love to hear your thoughts onthis is absolutely.
There are days where I know I'mjust being lazy and a good kick
(11:20):
up the gets me going again.
But there's also times whereperhaps there is something
really challenging going on.
Perhaps I am ill or I've got aninjury on my body, or perhaps
I'm really just genuinely nothaving a great day, and I would
really encourage people never toforce themselves back into
action in those moments.
I'm also not someone that'ssaying go and get ice cream
(11:43):
Doritos, sit on the sofa andhave a pity party for two weeks.
You know work on reducing yourrecovery period, but sometimes
you just need to let yourselfhave that space, and maybe it's
a hug with your grandkids, maybeit's going out for a walk in
nature, maybe it's having ashower, maybe it's dancing for
half an hour, but just doingsomething for a period of time
(12:04):
that enables you to change yourstate, because I don't agree
with just forcing ourselves todo something in a negative state
of mind.
I believe in shifting thatstate, coming back to some sort
of calm, some sort of content,some sort of normal-ish, to then
action.
Put yourself back into actionagain.
Does that make sense, tim?
Tim (12:24):
100% agree with you, because if you continue to force
yourself to do something,number one, it's not going to be
done well, there's going to bemistakes, you're going to come
back and you're going to becritical of it and then you're
going to have to redo it anyway.
It's so much better to just sayyou know what, move on, like
you said, move on to somethingelse to you know.
(12:45):
Just just say you know what,move on, like you said, move on
to something else, go, go, dosomething.
Clear your head.
Even it's for for the day.
You know what, at noon it's,it's I got all kinds of other
things going on up up in hereand, for whatever reason,
today's not the day for me to dothis.
Let's go clear that and that way, when I come back, I'm fresh
(13:07):
and I can truly do the thingsthat need to be done and it's
everything's going to be better.
You know that yourinterpersonal relationships are
going to be better because youknow what.
You're going to be angry orupset or whatever.
So take the time that we need.
And you know, that's somethingthat I've learned, tim, today
and obviously, if we're notgrowing as we get older, we're
doing it wrong, right, tim?
(13:28):
Today is very different thanthe Tim five years ago, five
years before that, five yearsbefore that, and what we've
learned, and or what I'velearned, and how to approach
things Tim 20 years ago wouldnot know this Tim at all and I
would say, for the most part,that's a, that's a good thing.
Harriet (13:51):
In terms of having that space to grow and keep learning
.
Tim (13:55):
And learning and giving myself grace and giving others
grace, because you know, if Iwas always let me back up for a
second you as an individualcannot have expectations of
others.
I mean you can if you want.
I mean that's up to you.
If you want to haveexpectations of others, go ahead
(14:15):
.
Let me know how that works outfor you.
And that's one of the thingsthat I've learned.
Okay, ok, I always expectedpeople to put forth the effort
and the passion into what theywere doing at the same level
that I was doing it, and if youdidn't look out and I was the
(14:37):
judge and jury of whether youwere doing what you were
supposed to do or not, and sothat that that to me, is a is a
very good thing.
That that, that that I'velearned.
Harriet (14:47):
Um, and you know, yeah, so I was just going to say I
think that's a phenomenal thingfor anybody listening at the
moment that that has that moment.
Um, it does take time, it doestake a shift.
I really resonate with what Timwas saying.
(15:08):
I was also that person thatjust had really high
expectations, high highstandards on what I was doing
and therefore what I expectedothers to do too.
And yeah, that's just the truth.
You cannot control whatsomebody else does.
You can only choose how yourespond to it, and if you
constantly try and live by thatexpectation, then you're going
(15:30):
to find yourself in a state ofdisappointment a lot.
I can really relate to that,tim.
I think it's a beautiful share.
Tim (15:36):
And so that's so.
I still have the expectationmyself.
I still have that expectationthat I'm going to produce, that
I'm still going to have thosehigh standards, and I hope that
you do, and if you don't, that'sfine, we move on and that's
that.
But you know that's kind of adifferent discussion, you know.
(15:56):
So, number one give yourselfgrace, give others grace,
because, again, we don'tnecessarily know what's going on
in their lives either, and ifwe show them caring and support,
then we can better help themget over whatever it is.
Help them, give them the toolsthat they need, whatever it is
that they need to be successful,because that's, in my view,
(16:19):
that's why we're here.
I'm here to help you, or you orwhoever it is, be successful
and get what you want out ofyour life and out of your career
, out of your personalrelationships.
Harriet (16:30):
And I can really see, from the moment we had our very
first conversation, your passionand embodiment of that.
So again, I just want toacknowledge you and your work,
tim.
It's outstanding.
Tim (16:43):
Thank you so much.
I appreciate it.
You know I've got ADHD, really,really bad, and I mean and I
mean it's bad.
And so you know I've learned to, I've learned some coping
mechanisms that you know I wishI had when I was younger.
(17:05):
Right, you know, when I wasyounger it was oh he just he's
hyper, he doesn't know how tosit down and listen.
And you know, I learned some ofthese coping mechanisms as an
adult and again, I wish I hadwhen I was younger.
But how, for you, has livingwith ADHD influenced your
journey as a speaker andentrepreneur?
(17:26):
Because it's, at least for me,it's tough sometimes, you know,
like I can't work outside at all.
I mean, if I go outside to work, forget it, day's done.
Harriet (17:48):
I'm inside shades, know , like I can't work outside at
all.
I mean, if I go outside to work, forget it, day's done.
I'm inside shades, drawn dark,interesting.
Interesting For those thatdon't know I also have ADHD.
I often joke and say I'm the.
Harriet in the ADHD um, but it'sagain.
We've said this a couple oftimes, you know it's really
finding what works for you,because I'm the opposite if it's
a nice day outside and I'minside, I will spend the entire
time wanting to be out.
(18:09):
So we've actually built a spacewith a shelter that goes over
the the computer, so the laptopcan be in the shade but I can
still see in the sun.
And for me that was an absolutegame changer and I actually sat
and worked rather than justmaking any excuse I could to get
outside.
It's finding what works for us,but I think for me, you know
(18:31):
particularly you said about as aspeaker and an entrepreneur.
Well, I had my diagnosis at avery, very young age and for me
I always say that it was neverthe diagnosis, it was never
having ADHD.
It was the way in which peopleapproached me, and even my own
parents, and I understand itcame from a space of love, it
(18:52):
came from a space of themwanting the best for me.
But you know, as soon as I wastold I had ADHD, everything
changed very quickly and myusual sort of Harriet energetic
bursts that before were almostlaughed about, joked about,
cheered on, suddenly became goand take your tablets, stop
showing off, stop seekingattention.
(19:14):
You can't concentrate, you know.
All of these statements weresuddenly being thrown at me.
So that's actually what I foundreally difficult.
So I think before I learned tomanage or understand how having
ADHD can serve me, but also howit can hold me back, especially
as an entrepreneur, I actuallyneeded to learn and understand
(19:34):
my feeling towards having ADHDand my choice in how I was going
to show up, not havingeverybody tell me what I needed
to do and more often than not itwas just negative statements.
No solutions, just negativestatements.
So by the time I started my ownbusiness, I'd really started to
see ADHD as a superpower and Isee the areas it can hold me
(19:57):
back.
I see the areas that I can getvery easily distracted and be
running in the complete oppositedirection than my goal.
But, as you say, in time I justlearned to do certain things.
If I'm doing my admin oraccounts, I'm at a standing desk
and I've got like music on inthe background.
If I'm doing content orrecording, I will record for 45
(20:17):
minutes and then I'll take 15minutes to go do something else,
put some music on and then comeback to record again.
So I found different ways thatit can work for me, but I'm
still very aware that I needthose particular methods to
support me in staying focused.
Tim (20:34):
Yeah, you know it's.
It's funny that you know how we, you know.
This is just an example of howdifferent people approach it
different ways.
If I, if again, if I'm outsidehere the birds chirp or see a
rabbit, yeah there goes, timchasing a rabbit, you know.
Or, or somebody, or somebodywalks by, I'll start talking to
them, or or whatever.
And then you know an hour later, man, I didn't get, I didn't
(20:56):
get anything done.
And then here comes that, thatnegative self-talk, right, all
because I didn't, you know, Ididn't do the things that I know
I should be doing to to stopthose things from happening.
But but it's, it's so importantto you know we can take the
medication and and, yes, ithelps, but we also have to know
who we are and what makes ustick and and put ourselves.
(21:19):
Whether you have ADHD, add orwhatever, um, you, if you don't
have any of that stuff, we stillhave to have the, the strategy,
strategies and techniques toput ourselves in position.
That is going to put us in tobe successful.
That's going to make ussuccessful.
It doesn't matter If, even ifyou don't have those things, you
know what, what's, how do youwork the best?
(21:41):
You know, how do you, you know,develop the thoughts?
How do you, how do you producethe best work product or the
best conversations with, withyour, your, your partners or,
you know, your friendships andthose types of things?
And I think it's.
I just really think that it's alost art, because people don't
necessarily think about who theyare and how they tick, and I
(22:03):
keep coming back to that.
But to me that's what it comesdown to.
Harriet (22:09):
I completely agree and I love that you keep coming back
to it, because I do believethat is where it all begins.
You know, when we look at ourlives, no matter who you are,
you are the dot in every.
You're the center of every areaof your life, whether it's your
romantic relationships, yourfamily, your work, your health,
your business.
Everything starts from you.
And I completely agree, youknow whether you're neurodiverse
(22:31):
, whether you're not I like totalk a bit of it in personality
traits.
I think that's less labeling forpeople, but either way, it is
understanding yourself and thereare certain you know whether
it's autism, adhd, dyslexiathere are certain terms that
have a greater depth of research, information that you can go in
(22:55):
and read and research and getto know yourself more.
But ultimately, as you justsaid, Tim, everybody has
strengths and areas ofimprovement.
Everybody has these light,magical, amazing qualities about
themselves and everybody hasthe doubt, the fear, the
procrastination, thedisempowered habits, whatever
(23:17):
that might be.
We all have that as humanbeings.
So again, I completely agreewith you and I'd love us to
maybe even tap into differentways to do that Because again, I
think you hear that so oftenget to know yourself, sit with
your feelings, but what doesthat really mean and what does
that really look like Like foryou, tim?
How did you really connect withwhat works for you and who you
(23:39):
are?
Tim (23:40):
Well, I, you know, I had a lot of help, just a lot of
professional help, a lot ofnon-professional help, and one
of the things that I did is Iasked the people in my inner
circle what they notice.
You know, how do they see me,how do they see?
You know, when do they see thatI've produced the best?
(24:03):
And you know, a lot of timesthey came at, came back with
when it's when you're doing this, it's when you're doing this,
it's when you're doing this.
And I said, okay, that thatthat makes a lot of sense
because I see it.
And I said, okay, that makes alot of sense because I see it.
And so you know, what we see inourselves is one thing, but
(24:27):
what others in our inner circlesee is something very different.
Because, again, we have ourtalk and we say we're good at
this, when we may notnecessarily be good, we may like
doing it, but we may not begood at it, and that's something
different that we can talkabout later.
But when are we producing andwhen are we the most effective?
It's when we're doing thesethings, and I think we see it's
(24:49):
our inner circle that sees thatbetter than us, and that's
really kind of how I started,because, you know, when I
started my doctoral program andnobody really knows this, so
this is going to be the firsttime coming out.
My wife knows I was never trulytaught how to read.
I figured it out on my ownright.
(25:09):
So I had gone through anundergraduate degree never being
taught how to read, finished amaster's degree, never being
taught how to read.
I mean I could read, but Inever being taught how to read,
finished a master's degree,never being taught how to read.
I mean I could read, but I wasnever taught how to read.
There's a difference there,right?
And what I found.
You know, when I started thedoctoral program, I went to my
wife I said, look, I'm fallingbehind and I can't figure it out
(25:30):
.
I don't know why.
I don't know why.
And that was when I wasdiagnosed with ADHD as I was
going through my doctoralprogram, and that's when I truly
learned how to how to read.
And you know when that happened, man, the light bulb, like that
, and I went forward so quickly.
And that's why I say you know,I really wish that I had learned
(25:54):
some of these things when I wasyounger.
But think about that 30 yearsold and again, I don't want that
.
I couldn't read.
There's a difference, right?
So when I was reading everysingle word and I would have to
read a sentence four or fivetimes, as opposed to, you know,
(26:15):
just reading and understanding.
So that for me was a light bulbmoment.
Harriet (26:21):
Yeah, I can very much imagine that, and again, though,
I think your approach and yourattitude and the way you've just
shared that.
You know, I've met a lot ofpeople or not a lot, but
certainly a few people thathaven't been able to read and
that's become their story Ican't read, and you've taken
(26:43):
something that you weren'ttaught but you clearly knew or
wanted to be able to.
You knew it was important, knewit could benefit you, whatever
your driving force was for doingit, and you've taught yourself,
and I think that that's such apowerful and also vulnerable
share of yours.
You know, reading is somethingthat we think of as sort of that
everyday skill, and I thinkpeople take it for granted that
(27:04):
they can do it, but actually, ifyou've never been taught it or
you don't know how to, thenreally it can.
It can affect your life in ahuge way, and I just want to
honor your approach and youryour attitude in that, and I
think there's a big lesson forlisteners.
You know, just because youweren't taught something doesn't
mean you can't find a way to dothat for yourself.
Tim (27:26):
Yeah, and, and you know I don't want I'm not throwing
anybody under the bus but Ithink a lot of it had to do when
I was younger, having ADHD.
It wasn't, it was Tim can't sitdown and learn there was there
and so there was no.
You know, we didn't have thetools that back then that we
(27:47):
have today to to understandcertain things and um and and
it's.
And again, it's okay.
Yeah, there's, it's.
Just figure out who you are.
Lean into it, because you know,it doesn't matter how many
billion people on this earth, weall have our thing.
Everybody has has their thingor things, or multiple things,
(28:09):
whatever it is, but we all havethat thing that makes us who we
are.
Lean it, it's okay.
You know, I had a conversation.
I had a conversation yesterdaywith with a, with a lady, and uh
, we, you know, we were doingthe pre-interview, like like you
and I had done, and she said oh, I hope this isn't the
interview.
I don't have makeup on, I don'tlook good.
I said.
I said, maybe you look, youlook beautiful.
(28:30):
I said, you know it.
I mean, look at me, this is,this is just my face, I'm not
putting makeup on anyway.
And she said well, you know,females have a different
expectation and I said, well,that's part of the problem.
That's part of the problem.
You know, we put so much valueon what other people think of us
(28:54):
.
If we just started to.
You know, I just met, I justmet you.
Why would you care if you, Ithink, if you got makeup on, if
I think you're pretty orbeautiful, whatever, and I think
I think you're, I think you aregreat, just however you are,
and just own it and come withthat, and people, people are
(29:19):
craving that authenticity andthat, that, that humanness.
That's just what I think,anyway, and and and I think we
as a society need to get to, toto get some hold on that idea of
why do we, why do I care whatsomebody else thinks, what I
(29:39):
look like, what I'm wearing,what have you?
It doesn't make, it doesn'tmake any difference on anything
anyway.
Harriet (29:44):
It's so true and I think it's a nice almost sort
round to we spoke earlier about.
Everybody has different fears,everybody has different things,
and fear of judgment was amassive one of mine.
And I laugh sometimes now whenI get dressed and I put so much
thought into my outfit and thenI walk out and see everybody
walking around wearing totallydifferent outfits and I'm not
(30:06):
there thinking, oh, shouldn'twear that, don't do that, we're
just out enjoying the day.
So I think you're right, we cansort of allow ourselves to get
consumed by a fear of judgment,a fear of rejection, perfection,
trying to be right all the time, whatever it might be.
And I think this couples nicelyinto what we started this
wonderful conversation with, isalso that element of bringing
(30:29):
the fun back.
You know I haven't quitefigured out how I'm speaking
about this, from live or virtualstages, so you've got it fresh
from me right now here, tim.
But I think that there's almostand again I have to be careful
how I word this, but there'salmost a disempowerment if you
become too addicted to personaldevelopment.
(30:51):
Now, let me just back that up alittle bit, because I am
obsessed with personaldevelopment and I think it is
absolutely can benefit and bringmonumental changes, fulfillment
, happiness to everybody.
That takes the time to whateverlanguage you want to use, work
on yourself, develop yourself,expand yourself.
So I'm absolutely in that camp.
(31:12):
But what I've started to see andwhat I went through in a
massive way myself you knowevery expert comes from a
different angle.
Right, you need to meditate,you need to journal, you need to
exercise, you need to visualize, you need to read, you need to
listen, you need to make sureyou're not using plastic bottles
.
You need to drink water, butnot fizzy water, normal water.
Right, I could just keeplistening.
(31:34):
Brush your teeth.
All of all of these, thesedifferent things in different
areas, whether it's for theenvironment, whether it's for
yourself, whether it's for yourhealth, whether it's for your
family, your business.
There's so many things that wecan be doing, and I don't know
about anybody else, but Iactually found I was starting to
get more stressed and almostput myself down, self-sabotage
(31:55):
myself in a bigger way, becauseI became so obsessed with
needing to be the person thatdid all of those things and I
think it's just remembering thatwhere is the area of most
importance?
Like you spoke to that ladyyesterday that had a fear of
judgment.
You know that's showing up inher everyday life.
Focus in that area right now.
(32:16):
I think having thatconversation with you was
probably a real light bulb,insightful moment for her.
And if she took that moment toreflect, as we spoke about
earlier, to go inside and thinkabout what you've just shared
and, slowly but surely, keepseeding that ease of letting it
go, of not worrying what otherpeople think, of understanding
(32:38):
that you'll naturally care whatsome people think, but who are
you giving the mic to?
Whose opinion are you reallylistening to?
And if we just focus in like aone or two particular areas of
our life at a time and justremember to enjoy that process
rather than becoming so consumedand trying to get everything
right all the time, I thinkyou'll find that your
(32:58):
progression is actually faster.
But it's also and this is moremeaningful so much more
enjoyable and so much more easyto continue with if you do it
that way.
What are your thoughts on that,tim?
Tim (33:11):
I 100% agree with everything that you just said,
and, as I'm listening to you,I'm thinking, you know, for you
and my perspective, right, Ilove your voice, I love it and
the power that you have when youspeak.
It's I mean not just here, butyou know, when you're on stage,
(33:31):
or you know the the things thatI've seen you say, that it, it,
it.
For me it's overwhelming.
I mean, you've, you've got suchpower, and you've obviously
developed that, as you know, asyour career has gone on, but
there's, you've you've probablyalways had that in you, right?
I mean, I would think, I wouldthink that, because there's I
(33:55):
mean it again I love therethere's just something,
something that's there, and howdid you, how did you develop
that, though?
Was that something that wasencouraged?
Was that something that thatyou that you know again, people
that you care about said youknow, harriet, you've got
something here.
Harriet (34:16):
Being honest, I think when I was younger, I was told
that I was either going to be afamous actress, the prime
minister, or I was going to runa brothel.
Tim (34:28):
You know, harriet, I'm not sure which one's worse, which
one's better um.
Harriet (34:35):
So yeah, I had an interesting uh projection there
of what I'd become, but I thinksuffice to say, especially when
it came, I think everyonethought I was going to be on
stage, like even from ayoungster.
I loved, loved, performing,singing, telling stories to the
group.
So I think it was very obviousthat I was going to be on stage.
(34:56):
But nobody, at least of allmyself, had any idea that it
would be as a as a publicspeaker, and in fact my family
and myself had absolutely noidea what this, this world oh no
right, you know, were you thesame oh yeah, yeah, they still
don't.
Tim (35:15):
Um, I'm not sure I'm, I don't say I'm not sure I do, but
but you know, they definitelydon't I'm still heavily learning
, but I now understand a littlebit more.
Harriet (35:24):
And again, I think this is really important, because
sometimes you know, if peoplesay, I want to become an
international speaker or I wantto become an author, whatever it
might be, sometimes you getresistance from loved ones and
from family members oh, I don'tthink you can do that.
Oh, no, that's not a greatcareer and it doesn't mean it's
true, it just means they don'thave experience in it.
(35:44):
So I would ask everyone just topause and again, think for
yourself, but also go to someonewho's doing the thing that you
want to do and have aconversation with them, because
it is possible.
But it might be that you needcertain insights, certain
know-how, certain skill, etcetera, et cetera, and really,
for me, that's what it was.
That was the original question,tim, you know.
(36:05):
Did you know that you were goingto become that?
And then, how did you?
Well, I was running a care home.
I was in a completely differentworld and I got to that point,
you know, I think, like many.
One day I was just sitting atmy desk and I this the tears and
I mean like ugly tears mascaradown my face, snot dripping out
my nose like smoothing tears andI just realized enough is
(36:32):
enough.
I can't do this anymore.
I'm not enjoying it, I'm nothappy, I don't feel valued.
Everything is a paperwork tickbox system rather than true
person centered care.
And I just had enough.
So I actually saw a littleadvert that said do you want
more positivity, do you wantmore flexibility, do you want to
be your own boss?
And I just said yes.
I was the most naive Tasmaniandevil running a million miles
(36:53):
towards something that I had noidea what it was.
I just knew it felt good and Ineeded to get away from what I
was currently doing, and thatwas actually for network
marketing, but of course, withinnetwork marketing.
I then found public speaking, Ifound personal development and
I just absolutely committedmyself to events, programs,
mentors, courses that allowed meto develop the skill.
(37:17):
So I would say, yes, I was anatural speaker, but also now
I'm a very skillful speaker.
When you put talent and work,effort, energy together, that's
when you become an unstoppableand impactful speaker.
Tim (37:32):
Yeah, and I'm glad you said that, because to be good at
anything it takes work.
It's not a you know, at leastfor most people it takes work.
It's not something that's justgoing to happen overnight.
You may have some talent to it,but to be good at it it takes
work.
It takes practice, talent to it, but to be good at it.
It takes work, it takes practice, and you know, that's that, I
(37:57):
think, is also something thatthat, especially from the
younger professional perspective, they need to to understand and
embrace that just because youdon't get it the first or second
time doesn't mean you shouldquit.
It means you should lean intoit.
It means you should try and andpractice more or or find a
different way to go about doingit.
Don't quit.
Harriet (38:14):
Work harder.
Yes, say it louder for thepeople at the back.
You pick up your phone and youcan have nearly anything
delivered to you either the sameday or the next day, or
certainly within a short amountof time.
You can order anything you want, you can connect, you can learn
(38:37):
, you can do so much instantlyfrom the devices that we have
around us that I think sometimes, especially younger generations
, forget the process, forget thesteps, and I know it's a little
bit cliche, but I'm going tosay it loudly and proudly yes,
set that goal.
Yes, have that vision.
Yes, have that mountaintopachievement that you're excited
(38:58):
to do, but please immerseyourself in the process, step by
step, the journey up themountain, the views, the rivers
that you cross, the people thatyou meet, whatever it might be.
Just hold that vision, butimmerse yourself in the
day-to-day steps and theday-to-day process.
Tim (39:15):
Yeah, it's so important and , and you said, the people that
you meet, I say I think it's.
You know, we're so in intechnology is so ingrained in
everything that we do.
And I had this conversationyesterday with that same same
lady.
You know, since I haven't beenteaching, I miss that
(39:38):
interpersonal relationship.
I mean I do five or six of zoomcalls or these types of things
a day, which is great.
I'm talking to people and I'mmeeting people.
You know it's great.
But I miss shaking somebody'shand, I miss, I miss sitting
down, having a coffee or havinglunch or breakfast, and you know
those types of conversationsand what we have to understand
(40:00):
that it doesn't matter whatindustry you get into, it's
people, it's relationships, it'sthe connections AI, this AI
that it's all good, it's allwell, but at the end of the day,
it's still.
It's the connections AI, thisAI that it's all good, it's all
well, but at the end of the day,it's still going to be about
people, it's still going to beabout the relationships, it's
still going to be about thosepersonal connections and we
cannot forget about that.
Harriet (40:21):
I so so agree, and there's an expression that I
think is really true it's notwhat you know, it's who you know
.
But I think if you can couplethe two, then, uh yes, you're
onto a winning path, but again,that's a process in itself.
As you say um, I'm sure you'rethe same, tim.
You know you open your, yourFacebook or your Instagram and
you are bombarded with coldmessages of people pitching, but
(40:45):
then you also are.
You also have people that opena conversation, that start a
dialogue and allow a space for arelationship to build.
And I've never seen results orinstant shifts from meeting
somebody in one moment andhaving that first initial
conversation, but in time,through building relationships,
(41:07):
I've seen doors open in places Iwould have thought were
impossible.
So I think relationships are soimportant, but it's bringing
value, love, patience and whatyou said earlier no expectation
to the meeting.
Tim (41:25):
Right and that's what works for me.
And you know, I think if youdon't have to, everybody has
their own way of doing things.
But understand that it'srelationships, it doesn't really
matter.
And you know you use the term.
I believe it's lead with love.
What does that mean for you?
Harriet (41:49):
What does that mean for you?
So Lead With Love is actuallyour logo and for people watching
, not listening, I'm trying toshow a little.
I've got it tattooed on areminder, but it's also our logo
.
So it's a heart with a littlearrow at the bottom pointing
into the heart.
And, essentially, lead WithLove is a breakdown of our
entire conversation.
(42:09):
So, first of all, it starts withyourself.
Lead with love for you.
You know, as we said earlier,you're the number one in every
single area of your life.
If you can give yourself thatlove for all of you Listeners,
make sure you heard that All ofyou, not just the wonderful,
amazing in the spotlight parts,but all of you, the bits that
make mistakes, the bits thatmess up, the bits that are still
(42:32):
learning.
If you can lead with love forall of who you are and keep
expanding, then of course thatwill naturally ripple out.
And then the obvious lead withlove for your family, for your
friends, for your localcommunity, for your customers,
for your team, for whoever youmeet in the streets.
And then, of course, at thebigger level, lead with love
from your stages, lead with lovewherever you are, lead with
(42:54):
love for our environment, forhumanity, for the universe.
So it kind of starts with anintrospective view, but it's
really just walking and leadingand especially speaking with
love, kindness and compassionfor all.
Tim (43:08):
Yeah, that's amazing and I really like that.
It's not just from a businessperspective and I think we get
so caught up in that.
You know, even from thecoaching business and
self-development business, likeyou said, that we forget about
some of the most important parts.
To me, the most important partof our life is our personal life
(43:29):
.
It's our personal relationships, it's our, you know, our friend
group, our spouse, our family.
You know, those types of thingsare way more important, at
least from my perspective, thanthan the business side.
Now, I get it, I understandthere, you got to have both.
But if we're not happy in one,we're not going to be happy in
(43:49):
the other and we can be happy athome and not happy at work.
Harriet (44:03):
But it's very rare to be happy at work if we're not
happy at home.
It's so true, and that's one ofour most meaningful connections
and spaces, isn't it?
So it's immensely important andI think sometimes it's
especially that with, likefamily and friends, sometimes
that's the bit that gets missed,and I'm really talking about in
a healthy manner.
I'm not talking about peoplethat just say yes to everything
(44:23):
and people please and are alwaysdoing for others.
I really mean leading in thatexample, being able to say no,
being able to, to set boundaries, but also, of course, leading
with love and sometimes havingthose tougher conversations.
We talk about speaking withconfidence.
That's not just from live andvirtual stages, that's in your
everyday life, and I reallybelieve some of the
(44:47):
conversations I've had with myhusband if we hadn't had them, I
believe it would have led downa totally different path and we
might not have been together.
But because we led with lovefor ourselves, understood who we
were and what we wanted, andthen were able to communicate
that with love and understandingto each other, without
expectation, without trying tocontrol, just an open
(45:07):
conversation, it's completelyshifted the dynamic that we have
in our marriage and I believethat we're much happier because
of our communication and beingable to speak up.
So it's truly important, anddon't just think about doing it
for you or doing it for yourbusiness.
Do it for those around you.
Tim (45:23):
Around you Exactly.
You know it's so important.
And you know another example Itell people I don't want, yes,
people around me, I want peoplethat are going to shoot me
straight.
And you know, as I was drivingup it's, it's about a 12 hour
drive from where I live to tosee the kids.
That's the time when I I spenta lot of time on the phone
(45:47):
because I can talk and drive andit's not taking away from some
other things.
And I was talking to my bestfriend and he's in the process
of he's got a business.
He's still working the business, but he's not sure if he wants
to sell it or if he wants tobranch off.
So we've been having thoseconversations and I told him one
(46:11):
of the things that he was doing.
I said, dude, that's, that's,that's a horrible idea, that's
not a good idea.
Don't do that.
And I told him, I asked him whyhe was thinking it and I told
him why it wasn't a good idea.
And he was so thankful becauseeverybody else has been telling
him it's.
It was a good idea to do.
When it would have been,without looking at from the
(46:34):
perspective that I gave him, itwould have been a disaster.
So you know you've got to havepeople in your inner circle that
are willing to shoot youstraight and say look, dude,
you're doing it wrong, youmessed up over here.
You need to need to go makeamends, um, or or whatever.
It's okay to have those peoplein your life that's important to
have those people in your life.
(46:55):
It really is so I completelyagree.
Harriet (46:59):
Sounds like you're.
Tim (46:59):
You're a good friend to him in that moment well, I, I try,
and you know he's, he'sdefinitely done the same for me,
and you know, as of others, andand just like you said in your
marriage, you know what I lovemy wife dearly, but I don't want
her to just agree and not.
I mean, that doesn't serveanybody, because all that does
is build resentment, you know.
(47:21):
But it really builds resentmenton both sides because, okay,
you're just going to agree witheverything I say I, you know,
that's it.
No discussion, no, nothing.
I can do whatever I want.
That's, that's not, that's notlife.
Harriet (47:35):
So you, know, and often if they are just agreeing with
everything.
It's, I mean, I'm sure thatcouples or I would hope that
couples can agree on a lot.
But you're right, we're twodifferent human beings existing
in the same space, so naturallythere's going to be differences,
different opinions, differentthoughts.
So, yes, I do believe it'sreally important to to voice
(47:56):
those and actually I, I thinkyou can see, sometimes you know,
I've worked with with leadersthat I I respect, that I admire,
but once I've been with themfor a certain amount of time, I
can sort of see you've neverbeen challenged, you always get
your own way.
And it's interesting thepitfalls that we can fall into
by always needing to be the onethat's right or by not enjoying
(48:19):
being challenged by others.
And actually being challenged,as long as you can stay calm,
understanding and receive it,can be one of the most powerful
accelerations within yourjourney.
Tim (48:31):
Exactly, exactly.
So part of that requireseverybody put their ego aside.
Harriet (48:44):
And that is definitely easier said than done.
Tim (48:47):
Way easier said than done.
But again, if you, I think, ifyou approach it, you know, from
the lead with love idea, itmakes it a lot easier because
it's you know.
I explain it.
It's not about me, you know,it's about the collective.
What's best for everybody,what's best for the family,
(49:09):
what's best for the relationship, what's best for the family,
what's best for the relationship, what's best for the business,
what's best for the team,whatever it is?
You know, sometimes it may bewhat's best for you, but
sometimes it's not and you'vegot to be okay with that.
Harriet (49:19):
Yeah, yeah, and I think it's being able to choose.
You know, you and I both speakabout speaking up, sharing,
speaking up with confidence,saying what's on your mind, and
maybe this is another podcastfor another time.
But I think the best speakersand the best communicators are
also the ones that know when notto speak, Exactly when to just
(49:39):
listen.
And you know, again, it's acommon quote, but choosing your
battles and I was somebody,especially with my feistiness,
my fire inside.
You know I needed to get myopinion out and I needed people
to hear me.
I needed people to know what'swrong, what's right, and it
wasn't even necessarily what waswrong or right, it was just in
my opinion.
(50:01):
So you know, you said about thelead with love.
It's no coincidence that it'sthere on my wrist and it's very
much a tangible tool for me nowthat I look at it.
I place my thumb on it Ifsomeone's saying something or
I'm in a disagreement, but it'snot.
I don't need to be involved inthis battle, or they're not
looking for support.
They don't want my feedback inthe moment.
Instead of trying to have thatfight, instead of forcing we
(50:24):
spoke earlier about thedifference between forcing and
allowing, or forcing andchoosing to do something.
You know, I found that so oftennow in life.
I'm able just to take thatbreath, sit back and just be and
use my energy in focuses whereit matters, where it serves,
(50:46):
where it's more helpful, and tonot spend the next day or two
days going oh my God, I can'tbelieve they said this, they did
that, but actually just justputting your energy into into
something that serves in themoment.
So, yes, speak up, but alsoallow yourself to not need to
speak up all the time.
Tim (50:58):
Exactly Well, harry, thank you so much for spending some
time with us today.
Where can people find with youand connect with you and and and
work with you?
Harriet (51:06):
I am on all the socials , so Instagram, facebook I
invite you to find me, harrietBratt, drop into my inbox, share
an insight that you've takenfrom this podcast or ask any
questions.
Just connect with me.
And, of course, my website isHarriet Bratt dot com, where
there is also a free masterclasson mastering the five pillars
of public speaking.
And, tim, I just want to saythank you, thank you for a
(51:29):
wonderful conversation.
Thank you to all of yourspeaking and, tim, I just want
to say thank you, thank you fora wonderful conversation, thank
you to all of your listeners and, again, thank you for this
platform that you've created tosupport and help others.
Tim (51:37):
I really do appreciate it.
I love the conversation.
I'll put all those links in theshow notes and again for
listeners out there searchHarriet out.
She is phenomenal, harriet out,she is phenomenal Again.
Harriet, I love your voice, andthat means it's not just your
(51:58):
voice, it's what you say and howyou say it, and you are a true
gem.
Thank you so much.
Harriet (52:01):
I appreciate you and I appreciate your heart, Ted.
Let's continue rising together.
Tim (52:06):
Absolutely.
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