May 19, 2025 • 48 mins
What do a sports statistician, a leadership coach, and a master storyteller have in common? A powerful understanding of what truly makes communication effective.
In this episode of Speaking With Confidence, I welcome Kirk McCarley, executive career coach, ESPN talent statistician, and self-proclaimed "wealthy man" (thanks to his relationships, not his bank account). Kirk shares how his behind-the-scenes role in live broadcasting taught him lessons that apply far beyond the sports world, especially about presence, preparation, and the power of listening.
From stories of maraschino cherry theft to lessons from a beloved neighbor, this episode dives deep into what it really means to be a powerful communicator. It’s not about saying more—it’s about listening better, slowing down, and connecting with intention.
In this episode, you’ll learn:
- Why active listening skills are your #1 communication tool
- How technology is killing connection, and how to fight back
- What leadership communication looks like in daily life
- Why “being present” is more powerful than being polished
- How overcoming imposter syndrome starts with preparation, not perfection
Kirk’s take on communication is both grounding and inspiring, reminding us that our greatest influence doesn’t come from speaking louder, but from listening more deeply.
Connect with Kirk:
theseedsowercoach.com
kirkmccarleyauthor.com
https://www.linkedin.com/in/kirk-mccarley-1bbba950/
https://www.instagram.com/kirkmccarley/
https://www.facebook.com/KirkMcCarleyTheSeedSowerCoach/
Visit TimNewmanSpeaks.com to grab your free resource, The Top 21 Challenges for Public Speakers and How to Overcome Them, and start building the confidence you deserve.
Want to be a guest on Speaking With Confidence? Send Tim Newman a message on PodMatch
Speaking With Confidence
Formula for Public Speaking
Facebook
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Tim (00:08):
Welcome to Speaking with Confidence, a podcast dedicated
to helping you unlock the powerof effective public speaking.
I'm Tim Newman, a recoveringcollege professor turned
communication coach, and I'mthrilled to guide you on your
journey to becoming a powerfulcommunicator.
I want to thank each and everyone of you for your support.
It truly means the world to me.
Please visit timnewmanspeakscomto get your free ebook the Top
(00:31):
21 Challenges for PublicSpeakers and how to Overcome
them.
Today's guest is Kirk McCarley.
He is a husband, father andgrandfather.
He is also an executive, careerand leadership development
coach.
He has more than 30 years ofexecutive leadership experience
in both the public and privatesector environments.
(00:51):
Kirk has a solid reputation forfostering individual growth and
development beyond the client'sexpectations.
As an executive and careercoach, he focuses on desired
customer outcomes, predicatedupon the premise that the
individual already possesses theingredients for success.
He is also a talentstatistician for ESPN, an author
(01:13):
and a group exercise instructor.
Kirk, welcome to the show.
You are a busy, busy man.
Kirk (01:21):
I'm engaged, Tim.
Tim (01:22):
Thanks for hosting me this morning, oh no worries, and you
know we've got a lot in commonand I think that being engaged
is really the key to life and Ikind of want to get into that.
But first I want to talk aboutthe one thing that we have in
common that really warms myheart being a grandfather.
(01:43):
I love being a dad, but to methere's nothing better than
being a grandfather.
Kirk (01:49):
And the grandkids were here for about five days.
They left yesterday, three ofthem, and it's an opportunity
for me to just pester them, andthey dish it right back at their
poppy.
Tim (02:01):
Yeah, I love that and you know, for me, I wish I could be
around them nonstop for about aweek and then go home, take a
nap and then, you know, haveabout a week recovery and then
come back at it.
But you know, there's there.
Really, to me is nothing,nothing better than being a
(02:21):
grandfather and watching themgrow and helping them and
teaching them.
It's so much better than being agrandfather and um and watching
them grow and helping them andteaching them.
It's so much better than beinga parent, because you don't
really have all the the theparenting responsibilities when
you're done with them.
Kirk (02:34):
Here they are.
Here they are.
They're yours.
Tim (02:35):
See you soon.
Good luck, don't mind all thesugar that I gave them, that's
right.
But we, you know, again, wehave a lot, like I said, a lot
(03:07):
in common.
And one of the things that kindof struck me, you know, after
we talked the other day, is yourprevious blog posts and you,
you wrote one, and I'm going wayback to 2019.
You, you wrote about successyou know what success and how
you define success and you toldtwo.
You told stories about twoindividuals that were important
in your life and it really kindof, you know, made me think
about on a deeper level, becauseI think success differently
than a lot of other people, butit really made me think about on
a deeper level, because I thinksuccess differently than a lot
of other people, but it reallymade me think about it on a much
(03:29):
deeper level than that.
And how did you come up withthis idea that success is more
than?
Obviously, it's more than money, but it's even more than just
being happy.
Kirk (03:45):
It's even more than just being happy.
I think contentment is thefirst word that comes to mind.
And those two individuals.
One of them was my backdoorneighbor growing up, mrs Clark,
and she was like a grandmotherfigure to me.
But I would go to her house,walk in, we would listen to Paul
Harvey on the radio.
She didn't have TV and eatVienna sausages out of the can,
(04:09):
but she would clip and handprune the edging of her yard
during the heat of a Texassummer.
And the dogs in theneighborhood, they roamed freely
.
In those days we didn't havelease laws.
They loved her.
Everybody was attracted to MrsClark, but she just had this
(04:30):
life of contentment.
She knew the history of theneighborhood.
She knew what everybody wasdoing, not so much a busybody
but just their history.
She built relationship andagain exuded joy.
She would walk to church six toeight blocks.
She didn't have a car.
(04:50):
She'd walk to the grocery storeabout another five blocks.
We'd pick her up every now andthen but she just exuded a
quality individual.
I termed her to be successful.
And that's in the heat of Texasright.
Tim (05:02):
I termed her to be successful, and that's in the
heat of Texas right.
Kirk (05:05):
That's in the heat of Texas.
It was 100 degrees and shewould go in between 2 and 5 in
the afternoon but then come backout in the evening when it was
only 98.
Tim (05:16):
God bless her.
God bless her.
But you know, I really thinkyou hit something there, the
whole idea of connection, and Ithink we miss out on today
because I think back to mychildhood.
I had people in my neighborhoodwhere I could just walk in
their house and you know, wedon't have that really today and
(05:50):
I think sometimes we probablyhave to and should do that, but
that takes away some of thatconnection.
Kirk (05:52):
growing up I remember all those neighbors.
Tim (05:54):
Yeah.
Kirk (05:54):
The Richardsons across the street.
I'd walk in their house andtake maraschino cherries out of
the refrigerator.
Mr Corn across the street, hewas a fireman.
Tim (06:17):
We were aghast when his garage burned down one year at
Christmas.
Mrs Payne across the streetmusic teacher.
I can go through the whole andthe need for connections for us
to become successful with herlife.
However, she chose to live itas opposed to trying to think
(06:48):
about what society has definedas success.
You know money, status, thosetypes of things and understand
that there's different ways todefine it and live our lives.
Kirk (07:02):
I'm a wealthy man and I'm not by virtue of monetary or
possessions, but it's myconnections and my relationships
and the variety of tribes thathave allowed me to be a part of
them, to come in and enter intotheir lives, and new tribes are
(07:23):
being formed all the time.
I did a bike ride in Lake City,florida, this past Sunday and
met a woman who again elderly,but she was the race director.
She happened to have some spareburritos from some of the
people who had finished earlierTim.
It was the best burrito I everhad in my life.
It was a Cuban guy who hadfinished earlier Tim.
(07:44):
It was the best burrito I everhad in my life.
It was a Cuban guy who had madeit and he included plantains as
part of the ingredient, and justgetting to know this woman who
I'd never met before, I'm goingto count her in my acquaintance
list.
Another one, then.
More riches for me in terms ofthat connection.
Tim (08:05):
And if we take that a step further, you know, when I say
you're a busy man, and I thinkthat's that's kind of ingrained
in who you are, to be busy, tobe involved in many different
things, to make theseconnections to you know to be I
wouldn't necessarily sayfulfilled you may say that for
yourself but to to try differentthings and to build all those
(08:28):
other different connections.
I mean to expand your life andto expand that network and those
connections is put that way.
Kirk (08:37):
Today is a perfect day for me.
I taught a spinning class at 6am.
I'm here with you now.
Later on I've got a coachingclient to meet with after we get
done with this call, and thenafter that I'm on the road to
Tallahassee to go work collegebasketball this evening.
(08:57):
So I incorporate all thesevarious elements of life.
I call it a perfect day.
Tim (09:05):
Well, I'm glad you brought up that you're heading to
Tallahassee.
I was going to ask you if youhad a game coming up.
This is where I really want tospend a little bit of time here,
because I'm fascinated with oneof the things that you do and
your story and how you gotstarted with this the whole
statistician gig that you havewith ESPN.
Let's get into that and talk alittle bit about that, and not
(09:29):
only how you got started in it,but the role that it has in
number one communication and howwe as listeners and viewers
take in an event, but thelessons it can teach us in our
own personal lives in terms ofinterpersonal and professional
(09:49):
communications.
Kirk (09:52):
Well, to kind of get started with it, I'll preface it
by saying I'm a dork, I'm anerd, I love numbers, I love
arithmetic and math, being ableto make a calculation.
But I was also an athlete and Iplayed sports.
I played basketball, but what Iwas really intrigued with was
(10:13):
statistical.
Tim (10:14):
That's a hard word for both of us Statistical.
Kirk (10:18):
Statistical aspect of sports, not just basketball,
baseball, baseball in particular, because there are so many
metrics that go into that.
Well, I grew up in a day whenwe didn't have electronic
calculators, so it was longhanddivision to figure things out,
and I got pretty good at that,to the point I can memorize that
(10:42):
14 to 24 was 58.3 percent and14 to 25 was 56 percent.
So what am I going to do withthis skill?
Tim (10:52):
Well.
Kirk (10:53):
I still had dreams of playing in the NBA.
That didn't happen, but went onto college and happened to room
with some people who were, witha guy in particular who was a
broadcast communication major,another guy across the hallway
who was an IT guy, and then athird guy who just had a general
(11:13):
knowledge of sports in general.
So we would sit around andwatch the baseball game of the
week Kurt Getty and Tony Kubekand we would critique what they
would say on the air oh, that'san obvious statement, kurt.
Tony, you can do better thanthat.
And so we would talk over them.
What was that going to parlayitself into?
(11:36):
Well, one of our friends becamea talent broadcaster and in 1989
, when he started broadcastingcollege football in what was
then the Southwest Conference,he asked me to be his talent
statistician and that's when myjourney on that ride began.
So this is season 36 for me.
(11:57):
We moved over to ESPN in 1996.
He has since gone back.
He's a professor now ofbroadcasting and media
communications at school.
I continue to work for ESPN.
Our other friend across thehall is in his 41st season now.
I believe it is as thestatistician for the Dallas
(12:22):
Cowboys.
Tim (12:27):
Wow, wow.
And so let's just hone in onsomething before we go any
further Relationships andconnections.
Right there, right, I mean,you're roommates and you had
something in common.
One goes off to do somethingand say you know what I'm going
to call my buddy?
This would be a great gig forhim.
We could work together.
If you don't have thatconnection, maybe we're not
sitting here today.
Kirk (12:49):
Absolutely, and in fact, even in our everyday
conversations, statistics enterinto it.
The fourth member of our groupturned 65 a couple of days ago.
We all wished him a happy 65thbirthday, but we broke 65 down
into congratulations on being 13for the fifth time oh, that's
(13:09):
funny, that's funny.
Tim (13:14):
So, yeah, we won't even, won't, even I'm I'm not there
yet, but but no, uh, that'sawesome.
So so talk about what you doand the entire process Because,
again to me it's fascinating.
For anybody who hasn't done it,it's a lot harder than it looks
(13:36):
, it's a lot more difficult,there's a lot more that goes
into it.
And, kirk, I think I told youthe story the Baltimore Orioles
I don't know if they still do it, but they used to have the
thing where you could paywhatever it was, to go in a
booth and they would give you abunch of stats and you could
broadcast an inning, they wouldrecord it for you and you could
(13:57):
take it home.
I thought I could do it.
There's just no way.
There's so many numbers,there's so many other things
that are going on, and baseballto me is relatively easy because
it's slow moving.
Now you're talking aboutbasketball and football, where
things are happening really,really quick and you've got to
process information.
You as a statistician, has toprocess the information, get it
(14:18):
over to the play-by-play andcolor guy.
Kirk (14:23):
The preparation and I want to give a shout out to the
talent, the broadcasters, thecolor analyst, the homework they
do.
But the knowledge they carryand what they have to
familiarize themselves withbefore they go into a broadcast
is just incredible.
And where they really earntheir paychecks is during the
(14:44):
third quarter of a game.
That is a 25 point blowout.
They've got to carry that tothe end.
There's not people listening.
They've moved to anotherchannel.
Now they're not watchinganymore.
And then's when they have tocome up with the stories that
continue to make that broadcastlive and make it meaningful for
(15:04):
the poor souls who are stillthere, glued to it, watching it
and listening to it.
So shout out to those guys.
First of all, I'm the silentpartner.
As a talent statistician, Isupply information to whoever is
talking.
So what is going to enhancewhat they're discussing at that
point in time?
(15:25):
Obviously, you've got to haveinformation that's going to keep
the watcher, the listener,glued to it.
That was a 12-yard run, firstdown.
That's the second three-pointshot they've hit in a row.
They're now 10 of 10 from thefree throw line, those kinds of
things.
I'll hand cards and informationor point some things out, but
(15:47):
I'll also include some thingsthat are maybe not showing up on
live stat broadcast, and thatis this is the fifth run in
basketball of this game.
Let's say, florida State, whoI'm doing tonight, has had a
10-0 run, has had a 12-0 run,but their opponent, whoever that
may be, has had runs thatthey've owned of 7-0 and 15-2.
(16:12):
So what that's painting apicture of is a game that has
been a series of runs.
It has not been smooth, it'sbeen erratic and it's had its
ebbs and flows.
To give a feel to the viewer ofwhat's really happening there.
So my job is to enhancewhatever is taking place for
(16:33):
those guys and allow them toappear even more intelligent
than they already are.
Tim (16:40):
And how much preparation for you as a statistician goes
into it?
Or do you just go in and justwhatever plays out plays out, or
do you do research on certainplayers and look for trends that
you think may be coming orthings of that nature?
Kirk (17:01):
So we've got a tough contest tonight.
We've got Miami coming intoTallahassee to play Florida
State.
Miami has not had a good season.
They're 6-19 this year.
Laren Yeager, their formercoach, resigned.
They were a Final Four teamjust a couple of years ago, as
you may recall year.
(17:27):
They've got one player who hasbeen key.
They've had a key injury thathas taken place.
So what are we going to build tomake this game interesting,
make it competitive?
It may be a storyline of whatare they doing to prepare for
next season.
What are we going to seetonight?
Who are some players that havemaybe not seen a lot of time up
to this point?
I'm going to acquaint myselfwith those kinds of things to be
(17:48):
prepared.
Then you've got watch list.
There's a certain player thatmay be 10 points away from a
thousand points for the career.
We're going to track him, thosekinds of things to give a game,
which otherwise may not be thatimpactful, a little bit of
flavor, variety to keep someoneengaged.
(18:09):
Florida State is stillpotentially a tournament team.
They're maybe coasting on thebubble right now at 15-10.
So what have they finished inrecent seasons?
What can we look for as the ACCseason winds down at this point
in time.
So I'm looking at those kindsof things.
I get game notes, I study them,I come in as prepared as I can
(18:33):
be and more often than not thepreparation goes for naught
because something elseunexpected has taken place.
Tim (18:43):
Well, I would say that preparation is whether it's used
or not, preparation is one ofthe number one.
It's one of the things that wecan control and if we don't
prepare, that will definitelyshow.
So I don't know thatpreparation is for naught.
It's your knowledge, you've gotthat Nobody can ever take's
(19:08):
it's, it's it's going back tocoaching.
Kirk (19:10):
It's like a coaching meeting.
Well, start where I'll start,with a client.
What would you like to focus ontoday?
And I've got a series of thingsthat we may touch on.
Very rarely do we get what I'veprepared for.
It's something else, but it'sthe preparation and the idea of
being ready.
Tim (19:28):
Yes, yeah, so so do you have conversations with the, the
on-air talent, prior to orprior to the event, so let's say
, the games today?
Have you spoken with thembefore today, or were you just
talk to them briefly before theevent and kind of get their
(19:48):
ideas of what they're lookingfor?
How does that process work?
Kirk (19:54):
In basketball, baseball, softball putting football aside
for right now.
I know the guy I'm working withtonight.
I've worked with him a time ortwo.
Good guy, very comfortable.
I'm LinkedIn with him and I'llask him is there anything in
particular that you want me towatch for for you?
(20:14):
What can I do to enhance theexperience for you?
And I'll get a few notes fromhim.
I'll concentrate and focus onthat.
Football is a little bit moreinvolved with that.
We work the same crew week inand week out generally, and kind
of an example of how that worksmy cousins is the talent
(20:35):
broadcaster that I work with incollege and professional
football.
We had the Fiesta Bowl PennState and Boise State and Boise
State, coming into that game,had an incredible statistic of
when they rushed for 40 carries.
They had one premier runningback, ashton, gentry, gentry.
But aside from him, when theyrushed for more than 40 times in
(20:59):
a game, they would haveremarkable results.
Well, they lost the fiesta Bowlto Penn State 31-14.
At the end of the game Ipointed to Mike 40 rushes.
We looked at each other,shrugged our shoulders.
Tim (21:14):
We'll live to fight another day, exactly exactly, and you
bring up football as a, forexample, Super Bowl was a couple
weeks ago and it wasn't nearlythe game that I think anybody
thought it was going to be, andwhen the I've forgotten the
player's name from Philadelphiawho intercepted the pass and
scored a touchdown on it, and hewas the first person to score
(21:40):
on their birthday score atouchdown in the Super Bowl on
their birthday.
Okay, but what struck me wasthat they number one, that they
had that and that the only otherperson that was playing, from
my understanding, that had abirthday that day was Saquon
Barkley, and so I think thatthey were.
That was a piece of informationthat they thought that they
(22:01):
were going to end up using, butit got used on somebody else.
Kirk (22:06):
Sometimes I'll get lucky and extract something like that,
but somebody else on the crewgot lucky that day and they
tracked that and they shared itand the producer bought it and
they passed it on to the talentand it was announced on air.
Tim (22:23):
But see, for people that may not necessarily be, you know
that, into sports and andlistening and watching on TV and
those types of things, that tome is something that is is is
number one.
It's fascinating and criticalfor telling the story of the
event and getting peopleinvested into listening, you
(22:45):
know, getting closer to the TVor turning it up or what have
you with the radio, and reallykind of making them feel the
event.
Kirk (22:56):
It makes it personal.
Yeah, and we feel thatconnection.
It's a warm feeling and this isa real person.
He has birthdays, besidesmaking millions of dollars as a
player and being in front ofmillions of people on television
.
Tim (23:14):
Right.
Kirk (23:14):
And not to mention the people that are watching it live
in the Superdome.
Tim (23:20):
So, during the game football, any game, it doesn't
really matter and things aregetting tight, what's the mood,
what's the back and forth interms of you and the talent in
terms of getting informationquickly or I don't want that
information, I want this howdoes that process work and does
(23:40):
it get heated, and how do youall deal with with those
emotions in the moment, knowingthat this is something that's
fast moving.
There's not time to talk aboutit, it's do it and get it out
because of the broadcastsometimes tim, there can be too
much information.
Kirk (24:01):
If it is an exciting game, the game is going to speak for
itself and you can over-talkthose events when maybe just
allowing somebody to drink it into hear the crowd noise On
radio.
We go through a lot ofpreparation as best we can so we
can have the crowd noise comingin to give that vibrancy to the
(24:25):
broadcast.
I remember this was years ago.
The too much information.
Chris Schenkel, who was awonderful broadcaster years and
years ago for college footballit was a Michigan State game and
a running back ran for a longtouchdown, 60 yards.
There was the crowd noise, thepause, the hesitation, and
(24:49):
Schenkel said and he did itagainst the wind, oh, it had
nothing to do with anything.
But it's lived in infamy, atleast in our minds.
Tim (25:05):
Oh my gosh.
Kirk (25:07):
You could have just let that happen.
Yeah, you've got the iconiccalls jack buck of ozzy smith.
Go crazy folks, go crazy.
Kirk gibson, the call on onthat home run joe buck with
David Freeze in the World Seriesagainst the Rangers and we will
see you tomorrow night.
(25:28):
Just that combination of theright things said at the right
time.
Yeah.
Tim (25:36):
And, like you said a lot of times, that's you know you
catch lightning in the bottleand you get lucky there, and
those are the things that liveon for forever and what people
actually maybe remember aboutthe game or the event.
Even if take Kirk Gibson as a,for example, you see him running
the bases, but what you reallyremember is that call.
(26:01):
You remember the sound, thewords in the announcers saying
those things and it's I can'tbelieve what I've just seen
Iconic, yeah, yeah.
So it's again.
This is is really fascinating.
And so how do how do thesethings kind of translate over
(26:22):
into, you know, the regularpeople world in terms of
communicating and sharinginformation in in a in a way
that let's just let's just takea business environment where you
know one person is counting oranother person to do something
(26:43):
so that they can do what theyneed to do.
How do we get people tounderstand number one, the
importance of connection andknowing how to actually
communicate with somebody in aparticular tone, using
particular words, with animportance of making sure that
things are getting done,importance of making sure that
things are getting done, Tim,when I coach people.
Kirk (27:08):
I'll preface it sometimes by saying we'll talk about
interviewing, for example, jobinterviewing.
When I speak to you, it maysound like I'm broadcasting a
game, so forgive me if it's likethat, because that gets it
built in my DNA.
It's been mostly a blessing,particularly with public
(27:34):
speaking, because I get likehours of osmosis just hearing
these talented people how theyspeak, how they pause, how they
hesitate, the vocabulary, thesynonyms they bring up are just
incredible.
But in the everyday world oneof the things that I've noticed
we don't allow enough time forquiet time, for pause, for
(27:55):
hesitation, and when I speakwith clients I've got to get
myself comfortable with the factI may be giving this person
five, 10, 30 seconds to processand we get uncomfortable with
that dead space.
But what I found more oftenthan not the person comes back
(28:15):
and says thank you for notpressuring me, for making me
feel relaxed, make me feelcomfortable, because so many
times I get into too big of ahurry and my mouth is speaking
faster than my brain can thinkand I stutter and I skip over
words and I get flustered withthat.
(28:38):
So, slowing down the pace, Ireally build that into it.
I've talked to people todayabout Dean Smith and the
four-corner offense.
They don't know what I'mtalking about because we have
shot clocks now in basketball.
But that was a strategy backthen to change the tempo, change
the rhythm, change the cadence.
Tim (29:00):
Well and it's funny that you say that because I do a lot
in the golf space and it wasbrought up to me a number of
years ago you know, if you watchhow Tiger Woods plays, he moves
very, very quickly from the teeto his next shot, but when he's
(29:20):
walking from, you know hisfairway shot to the green.
When he gets about 30 yardsaway from the green he slows his
pace down, slows his pace down,slows his heart rate down and
then really starts toconcentrate on making the putt
and reading the putt, because ofof how important you know the
heart rate is, how important youknow controlling nerves and
(29:44):
controlling movement really isin putting and, like you said,
the same thing goes with withcommunication.
Slow down, take a deep breathand think it through before you
just start spouting things offtiger applies some visualization
there as well the great golfinstructor instructor.
Kirk (30:04):
I believe it was Harvey Pinnock who taught Crenshaw.
Probably Tom Kite down inAustin would scold people for
using golf carts.
You need to walk the coursebecause you get a feel for it.
The contour and, like Tiger, asyou're getting close to the
ball for where you're going tohit your next shot, you get a
(30:25):
feel for what.
The topography is what the windfeels like, what the external
elements might be, as you beginto visualize in your mind what's
going to happen next.
Tim (30:40):
Yeah, and I think we could all take a page out of that book
in how we go about a lot ofthings that we do, especially
from the connection networking,interpersonal relationship
perspective, and take a stepback and don't be so quick to
judge and actually listen towhat other people are saying as
(31:01):
well.
Kirk (31:05):
I like to visualize where I am and my family, my friends.
They criticize me because Idon't use GPS.
I love a map, a paper map topull that out.
Where am I right now, spatiallyin the universe, in the world,
so to speak.
Where does this road lead to?
(31:27):
I look at the sun.
Where's the sun?
Right, that's to my right.
I'm headed north.
Well, I make a left turn.
I'm going to be headed west.
I'll pull out a compass everynow and then and people say, man
, you're pretty primitive.
How much wasted time is that?
Well, I'm going to see somethings perhaps that I would not
(31:51):
have seen otherwise.
But, more important, I heard anexpert, uh, on brain our brain
is at age ages talk about thisthe other day and said that maps
and not relying on gps is amajor um help as far as warding
off Alzheimer's and dementia andsome of those illnesses like
(32:11):
that, because you know whereyour place is.
So I'm lost half the time, tim,but I'm trying to fight off.
Fight off the aging brain.
Tim (32:25):
That's interesting.
I didn't know that, but youknow, um, maybe I'll get my.
You know, cut my wife a littlebit of slack, because, uh, even
with a GPS she gets lost.
Um, you know it's, it's, it's ablessing and a curse, I guess I
don't.
I don't know, but but the wholeidea of of map is, of having a
map, is fascinating because,again, you're right, most people
(32:48):
have no idea, number one, howto read a map or how to use a
map or what to even do with it.
Since we've gotten gps, it's,it's, it's crazy, and I think,
you know, from technology in theof itself, I think, has really
(33:09):
accelerated the whole dementia,alzheimer's paradigm, because
we've stopped doing a lot ofthings using our brains we watch
television, we play on thecomputer this, that and the
other thing, and we don't againactually interact like we used
to in the real world.
Kirk (33:32):
Well, first of all, this is wonderful.
You and I get to meet.
We're 500 miles away from eachother, but it's like we're
breaking bread just in remotelocations, right.
So the technology can be awonderful thing, but I was
having a discussion with somepeople earlier this week about
the onset of AI and I need tohave an understanding of it,
(33:57):
because that's what's happeningin the world.
But how far do you advance thator allow that?
And it's kind of like.
I think back to the Amish.
How did they decide?
This is where technology endsat this point.
I think they have a leader ofthe community that kind of
dictates that, but it's alwaysfascinating of that particular
(34:21):
segment of society how it wasdecided that they were going to
stop at this point.
This is okay, but this is not.
Tim (34:29):
Yeah, yeah, it's interesting.
I lived for a long time up inPennsylvania, just outside of
Amish country, in Lancaster, andnot truly, you know, when I
moved up there.
I still don't know that I trulyunderstand the culture, but not
truly understanding it, andwatching some of the things that
they did, I would think backand say it would be nice if we
(34:49):
could just do that all the time,you know.
And then I just get right backto you know, plowing right on
through and and and knockingstuff out.
So I think, part of it is is isreally being intentional with,
with how you live your life andhow you interact with others.
Yeah, because it can be done?
Kirk (35:13):
It can be, but it's decision points along the way.
What are you going to investyourself in and get involved in
with this now and whatnot?
I was talking to my wife theother day.
I told her.
I said I think men have a greatadvantage over women with
technology because we can stickour cell phones in our pockets.
(35:37):
Women, if they don't have apurse, don't tend to have
pockets in a lot of theirclothing.
It has to be on the top of thetable and when messages come up,
there it is.
I've got to check that.
So that contributes to thestatistic.
I heard the other day that theaverage person in America checks
their phone 144 times a day.
Tim (36:00):
Well, that doesn't surprise me at all.
I mean, I wouldn't be surprisedif it was higher than that.
I wouldn't be surprised if itwas higher than that.
So how do you coach people tobe present and not necessarily
be checking their phone whenyou're interacting with somebody
?
For me.
Kirk (36:36):
that's one of the things that truly elevates my blood
pressure almost immediately IfI'm having a conversation with
you and your phone goes off andyou stop the conversation and
you start checking your phone.
How do you coach people to trulybe present in that situation?
I think the Gaines couple, chipand Joanna, the fixer-upper.
They've got a restaurant it'spart of the Magnolia House
franchise down in Waco and oneof the rules that they establish
is cell phones.
They've got these pouches thatare in the booths or by the
tables where people sit aregoing to be deposited in there
(36:59):
when you sit down, because wewant you to enjoy your meal, but
we also want you to have aconversation with the person
you're with.
That's a ground rule that theyhave laid out and similarly, in
conversations, let's agree toturn off our cell phones right
now.
Is there anything that isreally necessary that you need
(37:21):
to take care of before we enterinto this meeting?
But I want to devote 100% of mytime to you for the next 60
minutes that we're going to meetand I hope that we can agree to
those terms going into it.
So it's establishing what thoseground rules are going to be
and if they're amenable toeverybody.
Tim (37:45):
Yeah, and I just think it's so important.
I think that that's a greatapproach.
It's if you're constantlychecking your cell phone, you
know, if you put this way, ifyou're having a 15 minute
conversation and you check yourcell phone five times, how, how
engaged are you actually intothe conversation and how much
are you actually taking, takingaway from from that?
(38:06):
If, once every three minutes,you've minutes, you've
disengaged and are not payingattention to it, I think people
need to truly understand whatthat does in terms of the
overall communication experience.
Kirk (38:23):
Yeah, it's saying to the other person you are of
secondary importance to amachine, right?
Basically, because I'm kind ofimprisoned by that to some
degree.
Before we had cell phones wehad regular phones.
Of course, I guess, landlines,landlines yeah, they're still
(38:44):
around here and there, they'restill around here and there.
But I would create a discipline.
If I was meeting with someoneand the landline would go off if
I hadn't set up a callforwarding, which I often
neglected to do.
They would hear it ring andthey say aren't you going to get
that?
I would say no, you're here,I'm here.
This is important, let's focuson that, right, and hopefully
(39:06):
that created a little bitgreater self-esteem for that
person that I was having achance to visit with.
Tim (39:13):
Yeah, and again, another great point, acknowledging
something that you know,whatever it is, it can wait.
You know I'm not perfect indoing it, but I do try really
hard, you know.
So I've got my phone set up somy wife and my kids have
different vibrations andringtones, and so you know, if
(39:37):
it's not one of those and I'm ina meeting, it doesn't really
matter, it's, it can wait.
If it's one of those otherspecial ringtones, depending on
where we're at in the meeting, Ijust let it go.
But I also tell my wife andkids I'm locked off during this
time.
So contact me if it's anemergency.
(39:59):
So I do try and put instrategies and tactics so that
it takes some, some of theimpulse away, because somebody
with ADD, adhd like me, thathappens.
It immediately diverts myattention and so we've got to
(40:20):
find ways to to reduce them.
Kirk (40:24):
In and of itself, I remember the days and probably
you do as well, tim.
The kids were younger and mywife and I would want to go out
for an evening, go to dinner, goto a movie.
We'd have a babysitter thatwould come over and we'd say
we're going to go eat at suchand such place.
Here's the number.
We're going to be at such andsuch movie theater If there's an
(40:46):
emergency.
Here's their number.
Call us if you need to, butotherwise don't call us.
We trust what you're doing andeverybody seemed to feel
comfortable with that.
Tim (40:58):
Yes.
Kirk (40:59):
And we had one episode the babysitter locked herself out
of the house and she had to goto the neighbor's house and call
us and get a hold of us.
That's a good story.
Now.
Tim (41:12):
It is because now, if we don't know what's going on every
two?
Minutes we're freaking out.
It's insane.
So again, you're involved in alot of different things and you
teach spinning classes.
Is that what it is, spinningclasses?
Kirk (41:31):
Spin classes.
Tim (41:32):
So are you this nice and this calm when you're coaching
spinning classes?
Because to me, if that were thecase, I'd probably just be kind
of pedaling along.
Oh, it's great, we're hangingout with Kirk for 45 minutes to
an hour.
Kirk (41:54):
How does a spinning class with Kirk actually go?
Well, tim, it kind of dependswho you are.
Okay, if you come in for thefirst time, it's going to be a
very welcoming, very encouraging, and if you've been in for the
50th time, it'll be the same way.
But I may pick on you just alittle bit.
I've got members of the classthat don't like certain
exercises, so what am I going todo?
I'm going to present them tothem.
(42:14):
So, david, who is one of themembers of the class he was
there today Dave, we're going todo some jumps, and Dave is
obstinate and says I'm not.
I said well, dave, you'redepriving yourself of one of the
great pleasures of this class.
I'm sorry to hear that.
And he'll yell it right back atme.
(42:35):
So there's some give and takeand we egg each other on, but
it's a blast.
I get paid money, tim, to yellat people at 6 am in the morning
.
What can be better?
It's great.
Tim (42:48):
Well, first off, god bless people being up at 6 am.
But that, to me, that's.
I need to get back into it.
That's how I used to be.
I would get up at 4.30, go tothe gym, go to the office, get
stuff done.
By the time people would startrolling in, I would already have
almost a full day of work beingdone.
(43:08):
That way I could then be freeto interact and talk to people
and stop in and they come in andsee me and those types of
things.
But to me, there's nothingbetter than getting up in the
morning and getting yourexercise in, getting that heart
rate going first thing in themorning and then going on about
your day.
Kirk (43:26):
Yeah, I don't like when the alarm goes off at five, but
once I've gotten up, gottenthere, done the class, all day
is still ahead of me.
I've got my workout in, I'mre-energized and ready for what
comes next.
Tim (43:41):
Yeah, and it's just so important.
Exercises number one is notonly so important for your
physical health.
What it does to your mentalhealth and all those other
extraneous benefits that you getfrom that afterwards Not just
talk about from the time thatyou're exercising, but the rest
of the day.
(44:01):
What that does physiologicallyfor you and your mental health
is phenomenal.
Just get up and go, do it.
Kirk (44:09):
Yeah, as I coach people, one of the most important things
is movement.
I hear people talking aboutbeing stuck.
How do you get unstuck?
Well, the first thing you domentally and physically move,
that's going out for a walk,going for a bike ride, going for
a run, going out for a walkgoing for a bike ride, going for
(44:35):
a run that's going to stimulatethose endorphins and maybe take
your brain to a different placethan it's been.
Oh, I know why I haven't beenable to do this, why I haven't
wanted to do it Right and takesyou down a path that's going to
be more rewarding and beneficialto you and for others as well.
Tim (44:49):
Absolutely correct.
If there's one piece of adviceyou could give to the young
professional in terms ofimproving their soft skills,
improving their communication,what would it be?
Kirk (45:03):
I think the first thing is be a good listener.
People that are good in sales.
They know how to listen well.
They know how to ask goodquestions.
I was with my brother-in-law acouple of weeks ago lives down
in Texas and one of the things Icomplimented him on was Don you
ask good questions?
(45:24):
And he thanked me for sayingthat.
But he also credited it to acareer spent in sales.
Because he says, one of thefirst tenets of sales is to
understand the person thatyou're talking to before you
ever talk about your product, toidentify that pain.
So begin at that point and whatyou may find is the person's
(45:48):
got an interesting story that'sgoing to enrich your life.
You walk away from it and say,god, that was a heck of a story
that I heard, really interesting.
You've enhanced your knowledgebase that day.
So that would be one big wordof advice Listen well, listen
intentionally.
Tim (46:08):
One big word of advice listen, well, listen
intentionally.
That's phenomenal advice, andyou know again if we could just
do that.
Listening is hard to do becauseyou actually have to turn that
voice off that's in your head,and turn your phone off as well,
and be present and be like yousaid, be wanting to actually
(46:29):
hear what they've got to say.
Not listen to respond, butactually listen to what they're
saying and take it in and listento understand.
It's so important and it's askill just like anything else.
Kirk (46:41):
It has to be practiced and some people we all know can
drone on and on and that becomesa coaching opportunity.
I've had those clients thatgive their 12 minutes soliloquy
and Tim between you and me andour listeners.
They're kind of boring, so atthe end of it that's a great
(47:02):
story.
How would you say that in threeminutes?
Three minutes, right.
Tim (47:07):
Right.
Well, Kirk, where can peoplefind you to?
Kirk (47:10):
work with you.
I'm in Northwest Florida, abouta half a mile from the Gulf of
Mexico, between Destin andPanama City Beach.
I'm at kirk attheseedsowercoachcom is my
website Alsokirkmccarleyauthorcom for my
book Thoughts for my Kids andOther People's Kids.
That's out on Amazon and it canbe found at your local
(47:32):
bookstore as well.
I'm on Facebook, instagram andLinkedIn too Kirk McCarley.
Tim (47:39):
Well, first off, northwest Florida is a good place to be
almost all year long, so I thinkyou're in a good spot there
almost all year long.
So you're, I think you're in agood spot there, but you know,
almost all year long with theweather just had to be kind of
kind of where around.
You know, certain times you'rewilling to bring them up.
Kirk (47:58):
Uh, last month we had four inches of snow on the ground
too, which was an anomaly, butit was a lot of fun.
Tim (48:04):
Well, so so you, you, actually we both got our our
snow in for, you know, nextdecade or so, so they, they can
have it.
But, kirk, thank you so muchfor spending some time with us.
The information you shared isincredible.
Good luck tonight.
I know it's gonna be a goodgame and, um, hopefully we'll
talk to you again soon thank youyou so much for having me, tim.
Kirk (48:26):
It's my pleasure being with you, you take care.
Tim (48:31):
Be sure to visit speakwithconfidencepodcastcom to
get your free ebook the top 21challenges for public speakers
and how to overcome them.
You can also register for theforum for public speaking.
Always remember your voice hasthe power to change the world.
We'll talk to you next time,take care.
Welcome to Speaking with Confidence, a podcast dedicated
to helping you unlock the powerof effective public speaking.
I'm Tim Newman, a recoveringcollege professor turned
communication coach, and I'mthrilled to guide you on your
journey to becoming a powerfulcommunicator.
I want to thank each and everyone of you for your support.
It truly means the world to me.
Please visit timnewmanspeakscomto get your free ebook the Top
(00:31):
21 Challenges for PublicSpeakers and how to Overcome
them.
Today's guest is Kirk McCarley.
He is a husband, father andgrandfather.
He is also an executive, careerand leadership development
coach.
He has more than 30 years ofexecutive leadership experience
in both the public and privatesector environments.
(00:51):
Kirk has a solid reputation forfostering individual growth and
development beyond the client'sexpectations.
As an executive and careercoach, he focuses on desired
customer outcomes, predicatedupon the premise that the
individual already possesses theingredients for success.
He is also a talentstatistician for ESPN, an author
(01:13):
and a group exercise instructor.
Kirk, welcome to the show.
You are a busy, busy man.
Kirk (01:21):
I'm engaged, Tim.
Tim (01:22):
Thanks for hosting me this morning, oh no worries, and you
know we've got a lot in commonand I think that being engaged
is really the key to life and Ikind of want to get into that.
But first I want to talk aboutthe one thing that we have in
common that really warms myheart being a grandfather.
(01:43):
I love being a dad, but to methere's nothing better than
being a grandfather.
Kirk (01:49):
And the grandkids were here for about five days.
They left yesterday, three ofthem, and it's an opportunity
for me to just pester them, andthey dish it right back at their
poppy.
Tim (02:01):
Yeah, I love that and you know, for me, I wish I could be
around them nonstop for about aweek and then go home, take a
nap and then, you know, haveabout a week recovery and then
come back at it.
But you know, there's there.
Really, to me is nothing,nothing better than being a
(02:21):
grandfather and watching themgrow and helping them and
teaching them.
It's so much better than being agrandfather and um and watching
them grow and helping them andteaching them.
It's so much better than beinga parent, because you don't
really have all the the theparenting responsibilities when
you're done with them.
Kirk (02:34):
Here they are.
Here they are.
They're yours.
Tim (02:35):
See you soon.
Good luck, don't mind all thesugar that I gave them, that's
right.
But we, you know, again, wehave a lot, like I said, a lot
(03:07):
in common.
And one of the things that kindof struck me, you know, after
we talked the other day, is yourprevious blog posts and you,
you wrote one, and I'm going wayback to 2019.
You, you wrote about successyou know what success and how
you define success and you toldtwo.
You told stories about twoindividuals that were important
in your life and it really kindof, you know, made me think
about on a deeper level, becauseI think success differently
than a lot of other people, butit really made me think about on
a deeper level, because I thinksuccess differently than a lot
of other people, but it reallymade me think about it on a much
(03:29):
deeper level than that.
And how did you come up withthis idea that success is more
than?
Obviously, it's more than money, but it's even more than just
being happy.
Kirk (03:45):
It's even more than just being happy.
I think contentment is thefirst word that comes to mind.
And those two individuals.
One of them was my backdoorneighbor growing up, mrs Clark,
and she was like a grandmotherfigure to me.
But I would go to her house,walk in, we would listen to Paul
Harvey on the radio.
She didn't have TV and eatVienna sausages out of the can,
(04:09):
but she would clip and handprune the edging of her yard
during the heat of a Texassummer.
And the dogs in theneighborhood, they roamed freely
.
In those days we didn't havelease laws.
They loved her.
Everybody was attracted to MrsClark, but she just had this
(04:30):
life of contentment.
She knew the history of theneighborhood.
She knew what everybody wasdoing, not so much a busybody
but just their history.
She built relationship andagain exuded joy.
She would walk to church six toeight blocks.
She didn't have a car.
(04:50):
She'd walk to the grocery storeabout another five blocks.
We'd pick her up every now andthen but she just exuded a
quality individual.
I termed her to be successful.
And that's in the heat of Texasright.
Tim (05:02):
I termed her to be successful, and that's in the
heat of Texas right.
Kirk (05:05):
That's in the heat of Texas.
It was 100 degrees and shewould go in between 2 and 5 in
the afternoon but then come backout in the evening when it was
only 98.
Tim (05:16):
God bless her.
God bless her.
But you know, I really thinkyou hit something there, the
whole idea of connection, and Ithink we miss out on today
because I think back to mychildhood.
I had people in my neighborhoodwhere I could just walk in
their house and you know, wedon't have that really today and
(05:50):
I think sometimes we probablyhave to and should do that, but
that takes away some of thatconnection.
Kirk (05:52):
growing up I remember all those neighbors.
Tim (05:54):
Yeah.
Kirk (05:54):
The Richardsons across the street.
I'd walk in their house andtake maraschino cherries out of
the refrigerator.
Mr Corn across the street, hewas a fireman.
Tim (06:17):
We were aghast when his garage burned down one year at
Christmas.
Mrs Payne across the streetmusic teacher.
I can go through the whole andthe need for connections for us
to become successful with herlife.
However, she chose to live itas opposed to trying to think
(06:48):
about what society has definedas success.
You know money, status, thosetypes of things and understand
that there's different ways todefine it and live our lives.
Kirk (07:02):
I'm a wealthy man and I'm not by virtue of monetary or
possessions, but it's myconnections and my relationships
and the variety of tribes thathave allowed me to be a part of
them, to come in and enter intotheir lives, and new tribes are
(07:23):
being formed all the time.
I did a bike ride in Lake City,florida, this past Sunday and
met a woman who again elderly,but she was the race director.
She happened to have some spareburritos from some of the
people who had finished earlierTim.
It was the best burrito I everhad in my life.
It was a Cuban guy who hadfinished earlier Tim.
(07:44):
It was the best burrito I everhad in my life.
It was a Cuban guy who had madeit and he included plantains as
part of the ingredient, and justgetting to know this woman who
I'd never met before, I'm goingto count her in my acquaintance
list.
Another one, then.
More riches for me in terms ofthat connection.
Tim (08:05):
And if we take that a step further, you know, when I say
you're a busy man, and I thinkthat's that's kind of ingrained
in who you are, to be busy, tobe involved in many different
things, to make theseconnections to you know to be I
wouldn't necessarily sayfulfilled you may say that for
yourself but to to try differentthings and to build all those
(08:28):
other different connections.
I mean to expand your life andto expand that network and those
connections is put that way.
Kirk (08:37):
Today is a perfect day for me.
I taught a spinning class at 6am.
I'm here with you now.
Later on I've got a coachingclient to meet with after we get
done with this call, and thenafter that I'm on the road to
Tallahassee to go work collegebasketball this evening.
(08:57):
So I incorporate all thesevarious elements of life.
I call it a perfect day.
Tim (09:05):
Well, I'm glad you brought up that you're heading to
Tallahassee.
I was going to ask you if youhad a game coming up.
This is where I really want tospend a little bit of time here,
because I'm fascinated with oneof the things that you do and
your story and how you gotstarted with this the whole
statistician gig that you havewith ESPN.
Let's get into that and talk alittle bit about that, and not
(09:29):
only how you got started in it,but the role that it has in
number one communication and howwe as listeners and viewers
take in an event, but thelessons it can teach us in our
own personal lives in terms ofinterpersonal and professional
(09:49):
communications.
Kirk (09:52):
Well, to kind of get started with it, I'll preface it
by saying I'm a dork, I'm anerd, I love numbers, I love
arithmetic and math, being ableto make a calculation.
But I was also an athlete and Iplayed sports.
I played basketball, but what Iwas really intrigued with was
(10:13):
statistical.
Tim (10:14):
That's a hard word for both of us Statistical.
Kirk (10:18):
Statistical aspect of sports, not just basketball,
baseball, baseball in particular, because there are so many
metrics that go into that.
Well, I grew up in a day whenwe didn't have electronic
calculators, so it was longhanddivision to figure things out,
and I got pretty good at that,to the point I can memorize that
(10:42):
14 to 24 was 58.3 percent and14 to 25 was 56 percent.
So what am I going to do withthis skill?
Tim (10:52):
Well.
Kirk (10:53):
I still had dreams of playing in the NBA.
That didn't happen, but went onto college and happened to room
with some people who were, witha guy in particular who was a
broadcast communication major,another guy across the hallway
who was an IT guy, and then athird guy who just had a general
(11:13):
knowledge of sports in general.
So we would sit around andwatch the baseball game of the
week Kurt Getty and Tony Kubekand we would critique what they
would say on the air oh, that'san obvious statement, kurt.
Tony, you can do better thanthat.
And so we would talk over them.
What was that going to parlayitself into?
(11:36):
Well, one of our friends becamea talent broadcaster and in 1989
, when he started broadcastingcollege football in what was
then the Southwest Conference,he asked me to be his talent
statistician and that's when myjourney on that ride began.
So this is season 36 for me.
(11:57):
We moved over to ESPN in 1996.
He has since gone back.
He's a professor now ofbroadcasting and media
communications at school.
I continue to work for ESPN.
Our other friend across thehall is in his 41st season now.
I believe it is as thestatistician for the Dallas
(12:22):
Cowboys.
Tim (12:27):
Wow, wow.
And so let's just hone in onsomething before we go any
further Relationships andconnections.
Right there, right, I mean,you're roommates and you had
something in common.
One goes off to do somethingand say you know what I'm going
to call my buddy?
This would be a great gig forhim.
We could work together.
If you don't have thatconnection, maybe we're not
sitting here today.
Kirk (12:49):
Absolutely, and in fact, even in our everyday
conversations, statistics enterinto it.
The fourth member of our groupturned 65 a couple of days ago.
We all wished him a happy 65thbirthday, but we broke 65 down
into congratulations on being 13for the fifth time oh, that's
(13:09):
funny, that's funny.
Tim (13:14):
So, yeah, we won't even, won't, even I'm I'm not there
yet, but but no, uh, that'sawesome.
So so talk about what you doand the entire process Because,
again to me it's fascinating.
For anybody who hasn't done it,it's a lot harder than it looks
(13:36):
, it's a lot more difficult,there's a lot more that goes
into it.
And, kirk, I think I told youthe story the Baltimore Orioles
I don't know if they still do it, but they used to have the
thing where you could paywhatever it was, to go in a
booth and they would give you abunch of stats and you could
broadcast an inning, they wouldrecord it for you and you could
(13:57):
take it home.
I thought I could do it.
There's just no way.
There's so many numbers,there's so many other things
that are going on, and baseballto me is relatively easy because
it's slow moving.
Now you're talking aboutbasketball and football, where
things are happening really,really quick and you've got to
process information.
You as a statistician, has toprocess the information, get it
(14:18):
over to the play-by-play andcolor guy.
Kirk (14:23):
The preparation and I want to give a shout out to the
talent, the broadcasters, thecolor analyst, the homework they
do.
But the knowledge they carryand what they have to
familiarize themselves withbefore they go into a broadcast
is just incredible.
And where they really earntheir paychecks is during the
(14:44):
third quarter of a game.
That is a 25 point blowout.
They've got to carry that tothe end.
There's not people listening.
They've moved to anotherchannel.
Now they're not watchinganymore.
And then's when they have tocome up with the stories that
continue to make that broadcastlive and make it meaningful for
(15:04):
the poor souls who are stillthere, glued to it, watching it
and listening to it.
So shout out to those guys.
First of all, I'm the silentpartner.
As a talent statistician, Isupply information to whoever is
talking.
So what is going to enhancewhat they're discussing at that
point in time?
(15:25):
Obviously, you've got to haveinformation that's going to keep
the watcher, the listener,glued to it.
That was a 12-yard run, firstdown.
That's the second three-pointshot they've hit in a row.
They're now 10 of 10 from thefree throw line, those kinds of
things.
I'll hand cards and informationor point some things out, but
(15:47):
I'll also include some thingsthat are maybe not showing up on
live stat broadcast, and thatis this is the fifth run in
basketball of this game.
Let's say, florida State, whoI'm doing tonight, has had a
10-0 run, has had a 12-0 run,but their opponent, whoever that
may be, has had runs thatthey've owned of 7-0 and 15-2.
(16:12):
So what that's painting apicture of is a game that has
been a series of runs.
It has not been smooth, it'sbeen erratic and it's had its
ebbs and flows.
To give a feel to the viewer ofwhat's really happening there.
So my job is to enhancewhatever is taking place for
(16:33):
those guys and allow them toappear even more intelligent
than they already are.
Tim (16:40):
And how much preparation for you as a statistician goes
into it?
Or do you just go in and justwhatever plays out plays out, or
do you do research on certainplayers and look for trends that
you think may be coming orthings of that nature?
Kirk (17:01):
So we've got a tough contest tonight.
We've got Miami coming intoTallahassee to play Florida
State.
Miami has not had a good season.
They're 6-19 this year.
Laren Yeager, their formercoach, resigned.
They were a Final Four teamjust a couple of years ago, as
you may recall year.
(17:27):
They've got one player who hasbeen key.
They've had a key injury thathas taken place.
So what are we going to build tomake this game interesting,
make it competitive?
It may be a storyline of whatare they doing to prepare for
next season.
What are we going to seetonight?
Who are some players that havemaybe not seen a lot of time up
to this point?
I'm going to acquaint myselfwith those kinds of things to be
(17:48):
prepared.
Then you've got watch list.
There's a certain player thatmay be 10 points away from a
thousand points for the career.
We're going to track him, thosekinds of things to give a game,
which otherwise may not be thatimpactful, a little bit of
flavor, variety to keep someoneengaged.
(18:09):
Florida State is stillpotentially a tournament team.
They're maybe coasting on thebubble right now at 15-10.
So what have they finished inrecent seasons?
What can we look for as the ACCseason winds down at this point
in time.
So I'm looking at those kindsof things.
I get game notes, I study them,I come in as prepared as I can
(18:33):
be and more often than not thepreparation goes for naught
because something elseunexpected has taken place.
Tim (18:43):
Well, I would say that preparation is whether it's used
or not, preparation is one ofthe number one.
It's one of the things that wecan control and if we don't
prepare, that will definitelyshow.
So I don't know thatpreparation is for naught.
It's your knowledge, you've gotthat Nobody can ever take's
(19:08):
it's, it's it's going back tocoaching.
Kirk (19:10):
It's like a coaching meeting.
Well, start where I'll start,with a client.
What would you like to focus ontoday?
And I've got a series of thingsthat we may touch on.
Very rarely do we get what I'veprepared for.
It's something else, but it'sthe preparation and the idea of
being ready.
Tim (19:28):
Yes, yeah, so so do you have conversations with the, the
on-air talent, prior to orprior to the event, so let's say
, the games today?
Have you spoken with thembefore today, or were you just
talk to them briefly before theevent and kind of get their
(19:48):
ideas of what they're lookingfor?
How does that process work?
Kirk (19:54):
In basketball, baseball, softball putting football aside
for right now.
I know the guy I'm working withtonight.
I've worked with him a time ortwo.
Good guy, very comfortable.
I'm LinkedIn with him and I'llask him is there anything in
particular that you want me towatch for for you?
(20:14):
What can I do to enhance theexperience for you?
And I'll get a few notes fromhim.
I'll concentrate and focus onthat.
Football is a little bit moreinvolved with that.
We work the same crew week inand week out generally, and kind
of an example of how that worksmy cousins is the talent
(20:35):
broadcaster that I work with incollege and professional
football.
We had the Fiesta Bowl PennState and Boise State and Boise
State, coming into that game,had an incredible statistic of
when they rushed for 40 carries.
They had one premier runningback, ashton, gentry, gentry.
But aside from him, when theyrushed for more than 40 times in
(20:59):
a game, they would haveremarkable results.
Well, they lost the fiesta Bowlto Penn State 31-14.
At the end of the game Ipointed to Mike 40 rushes.
We looked at each other,shrugged our shoulders.
Tim (21:14):
We'll live to fight another day, exactly exactly, and you
bring up football as a, forexample, Super Bowl was a couple
weeks ago and it wasn't nearlythe game that I think anybody
thought it was going to be, andwhen the I've forgotten the
player's name from Philadelphiawho intercepted the pass and
scored a touchdown on it, and hewas the first person to score
(21:40):
on their birthday score atouchdown in the Super Bowl on
their birthday.
Okay, but what struck me wasthat they number one, that they
had that and that the only otherperson that was playing, from
my understanding, that had abirthday that day was Saquon
Barkley, and so I think thatthey were.
That was a piece of informationthat they thought that they
(22:01):
were going to end up using, butit got used on somebody else.
Kirk (22:06):
Sometimes I'll get lucky and extract something like that,
but somebody else on the crewgot lucky that day and they
tracked that and they shared itand the producer bought it and
they passed it on to the talentand it was announced on air.
Tim (22:23):
But see, for people that may not necessarily be, you know
that, into sports and andlistening and watching on TV and
those types of things, that tome is something that is is is
number one.
It's fascinating and criticalfor telling the story of the
event and getting peopleinvested into listening, you
(22:45):
know, getting closer to the TVor turning it up or what have
you with the radio, and reallykind of making them feel the
event.
Kirk (22:56):
It makes it personal.
Yeah, and we feel thatconnection.
It's a warm feeling and this isa real person.
He has birthdays, besidesmaking millions of dollars as a
player and being in front ofmillions of people on television
.
Tim (23:14):
Right.
Kirk (23:14):
And not to mention the people that are watching it live
in the Superdome.
Tim (23:20):
So, during the game football, any game, it doesn't
really matter and things aregetting tight, what's the mood,
what's the back and forth interms of you and the talent in
terms of getting informationquickly or I don't want that
information, I want this howdoes that process work and does
(23:40):
it get heated, and how do youall deal with with those
emotions in the moment, knowingthat this is something that's
fast moving.
There's not time to talk aboutit, it's do it and get it out
because of the broadcastsometimes tim, there can be too
much information.
Kirk (24:01):
If it is an exciting game, the game is going to speak for
itself and you can over-talkthose events when maybe just
allowing somebody to drink it into hear the crowd noise On
radio.
We go through a lot ofpreparation as best we can so we
can have the crowd noise comingin to give that vibrancy to the
(24:25):
broadcast.
I remember this was years ago.
The too much information.
Chris Schenkel, who was awonderful broadcaster years and
years ago for college footballit was a Michigan State game and
a running back ran for a longtouchdown, 60 yards.
There was the crowd noise, thepause, the hesitation, and
(24:49):
Schenkel said and he did itagainst the wind, oh, it had
nothing to do with anything.
But it's lived in infamy, atleast in our minds.
Tim (25:05):
Oh my gosh.
Kirk (25:07):
You could have just let that happen.
Yeah, you've got the iconiccalls jack buck of ozzy smith.
Go crazy folks, go crazy.
Kirk gibson, the call on onthat home run joe buck with
David Freeze in the World Seriesagainst the Rangers and we will
see you tomorrow night.
(25:28):
Just that combination of theright things said at the right
time.
Yeah.
Tim (25:36):
And, like you said a lot of times, that's you know you
catch lightning in the bottleand you get lucky there, and
those are the things that liveon for forever and what people
actually maybe remember aboutthe game or the event.
Even if take Kirk Gibson as a,for example, you see him running
the bases, but what you reallyremember is that call.
(26:01):
You remember the sound, thewords in the announcers saying
those things and it's I can'tbelieve what I've just seen
Iconic, yeah, yeah.
So it's again.
This is is really fascinating.
And so how do how do thesethings kind of translate over
(26:22):
into, you know, the regularpeople world in terms of
communicating and sharinginformation in in a in a way
that let's just let's just takea business environment where you
know one person is counting oranother person to do something
(26:43):
so that they can do what theyneed to do.
How do we get people tounderstand number one, the
importance of connection andknowing how to actually
communicate with somebody in aparticular tone, using
particular words, with animportance of making sure that
things are getting done,importance of making sure that
things are getting done, Tim,when I coach people.
Kirk (27:08):
I'll preface it sometimes by saying we'll talk about
interviewing, for example, jobinterviewing.
When I speak to you, it maysound like I'm broadcasting a
game, so forgive me if it's likethat, because that gets it
built in my DNA.
It's been mostly a blessing,particularly with public
(27:34):
speaking, because I get likehours of osmosis just hearing
these talented people how theyspeak, how they pause, how they
hesitate, the vocabulary, thesynonyms they bring up are just
incredible.
But in the everyday world oneof the things that I've noticed
we don't allow enough time forquiet time, for pause, for
(27:55):
hesitation, and when I speakwith clients I've got to get
myself comfortable with the factI may be giving this person
five, 10, 30 seconds to processand we get uncomfortable with
that dead space.
But what I found more oftenthan not the person comes back
(28:15):
and says thank you for notpressuring me, for making me
feel relaxed, make me feelcomfortable, because so many
times I get into too big of ahurry and my mouth is speaking
faster than my brain can thinkand I stutter and I skip over
words and I get flustered withthat.
(28:38):
So, slowing down the pace, Ireally build that into it.
I've talked to people todayabout Dean Smith and the
four-corner offense.
They don't know what I'mtalking about because we have
shot clocks now in basketball.
But that was a strategy backthen to change the tempo, change
the rhythm, change the cadence.
Tim (29:00):
Well and it's funny that you say that because I do a lot
in the golf space and it wasbrought up to me a number of
years ago you know, if you watchhow Tiger Woods plays, he moves
very, very quickly from the teeto his next shot, but when he's
(29:20):
walking from, you know hisfairway shot to the green.
When he gets about 30 yardsaway from the green he slows his
pace down, slows his pace down,slows his heart rate down and
then really starts toconcentrate on making the putt
and reading the putt, because ofof how important you know the
heart rate is, how important youknow controlling nerves and
(29:44):
controlling movement really isin putting and, like you said,
the same thing goes with withcommunication.
Slow down, take a deep breathand think it through before you
just start spouting things offtiger applies some visualization
there as well the great golfinstructor instructor.
Kirk (30:04):
I believe it was Harvey Pinnock who taught Crenshaw.
Probably Tom Kite down inAustin would scold people for
using golf carts.
You need to walk the coursebecause you get a feel for it.
The contour and, like Tiger, asyou're getting close to the
ball for where you're going tohit your next shot, you get a
(30:25):
feel for what.
The topography is what the windfeels like, what the external
elements might be, as you beginto visualize in your mind what's
going to happen next.
Tim (30:40):
Yeah, and I think we could all take a page out of that book
in how we go about a lot ofthings that we do, especially
from the connection networking,interpersonal relationship
perspective, and take a stepback and don't be so quick to
judge and actually listen towhat other people are saying as
(31:01):
well.
Kirk (31:05):
I like to visualize where I am and my family, my friends.
They criticize me because Idon't use GPS.
I love a map, a paper map topull that out.
Where am I right now, spatiallyin the universe, in the world,
so to speak.
Where does this road lead to?
(31:27):
I look at the sun.
Where's the sun?
Right, that's to my right.
I'm headed north.
Well, I make a left turn.
I'm going to be headed west.
I'll pull out a compass everynow and then and people say, man
, you're pretty primitive.
How much wasted time is that?
Well, I'm going to see somethings perhaps that I would not
(31:51):
have seen otherwise.
But, more important, I heard anexpert, uh, on brain our brain
is at age ages talk about thisthe other day and said that maps
and not relying on gps is amajor um help as far as warding
off Alzheimer's and dementia andsome of those illnesses like
(32:11):
that, because you know whereyour place is.
So I'm lost half the time, tim,but I'm trying to fight off.
Fight off the aging brain.
Tim (32:25):
That's interesting.
I didn't know that, but youknow, um, maybe I'll get my.
You know, cut my wife a littlebit of slack, because, uh, even
with a GPS she gets lost.
Um, you know it's, it's, it's ablessing and a curse, I guess I
don't.
I don't know, but but the wholeidea of of map is, of having a
map, is fascinating because,again, you're right, most people
(32:48):
have no idea, number one, howto read a map or how to use a
map or what to even do with it.
Since we've gotten gps, it's,it's, it's crazy, and I think,
you know, from technology in theof itself, I think, has really
(33:09):
accelerated the whole dementia,alzheimer's paradigm, because
we've stopped doing a lot ofthings using our brains we watch
television, we play on thecomputer this, that and the
other thing, and we don't againactually interact like we used
to in the real world.
Kirk (33:32):
Well, first of all, this is wonderful.
You and I get to meet.
We're 500 miles away from eachother, but it's like we're
breaking bread just in remotelocations, right.
So the technology can be awonderful thing, but I was
having a discussion with somepeople earlier this week about
the onset of AI and I need tohave an understanding of it,
(33:57):
because that's what's happeningin the world.
But how far do you advance thator allow that?
And it's kind of like.
I think back to the Amish.
How did they decide?
This is where technology endsat this point.
I think they have a leader ofthe community that kind of
dictates that, but it's alwaysfascinating of that particular
(34:21):
segment of society how it wasdecided that they were going to
stop at this point.
This is okay, but this is not.
Tim (34:29):
Yeah, yeah, it's interesting.
I lived for a long time up inPennsylvania, just outside of
Amish country, in Lancaster, andnot truly, you know, when I
moved up there.
I still don't know that I trulyunderstand the culture, but not
truly understanding it, andwatching some of the things that
they did, I would think backand say it would be nice if we
(34:49):
could just do that all the time,you know.
And then I just get right backto you know, plowing right on
through and and and knockingstuff out.
So I think, part of it is is isreally being intentional with,
with how you live your life andhow you interact with others.
Yeah, because it can be done?
Kirk (35:13):
It can be, but it's decision points along the way.
What are you going to investyourself in and get involved in
with this now and whatnot?
I was talking to my wife theother day.
I told her.
I said I think men have a greatadvantage over women with
technology because we can stickour cell phones in our pockets.
(35:37):
Women, if they don't have apurse, don't tend to have
pockets in a lot of theirclothing.
It has to be on the top of thetable and when messages come up,
there it is.
I've got to check that.
So that contributes to thestatistic.
I heard the other day that theaverage person in America checks
their phone 144 times a day.
Tim (36:00):
Well, that doesn't surprise me at all.
I mean, I wouldn't be surprisedif it was higher than that.
I wouldn't be surprised if itwas higher than that.
So how do you coach people tobe present and not necessarily
be checking their phone whenyou're interacting with somebody
?
For me.
Kirk (36:36):
that's one of the things that truly elevates my blood
pressure almost immediately IfI'm having a conversation with
you and your phone goes off andyou stop the conversation and
you start checking your phone.
How do you coach people to trulybe present in that situation?
I think the Gaines couple, chipand Joanna, the fixer-upper.
They've got a restaurant it'spart of the Magnolia House
franchise down in Waco and oneof the rules that they establish
is cell phones.
They've got these pouches thatare in the booths or by the
tables where people sit aregoing to be deposited in there
(36:59):
when you sit down, because wewant you to enjoy your meal, but
we also want you to have aconversation with the person
you're with.
That's a ground rule that theyhave laid out and similarly, in
conversations, let's agree toturn off our cell phones right
now.
Is there anything that isreally necessary that you need
(37:21):
to take care of before we enterinto this meeting?
But I want to devote 100% of mytime to you for the next 60
minutes that we're going to meetand I hope that we can agree to
those terms going into it.
So it's establishing what thoseground rules are going to be
and if they're amenable toeverybody.
Tim (37:45):
Yeah, and I just think it's so important.
I think that that's a greatapproach.
It's if you're constantlychecking your cell phone, you
know, if you put this way, ifyou're having a 15 minute
conversation and you check yourcell phone five times, how, how
engaged are you actually intothe conversation and how much
are you actually taking, takingaway from from that?
(38:06):
If, once every three minutes,you've minutes, you've
disengaged and are not payingattention to it, I think people
need to truly understand whatthat does in terms of the
overall communication experience.
Kirk (38:23):
Yeah, it's saying to the other person you are of
secondary importance to amachine, right?
Basically, because I'm kind ofimprisoned by that to some
degree.
Before we had cell phones wehad regular phones.
Of course, I guess, landlines,landlines yeah, they're still
(38:44):
around here and there, they'restill around here and there.
But I would create a discipline.
If I was meeting with someoneand the landline would go off if
I hadn't set up a callforwarding, which I often
neglected to do.
They would hear it ring andthey say aren't you going to get
that?
I would say no, you're here,I'm here.
This is important, let's focuson that, right, and hopefully
(39:06):
that created a little bitgreater self-esteem for that
person that I was having achance to visit with.
Tim (39:13):
Yeah, and again, another great point, acknowledging
something that you know,whatever it is, it can wait.
You know I'm not perfect indoing it, but I do try really
hard, you know.
So I've got my phone set up somy wife and my kids have
different vibrations andringtones, and so you know, if
(39:37):
it's not one of those and I'm ina meeting, it doesn't really
matter, it's, it can wait.
If it's one of those otherspecial ringtones, depending on
where we're at in the meeting, Ijust let it go.
But I also tell my wife andkids I'm locked off during this
time.
So contact me if it's anemergency.
(39:59):
So I do try and put instrategies and tactics so that
it takes some, some of theimpulse away, because somebody
with ADD, adhd like me, thathappens.
It immediately diverts myattention and so we've got to
(40:20):
find ways to to reduce them.
Kirk (40:24):
In and of itself, I remember the days and probably
you do as well, tim.
The kids were younger and mywife and I would want to go out
for an evening, go to dinner, goto a movie.
We'd have a babysitter thatwould come over and we'd say
we're going to go eat at suchand such place.
Here's the number.
We're going to be at such andsuch movie theater If there's an
(40:46):
emergency.
Here's their number.
Call us if you need to, butotherwise don't call us.
We trust what you're doing andeverybody seemed to feel
comfortable with that.
Tim (40:58):
Yes.
Kirk (40:59):
And we had one episode the babysitter locked herself out
of the house and she had to goto the neighbor's house and call
us and get a hold of us.
That's a good story.
Now.
Tim (41:12):
It is because now, if we don't know what's going on every
two?
Minutes we're freaking out.
It's insane.
So again, you're involved in alot of different things and you
teach spinning classes.
Is that what it is, spinningclasses?
Kirk (41:31):
Spin classes.
Tim (41:32):
So are you this nice and this calm when you're coaching
spinning classes?
Because to me, if that were thecase, I'd probably just be kind
of pedaling along.
Oh, it's great, we're hangingout with Kirk for 45 minutes to
an hour.
Kirk (41:54):
How does a spinning class with Kirk actually go?
Well, tim, it kind of dependswho you are.
Okay, if you come in for thefirst time, it's going to be a
very welcoming, very encouraging, and if you've been in for the
50th time, it'll be the same way.
But I may pick on you just alittle bit.
I've got members of the classthat don't like certain
exercises, so what am I going todo?
I'm going to present them tothem.
(42:14):
So, david, who is one of themembers of the class he was
there today Dave, we're going todo some jumps, and Dave is
obstinate and says I'm not.
I said well, dave, you'redepriving yourself of one of the
great pleasures of this class.
I'm sorry to hear that.
And he'll yell it right back atme.
(42:35):
So there's some give and takeand we egg each other on, but
it's a blast.
I get paid money, tim, to yellat people at 6 am in the morning
.
What can be better?
It's great.
Tim (42:48):
Well, first off, god bless people being up at 6 am.
But that, to me, that's.
I need to get back into it.
That's how I used to be.
I would get up at 4.30, go tothe gym, go to the office, get
stuff done.
By the time people would startrolling in, I would already have
almost a full day of work beingdone.
(43:08):
That way I could then be freeto interact and talk to people
and stop in and they come in andsee me and those types of
things.
But to me, there's nothingbetter than getting up in the
morning and getting yourexercise in, getting that heart
rate going first thing in themorning and then going on about
your day.
Kirk (43:26):
Yeah, I don't like when the alarm goes off at five, but
once I've gotten up, gottenthere, done the class, all day
is still ahead of me.
I've got my workout in, I'mre-energized and ready for what
comes next.
Tim (43:41):
Yeah, and it's just so important.
Exercises number one is notonly so important for your
physical health.
What it does to your mentalhealth and all those other
extraneous benefits that you getfrom that afterwards Not just
talk about from the time thatyou're exercising, but the rest
of the day.
(44:01):
What that does physiologicallyfor you and your mental health
is phenomenal.
Just get up and go, do it.
Kirk (44:09):
Yeah, as I coach people, one of the most important things
is movement.
I hear people talking aboutbeing stuck.
How do you get unstuck?
Well, the first thing you domentally and physically move,
that's going out for a walk,going for a bike ride, going for
a run, going out for a walkgoing for a bike ride, going for
(44:35):
a run that's going to stimulatethose endorphins and maybe take
your brain to a different placethan it's been.
Oh, I know why I haven't beenable to do this, why I haven't
wanted to do it Right and takesyou down a path that's going to
be more rewarding and beneficialto you and for others as well.
Tim (44:49):
Absolutely correct.
If there's one piece of adviceyou could give to the young
professional in terms ofimproving their soft skills,
improving their communication,what would it be?
Kirk (45:03):
I think the first thing is be a good listener.
People that are good in sales.
They know how to listen well.
They know how to ask goodquestions.
I was with my brother-in-law acouple of weeks ago lives down
in Texas and one of the things Icomplimented him on was Don you
ask good questions?
(45:24):
And he thanked me for sayingthat.
But he also credited it to acareer spent in sales.
Because he says, one of thefirst tenets of sales is to
understand the person thatyou're talking to before you
ever talk about your product, toidentify that pain.
So begin at that point and whatyou may find is the person's
(45:48):
got an interesting story that'sgoing to enrich your life.
You walk away from it and say,god, that was a heck of a story
that I heard, really interesting.
You've enhanced your knowledgebase that day.
So that would be one big wordof advice Listen well, listen
intentionally.
Tim (46:08):
One big word of advice listen, well, listen
intentionally.
That's phenomenal advice, andyou know again if we could just
do that.
Listening is hard to do becauseyou actually have to turn that
voice off that's in your head,and turn your phone off as well,
and be present and be like yousaid, be wanting to actually
(46:29):
hear what they've got to say.
Not listen to respond, butactually listen to what they're
saying and take it in and listento understand.
It's so important and it's askill just like anything else.
Kirk (46:41):
It has to be practiced and some people we all know can
drone on and on and that becomesa coaching opportunity.
I've had those clients thatgive their 12 minutes soliloquy
and Tim between you and me andour listeners.
They're kind of boring, so atthe end of it that's a great
(47:02):
story.
How would you say that in threeminutes?
Three minutes, right.
Tim (47:07):
Right.
Well, Kirk, where can peoplefind you to?
Kirk (47:10):
work with you.
I'm in Northwest Florida, abouta half a mile from the Gulf of
Mexico, between Destin andPanama City Beach.
I'm at kirk attheseedsowercoachcom is my
website Alsokirkmccarleyauthorcom for my
book Thoughts for my Kids andOther People's Kids.
That's out on Amazon and it canbe found at your local
(47:32):
bookstore as well.
I'm on Facebook, instagram andLinkedIn too Kirk McCarley.
Tim (47:39):
Well, first off, northwest Florida is a good place to be
almost all year long, so I thinkyou're in a good spot there
almost all year long.
So you're, I think you're in agood spot there, but you know,
almost all year long with theweather just had to be kind of
kind of where around.
You know, certain times you'rewilling to bring them up.
Kirk (47:58):
Uh, last month we had four inches of snow on the ground
too, which was an anomaly, butit was a lot of fun.
Tim (48:04):
Well, so so you, you, actually we both got our our
snow in for, you know, nextdecade or so, so they, they can
have it.
But, kirk, thank you so muchfor spending some time with us.
The information you shared isincredible.
Good luck tonight.
I know it's gonna be a goodgame and, um, hopefully we'll
talk to you again soon thank youyou so much for having me, tim.
Kirk (48:26):
It's my pleasure being with you, you take care.
Tim (48:31):
Be sure to visit speakwithconfidencepodcastcom to
get your free ebook the top 21challenges for public speakers
and how to overcome them.
You can also register for theforum for public speaking.
Always remember your voice hasthe power to change the world.
We'll talk to you next time,take care.
Popular Podcasts
United States of Kennedy
United States of Kennedy is a podcast about our cultural fascination with the Kennedy dynasty. Every week, hosts Lyra Smith and George Civeris go into one aspect of the Kennedy story.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com