December 27, 2021 • 37 mins
Jackie Kono of Heart Whispers Healing joins us to discuss attachment focused EMDR. She tells us what EMDR is - how it is used to heal trauma and what the attachment focused branch can do for relational traumas. Jackie is also a holistic psychologist.
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Episode Transcript
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Unknown (00:00):
If you have the power to heal and change your life,
(00:06):
you might not have found it yet,but it's out there and it exists
for you.
Our intention is to have alittle fun while introducing you
to various new ways of healing.
Welcome to the spill, ginger teapodcast. Hi, everybody. I'm
Angel, Amy. I am a psychicmedium and a life coach. I work
(00:28):
with angels, spirit guides andloved ones in heaven. And I've
just love everything and allthings spiritual. Hi,
I'm Lila, I began my healingjourney looking for relief from
physical pain. And I'm alwayswilling to try something new to
feel better and improve myself.
(00:50):
We're going to be discussingalternative health techniques.
So if you're looking to heal thephysical, mental or spiritual
parts of yourself, or if you'rejust curious about what to try,
or what can help you live yourbest life. You're absolutely in
the right place. So welcome.
Today we have a very specialguest. We will be talking with
(01:15):
Jackie kono in she is a holisticpsychotherapist. She has a
private practice in which she isan EMDR practitioner among some
other things. So Hi, Jackie. Sonice to have you today. Hi,
Angel. Amy. Hi, Lila. Hi,Jackie.
(01:38):
Thanks so much for coming today.
Would you like to start bytelling us a little bit about
yourself?
Yes, I'd love to. So I My nameis Jackie, like you said, and I
have a private practice. Rightnow it's through telehealth. And
I do love incorporating a lot ofdifferent energy modalities,
(01:58):
including yoga, EmotionalFreedom Technique, attachment
focused EMDR. Other mindfulnesspractice is along with more
Western based psychodynamictherapies and existential
phenomenology, things like that.
And I'd say that I'm verypassionate about bringing them
together and helping us get to aplace where people are really
(02:20):
able to see significant changein their own bodies and, and
really heal, because I thinkthat that we have the ability to
do that. And yes, soI hear all those big words. And
I'm like, Ooh, this is a juicy.
She's like a master of theemotional component. And I've,
(02:42):
I've had the pleasure of workingwith you. So I know that you are
very, very gifted with theemotional component, because
you're super intuitive. And somepeople get a little confused
about the definition ofclairvoyance. So we know Lila
that clairvoyant people can see.
And they usually can seeoutside, like normal space and
(03:06):
time. But also to see the rootof all things or see like the
root in human behavior is alsoclairvoyance. And I know that
you have really mastered thatside of you. And I think it's
super cool.
(03:28):
Thank you. Yeah, I think thatthat is something that has
continued to get developed. Andin the work that I'm doing with
clients, it's, it comes intohand, it comes in handy. So
being able to understand thepatterns that exist with people,
when they walk in the door, andhow they are in relationship to
other people kind of whichposition they take in a
(03:50):
relationship and in what thatlook like looks like and usually
that can determine what types ofconflicts that people are
getting into what types ofthings that are causing them to
get stuck in. That's where wego, we'll look there to help
process emotion and help themget past these blocks that are
showing up for them.
(04:10):
Have you heard about this? Lila?
I have not. You haven't heardabout it at all. I know about it
through some other healers. Ihave. I haven't done a session
before. I haven't done EMDR yet.
I'm curious about it, though.
Yes. But you were telling me astory about 60 minutes? Yes.
(04:30):
That EMDR the what I've heardabout it, and what I saw in 60
minutes was Prince Harry doingor participating in EMDR and
that that was something that hewas using. I think he talked a
lot about you know, childhoodtrauma. I don't know if that's
the sameOh, yeah. EMD has gone right in
(04:51):
there and getting that traumaPrince Harry. Oh, there's no no
there's no trauma there. No.
Right right Jack Why don't yougo right in and get that trauma
if someone Yeah, that'sthat's what is so exciting that
you know, he opens up indiscloses that just to break the
stigma, I think so many peoplecan benefit from this. And, and
really the tools are here wehave them. And people are really
(05:14):
starting to learn, again that wedo have the capacity to heal,
our bodies are dying for it,people are starting to feel so
many symptoms coming up andstart coming to the surface,
which is such a great sign. Andonce we start to pay attention
to that and pay attention to thebody, then we really can step
into a totally new experience ofour lives. So,
(05:37):
so the EMDR that the attachmentfocused EMDR that you practice,
is that different?
Yeah. So there is there is EMDRand EMDR, Eye Movement
Desensitization andReprocessing, is it started in
the 90s. And it came aboutbecause this, I think she's a
psychologist, Francine Shapiro,she recognized that when she
(06:01):
experienced something, anemotional event, she was walking
outside, and she noticed hereyes were moving back and forth.
And it helped her process thetrauma. Interesting. And so then
she since then developed thisthis model called EMDR, with
some other layers added to it.
And then so basically whatpeople would do is, if they had
an incident that theyexperienced, like a car accident
(06:24):
or some sort of event thatoccurred that left them feeling
overstimulated, or basically atthat moment, they didn't have
the resources to process theemotion that was coming up. So
they go into a state of fightflight. And then what happens
after that is all of theemotion, the energy that didn't
ever get to get processed outgets stored in the body. And so
(06:45):
this is what is so amazing aboutour bodies is that we get it
recognizes that wait a second,you're going through this event,
we can't possibly process thisright now we just need to get to
safety. And when you know, afteryour nervous system settles
down, then you can identify orlocate what is remaining,
(07:07):
because it'll show up in theform of, you know, a trigger or
like a recurrent recurring, likea memory or something like that,
that'll show up. It's so EMDR,in and of itself is going into
those events that have happened,and just providing the space to
process a motion that is stuckin the body.
(07:29):
So I hear all this and Iactually hang out with a
scientist, we're quite a combotogether. My sister in law is
one of my best friends and sheis a scientist. And so I would
think that like a neuroscientist, or would would study
(07:52):
this, no, has, like, you know,the study of the brain. So it
what is this backed by scienceat all? Do we know?
Absolutely. This is this isbacked by science, for sure, it
is one of the most evidencebased practices that is around
for processing trauma. So Imean, I happen to be very
energetic in the work that I do.
And also this this model is verymuch has a lot of research
(08:16):
behind it so that you can easilyresearch. You know, go to EMDR,
emdria.com, EMDR, eye a.com andlook up those different research
methods.
Yeah. So what is a typicalsession like? So I know, in the
(08:39):
tapping session, I explained topeople like you sit across from
me, and you mirror me, as yourepeat after me, as I say,
different phrases and differentfeelings and emotions. While we
tap, you tap on yourself, and Itap on mine. And but then
there's an intuitive piece thatI bring in psychic peace with
(09:02):
it, to really feel the energeticbody and lead the person into
what they're ready to let go of.
How is EMDR similar anddifferent?
Yeah, so So EMDR you know, Ithink what I will say because
this is the one that I practicethe most most is the attachment
(09:22):
focused EMDR. And the the reasonwhy it's called attachment
focused is that people that comein with that haven't had luck
processing, you know, someemotions and traumas from the
past, they will come in to usethe attachment focused EMDR
because it helps to really getat the early conditioning. I
(09:45):
know I'm kind of not answeringfully, but I'll get there.
Yeah, so it's okay, I'mfollowing. So like, kind of like
a rewiring.
Yeah. So basically, just underthat notion that from birth to
age seven, we learn about who weare and how we are to be In the
world, based, you know, from ourprimary caregivers, and we learn
(10:05):
how to be in relationships, andwhatever has occurred during
that timeframe, then we, it canstay in the body, or we can
develop beliefs about ourselves.
And if there were anysignificant events that caused
us to experience a traumaticevent or traumatic situation,
thenlike sadness, anger, regret,
blame, shame, all of that youmean anything, that and then if
(10:29):
there's a specific event, like acar accident or something, then
that will add to it. And if thathappens during the developmental
period, birthdates, seven, itcan stay in the body in a in a
deeper way, basically, andaffect the brain. And so, you
know, there also can besituations where people feel,
(10:50):
you know, just based on thepersonalities of the people in
their household, they can assumea certain role, like maybe
they're the burden in thefamily, they're the one that
takes the responsibility for thefamily dynamic. And then they
they continue to grow up feelinglike they are a burden. So
something even just like that,where they have all these like
(11:11):
little instances that they mightfeel, have led themselves to
believe that they are a burden.
Like they're the way the dadyelled at them, or looked at
them in a certain type of way.
And then in their bodies, theyexperienced shame or so if that
happens enough, then that canturn into a pattern. And EMDR
can also be used for somethinglike that.
(11:36):
Okay. And so, like, what would Ibe if I called you to make an
appointment? Like, what's thegeneral thing people are are
calling you about? What are theyfinding in their lives that
they're reaching out to you?
Yeah, so a few different things.
So some people will come in andsay, I'm really just looking to
overcome these patterns that Ican continue to find myself in,
(11:57):
I'm feeling depressed andfeeling anxious, I'm getting
triggered a lot. In in. So Imight say that EMDR could be
really helpful for that. So theymight not necessarily come in
looking for EMDR. But becausethey're presenting in such a way
that their body is signaling tothem, it's ready to do some
work. Basically, what we woulddo is use that modality as a way
(12:19):
to understand and open up whatis the trigger? What is the
body's signaling to you how, howdo we get to the root to
understand what's really goingon so that we can clear what's
happening.
So I recently started to workwith a client that has extreme
(12:42):
OCD, in she has an extreme fearof throwing up. And she really,
really, really wanted to workwith me in person, which I'm
doing a lot on line right now.
But the location in which sheworks provided us to meet. And
so I have been working with herusing it. When I've said tapping
(13:07):
for those that don't know whatit is. It's a motion Emotional
Freedom Technique. But really,you know, it's it's similar but
different than EMDR. But where Iwant to go with this is, is that
when I leaned into her energy,and this is the thing that
Jackie consents to, is, she hadsomething attached to her. She
(13:31):
had like a darker being. And soI asked her, if I was looking at
me, talk to me, baby, talk tome. No,
I just want to hear more. Allright.
Where am I making youuncomfortable? Okay. So I know
this, I don't mean to scarepeople. But so listen, you're
(13:54):
not all walking around withthings attached to you. Let's
just be real here. Is there anymoment angels Laila to stubborn
angels with big wings and theirredheads go figure their gingers
Lila? Love you. So, you know,she had a big demon beast. She
(14:21):
really did. I'm sweating tellingthe story. And I just, you know,
connected to her. We wereoutside we had no shoes on on
the grass. And I started to justchannel light all through her
and really detached this thingin send a packing. And then we
(14:44):
started to do the healing work.
So she felt a lot better justfrom that before we even got
into the wouldn't, right.
Yeah, so have you had anyexperiences like this like cuz
you're super connected to,I think not not like that I do,
I definitely believe that therecould be things energetically
(15:07):
there that will keep peoplestuck where they just can't get
out of that pattern where theyneed something different or they
need like a blast of light likeAmy is giving? For sure. Like,
yeah.
So, you know, I just think it'sgood to have all different
(15:27):
avenues like all roads lead toRome. And this is why I say it's
a recipe. It's a special sauce,different people do different
things. She's actually nowseeing someone that does. I
don't know, there's so manydifferent modalities, but it has
to do with neuroscience, and butshe didn't call it EMDR. But
when I looked it up, I was like,Oh, this is similar. Okay,
(15:50):
so what drew you to EMDR?
So I, it works. It works. It'sit's,
but you know, we're in practicedoing other things before you
started with that. Yeah, soI was doing traditional
psychotherapy, and thenincorporating some energy
medicine techniques and doing alot of tapping. So okay, any
throughout my training, I'velearned that there's been pieces
(16:11):
that are missing in therapysessions, in my own experience
with therapy. Oh, yeah, it's,it's, it's like, where's the
processing happening. And Ididn't understand that
throughout going through a wholeprogram of undergrad and
Master's program. In still whenI work with clients that I have
no tools, right, except for theones that intuitively I already
(16:33):
know from observing humanobserving the world. But my
passion is in helping peopleprocess a motion, and amen. That
is what EMDR helps with. Yeah,and because I have in an
intuitive lens, I combine someother stuff with it, to make it
(16:53):
very spiritual. And because ofthe way EMDR is set up the
attachment focused EMDR, wherebasically, people come up, and I
help them with this of resourceteam. So you come up with a
resource team, where you mighthave a nurturing figure two
nurturing figures, two wisefigures, and two protective
(17:16):
figures. And basically, what youwould do is imagine who these
people are individually. Andthen we do a form of bilateral
stimulation, and bilateralstimulation. You know, when we
do it through telehealth, wetend to just do the cross arms
over the shoulders, and you tapone shoulder and tap the other
shoulder. And so when you're Ican explain
(17:39):
to everyone if you're notcoordinated like me, we can I
make this happen. I'm doing iteverybody. I have a following.
Jackie has her hands crossed infront of her chest. So her right
hand is tapping on her left,right below her shoulder. And
(18:00):
the left hand is now on rightbelow her right shoulder. And
she's rotating. Right Yeah,so recently just bilateral
stimulation, it's to stimulatethe right brain and the left
brain, it helps to open upemotion. So when you know if
somebody is experiencingsomething, the trauma gets
stored in the body in fragmentedform, which is stored on one
side of the brain. So when we'reactivating a network from an
(18:22):
incident, whether it's as simpleas a trigger, or like a real
significant event that occurred,you know, we do this bilateral
stimulation to help locate allthe other, you know, events that
are on the same channel as thistrauma. And so what we do with
the resourcing is that you bringup you know, a nurturing figure,
so someone might use a spiritualfigure like Mother Mary, and
(18:46):
imagine Mother Mary and feel herenergy so this is about getting
to a state of being able toaccess the energy of another
person or an angel or some sortof guide
team. Exactly. Grammy Stellaloved my Grammy Stella Who do
you have everyone tell me who isyour person? Lila? I don't know.
(19:09):
So maybe is it someone on? Is ita mystical person?
I don't know. Nurturing anurturing Well, I would think my
mom Oh I lovethat. Okay, so mine would be
Graeme Stella on Earth anddefinitely love that you said
Mother Mary. But I haven'tsomeone new on my team can we do
Angel Amy storytime sure when isthat okay? I cannot wait for
(19:32):
Lila as reaction to this. Okay.
Jackie ready So last week I so II say for those that don't know
me I am clairvoyant where I cansee but I see a lot in my mind's
eye and then blend a feelingwith it. But when I'm sleeping,
(19:53):
I can see see like see things inthe room. See, and I don't
really love that all the time.
Because in you know, at night,it just takes you back when
you're little and like you'veyou know, it's it's it's not
it's just not normal, I'm sorry.
So I had this woman come to me,and I was in a deep sleep, but I
(20:14):
knew the woman was there. And Ithought at first it was an
angel. But I, she told me toroll over onto my right side. So
I rolled over onto my rightside, and I started to feel her.
That's how I gained control. Iknew she was a good spirit. But
I, I she felt so real. Itranslated her as a medical
(20:40):
professional. So I then thoughtI was in the hospital. So I'm
laying on my right side in sheis tending to me. And I thought
I was in the hospital until Ihear Andy snoring. And I hear
Andy like, right, and then I'mlike, wait a minute, I'm in bed.
This is an angel. So I rollover, and then I'm back on my
(21:03):
left side, fall back asleep, andshe starts to shake me. Legit,
like angels don't do this.
Angels aren't like kind of,they're not aggressive. So she's
like shaking my left arm, likeroll over again. But nicely. So
I roll over again. And I canfeel her raking my whole left
side in my sleep. Okay. So Iwake up the next day and I tell
(21:25):
my daughter, because my daughteris very open to this. My husband
just gets completely freaked outlike Do not tell me these
things. He's in the bed. Andhe's watched pulled the guy like
he has students everything's sobad. Like, right. And so I know
it but fear if you don't havefear, it doesn't breed any of
that. It doesn't attract any ofthat. Right? Okay, so I'm
(21:48):
convinced she's an angel, butI'm confused how we feel about
this Jackie? Good feeling. Iknow you're really open. I know
you're fine with it, it getseven better. Okay, so I so I am
convinced she's an angel. Butthen she's like, was a little
too aggressive to be an angel.
(22:11):
And so I she came back to me notlast night the night before. And
I hear her voice. And but beforeI heard her voice, I translate
her as an indigenous woman. Soshe had bare feet, no shoes on.
And she was she's just like,like my belt. For those that
don't know me. I'm like, fullfigured five foot two woman. And
(22:34):
she was awesome. And she cameback. And she says to me, she
says, I'm here to help you. Tellme what you need. You can ask me
for anything. I roll over. And Isay to myself, I want to lose 50
pounds. Right? She hasn't comeback since she got gonna come
(23:02):
back. She's gonna tell me whatto do. Right? It's gonna be
probably a lot of walking andraking leaves Lila. But yeah, so
we're gonna let this unfold. Andthen in future podcasts. I'll
let you know the story of Amy'sindigenous woman. Right? And
it's like, so Okay, so this ishow I got here. And I am going
(23:24):
to start stop talking. Becausethis is Jackie show not mine. So
she's on my team Jackie. She'son my team girl. It's
amazing. So this is what we'relooking for is that. So when you
can connect to her to her? Yeah.
And you feel how she feels. Andbasically for a nurturing figure
it would be I would have theclient come up with a figure.
(23:46):
And then imagine this, thisspiritual figure this whoever
could be somebody alive orsomeone that's passed away, I'm
doing it bring up the feeling ofwhat they feel like. And once
you have a felt sense of it,then you start doing the
bilateral.
Oh, so can I do this at home?
Jackie?
So this is a great question. Andone of the things that we really
(24:09):
I think a lot of us need is tobring in positive emotion in our
body so that it can you knowlower the stress response I
think so many people arestressed out right now with
everything that's going on ohstress. So if you can do that on
a daily basis, and even juststart your day out with that,
that can completely change yourday. So you're accessing a
(24:29):
higher state you're feeling somesort of calm you're sending a
signal to the brain that you'resafe. And then you know your
your day will unfold in a in acompletely different way. And
then so in for uswhen we're doing this we're
picturing this nurturing we'retrying to get a real feel of
this yes during person. Exactly.
Youdon't I'm having an aha moment.
(24:49):
So when I was a little girl Iwanted like boss mom, like my
mother has a us in this isn't toput a dig on my beautiful
mother. But like this womanfeels like someone that she's
safe. She takes like she takescontrols like rollover. Angels
come and they flutter in andthey're light and they're
(25:14):
bright. Right? This is likegrounded and like I got you
Angela Amy, like, if shecould maybe she could be more of
a protector type of figure inyour body is going to know just
in terms of what we're using theEMDR for whether you know when
she'll come in. And so maybeI'll just explain a little bit
(25:35):
about how that could kind ofplay out. Yeah. So once you do
that, we come up with two wisefigures, two nurturing figures,
two protective figures,typically, because when someone
has experienced some pain, oryou know, chronically in their
lives, they were meant to feel acertain type of way, negative
way throughout their lives, theyprobably didn't get nurturing
(25:57):
very much, or they probablydidn't have anyone that had
their back or protected them. Sowe bring in these figures so
that we can create a feeling ofsomeone has my back in my own
body. And this is where epigenetics commit comes in. Which
is why and this is differentfrom EMDR. This is the genetics.
(26:21):
So basically, it's just verysimple. It's just that we in you
know, this is that when wecreate an experience in our
body, our brain does not care ifit's happened or not. It's just,
I just really talked about it,I do it. I just know how to do
it. In assist the client on howto heal themselves. I don't know
how to put big words to what Ido. It's all psychic. And yeah,
(26:44):
yeah. So okay, I love that,Jackie.
Yeah. And just to bring it intoI mean, this is just a more
scientific word that people liketo know that there's science
behind this, that yeah, it isthe mix between the spiritual
and scientific because, youknow, even though we can access
a feeling in our body, and youknow, as I explain how it might
(27:09):
unfold in it in a session, maybeI'll just do that now. So then,
so we can have a betterunderstanding. So after you
create all the, the team, theresource team, and really,
really feel it so so you're ableto access those feelings, even
if it's just for a split second,because a lot of people it might
take some time to be able tolike sit in a feeling of love
(27:32):
because their nervous systemcan't handle that yet, because
they're so used to cyclingthrough shame, guilt, pain,
overstimulation, fight flight.
So they have to find the lovewithin.
Exactly and, and, and without,because we're connected to
everything.
Right. So. So I'm slowing youdown, just to make sure I
(27:52):
understand is, so they would saythey say its highest and best
for them to feel love. Theywould first like maybe think of,
or draw their or lean intotheir, their person on their
team. That's the nurturer.
So they wouldn't even doanything yet. So I'm going to
(28:14):
just basically, so a firstsession, I'll just, we'll talk
and I'll get some information,I'll get like who they are, who
they are in relationships, whattheir past experiences have
been, like anything significantthat they would like me to know.
And as they're explaining thatI'm listening, and then I'm also
listening from an intuitiveplace. And understanding again,
(28:35):
like I was saying, what whatpatterns did they find
themselves in? Where are theygetting stuck? Where are their
triggers, and kind of knowing inthe back of my mind, what their
patterns could be based on whattheir triggers are. And in so
after that, a session or two ofcollecting a history, then we
would go in and build this teamthat might take a few sessions,
(28:57):
one or two sessions. And so oncethey have the team, then we
could be ready to start. And ineverybody takes a little bit
different times everybody's atdifferent places. So it might
take you know, a few weeks to afew months to do this history,
you know, portion of it, andthen also building the
(29:17):
resources, but some people mightjust be ready immediately. It
just depends on where they are.
But after the resource team isis established, then we would go
in and basically work with onememory. And I like to be very
fluid with it. So someone mightcome into session and just say,
I had this incident. This friendreached out to me the other day,
and she really triggered me andI was made to feel like I did
(29:41):
something wrong. So anyway, sowhat we would do is identify
what was the thing what was themost triggering part of that
experience? And she might say itwas when she walked away and she
closed the door in her car andthat Was it and I saw the look
on her face. And so I'mbasically noting that down that
(30:02):
that was the trigger. And, andthen once we have that, then we
get a sense of what emotion whenshe thinks of that, and she kind
of will bring her to that pointthrough like a visualization,
she might close her eyes and,and recall that. And she might
say, it makes me feel reallyangry and and then we identify
(30:23):
the anger, where does she feelit in her body? And then what is
the belief she has aboutherself, when this her friend
closed, the door of the cardrove away, and you know, the
look on her face as she wasdriving away? And she would say
something like, exactly, it'sconnecting to those limiting
beliefs. I'm not worthy, I didsomething or I did something
(30:46):
wrong. It can trigger someabandonment stuff. So then
basically, what we're doing isactivating that we're
activating. We're trying to gether to a state of activation
where she's triggered enough,because we do have to have some
activation for a person tolocate where the root is of
this. Yeah, and but we want themto be in a safe threshold.
(31:09):
So if you guys just kind ofjumped into the podcast in a
confused by this, go back to theintroductory episode where Lila
and I talk about the cells inwhat happens when you little
Angelina, that's me goes over. Italked about myself in the third
person goes over this in thatepisode, and it just gives you a
(31:32):
base of what exact like, likethe root of what Jackie just
explained. Yes, that's reallygood. Okay. Yeah.
So so then what we do is, is, Iwould, you know, bring it back
up and have them basically it's,you go into it again. So we're
bringing up the event thattriggered them. And then as
they're, they're closing theireyes, I might say, tune into
(31:54):
your body, what do you feel likewhat's coming up. And then I
would say something like, tracethat back in time to the
earliest memory that comes up,where you felt the same way and
just basically let whatever comeup, come up. And then you know,
they might be there for a minuteor so. And then most, all, most
of the time the clients likeyep, I'm this age, and I'm at
(32:14):
this spot. And this is where Ifelt. And so then it's
activating more of some sort ofemotion there. And then so what
we would do with the EMDR is, isgo back to the earliest and most
triggering memory, it's similarto tapping right,
so So I always say we're gonnago back to the the very first
time that you ever felt sad.
What's like, I would say tosomeone, what's the first, you
(32:36):
know, memory? And they'll say,Oh, when I was three, blah,
blah, blah, click Yes.
And yeah, in the great thingabout the body is that we don't
need the mind to do it. Yeah,you know, especially people that
have that personality, wherethey're like, very, very
intellectual and very smart.
That's actually we're actuallywanting to calm that down and
allow the body to take us there.
(32:59):
Yeah, so that can be a littlebit of work to help people know
that your body knows, and wedon't need your brain to figure
it out.
So Lila, let's talk a little bitabout, like, people we've met
along our journey that thiswould be great for like OCD, or
extreme anxiety, panic disorder,as
(33:19):
well, as we know, all of thesesort of unaddressed issues that
live inside the body, as you saythat you don't know whether
they're physical or emotional,they can definitely, you know,
present themselves as physicalpain, you know, right.
Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. So Iwould say anxiety. I don't know,
(33:39):
Jackie, do you do anything withpeople that have, you know,
autoimmune sort of disorders?
I think so. I wouldn't sayspecifically that. So. Okay. I
think anybody that has anythinggoing on in their body, what we
would do is address theemotional piece, because there's
an emotional piece toeverything. And with autoimmune,
(34:02):
you know, I can't guaranteethey're going to be healed from
their autoimmune, but I willdefinitely confidently say that
I'm sure there's traumaassociated somewhere. And the
best possible thing that we cando, no matter what is to help
clear that the emotion that'sstuck in the body,
right. So if you're listening tothis, and there's a pattern of
(34:24):
like, what could be patterns? Somany things?
Well, you could always be thefriend that ends up Yeah, ending
in the parking right,someone drives away. Yeah, like,
that's abandonment, right. So ifyou know, you know, patterns of
even dating, like the wrong,like, are the same kind of
person over and over again.
(34:45):
Exactly. Right. Or dealing withnarcissism or? Yeah, anxiety is
a big one for people. That'sespecially now Right. Yeah.
Because it really sits onunsafe, anything that's
unpredictable. All right,unsafe, right. And we live in a
land of safety. Right? Not sohumans just struggle with that.
(35:08):
And you know, that would be melaying in the bed the lady comes
in, I'm like, hi, I want to beyour friend and and he's like,
I'm out of here. You know?
I'm laughing too because so Ithink one of the things that I
love that you said that about,you know patterns and and
(35:28):
narcissism because I think thatthere is that narcissistic
codependent dynamic that playsout so frequently and I'm
smiling about it because I knowit's a very sensitive topic but
I love one of the my passions ishelping people with codependency
is like, yeah, evolving out ofbeing in that codependent way
(35:49):
have anarcissist relationship in your
life, please go see Jack.
Listen, I I am very picky aboutlike, who I'll let dip into my
energy. And I would let I wouldlet Jackie work on me. Like I
would work with Jackie. I'mlike, Super, thank you. You're
(36:09):
welcome. And I mean that. Soshe's really, really good at
what she does. I haven't donethis with her. But we've done
some other things together. Andshe she is a master with that
emotional component. And Ireally, really, really trust
your intuition too. Thank you.
You're so welcome. So welcome.
(36:31):
I so appreciate ya.
So this was fun today, Jackie.
Yeah, little chit chat. So thankyou so much for coming and being
here. And, you know, you justgave us like a ton of awesome
information. I actually need tolisten to this. Cuz like, I want
to take it all in myself. Let usknow how can people find you if
(36:52):
they want to like book anappointment? Or maybe follow you
on social media? Yeah, soyou can go to my website. It's
heart whispers healing.com. AgARTWHISPERS healing.com. In the
same for Instagram. It's atheart whispers healing. Very
good. Awesome. Thankyou, Jackie. Thank you for
(37:14):
listening. Thank you so much.
We hope you found thisenlightening. Please be sure to
subscribe to our podcast. We canbe found wherever you get your
podcasts,and Lila and I are on Instagram
at spill the ginger tea podcast.
If you have any questions,comments or ideas for future
(37:35):
shows, please message us there.
Lila and either Lila and I willdefinitely get back to you. We
will enter you back. So thanksfor joining us. Until next time,
be well
If you have the power to heal and change your life,
(00:06):
you might not have found it yet,but it's out there and it exists
for you.
Our intention is to have alittle fun while introducing you
to various new ways of healing.
Welcome to the spill, ginger teapodcast. Hi, everybody. I'm
Angel, Amy. I am a psychicmedium and a life coach. I work
(00:28):
with angels, spirit guides andloved ones in heaven. And I've
just love everything and allthings spiritual. Hi,
I'm Lila, I began my healingjourney looking for relief from
physical pain. And I'm alwayswilling to try something new to
feel better and improve myself.
(00:50):
We're going to be discussingalternative health techniques.
So if you're looking to heal thephysical, mental or spiritual
parts of yourself, or if you'rejust curious about what to try,
or what can help you live yourbest life. You're absolutely in
the right place. So welcome.
Today we have a very specialguest. We will be talking with
(01:15):
Jackie kono in she is a holisticpsychotherapist. She has a
private practice in which she isan EMDR practitioner among some
other things. So Hi, Jackie. Sonice to have you today. Hi,
Angel. Amy. Hi, Lila. Hi,Jackie.
(01:38):
Thanks so much for coming today.
Would you like to start bytelling us a little bit about
yourself?
Yes, I'd love to. So I My nameis Jackie, like you said, and I
have a private practice. Rightnow it's through telehealth. And
I do love incorporating a lot ofdifferent energy modalities,
(01:58):
including yoga, EmotionalFreedom Technique, attachment
focused EMDR. Other mindfulnesspractice is along with more
Western based psychodynamictherapies and existential
phenomenology, things like that.
And I'd say that I'm verypassionate about bringing them
together and helping us get to aplace where people are really
(02:20):
able to see significant changein their own bodies and, and
really heal, because I thinkthat that we have the ability to
do that. And yes, soI hear all those big words. And
I'm like, Ooh, this is a juicy.
She's like a master of theemotional component. And I've,
(02:42):
I've had the pleasure of workingwith you. So I know that you are
very, very gifted with theemotional component, because
you're super intuitive. And somepeople get a little confused
about the definition ofclairvoyance. So we know Lila
that clairvoyant people can see.
And they usually can seeoutside, like normal space and
(03:06):
time. But also to see the rootof all things or see like the
root in human behavior is alsoclairvoyance. And I know that
you have really mastered thatside of you. And I think it's
super cool.
(03:28):
Thank you. Yeah, I think thatthat is something that has
continued to get developed. Andin the work that I'm doing with
clients, it's, it comes intohand, it comes in handy. So
being able to understand thepatterns that exist with people,
when they walk in the door, andhow they are in relationship to
other people kind of whichposition they take in a
(03:50):
relationship and in what thatlook like looks like and usually
that can determine what types ofconflicts that people are
getting into what types ofthings that are causing them to
get stuck in. That's where wego, we'll look there to help
process emotion and help themget past these blocks that are
showing up for them.
(04:10):
Have you heard about this? Lila?
I have not. You haven't heardabout it at all. I know about it
through some other healers. Ihave. I haven't done a session
before. I haven't done EMDR yet.
I'm curious about it, though.
Yes. But you were telling me astory about 60 minutes? Yes.
(04:30):
That EMDR the what I've heardabout it, and what I saw in 60
minutes was Prince Harry doingor participating in EMDR and
that that was something that hewas using. I think he talked a
lot about you know, childhoodtrauma. I don't know if that's
the sameOh, yeah. EMD has gone right in
(04:51):
there and getting that traumaPrince Harry. Oh, there's no no
there's no trauma there. No.
Right right Jack Why don't yougo right in and get that trauma
if someone Yeah, that'sthat's what is so exciting that
you know, he opens up indiscloses that just to break the
stigma, I think so many peoplecan benefit from this. And, and
really the tools are here wehave them. And people are really
(05:14):
starting to learn, again that wedo have the capacity to heal,
our bodies are dying for it,people are starting to feel so
many symptoms coming up andstart coming to the surface,
which is such a great sign. Andonce we start to pay attention
to that and pay attention to thebody, then we really can step
into a totally new experience ofour lives. So,
(05:37):
so the EMDR that the attachmentfocused EMDR that you practice,
is that different?
Yeah. So there is there is EMDRand EMDR, Eye Movement
Desensitization andReprocessing, is it started in
the 90s. And it came aboutbecause this, I think she's a
psychologist, Francine Shapiro,she recognized that when she
(06:01):
experienced something, anemotional event, she was walking
outside, and she noticed hereyes were moving back and forth.
And it helped her process thetrauma. Interesting. And so then
she since then developed thisthis model called EMDR, with
some other layers added to it.
And then so basically whatpeople would do is, if they had
an incident that theyexperienced, like a car accident
(06:24):
or some sort of event thatoccurred that left them feeling
overstimulated, or basically atthat moment, they didn't have
the resources to process theemotion that was coming up. So
they go into a state of fightflight. And then what happens
after that is all of theemotion, the energy that didn't
ever get to get processed outgets stored in the body. And so
(06:45):
this is what is so amazing aboutour bodies is that we get it
recognizes that wait a second,you're going through this event,
we can't possibly process thisright now we just need to get to
safety. And when you know, afteryour nervous system settles
down, then you can identify orlocate what is remaining,
(07:07):
because it'll show up in theform of, you know, a trigger or
like a recurrent recurring, likea memory or something like that,
that'll show up. It's so EMDR,in and of itself is going into
those events that have happened,and just providing the space to
process a motion that is stuckin the body.
(07:29):
So I hear all this and Iactually hang out with a
scientist, we're quite a combotogether. My sister in law is
one of my best friends and sheis a scientist. And so I would
think that like a neuroscientist, or would would study
(07:52):
this, no, has, like, you know,the study of the brain. So it
what is this backed by scienceat all? Do we know?
Absolutely. This is this isbacked by science, for sure, it
is one of the most evidencebased practices that is around
for processing trauma. So Imean, I happen to be very
energetic in the work that I do.
And also this this model is verymuch has a lot of research
(08:16):
behind it so that you can easilyresearch. You know, go to EMDR,
emdria.com, EMDR, eye a.com andlook up those different research
methods.
Yeah. So what is a typicalsession like? So I know, in the
(08:39):
tapping session, I explained topeople like you sit across from
me, and you mirror me, as yourepeat after me, as I say,
different phrases and differentfeelings and emotions. While we
tap, you tap on yourself, and Itap on mine. And but then
there's an intuitive piece thatI bring in psychic peace with
(09:02):
it, to really feel the energeticbody and lead the person into
what they're ready to let go of.
How is EMDR similar anddifferent?
Yeah, so So EMDR you know, Ithink what I will say because
this is the one that I practicethe most most is the attachment
(09:22):
focused EMDR. And the the reasonwhy it's called attachment
focused is that people that comein with that haven't had luck
processing, you know, someemotions and traumas from the
past, they will come in to usethe attachment focused EMDR
because it helps to really getat the early conditioning. I
(09:45):
know I'm kind of not answeringfully, but I'll get there.
Yeah, so it's okay, I'mfollowing. So like, kind of like
a rewiring.
Yeah. So basically, just underthat notion that from birth to
age seven, we learn about who weare and how we are to be In the
world, based, you know, from ourprimary caregivers, and we learn
(10:05):
how to be in relationships, andwhatever has occurred during
that timeframe, then we, it canstay in the body, or we can
develop beliefs about ourselves.
And if there were anysignificant events that caused
us to experience a traumaticevent or traumatic situation,
thenlike sadness, anger, regret,
blame, shame, all of that youmean anything, that and then if
(10:29):
there's a specific event, like acar accident or something, then
that will add to it. And if thathappens during the developmental
period, birthdates, seven, itcan stay in the body in a in a
deeper way, basically, andaffect the brain. And so, you
know, there also can besituations where people feel,
(10:50):
you know, just based on thepersonalities of the people in
their household, they can assumea certain role, like maybe
they're the burden in thefamily, they're the one that
takes the responsibility for thefamily dynamic. And then they
they continue to grow up feelinglike they are a burden. So
something even just like that,where they have all these like
(11:11):
little instances that they mightfeel, have led themselves to
believe that they are a burden.
Like they're the way the dadyelled at them, or looked at
them in a certain type of way.
And then in their bodies, theyexperienced shame or so if that
happens enough, then that canturn into a pattern. And EMDR
can also be used for somethinglike that.
(11:36):
Okay. And so, like, what would Ibe if I called you to make an
appointment? Like, what's thegeneral thing people are are
calling you about? What are theyfinding in their lives that
they're reaching out to you?
Yeah, so a few different things.
So some people will come in andsay, I'm really just looking to
overcome these patterns that Ican continue to find myself in,
(11:57):
I'm feeling depressed andfeeling anxious, I'm getting
triggered a lot. In in. So Imight say that EMDR could be
really helpful for that. So theymight not necessarily come in
looking for EMDR. But becausethey're presenting in such a way
that their body is signaling tothem, it's ready to do some
work. Basically, what we woulddo is use that modality as a way
(12:19):
to understand and open up whatis the trigger? What is the
body's signaling to you how, howdo we get to the root to
understand what's really goingon so that we can clear what's
happening.
So I recently started to workwith a client that has extreme
(12:42):
OCD, in she has an extreme fearof throwing up. And she really,
really, really wanted to workwith me in person, which I'm
doing a lot on line right now.
But the location in which sheworks provided us to meet. And
so I have been working with herusing it. When I've said tapping
(13:07):
for those that don't know whatit is. It's a motion Emotional
Freedom Technique. But really,you know, it's it's similar but
different than EMDR. But where Iwant to go with this is, is that
when I leaned into her energy,and this is the thing that
Jackie consents to, is, she hadsomething attached to her. She
(13:31):
had like a darker being. And soI asked her, if I was looking at
me, talk to me, baby, talk tome. No,
I just want to hear more. Allright.
Where am I making youuncomfortable? Okay. So I know
this, I don't mean to scarepeople. But so listen, you're
(13:54):
not all walking around withthings attached to you. Let's
just be real here. Is there anymoment angels Laila to stubborn
angels with big wings and theirredheads go figure their gingers
Lila? Love you. So, you know,she had a big demon beast. She
(14:21):
really did. I'm sweating tellingthe story. And I just, you know,
connected to her. We wereoutside we had no shoes on on
the grass. And I started to justchannel light all through her
and really detached this thingin send a packing. And then we
(14:44):
started to do the healing work.
So she felt a lot better justfrom that before we even got
into the wouldn't, right.
Yeah, so have you had anyexperiences like this like cuz
you're super connected to,I think not not like that I do,
I definitely believe that therecould be things energetically
(15:07):
there that will keep peoplestuck where they just can't get
out of that pattern where theyneed something different or they
need like a blast of light likeAmy is giving? For sure. Like,
yeah.
So, you know, I just think it'sgood to have all different
(15:27):
avenues like all roads lead toRome. And this is why I say it's
a recipe. It's a special sauce,different people do different
things. She's actually nowseeing someone that does. I
don't know, there's so manydifferent modalities, but it has
to do with neuroscience, and butshe didn't call it EMDR. But
when I looked it up, I was like,Oh, this is similar. Okay,
(15:50):
so what drew you to EMDR?
So I, it works. It works. It'sit's,
but you know, we're in practicedoing other things before you
started with that. Yeah, soI was doing traditional
psychotherapy, and thenincorporating some energy
medicine techniques and doing alot of tapping. So okay, any
throughout my training, I'velearned that there's been pieces
(16:11):
that are missing in therapysessions, in my own experience
with therapy. Oh, yeah, it's,it's, it's like, where's the
processing happening. And Ididn't understand that
throughout going through a wholeprogram of undergrad and
Master's program. In still whenI work with clients that I have
no tools, right, except for theones that intuitively I already
(16:33):
know from observing humanobserving the world. But my
passion is in helping peopleprocess a motion, and amen. That
is what EMDR helps with. Yeah,and because I have in an
intuitive lens, I combine someother stuff with it, to make it
(16:53):
very spiritual. And because ofthe way EMDR is set up the
attachment focused EMDR, wherebasically, people come up, and I
help them with this of resourceteam. So you come up with a
resource team, where you mighthave a nurturing figure two
nurturing figures, two wisefigures, and two protective
(17:16):
figures. And basically, what youwould do is imagine who these
people are individually. Andthen we do a form of bilateral
stimulation, and bilateralstimulation. You know, when we
do it through telehealth, wetend to just do the cross arms
over the shoulders, and you tapone shoulder and tap the other
shoulder. And so when you're Ican explain
(17:39):
to everyone if you're notcoordinated like me, we can I
make this happen. I'm doing iteverybody. I have a following.
Jackie has her hands crossed infront of her chest. So her right
hand is tapping on her left,right below her shoulder. And
(18:00):
the left hand is now on rightbelow her right shoulder. And
she's rotating. Right Yeah,so recently just bilateral
stimulation, it's to stimulatethe right brain and the left
brain, it helps to open upemotion. So when you know if
somebody is experiencingsomething, the trauma gets
stored in the body in fragmentedform, which is stored on one
side of the brain. So when we'reactivating a network from an
(18:22):
incident, whether it's as simpleas a trigger, or like a real
significant event that occurred,you know, we do this bilateral
stimulation to help locate allthe other, you know, events that
are on the same channel as thistrauma. And so what we do with
the resourcing is that you bringup you know, a nurturing figure,
so someone might use a spiritualfigure like Mother Mary, and
(18:46):
imagine Mother Mary and feel herenergy so this is about getting
to a state of being able toaccess the energy of another
person or an angel or some sortof guide
team. Exactly. Grammy Stellaloved my Grammy Stella Who do
you have everyone tell me who isyour person? Lila? I don't know.
(19:09):
So maybe is it someone on? Is ita mystical person?
I don't know. Nurturing anurturing Well, I would think my
mom Oh I lovethat. Okay, so mine would be
Graeme Stella on Earth anddefinitely love that you said
Mother Mary. But I haven'tsomeone new on my team can we do
Angel Amy storytime sure when isthat okay? I cannot wait for
(19:32):
Lila as reaction to this. Okay.
Jackie ready So last week I so II say for those that don't know
me I am clairvoyant where I cansee but I see a lot in my mind's
eye and then blend a feelingwith it. But when I'm sleeping,
(19:53):
I can see see like see things inthe room. See, and I don't
really love that all the time.
Because in you know, at night,it just takes you back when
you're little and like you'veyou know, it's it's it's not
it's just not normal, I'm sorry.
So I had this woman come to me,and I was in a deep sleep, but I
(20:14):
knew the woman was there. And Ithought at first it was an
angel. But I, she told me toroll over onto my right side. So
I rolled over onto my rightside, and I started to feel her.
That's how I gained control. Iknew she was a good spirit. But
I, I she felt so real. Itranslated her as a medical
(20:40):
professional. So I then thoughtI was in the hospital. So I'm
laying on my right side in sheis tending to me. And I thought
I was in the hospital until Ihear Andy snoring. And I hear
Andy like, right, and then I'mlike, wait a minute, I'm in bed.
This is an angel. So I rollover, and then I'm back on my
(21:03):
left side, fall back asleep, andshe starts to shake me. Legit,
like angels don't do this.
Angels aren't like kind of,they're not aggressive. So she's
like shaking my left arm, likeroll over again. But nicely. So
I roll over again. And I canfeel her raking my whole left
side in my sleep. Okay. So Iwake up the next day and I tell
(21:25):
my daughter, because my daughteris very open to this. My husband
just gets completely freaked outlike Do not tell me these
things. He's in the bed. Andhe's watched pulled the guy like
he has students everything's sobad. Like, right. And so I know
it but fear if you don't havefear, it doesn't breed any of
that. It doesn't attract any ofthat. Right? Okay, so I'm
(21:48):
convinced she's an angel, butI'm confused how we feel about
this Jackie? Good feeling. Iknow you're really open. I know
you're fine with it, it getseven better. Okay, so I so I am
convinced she's an angel. Butthen she's like, was a little
too aggressive to be an angel.
(22:11):
And so I she came back to me notlast night the night before. And
I hear her voice. And but beforeI heard her voice, I translate
her as an indigenous woman. Soshe had bare feet, no shoes on.
And she was she's just like,like my belt. For those that
don't know me. I'm like, fullfigured five foot two woman. And
(22:34):
she was awesome. And she cameback. And she says to me, she
says, I'm here to help you. Tellme what you need. You can ask me
for anything. I roll over. And Isay to myself, I want to lose 50
pounds. Right? She hasn't comeback since she got gonna come
(23:02):
back. She's gonna tell me whatto do. Right? It's gonna be
probably a lot of walking andraking leaves Lila. But yeah, so
we're gonna let this unfold. Andthen in future podcasts. I'll
let you know the story of Amy'sindigenous woman. Right? And
it's like, so Okay, so this ishow I got here. And I am going
(23:24):
to start stop talking. Becausethis is Jackie show not mine. So
she's on my team Jackie. She'son my team girl. It's
amazing. So this is what we'relooking for is that. So when you
can connect to her to her? Yeah.
And you feel how she feels. Andbasically for a nurturing figure
it would be I would have theclient come up with a figure.
(23:46):
And then imagine this, thisspiritual figure this whoever
could be somebody alive orsomeone that's passed away, I'm
doing it bring up the feeling ofwhat they feel like. And once
you have a felt sense of it,then you start doing the
bilateral.
Oh, so can I do this at home?
Jackie?
So this is a great question. Andone of the things that we really
(24:09):
I think a lot of us need is tobring in positive emotion in our
body so that it can you knowlower the stress response I
think so many people arestressed out right now with
everything that's going on ohstress. So if you can do that on
a daily basis, and even juststart your day out with that,
that can completely change yourday. So you're accessing a
(24:29):
higher state you're feeling somesort of calm you're sending a
signal to the brain that you'resafe. And then you know your
your day will unfold in a in acompletely different way. And
then so in for uswhen we're doing this we're
picturing this nurturing we'retrying to get a real feel of
this yes during person. Exactly.
Youdon't I'm having an aha moment.
(24:49):
So when I was a little girl Iwanted like boss mom, like my
mother has a us in this isn't toput a dig on my beautiful
mother. But like this womanfeels like someone that she's
safe. She takes like she takescontrols like rollover. Angels
come and they flutter in andthey're light and they're
(25:14):
bright. Right? This is likegrounded and like I got you
Angela Amy, like, if shecould maybe she could be more of
a protector type of figure inyour body is going to know just
in terms of what we're using theEMDR for whether you know when
she'll come in. And so maybeI'll just explain a little bit
(25:35):
about how that could kind ofplay out. Yeah. So once you do
that, we come up with two wisefigures, two nurturing figures,
two protective figures,typically, because when someone
has experienced some pain, oryou know, chronically in their
lives, they were meant to feel acertain type of way, negative
way throughout their lives, theyprobably didn't get nurturing
(25:57):
very much, or they probablydidn't have anyone that had
their back or protected them. Sowe bring in these figures so
that we can create a feeling ofsomeone has my back in my own
body. And this is where epigenetics commit comes in. Which
is why and this is differentfrom EMDR. This is the genetics.
(26:21):
So basically, it's just verysimple. It's just that we in you
know, this is that when wecreate an experience in our
body, our brain does not care ifit's happened or not. It's just,
I just really talked about it,I do it. I just know how to do
it. In assist the client on howto heal themselves. I don't know
how to put big words to what Ido. It's all psychic. And yeah,
(26:44):
yeah. So okay, I love that,Jackie.
Yeah. And just to bring it intoI mean, this is just a more
scientific word that people liketo know that there's science
behind this, that yeah, it isthe mix between the spiritual
and scientific because, youknow, even though we can access
a feeling in our body, and youknow, as I explain how it might
(27:09):
unfold in it in a session, maybeI'll just do that now. So then,
so we can have a betterunderstanding. So after you
create all the, the team, theresource team, and really,
really feel it so so you're ableto access those feelings, even
if it's just for a split second,because a lot of people it might
take some time to be able tolike sit in a feeling of love
(27:32):
because their nervous systemcan't handle that yet, because
they're so used to cyclingthrough shame, guilt, pain,
overstimulation, fight flight.
So they have to find the lovewithin.
Exactly and, and, and without,because we're connected to
everything.
Right. So. So I'm slowing youdown, just to make sure I
(27:52):
understand is, so they would saythey say its highest and best
for them to feel love. Theywould first like maybe think of,
or draw their or lean intotheir, their person on their
team. That's the nurturer.
So they wouldn't even doanything yet. So I'm going to
(28:14):
just basically, so a firstsession, I'll just, we'll talk
and I'll get some information,I'll get like who they are, who
they are in relationships, whattheir past experiences have
been, like anything significantthat they would like me to know.
And as they're explaining thatI'm listening, and then I'm also
listening from an intuitiveplace. And understanding again,
(28:35):
like I was saying, what whatpatterns did they find
themselves in? Where are theygetting stuck? Where are their
triggers, and kind of knowing inthe back of my mind, what their
patterns could be based on whattheir triggers are. And in so
after that, a session or two ofcollecting a history, then we
would go in and build this teamthat might take a few sessions,
(28:57):
one or two sessions. And so oncethey have the team, then we
could be ready to start. And ineverybody takes a little bit
different times everybody's atdifferent places. So it might
take you know, a few weeks to afew months to do this history,
you know, portion of it, andthen also building the
(29:17):
resources, but some people mightjust be ready immediately. It
just depends on where they are.
But after the resource team isis established, then we would go
in and basically work with onememory. And I like to be very
fluid with it. So someone mightcome into session and just say,
I had this incident. This friendreached out to me the other day,
and she really triggered me andI was made to feel like I did
(29:41):
something wrong. So anyway, sowhat we would do is identify
what was the thing what was themost triggering part of that
experience? And she might say itwas when she walked away and she
closed the door in her car andthat Was it and I saw the look
on her face. And so I'mbasically noting that down that
(30:02):
that was the trigger. And, andthen once we have that, then we
get a sense of what emotion whenshe thinks of that, and she kind
of will bring her to that pointthrough like a visualization,
she might close her eyes and,and recall that. And she might
say, it makes me feel reallyangry and and then we identify
(30:23):
the anger, where does she feelit in her body? And then what is
the belief she has aboutherself, when this her friend
closed, the door of the cardrove away, and you know, the
look on her face as she wasdriving away? And she would say
something like, exactly, it'sconnecting to those limiting
beliefs. I'm not worthy, I didsomething or I did something
(30:46):
wrong. It can trigger someabandonment stuff. So then
basically, what we're doing isactivating that we're
activating. We're trying to gether to a state of activation
where she's triggered enough,because we do have to have some
activation for a person tolocate where the root is of
this. Yeah, and but we want themto be in a safe threshold.
(31:09):
So if you guys just kind ofjumped into the podcast in a
confused by this, go back to theintroductory episode where Lila
and I talk about the cells inwhat happens when you little
Angelina, that's me goes over. Italked about myself in the third
person goes over this in thatepisode, and it just gives you a
(31:32):
base of what exact like, likethe root of what Jackie just
explained. Yes, that's reallygood. Okay. Yeah.
So so then what we do is, is, Iwould, you know, bring it back
up and have them basically it's,you go into it again. So we're
bringing up the event thattriggered them. And then as
they're, they're closing theireyes, I might say, tune into
(31:54):
your body, what do you feel likewhat's coming up. And then I
would say something like, tracethat back in time to the
earliest memory that comes up,where you felt the same way and
just basically let whatever comeup, come up. And then you know,
they might be there for a minuteor so. And then most, all, most
of the time the clients likeyep, I'm this age, and I'm at
(32:14):
this spot. And this is where Ifelt. And so then it's
activating more of some sort ofemotion there. And then so what
we would do with the EMDR is, isgo back to the earliest and most
triggering memory, it's similarto tapping right,
so So I always say we're gonnago back to the the very first
time that you ever felt sad.
What's like, I would say tosomeone, what's the first, you
(32:36):
know, memory? And they'll say,Oh, when I was three, blah,
blah, blah, click Yes.
And yeah, in the great thingabout the body is that we don't
need the mind to do it. Yeah,you know, especially people that
have that personality, wherethey're like, very, very
intellectual and very smart.
That's actually we're actuallywanting to calm that down and
allow the body to take us there.
(32:59):
Yeah, so that can be a littlebit of work to help people know
that your body knows, and wedon't need your brain to figure
it out.
So Lila, let's talk a little bitabout, like, people we've met
along our journey that thiswould be great for like OCD, or
extreme anxiety, panic disorder,as
(33:19):
well, as we know, all of thesesort of unaddressed issues that
live inside the body, as you saythat you don't know whether
they're physical or emotional,they can definitely, you know,
present themselves as physicalpain, you know, right.
Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. So Iwould say anxiety. I don't know,
(33:39):
Jackie, do you do anything withpeople that have, you know,
autoimmune sort of disorders?
I think so. I wouldn't sayspecifically that. So. Okay. I
think anybody that has anythinggoing on in their body, what we
would do is address theemotional piece, because there's
an emotional piece toeverything. And with autoimmune,
(34:02):
you know, I can't guaranteethey're going to be healed from
their autoimmune, but I willdefinitely confidently say that
I'm sure there's traumaassociated somewhere. And the
best possible thing that we cando, no matter what is to help
clear that the emotion that'sstuck in the body,
right. So if you're listening tothis, and there's a pattern of
(34:24):
like, what could be patterns? Somany things?
Well, you could always be thefriend that ends up Yeah, ending
in the parking right,someone drives away. Yeah, like,
that's abandonment, right. So ifyou know, you know, patterns of
even dating, like the wrong,like, are the same kind of
person over and over again.
(34:45):
Exactly. Right. Or dealing withnarcissism or? Yeah, anxiety is
a big one for people. That'sespecially now Right. Yeah.
Because it really sits onunsafe, anything that's
unpredictable. All right,unsafe, right. And we live in a
land of safety. Right? Not sohumans just struggle with that.
(35:08):
And you know, that would be melaying in the bed the lady comes
in, I'm like, hi, I want to beyour friend and and he's like,
I'm out of here. You know?
I'm laughing too because so Ithink one of the things that I
love that you said that about,you know patterns and and
(35:28):
narcissism because I think thatthere is that narcissistic
codependent dynamic that playsout so frequently and I'm
smiling about it because I knowit's a very sensitive topic but
I love one of the my passions ishelping people with codependency
is like, yeah, evolving out ofbeing in that codependent way
(35:49):
have anarcissist relationship in your
life, please go see Jack.
Listen, I I am very picky aboutlike, who I'll let dip into my
energy. And I would let I wouldlet Jackie work on me. Like I
would work with Jackie. I'mlike, Super, thank you. You're
(36:09):
welcome. And I mean that. Soshe's really, really good at
what she does. I haven't donethis with her. But we've done
some other things together. Andshe she is a master with that
emotional component. And Ireally, really, really trust
your intuition too. Thank you.
You're so welcome. So welcome.
(36:31):
I so appreciate ya.
So this was fun today, Jackie.
Yeah, little chit chat. So thankyou so much for coming and being
here. And, you know, you justgave us like a ton of awesome
information. I actually need tolisten to this. Cuz like, I want
to take it all in myself. Let usknow how can people find you if
(36:52):
they want to like book anappointment? Or maybe follow you
on social media? Yeah, soyou can go to my website. It's
heart whispers healing.com. AgARTWHISPERS healing.com. In the
same for Instagram. It's atheart whispers healing. Very
good. Awesome. Thankyou, Jackie. Thank you for
(37:14):
listening. Thank you so much.
We hope you found thisenlightening. Please be sure to
subscribe to our podcast. We canbe found wherever you get your
podcasts,and Lila and I are on Instagram
at spill the ginger tea podcast.
If you have any questions,comments or ideas for future
(37:35):
shows, please message us there.
Lila and either Lila and I willdefinitely get back to you. We
will enter you back. So thanksfor joining us. Until next time,
be well
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