July 26, 2023 • 31 mins
Deacon Angelo Giambrone was ordained a permanent deacon for the Diocese of Orange in 2015. He is assigned to St. Vincent de Paul Church in Huntington Beach. He and wife Cindy have supported several ministries in the parish, including bringing communion to the sick and homebound and as chairs of the annual September-fest. They also run the Alpha Marriage course at the parish and are involved with the Worldwide Marriage Encounter ministry. They have three children. In this episode, their guest is Fr. Mike Ravenkamp.
Wedding Banns airs live weekdays at 7:30am and3:00pm Pacific Time go to spiritfilledevents.com website or download our Spirit Filled Radio App for Android or Apple Devices.
APPLE LINK FOR APP
GOOGLE PLAY LINK FOR APP
Archives of shows from Spirit Filled Radio are available on podcast at spiritfilledevents.com
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Intro Music (00:00):
The union of your spirits here is caused him to
(00:08):
remain whenever two or more aregathered in His name.
Intro (00:19):
What is God's plan for marriage? Get ready for some
real talk straight from theheart. Spirit filled radio is
proud to present wedding bands,the program that's all about
marriage with your hosts, DeaconAngelo and Cindy Cimbrone.
Listen as they share theirstories of navigating marriage
and family life with all thejoys and challenges that come
(00:40):
with it. Here's your host to getus started.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (00:43):
Hi, we are Cindy and Deacon Angelo
Giambrone. This show is calledwedding bands. today's show
we'll be meeting because a veryspecial guest, Father Mike Raven
camp. And before we get started,we remind you that we are not
marriage counselors, just amarried couple sharing our
experiences. And those areinvited guests like father, Mike
today. And if you like our showwedding bands, please share it
(01:05):
with your friends and family.
Remember, you can find us onspirit fool radio, or listen
anytime by downloading the showas a podcast from that website,
or your favorite podcastwebsite.
Cindy Giambrone (01:16):
Angelo and I start each morning with couple
prayer. And here's our favoriteline from that prayer that we
share. As we feel it relates toall of you listening as a
married couple. And this comesfrom the letters to Hebrews 313
In the name of the Father andthe Son and the Holy Spirit.
Amen. Dear Lord, please help usto remember this as a
(01:38):
sacramental couple that everyday, as long as this today
lasts, that we keep encouragingone another. We ask this through
Jesus Holy Name, Amen. And fortoday's show, we have a very
special guest Father Mike Ravencamp, who will share his
experiences ministering toengaged and married couples, as
(02:00):
a priest and Pastor and his pastexperience in ministries to
couples such as worldwideMarriage Encounter.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (02:07):
And first off Father, may we just
call you father Mike,
Unknown (02:11):
that's fine.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (02:12):
Okay, great. Father, Mike, might you
please tell us a little bitabout yourself?
Unknown (02:17):
Well, I'm 71 years old.
I'm the oldest of five children.
I grew up in the San GabrielValley, kind of in the 60s of
the 70s. My brothers and sisterslive normal lives. They dated
they did sports, they did allthe things that young people do.
(02:38):
I'm nearly blind. So a lot ofthat was limited. You know,
growing up in California, you'renobody nothing if you can't
drive somewhere on your own. Somy ability to circulate was
severely limited, but Icompensated with that with all
my studies. I went to Lavernecollege, got a degree in
(03:03):
history. And then I studiedRehabilitation Psychology for a
while. And eventually I went towork in an independent living
center. And what I did, therewas I, Bay shirt, doors and so
forth, are looking forarchitectural barriers. And I
would make reports to agovernment agency that we got
(03:28):
our money for HUD to do this.
And I entered the Society ofJesus in 1981. So after my entry
in the society, I've been allover North America. I've been
from Honduras, to Alaska, andI've seen much of Canada, in
terms of my priesthood, justcelebrated my 27th year of
(03:52):
priesthood. And about half ofthat was in parish ministry. So
I did a lot of marriagepreparation there. Oh, got my
introduction to engage toencounter during my first in at
most holy trinity in San Jose,California. When I went to UC
(04:13):
Santa Barbara and I arrivedthere in 2003 More parish
ministry. I left there in 2011.
To begin my Canon Law Studies inthe University of St. Paul
(04:35):
University in Ottawa, I wasaffiliated with the University
of Ottawa. So, I graduated fromthere came to San Diego the
following spring and have beenworking here for the Diocese of
San Diego. I'm now the defenderof the bond for the diocese. And
(04:56):
during my time here, I've gottenheavily involved With Marriage
Encounter, and Retrovir, inaddition to my work with engaged
in Khattar, just a little ofwhat that does for me to imagine
that this work in a tribunal,it's rather depressing reading
about marriages that have brokenup, yes, but I go to engage in
(05:20):
counter and these other groups,and that gives me hope that
people are able to learn tocommunicate, and especially
through engaged in kata we canenable people to stop and look,
and really get to know theirspouses. So I can remember one
time telling my parents aboutthis ministry and how life
(05:44):
giving us and both my parents aswell, they have nothing like
this. When they were marriedback in 51. You just signed the
bands, and there was nocounseling. Three weeks later,
you were married, nobody talkedabout feelings, or, you know,
(06:08):
this new lifestyle. I mean, theywere exhilarated, and yet they
were scared to so I heard myparents talking about this. And
I realized that the church hasmade some dramatic progress. And
500 years from now people willbe looking back at this in these
(06:30):
groups for married people andrealize that this was a
significant step forward inhuman institutions. So it gives
me hope, and passions. So Icould go on on on just this
theme, forever. But I know youwant to talk about other things.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (06:49):
Oh, yes. Well, no. And I think what
you're sharing is very powerful.
As far as your background and 23years is what I think what you
said, You've been ordained 23years. So Oh, no, that's what
you know. 2727 years. I'm sorry.
I was getting I wrote down somenotes here and didn't get it.
Right. But then you got you didcanon law, which is fascinating.
(07:11):
And you menu, you're thedefender of the bond is gonna
hurt us. What does
Unknown (07:14):
that mean? Yeah, I mean, this is a good way to
bring into our discussion. I amkind of like an attorney. For
the marriage. Oh, I see the waya marriage tribunal works. It's
different from a civil trial,and what you see on TV and in
(07:34):
the movies, we're notadversarial. We are dedicated to
learning the truth aboutrelationships. We are not out to
win cases, like LA law and nail,all that kind of stuff. We are
all about discovering the truthof a relationship. We know that
(07:59):
people do terrible things. Butour job is not to blame people.
And it's not the people who arein charge, who are on trial.
It's the marriage. And what thetribunal tries to do is to
determine the validity of themarriage. Now to have a valid
(08:23):
marriage. First thing you haveto have is complete freedom to
marry. And you have to followthe forms that the church
prescribes, in other words, ourwedding ritual. Now, often
people will still get married infront of a judge or a non
(08:44):
Catholic minister, awesomepeople, especially here in the
state of California will go andthey will have a friend solemn
dies, the marriage, this goes inthe licensed sale, who sold nice
the marriage, these are all lackform. And it was a special form
(09:04):
that you could use this iscalled that lack of form. You
just fill it out. You provideyour original marriage
certificate, and your divorcedecree, along with your baptism
certificate. And this is forCatholics, and people married to
(09:26):
them. And it's simply you couldget this from your local parish.
Or you could go to your localtribunal. They all have
websites, and you could downloadthis and fill it out. I
mentioned all the things you'llneed. And there's a page on
there, where it'll ask you tocite the names of three
witnesses who swear that thismarriage was never validated in
(09:52):
the Catholic Church. So there'sa lot more to this. I don't want
to end up giving a seminarycourse no This would be the
easiest route for a lot ofpeople. Right?
Cindy Giambrone (10:05):
I have a few questions for you. How did you
get interested in this? I mean,you were doing what I heard you
say, as you were doing parishlife in either Santa Barbara.
Unknown (10:17):
Yeah, I was in the parish. And people would often
come to me and ask for help infilling out their enrollments in
the in the seminary have, we gotsome passion interest in this,
and I took some electives inmarriage law, which was a good
foundation. And I was one thathave the patience to sit through
(10:43):
this with people, I would submitthese them and I can remember
being in the parish, and tellingmy staff, which were some of my
best friends. And these days, Iwish I could remember what I
learned an intro to Canon Law.
And that time, it seemed dry asdust, I thought, well, I'll
never live long enough to usethis stuff. I can't remember. It
(11:04):
went from being dry as dust tolive late. And I started reading
some books about this. And Ikind of came to the conclusion
that this would be a niceministry for me to have. I
(11:25):
decided, well, if this becomespossible, I would make all
effort to do this. Well, when Iwas in Santa Barbara, the deacon
was retiring. He used to do allthese and I would do them in
Spanish. And I decided I reallyneed a refresher course in this
(11:48):
so I went to LA they were havinga class for advocates in this
area. And Monsignor CharlesChapman who was judicial vicar
for the Diocese of La everthought of a career in canon
law. And I said, Oh, no, Ithought that was only for
(12:11):
wealthy people. Those people,okay, maybe we're a Jesuit,
aren't you? Nice as well, aswell, we mean, people like you.
He started telling me about it.
And I said, Well, why not? Myprovincial, was thrilled.
(12:35):
Eventually, to make a long storyshort, I went up going to
Ottawa, I wanted to go to Rome,but because of my blindness
share my provincials at the timesaid, Well, we didn't think it
survived. In Rome. It is chaoticover there. And I sold them all.
You know, I've been to to GucciDelta. I've been to Mexico City
(12:56):
and all these places, you justkind of move with groups of
people, and you make your act ofcontrition before you cross a
major intersection. And I serve.
They said, well, we'll be sofrustrated. They don't my lady
friends are saying the samething to find last my Italian
teacher and other people who areTFA for blind, do this over
(13:20):
their Jesus. People who aredifferently abled, just don't go
out. And I said, Well, I can'tlive with that. If I'm going to
Rome I am going to live in andreally enjoy Rome antiquities
are fascinating for me.
Absolutely. Maybe even a Nightat the Opera and that sort of
(13:43):
thing. But I had anotherconnection and ended up going to
Ottawa. Well, this is evenbetter. Besides it snows in
Ottawa. I love snow. And forcross country skiing. Oh, and I
found out that the program inOttawa was much more realistic
(14:07):
because the Canadian experienceis very much like here. Yeah,
the United States. Father Mike,
Cindy Giambrone (14:13):
you know, the title of our show is wedding
bands. So please, might youshare how your mother and father
and their marriage together,influenced you growing up and
your decision to become apriest? Oh, well,
Unknown (14:28):
my father especially wanted me to. And I remember
when I was five years old, wewere in church one day. He asked
me what I wanted to do when Igrew up and I probably said the
typical thing a five year oldfireman astronauts, et cetera,
(14:49):
et cetera and easily Mikey youknow what I hope can be somewhat
priest. Okay. could really saydad They'll don't want to be no
priest around, they just look atthe wall. And they don't even
talk English. Why would anyonewant to do that? Later on, I
(15:15):
began to make more maturedecisions. And I remember going
through a dark time ofdisappointment. wanted to be a
school teacher teaching history.
Oh, I thought that would be themost wonderful thing. Of course,
there were no jobs for teachersin the 70s especially blind.
About this time, I asked God outloud, Bill, what do you want me
(15:40):
to do? And I heard God's ricingbecome a priest, a priest. Oh,
no. Like any other young man,wine, women and song adventure,
right. But I began to accept theidea. I remember going to a
local pastor. And I justremember feeling such peace when
(16:04):
I came out of that meeting. Andwhat really clinched it for me
was, I was always interested inthe Jesuits. I mean, I learned
about them in history. I grew upin the 60s and Jesuits were
involved in the different peacemovements, civil rights, and I
just thought that was wonderful.
(16:27):
I thought that was certainlyGod's presence in the world. And
that was a big thing for me. Iremember going to this Jesuit
retreat house up in witches, andmaking traditional bands retreat
there. And toward the end,having this vivid experience of
(16:47):
Christ's love crucified for wow,I went in there, kind of like a
deist from the 18th century Oh,God created everything was like
a watchmaker whelmed any wild upthe clock and walked away
somewhere. Yeah, just the BigBang, or real mystic. That's one
(17:09):
thing, you know, God often givesthese graces and they're very
big. But we are always tested.
In the real world, we come backto reality. And that's one thing
I tell people who are preparingfor marriage. Oh, well, yeah,
you go to these weekends. Andyou'll have a peak experience.
But now comes to time to testwhat you've learned, put it into
(17:34):
practice. And not everyone canhave any peak experience. We're
not built for that. But it's theday by day that we live out our
vocations. Whether it'smarriage, or the priesthood.
That's right.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (17:49):
Amen on that one. And I like the idea of
the peak experience, you havethat experience. And you know,
that's, that fires you up, butyou have to make that work. You
can't just let it just go offlike fireworks and persevere.
And you have to persevere anduse that energy. And we're
curious, again, the show iswedding bands and for couples
(18:10):
listening, how have marriedcouples, in your view, affected
your picture your life as apriest today. I mean, you're
dealing with lots of marriedcouples engaged couples, what
are kind of the fruits of thoserelationships? How would you
answer that question how theyare married couples impact you?
Unknown (18:26):
Well, I think the first huge insight was on my first
engaged encounter weekend, andjust listening to people talk.
And I discovered that thecommitments married people make
toward each other, are verysimilar to the commitments
(18:49):
priests make to serve God andthe church. And this has
developed over the years. Onething I learned through marriage
in Qatar was the fullness oftheology of the sacramental
matrimony and in the sacrament.
This is an outward sign,something we perceive with our
senses. And it points to atranscendent inner reality. And
(19:14):
that's the grace. Now, in theSacrament of Matrimony. The
couples make their vows.
Hopefully you hear those vowsfor the whole congregation. And
I tell my couples act like yourproduct. When you go up there
and the priest says do youpledge to take this person as
(19:37):
your wife don't just say yeah.
The best thing to do is readthose vows out loud, like good
voice. You want the world tohear this. Yes. The grace that
leads to is the establishment ofa family implicit in these
(19:59):
wedding vows is the notion thatone spouse will seek to find God
in that other and work towardhis or her salvation. And it's
mutual of the other spouse isalso pledging to find God if you
(20:20):
ran to work for your salvation.
That's right. We carry a lot ofbaggage around with this a a one
of the readings from Paul'sletter to the Ephesians. is
about submission. Male Wivessubmit. Yeah, husband. Let's
(20:41):
first off, look at that word tosubmit. Now it comes from a
Latin word, Michel. And sub submeans under, it can also mean
supporting. So means I sent. Sowe're really saying I sent send
(21:03):
other or castles Latindictionary would define this as
support support. So we're reallywe're pledging to support each
other. And walking hand by hand,this is like a nice slow dance.
We're not concerned about who'sleading. But can you coordinate
(21:27):
your bodies in such a way thatyou're able to dance with grace
through life,
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (21:33):
amen.
And you what you're reminding usof what we send you now we meet
with engaged couples we talkabout, I tell them my goal is to
get Cindy to heaven. And hergoal is to get me to heaven that
we minister to each other. Andthe idea. And the submission
that you're talking about is Isee as a foundation, you know,
it's you sub sub and mission.
(21:57):
It's sad mission, you share as acouple, really, that you are
supporting each other and thatmission. And really admission, a
couple we spoke of an earliershow is to be the light to
others to be the outward sign ofGod's love Jesus love and grace
is that's found in marriage. Andit's just a beautiful reality of
(22:17):
the sacrament of marriage thatyou're just shared. And, and
thank you for that.
Unknown (22:21):
Let's take this one step further. This is pure
theology. Now let's apply it toreal life. So if you're thinking
of marrying someone, can you saythat I would be willing to give
up my own interests and desiresor at least to put them on hold
(22:43):
for the well being of mypartner? That's the essence of
Christian agape? And if theanswer is yes, then let's take
it one step further. Are youwilling to look for salvation?
For someone working for yourbenefit? Are you well, we'll
(23:04):
come to find God and that otherperson, are you willing to work
for his or her salvation? Andfind God in her if you get some
answer other than Yes.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (23:19):
Don't marry. Right. That's that's a
beautify often
Unknown (23:23):
hear in these melody petitions. Oh, we were mutually
attractive. The attraction wasphysical. Oh, we were a good
party companions. We likedhiking, and blah, blah, blah,
well, that's fine. But nowyou're married. You're gonna
have a family. That's right. Yougot your work you got to do and
(23:47):
so forth. So get over it. Startlooking at the inner person, get
to know as much as you possiblycan about your fiancee.
Cindy Giambrone (23:59):
Right. And it's good to have those conversations
before. Before. And yes,
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (24:06):
yes,
Unknown (24:07):
a lot of people will come and they say, Well, can you
marry us in three weeks? And theanswer is, law stipulates that
there should be a one yearanticipation for the wedding.
Why? Here? You've got a lot oflearning to do. You are learning
(24:29):
about your spouse, you've got togo through the marriage
preparations. You've got tothink about the practical
things. Well, where are yougoing to live? Yes. That's all
very important. So people wouldcome at the last minute and say,
Well, can you marry us in sixmonths? Oh, we got a whole
rented for that time. And we'vegot people coming out of town.
(24:54):
Oh, yeah. And there's the lastthought let's get a priest to do
our wedding.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (24:59):
Yes, yeah. So I understand what
you're saying. And we'veexperienced that ourselves and
you're working in marriage,marriage prep, and that, you
know, they may be spending moretime and attention to getting
locale for the reception versusgetting the locale of their
hearts, you know what I'msaying.
Cindy Giambrone (25:16):
And it's a good reminder for the importance of
marriage preparation and, andsome of the programs,
Unknown (25:23):
one of the major causes of, I want to get back to this
notion of the full canonicaltrial, where we are looking to
determine whether or not themarriage has been valid. Now one
of the determined errors, andthis is one of the grounds that
we use would be lack ofdiscretion and judgment. And the
(25:44):
probably the simplest example, Icould think of would be, let's
say, a man hooks up with a lady.
And they found that that she'spregnant. And the father of the
lady says, You'd better marryher or else. So they go down,
(26:06):
and they get married in thechurch. Their freedom was
hindered. So that the alsodetermines the validity of a
marriage. These people who don'tunderstand what the Sacrament of
Matrimony is, they think it'sjust, oh, happily ever after.
And no, we're gonna spend therest of our lives partying and
(26:31):
blah, blah, blah. They have noconcept of the sacrament of
marriage. They don't know whatthey're getting into.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (26:39):
Yes, yes, father and
Unknown (26:42):
their judgment.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (26:43):
Amen.
Amen. In judgment, haven't clearjudgment. And you said, freedom
of choice. What we have to do isfor this show, we're running out
of time. And I think Cindy has astatement and then we're going
to also be meeting with you inanother podcast. We'll continue
this discussion on that podcast,Cindy.
Cindy Giambrone (27:03):
Yes. And as we come towards the end of our
show, we thank again, ourguests, Father, Mike. And we
hope those listening heard aboutthe importance of recognizing
the presence of Christ in asacramental marriage. We also
heard from Father Mike hispersonal experiences with the
sacrament of marriage. And it'scalled to share the good news of
(27:25):
Jesus Christ in the world. Andas we close today's show, we
look forward to our next show,where we'll continue to talk
about the importance of marriageand the enrichment of our
sacrament. And we also ask thatif you enjoyed today's podcast,
to invite your friends andfamily to join a future wedding
bands podcast on spirit filledradio.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (27:46):
And Father, if you would, please
provide a blessing for thelisteners and for couples and
other listeners of the show. Andwe'll we'll close with that
today.
Unknown (27:57):
All right, well, may your eyes and ears be open? May
you be receptive to yourfiancee. May you delight in this
person from head to toe? May yourejoice and everything about him
(28:23):
or her? May you walk together,side by side as you go to your
future, full of hope, full offaith in each other with God and
not metal through Christ ourLord.
Cindy Giambrone (28:44):
Amen. Thank you so much, father, Mike. And we
look forward to others joiningat upcoming shows. And we hope
Father Mike, that you'll bewilling to join us again.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (28:57):
All right. And with that, we'll say
goodbye for now and may Godbless you and we'll see you on
future shows. Bye bye.
Intro (29:04):
You've been listening to wedding bands on spirit filled
radio. If this program has beena blessing to you, please share
it with others. You can find thepodcast at Spirit filled
radio.org That spirit filledradio.org And be sure to
download the app. Until nexttime, may your marriage be
blessed with love and joy thisday and always
Intro Music (29:30):
more gathered in his knee.
announcement (29:59):
It's the feeling you get when you see a familiar
face in a crowd of strangers.
It's the way the embrace of aloved one feels after a hard
day. That feeling is comfort.
And it's what we provide tofamilies who turned to O'Connor
mortuary in their moment ofneed. More than just providing
quality funeral service. Weprovide the necessary guidance
(30:21):
and support to help Catholicfamilies and people of all
faiths and cultures processgrief and heal their hearts. We
are here to help every step ofthe way. For compassionate
comfort in a time of loss. CallO'Connor mortuary in Laguna
Hills, you can reach us at949581 4300 That's 949581 4300
(30:48):
O'Connor mortuary is a sponsorpartner of spirit filled radio
The union of your spirits here is caused him to
(00:08):
remain whenever two or more aregathered in His name.
Intro (00:19):
What is God's plan for marriage? Get ready for some
real talk straight from theheart. Spirit filled radio is
proud to present wedding bands,the program that's all about
marriage with your hosts, DeaconAngelo and Cindy Cimbrone.
Listen as they share theirstories of navigating marriage
and family life with all thejoys and challenges that come
(00:40):
with it. Here's your host to getus started.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (00:43):
Hi, we are Cindy and Deacon Angelo
Giambrone. This show is calledwedding bands. today's show
we'll be meeting because a veryspecial guest, Father Mike Raven
camp. And before we get started,we remind you that we are not
marriage counselors, just amarried couple sharing our
experiences. And those areinvited guests like father, Mike
today. And if you like our showwedding bands, please share it
(01:05):
with your friends and family.
Remember, you can find us onspirit fool radio, or listen
anytime by downloading the showas a podcast from that website,
or your favorite podcastwebsite.
Cindy Giambrone (01:16):
Angelo and I start each morning with couple
prayer. And here's our favoriteline from that prayer that we
share. As we feel it relates toall of you listening as a
married couple. And this comesfrom the letters to Hebrews 313
In the name of the Father andthe Son and the Holy Spirit.
Amen. Dear Lord, please help usto remember this as a
(01:38):
sacramental couple that everyday, as long as this today
lasts, that we keep encouragingone another. We ask this through
Jesus Holy Name, Amen. And fortoday's show, we have a very
special guest Father Mike Ravencamp, who will share his
experiences ministering toengaged and married couples, as
(02:00):
a priest and Pastor and his pastexperience in ministries to
couples such as worldwideMarriage Encounter.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (02:07):
And first off Father, may we just
call you father Mike,
Unknown (02:11):
that's fine.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (02:12):
Okay, great. Father, Mike, might you
please tell us a little bitabout yourself?
Unknown (02:17):
Well, I'm 71 years old.
I'm the oldest of five children.
I grew up in the San GabrielValley, kind of in the 60s of
the 70s. My brothers and sisterslive normal lives. They dated
they did sports, they did allthe things that young people do.
(02:38):
I'm nearly blind. So a lot ofthat was limited. You know,
growing up in California, you'renobody nothing if you can't
drive somewhere on your own. Somy ability to circulate was
severely limited, but Icompensated with that with all
my studies. I went to Lavernecollege, got a degree in
(03:03):
history. And then I studiedRehabilitation Psychology for a
while. And eventually I went towork in an independent living
center. And what I did, therewas I, Bay shirt, doors and so
forth, are looking forarchitectural barriers. And I
would make reports to agovernment agency that we got
(03:28):
our money for HUD to do this.
And I entered the Society ofJesus in 1981. So after my entry
in the society, I've been allover North America. I've been
from Honduras, to Alaska, andI've seen much of Canada, in
terms of my priesthood, justcelebrated my 27th year of
(03:52):
priesthood. And about half ofthat was in parish ministry. So
I did a lot of marriagepreparation there. Oh, got my
introduction to engage toencounter during my first in at
most holy trinity in San Jose,California. When I went to UC
(04:13):
Santa Barbara and I arrivedthere in 2003 More parish
ministry. I left there in 2011.
To begin my Canon Law Studies inthe University of St. Paul
(04:35):
University in Ottawa, I wasaffiliated with the University
of Ottawa. So, I graduated fromthere came to San Diego the
following spring and have beenworking here for the Diocese of
San Diego. I'm now the defenderof the bond for the diocese. And
(04:56):
during my time here, I've gottenheavily involved With Marriage
Encounter, and Retrovir, inaddition to my work with engaged
in Khattar, just a little ofwhat that does for me to imagine
that this work in a tribunal,it's rather depressing reading
about marriages that have brokenup, yes, but I go to engage in
(05:20):
counter and these other groups,and that gives me hope that
people are able to learn tocommunicate, and especially
through engaged in kata we canenable people to stop and look,
and really get to know theirspouses. So I can remember one
time telling my parents aboutthis ministry and how life
(05:44):
giving us and both my parents aswell, they have nothing like
this. When they were marriedback in 51. You just signed the
bands, and there was nocounseling. Three weeks later,
you were married, nobody talkedabout feelings, or, you know,
(06:08):
this new lifestyle. I mean, theywere exhilarated, and yet they
were scared to so I heard myparents talking about this. And
I realized that the church hasmade some dramatic progress. And
500 years from now people willbe looking back at this in these
(06:30):
groups for married people andrealize that this was a
significant step forward inhuman institutions. So it gives
me hope, and passions. So Icould go on on on just this
theme, forever. But I know youwant to talk about other things.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (06:49):
Oh, yes. Well, no. And I think what
you're sharing is very powerful.
As far as your background and 23years is what I think what you
said, You've been ordained 23years. So Oh, no, that's what
you know. 2727 years. I'm sorry.
I was getting I wrote down somenotes here and didn't get it.
Right. But then you got you didcanon law, which is fascinating.
(07:11):
And you menu, you're thedefender of the bond is gonna
hurt us. What does
Unknown (07:14):
that mean? Yeah, I mean, this is a good way to
bring into our discussion. I amkind of like an attorney. For
the marriage. Oh, I see the waya marriage tribunal works. It's
different from a civil trial,and what you see on TV and in
(07:34):
the movies, we're notadversarial. We are dedicated to
learning the truth aboutrelationships. We are not out to
win cases, like LA law and nail,all that kind of stuff. We are
all about discovering the truthof a relationship. We know that
(07:59):
people do terrible things. Butour job is not to blame people.
And it's not the people who arein charge, who are on trial.
It's the marriage. And what thetribunal tries to do is to
determine the validity of themarriage. Now to have a valid
(08:23):
marriage. First thing you haveto have is complete freedom to
marry. And you have to followthe forms that the church
prescribes, in other words, ourwedding ritual. Now, often
people will still get married infront of a judge or a non
(08:44):
Catholic minister, awesomepeople, especially here in the
state of California will go andthey will have a friend solemn
dies, the marriage, this goes inthe licensed sale, who sold nice
the marriage, these are all lackform. And it was a special form
(09:04):
that you could use this iscalled that lack of form. You
just fill it out. You provideyour original marriage
certificate, and your divorcedecree, along with your baptism
certificate. And this is forCatholics, and people married to
(09:26):
them. And it's simply you couldget this from your local parish.
Or you could go to your localtribunal. They all have
websites, and you could downloadthis and fill it out. I
mentioned all the things you'llneed. And there's a page on
there, where it'll ask you tocite the names of three
witnesses who swear that thismarriage was never validated in
(09:52):
the Catholic Church. So there'sa lot more to this. I don't want
to end up giving a seminarycourse no This would be the
easiest route for a lot ofpeople. Right?
Cindy Giambrone (10:05):
I have a few questions for you. How did you
get interested in this? I mean,you were doing what I heard you
say, as you were doing parishlife in either Santa Barbara.
Unknown (10:17):
Yeah, I was in the parish. And people would often
come to me and ask for help infilling out their enrollments in
the in the seminary have, we gotsome passion interest in this,
and I took some electives inmarriage law, which was a good
foundation. And I was one thathave the patience to sit through
(10:43):
this with people, I would submitthese them and I can remember
being in the parish, and tellingmy staff, which were some of my
best friends. And these days, Iwish I could remember what I
learned an intro to Canon Law.
And that time, it seemed dry asdust, I thought, well, I'll
never live long enough to usethis stuff. I can't remember. It
(11:04):
went from being dry as dust tolive late. And I started reading
some books about this. And Ikind of came to the conclusion
that this would be a niceministry for me to have. I
(11:25):
decided, well, if this becomespossible, I would make all
effort to do this. Well, when Iwas in Santa Barbara, the deacon
was retiring. He used to do allthese and I would do them in
Spanish. And I decided I reallyneed a refresher course in this
(11:48):
so I went to LA they were havinga class for advocates in this
area. And Monsignor CharlesChapman who was judicial vicar
for the Diocese of La everthought of a career in canon
law. And I said, Oh, no, Ithought that was only for
(12:11):
wealthy people. Those people,okay, maybe we're a Jesuit,
aren't you? Nice as well, aswell, we mean, people like you.
He started telling me about it.
And I said, Well, why not? Myprovincial, was thrilled.
(12:35):
Eventually, to make a long storyshort, I went up going to
Ottawa, I wanted to go to Rome,but because of my blindness
share my provincials at the timesaid, Well, we didn't think it
survived. In Rome. It is chaoticover there. And I sold them all.
You know, I've been to to GucciDelta. I've been to Mexico City
(12:56):
and all these places, you justkind of move with groups of
people, and you make your act ofcontrition before you cross a
major intersection. And I serve.
They said, well, we'll be sofrustrated. They don't my lady
friends are saying the samething to find last my Italian
teacher and other people who areTFA for blind, do this over
(13:20):
their Jesus. People who aredifferently abled, just don't go
out. And I said, Well, I can'tlive with that. If I'm going to
Rome I am going to live in andreally enjoy Rome antiquities
are fascinating for me.
Absolutely. Maybe even a Nightat the Opera and that sort of
(13:43):
thing. But I had anotherconnection and ended up going to
Ottawa. Well, this is evenbetter. Besides it snows in
Ottawa. I love snow. And forcross country skiing. Oh, and I
found out that the program inOttawa was much more realistic
(14:07):
because the Canadian experienceis very much like here. Yeah,
the United States. Father Mike,
Cindy Giambrone (14:13):
you know, the title of our show is wedding
bands. So please, might youshare how your mother and father
and their marriage together,influenced you growing up and
your decision to become apriest? Oh, well,
Unknown (14:28):
my father especially wanted me to. And I remember
when I was five years old, wewere in church one day. He asked
me what I wanted to do when Igrew up and I probably said the
typical thing a five year oldfireman astronauts, et cetera,
(14:49):
et cetera and easily Mikey youknow what I hope can be somewhat
priest. Okay. could really saydad They'll don't want to be no
priest around, they just look atthe wall. And they don't even
talk English. Why would anyonewant to do that? Later on, I
(15:15):
began to make more maturedecisions. And I remember going
through a dark time ofdisappointment. wanted to be a
school teacher teaching history.
Oh, I thought that would be themost wonderful thing. Of course,
there were no jobs for teachersin the 70s especially blind.
About this time, I asked God outloud, Bill, what do you want me
(15:40):
to do? And I heard God's ricingbecome a priest, a priest. Oh,
no. Like any other young man,wine, women and song adventure,
right. But I began to accept theidea. I remember going to a
local pastor. And I justremember feeling such peace when
(16:04):
I came out of that meeting. Andwhat really clinched it for me
was, I was always interested inthe Jesuits. I mean, I learned
about them in history. I grew upin the 60s and Jesuits were
involved in the different peacemovements, civil rights, and I
just thought that was wonderful.
(16:27):
I thought that was certainlyGod's presence in the world. And
that was a big thing for me. Iremember going to this Jesuit
retreat house up in witches, andmaking traditional bands retreat
there. And toward the end,having this vivid experience of
(16:47):
Christ's love crucified for wow,I went in there, kind of like a
deist from the 18th century Oh,God created everything was like
a watchmaker whelmed any wild upthe clock and walked away
somewhere. Yeah, just the BigBang, or real mystic. That's one
(17:09):
thing, you know, God often givesthese graces and they're very
big. But we are always tested.
In the real world, we come backto reality. And that's one thing
I tell people who are preparingfor marriage. Oh, well, yeah,
you go to these weekends. Andyou'll have a peak experience.
But now comes to time to testwhat you've learned, put it into
(17:34):
practice. And not everyone canhave any peak experience. We're
not built for that. But it's theday by day that we live out our
vocations. Whether it'smarriage, or the priesthood.
That's right.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (17:49):
Amen on that one. And I like the idea of
the peak experience, you havethat experience. And you know,
that's, that fires you up, butyou have to make that work. You
can't just let it just go offlike fireworks and persevere.
And you have to persevere anduse that energy. And we're
curious, again, the show iswedding bands and for couples
(18:10):
listening, how have marriedcouples, in your view, affected
your picture your life as apriest today. I mean, you're
dealing with lots of marriedcouples engaged couples, what
are kind of the fruits of thoserelationships? How would you
answer that question how theyare married couples impact you?
Unknown (18:26):
Well, I think the first huge insight was on my first
engaged encounter weekend, andjust listening to people talk.
And I discovered that thecommitments married people make
toward each other, are verysimilar to the commitments
(18:49):
priests make to serve God andthe church. And this has
developed over the years. Onething I learned through marriage
in Qatar was the fullness oftheology of the sacramental
matrimony and in the sacrament.
This is an outward sign,something we perceive with our
senses. And it points to atranscendent inner reality. And
(19:14):
that's the grace. Now, in theSacrament of Matrimony. The
couples make their vows.
Hopefully you hear those vowsfor the whole congregation. And
I tell my couples act like yourproduct. When you go up there
and the priest says do youpledge to take this person as
(19:37):
your wife don't just say yeah.
The best thing to do is readthose vows out loud, like good
voice. You want the world tohear this. Yes. The grace that
leads to is the establishment ofa family implicit in these
(19:59):
wedding vows is the notion thatone spouse will seek to find God
in that other and work towardhis or her salvation. And it's
mutual of the other spouse isalso pledging to find God if you
(20:20):
ran to work for your salvation.
That's right. We carry a lot ofbaggage around with this a a one
of the readings from Paul'sletter to the Ephesians. is
about submission. Male Wivessubmit. Yeah, husband. Let's
(20:41):
first off, look at that word tosubmit. Now it comes from a
Latin word, Michel. And sub submeans under, it can also mean
supporting. So means I sent. Sowe're really saying I sent send
(21:03):
other or castles Latindictionary would define this as
support support. So we're reallywe're pledging to support each
other. And walking hand by hand,this is like a nice slow dance.
We're not concerned about who'sleading. But can you coordinate
(21:27):
your bodies in such a way thatyou're able to dance with grace
through life,
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (21:33):
amen.
And you what you're reminding usof what we send you now we meet
with engaged couples we talkabout, I tell them my goal is to
get Cindy to heaven. And hergoal is to get me to heaven that
we minister to each other. Andthe idea. And the submission
that you're talking about is Isee as a foundation, you know,
it's you sub sub and mission.
(21:57):
It's sad mission, you share as acouple, really, that you are
supporting each other and thatmission. And really admission, a
couple we spoke of an earliershow is to be the light to
others to be the outward sign ofGod's love Jesus love and grace
is that's found in marriage. Andit's just a beautiful reality of
(22:17):
the sacrament of marriage thatyou're just shared. And, and
thank you for that.
Unknown (22:21):
Let's take this one step further. This is pure
theology. Now let's apply it toreal life. So if you're thinking
of marrying someone, can you saythat I would be willing to give
up my own interests and desiresor at least to put them on hold
(22:43):
for the well being of mypartner? That's the essence of
Christian agape? And if theanswer is yes, then let's take
it one step further. Are youwilling to look for salvation?
For someone working for yourbenefit? Are you well, we'll
(23:04):
come to find God and that otherperson, are you willing to work
for his or her salvation? Andfind God in her if you get some
answer other than Yes.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (23:19):
Don't marry. Right. That's that's a
beautify often
Unknown (23:23):
hear in these melody petitions. Oh, we were mutually
attractive. The attraction wasphysical. Oh, we were a good
party companions. We likedhiking, and blah, blah, blah,
well, that's fine. But nowyou're married. You're gonna
have a family. That's right. Yougot your work you got to do and
(23:47):
so forth. So get over it. Startlooking at the inner person, get
to know as much as you possiblycan about your fiancee.
Cindy Giambrone (23:59):
Right. And it's good to have those conversations
before. Before. And yes,
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (24:06):
yes,
Unknown (24:07):
a lot of people will come and they say, Well, can you
marry us in three weeks? And theanswer is, law stipulates that
there should be a one yearanticipation for the wedding.
Why? Here? You've got a lot oflearning to do. You are learning
(24:29):
about your spouse, you've got togo through the marriage
preparations. You've got tothink about the practical
things. Well, where are yougoing to live? Yes. That's all
very important. So people wouldcome at the last minute and say,
Well, can you marry us in sixmonths? Oh, we got a whole
rented for that time. And we'vegot people coming out of town.
(24:54):
Oh, yeah. And there's the lastthought let's get a priest to do
our wedding.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (24:59):
Yes, yeah. So I understand what
you're saying. And we'veexperienced that ourselves and
you're working in marriage,marriage prep, and that, you
know, they may be spending moretime and attention to getting
locale for the reception versusgetting the locale of their
hearts, you know what I'msaying.
Cindy Giambrone (25:16):
And it's a good reminder for the importance of
marriage preparation and, andsome of the programs,
Unknown (25:23):
one of the major causes of, I want to get back to this
notion of the full canonicaltrial, where we are looking to
determine whether or not themarriage has been valid. Now one
of the determined errors, andthis is one of the grounds that
we use would be lack ofdiscretion and judgment. And the
(25:44):
probably the simplest example, Icould think of would be, let's
say, a man hooks up with a lady.
And they found that that she'spregnant. And the father of the
lady says, You'd better marryher or else. So they go down,
(26:06):
and they get married in thechurch. Their freedom was
hindered. So that the alsodetermines the validity of a
marriage. These people who don'tunderstand what the Sacrament of
Matrimony is, they think it'sjust, oh, happily ever after.
And no, we're gonna spend therest of our lives partying and
(26:31):
blah, blah, blah. They have noconcept of the sacrament of
marriage. They don't know whatthey're getting into.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (26:39):
Yes, yes, father and
Unknown (26:42):
their judgment.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (26:43):
Amen.
Amen. In judgment, haven't clearjudgment. And you said, freedom
of choice. What we have to do isfor this show, we're running out
of time. And I think Cindy has astatement and then we're going
to also be meeting with you inanother podcast. We'll continue
this discussion on that podcast,Cindy.
Cindy Giambrone (27:03):
Yes. And as we come towards the end of our
show, we thank again, ourguests, Father, Mike. And we
hope those listening heard aboutthe importance of recognizing
the presence of Christ in asacramental marriage. We also
heard from Father Mike hispersonal experiences with the
sacrament of marriage. And it'scalled to share the good news of
(27:25):
Jesus Christ in the world. Andas we close today's show, we
look forward to our next show,where we'll continue to talk
about the importance of marriageand the enrichment of our
sacrament. And we also ask thatif you enjoyed today's podcast,
to invite your friends andfamily to join a future wedding
bands podcast on spirit filledradio.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (27:46):
And Father, if you would, please
provide a blessing for thelisteners and for couples and
other listeners of the show. Andwe'll we'll close with that
today.
Unknown (27:57):
All right, well, may your eyes and ears be open? May
you be receptive to yourfiancee. May you delight in this
person from head to toe? May yourejoice and everything about him
(28:23):
or her? May you walk together,side by side as you go to your
future, full of hope, full offaith in each other with God and
not metal through Christ ourLord.
Cindy Giambrone (28:44):
Amen. Thank you so much, father, Mike. And we
look forward to others joiningat upcoming shows. And we hope
Father Mike, that you'll bewilling to join us again.
Deacon Angelo Giambrone (28:57):
All right. And with that, we'll say
goodbye for now and may Godbless you and we'll see you on
future shows. Bye bye.
Intro (29:04):
You've been listening to wedding bands on spirit filled
radio. If this program has beena blessing to you, please share
it with others. You can find thepodcast at Spirit filled
radio.org That spirit filledradio.org And be sure to
download the app. Until nexttime, may your marriage be
blessed with love and joy thisday and always
Intro Music (29:30):
more gathered in his knee.
announcement (29:59):
It's the feeling you get when you see a familiar
face in a crowd of strangers.
It's the way the embrace of aloved one feels after a hard
day. That feeling is comfort.
And it's what we provide tofamilies who turned to O'Connor
mortuary in their moment ofneed. More than just providing
quality funeral service. Weprovide the necessary guidance
(30:21):
and support to help Catholicfamilies and people of all
faiths and cultures processgrief and heal their hearts. We
are here to help every step ofthe way. For compassionate
comfort in a time of loss. CallO'Connor mortuary in Laguna
Hills, you can reach us at949581 4300 That's 949581 4300
(30:48):
O'Connor mortuary is a sponsorpartner of spirit filled radio
Popular Podcasts
Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang
Ding dong! Join your culture consultants, Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang, on an unforgettable journey into the beating heart of CULTURE. Alongside sizzling special guests, they GET INTO the hottest pop-culture moments of the day and the formative cultural experiences that turned them into Culturistas. Produced by the Big Money Players Network and iHeartRadio.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.