Send us your Questions for Jeremiah and Dan
Ever wondered how proper chemical handling can revolutionize your business operations and safety measures? Join us for an enlightening conversation with Aaron Carden, Chief Operating Officer of Energy Fox Solutions, as he shares his transformative journey from managing auto parts locations to steering the spray foam industry towards excellence. Aaron's insights paint a vivid picture of the evolution of Energy Fox Solutions and their unwavering commitment to maintaining optimal storage conditions for spray foam chemicals.
Discover the intricacies of the foam products' journey from the manufacturing facility to the end user, as we spotlight the pivotal role distributors play in ensuring product integrity. Listen to real-world challenges, like malfunctioning refrigeration and improper handling, and learn how manufacturers, distributors, and contractors can collectively adhere to best practices. By controlling variables and mitigating risks, we aim to protect both the product's integrity and the safety of those handling it.
We also delve into best practices for transporting heavy materials, such as 500-pound drums, emphasizing safety and efficiency. Unlock practical tips on using the right tools, like barrel dollies and pipe wrenches, to minimize physical strain and injury risks. Learn the importance of updated Safety Data Sheets (SDS) and informing customers about reentry times and potential odors. This episode is packed with essential insights to help you maintain a safe and efficient work environment while ensuring the quality and performance of spray foam products. Don't miss these crucial safety measures and tips!
For comments, suggestions, safety shares and questions email us at sprayfoammafia@gmail.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Dan (00:00):
Okay, welcome back to Toolbox Talks on Safety.
I'm Dan Benedict, spray FoamArizona.
I'm Jeremiah Schoenbergtechnician from UPC.
Today we have a special guest,Aaron Cardin I don't know what's
your title here Energy FoxSolutions.
Chief Operating Officer.
Special Assistant to Tiffany.
I pay the bills you pay thebills.
Aaron (00:20):
They tell me what I need to do next?
Dan (00:23):
I'm glad you're good at taking direction.
Aaron, give us a rundown.
Who are you?
What do you do?
The whole works.
Aaron (00:29):
What's your background?
I own Energy Fox Solutions.
We're a distribution company.
We sell foam, everything elsethat goes along with making sure
that you guys can do your jobproperly Accessories, parts,
equipment.
We've got good tech support andwe have great partners and I've
been open for over two yearsnow, been in the industry for
(00:51):
almost 10.
Dan (00:52):
Give us your background in the industry a little bit.
Start, heck, you can go beyondthat Like here.
I was just a poor farm kid inthe backwoods, definitely wasn't
a poor farm kid.
Aaron (01:03):
Actually, my background came from auto parts.
I had eight advanced auto partslocations that I ran the
commercial sales for needed achange and stepped into spray
foam and I still can't get itoff my shoes, same, same.
Dan (01:17):
Same.
Well, except not commercialauto parts, not on your shoes.
But if I do need an alternatorfor an 84 chevy, I know who to
call.
Now.
You probably remember the partnumber, I don't I don't.
Aaron (01:28):
I try to uh to get that out of my brain so I can pack it
with as much spray foamknowledge as possible.
All right, but no, I've been umdoing this for almost 10 years.
It was quite eye-opening.
Uh, the first seven I was witha another supplier and, uh, not
exactly friendly towards othersin the industry.
Everybody was competition,everybody was out to get you.
(01:50):
So when we started Energy FoxSolutions, I wanted to take
advantage of the partnershipsand helping people grow together
.
So that's why we're here.
Dan (01:57):
Topic of the day.
Here we're talking aboutchemical handling storage.
Maybe get into some SDSs alittle bit here.
Why do we need it?
What are we here to make surepeople are covering their butts
about?
Aaron (02:09):
Several reasons.
You guys put in a ton of moneyto make sure that your rigs work
properly.
The manufacturers put in a toninto R&D and making sure that
when you get the chemical, thatit performs optimally.
A lot of the pitfalls that wesee on our end is things just
not being stored properly, notbeing taken care of the way that
(02:30):
it has been or it should be.
Rather, every manufacturer hasa similar guideline as how this
product should be stored.
We work very hard to make surethat we're meeting those
conditions.
At the previous shop that we hadand Dan, you've been there
before and Jeremiah, I thinkwhen we first met we were at the
other location and it was aconstant battle for us.
(02:50):
Trying to keep a shop withswamp coolers at below 80
degrees was a challenge everyday.
We invested a ton of money intomaking cold rooms to make sure
the closed cells stayed where itneeded to be.
We put air conditioning in tomake sure we did all that just
to move about a year later intothe new location to where it's
(03:11):
not so much of a battle.
Our facility keeps foam whereit should be.
We're under 80 degrees even inthe 120 degree Arizona heat.
We know that when the productleaves here, that it's where it
should be, and I think part ofwhat we're going to talk about
today is what happens after thatand how to keep your material
(03:31):
where it needs to be, to whereit functions the way that you
guys expect, and you know anyother questions that you have
that can help the people thatare actually listening to this
today.
Dan (03:44):
Yeah, Jeremiah.
Why do we need to talk aboutthis today?
Jeremiah (03:47):
A lot of the talks we have when we're training and
doing demos is preconditioningof your materials right?
So if the distributor takescare of the material the way we
specify, it, gets on the rig theway we want it, then he's done
his job.
And then it comes, you know,comes to the contractor.
At that point you know we setstandards for a reason.
It's like you wouldn't set milkout on the counter for a week
(04:08):
and be like, oh, it's still good, same, same concept here, guys
like there's parameters theproduct can be stored in, and
that's what we ask everyone todo and, like I said once, the
distributor does that and hekind of hands off the baton to
the contractor.
Then it's the contractor totake care of the material, to
make sure they'repreconditioning and processing
it right, because if youprecondition the product right,
(04:28):
there's a lot less concern downthe line.
If you try and you know, comeat it a different direction or
you have the barrel too hot ortoo cold when you get the job.
So we all know how it's, how itaffects your day when it comes
to labor and time Right.
Aaron (04:47):
So that's you know.
It's a double edged sword, soto speak, and it's all the way
down the line.
It starts with themanufacturing facility, whether
it be in Arlington or Indiana orPennsylvania, where it is.
When you're in that perfect labenvironment and the temperature
set exactly right, it goes onto a refrigerated truck to where
it gets to us as distributorsor you as the customer, at the
exact temperature that it'ssupposed to be at.
You can't stop the train atthat point and expect everything
(05:11):
to work properly.
You know the manufacturer cando their job, we can store it
properly, you can make sure thatit gets to you guys, but there
is responsibility from thecontractor to make sure that
those parameters are met.
After that, once it's out ofour hands, there's not much we
can do other than take the phonecalls when it isn't done the
correct way.
Dan (05:27):
Yeah, yeah, you go on some people that have rigs that are
not equipped for like this heatout here and you look at those
football shaped drums.
You know, and you know, likethe poor guy that throws a bone
wrench on there to open that up.
It's about to have a terribleday to go sideways and you know
you just hope they don't get aface full of.
(05:48):
You know frothing over closedcell.
You don't have that pressurethe.
You know the rig that you cansee the b-side just got that
fountain of crap up the wall.
Yep, you know, on the lights inthe ceiling where you know
somebody all over the floor step, yeah, um, on there and you
just sit there looking like godI hope that guy didn't eat a big
face full of that stuff.
(06:09):
And even down to the, you knowyou open the barrels and they
just start hissing on you andthere's somebody sitting there
with their face over the top ofthat open that bung, it's
hissing.
They don't have any respiratoryprotection on, no ventilation
through that area.
They're're in.
You know they're just chokingon that stuff.
And I think that's somethingfor everybody, from the
(06:31):
ownership all the way down tothe helpers, to be cognizant of,
those kind of things.
Aaron (06:35):
Well, and then on, on our end it's.
We've had situations to where atruck's come and the say the
driver of the semi doesn'trealize that his air
conditioning went out on that800 mile trip from dallas, which
is where our foam comes out of.
We can't accept that product.
We're not only puttingourselves at risk for liability
but we're putting you guys atrisk of taking an inferior
(06:58):
product.
There have been situationswhere we've had to call the
manufacturer, say, hey look,this is coming right back to you
guys and we don't.
We can't take that risk of youguys putting that on there.
Like I said, from themanufacturer to us, to you.
All of those steps have to bein place to make sure that
everyone's protected and you'resparing good foam.
And I'm sure at some point inthis conversation we're going to
(07:21):
get to the whys, and I knowJeremiah's got a lot of
experience as to what happenswhen you don't properly store.
Jeremiah (07:28):
Yeah, Well, yeah, like you're saying, you know,
especially with closed cells,the blowing agents and things
like that can be affected by,you know, temperatures outside
the storage parameters andthat's the big thing.
You know, we all know theblowing agents are a very
important part and if you loseblowing agent, you're losing
some performance right, sothat's why I feel yeah, yeah.
(07:49):
That's why it's important to dothose things and store it how
you, how you should and withinthe parameters, and take care of
it because, like I said, you'regonna lose money and we're all
spending a lot of money on r&d,on transport, on logistics, on
rigs, on people to know wastemoney at this point or lose a
yield, like you said and to skipsteps on it, you're not doing
(08:10):
yourself any favors.
Aaron (08:12):
You know we all have a responsibility, not just to our
companies but to the industry,to do things the right way.
But you have the responsibilityto your company, to the people
that get on your rig and areexpecting to go to work.
Now do problems happen?
And things that are unforeseenhappen, of course, yeah, every
day.
The main part about what we'retalking about today is
mitigating that risk and takingsome of those factors out of the
(08:33):
way.
You're still going to havesituations to where you know
this didn't get done, thatdidn't get done or this breaks
or that breaks.
Those are out of your control,but it's controlling the
controllables which is whathelps any business be successful
.
Jeremiah (08:46):
Another variable you can subtract is a good one.
Exactly.
Dan (08:51):
How do we do this?
How's our best practices?
What do you want to see when wepull up with a trailer, whether
it be one of the rigs ready togo or just something we're going
to transport back to our jobsite or to our shop?
What do you like to see?
What makes you feel comfortablewhen your guys are helping load
, handling these drums and stuffthat are 500 pounds a piece?
(09:15):
What do you like to see?
What do you two have?
Aaron (09:18):
a plan Right.
So when, when you or any othercustomer comes up, we see the
inside of your rig, um, we knowwe can look and kind of see what
the challenges you, you, youhave, um, just like Jeremiah
does if he's going to hop, comeon site with you and he opens
back your rig rig, he sees whathe can see just from the back
end of that trailer or that boxtruck, what he might be stepping
(09:39):
in that day.
It's the same thing for for thecontractor.
Have a plan.
So when we get here, you knowyour product's coming out at a
temperature that's going to beoptimal and it's going on to the
rig.
Well, what's the plan from?
From there?
You know, do you have a two anda half hour drive to your job
site?
Do you have a 15 minute job toyour job site?
Are we putting this directlyonto the rig that's been either
(10:00):
stored in air conditioning orstored in the heat, depending on
?
You know what time of year orpart of the country that you're
in and then you know as far ashandling the material being safe
, you know, not cutting corners,we see some crazy, crazy stuff,
um, things that that I wouldnever in a million years do, uh,
(10:21):
but I obviously don't have thelower back strength of a lot of
the guys that come in here andjust start whipping these drums
around like they like cans ofCoke.
Um, but, like I said, having aplan, knowing that, once that,
that drum or those drums ratherget on your rig, what's the
what's the plan?
Ok, we're going directly to thejob site.
We're going to start sprayingimmediately.
Great, you know, when you pickup from your distributor or you
(10:44):
get your delivery, what have you?
What are you doing with thatmaterial?
At that point, dan, I know that, on on that, you're at your
shop.
You have warehouse space thatyou're keeping your materials
where they need to be until youget to them.
Right, well, not everybody hasthat luxury, which is why you
have, you know, guys that spraya ton of foam but they pick up
ones and twosies.
We would rather see that thanyou come and pick up six sets of
(11:06):
foam that you're not going tospray for the entire week.
Right, we've been on job sitesor delivery sites where I make
your blood boil.
You've got your, your product,your moneymaker, right, that's,
that's, that's your inventory.
And it's sitting out in directsunlight or it's in a shed
that's hotter than the atticthat you're getting ready to go
(11:28):
up and spray it.
Um, so what do you, as acontractor, do at that point?
You know, we've all been insituations where, okay, the AC
went out on my rig and you'reice packing.
Everything Right, not the bestof plans, but at least you know
what to do in.
That situation happens.
But I think that having proper,or rather proper, climate
(11:48):
control in your rig is essential, and it goes back to not
cutting corners and keepingthings in line.
Dan (11:55):
Manufacturer, distributor, customer jeremiah tools guys,
what do you see that works forshuffling these barrels around?
I mean, not all of us have theright forklift with the right
clamp, the right you know stuffto do it.
We're having to roll themaround yeah, I mean aaron's
right.
Jeremiah (12:12):
You know I I came in rolling the barrels around like
a Coke can, like I had to havethe right weight balance to get
them on the rigs and things likethat.
But you know the barrel dollies, the forklift attachments, if
you're lucky enough to have aforklift and pick the barrels,
don't be rolling the barrels onthe forks.
And you know, like, have theright tool for the job that you
can have.
You know, depending on yourlocation, where that you can
(12:37):
have.
You know, depending on yourlocation, where your shop is at.
And once again, you know, don'tsit there and try and manhandle
.
You know the drums every day.
Aaron (12:42):
The pipe wrench trickles, save your back, save your neck
and everything.
And it's just as simple askeeping a pipe wrench on your
rig, not just for smackingmachine when it's acting up.
Dan (12:51):
You don't hit your palm right on the head with those
things.
Aaron (13:00):
You can clamp that down on the on the lip of your barrel
and just use leverage and moveit into place.
You know, I came from adistributor in Florida where
there's sand everywhere and ifyou open a rig on a lot of our
smart contractors there was sandall over the floor and it's
because once you get that drumup there, they're just pushing
it into place.
Nobody's taking a risk ofdropping something on your feet.
And I don't know if there's anyvisuals that go with this
podcast, but I'll send you guysover some pictures of a customer
(13:21):
I had that had a full drum ofISO drop on their foot and it is
a nasty, gnarly injury.
So, but again, you pay your,your helpers, your sprayers, and
you want them to be there.
Um, for them to be there,they've got to take the
precautions to keep themselvessafe.
Right, you can't be on everyrig that you have um every day
(13:43):
at all times.
So you're putting a lot offaith in these guys to do things
the right way.
Well, if we give them the toolsto do things the right way and
show them the benefit, there's ayou move a lot of that risk
away.
But again, you can't.
Not everybody is going to seethings this way and they want to
get it done as quick aspossible.
I've been on a job site beforeand a customer had run back to
(14:04):
the shop to pick up somematerial and the oh my goodness
Tailgate the lift gate, stoppedworking on their box truck.
So they kicked off a masterpack of R38 and just push the
drum off off the back of it ontoit.
Nice, it works, but it's notsomething I would.
I would recommend no, not atall, but you know it.
(14:24):
It gets cold in NorthernArizona, it gets cold here.
As much as we talk aboutprotecting this product from
heat, you have to protect itfrom cold as well.
So what's the plan there?
Do you have plate heaters?
Do you have drum barrel warmers?
Do you have blankets and thingslike that?
Again, it's just making surethat you guys have the right
tools to do it.
Once that part's done, we cantalk about it, we can recommend
(14:45):
it, but we can't be on every rig, just like you can't be on
every one of your rigs hopingthat it gets done correctly.
Dan (14:51):
Yeah, and, like you said, the days of you know dropping
and tipping those things up.
I've got a 140 pound 16 yearold that can dang near, tip
those and roll them one handedRight, but every time he does it
I'm like no dude, stop.
Aaron (15:04):
Yeah, like you're scaring the crap out of me here, like
when you're 35, you're going tobe living here, right?
Dan (15:09):
Exactly, there's a proper way, there's a better way, and
even you know Piranha makestheir tool.
That's got the jaw that youjust put right on there and spin
those and make sure you got afoot behind you when you go to
wrench on one of those, Becausewhen they slip, so do you?
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
And you know I've flown fivefeet back in my trailer before
(15:31):
just dragging one around.
One of those little dealsdoesn't bite quite like you want
.
Aaron (15:38):
Well, and you guys have come up with best practices.
All contractors know what worksfor them, what doesn't work for
them.
Um, we just want to see you besafe.
We, we don't want, um, to losea customer ever, but we don't
want to lose one because theycan't work, because they hurt
themselves by doing somethingthat was very avoidable, by
taking some simple steps to makesure that they're taking care
of it properly With us.
You know we have two differentdrum grabbers, based to where,
(16:02):
if a customer has trailer A,this one works better.
If a customer has trailer B orbox truck B, we can do that.
But again, it all goes back towhat happens when it leaves the
shop.
Right, and we want to make surethat you guys are safe as
possible out there.
Ask questions when you havethem, when you're dealing with
your livelihood and your safety.
I really don't think there areany dumb questions.
I mean, the simplest misstepcan really cause a problem for
(16:26):
any company, especially whenyou're dealing with a product
that can crush you.
Dan (16:30):
Yeah, that's pretty fair.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And back to the old pipe wrenchtrick.
Every once in a while you'regoing to bite a little hard and
you're going to poke a hole in abarrel.
You're going to tear that seam.
I've seen it happen.
Um, make sure you have spillprotection ready to go.
If you do that, make sure youhave a way to secure that.
(16:52):
Make sure every way to pumpthat thing down so you know when
you're driving down the roadit's not just shaking its way
out and making a big messeverywhere.
Jeremiah (16:58):
Yeah, don't don't go to get the uh, you know the
cheap straps from Home Depot,rated for 25 pounds.
Guys, like you know as a tech,you get on those rigs and you
see those straps and you know,you know what a rated strap
looks like.
You know the right strap to buy.
Then, once again, the money youspend on getting that product,
the money you spend on labor,it's worth spending a little bit
(17:19):
more for a strap and takingthat extra five minutes to
secure your load the proper way,cause you don't want that stuff
shifting Of course, making amess in your rig and, worst case
scenario, tipping over andspilling on the road, and then
you have a whole nother set ofproblems Like so once again.
Aaron (17:32):
So, once again, right to you're not working until the
state clears you no, so yourbusiness is shut down because of
an unsecured drum.
But the other part, you knowyou're protecting your
investment, right?
We we hear it a lot from ourcustomers Is this pricing,
pricing, pricing?
And we want to help out.
We want to do as much as we can, but at the same time you have
to protect that investment.
(17:52):
And it goes like we were justsaying um, stay away from the 25
straps, man.
Um, if, if, even if you have adrum that comes loose and it
doesn't spill, how much damageis it going to do to your ph2 or
your e30?
You know a piece of equipmentthat you just spent fifty
thousand dollars on that'ssupposed to be your money maker
and you the equivalent ofleaving it alone in the back
(18:14):
with the bowling ball just justbouncing around.
Yeah and uh, you know that'srepair time, that's warranty
time, that's all time thatyou're just, you're down by.
Not, like you said, spend alittle, a little bit of money.
Spend the money to get a drumdolly.
Um, a couple hundred buckssaves your guys backs and it
moves a lot quicker.
Um, but at the very least, justmaking sure you're making good
(18:39):
decisions on the back of the rig.
Empower your guys to ask youquestions.
You know that, unfortunately,the industry that we're in,
especially during the summer,we're all hotheads because your
body temperature and your brainis only just too hot for this,
which makes people irritable,which makes it harder to
communicate.
But empower your guys to callyou out on it.
Hey, we don't have the pipewrench on the back here.
Hey, we don't have the drumdolly.
And by listening to them, youknow, hey, they're trying to
(19:02):
keep themselves safe.
That's keeping me safe, that'shelping me stay in business.
Take a deep breath and comeback.
But you know, we see it a lot.
You see it on site all the time, jeremy, and the time Jeremy
and Dan, you as on thecontractor side, you see it out
there.
You know you're hot, you'resweaty, you're frustrated.
It's easy to snap, it's easy tosay something that you probably
wouldn't have said had you beencooled down with a lemonade or
(19:23):
a cold beer.
But again, empower your guys toask those questions and ask you
for the safety equipment thatyou need.
I mean, you know you, youwouldn't ask.
You wouldn't lash out atsomebody that's asking you for
fresh air.
You wouldn't ask.
You wouldn't lash out atsomebody that's asking you for
fresh air.
You wouldn't lash out forsomebody that's asking you for
gloves or for a suit.
Kind of the same deal onprotecting your product again,
because that, at the end of theday, that's your inventory Right
(19:44):
and puncture drum yeah, itmakes a mess.
But you're also watching everydollar you just spent on that
product yeah, leaking out ontoyour floor, and you know there's
proper disposal ways when thathappens.
But the main thing is make sureyou got a spill kit on every
single one of your rigs.
I believe that's mandatory asit is.
Jeremiah (20:04):
Yeah Well, and like I've told guys before, you know
anything, any spill above fivegallons is an EPA spill.
So if anyone notices or oryou're in the location that's
very open to observation, youknow, and you have a spill and
five gallons you know EPA is,can come in and help you clean
up and regulate how you do it.
(20:25):
So, once again, if you don'thave that spill kit and you have
something happen, you have noway to stop it or prevent that
kind of spill from happening.
And it's not.
Once again, it's an investmentand, yes, spill kits are kind of
spendy sometimes depending onwhat you're buying, but once
again it's an ounce ofpreventative maintenance is
going to save you down the road.
Aaron (20:44):
If you puncture your, your resin side and you have
uncured ISO on your floor, oryou vice versa, you're creating
a massive mess Again.
You're causing yourself moretime, more energy and
potentially getting yourself insome trouble too.
We'll just cut out the dead end.
Dan (21:05):
Hit the clicker real quick for us.
So we know.
Okay, sorry, you brought thebook over here.
Aaron (21:09):
No, I'm just waiting for the wrap-up.
You guys have the book.
Dan (21:11):
Oh, okay, all right, sounds good.
Okay, all right, all right.
Aaron (21:16):
Sounds good, okay, all right.
Dan (21:23):
Okay, so earlier felt like I was back in school again.
The teacher was over herepassing handouts around.
Aaron handed out some MSDSsheets here Again, these are
available everywhere.
There's manufacturers, websites, there's apps.
There's ask your distributor Ifyou show up and be like, hey,
(21:44):
this is a new product that wehave not sprayed before or heck,
it's an old product.
We spray every day, but wehaven't seen a TDS MSDS on it in
months, they'll print you oneand hand it to you.
So once you get that in yourhands, aaron, what are we
looking for?
What are we doing for the guyin the rig that's about to take
this stuff and spray it orsomething?
(22:07):
What is he going to read onhere for his own safety and the
safety of everybody around?
Aaron (22:11):
Sure, it's a cheat sheet, right?
So the manufacturers put thisout on all products.
It's not just spray foam.
You have an SDS for your TSL,you have an SDS for motor oil.
Dan (22:23):
The caulking that you keep in the rig.
There's a TDS on that.
Aaron (22:26):
The main thing that I would recommend is one always
have an SDS on your rig, just incase you know.
Osha can pull up on a job site,unannounced State can pull up
on a job site.
Unannounced state can pull upon a job site unannounced.
And if you don't know theproduct that you're spraying,
you're creating a problem foryourself.
As far as the TDS, there's alot of useful information on
there.
It's got your processingparameters, it's got you know
(22:48):
your air perms, it's got your Rvalue just the basic stuff.
That's on the TDS, which iswhat we've got here, but it's
also got you know goodinformation.
As far as for the contractor,the main thing that I handed
these out for is because we aretalking about storage and safety
and material handling.
It has a black and whitedirectly right here for you the
(23:09):
shelf life and your storage.
Make sure your product storedbetween 50 and 80 degrees
Fahrenheit I'm saying Fahrenheitbecause we do have Canadian
customers that are going tolisten to this as well but use
it as your cheat sheet.
The parameters as far as forprocessing the material are on
there and that's a good startingpoint Because if you're in the
field and you call somebody likeJeremiah, they're going to ask
(23:29):
where you started.
Well, he's going to have thatDDS.
So you guys are starting on thesame page of the book.
It has your troubleshootingstuff.
That's on there.
So a lot of the times that weget, we get calls um, whether it
be for an equipment malfunction, um, or it'd be for foam that's
not reacting properly or it'snot performing the way that it
could.
This saves a lot of timebecause if you as a contractor
(23:52):
can pull open your TDS book oryour SDS book, go down to where
okay, so it's, I've got weird,weird cell structure or I'm
getting voids behind the phone,that's going to save you 10, 15,
20 minutes of a call with withJeremiah or tech from whatever
your your phone manufacturer is,to where you could have got
that problem solved two to threeminutes.
Oh, I skipped this step or Ididn't, didn't have this turned
(24:13):
on.
Again, it's about productivityand that 15 or 20 minutes Well,
in the grand scheme of a day itdoesn't sound like a lot, but
when you're on a job site it'sone hundred and fifteen outside
in Arizona, 140 in the attics.
15 to 20 minutes is a long damntime, yeah, To have to wait to
get your question answered.
So use it as a cheat sheet.
(24:36):
But the reason, like I said,said that I passed these out
like the, the teacher'sassistant was because it has it
on here.
Right, you're, you have tostore the stuff correctly.
You can't have it in directsunlight.
But the other part of of thetds is it doesn't just give you
the, the, what it gives you the,why, well outside of the, the,
storing it at the propertemperature ranges, you shorten
the, the light that you can havethat foam, but it also that
(24:59):
direct sunlight or that heatmesses with the chemistry and I
think that that gets lost a lotfrom on the contractor side is,
you know, you see it as A and B,A and B, a and B, a and B.
What you're not seeing is allof the chemistry that's in that
resin side.
The guys like Jeremiah and theother manufacturers have spent a
(25:20):
lot of time developing and ithas to be correct.
Right, we know the chemicalcomposition of our water, but
these guys know the chemicalcomposition of that material and
how it performs at thistemperature, this temperature
and this temperature.
And there's, in going back tothat, there's a reason that
there's summer blends on opencell close.
So there's a reason thatthere's winter blends, there's a
reason that they're regularblends because those are going
(25:41):
to perform different,temperature wise, altitude wise.
Um, so having this on your rigor, you know, having your guys
that at least have the generalknowledge of what's on here,
saves you a lot of time, saves alot of headache and make sure
that you are processing thematerial properly, right?
Dan (25:54):
Right, and you know one of the other good things about this
.
Back on to you know the primarypurpose of what we're talking
about here.
There is health and safetyinformation, there is cautions
and recommendations, there'shandling, there's job site
warnings all published righthere.
Even it goes back to abreakdown of what type of pp you
should have for it.
Yeah, of course.
(26:15):
Um, you know, proper.
Yeah, yeah, respiration right.
Yeah, respiratory protectioneverything is all sitting right
here on there well then you'reyou're.
Aaron (26:25):
If you talk about material handling, you know you
have what's the what's.
The end result is the tip ofthat gun, right.
So these chemicals never touch,they never mix until that very
last second right.
Once that happens, we all knowwhat spray foam looks like, what
it smells like, but yourcustomers don't.
And are you setting them upproperly to know when they can
(26:46):
reenter their home?
When can they reoccupy?
All that's going to be on theTDS as well.
So it's not just the materialstorage and handling, or what's
the R value or what's the airperms or what's the density,
it's keeping your end customerssafe.
I like to say that we all have aresponsibility to this industry
to do things the right way.
Well, part of that is makingsure that your customers are
(27:08):
safe on the end and they in turnbecome a steward for you,
whether it be Spray Foam Arizonaor company XYZ.
You want them to have a goodexperience with you because you
did it right.
Not getting calls back because,hey, I got a funny smell, right
.
All that can be linked back towell, was it stored properly?
Did we lose surfactant?
(27:29):
Is the catalyst messed up?
Again, was this all handledproperly from the very beginning
, right?
Okay, welcome back to Toolbox Talks on Safety.
I'm Dan Benedict, spray FoamArizona.
I'm Jeremiah Schoenbergtechnician from UPC.
Today we have a special guest,Aaron Cardin I don't know what's
your title here Energy FoxSolutions.
Chief Operating Officer.
Special Assistant to Tiffany.
I pay the bills you pay thebills.
Aaron (00:20):
They tell me what I need to do next?
Dan (00:23):
I'm glad you're good at taking direction.
Aaron, give us a rundown.
Who are you?
What do you do?
The whole works.
Aaron (00:29):
What's your background?
I own Energy Fox Solutions.
We're a distribution company.
We sell foam, everything elsethat goes along with making sure
that you guys can do your jobproperly Accessories, parts,
equipment.
We've got good tech support andwe have great partners and I've
been open for over two yearsnow, been in the industry for
(00:51):
almost 10.
Dan (00:52):
Give us your background in the industry a little bit.
Start, heck, you can go beyondthat Like here.
I was just a poor farm kid inthe backwoods, definitely wasn't
a poor farm kid.
Aaron (01:03):
Actually, my background came from auto parts.
I had eight advanced auto partslocations that I ran the
commercial sales for needed achange and stepped into spray
foam and I still can't get itoff my shoes, same, same.
Dan (01:17):
Same.
Well, except not commercialauto parts, not on your shoes.
But if I do need an alternatorfor an 84 chevy, I know who to
call.
Now.
You probably remember the partnumber, I don't I don't.
Aaron (01:28):
I try to uh to get that out of my brain so I can pack it
with as much spray foamknowledge as possible.
All right, but no, I've been umdoing this for almost 10 years.
It was quite eye-opening.
Uh, the first seven I was witha another supplier and, uh, not
exactly friendly towards othersin the industry.
Everybody was competition,everybody was out to get you.
(01:50):
So when we started Energy FoxSolutions, I wanted to take
advantage of the partnershipsand helping people grow together
.
So that's why we're here.
Dan (01:57):
Topic of the day.
Here we're talking aboutchemical handling storage.
Maybe get into some SDSs alittle bit here.
Why do we need it?
What are we here to make surepeople are covering their butts
about?
Aaron (02:09):
Several reasons.
You guys put in a ton of moneyto make sure that your rigs work
properly.
The manufacturers put in a toninto R&D and making sure that
when you get the chemical, thatit performs optimally.
A lot of the pitfalls that wesee on our end is things just
not being stored properly, notbeing taken care of the way that
(02:30):
it has been or it should be.
Rather, every manufacturer hasa similar guideline as how this
product should be stored.
We work very hard to make surethat we're meeting those
conditions.
At the previous shop that we hadand Dan, you've been there
before and Jeremiah, I thinkwhen we first met we were at the
other location and it was aconstant battle for us.
(02:50):
Trying to keep a shop withswamp coolers at below 80
degrees was a challenge everyday.
We invested a ton of money intomaking cold rooms to make sure
the closed cells stayed where itneeded to be.
We put air conditioning in tomake sure we did all that just
to move about a year later intothe new location to where it's
(03:11):
not so much of a battle.
Our facility keeps foam whereit should be.
We're under 80 degrees even inthe 120 degree Arizona heat.
We know that when the productleaves here, that it's where it
should be, and I think part ofwhat we're going to talk about
today is what happens after thatand how to keep your material
(03:31):
where it needs to be, to whereit functions the way that you
guys expect, and you know anyother questions that you have
that can help the people thatare actually listening to this
today.
Dan (03:44):
Yeah, Jeremiah.
Why do we need to talk aboutthis today?
Jeremiah (03:47):
A lot of the talks we have when we're training and
doing demos is preconditioningof your materials right?
So if the distributor takescare of the material the way we
specify, it, gets on the rig theway we want it, then he's done
his job.
And then it comes, you know,comes to the contractor.
At that point you know we setstandards for a reason.
It's like you wouldn't set milkout on the counter for a week
(04:08):
and be like, oh, it's still good, same, same concept here, guys
like there's parameters theproduct can be stored in, and
that's what we ask everyone todo and, like I said once, the
distributor does that and hekind of hands off the baton to
the contractor.
Then it's the contractor totake care of the material, to
make sure they'repreconditioning and processing
it right, because if youprecondition the product right,
(04:28):
there's a lot less concern downthe line.
If you try and you know, comeat it a different direction or
you have the barrel too hot ortoo cold when you get the job.
So we all know how it's, how itaffects your day when it comes
to labor and time Right.
Aaron (04:47):
So that's you know.
It's a double edged sword, soto speak, and it's all the way
down the line.
It starts with themanufacturing facility, whether
it be in Arlington or Indiana orPennsylvania, where it is.
When you're in that perfect labenvironment and the temperature
set exactly right, it goes onto a refrigerated truck to where
it gets to us as distributorsor you as the customer, at the
exact temperature that it'ssupposed to be at.
You can't stop the train atthat point and expect everything
(05:11):
to work properly.
You know the manufacturer cando their job, we can store it
properly, you can make sure thatit gets to you guys, but there
is responsibility from thecontractor to make sure that
those parameters are met.
After that, once it's out ofour hands, there's not much we
can do other than take the phonecalls when it isn't done the
correct way.
Dan (05:27):
Yeah, yeah, you go on some people that have rigs that are
not equipped for like this heatout here and you look at those
football shaped drums.
You know, and you know, likethe poor guy that throws a bone
wrench on there to open that up.
It's about to have a terribleday to go sideways and you know
you just hope they don't get aface full of.
(05:48):
You know frothing over closedcell.
You don't have that pressurethe.
You know the rig that you cansee the b-side just got that
fountain of crap up the wall.
Yep, you know, on the lights inthe ceiling where you know
somebody all over the floor step, yeah, um, on there and you
just sit there looking like godI hope that guy didn't eat a big
face full of that stuff.
(06:09):
And even down to the, you knowyou open the barrels and they
just start hissing on you andthere's somebody sitting there
with their face over the top ofthat open that bung, it's
hissing.
They don't have any respiratoryprotection on, no ventilation
through that area.
They're're in.
You know they're just chokingon that stuff.
And I think that's somethingfor everybody, from the
(06:31):
ownership all the way down tothe helpers, to be cognizant of,
those kind of things.
Aaron (06:35):
Well, and then on, on our end it's.
We've had situations to where atruck's come and the say the
driver of the semi doesn'trealize that his air
conditioning went out on that800 mile trip from dallas, which
is where our foam comes out of.
We can't accept that product.
We're not only puttingourselves at risk for liability
but we're putting you guys atrisk of taking an inferior
(06:58):
product.
There have been situationswhere we've had to call the
manufacturer, say, hey look,this is coming right back to you
guys and we don't.
We can't take that risk of youguys putting that on there.
Like I said, from themanufacturer to us, to you.
All of those steps have to bein place to make sure that
everyone's protected and you'resparing good foam.
And I'm sure at some point inthis conversation we're going to
(07:21):
get to the whys, and I knowJeremiah's got a lot of
experience as to what happenswhen you don't properly store.
Jeremiah (07:28):
Yeah, Well, yeah, like you're saying, you know,
especially with closed cells,the blowing agents and things
like that can be affected by,you know, temperatures outside
the storage parameters andthat's the big thing.
You know, we all know theblowing agents are a very
important part and if you loseblowing agent, you're losing
some performance right, sothat's why I feel yeah, yeah.
(07:49):
That's why it's important to dothose things and store it how
you, how you should and withinthe parameters, and take care of
it because, like I said, you'regonna lose money and we're all
spending a lot of money on r&d,on transport, on logistics, on
rigs, on people to know wastemoney at this point or lose a
yield, like you said and to skipsteps on it, you're not doing
(08:10):
yourself any favors.
Aaron (08:12):
You know we all have a responsibility, not just to our
companies but to the industry,to do things the right way.
But you have the responsibilityto your company, to the people
that get on your rig and areexpecting to go to work.
Now do problems happen?
And things that are unforeseenhappen, of course, yeah, every
day.
The main part about what we'retalking about today is
mitigating that risk and takingsome of those factors out of the
(08:33):
way.
You're still going to havesituations to where you know
this didn't get done, thatdidn't get done or this breaks
or that breaks.
Those are out of your control,but it's controlling the
controllables which is whathelps any business be successful
.
Jeremiah (08:46):
Another variable you can subtract is a good one.
Exactly.
Dan (08:51):
How do we do this?
How's our best practices?
What do you want to see when wepull up with a trailer, whether
it be one of the rigs ready togo or just something we're going
to transport back to our jobsite or to our shop?
What do you like to see?
What makes you feel comfortablewhen your guys are helping load
, handling these drums and stuffthat are 500 pounds a piece?
(09:15):
What do you like to see?
What do you two have?
Aaron (09:18):
a plan Right.
So when, when you or any othercustomer comes up, we see the
inside of your rig, um, we knowwe can look and kind of see what
the challenges you, you, youhave, um, just like Jeremiah
does if he's going to hop, comeon site with you and he opens
back your rig rig, he sees whathe can see just from the back
end of that trailer or that boxtruck, what he might be stepping
(09:39):
in that day.
It's the same thing for for thecontractor.
Have a plan.
So when we get here, you knowyour product's coming out at a
temperature that's going to beoptimal and it's going on to the
rig.
Well, what's the plan from?
From there?
You know, do you have a two anda half hour drive to your job
site?
Do you have a 15 minute job toyour job site?
Are we putting this directlyonto the rig that's been either
(10:00):
stored in air conditioning orstored in the heat, depending on
?
You know what time of year orpart of the country that you're
in and then you know as far ashandling the material being safe
, you know, not cutting corners,we see some crazy, crazy stuff,
um, things that that I wouldnever in a million years do, uh,
(10:21):
but I obviously don't have thelower back strength of a lot of
the guys that come in here andjust start whipping these drums
around like they like cans ofCoke.
Um, but, like I said, having aplan, knowing that, once that,
that drum or those drums ratherget on your rig, what's the
what's the plan?
Ok, we're going directly to thejob site.
We're going to start sprayingimmediately.
Great, you know, when you pickup from your distributor or you
(10:44):
get your delivery, what have you?
What are you doing with thatmaterial?
At that point, dan, I know that, on on that, you're at your
shop.
You have warehouse space thatyou're keeping your materials
where they need to be until youget to them.
Right, well, not everybody hasthat luxury, which is why you
have, you know, guys that spraya ton of foam but they pick up
ones and twosies.
We would rather see that thanyou come and pick up six sets of
(11:06):
foam that you're not going tospray for the entire week.
Right, we've been on job sitesor delivery sites where I make
your blood boil.
You've got your, your product,your moneymaker, right, that's,
that's, that's your inventory.
And it's sitting out in directsunlight or it's in a shed
that's hotter than the atticthat you're getting ready to go
(11:28):
up and spray it.
Um, so what do you, as acontractor, do at that point?
You know, we've all been insituations where, okay, the AC
went out on my rig and you'reice packing.
Everything Right, not the bestof plans, but at least you know
what to do in.
That situation happens.
But I think that having proper,or rather proper, climate
(11:48):
control in your rig is essential, and it goes back to not
cutting corners and keepingthings in line.
Dan (11:55):
Manufacturer, distributor, customer jeremiah tools guys,
what do you see that works forshuffling these barrels around?
I mean, not all of us have theright forklift with the right
clamp, the right you know stuffto do it.
We're having to roll themaround yeah, I mean aaron's
right.
Jeremiah (12:12):
You know I I came in rolling the barrels around like
a Coke can, like I had to havethe right weight balance to get
them on the rigs and things likethat.
But you know the barrel dollies, the forklift attachments, if
you're lucky enough to have aforklift and pick the barrels,
don't be rolling the barrels onthe forks.
And you know, like, have theright tool for the job that you
can have.
You know, depending on yourlocation, where that you can
(12:37):
have.
You know, depending on yourlocation, where your shop is at.
And once again, you know, don'tsit there and try and manhandle
.
You know the drums every day.
Aaron (12:42):
The pipe wrench trickles, save your back, save your neck
and everything.
And it's just as simple askeeping a pipe wrench on your
rig, not just for smackingmachine when it's acting up.
Dan (12:51):
You don't hit your palm right on the head with those
things.
Aaron (13:00):
You can clamp that down on the on the lip of your barrel
and just use leverage and moveit into place.
You know, I came from adistributor in Florida where
there's sand everywhere and ifyou open a rig on a lot of our
smart contractors there was sandall over the floor and it's
because once you get that drumup there, they're just pushing
it into place.
Nobody's taking a risk ofdropping something on your feet.
And I don't know if there's anyvisuals that go with this
podcast, but I'll send you guysover some pictures of a customer
(13:21):
I had that had a full drum ofISO drop on their foot and it is
a nasty, gnarly injury.
So, but again, you pay your,your helpers, your sprayers, and
you want them to be there.
Um, for them to be there,they've got to take the
precautions to keep themselvessafe.
Right, you can't be on everyrig that you have um every day
(13:43):
at all times.
So you're putting a lot offaith in these guys to do things
the right way.
Well, if we give them the toolsto do things the right way and
show them the benefit, there's ayou move a lot of that risk
away.
But again, you can't.
Not everybody is going to seethings this way and they want to
get it done as quick aspossible.
I've been on a job site beforeand a customer had run back to
(14:04):
the shop to pick up somematerial and the oh my goodness
Tailgate the lift gate, stoppedworking on their box truck.
So they kicked off a masterpack of R38 and just push the
drum off off the back of it ontoit.
Nice, it works, but it's notsomething I would.
I would recommend no, not atall, but you know it.
(14:24):
It gets cold in NorthernArizona, it gets cold here.
As much as we talk aboutprotecting this product from
heat, you have to protect itfrom cold as well.
So what's the plan there?
Do you have plate heaters?
Do you have drum barrel warmers?
Do you have blankets and thingslike that?
Again, it's just making surethat you guys have the right
tools to do it.
Once that part's done, we cantalk about it, we can recommend
(14:45):
it, but we can't be on every rig, just like you can't be on
every one of your rigs hopingthat it gets done correctly.
Dan (14:51):
Yeah, and, like you said, the days of you know dropping
and tipping those things up.
I've got a 140 pound 16 yearold that can dang near, tip
those and roll them one handedRight, but every time he does it
I'm like no dude, stop.
Aaron (15:04):
Yeah, like you're scaring the crap out of me here, like
when you're 35, you're going tobe living here, right?
Dan (15:09):
Exactly, there's a proper way, there's a better way, and
even you know Piranha makestheir tool.
That's got the jaw that youjust put right on there and spin
those and make sure you got afoot behind you when you go to
wrench on one of those, Becausewhen they slip, so do you?
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
And you know I've flown fivefeet back in my trailer before
(15:31):
just dragging one around.
One of those little dealsdoesn't bite quite like you want
.
Aaron (15:38):
Well, and you guys have come up with best practices.
All contractors know what worksfor them, what doesn't work for
them.
Um, we just want to see you besafe.
We, we don't want, um, to losea customer ever, but we don't
want to lose one because theycan't work, because they hurt
themselves by doing somethingthat was very avoidable, by
taking some simple steps to makesure that they're taking care
of it properly With us.
You know we have two differentdrum grabbers, based to where,
(16:02):
if a customer has trailer A,this one works better.
If a customer has trailer B orbox truck B, we can do that.
But again, it all goes back towhat happens when it leaves the
shop.
Right, and we want to make surethat you guys are safe as
possible out there.
Ask questions when you havethem, when you're dealing with
your livelihood and your safety.
I really don't think there areany dumb questions.
I mean, the simplest misstepcan really cause a problem for
(16:26):
any company, especially whenyou're dealing with a product
that can crush you.
Dan (16:30):
Yeah, that's pretty fair.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And back to the old pipe wrenchtrick.
Every once in a while you'regoing to bite a little hard and
you're going to poke a hole in abarrel.
You're going to tear that seam.
I've seen it happen.
Um, make sure you have spillprotection ready to go.
If you do that, make sure youhave a way to secure that.
(16:52):
Make sure every way to pumpthat thing down so you know when
you're driving down the roadit's not just shaking its way
out and making a big messeverywhere.
Jeremiah (16:58):
Yeah, don't don't go to get the uh, you know the
cheap straps from Home Depot,rated for 25 pounds.
Guys, like you know as a tech,you get on those rigs and you
see those straps and you know,you know what a rated strap
looks like.
You know the right strap to buy.
Then, once again, the money youspend on getting that product,
the money you spend on labor,it's worth spending a little bit
(17:19):
more for a strap and takingthat extra five minutes to
secure your load the proper way,cause you don't want that stuff
shifting Of course, making amess in your rig and, worst case
scenario, tipping over andspilling on the road, and then
you have a whole nother set ofproblems Like so once again.
Aaron (17:32):
So, once again, right to you're not working until the
state clears you no, so yourbusiness is shut down because of
an unsecured drum.
But the other part, you knowyou're protecting your
investment, right?
We we hear it a lot from ourcustomers Is this pricing,
pricing, pricing?
And we want to help out.
We want to do as much as we can, but at the same time you have
to protect that investment.
(17:52):
And it goes like we were justsaying um, stay away from the 25
straps, man.
Um, if, if, even if you have adrum that comes loose and it
doesn't spill, how much damageis it going to do to your ph2 or
your e30?
You know a piece of equipmentthat you just spent fifty
thousand dollars on that'ssupposed to be your money maker
and you the equivalent ofleaving it alone in the back
(18:14):
with the bowling ball just justbouncing around.
Yeah and uh, you know that'srepair time, that's warranty
time, that's all time thatyou're just, you're down by.
Not, like you said, spend alittle, a little bit of money.
Spend the money to get a drumdolly.
Um, a couple hundred buckssaves your guys backs and it
moves a lot quicker.
Um, but at the very least, justmaking sure you're making good
(18:39):
decisions on the back of the rig.
Empower your guys to ask youquestions.
You know that, unfortunately,the industry that we're in,
especially during the summer,we're all hotheads because your
body temperature and your brainis only just too hot for this,
which makes people irritable,which makes it harder to
communicate.
But empower your guys to callyou out on it.
Hey, we don't have the pipewrench on the back here.
Hey, we don't have the drumdolly.
And by listening to them, youknow, hey, they're trying to
(19:02):
keep themselves safe.
That's keeping me safe, that'shelping me stay in business.
Take a deep breath and comeback.
But you know, we see it a lot.
You see it on site all the time, jeremy, and the time Jeremy
and Dan, you as on thecontractor side, you see it out
there.
You know you're hot, you'resweaty, you're frustrated.
It's easy to snap, it's easy tosay something that you probably
wouldn't have said had you beencooled down with a lemonade or
(19:23):
a cold beer.
But again, empower your guys toask those questions and ask you
for the safety equipment thatyou need.
I mean, you know you, youwouldn't ask.
You wouldn't lash out atsomebody that's asking you for
fresh air.
You wouldn't ask.
You wouldn't lash out atsomebody that's asking you for
fresh air.
You wouldn't lash out forsomebody that's asking you for
gloves or for a suit.
Kind of the same deal onprotecting your product again,
because that, at the end of theday, that's your inventory Right
(19:44):
and puncture drum yeah, itmakes a mess.
But you're also watching everydollar you just spent on that
product yeah, leaking out ontoyour floor, and you know there's
proper disposal ways when thathappens.
But the main thing is make sureyou got a spill kit on every
single one of your rigs.
I believe that's mandatory asit is.
Jeremiah (20:04):
Yeah Well, and like I've told guys before, you know
anything, any spill above fivegallons is an EPA spill.
So if anyone notices or oryou're in the location that's
very open to observation, youknow, and you have a spill and
five gallons you know EPA is,can come in and help you clean
up and regulate how you do it.
(20:25):
So, once again, if you don'thave that spill kit and you have
something happen, you have noway to stop it or prevent that
kind of spill from happening.
And it's not.
Once again, it's an investmentand, yes, spill kits are kind of
spendy sometimes depending onwhat you're buying, but once
again it's an ounce ofpreventative maintenance is
going to save you down the road.
Aaron (20:44):
If you puncture your, your resin side and you have
uncured ISO on your floor, oryou vice versa, you're creating
a massive mess Again.
You're causing yourself moretime, more energy and
potentially getting yourself insome trouble too.
We'll just cut out the dead end.
Dan (21:05):
Hit the clicker real quick for us.
So we know.
Okay, sorry, you brought thebook over here.
Aaron (21:09):
No, I'm just waiting for the wrap-up.
You guys have the book.
Dan (21:11):
Oh, okay, all right, sounds good.
Okay, all right, all right.
Aaron (21:16):
Sounds good, okay, all right.
Dan (21:23):
Okay, so earlier felt like I was back in school again.
The teacher was over herepassing handouts around.
Aaron handed out some MSDSsheets here Again, these are
available everywhere.
There's manufacturers, websites, there's apps.
There's ask your distributor Ifyou show up and be like, hey,
(21:44):
this is a new product that wehave not sprayed before or heck,
it's an old product.
We spray every day, but wehaven't seen a TDS MSDS on it in
months, they'll print you oneand hand it to you.
So once you get that in yourhands, aaron, what are we
looking for?
What are we doing for the guyin the rig that's about to take
this stuff and spray it orsomething?
(22:07):
What is he going to read onhere for his own safety and the
safety of everybody around?
Aaron (22:11):
Sure, it's a cheat sheet, right?
So the manufacturers put thisout on all products.
It's not just spray foam.
You have an SDS for your TSL,you have an SDS for motor oil.
Dan (22:23):
The caulking that you keep in the rig.
There's a TDS on that.
Aaron (22:26):
The main thing that I would recommend is one always
have an SDS on your rig, just incase you know.
Osha can pull up on a job site,unannounced State can pull up
on a job site.
Unannounced state can pull upon a job site unannounced.
And if you don't know theproduct that you're spraying,
you're creating a problem foryourself.
As far as the TDS, there's alot of useful information on
there.
It's got your processingparameters, it's got you know
(22:48):
your air perms, it's got your Rvalue just the basic stuff.
That's on the TDS, which iswhat we've got here, but it's
also got you know goodinformation.
As far as for the contractor,the main thing that I handed
these out for is because we aretalking about storage and safety
and material handling.
It has a black and whitedirectly right here for you the
(23:09):
shelf life and your storage.
Make sure your product storedbetween 50 and 80 degrees
Fahrenheit I'm saying Fahrenheitbecause we do have Canadian
customers that are going tolisten to this as well but use
it as your cheat sheet.
The parameters as far as forprocessing the material are on
there and that's a good startingpoint Because if you're in the
field and you call somebody likeJeremiah, they're going to ask
(23:29):
where you started.
Well, he's going to have thatDDS.
So you guys are starting on thesame page of the book.
It has your troubleshootingstuff.
That's on there.
So a lot of the times that weget, we get calls um, whether it
be for an equipment malfunction, um, or it'd be for foam that's
not reacting properly or it'snot performing the way that it
could.
This saves a lot of timebecause if you as a contractor
(23:52):
can pull open your TDS book oryour SDS book, go down to where
okay, so it's, I've got weird,weird cell structure or I'm
getting voids behind the phone,that's going to save you 10, 15,
20 minutes of a call with withJeremiah or tech from whatever
your your phone manufacturer is,to where you could have got
that problem solved two to threeminutes.
Oh, I skipped this step or Ididn't, didn't have this turned
(24:13):
on.
Again, it's about productivityand that 15 or 20 minutes Well,
in the grand scheme of a day itdoesn't sound like a lot, but
when you're on a job site it'sone hundred and fifteen outside
in Arizona, 140 in the attics.
15 to 20 minutes is a long damntime, yeah, To have to wait to
get your question answered.
So use it as a cheat sheet.
(24:36):
But the reason, like I said,said that I passed these out
like the, the teacher'sassistant was because it has it
on here.
Right, you're, you have tostore the stuff correctly.
You can't have it in directsunlight.
But the other part of of thetds is it doesn't just give you
the, the, what it gives you the,why, well outside of the, the,
storing it at the propertemperature ranges, you shorten
the, the light that you can havethat foam, but it also that
(24:59):
direct sunlight or that heatmesses with the chemistry and I
think that that gets lost a lotfrom on the contractor side is,
you know, you see it as A and B,A and B, a and B, a and B.
What you're not seeing is allof the chemistry that's in that
resin side.
The guys like Jeremiah and theother manufacturers have spent a
(25:20):
lot of time developing and ithas to be correct.
Right, we know the chemicalcomposition of our water, but
these guys know the chemicalcomposition of that material and
how it performs at thistemperature, this temperature
and this temperature.
And there's, in going back tothat, there's a reason that
there's summer blends on opencell close.
So there's a reason thatthere's winter blends, there's a
reason that they're regularblends because those are going
(25:41):
to perform different,temperature wise, altitude wise.
Um, so having this on your rigor, you know, having your guys
that at least have the generalknowledge of what's on here,
saves you a lot of time, saves alot of headache and make sure
that you are processing thematerial properly, right?
Dan (25:54):
Right, and you know one of the other good things about this
.
Back on to you know the primarypurpose of what we're talking
about here.
There is health and safetyinformation, there is cautions
and recommendations, there'shandling, there's job site
warnings all published righthere.
Even it goes back to abreakdown of what type of pp you
should have for it.
Yeah, of course.
(26:15):
Um, you know, proper.
Yeah, yeah, respiration right.
Yeah, respiratory protectioneverything is all sitting right
here on there well then you'reyou're.
Aaron (26:25):
If you talk about material handling, you know you
have what's the what's.
The end result is the tip ofthat gun, right.
So these chemicals never touch,they never mix until that very
last second right.
Once that happens, we all knowwhat spray foam looks like, what
it smells like, but yourcustomers don't.
And are you setting them upproperly to know when they can
(26:46):
reenter their home?
When can they reoccupy?
All that's going to be on theTDS as well.
So it's not just the materialstorage and handling, or what's
the R value or what's the airperms or what's the density,
it's keeping your end customerssafe.
I like to say that we all have aresponsibility to this industry
to do things the right way.
Well, part of that is makingsure that your customers are
(27:08):
safe on the end and they in turnbecome a steward for you,
whether it be Spray Foam Arizonaor company XYZ.
You want them to have a goodexperience with you because you
did it right.
Not getting calls back because,hey, I got a funny smell, right
.
All that can be linked back towell, was it stored properly?
Did we lose surfactant?
(27:29):
Is the catalyst messed up?
Again, was this all handledproperly from the very beginning
, right?
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