January 29, 2025 • 25 mins
This episode features Olena Tokar, CEO of Lol & Pop, a Ukrainian candy company that successfully expanded globally.
Olena shares her inspiring entrepreneurial journey, from starting the company inspired by Martha Stewart to overcoming the challenges of franchising and exporting.
Learn how she navigated quality control issues, invested in learning about exporting, and ultimately broke into the US market during the COVID-19 pandemic.
Discover the importance of adaptability, perseverance, and believing in your idea, even when faced with obstacles.
Episode Highlights:
- From YouTube Inspiration to Global Expansion: Discover how Olena's entrepreneurial spirit led her to build a successful international candy business.
- Overcoming Franchise Challenges: Learn how Olena navigated quality control and other obstacles to find global success.
- Breaking into the US Market During a Pandemic: Uncover the unexpected opportunities and strategies that propelled Lol & Pop into the competitive US market.
- The Key Ingredients for Global Expansion: Find out the essential elements of adaptability, perseverance, and self-belief that are crucial for any entrepreneur aiming for international growth.
Sell Lol and Pop in your country: https://rebrand.ly/LolAndPop
Olena emphasizes that entrepreneurship is a marathon, not a sprint, and stresses the importance of perseverance, confidence, and continuous learning. With her unique perspective on the candy industry and international trade, she provides valuable tips for businesses looking to expand globally. Join us for an insightful discussion that highlights the resilience of Ukrainian entrepreneurs and their potential in the global market.
Don’t miss the next episode, where Olena will share more about her journey to Japan and additional tips for successful global expansion.
Speakers LinkedIn Profiles:
Dmytro Shvets https://www.linkedin.com/in/dshvets/
Olena Tokar https://www.linkedin.com/in/alonatokar/
Listen to Start Global Insights on all major podcast platforms. Don't forget to subscribe for more global business insights.
Spotify: https://rebrand.ly/SGISpotifyRSS
Apple podcasts: https://rebrand.ly/SGIAppleRSS
YouTube: https://rebrand.ly/SGIYTRSS
In your browser: https://rebrand.ly/SGISGRSS
Feedback: We value your thoughts. Please leave us a review on Apple podcasts, Spotify or email us at podcast@start-global.biz
Develop your international expansion strategy with Start Global, your guide to foreign markets. Visit us at https://www.start-global.biz/
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Hi, I'm Dmytro Shvets, your host at The Start Global Insights, where I interview experts
(00:10):
from different countries about local business secrets and international expansion experience.
This episode is devoted to the story of a small Ukrainian family company, a candy producer
that managed to expand globally.
The company chose not the easiest markets for its first steps, such as USA and Japan,
(00:31):
and succeeded there.
And in my opinion, this success is largely due to the personality of the company's CEO
and owner Olena Tokar, who will share today with us her story and tips on international
expansion.
Hi, Olena, and welcome to the show.
Hi, Dmytro.
(00:52):
Thank you for joining us, and I'm really excited to hear more about your journey.
Could you give a brief introduction of your company and its products, and how did it all
start and how did you come up with the idea of selling globally?
Yeah, sure.
Lol&Pop was established in 2013, and it was very unexpectedly.
(01:12):
I worked in a media company for a long period of time, and I was a co-publisher of a magazine
that was working with the celebrities.
So when you want celebrities to come to your event or just to give an interview or whatever,
you need to give something interesting to them.
(01:34):
And I was always looking for some unique stuff just to bring to this event.
It was some kind of a trade.
I find something interesting, they come to my events.
So it was pretty obvious how it works at the time, and in 2013, my daughter was almost
(01:55):
two years old, and I decided that I want more freedom.
And I saw that my business, it will give me my freedom.
One of the biggest mistakes of the beginners of entrepreneurship.
Yes, and actually all entrepreneurs, they really think that their own business will
give them freedom.
(02:16):
Well, to a certain extent, it's true.
Yeah, I have some kind of freedom, but still, you work nonstop.
It's 24-7 when you're an entrepreneur, and it doesn't really matter.
Because then you are starting to have the most evil boss in your life yourself.
Yourself, yeah.
It's true.
(02:36):
Yeah, it's true.
Wow.
And I was looking for some business ideas.
Me and my husband, we were like searching something, creating some kind of ideas, writing
them down, and then like sitting and saying, okay, this idea is okay, but not really what
we want.
This idea is okay, but we are too dependent to people who will be involved in this idea.
(02:58):
So it was pretty much of brainstorming all the time.
And one evening I was sitting searching something for my main job for some unique things for
the next event.
And I jumped into YouTube and it was a video there.
(03:19):
Like Martha Stewart was rolling some big candy in the bubble store in New York.
And inside of this huge candy, it was like a heart.
And at the end of this video, she told like, we made heart here, but actually you can make
anything you want, any text, logo, whatever.
(03:41):
And it was like lightning for me.
I was like, oh my God, this is the idea that I need to bring to Ukraine.
I know who gonna be my customers because I worked with a lot of like advertisers and
they know the market pretty well.
And I was like, oh my God, this is my idea.
I want to make natural candy with lager inside of them.
(04:04):
I woke up my husband and told him, I got the idea.
We're gonna make candy.
And he told me, oh, please go to sleep.
I just want you to go to sleep at this particular moment.
But I was all for it.
I was no, you need just to wake up and to listen to me.
I presented the idea like in some kind of 15 minutes and he told me, okay, it sounds
(04:26):
pretty.
So the first startup pitch was to your husband.
Yeah, the first startup pitch was for my husband.
And he believed in this idea.
Actually he believed in this idea and my mom's and believed in this idea.
And my dad was like, candy?
Why is that?
What for?
We have Russian, we have other companies.
(04:49):
And what was your idea of the client?
Who should be the client, the normal people or the B2B segment?
No, the first idea was that it's gonna be B2B.
Because I knew the market quite a while and I actually saw...
I don't know how to explain it, but I saw the whole way along and I saw my presentation.
(05:13):
Who am I gonna pitch this presentation?
Who are gonna be my customers, my first clients?
What lager types I will put their brand names.
I saw everything at that particular moment.
And first of all, it was B2B.
And then it was some kind of, okay, and my daughter, she believes this candy because
(05:34):
they will be natural and they want to make really good stuff.
So this is how it all happened.
The quality control was your daughter?
Yes, the quality control was my daughter.
And then was the most interesting part.
Okay, I saw this on YouTube video and it's great.
And who gonna teach us to make this candy in Ukraine?
(05:54):
So it was a long way.
To make the story short, we found a guy in Australia.
He came to one month to Kiev.
It was February, Australia.
From Australia?
From Australia.
Okay.
From Australia.
Yeah, it was like he was from Australia and he came here like in February.
(06:15):
And for us, it was some kind of, I don't know how to explain it, when you are so desperate
that you have one sheet document, like the agreement, it was one sheet agreement, and
you transfer all money.
And you just wait that this guy will come to Ukraine.
(06:38):
Because it was like all the money that you had, we also took bank loan for every family
member of my family.
It was so risky.
It's all in, all in like in Kazan.
Yeah, like it was all in.
It was all in.
So he taught you how to make candies.
(06:58):
Yeah, he taught us how to make candy.
So you actually began your business with international story at once.
Yeah.
Like he taught us how to make candy and only hard candy.
And then we developed marshmallows, jellies, caramels, lollipops, because I understood
that no business client will return for the same type of candy.
You always need to have something else.
(07:21):
And when you decided to go internationally, globally, how did it happen?
And what was your first market?
Actually, it was from the very beginning.
When we launched the company, I had an intention that it would be like international company
because the naming, lollipop, is not common for Ukraine.
(07:43):
It's not easy for Ukrainians to pronounce it.
Yeah.
So for me, it was obvious that I want to be international from the very beginning.
But in 2014, we decided that we're going to expand with franchising model.
We launched our own franchise.
And I would say that it was a successful experience because we had our own subsidiary in Ukraine
(08:11):
and Poland.
In Ukraine, we also had a franchising subsidiary in Zaporizhzhya.
And abroad, we had our franchising subsidiaries in Bulgaria and in Israel.
So from the start to this little network abroad, it took you two years, quite quick.
(08:33):
A little less.
It was year and a half.
Pretty quick.
Yeah.
But as we were young entrepreneurs, I think that here we made a mistake with the franchising
because we gave them the whole process, how to make candy.
It was better just to make not the production, but the product.
(08:55):
What was the downside of this approach?
The downside?
The main downside is that you can't fully control what ingredients your franchisee is
going to buy.
So they bought some part of natural ingredients and then they decided to buy another stuff.
And for us, keeping it natural, safe, it was our top priority.
(09:19):
It's our main value.
And it was unacceptable.
So we decided to close the franchising subsidiaries in 2017 and focused on exporting.
I took a lot of classes, I would say, in exporting because we had expert promotion office at
(09:39):
that time.
And they give a lot of trainings, a lot of experts who were telling about export, how
to export certification, logistics, and all this thing that you need to know about exporting.
We also took part in a lot of trade missions to Sweden, to Israel, to Germany, to Canada
(10:04):
as well.
And for us, it was really very important.
So from 2017 till 2020, I was just trying to get all the information that I need to
get about exporting.
And at that period of time, you make a lot of attempts, but you have no results.
(10:26):
And it might be really very hard.
And for me, it was like, oh my God, what I'm doing wrong?
What the matter with it?
Especially taking into account how quick you managed to launch your franchising network.
So you just had different expectations.
Yeah, different expectations.
For me, it was very interesting in that period of time.
(10:49):
But on the other hand, it was like some kind of disappointment.
And I was thinking, okay, let it be so.
Still, it's my experience.
I know a lot about exporting now and I will find my clients.
A lot of distributors, they want to work with big volumes.
(11:10):
And I work with quality, but my volumes are not as big as like Russian, AVECA and other
big companies.
And in terms of cooperation now, I understand that there are different distributors working
with different retail chains.
So all that we did was right, but the target audience was not the ones that we needed.
(11:34):
So you spent time of contacting not the right client and that's why the time was a bit longer
than you expected.
Yeah, it was a bit longer than I expected.
But after every trade mission, I got some contacts, I got some experience.
I heard what they told me about the products, the packaging, the labeling.
(11:54):
And we made rebranding.
We made a lot of things that was really necessary for us.
And we became stronger on our local market because of that.
And it was more just a matter of time.
So at that period of time, I was building my confidence.
I would call it like this.
(12:16):
And I will find my clients.
I was pretty much sure about this.
I think this is one of the main points in entrepreneurship in general, but also especially
if it is a global scale entrepreneurship, this confidence in yourself and belief that
yes, that you will make it because the journey is long and you need this energy.
(12:39):
And it will push you forward.
Actually, I love the quote that when we are talking about exporting, it's not a sprint.
It's a marathon.
And you need to be ready for this.
And you need to be ready for this in terms of your investments because trade fairs, like
(13:00):
taking part in trade fairs, exhibitions, trade missions, sending samples, like it all takes
time and money.
And you need to be sure that you want this because sometimes companies are not ready
for exporting at all.
So they think that they will write a few emails and we'll get contract.
(13:23):
Maybe if you're producing something really very unique, special, and you're the one producer
in the world, maybe this will work.
But in general, no, it doesn't work like this.
Yeah, this is what I hear now, especially because there is now kind of a boom of interest
(13:43):
towards exports from Ukraine because we are losing our sales inside of the country.
And many companies think that it will be like quick solution to get another source of income
and just expand their sales from Ukraine to abroad.
And then when they hear what the journey ahead, and they are like changing, very often they
(14:06):
are changing their minds because it will take too much of their forces to just start doing
that, not even getting the income and start sales.
And after having this, let's call it international markets MBA, but not in the university, but
in like real life MBA.
(14:28):
When you were already choosing the markets, have you chosen the markets according to some
criteria where it was also intuitively?
And what was your first market when you managed to sell?
Oh, wow.
Our first market was United States.
But to be honest, I'm not a good example, I would say, because I'm more of an example
(14:55):
that breaking the rules than the examples that following the rules how it should be.
I heard from everyone that United States or North America just couldn't be your first
export market.
It's just impossible, just impossible.
You can't do it like this.
And that was the trigger word for you.
(15:16):
Yes, the word impossible was the trigger word to do that.
Well, yeah, I like that impossible is nothing actually.
But all the limits are in our head.
And for me, it worked like this.
Our first export market was during the COVID and it was United States.
(15:37):
So tougher, tougher you could not find.
Maybe China would be tougher at that time.
Oh, yeah, definitely.
Here, here, here at least the language was closer to what you can speak.
Yeah.
Yeah, it was familiar.
And due to our experience working with like trade mission to Canada, and we took part
(16:05):
in the trade fair, Cial-Montreal in 2018.
So we had all the labels adapted to the United States market.
So we made a lot of homework before that contract without expectations that we would have it.
So sometimes you just do things without any expectations.
(16:30):
And then it helps you a lot.
Because at that particular time when this client came to us, we had a lot of things
and we were like prepared for this.
And he asked, do you have this?
Yes.
And this?
Yes.
And this?
Yes.
So we didn't have FDA at that period of time, but we had all the labelings, all the
(16:57):
nutrition that we need to have.
We had labeling in English and we could also sell to Canada because we had it in English
and in French.
So we had a lot of things prepared for this particular client that we didn't expect.
(17:19):
How did you find the client in the US?
He found us.
It's a kind of magic.
Just through the internet, how did it happen?
No, it was really very interesting situation because it was a friend of mine, not even
(17:42):
a friend but acquaintance that I had a few years before that.
And she just wrote me like, it's pandemic, it's July, it's like the most awful time
that you can imagine, everything is closed.
Like for the candy, summer is not the best time in ordinary periods of life and now it
(18:03):
was COVID.
So it was not okay.
And she wrote me, my husband decided to open a new store in the United States and they're
looking for...
Suppliers.
Yes, they're looking for suppliers.
Do you want to sell your candy in the United States?
It was like this.
(18:23):
It was like this.
And I was like, oh really, it's some kind of weird question.
But yeah, of course I want, let's talk.
And it was like the starting point.
And it was 1st of July and on 19th of September, we shipped six or seven pallets to the United
(18:47):
States.
We had more than 140 SKUs in this order.
And for us it was challenging because actually the times that we had for production was so
tight that we were working all days, almost all nights without any weekends.
But for us it was some kind of a big milestone, but a big challenge as well.
(19:13):
And our first pallets, they looked awful.
Because we had no clue what does it mean like to make a pallet.
We had no clue.
We had different boxes of different sizes.
So it looked awful.
Really, it looked awful.
Thanks God, like this partner that we had, he was empathetic.
(19:37):
Let's call it like this.
He was okay with this, but we saw all the mistakes that we had in this first delivery
and our second delivery, it was smooth.
We had really very decent pallets.
We bought this Zebra printer.
We had all the labelings correct and we were like stars, really.
(20:01):
I think this is very important to highlight.
This is not only for the exporting activities, but also for any type of entrepreneurship.
To do mistakes is okay.
But the main point here is to analyze the mistakes and come back with this new knowledge.
Because I have seen a lot of companies or entrepreneurs that just hit their head against
(20:27):
the wall and they made the same mistake all the time.
Not making their homework, analyzing the mistakes.
In fact, what you are talking about, what you're telling me is that you have been learning
all this time on your mistakes and on all your steps that you have made.
(20:48):
And then the next step was much, much better than the previous one.
It was almost like a kanban perfection.
You made each next step better than the previous one.
Well, it's a part of the journey.
You can't make it without mistakes.
(21:09):
Based from this lucky case in the US, did you consider to choose your markets not according
to your friends or acquaintances, but according to some analytics or any other data?
What were the next markets after the US?
The next markets that we wanted to enter were Lithuania because we made an expert plan after
(21:36):
that.
We were so confident.
So we have all this analysis of the...
Also we had this Sweden market, we had Lithuanian market and German market.
So for us, it was three main target markets that we wanted to enter.
We made a lot of analytics.
(21:56):
I also went to another expert program where we need to prepare our expert plan.
It was really very interesting program before the war, but what happened?
Nothing really happened because we tried to reach this market and all that we had in our
plan for us, it didn't work.
(22:18):
I don't know why.
Maybe because it was because of this full scale invasion because we are a high risky
producer.
So we can say that nothing's changed, but no, it's changed a lot.
For the rest of the world, we are really very high risky companies here in Ukraine.
(22:40):
The main risk is that you will order something, pay money and you're going to never receive
it.
Yeah, not because of the partner, but because of the cycle hit to the production.
Yes.
Yes.
So it's the reality that we live in.
But coming back to Sweden, Lithuania and Germany, what happened after you realized that this
(23:02):
is not your market?
To be honest, I wouldn't say that I don't think that these are our markets.
I still think that we have potential on this market.
For us, these markets are still interesting, but we received another contract from the
(23:24):
country.
Okay.
I will stop here for a second.
I think that this is just a destiny.
So you have a company that is doomed to succeed in international markets.
As Ukraine is doomed to be the greatest country on the continent, the same is with your company.
(23:48):
But I just want to stop and highlight this thing, this notion of potential markets for
those listeners that are listening to us in Sweden, Lithuania and Germany.
And according to statistics of my podcast, there are real listeners from these countries.
(24:09):
And I think that not only Ukrainians that are living there.
So for you, pay attention and remember the company name is Lol&Pop in Ukraine.
And I think that if I remember correctly, URL is Lol&Pop.ua.
So you can go there, find a place for international partners and just start a conversation with
(24:33):
Olena.
And I think that you should definitely find this potential mutual and earn together with
very tasty and high quality candies from Ukraine.
And now for the miracle.
Yeah, thanks.
Now before the miracle, I would say that we have a special link, expert, and you will
(24:53):
find our expert presentation there.
You can send me that afterwards and I will put it in the description of the podcast.
Great, great.
I will do this.
This is the end of the first part of the interview with Olena Tokar, the owner and CEO of the
candy producer Lol&Pop from Ukraine.
(25:14):
And we have discussed with Olena so many interesting information about her journey further to Japan.
So I decided not to cut out the valuable parts, but to make it in the second part.
So in the next part of the interview, you will get more information about the journey
(25:37):
of Lol&Pop to Japan.
How did they find the clients there?
And also several more tips from Olena about global expansion for your business.
And don't forget to subscribe not to miss next episodes.
Hi, I'm Dmytro Shvets, your host at The Start Global Insights, where I interview experts
(00:10):
from different countries about local business secrets and international expansion experience.
This episode is devoted to the story of a small Ukrainian family company, a candy producer
that managed to expand globally.
The company chose not the easiest markets for its first steps, such as USA and Japan,
(00:31):
and succeeded there.
And in my opinion, this success is largely due to the personality of the company's CEO
and owner Olena Tokar, who will share today with us her story and tips on international
expansion.
Hi, Olena, and welcome to the show.
Hi, Dmytro.
(00:52):
Thank you for joining us, and I'm really excited to hear more about your journey.
Could you give a brief introduction of your company and its products, and how did it all
start and how did you come up with the idea of selling globally?
Yeah, sure.
Lol&Pop was established in 2013, and it was very unexpectedly.
(01:12):
I worked in a media company for a long period of time, and I was a co-publisher of a magazine
that was working with the celebrities.
So when you want celebrities to come to your event or just to give an interview or whatever,
you need to give something interesting to them.
(01:34):
And I was always looking for some unique stuff just to bring to this event.
It was some kind of a trade.
I find something interesting, they come to my events.
So it was pretty obvious how it works at the time, and in 2013, my daughter was almost
(01:55):
two years old, and I decided that I want more freedom.
And I saw that my business, it will give me my freedom.
One of the biggest mistakes of the beginners of entrepreneurship.
Yes, and actually all entrepreneurs, they really think that their own business will
give them freedom.
(02:16):
Well, to a certain extent, it's true.
Yeah, I have some kind of freedom, but still, you work nonstop.
It's 24-7 when you're an entrepreneur, and it doesn't really matter.
Because then you are starting to have the most evil boss in your life yourself.
Yourself, yeah.
It's true.
(02:36):
Yeah, it's true.
Wow.
And I was looking for some business ideas.
Me and my husband, we were like searching something, creating some kind of ideas, writing
them down, and then like sitting and saying, okay, this idea is okay, but not really what
we want.
This idea is okay, but we are too dependent to people who will be involved in this idea.
(02:58):
So it was pretty much of brainstorming all the time.
And one evening I was sitting searching something for my main job for some unique things for
the next event.
And I jumped into YouTube and it was a video there.
(03:19):
Like Martha Stewart was rolling some big candy in the bubble store in New York.
And inside of this huge candy, it was like a heart.
And at the end of this video, she told like, we made heart here, but actually you can make
anything you want, any text, logo, whatever.
(03:41):
And it was like lightning for me.
I was like, oh my God, this is the idea that I need to bring to Ukraine.
I know who gonna be my customers because I worked with a lot of like advertisers and
they know the market pretty well.
And I was like, oh my God, this is my idea.
I want to make natural candy with lager inside of them.
(04:04):
I woke up my husband and told him, I got the idea.
We're gonna make candy.
And he told me, oh, please go to sleep.
I just want you to go to sleep at this particular moment.
But I was all for it.
I was no, you need just to wake up and to listen to me.
I presented the idea like in some kind of 15 minutes and he told me, okay, it sounds
(04:26):
pretty.
So the first startup pitch was to your husband.
Yeah, the first startup pitch was for my husband.
And he believed in this idea.
Actually he believed in this idea and my mom's and believed in this idea.
And my dad was like, candy?
Why is that?
What for?
We have Russian, we have other companies.
(04:49):
And what was your idea of the client?
Who should be the client, the normal people or the B2B segment?
No, the first idea was that it's gonna be B2B.
Because I knew the market quite a while and I actually saw...
I don't know how to explain it, but I saw the whole way along and I saw my presentation.
(05:13):
Who am I gonna pitch this presentation?
Who are gonna be my customers, my first clients?
What lager types I will put their brand names.
I saw everything at that particular moment.
And first of all, it was B2B.
And then it was some kind of, okay, and my daughter, she believes this candy because
(05:34):
they will be natural and they want to make really good stuff.
So this is how it all happened.
The quality control was your daughter?
Yes, the quality control was my daughter.
And then was the most interesting part.
Okay, I saw this on YouTube video and it's great.
And who gonna teach us to make this candy in Ukraine?
(05:54):
So it was a long way.
To make the story short, we found a guy in Australia.
He came to one month to Kiev.
It was February, Australia.
From Australia?
From Australia.
Okay.
From Australia.
Yeah, it was like he was from Australia and he came here like in February.
(06:15):
And for us, it was some kind of, I don't know how to explain it, when you are so desperate
that you have one sheet document, like the agreement, it was one sheet agreement, and
you transfer all money.
And you just wait that this guy will come to Ukraine.
(06:38):
Because it was like all the money that you had, we also took bank loan for every family
member of my family.
It was so risky.
It's all in, all in like in Kazan.
Yeah, like it was all in.
It was all in.
So he taught you how to make candies.
(06:58):
Yeah, he taught us how to make candy.
So you actually began your business with international story at once.
Yeah.
Like he taught us how to make candy and only hard candy.
And then we developed marshmallows, jellies, caramels, lollipops, because I understood
that no business client will return for the same type of candy.
You always need to have something else.
(07:21):
And when you decided to go internationally, globally, how did it happen?
And what was your first market?
Actually, it was from the very beginning.
When we launched the company, I had an intention that it would be like international company
because the naming, lollipop, is not common for Ukraine.
(07:43):
It's not easy for Ukrainians to pronounce it.
Yeah.
So for me, it was obvious that I want to be international from the very beginning.
But in 2014, we decided that we're going to expand with franchising model.
We launched our own franchise.
And I would say that it was a successful experience because we had our own subsidiary in Ukraine
(08:11):
and Poland.
In Ukraine, we also had a franchising subsidiary in Zaporizhzhya.
And abroad, we had our franchising subsidiaries in Bulgaria and in Israel.
So from the start to this little network abroad, it took you two years, quite quick.
(08:33):
A little less.
It was year and a half.
Pretty quick.
Yeah.
But as we were young entrepreneurs, I think that here we made a mistake with the franchising
because we gave them the whole process, how to make candy.
It was better just to make not the production, but the product.
(08:55):
What was the downside of this approach?
The downside?
The main downside is that you can't fully control what ingredients your franchisee is
going to buy.
So they bought some part of natural ingredients and then they decided to buy another stuff.
And for us, keeping it natural, safe, it was our top priority.
(09:19):
It's our main value.
And it was unacceptable.
So we decided to close the franchising subsidiaries in 2017 and focused on exporting.
I took a lot of classes, I would say, in exporting because we had expert promotion office at
(09:39):
that time.
And they give a lot of trainings, a lot of experts who were telling about export, how
to export certification, logistics, and all this thing that you need to know about exporting.
We also took part in a lot of trade missions to Sweden, to Israel, to Germany, to Canada
(10:04):
as well.
And for us, it was really very important.
So from 2017 till 2020, I was just trying to get all the information that I need to
get about exporting.
And at that period of time, you make a lot of attempts, but you have no results.
(10:26):
And it might be really very hard.
And for me, it was like, oh my God, what I'm doing wrong?
What the matter with it?
Especially taking into account how quick you managed to launch your franchising network.
So you just had different expectations.
Yeah, different expectations.
For me, it was very interesting in that period of time.
(10:49):
But on the other hand, it was like some kind of disappointment.
And I was thinking, okay, let it be so.
Still, it's my experience.
I know a lot about exporting now and I will find my clients.
A lot of distributors, they want to work with big volumes.
(11:10):
And I work with quality, but my volumes are not as big as like Russian, AVECA and other
big companies.
And in terms of cooperation now, I understand that there are different distributors working
with different retail chains.
So all that we did was right, but the target audience was not the ones that we needed.
(11:34):
So you spent time of contacting not the right client and that's why the time was a bit longer
than you expected.
Yeah, it was a bit longer than I expected.
But after every trade mission, I got some contacts, I got some experience.
I heard what they told me about the products, the packaging, the labeling.
(11:54):
And we made rebranding.
We made a lot of things that was really necessary for us.
And we became stronger on our local market because of that.
And it was more just a matter of time.
So at that period of time, I was building my confidence.
I would call it like this.
(12:16):
And I will find my clients.
I was pretty much sure about this.
I think this is one of the main points in entrepreneurship in general, but also especially
if it is a global scale entrepreneurship, this confidence in yourself and belief that
yes, that you will make it because the journey is long and you need this energy.
(12:39):
And it will push you forward.
Actually, I love the quote that when we are talking about exporting, it's not a sprint.
It's a marathon.
And you need to be ready for this.
And you need to be ready for this in terms of your investments because trade fairs, like
(13:00):
taking part in trade fairs, exhibitions, trade missions, sending samples, like it all takes
time and money.
And you need to be sure that you want this because sometimes companies are not ready
for exporting at all.
So they think that they will write a few emails and we'll get contract.
(13:23):
Maybe if you're producing something really very unique, special, and you're the one producer
in the world, maybe this will work.
But in general, no, it doesn't work like this.
Yeah, this is what I hear now, especially because there is now kind of a boom of interest
(13:43):
towards exports from Ukraine because we are losing our sales inside of the country.
And many companies think that it will be like quick solution to get another source of income
and just expand their sales from Ukraine to abroad.
And then when they hear what the journey ahead, and they are like changing, very often they
(14:06):
are changing their minds because it will take too much of their forces to just start doing
that, not even getting the income and start sales.
And after having this, let's call it international markets MBA, but not in the university, but
in like real life MBA.
(14:28):
When you were already choosing the markets, have you chosen the markets according to some
criteria where it was also intuitively?
And what was your first market when you managed to sell?
Oh, wow.
Our first market was United States.
But to be honest, I'm not a good example, I would say, because I'm more of an example
(14:55):
that breaking the rules than the examples that following the rules how it should be.
I heard from everyone that United States or North America just couldn't be your first
export market.
It's just impossible, just impossible.
You can't do it like this.
And that was the trigger word for you.
(15:16):
Yes, the word impossible was the trigger word to do that.
Well, yeah, I like that impossible is nothing actually.
But all the limits are in our head.
And for me, it worked like this.
Our first export market was during the COVID and it was United States.
(15:37):
So tougher, tougher you could not find.
Maybe China would be tougher at that time.
Oh, yeah, definitely.
Here, here, here at least the language was closer to what you can speak.
Yeah.
Yeah, it was familiar.
And due to our experience working with like trade mission to Canada, and we took part
(16:05):
in the trade fair, Cial-Montreal in 2018.
So we had all the labels adapted to the United States market.
So we made a lot of homework before that contract without expectations that we would have it.
So sometimes you just do things without any expectations.
(16:30):
And then it helps you a lot.
Because at that particular time when this client came to us, we had a lot of things
and we were like prepared for this.
And he asked, do you have this?
Yes.
And this?
Yes.
And this?
Yes.
So we didn't have FDA at that period of time, but we had all the labelings, all the
(16:57):
nutrition that we need to have.
We had labeling in English and we could also sell to Canada because we had it in English
and in French.
So we had a lot of things prepared for this particular client that we didn't expect.
(17:19):
How did you find the client in the US?
He found us.
It's a kind of magic.
Just through the internet, how did it happen?
No, it was really very interesting situation because it was a friend of mine, not even
(17:42):
a friend but acquaintance that I had a few years before that.
And she just wrote me like, it's pandemic, it's July, it's like the most awful time
that you can imagine, everything is closed.
Like for the candy, summer is not the best time in ordinary periods of life and now it
(18:03):
was COVID.
So it was not okay.
And she wrote me, my husband decided to open a new store in the United States and they're
looking for...
Suppliers.
Yes, they're looking for suppliers.
Do you want to sell your candy in the United States?
It was like this.
(18:23):
It was like this.
And I was like, oh really, it's some kind of weird question.
But yeah, of course I want, let's talk.
And it was like the starting point.
And it was 1st of July and on 19th of September, we shipped six or seven pallets to the United
(18:47):
States.
We had more than 140 SKUs in this order.
And for us it was challenging because actually the times that we had for production was so
tight that we were working all days, almost all nights without any weekends.
But for us it was some kind of a big milestone, but a big challenge as well.
(19:13):
And our first pallets, they looked awful.
Because we had no clue what does it mean like to make a pallet.
We had no clue.
We had different boxes of different sizes.
So it looked awful.
Really, it looked awful.
Thanks God, like this partner that we had, he was empathetic.
(19:37):
Let's call it like this.
He was okay with this, but we saw all the mistakes that we had in this first delivery
and our second delivery, it was smooth.
We had really very decent pallets.
We bought this Zebra printer.
We had all the labelings correct and we were like stars, really.
(20:01):
I think this is very important to highlight.
This is not only for the exporting activities, but also for any type of entrepreneurship.
To do mistakes is okay.
But the main point here is to analyze the mistakes and come back with this new knowledge.
Because I have seen a lot of companies or entrepreneurs that just hit their head against
(20:27):
the wall and they made the same mistake all the time.
Not making their homework, analyzing the mistakes.
In fact, what you are talking about, what you're telling me is that you have been learning
all this time on your mistakes and on all your steps that you have made.
(20:48):
And then the next step was much, much better than the previous one.
It was almost like a kanban perfection.
You made each next step better than the previous one.
Well, it's a part of the journey.
You can't make it without mistakes.
(21:09):
Based from this lucky case in the US, did you consider to choose your markets not according
to your friends or acquaintances, but according to some analytics or any other data?
What were the next markets after the US?
The next markets that we wanted to enter were Lithuania because we made an expert plan after
(21:36):
that.
We were so confident.
So we have all this analysis of the...
Also we had this Sweden market, we had Lithuanian market and German market.
So for us, it was three main target markets that we wanted to enter.
We made a lot of analytics.
(21:56):
I also went to another expert program where we need to prepare our expert plan.
It was really very interesting program before the war, but what happened?
Nothing really happened because we tried to reach this market and all that we had in our
plan for us, it didn't work.
(22:18):
I don't know why.
Maybe because it was because of this full scale invasion because we are a high risky
producer.
So we can say that nothing's changed, but no, it's changed a lot.
For the rest of the world, we are really very high risky companies here in Ukraine.
(22:40):
The main risk is that you will order something, pay money and you're going to never receive
it.
Yeah, not because of the partner, but because of the cycle hit to the production.
Yes.
Yes.
So it's the reality that we live in.
But coming back to Sweden, Lithuania and Germany, what happened after you realized that this
(23:02):
is not your market?
To be honest, I wouldn't say that I don't think that these are our markets.
I still think that we have potential on this market.
For us, these markets are still interesting, but we received another contract from the
(23:24):
country.
Okay.
I will stop here for a second.
I think that this is just a destiny.
So you have a company that is doomed to succeed in international markets.
As Ukraine is doomed to be the greatest country on the continent, the same is with your company.
(23:48):
But I just want to stop and highlight this thing, this notion of potential markets for
those listeners that are listening to us in Sweden, Lithuania and Germany.
And according to statistics of my podcast, there are real listeners from these countries.
(24:09):
And I think that not only Ukrainians that are living there.
So for you, pay attention and remember the company name is Lol&Pop in Ukraine.
And I think that if I remember correctly, URL is Lol&Pop.ua.
So you can go there, find a place for international partners and just start a conversation with
(24:33):
Olena.
And I think that you should definitely find this potential mutual and earn together with
very tasty and high quality candies from Ukraine.
And now for the miracle.
Yeah, thanks.
Now before the miracle, I would say that we have a special link, expert, and you will
(24:53):
find our expert presentation there.
You can send me that afterwards and I will put it in the description of the podcast.
Great, great.
I will do this.
This is the end of the first part of the interview with Olena Tokar, the owner and CEO of the
candy producer Lol&Pop from Ukraine.
(25:14):
And we have discussed with Olena so many interesting information about her journey further to Japan.
So I decided not to cut out the valuable parts, but to make it in the second part.
So in the next part of the interview, you will get more information about the journey
(25:37):
of Lol&Pop to Japan.
How did they find the clients there?
And also several more tips from Olena about global expansion for your business.
And don't forget to subscribe not to miss next episodes.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!