June 20, 2025 • 22 mins
What happens when you realize the person you've been presenting to the world for decades isn't your true self? Jay Washington's powerful conversation takes us on a journey through authenticity, emotional growth, and unexpected life pivots.
The conversation takes a deeply moving turn as Jay shares his transition from being the fun uncle ("funkle") to becoming a father figure ("dunkle") for his niece and nephew after they lost both parents. Rather than seeing this unexpected responsibility as a burden, Jay discovered it became his North Star, providing purpose and healing wounds he didn't know existed. "To make the choice to love a child that you didn't biologically create is a special gift," he reflects.
Jay's insights on setting boundaries, emotional intelligence, and breaking generational cycles offer practical wisdom for anyone navigating their own pivot. His simple yet profound advice to his younger self "I would hug him and tell him you are enough" encapsulates the core message of his transformation. For men especially, his advocacy for emotional expression challenges harmful societal norms: "The more emotionally in touch you can be as a man, it takes security in yourself to go against what society has prescribed for you."
Guest Bio:
Jay Washington is Client Advisor, Vice President Workplace Retirement Solutions for JPMorganChase. He works with Chase Business Bankers and other intermediaries provide a turnkey 401(k) solution to business owner plan sponsors. Jay Joined JPMC in March 2025. Prior to that, Jay spent 25 years in the retirement space in various client facing roles, where his passion for better participant outcomes provided a wealth of opportunities.
Jay graduated from Indiana University of Pennsylvania, with degrees in Economics and Journalism, and obtained his MBA from Point Park University— in addition to several industry designations. He holds FINRA Series 6, 7, 63 and 65 licenses.
In his spare time, Jay enjoys working out and traveling. He is an active father-figure to his niece and nephew, as well as an active member and officer of five nonprofit boards.
Connect with Jay:
Connect with Theresa and Ivana:
Theresa, True Strategy Consultants: tsc-consultants.com
LinkedIn @treeconti, Insta @tscconsultants
Ivana, Courageous Being: courageousbeing.com
LinkedIn @ivipol, Insta @courbeing
SITP team, Step Into The Pivot: stepintothepivot.com
LinkedIn @step-into-the-pivot, YouTube @StepIntoThePivot
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello everybody, welcome to this week's episode
of Step Into the Pivot, and ourguest today is Jay Washington.
Jay, so excited to have youhere.
Speaker 3 (00:10):
I'm excited to be here.
This couldn't be better timing.
This week has been the start ofa new chapter and I cannot
think of two people to have myfirst conversation with about it
than you two it than YouTubeAwesome.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
We had the pleasure of meeting at a conference we
were all at last year and it wassuch a fun and I've connected
several times since then.
You spent your whole career infinancial services.
I mean, you just speak mylanguage, so we are super
excited.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Yes, we love, you know, to talk about authenticity
.
We both really spend a lot oftime understanding it, unpacking
it and living it, and we boththink that it's not just a
conversation to be hadcognitively, but to really like
find examples of it and, youknow, look for the embodiment of
it.
And thank you also forauthentically being game to
(00:59):
essentially play with us here alittle bit, because as we were
getting on and getting ready tostart recording, you started
sharing about what's going onfor you today, literally right
now.
You're in the middle of a newpivot and we stopped you and we
said let's hit the record andtell us, together with our
audience, what's going on foryou right now.
(01:21):
Tell us about the new chapter.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
Excited to share, and what I want to say is it is so
easy to jump right into it whenyou're with people who you know
you can be yourself with.
I think sometimes, like wowtook me 47 years to learn that
and Sway was a big part of thatwhere we met and I went through
several different phases after Istarted realizing that Anger
(01:48):
that I put myself in.
I allowed myself to be put in abox Resentment, sadness,
acceptance and now where I am isat a place of joy, because I
realized going through all ofthat has allowed me to get to
where I am and appreciate it somuch more and to be a source for
(02:08):
those who I see going throughthat same thing, to let them
know you don't have to do that.
Here's my story.
Here's how you can overcome it.
So I'm going to take I alwayssay, let your adversity be your
university and then go forth andteach afterwards.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
Oh, I love that.
One of the first conversationswe had here in this, you know,
setting on the podcast, wasabout how also all the different
emotions you highlighted.
That also is not a linearjourney.
Oftentimes, you know, it's likethis is super cool, we come
together and then we try to sortof organize it and make sense
of it.
But it doesn't really go likethat right In terms of like oh,
(02:46):
now I'm in anger, now I'm infrustration, oh, now I'm in
acceptance, now I'm in joy.
Oftentimes there's going to besome sliding back and forth as
you keep, you know, pivoting andtransitioning and transforming.
Is that true for you too?
Speaker 3 (02:59):
Absolutely.
You know, monday was the startof my new job and I woke up
early and I was overjoyed.
And then I went to the gym andon my way back I hit a moment
where I started thinking aboutmy niece and nephew and
sometimes I talk about them Ichoke up.
My mom was telling me mynephew's baseball season is
starting soon, and oftentimeswhen I'm not there, she's his
(03:23):
only cheerleader, and oftentimeswhen I'm not there, she's his
only cheerleader.
And it made me realizesometimes that I fight anger at
the situation they've been putin by being 12 and 16 and having
lost both parents, and on a daywhen I should have just been
filled with overjoy because Igot this new job that I'm really
excited about, like I had tofight back tears and I realized
(03:44):
I said it's okay Emotion, likeyou said, it's not a linear
journey.
And it also made me remembersomething that's been really
been getting me through.
Every challenge is that life is10% what happens to you and 90%
how you react to it.
I had my moment.
I remember the abundance in mylife and I moved on, and I'm
(04:08):
grateful for that, because somany men are not taught how to
process the various emotions andwhen it gets hard, we struggle,
and so I pat myself on the back, because that was something
that I was very much subjectedto in years past.
God, in months past, thattemporary sadness would have
(04:28):
ruled my entire day, but I'velearned to change that.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
We have those moments in time and we have to give
ourselves the capability tothink about them, to work
through them a little bit sothat we can move forward.
Right, it's all those kind ofthings and it's part of being
who we are.
It's part of you know, when youstarted talking, what I was
thinking of is you know yourauthentic self, but think about
(04:55):
how long it probably took you toget there right and acceptance
and things like that.
So talk a little about you knowhow you were feeling that you
were living as someone otherthan your true self, other than
your authentic self.
Speaker 3 (05:12):
You know, I did such a good job at it.
I didn't even realize that Iwas living that way anymore.
And I remember I was part of amen's group.
It's June of 2023.
We were having a weekendretreat and the leader who I was
very close to, who I am veryclose to, said Jay, he said you
(05:35):
do the most amazing job ofmaking people feel that they
know you and you haven't letanybody in.
And that's when I realized thatwhat I've been living as my
authentic truth in fact was not.
And I started working throughthat and I realized that working
through it didn't mean I hadsolved it.
(05:57):
And the last year I would say2024 started to really take a
dark turn, probably around May,and I didn't know why, but it
just did.
And I was really struggling tothe point where a friend of mine
who has known me since I was 17said I was here when you lost
(06:19):
your father.
I was here when you lost yourgrandfather and your grandmother
three of the most importantpeople in your life.
I feel you're in a worse placenow than when that happened, and
she was right.
I shared it sway that at onepoint, as I was driving home, I
said to myself.
I slammed this car into a wall.
The noise stops, I'm insured,I've got savings, my niece and
(06:44):
nephew are taken care of,everything.
A pretty little bow is put oneverything.
And then I said or you can getsome help.
And I ended up working with acoach who helped me to realize
that I have lived from a placeof not feeling worthy of being
myself for so long that Iactually sent a version of me to
(07:08):
step in place to be what I felteveryone needed to be and what
I was going through.
He said.
And what I was going through.
He said the real you is finallystrong enough to step out, but
the old you is fighting to holdon.
So you're actually involved ina fight internal fight with
yourself.
The real you is winning and alot of the sadness is mourning
(07:33):
the person you were, who tooksuch good care of you for the
past four decades.
And he was absolutely right.
And he said the beauty of thisis when you come out on the
other side and you will, youwill appreciate what he did and
you will never look back andthis last year will be as if it
almost never happened, becauseyou will now know the purpose of
(07:55):
old you and the purpose of newyou, and that's where we are.
And it brought me back to myfaith, and on a daily basis.
I thank God that I went throughthat, because I would still be
living in authentically if Ihadn't.
And I do know it's not going tobe linear and there will be
moments when I slide back.
(08:15):
I may slide back.
I will never go back.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
Well, I'm going to say before Evie says, what she
wants to say is what I.
I love that your friendrecognized that in you.
I think that is so importantand I think sometimes we don't
do that enough with, with ourfriends or you know those kinds
of things, because we're afraidor overstepping or you know
whatever.
But I, I love that you know you.
(08:43):
That's a lot to be thankful forto have a friend like that.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
And you're talking soundbites, so meaning, so good,
right, so inspirational, andthat's really, I mean, it's,
it's.
I started taking notes, then Istopped because it was like I
can't keep up.
You know you can't keep upbecause these are such good, you
know, moments of wisdom, and Ifeel like that's really the
(09:10):
muscle we want to be exercising.
You know, practicing thisability to tune into a larger,
you know, a larger knowing, abigger perspective, and then
start to let that come throughon a regular basis.
And you know that is probablythe best way, the best remedy
for both the hurting one who is,you know, invested in old ways
(09:31):
of operating and is not reallyletting go easily.
Remedy for the one who wants to, you know, come through and
really express who he really is.
And at the end of the day, Ithink that's probably when you
let that guidance come through,best role modeling for your
niece and nephew and everybodyelse around you who knows you is
.
You're living by example.
(09:51):
It sounds like you've done alot for these kids in every way.
Is that true?
It sounds like you all as afamily have been on a pretty big
pivot journey.
Speaker 3 (10:04):
Yes, I think about my mother, who I can't imagine
burying a child, a child thatshe tried a very long time to
have.
There was almost nine yearsbetween me and my sister and she
really didn't even get theopportunity to grieve, because
there were two children at thetime seven and 11, who needed a
(10:28):
mother figure.
And she stepped right in and Ijust remember thinking, my God,
I'm going to have to be theirfather figure because,
unfortunately, their fatherbattled his own demons.
And I'm sitting there thinkingI'm like I'm the fun uncle.
I don't know how to do this.
And I look back now and a friendof mine several, actually, my
(10:51):
closest friend said we neverdoubted you.
You're the only person close toyou who doubted your ability to
do what you did.
And I realized, you know,people always tell me they're so
fortunate to have you.
I'm fortunate to have thembecause they gave me a North
star.
They gave me a reason to bebetter.
(11:14):
And I think the most.
I believe that most men whoreally struggle in life it's
because they don't have a trueNorth Star.
They may have one that's beenprescribed for them by society,
but until your North Star comesfrom within you, you can never
truly be your greatest self andI'm thankful for that pivot.
(11:36):
It healed a lot of wounds in methat I didn't even realize were
wounds and you know, it's beenabout five years now and I smile
on a daily basis because Irealized that I made a choice to
love those children and itbrings me so much joy because to
(11:59):
to make the choice to love achild that you didn't
biologically create is a specialgift.
It really and truly is.
Speaker 2 (12:06):
Yes, you know I'm a member of a blended family so
we've explored that terrain alot and my best friend in
Croatia is also in that context.
So it just comes up a lot in mylife and really like it really
touches my heart when you saythis and and you know I just
want to slow, slow down theconversation and feel it and
(12:26):
from there you know comment onum.
I think that's a lot of whatyou're talking about and
teaching with your example.
That you know growing in ourcapacity to feel all the
feelings that it's safe to feel.
You know when you're choosingto.
You know think about thingsdifferently or fully engage with
that.
(12:47):
You know idea that wait, I wasso excited beginning of the day,
but now I'm feeling somethingabout my niece and nephew.
What is that?
You know the growth in yourcapacity to be with it.
All that, for me, is really,really powerful.
Speaker 3 (13:05):
Thank you yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:08):
If you were going to go back to your younger self,
what would you say to him?
Speaker 3 (13:14):
That I'm enough.
I would hug him and I wouldtell him you are enough, and it
would be just that simple.
I look back now and there's notmuch about my life I would
change.
But that would be the one thingthat I would, and I would tell
him he was enough.
And, knowing that my youngerself would have set boundaries,
(13:37):
that's when you'll find you wantto stress test friendships.
Start setting boundaries andthe people who are truly in your
corner will applaud you, andI'm realizing the value of the
friends who see you for who youcan be.
They're going to be the oneswho support you when you don't
support yourself.
And so I wish I could have goneback and been that friend to
(14:00):
myself who saw the betterversion of me and let him know
he's coming and you are enough.
Trust the process.
You cannot pour from an emptycup, and I mean my coach was a
godsend because he helped me torealize I would talk about
saying yes and not settingboundaries and doing things for
(14:20):
people.
And he said do you hear thedisdain in your voice right now?
I said yeah, and he goes.
My sense is that you love doingfor others, but that you are
doing so much right now thatyou're draining your own cup and
(14:44):
he goes.
Mr World Traveler, you have toput he goes.
You really do have to put youroxygen mask on before you can
put help anyone else.
And I never realized that.
And now I realized that the youknow my boundaries and he did
warn me.
He said when you start he'slike it's going to be like a
pendulum.
You'll go from no boundaries toboundaries, boundaries,
boundaries, and then you'llswing to a healthy balance.
And I have found with thepeople I truly love.
(15:06):
Like one of my guy friends, hesaid something to me as a joke
and I said nope, and he goes.
It's about time you startedstanding up for yourself when
someone tries to minimize whoyou are and he goes.
I've never been happier to hearI'm not accepting that from you
.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Oh, that is so amazing.
I'd love to have a whole hourworth of conversation about this
.
I work on this a lot in thecenter, especially behind the
proverbial closed doors.
This is what people come in forfor individual sessions.
I mean so much work around thistopic because I think we go
(15:49):
about teaching it to each otherthe wrong way.
When people are little, whenwe're first born, we demo all
kinds of examples of things thatlook like boundaries, that are
not really boundaries.
Then we cross each other'sboundaries while exhibiting
boundaries and it's all likeit's just all super
dysfunctional.
And you know you're here, youknow a whole conversation you've
had with us is really speakinginto this.
(16:10):
You know who am I.
Do I show up authentically?
Do I know how to advocate formyself?
Because then that's reallyloving to everybody else.
I think even with the mask youknow the oxygen mask story we
don't finish the sentence likethe oxygen mask and yourself
first, before you help others,because if you don't, you're
going to pass out right there inthat aisle and then, and then
(16:32):
the other, you're going to be inthe in the way and not helpful
to anybody.
You know, when you mentionedfaith, you know, and for me one
of the things that's been reallyhelpful with boundaries and I
see you both demoing that sobeautifully and when we forget,
we remind each other, help eachother out that really, you know,
having lugged a lot of boundaryissues for a very long time
(16:54):
they're really the only shield Ineed is made of love, and
sometimes it will look like aabsolutely not I'm not doing
that, no way A short, a short,you know, but it can still be
infused with love and infusedwith, in a bigger sense of you
know, understanding.
(17:14):
So tell us, in conclusion, allof this, we ask a question of
all of our guests pivots and ifand if you think about, let's
say, if you focalize and youthink about one major pivot,
perhaps the one where you'reasked to be, you know, in a role
that you didn't think you weregoing to have, you know, moving
from a fun uncle did you call usa funkel, I think, when we met
(17:36):
you, yes, funkle, from funkle to, okay, father figure, really,
while you're still learning howto parent yourself, how was that
pivot or step forward for?
Speaker 3 (17:47):
you.
You know I call it from funkleto dunkle.
You can break generationalcurses simply by looking back
and saying what didn't I havethat I wanted, and you give that
to that child.
Kids now have access to moreinformation and things that we
(18:09):
did when I was growing up, sothey get to be able to develop
and be who they are, and I lovenurturing that and I the
greatest job that I'm ever goingto have in my life is helping
to develop two kids intowonderful human beings.
And if you can't pivot to that,then you really need to look
within and ask what are youmissing?
(18:30):
Because it's something sobeautiful that you just should
not be able to deny yourself theability to do that if you have
the opportunity.
Thank you both for bringingthese topics to people and to
giving a voice, especially tomen.
We need so much help becausewe've been taught for so long be
(18:51):
a man, keep it in, and I tellpeople, the more emotionally in
touch you can be as a man, likeit takes security in yourself to
go against what society hasprescribed for you, and I think
more men are finally seeing thatTelling boys they can't cry is
why we have as especially youngBlack men why we have so many of
(19:14):
them in prison?
Because they don't.
They're not allowed to expressemotions, so they bottle them up
and then, when they becomeadults and there are
consequences, they don't knowhow to deal with emotions such
as anger, and then it comes outin all the wrong ways, sometimes
just by verbalizing thingsyou've been holding in.
You'd be amazed how much betteryou feel and how everything
(19:38):
around you just becomes moreenjoyable.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
Thank you for this.
This is incredibly important.
No-transcript.
(20:12):
Really.
Thank you for being here withus courageously and raising
these important topics with somuch.
We use the word sternness, butit's like poison strength and
softness, soft heart, you know,goes a long way.
Speaker 1 (20:27):
Thank you again to Jay Washington.
Even I'll be back next weekwith, or in two weeks with,
another great guest.
Thank you all for joining ustoday on Step Into the Pivot and
remember if you have a pivot,step into it.
Hello everybody, welcome to this week's episode
of Step Into the Pivot, and ourguest today is Jay Washington.
Jay, so excited to have youhere.
Speaker 3 (00:10):
I'm excited to be here.
This couldn't be better timing.
This week has been the start ofa new chapter and I cannot
think of two people to have myfirst conversation with about it
than you two it than YouTubeAwesome.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
We had the pleasure of meeting at a conference we
were all at last year and it wassuch a fun and I've connected
several times since then.
You spent your whole career infinancial services.
I mean, you just speak mylanguage, so we are super
excited.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Yes, we love, you know, to talk about authenticity
.
We both really spend a lot oftime understanding it, unpacking
it and living it, and we boththink that it's not just a
conversation to be hadcognitively, but to really like
find examples of it and, youknow, look for the embodiment of
it.
And thank you also forauthentically being game to
(00:59):
essentially play with us here alittle bit, because as we were
getting on and getting ready tostart recording, you started
sharing about what's going onfor you today, literally right
now.
You're in the middle of a newpivot and we stopped you and we
said let's hit the record andtell us, together with our
audience, what's going on foryou right now.
(01:21):
Tell us about the new chapter.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
Excited to share, and what I want to say is it is so
easy to jump right into it whenyou're with people who you know
you can be yourself with.
I think sometimes, like wowtook me 47 years to learn that
and Sway was a big part of thatwhere we met and I went through
several different phases after Istarted realizing that Anger
(01:48):
that I put myself in.
I allowed myself to be put in abox Resentment, sadness,
acceptance and now where I am isat a place of joy, because I
realized going through all ofthat has allowed me to get to
where I am and appreciate it somuch more and to be a source for
(02:08):
those who I see going throughthat same thing, to let them
know you don't have to do that.
Here's my story.
Here's how you can overcome it.
So I'm going to take I alwayssay, let your adversity be your
university and then go forth andteach afterwards.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
Oh, I love that.
One of the first conversationswe had here in this, you know,
setting on the podcast, wasabout how also all the different
emotions you highlighted.
That also is not a linearjourney.
Oftentimes, you know, it's likethis is super cool, we come
together and then we try to sortof organize it and make sense
of it.
But it doesn't really go likethat right In terms of like oh,
(02:46):
now I'm in anger, now I'm infrustration, oh, now I'm in
acceptance, now I'm in joy.
Oftentimes there's going to besome sliding back and forth as
you keep, you know, pivoting andtransitioning and transforming.
Is that true for you too?
Speaker 3 (02:59):
Absolutely.
You know, monday was the startof my new job and I woke up
early and I was overjoyed.
And then I went to the gym andon my way back I hit a moment
where I started thinking aboutmy niece and nephew and
sometimes I talk about them Ichoke up.
My mom was telling me mynephew's baseball season is
starting soon, and oftentimeswhen I'm not there, she's his
(03:23):
only cheerleader, and oftentimeswhen I'm not there, she's his
only cheerleader.
And it made me realizesometimes that I fight anger at
the situation they've been putin by being 12 and 16 and having
lost both parents, and on a daywhen I should have just been
filled with overjoy because Igot this new job that I'm really
excited about, like I had tofight back tears and I realized
(03:44):
I said it's okay Emotion, likeyou said, it's not a linear
journey.
And it also made me remembersomething that's been really
been getting me through.
Every challenge is that life is10% what happens to you and 90%
how you react to it.
I had my moment.
I remember the abundance in mylife and I moved on, and I'm
(04:08):
grateful for that, because somany men are not taught how to
process the various emotions andwhen it gets hard, we struggle,
and so I pat myself on the back, because that was something
that I was very much subjectedto in years past.
God, in months past, thattemporary sadness would have
(04:28):
ruled my entire day, but I'velearned to change that.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
We have those moments in time and we have to give
ourselves the capability tothink about them, to work
through them a little bit sothat we can move forward.
Right, it's all those kind ofthings and it's part of being
who we are.
It's part of you know, when youstarted talking, what I was
thinking of is you know yourauthentic self, but think about
(04:55):
how long it probably took you toget there right and acceptance
and things like that.
So talk a little about you knowhow you were feeling that you
were living as someone otherthan your true self, other than
your authentic self.
Speaker 3 (05:12):
You know, I did such a good job at it.
I didn't even realize that Iwas living that way anymore.
And I remember I was part of amen's group.
It's June of 2023.
We were having a weekendretreat and the leader who I was
very close to, who I am veryclose to, said Jay, he said you
(05:35):
do the most amazing job ofmaking people feel that they
know you and you haven't letanybody in.
And that's when I realized thatwhat I've been living as my
authentic truth in fact was not.
And I started working throughthat and I realized that working
through it didn't mean I hadsolved it.
(05:57):
And the last year I would say2024 started to really take a
dark turn, probably around May,and I didn't know why, but it
just did.
And I was really struggling tothe point where a friend of mine
who has known me since I was 17said I was here when you lost
(06:19):
your father.
I was here when you lost yourgrandfather and your grandmother
three of the most importantpeople in your life.
I feel you're in a worse placenow than when that happened, and
she was right.
I shared it sway that at onepoint, as I was driving home, I
said to myself.
I slammed this car into a wall.
The noise stops, I'm insured,I've got savings, my niece and
(06:44):
nephew are taken care of,everything.
A pretty little bow is put oneverything.
And then I said or you can getsome help.
And I ended up working with acoach who helped me to realize
that I have lived from a placeof not feeling worthy of being
myself for so long that Iactually sent a version of me to
(07:08):
step in place to be what I felteveryone needed to be and what
I was going through.
He said.
And what I was going through.
He said the real you is finallystrong enough to step out, but
the old you is fighting to holdon.
So you're actually involved ina fight internal fight with
yourself.
The real you is winning and alot of the sadness is mourning
(07:33):
the person you were, who tooksuch good care of you for the
past four decades.
And he was absolutely right.
And he said the beauty of thisis when you come out on the
other side and you will, youwill appreciate what he did and
you will never look back andthis last year will be as if it
almost never happened, becauseyou will now know the purpose of
(07:55):
old you and the purpose of newyou, and that's where we are.
And it brought me back to myfaith, and on a daily basis.
I thank God that I went throughthat, because I would still be
living in authentically if Ihadn't.
And I do know it's not going tobe linear and there will be
moments when I slide back.
(08:15):
I may slide back.
I will never go back.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
Well, I'm going to say before Evie says, what she
wants to say is what I.
I love that your friendrecognized that in you.
I think that is so importantand I think sometimes we don't
do that enough with, with ourfriends or you know those kinds
of things, because we're afraidor overstepping or you know
whatever.
But I, I love that you know you.
(08:43):
That's a lot to be thankful forto have a friend like that.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
And you're talking soundbites, so meaning, so good,
right, so inspirational, andthat's really, I mean, it's,
it's.
I started taking notes, then Istopped because it was like I
can't keep up.
You know you can't keep upbecause these are such good, you
know, moments of wisdom, and Ifeel like that's really the
(09:10):
muscle we want to be exercising.
You know, practicing thisability to tune into a larger,
you know, a larger knowing, abigger perspective, and then
start to let that come throughon a regular basis.
And you know that is probablythe best way, the best remedy
for both the hurting one who is,you know, invested in old ways
(09:31):
of operating and is not reallyletting go easily.
Remedy for the one who wants to, you know, come through and
really express who he really is.
And at the end of the day, Ithink that's probably when you
let that guidance come through,best role modeling for your
niece and nephew and everybodyelse around you who knows you is
.
You're living by example.
(09:51):
It sounds like you've done alot for these kids in every way.
Is that true?
It sounds like you all as afamily have been on a pretty big
pivot journey.
Speaker 3 (10:04):
Yes, I think about my mother, who I can't imagine
burying a child, a child thatshe tried a very long time to
have.
There was almost nine yearsbetween me and my sister and she
really didn't even get theopportunity to grieve, because
there were two children at thetime seven and 11, who needed a
(10:28):
mother figure.
And she stepped right in and Ijust remember thinking, my God,
I'm going to have to be theirfather figure because,
unfortunately, their fatherbattled his own demons.
And I'm sitting there thinkingI'm like I'm the fun uncle.
I don't know how to do this.
And I look back now and a friendof mine several, actually, my
(10:51):
closest friend said we neverdoubted you.
You're the only person close toyou who doubted your ability to
do what you did.
And I realized, you know,people always tell me they're so
fortunate to have you.
I'm fortunate to have thembecause they gave me a North
star.
They gave me a reason to bebetter.
(11:14):
And I think the most.
I believe that most men whoreally struggle in life it's
because they don't have a trueNorth Star.
They may have one that's beenprescribed for them by society,
but until your North Star comesfrom within you, you can never
truly be your greatest self andI'm thankful for that pivot.
(11:36):
It healed a lot of wounds in methat I didn't even realize were
wounds and you know, it's beenabout five years now and I smile
on a daily basis because Irealized that I made a choice to
love those children and itbrings me so much joy because to
(11:59):
to make the choice to love achild that you didn't
biologically create is a specialgift.
It really and truly is.
Speaker 2 (12:06):
Yes, you know I'm a member of a blended family so
we've explored that terrain alot and my best friend in
Croatia is also in that context.
So it just comes up a lot in mylife and really like it really
touches my heart when you saythis and and you know I just
want to slow, slow down theconversation and feel it and
(12:26):
from there you know comment onum.
I think that's a lot of whatyou're talking about and
teaching with your example.
That you know growing in ourcapacity to feel all the
feelings that it's safe to feel.
You know when you're choosingto.
You know think about thingsdifferently or fully engage with
that.
(12:47):
You know idea that wait, I wasso excited beginning of the day,
but now I'm feeling somethingabout my niece and nephew.
What is that?
You know the growth in yourcapacity to be with it.
All that, for me, is really,really powerful.
Speaker 3 (13:05):
Thank you yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:08):
If you were going to go back to your younger self,
what would you say to him?
Speaker 3 (13:14):
That I'm enough.
I would hug him and I wouldtell him you are enough, and it
would be just that simple.
I look back now and there's notmuch about my life I would
change.
But that would be the one thingthat I would, and I would tell
him he was enough.
And, knowing that my youngerself would have set boundaries,
(13:37):
that's when you'll find you wantto stress test friendships.
Start setting boundaries andthe people who are truly in your
corner will applaud you, andI'm realizing the value of the
friends who see you for who youcan be.
They're going to be the oneswho support you when you don't
support yourself.
And so I wish I could have goneback and been that friend to
(14:00):
myself who saw the betterversion of me and let him know
he's coming and you are enough.
Trust the process.
You cannot pour from an emptycup, and I mean my coach was a
godsend because he helped me torealize I would talk about
saying yes and not settingboundaries and doing things for
(14:20):
people.
And he said do you hear thedisdain in your voice right now?
I said yeah, and he goes.
My sense is that you love doingfor others, but that you are
doing so much right now thatyou're draining your own cup and
(14:44):
he goes.
Mr World Traveler, you have toput he goes.
You really do have to put youroxygen mask on before you can
put help anyone else.
And I never realized that.
And now I realized that the youknow my boundaries and he did
warn me.
He said when you start he'slike it's going to be like a
pendulum.
You'll go from no boundaries toboundaries, boundaries,
boundaries, and then you'llswing to a healthy balance.
And I have found with thepeople I truly love.
(15:06):
Like one of my guy friends, hesaid something to me as a joke
and I said nope, and he goes.
It's about time you startedstanding up for yourself when
someone tries to minimize whoyou are and he goes.
I've never been happier to hearI'm not accepting that from you
.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Oh, that is so amazing.
I'd love to have a whole hourworth of conversation about this
.
I work on this a lot in thecenter, especially behind the
proverbial closed doors.
This is what people come in forfor individual sessions.
I mean so much work around thistopic because I think we go
(15:49):
about teaching it to each otherthe wrong way.
When people are little, whenwe're first born, we demo all
kinds of examples of things thatlook like boundaries, that are
not really boundaries.
Then we cross each other'sboundaries while exhibiting
boundaries and it's all likeit's just all super
dysfunctional.
And you know you're here, youknow a whole conversation you've
had with us is really speakinginto this.
(16:10):
You know who am I.
Do I show up authentically?
Do I know how to advocate formyself?
Because then that's reallyloving to everybody else.
I think even with the mask youknow the oxygen mask story we
don't finish the sentence likethe oxygen mask and yourself
first, before you help others,because if you don't, you're
going to pass out right there inthat aisle and then, and then
(16:32):
the other, you're going to be inthe in the way and not helpful
to anybody.
You know, when you mentionedfaith, you know, and for me one
of the things that's been reallyhelpful with boundaries and I
see you both demoing that sobeautifully and when we forget,
we remind each other, help eachother out that really, you know,
having lugged a lot of boundaryissues for a very long time
(16:54):
they're really the only shield Ineed is made of love, and
sometimes it will look like aabsolutely not I'm not doing
that, no way A short, a short,you know, but it can still be
infused with love and infusedwith, in a bigger sense of you
know, understanding.
(17:14):
So tell us, in conclusion, allof this, we ask a question of
all of our guests pivots and ifand if you think about, let's
say, if you focalize and youthink about one major pivot,
perhaps the one where you'reasked to be, you know, in a role
that you didn't think you weregoing to have, you know, moving
from a fun uncle did you call usa funkel, I think, when we met
(17:36):
you, yes, funkle, from funkle to, okay, father figure, really,
while you're still learning howto parent yourself, how was that
pivot or step forward for?
Speaker 3 (17:47):
you.
You know I call it from funkleto dunkle.
You can break generationalcurses simply by looking back
and saying what didn't I havethat I wanted, and you give that
to that child.
Kids now have access to moreinformation and things that we
(18:09):
did when I was growing up, sothey get to be able to develop
and be who they are, and I lovenurturing that and I the
greatest job that I'm ever goingto have in my life is helping
to develop two kids intowonderful human beings.
And if you can't pivot to that,then you really need to look
within and ask what are youmissing?
(18:30):
Because it's something sobeautiful that you just should
not be able to deny yourself theability to do that if you have
the opportunity.
Thank you both for bringingthese topics to people and to
giving a voice, especially tomen.
We need so much help becausewe've been taught for so long be
(18:51):
a man, keep it in, and I tellpeople, the more emotionally in
touch you can be as a man, likeit takes security in yourself to
go against what society hasprescribed for you, and I think
more men are finally seeing thatTelling boys they can't cry is
why we have as especially youngBlack men why we have so many of
(19:14):
them in prison?
Because they don't.
They're not allowed to expressemotions, so they bottle them up
and then, when they becomeadults and there are
consequences, they don't knowhow to deal with emotions such
as anger, and then it comes outin all the wrong ways, sometimes
just by verbalizing thingsyou've been holding in.
You'd be amazed how much betteryou feel and how everything
(19:38):
around you just becomes moreenjoyable.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
Thank you for this.
This is incredibly important.
No-transcript.
(20:12):
Really.
Thank you for being here withus courageously and raising
these important topics with somuch.
We use the word sternness, butit's like poison strength and
softness, soft heart, you know,goes a long way.
Speaker 1 (20:27):
Thank you again to Jay Washington.
Even I'll be back next weekwith, or in two weeks with,
another great guest.
Thank you all for joining ustoday on Step Into the Pivot and
remember if you have a pivot,step into it.
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