December 10, 2025 • 46 mins
Brad and Kate, licensed marriage counselor and relationship coaches, dive into the vital topic of “doing your own work” and how personal healing impacts marriage health, communication, and intimacy.
They unpack common church-influenced pushbacks: “we just need to pray more,” “I’ll use accountability,” and “why go back to childhood?” This episode blends faith, neuroscience, story work, and marriage coaching to help couples break cycles, set healthy boundaries, and cultivate hope and joy.
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Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_00 (00:04):
Welcome to the Still Becoming One podcast.
We are Brad and Kate.
Kate Aldrich (00:10):
In our more than 20 years of marriage, we've
survived both dark times andexperienced restoration.
SPEAKER_00 (00:15):
Now, as a licensed marriage counselor and
relationship coaches, we helpcouples to regain hope and joy.
Kate Aldrich (00:23):
We invite you to journey with us as we are still
becoming one.
SPEAKER_00 (00:27):
Let's start the conversation.
Hello everyone.
Welcome back to Still BecomingOne.
SPEAKER_02 (00:35):
Welcome.
SPEAKER_00 (00:37):
Now I just wait for you to hear.
Kate Aldrich (00:42):
I'm feeling particularly mischievous and
snarky this morning, so.
SPEAKER_00 (00:48):
Mischievous and snarky?
Okay.
Kate Aldrich (00:51):
Wait a second.
You say uh-oh, like it's asurprise.
SPEAKER_00 (00:55):
I didn't know you were mischievous and snarky.
Kate Aldrich (00:58):
I don't know, I just feel it inside of me.
SPEAKER_00 (01:00):
Okay.
Alright, I'm in trouble.
Um yeah, so do we want to checkin?
Other than mischievous andsnarky?
Kate Aldrich (01:11):
Sure.
SPEAKER_00 (01:13):
You would be the other then tell the nice people
what we've been up to.
Kate Aldrich (01:17):
Tell the nice people.
Aw, he thinks you're all nice.
That's a that's cute.
Um, I'm sure you are all nice,actually.
Uh I have to tell them whatwe've been up to.
SPEAKER_00 (01:28):
We're coming off of our second weekend.
Um, I don't know why they callit a weekend.
It's longer than a weekend, butstill, our second intensive
period of training for ournarrative-focused trauma care um
level two.
And um, you know, we've done,we've talked so much here about
(01:51):
the Allender Center and how muchwe appreciate them and really
how much we value that educationand learning, but their
experiences are so much morethan just like information and
education.
I mean, it is like lots ofhours, but it's both download of
(02:16):
information, but also somereally personal emotional time
sent in group and processing andlearning how to facilitate even
better and uh like all thesekinds of things that are just
emotionally tiring.
SPEAKER_02 (02:36):
Mm-hmm.
Kate Aldrich (02:38):
I mean, I think the reality is they'd be
exhausting regardless of likesitting through something like
that for four days.
Yeah.
Um, actually, I think theAllener, the the teachers often
call it week two.
SPEAKER_00 (02:52):
So that's more accurate.
It's Thursday through Sunday, soit's it's a long, long stint.
Kate Aldrich (02:57):
Four days may not feel like an actual week, but
the amount of time is definitelya week.
SPEAKER_00 (03:03):
Yeah.
So um it's like 30 hours thatwe're in class or group or you
know, something like teachingtime, yeah.
Four days, so it's a lot.
Um but it's so amazing.
Uh, do you want to give anyhighlights, things that you
walked away from with wow, umlots.
Kate Aldrich (03:27):
I and I mean, and I think my my processing style,
like I will still be processing.
In fact, what happens inteaching time, not so much, like
that.
I feel like I'm processing asit's happening.
But doing reading my ownstories, having them processed
(03:48):
with a group, which is not asmuch the point this time, but
it's still happening.
Um, and then facilitatingsomeone else's reading, there is
so much that I'm taking in aboutmyself and my style of relating,
all different kinds of thingsthat I have been writing things
down all weekend, and I think umI am still gonna be processing
(04:14):
them.
I'm thinking about what would bea takeaway that I feel like I've
solidified or what not.
Um, I don't know.
Do you have one?
SPEAKER_00 (04:25):
I I mean, there's definitely some things I'm
processing again about my story,right?
That's one of these interestingthings is we're jumping into our
own work in the middle oflearning how to do work better.
And that's kind of the point,right?
Like kind of the emphasis ofthis second level is hey, your
(04:46):
story impacts you as afacilitator, and we need to see
those places and times where itdoes so that we become better
facilitators.
So I I think there that meansyou're doing a lot of your own
work.
Um, I think there are, you know,there's always places that you
need to grow.
(05:06):
And, you know, I'm learning somethings about my facilitation
style that are things that Iwant to get better, you know.
And um, you know, just somethings that got pointed out as
as we're processing.
It's like, okay, I can do thatbetter to help people sit with
their stories differently,better, you know, kind of thing.
(05:26):
So I I think that's probablysome of my work-wise takeaways.
Um, I I mean, one of the thingsI don't mind saying it here, the
one of the things that Irecognize I know is I really
want people to have like the ahamoment, the insight, the light
bulb.
And sometimes I push to thatalmost too quickly um and need
(05:54):
to like slow down and let themsit and let their body process
because otherwise the aha momentmight not land in the same way.
Kate Aldrich (06:06):
So well, and you know, it's interesting.
I think the nature of story workis in the Allender Center sets
it up this way, very slow,gradual like work, and yet many
of our clients are coming in aspace where they want answers
(06:31):
quickly, which is honorable.
Yes.
Um, it's also probably somethingwe as a team at Aldrich
Ministries could work on betterof helping people understand
it's it's a slower process.
Well, and I mean you can comeand we can do it in a quicker
fashion, but like there arethings you're missing.
SPEAKER_02 (06:54):
I agree.
Kate Aldrich (06:55):
But it's also, I mean, I also feel the tension of
financially that's hard forpeople to like right.
They're willing to make thecommitment, but for many people,
it's like I can't commit tocoming forever, like
indefinitely, true kind ofthing.
So I think those are thetensions.
SPEAKER_00 (07:16):
I think another part of that tension, and this is a
question I ask a lot of peopleon first session, is almost like
tell me what the straw thatbroke the camel's back was.
What finally got you to actuallygo, okay, I need to call someone
and get some help?
Because I think a lot of peoplethink about it for a really long
(07:37):
time.
A lot of people want to do itfor a long time.
And it often takes,unfortunately, a negative
something to push people to go,all right, I have to do it.
And then they walk in going, Ineed to fix this thing.
(08:00):
And then it's like, oh, we'vegot to you gotta help me with
this thing.
This, you know, whether it be mymarriage is falling apart, or
this part of our marriage isfalling apart, or I've got this
problem that's surfaced, or it'sit becomes very focused on the
immediate.
Yeah.
Which is certainly differentthan really going into, hey,
(08:22):
let's let's do a slow pullingback what's really been the
motivating factors in your life.
Let's actually take a look atwhy you keep making the same
mistakes over and over again, orwhy you keep doing the same
things over and again.
Maybe maybe not even mistakes.
(08:43):
Right.
Why do we why do we fall intothose same patterns?
Kate Aldrich (08:47):
Sure.
Yeah, totally.
Yeah.
So yeah, I mean, I I coming offof it, like, yeah, I'm tired.
SPEAKER_00 (08:56):
Yeah.
I can feel that.
Kate Aldrich (08:58):
And it's really tired, but also really snarky.
SPEAKER_00 (09:03):
I'm in trouble.
Why do you always say that?
Kate Aldrich (09:06):
Why do you say we should unpack that right now?
Why do you say you're in troubleif I'm snarky?
SPEAKER_00 (09:11):
Because that's that's what my story is.
You're the king.
I'm in trouble.
Kate Aldrich (09:15):
Oh, gotcha.
But you're the oh, but yourparents weren't fun snarky.
I'm fun.
SPEAKER_00 (09:21):
Okay.
Kate Aldrich (09:23):
Wait a second.
Are you implying that I am not?
SPEAKER_00 (09:27):
You definitely are.
It's just sometimes when you'resnarky and I'm not, I don't know
what to expect.
And when it's being recorded foreveryone to see, I'm like, oh
hey, I warned you.
Kate Aldrich (09:39):
I know.
SPEAKER_00 (09:40):
Aren't you don't you feel so this leads us directly
into doing your own work?
Our topic for today.
I don't know why.
Kate Aldrich (09:50):
Yeah, I was like, wait a second, are you telling
me I need to do work because I'msnarky?
SPEAKER_00 (09:54):
No, I don't know.
No, I I mean, I think it was areally interesting thing that
you had brought up that uh totalk about of just, you know, we
love working with couples.
I think it's something that wedo that I truly enjoy.
I love it when I get to do itwith you and work together with
a couple.
Um, but we also end up workingwith a lot of individuals who
(10:18):
have said, I have some work todo.
I have some things that I needto unpack.
And I think there's thisquestion of does that make me
the problem in our marriage?
Does that mean, you know, I Ihave to be responsible for
everything?
(10:39):
And well, there's just maybethat's a place to start.
Is you know, how do youencourage people when they need
to do some of their own work,how do you encourage them to
dive in?
Kate Aldrich (10:55):
Well, it's funny you said that, like, am I the
problem?
I was kind of I kind of got alittle stuck there.
Like, I think there are things,and I think we definitely used
to ascribe to them like yes,yes.
Am I the problem?
(11:16):
Yes, right, and in on somelevels, yes.
But I also would like to umspeak to that and alleviate it a
little bit, and also say, do wehave to look at it as I'm the
problem, or that we both bringdynamics, which we understand
(11:36):
and um credit to your story.
Like we both bring things thatspecific to us and our
relationship are going to makeit challenging.
SPEAKER_00 (11:48):
Correct.
Correct, right.
Kate Aldrich (11:50):
So, yes, in one essence, you are the problem,
and I think the church reallykind of pushes that.
They do both pendulum swings oflike one person, like they can
certainly focus on one spousesometimes to a detriment, which
is just wrong, not helpful.
It just yeah.
Or you're both your biggestmarital problem kind of
(12:13):
attitude.
SPEAKER_00 (12:15):
Which I I wish it was more of that.
You're you're exactly right.
I can see the pendulum swing,and so it it goes really strong
because historically, regularly,we see the church blaming a lot
of marriage problems on women,especially sexual problems,
(12:35):
right?
Like, oh well, if if she, right?
Um, so I I think you're exactlyright.
I'll flip that script though andsay, I see the church a lot of
times supporting, you know, ifhe was just more spiritual, if
he was actually the gonna be thehead of the household, if he was
(12:57):
stepping up and doing what heshould, then you wouldn't be
having these problems too.
So like the guy is the theproblem.
Kate Aldrich (13:05):
Yep, those are two very true statements, and
they're they're incrediblymotivating, but also not really
helpful.
SPEAKER_00 (13:18):
Yeah.
Kate Aldrich (13:19):
That's the talent.
SPEAKER_00 (13:21):
Like they're replacing blame and making the
person on the opposite side feelbetter.
Kate Aldrich (13:28):
It's negative motivation.
SPEAKER_00 (13:29):
Actually, doing anything positive.
Kate Aldrich (13:32):
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, you know, people come inwith all different kinds of
expectations, and of course, welisten and take those into
consideration, but we are alwayslooking for the opportunities to
enter into the story bits thatare present with individuals,
(13:53):
always with but even withcouples, right?
Because that is the informationthat is truly gonna allow a
space of healing andunderstanding.
SPEAKER_00 (14:06):
And I think it is so necessary if we want to get out
of the cycles that we're in.
And that can be true for anindividual, and it's for sure
true for a couple.
You know, it I think mostcouples will admit that they
have the same fight or same twoor three fights over and over
(14:31):
again with maybe slightlydifferent subject matter, but
it's the same style, the samepattern, the same accusations
thrown at each other, just witha different subject matter.
Kate Aldrich (14:46):
Well, probably if we looked at those and dissected
them, they're probably the samefight.
SPEAKER_00 (14:50):
They they could be, right?
Yeah.
Kate Aldrich (14:51):
Not always, but probably it's the same wounds
that are being tended to inthose fights that or conflicts.
SPEAKER_00 (15:00):
Um, we want to get to those, one or hopefully both
of you need to get into yourstory to figure out why that
dynamic is there.
What it is that's actuallypushing that felt need.
Right, because I really trulybelieve most people are not out
(15:24):
there trying to make theirspouse out to be the enemy,
trying to make their spouse uh,you know, feel crazy, trying to,
you know, ruin theirrelationship.
I think most of them are walkingin their stuff, trying to make
it the best they know how, andwe regularly miss each other in
(15:45):
the same places.
Kate Aldrich (15:47):
Yeah, absolutely.
And and we're talking about, youknow, we started the subject of
like doing this processtogether.
Well, you brought up kind of themarriage, but I also think
that's a really good thing.
But I I think it's also reallygood for individuals, for your
(16:08):
own individual health, and thenfor the byproduct of the health
of your marriage.
It's really amazing when wehonor that we each have work to
do.
SPEAKER_00 (16:19):
For sure.
Kate Aldrich (16:21):
Right.
But m a lot of times we see thethe pattern of well, if you just
did what you need to do, right.
Dude the work, the well, thechange, the, you know, or you
got help, then we would be in amuch different place.
SPEAKER_00 (16:36):
Right.
The accusation rather than aninvitation.
But I even want to caution it,you know, making an invitation
for somebody else is prettyproblematic.
Like they have to come to aplace where they are wanting to
do their work.
Kate Aldrich (16:58):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (16:58):
As you're saying, like spouses trying to spouse
going, hey, why don't you go totherapy for a little while?
Like that rare.
I mean, I I think sometimes theconversation needs to happen
because people haven't felt thepermission to do so.
They haven't felt the permissionto sometimes it's spend the
(17:18):
money, they haven't spent, youknow, had the permission to
spend the time.
And so sometimes we need theconversation to happen.
But I don't think it should be.
Hey, I think you probably shouldbenefit from or would benefit
from some therapy, which I I dothink everyone could benefit
from some, but I I'm not suresaying it that way probably
(17:43):
works the best.
Kate Aldrich (17:45):
So, how would you say it?
I can't wait to hear this.
You guys all ready?
SPEAKER_00 (17:49):
I I there was the snark.
unknown (17:51):
Oh man.
Kate Aldrich (17:52):
There's the snark.
SPEAKER_00 (17:54):
I think at best, like if you think let's take the
best situation that you aresomebody who's already doing
your work.
You've gotten invested in yourstory, you've done um some
coaching or counseling, and youreally do see the benefit of it.
(18:16):
Um, I think the then the bestthing to encourage your spouse
to would be having aconversation with them about
what you've learned aboutyourself and how that has helped
you and their your relationship.
(18:36):
And then saying something to theeffect of if you ever want to go
on this exploration foryourself, I want to make sure we
make space for that.
Kate Aldrich (18:50):
I think that's pretty good.
I would amend it with one thing.
I would stick to just what it'staught you about you and not
sure how it's and now I'm doingthis so perfectly in our
marriage, right?
Like I would avoid that.
I would just, yeah, I would justtalk about what you've learned
about yourself, how you see itreflected in the things that you
(19:14):
do, and the kindness you'rebringing to try and work with
that.
Yeah.
Um, and I would just leave it atthat.
I I think the benefits of yourmarriage, hopefully, that person
is starting to see, but pointingthem out, depending on where you
are in your marriage journey andand how um your communication
(19:36):
has either been flowed well orisn't a problematic point.
I could just see that becoming apoint of tension.
So I think I would leave thatfor a later discussion when
that's invited.
SPEAKER_00 (19:49):
That's good.
Um, but so let me throw out thepushbacks that I hear all the
time.
Um to doing
Kate Aldrich (20:00):
Your own work?
SPEAKER_00 (20:00):
Yeah, to doing your own work.
So um I'll just I'll start withlike the churchy pushback of we
don't need therapy, we just needto pray more.
Kate Aldrich (20:12):
Okay.
Um praying is not bad.
But maybe there is no butt.
Praying is not bad, and neitheris therapy.
(20:33):
There are two differentprocesses, and yes, the Holy
Spirit could bring those things,those revelations to you in your
prayer time.
Absolutely.
We're not limiting him.
However, the whole like hecreated us to be in community,
(20:54):
to right.
We don't I like the challenge Ihave with only praying is it's
very isolating in many senses.
Not that it's, you know, like Imean, Jesus went off to pray.
We see that lots of times, andhe was praying by himself.
So it is not in and of itself,it is a good practice.
It is not the only practice andthe only way for us to receive
(21:18):
and learn things aboutourselves.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (21:21):
Yeah.
No, I I agree with thatcompletely.
I think that's a really goodanswer.
It's not no, that's not helpful.
It's just I think lots ofopportunities for more than that
exist.
Kate Aldrich (21:40):
And we were made for community.
We were made to bounce thingsoff of each other, right?
And and and yeah, I think I'lljust stop there.
SPEAKER_00 (21:50):
So, all right, another pushback that I think
I've heard before is uh, youknow, I'll just talk with my
friends or get an accountabilitypartner or you know, have
somebody who's gonna help mechange this thing, habit,
whatever.
What would you say?
Kate Aldrich (22:12):
Those are all good things again, like they're all
good things.
I don't think they address thewhy.
unknown (22:18):
Right.
Kate Aldrich (22:19):
And, you know, Dan Alender and his teaching team
and everything are very good atcommunicating that if we can't
address the actual harm thathappened that brought us to
this, dot dot dot.
SPEAKER_00 (22:33):
That strategy, that whatever.
Kate Aldrich (22:36):
We're going to struggle to change it right in
any sort of um permanent's not agood word, but like consistent
fashion.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (22:48):
And then we're often stuck repeating it with our own
family, our own children.
Kate Aldrich (22:55):
Yeah.
unknown (22:56):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (22:56):
For sure.
We end up repeating that samepattern and calling out the same
things and creating some of thesame things.
So it it is an important thingto push.
I I I would say I am not sure Iam I know any accountability
(23:16):
type relationship that hasworked by itself in the long
term.
Accountability relationships,the ones that I know are usually
very short-lived and maybe helpwith a little bit of immediate
behavior change.
(23:37):
Maybe.
But they don't really changestuff.
And that's the thing withtalking to your friend, you're
now, you know, maybe yourfriend's got some great advice,
comes great ideas, but unlessthey're actually knowing where
you know where to go, they'regiving you what's worked for
(24:01):
them, which is could be great,but a lot of times maybe not.
Kate Aldrich (24:07):
Yeah.
I think that's I think that'svery true.
Again, it's not these things arehave their place.
It's it's it's okay for you toimplement them.
I just think they the church hasrepeatedly, I guess in a um
we'll give it in a fashion oftrying to help, provided answers
(24:31):
that aren't reflective of what'sactually happening.
It's just a blanket answer I cangive to everybody who's
struggling with something.
And it's like that is bypassingthe fact that the Lord made us
all so intricately unique.
SPEAKER_00 (24:50):
Yeah.
Yeah.
What about the idea of uhnothing's really gonna change?
If I'm just doing it myself,nothing's really gonna change.
They need to, like, especiallyif you're dealing with a
relationship issue.
Um, you know, my going tocounseling is not gonna change
(25:12):
my husband's crappy habit ofXYZ.
Kate Aldrich (25:15):
Uh yeah, that's probably true.
That you going and working onyourself isn't necessarily going
to bring change about yourspouse.
Like that is something they haveto want, desire, move towards.
But also it's amazing.
(25:36):
I think every single one of ushas been inspired by others at
times or motivated by seeingsomething different in someone
else.
Or, you know, so I think thereis space for that to be
impactful.
But in some hands, you're right,but there is a piece of you
(25:59):
matter.
Yeah.
I mean, it's not a piece, it'sthe truth.
It is you matter, and so gettingyou to a place where that's a
really good thing, that youmatter, and you realizing what
level of I matter and health Ineed just to be here on earth,
(26:22):
just to be a human, and then inyour marriage, I think that's
vital.
SPEAKER_00 (26:27):
That's really good.
That's really good.
Yeah, I I I I agree.
You cannot go in order to withthe goal of just changing your
spouse.
You need to go with the goal ofwhat do I need to do?
How do I need to grow my side?
(26:47):
How do I need to understandmyself better?
And this is actually a caution.
Um, it's something that we teachall of our Alderch Ministries
coaches to watch out for.
There is this thing that happenswhen we go to individual, when
we're discouraged about ourspouse that we can very easily
(27:13):
get into a pattern of coming tothat person and convincing them
how awful they are.
And convincing them, I can'tbelieve my husband did this, I
can't believe my husband didthis, I can't believe my wife
did this, I can't, you know, andand look at all this list of
things that they did to hurt me.
(27:34):
And some of that's important toget off your chest.
Like I want to give some spaceto that.
But if that's all that'shappening, and your count coach,
your therapist is just going, Ohmy goodness, you're right.
They're so awful.
Without having met that person,there's some problems because
(27:56):
they're not helping you grow.
They're just joining you inpointing the finger that this
problem is all the other person.
And I'm not saying it's notsomewhat the other person.
Like there is some reality.
Yes, your spouse has some thingsto grow.
No, I don't care how good or badthey are, they have some things
(28:17):
to do.
But if you're going to therapyto get somebody to validate that
your spouse is really theproblem, I think maybe you'd
need a different coach ortherapist, right?
Kate Aldrich (28:29):
Like, I think the challenge is gonna be you're
never the problem in but right,like it's not it, it's not
helping you.
I think there's a place,obviously, for therapists and
coach to call out unhealthy,unsafe, wrong behavior.
(28:49):
100% and and say, Do you realizeyou're living in a situation
where this is not okay, this isnot good, this is not safe, like
those sorts of things.
Um but when we're seeing theaverage, for lack of better
term, average, um, it's notunsafe.
It's not right, it's it's notgreat, but it's not abuse.
SPEAKER_00 (29:12):
We're seeing a difficult system, a difficult
relationship, a volatilerelationship kind of thing.
Kate Aldrich (29:20):
Yeah.
Then it we have to tend towhat's here and why.
SPEAKER_00 (29:28):
Right.
Right.
And and what's my role in it?
What's what's my part of thestory when that person does
this?
How am I feeling?
What's that bringing up for me?
Where did that belief come from?
What what's my relationship withanger, right?
Is it I use anger to push peopleaway?
Is it I only get angry at myselfand I'm not allowed to be angry?
(29:51):
Is it like there's so manydifferent dynamics here that we
need to take the time to look atour own work to better
understand our relationship?
And and I will tell you, I Ifight this all the time with
clients, they don't know I'mfighting them, but of trying to
acknowledge like, yes, yourspouse has their stuff.
(30:17):
I want to hear it, I want to bethere with you.
If you need to vent, I get it.
But if all I do is validateyou're right, they're awful,
then all it's doing is pullingyour marriage apart.
And that is not truly helpinganyone until like if they're at
(30:37):
a place where they're saying,that's it, I filed divorce
papers, I'm done, then okay.
But even then, I will say, evenin that space, I'm still going,
okay, what are you going tolearn about yourself from this
situation?
Kate Aldrich (30:51):
Or you're just going to take the same patterns
into another relationship.
SPEAKER_00 (30:58):
That's right.
It's your own stuff, you know,that that you need to think
about and deal with.
Kate Aldrich (31:06):
I think the, you know, the other thing that I
hear a lot of specifically fromthe Christian crowd.
And this this may also be trueoutside of it, but I hear this
specifically of like, why doeseverything have to go back to my
childhood?
(31:26):
And can't we just forgive?
Can't we just forgive?
Like my parents were doing thebest they could.
Yes.
Or like, and some of it you'llhear that my parents are doing
the best they could, the theadult kid trying to protect the
parents, but there's alsopressure from parents, which we
addressed a little this of like,why does everything have to go
(31:50):
back to their childhood?
SPEAKER_00 (31:53):
Yeah, that's a great question.
And there's some really goodanswers.
One, because research has shownover and over again, core parts
of our personality are formed inthose formative years.
So as we have were trying tofigure out the world, our brain
was growing by leaps and bounds.
(32:17):
And so it put synapses together,which is how the brain
communicates of this thing andthis thing that repeat in a
pattern over and over again.
So when I feel this, I do this.
And that got established atfive, six, seven, like they're
so early in our thinking, andthen we repeat those patterns.
(32:39):
And so we have to figure out howto rewire those synapses.
We have to go back to where theywere formed.
So there is science behind whydo we go to our childhood?
Kate Aldrich (32:50):
So wait, you're saying the very thing that
Christians don't know what to dowith God created us that way?
SPEAKER_00 (32:56):
Yes.
Right?
God created us to be raised in asafe, loving, supported
environment.
Kate Aldrich (33:07):
So you're kind of fighting the way God made us.
unknown (33:10):
Correct.
SPEAKER_00 (33:11):
And if we were not raised in that safe, loving,
warm environment where we got tosafely explore this world, that
we got to make mistakes and itbe okay, that we got to it, you
know, figure out our way ofrelating with ourselves and
others in a safe place.
If we have that, we often launchinto the world as very stable
(33:38):
people.
Now, everybody has some wounds,right?
Because we are fallen.
Everybody has wounds.
I don't care.
You don't have perfect parents,they don't exist.
But there is sometimes morestability, more like that that
your parents were able to giveyou.
That's how we were made to haveour brain be built around that
(34:02):
environment.
And when it wasn't, there areconsequences.
Kate Aldrich (34:18):
The really loving lie.
That's you know, I don't knowthat I've ever heard someone
describe a lie as really loving.
SPEAKER_00 (34:25):
I I think it is honoring, right?
And we are called to honor ourfather and mother.
Kate Aldrich (34:30):
I think that's a better descriptor, yes.
SPEAKER_00 (34:32):
And so we try to take care of our parents by
saying they tried their best.
And often we look back at thosewound stories that are stuck in
our head and we go, well, whatwere they supposed to do?
Oh, they didn't even know thatwas going on.
(34:53):
Or, you know, I yeah, what wouldmy dad actually do?
Come on, it's not like he hurtme, he didn't like mean to, like
we create excuses and normalizethings that hurt us all the
time.
And it is our way of escapingthe emotions of not being seen,
(35:20):
of not being cared for by sayingthey tried their best.
And I think that is all I wantto say, I think that is most of
the time a true statement.
There are very few parents whoare out there trying to hurt
their children.
Very few.
(35:41):
But all parents try their best.
It doesn't mean that harm didn'thappen.
It doesn't mean that hurt didn'thappen.
It doesn't mean that things wereweren't missed that sometimes
needs to be talked about.
Kate Aldrich (35:57):
I agree.
I think the statement my parentswere doing their best is true
and also not, right?
Like I think that's they werewith their current skills due to
their story and what they'veprocessed, that was what they
(36:20):
could do.
SPEAKER_00 (36:21):
Right.
Kate Aldrich (36:24):
The truth also is that's often super harmful,
yeah, super hurtful.
Right.
Right?
Like, because yeah, because weare acting out of those wounds.
If we don't understand them, weare not necessarily repeating
them.
People tend to say that it couldbe that you do it in the same
fashion, but often notnecessarily.
(36:54):
But yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (36:55):
I want to put in there, like the the fact of, you
know, why do we have to look atmy parents?
I they tried their best.
We always are thinking about thenegative things and saying,
well, they didn't know anybetter, they didn't, they didn't
feel any better.
If you want to honor yourparents well, stop pulling up
(37:19):
just the negatives and lettingthem off the hook.
Start going, okay, wait, whatdid my parent do really well?
When was a time that theyactually really saw me?
When was a moment, when was thefive minutes of care that you
may have felt?
When was the space that theywere acting as the parent that
(37:44):
they really wanted to be?
And let's hold on to thatbeautiful, wonderful, my parents
were really trying, and thenallow ourselves the space to
say, and in that time theyreally missed it.
Kate Aldrich (38:01):
I I think there's also the fear that, like, if I
do this work, um, and and notnecessarily this isn't to fear
in your marriage relationship,but if I do this work, I'm gonna
somehow, the way to help is toconfront my parents.
SPEAKER_00 (38:17):
Oh, good, good point.
Kate Aldrich (38:19):
And I I I feel like I sometimes that comes up,
and sometimes people feel a verystrong need in that area.
But I also engage and invite aconversation of, you know,
what's your goal with that?
What do you think that's goingto accomplish?
Because for many people, notall, it doesn't ever need to be
(38:45):
a conversation or a conversationthe way you think it would be.
Um, doesn't mean we sometimesdon't address boundaries or, you
know, I would appreciate it ifthis you didn't do this to me or
whatever.
Like, but it's not this full-on,I think people often picture it,
(39:06):
and maybe this is just me, butkind of like those um the TV
shows where it's like, and well,I know you therapists call it
some what is it when you do aintervention, intervention,
right?
The where we have to sit downwith mom and dad and and we have
to tell them everything and wehave to like and they have to
take it and somehow that's gonnamake everything better.
(39:28):
I mean but that it has to belike that, and it's like I that
that's could it sure, I'm notsure how productive that's gonna
be.
Um, but it often, ifconversations happen, if they
don't have to look anything likethat, right?
And and so I wanna relieve thattension of like, you're not
(39:52):
gonna be asked to do that.
SPEAKER_00 (39:55):
Yes, that is so good.
I'm really glad you said thatbecause I think most people Go,
okay, now I have to dig up thisstuff about my parents and I
have to go blow up thatrelationship.
No, you don't.
No, you don't.
Are you gonna maybe hold it in adifferent way?
And maybe you're going to needto recognize some self-care
(40:16):
around relationship with them,maybe, but you're already doing
that.
SPEAKER_01 (40:21):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (40:22):
Right?
You're yeah.
Whether it's healthy or not, wedon't know.
But let's let's look at that.
We're already doing just thatand try and figure out
understanding why and helpingyou to navigate what that looks
like.
And you're exactly right.
And I see it all the time.
In fact, I usually warn peopleis if we're getting into
stories, I see people all thetime running and going, Okay,
(40:45):
mom and dad, I uncovered allthis stuff.
What do you gotta say about it?
And it not usually going well.
Because you've done some workdoesn't mean your parents are
ready to do the work.
Kate Aldrich (40:55):
Yeah.
I I mean, and I will speak tothe other side.
I have clients whose parents aredoing their own work and want to
have the conversations, and thatis a really beautiful thing.
Uh painful.
SPEAKER_00 (41:09):
Painful, but beautiful.
Kate Aldrich (41:10):
But beautiful.
But it's okay if you know yourparents are not even anywhere
close to that.
It's okay.
It's pay it's also painful thatthey're not.
SPEAKER_00 (41:21):
If you're a parent, and we said this earlier in that
parent session that we did acouple weeks ago.
If you're a parent, your goal isto reach out and say, Hey kids,
I can hold your stories now.
Not hey kids, guess what I foundout about my parents and my
(41:44):
background?
Here's all my stories that Iwant you to hold so that you
understand why I did thesethings.
Right?
That may come eventually as kidsgo.
I want to explore your culture,I want to explore our our family
situation.
Like that may come eventually,but that is not the way to
start.
Kate Aldrich (42:03):
Right.
Right.
And I would caution any parentout there who is tempted to just
pick up that line and take it totheir kids without understanding
what it means.
What that means.
Because that I'll be completelytransparent.
(42:23):
That would have been me.
SPEAKER_00 (42:25):
Oh, I'll go say the right thing and Oh, I just I
heard this line on a podcast.
Kate Aldrich (42:30):
I'll go say it to my kids with good intention.
SPEAKER_00 (42:33):
Oh, yeah.
Kate Aldrich (42:33):
But then but absolutely no skills or
understanding.
SPEAKER_00 (42:38):
I need you to know and immediately get defensive
and immediately get like, well,that's that's not the whole
story.
You you don't know what reallyhappened, right?
Like, yeah.
Kate Aldrich (42:49):
And I would caution you are going to do more
damage that way.
More than you already are ifyou're offering them something
really vulnerable and beautiful,but you don't you don't have the
skills and the understanding ofyourself yet to know how to do
it.
(43:09):
And and I'm not I'm not implyingthat you're ever going to be
perfect at it.
It is a brutal but beautifulprocess.
Yes.
As we've entered in with ourkids.
Uh, I'm sure we've made mistakeseven entering in.
There's repair to the repairsometimes, right?
Like yeah, just a caution.
(43:29):
Like because I know there arepeople out there like me who
would have been like, oh, Iheard this cool phrase.
I'm gonna say it to my kids andall will be well.
SPEAKER_00 (43:36):
Yeah.
Nope, not that.
That's good.
I I I think it's been a greatconversation of just what it,
why people enter into their ownwork and what it means to do it
in a way that isn't just aboutthe crisis, right?
But is about wait, I'm I'mseeing some patterns play out.
(44:00):
I'm seeing some things happenover and over again in my life,
and I want to change that.
And I think those have beenexploring those patterns have
been some of the biggest growthmoments in my life that I've
been able to go, wait, that'swhy I do that thing.
Okay, let me make some shifts,and it doesn't make it all go
(44:25):
away, but it is like I canunderstand it in a very
different way, and that's justso good stuff.
Well, it is good stuff.
Kate Aldrich (44:38):
Should I bring any snark before we go?
Yep, absolutely.
I didn't bring much.
SPEAKER_00 (44:42):
And until next.
Kate Aldrich (44:44):
Wait, what is that?
Oh, wait.
You were trying to close it outbefore I got any snarking?
Wowzers! This is a this is a guywho it feels like he doesn't
love my snark.
SPEAKER_00 (44:54):
Uh yep, yep, no, just I know you are.
Alright, well, I'm so glad thatwe could uh spend some time with
you.
I hope you guys got somethingout of that.
And you can use it to still workon becoming one in your
relationship.
Kate Aldrich (45:12):
It absolutely will benefit that.
SPEAKER_00 (45:14):
Yep.
Even if you're doing thatjourney.
Kate Aldrich (45:19):
Or forever.
There's no guarantees.
SPEAKER_00 (45:23):
Well.
Until next time, I'm BradAldrich.
Kate Aldrich (45:27):
And I'm Kate Aldrich.
Be kind and take care of eachother.
SPEAKER_00 (45:38):
Still Becoming One is a production of Aldrich
Ministries.
For more information about Bradand Kate's coaching ministry,
courses, and speakingopportunities, you can find us
at Aldrich Ministries.com.
For podcast show notes and linksto resources in all of our
social media, be sure to visitus at stillbecoming one.com.
(46:00):
And don't forget to like thisepisode wherever you get your
podcasts.
And be sure to follow us tocontinue your journey on Still
Becoming One.
Welcome to the Still Becoming One podcast.
We are Brad and Kate.
Kate Aldrich (00:10):
In our more than 20 years of marriage, we've
survived both dark times andexperienced restoration.
SPEAKER_00 (00:15):
Now, as a licensed marriage counselor and
relationship coaches, we helpcouples to regain hope and joy.
Kate Aldrich (00:23):
We invite you to journey with us as we are still
becoming one.
SPEAKER_00 (00:27):
Let's start the conversation.
Hello everyone.
Welcome back to Still BecomingOne.
SPEAKER_02 (00:35):
Welcome.
SPEAKER_00 (00:37):
Now I just wait for you to hear.
Kate Aldrich (00:42):
I'm feeling particularly mischievous and
snarky this morning, so.
SPEAKER_00 (00:48):
Mischievous and snarky?
Okay.
Kate Aldrich (00:51):
Wait a second.
You say uh-oh, like it's asurprise.
SPEAKER_00 (00:55):
I didn't know you were mischievous and snarky.
Kate Aldrich (00:58):
I don't know, I just feel it inside of me.
SPEAKER_00 (01:00):
Okay.
Alright, I'm in trouble.
Um yeah, so do we want to checkin?
Other than mischievous andsnarky?
Kate Aldrich (01:11):
Sure.
SPEAKER_00 (01:13):
You would be the other then tell the nice people
what we've been up to.
Kate Aldrich (01:17):
Tell the nice people.
Aw, he thinks you're all nice.
That's a that's cute.
Um, I'm sure you are all nice,actually.
Uh I have to tell them whatwe've been up to.
SPEAKER_00 (01:28):
We're coming off of our second weekend.
Um, I don't know why they callit a weekend.
It's longer than a weekend, butstill, our second intensive
period of training for ournarrative-focused trauma care um
level two.
And um, you know, we've done,we've talked so much here about
(01:51):
the Allender Center and how muchwe appreciate them and really
how much we value that educationand learning, but their
experiences are so much morethan just like information and
education.
I mean, it is like lots ofhours, but it's both download of
(02:16):
information, but also somereally personal emotional time
sent in group and processing andlearning how to facilitate even
better and uh like all thesekinds of things that are just
emotionally tiring.
SPEAKER_02 (02:36):
Mm-hmm.
Kate Aldrich (02:38):
I mean, I think the reality is they'd be
exhausting regardless of likesitting through something like
that for four days.
Yeah.
Um, actually, I think theAllener, the the teachers often
call it week two.
SPEAKER_00 (02:52):
So that's more accurate.
It's Thursday through Sunday, soit's it's a long, long stint.
Kate Aldrich (02:57):
Four days may not feel like an actual week, but
the amount of time is definitelya week.
SPEAKER_00 (03:03):
Yeah.
So um it's like 30 hours thatwe're in class or group or you
know, something like teachingtime, yeah.
Four days, so it's a lot.
Um but it's so amazing.
Uh, do you want to give anyhighlights, things that you
walked away from with wow, umlots.
Kate Aldrich (03:27):
I and I mean, and I think my my processing style,
like I will still be processing.
In fact, what happens inteaching time, not so much, like
that.
I feel like I'm processing asit's happening.
But doing reading my ownstories, having them processed
(03:48):
with a group, which is not asmuch the point this time, but
it's still happening.
Um, and then facilitatingsomeone else's reading, there is
so much that I'm taking in aboutmyself and my style of relating,
all different kinds of thingsthat I have been writing things
down all weekend, and I think umI am still gonna be processing
(04:14):
them.
I'm thinking about what would bea takeaway that I feel like I've
solidified or what not.
Um, I don't know.
Do you have one?
SPEAKER_00 (04:25):
I I mean, there's definitely some things I'm
processing again about my story,right?
That's one of these interestingthings is we're jumping into our
own work in the middle oflearning how to do work better.
And that's kind of the point,right?
Like kind of the emphasis ofthis second level is hey, your
(04:46):
story impacts you as afacilitator, and we need to see
those places and times where itdoes so that we become better
facilitators.
So I I think there that meansyou're doing a lot of your own
work.
Um, I think there are, you know,there's always places that you
need to grow.
(05:06):
And, you know, I'm learning somethings about my facilitation
style that are things that Iwant to get better, you know.
And um, you know, just somethings that got pointed out as
as we're processing.
It's like, okay, I can do thatbetter to help people sit with
their stories differently,better, you know, kind of thing.
(05:26):
So I I think that's probablysome of my work-wise takeaways.
Um, I I mean, one of the thingsI don't mind saying it here, the
one of the things that Irecognize I know is I really
want people to have like the ahamoment, the insight, the light
bulb.
And sometimes I push to thatalmost too quickly um and need
(05:54):
to like slow down and let themsit and let their body process
because otherwise the aha momentmight not land in the same way.
Kate Aldrich (06:06):
So well, and you know, it's interesting.
I think the nature of story workis in the Allender Center sets
it up this way, very slow,gradual like work, and yet many
of our clients are coming in aspace where they want answers
(06:31):
quickly, which is honorable.
Yes.
Um, it's also probably somethingwe as a team at Aldrich
Ministries could work on betterof helping people understand
it's it's a slower process.
Well, and I mean you can comeand we can do it in a quicker
fashion, but like there arethings you're missing.
SPEAKER_02 (06:54):
I agree.
Kate Aldrich (06:55):
But it's also, I mean, I also feel the tension of
financially that's hard forpeople to like right.
They're willing to make thecommitment, but for many people,
it's like I can't commit tocoming forever, like
indefinitely, true kind ofthing.
So I think those are thetensions.
SPEAKER_00 (07:16):
I think another part of that tension, and this is a
question I ask a lot of peopleon first session, is almost like
tell me what the straw thatbroke the camel's back was.
What finally got you to actuallygo, okay, I need to call someone
and get some help?
Because I think a lot of peoplethink about it for a really long
(07:37):
time.
A lot of people want to do itfor a long time.
And it often takes,unfortunately, a negative
something to push people to go,all right, I have to do it.
And then they walk in going, Ineed to fix this thing.
(08:00):
And then it's like, oh, we'vegot to you gotta help me with
this thing.
This, you know, whether it be mymarriage is falling apart, or
this part of our marriage isfalling apart, or I've got this
problem that's surfaced, or it'sit becomes very focused on the
immediate.
Yeah.
Which is certainly differentthan really going into, hey,
(08:22):
let's let's do a slow pullingback what's really been the
motivating factors in your life.
Let's actually take a look atwhy you keep making the same
mistakes over and over again, orwhy you keep doing the same
things over and again.
Maybe maybe not even mistakes.
(08:43):
Right.
Why do we why do we fall intothose same patterns?
Kate Aldrich (08:47):
Sure.
Yeah, totally.
Yeah.
So yeah, I mean, I I coming offof it, like, yeah, I'm tired.
SPEAKER_00 (08:56):
Yeah.
I can feel that.
Kate Aldrich (08:58):
And it's really tired, but also really snarky.
SPEAKER_00 (09:03):
I'm in trouble.
Why do you always say that?
Kate Aldrich (09:06):
Why do you say we should unpack that right now?
Why do you say you're in troubleif I'm snarky?
SPEAKER_00 (09:11):
Because that's that's what my story is.
You're the king.
I'm in trouble.
Kate Aldrich (09:15):
Oh, gotcha.
But you're the oh, but yourparents weren't fun snarky.
I'm fun.
SPEAKER_00 (09:21):
Okay.
Kate Aldrich (09:23):
Wait a second.
Are you implying that I am not?
SPEAKER_00 (09:27):
You definitely are.
It's just sometimes when you'resnarky and I'm not, I don't know
what to expect.
And when it's being recorded foreveryone to see, I'm like, oh
hey, I warned you.
Kate Aldrich (09:39):
I know.
SPEAKER_00 (09:40):
Aren't you don't you feel so this leads us directly
into doing your own work?
Our topic for today.
I don't know why.
Kate Aldrich (09:50):
Yeah, I was like, wait a second, are you telling
me I need to do work because I'msnarky?
SPEAKER_00 (09:54):
No, I don't know.
No, I I mean, I think it was areally interesting thing that
you had brought up that uh totalk about of just, you know, we
love working with couples.
I think it's something that wedo that I truly enjoy.
I love it when I get to do itwith you and work together with
a couple.
Um, but we also end up workingwith a lot of individuals who
(10:18):
have said, I have some work todo.
I have some things that I needto unpack.
And I think there's thisquestion of does that make me
the problem in our marriage?
Does that mean, you know, I Ihave to be responsible for
everything?
(10:39):
And well, there's just maybethat's a place to start.
Is you know, how do youencourage people when they need
to do some of their own work,how do you encourage them to
dive in?
Kate Aldrich (10:55):
Well, it's funny you said that, like, am I the
problem?
I was kind of I kind of got alittle stuck there.
Like, I think there are things,and I think we definitely used
to ascribe to them like yes,yes.
Am I the problem?
(11:16):
Yes, right, and in on somelevels, yes.
But I also would like to umspeak to that and alleviate it a
little bit, and also say, do wehave to look at it as I'm the
problem, or that we both bringdynamics, which we understand
(11:36):
and um credit to your story.
Like we both bring things thatspecific to us and our
relationship are going to makeit challenging.
SPEAKER_00 (11:48):
Correct.
Correct, right.
Kate Aldrich (11:50):
So, yes, in one essence, you are the problem,
and I think the church reallykind of pushes that.
They do both pendulum swings oflike one person, like they can
certainly focus on one spousesometimes to a detriment, which
is just wrong, not helpful.
It just yeah.
Or you're both your biggestmarital problem kind of
(12:13):
attitude.
SPEAKER_00 (12:15):
Which I I wish it was more of that.
You're you're exactly right.
I can see the pendulum swing,and so it it goes really strong
because historically, regularly,we see the church blaming a lot
of marriage problems on women,especially sexual problems,
(12:35):
right?
Like, oh well, if if she, right?
Um, so I I think you're exactlyright.
I'll flip that script though andsay, I see the church a lot of
times supporting, you know, ifhe was just more spiritual, if
he was actually the gonna be thehead of the household, if he was
(12:57):
stepping up and doing what heshould, then you wouldn't be
having these problems too.
So like the guy is the theproblem.
Kate Aldrich (13:05):
Yep, those are two very true statements, and
they're they're incrediblymotivating, but also not really
helpful.
SPEAKER_00 (13:18):
Yeah.
Kate Aldrich (13:19):
That's the talent.
SPEAKER_00 (13:21):
Like they're replacing blame and making the
person on the opposite side feelbetter.
Kate Aldrich (13:28):
It's negative motivation.
SPEAKER_00 (13:29):
Actually, doing anything positive.
Kate Aldrich (13:32):
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, you know, people come inwith all different kinds of
expectations, and of course, welisten and take those into
consideration, but we are alwayslooking for the opportunities to
enter into the story bits thatare present with individuals,
(13:53):
always with but even withcouples, right?
Because that is the informationthat is truly gonna allow a
space of healing andunderstanding.
SPEAKER_00 (14:06):
And I think it is so necessary if we want to get out
of the cycles that we're in.
And that can be true for anindividual, and it's for sure
true for a couple.
You know, it I think mostcouples will admit that they
have the same fight or same twoor three fights over and over
(14:31):
again with maybe slightlydifferent subject matter, but
it's the same style, the samepattern, the same accusations
thrown at each other, just witha different subject matter.
Kate Aldrich (14:46):
Well, probably if we looked at those and dissected
them, they're probably the samefight.
SPEAKER_00 (14:50):
They they could be, right?
Yeah.
Kate Aldrich (14:51):
Not always, but probably it's the same wounds
that are being tended to inthose fights that or conflicts.
SPEAKER_00 (15:00):
Um, we want to get to those, one or hopefully both
of you need to get into yourstory to figure out why that
dynamic is there.
What it is that's actuallypushing that felt need.
Right, because I really trulybelieve most people are not out
(15:24):
there trying to make theirspouse out to be the enemy,
trying to make their spouse uh,you know, feel crazy, trying to,
you know, ruin theirrelationship.
I think most of them are walkingin their stuff, trying to make
it the best they know how, andwe regularly miss each other in
(15:45):
the same places.
Kate Aldrich (15:47):
Yeah, absolutely.
And and we're talking about, youknow, we started the subject of
like doing this processtogether.
Well, you brought up kind of themarriage, but I also think
that's a really good thing.
But I I think it's also reallygood for individuals, for your
(16:08):
own individual health, and thenfor the byproduct of the health
of your marriage.
It's really amazing when wehonor that we each have work to
do.
SPEAKER_00 (16:19):
For sure.
Kate Aldrich (16:21):
Right.
But m a lot of times we see thethe pattern of well, if you just
did what you need to do, right.
Dude the work, the well, thechange, the, you know, or you
got help, then we would be in amuch different place.
SPEAKER_00 (16:36):
Right.
The accusation rather than aninvitation.
But I even want to caution it,you know, making an invitation
for somebody else is prettyproblematic.
Like they have to come to aplace where they are wanting to
do their work.
Kate Aldrich (16:58):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (16:58):
As you're saying, like spouses trying to spouse
going, hey, why don't you go totherapy for a little while?
Like that rare.
I mean, I I think sometimes theconversation needs to happen
because people haven't felt thepermission to do so.
They haven't felt the permissionto sometimes it's spend the
(17:18):
money, they haven't spent, youknow, had the permission to
spend the time.
And so sometimes we need theconversation to happen.
But I don't think it should be.
Hey, I think you probably shouldbenefit from or would benefit
from some therapy, which I I dothink everyone could benefit
from some, but I I'm not suresaying it that way probably
(17:43):
works the best.
Kate Aldrich (17:45):
So, how would you say it?
I can't wait to hear this.
You guys all ready?
SPEAKER_00 (17:49):
I I there was the snark.
unknown (17:51):
Oh man.
Kate Aldrich (17:52):
There's the snark.
SPEAKER_00 (17:54):
I think at best, like if you think let's take the
best situation that you aresomebody who's already doing
your work.
You've gotten invested in yourstory, you've done um some
coaching or counseling, and youreally do see the benefit of it.
(18:16):
Um, I think the then the bestthing to encourage your spouse
to would be having aconversation with them about
what you've learned aboutyourself and how that has helped
you and their your relationship.
(18:36):
And then saying something to theeffect of if you ever want to go
on this exploration foryourself, I want to make sure we
make space for that.
Kate Aldrich (18:50):
I think that's pretty good.
I would amend it with one thing.
I would stick to just what it'staught you about you and not
sure how it's and now I'm doingthis so perfectly in our
marriage, right?
Like I would avoid that.
I would just, yeah, I would justtalk about what you've learned
about yourself, how you see itreflected in the things that you
(19:14):
do, and the kindness you'rebringing to try and work with
that.
Yeah.
Um, and I would just leave it atthat.
I I think the benefits of yourmarriage, hopefully, that person
is starting to see, but pointingthem out, depending on where you
are in your marriage journey andand how um your communication
(19:36):
has either been flowed well orisn't a problematic point.
I could just see that becoming apoint of tension.
So I think I would leave thatfor a later discussion when
that's invited.
SPEAKER_00 (19:49):
That's good.
Um, but so let me throw out thepushbacks that I hear all the
time.
Um to doing
Kate Aldrich (20:00):
Your own work?
SPEAKER_00 (20:00):
Yeah, to doing your own work.
So um I'll just I'll start withlike the churchy pushback of we
don't need therapy, we just needto pray more.
Kate Aldrich (20:12):
Okay.
Um praying is not bad.
But maybe there is no butt.
Praying is not bad, and neitheris therapy.
(20:33):
There are two differentprocesses, and yes, the Holy
Spirit could bring those things,those revelations to you in your
prayer time.
Absolutely.
We're not limiting him.
However, the whole like hecreated us to be in community,
(20:54):
to right.
We don't I like the challenge Ihave with only praying is it's
very isolating in many senses.
Not that it's, you know, like Imean, Jesus went off to pray.
We see that lots of times, andhe was praying by himself.
So it is not in and of itself,it is a good practice.
It is not the only practice andthe only way for us to receive
(21:18):
and learn things aboutourselves.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (21:21):
Yeah.
No, I I agree with thatcompletely.
I think that's a really goodanswer.
It's not no, that's not helpful.
It's just I think lots ofopportunities for more than that
exist.
Kate Aldrich (21:40):
And we were made for community.
We were made to bounce thingsoff of each other, right?
And and and yeah, I think I'lljust stop there.
SPEAKER_00 (21:50):
So, all right, another pushback that I think
I've heard before is uh, youknow, I'll just talk with my
friends or get an accountabilitypartner or you know, have
somebody who's gonna help mechange this thing, habit,
whatever.
What would you say?
Kate Aldrich (22:12):
Those are all good things again, like they're all
good things.
I don't think they address thewhy.
unknown (22:18):
Right.
Kate Aldrich (22:19):
And, you know, Dan Alender and his teaching team
and everything are very good atcommunicating that if we can't
address the actual harm thathappened that brought us to
this, dot dot dot.
SPEAKER_00 (22:33):
That strategy, that whatever.
Kate Aldrich (22:36):
We're going to struggle to change it right in
any sort of um permanent's not agood word, but like consistent
fashion.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (22:48):
And then we're often stuck repeating it with our own
family, our own children.
Kate Aldrich (22:55):
Yeah.
unknown (22:56):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (22:56):
For sure.
We end up repeating that samepattern and calling out the same
things and creating some of thesame things.
So it it is an important thingto push.
I I I would say I am not sure Iam I know any accountability
(23:16):
type relationship that hasworked by itself in the long
term.
Accountability relationships,the ones that I know are usually
very short-lived and maybe helpwith a little bit of immediate
behavior change.
(23:37):
Maybe.
But they don't really changestuff.
And that's the thing withtalking to your friend, you're
now, you know, maybe yourfriend's got some great advice,
comes great ideas, but unlessthey're actually knowing where
you know where to go, they'regiving you what's worked for
(24:01):
them, which is could be great,but a lot of times maybe not.
Kate Aldrich (24:07):
Yeah.
I think that's I think that'svery true.
Again, it's not these things arehave their place.
It's it's it's okay for you toimplement them.
I just think they the church hasrepeatedly, I guess in a um
we'll give it in a fashion oftrying to help, provided answers
(24:31):
that aren't reflective of what'sactually happening.
It's just a blanket answer I cangive to everybody who's
struggling with something.
And it's like that is bypassingthe fact that the Lord made us
all so intricately unique.
SPEAKER_00 (24:50):
Yeah.
Yeah.
What about the idea of uhnothing's really gonna change?
If I'm just doing it myself,nothing's really gonna change.
They need to, like, especiallyif you're dealing with a
relationship issue.
Um, you know, my going tocounseling is not gonna change
(25:12):
my husband's crappy habit ofXYZ.
Kate Aldrich (25:15):
Uh yeah, that's probably true.
That you going and working onyourself isn't necessarily going
to bring change about yourspouse.
Like that is something they haveto want, desire, move towards.
But also it's amazing.
(25:36):
I think every single one of ushas been inspired by others at
times or motivated by seeingsomething different in someone
else.
Or, you know, so I think thereis space for that to be
impactful.
But in some hands, you're right,but there is a piece of you
(25:59):
matter.
Yeah.
I mean, it's not a piece, it'sthe truth.
It is you matter, and so gettingyou to a place where that's a
really good thing, that youmatter, and you realizing what
level of I matter and health Ineed just to be here on earth,
(26:22):
just to be a human, and then inyour marriage, I think that's
vital.
SPEAKER_00 (26:27):
That's really good.
That's really good.
Yeah, I I I I agree.
You cannot go in order to withthe goal of just changing your
spouse.
You need to go with the goal ofwhat do I need to do?
How do I need to grow my side?
(26:47):
How do I need to understandmyself better?
And this is actually a caution.
Um, it's something that we teachall of our Alderch Ministries
coaches to watch out for.
There is this thing that happenswhen we go to individual, when
we're discouraged about ourspouse that we can very easily
(27:13):
get into a pattern of coming tothat person and convincing them
how awful they are.
And convincing them, I can'tbelieve my husband did this, I
can't believe my husband didthis, I can't believe my wife
did this, I can't, you know, andand look at all this list of
things that they did to hurt me.
(27:34):
And some of that's important toget off your chest.
Like I want to give some spaceto that.
But if that's all that'shappening, and your count coach,
your therapist is just going, Ohmy goodness, you're right.
They're so awful.
Without having met that person,there's some problems because
(27:56):
they're not helping you grow.
They're just joining you inpointing the finger that this
problem is all the other person.
And I'm not saying it's notsomewhat the other person.
Like there is some reality.
Yes, your spouse has some thingsto grow.
No, I don't care how good or badthey are, they have some things
(28:17):
to do.
But if you're going to therapyto get somebody to validate that
your spouse is really theproblem, I think maybe you'd
need a different coach ortherapist, right?
Kate Aldrich (28:29):
Like, I think the challenge is gonna be you're
never the problem in but right,like it's not it, it's not
helping you.
I think there's a place,obviously, for therapists and
coach to call out unhealthy,unsafe, wrong behavior.
(28:49):
100% and and say, Do you realizeyou're living in a situation
where this is not okay, this isnot good, this is not safe, like
those sorts of things.
Um but when we're seeing theaverage, for lack of better
term, average, um, it's notunsafe.
It's not right, it's it's notgreat, but it's not abuse.
SPEAKER_00 (29:12):
We're seeing a difficult system, a difficult
relationship, a volatilerelationship kind of thing.
Kate Aldrich (29:20):
Yeah.
Then it we have to tend towhat's here and why.
SPEAKER_00 (29:28):
Right.
Right.
And and what's my role in it?
What's what's my part of thestory when that person does
this?
How am I feeling?
What's that bringing up for me?
Where did that belief come from?
What what's my relationship withanger, right?
Is it I use anger to push peopleaway?
Is it I only get angry at myselfand I'm not allowed to be angry?
(29:51):
Is it like there's so manydifferent dynamics here that we
need to take the time to look atour own work to better
understand our relationship?
And and I will tell you, I Ifight this all the time with
clients, they don't know I'mfighting them, but of trying to
acknowledge like, yes, yourspouse has their stuff.
(30:17):
I want to hear it, I want to bethere with you.
If you need to vent, I get it.
But if all I do is validateyou're right, they're awful,
then all it's doing is pullingyour marriage apart.
And that is not truly helpinganyone until like if they're at
(30:37):
a place where they're saying,that's it, I filed divorce
papers, I'm done, then okay.
But even then, I will say, evenin that space, I'm still going,
okay, what are you going tolearn about yourself from this
situation?
Kate Aldrich (30:51):
Or you're just going to take the same patterns
into another relationship.
SPEAKER_00 (30:58):
That's right.
It's your own stuff, you know,that that you need to think
about and deal with.
Kate Aldrich (31:06):
I think the, you know, the other thing that I
hear a lot of specifically fromthe Christian crowd.
And this this may also be trueoutside of it, but I hear this
specifically of like, why doeseverything have to go back to my
childhood?
(31:26):
And can't we just forgive?
Can't we just forgive?
Like my parents were doing thebest they could.
Yes.
Or like, and some of it you'llhear that my parents are doing
the best they could, the theadult kid trying to protect the
parents, but there's alsopressure from parents, which we
addressed a little this of like,why does everything have to go
(31:50):
back to their childhood?
SPEAKER_00 (31:53):
Yeah, that's a great question.
And there's some really goodanswers.
One, because research has shownover and over again, core parts
of our personality are formed inthose formative years.
So as we have were trying tofigure out the world, our brain
was growing by leaps and bounds.
(32:17):
And so it put synapses together,which is how the brain
communicates of this thing andthis thing that repeat in a
pattern over and over again.
So when I feel this, I do this.
And that got established atfive, six, seven, like they're
so early in our thinking, andthen we repeat those patterns.
(32:39):
And so we have to figure out howto rewire those synapses.
We have to go back to where theywere formed.
So there is science behind whydo we go to our childhood?
Kate Aldrich (32:50):
So wait, you're saying the very thing that
Christians don't know what to dowith God created us that way?
SPEAKER_00 (32:56):
Yes.
Right?
God created us to be raised in asafe, loving, supported
environment.
Kate Aldrich (33:07):
So you're kind of fighting the way God made us.
unknown (33:10):
Correct.
SPEAKER_00 (33:11):
And if we were not raised in that safe, loving,
warm environment where we got tosafely explore this world, that
we got to make mistakes and itbe okay, that we got to it, you
know, figure out our way ofrelating with ourselves and
others in a safe place.
If we have that, we often launchinto the world as very stable
(33:38):
people.
Now, everybody has some wounds,right?
Because we are fallen.
Everybody has wounds.
I don't care.
You don't have perfect parents,they don't exist.
But there is sometimes morestability, more like that that
your parents were able to giveyou.
That's how we were made to haveour brain be built around that
(34:02):
environment.
And when it wasn't, there areconsequences.
Kate Aldrich (34:18):
The really loving lie.
That's you know, I don't knowthat I've ever heard someone
describe a lie as really loving.
SPEAKER_00 (34:25):
I I think it is honoring, right?
And we are called to honor ourfather and mother.
Kate Aldrich (34:30):
I think that's a better descriptor, yes.
SPEAKER_00 (34:32):
And so we try to take care of our parents by
saying they tried their best.
And often we look back at thosewound stories that are stuck in
our head and we go, well, whatwere they supposed to do?
Oh, they didn't even know thatwas going on.
(34:53):
Or, you know, I yeah, what wouldmy dad actually do?
Come on, it's not like he hurtme, he didn't like mean to, like
we create excuses and normalizethings that hurt us all the
time.
And it is our way of escapingthe emotions of not being seen,
(35:20):
of not being cared for by sayingthey tried their best.
And I think that is all I wantto say, I think that is most of
the time a true statement.
There are very few parents whoare out there trying to hurt
their children.
Very few.
(35:41):
But all parents try their best.
It doesn't mean that harm didn'thappen.
It doesn't mean that hurt didn'thappen.
It doesn't mean that things wereweren't missed that sometimes
needs to be talked about.
Kate Aldrich (35:57):
I agree.
I think the statement my parentswere doing their best is true
and also not, right?
Like I think that's they werewith their current skills due to
their story and what they'veprocessed, that was what they
(36:20):
could do.
SPEAKER_00 (36:21):
Right.
Kate Aldrich (36:24):
The truth also is that's often super harmful,
yeah, super hurtful.
Right.
Right?
Like, because yeah, because weare acting out of those wounds.
If we don't understand them, weare not necessarily repeating
them.
People tend to say that it couldbe that you do it in the same
fashion, but often notnecessarily.
(36:54):
But yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (36:55):
I want to put in there, like the the fact of, you
know, why do we have to look atmy parents?
I they tried their best.
We always are thinking about thenegative things and saying,
well, they didn't know anybetter, they didn't, they didn't
feel any better.
If you want to honor yourparents well, stop pulling up
(37:19):
just the negatives and lettingthem off the hook.
Start going, okay, wait, whatdid my parent do really well?
When was a time that theyactually really saw me?
When was a moment, when was thefive minutes of care that you
may have felt?
When was the space that theywere acting as the parent that
(37:44):
they really wanted to be?
And let's hold on to thatbeautiful, wonderful, my parents
were really trying, and thenallow ourselves the space to
say, and in that time theyreally missed it.
Kate Aldrich (38:01):
I I think there's also the fear that, like, if I
do this work, um, and and notnecessarily this isn't to fear
in your marriage relationship,but if I do this work, I'm gonna
somehow, the way to help is toconfront my parents.
SPEAKER_00 (38:17):
Oh, good, good point.
Kate Aldrich (38:19):
And I I I feel like I sometimes that comes up,
and sometimes people feel a verystrong need in that area.
But I also engage and invite aconversation of, you know,
what's your goal with that?
What do you think that's goingto accomplish?
Because for many people, notall, it doesn't ever need to be
(38:45):
a conversation or a conversationthe way you think it would be.
Um, doesn't mean we sometimesdon't address boundaries or, you
know, I would appreciate it ifthis you didn't do this to me or
whatever.
Like, but it's not this full-on,I think people often picture it,
(39:06):
and maybe this is just me, butkind of like those um the TV
shows where it's like, and well,I know you therapists call it
some what is it when you do aintervention, intervention,
right?
The where we have to sit downwith mom and dad and and we have
to tell them everything and wehave to like and they have to
take it and somehow that's gonnamake everything better.
(39:28):
I mean but that it has to belike that, and it's like I that
that's could it sure, I'm notsure how productive that's gonna
be.
Um, but it often, ifconversations happen, if they
don't have to look anything likethat, right?
And and so I wanna relieve thattension of like, you're not
(39:52):
gonna be asked to do that.
SPEAKER_00 (39:55):
Yes, that is so good.
I'm really glad you said thatbecause I think most people Go,
okay, now I have to dig up thisstuff about my parents and I
have to go blow up thatrelationship.
No, you don't.
No, you don't.
Are you gonna maybe hold it in adifferent way?
And maybe you're going to needto recognize some self-care
(40:16):
around relationship with them,maybe, but you're already doing
that.
SPEAKER_01 (40:21):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (40:22):
Right?
You're yeah.
Whether it's healthy or not, wedon't know.
But let's let's look at that.
We're already doing just thatand try and figure out
understanding why and helpingyou to navigate what that looks
like.
And you're exactly right.
And I see it all the time.
In fact, I usually warn peopleis if we're getting into
stories, I see people all thetime running and going, Okay,
(40:45):
mom and dad, I uncovered allthis stuff.
What do you gotta say about it?
And it not usually going well.
Because you've done some workdoesn't mean your parents are
ready to do the work.
Kate Aldrich (40:55):
Yeah.
I I mean, and I will speak tothe other side.
I have clients whose parents aredoing their own work and want to
have the conversations, and thatis a really beautiful thing.
Uh painful.
SPEAKER_00 (41:09):
Painful, but beautiful.
Kate Aldrich (41:10):
But beautiful.
But it's okay if you know yourparents are not even anywhere
close to that.
It's okay.
It's pay it's also painful thatthey're not.
SPEAKER_00 (41:21):
If you're a parent, and we said this earlier in that
parent session that we did acouple weeks ago.
If you're a parent, your goal isto reach out and say, Hey kids,
I can hold your stories now.
Not hey kids, guess what I foundout about my parents and my
(41:44):
background?
Here's all my stories that Iwant you to hold so that you
understand why I did thesethings.
Right?
That may come eventually as kidsgo.
I want to explore your culture,I want to explore our our family
situation.
Like that may come eventually,but that is not the way to
start.
Kate Aldrich (42:03):
Right.
Right.
And I would caution any parentout there who is tempted to just
pick up that line and take it totheir kids without understanding
what it means.
What that means.
Because that I'll be completelytransparent.
(42:23):
That would have been me.
SPEAKER_00 (42:25):
Oh, I'll go say the right thing and Oh, I just I
heard this line on a podcast.
Kate Aldrich (42:30):
I'll go say it to my kids with good intention.
SPEAKER_00 (42:33):
Oh, yeah.
Kate Aldrich (42:33):
But then but absolutely no skills or
understanding.
SPEAKER_00 (42:38):
I need you to know and immediately get defensive
and immediately get like, well,that's that's not the whole
story.
You you don't know what reallyhappened, right?
Like, yeah.
Kate Aldrich (42:49):
And I would caution you are going to do more
damage that way.
More than you already are ifyou're offering them something
really vulnerable and beautiful,but you don't you don't have the
skills and the understanding ofyourself yet to know how to do
it.
(43:09):
And and I'm not I'm not implyingthat you're ever going to be
perfect at it.
It is a brutal but beautifulprocess.
Yes.
As we've entered in with ourkids.
Uh, I'm sure we've made mistakeseven entering in.
There's repair to the repairsometimes, right?
Like yeah, just a caution.
(43:29):
Like because I know there arepeople out there like me who
would have been like, oh, Iheard this cool phrase.
I'm gonna say it to my kids andall will be well.
SPEAKER_00 (43:36):
Yeah.
Nope, not that.
That's good.
I I I think it's been a greatconversation of just what it,
why people enter into their ownwork and what it means to do it
in a way that isn't just aboutthe crisis, right?
But is about wait, I'm I'mseeing some patterns play out.
(44:00):
I'm seeing some things happenover and over again in my life,
and I want to change that.
And I think those have beenexploring those patterns have
been some of the biggest growthmoments in my life that I've
been able to go, wait, that'swhy I do that thing.
Okay, let me make some shifts,and it doesn't make it all go
(44:25):
away, but it is like I canunderstand it in a very
different way, and that's justso good stuff.
Well, it is good stuff.
Kate Aldrich (44:38):
Should I bring any snark before we go?
Yep, absolutely.
I didn't bring much.
SPEAKER_00 (44:42):
And until next.
Kate Aldrich (44:44):
Wait, what is that?
Oh, wait.
You were trying to close it outbefore I got any snarking?
Wowzers! This is a this is a guywho it feels like he doesn't
love my snark.
SPEAKER_00 (44:54):
Uh yep, yep, no, just I know you are.
Alright, well, I'm so glad thatwe could uh spend some time with
you.
I hope you guys got somethingout of that.
And you can use it to still workon becoming one in your
relationship.
Kate Aldrich (45:12):
It absolutely will benefit that.
SPEAKER_00 (45:14):
Yep.
Even if you're doing thatjourney.
Kate Aldrich (45:19):
Or forever.
There's no guarantees.
SPEAKER_00 (45:23):
Well.
Until next time, I'm BradAldrich.
Kate Aldrich (45:27):
And I'm Kate Aldrich.
Be kind and take care of eachother.
SPEAKER_00 (45:38):
Still Becoming One is a production of Aldrich
Ministries.
For more information about Bradand Kate's coaching ministry,
courses, and speakingopportunities, you can find us
at Aldrich Ministries.com.
For podcast show notes and linksto resources in all of our
social media, be sure to visitus at stillbecoming one.com.
(46:00):
And don't forget to like thisepisode wherever you get your
podcasts.
And be sure to follow us tocontinue your journey on Still
Becoming One.
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The Burden
The Burden is a documentary series that takes listeners into the hidden places where justice is done (and undone). It dives deep into the lives of heroes and villains. And it focuses a spotlight on those who triumph even when the odds are against them. Season 5 - The Burden: Death & Deceit in Alliance On April Fools Day 1999, 26-year-old Yvonne Layne was found murdered in her Alliance, Ohio home. David Thorne, her ex-boyfriend and father of one of her children, was instantly a suspect. Another young man admitted to the murder, and David breathed a sigh of relief, until the confessed murderer fingered David; “He paid me to do it.” David was sentenced to life without parole. Two decades later, Pulitzer winner and podcast host, Maggie Freleng (Bone Valley Season 3: Graves County, Wrongful Conviction, Suave) launched a “live” investigation into David's conviction alongside Jason Baldwin (himself wrongfully convicted as a member of the West Memphis Three). Maggie had come to believe that the entire investigation of David was botched by the tiny local police department, or worse, covered up the real killer. Was Maggie correct? Was David’s claim of innocence credible? In Death and Deceit in Alliance, Maggie recounts the case that launched her career, and ultimately, “broke” her.” The results will shock the listener and reduce Maggie to tears and self-doubt. This is not your typical wrongful conviction story. In fact, it turns the genre on its head. It asks the question: What if our champions are foolish? Season 4 - The Burden: Get the Money and Run “Trying to murder my father, this was the thing that put me on the path.” That’s Joe Loya and that path was bank robbery. Bank, bank, bank, bank, bank. In season 4 of The Burden: Get the Money and Run, we hear from Joe who was once the most prolific bank robber in Southern California, and beyond. He used disguises, body doubles, proxies. He leaped over counters, grabbed the money and ran. Even as the FBI was closing in. It was a showdown between a daring bank robber, and a patient FBI agent. Joe was no ordinary bank robber. He was bright, articulate, charismatic, and driven by a dark rage that he summoned up at will. In seven episodes, Joe tells all: the what, the how… and the why. Including why he tried to murder his father. Season 3 - The Burden: Avenger Miriam Lewin is one of Argentina’s leading journalists today. At 19 years old, she was kidnapped off the streets of Buenos Aires for her political activism and thrown into a concentration camp. Thousands of her fellow inmates were executed, tossed alive from a cargo plane into the ocean. Miriam, along with a handful of others, will survive the camp. Then as a journalist, she will wage a decades long campaign to bring her tormentors to justice. Avenger is about one woman’s triumphant battle against unbelievable odds to survive torture, claim justice for the crimes done against her and others like her, and change the future of her country. Season 2 - The Burden: Empire on Blood Empire on Blood is set in the Bronx, NY, in the early 90s, when two young drug dealers ruled an intersection known as “The Corner on Blood.” The boss, Calvin Buari, lived large. He and a protege swore they would build an empire on blood. Then the relationship frayed and the protege accused Calvin of a double homicide which he claimed he didn’t do. But did he? Award-winning journalist Steve Fishman spent seven years to answer that question. This is the story of one man’s last chance to overturn his life sentence. He may prevail, but someone’s gotta pay. The Burden: Empire on Blood is the director’s cut of the true crime classic which reached #1 on the charts when it was first released half a dozen years ago. Season 1 - The Burden In the 1990s, Detective Louis N. Scarcella was legendary. In a city overrun by violent crime, he cracked the toughest cases and put away the worst criminals. “The Hulk” was his nickname. Then the story changed. Scarcella ran into a group of convicted murderers who all say they are innocent. They turned themselves into jailhouse-lawyers and in prison founded a lway firm. When they realized Scarcella helped put many of them away, they set their sights on taking him down. And with the help of a NY Times reporter they have a chance. For years, Scarcella insisted he did nothing wrong. But that’s all he’d say. Until we tracked Scarcella to a sauna in a Russian bathhouse, where he started to talk..and talk and talk. “The guilty have gone free,” he whispered. And then agreed to take us into the belly of the beast. Welcome to The Burden.