April 24, 2024 • 47 mins
Discover how Liz August, the virtual assistant with a trophy shelf, unveils the secrets behind a powerful user journey that's more than just skin deep for any business. We'll traverse the misconception that flashy websites and social media tweaks are the magic bullets for sales slumps. Instead, Liz and I dissect the transformative power of a meticulously structured customer journey—because it's the strategic trail of breadcrumbs that really leads to the golden egg of client conversion.
Strap in as we unveil the financial tightrope act that entrepreneurs often find themselves performing. I recount a story that turns the 'more hours equals more success' equation on its head, sharing how a client managed to multiply her income with a fraction of her previous working hours. We'll also tackle the temptation to throw money at overpriced solutions, advocating instead for smart, stage-appropriate investments. It's a bit like finding the perfect pair of jeans—why splurge on a designer label when the perfect fit can be found without breaking the bank?
Finally, we stir the pot on creativity, finances, and finding the right blend for a fulfilling professional journey. I'll take you through my own realizations about aligning missions with actions, revealing how it’s akin to crafting the perfect marinara sauce of work life. We also talk about the symbiotic dance between the dreamers and the doers in any thriving business. Plus, we'll share the recipe for maintaining authenticity while stirring up success. So, if you're ready to transform your business approach from a sketchy doodle to a masterpiece, Liz and I have the canvas, brushes, and colors all set for you.
CONNECT WITH ME MORE AT:
http://www.stopshoulding.me
https://www.instagram.com/minessa.konecky/
🎵 Thank you to Karacter for allowing me to use Telepathy (2005) in my intro.
This is one of my favorite albums of all time.
👉 Check it out: https://karacter.bandcamp.com/album/karacter
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
everybody, hi, welcome.
This is Liz August, thegreatest and uh, who won the.
By the way, I just can't getover the Bob award.
Look behind her head.
She's got the Bob award there,which I just like.
I see it on her website and I'mjust like I.
I just want to keep talkingabout the Bob award, um, which
is best of business, by the way,but we're calling it Bob Liz,
welcome.
(00:30):
I'm so excited we finally didthe thing, finally did the thing
.
So okay.
So here's why I was.
I met Liz through our friend,judy Harrington If you listen,
she's been on a couple of thepodcasts already and she said
well, you've got to meet Liz.
She's amazing, she's a greatvirtual assistant, she's
fabulous.
I'm like great.
You know, I like meeting newpeople, like building networks.
So I met Liz and here is themoment I said I wish I'd
(00:52):
recorded this.
We could go back to Sepia toneand be like and what happened
was is we were talking about howyou help people and you brought
up the user journey and how,like every person who comes to
you, or a large number, hasthey're going to do.
They want to update theirwebsite and they want to update
their social media and they wantto update all this and, by and
large, their problems are noneof those things.
(01:13):
Their problems are their userjourney.
And I so rarely, rarely hearpeople say things like that,
where it's like, dude, you don'tneed to do any of this nonsense
, like, forget about any of thisshit.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
You really this is what you need to do.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
So I would love to like sort of just hear from you
and your thoughts, like whensomebody comes to you and tells
you hey, I, my business and, bythe way, guys, we're going to
talk about this more than in thecontext of business is hey, I,
my business sucks, nobody'sbuying from me.
I'm going to spend money on amarketer and my website and
redoing, like what is the stuffthat goes through your mind,
(01:45):
what are the things that youwish you could be like tell them
, but you typically say very,very nicely, or don't tell them,
or tell them in like thesweetest way to not hurt their
feelings, what's like the whatdo you really want to be saying?
Speaker 2 (02:03):
here.
What do I really want to say?
So you up and they'll be likeoh, I need a virtual assistant.
I'm so stressed out, blah, blah, blah, and they come and
they're like I need a newwebsite, I need social media, I
need email marketing, I need aCRM, I you know whatever, and
I'm like actually no you need auser journey, and that's why, if
I could like shake somebodyright who came to me and they're
(02:25):
like well, I just need you todo this one thing, it's like no,
you don't.
And so I have to use terms likevirtual assistant or online
business manager, just so peoplewill understand what the hell
it is that I do.
Yeah, but virtual assistantsare such a dime a dozen.
You like throw a stick, you'llfind one.
It's fine, we're all amazing,but my biggest thing is that I
(02:47):
attack any task with strategyfirst, and so when people have a
strategy session with me,they're going to uncover so much
in their business that theoriginal thing that they came to
, let's say, it's a website.
They're going to be like ohyeah, I'm not, I'm not ready for
that yet.
I need to do these 20 otherthings that you just mentioned,
and it all centers around theuser journey.
(03:08):
I call it the customer journey.
Same thing, Um, but you know itall ties in.
Like if you are not thinkingabout your first touch point
with somebody and how that leadsto the next touch point and how
that leads to them becoming aclient and then that leads to
onboarding them, and then thatlead, like, if you're not
thinking about that, then thatfirst step your website or your
(03:30):
social media or however theyfound you, it's irrelevant.
Like you can't build a websiteunless you know your client
journey, because you need toknow the first step and you
can't be posting with any sortof content strategy unless you
know the first touch point withyou and that's the first step in
the client journey.
So it really like I think whenpeople start businesses, they're
(03:53):
excited.
I work with mostly creativesand they're very excited just to
serve people that they want toserve and the ways that they
want to serve them.
But there's so much to it tomake sure that you have a
successful business and itreally does stop from that, from
that experience, the journey.
I know, I know it's so much.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
you know you said no, there's something that you said
there that, like I think.
So you talk about the touchpoint.
So, like you have people, youknow that a lot of times people
will come and they'll say I needto update my website.
You want the website to bebeautiful and they'll say I need
to update my website.
You want the website to bebeautiful and you talk about how
you need to be able to knowwhat, the where are you taking
them once they come to yourwebsite?
What do they see when theyscroll down once?
If they've decided to buy now,what do they do?
(04:33):
Like, you really need to bethinking about those things
right, so that you know, whenyou send someone to Vanessacom
or simplify, simplify, mecom orwhatever you're sending people
to, you already know that theinfrastructure you've put in
place will guide them where theyneed to go.
You don't need to be involvedin like one of the things that I
think that the earliest, mostembarrassing lesson I ever had
(04:56):
was with my wife when I made myfirst or second website.
So like back in the day in 1995, so you mentioned earlier that
you were, uh, 37 and I'm 47.
So I was here way in the day in1995, so you mentioned earlier
that you were uh 37.
I'm 47, so I was here way inthe early days of the internet.
Right, we're just having aninternet website was enough,
right, you have the websiteright, so you're great you
decide, that's all you reallyneed.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
I have 10 000 visitors today click, oh look,
10 000 and you've got like therotating.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
Remember the taps, they're rotating oh my god, I
loved it.
I was so I remember when Istarted learning how to do that
and, like you, go to my websites, and I mean they were
assaulting your brain like itwas so much we all like and I
was like 10 and 96 and my dadgot me a computer and I'm like
coding and all that yeah, howfun that would have been around
the time then.
(05:41):
So you're also making theflashes.
Speaker 2 (05:43):
Oh yeah, I mean, if you don't have 25 moving objects
on your thing.
In 96 were you really doing?
You didn't really have awebsite.
Speaker 1 (05:50):
Yeah like, are you even relevant in this world?
Come on but you know, now we'reusers, are more sophisticated
and like they want to be, theyneed to, and they're very quick
to judge.
So and they don't.
I don't mean judge like yousuck, but you know, if I don
know where to go next, I'm goingto be quick to bounce off
because I don't.
Our attention spans have shrunk.
Our tolerance for discomforthas shrunk, right.
(06:11):
There was a time where I'd belike, oh, I don't know where to
go.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
Right, let me figure this out.
I'll figure it out.
Screw this, I'm done.
Peace, yeah, thing that I want.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
Um, and I, this doesn't.
This applies more in just yourwebsite.
So I'm actually so I'm going totell you and this is, how
important the user journey is,uh, and you said so much stuff
that, like I'm actually sad thatI have a one o'clock because
I'm like damn, we're going tohave a second.
Okay.
So here's, our episode, I knowfour hours later.
So, I was talking to someone theother day Cause, like you said,
the strategy is the key, and Ino longer do any coaching or
(06:43):
anything like that.
I just meet with people forstrategy sessions and then I say
you need, liz, you needso-and-so Exactly.
So there's one person that Italked to who, by the way, I
directed to you but, um, she'slocal and uh, there was this day
.
My wife and I wanted to go toher shop and her shop is inside
a smaller studio, yep.
(07:05):
And we went and we parkedacross the street from where her
shop is and my wife says Idon't think she's here.
And I was like no, she's here.
And my wife's like no, I don'tthink she's here.
And I was like no, no, she'shere.
And so we walk across thestreet.
We're literally like on thesame side of the block now as
her thing.
There's a little sandwich boardoutside but it says happy
holidays, and I'm, and I'mwalking up the stairs and it's
raining and it's cold, and mywife's like she's not here.
I'm like, oh my God, she's here.
So she says the store is open,everything is closed.
(07:27):
And I'm like I go in and I openthe door and I said, look, the
door is open.
And she's like, yeah, but it'sprobably for the other shop.
Like I don't see anything inhere that would indicate that
she's here.
All of the things are here.
And so this person and I endedup having a conversation a week
(07:47):
or so later, cause she washaving trouble finding clients.
You know now that the touristseason is over and I said to her
I told her this story and Isaid you were open.
But every step of the way I hadto drag my wife there.
And the only reason that Idragged her in there was because
I do this for a living.
So I know what I'm looking for.
But your average user is notgoing to do as much work as I
(08:08):
did.
Your average user is going tobe like my wife and say, oh, I
don't think she's here, I'mgoing to go have a drink at
honey baby Right.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
And this and this.
This hurts me.
It hurts me because there areso many incredible businesses
out there and they're notgetting the attention or the
clients that they deserve to get, and I recently discovered that
my entire mission, not just inbusiness but in life, is just to
(08:34):
make people's atmospheres andsurroundings and experiences
more comfortable, and I justwish that people didn't think it
was so hard to own a business.
It is.
I'm not saying it's not, butit's not as hard as it seems
when you get the, the help, that, the support that's out there
(08:57):
and there's ways.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
You know, I think part of the problem is, I think
it's been overcomplicated overthe years.
So like, if I think now youknow, to say three years ago,
when I was running my coachingbusiness, like the general
philosophy was you, you know,you had you have your mailing
list, there were all thesethings that you needed to do,
and then a lot of the coachesthat did trainings there's
always something else that theyare that you're paying them for,
right, and so it's always, andso I can see.
(09:20):
So for me, when I was firststarting out, and then, of
course, you know, I sort ofstarted to just like you start
to figure it out and you realize, oh, it's not that hard.
I feel like the mess that we'veadded so much junk on top of
things like, remember, you hadClubhouse and you had chatbots
and you had emails, and you havethis, and like in the end, all
(09:41):
of those things sound verycomplicated.
But the actual thing that we'redoing here is hey, liz, I met
you, let's talk, Right.
Oh, oh, you help with this.
Right, I have this problem.
This is so cool, let's.
And then you're walking me downthe garden path to say, oh,
strategy session.
Yeah, oh, let's book somethingbecause you can help me with
(10:02):
this, and but it's all aboutjust like a normal human, like
we've been having theserelationships since we were
children and, correct, I'mautistic, so I have trouble with
relationships.
But once you figure out thecadence, they're like oh, this
is how it, how relationshipshappen.
You can do the steps.
So how do you feel, like thatplays in when people come to you
and they're like okay, well, dothey ever say like that seems
so simple, like I feel like Ishould be doing that?
Speaker 2 (10:23):
Yeah, Tell me more about that.
I, so my strategy sessions are60 minutes long and I mean I
always freak out because I'mlike crap, I just unloaded so
much stuff and I feel so badCause I'm like I used to be a
teacher.
I taught a sixth, seventh andeighth grade Spanish and so I
know about different learningstyles and neurodivergency and I
(10:46):
know like not everybody learnsthe same way.
So when you word vomit all oversomebody like calm the hell
down, because these poor peoplelike they're trying to keep up
with you.
And I'm like but somebody toldme actually today one of my
clients and friends on WhatsApp.
She was like you're just thegoddess of making people feel
safe with tech stuff.
And I'm like, oh, that's sosweet, it was so sweet and it's
(11:07):
just, that's my goal is.
I just want you to make.
I want to make you feel safelike you.
And I say you, but like most ofmy clients are creatives that
have businesses and if they hadit their way, they wouldn't even
charge.
They just love helping people.
Oh, my God, absolutely.
And I'm like, god, you justhave so much just wonderful
(11:30):
stuff to bring to the world.
Like I don't want this to hurtyou.
I want you to feel safe and Iwant you to like, I want you to
get money so that you realizelike this is a cool thing to do,
is to own your own business.
Yeah, and so I just, you know,about 10 minutes into every call
, someone's like oh my God, Ijust feel so much better and I'm
like yeah, I feel like you andI have very similar calls.
Speaker 1 (11:51):
I do record that, because I actually tend to
record them and send them therecording Cause there's no way
they're able to take enoughnotes.
I actually typically would belike don't even bother taking
notes.
I'm like just, it's okay,You're going to be fine, Just
listen, just listen.
Well, and so you know and Ithink that that's really the key
, right Is that one is it's notas complicated as we think it is
.
It's been made to beovercomplicated, and I think
(12:11):
that that's what.
That's why I found what you doso alluring, in that it's not
just about like you're not.
It's not about oh, I have allthese services that I'm offering
you.
It's more about okay, this isyour business and this is what
you actually need to be doing,so, okay.
So I'm going to pull back alittle bit, because I had a
client once, and who, when I didthese, and I'm going to ask the
(12:35):
question differently.
I'm going to tell you whathappened with my client, then
I'm going to ask you a different, slightly different question.
So, the client I had.
I basically went with her andthe goal was to help her get
more time in her day, not somuch to make more money or that
kind of thing.
Right, She'd already figuredout how to make money.
She knew all of her shit, Heruser journeys were great.
Her issue was really just doingtoo many things.
So we sat, we met and I endedup.
(12:55):
She ended up going down to likefive hours a week from like 45
or something Like it was insane.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
It was fabulous Right .
Speaker 1 (13:02):
And she gets, gets you know, comes and talks to me
and says, oh, you know, I said,how are you doing?
And she's like well, I feellike I'm doing something wrong
and I'm like, oh my god, what'swrong are you?
You know?
She's like, well, I'm notworking that much anymore and
I'm like, oh god.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
I was like shit.
Speaker 1 (13:16):
You know, you always assume you fucked up somehow.
What did I do?
And then she says I said well,okay, well, hold on.
I was like how much are youmaking what you want?
She's like, actually I'm makingtwice what I was making before.
I just feel like I should beworking more.
No, and I was like no.
I was like that's conditioning,that's programming, that's the
feeling like you should be doingsomething more.
(13:39):
And so when I think about whatyou offer, people'm saying I
need to spend $10,000 on awebsite.
I'm going to spend, you know,$2,500 a month on a marketing
person like those, or Facebookads.
Everybody wants the Facebookads.
I don't know.
Please don't spend any money onFacebook ads if your user
journey unless you're just goingto spend money to send people
and push them off a cliff Right,what have you found in these
conversations in terms of thefinancial Cause, like if you're
(14:02):
telling me I don't need to dothese five or six things, what
I'm hearing is that wait aminute, I thought I was going to
have to spend $25,000 over thenext year, but I only need to
spend whatever it is, dependingon you know what service they
end up going with you or nothingbecause they decide, oh, I
don't need to do anything.
What do you typically find isthe results that you get on that
kind of where people have thething, oh, I don't need to spend
, what do they realize?
(14:22):
How much money do they realizethey don't need to actually be
spending?
Speaker 2 (14:25):
Well, it's funny At my core, I'm so frugal.
I was raised by financialparents, which is hilarious
because I don't math.
It's safer for people if I justdon't math.
And I was raised by two peoplein finance and it's just like
the most, the biggest, mostironic story of my life, um.
And then my mother gotremarried to a guy in finance
(14:46):
and I'm like God, just like,what is it with your number of
loving people?
Um?
But you know, at my core, Ihave to save a buck and I like
sometimes to my detriment, right, um?
And?
But it's also a great thing formy clients, because I don't
want them overspending, um.
It doesn't mean I don't chargemy worth.
I know my worth, um.
(15:06):
But I actually ask them in thefirst step to working with me is
filling out an application, andone of my questions is like
give me a range, what are youmaking every month?
And if it's less than $3,000,I'll have a strategy session
with you.
But you probably do not need myservices yet.
You just need my consulting.
Yeah, because I I refuse forsomebody to be making less than
(15:33):
$3,000 a month.
I refuse to give you my toppremium website because you're
not there yet.
You're just, you're not thereyet and and you're going to get
there, but a top notch websiteis not the thing that we're
going to focus on first for you.
Um, so that's my first thing,and then the other thing is like
, when you're ready and it'stime to invest, I'm going to
(15:53):
guide you to the best next step.
If it's a website, then yes,I'm going to give you a kick ass
website.
If it's, you know, working onyour services and figuring out
what those are.
First, I'm not a coach.
My thing is tech.
I work strategy in there.
I'm going to refer you out tothe many business coaches that I
(16:14):
know that are going to get youthere.
Yeah, so, yeah, so I don't knowif that answered the question
entirely but the financialaspect is so hard because we, we
really, I mean I told, mybookkeeper.
I love her.
I told my bookkeeper.
I said Bridget, listen, my goalnot resolution.
I won't do a resolution, but mygoal for 2024 is that I am not
(16:36):
going to get my debit card outand buy another online course.
Yes, $7, $17, $37.
That's the sevens they're likehey all the sevens that Amy
Porterfield talking about herdad sevens, damn it, amy
Porterfield, and your frickingsevens Cause that gets me, and
so I will.
You know, targeted ads, they'llget me.
(16:58):
And they'll be like if you buythis Trello board template, your
whole life will change.
And so I'm like, yes, boardtemplate, your whole life will
change.
And so I'm like, yes, take my17 and I buy so many of those.
And I immediately forward thereceipt over to my bookkeeper.
And so this poor woman, bridget, I love you so much, honey,
she'll, she'll just add it, andadd it, and add it to quickbooks
, and at the end of the year I'mlike, god, I forgot, I even
(17:20):
bought this thing I never usedit.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
where's my question?
Did you even look at it?
You bought it, you got yourdopamine hit and then you're
like oh, I forgot.
Speaker 2 (17:29):
I am ashamed to say so.
I file it neatly and it's got alittle.
It's got a tag for is it socialmedia or is it a Trello board,
and then it I would say like sixout of 10,.
I actually got my money's worthbecause I used it.
I'm not saying it's not worththe money.
I'm saying I didn't freakinguse it.
(17:52):
So I told Bridget I was like Irefuse to buy another one of
these things, like I call it.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
Professional development.
It's like yeah, no, no, I havea long professional development
list.
Speaker 2 (17:59):
But I told her I refuse to buy more until I've
used actually used all of theones that I've already purchased
, and we're talking like fiveyears of purchases.
Speaker 1 (18:09):
So that's a lot to go Well.
Some of them, you know you gotto give yourself like two years
because the three years beforethat it's like technology
evolves and that's the thing is.
Speaker 2 (18:16):
So I what I really want to do is just take the time
to weed through them and belike what's relevant, what's not
relevant?
Um, listen to a little bit ofthe videos.
We've also learned over theyears, and I do courses and
online memberships and and um,you know, evergreen products.
I set these up for people and Isay, you know, we've learned a
lot since COVID and we learnedthat it.
You know the beginning of COVID.
(18:37):
If you purchased an hour longvideo with a worksheet, fine,
you'd do it, but now give me afive minute video and an
actionable step I don't evenwatch videos.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
I will watch, I'll look at the step by step and
then or I'll watch the videolike three two x speed.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
Yeah, exactly, yes, um.
So yeah, I know, I went off ona wild no, no, it's great.
Speaker 1 (18:58):
I actually there was a.
Well, I mean, we both, we bothhave adhd, so we're like all
over the place.
No, we were talking earlier.
You were talking about sendingpeople places.
There was actually a flag.
You said something and I waslike, holy shit, this is really
good, hold on, we'll come to it.
We were talking about you.
We were talking about all right, go back to what we were
talking about before.
Yeah, okay, we were talkingabout you bring people in and
(19:20):
you'll coach them, you'll guidethem through.
Oh, so the um.
You mentioned that the businessdoesn't have to be that hard
right, Running a businessdoesn't have to be, oh yeah.
Yeah, I know.
Okay, there's two separatethings I was talking about.
First was the rut.
It doesn't have to be that hard, and when I'm at now in my I
would call it my business, butwhat it really is is my life
mission things that I do thatare work, that are just life
(19:41):
mission stuff.
Some makes me money, somedoesn't, right, but we'll call
it all my business.
I had an epiphany the other day.
After having spent a lot oftime in email, in social media
and all of these places, I hadthis moment where I was sitting
there and meditating and I waslike you know what I understand
now, how the things fit togetherand how I it doesn't.
I don't feel discomfort, Iactually just feel like, oh,
(20:05):
okay, I get it and.
But and now I feel like, oh,I'm doing my podcast and I'm
having so much fun doing mypodcast, and when the time comes
for me to write the email tothe pot to do the thing, it's
not like a giant.
Oh, yeah, yeah, right, becauseI understand now what I'm doing.
So it has actually becomeeasier.
And I wonder how much of that is.
And this goes back to whereyour gift is right, because,
like when I was all high strung.
(20:27):
It was so hard and I mean, itmakes sense because you're all
like all the time.
Right Now I feel likeeverything is just easy and I
wonder how much of what you weretalking about when you say that
you so you meet with thesepeople, you do these strategy
conversations.
I feel like I've becomebusiness marinara sauce, so now
I get it.
But when somebody is firststarting to work with you,
(20:47):
they're just, you know, onionsand tomatoes and basil and all
of that in a bowl.
I'm so hungry.
Now they want to become themarinara, right, yeah, and so I
feel like that's almost sort ofwhat you do is like you work
with people to help them getcomfortable with, like almost
like the simmering part of it,right?
Speaker 2 (21:04):
I did this somatic exercise recently with a group
of women.
I was in a coaching program andshe was getting us to come into
our core values and our missionright and we were really
meditating on that and we workedsome body work into it and so
each one of us had to do agesture with our bodies on how
(21:26):
we feel like our mission, justkind of some way to just
demonstrate our mission.
Speaker 1 (21:33):
Mine is this?
I actually have one.
Mine is this I love that.
What is that?
So this is it's super.
It's an explosion, it's likesupernova, it's like life coming
out.
Yes, is this?
I love that?
What is that?
So this is it's super.
It's an explosion, it's likesupernova, it's like life coming
out.
It's like love it's stuff iscoming out from within oh.
I love that, so here's mine,which is both gross and
titillating, depending on howyou think about it.
So mine is this how?
Speaker 2 (21:51):
interesting, and what it is is it's balloons, and all
the balloons floating are mycreative clients, cause you guys
are all creatives and I'mpulling you down to earth, and
it's not in a bad way.
It's not a bad way, but it'sbecause when you have a creative
that wants to take theircreativity and make it into a
business, this is really thefirst time that they start to
(22:15):
feel really just gross and ickyabout their creativity, because
they're seeing everybody havethese successful businesses and
they're like, well, I know, Ihave it in me, I have the
creative part, but now I got todo all this other shit and so
I'm like it's okay, I'm justgoing to pull your balloons down
and we're in it, I'm just goingto, it's going to, I'm going to
hold on to you and it's goingto be okay, we're going to
(22:36):
figure this out.
So that was my, that was mysomatic body work, but isn't
that fun.
Speaker 1 (22:41):
I love that, and here's you know what you're.
So I read this book and thisactually was a huge game changer
for me called a rocket fuel.
Have you read that?
Speaker 2 (22:49):
I've heard of this.
Well, it works perfectly withyour somatic thing, it is
perfect.
Speaker 1 (22:53):
So here's the thing about rocket fuel.
Okay, you can read an articleabout it and get what you need.
Don't read the whole book, I'mjust gonna that's how I got to
high school.
Come on cliff notes yeah, cliffnotes, so, um, okay.
So when I was in high school,we didn't have the internet, nor
did we have cliff notes, so Ihad to actually read all the
fucking books, okay.
So, um, this is a sorrow of mylife, I actually had to read
catcher in the rye, um, which Ireally hated that book, but at
(23:14):
any rate um uh.
I.
Is it one of your favorites?
No, not favorites.
So, um, uh, it's really.
It talks about the twodifferent roles that are
necessary in any business andhow, as you start to scale up,
you run into a challenge.
So it's interesting that youput that cap of 3000 where you
said, okay, at 3000, you don'tneed me, you need a strategy
(23:37):
call to figure out what are yoursteps.
And then um, and then uh, atthat point, when you scale to a
certain point, um, you need twoseparate people and you need the
integrator and you need thevisionary.
Yes, visionary is the creativeperson who is up here doing all
the woo right, and then theintegrator is the person who
(23:58):
does the tactical, step-by-stepstuff, operationalizing the
vision.
Because and he talks about itin the book you cannot move from
this to this without feeling.
We all know what it feels likeit's discomfort, it feels like
you're stuck.
It actually is not healthy,it's not good.
So you need those two people.
Speaker 2 (24:17):
And this is funny because I do use the term
integrator in my marketing.
Well, there you go.
Speaker 1 (24:21):
Yeah, check out an article about rocket fuel.
Oh, I love this, that's.
And so you are like thatnecessary step.
And so for me, I got to thepoint where I realized I wanted
to do it all on my own, like notbecause I wanted to do
everything myself, but becausethe vision that I had and the
person that I am makes it sothat I actually don't like
working with other people.
I've figured that out aboutmyself.
But that meant I could onlyscale to a certain point, or I
(24:44):
could only do something.
Like you, when you, when youmake a decision not to hire
somebody, you are deciding notto scale to a certain level.
You're just plateauing andthat's fine, if that's what you
want, that works.
But if you're trying to growand also not get somebody like
Liz, then you have two competingpriorities and you're always
going to feel attention.
You're never going to see thesuccess because those are at
(25:06):
odds with each other, inherentlyRight.
So you've got to know.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
It's funny too, because the way that I do my
business is because I'm abusiness owner at the end of the
day, and I just kind of thinkto myself, what do I need?
And then I go and I give thatto other people.
Um, and it got to the pointabout, oh God, three years ago I
was doing I had like 25 clientsand it was just me and I'm like
, oh Jesus, I'm like you're anidiot.
(25:29):
It's like the cobbler son hasno shoes.
I'm sitting here preaching topeople, delegate, delegate,
delegate, and I'm not.
I'm here working.
I, during COVID, I was working16, 18 hour days.
Um, I actually had to go outand invest in a really fancy
office chair because I be, Ihave chronic pain and my body
(25:52):
just sitting that much, oh God.
Speaker 1 (25:54):
Oh, my God.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
It was.
Thank God chiropractor was openduring COVID because it was
like, oh my God, this isliterally the worst possible
thing that I could have beendoing to my body and, um, yeah,
so you know, it's just you.
Like you said, you're going to,you're going to plateau.
If you're not, if you're, ifyou think you can do it all
yourself, I promise you that youwill quickly burn out and
(26:17):
that's where you're going tostart saying this is too hard.
And that's where you're going tostart saying I'm not cut out
for this and the shooting andthe shooting and the shooting
and the and uh.
And those are the people that Iwant to get the most, cause I'm
like guys, I am right here andit's so funny, cause I have
recurring clients.
I have clients that I'll do aproject from.
They'll go on their merry way.
(26:37):
They'll come back six monthslater.
Can we do this now?
Yes, we will.
Three years later I'll havepeople call me and they'll be
like hey.
So remember that thing you saidnot to do.
I did it.
I did that thing.
I said I'll do it myself.
And now I'm cranky and I'm abitch on wheels and I hate
everything.
And I just woke up this morningand I said why didn't I just
(27:00):
call Liz?
Why didn't I just call Liz?
And, and that's what ends uphappening is because you know,
we all entrepreneurs,solopreneur, we we get this idea
in our head that like it's allme and I'm going to make this
work, and it's like you don'tactually have to do that.
Speaker 1 (27:15):
And that's the thing right you have.
You don't have to do it allyourself, like and I think
that's really important, right?
Cause I earlier said that, yeah, I kind of do this stuff, but
this is what I did for a livingfor like 10, 15 years.
I really enjoyed it, and Ifound that I was irritated by
handing things off to otherpeople because nobody was doing
the things like.
I had a vision, right, and Irealized that what I was trying
to do was build a business, whenwhat I was actually trying to
(27:38):
do, like what I wanted to do inmy soul, was be creative and
just share that with the world,right, and so I realized I had
there's this idea.
I'm curious to know what youthink about this.
I got caught up in this, thisidea that you need to monetize
everything that you're good at.
Speaker 2 (27:52):
This is my toxic trait.
Speaker 1 (27:54):
This is my toxic trait.
Oh, you try to monetizeeverything that you're yeah,
well, because I surround myselfwith creatives.
Speaker 2 (27:59):
Yeah, so, for example , my husband uh went viral on
tiktok nice.
He has a following of like 89000 people.
It's a real number and, um, I'mlike babe, people want to hear
what you have to say.
Do you know how?
Many people oh no, I know whereyou did.
Speaker 1 (28:16):
I know what you did, and so I was like we must
monetize.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
I've done this and this is my superpower and I'm
like we will monetize this.
And so I built him a websiteand I set him all up with email
marketing.
Did he want to monetize?
No, absolutely not.
Did that matter?
Come on?
No, absolutely not.
This is me.
And also like when, in our 20s,before I even became an
(28:42):
entrepreneur, I was a teacher um, in our 20s, I just recognized
what an amazing guitarist andsinger and songwriter he was.
And then my best friend movedin with us and he also is an
amazing singer and guitar player, and I was was like you guys
must form a band.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
And we will get all the gigs in Boston and everyone
will love us.
And they'll be amazing, soundsfabulous.
You guys should start.
You'll get someone to sign youon.
Oh my God.
Speaker 2 (29:11):
And I wasn't even like expecting, like grandeur
Right, I wasn't like you're notthe next Rolling Stones, but
like I was, like this is great,right, and so I.
So I'm just like I'm like thisis great pocket money.
Guys are gonna gig and I thinkthey did like five gigs and
they're like we're all set, andI'm like no.
So, yes, please tell me moreabout my toxic trait of
monetizing.
Let me tell you more about I'mDr Connickie.
Speaker 1 (29:33):
let's say hello and welcome our caller today her
toxic trait, so toxic trait Hertoxic trait.
So I but you know, but the truthis is like I think there's a
couple of things.
One is is there's a capitalistconditioning that we all have,
which I'm working on.
So this year you know we weretalking earlier about money Part
of what my mission is this yearis to so I, one of my causes
(29:54):
that I feel very like, I feelvery like I, I feel very
strongly about is loving blacksingle mothers run by toy Smith,
and so my goal is to increasehow much I send to her
organization every month by theend of the year, and the way
that I'm getting there is byreducing the other things,
because I want to be spending mymoney in alignment with my life
mission.
You're awesome, now the.
The secret, I think, is thatyou one gotta be.
(30:17):
You have to trust that you'regood at making money right.
Any person has to trust it, andI am very good at making money.
Um, you, I anticipate, are alsovery good at making money.
You just have that mind.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
That kind of just you may not be good with numbers,
but you can see.
Speaker 1 (30:29):
I can do numbers either, but I can see how the
river of commerce works and howall the things fit together.
So I'm like, oh, okay, that'swhat we should do, right, and
not everything's going to work,but some of the things that work
make me millions of dollars andsome of the things don't.
It just right.
But if I don't believe that Ican make money doing anything,
that I'm not going to feel freeto say no to any idea, because
(30:51):
every idea that pops up is goingto be the last right.
So the first thing was that soI had it took me about a year,
lots of coaching to actually beable to say I'm really good at
making money without feelingdiscomfort Like I just like,
yeah, that makes that makes mewant to cry a little.
Speaker 2 (31:04):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (31:10):
Yeah, but it's a lot of work, so much work.
I saw so many coaches,therapists, you you name it to
like work through that shit,right, but then'm not on this
planet to be successful.
I'm on this planet to live asatisfied and fulfilled life and
help other people to do that.
Amen For me.
I realized that trying tomonetize my creativity was
draining all the joy out of it,and so I was like and I really
wanted to do the strategy workfor free.
(31:31):
So I was like, okay, becausethe people who need my strategy
work are the people whotypically don't have the funds
to be able to invest in mystrategy work.
So I'm like I need to rethinkall of this.
So I actually shut everythingdown and really thought to
myself what do I actually wantto do to make money?
And I actually realized it hadnothing to do with my creativity
.
It was something that I hadactually done years ago.
(31:52):
That I'm very good at isresearch administration.
So I went back into researchadministration as a consultant,
ramped that up, making about 400grand a year life's good.
And then I was like all right,now I'm just going to take the
time that.
I actually ended up realizingafter that that I wanted to
learn.
I wanted I went back tocorporate because I wanted to
(32:12):
implement a training systemwithin corporate America while
also compete come dealing withall of the pressures that people
deal with at in corporate Cause.
Like it's really easy for me tosay, do this, do this, do this,
but like there are a lot ofpressures happening in corporate
America that prevent peoplefrom taking that action, yep, so
I do.
(32:32):
So I went back to that.
So I'm doing that right now foranother, maybe like six, eight
months or something That'll dosomething else.
That.
So I'm doing that right now foranother, maybe like six, eight
months or so, and then I'll dosomething else.
But, um, the because I cancause, when you realize you can
make money doing anything, itdoesn't matter, you're just like
I'll do this and I'll do thisand I'll do this.
Speaker 2 (32:46):
It's almost a sickness, it's an addiction.
True, true yeah.
Speaker 1 (32:48):
It's right.
And that is the sick.
That was my sickness.
My toxic trait was I can make.
I felt compelled.
I had to make money doing so.
Form a band oh my God, I'm anartist.
Let's sell my artwork.
Oh my God, you know what?
I'm a coach?
Okay, we'll do that.
I'm going to sell thesetemplates, and this is.
I burned myself out just doingthat.
So I got really clear on what Ireally wanted to do, and now I
(33:11):
say no to anything that isoutside of like my scope.
Speaker 2 (33:18):
Love of like my scope .
I love that and like I have avery rigid scope for myself.
Oh God, there's so much I wantto say so, like, so.
First you touched on like moneymindset and almost a scarcity
mindset.
One of my dearest clients inthe world is Lynn Twist from the
Soul of Money.
I don't know if you've everheard of that book.
Speaker 1 (33:34):
Oh my God, oh my God, she's a also.
The name is amazing.
Speaker 2 (33:37):
She's just oh, oh, she's just amazing.
So she talks about moneymindset and scarcity a lot and,
um, it's funny, I'm a very, uh,practical, very logistical, very
down to earth person.
I would not call myself acreative.
And then my creative clientsimmediately are like you're a
liar, you're so creative.
Look at what you do.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
And I'm like I was going to say, I was like I'm
going to let you go with that.
I don't get to tell you whatyou are.
Speaker 2 (34:00):
But okay, right, so again, but it's a lot of
coaching right To kind of stop,um, making that my narrative and
to just finally admit, likeyou're a goddamn creative and
like, just deal with it.
Um, and so it's so.
(34:20):
All of my creative clients, I'mjust like, oh my God, I
surround myself with coaches, soat some points I can get a
little coached out and I'm justlike, yeah, money, I'm so done
working on my character.
I'm over it.
I'm like you know, you just getto a point.
It's like sometimes when I wasdoing I'm not doing therapy
currently, but when I did dotherapy, I was like God if.
I talk about my childhoodtraumas one more time I'm going
to scream.
(34:41):
It's like you get to a pointwhere you're like I just cannot
keep working on the same thing.
And sometimes I get like thatwith my coach clients.
I love them, but it's like Ijust I need to take a step back
for me, that money mindset andscarcity thing.
And I think actually that youpointed out my next step in this
work, which is like stopmonetizing everything.
(35:02):
People are not piggy banks,they're just.
They're just creative people.
Speaker 1 (35:07):
That's the truth, right?
People aren't piggy banks,right?
That's one thing, right, andthe other thing is is actually
it's?
It is an addiction, right?
Because if you are good atmaking money, money gives you
dopamine hits.
Yes, neurodivergent, you'rechasing dopamine?
Speaker 2 (35:20):
Hey, it's up for this and I just like I applaud my
husband because he was just likebabe, that's not me If I did
coach people, I don't want totake money for it and I'm like
you.
But yeah, no, I get that and Ilove you for it.
So, yeah, it's hard, it's ahard thing to break, but I will
(35:42):
say I've created the perfectbusiness because anybody who
does want to make money, theycome to me and I'm like yes,
feed the addiction.
That's the thing.
Speaker 1 (35:48):
Right, that's the key .
This is my loophole.
Well, that's the key, right.
Get excited by other people'smoney.
You said something shit.
You were talking about um,everything I forgot.
Speaker 2 (36:02):
I forgot you said something I was like oh, I've
got a great response, but then Itotally lost it.
That would be the name of myautobiography is.
Speaker 1 (36:08):
You said something and I don't and then I forgot
yeah, me too.
It's like, um, we're talkingabout dopamine hits, chasing
after making money, and it wasbefore that.
Uh, husband, money mindset, ohoh, you were saying how you were
not a creative.
I want to actually share someof you.
So I, up until about two yearsago maybe yeah, about two years
(36:28):
ago I used to say I have thesoul of an artist but none of
the talent, and I said that mywhole life.
I I used to paint until I wasabout 16 or 17, and then after
that I stopped and I just I'vedone, I've dabbled in things,
but I have never felt like theworld got you right.
Speaker 2 (36:47):
The world, the world got me.
Speaker 1 (36:48):
That's exactly what happened.
Like I remember when the worldgot me, it got me in Nepal.
That was the end, um, and sowhen the world got me in Nepal,
uh, I just I started saying Ihave the soul of an artist, but
I'm not.
But no talent.
When I see what I make now, Iknow I have talent.
Like I'm like holy shit, I havea lot of fucking talent.
Like I'm very, very talented, Ihave a vision, but I had to
(37:09):
change the story right, and soone of the things that my wife
and I and I'm not, I realize I'mlike, oh my God, this is like
you're all coached out.
You're like shut the fuck up,vanessa.
But seriously, my wife and mysister and I have been talking a
lot about the story lately islike anytime something happens,
we immediately myself too wejust default to this other story
.
It's the bad story, whateverthe narrative is.
And one of the things that wekeep we've all been saying to
(37:32):
each other to an annoying levelat this stage is change the
story right.
Yes, and it's great when you'rethe one on this end saying hey,
listen, change the story,you're a creative.
When you're the one on theother end hearing change the
story.
You're like fuck off.
Yeah, you can change yourgoddamn story 100%.
Speaker 2 (37:45):
Yeah, don't tell me what to do, and I'm a natural
rebel, so I'm like fuck that.
Speaker 1 (37:50):
I know me too so it's like I'm just like well, okay,
you want me to do the oppositeof what you said?
Speaker 2 (37:55):
I'll do the opposite of what you said.
I don't care if it destroys mylife this is why I laughed when
you said the catcher in the ryeand I was like, oh, was it
required reading in high school?
Speaker 1 (38:03):
I didn't read it yeah , no, it was required, and so
what's funny?
Actually, I failed almosteverything in high school.
I did really badly in highschool, and I think that
actually that is the challengethat a lot of um, the a lot of
our clientele really run into isthat these are typically
creative people who were made tofeel stupid in school, right,
and so you're.
(38:24):
You're overcoming that side ofit as well.
Speaker 2 (38:26):
I have oh, I have just such a soapbox on higher
education in the United Statesand how we push children,
because a lot I mean like, ifyou think about, like I think
about my daughter.
My daughter is born inSeptember and so when she goes
to college she'll be going at 17.
And she'll turn 18 very, veryfreshly in college.
(38:49):
She'll be in there for a monthand then she'll turn 18.
Fine, but I'm like God, a 17year old doesn't have an 18 year
old 22 year old, doesn't have afreaking clue.
Okay, and so we put so muchpressure on these children,
cause I mean, like, legally,physically, are they children?
Speaker 1 (39:07):
No, but they're still children.
Speaker 2 (39:09):
They're still children.
Speaker 1 (39:12):
Dude, did you know that if you're neurodivergent,
your brain doesn't start fullyforming until you're like 34?
Correct?
So I always said I don't thinkI finished adolescence until I
was in my thirties.
Speaker 2 (39:20):
And then there's the male female thing, and I think,
like a male brain doesn't stopmaturing until, like,
significantly later than afemale anyway.
And yes to all of this, um, andso I have this giant soapbox
that I love to climb on it andprobably about like every other
month or so, and it's a goodsoapbox it is.
And I just I get really upsetbecause I know there's somebody
(39:41):
in my life who sheds all overhimself, shits all over himself
constantly, because he couldn'tcrack it in college.
I just couldn't do it.
He's tried multiple times, hejust kept flunking out and I
just I want to hug him andsqueeze him and be like babe,
it's fine, like just stop it,because we're not all cut out
for college and also we're notall cut out for trade school,
(40:04):
cause that used to be the thingright Like, go to trade school.
And these are your choices.
Speaker 1 (40:08):
Choices, I don't actually think you need to do
any of those things like now,that's the story.
Like that's the story again,right, capital.
So my big thing, my, my hearton right now, is for the fact
that I feel like we've all beenconditioned by the four hundred
percent of our, which iscapitalism and consumerism,
colonialism, racism, uh shit, Ihave like there's something in
the patriarchy are you writing abook you?
(40:29):
really you really should.
I am, I'm writing a book, I'mwriting right now and with those
things come together and wewrite the story from that
framework, right.
And so the story that we've allbeen told is go to college, do
the trade school.
If you don't do that, you'restupid, you're done.
Your life is over.
There is something wrong withyou.
Speaker 2 (40:46):
Right, like I'm making a judgment on you as a
person and it hurts me so muchbecause there is and I was
raised in that mentality my mom,her entire career was in a
college, she was a vicepresident, and I get it and,
like education is important, I'mnot shitting on education.
I'm shitting on this push, this, this belief that that you, you
(41:09):
have to do that because it iswhat society says you have to do
.
We have a family friend.
She has been a waitress herentire life, her entire life
from teenage to she is in herlate 60s and she has figured out
.
I don't want to do anything else.
(41:29):
I have no desire.
I like knowing that I clock infor my shift and I clock out of
my shift and it's no brain poweris extended outside of this
shift.
It is rote memory.
I pour the drinks, I serve thedrinks, I pick up the food, I
give the food and I make moneydoing it and I am fine.
My family is fine.
I have other things outside ofwaitressing that complete me as
(41:53):
a human being and I'm just likefuck, yes, yeah.
Speaker 1 (41:56):
More of that, that is more of the message.
Speaker 2 (42:00):
And I just, I just feel terrible, for I mean, like
I also shed all over myselfbecause I'm like you, idiot.
You worked your entire life,since fourth grade, to be a
Spanish teacher.
That was your path and you didit.
You got a master's in Spanisheducation and you taught for 10
(42:24):
years.
You had a decade as a teacher,a profession, a career.
People martyred me, murderizedme Like I'd be like on a
vacation.
Oh, what do you do for a living?
Oh, I'm a Spanish teacher.
Oh my God, always.
Oh my God, you're a teacher.
Bless you.
You're amazing.
Bless me.
(42:46):
Now I have a really good livingthat I'm making over here.
Bless me now as a business andtech strategist and the owner of
my own company.
Bless me now.
I have a really good livingthat I'm making over here.
Bless me now as a business andtech strategist and the owner of
my own company.
Bless me now and it's oh so.
I want to write a book one dayon the martyrdom of teachers
because it and so like to thisday.
Sometimes I wake up and I'mlike dipshit, like you don't
(43:07):
know where your next money iscoming from.
If you lose all your clients,where's your money?
Whereas with teaching you were,you were in you like you had a
whole union behind you.
Speaker 1 (43:18):
That's an illusion.
You aren't in like that's justthe story we tell ourselves
right, like you really are notever secure.
We just say that we are, and itmade me miserable.
Speaker 2 (43:28):
I loved my kids.
Speaker 1 (43:29):
I loved my students.
Speaker 2 (43:30):
Um, I still like they're 26 now and they're on
Facebook.
I love you too, babe.
What's up journalists?
But like it made me miserable.
It made me miserable Causethere's just so many things in
it, which is an entirelydifferent podcast.
But leaving teaching was thehardest thing I've ever done
(43:52):
because there were so manystories coming at me Like you've
thrown away your entire career.
You've thrown away youreducation.
Speaker 1 (44:01):
What are you going to do with this master's that you
spent all this money?
Speaker 2 (44:04):
on yeah, um, you're never going to amount to
anything because you're notusing that master's and you're
not using that undergrad.
You're not using your 10 yearsof experience.
You think you're going to makesome money?
Speaker 1 (44:15):
What are you going to do when the next client doesn't
come around Running?
Speaker 2 (44:17):
your cute little business.
That's adorable.
You drained your retirementaccount so that you could live
while you're figuring this shitout Way to go.
Now you don't have anyretirement, liz, nice job, but
this is the money mindset that Ihad to grow out of my next
dollar.
Speaker 1 (44:30):
Everything you're talking about.
I had to grow out of it.
My next dollar is where I wantmy next dollar to be.
Speaker 2 (44:35):
I'll go call up an old client and be like hey, how
about that website?
Do you need another strategy?
Call my next dollar is just anemail away and it's not
guaranteed.
And the key, though, is rightnow.
Speaker 1 (44:44):
if you look at your money, you have clients right
now, so your next dollar rightnow is probably going into like
six months.
So when you talk about yournext, dollar.
Speaker 2 (44:50):
What are you really talking?
Speaker 1 (44:51):
about yeah, yeah.
So, that's the story, right?
You're telling the story as ifyou have no money today.
Speaker 2 (44:57):
Yeah, and that because that's what we do to
ourselves.
Meanwhile, I have clients onlike year long contracts.
Are you kidding me?
I've got money.
What are you?
Speaker 1 (45:10):
talking about that's, but that's why I was so
important, because we weimmediately jumped to that story
and we accept that story.
Is true, yeah, and unlessyou're having a conversation
with someone who's gonna callyou out on it, you're, you're
just gonna go on that narrative.
Um, okay, hold on.
We are now at 12 50 and I wasso earlier on I said all right
so five episodes.
Speaker 2 (45:31):
We're going for five episodes here.
Speaker 1 (45:33):
Five.
Well, we need a second podcastnow.
So the second podcast that weneed is actually it's going to
be born from this one, which isgoing to be about Liz.
I'm telling you this now isgoing to be about when you
decide to leave right, because Ithink this is a really powerful
conversation, like when you aremaking that decision, because
I've made that decision to leave, go back, leave, go back, right
, whatever.
I'd love to be able to talkabout that a little more,
(45:54):
because there's people I knowwho want to jump ship and start
their own consulting business.
Oh, my God, do it.
Oh, just do it guys, just the.
My answer is just do it, do not.
Even the answer is yes, do it,but if you want to hear more
about it, listen, I'll doanother podcast.
Absolutely the answer is stillyes.
Speaker 2 (46:10):
Do you know?
I get on Zoom calls.
I get on Zoom calls withteachers just to convince them
to leave teaching.
Speaker 1 (46:16):
It's so fun, that's well ultimately there's a lot of
industries people need to justleave.
And the reason why they need toleave is they've been doing it
for so long that they are beingmistreated so badly.
They cannot see how theydeserve more and that, but, like
a lot of times, they won'tleave because they feel like
people are reliant on them andit's like no, you're showing
them the strength.
(46:36):
Oh my God, I'm so excited.
We can't talk about that, okay.
So, guys, liz is going to comeback, yes, but in the moon time,
liz, everybody hearing you isgoing to be like, oh my God,
you're going to help me savetime, save money.
Speaker 2 (46:45):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (46:47):
How do they find you, Because I don't want to just
send them off to the ether.
Where do they find you?
Speaker 2 (46:50):
I love it Simplify simplifyme and because I care
about the customer journey.
Every single button is going topoint you to where I want you,
so just click a button.
Speaker 1 (46:59):
It's a really good user journey.
In fact.
When I went to her website, Isaid when we met, one of the
things I said was your userjourney.
I'm just going to say this.
She said you know, I wasactually thinking about updating
my website and changingeverything around because I
think it's terrible and I'm likedon't do it, do not do this.
You are falling into the trapthat your clients fall into.
(47:19):
I'm glad to see that you keptthe website the same, because
it's very good and your userjourney is spot on.
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (47:25):
But yeah, click a button and you'll talk to me.
Speaker 1 (47:27):
Fabulous no-transcript.
everybody, hi, welcome.
This is Liz August, thegreatest and uh, who won the.
By the way, I just can't getover the Bob award.
Look behind her head.
She's got the Bob award there,which I just like.
I see it on her website and I'mjust like I.
I just want to keep talkingabout the Bob award, um, which
is best of business, by the way,but we're calling it Bob Liz,
welcome.
(00:30):
I'm so excited we finally didthe thing, finally did the thing
.
So okay.
So here's why I was.
I met Liz through our friend,judy Harrington If you listen,
she's been on a couple of thepodcasts already and she said
well, you've got to meet Liz.
She's amazing, she's a greatvirtual assistant, she's
fabulous.
I'm like great.
You know, I like meeting newpeople, like building networks.
So I met Liz and here is themoment I said I wish I'd
(00:52):
recorded this.
We could go back to Sepia toneand be like and what happened
was is we were talking about howyou help people and you brought
up the user journey and how,like every person who comes to
you, or a large number, hasthey're going to do.
They want to update theirwebsite and they want to update
their social media and they wantto update all this and, by and
large, their problems are noneof those things.
(01:13):
Their problems are their userjourney.
And I so rarely, rarely hearpeople say things like that,
where it's like, dude, you don'tneed to do any of this nonsense
, like, forget about any of thisshit.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
You really this is what you need to do.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
So I would love to like sort of just hear from you
and your thoughts, like whensomebody comes to you and tells
you hey, I, my business and, bythe way, guys, we're going to
talk about this more than in thecontext of business is hey, I,
my business sucks, nobody'sbuying from me.
I'm going to spend money on amarketer and my website and
redoing, like what is the stuffthat goes through your mind,
(01:45):
what are the things that youwish you could be like tell them
, but you typically say very,very nicely, or don't tell them,
or tell them in like thesweetest way to not hurt their
feelings, what's like the whatdo you really want to be saying?
Speaker 2 (02:03):
here.
What do I really want to say?
So you up and they'll be likeoh, I need a virtual assistant.
I'm so stressed out, blah, blah, blah, and they come and
they're like I need a newwebsite, I need social media, I
need email marketing, I need aCRM, I you know whatever, and
I'm like actually no you need auser journey, and that's why, if
I could like shake somebodyright who came to me and they're
(02:25):
like well, I just need you todo this one thing, it's like no,
you don't.
And so I have to use terms likevirtual assistant or online
business manager, just so peoplewill understand what the hell
it is that I do.
Yeah, but virtual assistantsare such a dime a dozen.
You like throw a stick, you'llfind one.
It's fine, we're all amazing,but my biggest thing is that I
(02:47):
attack any task with strategyfirst, and so when people have a
strategy session with me,they're going to uncover so much
in their business that theoriginal thing that they came to
, let's say, it's a website.
They're going to be like ohyeah, I'm not, I'm not ready for
that yet.
I need to do these 20 otherthings that you just mentioned,
and it all centers around theuser journey.
(03:08):
I call it the customer journey.
Same thing, Um, but you know itall ties in.
Like if you are not thinkingabout your first touch point
with somebody and how that leadsto the next touch point and how
that leads to them becoming aclient and then that leads to
onboarding them, and then thatlead, like, if you're not
thinking about that, then thatfirst step your website or your
(03:30):
social media or however theyfound you, it's irrelevant.
Like you can't build a websiteunless you know your client
journey, because you need toknow the first step and you
can't be posting with any sortof content strategy unless you
know the first touch point withyou and that's the first step in
the client journey.
So it really like I think whenpeople start businesses, they're
(03:53):
excited.
I work with mostly creativesand they're very excited just to
serve people that they want toserve and the ways that they
want to serve them.
But there's so much to it tomake sure that you have a
successful business and itreally does stop from that, from
that experience, the journey.
I know, I know it's so much.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
you know you said no, there's something that you said
there that, like I think.
So you talk about the touchpoint.
So, like you have people, youknow that a lot of times people
will come and they'll say I needto update my website.
You want the website to bebeautiful and they'll say I need
to update my website.
You want the website to bebeautiful and you talk about how
you need to be able to knowwhat, the where are you taking
them once they come to yourwebsite?
What do they see when theyscroll down once?
If they've decided to buy now,what do they do?
(04:33):
Like, you really need to bethinking about those things
right, so that you know, whenyou send someone to Vanessacom
or simplify, simplify, mecom orwhatever you're sending people
to, you already know that theinfrastructure you've put in
place will guide them where theyneed to go.
You don't need to be involvedin like one of the things that I
think that the earliest, mostembarrassing lesson I ever had
(04:56):
was with my wife when I made myfirst or second website.
So like back in the day in 1995, so you mentioned earlier that
you were, uh, 37 and I'm 47.
So I was here way in the day in1995, so you mentioned earlier
that you were uh 37.
I'm 47, so I was here way inthe early days of the internet.
Right, we're just having aninternet website was enough,
right, you have the websiteright, so you're great you
decide, that's all you reallyneed.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
I have 10 000 visitors today click, oh look,
10 000 and you've got like therotating.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
Remember the taps, they're rotating oh my god, I
loved it.
I was so I remember when Istarted learning how to do that
and, like you, go to my websites, and I mean they were
assaulting your brain like itwas so much we all like and I
was like 10 and 96 and my dadgot me a computer and I'm like
coding and all that yeah, howfun that would have been around
the time then.
(05:41):
So you're also making theflashes.
Speaker 2 (05:43):
Oh yeah, I mean, if you don't have 25 moving objects
on your thing.
In 96 were you really doing?
You didn't really have awebsite.
Speaker 1 (05:50):
Yeah like, are you even relevant in this world?
Come on but you know, now we'reusers, are more sophisticated
and like they want to be, theyneed to, and they're very quick
to judge.
So and they don't.
I don't mean judge like yousuck, but you know, if I don
know where to go next, I'm goingto be quick to bounce off
because I don't.
Our attention spans have shrunk.
Our tolerance for discomforthas shrunk, right.
(06:11):
There was a time where I'd belike, oh, I don't know where to
go.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
Right, let me figure this out.
I'll figure it out.
Screw this, I'm done.
Peace, yeah, thing that I want.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
Um, and I, this doesn't.
This applies more in just yourwebsite.
So I'm actually so I'm going totell you and this is, how
important the user journey is,uh, and you said so much stuff
that, like I'm actually sad thatI have a one o'clock because
I'm like damn, we're going tohave a second.
Okay.
So here's, our episode, I knowfour hours later.
So, I was talking to someone theother day Cause, like you said,
the strategy is the key, and Ino longer do any coaching or
(06:43):
anything like that.
I just meet with people forstrategy sessions and then I say
you need, liz, you needso-and-so Exactly.
So there's one person that Italked to who, by the way, I
directed to you but, um, she'slocal and uh, there was this day
.
My wife and I wanted to go toher shop and her shop is inside
a smaller studio, yep.
(07:05):
And we went and we parkedacross the street from where her
shop is and my wife says Idon't think she's here.
And I was like no, she's here.
And my wife's like no, I don'tthink she's here.
And I was like no, no, she'shere.
And so we walk across thestreet.
We're literally like on thesame side of the block now as
her thing.
There's a little sandwich boardoutside but it says happy
holidays, and I'm, and I'mwalking up the stairs and it's
raining and it's cold, and mywife's like she's not here.
I'm like, oh my God, she's here.
So she says the store is open,everything is closed.
(07:27):
And I'm like I go in and I openthe door and I said, look, the
door is open.
And she's like, yeah, but it'sprobably for the other shop.
Like I don't see anything inhere that would indicate that
she's here.
All of the things are here.
And so this person and I endedup having a conversation a week
(07:47):
or so later, cause she washaving trouble finding clients.
You know now that the touristseason is over and I said to her
I told her this story and Isaid you were open.
But every step of the way I hadto drag my wife there.
And the only reason that Idragged her in there was because
I do this for a living.
So I know what I'm looking for.
But your average user is notgoing to do as much work as I
(08:08):
did.
Your average user is going tobe like my wife and say, oh, I
don't think she's here, I'mgoing to go have a drink at
honey baby Right.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
And this and this.
This hurts me.
It hurts me because there areso many incredible businesses
out there and they're notgetting the attention or the
clients that they deserve to get, and I recently discovered that
my entire mission, not just inbusiness but in life, is just to
(08:34):
make people's atmospheres andsurroundings and experiences
more comfortable, and I justwish that people didn't think it
was so hard to own a business.
It is.
I'm not saying it's not, butit's not as hard as it seems
when you get the, the help, that, the support that's out there
(08:57):
and there's ways.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
You know, I think part of the problem is, I think
it's been overcomplicated overthe years.
So like, if I think now youknow, to say three years ago,
when I was running my coachingbusiness, like the general
philosophy was you, you know,you had you have your mailing
list, there were all thesethings that you needed to do,
and then a lot of the coachesthat did trainings there's
always something else that theyare that you're paying them for,
right, and so it's always, andso I can see.
(09:20):
So for me, when I was firststarting out, and then, of
course, you know, I sort ofstarted to just like you start
to figure it out and you realize, oh, it's not that hard.
I feel like the mess that we'veadded so much junk on top of
things like, remember, you hadClubhouse and you had chatbots
and you had emails, and you havethis, and like in the end, all
(09:41):
of those things sound verycomplicated.
But the actual thing that we'redoing here is hey, liz, I met
you, let's talk, Right.
Oh, oh, you help with this.
Right, I have this problem.
This is so cool, let's.
And then you're walking me downthe garden path to say, oh,
strategy session.
Yeah, oh, let's book somethingbecause you can help me with
(10:02):
this, and but it's all aboutjust like a normal human, like
we've been having theserelationships since we were
children and, correct, I'mautistic, so I have trouble with
relationships.
But once you figure out thecadence, they're like oh, this
is how it, how relationshipshappen.
You can do the steps.
So how do you feel, like thatplays in when people come to you
and they're like okay, well, dothey ever say like that seems
so simple, like I feel like Ishould be doing that?
Speaker 2 (10:23):
Yeah, Tell me more about that.
I, so my strategy sessions are60 minutes long and I mean I
always freak out because I'mlike crap, I just unloaded so
much stuff and I feel so badCause I'm like I used to be a
teacher.
I taught a sixth, seventh andeighth grade Spanish and so I
know about different learningstyles and neurodivergency and I
(10:46):
know like not everybody learnsthe same way.
So when you word vomit all oversomebody like calm the hell
down, because these poor peoplelike they're trying to keep up
with you.
And I'm like but somebody toldme actually today one of my
clients and friends on WhatsApp.
She was like you're just thegoddess of making people feel
safe with tech stuff.
And I'm like, oh, that's sosweet, it was so sweet and it's
(11:07):
just, that's my goal is.
I just want you to make.
I want to make you feel safelike you.
And I say you, but like most ofmy clients are creatives that
have businesses and if they hadit their way, they wouldn't even
charge.
They just love helping people.
Oh, my God, absolutely.
And I'm like, god, you justhave so much just wonderful
(11:30):
stuff to bring to the world.
Like I don't want this to hurtyou.
I want you to feel safe and Iwant you to like, I want you to
get money so that you realizelike this is a cool thing to do,
is to own your own business.
Yeah, and so I just, you know,about 10 minutes into every call
, someone's like oh my God, Ijust feel so much better and I'm
like yeah, I feel like you andI have very similar calls.
Speaker 1 (11:51):
I do record that, because I actually tend to
record them and send them therecording Cause there's no way
they're able to take enoughnotes.
I actually typically would belike don't even bother taking
notes.
I'm like just, it's okay,You're going to be fine, Just
listen, just listen.
Well, and so you know and Ithink that that's really the key
, right Is that one is it's notas complicated as we think it is
.
It's been made to beovercomplicated, and I think
(12:11):
that that's what.
That's why I found what you doso alluring, in that it's not
just about like you're not.
It's not about oh, I have allthese services that I'm offering
you.
It's more about okay, this isyour business and this is what
you actually need to be doing,so, okay.
So I'm going to pull back alittle bit, because I had a
client once, and who, when I didthese, and I'm going to ask the
(12:35):
question differently.
I'm going to tell you whathappened with my client, then
I'm going to ask you a different, slightly different question.
So, the client I had.
I basically went with her andthe goal was to help her get
more time in her day, not somuch to make more money or that
kind of thing.
Right, She'd already figuredout how to make money.
She knew all of her shit, Heruser journeys were great.
Her issue was really just doingtoo many things.
So we sat, we met and I endedup.
(12:55):
She ended up going down to likefive hours a week from like 45
or something Like it was insane.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
It was fabulous Right .
Speaker 1 (13:02):
And she gets, gets you know, comes and talks to me
and says, oh, you know, I said,how are you doing?
And she's like well, I feellike I'm doing something wrong
and I'm like, oh my god, what'swrong are you?
You know?
She's like, well, I'm notworking that much anymore and
I'm like, oh god.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
I was like shit.
Speaker 1 (13:16):
You know, you always assume you fucked up somehow.
What did I do?
And then she says I said well,okay, well, hold on.
I was like how much are youmaking what you want?
She's like, actually I'm makingtwice what I was making before.
I just feel like I should beworking more.
No, and I was like no.
I was like that's conditioning,that's programming, that's the
feeling like you should be doingsomething more.
(13:39):
And so when I think about whatyou offer, people'm saying I
need to spend $10,000 on awebsite.
I'm going to spend, you know,$2,500 a month on a marketing
person like those, or Facebookads.
Everybody wants the Facebookads.
I don't know.
Please don't spend any money onFacebook ads if your user
journey unless you're just goingto spend money to send people
and push them off a cliff Right,what have you found in these
conversations in terms of thefinancial Cause, like if you're
(14:02):
telling me I don't need to dothese five or six things, what
I'm hearing is that wait aminute, I thought I was going to
have to spend $25,000 over thenext year, but I only need to
spend whatever it is, dependingon you know what service they
end up going with you or nothingbecause they decide, oh, I
don't need to do anything.
What do you typically find isthe results that you get on that
kind of where people have thething, oh, I don't need to spend
, what do they realize?
(14:22):
How much money do they realizethey don't need to actually be
spending?
Speaker 2 (14:25):
Well, it's funny At my core, I'm so frugal.
I was raised by financialparents, which is hilarious
because I don't math.
It's safer for people if I justdon't math.
And I was raised by two peoplein finance and it's just like
the most, the biggest, mostironic story of my life, um.
And then my mother gotremarried to a guy in finance
(14:46):
and I'm like God, just like,what is it with your number of
loving people?
Um?
But you know, at my core, Ihave to save a buck and I like
sometimes to my detriment, right, um?
And?
But it's also a great thing formy clients, because I don't
want them overspending, um.
It doesn't mean I don't chargemy worth.
I know my worth, um.
(15:06):
But I actually ask them in thefirst step to working with me is
filling out an application, andone of my questions is like
give me a range, what are youmaking every month?
And if it's less than $3,000,I'll have a strategy session
with you.
But you probably do not need myservices yet.
You just need my consulting.
Yeah, because I I refuse forsomebody to be making less than
(15:33):
$3,000 a month.
I refuse to give you my toppremium website because you're
not there yet.
You're just, you're not thereyet and and you're going to get
there, but a top notch websiteis not the thing that we're
going to focus on first for you.
Um, so that's my first thing,and then the other thing is like
, when you're ready and it'stime to invest, I'm going to
(15:53):
guide you to the best next step.
If it's a website, then yes,I'm going to give you a kick ass
website.
If it's, you know, working onyour services and figuring out
what those are.
First, I'm not a coach.
My thing is tech.
I work strategy in there.
I'm going to refer you out tothe many business coaches that I
(16:14):
know that are going to get youthere.
Yeah, so, yeah, so I don't knowif that answered the question
entirely but the financialaspect is so hard because we, we
really, I mean I told, mybookkeeper.
I love her.
I told my bookkeeper.
I said Bridget, listen, my goalnot resolution.
I won't do a resolution, but mygoal for 2024 is that I am not
(16:36):
going to get my debit card outand buy another online course.
Yes, $7, $17, $37.
That's the sevens they're likehey all the sevens that Amy
Porterfield talking about herdad sevens, damn it, amy
Porterfield, and your frickingsevens Cause that gets me, and
so I will.
You know, targeted ads, they'llget me.
(16:58):
And they'll be like if you buythis Trello board template, your
whole life will change.
And so I'm like, yes, boardtemplate, your whole life will
change.
And so I'm like, yes, take my17 and I buy so many of those.
And I immediately forward thereceipt over to my bookkeeper.
And so this poor woman, bridget, I love you so much, honey,
she'll, she'll just add it, andadd it, and add it to quickbooks
, and at the end of the year I'mlike, god, I forgot, I even
(17:20):
bought this thing I never usedit.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
where's my question?
Did you even look at it?
You bought it, you got yourdopamine hit and then you're
like oh, I forgot.
Speaker 2 (17:29):
I am ashamed to say so.
I file it neatly and it's got alittle.
It's got a tag for is it socialmedia or is it a Trello board,
and then it I would say like sixout of 10,.
I actually got my money's worthbecause I used it.
I'm not saying it's not worththe money.
I'm saying I didn't freakinguse it.
(17:52):
So I told Bridget I was like Irefuse to buy another one of
these things, like I call it.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
Professional development.
It's like yeah, no, no, I havea long professional development
list.
Speaker 2 (17:59):
But I told her I refuse to buy more until I've
used actually used all of theones that I've already purchased
, and we're talking like fiveyears of purchases.
Speaker 1 (18:09):
So that's a lot to go Well.
Some of them, you know you gotto give yourself like two years
because the three years beforethat it's like technology
evolves and that's the thing is.
Speaker 2 (18:16):
So I what I really want to do is just take the time
to weed through them and belike what's relevant, what's not
relevant?
Um, listen to a little bit ofthe videos.
We've also learned over theyears, and I do courses and
online memberships and and um,you know, evergreen products.
I set these up for people and Isay, you know, we've learned a
lot since COVID and we learnedthat it.
You know the beginning of COVID.
(18:37):
If you purchased an hour longvideo with a worksheet, fine,
you'd do it, but now give me afive minute video and an
actionable step I don't evenwatch videos.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
I will watch, I'll look at the step by step and
then or I'll watch the videolike three two x speed.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
Yeah, exactly, yes, um.
So yeah, I know, I went off ona wild no, no, it's great.
Speaker 1 (18:58):
I actually there was a.
Well, I mean, we both, we bothhave adhd, so we're like all
over the place.
No, we were talking earlier.
You were talking about sendingpeople places.
There was actually a flag.
You said something and I waslike, holy shit, this is really
good, hold on, we'll come to it.
We were talking about you.
We were talking about all right, go back to what we were
talking about before.
Yeah, okay, we were talkingabout you bring people in and
(19:20):
you'll coach them, you'll guidethem through.
Oh, so the um.
You mentioned that the businessdoesn't have to be that hard
right, Running a businessdoesn't have to be, oh yeah.
Yeah, I know.
Okay, there's two separatethings I was talking about.
First was the rut.
It doesn't have to be that hard, and when I'm at now in my I
would call it my business, butwhat it really is is my life
mission things that I do thatare work, that are just life
(19:41):
mission stuff.
Some makes me money, somedoesn't, right, but we'll call
it all my business.
I had an epiphany the other day.
After having spent a lot oftime in email, in social media
and all of these places, I hadthis moment where I was sitting
there and meditating and I waslike you know what I understand
now, how the things fit togetherand how I it doesn't.
I don't feel discomfort, Iactually just feel like, oh,
(20:05):
okay, I get it and.
But and now I feel like, oh,I'm doing my podcast and I'm
having so much fun doing mypodcast, and when the time comes
for me to write the email tothe pot to do the thing, it's
not like a giant.
Oh, yeah, yeah, right, becauseI understand now what I'm doing.
So it has actually becomeeasier.
And I wonder how much of that is.
And this goes back to whereyour gift is right, because,
like when I was all high strung.
(20:27):
It was so hard and I mean, itmakes sense because you're all
like all the time.
Right Now I feel likeeverything is just easy and I
wonder how much of what you weretalking about when you say that
you so you meet with thesepeople, you do these strategy
conversations.
I feel like I've becomebusiness marinara sauce, so now
I get it.
But when somebody is firststarting to work with you,
(20:47):
they're just, you know, onionsand tomatoes and basil and all
of that in a bowl.
I'm so hungry.
Now they want to become themarinara, right, yeah, and so I
feel like that's almost sort ofwhat you do is like you work
with people to help them getcomfortable with, like almost
like the simmering part of it,right?
Speaker 2 (21:04):
I did this somatic exercise recently with a group
of women.
I was in a coaching program andshe was getting us to come into
our core values and our missionright and we were really
meditating on that and we workedsome body work into it and so
each one of us had to do agesture with our bodies on how
(21:26):
we feel like our mission, justkind of some way to just
demonstrate our mission.
Speaker 1 (21:33):
Mine is this?
I actually have one.
Mine is this I love that.
What is that?
So this is it's super.
It's an explosion, it's likesupernova, it's like life coming
out.
Yes, is this?
I love that?
What is that?
So this is it's super.
It's an explosion, it's likesupernova, it's like life coming
out.
It's like love it's stuff iscoming out from within oh.
I love that, so here's mine,which is both gross and
titillating, depending on howyou think about it.
So mine is this how?
Speaker 2 (21:51):
interesting, and what it is is it's balloons, and all
the balloons floating are mycreative clients, cause you guys
are all creatives and I'mpulling you down to earth, and
it's not in a bad way.
It's not a bad way, but it'sbecause when you have a creative
that wants to take theircreativity and make it into a
business, this is really thefirst time that they start to
(22:15):
feel really just gross and ickyabout their creativity, because
they're seeing everybody havethese successful businesses and
they're like, well, I know, Ihave it in me, I have the
creative part, but now I got todo all this other shit and so
I'm like it's okay, I'm justgoing to pull your balloons down
and we're in it, I'm just goingto, it's going to, I'm going to
hold on to you and it's goingto be okay, we're going to
(22:36):
figure this out.
So that was my, that was mysomatic body work, but isn't
that fun.
Speaker 1 (22:41):
I love that, and here's you know what you're.
So I read this book and thisactually was a huge game changer
for me called a rocket fuel.
Have you read that?
Speaker 2 (22:49):
I've heard of this.
Well, it works perfectly withyour somatic thing, it is
perfect.
Speaker 1 (22:53):
So here's the thing about rocket fuel.
Okay, you can read an articleabout it and get what you need.
Don't read the whole book, I'mjust gonna that's how I got to
high school.
Come on cliff notes yeah, cliffnotes, so, um, okay.
So when I was in high school,we didn't have the internet, nor
did we have cliff notes, so Ihad to actually read all the
fucking books, okay.
So, um, this is a sorrow of mylife, I actually had to read
catcher in the rye, um, which Ireally hated that book, but at
(23:14):
any rate um uh.
I.
Is it one of your favorites?
No, not favorites.
So, um, uh, it's really.
It talks about the twodifferent roles that are
necessary in any business andhow, as you start to scale up,
you run into a challenge.
So it's interesting that youput that cap of 3000 where you
said, okay, at 3000, you don'tneed me, you need a strategy
(23:37):
call to figure out what are yoursteps.
And then um, and then uh, atthat point, when you scale to a
certain point, um, you need twoseparate people and you need the
integrator and you need thevisionary.
Yes, visionary is the creativeperson who is up here doing all
the woo right, and then theintegrator is the person who
(23:58):
does the tactical, step-by-stepstuff, operationalizing the
vision.
Because and he talks about itin the book you cannot move from
this to this without feeling.
We all know what it feels likeit's discomfort, it feels like
you're stuck.
It actually is not healthy,it's not good.
So you need those two people.
Speaker 2 (24:17):
And this is funny because I do use the term
integrator in my marketing.
Well, there you go.
Speaker 1 (24:21):
Yeah, check out an article about rocket fuel.
Oh, I love this, that's.
And so you are like thatnecessary step.
And so for me, I got to thepoint where I realized I wanted
to do it all on my own, like notbecause I wanted to do
everything myself, but becausethe vision that I had and the
person that I am makes it sothat I actually don't like
working with other people.
I've figured that out aboutmyself.
But that meant I could onlyscale to a certain point, or I
(24:44):
could only do something.
Like you, when you, when youmake a decision not to hire
somebody, you are deciding notto scale to a certain level.
You're just plateauing andthat's fine, if that's what you
want, that works.
But if you're trying to growand also not get somebody like
Liz, then you have two competingpriorities and you're always
going to feel attention.
You're never going to see thesuccess because those are at
(25:06):
odds with each other, inherentlyRight.
So you've got to know.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
It's funny too, because the way that I do my
business is because I'm abusiness owner at the end of the
day, and I just kind of thinkto myself, what do I need?
And then I go and I give thatto other people.
Um, and it got to the pointabout, oh God, three years ago I
was doing I had like 25 clientsand it was just me and I'm like
, oh Jesus, I'm like you're anidiot.
(25:29):
It's like the cobbler son hasno shoes.
I'm sitting here preaching topeople, delegate, delegate,
delegate, and I'm not.
I'm here working.
I, during COVID, I was working16, 18 hour days.
Um, I actually had to go outand invest in a really fancy
office chair because I be, Ihave chronic pain and my body
(25:52):
just sitting that much, oh God.
Speaker 1 (25:54):
Oh, my God.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
It was.
Thank God chiropractor was openduring COVID because it was
like, oh my God, this isliterally the worst possible
thing that I could have beendoing to my body and, um, yeah,
so you know, it's just you.
Like you said, you're going to,you're going to plateau.
If you're not, if you're, ifyou think you can do it all
yourself, I promise you that youwill quickly burn out and
(26:17):
that's where you're going tostart saying this is too hard.
And that's where you're going tostart saying I'm not cut out
for this and the shooting andthe shooting and the shooting
and the and uh.
And those are the people that Iwant to get the most, cause I'm
like guys, I am right here andit's so funny, cause I have
recurring clients.
I have clients that I'll do aproject from.
They'll go on their merry way.
(26:37):
They'll come back six monthslater.
Can we do this now?
Yes, we will.
Three years later I'll havepeople call me and they'll be
like hey.
So remember that thing you saidnot to do.
I did it.
I did that thing.
I said I'll do it myself.
And now I'm cranky and I'm abitch on wheels and I hate
everything.
And I just woke up this morningand I said why didn't I just
(27:00):
call Liz?
Why didn't I just call Liz?
And, and that's what ends uphappening is because you know,
we all entrepreneurs,solopreneur, we we get this idea
in our head that like it's allme and I'm going to make this
work, and it's like you don'tactually have to do that.
Speaker 1 (27:15):
And that's the thing right you have.
You don't have to do it allyourself, like and I think
that's really important, right?
Cause I earlier said that, yeah, I kind of do this stuff, but
this is what I did for a livingfor like 10, 15 years.
I really enjoyed it, and Ifound that I was irritated by
handing things off to otherpeople because nobody was doing
the things like.
I had a vision, right, and Irealized that what I was trying
to do was build a business, whenwhat I was actually trying to
(27:38):
do, like what I wanted to do inmy soul, was be creative and
just share that with the world,right, and so I realized I had
there's this idea.
I'm curious to know what youthink about this.
I got caught up in this, thisidea that you need to monetize
everything that you're good at.
Speaker 2 (27:52):
This is my toxic trait.
Speaker 1 (27:54):
This is my toxic trait.
Oh, you try to monetizeeverything that you're yeah,
well, because I surround myselfwith creatives.
Speaker 2 (27:59):
Yeah, so, for example , my husband uh went viral on
tiktok nice.
He has a following of like 89000 people.
It's a real number and, um, I'mlike babe, people want to hear
what you have to say.
Do you know how?
Many people oh no, I know whereyou did.
Speaker 1 (28:16):
I know what you did, and so I was like we must
monetize.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
I've done this and this is my superpower and I'm
like we will monetize this.
And so I built him a websiteand I set him all up with email
marketing.
Did he want to monetize?
No, absolutely not.
Did that matter?
Come on?
No, absolutely not.
This is me.
And also like when, in our 20s,before I even became an
(28:42):
entrepreneur, I was a teacher um, in our 20s, I just recognized
what an amazing guitarist andsinger and songwriter he was.
And then my best friend movedin with us and he also is an
amazing singer and guitar player, and I was was like you guys
must form a band.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
And we will get all the gigs in Boston and everyone
will love us.
And they'll be amazing, soundsfabulous.
You guys should start.
You'll get someone to sign youon.
Oh my God.
Speaker 2 (29:11):
And I wasn't even like expecting, like grandeur
Right, I wasn't like you're notthe next Rolling Stones, but
like I was, like this is great,right, and so I.
So I'm just like I'm like thisis great pocket money.
Guys are gonna gig and I thinkthey did like five gigs and
they're like we're all set, andI'm like no.
So, yes, please tell me moreabout my toxic trait of
monetizing.
Let me tell you more about I'mDr Connickie.
Speaker 1 (29:33):
let's say hello and welcome our caller today her
toxic trait, so toxic trait Hertoxic trait.
So I but you know, but the truthis is like I think there's a
couple of things.
One is is there's a capitalistconditioning that we all have,
which I'm working on.
So this year you know we weretalking earlier about money Part
of what my mission is this yearis to so I, one of my causes
(29:54):
that I feel very like, I feelvery like I, I feel very
strongly about is loving blacksingle mothers run by toy Smith,
and so my goal is to increasehow much I send to her
organization every month by theend of the year, and the way
that I'm getting there is byreducing the other things,
because I want to be spending mymoney in alignment with my life
mission.
You're awesome, now the.
The secret, I think, is thatyou one gotta be.
(30:17):
You have to trust that you'regood at making money right.
Any person has to trust it, andI am very good at making money.
Um, you, I anticipate, are alsovery good at making money.
You just have that mind.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
That kind of just you may not be good with numbers,
but you can see.
Speaker 1 (30:29):
I can do numbers either, but I can see how the
river of commerce works and howall the things fit together.
So I'm like, oh, okay, that'swhat we should do, right, and
not everything's going to work,but some of the things that work
make me millions of dollars andsome of the things don't.
It just right.
But if I don't believe that Ican make money doing anything,
that I'm not going to feel freeto say no to any idea, because
(30:51):
every idea that pops up is goingto be the last right.
So the first thing was that soI had it took me about a year,
lots of coaching to actually beable to say I'm really good at
making money without feelingdiscomfort Like I just like,
yeah, that makes that makes mewant to cry a little.
Speaker 2 (31:04):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (31:10):
Yeah, but it's a lot of work, so much work.
I saw so many coaches,therapists, you you name it to
like work through that shit,right, but then'm not on this
planet to be successful.
I'm on this planet to live asatisfied and fulfilled life and
help other people to do that.
Amen For me.
I realized that trying tomonetize my creativity was
draining all the joy out of it,and so I was like and I really
wanted to do the strategy workfor free.
(31:31):
So I was like, okay, becausethe people who need my strategy
work are the people whotypically don't have the funds
to be able to invest in mystrategy work.
So I'm like I need to rethinkall of this.
So I actually shut everythingdown and really thought to
myself what do I actually wantto do to make money?
And I actually realized it hadnothing to do with my creativity
.
It was something that I hadactually done years ago.
(31:52):
That I'm very good at isresearch administration.
So I went back into researchadministration as a consultant,
ramped that up, making about 400grand a year life's good.
And then I was like all right,now I'm just going to take the
time that.
I actually ended up realizingafter that that I wanted to
learn.
I wanted I went back tocorporate because I wanted to
(32:12):
implement a training systemwithin corporate America while
also compete come dealing withall of the pressures that people
deal with at in corporate Cause.
Like it's really easy for me tosay, do this, do this, do this,
but like there are a lot ofpressures happening in corporate
America that prevent peoplefrom taking that action, yep, so
I do.
(32:32):
So I went back to that.
So I'm doing that right now foranother, maybe like six, eight
months or something That'll dosomething else.
That.
So I'm doing that right now foranother, maybe like six, eight
months or so, and then I'll dosomething else.
But, um, the because I cancause, when you realize you can
make money doing anything, itdoesn't matter, you're just like
I'll do this and I'll do thisand I'll do this.
Speaker 2 (32:46):
It's almost a sickness, it's an addiction.
True, true yeah.
Speaker 1 (32:48):
It's right.
And that is the sick.
That was my sickness.
My toxic trait was I can make.
I felt compelled.
I had to make money doing so.
Form a band oh my God, I'm anartist.
Let's sell my artwork.
Oh my God, you know what?
I'm a coach?
Okay, we'll do that.
I'm going to sell thesetemplates, and this is.
I burned myself out just doingthat.
So I got really clear on what Ireally wanted to do, and now I
(33:11):
say no to anything that isoutside of like my scope.
Speaker 2 (33:18):
Love of like my scope .
I love that and like I have avery rigid scope for myself.
Oh God, there's so much I wantto say so, like, so.
First you touched on like moneymindset and almost a scarcity
mindset.
One of my dearest clients inthe world is Lynn Twist from the
Soul of Money.
I don't know if you've everheard of that book.
Speaker 1 (33:34):
Oh my God, oh my God, she's a also.
The name is amazing.
Speaker 2 (33:37):
She's just oh, oh, she's just amazing.
So she talks about moneymindset and scarcity a lot and,
um, it's funny, I'm a very, uh,practical, very logistical, very
down to earth person.
I would not call myself acreative.
And then my creative clientsimmediately are like you're a
liar, you're so creative.
Look at what you do.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
And I'm like I was going to say, I was like I'm
going to let you go with that.
I don't get to tell you whatyou are.
Speaker 2 (34:00):
But okay, right, so again, but it's a lot of
coaching right To kind of stop,um, making that my narrative and
to just finally admit, likeyou're a goddamn creative and
like, just deal with it.
Um, and so it's so.
(34:20):
All of my creative clients, I'mjust like, oh my God, I
surround myself with coaches, soat some points I can get a
little coached out and I'm justlike, yeah, money, I'm so done
working on my character.
I'm over it.
I'm like you know, you just getto a point.
It's like sometimes when I wasdoing I'm not doing therapy
currently, but when I did dotherapy, I was like God if.
I talk about my childhoodtraumas one more time I'm going
to scream.
(34:41):
It's like you get to a pointwhere you're like I just cannot
keep working on the same thing.
And sometimes I get like thatwith my coach clients.
I love them, but it's like Ijust I need to take a step back
for me, that money mindset andscarcity thing.
And I think actually that youpointed out my next step in this
work, which is like stopmonetizing everything.
(35:02):
People are not piggy banks,they're just.
They're just creative people.
Speaker 1 (35:07):
That's the truth, right?
People aren't piggy banks,right?
That's one thing, right, andthe other thing is is actually
it's?
It is an addiction, right?
Because if you are good atmaking money, money gives you
dopamine hits.
Yes, neurodivergent, you'rechasing dopamine?
Speaker 2 (35:20):
Hey, it's up for this and I just like I applaud my
husband because he was just likebabe, that's not me If I did
coach people, I don't want totake money for it and I'm like
you.
But yeah, no, I get that and Ilove you for it.
So, yeah, it's hard, it's ahard thing to break, but I will
(35:42):
say I've created the perfectbusiness because anybody who
does want to make money, theycome to me and I'm like yes,
feed the addiction.
That's the thing.
Speaker 1 (35:48):
Right, that's the key .
This is my loophole.
Well, that's the key, right.
Get excited by other people'smoney.
You said something shit.
You were talking about um,everything I forgot.
Speaker 2 (36:02):
I forgot you said something I was like oh, I've
got a great response, but then Itotally lost it.
That would be the name of myautobiography is.
Speaker 1 (36:08):
You said something and I don't and then I forgot
yeah, me too.
It's like, um, we're talkingabout dopamine hits, chasing
after making money, and it wasbefore that.
Uh, husband, money mindset, ohoh, you were saying how you were
not a creative.
I want to actually share someof you.
So I, up until about two yearsago maybe yeah, about two years
(36:28):
ago I used to say I have thesoul of an artist but none of
the talent, and I said that mywhole life.
I I used to paint until I wasabout 16 or 17, and then after
that I stopped and I just I'vedone, I've dabbled in things,
but I have never felt like theworld got you right.
Speaker 2 (36:47):
The world, the world got me.
Speaker 1 (36:48):
That's exactly what happened.
Like I remember when the worldgot me, it got me in Nepal.
That was the end, um, and sowhen the world got me in Nepal,
uh, I just I started saying Ihave the soul of an artist, but
I'm not.
But no talent.
When I see what I make now, Iknow I have talent.
Like I'm like holy shit, I havea lot of fucking talent.
Like I'm very, very talented, Ihave a vision, but I had to
(37:09):
change the story right, and soone of the things that my wife
and I and I'm not, I realize I'mlike, oh my God, this is like
you're all coached out.
You're like shut the fuck up,vanessa.
But seriously, my wife and mysister and I have been talking a
lot about the story lately islike anytime something happens,
we immediately myself too wejust default to this other story
.
It's the bad story, whateverthe narrative is.
And one of the things that wekeep we've all been saying to
(37:32):
each other to an annoying levelat this stage is change the
story right.
Yes, and it's great when you'rethe one on this end saying hey,
listen, change the story,you're a creative.
When you're the one on theother end hearing change the
story.
You're like fuck off.
Yeah, you can change yourgoddamn story 100%.
Speaker 2 (37:45):
Yeah, don't tell me what to do, and I'm a natural
rebel, so I'm like fuck that.
Speaker 1 (37:50):
I know me too so it's like I'm just like well, okay,
you want me to do the oppositeof what you said?
Speaker 2 (37:55):
I'll do the opposite of what you said.
I don't care if it destroys mylife this is why I laughed when
you said the catcher in the ryeand I was like, oh, was it
required reading in high school?
Speaker 1 (38:03):
I didn't read it yeah , no, it was required, and so
what's funny?
Actually, I failed almosteverything in high school.
I did really badly in highschool, and I think that
actually that is the challengethat a lot of um, the a lot of
our clientele really run into isthat these are typically
creative people who were made tofeel stupid in school, right,
and so you're.
(38:24):
You're overcoming that side ofit as well.
Speaker 2 (38:26):
I have oh, I have just such a soapbox on higher
education in the United Statesand how we push children,
because a lot I mean like, ifyou think about, like I think
about my daughter.
My daughter is born inSeptember and so when she goes
to college she'll be going at 17.
And she'll turn 18 very, veryfreshly in college.
(38:49):
She'll be in there for a monthand then she'll turn 18.
Fine, but I'm like God, a 17year old doesn't have an 18 year
old 22 year old, doesn't have afreaking clue.
Okay, and so we put so muchpressure on these children,
cause I mean, like, legally,physically, are they children?
Speaker 1 (39:07):
No, but they're still children.
Speaker 2 (39:09):
They're still children.
Speaker 1 (39:12):
Dude, did you know that if you're neurodivergent,
your brain doesn't start fullyforming until you're like 34?
Correct?
So I always said I don't thinkI finished adolescence until I
was in my thirties.
Speaker 2 (39:20):
And then there's the male female thing, and I think,
like a male brain doesn't stopmaturing until, like,
significantly later than afemale anyway.
And yes to all of this, um, andso I have this giant soapbox
that I love to climb on it andprobably about like every other
month or so, and it's a goodsoapbox it is.
And I just I get really upsetbecause I know there's somebody
(39:41):
in my life who sheds all overhimself, shits all over himself
constantly, because he couldn'tcrack it in college.
I just couldn't do it.
He's tried multiple times, hejust kept flunking out and I
just I want to hug him andsqueeze him and be like babe,
it's fine, like just stop it,because we're not all cut out
for college and also we're notall cut out for trade school,
(40:04):
cause that used to be the thingright Like, go to trade school.
And these are your choices.
Speaker 1 (40:08):
Choices, I don't actually think you need to do
any of those things like now,that's the story.
Like that's the story again,right, capital.
So my big thing, my, my hearton right now, is for the fact
that I feel like we've all beenconditioned by the four hundred
percent of our, which iscapitalism and consumerism,
colonialism, racism, uh shit, Ihave like there's something in
the patriarchy are you writing abook you?
(40:29):
really you really should.
I am, I'm writing a book, I'mwriting right now and with those
things come together and wewrite the story from that
framework, right.
And so the story that we've allbeen told is go to college, do
the trade school.
If you don't do that, you'restupid, you're done.
Your life is over.
There is something wrong withyou.
Speaker 2 (40:46):
Right, like I'm making a judgment on you as a
person and it hurts me so muchbecause there is and I was
raised in that mentality my mom,her entire career was in a
college, she was a vicepresident, and I get it and,
like education is important, I'mnot shitting on education.
I'm shitting on this push, this, this belief that that you, you
(41:09):
have to do that because it iswhat society says you have to do
.
We have a family friend.
She has been a waitress herentire life, her entire life
from teenage to she is in herlate 60s and she has figured out
.
I don't want to do anything else.
(41:29):
I have no desire.
I like knowing that I clock infor my shift and I clock out of
my shift and it's no brain poweris extended outside of this
shift.
It is rote memory.
I pour the drinks, I serve thedrinks, I pick up the food, I
give the food and I make moneydoing it and I am fine.
My family is fine.
I have other things outside ofwaitressing that complete me as
(41:53):
a human being and I'm just likefuck, yes, yeah.
Speaker 1 (41:56):
More of that, that is more of the message.
Speaker 2 (42:00):
And I just, I just feel terrible, for I mean, like
I also shed all over myselfbecause I'm like you, idiot.
You worked your entire life,since fourth grade, to be a
Spanish teacher.
That was your path and you didit.
You got a master's in Spanisheducation and you taught for 10
(42:24):
years.
You had a decade as a teacher,a profession, a career.
People martyred me, murderizedme Like I'd be like on a
vacation.
Oh, what do you do for a living?
Oh, I'm a Spanish teacher.
Oh my God, always.
Oh my God, you're a teacher.
Bless you.
You're amazing.
Bless me.
(42:46):
Now I have a really good livingthat I'm making over here.
Bless me now as a business andtech strategist and the owner of
my own company.
Bless me now.
I have a really good livingthat I'm making over here.
Bless me now as a business andtech strategist and the owner of
my own company.
Bless me now and it's oh so.
I want to write a book one dayon the martyrdom of teachers
because it and so like to thisday.
Sometimes I wake up and I'mlike dipshit, like you don't
(43:07):
know where your next money iscoming from.
If you lose all your clients,where's your money?
Whereas with teaching you were,you were in you like you had a
whole union behind you.
Speaker 1 (43:18):
That's an illusion.
You aren't in like that's justthe story we tell ourselves
right, like you really are notever secure.
We just say that we are, and itmade me miserable.
Speaker 2 (43:28):
I loved my kids.
Speaker 1 (43:29):
I loved my students.
Speaker 2 (43:30):
Um, I still like they're 26 now and they're on
Facebook.
I love you too, babe.
What's up journalists?
But like it made me miserable.
It made me miserable Causethere's just so many things in
it, which is an entirelydifferent podcast.
But leaving teaching was thehardest thing I've ever done
(43:52):
because there were so manystories coming at me Like you've
thrown away your entire career.
You've thrown away youreducation.
Speaker 1 (44:01):
What are you going to do with this master's that you
spent all this money?
Speaker 2 (44:04):
on yeah, um, you're never going to amount to
anything because you're notusing that master's and you're
not using that undergrad.
You're not using your 10 yearsof experience.
You think you're going to makesome money?
Speaker 1 (44:15):
What are you going to do when the next client doesn't
come around Running?
Speaker 2 (44:17):
your cute little business.
That's adorable.
You drained your retirementaccount so that you could live
while you're figuring this shitout Way to go.
Now you don't have anyretirement, liz, nice job, but
this is the money mindset that Ihad to grow out of my next
dollar.
Speaker 1 (44:30):
Everything you're talking about.
I had to grow out of it.
My next dollar is where I wantmy next dollar to be.
Speaker 2 (44:35):
I'll go call up an old client and be like hey, how
about that website?
Do you need another strategy?
Call my next dollar is just anemail away and it's not
guaranteed.
And the key, though, is rightnow.
Speaker 1 (44:44):
if you look at your money, you have clients right
now, so your next dollar rightnow is probably going into like
six months.
So when you talk about yournext, dollar.
Speaker 2 (44:50):
What are you really talking?
Speaker 1 (44:51):
about yeah, yeah.
So, that's the story, right?
You're telling the story as ifyou have no money today.
Speaker 2 (44:57):
Yeah, and that because that's what we do to
ourselves.
Meanwhile, I have clients onlike year long contracts.
Are you kidding me?
I've got money.
What are you?
Speaker 1 (45:10):
talking about that's, but that's why I was so
important, because we weimmediately jumped to that story
and we accept that story.
Is true, yeah, and unlessyou're having a conversation
with someone who's gonna callyou out on it, you're, you're
just gonna go on that narrative.
Um, okay, hold on.
We are now at 12 50 and I wasso earlier on I said all right
so five episodes.
Speaker 2 (45:31):
We're going for five episodes here.
Speaker 1 (45:33):
Five.
Well, we need a second podcastnow.
So the second podcast that weneed is actually it's going to
be born from this one, which isgoing to be about Liz.
I'm telling you this now isgoing to be about when you
decide to leave right, because Ithink this is a really powerful
conversation, like when you aremaking that decision, because
I've made that decision to leave, go back, leave, go back, right
, whatever.
I'd love to be able to talkabout that a little more,
(45:54):
because there's people I knowwho want to jump ship and start
their own consulting business.
Oh, my God, do it.
Oh, just do it guys, just the.
My answer is just do it, do not.
Even the answer is yes, do it,but if you want to hear more
about it, listen, I'll doanother podcast.
Absolutely the answer is stillyes.
Speaker 2 (46:10):
Do you know?
I get on Zoom calls.
I get on Zoom calls withteachers just to convince them
to leave teaching.
Speaker 1 (46:16):
It's so fun, that's well ultimately there's a lot of
industries people need to justleave.
And the reason why they need toleave is they've been doing it
for so long that they are beingmistreated so badly.
They cannot see how theydeserve more and that, but, like
a lot of times, they won'tleave because they feel like
people are reliant on them andit's like no, you're showing
them the strength.
(46:36):
Oh my God, I'm so excited.
We can't talk about that, okay.
So, guys, liz is going to comeback, yes, but in the moon time,
liz, everybody hearing you isgoing to be like, oh my God,
you're going to help me savetime, save money.
Speaker 2 (46:45):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (46:47):
How do they find you, Because I don't want to just
send them off to the ether.
Where do they find you?
Speaker 2 (46:50):
I love it Simplify simplifyme and because I care
about the customer journey.
Every single button is going topoint you to where I want you,
so just click a button.
Speaker 1 (46:59):
It's a really good user journey.
In fact.
When I went to her website, Isaid when we met, one of the
things I said was your userjourney.
I'm just going to say this.
She said you know, I wasactually thinking about updating
my website and changingeverything around because I
think it's terrible and I'm likedon't do it, do not do this.
You are falling into the trapthat your clients fall into.
(47:19):
I'm glad to see that you keptthe website the same, because
it's very good and your userjourney is spot on.
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (47:25):
But yeah, click a button and you'll talk to me.
Speaker 1 (47:27):
Fabulous no-transcript.
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