April 14, 2024 • 44 mins
In this conversation, Sarah Jane Wellock discusses the importance of using different modalities to heal trauma and the power of listening to our bodies. She shares her experiences with various practices, such as the Living Blog and caress, which involve writing, movement, and self-stimulation. Sarah Jane emphasizes the need to lower our walls and barriers, trust our bodies, and release judgment. She also highlights the significance of creating a safe space for ourselves and others. Overall, the conversation explores the messy and nonlinear nature of healing and the importance of self-care.
TAKEAWAYS
- Using different modalities can help individuals work through trauma and experiences.
- Listening to our bodies and trusting their wisdom is essential for healing.
- Creating a safe space for ourselves and others is important for personal growth.
- Lowering our walls and barriers can reduce judgment and increase awareness.
- Healing is a messy and nonlinear process that requires self-care and self-compassion.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
first let me just go with thank you, like I've had
like the weirdest fucking month,and when I I burst into tears.
But I'll tell you something asI've been preparing for this
conversation, I realized thatthere was a reason for this.
Like, like cause I was actually.
I was reading, well, I waswatching some of your, some of
your other interviews and thingslike that and cause I there's
(00:32):
just.
You know, I said to you thatyour message is so important and
in, in watching some of yourolder interviews and other
conversations that you've hadwith people, you know, I think
that something that I don'tthink I fully appreciated the
first time we talked, but sincenow I've recently gone through
my own again.
You know, you have PTSD, traumahappens, then things trigger
(00:53):
and then it's like a whole youknow thing I realized that one
of the things that I think is soimportant is that you use a lot
of different modalities, a lotof different ways of engaging
with people but really to helpus as individuals work through
traumas and experiences andthings that we've been holding
(01:14):
on to that maybe we don'tnecessarily need to hold on to,
and I don't think I fullyappreciated the depth of what
that is until, again.
You know, when we met last time, I was sort of like healed.
I was like, oh, I'm doingbetter now, blah, blah, blah.
And then you go back into thatspace and then you're like so
I'd like to ask a question ofyou, like, in terms of healing,
(01:35):
like you've done so manydifferent things.
The question I have is is whenyou were first starting, so,
let's say, like thinking back toyour initial healing journey,
because we've been on much of us, but we've been on many of them
, right, um, do you feel like?
Um, we are conditioned fromyouth to feel like there's like
a fast way to get through thisand like there's one or there's
(01:57):
like one solution, but thatreally like it's a, that's the,
it's like a mess of things thatcome together to heal us, right
like?
I'm curious to know thatevolution within, since you've
seen both the micro and themacro.
Interesting reason why it's soimportant, I think is because a
lot, and why I was so glad thatyou're willing to do it, is that
so many people right now aresuffering from so much trauma in
(02:19):
the world trying to heal, and Idon't know that any of the
things that we've been doinghave been working for us anymore
.
For a lot of people, you know,like I've hearing that a lot
like I've been doing x, I'vebeen doing y and therapy for x
number of years.
You know, and like, for me,what I realized was that it's a
conglomerate.
It's a conglomeration of thingslike there's somatic movement,
(02:39):
there's therapy.
You talk about poetry and diaryand journaling, like you do a
lot of different things, butyou're also so gentle about it,
like and that's, I think, one ofthe things that has struck me
the first, the even.
But OK, I'm going to gush aboutyou a little bit.
So like you're gentle but likeyou're so strong and bold at the
(03:00):
same time Right, like I saw youon your standup comedy and like
you're on stage being verygentle in your talk but at the
same time, like I can see theiron in you right, like it's so
interesting and I feel like thatmust take a lot of work to get
there, to get to that pointwhere you can be, feel strong
but also be soft at the sametime.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
No, it's funny and maybe I shouldn't repeat myself,
because I just was on a podcastthe other day and somebody was
asking me about Ladybug becausethat's the umbrella under which
many of my offerings exist and Iwas talking about Ladybugs and
how they're like delicate andpeople see them as lucky and
(03:41):
beautiful and yet they're alsolittle, fierce creatures and
they can help with pests in thegarden and they kind of gather
together and commune.
So, yeah, I think that existsin me, it probably exists in all
(04:02):
of us, that gentle side, andthen the fierce quality you know
, I feel like I would, I wouldargue for like.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
For a lot of us, I think it's difficult to not
become hardened, right, and solike.
As you start to like, you know,so like, you're, like trauma
over the years, you just kind ofget that hard outer shell and
then it's tough to like, open itup and like and we only like I
remember only seeing it as twopossibilities, right, either I
was hardened and let nobody in,or like I let people in and they
(04:34):
destroyed me.
Speaker 2 (04:35):
Right, I never saw like this, this other side, that
you could be soft and alsostuff that's super interesting,
and the question you just askedme before was also super
interesting, so I don't knowwhere.
Yeah, let's go back to thequestion.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
Let's go back to it.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
But I was saying it felt like we were just dying
into the middle of the oceanwith that amazing question about
are we conditioned?
I think you asked, but is thatthe word you used?
Speaker 1 (05:04):
Yeah, are we conditioned or do we asked?
But is that the word you used?
Yeah, are we conditioned or dowe like?
Speaker 2 (05:06):
we just assume the way it is right is that I do the
thing or I like I'm looking forthe solution, whereas the
solution may actually bemultifaceted yeah and yeah and
and you were mentioning thatI've looked at many different
modalities, as is probably truefor many of us uh and yeah, I
(05:29):
guess there is that thing whereit's like, oh, there must be one
thing that could solve this,and then maybe that idea evolves
over time.
I think really, there's also anidea that it's supposed to be
clean and neat, and fuckingmessy.
Speaker 1 (05:46):
It is so messy, I, you know, I agree.
I think we do feel like it'slike it's linear right, that
it's like okay, I'm gonna dothis, this is this, and now I
feel good and I'm like when, andI've never, I've never done
that, I've never done this, thisand this, and then felt good
it's dynamic, it's chaotic, andwhat?
Speaker 2 (06:05):
if that's okay and that's making me think of orgasm
, mom, you know what is that?
Speaker 1 (06:11):
that that's okay, like what, if it doesn't have to
be a linear, neat, pristineprocess I, you know, and I would
argue that like we've been likewe doesn't need to be, like
there's something um, what's theword freeing in not having it
need to be so neat and tidy,like I almost feel like at some
(06:32):
point oh, you know what, okay,I'm gonna go into some weird
shit here I feel like okay, sohere's what I feel, like at some
point I'm going all the wayback to like Puritans here.
There's like a right and a good, right and neatness is right
and good, and this is right andgood, and a clean healing
process is right and good, right.
(06:52):
So if and I know that thissounds weird just saying it, but
I know, as I'm saying it, thatthis is what I believed at some
point right and like, and ifit's not done cleanly, right and
good, then we feel like there'ssomething wrong with us almost
yeah, and and what if that'sjust not the case?
Speaker 2 (07:11):
and it's making me also think about nature and how
messy and wild nature can be,and what if we can emulate that
in our processes?
Like I just I'm so lucky I livein the middle of manhattan and
I happen to have a privatebackyard.
It's like that's amazing.
It's amazing, and I had treesand I was out there like
(07:32):
sleeping today and I was justlike looking at all these
interesting things that hadfallen from the trees and and
that is what creates such beautyin nature it's willingness to
be chaotic and wild and free.
And what if we could allow thatto exist in our healing process
, without thinking there's aright and a wrong and a good and
(07:53):
a bad?
That's an idea.
The right, wrong, good, bad isan idea for a passive
consciousness that I love.
What if there is no right orwrong or good or bad?
Just shouldn't?
Creation?
And what if everything's achoice?
And choice creates and I alwayssay this, but I just build
those two words together Choicecreates.
Speaker 1 (08:13):
It's like oh baby, it really is.
That actually is so interesting, because I always I think about
choice is like the big thing,like I can, for example, get
like really angry when someonesays something, but then I have
a choice in terms of how Irespond, right, so, and then my
choice creates whatever future.
It is that like.
So I snap at this person.
Well, my future is now createdfor the next 25 minutes.
(08:35):
Right, I don't, and I choose tobreathe in and just recognize
this is my own shit, that I needto deal with.
And again, now I've created itfor 25 minutes and maybe anger
is required sometimes.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
Anger is required sometimes anger is required.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
Right, and definitely I've been in a situation where
anger is required, but I wasthinking specifically of times
where like I, like, I'm like I'mI, where I tend to get like
overwhelmed, and then I'm like,yeah, right, and like it's a
lash out and I know that that's,it's childlike, and so I work
on that right to like and so Idon't that often, but unless I'm
sleepy, and then it's like abratty child, it's really good
to bed.
Um, but that's what I wasthinking about is like, really,
(09:10):
uh, but also, again, like yousaid, making the choice to, if
you're angry, saying the thingfeeling that you talked about
this in your um with, in yourvideo with, uh, peter, and I
thought that Peter, yeah, and Ithought that was really
interesting about letting itwork through your body.
Can you talk a little bit aboutthat, about like anger and like
(09:30):
like how it works that way?
Speaker 2 (09:34):
yeah.
So anger, friend, again from anaccess consciousness
perspective, and people cancheck out access consciousness
at accessconsciousnewscom um I,but um they.
They see when anger shows upthere's a lie attached.
You lied that we're tellingourselves um, or a lie someone
(09:56):
else is telling us, or a lie incondition to believe is true,
mm-hmm.
And it's also known in thatmodel as the distractor.
As far as all of like, theemotions and and what else is
possible that we can tap intoother ways of of being.
(10:16):
Like you said, we can becomeaware and we can make a choice
and tap into other ways of being, but certainly, sometimes,
perhaps that aggressive, fiercequality is required.
And again, thinking of nature,she's just like yo get out of my
(10:38):
way, bitches, look at that.
Right out here, yeah, and likethat's pretty interesting and
amazing.
And then sometimes she's sogentle when you're like looking
into a.
I remember being on ameditation retreat and looking
into this desert flower andthere was a bee in the flower
(11:00):
and it's so cliche and yet itwas so.
It was like, oh my goodness,how can nature be so cliche and
yet it was so amazing.
It's like, oh my goodness, howcan nature be so beautiful and
delicate and intricate?
Um, so it's all that.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
You know, I uh was.
I went to a conference recentlyin hawaii and the the person
who, uh, the keynote speaker wasis a wayfinder and she lives
out on the ocean most of a lotof the year and, um, she was,
she showed.
They have videos of like theocean, things that you only see
in the middle of the ocean andlike.
(11:32):
There's like pristine and quietdays, and then there's like the
violent days, and some of theviolent days don't even look
very violent, like they lookfine, but the swell of the ocean
is so much that it takes themtotally off course.
But if you look at it just fromthe camera, it looks fine, it's
like and um you know.
so you said something about alie and I think that's so
interesting because, you know,sometimes, sometimes I feel like
(11:55):
the lie is like just denial tooright, like it's something
that's scratching, and you'relike, oh, I don't want to.
My wife and I were talkingabout those times where you're
reading like a book, where it'slike a self-help book, or you're
maybe listening to a podcastwhere somebody's saying
something and they say somethingin particular, like maybe inner
child work or whatever, andyou're like I don't need that
shit and you put it down.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
And then it's like oh , oh, what's in that?
Yeah, yeah, I think anywherewhere we're thinking I think you
might be the operative wordthat we gotta turn something up
or turn down our awareness orclose something out, there's
probably something to it I thinkthat's probably so, going to,
(12:42):
um, you know, your uh, you, youruh, living blog and some of the
other.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
Now, actually, let's, let's talk a little about that.
So, uh, sarah jane does a lot,okay, so we talked about access
consciousness.
Uh, now let, and then uh, andwe'll probably, we'll definitely
come back to that because, like, we're just you know, we're
gonna go all over the place, butyou also have a living, a
living blog that you talkedabout and, um, and you talked a
little bit about it in yourvideo with peter, which I'll
have.
I'll share the link because itwas a really great video but, um
(13:07):
, where you talk about how you,um, you write the diary and then
you'll perform the day, butthere's movement and stuff to
where you're moving those thingsthrough the body.
Can you tell me a little bitabout why it's so important to
move these things through thebody?
Like, what does that do?
Speaker 2 (13:24):
Yeah, so LadyBug has multiple different offerings,
some of which I created and someare other people's modalities
that I've been trained tofacilitate.
So the living love was mycreation and I basically write a
diary entry, read it and thenhear it, typically with erotic
movement, and then other peoplein the audience get to do that
(13:51):
too.
now you have them writesomething in that moment, and
then right, it's all spontaneousbecause I know for me and my
ocd and my perfectionistsometimes, that, um, the the
inclination to go back and editand edit and edit can, can get
in your way.
Yeah, that's great, it's aspontaneous process.
I write the entry in themorning, I perform it on a stage
(14:13):
of the evening, I pair it witherotic movement and, yes, um,
and then and then every beoffice to do it.
So we take, you know, 30, 40minutes to write, read and move.
And, yeah, it's, I think it'sthe body's wisdom, um, to allow
ourselves to move anythingthrough the body.
(14:35):
It's such a beautiful, amazingway to release any toxic energy
or anything.
That's like stirred up To mewhenever I like go to a dance
class or swim or take a walk oreven just want to become really
aware of my breath and I'm sortof moving through that and it
(14:57):
makes such a difference.
Yeah, it's like listening tothe body and her amazing
awareness, like and yet most ofthe time, like you meant,
they're just like a tuning outor there's like a wrong, bad.
And what if we could justlisten to our bodies?
They're so infinitely wise.
Speaker 1 (15:18):
I've been thinking about this a lot lately, about
listening to your body and how Idon't feel, like I definitely
know that Like it's something I,it's a practice, right.
So when I was in practice, itmade a difference, like as you
were talking about likebreathing, and it's funny, I
actually literally did was inpractice.
It made a difference, like asyou were talking about like
breathing, and it's funny, Iactually literally did a TikTok
video about this this morningwas, yeah, about just breathing,
because you know what I'vestarted to feel and I like it's
(15:42):
weird because, oh, like over thelast year, so I've started to
like feel energy moving, right,so like I feel like when I am in
the zone and my energy is likehere, right, and so it means
that every piece of energy thatI have is it looks like a funnel
, like an alien head right,almost coming off my body, but
it's nowhere anywhere here,right?
So there's things going on inhere that I'm not even feeling
(16:03):
pain, whatever it is hunger, Igot to pee, I just I don't know
any of it, right?
If I don't hear it, I don't feelit, and um, and then, like you
said, you take that deep breathand now I realize I'm not
sitting up, I'm not lettinggravity hold my weight Right,
and it is so important because,like it, almost like just not
(16:25):
letting gravity hold my weight,for example, is hurting my back
Right.
So if I just sit down on thegravity hold my weight.
So do you find that in theseexercises where you're like,
when you do these, uh, yourliving blog, do you find that
people find a new way oflistening to their body or like,
is it?
How does that?
What kind of experiences dopeople have in terms of the mind
body connection?
Speaker 2 (16:46):
Yeah, I'd say, in any of the offerings that I provide
, usually there's a bodilycomponent, because I just think
our bodies are so smart, a lotof time either tuning them out
or judging them.
And what if we listened?
And I was looking at yourInstagram and looking at like
(17:07):
before agreements and that youcame up with other arrangements
that you prefer, and part ofthat was listening to your body.
Yeah, and there I think that'samazing.
And yes, all of the practicesessentially that I offer involve
listening, and listeningwithout judgment or conclusion,
(17:29):
and I think in so doing, you canchange your whole life.
You can change whateversituation is coming up if you so
choose, and you can change yourwhole way of operating, because
we kind of end up in a defaultsetting of of judgment or you
know, chronic worry about the ifa pain shows up.
(17:50):
It's not like buddy, that's that.
It's like oh my god, what'sthat?
It's cancer have to walk with acan or whatever we decide is
gonna happen?
And what if we just oh, thanks,body, thanks for that
information.
I think that can change ourwhole.
I think that can change ourwhole existence.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
That is so.
It is so true, like judgment.
I feel like judgment is ourdefault state and not just like
for.
It's like for everything, rightLike.
I've started to notice how muchand I'm just going to make
numbers up here 100% of thepeople I know, so it's not 100.
(18:34):
They're going to go for atleast 99.
Talk about themselves in areally negative way, right, yeah
, it's usually judgment ofourselves, judgment of ourselves
.
I don't mean even judgment ofothers.
I'm talking about ourselves,right Like.
We judge ourselves like soharshly and in silence of our
minds, I think, which makes itworse because once you write it
down, you have to face it, seeit, deal with it, right, but
(18:55):
it's usually just that monologuein our heads.
So I'm interested now, actually.
So you have, let's go into thenext one caress, right, where
there's, and I'll let you sharea little bit about what that is.
But because I want to ask aquestion about caress, because
something I've been thinkingabout a lot is the need for us,
our body, to be touched, even ifby ourselves, right Like, and I
(19:17):
feel like we don't do that asmuch anymore.
There's articles all over theplace to talk about how people
are not having as much sex,there's not a lot of touching
happening, and I feel likethat's creating a trauma in and
of itself.
Right, and then can you tell mea little bit about that and
then dive into caress a littlebit about what that, what that,
what the purpose of that was andhow that impacts people?
Speaker 2 (19:37):
Sure, yeah, I think touch is such a beautiful option
and now most of us have twohands not everyone, but a lot of
people have two hands and can,or at least one hand, and and
you can touch yourself, and thatcan make all the difference as
well.
Maybe your wrists are sorebecause you're like texting or
(20:00):
typing, you know, just give yourwrists a massage, like what you
said, is awesome, just likegiving ourselves.
That touch can be so profoundand, of course, receiving it
from others can be amazing aswell.
I mean, it's another thing thatI incorporated in most of my
practices.
(20:21):
So, yes, caress is specificallyabout self-stimulation and it
started.
It used to be for people with aclitoris only and we literally
stroke our clitoris during thepractice and maybe about two
years into it we started openingthe doors for everybody and
(20:44):
it's basically a meditationwhere I lead people through a
self-stimulation practice, whereI lead people through a
self-stimulation practice, andit started about three years ago
and it's been an amazingcontribution.
I can speak for myself thatit's really contributed to my
transformations.
(21:05):
And then, of course, I hearthat from clients as well.
I literally believe I healed.
You know, I got a Cree cancerdiagnosis.
I think that healed throughcaress, through access,
consciousness, through a dietaryswitch.
I've been more.
You know it's almost an eyeroll how much we hear like
(21:28):
you've got to love yourself andreally spending time with
yourself while being incommunion with others and in
community with your body canreally change things pretty
dynamically in terms of not onlyhow we interact with ourselves
but also the world and withother people, like it's uh,
(21:50):
essential, I say, to self-touchand self-suicide touch.
And yet, as you're done,probably not many people's
default setting.
I mean they may touch indifferent ways, but not that you
know intentional loving,nurturing, whatever's required.
(22:12):
Maybe it's a firm massage,maybe it's a light touch.
It's just not something peopletend to necessarily practice and
it can be sent to you tocontribution.
Just you know, and that'ssomething you can do, you know
you can practice to older, youcan grab your stovetop or
whatever.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
You know exactly now like I could, we could sit and
rub ourselves, which I do a lot.
Uh, you know I spin.
Rubbing myself is because it'show I self-soothe, so and it's
funny, before I knew I wasautistic, I didn't actually
understand that that's what Iwas doing, and then now I know,
so I just kind of like lean intoit.
You know you said somethingabout judgment.
(22:55):
I want to come back to that.
I want to tie a couple ofthings in.
Let's loop back a little bit to.
You were talking about yourclients in terms of releasing
themselves with judgment and soon.
So, in the bigger pictureconversation about releasing
ourselves with judgment, I'mcurious to know, like when you
work with clients, what are someof the because?
Like, what we're talking aboutnow and this is what I love
about you right Is like I reallylove the unexpected.
(23:23):
I love it when people are doingthings that challenge what we
think about, as whatever it isthat we think like in in, like
so for my audience, this issomething totally new and I love
that because it's like dude,have you ever thought about this
before?
You know, and it's it.
And so, whatever the reason whyI think it's important is
because so many of us rush tojudgment of ourselves, right,
and we don't believe.
And when we think aboutself-care, right, you were
(23:44):
saying an eye roll withself-care and self-love and that
does exist.
Because you know I don't wantto say it like this because
people, self-care is massages,but you know what Massages are.
Self-care, like it's reallyfucking good.
I need like no knocking that.
But like, are you in thatmoment saying to yourself, like
(24:14):
when you're getting the massage,are you really like owning and
saying I'm doing this, like I am, I love you, I care about you?
Or like, do you find with yourclients that initially they're
like doing the thing, but thatinner, like phantom working,
phantom judgment, phantom stuffis still there and I'm curious
to know how do you recommendthat?
People kind of like what is,what are some of the activities
that help massage people out ofthat space?
Speaker 2 (24:27):
No, that's interesting, I mean, I think at
first it still exists, even whenwe're practicing something
different.
And yet just the awareness thatwe're, you know, self judging,
or that we're rushing throughsomething, or that, you know,
rather than giving yourself agentle or a firm grip, you're
(24:51):
like digging your nails intoyour flesh, just having the
awareness of what we're doingcan also be different, and that
can come with different embodiedpractices, that can come with
caress, that can come with,which is kind of like a form of
meditation we are stillstimulating.
(25:14):
There is a sense of an orgasmicstate, and it's a form of
meditation that's likecultivating this awareness of
all of our body's responses, andjust that awareness can be a
contribution.
And the awareness awarenesswithout judgment or conclusion,
(25:36):
again, not like oh, no, you knowI'm doing it again and I'm
wrong in bet, but just like oh,here it is, you know.
Thank you for that information.
And and what else is possibledoes?
Speaker 1 (25:48):
that make?
Yeah, absolutely, and I thinkyou know, with something like
caress specifically.
You know, because that I agreewith you like self stimulation
is very meta because it's hardto like.
I found my, you know you getdistracted, right, but
eventually you start to get to aspace like just like any
meditation, where initiallyyou're like going here, you're
going there, whatever, and theneventually you start to get into
like the and I think it helpsbecause it is, you know, such a
(26:11):
powerful feeling physically aswell, that it does help to
create that sort of and I thinkthe other thing, that is, it's
almost like the only way out isthrough whatever it is Like you
know it's.
I often find that I and thiswas also in your I just loved
your conversation with Peterwhere you talked about everybody
should listen to that fullthing.
(26:31):
It's like super great Shit.
Hold on, we were talking about.
What was I just saying?
Seriously, I looked down atPeter and then I lost Just say
were we saying right before thatwe're talking about?
Uh?
Speaker 2 (26:49):
he said meditation.
It's a meditation that'll touchme.
I think you were gonna maybereference a personal story, were
you or?
Speaker 1 (26:58):
no, I was gonna reference something he said
specifically because I thoughtit was super interesting,
related to um getting stuck inyour own head and then, I don't
know, it'll come back again,it'll come back again.
But I was like, oh, but it wasa very good one, um, so, uh,
shit, now I will come backaround, um, you're good, so okay
, yeah, so the question he hebrought up is something totally
(27:19):
different.
Just to like something that Ihad that I was curious about is
I?
I thought this was reallyinteresting, right, he was
talking about how, because I,you know, when you were on the,
I said watch your comedy thatyou sent me and it was, and it
was great.
And you were like I said, youwere gentle but strong, and I
and I and it didn't occur to mein that moment how many stages
(27:41):
you'd actually already been on,how many things like it's this
point, you know that you'veworked.
And you said something aboutwhether or not someone shows up.
You do the practice, yeah, andI thought that was really
interesting because I think fora lot of people, right, he was
saying how if you go to a comedyshow and there's a comedian
talking, then you're all therefor the comedy show.
(28:04):
So we're all together.
We know you're supposed to befunny and I'm supposed to laugh
and we're all we're in theretogether, right, but you're
doing this event whethersomebody shows up or not, and so
that takes a lot of pressureoff, right, so that people can.
And I find that to be like whenyou started, that was that
scary for you.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
I mean, I think you must be referring to Living Live
in Cairo.
I used to do it down the street.
There was a theater and abasement and I would go and
clean the theater and thenperform and I would do all of
the pieces, went to the back toturn on the music, to do the
lighting and, yeah, sometimesthere were people and sometimes
(28:47):
there weren't, and I just had acommitment that I was going to
do this regardless.
Do it, I think that's.
I know it was Fridays at oneo'clock or something, so maybe
you're an hour and I was goingto do this regardless.
So, if there was no one in theaudience, if there was one
person, if there were 25, I wasgoing to do it.
And I think that level ofcommitment it is helpful.
(29:09):
But that's again not to makeanyone rather bad.
If you don't commit tosomething, that's fine too.
Like, um, I, for me, I like a, adaily practice, or I like the
consistent practice, yeah, andand for me that the, the
modalities that I've developed,whether it's the Living Blog or
(29:29):
Caress, I do them regularly, notonly for my clientele but for
myself.
Right, it's really a benefit.
So at that time I was doing theLiving Blog, like as a lunch
hour thing every week in thattheater I also Caress typically
takes place just to be so wittyabout it when you typically do
(29:51):
it on the new moon and the fullmoon, and then we also have
consecutive day practices and Ireally like that for me and my
body.
I like that consistency, like Ilike to you to just rely on.
Okay, I know this is coming up,I know this is happening.
(30:13):
I especially like the dailyinteraction the daily practices,
because it's just like it's away to show up regularly for
others and for myself, and tosee how unique each day unfolds.
You know, like there's certainyoga practices where you do the
exact same poses every day andyet they feel so different.
(30:35):
Yeah, yeah, we show updifferently each day and and the
same is true for caress it'slike when there's a consecutive
day practice and we're showingup each day to, to, to do this
together.
It's like some days maybeorgasm is flying, or some days
maybe I'm really caught up in myhead and it's just like doing
(30:58):
it no matter what, and so doingit with the living body.
It was like doing it whether ornot there was an audience, um,
but any other daily practicepractice, it's showing up for
yourself regardless.
Speaker 1 (31:13):
I think that's the I think for many of us.
I think that's the challenge.
You know, it's interesting,like it's all about
accountability, almost right.
Like you have these events.
You're like I'm going to dothis, so I'm going to have this
event in public and then that'llmake sure I'm and it's.
I was thinking about my I golive now on, I used to go live
every Monday um years ago when Iwas a marketing coach and a
business coach and I wouldbasically go live every Monday
(31:34):
and then it actually ended upbecoming an everyday thing.
Because some people were like,oh, we want this every day.
Uh, that it just became to metoo much.
But, um, but I did it because Iwanted to start my Mondays off
positively right.
Like I was tired of starting myMondays off like just Monday, I
don't like Mondays.
And so I was like, okay, youknow what, I'm just going to go
live on Mondays and now I haveto have a good attitude.
(31:54):
So I started going live so thatI would start the Monday with
like enthusiasm and happinessand joy.
And then you know, that justbecame what I did, but that was
years and years ago, as I nowI'm doing it again, but it's
(32:14):
about, like you said, thepractice, because you know, I
feel like we do the thing andthen we're like, oh, I'm healed.
And then we stop doing thething and then we're like, shit,
we have to do the thing againand it's very intense yeah, and
and what if that's okay?
Speaker 2 (32:26):
I mean, what if that is part of the whole process,
like, what if it is?
Speaker 1 (32:31):
messy.
I mean, for me it pretty, is mywife it's interesting when she
gets her mind set on something,track this and have it built
right in Awesome.
But for me it's messy, yeah,and cool.
I think that it goes back tothat's what I've been working on
right now.
So I am seeing I knew there wasa reason.
(32:51):
We did this now again because,like that's the thing I think
that we're we're so hyperfixated on judgment again
because we're so, like I think,we're so busy judging ourselves
Right.
So, like the, that releasingevery so often of your judgment
of yourself just creates moreopportunities for you to stop
(33:11):
judging other people totally,there's space beside.
Speaker 2 (33:15):
Yeah, also an excess consciousness.
Sorry if I'm jumping all overthe place, but I am too with
adhd man.
Speaker 1 (33:20):
I'm just all over the place okay, amazing.
Speaker 2 (33:23):
I think that's a superpower, so that's awesome.
Um, but an idea of like you, wecould do it together now, just
lowering your walls and yourbarriers and just you know
exactly how to do that.
Just lowering your walls andyour barriers, slowing your
walls and your barriers.
The idea of being that and thatfor me helps me kind of reduce
(33:46):
judgment.
I kind of immediately got intouch with myself and I kind of
I'm just like, oh, I don't haveto be um the defensive, yeah,
and I think of like rigid stickcan break really easily where a
piece of string is more valuable.
Um, and I just, yeah, just thepractice of lowering your walls
(34:10):
and your barriers, like what ifwe don't have to be in our armor
all the time, especiallyagainst ourselves?
Speaker 1 (34:20):
have you found?
And actually speaking to that?
Actually, because when I was,actually, I was conversation
with luca stella the other dayand they were.
The conversation was about andI'll be on a later podcast but
it was about safety in theworkplace, right, and like how a
lot of people at work, you know, we'll say, oh, work is like a
family, work is like a family.
And I said I don't subscribe tothat at all.
(34:41):
And we had actually a reallyinteresting conversation where I
changed my mind.
But and here's what happened,right, they said, listen, you
spend.
And I actually expected them tobe like totally on board with
that.
Oh, yeah, I don't.
And they were like, no, itabsolutely should be like your
family, you spend all your timewith these people, and so on.
And so I said, ok, I was like,but it's not safe for many
(35:04):
people to think that theircorporations or their their
family, because, like, theydon't have that same thing back,
and so what was interesting isthat they said that.
So we came to this conclusionthat what it is is is you want
your work to be like your family, and so you want to find a
place where it is safe for youto feel that way.
So what you're suggesting?
You know opening up is um isscary, right, if you're not in a
(35:27):
safe space.
So I'm curious to know have you, over the years, curated your
circle so that you are likesurrounded by people, or do you
find that you are safe in whichto open up or cause?
I mean, you do this in publictoo.
So it's not entirely safe, likeyou're creating the safe space
for other people, but like youyourself are the one out there
(35:49):
bringing this all down.
So I'm interested, I'minterested in how have you
navigated that space of safetyfor you?
Speaker 2 (35:56):
Yeah, I think I.
It did not always be thesaddest for me.
I often felt unsafe and andthat has changed quite a bit I
it's a rare occasion in thesedays that I feel unsafe, even
though I'm five foot two womanin New York City.
Maybe other people like me feelless safe.
(36:19):
I think it was for me accessconsciousness that helped me
make that shift where, thatshift where and this could be a
little out there, but they'relike would you be willing to
receive everything and loweryour walls and your barriers?
So, even so, there's like areally benign example.
Say, you're in, like in a storeand somebody's like really
(36:40):
pushing a product on you, likethe inclination might be to put
up your walls and your barriers,the person might keep pushing,
whereas if you just and it'senergetic and it can be conveyed
through language as well if youjust lower your walls and your
barriers, the person relents.
It's really fascinating towitness and to experience, and
(37:05):
so I think in the past I wasalways in a state of like I was
saying defense myself andeveryone else and fear and lack
of safety, even though I wasstill doing my best
professionally to co-create thatfor others.
Now I typically feel safe.
And if there's ever a question,I find a way to get into a safe
(37:31):
place, and sometimes it's justworking with my own body,
lowering my walls and mybarriers.
I might have that inclinationto put them up.
Okay, let me lower my walls andmy barriers.
What am I aware of?
Um, and, and knowing that wealso and this is another idea
from access consciousness, wepick up on the thoughts,
(37:51):
feelings and emotions of all thepeople around us.
So what am I picking up on?
You know what collectiveconcept or what other person's
thing am I?
Am I am I picking up on?
And what can I do different?
And is this even mine?
And if it's not mine, I canreturn to sender.
Speaker 1 (38:13):
And that has been so powerful for me.
The return to sender it's notalways yours.
Speaker 2 (38:18):
In fact, it's probably usually not ours right,
we're just like buying into thethoughts, feelings and emotions
and and access, not just andthis is not the only modality
that says that.
I mean, buddhism says that aswell that we're picking up on
other people and other ideas,and whether it's our mom in
childhood or our uncle or ourcousin or, you know, our friends
(38:40):
or the collective, it's likewhat, if we can know this, that
it's not ours.
So you know, for me, I think,when I used to feel so unsafe,
perhaps I was picking up onother people around me, or
perhaps I was picking up on aformer version of myself, but
now I typically have a sense ofsafety and I think in creating
(39:07):
that for that, in creating thatfor oneself, it's helpful.
You know, it's perhaps easierto cultivate it for other people
.
Speaker 1 (39:14):
Not that I have the power necessarily to do that,
but I I do my best and andhelping create those spaces for
everyone well, I think that Imean, like you know, in the end,
of course each individual weall have to like our own sense
of safety is our own, but at thesame time, like, there's
environments in which safety youknow, in the end, of course
each individual we all have tolike our own sense of safety is
our own, but, at the same time,like, there's environments in
which safety you know, where youcreate a feeling like, okay,
(39:34):
I'm safe here.
So for you know, like I've got,I've been to events like
conventions or whatever, whereeverything's fine, everything's
absolutely fine, but I don'tfeel particularly safe in that
event.
You know, and I just know thatI'm gonna have to just keep my
mask on, like my physical mask,my emotional mask.
Everything has to be right, umand like, and what I'm trying to
work for myself is isrecognizing again, like, okay,
(39:56):
if you're physically unsafe,then can we move out of it, but
if, like this is somethingthat's going on within me, what
can I do to kind of like,massage that out?
Speaker 2 (40:04):
I and that's I, I'm pleased yeah, and like that idea
that we were mentioning earlier, like I think okay, so maybe
you're gaining some awarenesslike what is that?
Rather than I think sometimesour inclination I'm not saying
this is true for you is like youshut it out, like, oh, I don't
want to be aware of this, or youknow, oh for I have done that
(40:24):
for sure at points in my lifeand we get freaked out by things
.
And what if it could just belike oh shoot, what am I aware
of here?
Like maybe this is, maybe Ineed to leave, or maybe I need
to take a job home, or you knowwhat I mean.
Like rather than walk, or likewe're so aware, like maybe
you're actually just aware andit's not something to shut out
or to make wrong.
Maybe you're actually justaware and it's not something to
(40:46):
shut out or to make wrong.
Speaker 1 (40:50):
I think that that is sort of like.
The central thing really formany of us is that we are aware
we trust our like, but we don'ttrust our bodies as much as we
would like to because, honestly,of years, of the voices of like
you're and this is wrong, dothis, oh, you know, whatever it
is, you know I don't want to hug.
(41:11):
Let him hug you.
He's your uncle, right?
That kind of thing Like thosemake you question your own gut
instincts and, like you said,it's almost like a trauma
healing thing, right Cause, likeyou know, initially, you're,
you know, I know for myself whatyou said is true.
I denied it.
You just push it down, youdon't deal with it, everything's
fine, everything's fine, right,and.
But then you eventually decideor you don't, but you decide.
(41:34):
I personally decided that Idon't want to live like that,
right.
Speaker 2 (41:37):
So now you have to like consciously, unwrap your
tension, really tension, fromaround a bowl that's awesome,
yeah, instead of, like so manypeople do, of like shoving it
out and I'm sure we've all donethat once in our lives and it's
like listening can be such acontribution, even if it's like
(42:02):
ways that what you're, you know,your breath, listening to your
breath or listening like youknow am I not meant to be in
this convention?
Or or, hey, you know this, Ihave this pain.
What is this?
That's huge.
Speaker 1 (42:20):
I love this.
Okay, so now you know, as Irealized, like, I just looked at
the clock and we're alreadylike 45 minutes.
I'm like holy shit, how didthat happen?
So, okay, I want to make surethat people know how to find you
, where to find you and how youhelp them.
So, uh, it's probably gonna beat the beginning, because I
gotta just dove into the veryend.
Hello everyone, and welcome tothe stop shitting all over
yourself podcast.
I'm here, uh, with sarah janewellock.
(42:42):
Welcome, welcome, uh.
Actually, this is the end, guys, I'm just being silly here, uh,
but now I'm going to put thatpart at the beginning.
But tell us where we can findyou, please tell us.
I mean, we talked about a lotof different things.
So what I'd love is if youshared the thing that you want
to share with people and like interms of this is where you find
me, and that kind of thing.
Speaker 2 (42:59):
Sure, I mean, there's so many places to find me,
which could be confusing.
I main site isladybugcalendarcom and that
through the ladybug calendar youcan see what's happening and
all the different things I offer.
Speaker 1 (43:12):
So, depending on when this will go up I'm next week-
this is like I'm literallyediting, recording it next week
like I, because I I held thisweek, so I've already done all
the graphics with your number onit and I was like I don't want
to re-edit amazing.
Speaker 2 (43:28):
So I'm considering a 31 day caress practice for May,
because it's a nationalmasturbation month.
Speaker 1 (43:37):
Fabulous, I didn't know we had a national
masturbation month.
Speaker 2 (43:39):
Yes, so people can find me at caressme
thelivingblognet.
Speaker 1 (43:49):
I mean, there's so many the links are all going to
be in the show notes, so don'tyou worry.
So actually I just realized areyou starting it on beltane?
Because my wife just sent me aninvitation for beltane, which
is she calls it, that's our sexholiday.
So she's like it's the sexholiday, that's great.
Speaker 2 (44:06):
Yeah, it's not official yet, but I think I'm
gonna do it, um I I keep gettingat this yeah, no, no, I got,
you got okay.
Speaker 1 (44:14):
So well, I will make sure this will be up well before
then.
So everybody sign up.
You are a psychologist.
I tell you things, to make alist.
(44:35):
You've got special powers,though.
You make me scared, you make mego.
first let me just go with thank you, like I've had
like the weirdest fucking month,and when I I burst into tears.
But I'll tell you something asI've been preparing for this
conversation, I realized thatthere was a reason for this.
Like, like cause I was actually.
I was reading, well, I waswatching some of your, some of
your other interviews and thingslike that and cause I there's
(00:32):
just.
You know, I said to you thatyour message is so important and
in, in watching some of yourolder interviews and other
conversations that you've hadwith people, you know, I think
that something that I don'tthink I fully appreciated the
first time we talked, but sincenow I've recently gone through
my own again.
You know, you have PTSD, traumahappens, then things trigger
(00:53):
and then it's like a whole youknow thing I realized that one
of the things that I think is soimportant is that you use a lot
of different modalities, a lotof different ways of engaging
with people but really to helpus as individuals work through
traumas and experiences andthings that we've been holding
(01:14):
on to that maybe we don'tnecessarily need to hold on to,
and I don't think I fullyappreciated the depth of what
that is until, again.
You know, when we met last time, I was sort of like healed.
I was like, oh, I'm doingbetter now, blah, blah, blah.
And then you go back into thatspace and then you're like so
I'd like to ask a question ofyou, like, in terms of healing,
(01:35):
like you've done so manydifferent things.
The question I have is is whenyou were first starting, so,
let's say, like thinking back toyour initial healing journey,
because we've been on much of us, but we've been on many of them
, right, um, do you feel like?
Um, we are conditioned fromyouth to feel like there's like
a fast way to get through thisand like there's one or there's
(01:57):
like one solution, but thatreally like it's a, that's the,
it's like a mess of things thatcome together to heal us, right
like?
I'm curious to know thatevolution within, since you've
seen both the micro and themacro.
Interesting reason why it's soimportant, I think is because a
lot, and why I was so glad thatyou're willing to do it, is that
so many people right now aresuffering from so much trauma in
(02:19):
the world trying to heal, and Idon't know that any of the
things that we've been doinghave been working for us anymore
.
For a lot of people, you know,like I've hearing that a lot
like I've been doing x, I'vebeen doing y and therapy for x
number of years.
You know, and like, for me,what I realized was that it's a
conglomerate.
It's a conglomeration of thingslike there's somatic movement,
(02:39):
there's therapy.
You talk about poetry and diaryand journaling, like you do a
lot of different things, butyou're also so gentle about it,
like and that's, I think, one ofthe things that has struck me
the first, the even.
But OK, I'm going to gush aboutyou a little bit.
So like you're gentle but likeyou're so strong and bold at the
(03:00):
same time Right, like I saw youon your standup comedy and like
you're on stage being verygentle in your talk but at the
same time, like I can see theiron in you right, like it's so
interesting and I feel like thatmust take a lot of work to get
there, to get to that pointwhere you can be, feel strong
but also be soft at the sametime.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
No, it's funny and maybe I shouldn't repeat myself,
because I just was on a podcastthe other day and somebody was
asking me about Ladybug becausethat's the umbrella under which
many of my offerings exist and Iwas talking about Ladybugs and
how they're like delicate andpeople see them as lucky and
(03:41):
beautiful and yet they're alsolittle, fierce creatures and
they can help with pests in thegarden and they kind of gather
together and commune.
So, yeah, I think that existsin me, it probably exists in all
(04:02):
of us, that gentle side, andthen the fierce quality you know
, I feel like I would, I wouldargue for like.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
For a lot of us, I think it's difficult to not
become hardened, right, and solike.
As you start to like, you know,so like, you're, like trauma
over the years, you just kind ofget that hard outer shell and
then it's tough to like, open itup and like and we only like I
remember only seeing it as twopossibilities, right, either I
was hardened and let nobody in,or like I let people in and they
(04:34):
destroyed me.
Speaker 2 (04:35):
Right, I never saw like this, this other side, that
you could be soft and alsostuff that's super interesting,
and the question you just askedme before was also super
interesting, so I don't knowwhere.
Yeah, let's go back to thequestion.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
Let's go back to it.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
But I was saying it felt like we were just dying
into the middle of the oceanwith that amazing question about
are we conditioned?
I think you asked, but is thatthe word you used?
Speaker 1 (05:04):
Yeah, are we conditioned or do we asked?
But is that the word you used?
Yeah, are we conditioned or dowe like?
Speaker 2 (05:06):
we just assume the way it is right is that I do the
thing or I like I'm looking forthe solution, whereas the
solution may actually bemultifaceted yeah and yeah and
and you were mentioning thatI've looked at many different
modalities, as is probably truefor many of us uh and yeah, I
(05:29):
guess there is that thing whereit's like, oh, there must be one
thing that could solve this,and then maybe that idea evolves
over time.
I think really, there's also anidea that it's supposed to be
clean and neat, and fuckingmessy.
Speaker 1 (05:46):
It is so messy, I, you know, I agree.
I think we do feel like it'slike it's linear right, that
it's like okay, I'm gonna dothis, this is this, and now I
feel good and I'm like when, andI've never, I've never done
that, I've never done this, thisand this, and then felt good
it's dynamic, it's chaotic, andwhat?
Speaker 2 (06:05):
if that's okay and that's making me think of orgasm
, mom, you know what is that?
Speaker 1 (06:11):
that that's okay, like what, if it doesn't have to
be a linear, neat, pristineprocess I, you know, and I would
argue that like we've been likewe doesn't need to be, like
there's something um, what's theword freeing in not having it
need to be so neat and tidy,like I almost feel like at some
(06:32):
point oh, you know what, okay,I'm gonna go into some weird
shit here I feel like okay, sohere's what I feel, like at some
point I'm going all the wayback to like Puritans here.
There's like a right and a good, right and neatness is right
and good, and this is right andgood, and a clean healing
process is right and good, right.
(06:52):
So if and I know that thissounds weird just saying it, but
I know, as I'm saying it, thatthis is what I believed at some
point right and like, and ifit's not done cleanly, right and
good, then we feel like there'ssomething wrong with us almost
yeah, and and what if that'sjust not the case?
Speaker 2 (07:11):
and it's making me also think about nature and how
messy and wild nature can be,and what if we can emulate that
in our processes?
Like I just I'm so lucky I livein the middle of manhattan and
I happen to have a privatebackyard.
It's like that's amazing.
It's amazing, and I had treesand I was out there like
(07:32):
sleeping today and I was justlike looking at all these
interesting things that hadfallen from the trees and and
that is what creates such beautyin nature it's willingness to
be chaotic and wild and free.
And what if we could allow thatto exist in our healing process
, without thinking there's aright and a wrong and a good and
(07:53):
a bad?
That's an idea.
The right, wrong, good, bad isan idea for a passive
consciousness that I love.
What if there is no right orwrong or good or bad?
Just shouldn't?
Creation?
And what if everything's achoice?
And choice creates and I alwayssay this, but I just build
those two words together Choicecreates.
Speaker 1 (08:13):
It's like oh baby, it really is.
That actually is so interesting, because I always I think about
choice is like the big thing,like I can, for example, get
like really angry when someonesays something, but then I have
a choice in terms of how Irespond, right, so, and then my
choice creates whatever future.
It is that like.
So I snap at this person.
Well, my future is now createdfor the next 25 minutes.
(08:35):
Right, I don't, and I choose tobreathe in and just recognize
this is my own shit, that I needto deal with.
And again, now I've created itfor 25 minutes and maybe anger
is required sometimes.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
Anger is required sometimes anger is required.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
Right, and definitely I've been in a situation where
anger is required, but I wasthinking specifically of times
where like I, like, I'm like I'mI, where I tend to get like
overwhelmed, and then I'm like,yeah, right, and like it's a
lash out and I know that that's,it's childlike, and so I work
on that right to like and so Idon't that often, but unless I'm
sleepy, and then it's like abratty child, it's really good
to bed.
Um, but that's what I wasthinking about is like, really,
(09:10):
uh, but also, again, like yousaid, making the choice to, if
you're angry, saying the thingfeeling that you talked about
this in your um with, in yourvideo with, uh, peter, and I
thought that Peter, yeah, and Ithought that was really
interesting about letting itwork through your body.
Can you talk a little bit aboutthat, about like anger and like
(09:30):
like how it works that way?
Speaker 2 (09:34):
yeah.
So anger, friend, again from anaccess consciousness
perspective, and people cancheck out access consciousness
at accessconsciousnewscom um I,but um they.
They see when anger shows upthere's a lie attached.
You lied that we're tellingourselves um, or a lie someone
(09:56):
else is telling us, or a lie incondition to believe is true,
mm-hmm.
And it's also known in thatmodel as the distractor.
As far as all of like, theemotions and and what else is
possible that we can tap intoother ways of of being.
(10:16):
Like you said, we can becomeaware and we can make a choice
and tap into other ways of being, but certainly, sometimes,
perhaps that aggressive, fiercequality is required.
And again, thinking of nature,she's just like yo get out of my
(10:38):
way, bitches, look at that.
Right out here, yeah, and likethat's pretty interesting and
amazing.
And then sometimes she's sogentle when you're like looking
into a.
I remember being on ameditation retreat and looking
into this desert flower andthere was a bee in the flower
(11:00):
and it's so cliche and yet itwas so.
It was like, oh my goodness,how can nature be so cliche and
yet it was so amazing.
It's like, oh my goodness, howcan nature be so beautiful and
delicate and intricate?
Um, so it's all that.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
You know, I uh was.
I went to a conference recentlyin hawaii and the the person
who, uh, the keynote speaker wasis a wayfinder and she lives
out on the ocean most of a lotof the year and, um, she was,
she showed.
They have videos of like theocean, things that you only see
in the middle of the ocean andlike.
(11:32):
There's like pristine and quietdays, and then there's like the
violent days, and some of theviolent days don't even look
very violent, like they lookfine, but the swell of the ocean
is so much that it takes themtotally off course.
But if you look at it just fromthe camera, it looks fine, it's
like and um you know.
so you said something about alie and I think that's so
interesting because, you know,sometimes, sometimes I feel like
(11:55):
the lie is like just denial tooright, like it's something
that's scratching, and you'relike, oh, I don't want to.
My wife and I were talkingabout those times where you're
reading like a book, where it'slike a self-help book, or you're
maybe listening to a podcastwhere somebody's saying
something and they say somethingin particular, like maybe inner
child work or whatever, andyou're like I don't need that
shit and you put it down.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
And then it's like oh , oh, what's in that?
Yeah, yeah, I think anywherewhere we're thinking I think you
might be the operative wordthat we gotta turn something up
or turn down our awareness orclose something out, there's
probably something to it I thinkthat's probably so, going to,
(12:42):
um, you know, your uh, you, youruh, living blog and some of the
other.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
Now, actually, let's, let's talk a little about that.
So, uh, sarah jane does a lot,okay, so we talked about access
consciousness.
Uh, now let, and then uh, andwe'll probably, we'll definitely
come back to that because, like, we're just you know, we're
gonna go all over the place, butyou also have a living, a
living blog that you talkedabout and, um, and you talked a
little bit about it in yourvideo with peter, which I'll
have.
I'll share the link because itwas a really great video but, um
(13:07):
, where you talk about how you,um, you write the diary and then
you'll perform the day, butthere's movement and stuff to
where you're moving those thingsthrough the body.
Can you tell me a little bitabout why it's so important to
move these things through thebody?
Like, what does that do?
Speaker 2 (13:24):
Yeah, so LadyBug has multiple different offerings,
some of which I created and someare other people's modalities
that I've been trained tofacilitate.
So the living love was mycreation and I basically write a
diary entry, read it and thenhear it, typically with erotic
movement, and then other peoplein the audience get to do that
(13:51):
too.
now you have them writesomething in that moment, and
then right, it's all spontaneousbecause I know for me and my
ocd and my perfectionistsometimes, that, um, the the
inclination to go back and editand edit and edit can, can get
in your way.
Yeah, that's great, it's aspontaneous process.
I write the entry in themorning, I perform it on a stage
(14:13):
of the evening, I pair it witherotic movement and, yes, um,
and then and then every beoffice to do it.
So we take, you know, 30, 40minutes to write, read and move.
And, yeah, it's, I think it'sthe body's wisdom, um, to allow
ourselves to move anythingthrough the body.
(14:35):
It's such a beautiful, amazingway to release any toxic energy
or anything.
That's like stirred up To mewhenever I like go to a dance
class or swim or take a walk oreven just want to become really
aware of my breath and I'm sortof moving through that and it
(14:57):
makes such a difference.
Yeah, it's like listening tothe body and her amazing
awareness, like and yet most ofthe time, like you meant,
they're just like a tuning outor there's like a wrong, bad.
And what if we could justlisten to our bodies?
They're so infinitely wise.
Speaker 1 (15:18):
I've been thinking about this a lot lately, about
listening to your body and how Idon't feel, like I definitely
know that Like it's something I,it's a practice, right.
So when I was in practice, itmade a difference, like as you
were talking about likebreathing, and it's funny, I
actually literally did was inpractice.
It made a difference, like asyou were talking about like
breathing, and it's funny, Iactually literally did a TikTok
video about this this morningwas, yeah, about just breathing,
because you know what I'vestarted to feel and I like it's
(15:42):
weird because, oh, like over thelast year, so I've started to
like feel energy moving, right,so like I feel like when I am in
the zone and my energy is likehere, right, and so it means
that every piece of energy thatI have is it looks like a funnel
, like an alien head right,almost coming off my body, but
it's nowhere anywhere here,right?
So there's things going on inhere that I'm not even feeling
(16:03):
pain, whatever it is hunger, Igot to pee, I just I don't know
any of it, right?
If I don't hear it, I don't feelit, and um, and then, like you
said, you take that deep breathand now I realize I'm not
sitting up, I'm not lettinggravity hold my weight Right,
and it is so important because,like it, almost like just not
(16:25):
letting gravity hold my weight,for example, is hurting my back
Right.
So if I just sit down on thegravity hold my weight.
So do you find that in theseexercises where you're like,
when you do these, uh, yourliving blog, do you find that
people find a new way oflistening to their body or like,
is it?
How does that?
What kind of experiences dopeople have in terms of the mind
body connection?
Speaker 2 (16:46):
Yeah, I'd say, in any of the offerings that I provide
, usually there's a bodilycomponent, because I just think
our bodies are so smart, a lotof time either tuning them out
or judging them.
And what if we listened?
And I was looking at yourInstagram and looking at like
(17:07):
before agreements and that youcame up with other arrangements
that you prefer, and part ofthat was listening to your body.
Yeah, and there I think that'samazing.
And yes, all of the practicesessentially that I offer involve
listening, and listeningwithout judgment or conclusion,
(17:29):
and I think in so doing, you canchange your whole life.
You can change whateversituation is coming up if you so
choose, and you can change yourwhole way of operating, because
we kind of end up in a defaultsetting of of judgment or you
know, chronic worry about the ifa pain shows up.
(17:50):
It's not like buddy, that's that.
It's like oh my god, what'sthat?
It's cancer have to walk with acan or whatever we decide is
gonna happen?
And what if we just oh, thanks,body, thanks for that
information.
I think that can change ourwhole.
I think that can change ourwhole existence.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
That is so.
It is so true, like judgment.
I feel like judgment is ourdefault state and not just like
for.
It's like for everything, rightLike.
I've started to notice how muchand I'm just going to make
numbers up here 100% of thepeople I know, so it's not 100.
(18:34):
They're going to go for atleast 99.
Talk about themselves in areally negative way, right, yeah
, it's usually judgment ofourselves, judgment of ourselves
.
I don't mean even judgment ofothers.
I'm talking about ourselves,right Like.
We judge ourselves like soharshly and in silence of our
minds, I think, which makes itworse because once you write it
down, you have to face it, seeit, deal with it, right, but
(18:55):
it's usually just that monologuein our heads.
So I'm interested now, actually.
So you have, let's go into thenext one caress, right, where
there's, and I'll let you sharea little bit about what that is.
But because I want to ask aquestion about caress, because
something I've been thinkingabout a lot is the need for us,
our body, to be touched, even ifby ourselves, right Like, and I
(19:17):
feel like we don't do that asmuch anymore.
There's articles all over theplace to talk about how people
are not having as much sex,there's not a lot of touching
happening, and I feel likethat's creating a trauma in and
of itself.
Right, and then can you tell mea little bit about that and
then dive into caress a littlebit about what that, what that,
what the purpose of that was andhow that impacts people?
Speaker 2 (19:37):
Sure, yeah, I think touch is such a beautiful option
and now most of us have twohands not everyone, but a lot of
people have two hands and can,or at least one hand, and and
you can touch yourself, and thatcan make all the difference as
well.
Maybe your wrists are sorebecause you're like texting or
(20:00):
typing, you know, just give yourwrists a massage, like what you
said, is awesome, just likegiving ourselves.
That touch can be so profoundand, of course, receiving it
from others can be amazing aswell.
I mean, it's another thing thatI incorporated in most of my
practices.
(20:21):
So, yes, caress is specificallyabout self-stimulation and it
started.
It used to be for people with aclitoris only and we literally
stroke our clitoris during thepractice and maybe about two
years into it we started openingthe doors for everybody and
(20:44):
it's basically a meditationwhere I lead people through a
self-stimulation practice, whereI lead people through a
self-stimulation practice, andit started about three years ago
and it's been an amazingcontribution.
I can speak for myself thatit's really contributed to my
transformations.
(21:05):
And then, of course, I hearthat from clients as well.
I literally believe I healed.
You know, I got a Cree cancerdiagnosis.
I think that healed throughcaress, through access,
consciousness, through a dietaryswitch.
I've been more.
You know it's almost an eyeroll how much we hear like
(21:28):
you've got to love yourself andreally spending time with
yourself while being incommunion with others and in
community with your body canreally change things pretty
dynamically in terms of not onlyhow we interact with ourselves
but also the world and withother people, like it's uh,
(21:50):
essential, I say, to self-touchand self-suicide touch.
And yet, as you're done,probably not many people's
default setting.
I mean they may touch indifferent ways, but not that you
know intentional loving,nurturing, whatever's required.
(22:12):
Maybe it's a firm massage,maybe it's a light touch.
It's just not something peopletend to necessarily practice and
it can be sent to you tocontribution.
Just you know, and that'ssomething you can do, you know
you can practice to older, youcan grab your stovetop or
whatever.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
You know exactly now like I could, we could sit and
rub ourselves, which I do a lot.
Uh, you know I spin.
Rubbing myself is because it'show I self-soothe, so and it's
funny, before I knew I wasautistic, I didn't actually
understand that that's what Iwas doing, and then now I know,
so I just kind of like lean intoit.
You know you said somethingabout judgment.
(22:55):
I want to come back to that.
I want to tie a couple ofthings in.
Let's loop back a little bit to.
You were talking about yourclients in terms of releasing
themselves with judgment and soon.
So, in the bigger pictureconversation about releasing
ourselves with judgment, I'mcurious to know, like when you
work with clients, what are someof the because?
Like, what we're talking aboutnow and this is what I love
about you right Is like I reallylove the unexpected.
(23:23):
I love it when people are doingthings that challenge what we
think about, as whatever it isthat we think like in in, like
so for my audience, this issomething totally new and I love
that because it's like dude,have you ever thought about this
before?
You know, and it's it.
And so, whatever the reason whyI think it's important is
because so many of us rush tojudgment of ourselves, right,
and we don't believe.
And when we think aboutself-care, right, you were
(23:44):
saying an eye roll withself-care and self-love and that
does exist.
Because you know I don't wantto say it like this because
people, self-care is massages,but you know what Massages are.
Self-care, like it's reallyfucking good.
I need like no knocking that.
But like, are you in thatmoment saying to yourself, like
(24:14):
when you're getting the massage,are you really like owning and
saying I'm doing this, like I am, I love you, I care about you?
Or like, do you find with yourclients that initially they're
like doing the thing, but thatinner, like phantom working,
phantom judgment, phantom stuffis still there and I'm curious
to know how do you recommendthat?
People kind of like what is,what are some of the activities
that help massage people out ofthat space?
Speaker 2 (24:27):
No, that's interesting, I mean, I think at
first it still exists, even whenwe're practicing something
different.
And yet just the awareness thatwe're, you know, self judging,
or that we're rushing throughsomething, or that, you know,
rather than giving yourself agentle or a firm grip, you're
(24:51):
like digging your nails intoyour flesh, just having the
awareness of what we're doingcan also be different, and that
can come with different embodiedpractices, that can come with
caress, that can come with,which is kind of like a form of
meditation we are stillstimulating.
(25:14):
There is a sense of an orgasmicstate, and it's a form of
meditation that's likecultivating this awareness of
all of our body's responses, andjust that awareness can be a
contribution.
And the awareness awarenesswithout judgment or conclusion,
(25:36):
again, not like oh, no, you knowI'm doing it again and I'm
wrong in bet, but just like oh,here it is, you know.
Thank you for that information.
And and what else is possibledoes?
Speaker 1 (25:48):
that make?
Yeah, absolutely, and I thinkyou know, with something like
caress specifically.
You know, because that I agreewith you like self stimulation
is very meta because it's hardto like.
I found my, you know you getdistracted, right, but
eventually you start to get to aspace like just like any
meditation, where initiallyyou're like going here, you're
going there, whatever, and theneventually you start to get into
like the and I think it helpsbecause it is, you know, such a
(26:11):
powerful feeling physically aswell, that it does help to
create that sort of and I thinkthe other thing, that is, it's
almost like the only way out isthrough whatever it is Like you
know it's.
I often find that I and thiswas also in your I just loved
your conversation with Peterwhere you talked about everybody
should listen to that fullthing.
(26:31):
It's like super great Shit.
Hold on, we were talking about.
What was I just saying?
Seriously, I looked down atPeter and then I lost Just say
were we saying right before thatwe're talking about?
Uh?
Speaker 2 (26:49):
he said meditation.
It's a meditation that'll touchme.
I think you were gonna maybereference a personal story, were
you or?
Speaker 1 (26:58):
no, I was gonna reference something he said
specifically because I thoughtit was super interesting,
related to um getting stuck inyour own head and then, I don't
know, it'll come back again,it'll come back again.
But I was like, oh, but it wasa very good one, um, so, uh,
shit, now I will come backaround, um, you're good, so okay
, yeah, so the question he hebrought up is something totally
(27:19):
different.
Just to like something that Ihad that I was curious about is
I?
I thought this was reallyinteresting, right, he was
talking about how, because I,you know, when you were on the,
I said watch your comedy thatyou sent me and it was, and it
was great.
And you were like I said, youwere gentle but strong, and I
and I and it didn't occur to mein that moment how many stages
(27:41):
you'd actually already been on,how many things like it's this
point, you know that you'veworked.
And you said something aboutwhether or not someone shows up.
You do the practice, yeah, andI thought that was really
interesting because I think fora lot of people, right, he was
saying how if you go to a comedyshow and there's a comedian
talking, then you're all therefor the comedy show.
(28:04):
So we're all together.
We know you're supposed to befunny and I'm supposed to laugh
and we're all we're in theretogether, right, but you're
doing this event whethersomebody shows up or not, and so
that takes a lot of pressureoff, right, so that people can.
And I find that to be like whenyou started, that was that
scary for you.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
I mean, I think you must be referring to Living Live
in Cairo.
I used to do it down the street.
There was a theater and abasement and I would go and
clean the theater and thenperform and I would do all of
the pieces, went to the back toturn on the music, to do the
lighting and, yeah, sometimesthere were people and sometimes
(28:47):
there weren't, and I just had acommitment that I was going to
do this regardless.
Do it, I think that's.
I know it was Fridays at oneo'clock or something, so maybe
you're an hour and I was goingto do this regardless.
So, if there was no one in theaudience, if there was one
person, if there were 25, I wasgoing to do it.
And I think that level ofcommitment it is helpful.
(29:09):
But that's again not to makeanyone rather bad.
If you don't commit tosomething, that's fine too.
Like, um, I, for me, I like a, adaily practice, or I like the
consistent practice, yeah, andand for me that the, the
modalities that I've developed,whether it's the Living Blog or
(29:29):
Caress, I do them regularly, notonly for my clientele but for
myself.
Right, it's really a benefit.
So at that time I was doing theLiving Blog, like as a lunch
hour thing every week in thattheater I also Caress typically
takes place just to be so wittyabout it when you typically do
(29:51):
it on the new moon and the fullmoon, and then we also have
consecutive day practices and Ireally like that for me and my
body.
I like that consistency, like Ilike to you to just rely on.
Okay, I know this is coming up,I know this is happening.
(30:13):
I especially like the dailyinteraction the daily practices,
because it's just like it's away to show up regularly for
others and for myself, and tosee how unique each day unfolds.
You know, like there's certainyoga practices where you do the
exact same poses every day andyet they feel so different.
(30:35):
Yeah, yeah, we show updifferently each day and and the
same is true for caress it'slike when there's a consecutive
day practice and we're showingup each day to, to, to do this
together.
It's like some days maybeorgasm is flying, or some days
maybe I'm really caught up in myhead and it's just like doing
(30:58):
it no matter what, and so doingit with the living body.
It was like doing it whether ornot there was an audience, um,
but any other daily practicepractice, it's showing up for
yourself regardless.
Speaker 1 (31:13):
I think that's the I think for many of us.
I think that's the challenge.
You know, it's interesting,like it's all about
accountability, almost right.
Like you have these events.
You're like I'm going to dothis, so I'm going to have this
event in public and then that'llmake sure I'm and it's.
I was thinking about my I golive now on, I used to go live
every Monday um years ago when Iwas a marketing coach and a
business coach and I wouldbasically go live every Monday
(31:34):
and then it actually ended upbecoming an everyday thing.
Because some people were like,oh, we want this every day.
Uh, that it just became to metoo much.
But, um, but I did it because Iwanted to start my Mondays off
positively right.
Like I was tired of starting myMondays off like just Monday, I
don't like Mondays.
And so I was like, okay, youknow what, I'm just going to go
live on Mondays and now I haveto have a good attitude.
(31:54):
So I started going live so thatI would start the Monday with
like enthusiasm and happinessand joy.
And then you know, that justbecame what I did, but that was
years and years ago, as I nowI'm doing it again, but it's
(32:14):
about, like you said, thepractice, because you know, I
feel like we do the thing andthen we're like, oh, I'm healed.
And then we stop doing thething and then we're like, shit,
we have to do the thing againand it's very intense yeah, and
and what if that's okay?
Speaker 2 (32:26):
I mean, what if that is part of the whole process,
like, what if it is?
Speaker 1 (32:31):
messy.
I mean, for me it pretty, is mywife it's interesting when she
gets her mind set on something,track this and have it built
right in Awesome.
But for me it's messy, yeah,and cool.
I think that it goes back tothat's what I've been working on
right now.
So I am seeing I knew there wasa reason.
(32:51):
We did this now again because,like that's the thing I think
that we're we're so hyperfixated on judgment again
because we're so, like I think,we're so busy judging ourselves
Right.
So, like the, that releasingevery so often of your judgment
of yourself just creates moreopportunities for you to stop
(33:11):
judging other people totally,there's space beside.
Speaker 2 (33:15):
Yeah, also an excess consciousness.
Sorry if I'm jumping all overthe place, but I am too with
adhd man.
Speaker 1 (33:20):
I'm just all over the place okay, amazing.
Speaker 2 (33:23):
I think that's a superpower, so that's awesome.
Um, but an idea of like you, wecould do it together now, just
lowering your walls and yourbarriers and just you know
exactly how to do that.
Just lowering your walls andyour barriers, slowing your
walls and your barriers.
The idea of being that and thatfor me helps me kind of reduce
(33:46):
judgment.
I kind of immediately got intouch with myself and I kind of
I'm just like, oh, I don't haveto be um the defensive, yeah,
and I think of like rigid stickcan break really easily where a
piece of string is more valuable.
Um, and I just, yeah, just thepractice of lowering your walls
(34:10):
and your barriers, like what ifwe don't have to be in our armor
all the time, especiallyagainst ourselves?
Speaker 1 (34:20):
have you found?
And actually speaking to that?
Actually, because when I was,actually, I was conversation
with luca stella the other dayand they were.
The conversation was about andI'll be on a later podcast but
it was about safety in theworkplace, right, and like how a
lot of people at work, you know, we'll say, oh, work is like a
family, work is like a family.
And I said I don't subscribe tothat at all.
(34:41):
And we had actually a reallyinteresting conversation where I
changed my mind.
But and here's what happened,right, they said, listen, you
spend.
And I actually expected them tobe like totally on board with
that.
Oh, yeah, I don't.
And they were like, no, itabsolutely should be like your
family, you spend all your timewith these people, and so on.
And so I said, ok, I was like,but it's not safe for many
(35:04):
people to think that theircorporations or their their
family, because, like, theydon't have that same thing back,
and so what was interesting isthat they said that.
So we came to this conclusionthat what it is is is you want
your work to be like your family, and so you want to find a
place where it is safe for youto feel that way.
So what you're suggesting?
You know opening up is um isscary, right, if you're not in a
(35:27):
safe space.
So I'm curious to know have you, over the years, curated your
circle so that you are likesurrounded by people, or do you
find that you are safe in whichto open up or cause?
I mean, you do this in publictoo.
So it's not entirely safe, likeyou're creating the safe space
for other people, but like youyourself are the one out there
(35:49):
bringing this all down.
So I'm interested, I'minterested in how have you
navigated that space of safetyfor you?
Speaker 2 (35:56):
Yeah, I think I.
It did not always be thesaddest for me.
I often felt unsafe and andthat has changed quite a bit I
it's a rare occasion in thesedays that I feel unsafe, even
though I'm five foot two womanin New York City.
Maybe other people like me feelless safe.
(36:19):
I think it was for me accessconsciousness that helped me
make that shift where, thatshift where and this could be a
little out there, but they'relike would you be willing to
receive everything and loweryour walls and your barriers?
So, even so, there's like areally benign example.
Say, you're in, like in a storeand somebody's like really
(36:40):
pushing a product on you, likethe inclination might be to put
up your walls and your barriers,the person might keep pushing,
whereas if you just and it'senergetic and it can be conveyed
through language as well if youjust lower your walls and your
barriers, the person relents.
It's really fascinating towitness and to experience, and
(37:05):
so I think in the past I wasalways in a state of like I was
saying defense myself andeveryone else and fear and lack
of safety, even though I wasstill doing my best
professionally to co-create thatfor others.
Now I typically feel safe.
And if there's ever a question,I find a way to get into a safe
(37:31):
place, and sometimes it's justworking with my own body,
lowering my walls and mybarriers.
I might have that inclinationto put them up.
Okay, let me lower my walls andmy barriers.
What am I aware of?
Um, and, and knowing that wealso and this is another idea
from access consciousness, wepick up on the thoughts,
(37:51):
feelings and emotions of all thepeople around us.
So what am I picking up on?
You know what collectiveconcept or what other person's
thing am I?
Am I am I picking up on?
And what can I do different?
And is this even mine?
And if it's not mine, I canreturn to sender.
Speaker 1 (38:13):
And that has been so powerful for me.
The return to sender it's notalways yours.
Speaker 2 (38:18):
In fact, it's probably usually not ours right,
we're just like buying into thethoughts, feelings and emotions
and and access, not just andthis is not the only modality
that says that.
I mean, buddhism says that aswell that we're picking up on
other people and other ideas,and whether it's our mom in
childhood or our uncle or ourcousin or, you know, our friends
(38:40):
or the collective, it's likewhat, if we can know this, that
it's not ours.
So you know, for me, I think,when I used to feel so unsafe,
perhaps I was picking up onother people around me, or
perhaps I was picking up on aformer version of myself, but
now I typically have a sense ofsafety and I think in creating
(39:07):
that for that, in creating thatfor oneself, it's helpful.
You know, it's perhaps easierto cultivate it for other people
.
Speaker 1 (39:14):
Not that I have the power necessarily to do that,
but I I do my best and andhelping create those spaces for
everyone well, I think that Imean, like you know, in the end,
of course each individual weall have to like our own sense
of safety is our own, but at thesame time, like, there's
environments in which safety youknow, in the end, of course
each individual we all have tolike our own sense of safety is
our own, but, at the same time,like, there's environments in
which safety you know, where youcreate a feeling like, okay,
(39:34):
I'm safe here.
So for you know, like I've got,I've been to events like
conventions or whatever, whereeverything's fine, everything's
absolutely fine, but I don'tfeel particularly safe in that
event.
You know, and I just know thatI'm gonna have to just keep my
mask on, like my physical mask,my emotional mask.
Everything has to be right, umand like, and what I'm trying to
work for myself is isrecognizing again, like, okay,
(39:56):
if you're physically unsafe,then can we move out of it, but
if, like this is somethingthat's going on within me, what
can I do to kind of like,massage that out?
Speaker 2 (40:04):
I and that's I, I'm pleased yeah, and like that idea
that we were mentioning earlier, like I think okay, so maybe
you're gaining some awarenesslike what is that?
Rather than I think sometimesour inclination I'm not saying
this is true for you is like youshut it out, like, oh, I don't
want to be aware of this, or youknow, oh for I have done that
(40:24):
for sure at points in my lifeand we get freaked out by things
.
And what if it could just belike oh shoot, what am I aware
of here?
Like maybe this is, maybe Ineed to leave, or maybe I need
to take a job home, or you knowwhat I mean.
Like rather than walk, or likewe're so aware, like maybe
you're actually just aware andit's not something to shut out
or to make wrong.
Maybe you're actually justaware and it's not something to
(40:46):
shut out or to make wrong.
Speaker 1 (40:50):
I think that that is sort of like.
The central thing really formany of us is that we are aware
we trust our like, but we don'ttrust our bodies as much as we
would like to because, honestly,of years, of the voices of like
you're and this is wrong, dothis, oh, you know, whatever it
is, you know I don't want to hug.
(41:11):
Let him hug you.
He's your uncle, right?
That kind of thing Like thosemake you question your own gut
instincts and, like you said,it's almost like a trauma
healing thing, right Cause, likeyou know, initially, you're,
you know, I know for myself whatyou said is true.
I denied it.
You just push it down, youdon't deal with it, everything's
fine, everything's fine, right,and.
But then you eventually decideor you don't, but you decide.
(41:34):
I personally decided that Idon't want to live like that,
right.
Speaker 2 (41:37):
So now you have to like consciously, unwrap your
tension, really tension, fromaround a bowl that's awesome,
yeah, instead of, like so manypeople do, of like shoving it
out and I'm sure we've all donethat once in our lives and it's
like listening can be such acontribution, even if it's like
(42:02):
ways that what you're, you know,your breath, listening to your
breath or listening like youknow am I not meant to be in
this convention?
Or or, hey, you know this, Ihave this pain.
What is this?
That's huge.
Speaker 1 (42:20):
I love this.
Okay, so now you know, as Irealized, like, I just looked at
the clock and we're alreadylike 45 minutes.
I'm like holy shit, how didthat happen?
So, okay, I want to make surethat people know how to find you
, where to find you and how youhelp them.
So, uh, it's probably gonna beat the beginning, because I
gotta just dove into the veryend.
Hello everyone, and welcome tothe stop shitting all over
yourself podcast.
I'm here, uh, with sarah janewellock.
(42:42):
Welcome, welcome, uh.
Actually, this is the end, guys, I'm just being silly here, uh,
but now I'm going to put thatpart at the beginning.
But tell us where we can findyou, please tell us.
I mean, we talked about a lotof different things.
So what I'd love is if youshared the thing that you want
to share with people and like interms of this is where you find
me, and that kind of thing.
Speaker 2 (42:59):
Sure, I mean, there's so many places to find me,
which could be confusing.
I main site isladybugcalendarcom and that
through the ladybug calendar youcan see what's happening and
all the different things I offer.
Speaker 1 (43:12):
So, depending on when this will go up I'm next week-
this is like I'm literallyediting, recording it next week
like I, because I I held thisweek, so I've already done all
the graphics with your number onit and I was like I don't want
to re-edit amazing.
Speaker 2 (43:28):
So I'm considering a 31 day caress practice for May,
because it's a nationalmasturbation month.
Speaker 1 (43:37):
Fabulous, I didn't know we had a national
masturbation month.
Speaker 2 (43:39):
Yes, so people can find me at caressme
thelivingblognet.
Speaker 1 (43:49):
I mean, there's so many the links are all going to
be in the show notes, so don'tyou worry.
So actually I just realized areyou starting it on beltane?
Because my wife just sent me aninvitation for beltane, which
is she calls it, that's our sexholiday.
So she's like it's the sexholiday, that's great.
Speaker 2 (44:06):
Yeah, it's not official yet, but I think I'm
gonna do it, um I I keep gettingat this yeah, no, no, I got,
you got okay.
Speaker 1 (44:14):
So well, I will make sure this will be up well before
then.
So everybody sign up.
You are a psychologist.
I tell you things, to make alist.
(44:35):
You've got special powers,though.
You make me scared, you make mego.
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