July 9, 2024 • 42 mins
Are you training for the next decade? Can therapeutic yoga revolutionize the way we approach back pain and functional mobility?
Join us for a captivating conversation with Dr. Nydia Tijerina Darby, a physical therapist and therapeutic yoga specialist. Dr. Darby is always training for the next decade. Discover how Nydia’s passion for movement helped her combat anxiety and depression, setting her on a path to a rewarding career that blends physical therapy and yoga.
Nydia Tijerina Darby is a Doctor of Physical Therapy, Therapeutic Yoga Specialist and Certified Yoga Therapist. She is an experienced yoga educator, writer, published author, and international presenter on Therapeutic Yoga Lifestyle practices.
Dr. Darby developed the Therapeutic Astanga Method© over 40 years and is the Owner & Creative Director of the Open Hand Institute and Nydia’s Yoga Therapy Studio in San Antonio, Texas. Nydia offers continuing education to clinicians in various fields introducing integrative methods of practicing into their lives and clinical work. She also provides community access to therapeutic yoga through her studio.
During our conversation we break down common misconceptions about yoga, challenging the idea that you need to be extremely flexible or fit a certain mold to benefit from its practice. Nydia shares the reasons why she wrote her book "Therapeutic Yoga Works:A Gentle Approach to Eliminating Back Pain and Improving Functional Mobility for Life." Her book is dedicated to making yoga accessible to everyone, emphasizing inclusivity and body positivity. We talk about the gentle yet effective methods she teaches to alleviate back pain and improve functional mobility, all backed by scientific research.
Dr. Nydia collaborates with faculty at The University of Texas Health in San Antonio on scientific research. Her research, with Dr. Amelie Ramirez, focuses on therapeutic yoga for cancer survivors. Their research found that yoga can be as effective as traditional exercise in improving health outcomes for cancer survivors. Their study revealed significant improvements in respiratory capacity, mental health, and reduced inflammation. We also talk about the importance of self-care for clinicians and the integration of therapeutic yoga into physical therapy practices. In 'preparing for the next decade,' Dr. Darby promotes preventative care to achieve holistic health and balance.
You can find Dr. Darby's book here: "THERAPEUTIC YOGA WORKS: A Gentle Approach to Eliminating Back Pain and Improving Functional Mobility for Life."
Therapeutic Yoga Lifestyle Immersions, Therapeutic Yoga Trainings & Medical Continuing Education. The Open Hand Institute.
You can watch some of Dr. Nydia's videos on her YouTube channels:
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Dr. Nydia (00:00):
Nydia Tijerina Darby.
I am a physical therapist, adoctor of physical therapy, a
therapeutic yoga specialist andthe owner and creative director
of the Open Hand Institute andNydia's Yoga Therapy Studio here
in San Antonio, Texas.
I like to do therapeutic yogaresearch and I kind of dabble in
a lot of different things, butpretty much I like to get people
(00:22):
upside down and help them learnhow to take care of themselves
for the long term.
Judy Oskam (00:29):
Welcome to Stories of Change and Creativity.
I'm Judy Oskam and I'm superexcited to share my conversation
with Dr .
Nydia is a doctor of physicaltherapy, a therapeutic yoga
specialist and a certified yogatherapist.
Her book is entitledTherapeutic Yoga Works A Gentle
(00:51):
Approach to Eliminating BackPain and Improving Functional
Mobility for Life, and Nydiasays she's been preparing for
the next decade since she was inher 20s and she helps us all do
that as well.
I hope you enjoy my interviewwith Dr .
How did you get into this inthe first place?
Dr. Nydia (01:14):
Oh gosh, it is a long story, but I've been teaching
exercise since I was 15 yearsold.
I, you know, didn't realize it,but movement, just, I just
loved it.
And you know, didn't realize it, but movement, just, uh, I just
loved it.
And you know, in high school,as in dance team, I was then
promoted to a position where Iwas leading the girls in our um,
(01:38):
stretching and strengtheningand flexibility, and that was my
role in my in in in that teamand and I then I also started
teaching exercise at a local gym.
And so, interestingly enough,when I went through um, finished
high school, I already knewthat I wanted, had a medical
(01:59):
bent, I wanted to do somethingin medicine.
But I had realized that, um,and I thought, oh yes, I'm going
to medical school and I'll be adoctor.
I had a few medical challengesthat were related to stress.
Everybody thought I had astomach problem, but it really
was anxiety, stress.
Judy Oskam (02:20):
Interesting, interesting.
Dr. Nydia (02:22):
So while I'm young this way, that's a whole other
story.
But while I'm young this way,I'm going to the doctor every so
often and I realized that Ionly would see my doctor for
about five minutes and that wasabout it.
It was real short, and I lovepeople.
So in my mind, by the time I'ma senior, I'm thinking I don't
(02:45):
think I need to be a physician.
You don't spend enough timewith them, with the patients.
So by the time I'm a senior,I'm looking, you know,
scrambling, like what am I goingto be?
What am I going to do?
And I found physical therapy andI read about it in a course
manual.
I never knew anybody who hadhad physical therapy, but it
(03:05):
looked good.
It said something, somethinglike a physical therapist helped
people with injuries, theyhelped them learn how to walk,
they massage and you know, andthey teach them exercise.
And I went check, check, check.
I like those things.
So I found Texas Women'sUniversity.
It was in Dentonxas.
I grew up in McAllan, Texas,which was at that time a nine
(03:26):
hour drive.
Yes, yes, you know.
And so I just um, I got intothe curriculum, got into school.
That was another long drawn outprocess, but I'm teaching
exercise during my college years.
I'm also taking dance andmovement while I'm taking.
My preparatory work forphysical therapy to get into my
(03:49):
first degree was a bachelor's ofscience in physical therapy,
and that was back in the daywhen you could get a bachelor's.
And then from there I'm moving,I'm teaching exercise.
I'm already beginning to meetsome of the healthiest people
I've ever met in my early yearsand in my early 20s and I'm
(04:10):
seeing some things and I'mtaking mental notes.
They had a positive outlook onlife, they were active, they
moved in some form or fashionevery day and they had a belief
in a higher power, and I saw itin the healthiest people and I
also saw the direct opposite inthe least healthy.
Judy Oskam (04:30):
So I'm taking mental notes and I'm thinking In your
20s.
Let me remind the listenersthis is in your 20s.
Oh my gosh, I didn't have thattogether in my 20s to really put
it all together, but you wereactually looking for a career
that combined some of thosethings as a senior in high
school, right?
Dr. Nydia (04:51):
Yeah, you know, I didn't realize it.
What I didn't know then was whyI loved exercise so much and
what was happening is it was mymedicine for the anxiety I had.
Anxiety and depression, youknow, very high level
functioning depressed personreally, you know hi, and back
(05:12):
then they didn't talk about itthat much, right?
Judy Oskam (05:13):
It wasn't something people talked about?
Dr. Nydia (05:16):
Oh, especially in the Hispanic culture.
No, I'm Mexican American, youknow, it's like.
You know, get over your badself.
You know you're feeling bad, goon, go work, go do something
and you'll feel better.
You know, it's like you know,get over your bad self.
You know you're feeling bad,moving on, yeah, go work, go do
something and you'll feel better, you know.
So it just kind of happened thatway and I'm collecting
information from my clients,from my patients, about how to
(05:39):
be the healthiest.
And because I was lovingteaching, exercise and doing the
physical therapy, noweventually I become a physical
therapist.
I'm thinking to myself how canI help myself move through the
decades with grace?
And so I started looking fornow I'm a clinician, I'm doing
orthopedic and spine care,neurological care, and I'm
(06:03):
looking for that thing that Icould do for me.
You know, I'm a runner and Ilike to swim and I do things and
I'm exercising and leadingexercise.
But what can I do for me sothat I could be the strongest,
most able, 90 year old, mm-hmm?
And.
And so I started reading about,you know, Qigong, tai Chi,
(06:27):
eastern medicine, martial arts,yoga, Pilates.
You know, at that time I lovedto read and I learned by reading
, and so I'm one of those.
Give me a technical manual,okay, let's have some fun here.
I'll figure out how to takeapart a toilet, you know?
No problem, I can do this.
So that's what I did.
(06:47):
I'm reading and I'm reading andfinally, eventually, I put down
.
The yoga just made sense, andbecause movement and exercise
are second nature to me, I juststarted looking at the pictures,
or you know the briefdescription.
There wasn't a lot of real good, you know instruction, but I
could figure this out, and Irealized that many of the
(07:11):
traditional yoga postures werereally difficult, they were not
easy to do and I couldn't see.
You know, I was having troubleand I was in my early 20s, later
20s, when I was out by thistime and I was having difficulty
with some of the postures and Icouldn't imagine my patients or
(07:31):
my clients being successful.
And it hurts me to the corewhen someone has a perception
that they can't do something,when it's a false perception,
you know, it's one thing.
If you know you really can't dosomething, that's fine.
But if it's something like ohno, nydia, I, there's never, I'd
(07:52):
never be able to stand and dothat position, you know.
So it's began.
I'm doing this practice in myhome, in my living room, for
myself, and it's influencingeverything.
It's influencing me as aclinician.
I'm still teaching exercise ata local gym one night a week.
It's influencing the way thatI'm seeing the world, and that's
(08:17):
because I was just doing thephysical practice.
I was doing breath work andthat was significant, and then I
was trying to keep breathingwhile I'm trying to stay, you
know, standing on one leg, andit was difficult, so that just
continued.
And eventually, while I wasdoing small groups and educating
(08:39):
the community on things thatwere easy for me to share, that
I thought were important, likehow to take care of your back,
or I do a little littleworkshops to small groups, like
your knee pain, what does itmean?
Now you know, what do you donext, and so all of those things
are just kind of comingtogether.
They're me sharing with thecommunity.
(09:01):
You know, one of the thingsthat I did as a physical
therapist and in my I had in mydouble life, which was physical
therapist and a fitness trainer.
Then this was before I, youknow, I pretty much came out as
a yoga instructor you put it alltogether right right, yes, you
know I'm already doing some typeof therapeutic yoga, but I'm
(09:22):
not talking about it.
But one of the things that washappening is that it was I was
working to try to help peoplewho I noticed clinically in the
clinic.
In the physical therapy clinicwe would have very specific
direction of a diagnosis leftelbow pain or biceps tear and in
(09:47):
the medical model we, becauseof the insurance industry,
third-party payer, we had to bevery direct to working on that
bicep, working on that elbow,whatever the part was.
And the third-party payer didnot appreciate when those of us
who worked holistically this isa whole human being, it's not
(10:10):
just an elbow.
This is not an elbow, you knowand they would be denying claims
and I was in charge of myclinic, so I was the one that
would call them up and sayplease share with me where you
have your medical degree.
That's telling me that you knowbetter than I do what this
person needs.
So that always made it a littlebit adventurous when I was a
(10:33):
clinician because I could.
I my whole entire career.
I've always seen my patients,or my clients, as a whole person
, mind, body, spirit.
This is someone who has a kneepain or knee injury, but they
also are a mother of three.
They are now not able to workbecause their job was very
(10:57):
physical and their whole worldis now upside down.
And another person might say oh, come on, lady, it's just knee
pain.
You know, get your act together.
It's like, no, this is majorbecause the stress involves you
know.
So, anyway, you know all ofthat over time, melded into what
(11:19):
I do now, which is combinephysical therapy, my experiences
in physical therapy, fitnessand yoga over 40 years, and this
process is designed to helpempower individuals to move the
(11:40):
best that they can, to recognizetheir strengths and be aware of
their limitations too.
This isn't about you know, justget in there and do the work.
But what you know, how do weknow when to say when you know?
enough you know, and to preservethe body, but not just the body
the mind and the spirit.
(12:00):
And and I joke about it and Isay, you know, when people ask
me, what do you do, I get peopleupside down.
That's what I do and literallyI do.
But also I get you know theseprocesses of when you start to
teach someone to begin to payattention to their breathing.
We're working on helping themsettle their mind, calm the
(12:25):
nervous nervous system and tobecome a little more
introspective, and that's not aneasy process.
So I start with the physical.
I say here, let's just do thisstrength or this stretch
activity, let's do this posture,and oh, while you're doing that
, let's, you know, keepbreathing.
And before you know it, if theykeep doing it, they begin to
(12:49):
change.
Judy Oskam (12:50):
Well, and having done one of your classes before,
I love that it's been a while.
Was that before the pandemic?
I think it was before thepandemic.
Dr. Nydia (12:59):
Was it after the pandemic?
It was after After the pandemic.
Judy Oskam (13:02):
Well, I did one of her sessions.
It after the pandemic, afterthe pandemic.
Well, I did one of her sessionsand what I loved about the way
you coached us and led usthrough, you guided us through
and you talked to us and I was Ithink I was the oldest one
there, but that's okay butprobably the stiffest one.
But I loved how you always saidand I made a note of it all you
(13:25):
have to do is breathe, andtelling me that in that moment
when I'm trying to get upsidedown myself, it was very helpful
and I did your.
You have quite an extensivelibrary of resources on YouTube
at your YouTube channel.
I have two YouTube channels andyou have two YouTube channels
(13:49):
and you've got now thetherapeuticyogaworkscom.
Dr. Nydia (13:53):
Correct, that is.
Judy Oskam (13:54):
That's a website for my new book and the new book
and and I love the title of thatnew book because it makes sense
Therapeutic Yoga Works Doublemeaning there, but it does work.
And, like I mentioned before,we, I guess, changed computers
and got rolling.
I did your breathing video thismorning.
(14:18):
That makes me so happy.
I did your and I'm going tosend that to some other folks.
But I also I broke my anklelast fall and I really am
looking for anything that'shelpful there, so I found your
feet foundation deal whateverit's called Setting a solid
foundation, setting a solidfoundation.
(14:38):
So I did that and that was super.
I mean, I do a lot of thosestretches anyway, but to do it
all together as a practice, Ilove that and I sent it to two
other friends of mine.
Dr. Nydia (14:52):
Once again you're making me so happy.
Oh, I'm, you know, I'm just earto ear with a grin.
Judy Oskam (14:59):
Well, I think, but so so I guess that's part of my
question.
I mean, I'm.
I have a question is why?
Why do people like me, let'ssay, why do we resist getting
involved with therapeutic yoga?
Why do you think there's achallenge there?
Dr. Nydia (15:16):
Well, I think, first and foremost, just yoga in and
of itself, just the word yogafor many.
They get a misperception thatyou have to be very bendy and
flexible and you have to lookreal cute in the little outfit
you know, and there's a certainidea about what someone who does
yoga looks like, and I thinkthat's the first thing that that
(15:40):
often scares individuals away.
Well, that can't be me.
I can't put my leg behind myhead and so and then.
So that's the beginning.
But when, when you put togethertherapeutic yoga, I mean, as I
was beginning to write my book,I'm asking people questions.
I'm asking men and women ofdifferent backgrounds hey, I'm
(16:01):
getting ready to write a book ontherapeutic yoga, what do you
think about that?
And they're like what'stherapeutic yoga?
So it really helped me to know,to understand that I'm in my
world, thinking that everybodyknows what therapeutic yoga is,
and I was very incorrect.
And that really actually iswhat helped me to put the title
(16:22):
on this book.
You know, and and to be veryyou know, I tried to get as sexy
as I could with the you knowand think about something that's
that you want to actually beinterested in sexy, that way.
You know, therapeutic yoga works.
That words, you know what, what.
What does that mean and maybecatch someone's attention.
But I also knew that if I justput the title without the next
(16:46):
portion, which was, you know, agentle approach to eliminating
back pain and improvingfunctional mobility for life,
when I was writing my you know,to write my first book, I wanted
to make certain that as manypeople might be interested in it
, and so my parameters, what Iput together, was well, as I'm
(17:06):
thinking about it, everybody hasa spine and, unfortunately,
many of us will have back painsometime in our life or know
someone.
So I thought, if I'm going towrite my first book, it should
be about the spine, because I amalso a spine specialist and I
have a lot of experience withthat.
But that, you know, canpossibly be interesting to many
(17:31):
more people.
Judy Oskam (17:33):
And the book also includes a lot of illustrations
and photographs.
So talk about the layout,because it's not just because
it's really hard to seesomething and see an example of
a posture if without a picture,I think.
So you included all that right.
Dr. Nydia (17:51):
I did do that on purpose and I'll be really
direct in saying that.
When I first contacted myphotographer I have a wonderful
photographer that she does greatwork and I said, hey, I need
you to come help me work withyou know, you're going to
photograph my images for myfirst book.
And her first question again,she's a professional said okay,
(18:14):
great, I'm excited to help you.
Are you going to use a model orare you going to be the model?
And I looked at her and Ididn't in my head automatically
I was going to be the model.
And I looked at her and Ididn't in my head automatically
I was going to be the model.
And I said, no, I'm going to bethe model.
And she goes Okay.
Now this is a very, again,direct thing that I want to
share with you.
(18:34):
My body is not the classicextremely lean yoga model that
you typically see on the coverof yoga Journal.
I have.
I'm a woman with curves and I'malso, you know, post-menopausal
and so I have the littleroundness that a body has when
you're going to be 58.
Which I love.
(18:56):
I can't believe that I love itand so I knew that I needed to
be the model I wantedindividuals to see a body with
curves and a cute little bellydoing the practice, and arms.
That weren't you know.
They just are.
It just is.
You know, I'm a strong body.
(19:17):
I'm very confident in mystrength, but I, you know, but I
have curves and I wanted peopleto see that.
So I said, nope, it's me and myunitard.
Now it's been years since I'dput on a unitard truly, and I
just said I'm going to put onthis unitard and I'm just going
to be the model, and it wasimportant.
Judy Oskam (19:36):
I love that.
Dr. Nydia (19:43):
Also if someone looks at those images, maybe they'll
see themselves and they'll sayhey, I don't have to look like
the cover of Yoga Journal or,you know, for any other you know
magazine.
I can actually just be in myown body.
Judy Oskam (19:57):
I love that.
I love the body positivemovement.
Dr. Nydia (20:01):
We shouldn't even need to have such a movement,
but we do you know especiallyfor women, I think, but men too
men, yes, yes, I mean I it'sbeen pretty brutal.
Uh, growing up in the fitnessindustry, my whole career has
always been well, if you don'tlook the part that, you must not
be worth your salt.
And over and over and over, Ijust kind of keep doing what I
(20:24):
do.
And well, here we are.
I love that.
Judy Oskam (20:29):
Well, and and when you're researching to do the
book, you also have such a greatscience background.
Talk about some of the studiesthat you've been involved with
which prove your point abouttherapeutic yoga that works.
Dr. Nydia (20:44):
Yes, I was fortunate to have an amazing student and
peer and friend and mentor in DrAmelie Ramirez.
She's at UT Health and, oh mygosh, I'd have to go and look at
my notes to tell you what heractual title is.
I just call her superwoman, yeah, but she's in charge of all of
(21:06):
our research, and in 2009, sheinvited me to do yoga and cancer
research with her team and shewanted to see if we could kind
of, you know, do somethingtogether.
And I, in my naivety, was likeheck, yeah, I'm in, sign me up.
(21:27):
And I, because I had a lot ofconfidence in the intervention
that I would develop I knew thatit worked because I had seen it
over decades, the practices,and I had also worked with
cancer survivors of varioustypes, and so I knew that what I
could deliver would actually bebeneficial, and so we started a
(21:48):
process in 2009.
Our first cohort.
We finalized a program.
That then our results in 2011.
And by 2012, I think, 2015, wehave our first publication, and
what we did was one of thethings that was happening in
this first study for breastcancer survivors implementing
(22:12):
therapeutic yoga is that we hadthis was a randomized controlled
trial, so we had a group about109 individuals we had 30 that
were doing traditional strength,flexibility and cardiovascular
training and they wereinstructed in it and then they
were to do it.
We had the yoga group that wereattending classes at my studio
(22:37):
under the supervision of theteachers that I had trained and
myself as well, and myself aswell.
And then we had the controlgroup and everybody was to do
their work yoga or practicethree times a week for six
(22:57):
months, which is unusually,wonderfully long time for a
study, because most yoga studieswere only done for about 12
weeks maybe 16 weeks.
So we were fortunate there, wehad time and at the end of that
study, you know, now I was veryinterested in something that was
a little bit different, becauseI had noticed that there was a
lot of yoga research up to thatpoint in 2009.
(23:20):
And there was some yoga andcancer research, but none of the
yoga studies that I, you know,as I did my research, they
didn't tell us what they did.
They just said we did yoga andsometimes they just said we did
the style of yoga Iyengar or youknow, Kripalu or something, but
(23:42):
they didn't.
And for me, scientific method,you've got to write down what
you did so that you can thendetermine.
Yeah.
So I came to my team and I saidI'm going to need your help.
I've never done anything likethis before, but I do know and
feel very strongly that I candevelop a protocol, meaning
(24:03):
there's going to be a list,we're going to go through it,
they're going to practice it andwe're going to try to reproduce
it similarly every single time.
The unique thing about thepractices that I create is that,
yes, while there is astructured sequence, the method
that I deliver them isindividualizing the practice for
(24:23):
each person when they're doingit Right.
So, which is very unique, andit is actually a very strong
point of the method that I'vedeveloped and so, in a group
setting, eventually you'll bedoing your own thing, your own
body's ability in your practice,which is really cool.
So we do.
(24:43):
We have, uh, we've done someresearch between that time, um
the most recent study that hadto turn into a live stream study
because of the covid pandemicyeah we were likely the only
therapeutic yoga and cancer yoga, therapeutic yoga cancer study
(25:04):
done via live stream in theworld.
It is highly unlikely thatanybody else was doing it,
because we actually didn't havea choice.
Yeah, it was that or nothing.
And in that study now I'm beingI'm geeking out on you with
this that's okay, I can nerd outtoo.
I love it.
In the first study, the teams,we had exercise physiologists
(25:26):
and then we had you know me asthe physical therapist but the
yoga person, and it was theexercise physiologist versus the
yoga team and we're like well,exercise better, yoga better.
At the end of the study, whatwe found was that therapeutic
yoga was equally as effective astraditional strength,
(25:48):
resistance and cardiovascularexercise, which is a win,
because before then it was likewell, that yoga, you know, we
don't really know if it reallyworks.
So that's what gave us thefoundation for our subsequent
studies.
One of the things that the teamactually talked about was well,
we saw this other thing, nydia,happening in the yoga group
(26:11):
that we didn't see some risingbenefits that were stronger in,
but still not statisticallysignificant in the yoga group
versus the exercise group.
And that was and they couldn'tput their finger on it.
They didn't know exactly why issomething what's happening in
(26:32):
the yoga group that's improvingoutcomes and not so much in the
exercise group.
They eventually started callingit the Nidia factor.
And when I started thinkingabout it.
I went you know what?
It's not that Our yogaparticipants were benefiting
from community yeah, the group,because the other participants
(26:57):
were by themselves doingexercise.
Judy Oskam (27:00):
Oh, that's a whole other study right there.
Oh, my gosh, completely.
Dr. Nydia (27:03):
And so it was just so I said, okay, let's keep doing
this.
So the live stream that we didin 2020, one of the wonderful,
some of the wonderful benefitsand the results that we got
where we found that if you dotherapeutic yoga three times a
week for four to six months, youcan actually improve your
respiratory capacity, yourability to breathe and bring
(27:27):
oxygen into your body.
Now this is COVID era.
Judy Oskam (27:30):
Wow.
Dr. Nydia (27:31):
We also found that these cancer survivors were
actually improving their mentalhealth.
This is COVID era and all ofthese things were statistically
significant.
And all of these things werestatistically significant.
And we saw also another we dohave another paper with this
that we saw a reduction ininflammation the inflammatory
(27:53):
cytokines.
So when I talk to anybody whowill listen about the benefits
of therapeutic yoga, I getreally strong and say I know
this works, we've done theresearch and it doesn't have to
be hard and it should feel goodand the gentlest practice can
really benefit you.
Judy Oskam (28:14):
I love that.
Well, how about someone who'sstarting out?
Where do they start?
Obviously, they come to one ofyour sessions if they live in
the San Antonio area or theywatch your videos.
Dr. Nydia (28:25):
Or they visit with me live stream or you can live
stream.
I love that.
I love that.
So my favorite way wheneverbecause I do also offer private
therapeutic yoga instruction anda therapeutic yoga assessment
for some.
Some individuals don't know,they're like I don't really want
to start with a class, I'membarrassed or I, you know, I
(28:46):
don't know if I'm ready, and sowe will sit down together and
we'll look at their past history.
The clinician in me is present,while the yoga person in me is
present, and it's just a melding, and so I'm making certain that
there's no reason why theyshouldn't be doing this work,
Clearing them from that.
And then we look at theirhistory.
(29:08):
What have they done before?
We look at physically.
You know, maybe there was someold back pain or you know some
surgery, and then we start to,you know, do work together, and
I always start by assessingtheir breath and their position
and their mobility.
Coming back to the bookTherapeutic Yoga Works, that
(29:35):
book is actually when you readit.
It's actually sharing a privatepractice that I did with an
individual who had intense backpain.
So it's when you read that bookit's actually written in
dialogue.
It's, it's a story.
And it's the story of a womanwho had extreme back pain, and
(29:58):
when you read it, it's like youare a beautiful butterfly in the
room, while she and I, caroline, are doing the work to help her
regain her function and herquality of life.
And so you know, I share that,because those that individual
instruction is important and Ioffer that.
But ultimately, my goal is toteach people how to take care of
(30:23):
themselves for the long termand so empower them and give
them the tools, and that's whywe start with the breath,
because the most important thingwe will do today is breathe,
and when we breathe efficiently,the nervous system says thank
you.
Judy Oskam (30:41):
Yeah, yeah.
Well, look back at that highschool senior.
What would you tell her afterwe've gone through all of this?
And what would you say to hernow?
Oh my gosh, she's proud of you.
Dr. Nydia (30:55):
I know, oh, she wouldn't imagine.
I would tell her, oh goodness,that I would tell her more early
in life that she should justnot care what anybody thinks.
I love that.
Judy Oskam (31:11):
Yes.
Dr. Nydia (31:12):
She should just do she's always been an oddball and
just go with it, babe, becauseyou're going to be fine.
Judy Oskam (31:19):
Yes, don't worry about that.
I so love that.
Well, and look ahead in fiveyears from now.
What's your goal?
Because I know your goal is tochange the world.
I know that.
I know that about you.
You pegged me, yeah.
And what are you going to bedoing in five years and what's
the practice going to be doing?
Dr. Nydia (31:39):
And you know, I really wasn't sure I wanted to
write a book, but I wasn't sureif I was going to like it, the
process or be any good.
Well, I loved it.
I want to continue writing.
I have so much to share andsome people are like me.
They like to read books andlearn about stuff, and it's just
(32:02):
so important to continue.
You know, reading it's justsuch a great way to stimulate
our brain and so I want to write, continue writing.
I will continue to provide thesegentle therapeutic yoga
practices at my I do have a homestudio and I will provide that
and to the community.
Whenever I'm invited to gosomewhere that I will go if I
(32:25):
can to.
Also to continue to educateclinicians.
I've been very fortunate thatthe Texas Physical Therapy
Association has they're myfriends and I get invited when I
submit.
They invite me to come andpresent about the therapeutic
yoga to physical therapists andphysical therapist assistants
(32:50):
and students, and so I want tocontinue doing that and I'll do
more workshops at my home studioto invite clinicians and
anybody who wants to come and doa workshop, you know, but it's
a really neat thing to danglethe carrot about.
You can get continuingeducation towards your license.
When you come and dotherapeutic yoga for two days
(33:14):
straight and eat nutritious anddelicious meals and then relax
and breathe, and they're like,seriously, and I'm like, oh yeah
, I've got the accreditation,I'm all in.
Judy Oskam (33:26):
I love that and that's a win-win, because then
their patients are thebeneficiaries, right.
Dr. Nydia (33:32):
When I do those programs I focus on the
clinician because I want theirself-care to rise.
These are servants, these arepeople who have a
service-oriented mind, body andspirit and they want to help.
But oftentimes those of us witha servant's heart, we don't put
ourselves first, we go last.
(33:54):
So I want them to be able toembody the practice, to
experience it, to benefit fromit and then hopefully it'll
influence their clinicalpractice, kind of like the way
it influenced mine, you know.
And then I just kind of keptdoing it because it felt good
and I kept sharing it because Iknew it was good.
Judy Oskam (34:14):
But what you did was you went in and you found the
framework for putting it alltogether.
That's, that takes some heavylifting.
Dr. Nydia (34:23):
It was really an accident.
I'm such a nerd, I love to takethings apart, I can't help
myself.
And so when I was on my livingroom floor you know, I'm a
manually trained physicaltherapist, both my husband and I
are manually trained that meansthat we do like osteopathic or
chiropractic mobilizing and, youknow, manipulating the joints,
and I realized that when I wasdoing a posture and I was
(34:51):
realized that when I was doing aposture and I was and I and it
was a hard one, so I would takeit apart to bring it down to its
essential element and then Iwould start building it back up.
You know well, if you want tostand with one leg on one leg,
with the other leg behind yourhead which, by the way, I don't
recommend but if you want to dothat, how do you start doing
that?
Well, at first you got to begood at standing on both legs.
You know both feet have to begrounded.
You want to do that.
How do you start doing that?
Well, at first you got to begood at standing on both legs.
You know both feet have to begrounded.
(35:13):
You have to learn that beforeyou can even try to think about
lifting one of the legs up evenan inch off the floor.
So I was noticing that when Itake these postures apart, the
traditional ones, and turn theminto what I thought was the best
way to do them oops, a littlebit different then.
What was happening is I couldsee the potential for
(35:36):
therapeutically mobilizing themajor joints and bringing the
body into balance in a way thatI could do it for myself.
Now, if you've ever had manualtherapies, the clinician does it
to you, which puts you in avery dependent situation.
If you have pain, you've got togo to your clinician and
(35:58):
they've got to fix you and it'slike no, no, no, no.
Again, I have strong opinionsabout this.
But if we're not empowering ourpatients, if we're not giving
them the tools strong opinioncoming at you we're not doing
our job we got to be able to.
It's more cost effective If weteach them they you know, I want
(36:21):
my clients to fire me.
Judy Oskam (36:24):
It's like I'm done with you.
Dr. Nydia (36:25):
Nydia, I feel fabulous.
I don't need to come back toour one-on-one or physical
therapy, but I'll do my practiceand I'm looking, I'm feeling
good and yay, that's what I want.
And my husband jokes with mebecause he and I are both
co-owners of the multipleprograms that we run, and he's a
silent partner.
(36:46):
And he says Nydia.
And he's a silent partner andhe says, Nydia, you know, your
business model kind of sucks.
You're supposed to make themwant to come back and give you
more money.
You know Right.
And I tell him I said, well,here's the reality.
Unfortunately, there are so manypeople who are living with pain
(37:07):
that I wish that I could justdo the funnest part of my work,
which is doing the prevention,where you know, hey, let's just
do the exercise and have fun.
No one has pain.
But I'm not.
I'm not afraid that I'm not,that I'm going to be out of a
job.
I wish that part of my jobcould be over, which would be
great, because then peoplearen't living in pain, People
(37:29):
are feeling strong, and then wecould just become superhuman
altogether.
Judy Oskam (37:33):
Right, right.
Well, it's such a challenging,I guess, future that you're
trying to solve there, I think.
But as someone who's been inone of your sessions and really
needs to get back and do that, Iwant to bring my husband and
have you analyze him a littlebit.
(37:54):
Soccer player really tighthamstrings really, really beat
up for years.
Dr. Nydia (38:02):
And he has great potential and he's got good
potential, so I'll be knockingon your door, but I look forward
to it Well, and I love thatyou've provided the resources.
Judy Oskam (38:13):
So talk a little bit about what's on your YouTube
channel so that people know whatto do, and I'll put the actual
addresses in the show notes foryou.
Dr. Nydia (38:22):
Thank you Well first and foremost, the book itself
has its own website.
Therapeuticyogaworks.
com itself has its own website,TherapeuticYogaWorks.
com, and in that book, on thatwebsite, are all of the
practices that are in the book.
You don't have to buy the bookIf you just want to go and get
an idea of what the practicesare like.
I recorded 22 postures that areall in the book.
(38:42):
I recorded the therapeutic sunsalutation that helps us get
down onto the floor and thenhelps us get back up, which is
very important If you end up onthe floor and you can't get up,
that's the problem and somebreathing audio recordings where
you just lie there or sit thereand just maximize your
oxygenation with gentle,rhythmic breathing.
(39:04):
So there's so much.
Just in therapeuticyogaworkworks.
com you could go to my YouTubepage, Nydia's yoga therapy and
the open hand Institute.
Also, I have two YouTube pagesand you can go to those and I
have uploaded so many recordingsof classes.
You could do a 10 minute, a 15minute, you could do a whole
(39:25):
full class, 60 minute or 75minute class.
I put them there on purpose.
Then there's my specialty footstuff.
I had classes more about yourhip, you know, maybe your I saw
that yeah I have my own fatherwho was a very dedicated
practitioner, non-traditionalhispanic male truck driver.
Him I recorded, uh, him, wewere doing a seated yoga with
(39:50):
Pedro.
Oh, go, look for that.
It's pretty hilarious.
I am, you know, I'm sometimesspeaking some Spanglish, you
know, and it's just and I'mgoing between Spanish and
English and and it's just showsyou that you know, you can sit
there and breathe and do someactivities and even when you're
limited in your emotion, you'restill doing the practice,
(40:11):
practice and it's so valuable.
I love that.
I also have a video with my now87 year old mother doing her
practice, and this one is yogafor knee strength awareness with
Bobby.
So some, she has two knee jointreplacements and so she's an
example of, yes, you still can.
And in that particular practicefor people with knee pain or
(40:33):
knee issues, there's a speciallittle section at the beginning
teaches you how to dotraditional isometric
strengthening and mobility ofyour knees to improve your
function, and then in thepractice there's also standing
postures and balancing andthings that we do.
So there's just a lot in there.
I have, you know, vimeocom andI have, through my own studio,
(41:00):
some video on demand servicesand so, but I like to let the
community know that the otherservices are completely free.
If you have internet access,then you could go and find those
and the therapeuticyogaworkscomalso.
The only thing that'll happenyou get on my email list, that's
(41:22):
it Completely free access.
And I want you know.
If you know someone who mightbenefit, please share it,
because that's another reasonwhy I did it to give it to the
community, because I know thisworks.
Judy Oskam (41:36):
And, yes, you've proven it works.
It's evident that it does, andwe're all the beneficiaries.
This has been so fun.
I appreciate this.
We might have to do anotherround two whenever we whenever
you get me going a little bithere.
Dr. Nydia (41:50):
Oh, I think it would be so fun for you to share about
your adventures.
That's great, that's great,it's just been so wonderful.
I so appreciate your invitationand I love just.
You know you got a beautifulsmile and your energy is so
magnificent, so thank you somuch.
Judy Oskam (42:05):
Thank you, and I'll put information in the show
notes.
Thank you so much.
Thank you.
Thank you, and I'll putinformation in the show notes.
And thank you for listening toStories of Change and Creativity
.
I love Dr Nydia and I love whatshe's doing and the resources
are out there.
So check out the show notes formore information and remember
if you've got a story to shareor know someone who does reach
(42:26):
out to me at judyoskam.
com.
Thanks for listening.
Nydia Tijerina Darby.
I am a physical therapist, adoctor of physical therapy, a
therapeutic yoga specialist andthe owner and creative director
of the Open Hand Institute andNydia's Yoga Therapy Studio here
in San Antonio, Texas.
I like to do therapeutic yogaresearch and I kind of dabble in
a lot of different things, butpretty much I like to get people
(00:22):
upside down and help them learnhow to take care of themselves
for the long term.
Judy Oskam (00:29):
Welcome to Stories of Change and Creativity.
I'm Judy Oskam and I'm superexcited to share my conversation
with Dr .
Nydia is a doctor of physicaltherapy, a therapeutic yoga
specialist and a certified yogatherapist.
Her book is entitledTherapeutic Yoga Works A Gentle
(00:51):
Approach to Eliminating BackPain and Improving Functional
Mobility for Life, and Nydiasays she's been preparing for
the next decade since she was inher 20s and she helps us all do
that as well.
I hope you enjoy my interviewwith Dr .
How did you get into this inthe first place?
Dr. Nydia (01:14):
Oh gosh, it is a long story, but I've been teaching
exercise since I was 15 yearsold.
I, you know, didn't realize it,but movement, just, I just
loved it.
And you know, didn't realize it, but movement, just, uh, I just
loved it.
And you know, in high school,as in dance team, I was then
promoted to a position where Iwas leading the girls in our um,
(01:38):
stretching and strengtheningand flexibility, and that was my
role in my in in in that teamand and I then I also started
teaching exercise at a local gym.
And so, interestingly enough,when I went through um, finished
high school, I already knewthat I wanted, had a medical
(01:59):
bent, I wanted to do somethingin medicine.
But I had realized that, um,and I thought, oh yes, I'm going
to medical school and I'll be adoctor.
I had a few medical challengesthat were related to stress.
Everybody thought I had astomach problem, but it really
was anxiety, stress.
Judy Oskam (02:20):
Interesting, interesting.
Dr. Nydia (02:22):
So while I'm young this way, that's a whole other
story.
But while I'm young this way,I'm going to the doctor every so
often and I realized that Ionly would see my doctor for
about five minutes and that wasabout it.
It was real short, and I lovepeople.
So in my mind, by the time I'ma senior, I'm thinking I don't
(02:45):
think I need to be a physician.
You don't spend enough timewith them, with the patients.
So by the time I'm a senior,I'm looking, you know,
scrambling, like what am I goingto be?
What am I going to do?
And I found physical therapy andI read about it in a course
manual.
I never knew anybody who hadhad physical therapy, but it
(03:05):
looked good.
It said something, somethinglike a physical therapist helped
people with injuries, theyhelped them learn how to walk,
they massage and you know, andthey teach them exercise.
And I went check, check, check.
I like those things.
So I found Texas Women'sUniversity.
It was in Dentonxas.
I grew up in McAllan, Texas,which was at that time a nine
(03:26):
hour drive.
Yes, yes, you know.
And so I just um, I got intothe curriculum, got into school.
That was another long drawn outprocess, but I'm teaching
exercise during my college years.
I'm also taking dance andmovement while I'm taking.
My preparatory work forphysical therapy to get into my
(03:49):
first degree was a bachelor's ofscience in physical therapy,
and that was back in the daywhen you could get a bachelor's.
And then from there I'm moving,I'm teaching exercise.
I'm already beginning to meetsome of the healthiest people
I've ever met in my early yearsand in my early 20s and I'm
(04:10):
seeing some things and I'mtaking mental notes.
They had a positive outlook onlife, they were active, they
moved in some form or fashionevery day and they had a belief
in a higher power, and I saw itin the healthiest people and I
also saw the direct opposite inthe least healthy.
Judy Oskam (04:30):
So I'm taking mental notes and I'm thinking In your
20s.
Let me remind the listenersthis is in your 20s.
Oh my gosh, I didn't have thattogether in my 20s to really put
it all together, but you wereactually looking for a career
that combined some of thosethings as a senior in high
school, right?
Dr. Nydia (04:51):
Yeah, you know, I didn't realize it.
What I didn't know then was whyI loved exercise so much and
what was happening is it was mymedicine for the anxiety I had.
Anxiety and depression, youknow, very high level
functioning depressed personreally, you know hi, and back
(05:12):
then they didn't talk about itthat much, right?
Judy Oskam (05:13):
It wasn't something people talked about?
Dr. Nydia (05:16):
Oh, especially in the Hispanic culture.
No, I'm Mexican American, youknow, it's like.
You know, get over your badself.
You know you're feeling bad, goon, go work, go do something
and you'll feel better.
You know, it's like you know,get over your bad self.
You know you're feeling bad,moving on, yeah, go work, go do
something and you'll feel better, you know.
So it just kind of happened thatway and I'm collecting
information from my clients,from my patients, about how to
(05:39):
be the healthiest.
And because I was lovingteaching, exercise and doing the
physical therapy, noweventually I become a physical
therapist.
I'm thinking to myself how canI help myself move through the
decades with grace?
And so I started looking fornow I'm a clinician, I'm doing
orthopedic and spine care,neurological care, and I'm
(06:03):
looking for that thing that Icould do for me.
You know, I'm a runner and Ilike to swim and I do things and
I'm exercising and leadingexercise.
But what can I do for me sothat I could be the strongest,
most able, 90 year old, mm-hmm?
And.
And so I started reading about,you know, Qigong, tai Chi,
(06:27):
eastern medicine, martial arts,yoga, Pilates.
You know, at that time I lovedto read and I learned by reading
, and so I'm one of those.
Give me a technical manual,okay, let's have some fun here.
I'll figure out how to takeapart a toilet, you know?
No problem, I can do this.
So that's what I did.
(06:47):
I'm reading and I'm reading andfinally, eventually, I put down
.
The yoga just made sense, andbecause movement and exercise
are second nature to me, I juststarted looking at the pictures,
or you know the briefdescription.
There wasn't a lot of real good, you know instruction, but I
could figure this out, and Irealized that many of the
(07:11):
traditional yoga postures werereally difficult, they were not
easy to do and I couldn't see.
You know, I was having troubleand I was in my early 20s, later
20s, when I was out by thistime and I was having difficulty
with some of the postures and Icouldn't imagine my patients or
(07:31):
my clients being successful.
And it hurts me to the corewhen someone has a perception
that they can't do something,when it's a false perception,
you know, it's one thing.
If you know you really can't dosomething, that's fine.
But if it's something like ohno, nydia, I, there's never, I'd
(07:52):
never be able to stand and dothat position, you know.
So it's began.
I'm doing this practice in myhome, in my living room, for
myself, and it's influencingeverything.
It's influencing me as aclinician.
I'm still teaching exercise ata local gym one night a week.
It's influencing the way thatI'm seeing the world, and that's
(08:17):
because I was just doing thephysical practice.
I was doing breath work andthat was significant, and then I
was trying to keep breathingwhile I'm trying to stay, you
know, standing on one leg, andit was difficult, so that just
continued.
And eventually, while I wasdoing small groups and educating
(08:39):
the community on things thatwere easy for me to share, that
I thought were important, likehow to take care of your back,
or I do a little littleworkshops to small groups, like
your knee pain, what does itmean?
Now you know, what do you donext, and so all of those things
are just kind of comingtogether.
They're me sharing with thecommunity.
(09:01):
You know, one of the thingsthat I did as a physical
therapist and in my I had in mydouble life, which was physical
therapist and a fitness trainer.
Then this was before I, youknow, I pretty much came out as
a yoga instructor you put it alltogether right right, yes, you
know I'm already doing some typeof therapeutic yoga, but I'm
(09:22):
not talking about it.
But one of the things that washappening is that it was I was
working to try to help peoplewho I noticed clinically in the
clinic.
In the physical therapy clinicwe would have very specific
direction of a diagnosis leftelbow pain or biceps tear and in
(09:47):
the medical model we, becauseof the insurance industry,
third-party payer, we had to bevery direct to working on that
bicep, working on that elbow,whatever the part was.
And the third-party payer didnot appreciate when those of us
who worked holistically this isa whole human being, it's not
(10:10):
just an elbow.
This is not an elbow, you knowand they would be denying claims
and I was in charge of myclinic, so I was the one that
would call them up and sayplease share with me where you
have your medical degree.
That's telling me that you knowbetter than I do what this
person needs.
So that always made it a littlebit adventurous when I was a
(10:33):
clinician because I could.
I my whole entire career.
I've always seen my patients,or my clients, as a whole person
, mind, body, spirit.
This is someone who has a kneepain or knee injury, but they
also are a mother of three.
They are now not able to workbecause their job was very
(10:57):
physical and their whole worldis now upside down.
And another person might say oh, come on, lady, it's just knee
pain.
You know, get your act together.
It's like, no, this is majorbecause the stress involves you
know.
So, anyway, you know all ofthat over time, melded into what
(11:19):
I do now, which is combinephysical therapy, my experiences
in physical therapy, fitnessand yoga over 40 years, and this
process is designed to helpempower individuals to move the
(11:40):
best that they can, to recognizetheir strengths and be aware of
their limitations too.
This isn't about you know, justget in there and do the work.
But what you know, how do weknow when to say when you know?
enough you know, and to preservethe body, but not just the body
the mind and the spirit.
(12:00):
And and I joke about it and Isay, you know, when people ask
me, what do you do, I get peopleupside down.
That's what I do and literallyI do.
But also I get you know theseprocesses of when you start to
teach someone to begin to payattention to their breathing.
We're working on helping themsettle their mind, calm the
(12:25):
nervous nervous system and tobecome a little more
introspective, and that's not aneasy process.
So I start with the physical.
I say here, let's just do thisstrength or this stretch
activity, let's do this posture,and oh, while you're doing that
, let's, you know, keepbreathing.
And before you know it, if theykeep doing it, they begin to
(12:49):
change.
Judy Oskam (12:50):
Well, and having done one of your classes before,
I love that it's been a while.
Was that before the pandemic?
I think it was before thepandemic.
Dr. Nydia (12:59):
Was it after the pandemic?
It was after After the pandemic.
Judy Oskam (13:02):
Well, I did one of her sessions.
It after the pandemic, afterthe pandemic.
Well, I did one of her sessionsand what I loved about the way
you coached us and led usthrough, you guided us through
and you talked to us and I was Ithink I was the oldest one
there, but that's okay butprobably the stiffest one.
But I loved how you always saidand I made a note of it all you
(13:25):
have to do is breathe, andtelling me that in that moment
when I'm trying to get upsidedown myself, it was very helpful
and I did your.
You have quite an extensivelibrary of resources on YouTube
at your YouTube channel.
I have two YouTube channels andyou have two YouTube channels
(13:49):
and you've got now thetherapeuticyogaworkscom.
Dr. Nydia (13:53):
Correct, that is.
Judy Oskam (13:54):
That's a website for my new book and the new book
and and I love the title of thatnew book because it makes sense
Therapeutic Yoga Works Doublemeaning there, but it does work.
And, like I mentioned before,we, I guess, changed computers
and got rolling.
I did your breathing video thismorning.
(14:18):
That makes me so happy.
I did your and I'm going tosend that to some other folks.
But I also I broke my anklelast fall and I really am
looking for anything that'shelpful there, so I found your
feet foundation deal whateverit's called Setting a solid
foundation, setting a solidfoundation.
(14:38):
So I did that and that was super.
I mean, I do a lot of thosestretches anyway, but to do it
all together as a practice, Ilove that and I sent it to two
other friends of mine.
Dr. Nydia (14:52):
Once again you're making me so happy.
Oh, I'm, you know, I'm just earto ear with a grin.
Judy Oskam (14:59):
Well, I think, but so so I guess that's part of my
question.
I mean, I'm.
I have a question is why?
Why do people like me, let'ssay, why do we resist getting
involved with therapeutic yoga?
Why do you think there's achallenge there?
Dr. Nydia (15:16):
Well, I think, first and foremost, just yoga in and
of itself, just the word yogafor many.
They get a misperception thatyou have to be very bendy and
flexible and you have to lookreal cute in the little outfit
you know, and there's a certainidea about what someone who does
yoga looks like, and I thinkthat's the first thing that that
(15:40):
often scares individuals away.
Well, that can't be me.
I can't put my leg behind myhead and so and then.
So that's the beginning.
But when, when you put togethertherapeutic yoga, I mean, as I
was beginning to write my book,I'm asking people questions.
I'm asking men and women ofdifferent backgrounds hey, I'm
(16:01):
getting ready to write a book ontherapeutic yoga, what do you
think about that?
And they're like what'stherapeutic yoga?
So it really helped me to know,to understand that I'm in my
world, thinking that everybodyknows what therapeutic yoga is,
and I was very incorrect.
And that really actually iswhat helped me to put the title
(16:22):
on this book.
You know, and and to be veryyou know, I tried to get as sexy
as I could with the you knowand think about something that's
that you want to actually beinterested in sexy, that way.
You know, therapeutic yoga works.
That words, you know what, what.
What does that mean and maybecatch someone's attention.
But I also knew that if I justput the title without the next
(16:46):
portion, which was, you know, agentle approach to eliminating
back pain and improvingfunctional mobility for life,
when I was writing my you know,to write my first book, I wanted
to make certain that as manypeople might be interested in it
, and so my parameters, what Iput together, was well, as I'm
(17:06):
thinking about it, everybody hasa spine and, unfortunately,
many of us will have back painsometime in our life or know
someone.
So I thought, if I'm going towrite my first book, it should
be about the spine, because I amalso a spine specialist and I
have a lot of experience withthat.
But that, you know, canpossibly be interesting to many
(17:31):
more people.
Judy Oskam (17:33):
And the book also includes a lot of illustrations
and photographs.
So talk about the layout,because it's not just because
it's really hard to seesomething and see an example of
a posture if without a picture,I think.
So you included all that right.
Dr. Nydia (17:51):
I did do that on purpose and I'll be really
direct in saying that.
When I first contacted myphotographer I have a wonderful
photographer that she does greatwork and I said, hey, I need
you to come help me work withyou know, you're going to
photograph my images for myfirst book.
And her first question again,she's a professional said okay,
(18:14):
great, I'm excited to help you.
Are you going to use a model orare you going to be the model?
And I looked at her and Ididn't in my head automatically
I was going to be the model.
And I looked at her and Ididn't in my head automatically
I was going to be the model.
And I said, no, I'm going to bethe model.
And she goes Okay.
Now this is a very, again,direct thing that I want to
share with you.
(18:34):
My body is not the classicextremely lean yoga model that
you typically see on the coverof yoga Journal.
I have.
I'm a woman with curves and I'malso, you know, post-menopausal
and so I have the littleroundness that a body has when
you're going to be 58.
Which I love.
(18:56):
I can't believe that I love itand so I knew that I needed to
be the model I wantedindividuals to see a body with
curves and a cute little bellydoing the practice, and arms.
That weren't you know.
They just are.
It just is.
You know, I'm a strong body.
(19:17):
I'm very confident in mystrength, but I, you know, but I
have curves and I wanted peopleto see that.
So I said, nope, it's me and myunitard.
Now it's been years since I'dput on a unitard truly, and I
just said I'm going to put onthis unitard and I'm just going
to be the model, and it wasimportant.
Judy Oskam (19:36):
I love that.
Dr. Nydia (19:43):
Also if someone looks at those images, maybe they'll
see themselves and they'll sayhey, I don't have to look like
the cover of Yoga Journal or,you know, for any other you know
magazine.
I can actually just be in myown body.
Judy Oskam (19:57):
I love that.
I love the body positivemovement.
Dr. Nydia (20:01):
We shouldn't even need to have such a movement,
but we do you know especiallyfor women, I think, but men too
men, yes, yes, I mean I it'sbeen pretty brutal.
Uh, growing up in the fitnessindustry, my whole career has
always been well, if you don'tlook the part that, you must not
be worth your salt.
And over and over and over, Ijust kind of keep doing what I
(20:24):
do.
And well, here we are.
I love that.
Judy Oskam (20:29):
Well, and and when you're researching to do the
book, you also have such a greatscience background.
Talk about some of the studiesthat you've been involved with
which prove your point abouttherapeutic yoga that works.
Dr. Nydia (20:44):
Yes, I was fortunate to have an amazing student and
peer and friend and mentor in DrAmelie Ramirez.
She's at UT Health and, oh mygosh, I'd have to go and look at
my notes to tell you what heractual title is.
I just call her superwoman, yeah, but she's in charge of all of
(21:06):
our research, and in 2009, sheinvited me to do yoga and cancer
research with her team and shewanted to see if we could kind
of, you know, do somethingtogether.
And I, in my naivety, was likeheck, yeah, I'm in, sign me up.
(21:27):
And I, because I had a lot ofconfidence in the intervention
that I would develop I knew thatit worked because I had seen it
over decades, the practices,and I had also worked with
cancer survivors of varioustypes, and so I knew that what I
could deliver would actually bebeneficial, and so we started a
(21:48):
process in 2009.
Our first cohort.
We finalized a program.
That then our results in 2011.
And by 2012, I think, 2015, wehave our first publication, and
what we did was one of thethings that was happening in
this first study for breastcancer survivors implementing
(22:12):
therapeutic yoga is that we hadthis was a randomized controlled
trial, so we had a group about109 individuals we had 30 that
were doing traditional strength,flexibility and cardiovascular
training and they wereinstructed in it and then they
were to do it.
We had the yoga group that wereattending classes at my studio
(22:37):
under the supervision of theteachers that I had trained and
myself as well, and myself aswell.
And then we had the controlgroup and everybody was to do
their work yoga or practicethree times a week for six
(22:57):
months, which is unusually,wonderfully long time for a
study, because most yoga studieswere only done for about 12
weeks maybe 16 weeks.
So we were fortunate there, wehad time and at the end of that
study, you know, now I was veryinterested in something that was
a little bit different, becauseI had noticed that there was a
lot of yoga research up to thatpoint in 2009.
(23:20):
And there was some yoga andcancer research, but none of the
yoga studies that I, you know,as I did my research, they
didn't tell us what they did.
They just said we did yoga andsometimes they just said we did
the style of yoga Iyengar or youknow, Kripalu or something, but
(23:42):
they didn't.
And for me, scientific method,you've got to write down what
you did so that you can thendetermine.
Yeah.
So I came to my team and I saidI'm going to need your help.
I've never done anything likethis before, but I do know and
feel very strongly that I candevelop a protocol, meaning
(24:03):
there's going to be a list,we're going to go through it,
they're going to practice it andwe're going to try to reproduce
it similarly every single time.
The unique thing about thepractices that I create is that,
yes, while there is astructured sequence, the method
that I deliver them isindividualizing the practice for
(24:23):
each person when they're doingit Right.
So, which is very unique, andit is actually a very strong
point of the method that I'vedeveloped and so, in a group
setting, eventually you'll bedoing your own thing, your own
body's ability in your practice,which is really cool.
So we do.
(24:43):
We have, uh, we've done someresearch between that time, um
the most recent study that hadto turn into a live stream study
because of the covid pandemicyeah we were likely the only
therapeutic yoga and cancer yoga, therapeutic yoga cancer study
(25:04):
done via live stream in theworld.
It is highly unlikely thatanybody else was doing it,
because we actually didn't havea choice.
Yeah, it was that or nothing.
And in that study now I'm beingI'm geeking out on you with
this that's okay, I can nerd outtoo.
I love it.
In the first study, the teams,we had exercise physiologists
(25:26):
and then we had you know me asthe physical therapist but the
yoga person, and it was theexercise physiologist versus the
yoga team and we're like well,exercise better, yoga better.
At the end of the study, whatwe found was that therapeutic
yoga was equally as effective astraditional strength,
(25:48):
resistance and cardiovascularexercise, which is a win,
because before then it was likewell, that yoga, you know, we
don't really know if it reallyworks.
So that's what gave us thefoundation for our subsequent
studies.
One of the things that the teamactually talked about was well,
we saw this other thing, nydia,happening in the yoga group
(26:11):
that we didn't see some risingbenefits that were stronger in,
but still not statisticallysignificant in the yoga group
versus the exercise group.
And that was and they couldn'tput their finger on it.
They didn't know exactly why issomething what's happening in
(26:32):
the yoga group that's improvingoutcomes and not so much in the
exercise group.
They eventually started callingit the Nidia factor.
And when I started thinkingabout it.
I went you know what?
It's not that Our yogaparticipants were benefiting
from community yeah, the group,because the other participants
(26:57):
were by themselves doingexercise.
Judy Oskam (27:00):
Oh, that's a whole other study right there.
Oh, my gosh, completely.
Dr. Nydia (27:03):
And so it was just so I said, okay, let's keep doing
this.
So the live stream that we didin 2020, one of the wonderful,
some of the wonderful benefitsand the results that we got
where we found that if you dotherapeutic yoga three times a
week for four to six months, youcan actually improve your
respiratory capacity, yourability to breathe and bring
(27:27):
oxygen into your body.
Now this is COVID era.
Judy Oskam (27:30):
Wow.
Dr. Nydia (27:31):
We also found that these cancer survivors were
actually improving their mentalhealth.
This is COVID era and all ofthese things were statistically
significant.
And all of these things werestatistically significant.
And we saw also another we dohave another paper with this
that we saw a reduction ininflammation the inflammatory
(27:53):
cytokines.
So when I talk to anybody whowill listen about the benefits
of therapeutic yoga, I getreally strong and say I know
this works, we've done theresearch and it doesn't have to
be hard and it should feel goodand the gentlest practice can
really benefit you.
Judy Oskam (28:14):
I love that.
Well, how about someone who'sstarting out?
Where do they start?
Obviously, they come to one ofyour sessions if they live in
the San Antonio area or theywatch your videos.
Dr. Nydia (28:25):
Or they visit with me live stream or you can live
stream.
I love that.
I love that.
So my favorite way wheneverbecause I do also offer private
therapeutic yoga instruction anda therapeutic yoga assessment
for some.
Some individuals don't know,they're like I don't really want
to start with a class, I'membarrassed or I, you know, I
(28:46):
don't know if I'm ready, and sowe will sit down together and
we'll look at their past history.
The clinician in me is present,while the yoga person in me is
present, and it's just a melding, and so I'm making certain that
there's no reason why theyshouldn't be doing this work,
Clearing them from that.
And then we look at theirhistory.
(29:08):
What have they done before?
We look at physically.
You know, maybe there was someold back pain or you know some
surgery, and then we start to,you know, do work together, and
I always start by assessingtheir breath and their position
and their mobility.
Coming back to the bookTherapeutic Yoga Works, that
(29:35):
book is actually when you readit.
It's actually sharing a privatepractice that I did with an
individual who had intense backpain.
So it's when you read that bookit's actually written in
dialogue.
It's, it's a story.
And it's the story of a womanwho had extreme back pain, and
(29:58):
when you read it, it's like youare a beautiful butterfly in the
room, while she and I, caroline, are doing the work to help her
regain her function and herquality of life.
And so you know, I share that,because those that individual
instruction is important and Ioffer that.
But ultimately, my goal is toteach people how to take care of
(30:23):
themselves for the long termand so empower them and give
them the tools, and that's whywe start with the breath,
because the most important thingwe will do today is breathe,
and when we breathe efficiently,the nervous system says thank
you.
Judy Oskam (30:41):
Yeah, yeah.
Well, look back at that highschool senior.
What would you tell her afterwe've gone through all of this?
And what would you say to hernow?
Oh my gosh, she's proud of you.
Dr. Nydia (30:55):
I know, oh, she wouldn't imagine.
I would tell her, oh goodness,that I would tell her more early
in life that she should justnot care what anybody thinks.
I love that.
Judy Oskam (31:11):
Yes.
Dr. Nydia (31:12):
She should just do she's always been an oddball and
just go with it, babe, becauseyou're going to be fine.
Judy Oskam (31:19):
Yes, don't worry about that.
I so love that.
Well, and look ahead in fiveyears from now.
What's your goal?
Because I know your goal is tochange the world.
I know that.
I know that about you.
You pegged me, yeah.
And what are you going to bedoing in five years and what's
the practice going to be doing?
Dr. Nydia (31:39):
And you know, I really wasn't sure I wanted to
write a book, but I wasn't sureif I was going to like it, the
process or be any good.
Well, I loved it.
I want to continue writing.
I have so much to share andsome people are like me.
They like to read books andlearn about stuff, and it's just
(32:02):
so important to continue.
You know, reading it's justsuch a great way to stimulate
our brain and so I want to write, continue writing.
I will continue to provide thesegentle therapeutic yoga
practices at my I do have a homestudio and I will provide that
and to the community.
Whenever I'm invited to gosomewhere that I will go if I
(32:25):
can to.
Also to continue to educateclinicians.
I've been very fortunate thatthe Texas Physical Therapy
Association has they're myfriends and I get invited when I
submit.
They invite me to come andpresent about the therapeutic
yoga to physical therapists andphysical therapist assistants
(32:50):
and students, and so I want tocontinue doing that and I'll do
more workshops at my home studioto invite clinicians and
anybody who wants to come and doa workshop, you know, but it's
a really neat thing to danglethe carrot about.
You can get continuingeducation towards your license.
When you come and dotherapeutic yoga for two days
(33:14):
straight and eat nutritious anddelicious meals and then relax
and breathe, and they're like,seriously, and I'm like, oh yeah
, I've got the accreditation,I'm all in.
Judy Oskam (33:26):
I love that and that's a win-win, because then
their patients are thebeneficiaries, right.
Dr. Nydia (33:32):
When I do those programs I focus on the
clinician because I want theirself-care to rise.
These are servants, these arepeople who have a
service-oriented mind, body andspirit and they want to help.
But oftentimes those of us witha servant's heart, we don't put
ourselves first, we go last.
(33:54):
So I want them to be able toembody the practice, to
experience it, to benefit fromit and then hopefully it'll
influence their clinicalpractice, kind of like the way
it influenced mine, you know.
And then I just kind of keptdoing it because it felt good
and I kept sharing it because Iknew it was good.
Judy Oskam (34:14):
But what you did was you went in and you found the
framework for putting it alltogether.
That's, that takes some heavylifting.
Dr. Nydia (34:23):
It was really an accident.
I'm such a nerd, I love to takethings apart, I can't help
myself.
And so when I was on my livingroom floor you know, I'm a
manually trained physicaltherapist, both my husband and I
are manually trained that meansthat we do like osteopathic or
chiropractic mobilizing and, youknow, manipulating the joints,
and I realized that when I wasdoing a posture and I was
(34:51):
realized that when I was doing aposture and I was and I and it
was a hard one, so I would takeit apart to bring it down to its
essential element and then Iwould start building it back up.
You know well, if you want tostand with one leg on one leg,
with the other leg behind yourhead which, by the way, I don't
recommend but if you want to dothat, how do you start doing
that?
Well, at first you got to begood at standing on both legs.
You know both feet have to begrounded.
You want to do that.
How do you start doing that?
Well, at first you got to begood at standing on both legs.
You know both feet have to begrounded.
(35:13):
You have to learn that beforeyou can even try to think about
lifting one of the legs up evenan inch off the floor.
So I was noticing that when Itake these postures apart, the
traditional ones, and turn theminto what I thought was the best
way to do them oops, a littlebit different then.
What was happening is I couldsee the potential for
(35:36):
therapeutically mobilizing themajor joints and bringing the
body into balance in a way thatI could do it for myself.
Now, if you've ever had manualtherapies, the clinician does it
to you, which puts you in avery dependent situation.
If you have pain, you've got togo to your clinician and
(35:58):
they've got to fix you and it'slike no, no, no, no.
Again, I have strong opinionsabout this.
But if we're not empowering ourpatients, if we're not giving
them the tools strong opinioncoming at you we're not doing
our job we got to be able to.
It's more cost effective If weteach them they you know, I want
(36:21):
my clients to fire me.
Judy Oskam (36:24):
It's like I'm done with you.
Dr. Nydia (36:25):
Nydia, I feel fabulous.
I don't need to come back toour one-on-one or physical
therapy, but I'll do my practiceand I'm looking, I'm feeling
good and yay, that's what I want.
And my husband jokes with mebecause he and I are both
co-owners of the multipleprograms that we run, and he's a
silent partner.
(36:46):
And he says Nydia.
And he's a silent partner andhe says, Nydia, you know, your
business model kind of sucks.
You're supposed to make themwant to come back and give you
more money.
You know Right.
And I tell him I said, well,here's the reality.
Unfortunately, there are so manypeople who are living with pain
(37:07):
that I wish that I could justdo the funnest part of my work,
which is doing the prevention,where you know, hey, let's just
do the exercise and have fun.
No one has pain.
But I'm not.
I'm not afraid that I'm not,that I'm going to be out of a
job.
I wish that part of my jobcould be over, which would be
great, because then peoplearen't living in pain, People
(37:29):
are feeling strong, and then wecould just become superhuman
altogether.
Judy Oskam (37:33):
Right, right.
Well, it's such a challenging,I guess, future that you're
trying to solve there, I think.
But as someone who's been inone of your sessions and really
needs to get back and do that, Iwant to bring my husband and
have you analyze him a littlebit.
(37:54):
Soccer player really tighthamstrings really, really beat
up for years.
Dr. Nydia (38:02):
And he has great potential and he's got good
potential, so I'll be knockingon your door, but I look forward
to it Well, and I love thatyou've provided the resources.
Judy Oskam (38:13):
So talk a little bit about what's on your YouTube
channel so that people know whatto do, and I'll put the actual
addresses in the show notes foryou.
Dr. Nydia (38:22):
Thank you Well first and foremost, the book itself
has its own website.
Therapeuticyogaworks.
com itself has its own website,TherapeuticYogaWorks.
com, and in that book, on thatwebsite, are all of the
practices that are in the book.
You don't have to buy the bookIf you just want to go and get
an idea of what the practicesare like.
I recorded 22 postures that areall in the book.
(38:42):
I recorded the therapeutic sunsalutation that helps us get
down onto the floor and thenhelps us get back up, which is
very important If you end up onthe floor and you can't get up,
that's the problem and somebreathing audio recordings where
you just lie there or sit thereand just maximize your
oxygenation with gentle,rhythmic breathing.
(39:04):
So there's so much.
Just in therapeuticyogaworkworks.
com you could go to my YouTubepage, Nydia's yoga therapy and
the open hand Institute.
Also, I have two YouTube pagesand you can go to those and I
have uploaded so many recordingsof classes.
You could do a 10 minute, a 15minute, you could do a whole
(39:25):
full class, 60 minute or 75minute class.
I put them there on purpose.
Then there's my specialty footstuff.
I had classes more about yourhip, you know, maybe your I saw
that yeah I have my own fatherwho was a very dedicated
practitioner, non-traditionalhispanic male truck driver.
Him I recorded, uh, him, wewere doing a seated yoga with
(39:50):
Pedro.
Oh, go, look for that.
It's pretty hilarious.
I am, you know, I'm sometimesspeaking some Spanglish, you
know, and it's just and I'mgoing between Spanish and
English and and it's just showsyou that you know, you can sit
there and breathe and do someactivities and even when you're
limited in your emotion, you'restill doing the practice,
(40:11):
practice and it's so valuable.
I love that.
I also have a video with my now87 year old mother doing her
practice, and this one is yogafor knee strength awareness with
Bobby.
So some, she has two knee jointreplacements and so she's an
example of, yes, you still can.
And in that particular practicefor people with knee pain or
(40:33):
knee issues, there's a speciallittle section at the beginning
teaches you how to dotraditional isometric
strengthening and mobility ofyour knees to improve your
function, and then in thepractice there's also standing
postures and balancing andthings that we do.
So there's just a lot in there.
I have, you know, vimeocom andI have, through my own studio,
(41:00):
some video on demand servicesand so, but I like to let the
community know that the otherservices are completely free.
If you have internet access,then you could go and find those
and the therapeuticyogaworkscomalso.
The only thing that'll happenyou get on my email list, that's
(41:22):
it Completely free access.
And I want you know.
If you know someone who mightbenefit, please share it,
because that's another reasonwhy I did it to give it to the
community, because I know thisworks.
Judy Oskam (41:36):
And, yes, you've proven it works.
It's evident that it does, andwe're all the beneficiaries.
This has been so fun.
I appreciate this.
We might have to do anotherround two whenever we whenever
you get me going a little bithere.
Dr. Nydia (41:50):
Oh, I think it would be so fun for you to share about
your adventures.
That's great, that's great,it's just been so wonderful.
I so appreciate your invitationand I love just.
You know you got a beautifulsmile and your energy is so
magnificent, so thank you somuch.
Judy Oskam (42:05):
Thank you, and I'll put information in the show
notes.
Thank you so much.
Thank you.
Thank you, and I'll putinformation in the show notes.
And thank you for listening toStories of Change and Creativity
.
I love Dr Nydia and I love whatshe's doing and the resources
are out there.
So check out the show notes formore information and remember
if you've got a story to shareor know someone who does reach
(42:26):
out to me at judyoskam.
com.
Thanks for listening.
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