April 26, 2025 • 35 mins
Andy Bell had a life changing event that rocked his world. And now he's working to change the world of education. As CEO of Thinkery, Andy shares his vision for revolutionizing education by combining AI technology with joyful learning experiences.
During our conversation you'll learn:
• how a brain cancer diagnosis gave Bell clarity and urgency about his mission to transform education
• that our traditional education system was designed for industrial era skills, not the critical thinking needed today
• the statistics that show 95% of preschoolers test as creative geniuses while less than 10% of college students do
• how parents can model a growth mindset by learning alongside children
• about a revolutionary new model that combines formal education with museum experiences
• how AI can free educators to focus on nurturing creativity instead of delivering content
Check out Andy Bell's TEDx Talk: Education Revolution: How AI and Joy will Transform Learning
You can learn more about Thinkery, a nonprofit organization that celebrates play-based STEAM learning, at this link.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Judy Oskam (00:02):
Hi everyone and welcome back to Stories of
Change and Creativity.
I'm Judy Oskam and on today'sepisode, I'm excited to share my
conversation with Andy Bell.
He's the CEO of Thinkery,Austin's amazing children's
museum.
It's all about creativity andlearning and play, and Andy had
(00:26):
the formula of success early inhis career.
He knew how to play the game.
He followed the rules until achallenging life event brain
cancer.
It shifted his life, but itgave him purpose and clarity.
Purpose and clarity.
(00:48):
He'll share how that impactedwhat we need to be doing to
start an education revolution.
I hope you enjoy this interviewas much as I did.
Well, Andy, give us yourelevator pitch.
Give us a little introduction,if you will.
Andy Bell (01:02):
Yes, thank you so much.
My name is Andy Belly bell andmy current role I'm the ceo of a
, a magical organization calledthinkery, where we bring, uh,
joyful, hands-on learningexperiences to children and
families to spark a lifelonglove of learning.
(01:23):
And that's a good segue to kindof who I am.
My pathway has been interestingand nonlinear, but I think
that's more and more normalthese days.
I originally studiedengineering and got into the
tech world, but my passion hasalways been in education and in
the opportunity that educationhas to transform lives, but
(01:45):
recognizing that there's a lotof opportunities to do it
differently and better and morecreatively, and being able to
focus on that.
As a father, I've got twodaughters who have grown up
going to places like Thinkeryand an amazing wife who has been
(02:06):
kind of part of this journey.
That has led me to really havethe opportunity to think about
learning and education and thepotential for informal learning
to partner with formal learningin really impactful ways.
Judy Oskam (02:24):
informal learning to partner with formal learning in
really impactful ways.
Well, I was so happy to meetyou in February when you did
your TEDx talk and I do want totalk about that.
Your TEDx talk EducationRevolution how AI and Joy Will
Transform Learning.
That's a powerful call toaction.
If you will, and how we vieweducation and success, can you
(02:47):
start by sharing what inspiredthat message and what you hope
people take away from it?
Andy Bell (02:56):
I love that you started with the call to action,
because we are in a moment thatthat call to action is critical
.
We're facing a lot ofchallenges in our education
system.
The inequities are only growingand the approaches that we have
(03:17):
taken for a really long timeright.
We fundamentally have aneducation system that was
designed well over a century agofor a very different set of
skills right to help kids besuccessful in a manufacturing
world of you know, followingprocess and instructions and
order.
Our world around us isdynamically changing at rates
(03:46):
that we've never seen and thatbrings opportunity.
But it means our kids need todevelop a very different set of
skills critical thinking andcollaboration and problem
solving.
And if we make the focus andchanges needed to think about
learning differently, we trulycan set this generation up to
(04:07):
thrive now and in the future.
But it's not going to take asmall incremental change of an
outdated and broken system.
It's going to take bold newthinking and leveraging the
opportunity that comes with newtechnology, that comes with AI,
to transform our educationsystem.
(04:28):
And that really was the focusof that talk and just trying to
change the mindset of you knoweveryone, because it's not just
you know administrators orpolicymakers.
One of the most important, youknow, people in education are
parents and caregivers andthey're going to play a bigger
(04:49):
and bigger role in out-of-schooltime learning but also other
community spaces like thinkeryand libraries, and we have a
chance to recognize thatlearning, you know, doesn't and
shouldn't just happen betweeneight and three in the same four
walls, and that sometimes themost impactful learning happens
outside of that, if we'reintentional about creating those
(05:11):
opportunities.
Judy Oskam (05:12):
Well, and you got into this in a weird kind of
interesting talk about yourjourney and you had some real
life changes that kind of putyou where you are today and I
thought that was a fascinatingpart of your TED Talk and we'll
put the TED Talk information inthe show notes because I really
want to encourage listeners togo and watch your talk.
But you really shared a lotabout how you got there.
Andy Bell (05:38):
Yeah, I, as I mentioned briefly in kind of my
introduction, I started in thetech and engineering world but
really at the intersection ofhow technologies can support
this new model of experientiallearning, and that led me to
working for Lego Education andreally immersing myself in the
(06:02):
power of creativity and joyfullearning, and we created some of
the most innovative learningsolutions, products like Lego,
mindstorms, robotics and WeDoand others.
And what I learned, that thebiggest challenge wasn't in the
visioning and the imagining ofthese products, it was
(06:24):
integrating them into aneducation system that really
should have welcomed them.
And you know, I kind of I didmy best, I did what a lot of
people do and like what's thenext step and kind of slow
progress and kind of movingforward.
And you know I have been anoverachiever and I you know I
loved being successful and kindof getting those gold stars.
(06:47):
Follow the rules, that's right,you know, playing the game that
we've kind of been given.
And and then I, I had a reallychallenging life events.
And, you know, one day I wascompletely healthy and felt
healthy at least, and the nextday, um, after, you know, a
(07:08):
series of kind of intenseheadaches, um learned that I had
brain cancer and um, it's youknow it's hard to describe how
jarring that is.
Right, like, um, I think youknow you can imagine it, but
just in this instant everythingjust completely flipped upside
(07:28):
down and and forces you to thinkabout things completely
differently and prioritiescompletely differently and my,
my purpose and and and how Iwant to kind of approach this
world.
And it gave me this clarity oflike, okay, the things that I
(07:50):
kind of knew, right, like thatwere important to pursue and
that we needed to do boldly, butwere maybe in the back of my
mind, of like, okay, those arethings that I could do later in
life and you know, I'll makeprogress.
An urgency of like, no like,okay, those are things that I
can do later in life and youknow, I'll make progress.
An urgency of like, no like,let's, let's really prioritize
(08:14):
and put energy and urgency intomaking an impact in areas that I
happen to have some backgroundand expertise and and so it
really pushed me on a differentpath and getting, you know,
significantly involved andimmersing myself in ways that we
can evolve our education systemand led me to this role at
(08:36):
Thinkery and some bold neweducational concepts and kind of
challenging the status quoconcepts.
And kind of challenging thestatus quo and, you know,
recognizing one of the things Italk about in my TED talk is
that we need to think about thisas revolution and not evolution
right.
Yeah, we can't just keep pushinguphill, you know, against a
(09:01):
system that was never meant fortrue learning, Like we, we have
to rebuild, Um, but I mean thethe good news, right, and, and
you know, I think part of who Iam is just always, uh, seeking
the opportunities andpossibilities that that we have
and and realizing them is thepieces that we need for the
(09:23):
future of our education system.
They're here, we just need toembrace them and we need to
really innovatively think aboutthe model differently.
Judy Oskam (09:36):
Well, let's go back a hot minute, because you had to
first deal with your cancerdiagnosis and dealing with that
on a personal level, your family, your whole being.
How did you deal with thatfirst to then get into your
(09:57):
purpose and I'm sure kind ofclarity in your purpose kind of
gave you a mission if you willduring that time, kind of gave
you a mission if you will duringthat time.
But how did you for peoplelistening who are dealing with a
life health challenge like that, how did you do that?
I always wonder about peoplehow do you get through something
like that?
Andy Bell (10:17):
Yeah, and for those, I mean, it may be a health
challenge, it may be anotherchallenge, right, it may be a
loss of a job or a family member, right, like I think, um, we're
all going to have these, thesejarring moments, um and um, you
know, I, I, I think the advicethat I would give is, um, that
(10:43):
everything that you areexperiencing and feeling is is
okay and, in the moment, likeit's all right for it to be a
struggle and for the hardestthing that you have experienced,
but but to to not pretend thatit's not happening or push it
(11:04):
away or kind of deal with it.
And you know, I'll give anexample.
You know, our two daughterswere pretty young at the time
and, of course, we wanted to doeverything that we could to
support them, but we weren'texperts and the strategies we
took, it turned out, werecompletely opposite of what we
(11:26):
should do.
And we found people who wereexperts in an amazing
organization called Wonders andWorries, who works with kids who
have a parent dealing with, youknow, challenges and, and I,
you know I, as a learner, Ineeded to get the tools and to
understand, like, what's outthere and how to go through it.
(11:46):
You know, I personally workedwith multiple therapists and
folks to kind of help me kind ofunderstand that you know there
are things that we can controland there are things that we
can't control Right and when weface these significant obstacles
, really leaning into like whatwe can control.
(12:09):
And that helped me lead towardsum, you know, focusing my energy
on the opportunity and claritythat this gave me to make the
most out of each and every dayand moment that I had the energy
and opportunity to do thatright and letting it be okay and
(12:32):
in the times that it's not.
But looking back now, sevenyears later, and being in in
great health now and part ofthat coming from just
breakthrough medical science anda clinical trial drug and the
importance of us inspiring thenext generation of problem
(12:56):
solvers who are going to help ustackle all of these challenges,
really came full circle.
Um for me because that has been, you know, kind of my passion
and my focus.
But um just gave me clarity onum, putting my energy, um into a
space that um that I know is isneeded and that's um that I
(13:21):
know is needed and that's, forme, is where my calling and my
purpose really aligned.
Judy Oskam (13:33):
Well, I'm sure you must have thought something like
if not, if not when, why notnow?
And if not who, why not?
Me, you know, because takingthe lead in this this is you're
talking about a massiveeducational shift and a mindset
shift into what we think ofeducation.
And I'm at the university leveland there are changes needed
there too.
But I always tell my facultyback to the education part is
(13:56):
remember K through 12, yourstudents have been in a box, if
you will.
They've been in a verystructured environment.
They come to the university andwe say get out of the box, be
creative.
Especially in my area, we teachmedia communication, digital
media, journalism, pr.
We say be creative andsometimes the students don't
(14:18):
really trust.
They ask things like what sizefont do you want on the paper,
what size, how many pages do youwant?
You know they're used to thatstructure.
How do we, how do we take yoursort of mindset that you went
through with your, with yourhealth challenge, and how do we
change that at at the local andglobal level when we're talking
about an education system?
Andy Bell (14:41):
And just to put a an put an exclamation point on
what you're saying.
There's fascinating but notsurprising research out there of
testing for creativity andlevels of creative genius and
the data and the studies showthat four and five-year-olds and
(15:12):
the data and the studies showthat four and five year olds the
percentage of kids at this agethat test as creative geniuses
is over 95%, and so it's notthat we need to teach kids how
to be creative kids how to becreative, but as you track their
progression, you know, inmiddle school, that number drops
significantly by the time theyget to you.
In higher ed, it's under 10% ofstudents test as creative
(15:35):
geniuses, and so I think a hugepart of what we do is, you know,
stop removing creativity fromlearning in their lives and
really embrace that exploringand tinkering and failing and
learning from that failure is anopportunity, instead of saying
(16:00):
that what's important ismemorizing a set of facts and
hitting, you know, this testmetric as we move forward, which
our system is structured around, and right now, a lot of that
needs to happen outside of ourformal classrooms.
And so, yes, we need to makesignificant changes in our
formal education and, you know,at Thinkery and other
(16:23):
organizations, we're doingprofessional development to help
teachers, who are superheroes,right, like they are the stars
of the show, but they're in asystem that doesn't allow for
them to tap into their strengths.
And, and so you know, I thinkthere are just really important
experiences that can happenoutside of the school day, in
(16:48):
after school programs, at boysand girls clubs, at places like
thinkery and libraries, andsummer camps, and FIRST robotics
, and you know, just all ofthese countless areas, while we
are also working with those thathave the opportunity to make
changes inside of formaleducation, and we're at a
(17:08):
transformative moment where AIand the rate of growth can help
us achieve the change that wealready know we need, and I
think that's what's interesting,and I think that's a big piece
(17:31):
of how we can accelerate thischange quickly, because this has
been a problem we've known fora long time.
There's a lot of people thathave worked on this, that are
passionate about it, that agreewith what I'm saying, and we
just haven't made progress, andso what's going to be that
dynamic, you know, forcingfunction, and I think AI has an
opportunity to do that, but onlyin the right environment, right
(17:51):
where we're thinking about thiscommunity-centric approach and
recognizing that the mostimportant piece is joyful
learning and bringing joy tolearning, and back to learning.
Judy Oskam (18:04):
Talk about joy a little bit because I love that.
I love that that was part ofyour TED Talk and talk about why
joy is so crucial to making allof the pieces fit together.
Andy Bell (18:15):
Yeah, if you look at , you know kids today and
students today and what they'regoing to see in their careers.
The truth is, we have no ideawhat the jobs of tomorrow are
going to look like.
Exactly right, we know there'sstatistics from MIT that already
(18:36):
60% of the jobs of today didn'texist in 1940 and an even
larger percentage of the jobs oftomorrow don't exist today.
What we need to focus on ispreparing our students to be
learners and to be lifelonglearners, and the best way to do
that is to create a love forlearning.
(18:58):
They're not just going to havemultiple jobs, they're going to
have multiple careers, and if wecan embrace the natural
creativity and desire toexperiment and to tinker and to
learn and have that be thethrough line in all of our
(19:20):
experiences, then that is goingto set our students up to
continue to do that throughouttheir lives and that, at the end
of the day, is how we're goingto help ensure students thrive
today and also in the future, inthis world of endless
possibility.
Judy Oskam (19:41):
Well, I love how you really give a shout out to the
parents, and it's not just yousend your child to school and
expect all the work to happenthere, all the work, the love
and the joy.
What can parents do?
And talk about what you didwith your kids?
How did you sort of get?
What did you do with yourdaughters to make things, to
(20:03):
make them lifelong learners?
Andy Bell (20:06):
Yeah, I think it's essential that we're proactive
as parents, right, and one ofthe challenges is that we come
from the system that we knowneeds changing and you are just
very likely to replicate whatyou have gone through, what you
(20:33):
have gone through, and so Idon't want to trivialize how
challenging what I'm saying isto completely change and adopt a
different mindset.
But fundamentally, that's whatwe're going to have to do and
you know, if I could put a youknow, a simple message on what
that looks like, this is truefor teachers, for parents, for
all of us who need to be seen aseducators.
(20:56):
You know, we come from a modelwhere there's just this
expectation that we need to knoweverything and with that, then
when you get questions from yourkids, when you get questions
from your students and you don'tknow the answer to that, then
that puts you in anuncomfortable spot where maybe
(21:18):
you don't embrace that as alearning moment and you're
modeling that it's important toknow the answer it's not
important to learn how to findthe answer and to embrace a
growth mindset.
And I think that growth mindsetfundamentally, is core to how
parents need to model embracinglearning alongside your child
(21:47):
and with your child and takingevery question that they ask of
wonder and inquiry because Iguarantee they're asking those
questions and to learn with themand to explore and to embrace,
whether it's, you know, a simpleproject that you do at home, or
(22:10):
whether you know a simpleproject that you do at home, or
whether it's findingenvironments that embrace these
types of experiences as you moveforward.
And that's where, you know, Ithink the intersection with AI
is interesting, because we nowhave the ability to get some of
(22:31):
that subject matter expertisethat we often think of as what's
essential for an educator tojust, you know, rotely deliver
in one direction, and so we canaccess that information in a
very engaging way as kind of apartner.
And then, parents, you know wecan just focus on creating this
(22:56):
environment of learning andgrowth and, you know, kind of
embracing this opportunity toexplore and, similar to you know
, what many amazing teachers aredoing today and how we want to
create kind of moreopportunities for teachers to do
that in the future.
Judy Oskam (23:15):
Yeah, I love that and I know and I always say
asking the right questions iskey rather than knowing all of
the answers, and in my TED TalkI talked about that a little bit
and about take action andfigure it out along the way.
So you're not going to know.
And education is not abouthaving all the right answers.
(23:38):
It's about finding thestrategies and the tools to then
embrace.
That's great.
Well, I know sometimes parentsmight be thinking well, I don't,
it's just me, what can I do?
But taking your kid to thethinkery and places like that,
and let's, let's get back tothat a little bit.
(23:58):
I mean, have you had a momentat the thinkery that really kind
of you know hit you and you'rethinking this I am in the right
place here.
Have you seen the impact it'shad on parents, children and
teachers?
Andy Bell (24:13):
I have and it's the most amazing experience to see
the light bulb and that sparkhappen.
And I had seen the impact ofThinkery through my kids'
experiences for many years andwhen I came on board as CEO
(24:34):
really recognized that we knewthe impacts that these types of
experiences have and in factwe've been doing research with
UT Austin for 15 years to kindof show how these experiences,
especially in early learning andelementary learning, can spark
(24:56):
and set you up for success andalso how we support parents and
kind of caregivers.
But what was clear was that weweren't reaching those in our
community who had been furthestfrom opportunity, those in our
community who have been furthestfrom opportunity, and so we put
a lot of intention and focus onhow do we remove barriers to
(25:17):
the programs and experiences atThinkery but how do we also
bring those experiences out intothe community and especially
for those that haven'ttraditionally had the same
opportunities?
And something that has been athrough line in my career and in
(25:38):
my kind of leadership style isthe power and importance of
collaboration.
I really come back to theAfrican proverb if you want to
go far, go sorry.
If you want to go fast, goalone.
If you want to go far, gotogether, and so we really put
(26:02):
understanding how we could workwith community-based
organizations that had beentransformational but may not
have Thinkery's specificexpertise in play-based team
learning and work together.
And so our partnership withBoys and Girls Club is an
incredible example and the workthat they are doing to impact
(26:26):
the lives of kids and thesuccess and graduation rates,
but knowing that you know theirexpertise again wasn't in this
type of a learning environmentor experience.
We co-developed a new afterschool program where Thinkery
developed this play-based STEAMcurriculum that gets delivered
(26:48):
at every Boys and Girls Clubsite across Central Texas, so
over 25 different sites, and atthe end of that and it's my
favorite part of every singleweek, the Boys and Girls Club
buses pull up at the Thinkeryand these kids take the projects
and the work and the learningthat they've done, and a lot of
(27:09):
times it's, you know, not justthe first time they've been to
thinkery, but sometimes thefirst time they've been to a
museum or any place that hasthis wonder and awe and magic
and seeing them apply you knowthis creative genius that they
have inside of them in this newenvironment and make those
connections and recognize thatthat space is their space and
(27:33):
that you know that sense ofbelonging and the importance of,
you know, turning a place likethinkery into a welcoming
environment for every child andtheir families.
And as part of that program theythen get they get memberships
(27:54):
to Thinkery right.
And so you know it's throughincredible donors and funders
that make programs like thatpossible right, so that program
is funded by an incredible localcompany, national Instruments.
But others right provide thedollars that help us open those
doors, our open door initiative,and have access to those
(28:14):
programs and scholarships to ourcamps.
And those are the moments thatyou get to see the magic and the
awe and the wonder that sparksthat love for learning that you
know.
We know we need to then addfuel onto that fire, but it has
to start with that spark.
Judy Oskam (28:35):
Well and does.
Is it ever too late to to findthat spark?
Is it ever too late to embracea creative growth mindset?
Andy Bell (28:44):
Absolutely not.
So I love that question .
Right, and I think in thislifelong learning moment and we
get to see that because wereally think of ourselves as a
family museum, not just achildren's museum.
And so you know, you see theadults come in and the
caregivers, and we're just asfocused on helping them
(29:09):
understand the role they canplay in learning.
So, instead of sitting on thesideline in the wall and, you
know, watching their kidsinteract, how do we give them
prompts that they can give theirkids so they can learn together
?
And you start to see thosewalls that we've put up and
those, you know, mentalconstructs of oh I can't be
(29:32):
creative and play anymore.
Fall down and get involved inlearning and engagement.
And you know we equally hopethat that helps puts a different
mindset of their inner childthat has been there for a really
long time to come back toembracing creativity and
(29:56):
learning.
And you know I do some someguest lecturing at the UT
McCombs Business School and youknow even talk about creativity
in a boardroom for a company andfor executives, and you know
just that mindset is soessential um that we really
(30:19):
recognize, uh, the importance ofum thinking outside of the box
and thinking differently andembracing the opportunity to be
creative in a lot of differentenvironments.
Judy Oskam (30:36):
Yeah, I love, love that and I'm teaching a graduate
class now on creative problemsolving and mass communication
and I'm going to ask thestudents to listen to this
interview because this is a goodcatalyst for them to maybe do a
quick visit to the Thinkery.
You know, they're not too old,but I think that's fantastic and
(30:59):
I think people it sounds likewhat you do too is you give
people permission to be creative.
Those parents that are on thesidelines, you give them sort of
the okay to jump in andre-engage with their creative
self.
You know.
Andy Bell (31:15):
That's right, and it's a virtuous cycle, because
that permission and engagementthen connects back to what we
were talking about before, whichis, you know how parents can
play an active role in learning,because they now then need to
model that in how they'reengaging with their child, and
so it's really an important partof how we will see a larger
(31:40):
transformation.
Judy Oskam (31:41):
Well, speaking of transformations, what's Andy
Bell going to be doing in thenext five years?
Andy Bell (31:58):
doing in the next five years.
I am passionately committed tohelping showcase and continue to
build and evolve these modelsthat are changing kids' lives
and families' lives and thecommunity's lives, and I think
for me, you know we have startedsome incredible new programs.
So, for instance, you know anexample of a innovative new
(32:20):
model that Thinkery hasundertook that really is a
revolution is a partnership thatwe have with one of our local
school districts, dell ValleyISD, and they are a hundred
percent title one schools, but areally innovative school
district and an incrediblyvibrant community, but a
(32:44):
community that's beenunderserved for so long.
And we decided, okay, we haveto do things very, very
differently.
And so together we decided tocommit to a new learning space
that during the day, is a childdevelopment center, and we
(33:05):
overlaid and infused a thinkeryneighborhood museum into that
child development center.
So every child benefits in aformal learning environment from
everything that we're talkingabout, and all of the teachers
in the district use this spaceas their hub for professional
development.
But then, outside of the schoolday, it becomes a thinkery
(33:27):
neighborhood museum wherefamilies gather and communities
gather and teachers, and so thismodel is very new and
revolutionary and different.
And so not just what impact canit make in that community, but
how do we study this and othernew models and show the impact
(33:48):
and data and how do we thinkabout scale of those in a larger
way and mindset?
And there's some incredibleorganizations that are thinking
about scale and so you know, aswe have these individual areas
of success, you know we need tobe really thoughtful and
(34:09):
studying what are the elementsthat are key, what is the impact
and then how do we use thatknowledge to influence the
future dollars that are goinginto schools and programs and
learning so that that can havean even bigger impact learning
(34:33):
so that that can have an evenbigger impact.
Judy Oskam (34:35):
That's a big job that's more than five years but
I'm so excited to see what youdo next, andy.
Andy Bell (34:38):
Thank you.
Well, I've been inspired by allof your work and thought
leadership and the importance ofcreativity and communication
and thinking differently andhaving the opportunity to have
this conversation and to shareand to learn from others who are
doing such great work, and sojust really appreciative for
(35:00):
everything that you are doing aswell and for the opportunity to
have conversations like this.
Judy Oskam (35:06):
Well, thank you.
Thanks for joining us today.
Appreciate it, my pleasure,thanks, thank you.
Thanks for joining us today.
Andy Bell (35:10):
Appreciate it my pleasure.
Thanks for having me.
Judy Oskam (35:13):
And thank you for listening to Stories of Change
and Creativity.
I hope you enjoyed myconversation with Andy.
Be sure and check out his TEDxtalk.
I'll post it in the show notes.
If you enjoyed today's episode,I'd love it if you could leave
us a five-star review.
It really helps more listenersfind the show.
And don't forget, if you've gota story to share or know
(35:35):
someone who does reach out to meat judyoskam.
com, I would love to hear fromyou.
Hi everyone and welcome back to Stories of
Change and Creativity.
I'm Judy Oskam and on today'sepisode, I'm excited to share my
conversation with Andy Bell.
He's the CEO of Thinkery,Austin's amazing children's
museum.
It's all about creativity andlearning and play, and Andy had
(00:26):
the formula of success early inhis career.
He knew how to play the game.
He followed the rules until achallenging life event brain
cancer.
It shifted his life, but itgave him purpose and clarity.
Purpose and clarity.
(00:48):
He'll share how that impactedwhat we need to be doing to
start an education revolution.
I hope you enjoy this interviewas much as I did.
Well, Andy, give us yourelevator pitch.
Give us a little introduction,if you will.
Andy Bell (01:02):
Yes, thank you so much.
My name is Andy Belly bell andmy current role I'm the ceo of a
, a magical organization calledthinkery, where we bring, uh,
joyful, hands-on learningexperiences to children and
families to spark a lifelonglove of learning.
(01:23):
And that's a good segue to kindof who I am.
My pathway has been interestingand nonlinear, but I think
that's more and more normalthese days.
I originally studiedengineering and got into the
tech world, but my passion hasalways been in education and in
the opportunity that educationhas to transform lives, but
(01:45):
recognizing that there's a lotof opportunities to do it
differently and better and morecreatively, and being able to
focus on that.
As a father, I've got twodaughters who have grown up
going to places like Thinkeryand an amazing wife who has been
(02:06):
kind of part of this journey.
That has led me to really havethe opportunity to think about
learning and education and thepotential for informal learning
to partner with formal learningin really impactful ways.
Judy Oskam (02:24):
informal learning to partner with formal learning in
really impactful ways.
Well, I was so happy to meetyou in February when you did
your TEDx talk and I do want totalk about that.
Your TEDx talk EducationRevolution how AI and Joy Will
Transform Learning.
That's a powerful call toaction.
If you will, and how we vieweducation and success, can you
(02:47):
start by sharing what inspiredthat message and what you hope
people take away from it?
Andy Bell (02:56):
I love that you started with the call to action,
because we are in a moment thatthat call to action is critical
.
We're facing a lot ofchallenges in our education
system.
The inequities are only growingand the approaches that we have
(03:17):
taken for a really long timeright.
We fundamentally have aneducation system that was
designed well over a century agofor a very different set of
skills right to help kids besuccessful in a manufacturing
world of you know, followingprocess and instructions and
order.
Our world around us isdynamically changing at rates
(03:46):
that we've never seen and thatbrings opportunity.
But it means our kids need todevelop a very different set of
skills critical thinking andcollaboration and problem
solving.
And if we make the focus andchanges needed to think about
learning differently, we trulycan set this generation up to
(04:07):
thrive now and in the future.
But it's not going to take asmall incremental change of an
outdated and broken system.
It's going to take bold newthinking and leveraging the
opportunity that comes with newtechnology, that comes with AI,
to transform our educationsystem.
(04:28):
And that really was the focusof that talk and just trying to
change the mindset of you knoweveryone, because it's not just
you know administrators orpolicymakers.
One of the most important, youknow, people in education are
parents and caregivers andthey're going to play a bigger
(04:49):
and bigger role in out-of-schooltime learning but also other
community spaces like thinkeryand libraries, and we have a
chance to recognize thatlearning, you know, doesn't and
shouldn't just happen betweeneight and three in the same four
walls, and that sometimes themost impactful learning happens
outside of that, if we'reintentional about creating those
(05:11):
opportunities.
Judy Oskam (05:12):
Well, and you got into this in a weird kind of
interesting talk about yourjourney and you had some real
life changes that kind of putyou where you are today and I
thought that was a fascinatingpart of your TED Talk and we'll
put the TED Talk information inthe show notes because I really
want to encourage listeners togo and watch your talk.
But you really shared a lotabout how you got there.
Andy Bell (05:38):
Yeah, I, as I mentioned briefly in kind of my
introduction, I started in thetech and engineering world but
really at the intersection ofhow technologies can support
this new model of experientiallearning, and that led me to
working for Lego Education andreally immersing myself in the
(06:02):
power of creativity and joyfullearning, and we created some of
the most innovative learningsolutions, products like Lego,
mindstorms, robotics and WeDoand others.
And what I learned, that thebiggest challenge wasn't in the
visioning and the imagining ofthese products, it was
(06:24):
integrating them into aneducation system that really
should have welcomed them.
And you know, I kind of I didmy best, I did what a lot of
people do and like what's thenext step and kind of slow
progress and kind of movingforward.
And you know I have been anoverachiever and I you know I
loved being successful and kindof getting those gold stars.
(06:47):
Follow the rules, that's right,you know, playing the game that
we've kind of been given.
And and then I, I had a reallychallenging life events.
And, you know, one day I wascompletely healthy and felt
healthy at least, and the nextday, um, after, you know, a
(07:08):
series of kind of intenseheadaches, um learned that I had
brain cancer and um, it's youknow it's hard to describe how
jarring that is.
Right, like, um, I think youknow you can imagine it, but
just in this instant everythingjust completely flipped upside
(07:28):
down and and forces you to thinkabout things completely
differently and prioritiescompletely differently and my,
my purpose and and and how Iwant to kind of approach this
world.
And it gave me this clarity oflike, okay, the things that I
(07:50):
kind of knew, right, like thatwere important to pursue and
that we needed to do boldly, butwere maybe in the back of my
mind, of like, okay, those arethings that I could do later in
life and you know, I'll makeprogress.
An urgency of like, no like,okay, those are things that I
can do later in life and youknow, I'll make progress.
An urgency of like, no like,let's, let's really prioritize
(08:14):
and put energy and urgency intomaking an impact in areas that I
happen to have some backgroundand expertise and and so it
really pushed me on a differentpath and getting, you know,
significantly involved andimmersing myself in ways that we
can evolve our education systemand led me to this role at
(08:36):
Thinkery and some bold neweducational concepts and kind of
challenging the status quoconcepts.
And kind of challenging thestatus quo and, you know,
recognizing one of the things Italk about in my TED talk is
that we need to think about thisas revolution and not evolution
right.
Yeah, we can't just keep pushinguphill, you know, against a
(09:01):
system that was never meant fortrue learning, Like we, we have
to rebuild, Um, but I mean thethe good news, right, and, and
you know, I think part of who Iam is just always, uh, seeking
the opportunities andpossibilities that that we have
and and realizing them is thepieces that we need for the
(09:23):
future of our education system.
They're here, we just need toembrace them and we need to
really innovatively think aboutthe model differently.
Judy Oskam (09:36):
Well, let's go back a hot minute, because you had to
first deal with your cancerdiagnosis and dealing with that
on a personal level, your family, your whole being.
How did you deal with thatfirst to then get into your
(09:57):
purpose and I'm sure kind ofclarity in your purpose kind of
gave you a mission if you willduring that time, kind of gave
you a mission if you will duringthat time.
But how did you for peoplelistening who are dealing with a
life health challenge like that, how did you do that?
I always wonder about peoplehow do you get through something
like that?
Andy Bell (10:17):
Yeah, and for those, I mean, it may be a health
challenge, it may be anotherchallenge, right, it may be a
loss of a job or a family member, right, like I think, um, we're
all going to have these, thesejarring moments, um and um, you
know, I, I, I think the advicethat I would give is, um, that
(10:43):
everything that you areexperiencing and feeling is is
okay and, in the moment, likeit's all right for it to be a
struggle and for the hardestthing that you have experienced,
but but to to not pretend thatit's not happening or push it
(11:04):
away or kind of deal with it.
And you know, I'll give anexample.
You know, our two daughterswere pretty young at the time
and, of course, we wanted to doeverything that we could to
support them, but we weren'texperts and the strategies we
took, it turned out, werecompletely opposite of what we
(11:26):
should do.
And we found people who wereexperts in an amazing
organization called Wonders andWorries, who works with kids who
have a parent dealing with, youknow, challenges and, and I,
you know I, as a learner, Ineeded to get the tools and to
understand, like, what's outthere and how to go through it.
(11:46):
You know, I personally workedwith multiple therapists and
folks to kind of help me kind ofunderstand that you know there
are things that we can controland there are things that we
can't control Right and when weface these significant obstacles
, really leaning into like whatwe can control.
(12:09):
And that helped me lead towardsum, you know, focusing my energy
on the opportunity and claritythat this gave me to make the
most out of each and every dayand moment that I had the energy
and opportunity to do thatright and letting it be okay and
(12:32):
in the times that it's not.
But looking back now, sevenyears later, and being in in
great health now and part ofthat coming from just
breakthrough medical science anda clinical trial drug and the
importance of us inspiring thenext generation of problem
(12:56):
solvers who are going to help ustackle all of these challenges,
really came full circle.
Um for me because that has been, you know, kind of my passion
and my focus.
But um just gave me clarity onum, putting my energy, um into a
space that um that I know is isneeded and that's um that I
(13:21):
know is needed and that's, forme, is where my calling and my
purpose really aligned.
Judy Oskam (13:33):
Well, I'm sure you must have thought something like
if not, if not when, why notnow?
And if not who, why not?
Me, you know, because takingthe lead in this this is you're
talking about a massiveeducational shift and a mindset
shift into what we think ofeducation.
And I'm at the university leveland there are changes needed
there too.
But I always tell my facultyback to the education part is
(13:56):
remember K through 12, yourstudents have been in a box, if
you will.
They've been in a verystructured environment.
They come to the university andwe say get out of the box, be
creative.
Especially in my area, we teachmedia communication, digital
media, journalism, pr.
We say be creative andsometimes the students don't
(14:18):
really trust.
They ask things like what sizefont do you want on the paper,
what size, how many pages do youwant?
You know they're used to thatstructure.
How do we, how do we take yoursort of mindset that you went
through with your, with yourhealth challenge, and how do we
change that at at the local andglobal level when we're talking
about an education system?
Andy Bell (14:41):
And just to put a an put an exclamation point on
what you're saying.
There's fascinating but notsurprising research out there of
testing for creativity andlevels of creative genius and
the data and the studies showthat four and five-year-olds and
(15:12):
the data and the studies showthat four and five year olds the
percentage of kids at this agethat test as creative geniuses
is over 95%, and so it's notthat we need to teach kids how
to be creative kids how to becreative, but as you track their
progression, you know, inmiddle school, that number drops
significantly by the time theyget to you.
In higher ed, it's under 10% ofstudents test as creative
(15:35):
geniuses, and so I think a hugepart of what we do is, you know,
stop removing creativity fromlearning in their lives and
really embrace that exploringand tinkering and failing and
learning from that failure is anopportunity, instead of saying
(16:00):
that what's important ismemorizing a set of facts and
hitting, you know, this testmetric as we move forward, which
our system is structured around, and right now, a lot of that
needs to happen outside of ourformal classrooms.
And so, yes, we need to makesignificant changes in our
formal education and, you know,at Thinkery and other
(16:23):
organizations, we're doingprofessional development to help
teachers, who are superheroes,right, like they are the stars
of the show, but they're in asystem that doesn't allow for
them to tap into their strengths.
And, and so you know, I thinkthere are just really important
experiences that can happenoutside of the school day, in
(16:48):
after school programs, at boysand girls clubs, at places like
thinkery and libraries, andsummer camps, and FIRST robotics
, and you know, just all ofthese countless areas, while we
are also working with those thathave the opportunity to make
changes inside of formaleducation, and we're at a
(17:08):
transformative moment where AIand the rate of growth can help
us achieve the change that wealready know we need, and I
think that's what's interesting,and I think that's a big piece
(17:31):
of how we can accelerate thischange quickly, because this has
been a problem we've known fora long time.
There's a lot of people thathave worked on this, that are
passionate about it, that agreewith what I'm saying, and we
just haven't made progress, andso what's going to be that
dynamic, you know, forcingfunction, and I think AI has an
opportunity to do that, but onlyin the right environment, right
(17:51):
where we're thinking about thiscommunity-centric approach and
recognizing that the mostimportant piece is joyful
learning and bringing joy tolearning, and back to learning.
Judy Oskam (18:04):
Talk about joy a little bit because I love that.
I love that that was part ofyour TED Talk and talk about why
joy is so crucial to making allof the pieces fit together.
Andy Bell (18:15):
Yeah, if you look at , you know kids today and
students today and what they'regoing to see in their careers.
The truth is, we have no ideawhat the jobs of tomorrow are
going to look like.
Exactly right, we know there'sstatistics from MIT that already
(18:36):
60% of the jobs of today didn'texist in 1940 and an even
larger percentage of the jobs oftomorrow don't exist today.
What we need to focus on ispreparing our students to be
learners and to be lifelonglearners, and the best way to do
that is to create a love forlearning.
(18:58):
They're not just going to havemultiple jobs, they're going to
have multiple careers, and if wecan embrace the natural
creativity and desire toexperiment and to tinker and to
learn and have that be thethrough line in all of our
(19:20):
experiences, then that is goingto set our students up to
continue to do that throughouttheir lives and that, at the end
of the day, is how we're goingto help ensure students thrive
today and also in the future, inthis world of endless
possibility.
Judy Oskam (19:41):
Well, I love how you really give a shout out to the
parents, and it's not just yousend your child to school and
expect all the work to happenthere, all the work, the love
and the joy.
What can parents do?
And talk about what you didwith your kids?
How did you sort of get?
What did you do with yourdaughters to make things, to
(20:03):
make them lifelong learners?
Andy Bell (20:06):
Yeah, I think it's essential that we're proactive
as parents, right, and one ofthe challenges is that we come
from the system that we knowneeds changing and you are just
very likely to replicate whatyou have gone through, what you
(20:33):
have gone through, and so Idon't want to trivialize how
challenging what I'm saying isto completely change and adopt a
different mindset.
But fundamentally, that's whatwe're going to have to do and
you know, if I could put a youknow, a simple message on what
that looks like, this is truefor teachers, for parents, for
all of us who need to be seen aseducators.
(20:56):
You know, we come from a modelwhere there's just this
expectation that we need to knoweverything and with that, then
when you get questions from yourkids, when you get questions
from your students and you don'tknow the answer to that, then
that puts you in anuncomfortable spot where maybe
(21:18):
you don't embrace that as alearning moment and you're
modeling that it's important toknow the answer it's not
important to learn how to findthe answer and to embrace a
growth mindset.
And I think that growth mindsetfundamentally, is core to how
parents need to model embracinglearning alongside your child
(21:47):
and with your child and takingevery question that they ask of
wonder and inquiry because Iguarantee they're asking those
questions and to learn with themand to explore and to embrace,
whether it's, you know, a simpleproject that you do at home, or
(22:10):
whether you know a simpleproject that you do at home, or
whether it's findingenvironments that embrace these
types of experiences as you moveforward.
And that's where, you know, Ithink the intersection with AI
is interesting, because we nowhave the ability to get some of
(22:31):
that subject matter expertisethat we often think of as what's
essential for an educator tojust, you know, rotely deliver
in one direction, and so we canaccess that information in a
very engaging way as kind of apartner.
And then, parents, you know wecan just focus on creating this
(22:56):
environment of learning andgrowth and, you know, kind of
embracing this opportunity toexplore and, similar to you know
, what many amazing teachers aredoing today and how we want to
create kind of moreopportunities for teachers to do
that in the future.
Judy Oskam (23:15):
Yeah, I love that and I know and I always say
asking the right questions iskey rather than knowing all of
the answers, and in my TED TalkI talked about that a little bit
and about take action andfigure it out along the way.
So you're not going to know.
And education is not abouthaving all the right answers.
(23:38):
It's about finding thestrategies and the tools to then
embrace.
That's great.
Well, I know sometimes parentsmight be thinking well, I don't,
it's just me, what can I do?
But taking your kid to thethinkery and places like that,
and let's, let's get back tothat a little bit.
(23:58):
I mean, have you had a momentat the thinkery that really kind
of you know hit you and you'rethinking this I am in the right
place here.
Have you seen the impact it'shad on parents, children and
teachers?
Andy Bell (24:13):
I have and it's the most amazing experience to see
the light bulb and that sparkhappen.
And I had seen the impact ofThinkery through my kids'
experiences for many years andwhen I came on board as CEO
(24:34):
really recognized that we knewthe impacts that these types of
experiences have and in factwe've been doing research with
UT Austin for 15 years to kindof show how these experiences,
especially in early learning andelementary learning, can spark
(24:56):
and set you up for success andalso how we support parents and
kind of caregivers.
But what was clear was that weweren't reaching those in our
community who had been furthestfrom opportunity, those in our
community who have been furthestfrom opportunity, and so we put
a lot of intention and focus onhow do we remove barriers to
(25:17):
the programs and experiences atThinkery but how do we also
bring those experiences out intothe community and especially
for those that haven'ttraditionally had the same
opportunities?
And something that has been athrough line in my career and in
(25:38):
my kind of leadership style isthe power and importance of
collaboration.
I really come back to theAfrican proverb if you want to
go far, go sorry.
If you want to go fast, goalone.
If you want to go far, gotogether, and so we really put
(26:02):
understanding how we could workwith community-based
organizations that had beentransformational but may not
have Thinkery's specificexpertise in play-based team
learning and work together.
And so our partnership withBoys and Girls Club is an
incredible example and the workthat they are doing to impact
(26:26):
the lives of kids and thesuccess and graduation rates,
but knowing that you know theirexpertise again wasn't in this
type of a learning environmentor experience.
We co-developed a new afterschool program where Thinkery
developed this play-based STEAMcurriculum that gets delivered
(26:48):
at every Boys and Girls Clubsite across Central Texas, so
over 25 different sites, and atthe end of that and it's my
favorite part of every singleweek, the Boys and Girls Club
buses pull up at the Thinkeryand these kids take the projects
and the work and the learningthat they've done, and a lot of
(27:09):
times it's, you know, not justthe first time they've been to
thinkery, but sometimes thefirst time they've been to a
museum or any place that hasthis wonder and awe and magic
and seeing them apply you knowthis creative genius that they
have inside of them in this newenvironment and make those
connections and recognize thatthat space is their space and
(27:33):
that you know that sense ofbelonging and the importance of,
you know, turning a place likethinkery into a welcoming
environment for every child andtheir families.
And as part of that program theythen get they get memberships
(27:54):
to Thinkery right.
And so you know it's throughincredible donors and funders
that make programs like thatpossible right, so that program
is funded by an incredible localcompany, national Instruments.
But others right provide thedollars that help us open those
doors, our open door initiative,and have access to those
(28:14):
programs and scholarships to ourcamps.
And those are the moments thatyou get to see the magic and the
awe and the wonder that sparksthat love for learning that you
know.
We know we need to then addfuel onto that fire, but it has
to start with that spark.
Judy Oskam (28:35):
Well and does.
Is it ever too late to to findthat spark?
Is it ever too late to embracea creative growth mindset?
Andy Bell (28:44):
Absolutely not.
So I love that question .
Right, and I think in thislifelong learning moment and we
get to see that because wereally think of ourselves as a
family museum, not just achildren's museum.
And so you know, you see theadults come in and the
caregivers, and we're just asfocused on helping them
(29:09):
understand the role they canplay in learning.
So, instead of sitting on thesideline in the wall and, you
know, watching their kidsinteract, how do we give them
prompts that they can give theirkids so they can learn together
?
And you start to see thosewalls that we've put up and
those, you know, mentalconstructs of oh I can't be
(29:32):
creative and play anymore.
Fall down and get involved inlearning and engagement.
And you know we equally hopethat that helps puts a different
mindset of their inner childthat has been there for a really
long time to come back toembracing creativity and
(29:56):
learning.
And you know I do some someguest lecturing at the UT
McCombs Business School and youknow even talk about creativity
in a boardroom for a company andfor executives, and you know
just that mindset is soessential um that we really
(30:19):
recognize, uh, the importance ofum thinking outside of the box
and thinking differently andembracing the opportunity to be
creative in a lot of differentenvironments.
Judy Oskam (30:36):
Yeah, I love, love that and I'm teaching a graduate
class now on creative problemsolving and mass communication
and I'm going to ask thestudents to listen to this
interview because this is a goodcatalyst for them to maybe do a
quick visit to the Thinkery.
You know, they're not too old,but I think that's fantastic and
(30:59):
I think people it sounds likewhat you do too is you give
people permission to be creative.
Those parents that are on thesidelines, you give them sort of
the okay to jump in andre-engage with their creative
self.
You know.
Andy Bell (31:15):
That's right, and it's a virtuous cycle, because
that permission and engagementthen connects back to what we
were talking about before, whichis, you know how parents can
play an active role in learning,because they now then need to
model that in how they'reengaging with their child, and
so it's really an important partof how we will see a larger
(31:40):
transformation.
Judy Oskam (31:41):
Well, speaking of transformations, what's Andy
Bell going to be doing in thenext five years?
Andy Bell (31:58):
doing in the next five years.
I am passionately committed tohelping showcase and continue to
build and evolve these modelsthat are changing kids' lives
and families' lives and thecommunity's lives, and I think
for me, you know we have startedsome incredible new programs.
So, for instance, you know anexample of a innovative new
(32:20):
model that Thinkery hasundertook that really is a
revolution is a partnership thatwe have with one of our local
school districts, dell ValleyISD, and they are a hundred
percent title one schools, but areally innovative school
district and an incrediblyvibrant community, but a
(32:44):
community that's beenunderserved for so long.
And we decided, okay, we haveto do things very, very
differently.
And so together we decided tocommit to a new learning space
that during the day, is a childdevelopment center, and we
(33:05):
overlaid and infused a thinkeryneighborhood museum into that
child development center.
So every child benefits in aformal learning environment from
everything that we're talkingabout, and all of the teachers
in the district use this spaceas their hub for professional
development.
But then, outside of the schoolday, it becomes a thinkery
(33:27):
neighborhood museum wherefamilies gather and communities
gather and teachers, and so thismodel is very new and
revolutionary and different.
And so not just what impact canit make in that community, but
how do we study this and othernew models and show the impact
(33:48):
and data and how do we thinkabout scale of those in a larger
way and mindset?
And there's some incredibleorganizations that are thinking
about scale and so you know, aswe have these individual areas
of success, you know we need tobe really thoughtful and
(34:09):
studying what are the elementsthat are key, what is the impact
and then how do we use thatknowledge to influence the
future dollars that are goinginto schools and programs and
learning so that that can havean even bigger impact learning
(34:33):
so that that can have an evenbigger impact.
Judy Oskam (34:35):
That's a big job that's more than five years but
I'm so excited to see what youdo next, andy.
Andy Bell (34:38):
Thank you.
Well, I've been inspired by allof your work and thought
leadership and the importance ofcreativity and communication
and thinking differently andhaving the opportunity to have
this conversation and to shareand to learn from others who are
doing such great work, and sojust really appreciative for
(35:00):
everything that you are doing aswell and for the opportunity to
have conversations like this.
Judy Oskam (35:06):
Well, thank you.
Thanks for joining us today.
Appreciate it, my pleasure,thanks, thank you.
Thanks for joining us today.
Andy Bell (35:10):
Appreciate it my pleasure.
Thanks for having me.
Judy Oskam (35:13):
And thank you for listening to Stories of Change
and Creativity.
I hope you enjoyed myconversation with Andy.
Be sure and check out his TEDxtalk.
I'll post it in the show notes.
If you enjoyed today's episode,I'd love it if you could leave
us a five-star review.
It really helps more listenersfind the show.
And don't forget, if you've gota story to share or know
(35:35):
someone who does reach out to meat judyoskam.
com, I would love to hear fromyou.
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