April 29, 2025 • 22 mins
What if the path to healing your deepest wounds lies in unexpected territory? Mistress Mia Payne, a professional dominatrix and certified therapeutic BDSM practitioner, reveals how controlled power exchange can unlock profound emotional release where traditional therapy falls short.
Beyond Hollywood's misrepresentations, therapeutic BDSM creates safe spaces for processing trauma, anxiety, and depression through physical experiences that engage the body where emotions are stored. For some clients, it's about reclaiming power after abuse or trauma. For others—particularly high-achieving professionals—sessions provide rare moments of mental quiet when they temporarily surrender the burden of constant responsibility. From age regression therapy that nurtures the inner child to sensation play that triggers healing neurochemical releases, these modalities address needs as unique as the individuals seeking them.
Shame emerges as the silent barrier to personal growth and intimate connection. Whether rooted in religious upbringing, strict parenting, or societal judgment, shame creates what Mistress Mia calls "a ribbon that runs through everything." By creating environments where all aspects of self are accepted, clients learn to integrate both shadow and light—a crucial step toward authentic living. "When we fully accept ourselves in all our parts," she explains, "then we can fully accept other people."
Having recently completed certification with the Therapeutic BDSM Collaborative Network, Mistress Mia now partners with therapists to design customized experiences for clients who feel stuck in traditional healing approaches. She emphasizes finding skilled practitioners who understand not just techniques but human psychology, as this vulnerable work requires trustworthy guidance. For those curious about exploring this cutting-edge healing modality, visit paynewithpurpose.com to learn more about her self-development dungeon and services.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Straight from the Source's Mouth
podcast.
Frank talk about sex and dating.
Hello everyone, Tamara here,Welcome to the show.
Today's guest is Mistress MiaPayne, a professional dominatrix
, and we'll be talking aboutBDSM and using it as a
therapeutic tool.
Thanks for joining me, MistressMia.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Nice to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
Yes, I think this is a great topic.
We've had an introductoryepisode before, but I'm not sure
if anyone a lot of people wouldrealize that this could be used
as a therapeutic tool.
So do you want to say moreabout that?
Speaker 2 (00:47):
a lot of it tends to be for women sexual trauma,
sometimes abuse trauma, wherethey feel disempowered.
People come to me when theywant to experience rites of
passage and they would like tohelp create their rite of
passage.
And some people come to me foranxiety, depression and just
sort of a quiet space for theirbrain, and I provide that in a
bunch of different waysdepending on the client's needs
(01:08):
and interests.
Using BDSM as an intentionaltool is fairly new.
I would say it's cutting edgeright now.
But I like to tell people that,just like massage therapy, it
used to be considered taboo togo to have somebody touch your
naked body.
(01:28):
Right, they assumed it wassexual.
The same is true of BDSM.
It's just sort of not as wellunderstood and Hollywood hasn't
done us any favors, so peopledon't know what it is or how it
works.
Don't know what it is or how itworks, and there are so many
(01:50):
aspects of what I do that reallyallow the person to break free
of things that they're carryingto experience, for example,
nurturing.
So not everything I do ispain-based.
Some of it is a nurturingenvironment, some of it is more
of an appreciative environment.
(02:10):
So somebody who feels reallymisunderstood or unseen in the
world might come to me and askto provide tasks for me, to do
tasks for me, and then they justwant to receive affirmation so
it can help them feel like theirefforts are appreciated and
that they are seen.
So there's lots of differenttools and modalities that I use
(02:35):
in my practice.
I fully support sex work.
I think it's real work.
I don't provide that.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
So my particular stable is is not it's a
non-sexual practice, but um, butyeah, but I, but everything
else is on the table, so it's alot of yeah, yeah, I mean I can
see, like as soon as I read thethe topic that you were covering
, that where it would be helpful, because people have a lot of
(03:04):
hangups, like you said, and youwant to talk about like removing
shame as well, like just whyyou have the kinks, why what
happened to you that you knowcaused you to have these, and
then actually, you know gettingeither if you're not comfortable
with them, getting comfortableor maybe even just understanding
why you have some.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
Yeah, but I'd like to challenge you to consider the
fact that kink is not oftencaused by a traumatic event.
That's only true in some cases.
For some people their brainsare just wired that way and so
it's not always sort of a resultof trauma.
It can actually just be the waysomebody is born.
(03:42):
So kinks are far more commonthan people think they are, and
the little granny next door thatyou would have no idea has an
interest in something unusualprobably does.
And yeah, it's interesting to methe types of people that come
through my door, and a lot ofthem are carrying shame.
(04:04):
A lot of them have shame fromreligious backgrounds.
A lot of them have shame fromvery strict parent backgrounds.
Sometimes those things go handin hand and a lot of times it's
just sort of society right, likeif a man you were dating said
to you I love feet like feet,turn me on.
(04:27):
For the vast number ofuneducated in kink women, that
would be a weird experience andthey would probably be turned
off by that, so that man wouldnot have a second date with you
and they would feel shamefulbecause they revealed something
vulnerable about themselves, andthat thing would have been the
(04:47):
reason why they're not getting asecond date.
So shame can come from a lot ofdifferent places.
But in my space we do a lot ofshame release because all of it
is normal and all of it is okayand all of it can be used as a
tool for their benefit.
And sometimes that benefit isjust fun.
It's just a break from adultingfor a little bit.
(05:09):
Right.
It's like cops and robbers, butjust a little different.
It's a little bit of play, alittle bit of imagination, and
the mind is a powerful thing.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
So, yeah, yeah, yeah, like cause.
I know I've heard like peoplewho are powerful out in life,
like in the bedroom, prefer notto be powerful and it's kind of.
I've heard that a coupleepisodes now.
Speaker 2 (05:30):
It's just an opportunity for you to downshift
from responsible to you're notresponsible.
Right, you hand over the mantleof exhausting responsibility to
somebody else for a period oftime so that your brain can just
go quiet, and that's reallywhat some of not all, but some
(05:51):
of my clients need.
They're in high poweredpositions, they tend to be very
intelligent, and coming to megives them a break.
They can just just relax and beat ease.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
Yeah, and then.
So BDSM specifically, what kindof examples or modalities?
Or, like you mentioned, there'sa lot, but like a couple of
examples or so in my practice Ido a wide variety of things.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
We can do some age play, which I consider
regression therapy of some kind.
So people who have hadtraumatic or neglectful
experiences as a child mightfind it beneficial to reenact
them being a child for a periodof time where they are nurtured,
(06:37):
read stories, offered juiceboxes and given a chance to play
the part of a child who did notreceive what they needed to
back.
Then that can be often verycathartic for people.
I do provide a lot of pain play.
That is my specialty.
So I use a bunch of differentkinds of implements, from
(06:58):
floggers to canes, to crops tohairbrushes, a bunch of
different things that causedifferent sensations on the body
.
So sensation play and impactplay are my sort of specialties,
my forte.
And then I can do things likepet play.
Pet play is sometimes fun forpeople.
They get to just not be humanfor a little bit and that can be
(07:21):
an interesting experience forthem to disassociate from their
human experience into somethingless sort of mental or cerebral
and just instinctive and in themoment.
So that can be helpful.
A lot of task play.
So people will just serve meand they receive admiration.
(07:43):
Sometimes they receive somekind of a treat in exchange.
So, yeah, so again, there's somany different things.
Bondage I do a lot of shibari,a lot of different bondage
activities to help people calmtheir nervous system with deep
pressure therapy.
Yeah, so so many things, yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
Yeah, and do they usually.
Is it usually a short-termthing or a long-term thing?
Or like once they you find outthey have more stuff like
underneath, or like how does?
Speaker 2 (08:17):
Well, people who come to me tend to stay for a while,
not necessarily because it'squote unquote, not working, but
because they find it'sbeneficial in a lot of different
ways.
For example, if somebody comesto me and their self-esteem is
very low and they're strugglingwith feeling sort of strong in
the world, then coming to me andbeing challenged by something
(08:40):
that is a tangible challengethat they can overcome and then
feel good about that overcoming,can change everything right.
Suddenly they may feel moreconfident and be able to go ask
for that raise or to go andaddress the issue in their
relationship that's holdingtheir relationship apart back.
And so when they come and theysee that it makes a difference,
(09:03):
some of them stay just for theongoing benefits.
There are people who just wouldlike one session.
It's more like a releasebecause and those are usually
pain experiences.
So they come, I provide forthem a series of painful
(09:25):
experiences and then they sortof because the body, all of
these neurochemicals, right, itcan give you a sort of a high,
and that high can last, for youknow, up to two weeks.
So some people just come oncein a while just to receive that
benefit and then they come backwhen they need another, another
break.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
And is there usually?
I know you said it's not alwaystrauma.
So are there other like?
Why do people like?
What are some reasons peoplehave given for coming to you
Like, like the?
Speaker 2 (09:56):
anxiety, depression, difficulty in their marriage.
Some of them have had fetisheslike foot fetish or like a being
, a being small fetish for areally long time and have just
never had a place to try it orexperience it.
Women come to me mostly fortherapy like mental and
(10:18):
emotional trauma therapy.
A lot of them have been in talktherapy for a really long time
and they just need to trysomething else.
Them have been in talk therapyfor a really long time and they
just need to try something else,something sometimes they feel
stuck in their own growth andhealing and they need something
to kind of move them past thatlimitation that they've kind of
come up against.
I actually just graduated from aprogram for becoming certified
(10:43):
in therapeutic BDSM and it'swith the.
It's a therapeutic BDSMcollaborative network.
So essentially this program isbrand new and what it does is
pair a therapist either a sextherapist or a regular therapist
with a pro practitioner who isalso certified in therapeutic
(11:04):
BDSM and together they create aprogram or scene to help the
client to move past whereverthey're stuck, which is really
exciting.
It's nice to see that this sortof new way of doing things is
there's a method for it, so it'sexciting.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
Yeah, and I do say that you know the body keeps.
The score is one book that I'vementioned a few times that you
keep your trauma somewhere inyour body so I can see where
like emotional emotions, arestored in fascia.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
So whatever you're doing to that space between your
layer and your muscles, yourskin and your muscles a layer,
whatever you're doing to it,will activate whatever trauma or
emotional trauma is left right.
So, whether you're going to amassage therapist, whether
you're going to a somaticpractitioner, whether you are
(11:58):
going somewhere to be cupped,coming to somebody like me who
will activate those parts ofyour body, you're bound to find
something to process and release, which is exciting because at
the end of a session, you feellike you've done something.
You've done some good work foryourself and you're moving in
the right direction.
Speaker 1 (12:18):
Yeah, and I can see where it's also more passive too
.
Well, depending, I guess, ontasks it wouldn't be passive,
but as far as the bondage sideof it would be, you're kind of
like forced to release, you know, in a way where you wouldn't be
able to like let yourself go.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
Is that a thing, or so?
We don't ever force somebody torelease, but we do.
We do force, with their consent, for them to be still, and
being still is an activity thatwe don't do well in this cup, in
this country or this culture.
I guess we like to always bebusy distracted.
When we feel something, we grabour phone and we just scroll,
and so when you're unable todistract yourself from your mind
(12:54):
because you're tied up and youcannot do anything else,
sometimes that can bring stuffup, and if you're ready to deal
with it, you will.
Speaker 1 (13:03):
So yeah, Okay, yeah, yeah, I'm someone like a lot of
people have said there'sprobably something there and I
just don't really let myself go.
I don't busy myself necessarily, but I also don't feel my body
as much, and I've mentioned thatin several episodes.
But yeah, so now and everyevery time I interview someone,
I'm like, oh, I need to try this.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Yeah, have you ever done this kind of experience?
Have you ever had it?
Speaker 1 (13:33):
I had it.
Yeah, I had one experience withsomeone who was into BDSM.
So I met him at a FetLife thingand I was trying it out to see
and I did enjoy it, but it wasmore, you know, a sexual thing
than it was anything therapeutic.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
And then were you on the receiving end, so were you
submissive yeah, yeah and didanything come up for you during
that process, or was it justprimarily an erotic experience?
Speaker 1 (13:53):
yeah, definitely more the latter, the erotic thing.
So that's what I mean.
Like I probably could even likeblock stuff out like that and
just have the, the sensual sideof it, okay.
Speaker 2 (14:03):
Okay, interesting.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
Yeah, but yeah, so maybe I'll have to talk after.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
Happy, happy to help.
Speaker 1 (14:11):
But speaking of which , how can?
If someone did want to workwith you, how can they reach you
and where can they find?
Speaker 2 (14:16):
you.
So, um, they can go to painwith purpose, and it's spelled P
A Y N E with purposecom.
Um, that's my self-developmentdungeon site and you can connect
with me there.
You can message me.
There's a little window to thelower right and you could just
send me a message.
Those messages go directly tomy email and nobody else reads
(14:38):
them, so you don't have to worryabout privacy.
And then there's you know, myservices are listed, there's
some information about me on thewebsite so you can know who I
am, some pictures of some thingsI've, you know, participated in
.
So if you looking me up,there's probably the most
(14:58):
helpful.
You can also find Mistress MiaPayne, p-a-y-n-e on social
medias like Instagram andFacebook.
I think Facebook has pain withpurpose, is my title there.
It's a brand new group, so I'mhoping to do some more things
with Q&A there.
So, yeah, so that's the bestway to reach me.
(15:19):
I'm in Ontario, canada, so I'meast of Toronto.
I can travel to some degree,but I at the moment will not
travel into the US.
So anybody who wants to come upto Canada can certainly do that
.
We can meet.
Even I can bring all of mytools and things and we can set
up in a hotel room.
(15:39):
Those are outcalls, and I'vedone them often and then you can
always travel to me and there'sit's a beautiful town.
You can get an Airbnb and havea whole weekend of care in this
way.
So, yeah, so there's lots ofexperiences that we can share
together, regardless of whereyou are.
Oh, and I also teach, so ifyou're an individual or a couple
(15:59):
who would like to learn moreabout it how to do it safely,
what are some things and tipsand tricks I can also provide
that as an option.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Awesome.
Okay, thank you.
And then I know we mentionedshame a little bit.
Did you want to talk more aboutit, or did you feel like we
covered that well enough?
Speaker 2 (16:30):
Well, I think it's say, in my opinion, that will
stop growth and you reachingyour potential faster than
anything else.
I think that we can blame a lotof our lack of success or
whatever we can find things toblame it on, but if you really
(16:52):
take time to look below it, alot of times there's a shame
sort of ribbon that runs througheverything, and when you learn
how to set yourself free fromshame, it changes the game,
because the world opens up in away that you haven't had access
to it before.
And when we fully, fully acceptourselves in all of our parts,
(17:16):
shadow and light, then we canfully accept other people.
And until we can do that, wetend to be more judgmental, we
tend to be more closed off todeep intimacy, and it all starts
with us, and so shame is reallyimportant to face and to
process and remove.
Speaker 1 (17:37):
And I know obviously you do it through BDSM as well,
but, like, is there more to sayabout how you would do that, or
is that for someone to figure?
Speaker 2 (17:45):
out when to say it's so individually customized that
it's not like a, it's notspecific, it's not a, it's not
like a thing I can say I will doevery time.
So it doesn't really help togive you, give an example.
Every person is different.
Um, I do a lot of intuitivereading.
So when I meet with a person todiscuss and receive consent and
(18:08):
to find what their limits areand express my limits, that's
where I learn how they tick.
I'm able to kind of readsomebody pretty quickly and know
what activities, whatexperiences are going to help
bring them to where they need tobe the most efficiently.
And I find, too, that trying tosort of give an outline of how
(18:35):
to help somebody heal is kind ofirresponsible, because you're
essentially cookie-cuttering anexperience that can't be
cookie-cuttered.
There's so many variables andit just makes it seem like you
know something you don't and youdon't know until you meet the
person.
So yeah, I don't do that.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
Yeah, no, I can see that.
Yeah, are there any?
Um?
I know you said you can'treally give examples or you
could, but it's so cookie cutter, that would what would be the
point.
But do you have any, um, either?
Closing comments or more, youwould like to say, to make sure
people get this concept?
Speaker 2 (19:14):
So I would just say that anytime that we're doing
something with the body, there'san opportunity for healing
something that's not physicaland BDSM is no exception.
It depends on the person who isdoing the activity for you and
with you.
They need to be skilled, theyneed to understand the
importance and the depth of whatthey're doing.
(19:36):
This work isn't likely tohappen just in a random play
date.
It would have to be withsomebody you trust, somebody
that is either trained or youhave built a rapport with,
because our nervous systemsdon't really let us become that
vulnerable with people that wedon't know well or we can't
(19:56):
reasonably trust theircredentials.
So I would say, if you're goingto venture into this which I
strongly suggest you do findsomebody that is skilled and
knowledgeable in this way, andnot just in the art of the
dominance, but also somebody whounderstands humans people you
(20:17):
know.
Like I, have a coachingbackground, so I do a lot of
life coaching as well, which isnot BDSM related, and because I
have life coaching skills, I canput those kinds of things at
work in this work as well.
So, yeah, so I would just say,make sure you're looking for
somebody credentialed orsomebody that you are pretty
(20:40):
sure is safe, because just likeyou can heal, you can also do
damage if you're not doing itwell.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
So yeah, like if people don't even know about
this, what issue could they havethat you would suggest, like
this would be a good thing forthem?
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Well, anytime that you have an event or a feeling
of powerlessness.
So if, if you've experiencedsomething that has left you
feeling powerless, if you havethat thing that goes around in
your mind over and over and youjust wish you could have undone
it, or you wish you could havesaid something to stop it, or
you know some kind of a missedopportunity to stand up for
(21:17):
yourself, bdsm is an opportunityto learn how not to abandon
yourself, because you have toadvocate for yourself and you
have to set your limits.
And you have to set your limitsand a skilled practitioner will
check in with you regularly tofind out if your limits are
close, like if you're reachingyour limits.
So learning to self-advocate, Ithink, is really part of that.
(21:37):
So anytime you feel powerlessis definitely one thing.
Rape, abuse of any kindfinancial, emotional, spiritual,
all of those kinds of traumasleave us feeling like we can't
really trust ourselves, andlearning how to trust yourself
is key to any kind of BDSMrelationship.
Speaker 1 (21:59):
Okay, yeah, I can see how this would be paired with
regular therapy, like if you'renot making headway, and or just
a little extra, like you said.
Yeah, so all right, awesome.
Well, thank you very much forbeing on.
I think this was veryeducational.
Well, good.
Speaker 2 (22:13):
I'm glad A lot of it?
Speaker 1 (22:14):
Yeah, and probably a little, I'm sure.
Like you said, it's a newprogram, so new information.
So yeah, but it makes senseAwesome.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
All right.
Speaker 1 (22:21):
Well, if you enjoyed this episode, to tell your
friends about it and rate it aswell, and thank you again,
mistress Payne, for being on.
Speaker 2 (22:28):
My pleasure.
Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1 (22:30):
Bye everyone, thank you.
Welcome to the Straight from the Source's Mouth
podcast.
Frank talk about sex and dating.
Hello everyone, Tamara here,Welcome to the show.
Today's guest is Mistress MiaPayne, a professional dominatrix
, and we'll be talking aboutBDSM and using it as a
therapeutic tool.
Thanks for joining me, MistressMia.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Nice to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
Yes, I think this is a great topic.
We've had an introductoryepisode before, but I'm not sure
if anyone a lot of people wouldrealize that this could be used
as a therapeutic tool.
So do you want to say moreabout that?
Speaker 2 (00:47):
a lot of it tends to be for women sexual trauma,
sometimes abuse trauma, wherethey feel disempowered.
People come to me when theywant to experience rites of
passage and they would like tohelp create their rite of
passage.
And some people come to me foranxiety, depression and just
sort of a quiet space for theirbrain, and I provide that in a
bunch of different waysdepending on the client's needs
(01:08):
and interests.
Using BDSM as an intentionaltool is fairly new.
I would say it's cutting edgeright now.
But I like to tell people that,just like massage therapy, it
used to be considered taboo togo to have somebody touch your
naked body.
(01:28):
Right, they assumed it wassexual.
The same is true of BDSM.
It's just sort of not as wellunderstood and Hollywood hasn't
done us any favors, so peopledon't know what it is or how it
works.
Don't know what it is or how itworks, and there are so many
(01:50):
aspects of what I do that reallyallow the person to break free
of things that they're carryingto experience, for example,
nurturing.
So not everything I do ispain-based.
Some of it is a nurturingenvironment, some of it is more
of an appreciative environment.
(02:10):
So somebody who feels reallymisunderstood or unseen in the
world might come to me and askto provide tasks for me, to do
tasks for me, and then they justwant to receive affirmation so
it can help them feel like theirefforts are appreciated and
that they are seen.
So there's lots of differenttools and modalities that I use
(02:35):
in my practice.
I fully support sex work.
I think it's real work.
I don't provide that.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
So my particular stable is is not it's a
non-sexual practice, but um, butyeah, but I, but everything
else is on the table, so it's alot of yeah, yeah, I mean I can
see, like as soon as I read thethe topic that you were covering
, that where it would be helpful, because people have a lot of
(03:04):
hangups, like you said, and youwant to talk about like removing
shame as well, like just whyyou have the kinks, why what
happened to you that you knowcaused you to have these, and
then actually, you know gettingeither if you're not comfortable
with them, getting comfortableor maybe even just understanding
why you have some.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
Yeah, but I'd like to challenge you to consider the
fact that kink is not oftencaused by a traumatic event.
That's only true in some cases.
For some people their brainsare just wired that way and so
it's not always sort of a resultof trauma.
It can actually just be the waysomebody is born.
(03:42):
So kinks are far more commonthan people think they are, and
the little granny next door thatyou would have no idea has an
interest in something unusualprobably does.
And yeah, it's interesting to methe types of people that come
through my door, and a lot ofthem are carrying shame.
(04:04):
A lot of them have shame fromreligious backgrounds.
A lot of them have shame fromvery strict parent backgrounds.
Sometimes those things go handin hand and a lot of times it's
just sort of society right, likeif a man you were dating said
to you I love feet like feet,turn me on.
(04:27):
For the vast number ofuneducated in kink women, that
would be a weird experience andthey would probably be turned
off by that, so that man wouldnot have a second date with you
and they would feel shamefulbecause they revealed something
vulnerable about themselves, andthat thing would have been the
(04:47):
reason why they're not getting asecond date.
So shame can come from a lot ofdifferent places.
But in my space we do a lot ofshame release because all of it
is normal and all of it is okayand all of it can be used as a
tool for their benefit.
And sometimes that benefit isjust fun.
It's just a break from adultingfor a little bit.
(05:09):
Right.
It's like cops and robbers, butjust a little different.
It's a little bit of play, alittle bit of imagination, and
the mind is a powerful thing.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
So, yeah, yeah, yeah, like cause.
I know I've heard like peoplewho are powerful out in life,
like in the bedroom, prefer notto be powerful and it's kind of.
I've heard that a coupleepisodes now.
Speaker 2 (05:30):
It's just an opportunity for you to downshift
from responsible to you're notresponsible.
Right, you hand over the mantleof exhausting responsibility to
somebody else for a period oftime so that your brain can just
go quiet, and that's reallywhat some of not all, but some
(05:51):
of my clients need.
They're in high poweredpositions, they tend to be very
intelligent, and coming to megives them a break.
They can just just relax and beat ease.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
Yeah, and then.
So BDSM specifically, what kindof examples or modalities?
Or, like you mentioned, there'sa lot, but like a couple of
examples or so in my practice Ido a wide variety of things.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
We can do some age play, which I consider
regression therapy of some kind.
So people who have hadtraumatic or neglectful
experiences as a child mightfind it beneficial to reenact
them being a child for a periodof time where they are nurtured,
(06:37):
read stories, offered juiceboxes and given a chance to play
the part of a child who did notreceive what they needed to
back.
Then that can be often verycathartic for people.
I do provide a lot of pain play.
That is my specialty.
So I use a bunch of differentkinds of implements, from
(06:58):
floggers to canes, to crops tohairbrushes, a bunch of
different things that causedifferent sensations on the body
.
So sensation play and impactplay are my sort of specialties,
my forte.
And then I can do things likepet play.
Pet play is sometimes fun forpeople.
They get to just not be humanfor a little bit and that can be
(07:21):
an interesting experience forthem to disassociate from their
human experience into somethingless sort of mental or cerebral
and just instinctive and in themoment.
So that can be helpful.
A lot of task play.
So people will just serve meand they receive admiration.
(07:43):
Sometimes they receive somekind of a treat in exchange.
So, yeah, so again, there's somany different things.
Bondage I do a lot of shibari,a lot of different bondage
activities to help people calmtheir nervous system with deep
pressure therapy.
Yeah, so so many things, yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
Yeah, and do they usually.
Is it usually a short-termthing or a long-term thing?
Or like once they you find outthey have more stuff like
underneath, or like how does?
Speaker 2 (08:17):
Well, people who come to me tend to stay for a while,
not necessarily because it'squote unquote, not working, but
because they find it'sbeneficial in a lot of different
ways.
For example, if somebody comesto me and their self-esteem is
very low and they're strugglingwith feeling sort of strong in
the world, then coming to me andbeing challenged by something
(08:40):
that is a tangible challengethat they can overcome and then
feel good about that overcoming,can change everything right.
Suddenly they may feel moreconfident and be able to go ask
for that raise or to go andaddress the issue in their
relationship that's holdingtheir relationship apart back.
And so when they come and theysee that it makes a difference,
(09:03):
some of them stay just for theongoing benefits.
There are people who just wouldlike one session.
It's more like a releasebecause and those are usually
pain experiences.
So they come, I provide forthem a series of painful
(09:25):
experiences and then they sortof because the body, all of
these neurochemicals, right, itcan give you a sort of a high,
and that high can last, for youknow, up to two weeks.
So some people just come oncein a while just to receive that
benefit and then they come backwhen they need another, another
break.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
And is there usually?
I know you said it's not alwaystrauma.
So are there other like?
Why do people like?
What are some reasons peoplehave given for coming to you
Like, like the?
Speaker 2 (09:56):
anxiety, depression, difficulty in their marriage.
Some of them have had fetisheslike foot fetish or like a being
, a being small fetish for areally long time and have just
never had a place to try it orexperience it.
Women come to me mostly fortherapy like mental and
(10:18):
emotional trauma therapy.
A lot of them have been in talktherapy for a really long time
and they just need to trysomething else.
Them have been in talk therapyfor a really long time and they
just need to try something else,something sometimes they feel
stuck in their own growth andhealing and they need something
to kind of move them past thatlimitation that they've kind of
come up against.
I actually just graduated from aprogram for becoming certified
(10:43):
in therapeutic BDSM and it'swith the.
It's a therapeutic BDSMcollaborative network.
So essentially this program isbrand new and what it does is
pair a therapist either a sextherapist or a regular therapist
with a pro practitioner who isalso certified in therapeutic
(11:04):
BDSM and together they create aprogram or scene to help the
client to move past whereverthey're stuck, which is really
exciting.
It's nice to see that this sortof new way of doing things is
there's a method for it, so it'sexciting.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
Yeah, and I do say that you know the body keeps.
The score is one book that I'vementioned a few times that you
keep your trauma somewhere inyour body so I can see where
like emotional emotions, arestored in fascia.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
So whatever you're doing to that space between your
layer and your muscles, yourskin and your muscles a layer,
whatever you're doing to it,will activate whatever trauma or
emotional trauma is left right.
So, whether you're going to amassage therapist, whether
you're going to a somaticpractitioner, whether you are
(11:58):
going somewhere to be cupped,coming to somebody like me who
will activate those parts ofyour body, you're bound to find
something to process and release, which is exciting because at
the end of a session, you feellike you've done something.
You've done some good work foryourself and you're moving in
the right direction.
Speaker 1 (12:18):
Yeah, and I can see where it's also more passive too
.
Well, depending, I guess, ontasks it wouldn't be passive,
but as far as the bondage sideof it would be, you're kind of
like forced to release, you know, in a way where you wouldn't be
able to like let yourself go.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
Is that a thing, or so?
We don't ever force somebody torelease, but we do.
We do force, with their consent, for them to be still, and
being still is an activity thatwe don't do well in this cup, in
this country or this culture.
I guess we like to always bebusy distracted.
When we feel something, we grabour phone and we just scroll,
and so when you're unable todistract yourself from your mind
(12:54):
because you're tied up and youcannot do anything else,
sometimes that can bring stuffup, and if you're ready to deal
with it, you will.
Speaker 1 (13:03):
So yeah, Okay, yeah, yeah, I'm someone like a lot of
people have said there'sprobably something there and I
just don't really let myself go.
I don't busy myself necessarily, but I also don't feel my body
as much, and I've mentioned thatin several episodes.
But yeah, so now and everyevery time I interview someone,
I'm like, oh, I need to try this.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Yeah, have you ever done this kind of experience?
Have you ever had it?
Speaker 1 (13:33):
I had it.
Yeah, I had one experience withsomeone who was into BDSM.
So I met him at a FetLife thingand I was trying it out to see
and I did enjoy it, but it wasmore, you know, a sexual thing
than it was anything therapeutic.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
And then were you on the receiving end, so were you
submissive yeah, yeah and didanything come up for you during
that process, or was it justprimarily an erotic experience?
Speaker 1 (13:53):
yeah, definitely more the latter, the erotic thing.
So that's what I mean.
Like I probably could even likeblock stuff out like that and
just have the, the sensual sideof it, okay.
Speaker 2 (14:03):
Okay, interesting.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
Yeah, but yeah, so maybe I'll have to talk after.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
Happy, happy to help.
Speaker 1 (14:11):
But speaking of which , how can?
If someone did want to workwith you, how can they reach you
and where can they find?
Speaker 2 (14:16):
you.
So, um, they can go to painwith purpose, and it's spelled P
A Y N E with purposecom.
Um, that's my self-developmentdungeon site and you can connect
with me there.
You can message me.
There's a little window to thelower right and you could just
send me a message.
Those messages go directly tomy email and nobody else reads
(14:38):
them, so you don't have to worryabout privacy.
And then there's you know, myservices are listed, there's
some information about me on thewebsite so you can know who I
am, some pictures of some thingsI've, you know, participated in
.
So if you looking me up,there's probably the most
(14:58):
helpful.
You can also find Mistress MiaPayne, p-a-y-n-e on social
medias like Instagram andFacebook.
I think Facebook has pain withpurpose, is my title there.
It's a brand new group, so I'mhoping to do some more things
with Q&A there.
So, yeah, so that's the bestway to reach me.
(15:19):
I'm in Ontario, canada, so I'meast of Toronto.
I can travel to some degree,but I at the moment will not
travel into the US.
So anybody who wants to come upto Canada can certainly do that
.
We can meet.
Even I can bring all of mytools and things and we can set
up in a hotel room.
(15:39):
Those are outcalls, and I'vedone them often and then you can
always travel to me and there'sit's a beautiful town.
You can get an Airbnb and havea whole weekend of care in this
way.
So, yeah, so there's lots ofexperiences that we can share
together, regardless of whereyou are.
Oh, and I also teach, so ifyou're an individual or a couple
(15:59):
who would like to learn moreabout it how to do it safely,
what are some things and tipsand tricks I can also provide
that as an option.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Awesome.
Okay, thank you.
And then I know we mentionedshame a little bit.
Did you want to talk more aboutit, or did you feel like we
covered that well enough?
Speaker 2 (16:30):
Well, I think it's say, in my opinion, that will
stop growth and you reachingyour potential faster than
anything else.
I think that we can blame a lotof our lack of success or
whatever we can find things toblame it on, but if you really
(16:52):
take time to look below it, alot of times there's a shame
sort of ribbon that runs througheverything, and when you learn
how to set yourself free fromshame, it changes the game,
because the world opens up in away that you haven't had access
to it before.
And when we fully, fully acceptourselves in all of our parts,
(17:16):
shadow and light, then we canfully accept other people.
And until we can do that, wetend to be more judgmental, we
tend to be more closed off todeep intimacy, and it all starts
with us, and so shame is reallyimportant to face and to
process and remove.
Speaker 1 (17:37):
And I know obviously you do it through BDSM as well,
but, like, is there more to sayabout how you would do that, or
is that for someone to figure?
Speaker 2 (17:45):
out when to say it's so individually customized that
it's not like a, it's notspecific, it's not a, it's not
like a thing I can say I will doevery time.
So it doesn't really help togive you, give an example.
Every person is different.
Um, I do a lot of intuitivereading.
So when I meet with a person todiscuss and receive consent and
(18:08):
to find what their limits areand express my limits, that's
where I learn how they tick.
I'm able to kind of readsomebody pretty quickly and know
what activities, whatexperiences are going to help
bring them to where they need tobe the most efficiently.
And I find, too, that trying tosort of give an outline of how
(18:35):
to help somebody heal is kind ofirresponsible, because you're
essentially cookie-cuttering anexperience that can't be
cookie-cuttered.
There's so many variables andit just makes it seem like you
know something you don't and youdon't know until you meet the
person.
So yeah, I don't do that.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
Yeah, no, I can see that.
Yeah, are there any?
Um?
I know you said you can'treally give examples or you
could, but it's so cookie cutter, that would what would be the
point.
But do you have any, um, either?
Closing comments or more, youwould like to say, to make sure
people get this concept?
Speaker 2 (19:14):
So I would just say that anytime that we're doing
something with the body, there'san opportunity for healing
something that's not physicaland BDSM is no exception.
It depends on the person who isdoing the activity for you and
with you.
They need to be skilled, theyneed to understand the
importance and the depth of whatthey're doing.
(19:36):
This work isn't likely tohappen just in a random play
date.
It would have to be withsomebody you trust, somebody
that is either trained or youhave built a rapport with,
because our nervous systemsdon't really let us become that
vulnerable with people that wedon't know well or we can't
(19:56):
reasonably trust theircredentials.
So I would say, if you're goingto venture into this which I
strongly suggest you do findsomebody that is skilled and
knowledgeable in this way, andnot just in the art of the
dominance, but also somebody whounderstands humans people you
(20:17):
know.
Like I, have a coachingbackground, so I do a lot of
life coaching as well, which isnot BDSM related, and because I
have life coaching skills, I canput those kinds of things at
work in this work as well.
So, yeah, so I would just say,make sure you're looking for
somebody credentialed orsomebody that you are pretty
(20:40):
sure is safe, because just likeyou can heal, you can also do
damage if you're not doing itwell.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
So yeah, like if people don't even know about
this, what issue could they havethat you would suggest, like
this would be a good thing forthem?
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Well, anytime that you have an event or a feeling
of powerlessness.
So if, if you've experiencedsomething that has left you
feeling powerless, if you havethat thing that goes around in
your mind over and over and youjust wish you could have undone
it, or you wish you could havesaid something to stop it, or
you know some kind of a missedopportunity to stand up for
(21:17):
yourself, bdsm is an opportunityto learn how not to abandon
yourself, because you have toadvocate for yourself and you
have to set your limits.
And you have to set your limitsand a skilled practitioner will
check in with you regularly tofind out if your limits are
close, like if you're reachingyour limits.
So learning to self-advocate, Ithink, is really part of that.
(21:37):
So anytime you feel powerlessis definitely one thing.
Rape, abuse of any kindfinancial, emotional, spiritual,
all of those kinds of traumasleave us feeling like we can't
really trust ourselves, andlearning how to trust yourself
is key to any kind of BDSMrelationship.
Speaker 1 (21:59):
Okay, yeah, I can see how this would be paired with
regular therapy, like if you'renot making headway, and or just
a little extra, like you said.
Yeah, so all right, awesome.
Well, thank you very much forbeing on.
I think this was veryeducational.
Well, good.
Speaker 2 (22:13):
I'm glad A lot of it?
Speaker 1 (22:14):
Yeah, and probably a little, I'm sure.
Like you said, it's a newprogram, so new information.
So yeah, but it makes senseAwesome.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
All right.
Speaker 1 (22:21):
Well, if you enjoyed this episode, to tell your
friends about it and rate it aswell, and thank you again,
mistress Payne, for being on.
Speaker 2 (22:28):
My pleasure.
Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1 (22:30):
Bye everyone, thank you.
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