The Terror of the Dogmen in the Land Between the Lakes with Aaron Deese

On this edition of the Strangeology Podcast return guest, Aaron Deese comes back to talk about his brand new book, Hunting Grounds : Dogmen of the Lakes released though Small Town Monsters Publishing, and it’s a great follow up in his research on the Dogman phenomena with some very interesting lore about this elusive cryptid, and beyond!

Aaron's Podcast: Hey Strangeness Podcast
Hunting Grounds: Dogmen of the Lakes Book Small Town Monsters Publishing

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Episode Transcript

(00:10):
Several actually nine flying gopor flying dipthat are out there up extra red rail
or a large uh hairy creature witharms and hang down beside. It's you
know, born down on the side. Help car journey and journey way,

(00:32):
he said, here's called cold.It's not anything to question. Up.
You're listening to the Strangeology Podcast.I'm your host, Jeff Foren, and
this is your place to explore theweird, strange and unexplained from cryptids and
creatures, the paranormal, aliens andUFOs, forbidden knowledge, ancient mysteries,

(00:53):
conspiracies and more. Hey everyone,and welcome back to the show. Thank
you so much for hanging out withme today. Coming up on this edition
is an update from author and friendof the show, Aaron Deese on his
latest book, Hunting Grounds, whichis all about the dog Man. Well,

(01:18):
summer is officially here, and thisweek has been super hot, and
I'm very thankful to have ac inmy upstairs office because I think I would
need to move this whole operation intothe basement of my house if I didn't.
I mean that might happen someday,but that would entail a lot of

(01:40):
work and remodeling. But we're makingdo as is. But anyway, thank
you for bearing with me while Itook a little bit of time off last
week from the usual production schedule.I've had so much going on at home,
between my partner's back injury flaring upand summer vacation for my older kid

(02:02):
at least, it's been super toughto get any new content done these past
couple of weeks, much less editingthe podcast. I have a few pre
recorded interviews that I just haven't hadthe time to do, but I do
now, and here we are now. Surgery is coming within the week for

(02:23):
my partner, so that's going tohelp out a lot, and you know,
hopefully everything goes well with that.This past weekend was also spent with
family for my mom's celebration of life. As some of you may remember,
she passed away back in February ofthis year, twenty twenty four. It

(02:46):
was a hard day, but alsoa good day and good to see family,
extended family, cousins, aunts,and uncles that I haven't seen in
a while. The forecast was originallysupposed to be rain, but the weather
cleared out in the morning for theceremony, which was good and you know,

(03:07):
maybe Mom had something to do withthat. I don't know. And
it's curious because about a week prior, my mom visited me in my dreams,
which hasn't happened at all since shedied, or really ever even when
she was still here, and itwas this brief thing, but basically she

(03:30):
was telling me this message that atfirst she didn't even realize what had happened,
but she's all right now and everythingis okay on the other side.
Now. I don't know how muchstock should be put into dreams. I
know there's a lot of people thatthink there is meaning to dreams and all

(03:52):
of that. There's certainly a lotof study. I've had folks on the
show talking about NDEs and shared deathexperiences and all that kind of stuff,
and this one felt really real andit definitely it helped me to find peace
and acceptance with it all. SoI just thought i'd share that little bit

(04:16):
there. This is a podcast aboutthe strange and unexplained, after all,
and I always appreciate everyone's support withwhat I do with this, so thank
you for listening and also bearing withme as I've been going through a bunch
of stuff the past few weeks,but I'm going to keep this intro frontloaded

(04:39):
as usual, but brief just wantedto throw a couple quick reminders out there
before things get started. Don't forgetto set your podcast app to auto download
so you never miss a new episode. And don't forget to follow Strangeology over
on all of my social media accounts. I'm on Instagram, TikTok, Facebook,

(05:00):
book, etc. For more content, updates, short form videos and
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com. I do have a blogthere with a bunch of articles that you
can check out, and I alsohave a mailing list. I don't send
out too many emails, if ever, but when I do, you can
get discount codes to my shop andall that kind of stuff, and maybe

(05:25):
updates on what I'm doing, newson events that I'll be at, etc.
But the best way to support myshow is to tell your friends and
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And if you love what I dowith Strangeology and want to support the show,
you can always become a member byheading over to Patreon dot com forward

(05:48):
slash Strangeology and you can join foras little as one dollar per month.
Any support helps out a ton andhelps keep the lights on here at Strangeology
HQ. Higher tiers unlock more perkslike early access and ad free episodes,
access to the member's only episode extensionStrangeology Beyond, which are sometimes a whole

(06:12):
other research topic or an extended guestinterview. We have fun with it.
There's also a merch discount for myshop that's permanent, exclusive merch voting power
on new topics, bonus content,and more so if you want to join
a growing community of like minded peoplewho are into the strange and unexplained.

(06:33):
It's a great place to be andI appreciate the support, and the more
of it I get, the morecontent I can create on a regular basis
and increasing frequency for everyone out thereinto all members of the show passed in
present, you know who you are. Thank you so much for the continued

(06:54):
or previous support. It helps meout so much. And finally, Monsterfest
Too is coming up next weekend.I've got some cool stuff lined up that's
happening during the event that I can'ttalk about yet, but I'm definitely stoked
to share it when I can,but anyway, it's happening June twenty ninth.

(07:15):
The main event is at the DoubleTree in Canton, Ohio. There's
a VIP ticket holder movie screening onthe evening before on the twenty eighth for
a new Small Town Monsters film,and as well, VIP tickets will get
you early access to the vendor Hallon Saturday morning, where you'll find me

(07:39):
and a lot of other great artists, creators and podcasters. And there's gonna
be a number of guest speakers andworkshops with people like Jim Harold Ken Gerhard
Paul Bartholomele, Ryan Sprague, LyleBlackburn, Mike Ann, Jeremiah Byron,
and a whole bunch more. Soit's gonna be an awesome time. You
can go to Small Town Monsters Dotto grab your tickets. It's looking like

(08:03):
this year is going to be biggerand better than last year. So I
hope to see a bunch of youthere. Come find me in the vendor
Hall, or maybe I'll be wanderingaround at some point. Either way,
come say hi. All right,that's enough of that, why don't we
get into the episode. For today'sshow, we have an update from Aaron
Deese, who has recently published afollow up book to last year's Texas Dogmen

(08:28):
Triangle Dogmen of the Lone Star State, this time with a focus on the
Dogmen of the LBL, along witha few other cool updates and stuff on
the horizon. So sit back,relax, and enjoy the show. All

(08:54):
right, folks, welcome back tothe show. Joining me today is the
one and only Aaron Deese from hayStrangeness and now Small Town Monsters. Now,
Aaron's been on the show a fewtimes before, and you already really
love it when he comes on,which is awesome. So stoked to have
him back. He doesn't really needa reintroduction, but if anyone out there

(09:16):
is new to the show you're listeningfor the first time, Aaron, can
you what do you do? Yeah? I do weird stuff. My name
is Aaron Deese. I am anauthor and content producer with Small Town Monsters.
You may know us from our documentaryfilms, of which there are many.
A few years ago, though,I started a podcast with my wife

(09:39):
called hay Strangeness, and that waskind of the springboard that launched me into
this community, got me acquainted withmister Jeff of Strangeology over here. You
know, it kind of connected mewith a lot of really interesting and cool
people who had turned out to bevery important to my present career. So
that's kind of where I got andwhere I how I got to what I'm

(10:00):
doing right now. But I dostory work and research for Small Town Monsters.
I produce currently all three of ourpodcasts, The Lord, you Know,
House of Monsters and STM Live.And then I've also been featured in
a couple of our films, dogMan Triangle, where Wolve's in the Lone
Star State, the upcoming dog ManTerritory where Wolve's in the Land between the
Lakes, which is coming out inreally just a couple of weeks once this

(10:22):
airs. And I also made asmall appearance in chuop A Copra And we
just started airing UFOs Revisited, whichI am the host of, which is
a show I'm very excited about.So that's awesome. I'm so happy for
you, man. That's thank youliving the dream. You're living the dream.
Thanks man. You've been You've beena role model and an inspiration since
day one, and that's not ashoke. Well, thank you, thank

(10:46):
you. We're out here doing thething, you know, So, yeah,
I want to get into this.This new book that you did.
It's kind of a you know,a sequel to the Texas dog Man Triangle.
It's called Hunting Grounds the dog Manof the Lake. Did I get
that right? Dog Men of theLakes? But it's dog Men. It's
it's also a weird title, andI honestly wanted to change it after I

(11:07):
had settled on it, but thenwe had already started publishing promos for it.
So now you get, yeah,it's too late, too late.
Yeah, So what what led tothe decision to look into the LBL versus
other potential hotspots for dog men?Yeah? Definitely. So I had finished

(11:28):
the Texas dog Man Triangle, hada tremendous amount of fun doing that,
you know, it was it wasgreat. It was everything I wanted it
to be. And then I kindof started looking at this dog man phenomenon
through a different lens, like takingall of the stuff I had learned in
Texas and going, Okay, well, where else is this going on?
And it turns out it's going onin a few places, So narrowing it

(11:50):
down to a specific area really kindof came from brainstorming with Heather and Seth
at STN and they, you know, full credit to them, they were
the ones that came up with theidea of, well, what if you
look specifically at the land between theLakes and dig into this massacre story,
which was really an organic transition becausepeople have been asking me about the LBL
massacre since I started having conversations aboutdog Man, and it wasn't something I

(12:15):
really had a definitive answer on,so I was excited to do it.
I had already kind of made notesjust from it being an area I wanted
to look into at some point,and then it sort of became part of
this whole you know, combined explorationof the Land between the Lakes that Small
Town Monsters is doing, which isongoing right now because it ties into the
movie dog maned Territory, and thenyou know, it also is alongside Eli's

(12:39):
Sasquatch on Earth series Piece of theLand between the Lakes, which is airing
right now, and Alex Petakov's episodeof Strange Places Lost in the Land between
the Lakes. So it started justas looking into the massacre story and then
also contrasting that to the dog Manphenomena as a whole kind of looking into
that historically and going Okay, whatelse is going on? And really it

(13:01):
wasn't even really planned. It justkind of happened. It became a piece
of this wider narrative because the landbetween the lakes is so strange and there's
so much history there. We talkedabout this, I think last time you
were kind enough to have me onand yeah, it's difficult to approach it
with just a documentary, just aYouTube series, just a podcast, just
a book. It's almost not possibleif you want to get a comprehensive picture.

(13:24):
So, you know, the bookfocus is very specifically on the dog
man phenomenon in the LBL, butit's also there's so much more. There's
so much out there. Yeah,yeah, it's yeah, the the LBL
has so much going on. Yeah. So this massacre that happened, I'm

(13:46):
sure some are are aware, butcan you give like a brief overview of
that part of the story. Yeah. So there is in air quotes a
fun internet ledge and that's been circulatingfor the last few years. And I
say fun because it's resulted in somevery entertaining content. It's resulted in a
lot of clicks and a lot oftraffic for a lot of creators, and

(14:09):
I don't that's not like a snarkycomment. It's a story, and we
cover stories. That's great, let'stalk about it. But it has very
much transcended from just being a cryptozoologycase to kind of having a life of
its own in the Internet age.And the story is that sometime in the
early nineteen eighties, a family offour were killed by one or possibly two

(14:31):
of these dog man were wolf likecreatures in the Land between the Lakes,
which is a national recreation area thatsits on the border of Tennessee and Kentucky.
And it was very largely written offby a lot of the community,
including myself, for a long timeas just being an Internet story. You
know, Oh, this is acreepypasta. We have tons of those.

(14:52):
You can put it in the samecategory as the Russian Sleep Experiment or the
Man from Tarat, you know,fun stories. Probably not true, maybe
some basis in reality, but we'repretty sure this is fake. Yeah.
Well, the earliest origin point ofthe story that we can trace in the
media is the two thousand and sevendocumentary Hunt the dog Man High strangeness in
Kentucky from mister Barton Nuntley, whoI'm sure many of your listeners are familiar

(15:13):
with. Great guy. Great Researcherturns out, though this story has been
present in the land between the lakesarea, the town of Grand Rivers comes
up quite a bit, which isadjacent to the park, since as early
as nineteen eighty two, we didnot have social media. In nineteen eighty
two, the Internet barely existed atall, and it was used by academic

(15:35):
and government organizations for stuff you andI probably wouldn't understand, so at least
not me. Can't speak for you, definitely not me. So once we've
traced an origin point that predates theInternet age, we can preclude the notion
that this is an Internet creepypasta.It may have become that in the intervening
years, but that's not where wegot it start. So then it becomes
a question of what else is thehistory in this area, what else is

(15:58):
going on that's surround this alleged eventthat allows us to look into it more
deeply. Within the last few years, a gentleman who calls himself Roger has
come forward and claimed to be asurvivor of the event. He did a
few interviews with the Cryptid Studies Institutewhich are not currently available publicly, and
I actually have the opportunity to speakwith him, Shannon and Lagroux, and

(16:18):
I spoke with him during the filmingof dog Man Triangle. Shannon, of
course is in this film, andshe's great. If you don't watch it
for anything else, watch it tosee Shannon because she's cool. And that
added some additional details that weren't presentin the general narrative that has altered the
discussion a little bit for people whoare really interested in it. There are

(16:41):
people go back and forth as towhether or not his account is valid,
whether or not it's a true story. I have my own opinions that I
won't share publicly, but it veryquickly became evident that, again, this
is not just a story of theInternet age. I'm personally of the opinion
that something happened. I don't thinksomeone just made up this whole thing,
because too many law enforcement officers thatare in the area are willing to say

(17:03):
that, yeah, I've heard ofthis, I heard this story at the
time that happened, or I knowsomeone who actually responded to the initial seat.
But as to how many of thosedetails you see online are accurate,
I don't know. I can't sayyeah, yeah, I mean I'm familiar
with that story for sure, andit is it's big if true, you

(17:30):
know, like who knows exactly.But I mean, the LBL has such
a storied history anyway, and besidesdog Band, there's other things going on
there. You've got UFO sightings,bigfoot, paranormal all that kind of stuff,
and just you know, I hadJesse and Joe from Hell About Holler

(17:53):
on my podcast last year and theywere talking about how, just like every
it's like the history of that stuffis like soaked into the ground, like
there was some some bad stuff.People were displaced when it was turned into
this reserve by the government, AndI mean, I think there's still a

(18:18):
few people that live there from whatI understand, but mostly not. I
mean, you've got all these abandonedcemeteries and all. It just seems it
seems like such a wild place.Now, did you during your research and
you mentioned this is a pretty comprehensivething. Small town monsters, you guys

(18:41):
are are you guys are going prettyhard at this from a lot of different
angles. Are there any other legendsbesides dog Man that have been kind of
prominent on on the radar for lookinginto and getting getting more info about.
Yeah, definitely. I mean thethe sasquatch activity out there is excuse me,

(19:02):
let's try that again. The sasquatchactivity out there is intense. Pretty
Much every person we spoke to aboutdog Man had an anecdote or an experience
that was most likely the result ofsome kind of sasquatch activity. So tons
of bigfoot reports, tons of researchersout there looking into that on a very
regular basis. Excuse me. Thereare quite a few UFO sightings in the

(19:25):
area throughout Tennessee and Kentucky anyway,but there are a lot of really high
profile ones that take place very closeto the land between the lakes. And
we may have mentioned this last timeyou had me on, but the Thomas
Mantel UFO crash took place very closeto the land between the lakes, and
based on the radar data and whenthat UFO was reported, it may have
actually been moving in the direction ofthe park. We can't say that specifically,

(19:48):
but it was moving in that generaldirection, so that I don't know
if that's something, but yeah,very interesting the Kentucky Hopkinsville Goblins incident that
was just about thirty miles from theLBO. If you zoom out a little
bit and smudge over the lines thatwe as human beings have arbitrarily drawn,
that took place in the same areaand in the same spot, so's it's

(20:11):
yeah, it's very weird. Andthen of course there's been a lot of
crime, there's a lot of shadyhuman activity that's gone on there. Moonshining
was a thing out there for along time, may still be according to
some people. So even if youstep away from the paranormal aspect and how
weird it is, all these strangestories that come out of there, there's
a very distinct and in some caseviolent history to this place that is documented,

(20:37):
is known about. It's not evenspeculation. So yeah, yeah,
no, it's definitely one of thoseseems like one of those window areas of
high strangeness, like your Bridgewater Trianglesand Bermuda Triangles of the world. Yeah,
and it's it is that part ofKentucky kind of still considered part of

(21:02):
Appalachia or is it too far west. I'm trying to envision to my a
mind map here a little too farwest, but you know, I don't
know. You always see on socialmedia people are talking about like all the
creepy stuff and in Appalachia, andyeah, I mean it's adjacent enough.
I suppose. Yeah, it's definitelylike in the vicinity. And if we're

(21:25):
speculating about window areas, vortex areas, portals, concentrations of energy, you
know, we don't know exactly howthose things work. So if if Appalachia
is a concentrated area of high strangeness, how far is that rippling out?
We don't know, you know,Yeah, that's that's a good point to
think about for sure. Yeah,because you know, Appalachia kind of is

(21:51):
it's thought to stretch between like northernGeorgia, a little bit of Alabama all
the way up to like its southwestPennsylvania. But the mountain range that that's
a part of comes up through NewEngland as well. There's a lot of
weird stuff that happens in New England. And then that whole mountain chain used

(22:11):
to be before the continents broke apartfrom Pangaea, used to be part of
like the Scottish Highlands and some otherstuff in like Scandinavia where there's like weird
legends of stuff happening as well withcreatures and monsters and all that. So
yeah, who's to say we tendto look at these things as human beings

(22:32):
in terms of what state is thisin? What county is this in?
You know, what concentration of highstrangeness is this in? But yeah,
I love that you mentioned Pangaea andgoing back to the roots of where these
mountains literally come from. We don'tknow how all that center connected. So
love that. Yeah. Yeah,yeah, and human borders are completely arbitrary
right in terms of the planet itself. But so you guys are doing a

(23:00):
brand new documentary follow up to Texasdog Man Triangle based on this book.
Have you gotten to go up tothe LBL yourself and gotten to experience anything
anything weird? Yeah. One ofthe one of the comments that you saw
a lot for the Texas dog ManTriangle was the documentary specifically, was oh,

(23:22):
it didn't really have any fieldwork.You guys weren't out there at night,
you know all that stuff, Andthe way that film was done and
the way the book was written,it just wasn't an element of that,
but this one is different. You'llsee us in the woods at night.
We get in some of the bunkers, the LBL bunkers that you hear about,
so some very interesting stuff went onthere. We do get out there

(23:47):
with Jesse and Joe Doyle. Idon't think that's a secret of hellbent Holler.
We go to the place where theyhad their sighting and they captured their
very compelling thermal photograph a few yearsago, so that's explored and talked about
quite a bit. We do getout there with mister Martin Groves. If
you've ever heard an interview with him, he's had some very compelling and really
frightening encounters with potentially with these creaturesin the park. So we were able

(24:10):
to go out with him and seewhere some of this activity had occurred.
And that was incredibly interesting and excitingfor me because I tend to do most
of my work with a computer.You know, I go to places and
I talk to witnesses and take pictures, but most of the time the actual
work is organizing and compiling and presentinginformation. So actually getting to get out

(24:33):
there in the woods was a lotof fun. The way Seth has edited
this film. I think it's goingto be a lot of fun for people
to watch too. Yeah, that'sgreat and yeah, for sure a breath
of fresh air when you actually getto walk away from the screens and burying
your nose and books to actually goto places where things were actually said to

(24:56):
have happened. Something I'd love toget more and involved and as time moves
forward myself. But it is youhear a story and until you've seen where
that story took place, doesn't haveto be anything paranormal. It can be
you know, an argument your friendgot into at the McDonald's, so you
see that McDonald's counter, you don'thave the full image in your mind,
and so like going to these placesand realizing like wow, something like this

(25:19):
could have happened here based on whatI see. That's it's It's kind of
adds an element to it. Yeah, yeah for sure. Now how did
you find I assume you guys foundsome some locals. You know, obviously
you had Martin Groves out there andhe did an episode with Jeremiah over at

(25:41):
Bigfoot Society last year Live for Monsterfests, which talk about monsterfests in a bit,
But you know, how did youfind local witnesses. What were their
opinions on sightings? Do people wholive in that area believe there's something going
on? So the sentiment seems tobe yes. Based on the people that

(26:04):
we talk to, there is anidea at least that there is something strange
going on in those woods, whetherit's an animal, whether it's something supernatural,
whether it's people hallucinating. You know, that's where opinions really start to
vary. When you're talking about smallcommunities like this. You know, it's
not always easy to get a leadto the inside, you know, because

(26:26):
you tell people you're working on adocumentary, immediately people think of the mainstream
stuff that's very sensationalized and push isa very specific narrative, which is basically,
you know, clickbait. To usethat term, no disrespect to anybody
who enjoys that content. I enjoyquite a bit of it myself from time
to time. But not everybody wantsto be involved in producing something like that.

(26:47):
Not everybody wants to be on camerain the first place. We were
very fortunate that we had people likeMike Smith, Elijah and Gappy Henderson,
Dewey Edwards Martin of course, DarrylDenton was along the right as well.
Who are locals to the area whohave also been doing this kind of research
for varying numbers of years. They'vealso had some of their own experiences,

(27:08):
so you know, we were ableto kind of get in work around that
initial roadblock of not being locals tothat area. Myself especially, I really
never spent time out there, Sowriting a book about it, you have
to know what the place is like. And I kind of started from square
one just learning about the environment,the animals, the industry, what businesses

(27:30):
are big out there. You know, what industries got their start out there
versus what's there today. I reallyhad to like start from square one,
and having those people like Elijah,Mike, you know, Martin really invaluable.
Yeah, well, that's awesome thatyou have those resources of people who
you know, are familiar, they'vegot their own stories and all that for

(27:55):
sure. Now have you found,like, have there we had any commonalities
or patterns with different sightings of dogmen? Like what do people usually experience
when when they see this stuff thatthey can't explain? Yeah? Yeah,

(28:15):
the short answers, Yes, there'sdefinitely a pattern to this stuff. What
that pattern doesn't seem to pervade everysingle sighting. But it's kind of the
same with UFOs. You know,we hear a lot of UFO sightings where
a person has radiation poisoning or radiationsickness afterwards, but not every single time.
A lot of UFO reports mention orbsor spheres, not every single time.

(28:37):
It's kind of the same way inthe dog man world. The one
thing that seems to be recurring thatwe note every single time pretty much,
unless we're talking about an auditory encounter. I heard something strange, but that's
a whole nother that's a whole otherthing. We don't have to go down
that avenue a lot of speculation.It's an upright canine form, essentially,

(28:59):
is what people are with. Usuallywe're hearing about pointed ears, an elongated
snout. Tails don't come up awhole lot. I know in pop culture,
any depiction you see of a werewolf, there's usually a tail. Maybe
not all the time, but veryoften. Don't hear a whole lot about
tails. That's sometimes so on thesurface level. I saw a dog walking
on two legs. What's striking aboutthese encounters is that very very often,

(29:21):
I would say seventy five eighty percentof the time, witnesses report feeling uncomfortable,
afraid, having nightmares afterward, beingafraid to go in the woods.
And we're usually talking about hunters,campers, people who are used to being
outside, law enforcement officers, militaryveterans. You know, if there's something
in the woods that people in thewoods are the ones most likely to encounter

(29:42):
it, and the people most likelyto be in the woods are the ones
who are comfortable being there, andthat's usually who these reports come from.
So to me, that's striking fortwo reasons, because one, if I
just see a strange dog, I'mnot gonna have nightmares for thirty years.
I'm not going to have post traumaticstress disorder. I'm just maybe if that
dog chases me or bites me,that's a whole other dimension. But if

(30:03):
I just see a dog walking throughthe woods, it's not going to have
that effect on me. And Ithink that's probably the same for most people.
You saw a dog. What wasthe other thing I was going to
say? I lost it. That'sthe most important part, though, is
the impact. It's the impact thatthese sightings have on the witnesses. Because
we can sit here all day andgo, well, what did they actually

(30:23):
see? What was going on there? Was it paranormal? Was it an
animal? That person's experience and theconsequences they face after having that experience are
not subject to our you know,critiques. It doesn't really matter what we
think, because that's real. That'sreal to them. And that's what comes
up again and again is these inthese dog Man's sightings, is the distinct

(30:44):
impression that no, I saw acanine form on two legs. I did
not see a bear, I didnot see an ape, I did not
see bigfoot, I saw what Ican only describe as a werewolf. And
then these lasting impressions of like dread, fear, sometimes physical sickness. So
yeah, yeah, well that's uh. I would say good to have,

(31:04):
you know, at least a littlebit of a pattern recognition there for all
these commonalities that people who don't knoweach other are, they're all reporting the
same thing, which to me soundslike there's something actually there And yeah,
that's super interesting. Now, doyou have any any encounter stories, uh,

(31:32):
save save for the massacre or orMartin Groves, any like crazy stories
that you heard about when writing thebook that really stick out into your in
your mind. Yeah. Absolutely.I had a great conversation with a gentleman
named Mike Smith, who is alsoin the documentary and featured in the book,
and he has lived in this areapretty much his entire life. He's
camped in the land between the lakesfor pretty much his entire life. You

(31:56):
know, knows knows the terrain,knows the wildlife very well, and he
hasn't had a visual sighting. Butin over the years he's developed an interest
in this stuff, and he's hadpeople contact him. You know, he's
kind of become a default researcher becauseyou're there and you're hearing these stories.
So he's had a few people tacthim with his own or with their own
visual sightings. And then he's goneout and done research in areas where he's

(32:16):
actually experienced very strange auditory activity,picked up EMF waves on a reader near
a graveyard. And when this happenednear this graveyard, he was there with
his son. It's in the movie. In the books, I don't want
to go into too many details becauseI'll get him wrong and then someone will
go watch it and be like,you got this wrong. But he actually
captured a footprint and was able tocast it. And it does not look

(32:39):
like a sasquatch print. It isway too big to be a human print,
and he actually ran it by Ibelieve. I believe doctor Jeff Meldrum,
if I'm not mistaken, took alook at it and said, this
is not a Sasquatch print. Icould be misremembering because I haven't talked about
this in an interview yet, soI didn't practice this. But a very

(33:00):
noted Sasquatch researcher, I believe itwas, doctor Meldrum looked at it and
was like, yeah, no,that's not sasquatch. Dude. I don't
know what you got, but it'ssomething. So you know, we don't
often see, right, we don'toften get physical evidence in dog man cases,
and when we do, it's usuallynot very good. It's usually easily
debunkable. But this is a reallycompelling, potential potential dog man print that

(33:22):
was captured by someone who, youknow, I'll die on this hill,
is a very reputable researcher and doeslook at this stuff objectively. So,
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(34:05):
I mean actual potential physical evidence ispretty big, you know. I
mean there's so much in the worldof bigfoot sasquatch with track castings and you
know, samples of potential hair orwhat have you. But yeah, no,
that's that'll be cool to see ifanything comes of that, or if

(34:29):
there's more stuff to come with withsome physical evidence. Now, I was
wondering, has there been anybody elseout there who has, you know,
potentially been attacked by these things?Because they they it seems like they're a

(34:50):
hell of a lot more aggressive andpotentially more dangerous than something like a bigfoot.
You know, people the stories I'veyou know, people are like this
thing jumped out in front of mycar. It's snarled at me and like
jumped across the road in one leap, probably could have probably could have like
torn the door off the car ifthey wanted to, Like yeah, yeah,

(35:15):
and that's yes. It's another shortanswer, yes scenario. I of
course, did not meet anybody whoclaimed to have been physically attacked by one
of these things, but there arequite a few stories. Again, talking
to Martin, law enforcement officer,thirty year career, great reputation, people
know who he is, you know, he mentioned that there may be as
many as thirty deaths that have takenplace within the land between the Lakes as

(35:37):
a result of these creatures. Canyou find those records publicly if you go
looking. No. No. There'salso quite a bit to the idea that
there's a reticence on the part ofthe powers that be the law enforcement in
the area to talk about this stuffpublicly. That's a rabbit hole. I
won't go too far down, butwhat I will say is I consider Martin

(35:59):
to be very credible, and ifhe tells me something, he believes that
what he's telling me, I believethat, no, no equivocation. I
believe Martin believes what he's telling me. So there's quite a bit of conjecture
about it, and then again,a lot of the local researchers like mister
Smith and mister Henderson have received reportsof these things physically attacking people second or

(36:20):
third hand from park rangers, visitorsto the park locals in the area.
Jesse and Joe Doyle over at HellbentHoller have received over one hundred potential dog
man reports in the North Carolina SouthCarolina area, including one where it was
alleged to have chased a vehicle atvery high speed. So, you know,
you mentioned that in kind of injest, but we actually do have

(36:40):
reports where these things are said tohave chased or attacked vehicles. So I
don't know, man, Yeah,yeah, yeah. Are we any closer
to figuring out what what dog manactually is? I mean, I know
there's a bunch of theories. Someonerecent was like, oh, they're called

(37:01):
what is it Sinocephaly, which islike goes back to like ancient Greece where
there were these dog headed men thatlived on an island somewhere. I want
to say, it must have beenin the Mediterranean or something like that,
but like, yeah, it soundslike something like this is bet around for
a long time. Yeah, I'mgot two minds there. I believe firmly

(37:25):
that this thing has been with uspretty much since the dawn of civilization,
probably before. And I believe thatbecause we see depictions of upright canines in
Mesopotamian art. I'm talking, youknow, back to Gilgamesh times now,
like since the beginning. Some ofthe earliest depicted artwork in the human record
is of upright canines. So there'sthat. The Sinuscephali is a really interesting

(37:50):
idea, this idea of a biological, not just biological, but intelligent,
civilized species of half human half canines. My opinion is that those legends are
probably a result of mistranslation. Wecan point to specifically Saint Christopher in Catholic
mythology, where he's depicted as beinga dog headed holy man warrior saint.

(38:14):
It's widely believed that those depictions arethe result of a misspelling of his name
or the region he was from.I can't remember specifically, but it was
very close to the word dog andit became that. So I don't have
my notes in front, you're explainthat in detail. And then also when
we're talking about, you know,stories of different civilizations. Christopher Columbus is

(38:34):
said to have encountered the Sinocephali insome stories. But I think what we
might be looking at there is kindof just the way in which people in
other time periods viewed other civilizations,how they would look at other cultures and
other practices and compare them to theirown. And I think it's my opinion,
as someone who's not a proper scholaror historian, I think some of

(38:55):
those legends at least are the resultof that. But I do believe that
whatever is causing these modern day sightingsof these upright canines, I do believe
whatever that is has been with usfor a very long time, whether it's
a biological species, a spiritual orsupernatural element of some type, or just
something we carry around with us,you know whatever that means. So yes

(39:19):
and no, yeah, I meanit's so it's so nebulous. I mean
you have people who are like,well, I mean this goes with any
prominent cryptid like Bigfoot or dog Man, Like where's where's the evidence in the
in the fossil records of creatures likethis? I mean Bigfoot probably has like

(39:40):
more more footing to stand on with, like Gigantipithecus, which was a ten
foot tall ape that was able tostand on bipedally. But like, where

(40:00):
where's the evidence of, you know, something like a dog man has that?
Has that come up in your researchat all or has anyone been able
to offer any kind of idea ofwhy that might be, Like, you
know, we're not finding dog manbodies or anything like that. There are
some rumors and some stories. I'mthinking of one that Nick Redfern wrote about

(40:24):
specifically, and I can't remember thebook he writes about it in, but
it can actually believe it was ShapeShifters, great book where he talks about
a legend out of somewhere in Englandwhere someone is alleged to have the skeleton
of a dog man creature. Andit's in this town where there's a warrior
of legend that goes back a fewhundred years. And you know you're not
going to find pictures of it online. I looked. If anyone does find

(40:45):
it, let me know. Butso there is to go to England.
Yeah, get over there, callNick ask him. I don't know,
actually I've got his email, letme let me but shoot him an email
right now. So there are somestories about that with the fossil record,
that's fun. I'm not an archaeologist, but I do know that we discover
new species all the time. Ido know that for a very long time,

(41:07):
we thought Brontosaurus and a Patosaurus weretwo different things. It turns out
to the same species. We didn'tthink dinosaurs had feathers for a very very
long time. So we're always learningnew things and finding new things. When
we find fossils of animals, wedon't usually find whole skeletons. You know,
a lot of people probably know thisalready, but when you see dinosaur

(41:27):
skeletons and museums, generally they didn'tfind all those bones in one place.
They were from different places, andthey were able to determine these are from
the same species, so we're goingto put them together. Sometimes they have
to fill in the blanks with artificialpieces. So if we found dog manned
fossils, how would that necessarily lookanything different from say, you know,
just a canine skull or a canineappendage, or a fossilized canine oops,

(41:52):
sorry, or a fossilized canine footprint. The same thing applies to modern day
sightings. Say there are you know, a few dog men quote unquote in
a given area, one of themdies, it's already away from human eyes,
it's already in an isolated area.Animals in general, we know will
go away to isolated places when they'resick or they know that their time is

(42:13):
coming. So add that to thefact that decomposition happens very very rapidly in
the wild, scavengers, bacteria,bugs, the elements. If we found
a dog man's skeleton, unless wefound it within a few hours of it
dying, who's to say it wouldlook anything differently from a wolf, a
coyote, something that was hit bya car. I don't know that we

(42:34):
would know that. The same goesfor DNA. If dog man is an
amalgamation of known canine species, amutant or a you know, a one
off crossbread situation, which I thinkthere's some room to make that argument,
why would the DNA look anything differentlythan a mix of wolf, dog,
coyote, which is what a lotof wild canine DNA looks like. Same
with the Texas schupacabra. We finallyfigured out that that is something that's a

(42:58):
little bit strange. We're not exactlysure how this happened, but we know
that it has wolf, coyote,domestic dog, DNA so and all of
those species have displayed the ability towalk on two legs for limited periods.
So then the question is, like, can they cross breed in such a
way that one of their offspring adaptsto that as a primary method of locomotion.

(43:19):
That's what I don't know. Butas far as remains footprints, you
know, DNA, I tend tothink it would probably all look like just
regular canine stuff. Yeah, yeah, no, that's all really good and
valid points for sure. And thenyou know, I was thinking, it's
also with fossilization, a very certainset of conditions need to happen for fossils

(43:47):
to form. And you know howmany dinosaur fossils do we have, It's
really not all that many, orany other ancient extinct species or even species
that are still around. And yeah, scavenging decomposition happens very rapidly, So

(44:09):
there are people that do come acrossthe carcasses of larger animals in the woods
sometimes, but it's not all thatoften. I think. Yeah, it's
kind of the same argument people makewith sasquatch, like why haven't we found
a dead sasquatch. Well, howoften have you found a dead bear?
You know, how often do huntersand woods you find dead bears? Not
very often? So scale the numbersdown of available specimens by however many thousand.

(44:34):
You know, we don't have harddata yet. I don't think it's
very likely we would find one.I think it would be a very random
chance, like catching a shooting star, you know, yeah, exactly.
And you know, I'm of theopinion that it's a big possibility with bigfoot,
since they are if they do exist, they are a hominid species,

(44:55):
and they're intelligent, they might burytheir dead. And if dog men are
intelligent, I mean dogs bury theirbones, exactly right, they could do
a similar thing. They could doa similar thing and we'd never know,
be none the wiser. So yeah, Now, as far as the different

(45:17):
dog man hotspots around, I mean, is there do you think what do
you think the reason is they're they'rein the LBL. Is it just because
of the the remoteness of the area, or are there any ideas surrounding why
there's certain hotspots aside from you know, vortex areas and stuff like that.

(45:40):
Yeah, I was gonna say thenwe get into the nature of what they
are, because if we're talking aboutsupernatural, spiritual something, something from another
dimension, whatever, which is wherea lot of the speculation is going nowadays.
That's being talked about quite a bit. Is it because of the history?
Is it because of the elements inthe ground. You know, there's

(46:01):
a lot of folklore in mythology surroundingrivers and lakes. A lot of these
sightings take place next to bodies ofwater. Land between the Lakes is the
largest inland peninsula in the United States. You can't get more than a few
miles away from water in any direction, So does that have something to do
with it. A lot of theseareas where we're seeing concentrations, and I
can mention Ohio as another example,have a history of iron mine and limestone

(46:27):
mining and steel refineries and things likethat. Iron has folklore in mythology,
going back to again the ancient world. You know, our ancestors believe that
iron interacted with the spiritual realm indifferent ways based on their belief systems.
But there's that Jesse Doyle has mentionedthat when they took all this iron out
of the land between the Lakes,maybe they removed some kind of protection that

(46:49):
was keeping these dark beings at baySo and that's explored more in the documentary
and the book, but fun littleteaser to gets you excited. So there's
that idea, you know, ifthese are spiritual beings, maybe it's the
physical elements in the environment and theway that we interact with them that causes
them to show up on the otherside of the coin. If they are
animals, If they are true cryptids, we can point to the fact that

(47:14):
they generally occur, like I mentioned, in wooded areas, in isolated locations.
We do have some roadside sidings thattake place close or adjacent to cities,
but they're usually near wooded areas.Pretty much always near wooded areas.
I have yet to encounter a dogman's story that I've done any significant research
on. You hear anecdotes and stuffonline, but that took place in an

(47:35):
urban area. Maybe there are some, maybe your listeners can point me to
some, but it seems by andlarge these are taking place near wooded or
undeveloped areas, if not in thoseareas already national parks, ranches, campgrounds,
mountainous places. So if it's ananimal it needs concealment, it needs
prey because if it's a canine,it has carnivorous tendencies, and it needs

(47:57):
water. We find all three ofthose things present in pretty much all of
these encounters. Yeah, yeah,that all very much makes sense. You
know, wooded, potentially mountainous.You got to have your your lakes,
your rivers and all that, anda source of food. Yeah. I
was thinking the other day, it'slike, have there ever been any any

(48:21):
dog man sightings out in like theSouthwest, like Arizona, New Mexico,
Utah. I mean, there's obviouslylike legends of like skin walkers and stuff
like that, but dog man specifically, Like I don't know if that environment
would really would really gel with themunless you've come into any different information.
But yeah, yeah, random randomthought of the day. I know you're

(48:43):
right, and I can't speak tothat area, you know, I haven't
written a book on Arizona, NewMexico, but a lot of the conjecture
you hear that comes out of thatarea concerns, well, this is probably
a skin walker, it's adjacent tothese native lands, and that is actually
explored very thoroughly in the skin WalkersAmerica and were wolves too from small town
monsters, which I am not inand had nothing to do with. But

(49:05):
some of the themes in that filmcross over with some of the themes in
Hunting Grounds, and that was purecoincidence. So you know, I'm I'm,
I am not a person of nativedescent. I probably got some in
there somewhere. I'm never gonna say, well, skinwalker and dog bait have
the same thing. I don't know. I don't I don't know, and
I'm not here to try to makethat point. I don't have the knowledge
or the cultural background to even begin. But if we're talking about an upright

(49:28):
canine archetype, people do often mentionthem in the same sentence. So but
yeah, what I don't hear alot of is people going dog man as
a separate thing from the skinwalker presencein those areas. So yeah, interesting,
Yeah, yeah, that's a goodpoint. That's a good point.
Now. The one thing I'm wonderingabout your opinion on is and I can't

(49:54):
remember if we talked about this lasttime, but government cover ups. Do
you think it's possible that the governmentmight know of the existence of these things
and other cryptids? There's this wholeconspiracy theory that national parks were made because
there's cryptids and creatures in there thatthe government doesn't want the public to know

(50:15):
about or get by or something likethat. But what's your opinion on that,
and you know, potential military experimentgone wrong, Like, yeah,
it's a weird rabbit hole. Yeah. Sure. It's such a fun idea,
man, And it's one of thoseplaces where you know, the legend
inter sex with fiction because we seethat trope all throughout fiction. I mean,

(50:37):
you know, if you look atthe Underworld movies, that's not quite
what you were describing. But thiswhole idea of an underground were wolf society
existing alongside us, you know,I think it's a great idea, But
I haven't run into any evidence orenough compelling testimony to make me think that
that's the case. I think what'smore likely is that they don't care.

(51:02):
I don't think it happens often enoughthat the federal government is like, we
got to get a handle on this, we got to deal with this.
I think there is definitely a reticenceon the part of like I said earlier,
local law enforcement or even federal lawenforcement that are active in that area
to talk about this stuff. Butif you're a law enforcement officer with no
general interest in the paranormal, whywould you agree to an interview on something

(51:23):
like this? Why would you riskyour reputation if you hadn't had a real
experience, you know, like MartinGroves that's cemented in reality for you,
why bother? So I would guessthat these reports probably still are coming in
from time to time. The rumorsare probably still floating around in certain circles.
But these people don't have enough ofan investment to come and talk to

(51:43):
people like you and me, youknow, and I wouldn't either. I
would not either. When I workedin apartment management, I didn't want to
talk to anybody about anything I didnot have to talk to them about because
I was trying to get through theday. And I expect their jobs are
a lot more stressful than mine was. So that's kind of very good share.
Yeah, I think I think it'skind of the same with like UFOs.

(52:04):
The government probably knows more than whatthey're telling us. I'm sure there
are elements of any government organization they'relike, yeah, I don't want to
deal with this dog man thing,so I'm just gonna not do a press
conference about this, but I don't. I'm not of the opinion that it's
a mass cover up. I'm notof the opinion that it's necessarily a conspiracy.

(52:25):
I don't buy into the government breedingprogram angle. I just don't.
That's my opinion. People are welcometo disagree with me, point me towards
resources that might change my mind.But aside from YouTube comments, I haven't
seen enough to point me in thatdirection. I think if they're out there,
well, I do believe that they'reout there at some capacity, but

(52:45):
I don't think it's something the governmenthas controlled over or you know, is
hiding from us necessarily. I justdon't think they care that much. Right,
Yeah, that makes sense, Thatmakes sense. I mean, if
it's there's not a ton of them, they're not coming into urban areas and
and being a menace to society.Yeah, like, let him be,

(53:06):
let him be. Let a guysay I saw a werewolf. No one's
gonna believe him anyway. If I'ma government official, that's my mindset.
Yeah, yeah, for sure.Now I wanted to jump back to two
UFOs for a second. Do youthink you know sometimes there's UFO sightings in
conjunction with big foot sightings. Didyou run across any anything. I know

(53:30):
you mentioned that that pretty major UFOevent that happened earlier in the in the
episode here, But were there anystories you came across where people saw a
dog man but then they also sawlike a UFO, either in that that
moment or shortly after. You know, they're sort of kind of there.

(53:53):
There is an encounter in the bookthat is very much more on the bizarre
kind of spec control realm. It'sdifficult to make a case for that one
as being a biological animal. That'sanother one that actually comes from Martin Groves.
He's had continuing experiences there. Idon't want to go too into details,

(54:14):
it'll spoil a lot of really interestingstuff from the book in the movie.
But during an encounter he had veryrecently, UFO sidings in Kentucky and
Tennessee spiked dramatically by a percent oflike eighty percent or something like that.
I don't have my numbers in frontof me, but in the few days
before and a few days after thisvery dramatic sighting, there were a lot

(54:35):
more UFO sidings according to Newfork,and you forc their database, so maybe,
and you hear so much conjecture aboutghost lights and things hovering over the
trees. Jesse and Joe Doyle haveexperienced some of that on their research trips.
So it's kind of one of thosethings where it's hard to say that,
yeah, there's a direct connection.I didn't see Bigfoot get into a

(54:58):
UFO, for example, but theproximity, the adjacency is definitely there.
People are having these independent experiences,do they overlap? I don't know.
Yeah, yeah, I mean Isuppose that kind of strength strengthens the argument
a little bit about these things mightbe more spiritual or inter dimensional or something

(55:22):
like that, or maybe it's acombination of all of the above. I
mean, yeah, it's such aweird, such a weird thing, it
really is. It's I'm reaching apoint and maybe I shouldn't say this out
loud because I can't fully explain ityet, but I'm reaching a point where
I think the dog man question transcendsis it an animal or is it a

(55:45):
spirit of some kind? I don'tthink it's that simple. Paranormal phenomena and
folklore crosses over with the real worldall the time. There are pretty much
any paranormal monster you can think ofis derived from some kind of real world
beast, goat man, donkey,Lady sasquatch is an ape man, the
frog man. Like, we seethis amalgamation of real world animals and mythological

(56:08):
creatures all the time. I justthink the question is bigger than that.
But yeah, I don't know,I don't know. Yeah, yeah,
it's yeah, it's kind of likethe Eighth Tower John John Keel, Yes,
yes, it's very a Kellian.I think the direction I'm going with
this stuff, I don't know ifthe super spectrum is pulling the strings and

(56:30):
screwing with me. I definitely feellike somebody is some days, but that's
just having a toddler. But yeah, yeah, I feel you there for
sure. Yeah yeah, so yeah, dog men. Dog men are out
there, it seems like. Sowhat's what's next for your research? Are

(56:52):
you going to continue looking into otherdog men hotspots or do you think you're
going to start to branch into othercryptid stories. What's on the agenda here?
Yeah, I'd kind of like todo both. I'm definitely planning to
take a break from writing books fora little bit because I'm two books in

(57:14):
three years now, and that wasfun. It was great. I loved
it. It's what I've always wantedto do since I was a kid.
I wanted to be an author.But I do want to take a step
back and kind of let things dofor a little bit. I'm already getting
some contacts from people who have hadencounters, both in Kentucky and Texas,
since you know, the work I'vealready done on that was put out,
so I'd like to give it moretime. And then I've also heard some

(57:37):
rumors about potential sightings in Australia,potential sightings in Europe, and so I'm
working on making some connections, hopefullyin those areas to look more deeply into
that. I've already been in touchwith one viewer of STM Live, which
is our weekly Small Town Monsters livestream, who pointed me towards an alleged
encounter out of Scotland in the earlytwo thousands, so, you know,

(58:00):
and Scotland has the legend of theWolver, which is another European werewolf myth.
So it's I want to chase thosethreads as far as I can,
and I don't want to be rushed, you know. What I mean.
Yeah, yeah, in the interim, I'm spending a lot of time on
UFOs these days. We've already announcedon the trail of UFOs Season two over

(58:20):
at Small Town Monsters, and I'minvolved in the background of that production,
so that's been a lot of fun. UFOs Revisited, of course, is
airing right now, and I spenta lot of people behind the scenes,
spent a lot of time on that. But I was doing research for many,
many, many many hours to havethe episode outlines ready for our cast

(58:42):
for that. So I'm very muchin the UFO headspace right now. And
then, like you know, somebodyat STM is always doing big Foot stuff
and they're better at it than Iam, So I'm gonna leave bigfot alone
at least for now. Yeah,yeah, yeah, for sure, for
sure. Well, man, that'sthat's super exciting. I mean, has
the book gotten some really good feedbackas of yet? I mean it's still

(59:05):
pretty new. Yeah, yeah,it's it's doing well. The feedback from
friends, colleagues, you know,members of the Small Town Monsters community has
all been very positive. People havebeen incredibly kind, and I'm grateful for
all of that. Their Amazon reviewsare pretty good. I don't like reviews
in general. I usually don't botherto read them because people just you know,
like to complain. But the onlynegative review I've gotten on Amazon so

(59:30):
far was I lived in this areaand I had never heard of this,
but I did hear about sasquatching UFOsand I was like, to me,
that's not a bad thing. Tome, that's not a negative review.
You learned something, you just toldanyone who's curious that this book has information
you didn't know about before, Soto me, that's a win. So
yeah, in general, in general, the feedback's been very kind and positive,

(59:50):
and I'm really grateful for that.There you go there, any press
is good press. I've uhh,yeah, tell your friend you didn't like
it, that's fine. They heardof it, yeah, yeah, exactly
gets it out there to the world. And also what books have you written
lately? But that's a separate thing. Yes, of course, Well this
is this has been an awesome update, Aaron. Thank you again for taking

(01:00:13):
some time to come and chat about, you know, your work into the
wide world of dog Man and getinto the bottom of some stuff in the
LBL and Texas Before you go,can you tell my listeners the best place
to you know, find all ofyour stuff online. Yeah, I am

(01:00:37):
very active on the small Town Monsterssocial media channels because I run them.
That's part of my job, soyou can always find me over there.
You can tune into our weekly livestream if you actually want to hang out
and ask questions. That's Wednesday nightsat nine pm on YouTube and Facebook.
You can also email me Aaron atsmalltown Monsters dot com. And then my
Instagram account is at hey underscore strangeness. I'm one of the many people following

(01:01:02):
Jeff if you need to isolate it. But that's my personal account where I
just kind of hang out and thenyou know, work is work, that's
over here. But yeah, yeah, I'm fairly accessible right on. And
you mentioned the book is on Amazon, and uh yeah, definitely pick up
a copy. Yes, if youget it all sorry, if you get

(01:01:22):
it from small trees dot com slashshop, it is cheaper because you don't
have to pay Amazon there go betweenfees, so there you go, there
you go. I always always wantto save some some cash, especially in
these times. All right, man, Well, thank you again, and
well you'll chat soon, yes,sir, oh and before we go monster
Fest end of the month. Ifyou're going, you'll see us there.

(01:01:45):
I'll see your table a few days. Aaron's going to be there. Yeah,
yeah, it's in a few weeksfrom this recording, so definitely check
it out. I'll have information linksin the show notes for all that so
anyway, yeah, all right,all right, take care dude, Thank
you, Jeff, all right,thanks again Aaron for coming on the show

(01:02:15):
one more time. I think he'sbeen my most frequent guest for the show.
I always love having Aaron on.He's such a dude, such a
scholar. But yeah, definitely,if you're coming to Monsterfest, definitely come
say hi. We'll be around andI'll have all of Aaron's links in the

(01:02:37):
show notes for all of his books, small town monster stuff, Hey,
Strangest podcasts, It'll all be there, so definitely check that out. As
always, I want to give ahuge thank you out there to everyone who
checks out the Strangeology podcast. Thoseyou download it, share it with friends
and family. It helps me outso much when you do that. The

(01:02:58):
Strangeology podcast wouldn't be possible without thesupport of listeners like you. To any
advertisers or companies out there looking tocollaborate with the Strangeology podcast, or if
you're someone who would like to beconsidered for an interview on the show.
If you're an author, researcher,experiencer, please send all inquiries to info

(01:03:19):
at strangeology dot com. And beyondbecoming a member through my Patreon, you
can also support Strangeology through my Etsyshop, which is at strangeology dot etsy
dot com, where I have awhole assortment of Cryptid alien and forty and
gear available on items like T shirts, tank tops, long sleeves, sweatshirts,

(01:03:42):
hoodies. Hot weather is here,so if you're going to get something,
you probably want to go with atank top. I've got all sorts
of cryptid encounter designs. I've gotmy Home State Cryptid collection, which has
every state in the US the mostpopular cryptid. I must have at least
sixty plus designs for that, andperiodically I add new ones. So definitely

(01:04:08):
you're gonna want to check back onmy shop frequently because I'm always trying to
add new designs as often as Ican. I've also got tons of stickers,
magnets, prints, my Homestate cryptidmapprint, which is a popular item
mugs, enamel pins, there's blankets, hats, and more, and again
make sure to check back often.I recently updated the shop with several new

(01:04:32):
designs and hoping to add more overthe summer as well. So again,
that is Strangeology dot Etsy dot com. Check it out, and one more
time, if you haven't yet,make sure to give me a follow over
on all my social media accounts.You can find me on Instagram, Facebook,
YouTube, Twitter, TikTok. I'mmost active posting short form content videos

(01:04:57):
on Instagram, TikTok, and Facebook. Or if you're looking for more from
me, definitely check that out.And I have longer form videos on YouTube,
trying hoping as schedule permits to expandand add more long form video content.
I've had a bunch of people askingif I can start doing a video
podcast, so I'm trying to explorethat idea as time permits. But yeah,

(01:05:23):
stay tuned on all that, andalso don't forget to check Instagram.
Every once in a while, Ido a giveaway for Strangeology merch and I
haven't done one in a little while, and the show is starting to get
pretty close to half a million downloads, so I think that would be a
great milestone marker for a giveaway,so that's probably going to be happening pretty

(01:05:48):
soon, so stay tuned. Allright, I think that's all for me
for now. I'm going to takea quick break here. Aaron was able
to hang out for a little whilelonger to chat out about some non dog
man related topics like UFOs and afew other things. It got really interesting,
so you won't want to miss it, so patrons, stick with me

(01:06:10):
and for everyone else, you'll hearfrom me after monster Fest too, So
take care of yourselves and each otherand keep it strange. Okay, members,

(01:07:25):
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(01:07:45):
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