August 5, 2025 • 53 mins
What does it take to completely rewrite your story—no matter your age, your past, or the obstacles stacked before you? In this moving episode of Stuck In My Mind, host Wize El Jefe welcomes Zulma Williams, a licensed therapist, trauma specialist, and founder of Dragonfly Therapy Services. Zulma’s journey is anything but ordinary: from a close-knit upbringing in Buenos Aires, Argentina, to surviving cancer, toxic relationships, and cultural upheaval, she’s a living embodiment of resilience and reinvention.
Hear Zulma recount her early life shaped by strong family bonds and the instability of Argentina’s economy, leading her to embark on a bold transcontinental move to the United States at the age of 31. She describes the shock, the magic, and the reality of starting over in a new culture where language and customs were unfamiliar. Despite the hardships, Zulma found spark and adventure, challenging herself to adapt and grow.
At 42, while working in accounting, Zulma took an inspiring leap into the world of mental health. She shares how listening to people’s stories—and surviving her own emotional abuse—ignited her passion to help others heal. Zulma’s candid account of confronting a late-in-life breast cancer diagnosis (just after graduating with her bachelor’s degree), and navigating the expectations of her Hispanic upbringing, offers a raw look at battling both illness and cultural barriers.
The conversation dives deep into the challenges of setting boundaries, especially as an immigrant and a Latina woman, and the importance of honoring your own voice—even when tradition says otherwise. Zulma reveals how her experiences and age have become assets in her work, enabling her to connect with clients on a meaningful, transformative level. She explains the unique approach at Dragonfly Therapy Services, including her use of Accelerated Resolution Therapy (ART) for trauma, and what the dragonfly symbolizes: deep change, growth, and letting the light in.
As the episode unfolds, Zulma and Wize explore the myths of “too late” and the power of saying “Why not?” to dreams at any stage of life. Listeners will find motivation in stories about pivoting careers, starting over, and how the fears of success can be as real and paralyzing as the fears of failure. Zulma’s vibrant storytelling, sprinkled with humor and authenticity, reconfirms that “stuck” is just a mindset—not a life sentence.
Whether you’re navigating adversity, considering a bold life change, or simply looking for inspiration, this episode is full of practical wisdom, hope, and a reminder that our scars can become powerful sources of service and healing. Tune in to be uplifted, challenged, and reminded that if you’re alive—your mission isn’t done yet.
Connect with Zulma Williams: Instagram: @theswearingtherapist Website: Dragonfly Therapy Services Podcast: Keeping It Real with Zulma the Swearing Therapist
Don’t forget: Subscribe, share, and leave a review to keep the community growing!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:42):
And welcome to another episode of Stuck in My Mind podcast. I
am your host wiz. And today's
guest is proof that it's never too late to rewrite your story.
Zuma Williams is a licensed therapist, trauma specialist, and
founder of Dragonfly Therapy Services. From surviving cancer
and toxic relationships to launching a career and mental health in her 50s,
(01:05):
she's a living testament to the warrior within. Let's
welcome someone who's turned pain into purpose and is helping others do
the same. Welcome to the show, Zulma Williams.
Thank you so much for having me. Such an honor. Oh, the pleasure
is mine. Thank you for being a great, for being a guest. I
appreciate it. Sure. So what was it like growing
(01:27):
up in Bueno in Buenos Aires? And what values did you, did your
upbringing instill in you? So I
was born and raised there in, you know,
family is so important. We tight
knit family extend. The neighbors are
your extended family, right?
(01:49):
Everybody's in everybody's homes. Everybody's in everybody's business.
And, and then I started
my, my parents got separated when I was
8. And that kind of like changed a
lot of the dynamic in the, in the family. My, my
(02:09):
siblings are, my brother is 10 years older and my
sister is seven years older than me. So I was kind of like the only
child with my mom at home. She was in a
state home mom. And, and it just like,
you know, the, the, you belong,
you, you are part of something, the community
(02:32):
that is, it was a big part of
growing up. And then I
started, you know, I have a job and, and I was
being outside of the home. And then at 31, I moved to
the United States. But it was
the socioeconomic situation in the country is still
(02:55):
to this day so many years later, so unstable.
So it's like you do rely on family
and friends because like you really cannot
do it alone. Right. And I was 31, still
living with my mom because I had lost my job. I didn't have a job
for like two years. And, and it's like, and you're 31, you don't
(03:17):
want to be living with your mom. But a roof is
a roof, right? Like so, so, so was the, the economic.
The socioeconomic situation, was that the. Reason
why you, you left Argentina and started fresh in the United states at age
31, correct? Because so I had
(03:38):
a, so I didn't have a job for two years at
this point. And the tragedy really
happened in my family. I had a cousin, I was
31, so he was probably 32 because he was a couple of months
Older than me. And he died of. He had a stroke
and died. And it was like everything came crashing down because
(04:00):
I, you know, at 30, you. You think you have your entire life in front
of you. I was like, okay, like, time to
start parking, right? Like, because it was such a wake up call
that he died so suddenly. And. And I was
like, okay, I think that this is my.
My sign to do what. What I want.
(04:24):
I. So moving to the United States was a
kind of like a dream of mine since I was a teenager. And I'm
like, oh, you know, whatever. And then later might never
come. And. And he's passing, kind of like,
I'm like, okay. I think that six months later, I
definitely move. And my therapist at the time, when
(04:46):
I told him, he was like, congratulations. I was like, the.
Is that coming from? But because I've been toying with the
idea and I finally made the decision. So
at the time, I took it as an adventure. I didn't have
anything. So when you have nothing, when you don't have
anything, you have nothing to lose because you don't have anything,
(05:09):
right? Like, so moving to the States was an adventure.
My mom gave me her blessing and she was like, if it doesn't
work out, you always have your home here. So it was like, okay,
like, let me see. What. What waits on the other side, right?
And. And it was so magical. I mean,
reality set up sitting really quick. But at the beginning,
(05:31):
it was December, so I stepped into a movie, you know
what I mean, with all the Christmas decorations, all the lights, all. We don't have
that. Not to mention that in Argentina we
have the opposite season. So it was summer over there and
I came to winter, right? And it's like all the decorations,
all the lighting, and. And so. And I'm like, oh, my God,
(05:53):
it's like in the movie. And then two weeks later,
reality set in. But those two weeks, you know, and.
And I was like, okay, what do you do? I
have to lose. I can. If it doesn't work
out, I can come back. Yeah.
Oh, here I am. Right? Like, so
(06:14):
it. I kind of, like, I made it work out, but
it was hard. It was very hard at the beginning. Like, I didn't speak
the language. I knew how to read and write
English because in high school in Argentina, I.
I Learned English for 6 years, but there were so many
students that we didn't have time to practice. So I
(06:37):
came here and I start. I remember I was
at Miami Airport was my point of entrance. Although I. I was
going all the Way to California. But it was a cheaper way
to come through that, right? Like, so. And again, because it
was an adventure. I flew for, like, 22 hours, and it was
like. And you can do it in 15, right? Like, was it. And
(07:00):
whatever. So I remember, like, landing in. In Miami,
and the guy is asking, and I'm like, in my
face is like, you know, like, I'm terrified because
I. I'm not understanding what he's saying. And he went like
that. And then he grabbed a piece of paper and was the
questions, like, do you have any. Did anybody give you something that you don't know
(07:22):
what it is? And what's your luggage with you the entire time? Right? Like,
so I was like, oh, no. Yes, you know, whatever. And I. And I
went on my. It was. And
then I started taking English as second language classes. And it was the
same thing because there was so many of us that we
couldn't practice to the
(07:44):
speaking part. Right? Like, so. And I was living in a Hispanic
neighborhood, and then I move into a more
white neighborhood. I learned really quick
because I was. I remember my first words were, like,
more slowly, please. Right? Because, like, people have a tendency to
speak very fast in their. In their first language. And I'm
(08:07):
like, I was working at a laundromat, the one that you
drop your clothes and you can't pick them up. I'm like, if. If
you don't slow down, you're gonna get the shirts how I want the starch,
right? Like, because it was like, light, medium,
or heavy starch. And. And I'm asking,
like, sir, you need to slow down. I don't understand
(08:30):
one word. And then being there, I think, like,
within. I would say within a month to six weeks,
I was speaking English because it's like, you have no
choice. Literally. I Like, so it was like, it
was a. Now when I look back, it was a wonderful experience, but
it was very traumatic the way that it happened. Right?
(08:56):
We all experience a lot of traumas. It's like, okay,
you know, I was working two blocks from the beach. I saw the
sunset every. Every day. Like, what the fuck? Are you complaining?
Right? So. So.
So you started your bachelor of social, social work program at
(09:17):
42. What gave you the courage to take the leap at a
stage when many are slowing down? So
I was working in accounting at that time, and.
And I was. I always had this thing
that people will come and tell me their stories, and they're like,
oh, I never told. Share this with anybody. And I'm
(09:39):
like, okay. And. And
I Have a passion for helping people. And I started thinking
about my future. I'm like, okay, do I want to be doing this for another
25 years? And. And I was like,
I'll. I think I. You know,
it's time for me to be a therapist officially.
(10:02):
So I was like, okay, what do I need to do? Okay, I need a
bachelor's and I need a master's. Then I need to do my internship.
So I started my bachelor's, but
I didn't quit my job because I still had to pay
bills and buy food, right? Like, so I. While
I was. So I was doing this in parallel, a lot of times
(10:25):
we are having this idea that in order to build something new, I have
to destroy what. What I have. And it's. It's not
like that. While I was creating a different
future, I was still living in the
present, in my present at that time.
So I graduated at
(10:47):
46. And then six weeks later, I was on track to do
my master's. And then six week late, six weeks later, I got
diagnosed with breast cancer. Life is what happens when you have
other plans, right? Like, so I took
a break, clearly, from higher education to take care of my health.
But then once I, you know, three years later,
(11:11):
I moved back to Argentina to be closer to my family, blah,
blah, blah. And then I'm like this. Like, I
had a cultural shock when I moved the United States.
And then I had a cultural shock when I moved back to
Argentina after being here for, like, about, I think, seven, 15,
17 years. It was like, oh, my God, you know, my
(11:34):
head was exploded. My friends were
like, you need to calm down. You're gonna. You're gonna have a heart attack. Because
I was like, no, this is wrong. And, you know, and. And.
But because I live in another culture, and I, like, I know
things can be done differently. So anyhow, I'm there,
and I'm like, okay, it's time for me to move back to the
(11:56):
States. I wanted to celebrate my 50th birthday here.
And. And I asked God for a sign.
Be careful what you asked for. So I asked God for a sign that
moving back was the right thing to do. And out of
nowhere, I get a message from the university to my
personal email saying, we have
(12:19):
the advanced master program back. Do you want to enroll?
Right? Like, so I asked for a sign. I got a banner, right? And I'm
like, okay. And I move. I celebrated my
50th birthday here. I started school. I graduated
51. The thing is that. So I
talk too Much. To answer your question, it was,
(12:42):
if social work doesn't work out for me, I can
always continue to do accounting.
But if I don't try it,
I don't want to be regretting this in my
death bed. Right? Like a lot of hospice patients,
I don't work with that population, but a lot of
(13:05):
hospice patients, their regret is that
they didn't try more when they were alive, right?
Like, so I was like, okay, what do
I have to lose if this doesn't work out? I gain an education.
I have a bachelor's degree. And if it.
But I never. I really never thought that it was not going to work
(13:28):
out. But just in case that it didn't work out, I'm bilingual in
Spanish. We need these services for our
Hispanic community. And it's like, okay.
And if. Okay, all that didn't work out,
my accounting knowledge didn't disappear from my
brain. So I kind of always do that, right? Like, so I
(13:50):
encourage people to step out of their comfort
zone because, okay, you tried something and it doesn't work.
You are back to where you. Where you began. Like, what the.
What do you have to lose? Right? Because I was gonna be
50 with a degree or without a degree. The time doesn't wait
for anybody. So how do you. How
(14:13):
do you want to use this time?
Right? And also for this profession,
I thought my age is
an asset. My life experience is an asset.
Because when I have a client who move here,
I'm an immigrant, too. So you don't have to tell me, right? Like,
(14:36):
we can connect on a different. A different level
than somebody who is just bilingual. But
that doesn't have the cultural part, right? Like, you
are Hispanic too. You know that women don't have a voice, right? Like, you
shut up. You see pretty. You pop babies and. Right?
And you cook and. And it's like, okay, I understand
(14:58):
that culture. And I. And I had kind of like a.
That was so clear to me because my therapist here is white.
And so, like, I. I'll be telling her whatever. Like, I
had an ex boyfriend from Argentina. And. And
I'll be telling her stuff. And she would be like, why?
I'm like, what you mean, why? Because that's part of the culture, right? Like,
(15:22):
I. Like, I. I didn't understand why she didn't understand.
Yeah. What she said or what she did or whatever. I'm like,
what you mean, why? Right? Like, that's the way that it is. He's
the man, right? Like, so to.
So being an older student, being an
(15:42):
older, like, transitioning into
this profession at an later
time, it, to me, is an asset because I
bring a lot of life experience to. To the
therapeutic relationship. So. But
the main thing was why not? A lot of
(16:05):
people say why? And I say, why not? Right? Like,
what do I have to lose if it doesn't work out? At least I tried
it. So what. What made you really
realize you wanted to help others professionally?
I said, this ex boyfriend, the Argentinian
(16:25):
one, he was verbally and emotionally abusive,
But I didn't know that. I was very depressed.
We were fighting all the time, and I was
suicidal. And I told my therapist, like, I don't
know, but I just don't want to leave anymore. And she's like, you are
being abused. And I was like, oh, no, no, you're mistaken.
(16:49):
He doesn't touch me. Because to me,
abuse was physical abuse. I beat you up and I sent you to the hospital,
right? Yeah. So. So I started learning about
emotional abuse and verbal abuse, and I was like, holy.
I consider myself an educated person and a
smart person, but I didn't know I was being abused. So
(17:13):
it was kind of like, I want to do this. I want to help
other women. I want to bring awareness into the community,
because if I don't know I'm being abused. How many
other women are taking this? Again, the cultural part,
right? Like, I'm from Argentina. He's from Argentina. This is what
we do. But not
(17:35):
necessarily, right? Like, it's like, to bring it a different light.
So I think that that was the
inspiration. Although it happened way before I started
school, it. I wanted to be her. She
helped me so much, and I was like, I.
I want to know if I'm able to help another
(17:58):
person the way that she helped me. Right? Because she.
Of course, when you do therapy, the
therapist is a guide. But I did the work. But to
me, she was helping me so much because I.
She was kind of like, directing this. All this energy that I had
(18:18):
in order to make it productive so
I can. I can do better, right? I can feel better,
and here I am. So is because of her
influence and how she literally saved
my life. I say therapy saved my life. Not
specifically her, but her help into.
(18:43):
Because I wanted him to change. Right? And
she said, well, that's not in your control, but if you
change, then the. The relationship cannot stay the same.
Yeah. And. And that. Right. That. That blew my mind.
So I was like, okay. So she said, what's gonna work on you? And then.
(19:04):
And then the relationship changed because I wasn't
the same person, so he couldn't continue
the abuse in the same manner that has been
happening. Because now I'm not taking it, right?
I'm not sitting there like, take it, take it, take it.
So to have this
(19:27):
gift and ability and opportunity to do it and
not take it, it's kind of like a crime to me, right? Like,
let's, let's do it. And, and if I get tired of
doing therapy, I can always go back to numbers. They are
black and white, right? It's like, so straightforward.
(19:48):
But I'm, I'm really passionate about
helping others find their own way, their
own questions. I, I, I barely know what
the to do with my own life. I'm not telling you what to do with
yours. But we are gonna find the answers together,
right? Yeah. So how,
(20:10):
how does your cultural background influence. Because
I know, I know how it is in the Hispanic community and
stuff. How has your cultural background influenced your views
on healing and resilience? Because it's something that
we're not. That's not something we discuss back
in our homes. It's not. Right. We keep
(20:32):
it right. It's like, oh, this in, in,
you know, God.
So my. So I was raised Catholic, and
although I'm not practicing actively practicing
anymore, I do believe in God. So when I got my diagnosis,
my first reaction was, why me?
(20:56):
But then I don't have children
myself, but at that time, my mom was alive. So then I
start reflecting. Well, I have my mom, and I have
a sister, and I have nieces, and I have
girlfriends. If it was not me, would I. Would I prefer that
it was one of them? And the answer was no.
(21:20):
So I changed the question
from why me? To why not me?
And then once I step out of
my victim mindset, right, it's like,
okay, so now I have a decision to make. I can sit there
(21:40):
waiting to die, or I can stand up and fight. Fight. Spoiler
alert. I chose a ladder, right? Here I am.
But the, to answer the question, the cultural
part was mainly the
God influence, right? Because it's so prevalent in our
(22:02):
culture. But also I had to
learn how to set boundaries because I. So
I moved there right after my diagnosis. I moved back there.
And then my brother was like, you do this, and we are going to do
that. And I'm like, okay, hold on. This is my life.
I'm 46 years old. I'm not a child.
(22:25):
So setting boundaries was hard
for them, not for me, because I was more Americanized
than Argentinian at this point. But I'm like,
I'm this is my diagnosis, this is my life, this is my body,
right? But because everybody wanted was in everybody's business.
(22:47):
So I'm like, I'm not like that. Like, when I moved back,
my brother was like, we are going to talk. You have to call every day
to check in. I'm like, sir, what the is wrong with you?
I'm not working. Like, I'm not calling nobody to.
There is no check in. Right? But because they were doing that,
I was not part of that because I was here, but
(23:10):
they were doing that. So
setting the boundaries, although it created a lot of friction at the
beginning, was paramount
in my recovery because otherwise I will have to be
every decision that I made. We had to be a
family decision, right? And I'm. And again, I'm a
(23:33):
grown ass adult. So
if for people who are listening and I'll. They are not so
Americanized that it's hard to set boundaries,
I want to say, like, it's okay that you
are making your own decisions because this is
your health, this is your life, this is your body,
(23:56):
right? I refuse chemotherapy at the
time. And the doctor in Argentina, she was like,
oh, if it was me, I will do it. Say, with all due respect,
doctor, it's not. Your body is mine. So when you
get the diagnosis, you make your own decisions, right?
And by all means, this is not medical advice in my
(24:18):
situation. I asked what is a. What are the.
The chances? And they were like 50, 50. I'm like, no,
you got to give me 8020. I'm not going to poison my entire body
just in case the one cancer cell got
missed. And no. So they came out with an
alternative treatment. Oh, see that there is
(24:40):
alternatives. Like, that's not the only thing.
But I. I do it, you know, going
back there from America, I'm like, I sign whatever the you want
me to sign. Like, you know, if you think that I'm gonna sue you if
the cancer comes back and making an informed decision.
So I will sign whatever paperwork you want me to sign. And they did.
(25:04):
I met with the attorneys for the hospital. I signed paperwork
like that I'm not gonna sue them if the cancer came back and all that.
But I noticed now that I'm telling you this, that I'm
saying it out loud. It was a lot of America in those things.
Because if I would have been
(25:24):
with the Hispanic mentality, I would have done
because I was not being heard. I'm telling the doctor,
I don't want to poison my entire body. She's like, well, I will do
it. Well, it's not you, it's me is my body.
So guess what? We ain't freaking doing it, right? Like, is there
another treatment? And I, and I risk being kicked out,
(25:48):
not being kicked out as a patient because I'm not following
hospital protocol. But I'm like,
no, like this. If I don't
defend my body, who will?
Right? And my boyfriend at the time, which was another.
(26:10):
No, no, the abusive one. Stay here. This is another.
I felt so betrayed by him because I had talked to him
prior to going. He went with me to that appointment
and I said, I don't want to do the chemo because
they are giving me 50 50. So we had all this conversation
(26:30):
at home. And then when the doctor
said, if he was me, I will do it,
he changed completely and
deferred to the doctor. So I felt so betrayed because
even my partner is not backing me up
(26:50):
in this because of the doctor's authority.
Yes, the doctor knows about cancer,
but this is my body, so we need to work together.
I don't know about cancer, but I know my body. You know
about cancer, but you don't know my body. So we need to work
(27:11):
as a team. But a lot of times we
defer to the authority, right? Like, oh, is the doctor. So if the
doctor says, I want to know why the fuck you are telling me
this. Is there another, an alternative
treatment? Or all of the sudden, because I refuse. They came up
with an alternative to oh, see, it can't.
(27:34):
It can be done in another way. Yeah,
but because we put our head down and we say,
yes, ma', am, yes sir, because it's a doctor
and maybe another patient wouldn't get
this opportunity, right? And I, and I
(27:55):
think that all that courage, if you would,
is because I was American, that, that was my American
part. Because I, I don't
know if I would have done it if
I was there the entire time, right? Like
so the family dynamics and, and you
(28:18):
know, everybody being in everybody's business is like,
I remove myself from that dynamic so I
can see it and I can set a boundary better than if
I'm in the, in the midst of that dynamic. But I'm like,
no, I'm a grown ass woman and I'm going to
(28:39):
make my own decisions again. Informed decisions,
right? It's not, oh, it's not because I don't want to lose my hair. It's
because you're poisoning my entire body and you don't even
give me if you're, oh, it's hit or Miss. Why don't
you poison your body for hidden or miss. And.
And we'll see. Right? Like, so it's like,
(29:02):
you know, so. You'Ve taken hits that would have knocked
people, most people out. But you, you. You didn't. You
just didn't survive. You built something from it. Let's talk about how you turned your
scars into a source of service. What inspired you
to launch Dragonfly Therapy Services, and why the
name? So
(29:25):
I want my motto after my diagnosis is I
had cancer. Cancer didn't have me. And
we can apply this to any challenge that anybody is confronting.
So I started doing internship that I became
independently licensed. And I'm telling I'm working in
community mental health, and I want to
(29:48):
help people who experience anxiety, depression, and
trauma. When you are an intern, you have to take whomever walks
through the door. But when you are independently licensed, you get a
little bit more choice. I was working in community mental
health, and I'm like, okay, I want to focus on anxiety,
depression, and trauma. I don't want to work with couples.
(30:10):
I don't want to work with personality disorders. Here comes a
couple. And they is put in my schedule because one
of them only speaks Spanish. And I'm like, how is my fucking
problem that I'm the only bilingual therapist that you have
hired other bilingual therapists? So I grew
tired of not being heard. So
(30:32):
I open my own practice, right? Because then I can
choose who the I work with, right? And
dragonfly, White dragonfly. Because dragonfly
symbolizes the change that comes from the
inside. Dragonflies fly over the surface
of the water and they eat all the bacteria so the light
(30:55):
can come in. So that's why dragonfly,
it's very symbolic to me.
So what types of clients do you work with and what makes you, your approach
to trauma therapy unique? I
work with highly motivated adults who experience
anxiety, depression and trauma. And
(31:18):
specifically for trauma, I use a technique that is called
accelerated resolution therapy, which is very, very
effective for traumatic events, for. For other things too.
But I use it. Use it mainly for trauma.
So when. When a traumatic event happens, your brain
creates a movie of that event. Let's say a car accident.
(31:40):
So a car accident happens,
then you start feeling anxious about driving. And
when you are approaching the intersection where the accident happened,
it's kind of like, oh, my God, I'm going to get hit again, right? Like,
so what this technique does, it uses
eye movements. I'll be guiding your eyes to follow my hand.
(32:02):
And then I'm guiding you into watching the movie
of the accident. Two times. And then
you get to replace the movie. You, you
make it that you were not there. You make it that the collision didn't happen.
However you want to change it. But hold on.
The movie I make, I'm creating is not real,
(32:26):
correct? But the movie of the accident is not
real in a sense of, like, the accident is not happening right now.
It happened when it happened, but the brain cannot tell the
difference. So out of this movie that is a horror
movie, and this movie that you created with a better
ending, which movie do you prefer? Right, like, so
(32:49):
when. When the brain creates a movie, it plays.
That is Channel three with a movie of the accident.
That's the only movie house. So does the only movie plays.
But now we are giving Channel 5 with a different
movie. You know that the movie is not real.
You know, what happened is not about denial, but
(33:12):
is to help you not get so trapped
about something that you cannot fucking change. The accident happened,
but you reliving it every time you go through the
intersection is not helping your
present your life right now. Right? Like, so it's kind of
like, okay, well, let's change the channel, like,
(33:35):
because neither one of this is real.
Okay, let me move. Watch the movie that I
created where, like, this didn't happen.
And I'm using a car accident as an example, but it can
be used for sexual abuse in childhood, for example,
where it's so empowering because in your new
(33:57):
movie, you can go as the adult that you
are now and rescue the earlier version of yourself.
So when you got abused and you were a kid, you couldn't stand up to
the perpetrator. But now as an adult,
you can protect the earlier version
of you, right? Like, so you, the. In the new movie,
(34:21):
you go in as the adult that you are now and you rescue
yourself, which is so empowering
because at the time that the abuse happened, you
couldn't have done that because you, you don't. You don't know how to
do that. But now it's like, okay, like, you're not gonna.
Right? Like, you. Because you will protect your children
(34:43):
from something like that happening. So you are
protect. You are rescuing the child
version of yourself, which is. Is so beautiful
to see because you see the transformation in
most of the time in one session, some, Some stuff
may take two or three, but in my experience,
(35:07):
after one session, you're good to go. So
in. In people get so surprised and excited
because it's, oh, like, I do feel better. So that now they want to.
They want to process more trauma, right? Because it's working. I'm like,
yep, bring it on. Let's start
changing the narrative. Because
(35:30):
when you. When I have a client with a traumatic event, to
me, it's an opportunity to have help.
So when you told me something traumatic that happened to you,
like, oh, I can help. If I sit there and I cry with
you, we're not going to get anywhere. I'll see it as an, oh, how
can I help you? Right. Like, I'll see it as an opportunity to help.
(35:53):
So I am very in tune with
this type of diagnosis in clients.
I don't know. I can connect with personality disorders
or with mood disorders like substance abuse.
Although substance abuse is so linked to
trauma, I want to work with a real version
(36:15):
of you. And if you are under the influence,
I don't know who you are. Right. Like, I mean, who is sitting here in
front of me? So. And that's why I
refer those situations to other people who
specialize in that. If you have heart issues, you're not going to go to the
gynecologist, you're going to go to the cardiologist. This
(36:39):
is the same. If you have substance abuse, what the are you
doing with me? Go to someone who
specializes in that and can help you better. I
want you to get better. It doesn't have to be with me. So
if I feel it's not a good fit, I will
refer you out. There is enough therapist to
(37:00):
treat all the things. It doesn't have to be
me. I don't know if they swear like I do, but,
you know, you cannot get everything, I guess.
So something you talk about a lot is honoring the warrior within.
(37:21):
What does that actually look like in daily life?
Let's say that you are currently facing a challenge, and
I will ask you to revisit
your own life. You have
confronted challenges before. How do I know? Because
(37:42):
you're an adult. How do I know that you made it? Because you're here.
So go just check back your own life
and you are gonna realize, like, you have a hundred percent
positive feel like outcome on overcoming
challenges. How do I know? Because you're here. So whatever the
(38:05):
fact you've been through could not take you out. Why is
this challenge different? You are gonna overcome
this one too. But we have a tendency to
forget because when we are in the middle of the
challenge, right? It's like, oh, my God, like, I don't. I don't know. I cannot.
I don't see the way out. I.
(38:26):
I encourage you to think about a particular challenge
in your past where you didn't see the way out either
at that time, but somewhat,
you kept pushing through one day at a time, and
you came on the other side. Why is this challenge different
than that? So I'm reminding you of your own power.
(38:50):
I don't even know. Need to know what your challenges were
I know you've been through simply because you are human,
right? So it's like, okay, look at your own life. I'm not a
Pollyanna. Oh, I believe in you. Like, no,
check your own life. Like, I don't. I don't even need to know if this
is your own record, right? Like, so in my
(39:13):
case, I use cancer as an example. Like, if I keep canceling the ass,
like, what can stop me? But I. Sometimes I
forget. I do get depressed about a current challenge,
and I'm like, wake up. Like, you keep
canceling the ass. Like, why is this overpowering
you right now? Right? Like, and I. And I forget
(39:37):
that, oh, yeah, I've been through. And at
that time, I didn't have all the answers either. We have,
like, this idea that, oh, when I have all the answers in front of me,
I'm gonna overcome this. No, you just need to
keep going through it, and you're gonna come out on the
other side. So finding your inner warrior
(40:00):
is that it's like remembering that you
already have done this. And I understand
that God doesn't give you more than you can handle, but
sometimes God confused some of us with Rambo. Right? Like,
like, good, let's sharing this theory. Let's give
to other people, right? Like, but it's
(40:22):
about remembering that you. You
have the power to overcome this too.
You've already changed so many lives, but I know you're far from done. Let's talk
about the next chapter. What's your
big vision for Dragonfly therapy services in the next three to five
(40:44):
years? I want to
be able to help more people right now.
License in Nevada. So in order to be a client for me, you have
to be in the state of Nevada physically.
But I want to expand. And
that's where the podcast come in. Because I wanted to be.
(41:09):
To get to know, to be known and
hopefully expand to provide services
to people independently of where they are in the world.
So, so does that include, like, digital resources, courses,
events? Yes, yes. And a book is
(41:29):
also on. On in the bucket list,
Right? The word. Like, I. I haven't started yet, but it's like, it's
something that I'm being called to do
because it's like, oh,
it's like, Yeah, I, I can. I. I do appreciate
the opportunity to share my story. And also, it's
(41:51):
like, oh, okay, maybe I can reach more people
if. When the book is
complete. Oh, I. It's funny because a few years
back, we self published my nephew's book, and,
And. And back then, I didn't think I would be a writer. I didn't think
of myself as creative and stuff like that. And
(42:14):
so. But in these two. In these past
few years, we've. I've written multiple books and I just
released a couple, so.
So, yeah, so it's just.
I would have never thought five years ago when I started this,
that I would have been doing the things, but it was just like
(42:36):
an natural progression. It's like,
all right, I started podcasting. I was not in media. I
was. That was not my career. But when I got into it,
I discovered my voice. I discovered that I had a voice and I discovered my
purpose. And what. And it was like, okay. Having these
(42:56):
conversations were beneficial to me because I was
still. I'm growing and learning every day. But then
I'm realizing that it's also impacting other people when people are sending me
messages like, oh, I had to hear this episode. Thank you. Or
in one case, it was a guest of mine that I had
not released the episode. I had kept it away for like a year, and I
(43:19):
didn't really. When I finally released it, the first, the person that
impacted the most was the person who did the episode with me because she was
going through some. Stuff and,
oh, my God, I love it. During the episode out, I
put a lot of. I've. Because me and her became. We've become friends and, and
we still communicate through messaging and all that because she's. She's in.
(43:41):
I think she's in New Zealand right now, but. Oh,
yeah, because she's actually. She's. She's Italian and she lives
in Italy and she's been traveling and. And so.
But when I released the episode, she was in a point in her life where
she was. She was doubting herself. She didn't. She like
(44:02):
the picture I used for the thumbnail. She was like, yo, that was. That's one
of my favorite pictures of myself. She says the description you
say about me and all the stuff you say about me. She says, I forgot
that person. I forgot who that person was. She's like, I've been going through all
this stuff, and it was like, there was a reason
that I held onto that episode for, like, for. For that long.
(44:23):
Because, like, a year later, she Needed the episode more than anything
else. So the fact that she was like, yo, thank you. I
was like, man, you just. This. This. This is doing something. That's the power
that you have. Right, Right.
It's funny you mentioned that, because I always say when you are in the
pic in the picture, you cannot see the picture. Right.
(44:45):
That goes. Although she recorded the episode, she forgot.
Yeah. Her. Her own power, her own internal
warrior. Right. Like, so by you publishing and
in. In doing what you did, it's like, oh,
yeah, okay. Yeah, I'm that person. Yes. I
remember her. Yeah. And that's how it went when she messaged me. She's
(45:09):
like, yo, I've forgotten who that person was. And. And by your
words and you using a picture that I love, that feels so beautiful, and
it reminded me kind of who I am. And so it was
like, okay, even though. And I apologize to you. Listen. But
she's like, I guess this is when it needed to happen. Like, this was the
(45:29):
time that this episode needed to be released because she needed it
at that time. Right? Right.
Absolutely. So what's one mindset
shift you believe that would world. The world needs to hear right now.
If you woke up today, that means
(45:51):
that your mission in life is not complete.
So keep putting one foot in front of the other,
one day at a time. If one day is too long, one hour
at a time. If one hour is too long, 15
minutes at a time, as far as you continue to put one foot
in front of the other, you are going to come on the other side
(46:13):
of this.
If someone's this. This thing feels like they're too late to change their
life, what. What would you say to them?
I would say you are. You're barking at the wrong tree. Okay,
I'm. I started my bachelor's at 42, my master's at 50.
English is not my first language. What's your excuse?
(46:36):
Okay, I'm not motivated.
Motivation is overrated.
Okay? You have done. You were not motivated to
do your entire life. So I like to change. Like
that day that you went to work, when you were dying, you
were not motivated. You did it when your kid needed
(46:57):
something and you were sick. You got up and you did
it right, and you were not motivated. So I like to
use the word discipline instead.
That you discipline enough to do it
right. Like, do you want it bad enough? If. If
anything, cancer came to show me how bad I wanted
(47:19):
to be a therapist because I could have given up at that point, and
nobody will have blamed me. Oh, my God, she had cancer. I'm
like, okay, let me get better, and then
I'm back. Right? And stronger. If you would.
So it's like,
it's never too late. Are you breathing?
(47:42):
Go and do it. Do you want to do that? I start podcasting
at 59. Hello.
Like, you know, what is it that you want to do? If.
If money was not an issue, what
would you do? That's where your passion is.
So without leaving your current situation, like, if you have a
(48:05):
job, don't quit your job to pursue your passion.
You're gonna die in two months because you need to
eat. So you need to be practical. But it
can be done. You don't need to destroy where you are in
order to build your future. So done now.
Well, I don't know how to. Whatever.
(48:29):
Learn everything. Like, now everything pop
out. YouTube. Like, you're gonna find it
casted on my office chair broke. I'm like, okay,
YouTube. Like, how do you pop? I didn't know how to pop. You just
had to pull it out. I didn't know that. YouTube told me.
Right? Like, so. And I replaced it. So, like,
(48:50):
just Google how to do
whatever, and you're gonna use chat GPT. Like,
what are the stuff. I want to do this. What are the steps? Right? Like
so. And start doing it. Yeah,
because you are gonna turn 50,
60, 70, 80
(49:13):
having tried that. Or without her or without that.
What if that works and. And you're a
lot happier? We always talk about the fear
of failure, but fear of success is very real.
What if I try this and it works out? Oh, I cannot be
(49:34):
complaining anymore. Huh? Right? Or at least not complaining about
this. So fear of. Of success
is a very real thing. Who am I to be doing better
than my. My family? Right? And it's
like, who are. Who are you to not
fulfill your purpose in life?
(49:57):
To dim your light so that other people wouldn't be uncomfortable?
What if your mission is to
show your family that this can be done? I left
Argentina. I'm paving the
way for my nieces and nephews so they know that
there are other things that can be pursued and tried.
(50:20):
Right? And. And again, if it doesn't work, you are back at
the square one. What the. Did you lose nothing?
So it's like, don't be afraid to learn new
things. And then if it doesn't work out, you are back
to square one. Like, what the. Did you lose
nothing? Because you have in your mind,
(50:43):
well, this isn't work. So you have information when you
try something, and that doesn't work. That's information
so you don't lose. You. You win either way. If it works out,
yay. And if it doesn't work out, you gather information
either way is winning. So, like,
(51:06):
okay, you learn how not how not to do whatever
the. So you try something different next time.
So there is never too late, you know when it's too late when you're
dead. Yeah.
So zoom on. Before we wrap up, this has been a great conversation. You're
gonna, you're gonna let the people know what's the best way to connect with you,
(51:29):
work with you, or share your message. So I'm gonna give you a solo screen.
And here you go. Okay. So
my Instagram is at the Sweating Therapist
and Dragonflytherapy
Services.net is a website. And also I
have my own show is called my own
(51:50):
podcast. It's called Keeping it real with Sulma the
swearing Therapist. Thank you.
And so if in case you. She's not saying sweating Therapist. She's saying
swearing Therapist. If anyone else.
I don't gotta go looking for the sweating therapist. I need y' all to go
(52:13):
look for the swearing. If you, you
know, she is the swearing.
Yes. Thank you. Thank you. You.
Zuma. Thank you so much for being such a great guest. Don't just leave yet,
(52:34):
though. Let me close out the show and. And we'll talk a little bit off
the air. But thank you so much for being such a great guest. Thank you
for having me. Such a pleasure. All
right, everybody. Oh, thank you so. Thank you.
Let's see. Let me. There you go. All right. All right,
everybody. If you vibed with today's episode,
(52:57):
don't just listen. Move. Follow today's guest, connect with their work and
take action on what hit home you already know. This is Stuck in my
mind podcast where stuck is a mindset, not a life sentence.
Subscribe, share and leave the Leave a review. Let's keep
elevating together until next time. Stay hungry, stay humble, and
stay real. Now your boy wise does it. Peace out.
(53:42):
Sa.
And welcome to another episode of Stuck in My Mind podcast. I
am your host wiz. And today's
guest is proof that it's never too late to rewrite your story.
Zuma Williams is a licensed therapist, trauma specialist, and
founder of Dragonfly Therapy Services. From surviving cancer
and toxic relationships to launching a career and mental health in her 50s,
(01:05):
she's a living testament to the warrior within. Let's
welcome someone who's turned pain into purpose and is helping others do
the same. Welcome to the show, Zulma Williams.
Thank you so much for having me. Such an honor. Oh, the pleasure
is mine. Thank you for being a great, for being a guest. I
appreciate it. Sure. So what was it like growing
(01:27):
up in Bueno in Buenos Aires? And what values did you, did your
upbringing instill in you? So I
was born and raised there in, you know,
family is so important. We tight
knit family extend. The neighbors are
your extended family, right?
(01:49):
Everybody's in everybody's homes. Everybody's in everybody's business.
And, and then I started
my, my parents got separated when I was
8. And that kind of like changed a
lot of the dynamic in the, in the family. My, my
(02:09):
siblings are, my brother is 10 years older and my
sister is seven years older than me. So I was kind of like the only
child with my mom at home. She was in a
state home mom. And, and it just like,
you know, the, the, you belong,
you, you are part of something, the community
(02:32):
that is, it was a big part of
growing up. And then I
started, you know, I have a job and, and I was
being outside of the home. And then at 31, I moved to
the United States. But it was
the socioeconomic situation in the country is still
(02:55):
to this day so many years later, so unstable.
So it's like you do rely on family
and friends because like you really cannot
do it alone. Right. And I was 31, still
living with my mom because I had lost my job. I didn't have a job
for like two years. And, and it's like, and you're 31, you don't
(03:17):
want to be living with your mom. But a roof is
a roof, right? Like so, so, so was the, the economic.
The socioeconomic situation, was that the. Reason
why you, you left Argentina and started fresh in the United states at age
31, correct? Because so I had
(03:38):
a, so I didn't have a job for two years at
this point. And the tragedy really
happened in my family. I had a cousin, I was
31, so he was probably 32 because he was a couple of months
Older than me. And he died of. He had a stroke
and died. And it was like everything came crashing down because
(04:00):
I, you know, at 30, you. You think you have your entire life in front
of you. I was like, okay, like, time to
start parking, right? Like, because it was such a wake up call
that he died so suddenly. And. And I was
like, okay, I think that this is my.
My sign to do what. What I want.
(04:24):
I. So moving to the United States was a
kind of like a dream of mine since I was a teenager. And I'm
like, oh, you know, whatever. And then later might never
come. And. And he's passing, kind of like,
I'm like, okay. I think that six months later, I
definitely move. And my therapist at the time, when
(04:46):
I told him, he was like, congratulations. I was like, the.
Is that coming from? But because I've been toying with the
idea and I finally made the decision. So
at the time, I took it as an adventure. I didn't have
anything. So when you have nothing, when you don't have
anything, you have nothing to lose because you don't have anything,
(05:09):
right? Like, so moving to the States was an adventure.
My mom gave me her blessing and she was like, if it doesn't
work out, you always have your home here. So it was like, okay,
like, let me see. What. What waits on the other side, right?
And. And it was so magical. I mean,
reality set up sitting really quick. But at the beginning,
(05:31):
it was December, so I stepped into a movie, you know
what I mean, with all the Christmas decorations, all the lights, all. We don't have
that. Not to mention that in Argentina we
have the opposite season. So it was summer over there and
I came to winter, right? And it's like all the decorations,
all the lighting, and. And so. And I'm like, oh, my God,
(05:53):
it's like in the movie. And then two weeks later,
reality set in. But those two weeks, you know, and.
And I was like, okay, what do you do? I
have to lose. I can. If it doesn't work
out, I can come back. Yeah.
Oh, here I am. Right? Like, so
(06:14):
it. I kind of, like, I made it work out, but
it was hard. It was very hard at the beginning. Like, I didn't speak
the language. I knew how to read and write
English because in high school in Argentina, I.
I Learned English for 6 years, but there were so many
students that we didn't have time to practice. So I
(06:37):
came here and I start. I remember I was
at Miami Airport was my point of entrance. Although I. I was
going all the Way to California. But it was a cheaper way
to come through that, right? Like, so. And again, because it
was an adventure. I flew for, like, 22 hours, and it was
like. And you can do it in 15, right? Like, was it. And
(07:00):
whatever. So I remember, like, landing in. In Miami,
and the guy is asking, and I'm like, in my
face is like, you know, like, I'm terrified because
I. I'm not understanding what he's saying. And he went like
that. And then he grabbed a piece of paper and was the
questions, like, do you have any. Did anybody give you something that you don't know
(07:22):
what it is? And what's your luggage with you the entire time? Right? Like,
so I was like, oh, no. Yes, you know, whatever. And I. And I
went on my. It was. And
then I started taking English as second language classes. And it was the
same thing because there was so many of us that we
couldn't practice to the
(07:44):
speaking part. Right? Like, so. And I was living in a Hispanic
neighborhood, and then I move into a more
white neighborhood. I learned really quick
because I was. I remember my first words were, like,
more slowly, please. Right? Because, like, people have a tendency to
speak very fast in their. In their first language. And I'm
(08:07):
like, I was working at a laundromat, the one that you
drop your clothes and you can't pick them up. I'm like, if. If
you don't slow down, you're gonna get the shirts how I want the starch,
right? Like, because it was like, light, medium,
or heavy starch. And. And I'm asking,
like, sir, you need to slow down. I don't understand
(08:30):
one word. And then being there, I think, like,
within. I would say within a month to six weeks,
I was speaking English because it's like, you have no
choice. Literally. I Like, so it was like, it
was a. Now when I look back, it was a wonderful experience, but
it was very traumatic the way that it happened. Right?
(08:56):
We all experience a lot of traumas. It's like, okay,
you know, I was working two blocks from the beach. I saw the
sunset every. Every day. Like, what the fuck? Are you complaining?
Right? So. So.
So you started your bachelor of social, social work program at
(09:17):
42. What gave you the courage to take the leap at a
stage when many are slowing down? So
I was working in accounting at that time, and.
And I was. I always had this thing
that people will come and tell me their stories, and they're like,
oh, I never told. Share this with anybody. And I'm
(09:39):
like, okay. And. And
I Have a passion for helping people. And I started thinking
about my future. I'm like, okay, do I want to be doing this for another
25 years? And. And I was like,
I'll. I think I. You know,
it's time for me to be a therapist officially.
(10:02):
So I was like, okay, what do I need to do? Okay, I need a
bachelor's and I need a master's. Then I need to do my internship.
So I started my bachelor's, but
I didn't quit my job because I still had to pay
bills and buy food, right? Like, so I. While
I was. So I was doing this in parallel, a lot of times
(10:25):
we are having this idea that in order to build something new, I have
to destroy what. What I have. And it's. It's not
like that. While I was creating a different
future, I was still living in the
present, in my present at that time.
So I graduated at
(10:47):
46. And then six weeks later, I was on track to do
my master's. And then six week late, six weeks later, I got
diagnosed with breast cancer. Life is what happens when you have
other plans, right? Like, so I took
a break, clearly, from higher education to take care of my health.
But then once I, you know, three years later,
(11:11):
I moved back to Argentina to be closer to my family, blah,
blah, blah. And then I'm like this. Like, I
had a cultural shock when I moved the United States.
And then I had a cultural shock when I moved back to
Argentina after being here for, like, about, I think, seven, 15,
17 years. It was like, oh, my God, you know, my
(11:34):
head was exploded. My friends were
like, you need to calm down. You're gonna. You're gonna have a heart attack. Because
I was like, no, this is wrong. And, you know, and. And.
But because I live in another culture, and I, like, I know
things can be done differently. So anyhow, I'm there,
and I'm like, okay, it's time for me to move back to the
(11:56):
States. I wanted to celebrate my 50th birthday here.
And. And I asked God for a sign.
Be careful what you asked for. So I asked God for a sign that
moving back was the right thing to do. And out of
nowhere, I get a message from the university to my
personal email saying, we have
(12:19):
the advanced master program back. Do you want to enroll?
Right? Like, so I asked for a sign. I got a banner, right? And I'm
like, okay. And I move. I celebrated my
50th birthday here. I started school. I graduated
51. The thing is that. So I
talk too Much. To answer your question, it was,
(12:42):
if social work doesn't work out for me, I can
always continue to do accounting.
But if I don't try it,
I don't want to be regretting this in my
death bed. Right? Like a lot of hospice patients,
I don't work with that population, but a lot of
(13:05):
hospice patients, their regret is that
they didn't try more when they were alive, right?
Like, so I was like, okay, what do
I have to lose if this doesn't work out? I gain an education.
I have a bachelor's degree. And if it.
But I never. I really never thought that it was not going to work
(13:28):
out. But just in case that it didn't work out, I'm bilingual in
Spanish. We need these services for our
Hispanic community. And it's like, okay.
And if. Okay, all that didn't work out,
my accounting knowledge didn't disappear from my
brain. So I kind of always do that, right? Like, so I
(13:50):
encourage people to step out of their comfort
zone because, okay, you tried something and it doesn't work.
You are back to where you. Where you began. Like, what the.
What do you have to lose? Right? Because I was gonna be
50 with a degree or without a degree. The time doesn't wait
for anybody. So how do you. How
(14:13):
do you want to use this time?
Right? And also for this profession,
I thought my age is
an asset. My life experience is an asset.
Because when I have a client who move here,
I'm an immigrant, too. So you don't have to tell me, right? Like,
(14:36):
we can connect on a different. A different level
than somebody who is just bilingual. But
that doesn't have the cultural part, right? Like, you
are Hispanic too. You know that women don't have a voice, right? Like, you
shut up. You see pretty. You pop babies and. Right?
And you cook and. And it's like, okay, I understand
(14:58):
that culture. And I. And I had kind of like a.
That was so clear to me because my therapist here is white.
And so, like, I. I'll be telling her whatever. Like, I
had an ex boyfriend from Argentina. And. And
I'll be telling her stuff. And she would be like, why?
I'm like, what you mean, why? Because that's part of the culture, right? Like,
(15:22):
I. Like, I. I didn't understand why she didn't understand.
Yeah. What she said or what she did or whatever. I'm like,
what you mean, why? Right? Like, that's the way that it is. He's
the man, right? Like, so to.
So being an older student, being an
(15:42):
older, like, transitioning into
this profession at an later
time, it, to me, is an asset because I
bring a lot of life experience to. To the
therapeutic relationship. So. But
the main thing was why not? A lot of
(16:05):
people say why? And I say, why not? Right? Like,
what do I have to lose if it doesn't work out? At least I tried
it. So what. What made you really
realize you wanted to help others professionally?
I said, this ex boyfriend, the Argentinian
(16:25):
one, he was verbally and emotionally abusive,
But I didn't know that. I was very depressed.
We were fighting all the time, and I was
suicidal. And I told my therapist, like, I don't
know, but I just don't want to leave anymore. And she's like, you are
being abused. And I was like, oh, no, no, you're mistaken.
(16:49):
He doesn't touch me. Because to me,
abuse was physical abuse. I beat you up and I sent you to the hospital,
right? Yeah. So. So I started learning about
emotional abuse and verbal abuse, and I was like, holy.
I consider myself an educated person and a
smart person, but I didn't know I was being abused. So
(17:13):
it was kind of like, I want to do this. I want to help
other women. I want to bring awareness into the community,
because if I don't know I'm being abused. How many
other women are taking this? Again, the cultural part,
right? Like, I'm from Argentina. He's from Argentina. This is what
we do. But not
(17:35):
necessarily, right? Like, it's like, to bring it a different light.
So I think that that was the
inspiration. Although it happened way before I started
school, it. I wanted to be her. She
helped me so much, and I was like, I.
I want to know if I'm able to help another
(17:58):
person the way that she helped me. Right? Because she.
Of course, when you do therapy, the
therapist is a guide. But I did the work. But to
me, she was helping me so much because I.
She was kind of like, directing this. All this energy that I had
(18:18):
in order to make it productive so
I can. I can do better, right? I can feel better,
and here I am. So is because of her
influence and how she literally saved
my life. I say therapy saved my life. Not
specifically her, but her help into.
(18:43):
Because I wanted him to change. Right? And
she said, well, that's not in your control, but if you
change, then the. The relationship cannot stay the same.
Yeah. And. And that. Right. That. That blew my mind.
So I was like, okay. So she said, what's gonna work on you? And then.
(19:04):
And then the relationship changed because I wasn't
the same person, so he couldn't continue
the abuse in the same manner that has been
happening. Because now I'm not taking it, right?
I'm not sitting there like, take it, take it, take it.
So to have this
(19:27):
gift and ability and opportunity to do it and
not take it, it's kind of like a crime to me, right? Like,
let's, let's do it. And, and if I get tired of
doing therapy, I can always go back to numbers. They are
black and white, right? It's like, so straightforward.
(19:48):
But I'm, I'm really passionate about
helping others find their own way, their
own questions. I, I, I barely know what
the to do with my own life. I'm not telling you what to do with
yours. But we are gonna find the answers together,
right? Yeah. So how,
(20:10):
how does your cultural background influence. Because
I know, I know how it is in the Hispanic community and
stuff. How has your cultural background influenced your views
on healing and resilience? Because it's something that
we're not. That's not something we discuss back
in our homes. It's not. Right. We keep
(20:32):
it right. It's like, oh, this in, in,
you know, God.
So my. So I was raised Catholic, and
although I'm not practicing actively practicing
anymore, I do believe in God. So when I got my diagnosis,
my first reaction was, why me?
(20:56):
But then I don't have children
myself, but at that time, my mom was alive. So then I
start reflecting. Well, I have my mom, and I have
a sister, and I have nieces, and I have
girlfriends. If it was not me, would I. Would I prefer that
it was one of them? And the answer was no.
(21:20):
So I changed the question
from why me? To why not me?
And then once I step out of
my victim mindset, right, it's like,
okay, so now I have a decision to make. I can sit there
(21:40):
waiting to die, or I can stand up and fight. Fight. Spoiler
alert. I chose a ladder, right? Here I am.
But the, to answer the question, the cultural
part was mainly the
God influence, right? Because it's so prevalent in our
(22:02):
culture. But also I had to
learn how to set boundaries because I. So
I moved there right after my diagnosis. I moved back there.
And then my brother was like, you do this, and we are going to do
that. And I'm like, okay, hold on. This is my life.
I'm 46 years old. I'm not a child.
(22:25):
So setting boundaries was hard
for them, not for me, because I was more Americanized
than Argentinian at this point. But I'm like,
I'm this is my diagnosis, this is my life, this is my body,
right? But because everybody wanted was in everybody's business.
(22:47):
So I'm like, I'm not like that. Like, when I moved back,
my brother was like, we are going to talk. You have to call every day
to check in. I'm like, sir, what the is wrong with you?
I'm not working. Like, I'm not calling nobody to.
There is no check in. Right? But because they were doing that,
I was not part of that because I was here, but
(23:10):
they were doing that. So
setting the boundaries, although it created a lot of friction at the
beginning, was paramount
in my recovery because otherwise I will have to be
every decision that I made. We had to be a
family decision, right? And I'm. And again, I'm a
(23:33):
grown ass adult. So
if for people who are listening and I'll. They are not so
Americanized that it's hard to set boundaries,
I want to say, like, it's okay that you
are making your own decisions because this is
your health, this is your life, this is your body,
(23:56):
right? I refuse chemotherapy at the
time. And the doctor in Argentina, she was like,
oh, if it was me, I will do it. Say, with all due respect,
doctor, it's not. Your body is mine. So when you
get the diagnosis, you make your own decisions, right?
And by all means, this is not medical advice in my
(24:18):
situation. I asked what is a. What are the.
The chances? And they were like 50, 50. I'm like, no,
you got to give me 8020. I'm not going to poison my entire body
just in case the one cancer cell got
missed. And no. So they came out with an
alternative treatment. Oh, see that there is
(24:40):
alternatives. Like, that's not the only thing.
But I. I do it, you know, going
back there from America, I'm like, I sign whatever the you want
me to sign. Like, you know, if you think that I'm gonna sue you if
the cancer comes back and making an informed decision.
So I will sign whatever paperwork you want me to sign. And they did.
(25:04):
I met with the attorneys for the hospital. I signed paperwork
like that I'm not gonna sue them if the cancer came back and all that.
But I noticed now that I'm telling you this, that I'm
saying it out loud. It was a lot of America in those things.
Because if I would have been
(25:24):
with the Hispanic mentality, I would have done
because I was not being heard. I'm telling the doctor,
I don't want to poison my entire body. She's like, well, I will do
it. Well, it's not you, it's me is my body.
So guess what? We ain't freaking doing it, right? Like, is there
another treatment? And I, and I risk being kicked out,
(25:48):
not being kicked out as a patient because I'm not following
hospital protocol. But I'm like,
no, like this. If I don't
defend my body, who will?
Right? And my boyfriend at the time, which was another.
(26:10):
No, no, the abusive one. Stay here. This is another.
I felt so betrayed by him because I had talked to him
prior to going. He went with me to that appointment
and I said, I don't want to do the chemo because
they are giving me 50 50. So we had all this conversation
(26:30):
at home. And then when the doctor
said, if he was me, I will do it,
he changed completely and
deferred to the doctor. So I felt so betrayed because
even my partner is not backing me up
(26:50):
in this because of the doctor's authority.
Yes, the doctor knows about cancer,
but this is my body, so we need to work together.
I don't know about cancer, but I know my body. You know
about cancer, but you don't know my body. So we need to work
(27:11):
as a team. But a lot of times we
defer to the authority, right? Like, oh, is the doctor. So if the
doctor says, I want to know why the fuck you are telling me
this. Is there another, an alternative
treatment? Or all of the sudden, because I refuse. They came up
with an alternative to oh, see, it can't.
(27:34):
It can be done in another way. Yeah,
but because we put our head down and we say,
yes, ma', am, yes sir, because it's a doctor
and maybe another patient wouldn't get
this opportunity, right? And I, and I
(27:55):
think that all that courage, if you would,
is because I was American, that, that was my American
part. Because I, I don't
know if I would have done it if
I was there the entire time, right? Like
so the family dynamics and, and you
(28:18):
know, everybody being in everybody's business is like,
I remove myself from that dynamic so I
can see it and I can set a boundary better than if
I'm in the, in the midst of that dynamic. But I'm like,
no, I'm a grown ass woman and I'm going to
(28:39):
make my own decisions again. Informed decisions,
right? It's not, oh, it's not because I don't want to lose my hair. It's
because you're poisoning my entire body and you don't even
give me if you're, oh, it's hit or Miss. Why don't
you poison your body for hidden or miss. And.
And we'll see. Right? Like, so it's like,
(29:02):
you know, so. You'Ve taken hits that would have knocked
people, most people out. But you, you. You didn't. You
just didn't survive. You built something from it. Let's talk about how you turned your
scars into a source of service. What inspired you
to launch Dragonfly Therapy Services, and why the
name? So
(29:25):
I want my motto after my diagnosis is I
had cancer. Cancer didn't have me. And
we can apply this to any challenge that anybody is confronting.
So I started doing internship that I became
independently licensed. And I'm telling I'm working in
community mental health, and I want to
(29:48):
help people who experience anxiety, depression, and
trauma. When you are an intern, you have to take whomever walks
through the door. But when you are independently licensed, you get a
little bit more choice. I was working in community mental
health, and I'm like, okay, I want to focus on anxiety,
depression, and trauma. I don't want to work with couples.
(30:10):
I don't want to work with personality disorders. Here comes a
couple. And they is put in my schedule because one
of them only speaks Spanish. And I'm like, how is my fucking
problem that I'm the only bilingual therapist that you have
hired other bilingual therapists? So I grew
tired of not being heard. So
(30:32):
I open my own practice, right? Because then I can
choose who the I work with, right? And
dragonfly, White dragonfly. Because dragonfly
symbolizes the change that comes from the
inside. Dragonflies fly over the surface
of the water and they eat all the bacteria so the light
(30:55):
can come in. So that's why dragonfly,
it's very symbolic to me.
So what types of clients do you work with and what makes you, your approach
to trauma therapy unique? I
work with highly motivated adults who experience
anxiety, depression and trauma. And
(31:18):
specifically for trauma, I use a technique that is called
accelerated resolution therapy, which is very, very
effective for traumatic events, for. For other things too.
But I use it. Use it mainly for trauma.
So when. When a traumatic event happens, your brain
creates a movie of that event. Let's say a car accident.
(31:40):
So a car accident happens,
then you start feeling anxious about driving. And
when you are approaching the intersection where the accident happened,
it's kind of like, oh, my God, I'm going to get hit again, right? Like,
so what this technique does, it uses
eye movements. I'll be guiding your eyes to follow my hand.
(32:02):
And then I'm guiding you into watching the movie
of the accident. Two times. And then
you get to replace the movie. You, you
make it that you were not there. You make it that the collision didn't happen.
However you want to change it. But hold on.
The movie I make, I'm creating is not real,
(32:26):
correct? But the movie of the accident is not
real in a sense of, like, the accident is not happening right now.
It happened when it happened, but the brain cannot tell the
difference. So out of this movie that is a horror
movie, and this movie that you created with a better
ending, which movie do you prefer? Right, like, so
(32:49):
when. When the brain creates a movie, it plays.
That is Channel three with a movie of the accident.
That's the only movie house. So does the only movie plays.
But now we are giving Channel 5 with a different
movie. You know that the movie is not real.
You know, what happened is not about denial, but
(33:12):
is to help you not get so trapped
about something that you cannot fucking change. The accident happened,
but you reliving it every time you go through the
intersection is not helping your
present your life right now. Right? Like, so it's kind of
like, okay, well, let's change the channel, like,
(33:35):
because neither one of this is real.
Okay, let me move. Watch the movie that I
created where, like, this didn't happen.
And I'm using a car accident as an example, but it can
be used for sexual abuse in childhood, for example,
where it's so empowering because in your new
(33:57):
movie, you can go as the adult that you
are now and rescue the earlier version of yourself.
So when you got abused and you were a kid, you couldn't stand up to
the perpetrator. But now as an adult,
you can protect the earlier version
of you, right? Like, so you, the. In the new movie,
(34:21):
you go in as the adult that you are now and you rescue
yourself, which is so empowering
because at the time that the abuse happened, you
couldn't have done that because you, you don't. You don't know how to
do that. But now it's like, okay, like, you're not gonna.
Right? Like, you. Because you will protect your children
(34:43):
from something like that happening. So you are
protect. You are rescuing the child
version of yourself, which is. Is so beautiful
to see because you see the transformation in
most of the time in one session, some, Some stuff
may take two or three, but in my experience,
(35:07):
after one session, you're good to go. So
in. In people get so surprised and excited
because it's, oh, like, I do feel better. So that now they want to.
They want to process more trauma, right? Because it's working. I'm like,
yep, bring it on. Let's start
changing the narrative. Because
(35:30):
when you. When I have a client with a traumatic event, to
me, it's an opportunity to have help.
So when you told me something traumatic that happened to you,
like, oh, I can help. If I sit there and I cry with
you, we're not going to get anywhere. I'll see it as an, oh, how
can I help you? Right. Like, I'll see it as an opportunity to help.
(35:53):
So I am very in tune with
this type of diagnosis in clients.
I don't know. I can connect with personality disorders
or with mood disorders like substance abuse.
Although substance abuse is so linked to
trauma, I want to work with a real version
(36:15):
of you. And if you are under the influence,
I don't know who you are. Right. Like, I mean, who is sitting here in
front of me? So. And that's why I
refer those situations to other people who
specialize in that. If you have heart issues, you're not going to go to the
gynecologist, you're going to go to the cardiologist. This
(36:39):
is the same. If you have substance abuse, what the are you
doing with me? Go to someone who
specializes in that and can help you better. I
want you to get better. It doesn't have to be with me. So
if I feel it's not a good fit, I will
refer you out. There is enough therapist to
(37:00):
treat all the things. It doesn't have to be
me. I don't know if they swear like I do, but,
you know, you cannot get everything, I guess.
So something you talk about a lot is honoring the warrior within.
(37:21):
What does that actually look like in daily life?
Let's say that you are currently facing a challenge, and
I will ask you to revisit
your own life. You have
confronted challenges before. How do I know? Because
(37:42):
you're an adult. How do I know that you made it? Because you're here.
So go just check back your own life
and you are gonna realize, like, you have a hundred percent
positive feel like outcome on overcoming
challenges. How do I know? Because you're here. So whatever the
(38:05):
fact you've been through could not take you out. Why is
this challenge different? You are gonna overcome
this one too. But we have a tendency to
forget because when we are in the middle of the
challenge, right? It's like, oh, my God, like, I don't. I don't know. I cannot.
I don't see the way out. I.
(38:26):
I encourage you to think about a particular challenge
in your past where you didn't see the way out either
at that time, but somewhat,
you kept pushing through one day at a time, and
you came on the other side. Why is this challenge different
than that? So I'm reminding you of your own power.
(38:50):
I don't even know. Need to know what your challenges were
I know you've been through simply because you are human,
right? So it's like, okay, look at your own life. I'm not a
Pollyanna. Oh, I believe in you. Like, no,
check your own life. Like, I don't. I don't even need to know if this
is your own record, right? Like, so in my
(39:13):
case, I use cancer as an example. Like, if I keep canceling the ass,
like, what can stop me? But I. Sometimes I
forget. I do get depressed about a current challenge,
and I'm like, wake up. Like, you keep
canceling the ass. Like, why is this overpowering
you right now? Right? Like, and I. And I forget
(39:37):
that, oh, yeah, I've been through. And at
that time, I didn't have all the answers either. We have,
like, this idea that, oh, when I have all the answers in front of me,
I'm gonna overcome this. No, you just need to
keep going through it, and you're gonna come out on the
other side. So finding your inner warrior
(40:00):
is that it's like remembering that you
already have done this. And I understand
that God doesn't give you more than you can handle, but
sometimes God confused some of us with Rambo. Right? Like,
like, good, let's sharing this theory. Let's give
to other people, right? Like, but it's
(40:22):
about remembering that you. You
have the power to overcome this too.
You've already changed so many lives, but I know you're far from done. Let's talk
about the next chapter. What's your
big vision for Dragonfly therapy services in the next three to five
(40:44):
years? I want to
be able to help more people right now.
License in Nevada. So in order to be a client for me, you have
to be in the state of Nevada physically.
But I want to expand. And
that's where the podcast come in. Because I wanted to be.
(41:09):
To get to know, to be known and
hopefully expand to provide services
to people independently of where they are in the world.
So, so does that include, like, digital resources, courses,
events? Yes, yes. And a book is
(41:29):
also on. On in the bucket list,
Right? The word. Like, I. I haven't started yet, but it's like, it's
something that I'm being called to do
because it's like, oh,
it's like, Yeah, I, I can. I. I do appreciate
the opportunity to share my story. And also, it's
(41:51):
like, oh, okay, maybe I can reach more people
if. When the book is
complete. Oh, I. It's funny because a few years
back, we self published my nephew's book, and,
And. And back then, I didn't think I would be a writer. I didn't think
of myself as creative and stuff like that. And
(42:14):
so. But in these two. In these past
few years, we've. I've written multiple books and I just
released a couple, so.
So, yeah, so it's just.
I would have never thought five years ago when I started this,
that I would have been doing the things, but it was just like
(42:36):
an natural progression. It's like,
all right, I started podcasting. I was not in media. I
was. That was not my career. But when I got into it,
I discovered my voice. I discovered that I had a voice and I discovered my
purpose. And what. And it was like, okay. Having these
(42:56):
conversations were beneficial to me because I was
still. I'm growing and learning every day. But then
I'm realizing that it's also impacting other people when people are sending me
messages like, oh, I had to hear this episode. Thank you. Or
in one case, it was a guest of mine that I had
not released the episode. I had kept it away for like a year, and I
(43:19):
didn't really. When I finally released it, the first, the person that
impacted the most was the person who did the episode with me because she was
going through some. Stuff and,
oh, my God, I love it. During the episode out, I
put a lot of. I've. Because me and her became. We've become friends and, and
we still communicate through messaging and all that because she's. She's in.
(43:41):
I think she's in New Zealand right now, but. Oh,
yeah, because she's actually. She's. She's Italian and she lives
in Italy and she's been traveling and. And so.
But when I released the episode, she was in a point in her life where
she was. She was doubting herself. She didn't. She like
(44:02):
the picture I used for the thumbnail. She was like, yo, that was. That's one
of my favorite pictures of myself. She says the description you
say about me and all the stuff you say about me. She says, I forgot
that person. I forgot who that person was. She's like, I've been going through all
this stuff, and it was like, there was a reason
that I held onto that episode for, like, for. For that long.
(44:23):
Because, like, a year later, she Needed the episode more than anything
else. So the fact that she was like, yo, thank you. I
was like, man, you just. This. This. This is doing something. That's the power
that you have. Right, Right.
It's funny you mentioned that, because I always say when you are in the
pic in the picture, you cannot see the picture. Right.
(44:45):
That goes. Although she recorded the episode, she forgot.
Yeah. Her. Her own power, her own internal
warrior. Right. Like, so by you publishing and
in. In doing what you did, it's like, oh,
yeah, okay. Yeah, I'm that person. Yes. I
remember her. Yeah. And that's how it went when she messaged me. She's
(45:09):
like, yo, I've forgotten who that person was. And. And by your
words and you using a picture that I love, that feels so beautiful, and
it reminded me kind of who I am. And so it was
like, okay, even though. And I apologize to you. Listen. But
she's like, I guess this is when it needed to happen. Like, this was the
(45:29):
time that this episode needed to be released because she needed it
at that time. Right? Right.
Absolutely. So what's one mindset
shift you believe that would world. The world needs to hear right now.
If you woke up today, that means
(45:51):
that your mission in life is not complete.
So keep putting one foot in front of the other,
one day at a time. If one day is too long, one hour
at a time. If one hour is too long, 15
minutes at a time, as far as you continue to put one foot
in front of the other, you are going to come on the other side
(46:13):
of this.
If someone's this. This thing feels like they're too late to change their
life, what. What would you say to them?
I would say you are. You're barking at the wrong tree. Okay,
I'm. I started my bachelor's at 42, my master's at 50.
English is not my first language. What's your excuse?
(46:36):
Okay, I'm not motivated.
Motivation is overrated.
Okay? You have done. You were not motivated to
do your entire life. So I like to change. Like
that day that you went to work, when you were dying, you
were not motivated. You did it when your kid needed
(46:57):
something and you were sick. You got up and you did
it right, and you were not motivated. So I like to
use the word discipline instead.
That you discipline enough to do it
right. Like, do you want it bad enough? If. If
anything, cancer came to show me how bad I wanted
(47:19):
to be a therapist because I could have given up at that point, and
nobody will have blamed me. Oh, my God, she had cancer. I'm
like, okay, let me get better, and then
I'm back. Right? And stronger. If you would.
So it's like,
it's never too late. Are you breathing?
(47:42):
Go and do it. Do you want to do that? I start podcasting
at 59. Hello.
Like, you know, what is it that you want to do? If.
If money was not an issue, what
would you do? That's where your passion is.
So without leaving your current situation, like, if you have a
(48:05):
job, don't quit your job to pursue your passion.
You're gonna die in two months because you need to
eat. So you need to be practical. But it
can be done. You don't need to destroy where you are in
order to build your future. So done now.
Well, I don't know how to. Whatever.
(48:29):
Learn everything. Like, now everything pop
out. YouTube. Like, you're gonna find it
casted on my office chair broke. I'm like, okay,
YouTube. Like, how do you pop? I didn't know how to pop. You just
had to pull it out. I didn't know that. YouTube told me.
Right? Like, so. And I replaced it. So, like,
(48:50):
just Google how to do
whatever, and you're gonna use chat GPT. Like,
what are the stuff. I want to do this. What are the steps? Right? Like
so. And start doing it. Yeah,
because you are gonna turn 50,
60, 70, 80
(49:13):
having tried that. Or without her or without that.
What if that works and. And you're a
lot happier? We always talk about the fear
of failure, but fear of success is very real.
What if I try this and it works out? Oh, I cannot be
(49:34):
complaining anymore. Huh? Right? Or at least not complaining about
this. So fear of. Of success
is a very real thing. Who am I to be doing better
than my. My family? Right? And it's
like, who are. Who are you to not
fulfill your purpose in life?
(49:57):
To dim your light so that other people wouldn't be uncomfortable?
What if your mission is to
show your family that this can be done? I left
Argentina. I'm paving the
way for my nieces and nephews so they know that
there are other things that can be pursued and tried.
(50:20):
Right? And. And again, if it doesn't work, you are back at
the square one. What the. Did you lose nothing?
So it's like, don't be afraid to learn new
things. And then if it doesn't work out, you are back
to square one. Like, what the. Did you lose
nothing? Because you have in your mind,
(50:43):
well, this isn't work. So you have information when you
try something, and that doesn't work. That's information
so you don't lose. You. You win either way. If it works out,
yay. And if it doesn't work out, you gather information
either way is winning. So, like,
(51:06):
okay, you learn how not how not to do whatever
the. So you try something different next time.
So there is never too late, you know when it's too late when you're
dead. Yeah.
So zoom on. Before we wrap up, this has been a great conversation. You're
gonna, you're gonna let the people know what's the best way to connect with you,
(51:29):
work with you, or share your message. So I'm gonna give you a solo screen.
And here you go. Okay. So
my Instagram is at the Sweating Therapist
and Dragonflytherapy
Services.net is a website. And also I
have my own show is called my own
(51:50):
podcast. It's called Keeping it real with Sulma the
swearing Therapist. Thank you.
And so if in case you. She's not saying sweating Therapist. She's saying
swearing Therapist. If anyone else.
I don't gotta go looking for the sweating therapist. I need y' all to go
(52:13):
look for the swearing. If you, you
know, she is the swearing.
Yes. Thank you. Thank you. You.
Zuma. Thank you so much for being such a great guest. Don't just leave yet,
(52:34):
though. Let me close out the show and. And we'll talk a little bit off
the air. But thank you so much for being such a great guest. Thank you
for having me. Such a pleasure. All
right, everybody. Oh, thank you so. Thank you.
Let's see. Let me. There you go. All right. All right,
everybody. If you vibed with today's episode,
(52:57):
don't just listen. Move. Follow today's guest, connect with their work and
take action on what hit home you already know. This is Stuck in my
mind podcast where stuck is a mindset, not a life sentence.
Subscribe, share and leave the Leave a review. Let's keep
elevating together until next time. Stay hungry, stay humble, and
stay real. Now your boy wise does it. Peace out.
(53:42):
Sa.
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