In this episode, I sit down with South African-born athlete, coach, and entrepreneur Natasha van der Merwe—a woman whose life has spanned pro tennis, professional triathlon, coaching at the highest level, and now leading a 23-coach organization at NVDM Coaching.
We go deep into the stories behind her leadership, her faith, and the experiences that shaped her—including losing her father at 15, navigating the pressures of elite sport, rebuilding her confidence through motherhood, and learning to show vulnerability without losing strength.
Natasha opens up about what it means to steward a calling, how she balances ambition with faith, why relationships are the core of great coaching, and the challenges of raising a daughter while running a rapidly expanding business.
This conversation is layered, emotional, and rich with perspective—from identity and grief, to entrepreneurship, to parenting and the future of triathlon. Whether you're an athlete, a leader, a parent, or someone figuring out who you’re becoming, Natasha’s story will leave you thinking long after it's over.
Natasha’s IG: https://www.instagram.com/natashavdm81/
NVDM Coaching IG: https://www.instagram.com/nvdmcoaching/
Support the Pod: https://stupidquestions.show/pages/sq-merch
Newsletter: https://stupidquestions.show/pages/newsletter-signup
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
How's it going everyone? And welcome back to another
edition of the Stupid Questions podcast.
My name is Seth and today on thepod, we're going to be talking
with Natasha van der Marva. She is a South African born
professional athlete in several respects.
She has a history in being a protennis player, a pro triathlete,
pro tennis coach and triathlete coach.
She has a business called NVDM Coaching.
(00:21):
I would be shocked if you haven't heard of it yet.
I'll make sure to link that in the show notes.
So make sure to go check it out.And she's also involved with Ron
Durance, I believe, as the director of Endurance.
And I'm sure you guys have seen that brand around here the past
couple of years as well. So Natasha is an amazing person.
She's a mother, she is obviouslyan athletic person,
entrepreneur, so many things we have in common and really
(00:43):
appreciated getting the opportunity to dive in deep with
her and learning how much we truly did have in common.
I don't know if I said that fiveTimes Now, but if I have, so
sorry. But thank you guys so much for
being here. Check out the show notes if you
want to get connected with her and her team, if you're looking
for coaching services in any way.
And yeah, check out the show notes for otherwise you can get
involved with supporting this podcast.
(01:04):
If you are listening anywhere that does review allows you to
leave comments, turn on notification bells, subscribe,
follow all the things. Please make sure to do that
continues to help to grow this little old podcast.
So thank you guys so much for being here.
Yeah, really appreciate it. And without further ado, want to
introduce you to Natasha Vandemurva.
(01:25):
Well, Natasha, thank you so muchfor making the time.
I know I've been after you for awhile and you have so graciously
made some time in your schedule for me, so I really appreciate
it. Thank you for being on.
Thank you for being patient withme.
Yeah, this is like a year and a half in the making or something.
It's all good. No, I appreciate it that the
ones that mean the most are onesthat I have to kind of fight for
(01:45):
a little bit. So high expectations and looking
forward to it, but yeah, I do. Really appreciate you no looking
forward to it as well. Yeah.
So you're home right now. I am, yeah.
So my office is in my house. I usually move around a little
bit depending on my mood for theday.
And every morning again, I'll goout to a coffee shop or work at
the gym, but just kind of depends on where my rhythm is
(02:07):
right now. Getting a lot done at home and a
lot of planning for next year. And so, yeah, just trying to
knock it out. Yeah, that's always been a big,
like something I don't understand about myself is like
you're talking about the rhythm,like, oh, today I feel like I
could work in my living room today.
It needs to be a coffee shop. Like what?
What do you think? Have you figured out why that is
(02:28):
what the rhythm determination factor is?
Yeah, just, you know, I'm looking for productivity, right?
And so sometimes at home, I'm just distracted with other
little things and in that I needto go out.
But then sometimes you're out and you need the things you need
at home. You have yet some files that you
(02:50):
need to access for contracts or whatever.
And then as it depends in the house, it's really just like, I
think it's a lighting thing. You know, I have my office and I
can open up the blinds and stufflike that and get some light in.
But then it's so nice I open up the door there and actually get
some air in. And so I think it's just like,
what do I, what do I need at themoment?
But yeah, at the end of the day,I'm fighting for how can I make
(03:12):
the most of every single minute I'm I'm spending working with
that goal of getting a lot done in as little time as possible so
that I have been more time for family relationships, etcetera.
So I'm continuously adapting my workflow for what works and it's
every year it changes where I understand myself and I have
(03:34):
different pockets of time for different things because I get
most out of myself in those things.
So you know what's from that? Your desire for productivity, is
that something that has been a through line for your entire
life or is that something you have developed and and shaped
over time? Yeah, I mean, I've definitely
shaped that over time. I think an element for sure has
(03:55):
been part of my life. I don't think I'd be where I am
today if there wasn't there fromthe beginning.
But in how much I have to handle.
If you had asked me a couple years ago what I'm doing today,
if that was even possible, I would say no way.
Like really too much. Yeah, that's too much.
And so but all these things keptpresenting themselves in front
of me and I was like, I can do that.
(04:16):
I can do that. And so, yeah, in that I'm just
always working on better time and management in order to do
it. And sure enough, I do, because I
think in the past, like the thought of something would be
like, wow, that's a lot. And then I recognized that no,
you just got to do it. And as soon as I started doing
it, I'm like, well, that's totally doable.
(04:36):
And then you do the next thing and the next thing.
And so I still think I could do more, to be honest.
I'm always, yeah, I'm in a good spot right now.
It's just whether I want to or not.
I kind of like I'm. Fighting that so So what are the
what are the big buckets like when you think about, OK, these
are the things that I'm working on even in the short term, I
(04:57):
guess even partially long term, but what are the big buckets of
things that you are like spending time and obviously
coaching? What are the?
Other things, yeah. So I'd say the one what takes my
time at work wise is coaching and my athletes specifically.
And so that's broken up between their training plans, feedback
and assessment of their workoutsand then actually interaction
(05:20):
with the athletes. So that's one.
Then the other is management of the business and everything that
that is entailed. And I have a staff, you know of
people that today we've had multiple meetings.
So making sure we're all connecting and what are we doing
and what what's ahead that we need to prepare for.
And so it's that side of the business.
(05:43):
Yeah, outside of those meetings,it's planning.
You know, I do a lot on the backend for the business, for the
coaches. So there's a lot of like right
now. I'll give you an example.
I'm going in and cleaning up my libraries of training peaks.
I've got hundreds workouts. Workouts.
Yeah, and. I'm going into every bucket and
making it a lot more accessible,making sure there's no
(06:05):
repetitive workouts and and that's 10 hours I've spent on
that right now. And then I also do like some
mock planning. And so I go through all of that
and each one of those plans thatI've created has taken me days,
but I go in and I make small adjustments based on what I've
learned of like, oh, I shouldn'thave done that.
And so I do that refresh every year.
(06:25):
That's a lot of hours. And then outside of that, I work
for raw nutrition. And so we had a meeting today
connecting, what are we working on?
What are we planning on? OK, from there, here are my to
do's. And so I'm going to list out
those to do's. I'm going to make emails, make
those phone calls, and then yeah, other relationships with
sponsors, events, stuff like that, coordinating with them.
(06:51):
Yeah, those are my work buckets right now.
So when you come to the end of your day, what makes you feel
like, OK, today was a successfulday?
I did well, I did good. Yeah, there's definitely like I
have a endless To Do List and I always highlight the key to do's
that I need to do. And it's usually just three to
five things. I have to do those things today
(07:15):
and sometimes I don't and that'sOK.
I always make time for it later then.
But I have, I have built awareness in that middle of the
week, Monday through Friday. What's the most important thing
to me is the conversations I'm having.
So the phone calls being open for phone calls and so if work
(07:35):
needs to be pushed off to be available for phone call with an
athlete, that will always take priority.
And I will take time for the thebusy computer work.
And that might honestly be a Saturday morning at 4:00 AM that
happens every single week. So, so yeah, yeah, I think it's
just knowing I did the best I could.
And then honestly, like at the end of the day, if I if I did
(07:57):
mess around with my time a little bit, I just try to do
better the next day. Would you say that you're pretty
forgiving of yourself or you give yourself a good bit of
mercy or leniency on how you conduct each day because you're
talking about. Yeah, yeah, I'm forgiving.
I I, I used to be a lot harder on myself.
Now I've done this for so long and I think I have proof in that
(08:20):
I can. I'm still able to do this.
I'm not letting others down. I'm not letting myself down.
I've proof that I can get it done.
What to be done? Yeah, we're talking about what,
12 years? 1011 years.
NVDM Yeah 5. Five years, OK, So you've been
involved with endurance sport for like 10 years or so, but
like, yeah. So I was professional athlete
(08:42):
for 13 years and in that I was always coaching on the side.
Actually had a bike transport company that I started my
career. So yeah, I mean, that is how I
was a tennis coach before I was a professional tennis player.
Got into tennis and then I foundthe sport of triathlon and I was
like, OK, I really want to do this.
(09:02):
I can't coach tennis as well. So at the time we noted there
was tribe transport and there was no one else.
And we're like, well there needsto be a better way because I was
actually involved with a team that went up to Coeur d'Alene
Iron Man and about 8 bikes got broken in that trip.
More like surely there should beanother option and created a
trailer where we could front, wecould mount every single bike
(09:24):
separately by itself in that we could only take 40 bikes at a
time. But we mounted by a front fork,
we mounted the wheel next to it.And the business was this 34
trailer. I would go to the shops in Texas
and then go to the designated race.
And at the time Iron Man, they, they listed out who was all
doing these races on the Iron Man website.
(09:46):
So I could go three months aheadof time and go, OK, here are all
the Texas people and I reached out to them on Facebook.
Hey, what a marketing plan. And and yeah, and then word got
out and then we got to a point where we had two trailers and we
were taking 100 bikes to races. And then we ended up selling
after three years. And so, yeah, that's how I
supported myself the first couple years in triathlon.
(10:08):
But as racing as a pro, I would drive this trailer.
I would race in Iron Man, I would sit up in the parking lot.
And we were actually the first ones to, you know, how Tri Bike
Transport did valet service yourbikes?
Well, we actually, we decided todo that.
Give us your tickets. We'll go get your bikes for you.
So we don't stand here till 2:00AM in the morning waiting for
you. And then we're like, OK, we
(10:29):
should charge for that. And then sure enough, Tri Bike
started doing that. So we we started that, Yeah.
Wow, this hustle mentality, the entrepreneurship, is that
running your blood and your family?
Yeah, I would say so. My mom is an extremely.
So my my dad, first of all, he passed away when I was 14.
At the time, my mom and my dad were working for a family
(10:51):
business and but always worked very hard.
He was always on the road as a traveling salesman.
My mom was like general manager of this company, working for my
grandmother or grandfather, all big parts of our lives and they
worked really hard. And then to see my mom
afterwards, she was worked really hard all hours of the
night. The things that she did, she ran
(11:13):
this, it's called the Nike Junior Tour for tennis.
And she had to manage the logistics for all these tennis
players and teams from all over the world to arrive at this
tournament at the same time. And I saw her working ridiculous
hours. And then on top of that, she was
doing the media and, and all sorts of things.
So I say, and then I would help her.
And I say I learned a lot of my my hustle work mentality from
(11:35):
from my mom in those later years.
Yeah, that's such valuable experience to get such you
engaged as well. But something not so I guess
valuable is losing your dad at 14.
I'm curious. Well, first of all, like, do you
mind me asking how he passed? Yeah, He had a heart attack.
Yeah. Unexpected.
(11:55):
Unexpected. I wasn't even in South Africa at
the time. I was playing tennis.
I was on the from the ages of like 13 to 18.
I was playing tennis all over the world.
I was on this Junior World circuit and I was in Asia at the
time and doing very well. I was.
Yeah, I was 15 at the time and Ijust got a call from my mom
like, hey, I think you should come home.
(12:16):
And I had to pull out of the lost.
It was the finals of Double S and then I came home and I'd
find out. So we had no idea.
I mean, it's not like indicationof him being sick.
It just happened on a work trip.So how?
Long do you think it took beforeyou accepted or not accepted but
like got through the denial stage and realized?
(12:37):
It was weird, man. I was really, really obviously
upset for a couple months. I remember.
And then I got to the point of like, I'm going to go and still
keep. And my mom tried to put me back
in as much of a normal life as possible.
And so she sent me off for the next tennis tournament and the
next tennis tournament. And I was not the same since.
(13:01):
Yeah, it was. I was a disaster from being
honest. And so, yeah, I mean, it's so
funny. I did the the thoughts I
remember of like being at Wimbledon and because I played
junior Wimbledon and all these tournaments was just me still
struggling with the loss of my dad and.
And yeah, and just just not having any confidence or any.
(13:23):
Yeah, I had just, it felt so I don't know.
Yeah, I'd worked all my life to be here at this big stage, and
it's just like, don't even care anymore.
So I honestly after that, I thenstruggled like this.
The fact that I'm speaking aboutmy dad like this right now is a
massive deal. I don't think you've done that
up to a year or two ago. And I'm 44.
(13:45):
Yeah. So that's.
Yeah, that's the what happened. What do you mean?
I didn't know why. Did you just Yeah.
What happened? What changed I?
Think some some conversation washad and I was able to speak
about him and not break down in tears.
I was like, oh, and then I actually like in me speaking
about him. I felt like, OK, I honored him
(14:05):
and his role in my life versus like not speaking about it at
all. Yeah.
And then I was like, oh, I'm OK with this.
I I'm now. It's enough Time has come, has
passed and yeah. And here we are.
So if the question comes up, I can take it.
In the past I was like, can't talk about it, sorry.
Well, I have some more questions.
So I I think you know, but my dad passed by when I was 16.
(14:27):
I don't know if you knew that ornot.
Yeah. So my dad passed away when I was
16. I have two younger sisters, so
my sisters were 12:00 and 4:00 at the time.
It was very hard for me. I will say, you know, going
through puberty, whatever, just trying to figure out what it
means to be a man with the absence of a father.
There was a complexity there because he actually took his own
(14:47):
life. So it was this whole other set
of baggage, but not not to talk about me, but was most apparent
to me as I've gotten older now. So I'm 33.
My sisters are, you know, early 20s and going to be 30 soon.
Watching 2 two of his daughters grow up without dads at very
crucial parts in their lives waslike, I just realized that is
(15:10):
one of I don't know if there's aharder thing that a girl could
grow up with with other than have like with the absence of a
father just was so apparent to me.
Like it's hard for me, but I feel like it's harder for them.
So what was the hardest part of growing up without that for you?
Yeah. I mean, I think you go relate
(15:30):
and just like you think of all the things that you do.
And I mean the fact that he's he's missing it, you're missing
him being a part of it, these pivotal life moments.
And then I definitely think for him to see what I'm doing now, I
just know, like, how proud he would be, you know, and men,
imagine if he was a part of thisright now.
(15:52):
Yeah. I just think that'd be yeah.
Now normal questions. You got to.
You got to stop. If you cry, it's OK, Natasha.
I, I cry on this podcast. It's happened, Yeah.
Don't want to go there? Yeah.
Well, I won't ask any more specific questions than about
that, but I am, I guess I just want to say like it is really
(16:15):
cool to know that you are have come to a place where you can
talk about it, you know, being at 44, because I, I can see just
from talking to you for 15 minutes and some of the stuff
that you put out there. But the, the tenacity and the
drive forward, like I would say that there's probably a piece of
that experience that is motivated or your life is
motivated by that by missing dad.
(16:37):
What do you think? No.
No, not that I've ever been aware of before now.
Contemplated for sure, but yeah,I don't think so.
I think there's other things that have been motivated by the
missing of my dad, for sure, butI think my work ethic is one of
them, yeah. You're just, you're kind of born
with that. And did you have young chores
(16:58):
when or did you have chores whenyou were a kid?
Like you had to do this, do thataround the house like.
Yeah, not really. We actually grew up in South
Africa and where it was common that we had help around the
house. Didn't do anything.
But I did go off to boarding school when I was 12.
And in that you learned a lot ofdiscipline.
Yeah. No kidding.
(17:19):
We were in uniforms. We had to stand up anytime
someone came in the door. We had to stand back anytime we
come to a door. And I still do this today.
I look back and if there's anyone older than me in eyeshot,
I will wait for them. And it's the weirdest thing
because I'll even wait for guys to walk through because I'm
like, older. You're going first.
I just wait. And then, yeah, just kind of
(17:40):
this respect mentality through everything.
And I still hold it. And then, yeah, I mean, we had
to, you know, 12-12 years old, understand cleanliness.
You're sharing a room with someone else, making your bed
like that, routinely got checked, showing your homework,
lights out at this time. So yeah, I think that was built
(18:02):
into me at a young age, Yeah. No kidding.
Did your parents also go to boarding school as children?
Or why did they decide to send you?
Yeah. Yeah, not my mom.
My dad did. The reason I went is actually
grew up in a very small town, it's called Kimberly in South
Africa. And I had outgrown, I was
already at 12, the best tennis player in the city and they I
(18:25):
needed to have a better tennis coach, hitting partners.
We knew that was the direction that I wanted to go.
I loved it and I got a scholarship opportunity.
So I had my boarding school and schooling all paid for for me to
go and then play for the school and they had great coaches
there. So that's my mom was like, you
need to take that opportunity ifyou want to advance.
And so I did that. And then I ended up moving from
(18:47):
there to Johannesburg, which is now 6 hours away from my parents
at the age of 15, my dad. And at the time I was staying
with my older sister, who's fiveyears older than me, one of two.
And she had a one bedroom deficiency about the size of
this room. And I was on a mattress next to
her bed. And that's where I stayed for
(19:08):
the first year at that age. And I learned how I was like,
oh, I need to go buy myself somefood.
I need to get myself from here to here at 15.
Because she was in college and she was working, and that was my
place to stay. But then I went off to school
and played tennis all day. So wow.
So you're, you have a daughter, right?
Yes, just. 1. I have one daughter, her name is
(19:31):
Nadine, and I actually named herafter the sister I just talked
about. Oh cool.
How old is you? Said Nadine.
Nadine. She's nine years old.
Do you think that you'll send Nadine through boarding school?
No, no. Why?
Not no. I want to spend as much time as
I can with her, for one. Yeah.
(19:51):
I couldn't even imagine, to be honest.
Like to think that in four yearstime I'm sending her off to
boarding school. No.
Yeah. I was like, you can live with me
as long as you want to. So she's such a joy, but.
Yeah. I mean, obviously you do the
best you can. If your child and what their
needs are at the time something comes up that it requires that
(20:13):
and that's in what she wants andin her best interests, well then
you've got to consider it for sure.
So you're married. No, so I, I actually, yeah, I
guess first time public information.
I'm thinking people have guessedit by now, but I actually went
through a divorce and which was finalized earlier this year and
(20:34):
a big why I kept on pushing off our call, by the way.
Well, how are you doing doing? Good.
Yeah, we're on the other side ofit, yeah.
So, yeah, well. Who do you with Your daughter?
If I'm can ask this question, who do you see more of more in
her? You or her father?
(20:54):
I mean, I I feel me, to be honest.
Yeah, yeah. I get that a lot from other
people as well. So I would say probably me.
Is she? Showing the entrepreneurial bug.
Yes, that's so funny. We were.
I took it to Nashville for a wedding and we're just walking
along talking and she says, you know what, mom, I'm going to
start a babysitting company. Let's.
(21:16):
Go. I'm going to call it.
It's gonna pull it NW babysitting, which is her
initials and my initials. Yeah.
So what I'm gonna do is I'm going to hire a bunch of
babysitters who are gonna work for me and they're gonna do the
work and I'm gonna get the percentage of the top.
And this is an 8 year old conversation she's been.
Listening to your conversations.We haven't had this
(21:38):
conversation. She's just watching and she said
I'm going to get the percentage off the top and then I'll send
them off and they go work and she says I'm going to run the
business. And then outside of that, she
has expressed interest of like, I want to do what you want to
do. You know, I think a lot of the
times when it's time to like dress up or be someone at school
or she kind of mirrors like whatwhat I'm doing and, and is
(22:01):
wanting to do it as well. Are you a good mom?
I would think so I, I did struggle with that question for
a very long time actually, whereI always felt like I could be
better. You know, you think about the
things of showing up well for a mom and I always struggle with
how much I work and how much I travel and and still to a degree
(22:23):
some point now, but I've definitely, I think let that go
this year. And I just felt like I was
taking away from her childhood. I wasn't showing up as best I
could because, because that timeaway, but then also a lot of the
times I show up, I'm, I'm tired,you know, and maybe I'm not as
intentional with the time as I want.
And so I definitely like right before this, I took like a 10
(22:43):
minute nap and it's, I can do that.
I can nap for 10 minutes really hard, wake up and be like my
mind's fresh. And that's true.
Athlete. That's amazing.
But I do that a lot of the timesbecause I know if I don't do
that, I'm going to be too tired for when she gets back from
school. And now I can show up as well as
I can. And so I've definitely given
myself a lot of grace this year where I just as long as in the
(23:05):
time that I have her because it's a little less time now.
I show up the best I can. And that's by giving her as much
attention as I can for that day.Not perfect.
Sometimes I am massively distracted with work.
I think it's just the mark of anentrepreneur.
There's always something going on that you have to be like, got
to put it aside. And yeah, she's a good kid.
(23:25):
And I think that's the result ofgood parenting is where she's,
she's always happy. I mean truly always happy.
So much fun. She's great with kids we're
great with. She shows up well in every area.
She's full of joy. And I'm like, OK, I have shown
her the way in that because I can truthfully say, for better
(23:46):
or worse, I've never raised my voice to her or had to.
You know, when they say you discipline a child, I don't
think I've ever had to discipline her because she kind
of knows. And it's really just a question
asking is the way I approach it.Like if she's doing something,
I'm like, Nadine, should we be doing that?
And she's like, no. And then if she is, and then and
(24:06):
that's it, like there's no tantrum, there's no fighting,
there's no nothing. And then if there is something,
I think she'd something. She did something the other day
and I didn't even have to say it.
And she came up and she started crying and was like, I'm so
sorry. You know, I was like, it's OK,
let's talk about this. So yeah, I think proof of we're
doing, we're doing OK over here.Yeah.
(24:28):
How much of your coaching style do you think is informed by your
parenting style and vice versa? Quite a bit, yeah.
Yeah, quite a bit, yeah. Is that by choice or is it just
the way you operate like have you put thought into that?
Definitely by choice at this point.
I think there was a level of just you operate and now I'm
(24:49):
understanding fully of of how I show up and what I say
absolutely matters and I have toprepare myself accordingly.
So like I'm not just going somewhere and just being like
I'm intentionally showing up a certain way.
And I think with her as well, like there is thought going into
what am I going to do in this moment in this conversation
(25:10):
versus just responding? That's learned I think through
me being a professional athlete as well.
I learned how to later years notbe emotional.
You you respond, you don't reactright.
And so yeah, I'm definitely, I feel like I'm a little more
thoughtful in relationships and that.
(25:32):
If there's one thing I continue to hear echoed from parents who
are ahead of me in the game, it's that kids care less about
what you say and more about whatyou do.
So it's interesting that you said showing like an active
actual action to to emulate whatever is going on.
That's usually how kids pick up stuff.
And it's so funny because a lot of the characteristics,
(25:54):
mannerisms that I notice in myself, I am now to an age where
I have enough self-awareness to be like, Oh my goodness, that's
my mother's talking through me. Like, what am I?
But that's how it works. And I think it's a beautiful
thing. You can change some of those
things for sure. But yeah, we are definitely
impressions of what our parents are were.
To a large degree, absolutely. Yeah.
(26:16):
I think it just starts with self-awareness.
Are you, Are you ready to? Yeah, be self aware and then do
you want to make the change? Yeah.
So I have so many questions for you.
I'm trying to arrange them in myhead, but the first one I have
to ask before I forget is your last name, Is it Vander Maui
Murui? How do you say the SO?
Correctly, it's Vanamava. Vander Maava, It sounds German,
(26:40):
that South African. South African, OK phenomena.
Yeah, we here in the States, I'll say Vandermoeba.
A lot. Easier.
Like the V, the WS, like AV. Yeah, OK, interesting.
Well, thanks. Now I know how to say it.
Whenever I do the Antro outro. How old were you when you quit
tennis? 2020 ish.
(27:05):
OK. And you started playing tennis
when you were, what, 7-8? Yeah, 656767.
OK, Yeah. Where's this?
That's hilarious. So that's a long time but you
know, your dad passed away when you were 15 so really it's kind
of like 50% of your career ish was pre dad post dad.
(27:29):
How, how did that affect the dream for you to like, I would
assume if you're doing Wimbledonjuniors, like you wanted to be
the best and you were doing quite well.
So how did that affect your dream?
Did that slowly start to kill itor did it not affect it?
What do you think? Yeah, unintentionally killed it.
So yeah, I just, I just struggled.
(27:49):
I really did through my late teens and 20s, Yeah.
And so, yeah, I just think like everything was kind of building
up until that point that the tournaments that I did in in
Asia, I pretty much won every single one of them.
And then I couldn't win anythingoff to that.
I was, I was just a mess. I really was.
(28:10):
Just like you're when you get upthere, OK, I'm serving like it's
just you're overthinking. You can't get into a flow state.
Like what? What really was happening?
Yeah, yeah. I mean, I did the number of
games that I was like, honestly,like 6 love, 5 Love up, like
should be should easily just close it out and then I'll just
freeze. And I can't say that was
(28:30):
directly then my dad, but I mean, there was just a lot of
things on the outside as well. Yeah.
And then those people went on tobe like top 30 in the world
professional tennis player, you know, so.
And I knew that as I knew that capability.
And then I'd keep letting myselfdown.
And then more and more I just had that that action would then
(28:50):
leave my mindset of like, well, you can't do this.
And yeah, so yeah, just kind of let it go from there.
Yeah, well, then you started doing triathlon, I guess, after
that. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Only when I was 27. So I went from playing to
coaching to then triathlon. Picking up triathlon at 27?
(29:13):
Yeah. Was there a rebirth in your
confidence during that time because if you're going on to be
a professional, or did you stillstruggle in the same way you
just had enough genetics and base to like carry yourself
through to be? Yeah, yeah.
No, I think if I was struggling,which I did, it wasn't because
of that, I'll tell you that. Different, separate, separate.
(29:34):
Yeah. I mean, I just, I had, I played
every single sport growing up. And so I was just very talented
to where I could. I, I swam a little bit when
growing up, the cycling, I felt like all the strength from the,
the tennis and the strength workI did right over to the bike we
ran. So I had success pretty quickly.
And then there was definitely a goal of like, I've messed up my
(29:56):
tennis career. Let me see if I can do this
again in triathlon and actually live up to my potential.
But I had so many things I had to work through.
I mean, one of them just being like, I had this constant body
like you hear from female athletes all the time, body
image issues and constantly under fueling myself, never
(30:18):
thinking I was lean enough, fit enough to compete.
There was obviously this massivecomparison cycle going on.
Yeah. And that hurt me big time
because I was always tired. I was always injured, just never
able to train up to my potential.
And then there was just like a lot I was emotionally not where
(30:39):
I am now. I'm not even comparable from the
person in my 20s, early 30s to where I am now.
The two don't recognize each other.
So yeah. And that didn't bode well for
trying to be a good professionalgraphly.
Yeah. Yeah.
The the body dysmorphia, like the eating disorder type of a
thing. What?
What what came about where you realized, OK, this is a problem,
(31:01):
I should probably address it. I knew I had it all along,
couldn't didn't have the tools, the capability to fix it.
I think at at some point it was actually, I think I only fixed
it when I had my daughter, to behonest, gained all this weight,
had her and it was time to I worked with a nutritionist to
lose the weight and I got in thebest shape of my life after the
(31:24):
fact. And really, she just taught me
how to fuel for performance. And what we found, I'd never
tracked my food before. And what we found was like, I
was massively under eating and my body was holding on because
of it. And as soon as I started eating
way more, which is very scary atfirst, my body just leaned out.
Yeah. Just like soaked it.
(31:45):
All up, yeah, I was like, and then I I felt amazing, like I
was. So my best years came after I
had my daughter because I alwayshad energy.
I was recovering well. I could train a lot more and at
that time, yeah, I mean, I did just a turn from like, I'm not
even going to look at the scale anymore.
Whatever I'm going to eat is well, how is that going to
benefit me from my session and recover me from my session?
(32:07):
The focus was performance. The focus wasn't body
composition at all. And I just had to switch at that
time. I'm.
So curious because this fascinates me and I've I've
never truly gone through like the transformations you're
talking about, but from when youwere under eating, were you
constantly hungry? Like did you have hunger more
and you just like, pushed yourself to not eat or in like,
(32:29):
yeah, yeah, that was it. Like that's what it feels like.
Yeah, yeah. And I would see results too, in
that I would lean down. But then all of a sudden I would
then binge eat because I had this opportunity to.
And, and so that was my cycle. I would eat almost nothing.
And then I'd be really, really hungry and I'd eat as much as I
could. OK, let me eat some more because
this is the one day I'm doing that.
(32:49):
And then the next day I'd be like, OK, no more food.
Yeah. And, and I and I would be
hungry. Yeah.
And I'd just be like, well, no, the goal is you need to, you
know, lean down. So.
Yeah. Would you say that it's fair to
say after you, you know, startedworking with the nutritionist,
did you eat until you were full or did you have to, even with
your training load, extend beyond what was full, like the
(33:11):
feeling of full? No, yeah, the no, I never ever
ate beyond what was what I thought was full.
If anything. Like before, I would overeat,
like to the point of being full.Now I never eat to the point of
being full. Like I just feel like I just eat
enough fully balanced. Like my, my diet today is like,
OK, I need this amount, I'm going to eat.
(33:34):
And even if I'm, if I'm full andthere's a little bit left on the
plate, I'm full. Yeah, I would never do that in
the past, Right. And then it's like, oh man, I
really feel like something sweet.
Well, I can go and I can grab and I'll have like a small
cookie or whatever. Fine, do that every day.
Whereas before it's like, oh, ifyou're going to eat a cookie, we
might as well eat 15 because that's limited.
(33:56):
Yeah, that was me. So now it's just like balanced
approach of like how am I feeling and just eating
intuitively, Yeah. It's interesting this whole
topic of food, especially with like American food, I think
because things are literally engineered to be put on the
shelf to be addicting. You know, when you eat Whole
(34:17):
Foods like this is my been in myexperience when I eat Whole
Foods and things that I actuallycook like whole based
ingredients and stuff, I will beeating.
And then you'll get to a place where it like doesn't even taste
good anymore, even though it tasted amazing 10 minutes ago,
but now it's like it doesn't really hit it.
But a lot of these processed foods, they never get to a place
really where it's like, I don't want, no longer want the taste
(34:37):
of this. It's like you keep going for it.
And I feel like the system is sogames against people who aren't
exercising a lot every day because like, I feel like it,
the taste buds, the over spiced,whatever, this, it's just such
an interesting field. Yeah, yeah.
I mean, we, we could go on on this conversation if we want to,
but yeah, it's. Crazy.
(34:58):
So let me ask you this question.You have done a lot.
You have quite a level of self-awareness.
You're an entrepreneur, you're amother, coach, business owner.
From your perspective though, who is Natasha?
I hear you ask this question allthe time, by the way.
I just should have prepared myself.
(35:18):
No one. Does and that's OK.
Yeah, no, it's, it's all good. Yeah.
I mean, I, I just think to myself as far as like, what do,
what do I strive to be every single day, right?
And I really, obviously we, we haven't even touched on my
faith, but truly that's like the, the beacon or the from who
I am and me. And so I wake up every day and I
(35:44):
think like yourself, like, you know, you're a child of God.
And I look at my business and I say, well, this is the plat,
this is the, what's the word? No, I can't think of it.
But essentially God has given methis business.
How am I going to steward? How am I going to steward this
business the best I can? What does that require of me as
(36:05):
far as stewarding? It's how I show up with
relationships within the business.
Am I doing well by the resourcesof our businesses, by the
athletes? What kind of impact am I making
from that standpoint? And then that carries over into
my personal life as well. And try to do the best I can
there. And I think what does the
(36:25):
Christian life really stand for?It's a life where you're
supposed to love other people. And so that's kind of my mission
is that I love other people through in my business, the
sport of triathlon and our business.
And they're coming into something where they're
receiving support for a big goalof theirs that I feel is
(36:49):
something that motivates them topush for something that's bigger
maybe than what they might work with someone else.
I don't know if that's a question you answered, but yeah,
I mean, Christian mother, everything that I do is driven
through. Like what is what has God made
me here to do? And that's it.
(37:10):
And and also I am equally compivot if I feel like God is
calling me to a different directions.
Like right now one of me is the business and my daughter, but
I'm always open to if he's calling me into something
slightly different to use my talents.
But right now, I, yeah, this is where we are, yeah.
No, that's beautiful. So let me ask you this question.
(37:34):
When you have the opportunity towalk into the throne room and
you have the opportunity to see God for the first time, assuming
you haven't already seen him, what what do you, what do you
hope that he would say to you? Or what do you?
Yeah, what do you what would be like the most meaningful thing
you could hear from him? Yeah, I mean, it's so funny.
(37:55):
I think the first thing that came to mind was well done, good
and faithful servant, right? Say the same.
But yeah, I think that's really it.
It's like, did I use my time on earth well for what he made me
for? Yeah.
And yeah. And then this.
(38:16):
It's so funny. I'm just going to speak to what
my mind goes to. It's like, OK, you can you can
rest now because I think that's a long one.
It's like every day I push forwards and I really do live on
this mindset of like, I am only going to do what God has given
me the strength to do. That's a lot.
But He's given us 24 hours in a day with eight hours of rest in
(38:37):
between. So I have to understand that
tomorrow is a new day. And even though I'm completely
wiped out from today and what it's asked of me, I will be
fresh again tomorrow. And I can tell you most nights I
go to bed going, how am I going to do this again tomorrow?
Sure enough, I wake up the next day.
I'm like, let's go, you know, But but in that I'm like, yeah,
(38:59):
at some point I'll be in I'll just to be able to rest in his
Kingdom and not have to strive for anything, even though I'm
not striving for people or it tells us not to strive just to
be. That's one thing that I've
always struggled with my entire life as well.
It's it's it's a Christian song will come up.
I was just said upper room in Dallas.
(39:20):
You know that church? It's a very well known church
that has great music, great great pastors, amazing sermons.
I have think I've seen some stuff on Instagram but I'm not
super familiar with them. Yeah, I listen to the sermons
all the time, multiple times a day actually, while I'm driving,
while I'm cooking and doing that.
And I just, I just love having it on the background.
(39:43):
But they had a song that came onand it was about stop striving,
stop, you know, and it always brings me to tears because I'm
like, yes, you got to stop striving.
Like just are. You afraid to slow down?
No, no, I'm not. But I think that what's in front
of me right now is not to slow down.
(40:05):
You know, like God continues to put.
So many opportunities in front of me.
Like again, if I couldn't handleit, he wouldn't put that in
front of me. So I've I've got to go.
So yeah, I think of that verse that says, man, I wish I could
quote exactly where it's from, but the the the harvest is great
(40:28):
and the laborers are few like that kind of situation.
I think that God really does bless those who show like that
in the little things that they they honor him or honored
kindness and love above all else.
And then there are so many opportunities and it can be
difficult honestly, for in the best way to know well which
opportunities should I go after?And because of this whole thing
(40:48):
with free will, the thing that I've struggled with the most has
been like, well, what things do I actually say yes to?
And I'm like, God, just, you know, tell me which ones
exactly. Could you give me a little
checklist? And I'll do those things.
And that's not how it works because the free will aspect,
like that's what makes the relationship, I think with God
so unlike anything else because even in my human relationships,
even in my own marriage at times, like it becomes like
(41:11):
this, oh, I want you to do this.And if you love me, you will do
this. And there is an element of that,
I think. But in an imperfect human to
human, it does not work the sameway.
So yeah, it's interesting how that all works, but you're.
I, I want to say something to that because it's a big company
that I've just had and it is andit's, we have free will to
(41:33):
choose what we're going to do. However, the scripture on it
that God, God will make those paths straight.
So we make the wrong choice. I'm fully trusting that God is
going to come in and make that choice to what he designed it to
be. And that takes the pressure off
my choices. And I have seen it play out in
(41:53):
my life many times where I'm like, man, that was a bad idea.
But while look at the blessings that actually came out of what
was probably really bad anyway. Yeah.
All things work together for those who love God.
I really do believe that becauseI've made some really stinkers
myself. Or another example, like losing
my dad in the way I did, I wouldnever say like, oh, I'm happy
that that happened. But in a strange kind of a way,
(42:15):
like I can be thankful for a lotof the outcomes of those things.
Just, yeah, a lot of people who go through a hardship like that
don't make it through in a healthy way.
And to be able to look back and say, like, wow, yeah, like God
brought me through. These people were in my life
where I had the community of triathlon or coaching or tennis
or whatever it is. There's so much to be thankful
(42:37):
for. With them, yeah.
So on your Instagram you do haveColossians 323 through 24.
I'm going to read it really quick and then I have a question
about it. So it says work willingly at
whatever you do as though you were working for the Lord rather
than for people. Remember that the Lord will give
you an inheritance as your reward, and the master that the
master you are serving is Christ.
(42:57):
So my question to you is, first of all, I love that verse.
I think it's beautiful. How does it influence the way
that you balance ambition and faith?
Because you seemed like a very ambitious person and if you were
my competitor, I would have to be very much on my toes.
So how do you balance ambition with faith?
Yeah, I mean, I I don't considerit ambition, to be honest.
(43:21):
I'm not striving for things of this world that you would say
ambition is driving you towards.I don't love that verse so much
Is it's really what brought me to Christ.
So you know, how people decide to make a leap of faith and say
I'm going to put my trust in Godand accept Jesus is because of
this negative thing that happened.
And this happened, well, for me,I had so much anxiety around
(43:44):
people pleasing it to like crippling pain.
Like I had pain in my chest. I, I had anxiety and, you know,
and then I also had like, this is this what life is about, is
going and working for this person and making them happy.
And you can't make old people happy.
And so that, that was actually my turning point in when I was
26. And so, yeah, I really just do
(44:06):
consider that whatever I am doing, it is for the Lord.
It's not for for anybody else. And in that it's again, it's
what does he want me to do? And so my ambition is driven by
I feel like this is God has placed this on my heart to
steward and that's it. So and then whatever the results
are, it's like, OK, now what do I do with this?
(44:28):
How is it going to push his Kingdom forwards and the next
decision is made? Do you feel like you've made it
or are you still chasing a mountain?
Like, do you feel like, OK, I'm like, I'm a successful person.
I'm here. I don't think I even consider
that, to be honest, like at all.Yeah.
I really just live for the day that I'm in.
(44:49):
And it's, it's so funny because most would look at my life and
say, yeah, she's, she's made it,you know, look at the career
she's made and she's living her dream.
Great. But yeah, I don't consider it.
I'm very blessed. I feel like very, very fortunate
this is a life I get to live. Absolutely.
But me making it is, am I doing the best I can with this day?
(45:14):
That's that's all I'm really focused on.
So I have no focus of the future.
Probably should you know, everyone has like a five year,
10 year plan. Like I have no concept because
who knows where God's going to take me?
Like there might be something there is.
I've had so much prophecy over me about teaching, which I teach
now, but is it going to be teaching his word in a bigger
(45:36):
way, you know? And if he takes me down that
path and opens those doors, well, that might be my path in
five years time, you know? And then you would say, well,
this wasn't on the path at all, so you weren't a success, but
that was the end goal, right. So I don't know.
Yeah. Would you say as a whole, our
sport of triathlon is filled with more believers or none
(45:56):
because you know a lot of people?
Yeah, that's interesting becauseI always look at the my team,
right, and the pool of my team. However, I'm actually a
believer. And what does that attract?
It attracts believers. So in our team we are mostly
believers as a whole. I feel like it's definitely
(46:20):
something more people are speaking about.
It was definitely taboo before even for me, right.
I had to gain a lot of confidence to say I'm going to
speak about this for sure. I don't know.
I, I would, I would say 5050, but I'd like to think it's like
7030 now, like 70 believers, 30%not, you know, no, Yeah, yeah.
(46:47):
It will be interesting. I don't know if there's an
accurate way to measure that because declared versus action
driven, Yeah, it's like it's different and it's different
because I think it's interestingbecause our culture is in the
world, at least in the popular culture that I'm involved in.
I can't speak for all of the Middle East or all of Asia
because I don't have my hand or pulse in that.
But there seems to be a large swing back toward traditional
(47:09):
values, which a lot of those, especially in America, like kind
of lean in the Christian way. And I'm wondering how that's
going to affect just how we conduct ourselves as a society
and the things we deem right andwrong.
And, you know, it's just, it's kind of, it's been interesting
to me to watch that shift happen.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I have nothing else to comment
(47:31):
on. That Is there something you want
to comment or you're afraid to comment on?
No. There's nothing else.
Yeah. If honest, If honest, like my
mind would blank there for a second.
Yeah. Yeah.
What? Yeah.
So you mentioned your coaches, you have, I think I counted 23
and and do you say NVDM coachingor do you OK, that's how you say
it. What's the hardest part about
(47:53):
running a coaching outfit of that size?
You know, if you asked me a yearor two ago, I would say the
people like the men, the people.But it's not anymore.
I feel like we've learnt throughthe five years to communicate
better, to have a better structured organization because
(48:14):
the because look at the at the end of the day, if there's any
dysfunction down here, and when I say down here, it's like my
coaches, it starts with me. I'm leading them correctly.
And then the team that's supported around me that's also
working to manage these athletes, it's me not
communicating correctly to them.So it's me.
So I feel like I've grown into abetter leader.
(48:37):
I don't think I was 1 from the onset.
It was kind of like this thing started and now all these people
are working for me. I'm like, Oh my gosh, what am I
doing? And I had to learn through that
process. And I didn't have a lot of
confidence in that process either.
Like I was put in this position,but I'm not skilled to be in
this position. And through action and through
time, I'm like, Oh no, I am like, I can do this.
(48:59):
And so, yeah, I think we're in aplace now where we are kind of
in a sweet spot. Like I things happen, we handle
them, you know, conversation is had, what's the next step?
And I do so without fear. So where's before I'd be like,
(49:19):
I'd be fearful of making the wrong step.
What does this mean for the business?
And I feel like there's enough five years of proof now that no
matter what happens, like we'll figure it out and the next step
will be taken. So, yeah, I mean, if anything,
it's just like, I work a lot like, so I, I'm handing off as
much as I can. Sure enough.
And the business would not run without my team, I'll tell you
(49:39):
that much. Everything that can be handed
off has been handed off. And they do so with full trust.
I almost don't have to speak to them.
They know their roles, which is incredible, right?
It took us a little while to getthere, but because of me, not
because of them. They were willing from the
beginning. And yeah, but with that, more
has come on. And now I'm like, OK, how do I
delegate the next thing? So it's like the delegation and
(50:02):
in trusting and teaching, because there's a process,
right? If I'm going to delegate well,
now I'm committing to telling you how to do it.
Well, that's that takes time. Sometimes you're like, I'll just
do it. You know, I just, I just have to
do more of that because at the end of the day, it's like this
has to be scalable. It has to be this long term
vision. Otherwise what we're doing right
now makes no sense. And that's how we've always
(50:25):
operated and how I've put back into the company is like with
that long term vision. Yeah.
What part of leading this, this group, this people gives you the
most joy? What I just, I mean, I love the
fact that I essentially am responsible for 23 jobs, if that
(50:54):
makes sense. Like that is that is a big on my
shoulder, but what a gift that is.
I'm like, wow, that's what I'm getting to do.
And I take that very seriously. And so something like I have
with him, it's like, what are your goals?
What do you want to do? What do you need to make for
your family? OK, let's get there.
You know, I really enjoy that. Like I still do payroll.
(51:14):
I'm a part of, I don't need to be, but I'm still a part of
payroll to go. Oh my gosh, I just put out X
amount for payroll this week. That's crazy.
You know, that's kind of fun. Yeah.
And then I mean, the first answer should have gone there
first. The relationships, I mean, they
truly have become like family. Mike, who's my CEO, CEO, he's
(51:35):
been with me from the very beginning.
I mean, we've had some little but not much.
I can probably say two or three,but we will be straight away.
That hurt my feelings and I think we should address this
differently. I'm like, OK, no, you're right.
And so we have that conversation.
I appreciate it. And then 10 minutes later, we're
as if nothing happened because we've moved forwards.
(51:56):
And those are pretty incredible relationships to have.
Yeah. Yeah, I can imagine there's
quite a bit of joy that comes from the ability to have
conflict resolution in a good way, because that's a, that's an
art and a skill that takes a lotof trips around the sun I think
to start to figure out. Are you comfortable with
confrontation nowadays? I guess it's kind of says sounds
(52:16):
like you are. I am, yeah.
I'm very address things pretty quickly.
Yeah, I feel like I always address it fairly.
And so I have confidence in that, those meetings.
And then honestly, I am always quick to listen in that if they
feel differently because I have to understand their side of it,
(52:37):
I'm going to fully hear it out, consider it and then try to make
the best decision moving forward.
So I think again, it's proof of results of what's happened in
the last five years. Give me gives me then the
confidence of where I am now andhow I'm going to move forwards.
Do you feel like you've made or had to make any sacrifices that
(52:57):
you might regret one day? Definitely the time with my
daughter, yeah. That's the said that.
Yeah. So, yeah, absolutely.
And it's my, my, my hope and desire is that she gets to see
that I'm living out my dream of impacting a lot of people that
brings them a lot of joy. And that's something she desires
(53:17):
for herself as well. So it's not like I'm in a a job
that I don't enjoy. Like I love it.
It just takes a lot of me. And hopefully through that
action and seeing that that willbe a good influence on her.
I'm sure it will. Yeah.
Her favorite thing, I always askher what her favorite thing is.
And it's just purely spending time with me.
And so the fact that it's takingaway from that, it's just like,
(53:38):
yes. Do you feel like your mom's
proud of what you're doing? Absolutely.
Yeah. Does she say it?
No. Is.
That a South African thing. I think it's my mom thing.
Probably not. Yeah.
So it's so funny. Like she won't say too much to
my face every now and again. I'm like, thank you.
I I can count on listen one hand, by the way, but when she's
(54:01):
speaking to someone else and I will happen upon that
conversation, she is it comes inbeaming pride, you know?
And I'm like, OK, like she just doesn't say it to me.
But that's. Yeah.
Do you? Do you think that you are
similar in your interactions with your own daughter or are
you? She's going to know.
(54:22):
You are so proud. Yeah.
Yeah, I feel like my mom's mothering style of me and mine
of my daughter. 'S is quite a different dad.
And my mom is my mom. Yeah, definitely the yeah, I've
never like if you think of all the things you could get into
where smoking and drugs and all like, no, I saw.
(54:43):
I saw the wrath of my mom and myolder sisters, like I will never
so. And she's, yeah, I make it sound
worse than it is, but you definitely, yeah, you don't mess
around. Yeah, what do your older sisters
do now? So my middle sister's a tennis
coach very, very good. And my older sister works for
(55:06):
she's like in counting. So CFO.
Type role. Nice.
All daughters. Yes.
Did you go for it? No, yeah.
And they're two step, the Hoff sisters.
So they have what I was my my dad's only child.
Oh wow, how many years are you guys separated by?
(55:27):
7:00 and 5:00. Seven and five, yeah, that's a
good chunk. It is.
Yeah, it is. I came, came on and yeah, it was
a different, a different split, definite split to where I was
definitely kind of doing my own thing, yeah.
Did you ever wish you had a brother?
No. You don't know what you were
missing. That's all it is.
(55:49):
My, my little sister, we were tomboys growing up.
OK, yeah. And I've said like, I had a
brother. Yeah.
Yeah, that's so. Cool.
So I, this is a question I've been holding on to for a while.
I don't think there's any good way to like jump back into it
because we kind of moved away from it a little bit.
But when I was asking questions about your dad, like, you know,
there was a little emotion that started to come through.
My question is, are you afraid of the emotions that make you
(56:14):
sad? Why?
Do you not like them? No, I mean, I Hmm, yeah, I can.
I don't know. I don't know how to answer that
question. I can definitely tell you that
(56:41):
when I am with people and I present myself, there is a
certain level of a person that Ifeel like I should present to
us. And in that there is a shield
around me that only so many get to see that other side of me.
And I feel like that level of vulnerable vulnerability and
emotion is, yeah, it's just not something that I put out to the
(57:06):
world easily. And I think it's a level of like
a little level of respect. Maybe I'm in this position that
I can't look like I'm don't haveit together kind of thing.
That's why I stopped myself fromfrom that.
However, I have found in this last year with everything that
I've been through, the benefit of actually opening up and how
(57:29):
it deepens relationships. And so this year, I have been
more open about my personal lifethan I ever have usually.
It was closed door. And yeah.
And through that, I've now have the closest, closest of friends
that I've ever had in my entire life of 44 years of living.
(57:49):
So. So yeah, yeah, I think, I think
that's it. I think yeah.
I just, I just feel like there'sonly so much emotion one should
show in the position that I'm in.
Yeah, no, that's fair. That is fair.
I found myself also adapting similar.
I don't know if you'd call them strategies or tactics or ways of
operating in a position of leadership, especially because
(58:13):
I've had people who've worked for me that I'm related to.
So it's like, well, during Thanksgiving we're this person,
but then when we're working, it's like a totally different,
one of them is actually my mom. So like figuring out how that
dynamic, it's actually, it's interesting.
I'm just kind of sharing freely a little bit, but it's one of
the greatest things I think thathappened that enriched the
relationship with my mother because I felt like she really
(58:34):
respected me for the first time in a in a meaningful way when I
was like in a position of leadership.
And that felt really good as yeah.
Because there's other things that I can still go to her for,
to seek wisdom, but to know thatshe can like look to me, up to
me a little bit like that's a pretty special thing.
So I can understand. Yeah.
And I've only been talking to you for 57 minutes, so you know,
(58:55):
I'm, I'm trying to crack you open.
But I mean, it's I, I really respect that.
Like to, to, like you mentioned,respect being a factor of like
who you choose to open up with about.
And you have only have so many people that you can do that
with. And I think that's really
important. A lot of people don't know how
to do that or regulate that. And that's a, again, a super
important skill. I feel like that I'm still
(59:16):
mastering. I agree, yeah.
Do you spend more time in your head or your heart?
Bit of both, yeah. Yeah, I've learned to, I
actually, it was a realization Ihad this year where I would, I'd
have an event that I'm going to and I knew who would be there.
And in my mind I would practice and, and this is intentionality
(59:38):
that I go into these, these, these times with people.
What questions am I going to ask?
What then questions am I going to ask if they answer this way
or this way to make sure that there's always conversation that
is being had and interest being showed.
Because I'll get in a room with someone and they will talk.
I can get them to talk about themselves for an hour, you
know, non-stop. But I've prepared that trying to
(59:59):
let that go a little bit to leave room, you know, and, and
also I read somewhere and I think it was maybe a daily
devotional about just taking toomuch control away from from God
and by doing stuff like that. And so.
For me, it's like, well, it's part business, but but yeah, I'm
(01:00:20):
trying to trying to just more be.
With that being said, that's thehead side of it.
There is a hard side of it and Iam someone that that wears their
heart on their sleeve in a sense.
Again, I've learned to control that.
So only some people see it, but it's, it's there.
Like I'm definitely, as much as I have life, things happen to me
(01:00:43):
and I should definitely have a vault around me and my heart at
this point, I somehow don't. And I think it's knowing my part
is that I have the ability to love freely, give freely.
And only so many people can do that and how wonderful it is to
receive that. Why would I not do that?
And so I just made the decision that that's what I'm going to
(01:01:04):
do, even though it hurts me mostof the time so and has hurt me
many times so. Yeah, to radical vulnerability
is a pretty radical thing to be able to do that with anybody
because it it opens you up to tobe hurt greatly.
But it also opens us up, I thinkto be like to be loved greatly.
(01:01:24):
Because something I figured out in the past couple of years
after going to this just three day weekend that focused a lot
on this one concept and that washow to accept affirmation.
Because if you don't and you can't be loved, if you don't
allow yourself to be loved, thenhow in the world are you going
to pour that out into someone else?
And that's a hard thing to do because often times whenever
(01:01:45):
people be like, oh, Seth, you'reso this or that.
And you know, these positive compliments most of us are like.
Whatever. And the thing that like hit me
between the eyes was like, wait,they had us write down all of
our inner critic voices, say them out loud to ourselves for
like 3 minutes. And then the music stopped as we
were saying this. And they had us pull out a
picture out of this envelope. And it was me as like a 7 year
(01:02:06):
old kid. And they were like, would you
ever say that to a little kid like that?
And I just, I cried. And I cried because I realized,
like, it made it so practical. I realized like, Oh my goodness,
that's what we're all doing. We're beating up our little
inner child that is still there.And yeah, isn't that crazy?
Yeah. Just a couple more questions for
(01:02:26):
you though. What makes what makes a good
coach different from a great coach?
Yeah, I mean, she speak about this with that coach all the
time. At the end of the day, it's it's
the relationship you have with the athlete.
And so when you think about whata good relationship is, it's
really good communication. It's a lot of like true care
(01:02:49):
followed by action, right? And so it's like you have so
many coaches who are so smart, you know, they know it all, but
they don't know how to either relay that to the athlete to
help them correctly. They maybe the the work ethic is
(01:03:11):
not there to be honest to where there is true care shown.
I just, I just the word action is there, right?
So it's like you as a coach, I tell athletes like after every
single workout we're looking, we're assessing, you're asking
practical questions like, OK, this went well, how do we make
it better at all times? And and then you're doing that,
(01:03:32):
you're following it up with, OK,let's get you a video of this
forum and let's make sure the feedback is given so that we can
run correctly, etcetera. There's so many things to it.
You're always uncovering and asking different questions to
make this athlete better. And so, so, yeah, I think it's,
it's work. But I think above all, it's it's
(01:03:53):
a relationship. And I think why I have athletes
that have been with me for 1012 years is because we've become so
close as friends. And that just requires you to
show up in a different way. You're not just a coach giving a
workout plan like you truly, truly, you're showing up as a
friend who cares and then working accordingly.
(01:04:14):
Yeah, good, good stuff. So my final question for you is
a total selfish one, because you're ahead of me and you have
a nine year old. What?
How can I prepare? What?
What makes a good dad, do you think?
Two things. It's so in the beginning, it's
(01:04:35):
hard for the dad because you haven't given birth to this baby
and most of the things that yourwife is going to do, like she
has to do. So I think your role in the
beginning is how do you best support your wife at the end of
the day, because there's only somuch you can do and being OK
with that, right? And then that role will change
and, and you will be looked at and you think of all the
(01:04:59):
character characteristics of a man to his wife.
But now you're giving that to your child as far as like
stability and safety and care and, and I think just showing up
in that manner, that will probably be more important later
on. I think at first we just talked
about it. It's about just being present,
(01:05:19):
right, For whatever that moment entails.
Every time you show up, it's probably going to look a little
different. But yeah, I mean, you are the
head of the household and you have to demonstrate it for your
wife and for your child. And you will set the tone of how
everybody shows up and you will dictate that.
(01:05:40):
Thanks for that feedback. Yeah, I have been thinking a lot
about this next year because thebaby's due in February and for
the past five years or so I've been like, OK, it's November,
December. I'm planning out all my races
and what I'm going to do for this next year.
And to be honest, I haven't truly figured out how this next
year's going to look. I told my wife I'm not going to
race really at all, although there's a brand new 70.3 that's
coming to our hometown. So I'm going to do that one
(01:06:02):
singular race. But in terms of like training
schedule and timing. And you know, my wife, I feel
like she feels most supported, at least historically, by just
being present like you were saying, but like actually there
beside her in the moment when she's going through something.
So I think there's still that. But a lot of the other stuff I'm
still a little fuzzy on like, well, she's gonna have to feed
the baby mostly. Like what do I do?
(01:06:24):
I guess we'll pump some and I'llhelp there.
Like, I don't, I don't really know, Maybe it'll all come to
me. Yeah, I think you guys will
figure it out. I think just like open
communication about what the needs are.
I will tell you this. Like if you you have to have
your own thing, I raced better after I had Nadine because I
made time for myself and but that time was super intentional.
(01:06:45):
And I'm like, OK, if I'm going to take time away, if in your
case from your wife, from your baby, I'm going to go make the
most of this next hour. And in that you'll, you'll
actually have a really great session and you'll build great
fitness. But that time is going to have
you show up better when you comecome back to them.
If you don't have that time, you're actually all going to
show upwards for each other. So I would say like you still
(01:07:06):
need to make sure you're taking care of yourself.
So then you can show up and thenit's just coordinating the times
to do that correctly. That works for her baby.
Sleeping, she's resting, etcetera on.
Three hours of sleep is what I'mafraid of, yeah.
How am I going to do? Yeah, it's so funny all the
things you're worried about. I look back on that time ago
(01:07:27):
that wasn't actually such a big deal.
You get bad strength, by the way.
Like it's a whole. You're just excited about life.
3 hours of sleep is no big deal.So excited about this family you
now have. And you get to before and, you
know, the changing of the diaperand all of that.
Like, I just wish I embrace thattime more, knowing it's just a
(01:07:49):
small part of time, yeah. Well, Natasha, it has been a
great joy and honor to get to pry through your life and ask
questions and learn more about you.
Yeah, it's brought a lot of joy,a lot of things for me to think
about. So I can't always say that for
every episode. So I really appreciate it for
you. Let me do it.
Yeah, appreciate the conversation, Seth, always such
(01:08:11):
good questions. Appreciate what you're doing so
and opportunity to get to know you as well.
Yeah. Thank you.
Thank you very much. It is podcasts like these that
keep me coming back for more. What a great conversation with
Natasha. You know, it's so much fun for
me to ask all these questions about their lives, but selfishly
(01:08:31):
asking the ones about parenthoodright now at the season of life
that I'm in, I think is what gives me the most excitement.
I guess that makes sense. I don't know why I'm surprised
by that or decide to share that,but that's something that is on
my heart and I really, I appreciate it.
We're coming down to the wire for the last couple of episodes
here for the season before I do a little bit of a send off as I
(01:08:51):
go to take off some time and then come back in the 2026 year.
But this is one of the best onesthat I've done in quite a while.
I really appreciate Natasha taking the time to let me dig
deep, especially around some of the sensitive topics about
losing her dad and stuff. Obviously means a lot to me to
be able to talk about those things because I've experienced
them and Natasha seems to be doing quite well considering the
(01:09:13):
things that she has gone through.
So thank you Natasha for again for taking the time to spend
with me and for all you guys listening.
Thank you so much for being here.
Make sure to follow like, subscribe, comment, do all those
things helps continue to grow the pod.
Thank you so much and we'll catch you in the next one.
Peace.
How's it going everyone? And welcome back to another
edition of the Stupid Questions podcast.
My name is Seth and today on thepod, we're going to be talking
with Natasha van der Marva. She is a South African born
professional athlete in several respects.
She has a history in being a protennis player, a pro triathlete,
pro tennis coach and triathlete coach.
She has a business called NVDM Coaching.
(00:21):
I would be shocked if you haven't heard of it yet.
I'll make sure to link that in the show notes.
So make sure to go check it out.And she's also involved with Ron
Durance, I believe, as the director of Endurance.
And I'm sure you guys have seen that brand around here the past
couple of years as well. So Natasha is an amazing person.
She's a mother, she is obviouslyan athletic person,
entrepreneur, so many things we have in common and really
(00:43):
appreciated getting the opportunity to dive in deep with
her and learning how much we truly did have in common.
I don't know if I said that fiveTimes Now, but if I have, so
sorry. But thank you guys so much for
being here. Check out the show notes if you
want to get connected with her and her team, if you're looking
for coaching services in any way.
And yeah, check out the show notes for otherwise you can get
involved with supporting this podcast.
(01:04):
If you are listening anywhere that does review allows you to
leave comments, turn on notification bells, subscribe,
follow all the things. Please make sure to do that
continues to help to grow this little old podcast.
So thank you guys so much for being here.
Yeah, really appreciate it. And without further ado, want to
introduce you to Natasha Vandemurva.
(01:25):
Well, Natasha, thank you so muchfor making the time.
I know I've been after you for awhile and you have so graciously
made some time in your schedule for me, so I really appreciate
it. Thank you for being on.
Thank you for being patient withme.
Yeah, this is like a year and a half in the making or something.
It's all good. No, I appreciate it that the
ones that mean the most are onesthat I have to kind of fight for
(01:45):
a little bit. So high expectations and looking
forward to it, but yeah, I do. Really appreciate you no looking
forward to it as well. Yeah.
So you're home right now. I am, yeah.
So my office is in my house. I usually move around a little
bit depending on my mood for theday.
And every morning again, I'll goout to a coffee shop or work at
the gym, but just kind of depends on where my rhythm is
(02:07):
right now. Getting a lot done at home and a
lot of planning for next year. And so, yeah, just trying to
knock it out. Yeah, that's always been a big,
like something I don't understand about myself is like
you're talking about the rhythm,like, oh, today I feel like I
could work in my living room today.
It needs to be a coffee shop. Like what?
What do you think? Have you figured out why that is
(02:28):
what the rhythm determination factor is?
Yeah, just, you know, I'm looking for productivity, right?
And so sometimes at home, I'm just distracted with other
little things and in that I needto go out.
But then sometimes you're out and you need the things you need
at home. You have yet some files that you
(02:50):
need to access for contracts or whatever.
And then as it depends in the house, it's really just like, I
think it's a lighting thing. You know, I have my office and I
can open up the blinds and stufflike that and get some light in.
But then it's so nice I open up the door there and actually get
some air in. And so I think it's just like,
what do I, what do I need at themoment?
But yeah, at the end of the day,I'm fighting for how can I make
(03:12):
the most of every single minute I'm I'm spending working with
that goal of getting a lot done in as little time as possible so
that I have been more time for family relationships, etcetera.
So I'm continuously adapting my workflow for what works and it's
every year it changes where I understand myself and I have
(03:34):
different pockets of time for different things because I get
most out of myself in those things.
So you know what's from that? Your desire for productivity, is
that something that has been a through line for your entire
life or is that something you have developed and and shaped
over time? Yeah, I mean, I've definitely
shaped that over time. I think an element for sure has
(03:55):
been part of my life. I don't think I'd be where I am
today if there wasn't there fromthe beginning.
But in how much I have to handle.
If you had asked me a couple years ago what I'm doing today,
if that was even possible, I would say no way.
Like really too much. Yeah, that's too much.
And so but all these things keptpresenting themselves in front
of me and I was like, I can do that.
(04:16):
I can do that. And so, yeah, in that I'm just
always working on better time and management in order to do
it. And sure enough, I do, because I
think in the past, like the thought of something would be
like, wow, that's a lot. And then I recognized that no,
you just got to do it. And as soon as I started doing
it, I'm like, well, that's totally doable.
(04:36):
And then you do the next thing and the next thing.
And so I still think I could do more, to be honest.
I'm always, yeah, I'm in a good spot right now.
It's just whether I want to or not.
I kind of like I'm. Fighting that so So what are the
what are the big buckets like when you think about, OK, these
are the things that I'm working on even in the short term, I
(04:57):
guess even partially long term, but what are the big buckets of
things that you are like spending time and obviously
coaching? What are the?
Other things, yeah. So I'd say the one what takes my
time at work wise is coaching and my athletes specifically.
And so that's broken up between their training plans, feedback
and assessment of their workoutsand then actually interaction
(05:20):
with the athletes. So that's one.
Then the other is management of the business and everything that
that is entailed. And I have a staff, you know of
people that today we've had multiple meetings.
So making sure we're all connecting and what are we doing
and what what's ahead that we need to prepare for.
And so it's that side of the business.
(05:43):
Yeah, outside of those meetings,it's planning.
You know, I do a lot on the backend for the business, for the
coaches. So there's a lot of like right
now. I'll give you an example.
I'm going in and cleaning up my libraries of training peaks.
I've got hundreds workouts. Workouts.
Yeah, and. I'm going into every bucket and
making it a lot more accessible,making sure there's no
(06:05):
repetitive workouts and and that's 10 hours I've spent on
that right now. And then I also do like some
mock planning. And so I go through all of that
and each one of those plans thatI've created has taken me days,
but I go in and I make small adjustments based on what I've
learned of like, oh, I shouldn'thave done that.
And so I do that refresh every year.
(06:25):
That's a lot of hours. And then outside of that, I work
for raw nutrition. And so we had a meeting today
connecting, what are we working on?
What are we planning on? OK, from there, here are my to
do's. And so I'm going to list out
those to do's. I'm going to make emails, make
those phone calls, and then yeah, other relationships with
sponsors, events, stuff like that, coordinating with them.
(06:51):
Yeah, those are my work buckets right now.
So when you come to the end of your day, what makes you feel
like, OK, today was a successfulday?
I did well, I did good. Yeah, there's definitely like I
have a endless To Do List and I always highlight the key to do's
that I need to do. And it's usually just three to
five things. I have to do those things today
(07:15):
and sometimes I don't and that'sOK.
I always make time for it later then.
But I have, I have built awareness in that middle of the
week, Monday through Friday. What's the most important thing
to me is the conversations I'm having.
So the phone calls being open for phone calls and so if work
(07:35):
needs to be pushed off to be available for phone call with an
athlete, that will always take priority.
And I will take time for the thebusy computer work.
And that might honestly be a Saturday morning at 4:00 AM that
happens every single week. So, so yeah, yeah, I think it's
just knowing I did the best I could.
And then honestly, like at the end of the day, if I if I did
(07:57):
mess around with my time a little bit, I just try to do
better the next day. Would you say that you're pretty
forgiving of yourself or you give yourself a good bit of
mercy or leniency on how you conduct each day because you're
talking about. Yeah, yeah, I'm forgiving.
I I, I used to be a lot harder on myself.
Now I've done this for so long and I think I have proof in that
(08:20):
I can. I'm still able to do this.
I'm not letting others down. I'm not letting myself down.
I've proof that I can get it done.
What to be done? Yeah, we're talking about what,
12 years? 1011 years.
NVDM Yeah 5. Five years, OK, So you've been
involved with endurance sport for like 10 years or so, but
like, yeah. So I was professional athlete
(08:42):
for 13 years and in that I was always coaching on the side.
Actually had a bike transport company that I started my
career. So yeah, I mean, that is how I
was a tennis coach before I was a professional tennis player.
Got into tennis and then I foundthe sport of triathlon and I was
like, OK, I really want to do this.
(09:02):
I can't coach tennis as well. So at the time we noted there
was tribe transport and there was no one else.
And we're like, well there needsto be a better way because I was
actually involved with a team that went up to Coeur d'Alene
Iron Man and about 8 bikes got broken in that trip.
More like surely there should beanother option and created a
trailer where we could front, wecould mount every single bike
(09:24):
separately by itself in that we could only take 40 bikes at a
time. But we mounted by a front fork,
we mounted the wheel next to it.And the business was this 34
trailer. I would go to the shops in Texas
and then go to the designated race.
And at the time Iron Man, they, they listed out who was all
doing these races on the Iron Man website.
(09:46):
So I could go three months aheadof time and go, OK, here are all
the Texas people and I reached out to them on Facebook.
Hey, what a marketing plan. And and yeah, and then word got
out and then we got to a point where we had two trailers and we
were taking 100 bikes to races. And then we ended up selling
after three years. And so, yeah, that's how I
supported myself the first couple years in triathlon.
(10:08):
But as racing as a pro, I would drive this trailer.
I would race in Iron Man, I would sit up in the parking lot.
And we were actually the first ones to, you know, how Tri Bike
Transport did valet service yourbikes?
Well, we actually, we decided todo that.
Give us your tickets. We'll go get your bikes for you.
So we don't stand here till 2:00AM in the morning waiting for
you. And then we're like, OK, we
(10:29):
should charge for that. And then sure enough, Tri Bike
started doing that. So we we started that, Yeah.
Wow, this hustle mentality, the entrepreneurship, is that
running your blood and your family?
Yeah, I would say so. My mom is an extremely.
So my my dad, first of all, he passed away when I was 14.
At the time, my mom and my dad were working for a family
(10:51):
business and but always worked very hard.
He was always on the road as a traveling salesman.
My mom was like general manager of this company, working for my
grandmother or grandfather, all big parts of our lives and they
worked really hard. And then to see my mom
afterwards, she was worked really hard all hours of the
night. The things that she did, she ran
(11:13):
this, it's called the Nike Junior Tour for tennis.
And she had to manage the logistics for all these tennis
players and teams from all over the world to arrive at this
tournament at the same time. And I saw her working ridiculous
hours. And then on top of that, she was
doing the media and, and all sorts of things.
So I say, and then I would help her.
And I say I learned a lot of my my hustle work mentality from
(11:35):
from my mom in those later years.
Yeah, that's such valuable experience to get such you
engaged as well. But something not so I guess
valuable is losing your dad at 14.
I'm curious. Well, first of all, like, do you
mind me asking how he passed? Yeah, He had a heart attack.
Yeah. Unexpected.
(11:55):
Unexpected. I wasn't even in South Africa at
the time. I was playing tennis.
I was on the from the ages of like 13 to 18.
I was playing tennis all over the world.
I was on this Junior World circuit and I was in Asia at the
time and doing very well. I was.
Yeah, I was 15 at the time and Ijust got a call from my mom
like, hey, I think you should come home.
(12:16):
And I had to pull out of the lost.
It was the finals of Double S and then I came home and I'd
find out. So we had no idea.
I mean, it's not like indicationof him being sick.
It just happened on a work trip.So how?
Long do you think it took beforeyou accepted or not accepted but
like got through the denial stage and realized?
(12:37):
It was weird, man. I was really, really obviously
upset for a couple months. I remember.
And then I got to the point of like, I'm going to go and still
keep. And my mom tried to put me back
in as much of a normal life as possible.
And so she sent me off for the next tennis tournament and the
next tennis tournament. And I was not the same since.
(13:01):
Yeah, it was. I was a disaster from being
honest. And so, yeah, I mean, it's so
funny. I did the the thoughts I
remember of like being at Wimbledon and because I played
junior Wimbledon and all these tournaments was just me still
struggling with the loss of my dad and.
And yeah, and just just not having any confidence or any.
(13:23):
Yeah, I had just, it felt so I don't know.
Yeah, I'd worked all my life to be here at this big stage, and
it's just like, don't even care anymore.
So I honestly after that, I thenstruggled like this.
The fact that I'm speaking aboutmy dad like this right now is a
massive deal. I don't think you've done that
up to a year or two ago. And I'm 44.
(13:45):
Yeah. So that's.
Yeah, that's the what happened. What do you mean?
I didn't know why. Did you just Yeah.
What happened? What changed I?
Think some some conversation washad and I was able to speak
about him and not break down in tears.
I was like, oh, and then I actually like in me speaking
about him. I felt like, OK, I honored him
(14:05):
and his role in my life versus like not speaking about it at
all. Yeah.
And then I was like, oh, I'm OK with this.
I I'm now. It's enough Time has come, has
passed and yeah. And here we are.
So if the question comes up, I can take it.
In the past I was like, can't talk about it, sorry.
Well, I have some more questions.
So I I think you know, but my dad passed by when I was 16.
(14:27):
I don't know if you knew that ornot.
Yeah. So my dad passed away when I was
16. I have two younger sisters, so
my sisters were 12:00 and 4:00 at the time.
It was very hard for me. I will say, you know, going
through puberty, whatever, just trying to figure out what it
means to be a man with the absence of a father.
There was a complexity there because he actually took his own
(14:47):
life. So it was this whole other set
of baggage, but not not to talk about me, but was most apparent
to me as I've gotten older now. So I'm 33.
My sisters are, you know, early 20s and going to be 30 soon.
Watching 2 two of his daughters grow up without dads at very
crucial parts in their lives waslike, I just realized that is
(15:10):
one of I don't know if there's aharder thing that a girl could
grow up with with other than have like with the absence of a
father just was so apparent to me.
Like it's hard for me, but I feel like it's harder for them.
So what was the hardest part of growing up without that for you?
Yeah. I mean, I think you go relate
(15:30):
and just like you think of all the things that you do.
And I mean the fact that he's he's missing it, you're missing
him being a part of it, these pivotal life moments.
And then I definitely think for him to see what I'm doing now, I
just know, like, how proud he would be, you know, and men,
imagine if he was a part of thisright now.
(15:52):
Yeah. I just think that'd be yeah.
Now normal questions. You got to.
You got to stop. If you cry, it's OK, Natasha.
I, I cry on this podcast. It's happened, Yeah.
Don't want to go there? Yeah.
Well, I won't ask any more specific questions than about
that, but I am, I guess I just want to say like it is really
(16:15):
cool to know that you are have come to a place where you can
talk about it, you know, being at 44, because I, I can see just
from talking to you for 15 minutes and some of the stuff
that you put out there. But the, the tenacity and the
drive forward, like I would say that there's probably a piece of
that experience that is motivated or your life is
motivated by that by missing dad.
(16:37):
What do you think? No.
No, not that I've ever been aware of before now.
Contemplated for sure, but yeah,I don't think so.
I think there's other things that have been motivated by the
missing of my dad, for sure, butI think my work ethic is one of
them, yeah. You're just, you're kind of born
with that. And did you have young chores
(16:58):
when or did you have chores whenyou were a kid?
Like you had to do this, do thataround the house like.
Yeah, not really. We actually grew up in South
Africa and where it was common that we had help around the
house. Didn't do anything.
But I did go off to boarding school when I was 12.
And in that you learned a lot ofdiscipline.
Yeah. No kidding.
(17:19):
We were in uniforms. We had to stand up anytime
someone came in the door. We had to stand back anytime we
come to a door. And I still do this today.
I look back and if there's anyone older than me in eyeshot,
I will wait for them. And it's the weirdest thing
because I'll even wait for guys to walk through because I'm
like, older. You're going first.
I just wait. And then, yeah, just kind of
(17:40):
this respect mentality through everything.
And I still hold it. And then, yeah, I mean, we had
to, you know, 12-12 years old, understand cleanliness.
You're sharing a room with someone else, making your bed
like that, routinely got checked, showing your homework,
lights out at this time. So yeah, I think that was built
(18:02):
into me at a young age, Yeah. No kidding.
Did your parents also go to boarding school as children?
Or why did they decide to send you?
Yeah. Yeah, not my mom.
My dad did. The reason I went is actually
grew up in a very small town, it's called Kimberly in South
Africa. And I had outgrown, I was
already at 12, the best tennis player in the city and they I
(18:25):
needed to have a better tennis coach, hitting partners.
We knew that was the direction that I wanted to go.
I loved it and I got a scholarship opportunity.
So I had my boarding school and schooling all paid for for me to
go and then play for the school and they had great coaches
there. So that's my mom was like, you
need to take that opportunity ifyou want to advance.
And so I did that. And then I ended up moving from
(18:47):
there to Johannesburg, which is now 6 hours away from my parents
at the age of 15, my dad. And at the time I was staying
with my older sister, who's fiveyears older than me, one of two.
And she had a one bedroom deficiency about the size of
this room. And I was on a mattress next to
her bed. And that's where I stayed for
(19:08):
the first year at that age. And I learned how I was like,
oh, I need to go buy myself somefood.
I need to get myself from here to here at 15.
Because she was in college and she was working, and that was my
place to stay. But then I went off to school
and played tennis all day. So wow.
So you're, you have a daughter, right?
Yes, just. 1. I have one daughter, her name is
(19:31):
Nadine, and I actually named herafter the sister I just talked
about. Oh cool.
How old is you? Said Nadine.
Nadine. She's nine years old.
Do you think that you'll send Nadine through boarding school?
No, no. Why?
Not no. I want to spend as much time as
I can with her, for one. Yeah.
(19:51):
I couldn't even imagine, to be honest.
Like to think that in four yearstime I'm sending her off to
boarding school. No.
Yeah. I was like, you can live with me
as long as you want to. So she's such a joy, but.
Yeah. I mean, obviously you do the
best you can. If your child and what their
needs are at the time something comes up that it requires that
(20:13):
and that's in what she wants andin her best interests, well then
you've got to consider it for sure.
So you're married. No, so I, I actually, yeah, I
guess first time public information.
I'm thinking people have guessedit by now, but I actually went
through a divorce and which was finalized earlier this year and
(20:34):
a big why I kept on pushing off our call, by the way.
Well, how are you doing doing? Good.
Yeah, we're on the other side ofit, yeah.
So, yeah, well. Who do you with Your daughter?
If I'm can ask this question, who do you see more of more in
her? You or her father?
(20:54):
I mean, I I feel me, to be honest.
Yeah, yeah. I get that a lot from other
people as well. So I would say probably me.
Is she? Showing the entrepreneurial bug.
Yes, that's so funny. We were.
I took it to Nashville for a wedding and we're just walking
along talking and she says, you know what, mom, I'm going to
start a babysitting company. Let's.
(21:16):
Go. I'm going to call it.
It's gonna pull it NW babysitting, which is her
initials and my initials. Yeah.
So what I'm gonna do is I'm going to hire a bunch of
babysitters who are gonna work for me and they're gonna do the
work and I'm gonna get the percentage of the top.
And this is an 8 year old conversation she's been.
Listening to your conversations.We haven't had this
(21:38):
conversation. She's just watching and she said
I'm going to get the percentage off the top and then I'll send
them off and they go work and she says I'm going to run the
business. And then outside of that, she
has expressed interest of like, I want to do what you want to
do. You know, I think a lot of the
times when it's time to like dress up or be someone at school
or she kind of mirrors like whatwhat I'm doing and, and is
(22:01):
wanting to do it as well. Are you a good mom?
I would think so I, I did struggle with that question for
a very long time actually, whereI always felt like I could be
better. You know, you think about the
things of showing up well for a mom and I always struggle with
how much I work and how much I travel and and still to a degree
(22:23):
some point now, but I've definitely, I think let that go
this year. And I just felt like I was
taking away from her childhood. I wasn't showing up as best I
could because, because that timeaway, but then also a lot of the
times I show up, I'm, I'm tired,you know, and maybe I'm not as
intentional with the time as I want.
And so I definitely like right before this, I took like a 10
(22:43):
minute nap and it's, I can do that.
I can nap for 10 minutes really hard, wake up and be like my
mind's fresh. And that's true.
Athlete. That's amazing.
But I do that a lot of the timesbecause I know if I don't do
that, I'm going to be too tired for when she gets back from
school. And now I can show up as well as
I can. And so I've definitely given
myself a lot of grace this year where I just as long as in the
(23:05):
time that I have her because it's a little less time now.
I show up the best I can. And that's by giving her as much
attention as I can for that day.Not perfect.
Sometimes I am massively distracted with work.
I think it's just the mark of anentrepreneur.
There's always something going on that you have to be like, got
to put it aside. And yeah, she's a good kid.
(23:25):
And I think that's the result ofgood parenting is where she's,
she's always happy. I mean truly always happy.
So much fun. She's great with kids we're
great with. She shows up well in every area.
She's full of joy. And I'm like, OK, I have shown
her the way in that because I can truthfully say, for better
(23:46):
or worse, I've never raised my voice to her or had to.
You know, when they say you discipline a child, I don't
think I've ever had to discipline her because she kind
of knows. And it's really just a question
asking is the way I approach it.Like if she's doing something,
I'm like, Nadine, should we be doing that?
And she's like, no. And then if she is, and then and
(24:06):
that's it, like there's no tantrum, there's no fighting,
there's no nothing. And then if there is something,
I think she'd something. She did something the other day
and I didn't even have to say it.
And she came up and she started crying and was like, I'm so
sorry. You know, I was like, it's OK,
let's talk about this. So yeah, I think proof of we're
doing, we're doing OK over here.Yeah.
(24:28):
How much of your coaching style do you think is informed by your
parenting style and vice versa? Quite a bit, yeah.
Yeah, quite a bit, yeah. Is that by choice or is it just
the way you operate like have you put thought into that?
Definitely by choice at this point.
I think there was a level of just you operate and now I'm
(24:49):
understanding fully of of how I show up and what I say
absolutely matters and I have toprepare myself accordingly.
So like I'm not just going somewhere and just being like
I'm intentionally showing up a certain way.
And I think with her as well, like there is thought going into
what am I going to do in this moment in this conversation
(25:10):
versus just responding? That's learned I think through
me being a professional athlete as well.
I learned how to later years notbe emotional.
You you respond, you don't reactright.
And so yeah, I'm definitely, I feel like I'm a little more
thoughtful in relationships and that.
(25:32):
If there's one thing I continue to hear echoed from parents who
are ahead of me in the game, it's that kids care less about
what you say and more about whatyou do.
So it's interesting that you said showing like an active
actual action to to emulate whatever is going on.
That's usually how kids pick up stuff.
And it's so funny because a lot of the characteristics,
(25:54):
mannerisms that I notice in myself, I am now to an age where
I have enough self-awareness to be like, Oh my goodness, that's
my mother's talking through me. Like, what am I?
But that's how it works. And I think it's a beautiful
thing. You can change some of those
things for sure. But yeah, we are definitely
impressions of what our parents are were.
To a large degree, absolutely. Yeah.
(26:16):
I think it just starts with self-awareness.
Are you, Are you ready to? Yeah, be self aware and then do
you want to make the change? Yeah.
So I have so many questions for you.
I'm trying to arrange them in myhead, but the first one I have
to ask before I forget is your last name, Is it Vander Maui
Murui? How do you say the SO?
Correctly, it's Vanamava. Vander Maava, It sounds German,
(26:40):
that South African. South African, OK phenomena.
Yeah, we here in the States, I'll say Vandermoeba.
A lot. Easier.
Like the V, the WS, like AV. Yeah, OK, interesting.
Well, thanks. Now I know how to say it.
Whenever I do the Antro outro. How old were you when you quit
tennis? 2020 ish.
(27:05):
OK. And you started playing tennis
when you were, what, 7-8? Yeah, 656767.
OK, Yeah. Where's this?
That's hilarious. So that's a long time but you
know, your dad passed away when you were 15 so really it's kind
of like 50% of your career ish was pre dad post dad.
(27:29):
How, how did that affect the dream for you to like, I would
assume if you're doing Wimbledonjuniors, like you wanted to be
the best and you were doing quite well.
So how did that affect your dream?
Did that slowly start to kill itor did it not affect it?
What do you think? Yeah, unintentionally killed it.
So yeah, I just, I just struggled.
(27:49):
I really did through my late teens and 20s, Yeah.
And so, yeah, I just think like everything was kind of building
up until that point that the tournaments that I did in in
Asia, I pretty much won every single one of them.
And then I couldn't win anythingoff to that.
I was, I was just a mess. I really was.
(28:10):
Just like you're when you get upthere, OK, I'm serving like it's
just you're overthinking. You can't get into a flow state.
Like what? What really was happening?
Yeah, yeah. I mean, I did the number of
games that I was like, honestly,like 6 love, 5 Love up, like
should be should easily just close it out and then I'll just
freeze. And I can't say that was
(28:30):
directly then my dad, but I mean, there was just a lot of
things on the outside as well. Yeah.
And then those people went on tobe like top 30 in the world
professional tennis player, you know, so.
And I knew that as I knew that capability.
And then I'd keep letting myselfdown.
And then more and more I just had that that action would then
(28:50):
leave my mindset of like, well, you can't do this.
And yeah, so yeah, just kind of let it go from there.
Yeah, well, then you started doing triathlon, I guess, after
that. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Only when I was 27. So I went from playing to
coaching to then triathlon. Picking up triathlon at 27?
(29:13):
Yeah. Was there a rebirth in your
confidence during that time because if you're going on to be
a professional, or did you stillstruggle in the same way you
just had enough genetics and base to like carry yourself
through to be? Yeah, yeah.
No, I think if I was struggling,which I did, it wasn't because
of that, I'll tell you that. Different, separate, separate.
(29:34):
Yeah. I mean, I just, I had, I played
every single sport growing up. And so I was just very talented
to where I could. I, I swam a little bit when
growing up, the cycling, I felt like all the strength from the,
the tennis and the strength workI did right over to the bike we
ran. So I had success pretty quickly.
And then there was definitely a goal of like, I've messed up my
(29:56):
tennis career. Let me see if I can do this
again in triathlon and actually live up to my potential.
But I had so many things I had to work through.
I mean, one of them just being like, I had this constant body
like you hear from female athletes all the time, body
image issues and constantly under fueling myself, never
(30:18):
thinking I was lean enough, fit enough to compete.
There was obviously this massivecomparison cycle going on.
Yeah. And that hurt me big time
because I was always tired. I was always injured, just never
able to train up to my potential.
And then there was just like a lot I was emotionally not where
(30:39):
I am now. I'm not even comparable from the
person in my 20s, early 30s to where I am now.
The two don't recognize each other.
So yeah. And that didn't bode well for
trying to be a good professionalgraphly.
Yeah. Yeah.
The the body dysmorphia, like the eating disorder type of a
thing. What?
What what came about where you realized, OK, this is a problem,
(31:01):
I should probably address it. I knew I had it all along,
couldn't didn't have the tools, the capability to fix it.
I think at at some point it was actually, I think I only fixed
it when I had my daughter, to behonest, gained all this weight,
had her and it was time to I worked with a nutritionist to
lose the weight and I got in thebest shape of my life after the
(31:24):
fact. And really, she just taught me
how to fuel for performance. And what we found, I'd never
tracked my food before. And what we found was like, I
was massively under eating and my body was holding on because
of it. And as soon as I started eating
way more, which is very scary atfirst, my body just leaned out.
Yeah. Just like soaked it.
(31:45):
All up, yeah, I was like, and then I I felt amazing, like I
was. So my best years came after I
had my daughter because I alwayshad energy.
I was recovering well. I could train a lot more and at
that time, yeah, I mean, I did just a turn from like, I'm not
even going to look at the scale anymore.
Whatever I'm going to eat is well, how is that going to
benefit me from my session and recover me from my session?
(32:07):
The focus was performance. The focus wasn't body
composition at all. And I just had to switch at that
time. I'm.
So curious because this fascinates me and I've I've
never truly gone through like the transformations you're
talking about, but from when youwere under eating, were you
constantly hungry? Like did you have hunger more
and you just like, pushed yourself to not eat or in like,
(32:29):
yeah, yeah, that was it. Like that's what it feels like.
Yeah, yeah. And I would see results too, in
that I would lean down. But then all of a sudden I would
then binge eat because I had this opportunity to.
And, and so that was my cycle. I would eat almost nothing.
And then I'd be really, really hungry and I'd eat as much as I
could. OK, let me eat some more because
this is the one day I'm doing that.
(32:49):
And then the next day I'd be like, OK, no more food.
Yeah. And, and I and I would be
hungry. Yeah.
And I'd just be like, well, no, the goal is you need to, you
know, lean down. So.
Yeah. Would you say that it's fair to
say after you, you know, startedworking with the nutritionist,
did you eat until you were full or did you have to, even with
your training load, extend beyond what was full, like the
(33:11):
feeling of full? No, yeah, the no, I never ever
ate beyond what was what I thought was full.
If anything. Like before, I would overeat,
like to the point of being full.Now I never eat to the point of
being full. Like I just feel like I just eat
enough fully balanced. Like my, my diet today is like,
OK, I need this amount, I'm going to eat.
(33:34):
And even if I'm, if I'm full andthere's a little bit left on the
plate, I'm full. Yeah, I would never do that in
the past, Right. And then it's like, oh man, I
really feel like something sweet.
Well, I can go and I can grab and I'll have like a small
cookie or whatever. Fine, do that every day.
Whereas before it's like, oh, ifyou're going to eat a cookie, we
might as well eat 15 because that's limited.
(33:56):
Yeah, that was me. So now it's just like balanced
approach of like how am I feeling and just eating
intuitively, Yeah. It's interesting this whole
topic of food, especially with like American food, I think
because things are literally engineered to be put on the
shelf to be addicting. You know, when you eat Whole
(34:17):
Foods like this is my been in myexperience when I eat Whole
Foods and things that I actuallycook like whole based
ingredients and stuff, I will beeating.
And then you'll get to a place where it like doesn't even taste
good anymore, even though it tasted amazing 10 minutes ago,
but now it's like it doesn't really hit it.
But a lot of these processed foods, they never get to a place
really where it's like, I don't want, no longer want the taste
(34:37):
of this. It's like you keep going for it.
And I feel like the system is sogames against people who aren't
exercising a lot every day because like, I feel like it,
the taste buds, the over spiced,whatever, this, it's just such
an interesting field. Yeah, yeah.
I mean, we, we could go on on this conversation if we want to,
but yeah, it's. Crazy.
(34:58):
So let me ask you this question.You have done a lot.
You have quite a level of self-awareness.
You're an entrepreneur, you're amother, coach, business owner.
From your perspective though, who is Natasha?
I hear you ask this question allthe time, by the way.
I just should have prepared myself.
(35:18):
No one. Does and that's OK.
Yeah, no, it's, it's all good. Yeah.
I mean, I, I just think to myself as far as like, what do,
what do I strive to be every single day, right?
And I really, obviously we, we haven't even touched on my
faith, but truly that's like the, the beacon or the from who
I am and me. And so I wake up every day and I
(35:44):
think like yourself, like, you know, you're a child of God.
And I look at my business and I say, well, this is the plat,
this is the, what's the word? No, I can't think of it.
But essentially God has given methis business.
How am I going to steward? How am I going to steward this
business the best I can? What does that require of me as
(36:05):
far as stewarding? It's how I show up with
relationships within the business.
Am I doing well by the resourcesof our businesses, by the
athletes? What kind of impact am I making
from that standpoint? And then that carries over into
my personal life as well. And try to do the best I can
there. And I think what does the
(36:25):
Christian life really stand for?It's a life where you're
supposed to love other people. And so that's kind of my mission
is that I love other people through in my business, the
sport of triathlon and our business.
And they're coming into something where they're
receiving support for a big goalof theirs that I feel is
(36:49):
something that motivates them topush for something that's bigger
maybe than what they might work with someone else.
I don't know if that's a question you answered, but yeah,
I mean, Christian mother, everything that I do is driven
through. Like what is what has God made
me here to do? And that's it.
(37:10):
And and also I am equally compivot if I feel like God is
calling me to a different directions.
Like right now one of me is the business and my daughter, but
I'm always open to if he's calling me into something
slightly different to use my talents.
But right now, I, yeah, this is where we are, yeah.
No, that's beautiful. So let me ask you this question.
(37:34):
When you have the opportunity towalk into the throne room and
you have the opportunity to see God for the first time, assuming
you haven't already seen him, what what do you, what do you
hope that he would say to you? Or what do you?
Yeah, what do you what would be like the most meaningful thing
you could hear from him? Yeah, I mean, it's so funny.
(37:55):
I think the first thing that came to mind was well done, good
and faithful servant, right? Say the same.
But yeah, I think that's really it.
It's like, did I use my time on earth well for what he made me
for? Yeah.
And yeah. And then this.
(38:16):
It's so funny. I'm just going to speak to what
my mind goes to. It's like, OK, you can you can
rest now because I think that's a long one.
It's like every day I push forwards and I really do live on
this mindset of like, I am only going to do what God has given
me the strength to do. That's a lot.
But He's given us 24 hours in a day with eight hours of rest in
(38:37):
between. So I have to understand that
tomorrow is a new day. And even though I'm completely
wiped out from today and what it's asked of me, I will be
fresh again tomorrow. And I can tell you most nights I
go to bed going, how am I going to do this again tomorrow?
Sure enough, I wake up the next day.
I'm like, let's go, you know, But but in that I'm like, yeah,
(38:59):
at some point I'll be in I'll just to be able to rest in his
Kingdom and not have to strive for anything, even though I'm
not striving for people or it tells us not to strive just to
be. That's one thing that I've
always struggled with my entire life as well.
It's it's it's a Christian song will come up.
I was just said upper room in Dallas.
(39:20):
You know that church? It's a very well known church
that has great music, great great pastors, amazing sermons.
I have think I've seen some stuff on Instagram but I'm not
super familiar with them. Yeah, I listen to the sermons
all the time, multiple times a day actually, while I'm driving,
while I'm cooking and doing that.
And I just, I just love having it on the background.
(39:43):
But they had a song that came onand it was about stop striving,
stop, you know, and it always brings me to tears because I'm
like, yes, you got to stop striving.
Like just are. You afraid to slow down?
No, no, I'm not. But I think that what's in front
of me right now is not to slow down.
(40:05):
You know, like God continues to put.
So many opportunities in front of me.
Like again, if I couldn't handleit, he wouldn't put that in
front of me. So I've I've got to go.
So yeah, I think of that verse that says, man, I wish I could
quote exactly where it's from, but the the the harvest is great
(40:28):
and the laborers are few like that kind of situation.
I think that God really does bless those who show like that
in the little things that they they honor him or honored
kindness and love above all else.
And then there are so many opportunities and it can be
difficult honestly, for in the best way to know well which
opportunities should I go after?And because of this whole thing
(40:48):
with free will, the thing that I've struggled with the most has
been like, well, what things do I actually say yes to?
And I'm like, God, just, you know, tell me which ones
exactly. Could you give me a little
checklist? And I'll do those things.
And that's not how it works because the free will aspect,
like that's what makes the relationship, I think with God
so unlike anything else because even in my human relationships,
even in my own marriage at times, like it becomes like
(41:11):
this, oh, I want you to do this.And if you love me, you will do
this. And there is an element of that,
I think. But in an imperfect human to
human, it does not work the sameway.
So yeah, it's interesting how that all works, but you're.
I, I want to say something to that because it's a big company
that I've just had and it is andit's, we have free will to
(41:33):
choose what we're going to do. However, the scripture on it
that God, God will make those paths straight.
So we make the wrong choice. I'm fully trusting that God is
going to come in and make that choice to what he designed it to
be. And that takes the pressure off
my choices. And I have seen it play out in
(41:53):
my life many times where I'm like, man, that was a bad idea.
But while look at the blessings that actually came out of what
was probably really bad anyway. Yeah.
All things work together for those who love God.
I really do believe that becauseI've made some really stinkers
myself. Or another example, like losing
my dad in the way I did, I wouldnever say like, oh, I'm happy
that that happened. But in a strange kind of a way,
(42:15):
like I can be thankful for a lotof the outcomes of those things.
Just, yeah, a lot of people who go through a hardship like that
don't make it through in a healthy way.
And to be able to look back and say, like, wow, yeah, like God
brought me through. These people were in my life
where I had the community of triathlon or coaching or tennis
or whatever it is. There's so much to be thankful
(42:37):
for. With them, yeah.
So on your Instagram you do haveColossians 323 through 24.
I'm going to read it really quick and then I have a question
about it. So it says work willingly at
whatever you do as though you were working for the Lord rather
than for people. Remember that the Lord will give
you an inheritance as your reward, and the master that the
master you are serving is Christ.
(42:57):
So my question to you is, first of all, I love that verse.
I think it's beautiful. How does it influence the way
that you balance ambition and faith?
Because you seemed like a very ambitious person and if you were
my competitor, I would have to be very much on my toes.
So how do you balance ambition with faith?
Yeah, I mean, I I don't considerit ambition, to be honest.
(43:21):
I'm not striving for things of this world that you would say
ambition is driving you towards.I don't love that verse so much
Is it's really what brought me to Christ.
So you know, how people decide to make a leap of faith and say
I'm going to put my trust in Godand accept Jesus is because of
this negative thing that happened.
And this happened, well, for me,I had so much anxiety around
(43:44):
people pleasing it to like crippling pain.
Like I had pain in my chest. I, I had anxiety and, you know,
and then I also had like, this is this what life is about, is
going and working for this person and making them happy.
And you can't make old people happy.
And so that, that was actually my turning point in when I was
26. And so, yeah, I really just do
(44:06):
consider that whatever I am doing, it is for the Lord.
It's not for for anybody else. And in that it's again, it's
what does he want me to do? And so my ambition is driven by
I feel like this is God has placed this on my heart to
steward and that's it. So and then whatever the results
are, it's like, OK, now what do I do with this?
(44:28):
How is it going to push his Kingdom forwards and the next
decision is made? Do you feel like you've made it
or are you still chasing a mountain?
Like, do you feel like, OK, I'm like, I'm a successful person.
I'm here. I don't think I even consider
that, to be honest, like at all.Yeah.
I really just live for the day that I'm in.
(44:49):
And it's, it's so funny because most would look at my life and
say, yeah, she's, she's made it,you know, look at the career
she's made and she's living her dream.
Great. But yeah, I don't consider it.
I'm very blessed. I feel like very, very fortunate
this is a life I get to live. Absolutely.
But me making it is, am I doing the best I can with this day?
(45:14):
That's that's all I'm really focused on.
So I have no focus of the future.
Probably should you know, everyone has like a five year,
10 year plan. Like I have no concept because
who knows where God's going to take me?
Like there might be something there is.
I've had so much prophecy over me about teaching, which I teach
now, but is it going to be teaching his word in a bigger
(45:36):
way, you know? And if he takes me down that
path and opens those doors, well, that might be my path in
five years time, you know? And then you would say, well,
this wasn't on the path at all, so you weren't a success, but
that was the end goal, right. So I don't know.
Yeah. Would you say as a whole, our
sport of triathlon is filled with more believers or none
(45:56):
because you know a lot of people?
Yeah, that's interesting becauseI always look at the my team,
right, and the pool of my team. However, I'm actually a
believer. And what does that attract?
It attracts believers. So in our team we are mostly
believers as a whole. I feel like it's definitely
(46:20):
something more people are speaking about.
It was definitely taboo before even for me, right.
I had to gain a lot of confidence to say I'm going to
speak about this for sure. I don't know.
I, I would, I would say 5050, but I'd like to think it's like
7030 now, like 70 believers, 30%not, you know, no, Yeah, yeah.
(46:47):
It will be interesting. I don't know if there's an
accurate way to measure that because declared versus action
driven, Yeah, it's like it's different and it's different
because I think it's interestingbecause our culture is in the
world, at least in the popular culture that I'm involved in.
I can't speak for all of the Middle East or all of Asia
because I don't have my hand or pulse in that.
But there seems to be a large swing back toward traditional
(47:09):
values, which a lot of those, especially in America, like kind
of lean in the Christian way. And I'm wondering how that's
going to affect just how we conduct ourselves as a society
and the things we deem right andwrong.
And, you know, it's just, it's kind of, it's been interesting
to me to watch that shift happen.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I have nothing else to comment
(47:31):
on. That Is there something you want
to comment or you're afraid to comment on?
No. There's nothing else.
Yeah. If honest, If honest, like my
mind would blank there for a second.
Yeah. Yeah.
What? Yeah.
So you mentioned your coaches, you have, I think I counted 23
and and do you say NVDM coachingor do you OK, that's how you say
it. What's the hardest part about
(47:53):
running a coaching outfit of that size?
You know, if you asked me a yearor two ago, I would say the
people like the men, the people.But it's not anymore.
I feel like we've learnt throughthe five years to communicate
better, to have a better structured organization because
(48:14):
the because look at the at the end of the day, if there's any
dysfunction down here, and when I say down here, it's like my
coaches, it starts with me. I'm leading them correctly.
And then the team that's supported around me that's also
working to manage these athletes, it's me not
communicating correctly to them.So it's me.
So I feel like I've grown into abetter leader.
(48:37):
I don't think I was 1 from the onset.
It was kind of like this thing started and now all these people
are working for me. I'm like, Oh my gosh, what am I
doing? And I had to learn through that
process. And I didn't have a lot of
confidence in that process either.
Like I was put in this position,but I'm not skilled to be in
this position. And through action and through
time, I'm like, Oh no, I am like, I can do this.
(48:59):
And so, yeah, I think we're in aplace now where we are kind of
in a sweet spot. Like I things happen, we handle
them, you know, conversation is had, what's the next step?
And I do so without fear. So where's before I'd be like,
(49:19):
I'd be fearful of making the wrong step.
What does this mean for the business?
And I feel like there's enough five years of proof now that no
matter what happens, like we'll figure it out and the next step
will be taken. So, yeah, I mean, if anything,
it's just like, I work a lot like, so I, I'm handing off as
much as I can. Sure enough.
And the business would not run without my team, I'll tell you
(49:39):
that much. Everything that can be handed
off has been handed off. And they do so with full trust.
I almost don't have to speak to them.
They know their roles, which is incredible, right?
It took us a little while to getthere, but because of me, not
because of them. They were willing from the
beginning. And yeah, but with that, more
has come on. And now I'm like, OK, how do I
delegate the next thing? So it's like the delegation and
(50:02):
in trusting and teaching, because there's a process,
right? If I'm going to delegate well,
now I'm committing to telling you how to do it.
Well, that's that takes time. Sometimes you're like, I'll just
do it. You know, I just, I just have to
do more of that because at the end of the day, it's like this
has to be scalable. It has to be this long term
vision. Otherwise what we're doing right
now makes no sense. And that's how we've always
(50:25):
operated and how I've put back into the company is like with
that long term vision. Yeah.
What part of leading this, this group, this people gives you the
most joy? What I just, I mean, I love the
fact that I essentially am responsible for 23 jobs, if that
(50:54):
makes sense. Like that is that is a big on my
shoulder, but what a gift that is.
I'm like, wow, that's what I'm getting to do.
And I take that very seriously. And so something like I have
with him, it's like, what are your goals?
What do you want to do? What do you need to make for
your family? OK, let's get there.
You know, I really enjoy that. Like I still do payroll.
(51:14):
I'm a part of, I don't need to be, but I'm still a part of
payroll to go. Oh my gosh, I just put out X
amount for payroll this week. That's crazy.
You know, that's kind of fun. Yeah.
And then I mean, the first answer should have gone there
first. The relationships, I mean, they
truly have become like family. Mike, who's my CEO, CEO, he's
(51:35):
been with me from the very beginning.
I mean, we've had some little but not much.
I can probably say two or three,but we will be straight away.
That hurt my feelings and I think we should address this
differently. I'm like, OK, no, you're right.
And so we have that conversation.
I appreciate it. And then 10 minutes later, we're
as if nothing happened because we've moved forwards.
(51:56):
And those are pretty incredible relationships to have.
Yeah. Yeah, I can imagine there's
quite a bit of joy that comes from the ability to have
conflict resolution in a good way, because that's a, that's an
art and a skill that takes a lotof trips around the sun I think
to start to figure out. Are you comfortable with
confrontation nowadays? I guess it's kind of says sounds
(52:16):
like you are. I am, yeah.
I'm very address things pretty quickly.
Yeah, I feel like I always address it fairly.
And so I have confidence in that, those meetings.
And then honestly, I am always quick to listen in that if they
feel differently because I have to understand their side of it,
(52:37):
I'm going to fully hear it out, consider it and then try to make
the best decision moving forward.
So I think again, it's proof of results of what's happened in
the last five years. Give me gives me then the
confidence of where I am now andhow I'm going to move forwards.
Do you feel like you've made or had to make any sacrifices that
(52:57):
you might regret one day? Definitely the time with my
daughter, yeah. That's the said that.
Yeah. So, yeah, absolutely.
And it's my, my, my hope and desire is that she gets to see
that I'm living out my dream of impacting a lot of people that
brings them a lot of joy. And that's something she desires
(53:17):
for herself as well. So it's not like I'm in a a job
that I don't enjoy. Like I love it.
It just takes a lot of me. And hopefully through that
action and seeing that that willbe a good influence on her.
I'm sure it will. Yeah.
Her favorite thing, I always askher what her favorite thing is.
And it's just purely spending time with me.
And so the fact that it's takingaway from that, it's just like,
(53:38):
yes. Do you feel like your mom's
proud of what you're doing? Absolutely.
Yeah. Does she say it?
No. Is.
That a South African thing. I think it's my mom thing.
Probably not. Yeah.
So it's so funny. Like she won't say too much to
my face every now and again. I'm like, thank you.
I I can count on listen one hand, by the way, but when she's
(54:01):
speaking to someone else and I will happen upon that
conversation, she is it comes inbeaming pride, you know?
And I'm like, OK, like she just doesn't say it to me.
But that's. Yeah.
Do you? Do you think that you are
similar in your interactions with your own daughter or are
you? She's going to know.
(54:22):
You are so proud. Yeah.
Yeah, I feel like my mom's mothering style of me and mine
of my daughter. 'S is quite a different dad.
And my mom is my mom. Yeah, definitely the yeah, I've
never like if you think of all the things you could get into
where smoking and drugs and all like, no, I saw.
(54:43):
I saw the wrath of my mom and myolder sisters, like I will never
so. And she's, yeah, I make it sound
worse than it is, but you definitely, yeah, you don't mess
around. Yeah, what do your older sisters
do now? So my middle sister's a tennis
coach very, very good. And my older sister works for
(55:06):
she's like in counting. So CFO.
Type role. Nice.
All daughters. Yes.
Did you go for it? No, yeah.
And they're two step, the Hoff sisters.
So they have what I was my my dad's only child.
Oh wow, how many years are you guys separated by?
(55:27):
7:00 and 5:00. Seven and five, yeah, that's a
good chunk. It is.
Yeah, it is. I came, came on and yeah, it was
a different, a different split, definite split to where I was
definitely kind of doing my own thing, yeah.
Did you ever wish you had a brother?
No. You don't know what you were
missing. That's all it is.
(55:49):
My, my little sister, we were tomboys growing up.
OK, yeah. And I've said like, I had a
brother. Yeah.
Yeah, that's so. Cool.
So I, this is a question I've been holding on to for a while.
I don't think there's any good way to like jump back into it
because we kind of moved away from it a little bit.
But when I was asking questions about your dad, like, you know,
there was a little emotion that started to come through.
My question is, are you afraid of the emotions that make you
(56:14):
sad? Why?
Do you not like them? No, I mean, I Hmm, yeah, I can.
I don't know. I don't know how to answer that
question. I can definitely tell you that
(56:41):
when I am with people and I present myself, there is a
certain level of a person that Ifeel like I should present to
us. And in that there is a shield
around me that only so many get to see that other side of me.
And I feel like that level of vulnerable vulnerability and
emotion is, yeah, it's just not something that I put out to the
(57:06):
world easily. And I think it's a level of like
a little level of respect. Maybe I'm in this position that
I can't look like I'm don't haveit together kind of thing.
That's why I stopped myself fromfrom that.
However, I have found in this last year with everything that
I've been through, the benefit of actually opening up and how
(57:29):
it deepens relationships. And so this year, I have been
more open about my personal lifethan I ever have usually.
It was closed door. And yeah.
And through that, I've now have the closest, closest of friends
that I've ever had in my entire life of 44 years of living.
(57:49):
So. So yeah, yeah, I think, I think
that's it. I think yeah.
I just, I just feel like there'sonly so much emotion one should
show in the position that I'm in.
Yeah, no, that's fair. That is fair.
I found myself also adapting similar.
I don't know if you'd call them strategies or tactics or ways of
operating in a position of leadership, especially because
(58:13):
I've had people who've worked for me that I'm related to.
So it's like, well, during Thanksgiving we're this person,
but then when we're working, it's like a totally different,
one of them is actually my mom. So like figuring out how that
dynamic, it's actually, it's interesting.
I'm just kind of sharing freely a little bit, but it's one of
the greatest things I think thathappened that enriched the
relationship with my mother because I felt like she really
(58:34):
respected me for the first time in a in a meaningful way when I
was like in a position of leadership.
And that felt really good as yeah.
Because there's other things that I can still go to her for,
to seek wisdom, but to know thatshe can like look to me, up to
me a little bit like that's a pretty special thing.
So I can understand. Yeah.
And I've only been talking to you for 57 minutes, so you know,
(58:55):
I'm, I'm trying to crack you open.
But I mean, it's I, I really respect that.
Like to, to, like you mentioned,respect being a factor of like
who you choose to open up with about.
And you have only have so many people that you can do that
with. And I think that's really
important. A lot of people don't know how
to do that or regulate that. And that's a, again, a super
important skill. I feel like that I'm still
(59:16):
mastering. I agree, yeah.
Do you spend more time in your head or your heart?
Bit of both, yeah. Yeah, I've learned to, I
actually, it was a realization Ihad this year where I would, I'd
have an event that I'm going to and I knew who would be there.
And in my mind I would practice and, and this is intentionality
(59:38):
that I go into these, these, these times with people.
What questions am I going to ask?
What then questions am I going to ask if they answer this way
or this way to make sure that there's always conversation that
is being had and interest being showed.
Because I'll get in a room with someone and they will talk.
I can get them to talk about themselves for an hour, you
know, non-stop. But I've prepared that trying to
(59:59):
let that go a little bit to leave room, you know, and, and
also I read somewhere and I think it was maybe a daily
devotional about just taking toomuch control away from from God
and by doing stuff like that. And so.
For me, it's like, well, it's part business, but but yeah, I'm
(01:00:20):
trying to trying to just more be.
With that being said, that's thehead side of it.
There is a hard side of it and Iam someone that that wears their
heart on their sleeve in a sense.
Again, I've learned to control that.
So only some people see it, but it's, it's there.
Like I'm definitely, as much as I have life, things happen to me
(01:00:43):
and I should definitely have a vault around me and my heart at
this point, I somehow don't. And I think it's knowing my part
is that I have the ability to love freely, give freely.
And only so many people can do that and how wonderful it is to
receive that. Why would I not do that?
And so I just made the decision that that's what I'm going to
(01:01:04):
do, even though it hurts me mostof the time so and has hurt me
many times so. Yeah, to radical vulnerability
is a pretty radical thing to be able to do that with anybody
because it it opens you up to tobe hurt greatly.
But it also opens us up, I thinkto be like to be loved greatly.
(01:01:24):
Because something I figured out in the past couple of years
after going to this just three day weekend that focused a lot
on this one concept and that washow to accept affirmation.
Because if you don't and you can't be loved, if you don't
allow yourself to be loved, thenhow in the world are you going
to pour that out into someone else?
And that's a hard thing to do because often times whenever
(01:01:45):
people be like, oh, Seth, you'reso this or that.
And you know, these positive compliments most of us are like.
Whatever. And the thing that like hit me
between the eyes was like, wait,they had us write down all of
our inner critic voices, say them out loud to ourselves for
like 3 minutes. And then the music stopped as we
were saying this. And they had us pull out a
picture out of this envelope. And it was me as like a 7 year
(01:02:06):
old kid. And they were like, would you
ever say that to a little kid like that?
And I just, I cried. And I cried because I realized,
like, it made it so practical. I realized like, Oh my goodness,
that's what we're all doing. We're beating up our little
inner child that is still there.And yeah, isn't that crazy?
Yeah. Just a couple more questions for
(01:02:26):
you though. What makes what makes a good
coach different from a great coach?
Yeah, I mean, she speak about this with that coach all the
time. At the end of the day, it's it's
the relationship you have with the athlete.
And so when you think about whata good relationship is, it's
really good communication. It's a lot of like true care
(01:02:49):
followed by action, right? And so it's like you have so
many coaches who are so smart, you know, they know it all, but
they don't know how to either relay that to the athlete to
help them correctly. They maybe the the work ethic is
(01:03:11):
not there to be honest to where there is true care shown.
I just, I just the word action is there, right?
So it's like you as a coach, I tell athletes like after every
single workout we're looking, we're assessing, you're asking
practical questions like, OK, this went well, how do we make
it better at all times? And and then you're doing that,
(01:03:32):
you're following it up with, OK,let's get you a video of this
forum and let's make sure the feedback is given so that we can
run correctly, etcetera. There's so many things to it.
You're always uncovering and asking different questions to
make this athlete better. And so, so, yeah, I think it's,
it's work. But I think above all, it's it's
(01:03:53):
a relationship. And I think why I have athletes
that have been with me for 1012 years is because we've become so
close as friends. And that just requires you to
show up in a different way. You're not just a coach giving a
workout plan like you truly, truly, you're showing up as a
friend who cares and then working accordingly.
(01:04:14):
Yeah, good, good stuff. So my final question for you is
a total selfish one, because you're ahead of me and you have
a nine year old. What?
How can I prepare? What?
What makes a good dad, do you think?
Two things. It's so in the beginning, it's
(01:04:35):
hard for the dad because you haven't given birth to this baby
and most of the things that yourwife is going to do, like she
has to do. So I think your role in the
beginning is how do you best support your wife at the end of
the day, because there's only somuch you can do and being OK
with that, right? And then that role will change
and, and you will be looked at and you think of all the
(01:04:59):
character characteristics of a man to his wife.
But now you're giving that to your child as far as like
stability and safety and care and, and I think just showing up
in that manner, that will probably be more important later
on. I think at first we just talked
about it. It's about just being present,
(01:05:19):
right, For whatever that moment entails.
Every time you show up, it's probably going to look a little
different. But yeah, I mean, you are the
head of the household and you have to demonstrate it for your
wife and for your child. And you will set the tone of how
everybody shows up and you will dictate that.
(01:05:40):
Thanks for that feedback. Yeah, I have been thinking a lot
about this next year because thebaby's due in February and for
the past five years or so I've been like, OK, it's November,
December. I'm planning out all my races
and what I'm going to do for this next year.
And to be honest, I haven't truly figured out how this next
year's going to look. I told my wife I'm not going to
race really at all, although there's a brand new 70.3 that's
coming to our hometown. So I'm going to do that one
(01:06:02):
singular race. But in terms of like training
schedule and timing. And you know, my wife, I feel
like she feels most supported, at least historically, by just
being present like you were saying, but like actually there
beside her in the moment when she's going through something.
So I think there's still that. But a lot of the other stuff I'm
still a little fuzzy on like, well, she's gonna have to feed
the baby mostly. Like what do I do?
(01:06:24):
I guess we'll pump some and I'llhelp there.
Like, I don't, I don't really know, Maybe it'll all come to
me. Yeah, I think you guys will
figure it out. I think just like open
communication about what the needs are.
I will tell you this. Like if you you have to have
your own thing, I raced better after I had Nadine because I
made time for myself and but that time was super intentional.
(01:06:45):
And I'm like, OK, if I'm going to take time away, if in your
case from your wife, from your baby, I'm going to go make the
most of this next hour. And in that you'll, you'll
actually have a really great session and you'll build great
fitness. But that time is going to have
you show up better when you comecome back to them.
If you don't have that time, you're actually all going to
show upwards for each other. So I would say like you still
(01:07:06):
need to make sure you're taking care of yourself.
So then you can show up and thenit's just coordinating the times
to do that correctly. That works for her baby.
Sleeping, she's resting, etcetera on.
Three hours of sleep is what I'mafraid of, yeah.
How am I going to do? Yeah, it's so funny all the
things you're worried about. I look back on that time ago
(01:07:27):
that wasn't actually such a big deal.
You get bad strength, by the way.
Like it's a whole. You're just excited about life.
3 hours of sleep is no big deal.So excited about this family you
now have. And you get to before and, you
know, the changing of the diaperand all of that.
Like, I just wish I embrace thattime more, knowing it's just a
(01:07:49):
small part of time, yeah. Well, Natasha, it has been a
great joy and honor to get to pry through your life and ask
questions and learn more about you.
Yeah, it's brought a lot of joy,a lot of things for me to think
about. So I can't always say that for
every episode. So I really appreciate it for
you. Let me do it.
Yeah, appreciate the conversation, Seth, always such
(01:08:11):
good questions. Appreciate what you're doing so
and opportunity to get to know you as well.
Yeah. Thank you.
Thank you very much. It is podcasts like these that
keep me coming back for more. What a great conversation with
Natasha. You know, it's so much fun for
me to ask all these questions about their lives, but selfishly
(01:08:31):
asking the ones about parenthoodright now at the season of life
that I'm in, I think is what gives me the most excitement.
I guess that makes sense. I don't know why I'm surprised
by that or decide to share that,but that's something that is on
my heart and I really, I appreciate it.
We're coming down to the wire for the last couple of episodes
here for the season before I do a little bit of a send off as I
(01:08:51):
go to take off some time and then come back in the 2026 year.
But this is one of the best onesthat I've done in quite a while.
I really appreciate Natasha taking the time to let me dig
deep, especially around some of the sensitive topics about
losing her dad and stuff. Obviously means a lot to me to
be able to talk about those things because I've experienced
them and Natasha seems to be doing quite well considering the
(01:09:13):
things that she has gone through.
So thank you Natasha for again for taking the time to spend
with me and for all you guys listening.
Thank you so much for being here.
Make sure to follow like, subscribe, comment, do all those
things helps continue to grow the pod.
Thank you so much and we'll catch you in the next one.
Peace.
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