In this episode, Seth Hill and Victor dive into a wide-ranging conversation that begins with Victor’s recent business trip and the challenges of building a brand in the U.S. market. The discussion quickly deepens, exploring the cultural implications of pornography, personal struggles with addiction, and the impact of marriage on sexuality and intimacy. They reflect on how personal trauma shapes relationships—especially within marriage and parenting—and the unique challenges of raising daughters in a world shaped by social media and sexualized content. With a focus on discipline, faith, and personal responsibility, the conversation underscores the importance of open dialogue, healthy relationships, and a deeper understanding of love in navigating modern pressures around sexuality.
Feya India on Modern Wisdom: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmU7VVxhERw
Dr. Julie Smith on Modern Wisdom: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-lDza7kSqvw
Victor’s IG: https://www.instagram.com/victorcastellobrancoz2/
Z2 IG: https://www.instagram.com/z2performance/
Z2 Website: https://z2alwayschasing.com/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:02):
How's it going everybody? Pornography.
That is going to be the majorityof the topic for today's
conversation with Victor Bronco.This is his round two interview
and I wanted to have him on again to talk about this touchy,
but I think very important topicmatter and subject that needs to
be hopefully the starting point of a lot of conversations.
(00:23):
I believe that in a lot of ways this is probably one of the most
important podcasts that ever recorded and it gets real and
raw and just really happy to have the opportunity to record
it, especially with someone likeVictor over at Zone 2.
He is starting an amazing company there and if you want to
check out that company, you can do so in the show notes.
But I hope you enjoy this conversation and just want to
(00:44):
say before he even starts, thankyou Victor for allowing me to
have the space with you to have this conversation.
A bit sick traveling and not sleeping.
Coming back home. Yeah, no, in in the States.
New York was cold as hell. Then we went to to Boulder after
(01:07):
that. The guys were also in Anaheim,
so pretty intense trip. Yeah.
How long were you gone in total?I was gone for about 15 days.
The guys here were gone for about 2020 something days.
Nice man, it's a long trip. What was the?
Almost a month. Yeah, that's long time.
What? What were the goals that you
(01:28):
placed for this trip? So, so we were, we were meeting
with some suppliers and distributors and some, some
stores at the at the Expo in Anaheim.
It's called the Expo West. Big one.
Something like nutrition and nutrition and something Expo.
(01:48):
It's very big, very, very big. I went there last year and I
wanted my my general manager forthe US and my marketing manager
also to see what the brands are doing and how, how stuff works
in the US. So I sent them there and we also
had all a few meetings lined up there.
From there. We met up in New York.
(02:09):
We had like some activation, some samplings and also some
visit in some stores for New York.
We're going to use New York as like our our running hub or
distribution. We're going to work there
mainly. And then we made a crazy 2 day
trip to Boulder just just to close some deals.
(02:32):
We we had to meet up with with Trevor Foley.
Then we met up with Holly Lawrence as well to to sign her
contract and then a visit also to Matt Johnson and the feed to
see how, how to basically to to close a deal there with feed and
and get stuff shipped there to them.
Yeah. So yeah, it was a a quick sort
(02:54):
of long trip, but but quick in terms of the the bunch of.
Things, yeah, you're bouncing around a lot.
Yeah, so and also the, the, the time difference also caught up
to us because we we're I think one hour where, where are you
now? Are you California?
I'm Pacific. Yeah, in California.
So we're about, I think 3 hours behind.
(03:16):
What time is it there? It's 11 AM.
Yeah, or more. It's 3:00, so it's 55 hours
behind. Yeah, you're 5 hours behind.
So the time difference, we slept, I think one day, one
hour, and we went out for a run.We also ran the island of
Manhattan, so that was like 30 something miles.
It was cold, yeah. We did a.
(03:37):
Bunch of stuff, Yeah. We did a bunch of stuff, yeah.
Did do you find success in termsof getting the contracts
relationships built that you needed to kind of cement into
place if you're allowed to say? Yeah, it's, I mean, it's still,
it's still, it's almost like starting all over again the
company because like we've, we've built a bunch of stuff
here in Brazil, but in terms of like brand recognition, you have
(03:58):
to start from zero. So you can't go on what you have
here. And just like, yeah, we're the
best selling brand in Brazil that won't sell you inside the
big retailer. So you have to start the brand
there. And yeah, but I talking to Matt
from the feed, I get the feelingthat most of the brands that
come into the US that are from abroad, they just like, dude,
(04:19):
you're the, you're the place to be in.
I'll pay you the money. And I don't want the hassle to
try and develop the brand there in the States.
But we're, we want the hassle, we want to be there.
We want to have contact with thepeople.
So I, we were talking to Matt, like the deal that you have with
these guys doesn't really apply to us because we're going to be
pushing product. Like people are going to come
(04:41):
looking for the product in your website different than the other
brands that you have there. And that you go fish in the, in
the European Union and whatever you have these like innervate
brands and, and more and more common European brands that he
brings abroad from abroad, it's going to be a bit different.
So he managed to convince him sothat that was a good a good part
(05:02):
of it as well. Yeah, Congrats, man.
That's awesome. Well, first of all, I just want
to say thank you so much for making the time to come on a
second time. I've been wanting to have this
conversation a while. This has been one that's been on
my radar for I guess since we booked it relatively soon after
we've had our first conversation.
But I guess for those listening,I'll just preface the
conversation really quick to saywhen we had our first
(05:24):
conversation, I forget exactly how the topic was raised, but
you mentioned that, you know, interms of just negative aspects
of life, one of the things that had been a part of your life and
then has since not become a partof your life anymore has been
pornography. And I've had a huge struggle
(05:46):
with that over the years, some battling there.
And I feel like this is a conversation that is probably
more ripe to be had than probably anytime in the past
1520 years, I think just becauseof its prevalence, because
statistically everyone has dealtwith it in some fashion.
(06:09):
I forget it's in the 90 ish percent in terms of like the
number of males that struggle with it.
And then it's climbing for females as well.
So I just wanted to open up the space for us to kind of
literally beat the horse to death because I think it should
be beat. And yeah, just, I guess the
first place I'd love to open up with.
It's just when, when I bring up the topic of pornography for
(06:34):
you, what, what, what does that invoke in you?
Like what? What kind of stories come to
mind? What kind of battles?
Anything at all you want to share?
Then I have some more specific pointed questions that we can
dive into as well. Yeah, man, I think it's, it's a
tough one because it's sort of alike ambivalent is, is what you
(06:54):
learn of, of being a man, at least from, from the 90s of how
I grew up. Like this is how, how you become
a man. You have to have your Playboy.
You, you, you have to like girlsin a certain way.
And this is how you, how men behave.
You go to Barber shops and thereare a bunch of pictures of, of
naked women on, on the wall. And I grew up around that
(07:19):
because here in Brazil we have like these sort of like country
clubs. It's more common here and it's
more popular to more people haveaccess to it.
And like when you grew up with your friends, that was basically
being the cool guy would be the guy that that owns the the the
Playboy magazines that eventually had the VHS of the of
(07:40):
the new porn that came out and and future after that came, I
think Limewire came the the the downloads from the Internet and
then after that, like your X videos.
Yeah, your, your, your websites.So, you know, it was sort of
like a, a, a rite of passage in here in Brazil.
(08:01):
It goes even a step further, I think in the States.
It's more common here in Brazil for you to lose your virginity
at a a sort of whorehouse. Seriously.
Wow. Yeah, it's, it's, it's more it's
like like you guys have in the States, sort of like your strip
clubs. It's the same thing here.
But you, you buy for you buy sex, you don't buy a lot that.
Yeah. So it's legal in Brazil?
(08:22):
It's legal. It's it's it's borderline, but
it's you have it everywhere. You have it in every city here
in Brazil. Wow.
And it's sort of the same thing as, as, as becoming a man in
terms of you, you, you masturbate, you, you see
pornography, you, you have all that kind of stuff.
(08:43):
It was that you had to have sex at an early age between like
you're 13 to like 17. You're expected to either have
had a girlfriend or go someplaceget your, get your, your sex on
with, with a prostitute. And, and that, that was
something that really conflictedme with my religious life,
(09:05):
especially because I, I always had a sort of connection with,
with religion at some point in my life, be it from a very early
age or like I had different points of connection.
So when I was younger, this wasn't a real big problem, but I
always had like my parents more as more of guys in terms of
(09:27):
religion getting to my teens. I had more of a, I got it from
my grandparents, my grandfather,my grandmother, because we, we
went to this Country Club, the same one that had the, the, the
porn pictures on the wall. But my, my grandmother, she was
a minister of the church there. So she would ask me to go every
every Saturday. And I had that conflict that
(09:47):
like, I know this is wrong, but everyone does it.
And it's something that, that affirms me as a, as a man.
So I have to do it. So when you talk about
pornography, that's how I was basically like thought to
believe in pornography and and that it was something more
harmless and more more not necessary, but something that
(10:07):
everyone had to do to become a man you.
Know, wow, that's crazy. First of all, thanks for sharing
that. I had no previous context to
understand or know that. So that's wild just to hear just
the cultural difference there. So I guess the next question I
have for you is based on a little bit of my own experience,
(10:28):
but so there there's these kind of two chapters in my life of
how I've related with porn. So when I it was pre marriage
and when you're younger, you know, you're just going through
puberty, especially as a man, can't speak for the women, but
especially as a man, like, you know, you're going through
puberty and you start having thejust these raging hormones and
lust is like it is a burning fire within every young man and
(10:52):
trying to figure out an outlet for that.
And in a good way, it's like very difficult.
So for me, I actually wasn't introduced into pornography till
I was probably 12 or 13 was at my friend's house, who was at my
time the best friend. And he had like this little
wooden chest that he had under lock and key and, you know,
pictures that he printed off theInternet.
And, you know, then he'd show mestuff on his computer.
(11:12):
And because I was a late bloomerin the beginning, honestly, it
was just that curiosity thing. It wasn't even something that
like I was really that into like13.
I really hadn't gone through puberty yet.
And so there wasn't like that just overwhelming stimulation
going on in the brain where it'slike, oh, I want to go after
this. So then after I started to go
through puberty, then, you know,it was a lustful thing.
(11:32):
I was seeking after it. And then what I realized that,
you know, even after being married and I went through and
we can talk about this too, but I went through like a four or
five year period of like watching no pornography
whatsoever. I'd totally given it up.
But then as it's come back into my life, unfortunately over the
past several years, and it's like this once a month thing
where like I, I shun it and thenlike I, I go to it now instead
(11:56):
of necessarily for lust, it's like of this wanting to have a
sense of comfort or security or a relationship or companionship
or something that like it is empty within me.
So it's like in the beginning, it's this lustful thing as we
get older, I think. And I'd be curious to hear what
your experience has been or whatyou've heard from other people.
But it's like it becomes something I'm grabbing out for
(12:16):
in order to fill some type of a void.
So like, those are the two distinct chapters in my life
where I related to it differently.
Did you experience those similarchapters?
And yeah. Definitely, yeah.
I was also a late bloomer, so interms of I had the same feeling
as like curiosity and also beinga part of the guys because like
(12:38):
my friends like used to have magazines and stuff.
So I would I would also be part of the group.
I think I also wanted my own magazines and but yeah, once
once purity hits and that showerof hormones and I didn't have
triathlon or anything to, to suppress that energy and outlet.
(13:02):
It all went not just born but also like girls and and running
after as many girls as possible and A and a different lifestyle
that that would be healthy. After that I, I think I, I kept
at it until like maybe I starteddating my wife and then it
(13:24):
started to tone down because it,it made less sense.
We, we saw a lot of each other, like we started also having a
relationship and that's something else.
So that I, I, I think I never talked about is, is that we, we
also started like this, this journey together in terms of
(13:45):
like what we want out of our relationship.
And it started evolving in something like we want to get,
if we want to get married, we want to get married in the
church. We're both Catholic, but we're
living in sin because we were having sexual relationships.
So how do we, how do we make peace with this?
And whilst I'm, I'm, I'm having these discussions, I'm also
(14:06):
having these internal discussions in terms of porn and
masturbation and, and, and everything that goes with it.
And, and that's also conflicting.
So we decide like we get engagedand I think from the moment we
get engaged, we decide that we're not going to have sex till
we get married, which was about a year.
And we've started seeing a priest for like, I don't know
(14:29):
how you say that in English, butit's sort of like a consultation
for the marriage. Like premarital don't.
Really want to do this exactly premarital counseling And it
worked really well for us because we managed to understand
why we were doing it and why we were getting married and what
marriage meant. And that's something that's
tough like we, we, we, we discussed last time is like, you
(14:49):
have to have the same meaning asmarriage as your spouse or else
you're going to expect somethingdifferent from it than your
spouse. So it needs to have the same
meaning for you as it does for her.
And that made it easier to startcutting that side of porn off.
And masturbation also was a different, was a different point
of it as well, because every time you, you, you watch porn,
(15:13):
you, you watch porn to masturbate.
So it was something else that I wanted to, I've always wanted to
cut off since I, I started getting closer with God and, and
once I got married, I had the like I'm going to, I'm going to
cut it off because once I cut that off, I'm automatically not
going to need porn. Like I usually had porn only
(15:34):
because of that. So I started like this whole
journey in my marriage to stop start cutting it off and I and I
sort of eased it out. I have like every year I would
count like I cannot, I cannot masturbate this month and I, I
would fall into temptation. I would, I would, I would, I
would falter. But eventually I, I got to a
point where I, I was able to control myself like completely.
(15:56):
So nowadays I, I, I never, I never masturbated, I never watch
porn. And it's not something that it's
hard. I I, I, I, I hear myself saying
it and I, I, we, I have like a, like a Bible studies group,
which are guys my age. And I told them this like last
year and they were like, are youcrazy, man?
How can you like? And I'm like, I know it seems
(16:19):
crazy nowadays, but it's, it's not as hard as it seems once
you're married. Like I have a married life.
So it's not like I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm celibate, which would be
tough as well. But once you start getting rid
of it, you start understanding also why it's so bad for you,
like why it's bad for you and obviously the industry of the
(16:40):
people that it affects. So that's a bit of the the
journey in terms of the arc pornography that that I lived
through. Yeah.
So I think for anybody who doesn't have a religious
context, it becomes a bit more difficult for for the for the
mindset conclusion to be settledon.
This is wrong. So I would love to hear on the
(17:00):
topic of like masturbation, pornography, infidelity, why is
it wrong? I wouldn't even say just
religion, OK. I think it's it's easier for
religion because basically you get your rules like you can't.
Do that and it's. Set in stone and you're, you're
not supposed to do it because it, it's bad for you, it's bad
(17:23):
for your soul. So and, and you believe that and
obviously there's an explanationto it.
But if you look at it from a practical standpoint, it's
obviously not healthy. It's something that you're
watching people do and, and it stimulates a part of you that
you're looking at someone else to get pleasure whilst you have
your wife or wife, whilst you have your, your, your girlfriend
(17:45):
and you feel like, and you don'tneed religion for that.
You feel like you're, you're cheating every time you do that
because you're getting pleasure from someplace else.
And what religion basically saidis, is that you're, you are
cheating on your girlfriend every time that you do that,
you're cheating on your, your wife every time that you do
(18:06):
that. And, and to live in a lie is
something that destroys you and makes you look at yourself as a,
as a worse person, as someone that's not worthy of, of love
and, and other stuff. So every time you fall into
that, it's like a negative circle that you, that you keep,
(18:26):
you keep doing it and you keep doing it to search for some
pleasure and it, and it all, all, it's like a drug.
So why, why do people get high on, on cocaine or on, on crack?
Because once they do it, it's the best feeling ever.
But 2 seconds after that, or I don't know, 10 minutes after
that, they feel like shit. So it's the same sort of concept
(18:47):
and, and it breaks something inside of you as well.
And that's more, more coming, coming more from a religious
standpoint, But it, it's, it's this the sacredness that we have
that that is our body, our temple, that we're basically,
not only are we, we, we be throwing away, we're throwing
(19:09):
away our sacredness, but we're also throwing away the
sacredness of people that are doing the act on a, on a, on a
video or whatever, whatever. So it it it makes us more more
like animals and less less like humans.
One of the most thought provoking arguments or or
proposals of thought that I've heard.
Most recently, I think it was byJordan Peterson, but it's been
(19:32):
and if you know who he is or not, I'm not sure.
But his this idea I think has been echoed through several
different popular orators. But it's the concept of, you
know, a lot of the identity thatpeople assign themselves
nowadays is in relation to theirdesires.
(19:52):
So, you know, not to pick on anyparticular group.
But if I'm like, you know, if I have the same sex, same sex
attraction, well, I'm gay. Well, like my identity's wrapped
up in that or, you know, I'm, I'm whatever, you know, you can
attribute to that. But a lot of them have to do
with like sexual orientation, which is like the very base need
or desire. And if we like, if we identify
(20:13):
ourselves with our base desires,then like, OK, well, what, You
know, if I control. Yeah, it's going to control us.
And you go down any of those paths and.
What's even blows my mind even more with like the stuff like
the Diddy conversation or a lot of these people that are into
just the most horrific forms of sexual manipulation of others,
even underage. It's like if, if I was ever in a
(20:35):
place I would be, I would be concerned if I was ever in a
place where I had the unlimited money and connections and could
get anything I want with no check or balance.
Because really in a lot of ways,for example, like being poorer
or having less economic availability, you have these
(20:56):
checks and balances to kind of put force against a lot of those
base desires. Because I, I really truly do
believe I told my wife this before we were dating.
I was like, I think that like the core of 90% of all the
problems when the world is actually pornography or like
sexual promiscuity, because you start to go down any of those
paths and you're always seeking the next high.
And you see it with drug addictsvery plainly because it's out in
(21:17):
the open. You know, you're always seeking
the next high and then like, you're willing to steal for it
and then you're willing to kill for it.
And then you're willing to do anything you can to get that
high. And I think it's the same way
for sexual things, which is like, you know, I, I watched, I
don't know if you know who Ted Bundy is.
Yeah, yeah. Have you seen his testimony?
(21:37):
Yeah, where he had that? Well, so yeah, there's that.
But that he had this actual interview, I think it was like a
day or a few hours before he wasto be executed.
And for those who don't know him, like, careful, we look up.
But Ted Bundy like did a lot of horrible things, killed a lot of
people and involved a lot of like really messed up sexual
stuff. But in the interview, he was
asked like, you know, you know, what was it that like caused
(21:59):
this essentially? And he went down the path.
He's like, well, I came from a normal family, had loving
parents, went to a good school. But when I was young, you know,
I found pornography and then I started to seek the next extreme
thing and the next extreme thingand the next extreme thing until
he was like essentially killing people and, and raping them to
find that high to where it wouldlike completely disassociate and
(22:21):
he would turn into like a complete different person.
So I'm of the belief that reallylike pornography, sexual
addiction is the root of many forms of evil and sin.
And it's just crazy. But my question, I guess I want
to shift the topic slightly is because this is something that I
learned that I wish someone would have given me context for
(22:45):
prior to being married. So pre marriage, we've all
experienced lust. It burns hot, it burns fast.
It's like, it's like throwing gasoline on flames.
It's just like, you know, boom. And then it's gone a second.
And then after getting married that that sexual experience was
totally different because this person that I and me and my
(23:05):
wife, we decide not to have sex before marriage as well.
And came close a few times to break in that oath, but we kept
that. And then after getting married,
sex became like this slow burn. And there's no shame attached.
And not to be like overly graphic, but like after orgasm
or after that climax, you know, you don't feel that sense of
shame. You feel that connection, that
oneness with that partner. And so like the comparing and
(23:27):
contrasting for me between like a pornography experience and
like being married and, you know, being with someone, like
those were two totally differentfires that I like did not know
existed. And you know, for some people,
if they go into marriage or any relationship even let's just
throw marriage outside for a second and you're expecting to
have that same level of fire. If you truly love that person,
(23:50):
it's not going to be there. And I wanted to tell people
like, that's that's actually OK.I think that's normal.
And I don't know if you had a similar experience.
Yeah, that's you should expect it because eventually it's not
that it, it's dies down or anything, it's just that it's
different and and it's I, I, I think it's more beautiful.
(24:13):
I, I look at it as something, and, and I heard someone say
this the other day and it not only sex, but in terms of love,
like, like the love that you have for that your parents have
for you. It's, it's something that, that
(24:34):
you, you never earned. It's something that they'll give
you regardless what you're doing, how high you are, how low
you are, how pretty you are. And the love that you give your
kids is the same. Like you never ask for anything
in return. It's just like you'll love them
no matter what, but the love that you have for your spouse,
(24:54):
it's different because it's something that, that it's not,
it's it, it's not something that, that, that, it's that,
that you have naturally something that you have to
decide every day. And that's why it's the most
important aspect of religion. It's, it's, it's that or the
order of the priestess. So it's either you, you grow the
(25:17):
flock as a, as a, as a, as a married person, or you're a
priest and you're like a shepherd for the, for the flock.
So the most important thing for the, for the church that why did
why does religion is exist is toprotect the family.
Once you, you put pornography and you put lust and you put
(25:37):
other things that are fast burning and that only
deteriorate from the family. It's it's it's definitely going
to look more attractive because that's what the the devil that
we believe in does. It makes it look attractive, but
it's not going to last long. So it's it's empty now.
That's what's that's the the description of of hell is
(26:00):
emptiness. It's not that not only that it
burns flames, but it burns it's,it's, it's a sensation of
burning because it's empty. And yeah, so, so definitely just
going back on that is, is that the, the sensation that you
that, that the sexual relationship you have with your
wife, it's completely different than than you have with a
(26:21):
girlfriend. It's something that that's
that's I think you describe it perfectly.
It's it's the exact opposite, opposite of the sensation you
have for a one night stand for a, for a, a pornography session
is the exact opposite. There's no shame.
There's no, none of that rush ofOh my God, what am I doing?
(26:43):
Is this crazy or not? Sometimes you, you do have that
rush if you're like in a different, different place or
not, but it's not exactly the same.
And after that there's, there's just a sense of fulfillment
because that's, that's what it's, that's how it's meant to
be. That's you and her.
So it's completely different andit's completely, it's
(27:04):
completely, I think these words are a bit like exaggerated, but
it's it's sort of like divines. What's what, what marriage is
meant to be. So yeah.
Mm hmm. No, 100% agree.
Yeah, I and also I would add, soI've only been married going on
8 years and my wife as I I don'tknow if I mentioned this to you
previously, but I have in the podcast.
(27:25):
It's just like, it's like a cycle.
You go through ups and downs andevery time around that circle,
it just makes that bond so much stronger.
And then sex means up so much more.
I think because when I get to know my wife at a new level,
even after eight years, and I hope after 20 and 30 and 40
years, it just makes all of thatso much deeper in in a way that
(27:46):
really cannot be described in words.
I would struggle to really convey that because like you
said, sensation, it is a real sensation because my wife and I,
we've gone through moments when we love each other, but we may
not like each other in the moment.
And like, you know, I mean, justto be completely real, like four
or five days ago, man, I was having such a down moment just
(28:06):
with myself and I was like, Hon,like, I don't know why.
Like I get attracted to other women and I don't like this.
And, you know, I let my mind go around and my wife is the most
forgiving and gracious person and the most understanding
person when it comes to any typeof sexual sin in a way that I
almost wish she would get mad atme at sometimes.
But she's like just so forgiving.
(28:26):
And I was going down this dark road and she was like, hey,
like, I'm here. I'm not going to leave you.
Like we're going to get through this together.
And then, you know, you have that understanding removed from
that hard day. A couple of days forward, then
I'm able to look back on a relationship as we're taking a
walk around along the SacramentoRiver.
And I'm just realizing like, wow, like this is what marriage
(28:48):
is actually about. And then when we do, you know,
Make Love, it has such a deeper meaning and understanding of
like complete comfort. Because for me, what I usually
am seeking is like, for it's really like some comfort and
security, like a level of warmthand understanding.
Like I'm not going to get left because like my dad passed away
(29:09):
when I was 16 by his own hand. So he left me and then, you
know, like I had step grandfathers that were abusive
and like they were, you know, had left me in respect and I'd
never been I'd never broken up with a girlfriend in the past.
Like I was always 1 broken up with.
So it was just like this recurring pattern.
But marriage has the opportunity, I think to if if
(29:30):
it's allowed to have give the test of time to basically speak
truth back into any life that like, no, you are worth being
loved. It's really supposed to be a
representation, I think of how Christ loves us in the church,
right. So yeah.
That's exactly it. Yeah, dude.
But I mean, everyone has a journey.
And for some reason you had to go through what you what you
(29:52):
went through to to realize that.But it, it's funny because we
were talking about the, what wasyour first contact with
pornography at and hearing you, you tell your story.
And, and like you, you learn to love your wife in so many
different ways. Like your respect, you're for
first of all, for, for just being that, that forgiving
(30:13):
person that she is. Like that takes such a great
heart to do that. And then you'll learn to love
her like in a whole different level.
Once, once you, you have your first kid with her and, and,
and, and you learn to, to root for her and to, to be happy for
every, every new, new growth andnew step that she takes.
(30:34):
And that's like, it's basically you.
You're as happy as it is when ithappens to you even more.
And, and I was thinking about itbecause I was thinking about
myself as 17. I was like, no dude, she just
needs to have tits and a nice hat.
So that would be fine. That's all I need.
Yeah, she doesn't need a good personality.
(30:55):
And, and once you cut porn off, I think that also has like a
funny effect because I used to struggle a lot with this in
terms of like looking at other women, especially when we were
dating and also in the beginningof the marriage, Like it's,
it's, it's hard because especially I live in a world
(31:16):
where there are a bunch of fit women, which are the women that
do sports. There are a bunch of women that
look nice. And I used to struggle a lot
with that. And I think that cutting porn
off and cutting masturbation offconsequent consequently was
something that really helped me like just be more more in
control of myself. So in terms of like, I, I
(31:41):
understand that that girl's pretty.
She, she is an attractive girl, but what I have with my wife and
what I have with with my children and in my family and in
my home is a million times prettier, a million times more
valuable to me. And to pursue any even thought
(32:01):
of whatever it is that my brain wants to think about, my lizard
brain wants to think about once I look at a Pretty Woman and
that makes makes life a lot, a lot lighter because you you're
it's not like God made someone pretty and it's not like you're
not you're acknowledging it. You're just not pursuing the bad
(32:22):
thought of being with that girl or doing stuff for that girl.
And, and so, so I think that thepart of the evolution of, of
being able to, to control like these these feelings.
And I know people that that probably hear us that are, that
are not as religious or that don't, don't feel that this is
(32:43):
something bad. They could maybe look at this
and and say, wow, these guys arethey live such like a restricted
life and you can't do this. You can't do that, but it's that
that famous phrase that with discipline comes freedom.
Like this is the sort of thing that will set you free to do
what you actually want to do. Because for me, it's like the,
the, the, the term of success isto be married with the same
(33:06):
person till the day I die. That would be the greatest story
that I could tell myself and my kids and whatever person that
that went through life with me rather than having been on the
6th marriage and then dying alone on some home somewhere
that nobody would would considervisiting.
So that that to me is, is, is what I want.
(33:29):
And to get there, I need to get through these these problems
that I have internally and that every man suffers with
internally. And to do that you need
discipline. So discipline in this case gives
me freedom to pursue that which I want.
And it's tough because people don't, don't look at it like
that. They say, ah, we only live once.
Why don't you go out with that girl and that girl your wife
(33:51):
will never know. And, and, and people try try and
justify themselves like that. And then and I think that it
eventually catches up with themselves and it they're the
only ones that that that suffer for.
Yeah, it's beautifully put. There's such a popular
conversation that's also going on right now around longevity of
life, like physical health. And I think that if we started
(34:15):
to put a little more emphasis onthe topic of like relational
longevity, being in relationships, especially
marriages for like the long haul.
It's like the beautiful word picture, I guess could be, you
know, an oak tree after 300 years, it's a strong, sturdy
thing that you grow and you can build a house in that, in that
oak tree. And you know, you, you can't
(34:36):
have that if you don't pursue relationships long term because
like you said, you know, some people might feel restricted.
And it's like, well, your optionfor sexual experiences are an
inch deep and a mile wide. So you're not going to get very
deep, but you can go and try every flavor of everything you
ever wanted. But in terms you're going to
always going to put your foot inthat water, man, that's so
shallow. But then like a relationship, it
(34:58):
may be a, let's just say 1 foot by 1 foot or one beater, 1
beater, 1m by 1m section of water.
But the depth that you can go tois just, it's, it's honestly
never ending. I, I think that, you know, if
what we believe is true and an eternity is a real thing.
If you have an eternity to builda relationship, like how much
(35:21):
can you learn about a person at what depth of bonding are you
able to have with that person? Because everybody knows that
having long friends or friends from when you were really young
or those ones you've had just for a long time, you can go and
be with that person. There's no level of facade that
needs to come up. You're just completely who you
are. If you could build that over the
course of 1000 years, 10,000 years, I can only imagine what
(35:45):
that would actually be like. Yeah, that's why they'd say
that. Once you get married, you're
one, right? You're not.
You're not 2 anymore. You're one.
You're one soul. You're one person because I feel
that's, that's, that's how it itactually works because if you
take it seriously and if you work on it, that's how you'll
(36:05):
spend eternity. And that's why you have to be
your your spouse's like biggest fan and biggest like supporter
because everything that that goes for her and she grows and
returns directly to you and to your family.
So I think that that it's it's the noblest pursuit and the
(36:27):
toughest and most important decision that you make in life
is to try and try and be one with one person for the rest of
your life. Yeah, so talk to me in the
context of what we've been discussing relationships, long
term values, pornography, masturbation.
Remind me how old your kids are and what how are you planning to
(36:49):
introduce them to this topic of the you're going to come across
crude. Man, I only have girls.
Yeah, I'm So. I'm 36.
I've been married for 10 years. I have a 5 year old, a 2 year
old, and now I'm pregnant with athird girl.
They're all congratulations. Thanks.
So all my girls are called Mary.Mary something.
(37:11):
So it's Mary Maria, Eduardo, Maria, Beatrice, Maria Teresa
and hopefully Mary helped me outwith, with these girls because I
have no clue of how I'm going tointroduce this to the girls, but
I, I hope her mom, her mom, their mom will, will help with
this. But it's, it's going to have to
(37:32):
be a topic and I'm, I'm going tohave to shed a bunch of a bunch
of ego and, and like ideas that I had of how I would be as a, as
a girl dad in terms of like carrying my gun around and
chasing after their. Boyfriend mow down all the boys
who come back nursing because. I, I, I, I know it's, it's
(37:54):
tough, but like, you want them, you want them to have like a
healthy relationship because once you're gone, that's who
they're going to be with. So it has to, it has to be a
topic like this, this world exists and how I would introduce
it like if I could like think ofit right now, I think is it's,
(38:16):
it's basically how we're talkingabout it is that you're going to
be, you're going to be exposed to it.
Like it's, it's probably one of the, the worst drugs in terms
of, of spiritual corruption there is, but it's kind of it's
out there and just try and preserve what you have, know
(38:38):
what it is and always look for someone that that brings you
closer to God. And I think the, for me, it's
going to be like, I don't know how it, how it's dad and
different religions or no religions are going to try and
do this. But for me, it's going to be
more simple because I'm going totry and introduce faith and
(38:58):
religion to them. I already AM.
And at the earliest age in a, ina like the, the lightest and
most loving way possible in terms of like, look, it's not a,
you're going to die if you don'tdo this, but this is the best
tool you'll have to help you outthroughout, to help you
throughout life that I could ever give you.
(39:19):
So more than money, more than schools, if you have faith and
if you, if you have this book called the Bible and you could
have this guy called Jesus and all of these characters are in
this book. And if you've managed to live by
what what this book and this guytells you to live by, I can
guarantee you that you will not be be oppressed, be sad, be
(39:45):
alone, be anxious. It's obviously tougher said than
a tougher done than said, but I think if, if, if I managed to
instill some of that in in in each of their hearts, it's going
to come naturally. Like it sort of came to me.
I hope it'll come in at an earlier age, but each of us has
(40:10):
has their own journey and I'll obviously always be there to
support them, I hope. Yeah.
Well, how about you? Any kids in the in the plan?
Yeah, in the plan on my last time, right?
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So my wife and I, we will
probably start quote UN quote trying in like June or maybe a
(40:31):
little bit before then maybe in April or excuse me, May.
My wife's on some stuff, right, like a medicine right now that
like we're, we're probably goingto wean her off just because
there's some potential health risks there.
So she probably wouldn't be downfor me sharing that, but there
it is. But she so we're going to.
That one out. No, no, it's all fine.
(40:52):
She doesn't listen. So.
But yeah, we're going to start trying to have kids.
Yeah, I'll probably tell her about this one because this is
going to be a unique podcast in itself.
Yeah. But so I don't.
I have two younger sisters. My the middle sister is 4 years
younger than me. The youngest sister is 12 years
younger than me. So I, I have this interesting
(41:12):
perspective and you know, like Iwas saying, I was 16 when my dad
passed away. So the, the perspective that I
hold on the development of youngwomen, I think is different than
a lot of people just because youknow, when I lost my dad when I
was 16, trauma, typically they were 12 and 4.
Oh, they're younger. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
(41:34):
They're younger than me. So they were 12 and four when
that happened. So, you know, when that
happened, I remember, let me just say this trauma I think
robs people their childhood in alot of ways.
Not saying that it brings you tomaturity, but in terms of just
the way that a child brain processes life before and after
trauma, it's usually very different.
(41:55):
You're, you know, a lot of phrases have been said, the word
kids are robbed of their childhood or whatever it is.
And so I was very analytical in terms of like my observation of
them and very acutely aware of the actions, the things that I
said and how it affected them. Even my mother, even though she
was much older than me, when there's that absence of a father
in the home, there's just this interesting thing that happens
(42:15):
where girls, you know, especially my middle sister, she
was 12 years old. She was just starting to come of
age. She was an early bloomer.
So you know, she's going through12/13/14, going through puberty,
didn't have a father figure. There was like this unspoken,
unspoken desire for me to be a leader in the home.
But like I was 16 years old, a late bloomer, had no idea what
(42:36):
life was even about. So you know that.
Must have been so tough. It was tough and thanks for
saying that, but like I'm now today, like I'm thankful that,
you know, I've made it through and through a lot of amazing
people, honestly, that have invested themselves into my
life, my whole family, like we're all alive and breathing
and and doing pretty well. So I have nothing to be super
(42:59):
upset about really. I think it's a lot of those
things have become some of my greatest advantages in life.
Just the perspective, that forced perspective, but with
young women, it's such an interesting dichotomy for me to
to observe because I know for a fact that I'll even go on a limb
generalization and say that all women want to know that they're
(43:23):
beautiful by their fathers. And so, you know, I get on
Instagram today and I won't callanyone out, but I got on this
morning and like, there's this picture that very revealing of
this young woman online. And you know, you go and you
look at the comments and most guys are afraid to comment on
them. And it's a bunch of girls and
they're all like, oh, babe, you slay, you're so hot, blah, blah,
(43:44):
blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And like they're seeking at some
form of attention to know that they're pretty, which is like a
completely normal thing. So with my daughters, like I'm
thinking like, man, if I do havedaughters, if they start getting
online at a young age, which I, I'm not going to get them a
phone probably till they're 50, but that's.
One of my ideas as well. Yeah, like grow up in the woods
(44:05):
because it's like that, that kind of stuff.
I don't know, it's just it's very difficult to say how I
would do things differently. But I know for a fact that it's,
it's a toxic place to be for a woman who's developing because
the best thing for your daughters, I was going to say
this earlier. I think that you're going to be
a great dad or you are a great dad, especially in the raising
(44:27):
them through this age. Because the best thing I think
that you can do for your your daughters is to have a loving
relationship with your wife. And that will show them where
value comes from because as soonas someone starts looking
elsewhere, you know, like I was saying, it's a mile wide and an
inch deep. I think it's anywhere you can go
to find that short level of gratification of like, oh, I am
pretty because this guy told me I have a nice butt because this
(44:50):
guy said I have nice boobs because whatever it is.
And like, that fulfills a piece of that emptiness.
But it doesn't last very long. So.
Yeah. Yeah.
And, and just to circle back on the, the social media and like
Internet and what things are nowthat we're like, my kids aren't
(45:14):
close to, to having a cell phoneyet, but I don't know how it'll
be if it will still be Instagram, TikTok and whatnot.
But like it, it's tough for us. And we're a grown man and we
know what we like, what we don'tlike.
We know if something's more of aless of of a imagine for a kid,
(45:34):
like it's it's so addicting and so and so hard to get out of
that even when you're you're a thinking grown man for a kid
that's going through all these insecurities and and puberty and
trying to fit in school. Yeah.
I mean, you do have loving parents like Ted Bundy had
(45:55):
loving parents, but obviously I,I'm not going to compare like
the, the levels of parenting, but it's, it's like it's
something that you, I will, willdefinitely want to avoid.
Is, is, is that I think that's even tougher than than talking
about pornography. Is is like introducing the kids
(46:16):
to social media and how you do it.
Like that's going to be that's going to be a a tough subject
when it comes around. But we're also the line that
the, the longest that we can wait out and the longest that we
can like do outdoors, go outdoortravel with them, like get them
to see real life before they they get stuck inside a, a
(46:38):
screen. And we're going to, we're going
to fight for that. Yeah, I was trying to think of
like some way to compare it to some other form of food or a
tool in life that we use to like, 'cause it really it is a
tool and it's become very much abusiness tool and it's, it's
(46:58):
also become a method of communication.
But using it in the correct way,whatever that is, is like it's
very difficult to parse out because everybody, it's like
multiple people could go and post the same thing for three.
If there's three people, they post the same thing three
different times, but their motivations can be completely
different and some of them are healthy and some of them are
(47:18):
not. And it affects everybody on the
other side of that who's receiving whatever that post is.
It affects them in a different way.
I think it would be so fascinating to know, to actually
see not in numbers of engagement, not in numbers of
clicks or views or likes, but what is the impact that we
actually have in another person's life by what we post?
(47:39):
Because I think it transcends beyond off screen.
It transcends how we think, whatwe think, why we think, what we
think, how we process life like.It's just, yeah, it's it's a
crazy time to be alive with the method of communication that we
have. And that's something that I, I
did for Lent. Now we're, we're almost in, yes,
there's, there's this period of 40 days of length until Easter
(48:04):
that we usually give up something to, to remember Jesus,
giving it the, the 40 days of Jesus in the desert and get
ready for Easter. And I usually do something like,
I'm going to get rid of coffee. You can get rid of something
going to not eat a meal on the Fridays going to.
So then this year I took took off social media last year and
(48:28):
in my social media I had like a purpose opening the question box
and answering religious questions for people that are
not religious at all that followme.
And this year I was like, OK, soI'm, I'm getting too into the
Instagram thing. I'm going to, I'm going to cut
off social media for a while. So I cut off because we, we use
(48:51):
a bunch of social media for the company.
So I cut off only my personal social media accounts.
And it helps, it helps with a bunch of things and, and it
helps you to reorganize what youneed that platform for what, how
you, you position yourself thereand what, why you post what you
both or why you follow who you follow and be more purposeful
(49:13):
with that because it is a, a very powerful tool.
But if you don't use it, well, it's going to take control of
you. So it, it's also one of the, one
of the probably biggest propagators of, of pornography
as well nowadays is social mediaand the, the pay platforms.
What do you call it? Important to have all that
(49:34):
stuff, yeah. On the fence.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's crazy.
I've listened to a quite a few podcasts in the last week.
Have you heard of Chris Williamson with Modern Wisdom,
his podcast? Yeah, we probably listen all the
same stuff, but he he he did this recent conversation with.
I forget her name. I want it.
What is her name? It's a blonde girl.
(49:54):
I have to link it in the show notes if whoever wants to go
check it out. But she was talking about just
the deep dive education on like what pornography actually does
to people and like what are the inner workings of the business
models behind it. And in terms of just a number of
illegal and abusive content thatgets uploaded to these different
(50:16):
sites, whether it be only fans or Pornhub or whatever.
Like it's just, it's mind boggling.
So for me, you know, in the combating of like going down
that road, I just remind myself of.
Just India, No. Yeah, it may have been, it may
have been her. I think it is.
Is she brown haired? There was 2 girls, 1 was blonde
(50:37):
and she was talking about like young women and their mindsets
and then there was some overlap there and then there and the
other girl was like who was talking specifically in the
topic of pornography and riding these sites of all dish this
horrendous content that gets uploaded like where people are
being physically abused. No, it was this year.
It was like a couple of weeks ago.
I'll link them in the show notesfor sure.
(50:59):
Yeah, I can't remember but. The modern women feel more lost
than ever. Yeah.
Yeah, that's the. Is that for you?
Yeah, but maybe, maybe not. You'll you'll have to link
you'll link that one. Yeah, I'll link them, but it is
it was just, it was a humble andsobering thought and like the
longevity of someone who works in that industry too.
(51:20):
It's like, I think the average is like 36 months.
And I've watched a few podcasts of, you know, these women who
have been in that industry and then come out of it and just
hearing some of their stories, it's like, and I've supported
that. Like it's just disgusting to
know like that, you know, if youcounts and whatnot.
And what's really gross is behind all of this.
It's like a bunch of dudes, man,that run this industry and
(51:42):
they're like modern day pimps. They go around and that's what
they do. And it's all about money and
power at the end of the day. And it's just like, man, like I
wish that stuff, if I was to ever get into an illegal
activity, I would figure out where the servers are, that
whole house, all of this pornography stuff, and just cut
the cables and blow it out. Blow it up.
(52:03):
Like for real, a couple strategic missiles.
Because really, like, it's the downfall of society in so many
ways if dudes get offline and start thinking about what it
means to be a good dad and staying with someone and loving
your children. Like that's how you fix a lot of
the political issues, man. It's like, go back to the root
of civilization and society. It's the family unit.
(52:24):
And soon as you throw that on the back on the burner and you
just fry it until it's nothing left, it just becomes warped.
Have you ever left like a fryingpan or a pot on the stove too
long and everything evaporates and then you like, warp the
metal? Like that's literally our life.
Crazy. Exactly.
I love myologies, yeah. That's true, That's true, but I
(52:48):
mean, going back to your your theory that it's the root of all
all that the downfall of society.
I think that that you're you're on to it because may most of our
problems would probably it shakes if it if we didn't have
power greedy or or pornographersor or people that didn't mean
(53:11):
mean good. Because usually when you have,
when you have families, when youhave people that, that look at
it for, for their kid that are looking out for their kids that
are looking out for good, that are trying to develop these long
term relationships that aren't looking at these, these, these
(53:32):
short term crazy lustful ideas of P Diddy or whatever
pornography and things that thatall all lead to, to money and
power. You'd probably not have as many
wars and as many conflicts and as many upset as lonely people
as you do. Because if if, if you cut that
(53:57):
off, it's it it's tough to to feed the to feed the other, the
other two, which is which is power and money as well, because
you it basically you, you use them for good and you'll you'll
eventually just distributed themthat them out.
I don't know, but I think you'reon to something there with with
(54:20):
with it being the cause of of most of the evils.
I think it, it all comes back to, to to try what, what
destroys destroys societies and the family.
Then I think that when, when youput money and power and and and
and pleasure above above God, above love, above family, then
(54:42):
then you're, you're, you're, you're destined to lose.
Yeah, I'd love to see the studies of what I forget all of
the what the base needs are of humanity, but it's like food and
water, shelter, environment. Obviously sex is one of them and
food or whatever. It's like if you can corrupt any
of those, OK, so food, fast food, you introduce that
(55:03):
environment, you shove a bunch of people into a city where the
the lights block out the stars so you're not reminded of the
nature and the beauty of the world.
Things that disrupt your sleep phones, like all of these things
that are right at our fingertipsthat are of convenience.
And when we bring them into our,our operation of what's going on
within our, our, our, our body, it's like, yeah, it throws all
(55:24):
of those things off. Yeah, that's a whole other
conversation. Yeah, it's.
Crazy, it's crazy. We're we're, we're going on down
the destruction rabbit hole. Yeah.
So let me let me ask you this kind of to to wrap up a little
bit. If we're somebody who
practically is, like, you know what, I'm recognizing that I'm
empty and I'm not able to find solace and fulfillment from
(55:49):
these things and I think I want to break them off.
What practical advice would you give to a young man or woman who
is wanting to leave these thingsbehind, specifically pornography
and masturbation? You have to recognize first why
why it's bad. So you, you need to understand
why it's bad for you and why it doesn't contribute to, to who
(56:13):
you want to become and who you think you, you want to become
and who you think you are. So first, you need to find out
who you want to be and who you think you want to be and who you
think you are. And then you need to make peace
with the bad things that you have, the bad vices that you,
that you have, the bad habits that you, that you have.
You need them looking straight in the face.
(56:35):
And then you need to work at it every day.
You need to know that you're imperfect, that everyone is that
everyone fails. Everyone's a Sinner.
Everyone does bad, bad, bad things all the time do bad.
And so, but you have to make peace with that and you have to
forgive yourself. You have to want to want to be
better every day and you have tofight at it every day.
(56:59):
It's like a drug addict. Once you once you're a drug
addict, you're never an ex drug addict.
You're just holding on to, to the counting the days that
you're, that you haven't used that you're sober.
So that's, that's how I, I see it that basically every day is a
new opportunity to do, do it right.
So you're never the devil is never far away.
(57:22):
He's always waiting for you to slip and for you to, to think
about some temptation or something that, oh, that would
be OK. That's not that bad.
And that's how you start slipping down.
But always, if you do slip down,remember that you have to
forgive yourself and you have tokeep striving to be better.
The alternative is much worse tofall down and to just think
(57:42):
you're a piece of shit and that you're, you're made that way.
And you're supposed to, to look at porn or to be in inside the
industry or to, to make money through that.
And you're definitely not built to to be that way.
You're built to be happy. You're built to, to fulfill
whatever it is you, you believe that you, you should be.
You're set on the surface to do,sure.
(58:06):
Well, Victor, thank you for taking the time.
I can't believe we've already escalated our great
conversation. It's the one that I think that
needs to be popularized and talked about a lot more.
But thank you for sharing your story and experience.
Yeah, people, people definitely don't want to talk about.
Well, good. I hope this one goes viral and
it just gets shared to everybodybecause it's a there's a
(58:27):
conversation that needs to happen.
So thank you so much for making the time, man.
We're gonna we're gonna start the they have the Mofap Nofap
November. We're gonna do the Nofap 2025.
There you go. I love it.
I love it. We'll do it.
Thanks man. Good, good talk man.
Later. Thank you so much to Victor for
(58:48):
coming on the pod and sharing insuch a way that he did so
candidly. And just the ability to even say
those words, pornography, masturbation, infidelity, and
talk about them in an open lightis not an easy thing to do.
And it comes at the potential for scrutiny.
But that's OK because I think this conversation needs to
(59:09):
happen. And I'm so glad that it was able
to happen in a small way here onthis podcast.
So thank you so much for jumpingin listening.
And if you learned anything, I just asked that you would share
that with somebody who you care about.
So thank you so much again for Victor for coming on.
If you want to check out the Zone 2 performance that company,
(59:29):
check out the show notes in the description.
And also you can check out thosetwo podcasts from Chris
Williamson that I was mentioningabout these topics and the
development of young women and the just the crazy behind the
scenes stuff that goes on in thepornography world and how it
truly affects the world in a negative way.
So go check out those things if you are still watching.
(59:50):
And to this point, just want to say thank you so much.
If you're watching on YouTube, if you could like comment,
subscribe, turn on the notification bell, that helps to
continue to grow the pod. If you're on Apple Podcasts or
Spotify, if you could like review, comment on those
platforms as well, that would continue to help grow this
system that I'm building. With the podcast and also last
(01:00:11):
Thing newsletter, if you want tosign up for that, you can check
out the show note descriptions as well.
They'll take you to the website and you can enter your e-mail
there if you want to get a weekly roundup of the
conversations that I've had for the previous week.
All right, thank you guys so much and we'll catch you in the
next one. Peace.
How's it going everybody? Pornography.
That is going to be the majorityof the topic for today's
conversation with Victor Bronco.This is his round two interview
and I wanted to have him on again to talk about this touchy,
but I think very important topicmatter and subject that needs to
be hopefully the starting point of a lot of conversations.
(00:23):
I believe that in a lot of ways this is probably one of the most
important podcasts that ever recorded and it gets real and
raw and just really happy to have the opportunity to record
it, especially with someone likeVictor over at Zone 2.
He is starting an amazing company there and if you want to
check out that company, you can do so in the show notes.
But I hope you enjoy this conversation and just want to
(00:44):
say before he even starts, thankyou Victor for allowing me to
have the space with you to have this conversation.
A bit sick traveling and not sleeping.
Coming back home. Yeah, no, in in the States.
New York was cold as hell. Then we went to to Boulder after
(01:07):
that. The guys were also in Anaheim,
so pretty intense trip. Yeah.
How long were you gone in total?I was gone for about 15 days.
The guys here were gone for about 2020 something days.
Nice man, it's a long trip. What was the?
Almost a month. Yeah, that's long time.
What? What were the goals that you
(01:28):
placed for this trip? So, so we were, we were meeting
with some suppliers and distributors and some, some
stores at the at the Expo in Anaheim.
It's called the Expo West. Big one.
Something like nutrition and nutrition and something Expo.
(01:48):
It's very big, very, very big. I went there last year and I
wanted my my general manager forthe US and my marketing manager
also to see what the brands are doing and how, how stuff works
in the US. So I sent them there and we also
had all a few meetings lined up there.
From there. We met up in New York.
(02:09):
We had like some activation, some samplings and also some
visit in some stores for New York.
We're going to use New York as like our our running hub or
distribution. We're going to work there
mainly. And then we made a crazy 2 day
trip to Boulder just just to close some deals.
(02:32):
We we had to meet up with with Trevor Foley.
Then we met up with Holly Lawrence as well to to sign her
contract and then a visit also to Matt Johnson and the feed to
see how, how to basically to to close a deal there with feed and
and get stuff shipped there to them.
Yeah. So yeah, it was a a quick sort
(02:54):
of long trip, but but quick in terms of the the bunch of.
Things, yeah, you're bouncing around a lot.
Yeah, so and also the, the, the time difference also caught up
to us because we we're I think one hour where, where are you
now? Are you California?
I'm Pacific. Yeah, in California.
So we're about, I think 3 hours behind.
(03:16):
What time is it there? It's 11 AM.
Yeah, or more. It's 3:00, so it's 55 hours
behind. Yeah, you're 5 hours behind.
So the time difference, we slept, I think one day, one
hour, and we went out for a run.We also ran the island of
Manhattan, so that was like 30 something miles.
It was cold, yeah. We did a.
(03:37):
Bunch of stuff, Yeah. We did a bunch of stuff, yeah.
Did do you find success in termsof getting the contracts
relationships built that you needed to kind of cement into
place if you're allowed to say? Yeah, it's, I mean, it's still,
it's still, it's almost like starting all over again the
company because like we've, we've built a bunch of stuff
here in Brazil, but in terms of like brand recognition, you have
(03:58):
to start from zero. So you can't go on what you have
here. And just like, yeah, we're the
best selling brand in Brazil that won't sell you inside the
big retailer. So you have to start the brand
there. And yeah, but I talking to Matt
from the feed, I get the feelingthat most of the brands that
come into the US that are from abroad, they just like, dude,
(04:19):
you're the, you're the place to be in.
I'll pay you the money. And I don't want the hassle to
try and develop the brand there in the States.
But we're, we want the hassle, we want to be there.
We want to have contact with thepeople.
So I, we were talking to Matt, like the deal that you have with
these guys doesn't really apply to us because we're going to be
pushing product. Like people are going to come
(04:41):
looking for the product in your website different than the other
brands that you have there. And that you go fish in the, in
the European Union and whatever you have these like innervate
brands and, and more and more common European brands that he
brings abroad from abroad, it's going to be a bit different.
So he managed to convince him sothat that was a good a good part
(05:02):
of it as well. Yeah, Congrats, man.
That's awesome. Well, first of all, I just want
to say thank you so much for making the time to come on a
second time. I've been wanting to have this
conversation a while. This has been one that's been on
my radar for I guess since we booked it relatively soon after
we've had our first conversation.
But I guess for those listening,I'll just preface the
conversation really quick to saywhen we had our first
(05:24):
conversation, I forget exactly how the topic was raised, but
you mentioned that, you know, interms of just negative aspects
of life, one of the things that had been a part of your life and
then has since not become a partof your life anymore has been
pornography. And I've had a huge struggle
(05:46):
with that over the years, some battling there.
And I feel like this is a conversation that is probably
more ripe to be had than probably anytime in the past
1520 years, I think just becauseof its prevalence, because
statistically everyone has dealtwith it in some fashion.
(06:09):
I forget it's in the 90 ish percent in terms of like the
number of males that struggle with it.
And then it's climbing for females as well.
So I just wanted to open up the space for us to kind of
literally beat the horse to death because I think it should
be beat. And yeah, just, I guess the
first place I'd love to open up with.
It's just when, when I bring up the topic of pornography for
(06:34):
you, what, what, what does that invoke in you?
Like what? What kind of stories come to
mind? What kind of battles?
Anything at all you want to share?
Then I have some more specific pointed questions that we can
dive into as well. Yeah, man, I think it's, it's a
tough one because it's sort of alike ambivalent is, is what you
(06:54):
learn of, of being a man, at least from, from the 90s of how
I grew up. Like this is how, how you become
a man. You have to have your Playboy.
You, you, you have to like girlsin a certain way.
And this is how you, how men behave.
You go to Barber shops and thereare a bunch of pictures of, of
naked women on, on the wall. And I grew up around that
(07:19):
because here in Brazil we have like these sort of like country
clubs. It's more common here and it's
more popular to more people haveaccess to it.
And like when you grew up with your friends, that was basically
being the cool guy would be the guy that that owns the the the
Playboy magazines that eventually had the VHS of the of
(07:40):
the new porn that came out and and future after that came, I
think Limewire came the the the downloads from the Internet and
then after that, like your X videos.
Yeah, your, your, your websites.So, you know, it was sort of
like a, a, a rite of passage in here in Brazil.
(08:01):
It goes even a step further, I think in the States.
It's more common here in Brazil for you to lose your virginity
at a a sort of whorehouse. Seriously.
Wow. Yeah, it's, it's, it's more it's
like like you guys have in the States, sort of like your strip
clubs. It's the same thing here.
But you, you buy for you buy sex, you don't buy a lot that.
Yeah. So it's legal in Brazil?
(08:22):
It's legal. It's it's it's borderline, but
it's you have it everywhere. You have it in every city here
in Brazil. Wow.
And it's sort of the same thing as, as, as becoming a man in
terms of you, you, you masturbate, you, you see
pornography, you, you have all that kind of stuff.
(08:43):
It was that you had to have sex at an early age between like
you're 13 to like 17. You're expected to either have
had a girlfriend or go someplaceget your, get your, your sex on
with, with a prostitute. And, and that, that was
something that really conflictedme with my religious life,
(09:05):
especially because I, I always had a sort of connection with,
with religion at some point in my life, be it from a very early
age or like I had different points of connection.
So when I was younger, this wasn't a real big problem, but I
always had like my parents more as more of guys in terms of
(09:27):
religion getting to my teens. I had more of a, I got it from
my grandparents, my grandfather,my grandmother, because we, we
went to this Country Club, the same one that had the, the, the
porn pictures on the wall. But my, my grandmother, she was
a minister of the church there. So she would ask me to go every
every Saturday. And I had that conflict that
(09:47):
like, I know this is wrong, but everyone does it.
And it's something that, that affirms me as a, as a man.
So I have to do it. So when you talk about
pornography, that's how I was basically like thought to
believe in pornography and and that it was something more
harmless and more more not necessary, but something that
(10:07):
everyone had to do to become a man you.
Know, wow, that's crazy. First of all, thanks for sharing
that. I had no previous context to
understand or know that. So that's wild just to hear just
the cultural difference there. So I guess the next question I
have for you is based on a little bit of my own experience,
(10:28):
but so there there's these kind of two chapters in my life of
how I've related with porn. So when I it was pre marriage
and when you're younger, you know, you're just going through
puberty, especially as a man, can't speak for the women, but
especially as a man, like, you know, you're going through
puberty and you start having thejust these raging hormones and
lust is like it is a burning fire within every young man and
(10:52):
trying to figure out an outlet for that.
And in a good way, it's like very difficult.
So for me, I actually wasn't introduced into pornography till
I was probably 12 or 13 was at my friend's house, who was at my
time the best friend. And he had like this little
wooden chest that he had under lock and key and, you know,
pictures that he printed off theInternet.
And, you know, then he'd show mestuff on his computer.
(11:12):
And because I was a late bloomerin the beginning, honestly, it
was just that curiosity thing. It wasn't even something that
like I was really that into like13.
I really hadn't gone through puberty yet.
And so there wasn't like that just overwhelming stimulation
going on in the brain where it'slike, oh, I want to go after
this. So then after I started to go
through puberty, then, you know,it was a lustful thing.
(11:32):
I was seeking after it. And then what I realized that,
you know, even after being married and I went through and
we can talk about this too, but I went through like a four or
five year period of like watching no pornography
whatsoever. I'd totally given it up.
But then as it's come back into my life, unfortunately over the
past several years, and it's like this once a month thing
where like I, I shun it and thenlike I, I go to it now instead
(11:56):
of necessarily for lust, it's like of this wanting to have a
sense of comfort or security or a relationship or companionship
or something that like it is empty within me.
So it's like in the beginning, it's this lustful thing as we
get older, I think. And I'd be curious to hear what
your experience has been or whatyou've heard from other people.
But it's like it becomes something I'm grabbing out for
(12:16):
in order to fill some type of a void.
So like, those are the two distinct chapters in my life
where I related to it differently.
Did you experience those similarchapters?
And yeah. Definitely, yeah.
I was also a late bloomer, so interms of I had the same feeling
as like curiosity and also beinga part of the guys because like
(12:38):
my friends like used to have magazines and stuff.
So I would I would also be part of the group.
I think I also wanted my own magazines and but yeah, once
once purity hits and that showerof hormones and I didn't have
triathlon or anything to, to suppress that energy and outlet.
(13:02):
It all went not just born but also like girls and and running
after as many girls as possible and A and a different lifestyle
that that would be healthy. After that I, I think I, I kept
at it until like maybe I starteddating my wife and then it
(13:24):
started to tone down because it,it made less sense.
We, we saw a lot of each other, like we started also having a
relationship and that's something else.
So that I, I, I think I never talked about is, is that we, we
also started like this, this journey together in terms of
(13:45):
like what we want out of our relationship.
And it started evolving in something like we want to get,
if we want to get married, we want to get married in the
church. We're both Catholic, but we're
living in sin because we were having sexual relationships.
So how do we, how do we make peace with this?
And whilst I'm, I'm, I'm having these discussions, I'm also
(14:06):
having these internal discussions in terms of porn and
masturbation and, and, and everything that goes with it.
And, and that's also conflicting.
So we decide like we get engagedand I think from the moment we
get engaged, we decide that we're not going to have sex till
we get married, which was about a year.
And we've started seeing a priest for like, I don't know
(14:29):
how you say that in English, butit's sort of like a consultation
for the marriage. Like premarital don't.
Really want to do this exactly premarital counseling And it
worked really well for us because we managed to understand
why we were doing it and why we were getting married and what
marriage meant. And that's something that's
tough like we, we, we, we discussed last time is like, you
(14:49):
have to have the same meaning asmarriage as your spouse or else
you're going to expect somethingdifferent from it than your
spouse. So it needs to have the same
meaning for you as it does for her.
And that made it easier to startcutting that side of porn off.
And masturbation also was a different, was a different point
of it as well, because every time you, you, you watch porn,
(15:13):
you, you watch porn to masturbate.
So it was something else that I wanted to, I've always wanted to
cut off since I, I started getting closer with God and, and
once I got married, I had the like I'm going to, I'm going to
cut it off because once I cut that off, I'm automatically not
going to need porn. Like I usually had porn only
(15:34):
because of that. So I started like this whole
journey in my marriage to stop start cutting it off and I and I
sort of eased it out. I have like every year I would
count like I cannot, I cannot masturbate this month and I, I
would fall into temptation. I would, I would, I would, I
would falter. But eventually I, I got to a
point where I, I was able to control myself like completely.
(15:56):
So nowadays I, I, I never, I never masturbated, I never watch
porn. And it's not something that it's
hard. I I, I, I, I hear myself saying
it and I, I, we, I have like a, like a Bible studies group,
which are guys my age. And I told them this like last
year and they were like, are youcrazy, man?
How can you like? And I'm like, I know it seems
(16:19):
crazy nowadays, but it's, it's not as hard as it seems once
you're married. Like I have a married life.
So it's not like I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm celibate, which would be
tough as well. But once you start getting rid
of it, you start understanding also why it's so bad for you,
like why it's bad for you and obviously the industry of the
(16:40):
people that it affects. So that's a bit of the the
journey in terms of the arc pornography that that I lived
through. Yeah.
So I think for anybody who doesn't have a religious
context, it becomes a bit more difficult for for the for the
mindset conclusion to be settledon.
This is wrong. So I would love to hear on the
(17:00):
topic of like masturbation, pornography, infidelity, why is
it wrong? I wouldn't even say just
religion, OK. I think it's it's easier for
religion because basically you get your rules like you can't.
Do that and it's. Set in stone and you're, you're
not supposed to do it because it, it's bad for you, it's bad
(17:23):
for your soul. So and, and you believe that and
obviously there's an explanationto it.
But if you look at it from a practical standpoint, it's
obviously not healthy. It's something that you're
watching people do and, and it stimulates a part of you that
you're looking at someone else to get pleasure whilst you have
your wife or wife, whilst you have your, your, your girlfriend
(17:45):
and you feel like, and you don'tneed religion for that.
You feel like you're, you're cheating every time you do that
because you're getting pleasure from someplace else.
And what religion basically saidis, is that you're, you are
cheating on your girlfriend every time that you do that,
you're cheating on your, your wife every time that you do
(18:06):
that. And, and to live in a lie is
something that destroys you and makes you look at yourself as a,
as a worse person, as someone that's not worthy of, of love
and, and other stuff. So every time you fall into
that, it's like a negative circle that you, that you keep,
(18:26):
you keep doing it and you keep doing it to search for some
pleasure and it, and it all, all, it's like a drug.
So why, why do people get high on, on cocaine or on, on crack?
Because once they do it, it's the best feeling ever.
But 2 seconds after that, or I don't know, 10 minutes after
that, they feel like shit. So it's the same sort of concept
(18:47):
and, and it breaks something inside of you as well.
And that's more, more coming, coming more from a religious
standpoint, But it, it's, it's this the sacredness that we have
that that is our body, our temple, that we're basically,
not only are we, we, we be throwing away, we're throwing
(19:09):
away our sacredness, but we're also throwing away the
sacredness of people that are doing the act on a, on a, on a
video or whatever, whatever. So it it it makes us more more
like animals and less less like humans.
One of the most thought provoking arguments or or
proposals of thought that I've heard.
Most recently, I think it was byJordan Peterson, but it's been
(19:32):
and if you know who he is or not, I'm not sure.
But his this idea I think has been echoed through several
different popular orators. But it's the concept of, you
know, a lot of the identity thatpeople assign themselves
nowadays is in relation to theirdesires.
(19:52):
So, you know, not to pick on anyparticular group.
But if I'm like, you know, if I have the same sex, same sex
attraction, well, I'm gay. Well, like my identity's wrapped
up in that or, you know, I'm, I'm whatever, you know, you can
attribute to that. But a lot of them have to do
with like sexual orientation, which is like the very base need
or desire. And if we like, if we identify
(20:13):
ourselves with our base desires,then like, OK, well, what, You
know, if I control. Yeah, it's going to control us.
And you go down any of those paths and.
What's even blows my mind even more with like the stuff like
the Diddy conversation or a lot of these people that are into
just the most horrific forms of sexual manipulation of others,
even underage. It's like if, if I was ever in a
(20:35):
place I would be, I would be concerned if I was ever in a
place where I had the unlimited money and connections and could
get anything I want with no check or balance.
Because really in a lot of ways,for example, like being poorer
or having less economic availability, you have these
(20:56):
checks and balances to kind of put force against a lot of those
base desires. Because I, I really truly do
believe I told my wife this before we were dating.
I was like, I think that like the core of 90% of all the
problems when the world is actually pornography or like
sexual promiscuity, because you start to go down any of those
paths and you're always seeking the next high.
And you see it with drug addictsvery plainly because it's out in
(21:17):
the open. You know, you're always seeking
the next high and then like, you're willing to steal for it
and then you're willing to kill for it.
And then you're willing to do anything you can to get that
high. And I think it's the same way
for sexual things, which is like, you know, I, I watched, I
don't know if you know who Ted Bundy is.
Yeah, yeah. Have you seen his testimony?
(21:37):
Yeah, where he had that? Well, so yeah, there's that.
But that he had this actual interview, I think it was like a
day or a few hours before he wasto be executed.
And for those who don't know him, like, careful, we look up.
But Ted Bundy like did a lot of horrible things, killed a lot of
people and involved a lot of like really messed up sexual
stuff. But in the interview, he was
asked like, you know, you know, what was it that like caused
(21:59):
this essentially? And he went down the path.
He's like, well, I came from a normal family, had loving
parents, went to a good school. But when I was young, you know,
I found pornography and then I started to seek the next extreme
thing and the next extreme thingand the next extreme thing until
he was like essentially killing people and, and raping them to
find that high to where it wouldlike completely disassociate and
(22:21):
he would turn into like a complete different person.
So I'm of the belief that reallylike pornography, sexual
addiction is the root of many forms of evil and sin.
And it's just crazy. But my question, I guess I want
to shift the topic slightly is because this is something that I
learned that I wish someone would have given me context for
(22:45):
prior to being married. So pre marriage, we've all
experienced lust. It burns hot, it burns fast.
It's like, it's like throwing gasoline on flames.
It's just like, you know, boom. And then it's gone a second.
And then after getting married that that sexual experience was
totally different because this person that I and me and my
(23:05):
wife, we decide not to have sex before marriage as well.
And came close a few times to break in that oath, but we kept
that. And then after getting married,
sex became like this slow burn. And there's no shame attached.
And not to be like overly graphic, but like after orgasm
or after that climax, you know, you don't feel that sense of
shame. You feel that connection, that
oneness with that partner. And so like the comparing and
(23:27):
contrasting for me between like a pornography experience and
like being married and, you know, being with someone, like
those were two totally differentfires that I like did not know
existed. And you know, for some people,
if they go into marriage or any relationship even let's just
throw marriage outside for a second and you're expecting to
have that same level of fire. If you truly love that person,
(23:50):
it's not going to be there. And I wanted to tell people
like, that's that's actually OK.I think that's normal.
And I don't know if you had a similar experience.
Yeah, that's you should expect it because eventually it's not
that it, it's dies down or anything, it's just that it's
different and and it's I, I, I think it's more beautiful.
(24:13):
I, I look at it as something, and, and I heard someone say
this the other day and it not only sex, but in terms of love,
like, like the love that you have for that your parents have
for you. It's, it's something that, that
(24:34):
you, you never earned. It's something that they'll give
you regardless what you're doing, how high you are, how low
you are, how pretty you are. And the love that you give your
kids is the same. Like you never ask for anything
in return. It's just like you'll love them
no matter what, but the love that you have for your spouse,
(24:54):
it's different because it's something that, that it's not,
it's it, it's not something that, that, that, it's that,
that you have naturally something that you have to
decide every day. And that's why it's the most
important aspect of religion. It's, it's, it's that or the
order of the priestess. So it's either you, you grow the
(25:17):
flock as a, as a, as a, as a married person, or you're a
priest and you're like a shepherd for the, for the flock.
So the most important thing for the, for the church that why did
why does religion is exist is toprotect the family.
Once you, you put pornography and you put lust and you put
(25:37):
other things that are fast burning and that only
deteriorate from the family. It's it's it's definitely going
to look more attractive because that's what the the devil that
we believe in does. It makes it look attractive, but
it's not going to last long. So it's it's empty now.
That's what's that's the the description of of hell is
(26:00):
emptiness. It's not that not only that it
burns flames, but it burns it's,it's, it's a sensation of
burning because it's empty. And yeah, so, so definitely just
going back on that is, is that the, the sensation that you
that, that the sexual relationship you have with your
wife, it's completely different than than you have with a
(26:21):
girlfriend. It's something that that's
that's I think you describe it perfectly.
It's it's the exact opposite, opposite of the sensation you
have for a one night stand for a, for a, a pornography session
is the exact opposite. There's no shame.
There's no, none of that rush ofOh my God, what am I doing?
(26:43):
Is this crazy or not? Sometimes you, you do have that
rush if you're like in a different, different place or
not, but it's not exactly the same.
And after that there's, there's just a sense of fulfillment
because that's, that's what it's, that's how it's meant to
be. That's you and her.
So it's completely different andit's completely, it's
(27:04):
completely, I think these words are a bit like exaggerated, but
it's it's sort of like divines. What's what, what marriage is
meant to be. So yeah.
Mm hmm. No, 100% agree.
Yeah, I and also I would add, soI've only been married going on
8 years and my wife as I I don'tknow if I mentioned this to you
previously, but I have in the podcast.
(27:25):
It's just like, it's like a cycle.
You go through ups and downs andevery time around that circle,
it just makes that bond so much stronger.
And then sex means up so much more.
I think because when I get to know my wife at a new level,
even after eight years, and I hope after 20 and 30 and 40
years, it just makes all of thatso much deeper in in a way that
(27:46):
really cannot be described in words.
I would struggle to really convey that because like you
said, sensation, it is a real sensation because my wife and I,
we've gone through moments when we love each other, but we may
not like each other in the moment.
And like, you know, I mean, justto be completely real, like four
or five days ago, man, I was having such a down moment just
(28:06):
with myself and I was like, Hon,like, I don't know why.
Like I get attracted to other women and I don't like this.
And, you know, I let my mind go around and my wife is the most
forgiving and gracious person and the most understanding
person when it comes to any typeof sexual sin in a way that I
almost wish she would get mad atme at sometimes.
But she's like just so forgiving.
(28:26):
And I was going down this dark road and she was like, hey,
like, I'm here. I'm not going to leave you.
Like we're going to get through this together.
And then, you know, you have that understanding removed from
that hard day. A couple of days forward, then
I'm able to look back on a relationship as we're taking a
walk around along the SacramentoRiver.
And I'm just realizing like, wow, like this is what marriage
(28:48):
is actually about. And then when we do, you know,
Make Love, it has such a deeper meaning and understanding of
like complete comfort. Because for me, what I usually
am seeking is like, for it's really like some comfort and
security, like a level of warmthand understanding.
Like I'm not going to get left because like my dad passed away
(29:09):
when I was 16 by his own hand. So he left me and then, you
know, like I had step grandfathers that were abusive
and like they were, you know, had left me in respect and I'd
never been I'd never broken up with a girlfriend in the past.
Like I was always 1 broken up with.
So it was just like this recurring pattern.
But marriage has the opportunity, I think to if if
(29:30):
it's allowed to have give the test of time to basically speak
truth back into any life that like, no, you are worth being
loved. It's really supposed to be a
representation, I think of how Christ loves us in the church,
right. So yeah.
That's exactly it. Yeah, dude.
But I mean, everyone has a journey.
And for some reason you had to go through what you what you
(29:52):
went through to to realize that.But it, it's funny because we
were talking about the, what wasyour first contact with
pornography at and hearing you, you tell your story.
And, and like you, you learn to love your wife in so many
different ways. Like your respect, you're for
first of all, for, for just being that, that forgiving
(30:13):
person that she is. Like that takes such a great
heart to do that. And then you'll learn to love
her like in a whole different level.
Once, once you, you have your first kid with her and, and,
and, and you learn to, to root for her and to, to be happy for
every, every new, new growth andnew step that she takes.
(30:34):
And that's like, it's basically you.
You're as happy as it is when ithappens to you even more.
And, and I was thinking about itbecause I was thinking about
myself as 17. I was like, no dude, she just
needs to have tits and a nice hat.
So that would be fine. That's all I need.
Yeah, she doesn't need a good personality.
(30:55):
And, and once you cut porn off, I think that also has like a
funny effect because I used to struggle a lot with this in
terms of like looking at other women, especially when we were
dating and also in the beginningof the marriage, Like it's,
it's, it's hard because especially I live in a world
(31:16):
where there are a bunch of fit women, which are the women that
do sports. There are a bunch of women that
look nice. And I used to struggle a lot
with that. And I think that cutting porn
off and cutting masturbation offconsequent consequently was
something that really helped me like just be more more in
control of myself. So in terms of like, I, I
(31:41):
understand that that girl's pretty.
She, she is an attractive girl, but what I have with my wife and
what I have with with my children and in my family and in
my home is a million times prettier, a million times more
valuable to me. And to pursue any even thought
(32:01):
of whatever it is that my brain wants to think about, my lizard
brain wants to think about once I look at a Pretty Woman and
that makes makes life a lot, a lot lighter because you you're
it's not like God made someone pretty and it's not like you're
not you're acknowledging it. You're just not pursuing the bad
(32:22):
thought of being with that girl or doing stuff for that girl.
And, and so, so I think that thepart of the evolution of, of
being able to, to control like these these feelings.
And I know people that that probably hear us that are, that
are not as religious or that don't, don't feel that this is
(32:43):
something bad. They could maybe look at this
and and say, wow, these guys arethey live such like a restricted
life and you can't do this. You can't do that, but it's that
that famous phrase that with discipline comes freedom.
Like this is the sort of thing that will set you free to do
what you actually want to do. Because for me, it's like the,
the, the, the term of success isto be married with the same
(33:06):
person till the day I die. That would be the greatest story
that I could tell myself and my kids and whatever person that
that went through life with me rather than having been on the
6th marriage and then dying alone on some home somewhere
that nobody would would considervisiting.
So that that to me is, is, is what I want.
(33:29):
And to get there, I need to get through these these problems
that I have internally and that every man suffers with
internally. And to do that you need
discipline. So discipline in this case gives
me freedom to pursue that which I want.
And it's tough because people don't, don't look at it like
that. They say, ah, we only live once.
Why don't you go out with that girl and that girl your wife
(33:51):
will never know. And, and, and people try try and
justify themselves like that. And then and I think that it
eventually catches up with themselves and it they're the
only ones that that that suffer for.
Yeah, it's beautifully put. There's such a popular
conversation that's also going on right now around longevity of
life, like physical health. And I think that if we started
(34:15):
to put a little more emphasis onthe topic of like relational
longevity, being in relationships, especially
marriages for like the long haul.
It's like the beautiful word picture, I guess could be, you
know, an oak tree after 300 years, it's a strong, sturdy
thing that you grow and you can build a house in that, in that
oak tree. And you know, you, you can't
(34:36):
have that if you don't pursue relationships long term because
like you said, you know, some people might feel restricted.
And it's like, well, your optionfor sexual experiences are an
inch deep and a mile wide. So you're not going to get very
deep, but you can go and try every flavor of everything you
ever wanted. But in terms you're going to
always going to put your foot inthat water, man, that's so
shallow. But then like a relationship, it
(34:58):
may be a, let's just say 1 foot by 1 foot or one beater, 1
beater, 1m by 1m section of water.
But the depth that you can go tois just, it's, it's honestly
never ending. I, I think that, you know, if
what we believe is true and an eternity is a real thing.
If you have an eternity to builda relationship, like how much
(35:21):
can you learn about a person at what depth of bonding are you
able to have with that person? Because everybody knows that
having long friends or friends from when you were really young
or those ones you've had just for a long time, you can go and
be with that person. There's no level of facade that
needs to come up. You're just completely who you
are. If you could build that over the
course of 1000 years, 10,000 years, I can only imagine what
(35:45):
that would actually be like. Yeah, that's why they'd say
that. Once you get married, you're
one, right? You're not.
You're not 2 anymore. You're one.
You're one soul. You're one person because I feel
that's, that's, that's how it itactually works because if you
take it seriously and if you work on it, that's how you'll
(36:05):
spend eternity. And that's why you have to be
your your spouse's like biggest fan and biggest like supporter
because everything that that goes for her and she grows and
returns directly to you and to your family.
So I think that that it's it's the noblest pursuit and the
(36:27):
toughest and most important decision that you make in life
is to try and try and be one with one person for the rest of
your life. Yeah, so talk to me in the
context of what we've been discussing relationships, long
term values, pornography, masturbation.
Remind me how old your kids are and what how are you planning to
(36:49):
introduce them to this topic of the you're going to come across
crude. Man, I only have girls.
Yeah, I'm So. I'm 36.
I've been married for 10 years. I have a 5 year old, a 2 year
old, and now I'm pregnant with athird girl.
They're all congratulations. Thanks.
So all my girls are called Mary.Mary something.
(37:11):
So it's Mary Maria, Eduardo, Maria, Beatrice, Maria Teresa
and hopefully Mary helped me outwith, with these girls because I
have no clue of how I'm going tointroduce this to the girls, but
I, I hope her mom, her mom, their mom will, will help with
this. But it's, it's going to have to
(37:32):
be a topic and I'm, I'm going tohave to shed a bunch of a bunch
of ego and, and like ideas that I had of how I would be as a, as
a girl dad in terms of like carrying my gun around and
chasing after their. Boyfriend mow down all the boys
who come back nursing because. I, I, I, I know it's, it's
(37:54):
tough, but like, you want them, you want them to have like a
healthy relationship because once you're gone, that's who
they're going to be with. So it has to, it has to be a
topic like this, this world exists and how I would introduce
it like if I could like think ofit right now, I think is it's,
(38:16):
it's basically how we're talkingabout it is that you're going to
be, you're going to be exposed to it.
Like it's, it's probably one of the, the worst drugs in terms
of, of spiritual corruption there is, but it's kind of it's
out there and just try and preserve what you have, know
(38:38):
what it is and always look for someone that that brings you
closer to God. And I think the, for me, it's
going to be like, I don't know how it, how it's dad and
different religions or no religions are going to try and
do this. But for me, it's going to be
more simple because I'm going totry and introduce faith and
(38:58):
religion to them. I already AM.
And at the earliest age in a, ina like the, the lightest and
most loving way possible in terms of like, look, it's not a,
you're going to die if you don'tdo this, but this is the best
tool you'll have to help you outthroughout, to help you
throughout life that I could ever give you.
(39:19):
So more than money, more than schools, if you have faith and
if you, if you have this book called the Bible and you could
have this guy called Jesus and all of these characters are in
this book. And if you've managed to live by
what what this book and this guytells you to live by, I can
guarantee you that you will not be be oppressed, be sad, be
(39:45):
alone, be anxious. It's obviously tougher said than
a tougher done than said, but I think if, if, if I managed to
instill some of that in in in each of their hearts, it's going
to come naturally. Like it sort of came to me.
I hope it'll come in at an earlier age, but each of us has
(40:10):
has their own journey and I'll obviously always be there to
support them, I hope. Yeah.
Well, how about you? Any kids in the in the plan?
Yeah, in the plan on my last time, right?
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So my wife and I, we will
probably start quote UN quote trying in like June or maybe a
(40:31):
little bit before then maybe in April or excuse me, May.
My wife's on some stuff, right, like a medicine right now that
like we're, we're probably goingto wean her off just because
there's some potential health risks there.
So she probably wouldn't be downfor me sharing that, but there
it is. But she so we're going to.
That one out. No, no, it's all fine.
(40:52):
She doesn't listen. So.
But yeah, we're going to start trying to have kids.
Yeah, I'll probably tell her about this one because this is
going to be a unique podcast in itself.
Yeah. But so I don't.
I have two younger sisters. My the middle sister is 4 years
younger than me. The youngest sister is 12 years
younger than me. So I, I have this interesting
(41:12):
perspective and you know, like Iwas saying, I was 16 when my dad
passed away. So the, the perspective that I
hold on the development of youngwomen, I think is different than
a lot of people just because youknow, when I lost my dad when I
was 16, trauma, typically they were 12 and 4.
Oh, they're younger. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
(41:34):
They're younger than me. So they were 12 and four when
that happened. So, you know, when that
happened, I remember, let me just say this trauma I think
robs people their childhood in alot of ways.
Not saying that it brings you tomaturity, but in terms of just
the way that a child brain processes life before and after
trauma, it's usually very different.
(41:55):
You're, you know, a lot of phrases have been said, the word
kids are robbed of their childhood or whatever it is.
And so I was very analytical in terms of like my observation of
them and very acutely aware of the actions, the things that I
said and how it affected them. Even my mother, even though she
was much older than me, when there's that absence of a father
in the home, there's just this interesting thing that happens
(42:15):
where girls, you know, especially my middle sister, she
was 12 years old. She was just starting to come of
age. She was an early bloomer.
So you know, she's going through12/13/14, going through puberty,
didn't have a father figure. There was like this unspoken,
unspoken desire for me to be a leader in the home.
But like I was 16 years old, a late bloomer, had no idea what
(42:36):
life was even about. So you know that.
Must have been so tough. It was tough and thanks for
saying that, but like I'm now today, like I'm thankful that,
you know, I've made it through and through a lot of amazing
people, honestly, that have invested themselves into my
life, my whole family, like we're all alive and breathing
and and doing pretty well. So I have nothing to be super
(42:59):
upset about really. I think it's a lot of those
things have become some of my greatest advantages in life.
Just the perspective, that forced perspective, but with
young women, it's such an interesting dichotomy for me to
to observe because I know for a fact that I'll even go on a limb
generalization and say that all women want to know that they're
(43:23):
beautiful by their fathers. And so, you know, I get on
Instagram today and I won't callanyone out, but I got on this
morning and like, there's this picture that very revealing of
this young woman online. And you know, you go and you
look at the comments and most guys are afraid to comment on
them. And it's a bunch of girls and
they're all like, oh, babe, you slay, you're so hot, blah, blah,
(43:44):
blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And like they're seeking at some
form of attention to know that they're pretty, which is like a
completely normal thing. So with my daughters, like I'm
thinking like, man, if I do havedaughters, if they start getting
online at a young age, which I, I'm not going to get them a
phone probably till they're 50, but that's.
One of my ideas as well. Yeah, like grow up in the woods
(44:05):
because it's like that, that kind of stuff.
I don't know, it's just it's very difficult to say how I
would do things differently. But I know for a fact that it's,
it's a toxic place to be for a woman who's developing because
the best thing for your daughters, I was going to say
this earlier. I think that you're going to be
a great dad or you are a great dad, especially in the raising
(44:27):
them through this age. Because the best thing I think
that you can do for your your daughters is to have a loving
relationship with your wife. And that will show them where
value comes from because as soonas someone starts looking
elsewhere, you know, like I was saying, it's a mile wide and an
inch deep. I think it's anywhere you can go
to find that short level of gratification of like, oh, I am
pretty because this guy told me I have a nice butt because this
(44:50):
guy said I have nice boobs because whatever it is.
And like, that fulfills a piece of that emptiness.
But it doesn't last very long. So.
Yeah. Yeah.
And, and just to circle back on the, the social media and like
Internet and what things are nowthat we're like, my kids aren't
(45:14):
close to, to having a cell phoneyet, but I don't know how it'll
be if it will still be Instagram, TikTok and whatnot.
But like it, it's tough for us. And we're a grown man and we
know what we like, what we don'tlike.
We know if something's more of aless of of a imagine for a kid,
(45:34):
like it's it's so addicting and so and so hard to get out of
that even when you're you're a thinking grown man for a kid
that's going through all these insecurities and and puberty and
trying to fit in school. Yeah.
I mean, you do have loving parents like Ted Bundy had
(45:55):
loving parents, but obviously I,I'm not going to compare like
the, the levels of parenting, but it's, it's like it's
something that you, I will, willdefinitely want to avoid.
Is, is, is that I think that's even tougher than than talking
about pornography. Is is like introducing the kids
(46:16):
to social media and how you do it.
Like that's going to be that's going to be a a tough subject
when it comes around. But we're also the line that
the, the longest that we can wait out and the longest that we
can like do outdoors, go outdoortravel with them, like get them
to see real life before they they get stuck inside a, a
(46:38):
screen. And we're going to, we're going
to fight for that. Yeah, I was trying to think of
like some way to compare it to some other form of food or a
tool in life that we use to like, 'cause it really it is a
tool and it's become very much abusiness tool and it's, it's
(46:58):
also become a method of communication.
But using it in the correct way,whatever that is, is like it's
very difficult to parse out because everybody, it's like
multiple people could go and post the same thing for three.
If there's three people, they post the same thing three
different times, but their motivations can be completely
different and some of them are healthy and some of them are
(47:18):
not. And it affects everybody on the
other side of that who's receiving whatever that post is.
It affects them in a different way.
I think it would be so fascinating to know, to actually
see not in numbers of engagement, not in numbers of
clicks or views or likes, but what is the impact that we
actually have in another person's life by what we post?
(47:39):
Because I think it transcends beyond off screen.
It transcends how we think, whatwe think, why we think, what we
think, how we process life like.It's just, yeah, it's it's a
crazy time to be alive with the method of communication that we
have. And that's something that I, I
did for Lent. Now we're, we're almost in, yes,
there's, there's this period of 40 days of length until Easter
(48:04):
that we usually give up something to, to remember Jesus,
giving it the, the 40 days of Jesus in the desert and get
ready for Easter. And I usually do something like,
I'm going to get rid of coffee. You can get rid of something
going to not eat a meal on the Fridays going to.
So then this year I took took off social media last year and
(48:28):
in my social media I had like a purpose opening the question box
and answering religious questions for people that are
not religious at all that followme.
And this year I was like, OK, soI'm, I'm getting too into the
Instagram thing. I'm going to, I'm going to cut
off social media for a while. So I cut off because we, we use
(48:51):
a bunch of social media for the company.
So I cut off only my personal social media accounts.
And it helps, it helps with a bunch of things and, and it
helps you to reorganize what youneed that platform for what, how
you, you position yourself thereand what, why you post what you
both or why you follow who you follow and be more purposeful
(49:13):
with that because it is a, a very powerful tool.
But if you don't use it, well, it's going to take control of
you. So it, it's also one of the, one
of the probably biggest propagators of, of pornography
as well nowadays is social mediaand the, the pay platforms.
What do you call it? Important to have all that
(49:34):
stuff, yeah. On the fence.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's crazy.
I've listened to a quite a few podcasts in the last week.
Have you heard of Chris Williamson with Modern Wisdom,
his podcast? Yeah, we probably listen all the
same stuff, but he he he did this recent conversation with.
I forget her name. I want it.
What is her name? It's a blonde girl.
(49:54):
I have to link it in the show notes if whoever wants to go
check it out. But she was talking about just
the deep dive education on like what pornography actually does
to people and like what are the inner workings of the business
models behind it. And in terms of just a number of
illegal and abusive content thatgets uploaded to these different
(50:16):
sites, whether it be only fans or Pornhub or whatever.
Like it's just, it's mind boggling.
So for me, you know, in the combating of like going down
that road, I just remind myself of.
Just India, No. Yeah, it may have been, it may
have been her. I think it is.
Is she brown haired? There was 2 girls, 1 was blonde
(50:37):
and she was talking about like young women and their mindsets
and then there was some overlap there and then there and the
other girl was like who was talking specifically in the
topic of pornography and riding these sites of all dish this
horrendous content that gets uploaded like where people are
being physically abused. No, it was this year.
It was like a couple of weeks ago.
I'll link them in the show notesfor sure.
(50:59):
Yeah, I can't remember but. The modern women feel more lost
than ever. Yeah.
Yeah, that's the. Is that for you?
Yeah, but maybe, maybe not. You'll you'll have to link
you'll link that one. Yeah, I'll link them, but it is
it was just, it was a humble andsobering thought and like the
longevity of someone who works in that industry too.
(51:20):
It's like, I think the average is like 36 months.
And I've watched a few podcasts of, you know, these women who
have been in that industry and then come out of it and just
hearing some of their stories, it's like, and I've supported
that. Like it's just disgusting to
know like that, you know, if youcounts and whatnot.
And what's really gross is behind all of this.
It's like a bunch of dudes, man,that run this industry and
(51:42):
they're like modern day pimps. They go around and that's what
they do. And it's all about money and
power at the end of the day. And it's just like, man, like I
wish that stuff, if I was to ever get into an illegal
activity, I would figure out where the servers are, that
whole house, all of this pornography stuff, and just cut
the cables and blow it out. Blow it up.
(52:03):
Like for real, a couple strategic missiles.
Because really, like, it's the downfall of society in so many
ways if dudes get offline and start thinking about what it
means to be a good dad and staying with someone and loving
your children. Like that's how you fix a lot of
the political issues, man. It's like, go back to the root
of civilization and society. It's the family unit.
(52:24):
And soon as you throw that on the back on the burner and you
just fry it until it's nothing left, it just becomes warped.
Have you ever left like a fryingpan or a pot on the stove too
long and everything evaporates and then you like, warp the
metal? Like that's literally our life.
Crazy. Exactly.
I love myologies, yeah. That's true, That's true, but I
(52:48):
mean, going back to your your theory that it's the root of all
all that the downfall of society.
I think that that you're you're on to it because may most of our
problems would probably it shakes if it if we didn't have
power greedy or or pornographersor or people that didn't mean
(53:11):
mean good. Because usually when you have,
when you have families, when youhave people that, that look at
it for, for their kid that are looking out for their kids that
are looking out for good, that are trying to develop these long
term relationships that aren't looking at these, these, these
(53:32):
short term crazy lustful ideas of P Diddy or whatever
pornography and things that thatall all lead to, to money and
power. You'd probably not have as many
wars and as many conflicts and as many upset as lonely people
as you do. Because if if, if you cut that
(53:57):
off, it's it it's tough to to feed the to feed the other, the
other two, which is which is power and money as well, because
you it basically you, you use them for good and you'll you'll
eventually just distributed themthat them out.
I don't know, but I think you'reon to something there with with
(54:20):
with it being the cause of of most of the evils.
I think it, it all comes back to, to to try what, what
destroys destroys societies and the family.
Then I think that when, when youput money and power and and and
and pleasure above above God, above love, above family, then
(54:42):
then you're, you're, you're, you're destined to lose.
Yeah, I'd love to see the studies of what I forget all of
the what the base needs are of humanity, but it's like food and
water, shelter, environment. Obviously sex is one of them and
food or whatever. It's like if you can corrupt any
of those, OK, so food, fast food, you introduce that
(55:03):
environment, you shove a bunch of people into a city where the
the lights block out the stars so you're not reminded of the
nature and the beauty of the world.
Things that disrupt your sleep phones, like all of these things
that are right at our fingertipsthat are of convenience.
And when we bring them into our,our operation of what's going on
within our, our, our, our body, it's like, yeah, it throws all
(55:24):
of those things off. Yeah, that's a whole other
conversation. Yeah, it's.
Crazy, it's crazy. We're we're, we're going on down
the destruction rabbit hole. Yeah.
So let me let me ask you this kind of to to wrap up a little
bit. If we're somebody who
practically is, like, you know what, I'm recognizing that I'm
empty and I'm not able to find solace and fulfillment from
(55:49):
these things and I think I want to break them off.
What practical advice would you give to a young man or woman who
is wanting to leave these thingsbehind, specifically pornography
and masturbation? You have to recognize first why
why it's bad. So you, you need to understand
why it's bad for you and why it doesn't contribute to, to who
(56:13):
you want to become and who you think you, you want to become
and who you think you are. So first, you need to find out
who you want to be and who you think you want to be and who you
think you are. And then you need to make peace
with the bad things that you have, the bad vices that you,
that you have, the bad habits that you, that you have.
You need them looking straight in the face.
(56:35):
And then you need to work at it every day.
You need to know that you're imperfect, that everyone is that
everyone fails. Everyone's a Sinner.
Everyone does bad, bad, bad things all the time do bad.
And so, but you have to make peace with that and you have to
forgive yourself. You have to want to want to be
better every day and you have tofight at it every day.
(56:59):
It's like a drug addict. Once you once you're a drug
addict, you're never an ex drug addict.
You're just holding on to, to the counting the days that
you're, that you haven't used that you're sober.
So that's, that's how I, I see it that basically every day is a
new opportunity to do, do it right.
So you're never the devil is never far away.
(57:22):
He's always waiting for you to slip and for you to, to think
about some temptation or something that, oh, that would
be OK. That's not that bad.
And that's how you start slipping down.
But always, if you do slip down,remember that you have to
forgive yourself and you have tokeep striving to be better.
The alternative is much worse tofall down and to just think
(57:42):
you're a piece of shit and that you're, you're made that way.
And you're supposed to, to look at porn or to be in inside the
industry or to, to make money through that.
And you're definitely not built to to be that way.
You're built to be happy. You're built to, to fulfill
whatever it is you, you believe that you, you should be.
You're set on the surface to do,sure.
(58:06):
Well, Victor, thank you for taking the time.
I can't believe we've already escalated our great
conversation. It's the one that I think that
needs to be popularized and talked about a lot more.
But thank you for sharing your story and experience.
Yeah, people, people definitely don't want to talk about.
Well, good. I hope this one goes viral and
it just gets shared to everybodybecause it's a there's a
(58:27):
conversation that needs to happen.
So thank you so much for making the time, man.
We're gonna we're gonna start the they have the Mofap Nofap
November. We're gonna do the Nofap 2025.
There you go. I love it.
I love it. We'll do it.
Thanks man. Good, good talk man.
Later. Thank you so much to Victor for
(58:48):
coming on the pod and sharing insuch a way that he did so
candidly. And just the ability to even say
those words, pornography, masturbation, infidelity, and
talk about them in an open lightis not an easy thing to do.
And it comes at the potential for scrutiny.
But that's OK because I think this conversation needs to
(59:09):
happen. And I'm so glad that it was able
to happen in a small way here onthis podcast.
So thank you so much for jumpingin listening.
And if you learned anything, I just asked that you would share
that with somebody who you care about.
So thank you so much again for Victor for coming on.
If you want to check out the Zone 2 performance that company,
(59:29):
check out the show notes in the description.
And also you can check out thosetwo podcasts from Chris
Williamson that I was mentioningabout these topics and the
development of young women and the just the crazy behind the
scenes stuff that goes on in thepornography world and how it
truly affects the world in a negative way.
So go check out those things if you are still watching.
(59:50):
And to this point, just want to say thank you so much.
If you're watching on YouTube, if you could like comment,
subscribe, turn on the notification bell, that helps to
continue to grow the pod. If you're on Apple Podcasts or
Spotify, if you could like review, comment on those
platforms as well, that would continue to help grow this
system that I'm building. With the podcast and also last
(01:00:11):
Thing newsletter, if you want tosign up for that, you can check
out the show note descriptions as well.
They'll take you to the website and you can enter your e-mail
there if you want to get a weekly roundup of the
conversations that I've had for the previous week.
All right, thank you guys so much and we'll catch you in the
next one. Peace.
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