October 14, 2022 • 54 mins
Being a parent or caregiver to a child living with type 1 diabetes can come with a lot of anxiety. Listen in to today's episode as Psychotherapist and fellow T1D parent, Joanne Robb, and I try to unpack some of that anxiety and discuss how to work with it and through it. Joanne is such a great resource for parents and caregivers of type 1 diabetics. In her practice, coaching courses and podcast, she primarily deals with the emotional and relational challenges that come along with managing T1D. Check out all the links below to find Joanne! Enjoy!
For JOANNE'S WEBSITE click HERE. Click on the dark purple banner at the top of the page to be a guest on her podcast and have your questions answered! You'll also find a direct link to the podcast itself.
OTHER EPISODES YOU MIGHT ENJOY
Trialnet
Early episode on Anxiety
The Grief and the Trauma of a T1D Diagnosis
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Katie (00:00):
This is episode 88 of the sugar mamas podcast today.
My guest is Joanne Rob, apsychotherapist and fellow T one
D mom, Joanne actually has twochildren living with type one
diabetes.
One is already grown and flown,and one is a freshman in high
Joanne has so much wisdom tooffer listeners.
(00:23):
In her practice.
She primarily deals with theemotional and relational
challenges that come alongsidebeing the caregiver of somebody
with type one diabetes.
Joanne is actually going to bemy guest for a handful of
episodes.
As I do a little mini series.
On anxiety, validation,feelings, and emotions.
(00:45):
And relational challenges allfrom the lens.
Of a type one parent.
The topic for today's episode isanxiety and working through the
anxiety that we may experience.
As T1 D parents.
Make sure you check out thelinks in the show notes to find
Joanne's website at diabetes.
Sweet talk.com.
(01:05):
There you'll also find a link toher podcast, which we're going
to talk about in this episode.
Uh, I won't give anything away,but just to let you know it is
awesome and you're going to wantto find it.
I'm also going to link to a fewother episodes that I mentioned
in this one, such as the episodeI did on TrialNet.
If you're interested in havingyour non-type.
(01:25):
Type one kids tested for thediabetes auto antibodies.
I did a very early episode onanxiety that I think you would
enjoy listening if you like thisepisode.
And I did an episode on griefand the trauma of a type one
diagnosis that I think you wouldalso enjoy.
If you enjoy this interview withJoanne.
So again, check out the links inthe show notes for all of that.
(01:48):
Okay.
Without further ado, let's getstarted.
You're listening to the sugarmamas podcast, a show designed
for moms and caregivers of typeone diabetics here.
You'll find a community oflike-minded people who are
striving daily to keep theirkids safe, happy, and healthy in
(02:10):
the ever-changing world of typeone.
I'm your host and fellow T one Dmom, Katie Roseboro.
Before we get started.
I need you to know that nothingyou hear on the sugar mamas
podcast should be consideredmedical advice.
Please be safe, be smart, andalways consult your physician
before making changes to the wayyou manage type one diabetes.
(02:34):
Thanks.
Hey everybody.
I am here with Joanne Robbtoday, and I think this is just
gonna be a fantastic episode.
Joanne is actually gonna bejoining me for a handful of
episodes.
But Joanne, I would like for youto introduce yourself and tell
the listeners how you areconnected to the world of Type
(02:54):
one Diabetes.
Joanne (02:56):
Hi Katie.
Thanks for having me on theshow.
I'm so excited to be here.
I am a mom with three kids andtwo of them have type one.
They are the, my type ones arenow 23 and 14, diagnosed at nine
and four, and my poor middlechild is currently 19 years old.
And I am a psychotherapist.
I have a practice in Oakland,California, and I specialize
(03:18):
among other things in treatingadults family.
With Type one Diabetes, but Iactually started a group called
Sweet Talk.
Diabetes sweet talk.com is thewebsite and I, my goal with that
group, it's a coaching programfor parents of kids with type
one to help them reduce theiranxiety and stress to sort of
move diabetes out from thecenterpiece of their lives.
(03:40):
So that they can live with lessanxiety and with less focus on
diabetes so that they have thepossibility of focusing on the
things they want to right, thethings that bring them joy.
Cuz diabetes is a heavy load, aswe all know, and I think that
parents can get really boggeddown in it in a way that's
actually not productive forthemselves, for management, for
family relationships.
(04:01):
And so I.
My goal is to help with that inthe coaching program, and I
recently actually started apodcast that's a q and a format,
kind of like an ask thetherapist format called Sweet
Talk for Parents of Kids withType one Diabetes.
And I get on and answer parentquestions about sort of the
social, emotional, developmentalanxiety problems that we
(04:23):
struggle with that we can't getanswered in the Endo office.
So those are all my connectionsto diabetes.
Katie (04:28):
Yes, and I can tell you for sure that most of the time,
I, or at least 50% of the time Ishould say, when people reach
out to me with questions,they're mostly like focused
around the anxiety of it all,the emotional toll that it takes
on.
You as a parent and a caregiver,and then of course your kid
who's living with this disease.
(04:50):
And, and you know, I've hadseveral people ask, Can you
recommend somebody that I can goand talk to about my anxiety or
just, you know, the depressionthat I'm having because of this?
And there's really not a wholelot of people out there that
really specialize in, therapysessions for a, a type one
caregiver or just a caregiverwho has a kid with, you know, a
(05:12):
chronic medical condition nomatter what it is.
So that's pretty rare to find.
So I was really excited when youreached out and I was like, Oh,
good.
Now I have somebody that I canrefer these people to,
Joanne (05:21):
people to,
Katie (05:23):
who can, who can help them.
It's such a challenge.
Joanne (05:26):
It is and it's part of why I wanted to create the
coaching program.
So it's much more behaviorallyfocused and the goal is to help
really both bring peopletogether so it normalizes
everybody's experience cuzeveryone in the space is having
a similar experience and alsoprovide parents with some very
concrete tools to help them.
(05:48):
Shift their worry, their anxietyover, Right?
Because there are so few peoplewho do the work.
You know, there are a fewclinics I know who have a
psychologist on staff, but thoseare few and far between, and so
I feel like parents need moresupport than that.
Katie (06:01):
Right.
And anyone can access thecoaching courses that you offer,
Correct.
It doesn't have to be justwithin your state.
Yeah.
Joanne (06:08):
Yeah.
That's part of why I offer itthan that way.
Katie (06:11):
Yes, and anybody can also access the podcast.
And I just wanna tell you guysthat I had to be home all day
today because we.
People here, maintenance workersreplacing one of our air
conditioning units, which isalways a joy to do.
And it's, you know, so, so cheaptoo.
It's just so cheap.
But I, so I was, you know, doingchores around the house and I
got on your website cause Ialways like to do a little, you
(06:33):
know, a little bit more researchand I have to do.
Pretty soon before I interviewsomebody cuz otherwise like I
forget a lot of things.
So I was on your website todayand I was like, oh, she actually
started her podcast cuz in theemails you had just said, I'm
going to start.
A podcast.
So I was like, Oh, let me take alisten.
Cuz I, I love podcasts.
I'm a podcast junkie.
(06:54):
You have five episodes out sofar?
Correct.
And you guys, I listen to everysingle one of them today.
no, I did speed them up.
I'll, I'll be honest.
Only because, And it's not you,it's everybody.
I speed all my podcasts upbecause that's just how.
That's just how I roll.
One time I turned on my playerand it was not sped up at all,
(07:14):
and I literally thought for asolid five seconds that I was
having a stroke because I waslike, Oh my God, what is wrong?
These people are talking soslow.
But it's just that I forgot.
I just forgot to speed it up.
So, no, but I listened to allfive today and I really wanna
put this at the beginning of theepisode cause I want people to
hear this, that like, they, theywere so good.
I mean, I felt like even thoughI wasn't the one, you know,
(07:37):
Sitting behind the desk talkingand asking you questions like I
felt like I was in on a minitherapy session for myself, and
I truly felt so seen and soknown and validated, and I just,
it was like, Oh, wow.
Like there's somebody thatactually gets it out there.
And all the questions peoplewere asking, like, I could
(07:58):
relate to every.
Single one of'em, even though Ihadn't experienced that exact
same thing, there was a, therewas always a part of it that I
could relate to and your answerswere just so great.
So everybody, I will put a linkto it in the show notes to your
website.
Honestly, your website has linksto everything, so I'll put a
link to the website in the shownotes, but definitely check it
out.
It was great.
Sweet talk for parents of kidswith type one is the name
Joanne (08:20):
Diabetes.
Mm-hmm.
.Yep.
Thank you, Katie.
I really appreciate the feedbackand I, and I really welcome
people to get on, not just tolisten, but to sign up to get
their questions answered,because it's a good way for
people to get some personalizedsupport.
Katie (08:32):
Yeah, absolutely.
If you guys have questions, you,how do you do it?
That you just sign up on yourwebsite and you'll contact them
or.
Joanne (08:39):
Yeah, there.
Right now there's specifictimes, but I think I might be
able to expand that.
If someone can't do the time,they can just email me and we'll
find a time.
Katie (08:46):
Okay.
All right.
Awesome.
Well, I know it's been many,many years since your kids were
diagnosed.
You, you've been dealing withtype one now for a very long
time.
What, 15 years you said?
Joanne (08:56):
I think it's almost 14.
I can't quite remember,honestly,
Katie (08:59):
Yeah.
So just, I'm just curious, likewhat stands out in your, because
even only two years out fromdiagnosis for me, I mean, it's,
it's very much so a big memoryin my head, but like even now,
It's still, some of it is alittle fuzzy, you know, the
memory starts to fade over time.
So what, I'm just curious, likewhat do you remember about that
time?
Like what stands out to you inyour mind about, you know, the
(09:20):
time surrounding, like yourkid's diagnosis?
Joanne (09:22):
actually, I think that those memories are pretty sharp
for me.
The actual diagnosis?
Katie (09:27):
Yeah.
I mean, they're very sharp, butlike, I don't know.
I've never been a great, I'venever been great with details,
so, you know what I mean?
Like it, like for instance, Ican't tell you every single
detail of what happened, but Ican, I just remember an
overwhelming sense of sadness.
You know, everybody has, theiremotions come out in different
ways.
You know, Some people are soangry and some people are so
(09:48):
fearful and some people are justin complete denial.
But I just was so.
Sad.
That was my overwhelming
Joanne (09:56):
issue.
Mm.
Katie (09:57):
Yeah.
Joanne (09:58):
I think for my first diagnosis, I honestly, I have to
say, I don't think I know how Ifelt because I was so busy,
which is totally how I operate.
When things are hard, I just getsuper busy to learn everything.
It wasn't till my seconddiagnosis, I think that I could
even let the sadness really in,in a, in a profound way, which
(10:18):
wasn't to say I didn't have sadmoments when my son was
diagnosed, but it wasn't untilmy daughter was.
She was sort of on the verge ofdiagnosis, right?
Because we got diagnosed withher through Trial net.
So it was a very not standarddiagnosis, but it meant I knew
for a while what was coming.
And that was deeply sad with myson.
I think it was deeply busy andfrantic.
(10:40):
Right?
Cuz I think I, my response isfrantic.
But I also have specificmemories of, you know, sitting
in the hospital.
Er, and there wasn't a room forhim.
And so the doctor came andtalked to us and did a consult,
like in the hall, on the gurney,in the er and said, You're gonna
be fine.
And me sort of latching ontothat, like it was like, it was
(11:03):
the god-given truth because Ididn't, it was scary.
Right.
And then a memory with mydaughter of, you know, a moment
where I just wept and wept andwept because it was just so,
Hard.
Right.
And also I think we, you know,I'm like the unicorn having two
kids.
It can happen, but we're rarerand thank God.
(11:23):
And you know, a friend of minesaid it's not often that we get
to repeat a crisis or anemergency.
And so it really was differenthow they played out.
Katie (11:33):
That's so interesting.
And how far apart, I know onewas nine at diagnosis and one
was four, but how many years inbetween their diagnoses
Joanne (11:41):
I'm trying to do that math.
Katie (11:42):
know?
Joanne (11:43):
So four years, because they're nine years apart.
So when my son was diagnosed, somaybe three and change when my
son was diagnosed my daughterwas still a baby.
Like I was still nursing her andnaps and the whole thing.
And I would wake her up and haulher into school to give him
shots and you know, the wholething.
(12:03):
So I'm gonna say three endchange years.
Katie (12:06):
Okay.
Just curious, This episode,specifically is gonna be on
anxiety.
So just in your practice, whatare some ways that you have seen
anxiety just kind of manifest orcome out of people?
You know, cuz it can take somany different forms.
Joanne (12:23):
mm-hmm.
So it can take so many differentforms.
And actually I think with a newdiagnosis, if that's what you're
asking about, Anxiety takesevery form, right?
Because it, it actually likechannels through every emotion.
So like for me, when my son wasdiagnosed, it was frantic.
For some parents, I think it'sanger, it's sadness, it's
(12:43):
anxiety channels into all thoseplaces, right?
And it moves people forward.
I think what I also see thoughis the kind of Frantic need to
get it exactly right.
And I would say as anoverarching Presentation.
That's what I see is that newlydiagnosed parents have a deep
need to get it exactly right andhave their kid be in range all
(13:05):
the time and be sure thatthey've counted every carb and
it, it makes total sense, right?
You leave the hospital and thisis what you're told is
essential, and you as a parentlooking ahead feel like what is
the, what are the health riskshere?
And so I think that.
Largely how I see it show up innewly diagnosed parents.
And, and then there are, andthen there are all the emotions
(13:27):
that come along with the anxietythat I already named, which can,
you know, be in really almostany form.
But I think they're oftenattached to anxiety that's in
there too.
They're not like, it's not justpure anger.
There's like anxiety woven inwith it.
Katie (13:39):
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
And how do, I mean, how do youkind of teach people to
recognize their anxiety?
You know, if they're maybe evena little bit unaware that
they're even.
having it.
I mean, cuz I, I do think you'reright.
Like, you know, when I, I thinkanxiety is synonymous with
worry.
And, and I guess in some ways itis, but I feel like it can show
(14:00):
up in so many different forms.
So how, how do you kind of coachpeople through recognizing their
anxiety and then validatingtheir anxiety?
Joanne (14:10):
Well, I think this is, This is the work I do mostly in
the coaching course, and so whatI would say is there are a few
prongs to that.
One is, I love that you use theword normalizing and validating,
right?
That's exactly what I'm there todo.
And we normalize it in part byseeing that everybody's having
the same experience in thisweird way.
None of us are special.
Like of course our children areincredibly, deeply special and
(14:32):
we love them and are protectingthem, and it feels very unique
to us.
But when you're in a room fullof parents with type one, we
sort of recognize thateveryone's having a really
similar experience and it'ssuper grounding for most parents
to feel like.
They understand like all thesepeople get it cuz I do think
that part of what makes usanxious is that we don't know
(14:53):
how to reach out for helpbecause we feel like it's both
it so much and also we speakthis weird language that nobody
else speaks right?
We speak in code almost like afriend of mine once said, I
speak stock broker.
Like to her it just sounded likethis really weird thing.
And so I think some of how wedeal with anxiety is just being
in a room with other people.
(15:14):
Who speak like we speak, whohave the same experiences we
have who can understand ourexperiences.
I think that's profoundlyimportant.
It's one of the reasons I'm ahuge proponent of things like
diabetes camp and in particularfamily camp, cuz I think parents
need it Another way I help workwith anxiety.
Well, there two more ways.
I think you named it isvalidating it.
Like, of course it makes sensethat you're anxious, duh, Like
(15:37):
there's no reason for you tofeel badly about it.
Right.
It's just normal.
It's a huge growth curve.
It's a huge learning curve, andit's not something you signed up
for.
And it's not something that youwant.
So we work from that place aswell.
And then in the coachingcourses, I actually have a lot
of tools that I've built to helppeople create one behavioral
(15:58):
change.
And I'm a really big believerthat small changes have a huge
ripple effect over time.
Like you can't bite off a big,you can't eat a whole five
course meal in one bite.
You right?
You take one bite and one biteand one bite.
And so I'm a believer thattaking a small step towards
change can have a ripple effectin impact, in part because it
(16:20):
makes you feel competent tocreate the change.
So one example I have that'sreally common is people who over
check the Dexcom.
Right, and, and I mean, overcheck these, you know, we all,
we're all guilty of it.
Like I wake up in the night andoften look at my daughter's
number.
How does that serve me?
I do not know.
Just have the alarm set and goto sleep.
(16:41):
Like lean into trust, right?
And that behavior that like ocd,like checking behavior, actually
increases our anxiety loop.
So what would happen if, And weset a behavioral goal one day
you check whatever it is, onetime less, or you check only
once around lunch or whatever itis that feels manageable to see
(17:04):
if you can lower your anxietyaround that moment.
So those kinds of small changesis a big way that I think is
effective to work with.
Katie (17:13):
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
So just little, little stepsThat's a very common comment
that I hear from parents justbeing glued to the, to the
Dexcom situation.
And then, you know, freaking outa little bit when the.
Their kid goes offline, which,which happens, you know, quite,
quite frequently.
Yeah.
Joanne (17:31):
Yep.
Yep.
Katie (17:33):
I always just have to remind myself that, you know,
that's just how that was, How itwas like not even 10 years ago,
pretty much.
So, we're gonna survive.
Sarah has a support group atschool that I can call upon if I
need to, I remember my husbandtexted me one day, he's like,
Hey, Sarah's been off the gridfor like four hours.
I'm like, Yeah, I know.
He's like, Are you gonna driveup there and fix it?
And I'm like, No, I'm actuallykind of enjoying the break.
Joanne (17:54):
That's awesome.
That's awesome.
Katie, look at you
Katie (17:58):
He was like, I think he was more like, Well, I'll drive
over there if you're not goingto, But he, he did not.
He, he couldn't.
He was in some sort of meetingthat he couldn't get out of.
But, but yeah, no, I've said iton the podcast before, but like,
my favorite 30 minutes of theday.
I mean, this is, this isdramatic.
It's not my favorite 30 minutesof the day, but when Sarah goes
to recess and is like off thegrid for a little bit, I'm like,
Oh, I don't have to payattention because there's no
(18:20):
point.
I'm not gonna see it, see thenumber.
Anyway, so
Joanne (18:23):
Yeah, I mean, when, when my kids started, they didn't
have technology to do that.
I mean, I'm sure they did, butI'm sure it was the size of like
a VCR cassette tape, right?
I'm dating myself, so that wasnot practical and my son really
didn't wanna wear it.
And at some point I said to him,I need you to do this.
Like, I was literally dying.
I was waking up to alarms.
(18:43):
Like I would set an alarm in thenight, wake up every night, do
fingert sticks.
It was exhausting.
And I was working multiple jobsand the, you know, that I re,
I'll never forget the night Isat down on the bathroom floor
sobbing.
Like, I cannot do this anymore.
They need to be on thistechnology.
And he agreed, and therefore sheagreed, she did anything he told
her.
Older brother, younger sister.
But yeah, we lived without itall the time.
(19:05):
And, and your kids do learn, youknow, not teeny little kids,
right?
That's not realistic.
But your kids do learn as theyget older, like what it feels
like in their body.
And that's actually what youwant, right?
Because the, the Dexcom isn'talways accurate either.
Like it can be off.
It's important for them to know,for example, when they're lower
than what the Dexcom says,right?
All of these things areimportant, so they do need to
(19:27):
have that physical knowledge andawareness.
Katie (19:30):
So I kind of wanna, if I, if I can, I wanna ask you about,
I'll give two specific examplesfrom just my experience and
maybe you could kind of tell mehow you would approach both of
these things, cuz, So the, thefirst one would be like a short
term.
Anxiety situation.
I mean, not, it could be longterm, but for me it was short
term.
It was, it was almost more oflike a panic situation, which I
(19:53):
am, I am not one for panicattacks.
I don't, I can think of, youknow, very few times in my life
where I've have felt very, verypanicky.
But shortly after Sarah'sdiagnosis, I just started having
these.
What I would call irrational.
I mean, I guess they're notirrational cuz truly it could
happen.
But I started having these fearsof what if, what if something
happens to me like, and Iwouldn't be there to take care
(20:16):
of her.
Like it wasn't even about, Imean I've had those fears too
about what if something happensto her, but like what if
something happens to me rightnow and.
and I'm not here.
And, and I, I was getting shortof breath.
I was not able to sleep atnight, and finally I just kind
of like stabbed myself out ofit, which I feel like honestly
for me was a gift from God.
Like, he was just like, Look,what are you doing?
(20:36):
Like you can't control this.
Like you have no, you have nocontrol over this, so why are
you wasting your time worryingover it?
But how would you kind of helpsomebody?
With more of a I would say moreof like an intense, kind of
shorter term, almost panicsituation
Joanne (20:51):
Mm-hmm.
.Mm-hmm.
It's a great question, Katie,and I have to name that I had a
very similar, like near topanic.
I actually had a few panicattacks not long after my son
was diagnosed, and it's not howI normally fly.
Right.
So you, you did exactly what atherapist would do.
I have to.
Brilliant.
Which is that you recognized youcouldn't actually control it.
(21:13):
So I, this, it, honestly, if Igot someone in with this level
of panic and it was continuing,I would probably refer them to
somebody who is specializes incognitive behavioral therapy,
because that's sort of the goldstandard for things like panic
attacks.
And what I understand of it isthat the treatment is exposure.
(21:34):
So, and the exposure in thiscase is really knowing that you
can't do anything andrecognizing that no disaster
happens because of the thoughtthat you're having, right?
It's just a thought it couldhappen.
Sure.
Bad things can happen and it'snot happening right now, and
everybody's safe and okay rightnow.
(21:54):
And so that's sort of thetreatment for something like
that for.
And you did it yourself.
You snapped yourself out of itand acknowledged that you can't
control it.
And so there's no point inworrying and thinking about it
like you have all your ducks ina row in some way to address the
possibility.
Like as a parent, you know whoyour kids would go to if
something happened to you,right?
Or you have a will, or whateverit is.
(22:14):
Certainly those things,structural things, having that
in place is helpful, but reallyyou have to come to some kind of
piece inside yourself that likebad things do happen and we
don't have control overeverything all the time.
No matter what.
And of course, diabetes makesthat worse, right?
Because it's scarier.
Katie (22:30):
yeah.
And I had to remind myself too,like, there's other people in
her life.
Like there's my husband andthere's grandparents, and
there's aunts and uncles thatlove her too.
So it's gonna be So then, okay,so that would be more of like
intense, kind of shorter term.
What about like, you know, Ikind of, I feel like for the
most part I'm good, but likewith like the whole I worry.
I worry more about the emotionalburden and toll that it's gonna
(22:54):
take on her way more than I eventhink about the medical side of
things.
Like, sure, I think about likethe complications that could
happen, but mostly I find myselfhaving anxiety about like, how
is this gonna affect her?
Mentally.
And that just kind of comes andgoes.
I don't, I definitely don'tspend all day thinking about
that.
It's not debilitating.
I'm still obviously functioningand performing my life duties,
(23:17):
but, for more of like a, a lowergrade, but longer term anxiety
such as that, how would youapproach that?
Joanne (23:24):
So I wanna name like how I would approach that as
different in different settings.
So as a therapist, we'd betalking, we have more time and
space to look at that kind ofthing.
In my coaching course, we'relooking at a behavioral shift in
modification that can get madethat would help you feel more in
control and less like you'rethinking about that.
And off the top of my head,honestly, Katie, I can't think
(23:45):
about what exactly I would grabfor that.
So I'll keep thinking about it,but.
I think that with that kind ofanxiety, there's partly just the
normalizing of it, which is thatthe research does show that
that's actually really common.
So with kids with for example,cancer, their parents are
anxious.
Like if you were to look at a.
Curve, their parents have highanxiety and then it comes down,
(24:08):
right?
Because there's treatment andthen there's resolution one way
or the other, hopefully to forthe better, right?
With diabetes, parents get inthere fast and then over time
their anxiety creeps up, right?
Because they recognize more andmore like how heavy a load it.
So it's a really differentlooking curve and I think I
(24:28):
would say, yeah, that makessense to me.
Like as you sit with this andyou see the ramifications and
the impact for your daughterevery single day, and you
imagine out to the next thingdevelopmentally what's coming
for her?
Like, how could you not feel alittle worried about
emotionally, how it's gonnaresonate?
and then I would send you to doexactly what you sensible Katie
(24:50):
are doing, which is creatingcommunity around it because it
helps you to see.
She's gonna be okay.
You know, it takes attentiveparenting in any situation,
right?
Our kids can throw us curveballs no matter what, and we
have to pay attention and bewatching for the places that are
hard for them to be able to helpand support them.
(25:10):
But when you're in community,you also can see people who have
diabetes, who are 20, who are25, who are 30, who are doing
fine.
And so that's an importantantidote also, I think, to the
worry.
Does that all make sense?
Katie (25:23):
Yes.
No, I, I think it does.
We, I just went to a um,conference touch by type one in
Orlando.
They have an annual conferenceand a friend of mine also
obviously a T one D Mom uh, wewent together and.
It really was just amazing, evenjust to be, I didn't, I wasn't
speaking at this conference, Iwasn't promoting the podcast at
this conference.
I was just there as a caregiverof a T one D and it really was
(25:46):
quite spectacular to be in agiant conference hall with all
these other parents.
Of, of kids that have type one.
Solidarity was palpable, youknow, and just to listen to all
these speakers, you know, mostof the speakers had type one and
were doing.
Amazing things, or just normalthings like, you know, they were
just thriving in life.
And then a lot of them wereparents of type one.
(26:08):
So it was great.
I, I, I wanna echo yourrecommendation to just get
involved with community and Youknow, not, not all day, every
day, cuz I think that would be alittle bit too much, but
sprinkle it in, in every now andthen for sure.
And then this particularconference also, we did not
bring our kids to this.
It was like a mom's weekendaway.
But they have, you know, theyhave programs there for kids
(26:31):
too.
So while the parents arelearning, the kids are playing
and hanging out with other kidswith type one.
So it's, it was.
Joanne (26:38):
It sounds amazing and I think actually what I love that
you just said is that there werepeople who were just thriving
living their regular lives.
Cuz I think at those kind ofconferences they tend to throw
up, you know, the person whoclimbed Mount Everest with type
one or the person who cycledacross America with type one.
And those are amazing, amazingthings.
But not our most of ourchildren.
And so I think that it's nice tosee people who are just living
(27:00):
normal lives, who have jobs andfamilies and are thriving, doing
regular things.
It's not to say our kids can'tclimb Mount Everest, bike across
America, go live in Africa, doall those amazing things, but
it's nice to know they can justbe good functioning,
professional, smart, workingfamily people.
Katie (27:18):
Mm-hmm.
Yep.
Really my main goal as a parentis to keep the kids outta jail.
So if I can do that, That's,really goal number one and
alive, I guess, alive and outtajail.
If I've, if I've accomplishedthat when the day's over, I have
done my job
Joanne (27:36):
of a low bar.
Katie (27:39):
I do That's probably a, a strength and a
Joanne (27:43):
and a weakness,
Katie (27:44):
Depending on
Joanne (27:47):
Okay.
I'm not quite believing you, butit's a good line,
Katie (27:51):
No, it's okay.
It was funny, you actually inour, my church group the other
day, we were, we, that questionwas asked like, what does it
mean to you?
Like, what would it mean foryou, like for your kids to be
successful, like when they'regrown?
Like what would be your, yourbenchmark or your standard?
Like, okay, well they did.
Did this, so I know they'resuccessful, and one guy was
like, I mean, I think if theyjust get a job at Chick-fil-A,
(28:12):
that's probably it.
Right?
Like they're That's like themeasure of success, right?
For a good kid, I'm like, that'spretty funny.
Joanne (28:19):
Well also, he's probably talking about his 15 year old,
not his 30 year old.
Like he's having trouble seeingfar enough out
Katie (28:26):
Right, right,
Joanne (28:26):
for sure.
But you know what, that's suchan important question for our
diabetic kids too.
Like what's a measure of successfor them?
And it's really the same.
And we're aim and what'simportant is for us to keep, I
mean, I'm a big believer inkeeping our relationship with
our children in the.
of everything as opposed todiabetes in the front of
everything.
(28:46):
And so we need to remember that,that what we want for them is to
be close to us because we lovethem and also because we're
protective for them.
Like we are a protective factorfor their mental health.
And so if they have a strongconnection with us and are able
to talk to us even when theirdiabetes is going sideways, it's
gonna turn out better for them.
Katie (29:05):
Yeah.
Definitely.
I agree you, you said that a fewdifferent times today when I was
listening to those episodes andI was like, it was like, I was,
talking to myself, walkingaround my house like, Yes, you
know, agreeing with you.
Like, But yeah, that was a bigpoint that you made a few times
that I really agreed with that.
The relationships really justneed to come first and.
that's not to say you throw allcaution to the wind and just let
(29:27):
it all, let it all go.
You know, diabetes managementwise, but relationships should
be first and foremost for sure.
Okay.
Let's see.
So just what are some, some tipsand tricks?
You know, you've alreadymentioned a few, but like, some
fast tools that you give parentsto pull out when they're feeling
overly anxious or you know, ifthey're just kind of having like
an overly anxious week, or whatare some, some things that you
(29:49):
suggest to help them decreasetheir anxiety?
Joanne (29:52):
So actually I don't really suggest I ask them
because I think you're theexpert of your own experience
more than I am.
Right?
And you know, you know whenyou've been successful in the
past with decreasing youranxiety and those are the things
we have to remember and help.
Ourselves and parents moved toright, is like what used to
work, what has worked in thepast.
(30:12):
What could you do that would behelpful?
I could come up with a long listfor you and you know, I'm, you
and I in a Venn diagram wouldprobably have a lot of overlap,
right?
Because most people do.
Getting enough rest, havingpeople to connect to having a
hobby you love.
Like for me, I like to read abook.
I like to cook a meal I've nevermade before.
These kinds of things.
I love to go for a walk or ahike, right?
But yours are gonna be differentthan mine.
(30:34):
Maybe you like to pet a dog,maybe you like, you know,
whatever it is.
So I think it's, it'srecognizing what is helpful for
you.
And there's some foundationalpieces, right?
Like we all need humanconnection, It's important for
us to have that.
So where do you get that?
Who are the people who like fillyou up and help you feel well
nourished and well cared for andloved, especially in the moments
(30:56):
where you're feeling at yourmost vulnerable and weakest.
But I, I don't have a go-tolist.
I feel like my job is to helpyou create your own.
Katie (31:04):
yeah.
I mean, I, had that thoughtseveral times when I was
listening to your podcast todayabout just how, you know, there
are some people that really andtruly just feel so isolated and
alone.
Like, I mean, they, you know, amilitary family for example,
they might be miles away fromany family or close friends.
And now they're dealing.
This.
Um, But I, that was one thingthat I felt while I was
(31:24):
listening to you like I almostfelt like there was community,
even though it's, you're notsitting with other people and,
you know, I don't, I wouldn'tsay that would take the place of
like real life human interactionwith other people, but it really
was like a very comforting thingto listen to.
You know, almost like you'resitting in a conference and
listening to other parents talkand kind of bounce ideas off
each other and just to know thatyou're, you're not alone.
(31:46):
Again, if, if any parent outthere is feeling very isolated
and alone highly recommend, lookup where your local JDRF
chapters are, and then listen tomy podcast and Joanne's podcast,
Joanne (31:59):
thank you for the plug.
But I think, I think the localjdrf, you know, and, and there
are so many resources andbecause the world is connected
and the internet exists,there're even more, right?
So there's, there's just allkinds of forums and places for
parents to get some connectionand I cannot recommend it more.
However it works for you.
It's important.
Katie (32:19):
Yeah, it's easier now than it ever has been.
And I think even more so comingout of this pandemic cuz
everybody's so hungry for actualcommunity, authentic community.
Not just let's chat over a Zoomcall, you know?
Joanne (32:31):
Yep.
Katie (32:32):
All right.
Let's see.
So So is there any, any familyor parent that you've like
worked with, obviously withoutgiving names and details that
really stuck out to you in termsof like you know, their anxiety
and just your experience helpingthem through their anxiety.
Do you mind, do you mind sharingif you have a story or two that
stands out, how you kind ofcoach them through that or do
(32:53):
you feel comfortable
Joanne (32:54):
no, I thought I've been thinking about this since you
sent it to me.
So you just added a piece, whichis How did I coach them through
that and.
I'm thinking of families whohave been in my coaching course
and one of the families, and I,I say this with absolute
empathy, like this is what I didtoo.
When my son was diagnosed, Ijust slept with him every night
as though sleeping with himwould give me information.
(33:17):
I.
Because it didn't, we didn'thave a cgm.
I would just wake up and rollover and prick his finger and
man, I didn't have to get outtabed for a while.
Right.
But that, it wasn't really asustainable lifestyle for 10,000
reasons.
And there was a family I workedwith where that was mom's
strategy for dealing with heranxiety.
And she was really stuck there.
(33:38):
It was really hard for her.
And And she wasn't in a placethat she was really ready to
make a shift around it either.
So I can help with managinganxiety, but there has to be
openness to suggestions ofchange.
You have to be coachablebasically.
I'm thinking of another familywhere mom was actually quite
(33:59):
angry.
Like it, it was anxiety, but itlooked like anger at her kid for
the way he was not managing atschool.
And I honestly can't remember alot of the details of how that
worked, but we just, she did mycoaching program like we went
through, and some of it is mejust setting realistic
expectations, like when you havea teen child, they're not gonna
(34:20):
manage their diabetes.
As well as you want them to.
And of course that is stressful,but we can't pile on all the
expectations at once.
It's just like we're not gonnasay to our 14 year old, Okay,
well now you're a teenager, soyou should be able to do all the
laundry and wash all the dishesand make all the meals.
Like, we're not gonna do that.
We're gonna slowly, slowly,slowly teach them how to be
(34:42):
independent and how to do thosekinds of things.
And it's the same thing withdiabetes, like.
They're really not gonna do agreat job.
And it's stressful, right?
Because we feel like theirhealth is at risk, but we can't
make them do all of it at once.
And it gets in the way of therelationship.
So I'm just thinking about thisfamily and through the coaching
program, she was able to takesmall bites, right?
And I, I can't even remember,Katie.
(35:03):
I think it was like she washelping support him to check one
time a day while he was atschool.
And, and she was able to settledown and like understand through
me reflecting how normal it was.
Like, of course you don't wannaunclip your seatbelt, but it is
by the data, a very normalexperience for teenagers to not
do as well with management.
Right?
It's just what it is.
(35:23):
And so helping her to recognizethat take a small step, we got
to a place where she was a lotless anxious.
Katie (35:30):
That's good.
You know, I didn't put this inthe questions, the pre the
prewritten out questions that weexchanged, but, you know, you
talk about the, the teenagersand how they typically have
higher a1c during thoseformative years.
And this, you know, ourexpectations really shouldn't.
Extremely high for them duringthat time of their life.
But you know, wh where, where doyou feel like social media falls
(35:53):
I feel like social media is goodin so many ways because it is
how we find that community,right?
I mean, that's, And we can.
Ask questions and, you know,hear from other moms and feel
like we're not alone.
But then there's the other sideof it, which I think is very
anxiety inducing and just reallywill just steal all the joy and
(36:14):
suck all the joy out of yoursoul when you see these, You
know, and it's funny becausethere's, I'm not gonna name
names, but there is, there's,there's some personalities
online where they do haveteenagers and their teenagers.
Their, their graphs are alwaysperfect.
They're always, they're always,and I'm like, Did you screenshot
this like six years ago and nowyou're posting it?
(36:35):
Or like, but it's amazing howthe loudest people speak the
most.
It, and it really makes, startsto make you feel like, Wow, I'm,
I'm really doing about job.
Like when you start comparingyourself to these, to these
other people it's just, I justfeel like social media is such a
rabbit hole that you can spiral.
Joanne (36:54):
you
Katie (36:55):
Out of control very quickly in terms of comparing
yourself to other people, andthat causing a lot of anxiety.
So do you ever just tell peoplelike, you just need to get off
social media?
Like how have, have you dealtwith that at all?
Joanne (37:05):
I love this question because I I love this question
because I grapple with this alot, with this idea of
perfection.
I think this is the same thingwith the Dexcom, frankly.
It's like a double edged sword.
Thank God we have it, we allsleep better for it.
We all are much more sane in somany ways, and yet it's created
this 10 outta 10 of anxietywhere we're watching all the
(37:28):
time.
Like, that's not good for useither.
And so I think you're exactlyright, like online creates
community and it also createscompetition in a way that's very
specifically anxiety inducingfor us as T one D parents.
I've never said to anyone getoff social media.
I try to be as generous anddiplomatic as I feel like you're
being right now.
(37:48):
But part of why I wanted to beon your show is I feel like you
have a pretty level perspective.
I like your sensible, groundedperspective on your show, and
that includes that we're notgonna be perfect all the time.
That this is one of many thingsthat we do.
And I, so in my coachingprogram, I have an actual.
Little piece, you know, it'sall, it's all reverse classroom,
(38:09):
so it's all, you know, videosI've created and lesson plans
and all of this stuff that youdo on your own.
And then you come to the meetingprepared or as prepared as you
wanna be.
And then there's a group chatalso where I answer questions,
but one of the teachings iscalled Numbers Perfection.
And it talks about the data.
Right.
The data really shows this, soyou can kill yourself to try and
(38:32):
get to a flat line, but I don'tthink it's real for most people.
I do think, of course, there aresome people who probably eat no
carbs, who Probably are very,very watchful.
And if, and if those people havekids with that, I suspect that
those kids are gonna have somekind of rebound around it later.
(38:52):
Right?
It's too hard to do.
So I'll name that my son who'snow 23, was highly anxious about
his diabetes, like crazy amountsof anxiety and was because of
that, an excellent manager.
And as he's gotten older and isless anxious and he's on closed
loop.
Dexcom and Tandem.
He's exhausted, He's genuinelyexhausted and I don't wanna say
(39:14):
he's not taking care of himself,but I've noticed like he's
actually home right now.
He's leaving to move to Spainsoon.
And so he is having a littlehiatus here while he's waiting
for his visa.
the other day he forgot to dosefor.
Forgot to dose for dinner.
I was so stunned, right?
So this idea that you're gonnaget a flat line and you're gonna
cheer yourself on, like, allright, but it's gonna change
(39:37):
later.
And what we have to do is createpermission not to fall off the
rails, but that it is possiblethat you're gonna have hard
days.
That it's possible that you'regonna wanna eat a donut and
you're not gonna dose for it,right?
That it's possible that, youknow, all kinds of things can
happen.
Your Dexcom goes off, your pumpfalls apart, you go back to
shots, you, whatever, right?
(39:58):
All those things happen, and Ithink when we hold a line of
perfection, we do our children atremendous disservice, like for
the long term of their lives.
Like they, This is not aperfection game.
This is a like making it throughgame
Katie (40:11):
Yeah.
I have a, I had a, a little, ahumbling experience the other
night.
We were out to dinner at ahibachi restaurant for my oldest
son's birthday.
And you know, all the things,all the rice and the noodles and
the sauces and I mean, it was,you know, We were definitely not
a low carb family over here.
I can tell you that for sure,which to each his own.
But I completely forgot tobolus, like, remind my daughter.
(40:33):
I forgot to do it like we hadstarted eating.
I was like, Oh my gosh, Okay,let's see how many, what do we
think this you know, like, sonow I'm like, backpedaling,
we're already eating.
And, and so it was, it was ahumbling experience and it was a
good reminder for me that.
I, I'm an adult, like, you know,and I forgot and I forget
sometimes.
And so how in the world can Iexpect, you know, a, a 10 year
(40:56):
old or how old your kid is toremember all the time.
Or even really wanna do it allthe time, you know?
I'm sure there's just some dayswhere you're like, I don't wanna
do it.
And I get that too.
Joanne (41:07):
We call that a diabetes vacation, and those are, there
are ways to take a diabetesvacation in a way that's
structured.
This is for when your kids areolder, like how can mom take it
all back on for a day or two soyou don't have to do it right,
But yeah, and they're gonna makemistakes.
I left my daughter homeyesterday for the day, and I
looked at her.
Dex come read out and suddenlyshe was three 15 double arrow
(41:28):
up.
And I text her and I'm like, Didyou forget to bowls for
something?
And she's like, Oh yeah, sorry.
You know, she just doesn'tremember.
Katie (41:36):
Yeah, we ha we had a similar morning and it was
actually the morning that wewere going to our checkup, which
it's, what is it?
It's now October and we haven'tbeen to the endocrinologist
since March, just because we hadto cancel.
And then they did not even havea time for us to reschedule
cause they're so busy.
So it was like our checkup day,you know, for the first time in
(41:58):
several, several months.
And and it just, anyway, itjust.
Some things were forgotten.
And we walked into theendocrinologist and we were
like, three 50.
And I'm like, I'm sorry.
Look at the rest of the data.
Like, we, we do good.
Most of the time.
This is just a really offmorning.
And she's like, I'm not, I'mnot, What do you think?
I'm gonna yell at you.
I'm like, Well, some, I thinksome endocrinologists do yell at
(42:18):
people, so I'm grateful you'renot one of those
Joanne (42:22):
Well, but also like how that feeling of shame, like,
that's terrible.
We don't need to feel that way.
And it comes from, you can'tgrow and create positive change
for yourself if you're comingfrom a place of shame.
And so, The goal for theendocrinologist for us in
community with each other isjust support each other where we
are.
We don't need judgment.
It's hard enough.
(42:43):
Like we just need to supporteach other where we are.
Sure.
We could almost always dobetter.
Some days we don't feel like it,and some days we have the energy
to take it on.
Katie (42:51):
my husband texts me, he's like, Did her pump fail?
I'm like, No, no.
It was just some, some uncoveredgrapes.
Joanne (42:58):
Yep.
Katie (42:59):
No worries.
We went to Chick-fil-A afterthat office because in, in the
end, overall it was a greatcheckup.
We had a great checkup.
We got a good report, so we werelike, Let's go get some
Chick-Fil-A and go back toschool.
Joanne (43:08):
Can I, Can I name one more thing there, Katie, that I
noticed too?
I You said you're two years intodiagnosis.
This feels normal to me, right?
Like at the beginning I am sureyou washed everybody.
Food that went into yourdaughter's mouth, you counted
every car, you weighed things,you measured things.
You did all the things.
And now you're eyeballingthings.
You're going to Chick-fil-A, youhad grapes you forgot to cover,
(43:29):
you're eating, you know, at therestaurant with the sauce.
Right.
You're expanding your life in away that's actually appropriate,
and diabetes isn't in the centeranymore, so that's beautiful.
That's kind of what you want andneed and diabetes sometimes
drops off in a way that likeyou're not perfect anymore
around it.
That's okay.
Like I'm not saying, again, Iwould never say unclip your
(43:50):
seatbelt.
Like it's a very, very importantthing to pay attention to and be
attentive to.
But we're also teaching ourchildren how to live their lives
fully and richly, even with.
Katie (44:01):
That's a great point.
I had, I wanted You were, Thatreminded me.
I wanted to ask you somethingand Hold on.
It'll come back.
Oh, this is it.
This is it.
Okay.
So in terms of just anxiety andall the feelings like.
how do you talk to parents aboutshowing those emotions in front
of their kids?
Because I feel like there is adifference between panic.
Joanne (44:25):
difference.
Mm-hmm.
Katie (44:25):
Like you don't, like, you don't want to like I have a fear
of sharks and And I watched themovie Jaws way too many times
when I was way too.
So now I have an
Joanne (44:34):
you have some trauma around shark
Katie (44:36):
my husband calls it an irrational fear, but I call it
a, I could get eaten by a sharkwhen I go in the ocean.
Fear, like that's true anyway,but I don't wanna, I didn't
wanna pass that on to my kids,so I like suck it up and I get
in the water when we go to theocean and I just have a talk.
You know, I'll come to Jesusmeeting with myself.
Like, Look, if this is my day toget eaten by a shark, this is my
day to get eaten by a shark.
(44:56):
But I don't want my kids to befearful of sharks.
So I feel like with diabetes,These anxieties that you don't
want necessarily to rub off onyour kids, but you also don't
wanna have, feel like you haveto hide everything and bottle it
all up.
So just how do you talk toparents about that?
Joanne (45:14):
yeah.
It's different depending on whatthe emotion is that's coming
out.
So anxiety itself, if we'retalking pure anxiety, which is
what this episode for you, thispodcast is supposed to be about,
I would say you need to keepthat in check, right?
Just the same way you're doingwith the shark.
You need to do that withdiabetes.
You don't wanna spook your kidsand you want to, The message you
(45:36):
wanna give them is you can dothis.
You are gonna grow into theadult you're meant to.
I am gonna help you get there.
I am right here alongside you.
And if your anxiety is, Oh myGod, what are the medical
conditions gonna be?
Oh my God, they're not gonnamanage well.
Oh my God.
All those things.
You need to take that and put itsomeplace else with other adults
who can safely help and supportyou.
(45:57):
If it's feelings like I am sadthat you have diabetes, that you
get to.
Some of right?
I'm a believer that our childrenactually learn how to be in
relationship to their ownfeelings, in part by seeing us
model them there lots of ways.
You know, we, we help them withtheir feelings, but we also show
them feelings and they also, wealso are impacting each other
(46:20):
all the time.
So if your kids do somethingrude that hurts you, you get to
say, ouch, right?
You have to say it carefully cuzthere are some way we don't want
our children to feel likethey're damaging.
Right?
So that's where you have to beimportant.
That's where it's important tobe careful with diabetes,
because in my work with peoplewith diabetes, what I find over
and over and over is that nomatter how old the client is,
(46:43):
that they end up feeling likesomehow they hurt their parent.
Somehow they were too muchbecause, or somehow they had to
hold themselves back becausethey knew their parents were
doing a big job managing theirdiabetes.
And so even though I honestlydon't think that's really
avoidable, I think they aregonna carry that.
And I think we have to beattentive to it.
I think we don't wanna reinforceit by being too much with our
(47:06):
own feelings but with anxietyfor sure, that needs to get
parked someplace.
So if we're sad, we get to say,Yeah, it's sad for me that you
have this.
I'm so sorry and sad that youhave it.
You can say it, but you can't beweeping in front of your kids.
Right.
There's a difference.
You get to show some, but not atoo much and anxiety needs to
get parked somewhere
Katie (47:25):
Mm-hmm.
No, that's good advice.
Yeah, I usually sit with her inthe sadness for a while, but
then I'm like, Okay, we gottamove on.
I mean, we've been sad.
We've done our sadness.
Now it's time to, to pickourselves up and onward.
Joanne (47:40):
Mm-hmm.
Katie (47:41):
So let's talk about if there's times where anxiety can
maybe be helpful or beneficial.
Like, is that even a possibilityto where it can benefit
Joanne (47:49):
Sure, of course.
Like if, think about itevolutionarily, right?
It's like you know, you're inthe brush and the lion comes and
you get anxious and you flee,right?
That kind of way of operating ishelpful for us and anxiety
often.
Creates it motivates us to plan,to look ahead to do all the
things that we as T one Dparents absolutely have to do.
(48:11):
Like you need all those suppliesand all the cars and all the
bags and all the, everything andanxiety can push us to do that.
Too much anxiety, right?
Where that's all we're thinkingabout and we're buzzing and
spinning about it over and overand over, that's not good.
But a little healthy dose ofanxiety, like that's what gets
your kid to study for the socialstudies test when they're not
prepared.
A little healthy dose of anxietygets you to prepare for that
(48:34):
speech you're gonna give, right?
You know, so that you can getover those hurdles.
But but too much obviously isnot healthy for anyone.
Katie (48:42):
So trying to create a healthy amount of anxiety in our
kids.
Like I have had multiple adulttype one diabetics tell me that
One thing that their parents didthat they absolutely hated was
use, like a scare tactic withthem.
Like, you're gonna ruin your,you know, X, y, z all naming all
the organs if you don't do this.
And and they nobody liked that.
(49:02):
That was not effective for anyof the people that I've talked
to.
Which is understandable.
I mean, I think if any of usreally sit down and think like,
Well, somebody was doing that tome, I don't, I don't think I
would respond well to thateither.
but I, I guess just surroundingdiabetes, like not so much a
social studies test, butsurrounding diabetes like we do.
Maybe what are some ways we canmotivate them to take care of
themselves without scaring themto death or just causing them to
(49:24):
be resentful of us being crazypeople?
Joanne (49:27):
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
I'm not a believer in scaringour children to death.
That actually was a questionthat recently came up that
somebody asked me about which isthat her son was, was doing
well, he was recently diagnoseda teenager.
He was doing well with it, andshe was worried that he was a
little too laissez fare and thathe wasn't understanding.
And at some point it was gonnago south and he wasn't gonna.
(49:47):
We need to quiet.
That's our own buzzing noise,and we need to get off that
hamster wheel.
In our minds, it is not helpfulto scare our children.
Nobody gets motivated by fear,And so, In terms of motivation,
I'm a big believer in positivemotivation, right?
They do.
Well, you tell'em how theyknocked it out of the park for
that one thing because peoplelove praise and people love to
(50:08):
feel like they're doing well.
And our children, all childrenwant to please their parents.
They do.
The research actually is sointeresting on this that kids
lie to their parents becausethey don't wanna create
conflict.
Like 99% of children lie totheir parents.
The numbers are staggering, andthe reason they do it is to
avoid conflict with theirparents.
Right.
So you don't, you don't wantthat.
(50:28):
You want them to come to youbecause they're, they can, you
can be delighted in them andthat you're praising them and
you're always finding the smalledge, even when they're doing
badly.
You wanna find the small edgewhere they're doing well and you
can message, you know, this isan, an unfortunate thing that
you got handed this and still wegotta find a way to help you do
it well so that you get to havea rich and full life.
(50:50):
You don't need to message any ofthe bad.
Katie (50:52):
Mm-hmm.
Joanne (50:53):
be saying to them that it's important to do it well,
they, they're gonna know, Ipromise the soup is out there,
they're gonna figure it out,that it's not good to not manage
well.
It doesn't need to come fromyou.
Katie (51:03):
Yeah, that's a great point.
Good advice and a good reminderfor me, I, I haven't really used
that.
I, there's times in my headwhere, like my head is saying
that, but I don't think thewords know.
The words have never come out ofmy mouth.
Not yet.
I'm, who knows?
It might have a moment,
Joanne (51:18):
Well, also the other thing is that the research shows
that these, the terriblecomplications that we know most
about blindness, kidney failureand amputation are really,
really super rare now.
So it doesn't really happen somuch.
It's like in 1%, something likethat.
It's very, very low.
There are some complicationsthat can happen more about heart
(51:39):
disease, but that's.
That's not what people even knowabout.
So it it, the scare tactics kindof don't really work all that
well.
They're not that accurate, Iguess is what I wanna.
Katie (51:48):
Yeah.
Well, that's a good point too.
Joanne (51:50):
Yeah.
Katie (51:50):
Well, Joanna, is there anything that we kind of didn't
chat about or that we missedthat you feel you know about
anxiety specifically surroundingdiabetes that you feel like
would be helpful for parents andcaregivers to to know, to hear?
Joanne (52:02):
I love your questions, Katie.
I think they were reallythorough.
Katie (52:05):
Thank you,
Joanne (52:05):
No, you, you, you're in the right line of work here.
I think the only thing I wouldsay is don't be attentive to
when it gets to be too much.
Right?
Like, if you are having panicattacks that you can't shake
yourself out of, right?
Go get help.
Don't assume that it needs to bethat way if you can't get off
the DLE wheel in your head.
Buzzing about numbers all daylong.
All day long.
All day long.
(52:26):
And you're past a year and it'snot shifting at all.
I'm not saying that like I stillwake up in the night sometimes x
number of years later andsometimes check my decks come.
But if you really feel likethat's all that's there, I
really wanna say that there'shelp to be had cuz it doesn't
need to be that way.
Katie (52:42):
Yeah.
That's great.
Okay, well, Joey Ann, thank you.
I so appreciate your time.
I loved your answers.
I loved chatting with you.
I.
Have no doubt this will be verybeneficial for listeners.
And like I said, Joanne will beback for a couple more episodes.
We're gonna talk dive a littledeeper into some of the other
emotional, mental challengesthat come along with caring for
(53:02):
somebody with type one.
So
Joanne (53:04):
Thank you, Katie, for having me.
Katie (53:06):
you're welcome.
Bye.
Joanne (53:07):
Bye.
Katie (53:11):
Okay guys, that was it for our episodes day.
I hope you enjoyed that chatwith Joanne.
I know I loved talking with her.
I hope you gleaned as muchwisdom as I did.
From listening to her chat.
Again, please, please, pleasecheck out the links in the show
notes there you will find linksto a few other episodes that if
you really enjoyed this one, Ithink you will enjoy those as
(53:32):
well.
You will also find a link to.
Joanne's website diabetes.
Sweet talk.com.
And on her website, you can finda link to her podcast.
Sweet talk for parents of kidswith type one diabetes.
And if you click the purplebanner at the top of the page,
you can submit your question.
For Joanne to answer, and youcan even be a guest on her
(53:53):
podcast.
And of course, that can be donecompletely anonymously.
Check it out.
All right, you guys have afantastic week.
I will chat with you soon, butuntil Ben.
Stay calm and bolus on myfriends.
Bye.
This is episode 88 of the sugar mamas podcast today.
My guest is Joanne Rob, apsychotherapist and fellow T one
D mom, Joanne actually has twochildren living with type one
diabetes.
One is already grown and flown,and one is a freshman in high
Joanne has so much wisdom tooffer listeners.
(00:23):
In her practice.
She primarily deals with theemotional and relational
challenges that come alongsidebeing the caregiver of somebody
with type one diabetes.
Joanne is actually going to bemy guest for a handful of
episodes.
As I do a little mini series.
On anxiety, validation,feelings, and emotions.
(00:45):
And relational challenges allfrom the lens.
Of a type one parent.
The topic for today's episode isanxiety and working through the
anxiety that we may experience.
As T1 D parents.
Make sure you check out thelinks in the show notes to find
Joanne's website at diabetes.
Sweet talk.com.
(01:05):
There you'll also find a link toher podcast, which we're going
to talk about in this episode.
Uh, I won't give anything away,but just to let you know it is
awesome and you're going to wantto find it.
I'm also going to link to a fewother episodes that I mentioned
in this one, such as the episodeI did on TrialNet.
If you're interested in havingyour non-type.
(01:25):
Type one kids tested for thediabetes auto antibodies.
I did a very early episode onanxiety that I think you would
enjoy listening if you like thisepisode.
And I did an episode on griefand the trauma of a type one
diagnosis that I think you wouldalso enjoy.
If you enjoy this interview withJoanne.
So again, check out the links inthe show notes for all of that.
(01:48):
Okay.
Without further ado, let's getstarted.
You're listening to the sugarmamas podcast, a show designed
for moms and caregivers of typeone diabetics here.
You'll find a community oflike-minded people who are
striving daily to keep theirkids safe, happy, and healthy in
(02:10):
the ever-changing world of typeone.
I'm your host and fellow T one Dmom, Katie Roseboro.
Before we get started.
I need you to know that nothingyou hear on the sugar mamas
podcast should be consideredmedical advice.
Please be safe, be smart, andalways consult your physician
before making changes to the wayyou manage type one diabetes.
(02:34):
Thanks.
Hey everybody.
I am here with Joanne Robbtoday, and I think this is just
gonna be a fantastic episode.
Joanne is actually gonna bejoining me for a handful of
episodes.
But Joanne, I would like for youto introduce yourself and tell
the listeners how you areconnected to the world of Type
(02:54):
one Diabetes.
Joanne (02:56):
Hi Katie.
Thanks for having me on theshow.
I'm so excited to be here.
I am a mom with three kids andtwo of them have type one.
They are the, my type ones arenow 23 and 14, diagnosed at nine
and four, and my poor middlechild is currently 19 years old.
And I am a psychotherapist.
I have a practice in Oakland,California, and I specialize
(03:18):
among other things in treatingadults family.
With Type one Diabetes, but Iactually started a group called
Sweet Talk.
Diabetes sweet talk.com is thewebsite and I, my goal with that
group, it's a coaching programfor parents of kids with type
one to help them reduce theiranxiety and stress to sort of
move diabetes out from thecenterpiece of their lives.
(03:40):
So that they can live with lessanxiety and with less focus on
diabetes so that they have thepossibility of focusing on the
things they want to right, thethings that bring them joy.
Cuz diabetes is a heavy load, aswe all know, and I think that
parents can get really boggeddown in it in a way that's
actually not productive forthemselves, for management, for
family relationships.
(04:01):
And so I.
My goal is to help with that inthe coaching program, and I
recently actually started apodcast that's a q and a format,
kind of like an ask thetherapist format called Sweet
Talk for Parents of Kids withType one Diabetes.
And I get on and answer parentquestions about sort of the
social, emotional, developmentalanxiety problems that we
(04:23):
struggle with that we can't getanswered in the Endo office.
So those are all my connectionsto diabetes.
Katie (04:28):
Yes, and I can tell you for sure that most of the time,
I, or at least 50% of the time Ishould say, when people reach
out to me with questions,they're mostly like focused
around the anxiety of it all,the emotional toll that it takes
on.
You as a parent and a caregiver,and then of course your kid
who's living with this disease.
(04:50):
And, and you know, I've hadseveral people ask, Can you
recommend somebody that I can goand talk to about my anxiety or
just, you know, the depressionthat I'm having because of this?
And there's really not a wholelot of people out there that
really specialize in, therapysessions for a, a type one
caregiver or just a caregiverwho has a kid with, you know, a
(05:12):
chronic medical condition nomatter what it is.
So that's pretty rare to find.
So I was really excited when youreached out and I was like, Oh,
good.
Now I have somebody that I canrefer these people to,
Joanne (05:21):
people to,
Katie (05:23):
who can, who can help them.
It's such a challenge.
Joanne (05:26):
It is and it's part of why I wanted to create the
coaching program.
So it's much more behaviorallyfocused and the goal is to help
really both bring peopletogether so it normalizes
everybody's experience cuzeveryone in the space is having
a similar experience and alsoprovide parents with some very
concrete tools to help them.
(05:48):
Shift their worry, their anxietyover, Right?
Because there are so few peoplewho do the work.
You know, there are a fewclinics I know who have a
psychologist on staff, but thoseare few and far between, and so
I feel like parents need moresupport than that.
Katie (06:01):
Right.
And anyone can access thecoaching courses that you offer,
Correct.
It doesn't have to be justwithin your state.
Yeah.
Joanne (06:08):
Yeah.
That's part of why I offer itthan that way.
Katie (06:11):
Yes, and anybody can also access the podcast.
And I just wanna tell you guysthat I had to be home all day
today because we.
People here, maintenance workersreplacing one of our air
conditioning units, which isalways a joy to do.
And it's, you know, so, so cheaptoo.
It's just so cheap.
But I, so I was, you know, doingchores around the house and I
got on your website cause Ialways like to do a little, you
(06:33):
know, a little bit more researchand I have to do.
Pretty soon before I interviewsomebody cuz otherwise like I
forget a lot of things.
So I was on your website todayand I was like, oh, she actually
started her podcast cuz in theemails you had just said, I'm
going to start.
A podcast.
So I was like, Oh, let me take alisten.
Cuz I, I love podcasts.
I'm a podcast junkie.
(06:54):
You have five episodes out sofar?
Correct.
And you guys, I listen to everysingle one of them today.
no, I did speed them up.
I'll, I'll be honest.
Only because, And it's not you,it's everybody.
I speed all my podcasts upbecause that's just how.
That's just how I roll.
One time I turned on my playerand it was not sped up at all,
(07:14):
and I literally thought for asolid five seconds that I was
having a stroke because I waslike, Oh my God, what is wrong?
These people are talking soslow.
But it's just that I forgot.
I just forgot to speed it up.
So, no, but I listened to allfive today and I really wanna
put this at the beginning of theepisode cause I want people to
hear this, that like, they, theywere so good.
I mean, I felt like even thoughI wasn't the one, you know,
(07:37):
Sitting behind the desk talkingand asking you questions like I
felt like I was in on a minitherapy session for myself, and
I truly felt so seen and soknown and validated, and I just,
it was like, Oh, wow.
Like there's somebody thatactually gets it out there.
And all the questions peoplewere asking, like, I could
(07:58):
relate to every.
Single one of'em, even though Ihadn't experienced that exact
same thing, there was a, therewas always a part of it that I
could relate to and your answerswere just so great.
So everybody, I will put a linkto it in the show notes to your
website.
Honestly, your website has linksto everything, so I'll put a
link to the website in the shownotes, but definitely check it
out.
It was great.
Sweet talk for parents of kidswith type one is the name
Joanne (08:20):
Diabetes.
Mm-hmm.
.Yep.
Thank you, Katie.
I really appreciate the feedbackand I, and I really welcome
people to get on, not just tolisten, but to sign up to get
their questions answered,because it's a good way for
people to get some personalizedsupport.
Katie (08:32):
Yeah, absolutely.
If you guys have questions, you,how do you do it?
That you just sign up on yourwebsite and you'll contact them
or.
Joanne (08:39):
Yeah, there.
Right now there's specifictimes, but I think I might be
able to expand that.
If someone can't do the time,they can just email me and we'll
find a time.
Katie (08:46):
Okay.
All right.
Awesome.
Well, I know it's been many,many years since your kids were
diagnosed.
You, you've been dealing withtype one now for a very long
time.
What, 15 years you said?
Joanne (08:56):
I think it's almost 14.
I can't quite remember,honestly,
Katie (08:59):
Yeah.
So just, I'm just curious, likewhat stands out in your, because
even only two years out fromdiagnosis for me, I mean, it's,
it's very much so a big memoryin my head, but like even now,
It's still, some of it is alittle fuzzy, you know, the
memory starts to fade over time.
So what, I'm just curious, likewhat do you remember about that
time?
Like what stands out to you inyour mind about, you know, the
(09:20):
time surrounding, like yourkid's diagnosis?
Joanne (09:22):
actually, I think that those memories are pretty sharp
for me.
The actual diagnosis?
Katie (09:27):
Yeah.
I mean, they're very sharp, butlike, I don't know.
I've never been a great, I'venever been great with details,
so, you know what I mean?
Like it, like for instance, Ican't tell you every single
detail of what happened, but Ican, I just remember an
overwhelming sense of sadness.
You know, everybody has, theiremotions come out in different
ways.
You know, Some people are soangry and some people are so
(09:48):
fearful and some people are justin complete denial.
But I just was so.
Sad.
That was my overwhelming
Joanne (09:56):
issue.
Mm.
Katie (09:57):
Yeah.
Joanne (09:58):
I think for my first diagnosis, I honestly, I have to
say, I don't think I know how Ifelt because I was so busy,
which is totally how I operate.
When things are hard, I just getsuper busy to learn everything.
It wasn't till my seconddiagnosis, I think that I could
even let the sadness really in,in a, in a profound way, which
(10:18):
wasn't to say I didn't have sadmoments when my son was
diagnosed, but it wasn't untilmy daughter was.
She was sort of on the verge ofdiagnosis, right?
Because we got diagnosed withher through Trial net.
So it was a very not standarddiagnosis, but it meant I knew
for a while what was coming.
And that was deeply sad with myson.
I think it was deeply busy andfrantic.
(10:40):
Right?
Cuz I think I, my response isfrantic.
But I also have specificmemories of, you know, sitting
in the hospital.
Er, and there wasn't a room forhim.
And so the doctor came andtalked to us and did a consult,
like in the hall, on the gurney,in the er and said, You're gonna
be fine.
And me sort of latching ontothat, like it was like, it was
(11:03):
the god-given truth because Ididn't, it was scary.
Right.
And then a memory with mydaughter of, you know, a moment
where I just wept and wept andwept because it was just so,
Hard.
Right.
And also I think we, you know,I'm like the unicorn having two
kids.
It can happen, but we're rarerand thank God.
(11:23):
And you know, a friend of minesaid it's not often that we get
to repeat a crisis or anemergency.
And so it really was differenthow they played out.
Katie (11:33):
That's so interesting.
And how far apart, I know onewas nine at diagnosis and one
was four, but how many years inbetween their diagnoses
Joanne (11:41):
I'm trying to do that math.
Katie (11:42):
know?
Joanne (11:43):
So four years, because they're nine years apart.
So when my son was diagnosed, somaybe three and change when my
son was diagnosed my daughterwas still a baby.
Like I was still nursing her andnaps and the whole thing.
And I would wake her up and haulher into school to give him
shots and you know, the wholething.
(12:03):
So I'm gonna say three endchange years.
Katie (12:06):
Okay.
Just curious, This episode,specifically is gonna be on
anxiety.
So just in your practice, whatare some ways that you have seen
anxiety just kind of manifest orcome out of people?
You know, cuz it can take somany different forms.
Joanne (12:23):
mm-hmm.
So it can take so many differentforms.
And actually I think with a newdiagnosis, if that's what you're
asking about, Anxiety takesevery form, right?
Because it, it actually likechannels through every emotion.
So like for me, when my son wasdiagnosed, it was frantic.
For some parents, I think it'sanger, it's sadness, it's
(12:43):
anxiety channels into all thoseplaces, right?
And it moves people forward.
I think what I also see thoughis the kind of Frantic need to
get it exactly right.
And I would say as anoverarching Presentation.
That's what I see is that newlydiagnosed parents have a deep
need to get it exactly right andhave their kid be in range all
(13:05):
the time and be sure thatthey've counted every carb and
it, it makes total sense, right?
You leave the hospital and thisis what you're told is
essential, and you as a parentlooking ahead feel like what is
the, what are the health riskshere?
And so I think that.
Largely how I see it show up innewly diagnosed parents.
And, and then there are, andthen there are all the emotions
(13:27):
that come along with the anxietythat I already named, which can,
you know, be in really almostany form.
But I think they're oftenattached to anxiety that's in
there too.
They're not like, it's not justpure anger.
There's like anxiety woven inwith it.
Katie (13:39):
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
And how do, I mean, how do youkind of teach people to
recognize their anxiety?
You know, if they're maybe evena little bit unaware that
they're even.
having it.
I mean, cuz I, I do think you'reright.
Like, you know, when I, I thinkanxiety is synonymous with
worry.
And, and I guess in some ways itis, but I feel like it can show
(14:00):
up in so many different forms.
So how, how do you kind of coachpeople through recognizing their
anxiety and then validatingtheir anxiety?
Joanne (14:10):
Well, I think this is, This is the work I do mostly in
the coaching course, and so whatI would say is there are a few
prongs to that.
One is, I love that you use theword normalizing and validating,
right?
That's exactly what I'm there todo.
And we normalize it in part byseeing that everybody's having
the same experience in thisweird way.
None of us are special.
Like of course our children areincredibly, deeply special and
(14:32):
we love them and are protectingthem, and it feels very unique
to us.
But when you're in a room fullof parents with type one, we
sort of recognize thateveryone's having a really
similar experience and it'ssuper grounding for most parents
to feel like.
They understand like all thesepeople get it cuz I do think
that part of what makes usanxious is that we don't know
(14:53):
how to reach out for helpbecause we feel like it's both
it so much and also we speakthis weird language that nobody
else speaks right?
We speak in code almost like afriend of mine once said, I
speak stock broker.
Like to her it just sounded likethis really weird thing.
And so I think some of how wedeal with anxiety is just being
in a room with other people.
(15:14):
Who speak like we speak, whohave the same experiences we
have who can understand ourexperiences.
I think that's profoundlyimportant.
It's one of the reasons I'm ahuge proponent of things like
diabetes camp and in particularfamily camp, cuz I think parents
need it Another way I help workwith anxiety.
Well, there two more ways.
I think you named it isvalidating it.
Like, of course it makes sensethat you're anxious, duh, Like
(15:37):
there's no reason for you tofeel badly about it.
Right.
It's just normal.
It's a huge growth curve.
It's a huge learning curve, andit's not something you signed up
for.
And it's not something that youwant.
So we work from that place aswell.
And then in the coachingcourses, I actually have a lot
of tools that I've built to helppeople create one behavioral
(15:58):
change.
And I'm a really big believerthat small changes have a huge
ripple effect over time.
Like you can't bite off a big,you can't eat a whole five
course meal in one bite.
You right?
You take one bite and one biteand one bite.
And so I'm a believer thattaking a small step towards
change can have a ripple effectin impact, in part because it
(16:20):
makes you feel competent tocreate the change.
So one example I have that'sreally common is people who over
check the Dexcom.
Right, and, and I mean, overcheck these, you know, we all,
we're all guilty of it.
Like I wake up in the night andoften look at my daughter's
number.
How does that serve me?
I do not know.
Just have the alarm set and goto sleep.
(16:41):
Like lean into trust, right?
And that behavior that like ocd,like checking behavior, actually
increases our anxiety loop.
So what would happen if, And weset a behavioral goal one day
you check whatever it is, onetime less, or you check only
once around lunch or whatever itis that feels manageable to see
(17:04):
if you can lower your anxietyaround that moment.
So those kinds of small changesis a big way that I think is
effective to work with.
Katie (17:13):
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
So just little, little stepsThat's a very common comment
that I hear from parents justbeing glued to the, to the
Dexcom situation.
And then, you know, freaking outa little bit when the.
Their kid goes offline, which,which happens, you know, quite,
quite frequently.
Yeah.
Joanne (17:31):
Yep.
Yep.
Katie (17:33):
I always just have to remind myself that, you know,
that's just how that was, How itwas like not even 10 years ago,
pretty much.
So, we're gonna survive.
Sarah has a support group atschool that I can call upon if I
need to, I remember my husbandtexted me one day, he's like,
Hey, Sarah's been off the gridfor like four hours.
I'm like, Yeah, I know.
He's like, Are you gonna driveup there and fix it?
And I'm like, No, I'm actuallykind of enjoying the break.
Joanne (17:54):
That's awesome.
That's awesome.
Katie, look at you
Katie (17:58):
He was like, I think he was more like, Well, I'll drive
over there if you're not goingto, But he, he did not.
He, he couldn't.
He was in some sort of meetingthat he couldn't get out of.
But, but yeah, no, I've said iton the podcast before, but like,
my favorite 30 minutes of theday.
I mean, this is, this isdramatic.
It's not my favorite 30 minutesof the day, but when Sarah goes
to recess and is like off thegrid for a little bit, I'm like,
Oh, I don't have to payattention because there's no
(18:20):
point.
I'm not gonna see it, see thenumber.
Anyway, so
Joanne (18:23):
Yeah, I mean, when, when my kids started, they didn't
have technology to do that.
I mean, I'm sure they did, butI'm sure it was the size of like
a VCR cassette tape, right?
I'm dating myself, so that wasnot practical and my son really
didn't wanna wear it.
And at some point I said to him,I need you to do this.
Like, I was literally dying.
I was waking up to alarms.
(18:43):
Like I would set an alarm in thenight, wake up every night, do
fingert sticks.
It was exhausting.
And I was working multiple jobsand the, you know, that I re,
I'll never forget the night Isat down on the bathroom floor
sobbing.
Like, I cannot do this anymore.
They need to be on thistechnology.
And he agreed, and therefore sheagreed, she did anything he told
her.
Older brother, younger sister.
But yeah, we lived without itall the time.
(19:05):
And, and your kids do learn, youknow, not teeny little kids,
right?
That's not realistic.
But your kids do learn as theyget older, like what it feels
like in their body.
And that's actually what youwant, right?
Because the, the Dexcom isn'talways accurate either.
Like it can be off.
It's important for them to know,for example, when they're lower
than what the Dexcom says,right?
All of these things areimportant, so they do need to
(19:27):
have that physical knowledge andawareness.
Katie (19:30):
So I kind of wanna, if I, if I can, I wanna ask you about,
I'll give two specific examplesfrom just my experience and
maybe you could kind of tell mehow you would approach both of
these things, cuz, So the, thefirst one would be like a short
term.
Anxiety situation.
I mean, not, it could be longterm, but for me it was short
term.
It was, it was almost more oflike a panic situation, which I
(19:53):
am, I am not one for panicattacks.
I don't, I can think of, youknow, very few times in my life
where I've have felt very, verypanicky.
But shortly after Sarah'sdiagnosis, I just started having
these.
What I would call irrational.
I mean, I guess they're notirrational cuz truly it could
happen.
But I started having these fearsof what if, what if something
happens to me like, and Iwouldn't be there to take care
(20:16):
of her.
Like it wasn't even about, Imean I've had those fears too
about what if something happensto her, but like what if
something happens to me rightnow and.
and I'm not here.
And, and I, I was getting shortof breath.
I was not able to sleep atnight, and finally I just kind
of like stabbed myself out ofit, which I feel like honestly
for me was a gift from God.
Like, he was just like, Look,what are you doing?
(20:36):
Like you can't control this.
Like you have no, you have nocontrol over this, so why are
you wasting your time worryingover it?
But how would you kind of helpsomebody?
With more of a I would say moreof like an intense, kind of
shorter term, almost panicsituation
Joanne (20:51):
Mm-hmm.
.Mm-hmm.
It's a great question, Katie,and I have to name that I had a
very similar, like near topanic.
I actually had a few panicattacks not long after my son
was diagnosed, and it's not howI normally fly.
Right.
So you, you did exactly what atherapist would do.
I have to.
Brilliant.
Which is that you recognized youcouldn't actually control it.
(21:13):
So I, this, it, honestly, if Igot someone in with this level
of panic and it was continuing,I would probably refer them to
somebody who is specializes incognitive behavioral therapy,
because that's sort of the goldstandard for things like panic
attacks.
And what I understand of it isthat the treatment is exposure.
(21:34):
So, and the exposure in thiscase is really knowing that you
can't do anything andrecognizing that no disaster
happens because of the thoughtthat you're having, right?
It's just a thought it couldhappen.
Sure.
Bad things can happen and it'snot happening right now, and
everybody's safe and okay rightnow.
(21:54):
And so that's sort of thetreatment for something like
that for.
And you did it yourself.
You snapped yourself out of itand acknowledged that you can't
control it.
And so there's no point inworrying and thinking about it
like you have all your ducks ina row in some way to address the
possibility.
Like as a parent, you know whoyour kids would go to if
something happened to you,right?
Or you have a will, or whateverit is.
(22:14):
Certainly those things,structural things, having that
in place is helpful, but reallyyou have to come to some kind of
piece inside yourself that likebad things do happen and we
don't have control overeverything all the time.
No matter what.
And of course, diabetes makesthat worse, right?
Because it's scarier.
Katie (22:30):
yeah.
And I had to remind myself too,like, there's other people in
her life.
Like there's my husband andthere's grandparents, and
there's aunts and uncles thatlove her too.
So it's gonna be So then, okay,so that would be more of like
intense, kind of shorter term.
What about like, you know, Ikind of, I feel like for the
most part I'm good, but likewith like the whole I worry.
I worry more about the emotionalburden and toll that it's gonna
(22:54):
take on her way more than I eventhink about the medical side of
things.
Like, sure, I think about likethe complications that could
happen, but mostly I find myselfhaving anxiety about like, how
is this gonna affect her?
Mentally.
And that just kind of comes andgoes.
I don't, I definitely don'tspend all day thinking about
that.
It's not debilitating.
I'm still obviously functioningand performing my life duties,
(23:17):
but, for more of like a, a lowergrade, but longer term anxiety
such as that, how would youapproach that?
Joanne (23:24):
So I wanna name like how I would approach that as
different in different settings.
So as a therapist, we'd betalking, we have more time and
space to look at that kind ofthing.
In my coaching course, we'relooking at a behavioral shift in
modification that can get madethat would help you feel more in
control and less like you'rethinking about that.
And off the top of my head,honestly, Katie, I can't think
(23:45):
about what exactly I would grabfor that.
So I'll keep thinking about it,but.
I think that with that kind ofanxiety, there's partly just the
normalizing of it, which is thatthe research does show that
that's actually really common.
So with kids with for example,cancer, their parents are
anxious.
Like if you were to look at a.
Curve, their parents have highanxiety and then it comes down,
(24:08):
right?
Because there's treatment andthen there's resolution one way
or the other, hopefully to forthe better, right?
With diabetes, parents get inthere fast and then over time
their anxiety creeps up, right?
Because they recognize more andmore like how heavy a load it.
So it's a really differentlooking curve and I think I
(24:28):
would say, yeah, that makessense to me.
Like as you sit with this andyou see the ramifications and
the impact for your daughterevery single day, and you
imagine out to the next thingdevelopmentally what's coming
for her?
Like, how could you not feel alittle worried about
emotionally, how it's gonnaresonate?
and then I would send you to doexactly what you sensible Katie
(24:50):
are doing, which is creatingcommunity around it because it
helps you to see.
She's gonna be okay.
You know, it takes attentiveparenting in any situation,
right?
Our kids can throw us curveballs no matter what, and we
have to pay attention and bewatching for the places that are
hard for them to be able to helpand support them.
(25:10):
But when you're in community,you also can see people who have
diabetes, who are 20, who are25, who are 30, who are doing
fine.
And so that's an importantantidote also, I think, to the
worry.
Does that all make sense?
Katie (25:23):
Yes.
No, I, I think it does.
We, I just went to a um,conference touch by type one in
Orlando.
They have an annual conferenceand a friend of mine also
obviously a T one D Mom uh, wewent together and.
It really was just amazing, evenjust to be, I didn't, I wasn't
speaking at this conference, Iwasn't promoting the podcast at
this conference.
I was just there as a caregiverof a T one D and it really was
(25:46):
quite spectacular to be in agiant conference hall with all
these other parents.
Of, of kids that have type one.
Solidarity was palpable, youknow, and just to listen to all
these speakers, you know, mostof the speakers had type one and
were doing.
Amazing things, or just normalthings like, you know, they were
just thriving in life.
And then a lot of them wereparents of type one.
(26:08):
So it was great.
I, I, I wanna echo yourrecommendation to just get
involved with community and Youknow, not, not all day, every
day, cuz I think that would be alittle bit too much, but
sprinkle it in, in every now andthen for sure.
And then this particularconference also, we did not
bring our kids to this.
It was like a mom's weekendaway.
But they have, you know, theyhave programs there for kids
(26:31):
too.
So while the parents arelearning, the kids are playing
and hanging out with other kidswith type one.
So it's, it was.
Joanne (26:38):
It sounds amazing and I think actually what I love that
you just said is that there werepeople who were just thriving
living their regular lives.
Cuz I think at those kind ofconferences they tend to throw
up, you know, the person whoclimbed Mount Everest with type
one or the person who cycledacross America with type one.
And those are amazing, amazingthings.
But not our most of ourchildren.
And so I think that it's nice tosee people who are just living
(27:00):
normal lives, who have jobs andfamilies and are thriving, doing
regular things.
It's not to say our kids can'tclimb Mount Everest, bike across
America, go live in Africa, doall those amazing things, but
it's nice to know they can justbe good functioning,
professional, smart, workingfamily people.
Katie (27:18):
Mm-hmm.
Yep.
Really my main goal as a parentis to keep the kids outta jail.
So if I can do that, That's,really goal number one and
alive, I guess, alive and outtajail.
If I've, if I've accomplishedthat when the day's over, I have
done my job
Joanne (27:36):
of a low bar.
Katie (27:39):
I do That's probably a, a strength and a
Joanne (27:43):
and a weakness,
Katie (27:44):
Depending on
Joanne (27:47):
Okay.
I'm not quite believing you, butit's a good line,
Katie (27:51):
No, it's okay.
It was funny, you actually inour, my church group the other
day, we were, we, that questionwas asked like, what does it
mean to you?
Like, what would it mean foryou, like for your kids to be
successful, like when they'regrown?
Like what would be your, yourbenchmark or your standard?
Like, okay, well they did.
Did this, so I know they'resuccessful, and one guy was
like, I mean, I think if theyjust get a job at Chick-fil-A,
(28:12):
that's probably it.
Right?
Like they're That's like themeasure of success, right?
For a good kid, I'm like, that'spretty funny.
Joanne (28:19):
Well also, he's probably talking about his 15 year old,
not his 30 year old.
Like he's having trouble seeingfar enough out
Katie (28:26):
Right, right,
Joanne (28:26):
for sure.
But you know what, that's suchan important question for our
diabetic kids too.
Like what's a measure of successfor them?
And it's really the same.
And we're aim and what'simportant is for us to keep, I
mean, I'm a big believer inkeeping our relationship with
our children in the.
of everything as opposed todiabetes in the front of
everything.
(28:46):
And so we need to remember that,that what we want for them is to
be close to us because we lovethem and also because we're
protective for them.
Like we are a protective factorfor their mental health.
And so if they have a strongconnection with us and are able
to talk to us even when theirdiabetes is going sideways, it's
gonna turn out better for them.
Katie (29:05):
Yeah.
Definitely.
I agree you, you said that a fewdifferent times today when I was
listening to those episodes andI was like, it was like, I was,
talking to myself, walkingaround my house like, Yes, you
know, agreeing with you.
Like, But yeah, that was a bigpoint that you made a few times
that I really agreed with that.
The relationships really justneed to come first and.
that's not to say you throw allcaution to the wind and just let
(29:27):
it all, let it all go.
You know, diabetes managementwise, but relationships should
be first and foremost for sure.
Okay.
Let's see.
So just what are some, some tipsand tricks?
You know, you've alreadymentioned a few, but like, some
fast tools that you give parentsto pull out when they're feeling
overly anxious or you know, ifthey're just kind of having like
an overly anxious week, or whatare some, some things that you
(29:49):
suggest to help them decreasetheir anxiety?
Joanne (29:52):
So actually I don't really suggest I ask them
because I think you're theexpert of your own experience
more than I am.
Right?
And you know, you know whenyou've been successful in the
past with decreasing youranxiety and those are the things
we have to remember and help.
Ourselves and parents moved toright, is like what used to
work, what has worked in thepast.
(30:12):
What could you do that would behelpful?
I could come up with a long listfor you and you know, I'm, you
and I in a Venn diagram wouldprobably have a lot of overlap,
right?
Because most people do.
Getting enough rest, havingpeople to connect to having a
hobby you love.
Like for me, I like to read abook.
I like to cook a meal I've nevermade before.
These kinds of things.
I love to go for a walk or ahike, right?
But yours are gonna be differentthan mine.
(30:34):
Maybe you like to pet a dog,maybe you like, you know,
whatever it is.
So I think it's, it'srecognizing what is helpful for
you.
And there's some foundationalpieces, right?
Like we all need humanconnection, It's important for
us to have that.
So where do you get that?
Who are the people who like fillyou up and help you feel well
nourished and well cared for andloved, especially in the moments
(30:56):
where you're feeling at yourmost vulnerable and weakest.
But I, I don't have a go-tolist.
I feel like my job is to helpyou create your own.
Katie (31:04):
yeah.
I mean, I, had that thoughtseveral times when I was
listening to your podcast todayabout just how, you know, there
are some people that really andtruly just feel so isolated and
alone.
Like, I mean, they, you know, amilitary family for example,
they might be miles away fromany family or close friends.
And now they're dealing.
This.
Um, But I, that was one thingthat I felt while I was
(31:24):
listening to you like I almostfelt like there was community,
even though it's, you're notsitting with other people and,
you know, I don't, I wouldn'tsay that would take the place of
like real life human interactionwith other people, but it really
was like a very comforting thingto listen to.
You know, almost like you'resitting in a conference and
listening to other parents talkand kind of bounce ideas off
each other and just to know thatyou're, you're not alone.
(31:46):
Again, if, if any parent outthere is feeling very isolated
and alone highly recommend, lookup where your local JDRF
chapters are, and then listen tomy podcast and Joanne's podcast,
Joanne (31:59):
thank you for the plug.
But I think, I think the localjdrf, you know, and, and there
are so many resources andbecause the world is connected
and the internet exists,there're even more, right?
So there's, there's just allkinds of forums and places for
parents to get some connectionand I cannot recommend it more.
However it works for you.
It's important.
Katie (32:19):
Yeah, it's easier now than it ever has been.
And I think even more so comingout of this pandemic cuz
everybody's so hungry for actualcommunity, authentic community.
Not just let's chat over a Zoomcall, you know?
Joanne (32:31):
Yep.
Katie (32:32):
All right.
Let's see.
So So is there any, any familyor parent that you've like
worked with, obviously withoutgiving names and details that
really stuck out to you in termsof like you know, their anxiety
and just your experience helpingthem through their anxiety.
Do you mind, do you mind sharingif you have a story or two that
stands out, how you kind ofcoach them through that or do
(32:53):
you feel comfortable
Joanne (32:54):
no, I thought I've been thinking about this since you
sent it to me.
So you just added a piece, whichis How did I coach them through
that and.
I'm thinking of families whohave been in my coaching course
and one of the families, and I,I say this with absolute
empathy, like this is what I didtoo.
When my son was diagnosed, Ijust slept with him every night
as though sleeping with himwould give me information.
(33:17):
I.
Because it didn't, we didn'thave a cgm.
I would just wake up and rollover and prick his finger and
man, I didn't have to get outtabed for a while.
Right.
But that, it wasn't really asustainable lifestyle for 10,000
reasons.
And there was a family I workedwith where that was mom's
strategy for dealing with heranxiety.
And she was really stuck there.
(33:38):
It was really hard for her.
And And she wasn't in a placethat she was really ready to
make a shift around it either.
So I can help with managinganxiety, but there has to be
openness to suggestions ofchange.
You have to be coachablebasically.
I'm thinking of another familywhere mom was actually quite
(33:59):
angry.
Like it, it was anxiety, but itlooked like anger at her kid for
the way he was not managing atschool.
And I honestly can't remember alot of the details of how that
worked, but we just, she did mycoaching program like we went
through, and some of it is mejust setting realistic
expectations, like when you havea teen child, they're not gonna
(34:20):
manage their diabetes.
As well as you want them to.
And of course that is stressful,but we can't pile on all the
expectations at once.
It's just like we're not gonnasay to our 14 year old, Okay,
well now you're a teenager, soyou should be able to do all the
laundry and wash all the dishesand make all the meals.
Like, we're not gonna do that.
We're gonna slowly, slowly,slowly teach them how to be
(34:42):
independent and how to do thosekinds of things.
And it's the same thing withdiabetes, like.
They're really not gonna do agreat job.
And it's stressful, right?
Because we feel like theirhealth is at risk, but we can't
make them do all of it at once.
And it gets in the way of therelationship.
So I'm just thinking about thisfamily and through the coaching
program, she was able to takesmall bites, right?
And I, I can't even remember,Katie.
(35:03):
I think it was like she washelping support him to check one
time a day while he was atschool.
And, and she was able to settledown and like understand through
me reflecting how normal it was.
Like, of course you don't wannaunclip your seatbelt, but it is
by the data, a very normalexperience for teenagers to not
do as well with management.
Right?
It's just what it is.
(35:23):
And so helping her to recognizethat take a small step, we got
to a place where she was a lotless anxious.
Katie (35:30):
That's good.
You know, I didn't put this inthe questions, the pre the
prewritten out questions that weexchanged, but, you know, you
talk about the, the teenagersand how they typically have
higher a1c during thoseformative years.
And this, you know, ourexpectations really shouldn't.
Extremely high for them duringthat time of their life.
But you know, wh where, where doyou feel like social media falls
(35:53):
I feel like social media is goodin so many ways because it is
how we find that community,right?
I mean, that's, And we can.
Ask questions and, you know,hear from other moms and feel
like we're not alone.
But then there's the other sideof it, which I think is very
anxiety inducing and just reallywill just steal all the joy and
(36:14):
suck all the joy out of yoursoul when you see these, You
know, and it's funny becausethere's, I'm not gonna name
names, but there is, there's,there's some personalities
online where they do haveteenagers and their teenagers.
Their, their graphs are alwaysperfect.
They're always, they're always,and I'm like, Did you screenshot
this like six years ago and nowyou're posting it?
(36:35):
Or like, but it's amazing howthe loudest people speak the
most.
It, and it really makes, startsto make you feel like, Wow, I'm,
I'm really doing about job.
Like when you start comparingyourself to these, to these
other people it's just, I justfeel like social media is such a
rabbit hole that you can spiral.
Joanne (36:54):
you
Katie (36:55):
Out of control very quickly in terms of comparing
yourself to other people, andthat causing a lot of anxiety.
So do you ever just tell peoplelike, you just need to get off
social media?
Like how have, have you dealtwith that at all?
Joanne (37:05):
I love this question because I I love this question
because I grapple with this alot, with this idea of
perfection.
I think this is the same thingwith the Dexcom, frankly.
It's like a double edged sword.
Thank God we have it, we allsleep better for it.
We all are much more sane in somany ways, and yet it's created
this 10 outta 10 of anxietywhere we're watching all the
(37:28):
time.
Like, that's not good for useither.
And so I think you're exactlyright, like online creates
community and it also createscompetition in a way that's very
specifically anxiety inducingfor us as T one D parents.
I've never said to anyone getoff social media.
I try to be as generous anddiplomatic as I feel like you're
being right now.
(37:48):
But part of why I wanted to beon your show is I feel like you
have a pretty level perspective.
I like your sensible, groundedperspective on your show, and
that includes that we're notgonna be perfect all the time.
That this is one of many thingsthat we do.
And I, so in my coachingprogram, I have an actual.
Little piece, you know, it'sall, it's all reverse classroom,
(38:09):
so it's all, you know, videosI've created and lesson plans
and all of this stuff that youdo on your own.
And then you come to the meetingprepared or as prepared as you
wanna be.
And then there's a group chatalso where I answer questions,
but one of the teachings iscalled Numbers Perfection.
And it talks about the data.
Right.
The data really shows this, soyou can kill yourself to try and
(38:32):
get to a flat line, but I don'tthink it's real for most people.
I do think, of course, there aresome people who probably eat no
carbs, who Probably are very,very watchful.
And if, and if those people havekids with that, I suspect that
those kids are gonna have somekind of rebound around it later.
(38:52):
Right?
It's too hard to do.
So I'll name that my son who'snow 23, was highly anxious about
his diabetes, like crazy amountsof anxiety and was because of
that, an excellent manager.
And as he's gotten older and isless anxious and he's on closed
loop.
Dexcom and Tandem.
He's exhausted, He's genuinelyexhausted and I don't wanna say
(39:14):
he's not taking care of himself,but I've noticed like he's
actually home right now.
He's leaving to move to Spainsoon.
And so he is having a littlehiatus here while he's waiting
for his visa.
the other day he forgot to dosefor.
Forgot to dose for dinner.
I was so stunned, right?
So this idea that you're gonnaget a flat line and you're gonna
cheer yourself on, like, allright, but it's gonna change
(39:37):
later.
And what we have to do is createpermission not to fall off the
rails, but that it is possiblethat you're gonna have hard
days.
That it's possible that you'regonna wanna eat a donut and
you're not gonna dose for it,right?
That it's possible that, youknow, all kinds of things can
happen.
Your Dexcom goes off, your pumpfalls apart, you go back to
shots, you, whatever, right?
(39:58):
All those things happen, and Ithink when we hold a line of
perfection, we do our children atremendous disservice, like for
the long term of their lives.
Like they, This is not aperfection game.
This is a like making it throughgame
Katie (40:11):
Yeah.
I have a, I had a, a little, ahumbling experience the other
night.
We were out to dinner at ahibachi restaurant for my oldest
son's birthday.
And you know, all the things,all the rice and the noodles and
the sauces and I mean, it was,you know, We were definitely not
a low carb family over here.
I can tell you that for sure,which to each his own.
But I completely forgot tobolus, like, remind my daughter.
(40:33):
I forgot to do it like we hadstarted eating.
I was like, Oh my gosh, Okay,let's see how many, what do we
think this you know, like, sonow I'm like, backpedaling,
we're already eating.
And, and so it was, it was ahumbling experience and it was a
good reminder for me that.
I, I'm an adult, like, you know,and I forgot and I forget
sometimes.
And so how in the world can Iexpect, you know, a, a 10 year
(40:56):
old or how old your kid is toremember all the time.
Or even really wanna do it allthe time, you know?
I'm sure there's just some dayswhere you're like, I don't wanna
do it.
And I get that too.
Joanne (41:07):
We call that a diabetes vacation, and those are, there
are ways to take a diabetesvacation in a way that's
structured.
This is for when your kids areolder, like how can mom take it
all back on for a day or two soyou don't have to do it right,
But yeah, and they're gonna makemistakes.
I left my daughter homeyesterday for the day, and I
looked at her.
Dex come read out and suddenlyshe was three 15 double arrow
(41:28):
up.
And I text her and I'm like, Didyou forget to bowls for
something?
And she's like, Oh yeah, sorry.
You know, she just doesn'tremember.
Katie (41:36):
Yeah, we ha we had a similar morning and it was
actually the morning that wewere going to our checkup, which
it's, what is it?
It's now October and we haven'tbeen to the endocrinologist
since March, just because we hadto cancel.
And then they did not even havea time for us to reschedule
cause they're so busy.
So it was like our checkup day,you know, for the first time in
(41:58):
several, several months.
And and it just, anyway, itjust.
Some things were forgotten.
And we walked into theendocrinologist and we were
like, three 50.
And I'm like, I'm sorry.
Look at the rest of the data.
Like, we, we do good.
Most of the time.
This is just a really offmorning.
And she's like, I'm not, I'mnot, What do you think?
I'm gonna yell at you.
I'm like, Well, some, I thinksome endocrinologists do yell at
(42:18):
people, so I'm grateful you'renot one of those
Joanne (42:22):
Well, but also like how that feeling of shame, like,
that's terrible.
We don't need to feel that way.
And it comes from, you can'tgrow and create positive change
for yourself if you're comingfrom a place of shame.
And so, The goal for theendocrinologist for us in
community with each other isjust support each other where we
are.
We don't need judgment.
It's hard enough.
(42:43):
Like we just need to supporteach other where we are.
Sure.
We could almost always dobetter.
Some days we don't feel like it,and some days we have the energy
to take it on.
Katie (42:51):
my husband texts me, he's like, Did her pump fail?
I'm like, No, no.
It was just some, some uncoveredgrapes.
Joanne (42:58):
Yep.
Katie (42:59):
No worries.
We went to Chick-fil-A afterthat office because in, in the
end, overall it was a greatcheckup.
We had a great checkup.
We got a good report, so we werelike, Let's go get some
Chick-Fil-A and go back toschool.
Joanne (43:08):
Can I, Can I name one more thing there, Katie, that I
noticed too?
I You said you're two years intodiagnosis.
This feels normal to me, right?
Like at the beginning I am sureyou washed everybody.
Food that went into yourdaughter's mouth, you counted
every car, you weighed things,you measured things.
You did all the things.
And now you're eyeballingthings.
You're going to Chick-fil-A, youhad grapes you forgot to cover,
(43:29):
you're eating, you know, at therestaurant with the sauce.
Right.
You're expanding your life in away that's actually appropriate,
and diabetes isn't in the centeranymore, so that's beautiful.
That's kind of what you want andneed and diabetes sometimes
drops off in a way that likeyou're not perfect anymore
around it.
That's okay.
Like I'm not saying, again, Iwould never say unclip your
(43:50):
seatbelt.
Like it's a very, very importantthing to pay attention to and be
attentive to.
But we're also teaching ourchildren how to live their lives
fully and richly, even with.
Katie (44:01):
That's a great point.
I had, I wanted You were, Thatreminded me.
I wanted to ask you somethingand Hold on.
It'll come back.
Oh, this is it.
This is it.
Okay.
So in terms of just anxiety andall the feelings like.
how do you talk to parents aboutshowing those emotions in front
of their kids?
Because I feel like there is adifference between panic.
Joanne (44:25):
difference.
Mm-hmm.
Katie (44:25):
Like you don't, like, you don't want to like I have a fear
of sharks and And I watched themovie Jaws way too many times
when I was way too.
So now I have an
Joanne (44:34):
you have some trauma around shark
Katie (44:36):
my husband calls it an irrational fear, but I call it
a, I could get eaten by a sharkwhen I go in the ocean.
Fear, like that's true anyway,but I don't wanna, I didn't
wanna pass that on to my kids,so I like suck it up and I get
in the water when we go to theocean and I just have a talk.
You know, I'll come to Jesusmeeting with myself.
Like, Look, if this is my day toget eaten by a shark, this is my
day to get eaten by a shark.
(44:56):
But I don't want my kids to befearful of sharks.
So I feel like with diabetes,These anxieties that you don't
want necessarily to rub off onyour kids, but you also don't
wanna have, feel like you haveto hide everything and bottle it
all up.
So just how do you talk toparents about that?
Joanne (45:14):
yeah.
It's different depending on whatthe emotion is that's coming
out.
So anxiety itself, if we'retalking pure anxiety, which is
what this episode for you, thispodcast is supposed to be about,
I would say you need to keepthat in check, right?
Just the same way you're doingwith the shark.
You need to do that withdiabetes.
You don't wanna spook your kidsand you want to, The message you
(45:36):
wanna give them is you can dothis.
You are gonna grow into theadult you're meant to.
I am gonna help you get there.
I am right here alongside you.
And if your anxiety is, Oh myGod, what are the medical
conditions gonna be?
Oh my God, they're not gonnamanage well.
Oh my God.
All those things.
You need to take that and put itsomeplace else with other adults
who can safely help and supportyou.
(45:57):
If it's feelings like I am sadthat you have diabetes, that you
get to.
Some of right?
I'm a believer that our childrenactually learn how to be in
relationship to their ownfeelings, in part by seeing us
model them there lots of ways.
You know, we, we help them withtheir feelings, but we also show
them feelings and they also, wealso are impacting each other
(46:20):
all the time.
So if your kids do somethingrude that hurts you, you get to
say, ouch, right?
You have to say it carefully cuzthere are some way we don't want
our children to feel likethey're damaging.
Right?
So that's where you have to beimportant.
That's where it's important tobe careful with diabetes,
because in my work with peoplewith diabetes, what I find over
and over and over is that nomatter how old the client is,
(46:43):
that they end up feeling likesomehow they hurt their parent.
Somehow they were too muchbecause, or somehow they had to
hold themselves back becausethey knew their parents were
doing a big job managing theirdiabetes.
And so even though I honestlydon't think that's really
avoidable, I think they aregonna carry that.
And I think we have to beattentive to it.
I think we don't wanna reinforceit by being too much with our
(47:06):
own feelings but with anxietyfor sure, that needs to get
parked someplace.
So if we're sad, we get to say,Yeah, it's sad for me that you
have this.
I'm so sorry and sad that youhave it.
You can say it, but you can't beweeping in front of your kids.
Right.
There's a difference.
You get to show some, but not atoo much and anxiety needs to
get parked somewhere
Katie (47:25):
Mm-hmm.
No, that's good advice.
Yeah, I usually sit with her inthe sadness for a while, but
then I'm like, Okay, we gottamove on.
I mean, we've been sad.
We've done our sadness.
Now it's time to, to pickourselves up and onward.
Joanne (47:40):
Mm-hmm.
Katie (47:41):
So let's talk about if there's times where anxiety can
maybe be helpful or beneficial.
Like, is that even a possibilityto where it can benefit
Joanne (47:49):
Sure, of course.
Like if, think about itevolutionarily, right?
It's like you know, you're inthe brush and the lion comes and
you get anxious and you flee,right?
That kind of way of operating ishelpful for us and anxiety
often.
Creates it motivates us to plan,to look ahead to do all the
things that we as T one Dparents absolutely have to do.
(48:11):
Like you need all those suppliesand all the cars and all the
bags and all the, everything andanxiety can push us to do that.
Too much anxiety, right?
Where that's all we're thinkingabout and we're buzzing and
spinning about it over and overand over, that's not good.
But a little healthy dose ofanxiety, like that's what gets
your kid to study for the socialstudies test when they're not
prepared.
A little healthy dose of anxietygets you to prepare for that
(48:34):
speech you're gonna give, right?
You know, so that you can getover those hurdles.
But but too much obviously isnot healthy for anyone.
Katie (48:42):
So trying to create a healthy amount of anxiety in our
kids.
Like I have had multiple adulttype one diabetics tell me that
One thing that their parents didthat they absolutely hated was
use, like a scare tactic withthem.
Like, you're gonna ruin your,you know, X, y, z all naming all
the organs if you don't do this.
And and they nobody liked that.
(49:02):
That was not effective for anyof the people that I've talked
to.
Which is understandable.
I mean, I think if any of usreally sit down and think like,
Well, somebody was doing that tome, I don't, I don't think I
would respond well to thateither.
but I, I guess just surroundingdiabetes, like not so much a
social studies test, butsurrounding diabetes like we do.
Maybe what are some ways we canmotivate them to take care of
themselves without scaring themto death or just causing them to
(49:24):
be resentful of us being crazypeople?
Joanne (49:27):
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
I'm not a believer in scaringour children to death.
That actually was a questionthat recently came up that
somebody asked me about which isthat her son was, was doing
well, he was recently diagnoseda teenager.
He was doing well with it, andshe was worried that he was a
little too laissez fare and thathe wasn't understanding.
And at some point it was gonnago south and he wasn't gonna.
(49:47):
We need to quiet.
That's our own buzzing noise,and we need to get off that
hamster wheel.
In our minds, it is not helpfulto scare our children.
Nobody gets motivated by fear,And so, In terms of motivation,
I'm a big believer in positivemotivation, right?
They do.
Well, you tell'em how theyknocked it out of the park for
that one thing because peoplelove praise and people love to
(50:08):
feel like they're doing well.
And our children, all childrenwant to please their parents.
They do.
The research actually is sointeresting on this that kids
lie to their parents becausethey don't wanna create
conflict.
Like 99% of children lie totheir parents.
The numbers are staggering, andthe reason they do it is to
avoid conflict with theirparents.
Right.
So you don't, you don't wantthat.
(50:28):
You want them to come to youbecause they're, they can, you
can be delighted in them andthat you're praising them and
you're always finding the smalledge, even when they're doing
badly.
You wanna find the small edgewhere they're doing well and you
can message, you know, this isan, an unfortunate thing that
you got handed this and still wegotta find a way to help you do
it well so that you get to havea rich and full life.
(50:50):
You don't need to message any ofthe bad.
Katie (50:52):
Mm-hmm.
Joanne (50:53):
be saying to them that it's important to do it well,
they, they're gonna know, Ipromise the soup is out there,
they're gonna figure it out,that it's not good to not manage
well.
It doesn't need to come fromyou.
Katie (51:03):
Yeah, that's a great point.
Good advice and a good reminderfor me, I, I haven't really used
that.
I, there's times in my headwhere, like my head is saying
that, but I don't think thewords know.
The words have never come out ofmy mouth.
Not yet.
I'm, who knows?
It might have a moment,
Joanne (51:18):
Well, also the other thing is that the research shows
that these, the terriblecomplications that we know most
about blindness, kidney failureand amputation are really,
really super rare now.
So it doesn't really happen somuch.
It's like in 1%, something likethat.
It's very, very low.
There are some complicationsthat can happen more about heart
(51:39):
disease, but that's.
That's not what people even knowabout.
So it it, the scare tactics kindof don't really work all that
well.
They're not that accurate, Iguess is what I wanna.
Katie (51:48):
Yeah.
Well, that's a good point too.
Joanne (51:50):
Yeah.
Katie (51:50):
Well, Joanna, is there anything that we kind of didn't
chat about or that we missedthat you feel you know about
anxiety specifically surroundingdiabetes that you feel like
would be helpful for parents andcaregivers to to know, to hear?
Joanne (52:02):
I love your questions, Katie.
I think they were reallythorough.
Katie (52:05):
Thank you,
Joanne (52:05):
No, you, you, you're in the right line of work here.
I think the only thing I wouldsay is don't be attentive to
when it gets to be too much.
Right?
Like, if you are having panicattacks that you can't shake
yourself out of, right?
Go get help.
Don't assume that it needs to bethat way if you can't get off
the DLE wheel in your head.
Buzzing about numbers all daylong.
All day long.
All day long.
(52:26):
And you're past a year and it'snot shifting at all.
I'm not saying that like I stillwake up in the night sometimes x
number of years later andsometimes check my decks come.
But if you really feel likethat's all that's there, I
really wanna say that there'shelp to be had cuz it doesn't
need to be that way.
Katie (52:42):
Yeah.
That's great.
Okay, well, Joey Ann, thank you.
I so appreciate your time.
I loved your answers.
I loved chatting with you.
I.
Have no doubt this will be verybeneficial for listeners.
And like I said, Joanne will beback for a couple more episodes.
We're gonna talk dive a littledeeper into some of the other
emotional, mental challengesthat come along with caring for
(53:02):
somebody with type one.
So
Joanne (53:04):
Thank you, Katie, for having me.
Katie (53:06):
you're welcome.
Bye.
Joanne (53:07):
Bye.
Katie (53:11):
Okay guys, that was it for our episodes day.
I hope you enjoyed that chatwith Joanne.
I know I loved talking with her.
I hope you gleaned as muchwisdom as I did.
From listening to her chat.
Again, please, please, pleasecheck out the links in the show
notes there you will find linksto a few other episodes that if
you really enjoyed this one, Ithink you will enjoy those as
(53:32):
well.
You will also find a link to.
Joanne's website diabetes.
Sweet talk.com.
And on her website, you can finda link to her podcast.
Sweet talk for parents of kidswith type one diabetes.
And if you click the purplebanner at the top of the page,
you can submit your question.
For Joanne to answer, and youcan even be a guest on her
(53:53):
podcast.
And of course, that can be donecompletely anonymously.
Check it out.
All right, you guys have afantastic week.
I will chat with you soon, butuntil Ben.
Stay calm and bolus on myfriends.
Bye.
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