November 12, 2022 • 51 mins
Today's topic is Raising a Healthy and competent eater and my awesome guest to help guide us is Aren Dodge. Aren is the owner and founder of Dodge Diabetes, she's a registered dietician, a diabetes educator, and she has been living with type 1 diabetes for nearly 30 years. As a diabetes educator, Aren has advanced training from the Ellyn Satter Intitute which you'll learn more about in today's episode. As a diabetes educator, Aren is trained on all of the FDA approved pump systems that are on the market today! Feel like you might need Aren's help? Good news! She's available! Be sure to check out the links in the show notes to be able to find her on the web and on social media. Enjoy the show!
LINKS TO FIND AREN AND LEARN MORE ABOUT ELLYN SATTER
Aren's Website: Dodge Diabetes
Aren on Instagram, @dodge_diabetes
Aren's awesome Facebook Group: Dodge Diabetes Community
Learn more about the Ellyn Satter Institute and the Division of Responsibility
Follow the show on Instagram @sugarmamaspodcast
Come join the Facebook Group!
Visit the Sugar Mama's Podcast Website
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Katie (00:00):
Hello, and welcome to episode 92 of the sugar mamas
podcast.
Today, we are talking aboutraising a healthy and competent
eater.
And my guest is Erin Dodge.
Erin is a registered dietician.
She's a certified diabetes careand education specialist also
known as a diabetes educator.
And she's been living with typeone diabetes for nearly 30
(00:22):
years.
As a diabetes educator, Erin istrained in several of the FDA
approved pump systems.
Including the automated ones.
And as a registered dietician,she has advanced training from
the Ellyn Satter Institute,which you're going to learn more
about today.
As a registered dietician and adiabetes educator.
Erin owns her own business.
Called Dodge diabetes.
(00:43):
So, if you feel like you mightneed Erin, check out all the
links in the show notes to whereyou can find her.
On our website at Dodge,diabetes.com.
And on social media.
She's definitely a fantasticresource for the type one
community.
All right.
Without further ado, let's getstarted.
(01:06):
You're listening to the sugarmamas podcast, a show designed
for moms and caregivers of typeone diabetics here.
You'll find a community oflike-minded people who are
striving daily to keep theirkids safe, happy, and healthy in
the ever-changing world of typeone.
I'm your host and fellow T one Dmom, Katie Roseboro.
(01:28):
Before we get started.
I need you to know that nothingyou hear on the sugar mamas
podcast should be consideredmedical advice.
Please be safe, be smart, andalways consult your physician
before making changes to the wayyou manage type one diabetes.
Thanks.
I am here with a very specialguest today.
(01:50):
I'm here with Aaron Dodge.
And Aaron, I'm gonna go aheadand let you introduce yourself
to the listeners.
Tell everybody what yourconnection is to type one
diabetes.
you have a lot of them.
so tell'em your connectionpersonally and also
professionally.
Aren (02:04):
Good morning, Katie.
I'm, I've had diabetes.
This will be my 30 yearanniversary this January.
And I had a misdiagnosis and areally high like coma for two or
three days, um, when I was akid.
So I've had diabetes since I was13 and, Ever since I was
diagnosed, I've been teaching myfriends, teaching my teachers,
(02:28):
family and relatives all aboutdiabetes.
So I just took that natural pathand went and got a degree in
nutrition Then became a diabeteseducator and I got my first
insulin pump in 1999 when I wentto college.
That tells you how old I am and,man, technology has just changed
so much.
Uh, no, we were chatting beforeabout like how far it's come,
(02:50):
but um, it's just so amazing howmuch we've learned about type
one.
We still have a lot to go, along way to go, but, I just love
teaching and I love, helpingother people because my
specialty is, um, at DodgeDiabetes I do one on one
counseling and I have, a groupclass called Be Your Best
Pancreas, where I teach peoplehow to like be an insulin ninja
(03:12):
and how to look at their CGMgraphs and figure out.
Trends and any weird variablesand things.
And I feel like that you'remissing that a lot in, um, our
15 minute endocrinologyappointments and follow ups and
even with the diabetes educator.
So having diabetes, I feel likegives me an advantage to help
other people that arestruggling.
(03:33):
but as a dietician, I reallyenjoy.
Love food.
obviously my husband and I arefoodies.
I'm so blessed that my husbandloves to cook, so, um, he has a
lot of that, um, groceryshopping, um, routine in his, in
his court.
I just, uh, am excited.
I have two kiddos.
I have, um, a fourth grader inwho's nine and a six year old
(03:56):
that's in first grade.
So it's an adventure here at thehouse.
Katie (03:59):
Oh my gosh.
Okay.
So many things.
Um, so so you are, you're aregistered dietician, which I
love that you said you love foodbecause my sister is also a
registered dietician and shealso just, I mean, she is a, you
know, a, a rather.
Slim fit person, but she justjokes around all the time how
she's like the worst dieticianin the world.
Cuz you know, she goes to workand she, she works in, well, she
(04:22):
works from home now for Teledoc,but she used to work in an
outpatient dialysis clinic andshe would of course go to work
and like educate her patients onwhat they should be doing
differently and how they canimprove their overall, you know,
health and nutrition.
And then we'd go out to dinnerand she'd get like, you know,
Heinously fried item on the onthe menu.
And I mean, she, she certainlygets in plenty of healthy stuff
(04:44):
too, but she, she would alwaysjoke around about how she's the
worst dietician in the world.
Aren (04:50):
Yeah.
Loaded nachos for the win.
Katie (04:52):
Yes.
Yes.
Absolutely.
So I, I want you to talk alittle bit more about Dodge
Diabetes because as a registereddietician, at least I know with
my sister, like she can only.
Treat people, in that field, inthe state that she's licensed
in.
Um, is that the case for you oris this something different
where through kind of yourcoaching courses, you can, you
can get to people nationwide?
Aren (05:13):
well a lot of the coaching is like part of, so I'm also a
certified diabetes educator.
Mm-hmm.
um, and a specialist.
So I have that sort of realm tooas, um, kind of a broad spectrum
of things where I can kind ofencourage and coach people on
insulin and things.
Mm-hmm.
Um, I do have a pretty bigfollowing across, um, mostly the
East Coast and kind of tricklinginto, uh, out west a little bit
(05:36):
now.
Um, but I do a lot of insulinpump trainings.
Um, And really kind of helppeople that way as well with the
technology and devices and youknow, when you wear all the
stuff, it just makes it so mucheasier to teach people when
you're kind of, you know, 24 7sort of.
Tapped into it.
Katie (05:55):
Yeah, because you, I want people to know this too, like
you're pretty much trained andcertified in, is it all of the
pumps that are out there?
Which pumps are you trained in?
Aren (06:04):
I really, There's only three on the market right now
that's FDA approved.
Um, and previously there's beenup to six or seven, which I got
to wear'em all, which is thecool part about my job.
but yeah, so I do mostlytradings with Omnipod and a few
tandem insulin pumps here and.
Um, but getting to wear all thedevices and learning how the
algorithms work, it really helpsme be able to help other people
(06:27):
that are trying to finagle andfinesse those algorithms to
really hone in and get theirbest blood sugars with the
technology.
Katie (06:34):
Okay.
So there's probably a lot ofpeople listening right now that
are like, I, I need that.
I need you.
So if people, if people wannafind you before we jump into our
topic today, where, where canthey go to find you?
Aren (06:45):
Uh, you can find me on social media, um, Dodge
Diabetes, um, on Facebook.
And then I also have a privateFacebook community where a lot
of the magic happens with someof my freebie courses and
things.
and that's, uh, the DodgeDiabetes community.
And then I also have anInstagram account as well.
And then you can go to my slowlybuilding website, um, dodge
(07:07):
diabetes.com.
Katie (07:08):
Yeah, I will link to all of that stuff in the show notes
so people will, will know wherethey can go to find you, to see
what you're all about and to gethelp from you if they, if they
need it.
Okay.
So today's topic is a veryimportant one, just in general
for parents.
Like, forget about type onediabetes for a second.
Um, but definitely also forparents of type one diabetics.
(07:30):
And Today we're going to betalking about raising A healthy
eater.
so I want everybody to know aabout your background and your
training as a dietitian.
I know that just from talkingwith you for several months now
that you're, trained, you haveadvanced training from the Ellen
Satter Institute, which.
Um, if you're in the dietitianworld, especially in the
pediatric, you know, dieteticsworld, you're probably very
(07:53):
familiar with that name atleast.
So can you tell listeners, um,who Ellen Satter is and what
she's known?
Aren (08:00):
Ellen Satter is my hero.
She, started out as a dietitian,probably, gosh, back in the
seventies.
And she.
Practiced as a dietician doing aweight loss clinic, and to make
the long story short, sherealized that it didn't work.
She would coach these people andthese intense weight management
programs and give them mealplans and have them scour
(08:24):
through their pantry and theirkitchens and.
Really be miserable to be honestand see a little bit of success,
but then to see the weight comeback on and she figured out that
the current weight managementprograms that are out there on
the market, only 5% of peoplewho lose weight actually keep it
(08:46):
off for more than a year, 5%.
And that's a major failure ratein terms of, healthcare and In
general, the process of things.
So she went back to school afterbeing a dietician and went into
psychology and got her,psychiatry degree.
So now she does, she's adietician and a therapist, and
(09:09):
what she found was she wanted totest her theory about people's
relationships with food and howthat correlates with general
overall health.
And what she found was crazy wasthat if you're a competent
eater, And you can kind of feedyourself in a positive way.
You enjoy food, you have astructure around your eating,
(09:32):
and you take time to nourishyourself.
That.
Your outcomes are drasticallybetter in all aspects of all
health.
So that would be cardiac riskfactors.
Your weight is in a more normalrange.
You're overall generally happierand don't have a lot of guilt
around food.
And this measurement that shedid, Was was pretty surprising
(09:54):
to a lot of the medicalcommunity and the psych
psychology side of things aswell, and it eventually became
adopted by the American Academyof Pediatrics, and so they
follow that guideline on how toteach.
parents how to feed their kids.
And we'll go into that in alittle bit more about how to
kind of be successful, with herapproach and the division of
(10:15):
responsibility.
Katie (10:16):
Okay.
Yes, I definitely wanna touch onthat and the division of
responsibility, cause I knowthat's.
That's like her big thing and Iwant listeners to know about
that too.
Um, but you, you kind of usedthe term competent eater A
minute ago when you were saying,you know, she she has found that
if you are a competent eater andyou're good at nourishing
(10:37):
yourself and taking care ofyourself and listening to your
body, then you're be a lot moresuccessful than trying to
restrict.
So can you just like, what is,what does it mean to be a
competent eater?
Um, to you or, and, and or toEllen Satter.
Aren (10:50):
Competent eating is just where you trust yourself to be
able to stop when you're full,to eat, when you're hungry, and
to not have a lot of emotion.
Tied with like guilt or, Oh, Ishouldn't be eating that or, and
just really be joyful abouteating and coming to the table
and focusing on so many otheraspects of nutrition besides
(11:12):
just the calories and theprotein and the fat.
And I know that's tricky whenyou're, when you have diabetes
or you're raising a child thathas diabetes, not to just focus
on all the.
But more on the emotional sideof how food brings us all
together and, you know, havingthat joy around the table.
Katie (11:30):
I know, I, I'm very big on, I mean, we really try to
have family meals as much aspossible and we could, you know,
we we'll talk about that too,cuz she, she talks about that a
lot in her book.
Um, Erin suggested that I read,um, a book by Ellen Satter.
She said they're all good, butshe said, If I was gonna pick
one to read this one called YourChild's Weight.
Helping Without harming.
(11:50):
and I did, I did, I skimmed someof it, but read most of it and
It was really a great read.
I feel like just the title couldprobably be pretty triggering
for some people, to be quitehonest.
It was a little triggering forme cuz I was a pretty overweight
kid.
So I was like, Oh geez, what is,what kind of light is this gonna
shed on on things?
but what, what I was gonna sayis, um, you know, in You know,
(12:10):
we we don't follow the EllenSaturn method.
Exactly to a T and we're gonnatalk about that, what it is in a
minute.
But one thing I do is if my kidsare just eating lunch, you know,
and they're maybe on a device,like if they're sitting there
with their iPad next to em, likeplaying Minecraft or the phone,
I always.
I make them get off the screencuz I'm like, I want your full
attention to be on your foodbecause I've, I really feel like
(12:34):
there's a mental tie to likeyour experience of eating.
It's just not, it's not justabout like, shoving calories in
your face that makes you fulland satisfied.
Like, I feel like being able tokind of focus on your food and
experience, it makes you fuller.
allows you to kind of remainfuller for longer, and it's
like, it, it like registers withyour brain more that you've
(12:55):
actually eaten a full meal.
Whereas when you're Kind ofdoing something else at the same
time while you're eating.
It's like it almost doesn'tregister with your brain, or at
least with my brain.
I know that if I'm scrolling onmy phone and eating a bowl of
oatmeal, I feel like I'mhungrier an hour later than I If
I had hadn't been scrolling onmy phone and eating at the same
time.
Aren (13:13):
Yeah.
You look down in your sandwichesgone and you don't even remember
eating it, and so being moremindful because your body's
giving you constant cues.
Mm-hmm.
just like when you're.
When your kids were babies, youhad to pay really close
attention or you were gonna get,the bowl thrown at you or spit
at you.
And so as babies we're born withthe ability to know how much to
(13:35):
eat, when to eat, and sort ofthat, demand.
So you're constantly, you know,listening for the baby cry.
And as a mom you could hearwhich cry is a hungry cry, and
my diapers wet and.
If you can just support and,feed in that loving way where
you're providing and notrestricting, then I think you're
(13:58):
gonna find that, you can createa child that has that joyful
around the table that, hascompetent eating skills and that
will eventually grow up withthose.
That's a huge skill set to beable to have competent eating as
an adult.
And we all know.
That you go out to dinner withand they like, don't like to eat
(14:18):
in front of people, or they'llorder salad and just push it
around, or they don't really, orthey're not in the moment and
don't enjoy the food.
Or they're obsessed with, youknow, how perfect their, their
nutritional like kind of profileis and their plate and they
don't enjoy it.
Like your sister, she goes outand enjoys her.
It's not her everyday routinethat she does the fried stuff,
but again, you get a lot of joyout of it.
(14:39):
You enjoy the company and it'sreally sad when people, um, as
adults, they don't have that joyaround eating.
And we wanna have that for ourkids as well.
So hopefully we'll get to allthe details of how you can do
that soon.
Katie (14:52):
Yeah, let's do that now actually.
So, she, her big phrase, thatshe has coined is called the
division of responsibility,which is kind of her method, Of
how to, and by the way, you'rethe expert.
So if I'm saying somethingwrong, you feel free to stop me
and be like, No, Katie, that'stotally wrong.
Um, but so her, the division ofresponsibility is kind of her
(15:13):
method parents to kind of bringback that joy to, to eating at
the table, and kind of allowkids to kind of figure out on
their own, How much food theyneed and when they need it and
and whatnot.
So could you, could you talkabout that?
Could you explain to listenerswhat is the division of
responsibility and how, she kindof suggests that we put it into
(15:35):
practice in our
Aren (15:36):
Right.
So, the division ofresponsibility divvies up jobs
for the parents when they'repreparing the meal and jobs for
the infant or the child.
So the job of the parent or thecaregiver is the, what you're
feeding.
When you're feeding it and whereyou're eating it.
Okay?
(15:56):
And if you can stay within thoseboundaries of your jobs, then
the child will be able to showup at the table and be
responsible for how much theyeat and whether or not they eat
at all.
And as long as you don't kind oftiptoe into the child's
responsibility, what they found,and again, this is what's
supported by the AmericanAcademy of Pediatrics, um, when
(16:20):
raising a competent, healthyeater, is that.
The child will grow up to getthe body that's right for them.
They'll be able to learn cuesand push themselves along for
hunger and satiety.
They'll get a variety ofdifferent foods that are sort of
introduced to them so they cantry different things and kind of
develop their, their pallet andtaste buds for a variety of
(16:43):
different foods and, again, havethat joy in feeding and eating.
Katie (16:49):
when I was reading through it, like she was talking
about how she had all theseparents coming to her, very
anxious and worried was cuztheir kid was, was gaining a lot
of weight or just wasn't eatingat all at the dinner table.
And what she found is that theseparents were putting, um, very
kind of strict rules around whattheir kids could eat and how
(17:10):
much of it they could eat.
Um, and just really restrictingtheir diets Quite a bit right In
both and, and what they'reeating in the quantity of it.
so she found that you.
if you kind of take off thoseres a little bit, which we're
gonna talk about this in alittle bit, but that can be very
scary for the parent of a typeone diabetic to be like, eat
however much of this you want,but she found that as long as
(17:33):
the parents brought to the tablethe food that was being.
Eaten.
Right?
Like the parents got to choosewhat was being eaten and when,
Right.
The time and where, whether thatwas at the family dinner table
or at a, you know, at a,obviously at a restaurant you
can't choose the the what somuch cuz people are ordering
from a menu, but,
Aren (17:50):
or even on in the car on the way to soccer practice.
You know, sometimes it getscrazy at after school
activities,
Katie (17:56):
Right, Right, right, right.
So if you show up with the food,And basically let your child
know, Okay, this is what we'reeating.
You can eat as much of it as youwant, or nothing at all, Um,
that's fine, right?
I'm gonna let you make thatdecision.
that's where the childresponsibility comes in of how
much and whether or not, So shefound, If the children were
(18:17):
allowed to make those decisionsabout how much or whether they
ate or not, then there was a lotmore success with getting kids
on a healthier path, um, toeating their meals.
And then she was finding toothat the weight was getting
regulated.
And I, and I say that cautiouslybecause I don't mean that all of
(18:37):
a sudden the kids dropped abunch of weight, but in the
sense that they were nowstarting to grow.
Normally on the growth chart,the growth chart was showing
consistent growth and weight andheight.
then that was consideredsuccessful.
Aren (18:51):
Right.
So anytime parents interfere inthe kids' jobs around feeding,
then.
It's usually results in, anegative outcome.
And what we found in research isthat if you have a heavy child
and you try to restrict theirfood, the child will typically
get heavier.
(19:12):
Hmm.
And if you have a child that'sunderweight that you're trying
to encourage and eat, have themeat more and try to add more
calories in here and there thatthey will typically.
Thinner.
So it's almost like, I mean, youguys have been parents, you know
how how that opposite effectkind of happens psychologically
so they can sense yourinterference and that you're
(19:35):
trying to persuade them intodoing something that they just
really don't wanna do andthey'll fight back.
The big trigger in what youwanna look for, especially for
children who are on the heavierside, is if you're over
restricting, they'll startsneaking food.
Mm-hmm.
or if you're over restrictivewith, Your allowance of some of
the not so healthy, likeforbidden foods, which we'll go
(19:58):
into, a little bit down theroad.
Then you're gonna find, again,sneaking food over consuming, to
the point where, it becomes moreof an issue than it was if you
would've just.
Supported your child's eating,as they go.
Because what we know with kidsand their growth is it's not a
smooth, perfect growth chart.
Mm-hmm.
(20:18):
is that a lot of times kids willget a little chubby mm-hmm.
and then they'll grow like twoinches.
Mm-hmm.
and then they'll get a littlechubby and then they'll grow two
more inches.
So you have to trust theprocess.
And again, like you said, it'snot gonna fix itself overnight
or even.
Three to six to nine months.
And with younger kids, it's apretty quick turnaround if you
can start applying these, theseapproaches with, the division or
(20:41):
responsibility.
But for older kids, you'reunraveling a lot of, a lot of
things that have been sort of inplace for several years.
So it may take a little longerto see strides in, that
competent eating and.
With, with the division ofresponsibility, again, like you
said, you sort of offer thefoods that you're gonna select.
So let's say it's, you know, ameat and size and a glass of
(21:05):
milk or a, you know, butterbread or something like that.
So your child can choose anycombination of those items from
that meal that you're servingand eat as much or as little or
none of it that they want.
The key piece though is that youhave established structure
around that meal.
So the worst thing that I seehappen with parents is snacking.
(21:29):
And if your child's not comingto the dinner table hungry,
number one, their behavior'sgonna be terrible.
They're just gonna be jerks.
Number two, they're not gonna behungry, which means they're not
gonna eat the items that you'vetook all this time to prepare.
Cause let's face it, makingfamily meals is hard work.
And when no one eats, it's like.
The biggest insult ever, youknow?
(21:51):
Yeah.
And it makes you not wanna do itagain.
It was like, well that was justa waste.
I should have just made peanutbutter and jelly.
Or, you know what, I'm just sortof, and, and there's nothing
wrong with peanut butter andjelly for dinner but effort
wise, it's a lot of work and alot of energy to put into
preparing meals.
So you want your child to showup hungry, so, in the structure
of feeding, it's typically, youknow, three meals a day and then
(22:14):
maybe a snack or two or threedepending on your child's age,
so that after school snack,you're gonna offer.
The item that you're gonnaselect and they can eat as much
or as little of it as they want,but, and once that snack is
over, they can't graze untilthey sit down at the dinner
table.
the recommendation is only waterbetween meals or snacks.
Katie (22:36):
Yeah.
I had to Put this into practicein my own house.
at some point because my, youknow, my kids will come home
from school and, they'll saythey wanna snack, but then
they'll do their homework andthey'll watch TV for a little
while and then they'll go outand play and then they come back
in at five 30 when we're gonnaeat dinner at six or six 30 and
now they're ready for theirsnack.
And it's like, well, no, thesnack window is closed.
and I guess I realized that Iwasn't really verbalizing that
(22:58):
very well.
Like there is a certain timethat I want you to eat a snack
and be done eating your snack.
And then after that there's, youknow, there's nothing until,
dinner.
because otherwise you're gonnaruin your meal.
And I, like you said, I workedhard to cook this meal and it
took me a long time to thinkabout it and buy the stuff and
prepare it and all that.
so we kind of had to start doingthat.
And with Sarah specifically, ifwe wanna look at it from a type
(23:18):
one lens, you know, we'll be inthe car on the way home from
school.
And I always ask, what are yougonna have for a snack when you
get.
And some days she says, I don'twanna have a snack.
And, I say that, that's fine,but just remember that like, you
know, we're not gonna besnacking close to dinner, so if
you want to eat something, youneed to eat it when we get home
from school.
you know, and then, but mostdays she does wanna snack and
(23:39):
she tells me, you know, I justwant, grapes or something, which
grapes.
great, Right.
They're healthy food and it'sone of Sarah's favorite foods,
but I try to encourage her toeat a little something more,
which.
maybe, Maybe, that's the wrongthing to do, but just for for
the lens of type one, like, I Iwanna bolus for the snack, and
then I wanna be done bolusinguntil dinner.
(24:01):
I mean, I'm not opposed to likeseconds or thirds at a meal, but
with snacking, I don't reallywanna be just snacking and
grazing all the way through theafternoon until we hit, until we
hit dinner.
So I try to encourage her like,Hey, what if we added a cheese
stick to that, or maybe somepepperoni slices, or try to get
her to eat a little somethingmore substantial.
to carrier through, and so I'monly having the goal once.
Aren (24:22):
and my kids are starved when they get home, depending on
what they had for lunch or whatthey did during the day.
they're ready to eat their armoff.
So I.
Again, putting the homework downand like focusing on the snack.
And even if it's okay, even toset a timeframe, be like,
Listen, finish up your snack.
We gotta move on and work onhomework and do these other
things.
And so you have five moreminutes to finish your snack and
(24:44):
then we're gonna put it away.
but what you did with offeringthe cheese or the pepperoni or
whatever else to go with the,the, grapes is perfect.
Now.
It would be her decision to say,eh, not feeling cheese or
grapes, but.
As, feeding with love, and evenwith diabetes, you could kind of
suggest, hey, let's get theboles in a little bit earlier.
(25:05):
Do the like pre boles for thegrapes.
and you can kind of talk herthrough, and I know you do a
great job of being a goodteammate with your daughter with
diabetes too, and justcheerleading and encourag.
but prebus are tricky.
They don't always, you don'talways have that perfect window
to be able to do that.
but you just have to be reallycareful that you don't tiptoe
into her realm of responsibilitywith, the how much and weather.
(25:29):
does that make sense with thetiming and, and dosing
Katie (25:32):
Yeah, and I do wanna encourage parents too with the
how much aspect, like if I bolist for X amount of grapes in
the, in the car.
And then we got home and Sarah,I measured those out and Sarah
ate them and then right then andthere was like, can I have some
more?
don't, I personally don't have aproblem with that.
Ive, I, have found that if I canget that first pre bowlus in, in
(25:54):
working, the first time aroundthat, and there's already
something working in her systemthat it's not necessarily
necessary, at least for us, forSarah to do another prelist
before she has like anotherhandful of grapes.
Like I can just give her theinsulin then and she can eat the
grapes.
And And that seems to work wellwhen there's already some,
something working in her system.
(26:15):
Um, So I feel like a lot ofpeople get a little panicky type
one parents about that.
About the how much, Like, oh no,now they want seconds or thirds
and, I don't know.
I have found, I don't know whatyour experience has been in your
own type one journey, but I havefound that if we can kind of get
the insulin flowing first, the,the second pre bolus doesn't
matter as much.
Aren (26:32):
Right, Right.
And now again, I'm a diabetesdinosaur and I still remember as
a kid being on an exchange list.
And for you guys that arenewbies, an exchange list was
back before, like literally Iwas diagnosed when food labels
just had come out in 1993 and.
I had a meal plan of, I got oneserving of fruit and I got one
(26:53):
starch and a meat and like, soit was a very regimented routine
as a teenager and so I had toeat to match up with my insulin.
Mm-hmm.
and now because of all theadvancements in diabetes and
what we know we can now.
Match the insulin with the food.
So you're doing the perfectapproach.
And now when you're on aninsulin pump, that makes life a
(27:15):
lot easier if you want seconds.
Mm-hmm.
Um, what I would tell parentswho are on injections is
depending on the age of thechild, You can let them decide.
You can put the, the, um,responsibility kind of in their
decision court and say, Hey,listen, I know you want more
grapes, or, I know you wantanother scoop of rice, but we
already do for this much rice.
(27:36):
You can either.
and then kind of lay out theoption so you can either eat a
little bit more meat and moregreen beans and not have to take
an injection, or if you reallywant that rice, we're gonna have
to do another injection.
And that gives them the choiceand the responsibility, in their
division of responsibility withfeeding so that they can choose
more.
But then they realize they haveto have that responsibility with
(27:59):
diabetes of taking a little moreinsulin.
and just having empathy andletting your child make that
decision.
on their own about taking a shotbecause I mean, if it's
delicious, It's worth an extrainjection for me for another two
slices of pizza or somethinglike that.
Mm-hmm.
you have to kind of give them alittle bit more reins and when
they're going through a growthspurt, man, they'll eat you
(28:19):
outta house and home.
Mm-hmm.
So as much as you try toguesstimate how much they're
going to eat, they may surpriseyou.
Katie (28:25):
I'm definitely experiencing that right now.
Mostly with my older son who'sa, Who's 12?
Oh my gosh.
I just, he just eats so muchfood, which I know that's
normal.
Right?
that's that's just normal forthat age.
But I'm like, Oh, we're gonnahave to increase the grocery
budget coming up here, I think.
I I wanna talk too about, youknow, I feel like people should
definitely go look up EllenSatter's method.
(28:47):
I think her philosophy aroundeating is, I definitely love it.
I think that for type oneparents, it might be a little,
anxiety inducing at first.
and I have a question about thatin just a second.
I wanna come back to it.
but I also know that there's alot of people out there that are
gonna read it and or hear it andnot agree with it.
And, and not.
I, I, just wanna say in themiddle of the episode here,
(29:08):
that.
It's just, it's not gonna be forevery, like, everything I say
isn't gonna be for everybody.
This is just one method.
A very, it's a very popularmethod.
It's, you know, it's very, itwas adopted by the American
Academy of Pediatrics.
so it, you know, it's very, verypopular, very well known.
Um, highly respected method, butit's also not for everybody.
And we might touch on that inanother episode cuz Erin's gonna
(29:29):
do a couple episodes with me.
But, um, okay, so I want, Iwanted to go back and say that
with the division ofresponsibility, In the book and
this was causing me to sweat alittle bit while I was reading
it, but she, you know, she's,you as the parent, you provide
what they eat.
That might mean you have rollson the table.
Like you said, you have steak,you have green beans or whatever
it may be, but it's up to thekid to decide what they eat or
(29:53):
whether or not they eat.
So if they decide they don'twant any steak or green beans,
but they want to eat five rolls,like she says.
Let'em do that.
she says to let them do that andthey will figure out, kind of
how to navigate that and how toslowly incorporate more foods
and increase their palate whenit comes to foods like meats and
(30:13):
vegetables and things like that.
would you talk about that alittle bit and maybe just, um,
help parents of type one s uh,ease our fears around letting
our kids eat an entire basket ofbread
Aren (30:23):
picky eating is one of the biggest concerns that moms and
parents have around eating.
And what we know is that.
When there's pressure aroundeating or the one bite role, or
you have to eat this before youcan get up from the table, that
that creates a lot of anxiety ina child's mind around that food.
(30:46):
And again, it's almost likereverse psychology.
Like there's some reason theywant me to eat this, but I don't
wanna eat it, kind of thing.
And you know your kids and yourfamily better than anybody else
and some.
Dig their heels in way more thanothers and their personalities.
But what they know is that ittakes anywhere from 10 to 20
exposures to a new food for achild or even an adult to come
(31:10):
around to get.
Comfortable with it and to likeit.
And so what might seem like to alot of moms, they said after
three introductions to a newfood, moms chalked it up like,
Eh, well, they don't like that.
I'm not gonna serve that again.
Where it actually takes a lotmore repetition than you'd
actually think to a food beforeit to become familiar.
(31:31):
And for people to try it, forkids to try it.
And I know, even the differencesin my two kids, like my older
daughter is so much moreadventurous with food.
She's not afraid to putsomething in her mouth and be
like, Oh, that's terrible, andspit it back out.
But my son is, He will startgagging before it even hits his
lips, like he's already decidedin his head.
(31:52):
But what they found is that themore pressure you put around
eating and trying a new foodand, and adding, again, you want
it to be like a neutral sort ofplaying field at the dinner
table to where if they wanna tryit, they can.
If not, they don't.
And it's just kind of like, eh,you know.
and you have to trust theprocess and some kids are gonna
(32:16):
be more adventurous.
Like I said, with my daughterand her pallet, she likes a lot
more items than my son does, buthe's really starting to come
around and try new foods and,and at least let it sit on his
plate cuz at one point.
With green beans, he wouldn'teven let it touch his plate.
He would set it off to the side,off on his napkin, and now he's
getting to where he'll squish itand smush it with his finger.
(32:38):
and that's signs that he'scoming around to adopting and
getting around to liking thatnew food.
So just be patient.
And again, if you're serving,meat and potatoes at all your
meals, then your child's notgonna learn to, like caviar and
sushi.
Mm-hmm.
If you're serving and using thedivisional responsibility, your
(33:00):
child will grow up to get tolike and choose foods that you
already serve and like that arefamiliar, and then be
adventurous to try other thingsas you push them out of the nest
and they go try other, otherfamilies', meals or at other,
other opportunities atrestaurants and things.
Katie (33:17):
Yeah, I can definitely speak to that, especially for My
my Sarah, thank goodness, mytype one, she is my most
adventurous eater.
so she's very, she loves allsorts of vegetables and she's
willing to try almost anything.
Um, my two boys on the otherhand, must be a boy thing.
Maybe maybe not.
Um, I'm sure there's a lot ofpicky girls out there, but they
are a lot more hesitant to try,especially my youngest to try
(33:40):
new food.
But with my oldest kid, we hadto have a conversation in our
family.
a few years ago, just aboutdinner time because it was very
stressful for me because I like,like you've already touched on,
like, I would, I would mentallyplan what I was gonna buy, go to
the grocery store, unload thegroceries, prep the meal, you
know, then have to clean up themeal.
(34:00):
So it was very stressful for meto sit down at the table and
have an unpleasant experience.
Like I just wanted to sit downwith my family.
Did not care what they put intheir mouths.
Honestly, I didn't care if theyate or what they ate.
I just was like, I just wanted,This is our really only time of
the day to sit down and have ameal together.
I just want it to be pleasantand I don't actually care what
(34:22):
they're eating, which I'm suresome parents are listening to
that and are just absolutelyhorrified.
But listen, I'm not everybody'scup of tea.
That's just, that's just me.
So I, and I, you know, singingas the meals were primarily my
responsibility.
I was like, can we.
Not care quite as much aboutwhat You know, people are
(34:43):
eating.
cuz I did not like, you know,I'm forcing them to take one
bite of something before theycould, you know, get up from the
table or try everything on theirplate before they could get up.
Like, that just wasn't my jam.
I told my husband, I was like,at this point in time, like if I
can just put broccoli on thetable and they can see it, and
they can identify a piece ofbroccoli, then I'm happy with
that.
(35:03):
Like they could just know what apiece of broccoli is or know
what a brussel sprout is like.
That's sounds great to me.
And so we agreed on that justbecause, you know, it was
something that was stressing meout.
So we agreed on that.
And I will say that over time,just being patient and
continuing to serve a variety offoods, but also not care About
the.
(35:23):
Whether or not those foods werebeing eaten because hon I love
leftovers, so whatever's noteaten, I will eat the next day
or a couple days after.
Like, that's fine with me.
but I will say over time thatlike, especially my oldest son,
I mean, he's really starting toget pretty adventurous with what
he will eat and what he willtry.
I mean, he still doesn't love toeat a bowl of broccoli, but you
know, he'll we got torestaurants and he orders
(35:43):
something that's not chickentenders or a cheeseburger, you
know, he'll, he's branching outand he's trying new things and
you know, he's asking for saladnow at dinner, where before I
would just, just, my husband andI would have salad or whatever.
you know, I just wanted to saythat so parents would have some
hope and just, you know, havethe long view, have the bigger
picture in mind that it's gonnatake Some time.
(36:04):
and certainly shoving a piece ofbroccoli down somebody's throat
is not gonna make them love it.
Aren (36:09):
and honestly, the amount of exposures with a neutral,
like your dinner table whereyou're not pressured, you, you
can take it or leave it.
When you don't fuss, it makesthem more curious and they're
more likely to try it sooner andless exposures than if you
pressure and you force and youhave to take one bite.
(36:32):
And it's almost like a mentalblock that they make where I am
never gonna like broccoli, youknow, kind of thing.
And.
Kids are, kids have got some,they're, they're pretty, they'll
flex on you big time
Katie (36:42):
They can hold a broccoli grudge for a long time,
Aren (36:45):
And so we don't want broccoli grudges.
And, it makes dinner time somuch more pleasant.
It makes the kids excited tocome to the table.
And family meals are a lost art.
And again, just turning the TVoff, sitting down together,
having a meal, enjoying.
Having that conversation isreally what kids thrive in, what
(37:07):
adults thrive in and thatstructure.
And, they've shown that sociallythey do way better in terms of,
drugs and, and cigarettes andpromiscuous, actions.
And then even.
The relationship with theirfamily.
They eat more vegetables, theydo better in school.
They have a better outlook justin positivity in general.
(37:30):
So it's just amazing how thoseconnections over the week with
your kiddos at that family meal,um, can make a huge difference
in, your relationships.
Katie (37:40):
we don't get to eat a family meal together every
single night just because ofactivities and work schedules
and and things like that.
But we, we make it a point to doit, at least, you know.
three three nights a week, Iwould, at minimum, that would,
you know, we we really shoot forthat.
And then, you know, and thenthere's weekends too where it
doesn't have to be dinner.
You know, I think people getstuck in this mindset of, Oh, it
(38:01):
has to be this dinner.
This public's beautiful public'scommercial esque dinner where
we're all sitting down together.
It could be breakfast, sometimesSaturday morning, we're all
sitting around the breakfasttable together and chatting or,
I'll come in on a Sunday forlunch from doing whatever we're
doing and, and eat lunchtogether, just kind of standing
around the the kitchen counter.
It doesn't have to be thisformal sit down situation
(38:23):
necessarily.
Um, and she even talks about itcan be, you know, in the, like
you said, in the car on the wayto soccer practice or, um, even
at a restaurant, which again,it, it's a little harder to do
with the what you're going eatof the division of
responsibility, but, But it'sreally more about the
connections that you're havingtogether as a family.
that kind of helps with kidskind of growing into being more
(38:45):
competent eaters
Aren (38:46):
mm-hmm.
and having that joy around themeal, and having it nourish your
body.
And, and I feel like with, withdiabetes, we know that there's
so much emphasis put on foodthat it's really hard to enjoy,
so you have to make.
intentional, especially I thinkwith type one to make food
joyful, and not associate itwith, I'll have to take an
(39:09):
injection.
Oh, you know, there's always afight around dinner and, and am
I eating the right amount ofcarbs?
And then seeing the numbers and,and even making, judgements
about what the sugars do interms of feeling guilty for
eating certain foods.
So again, it's just data, it'sinformation and you wanna
maintain that joy around eating.
Even if diabetes tries to stealthat joy a
Katie (39:32):
Yeah.
I'm just curious, like with youbeing on the exchange di with
you being on the exchange dietback in the day being, being the
diabetes dinosaur that you are,that's a good term.
I like it.
did that create some unhealthyrelationships with food for you?
Like did you have to kind ofundo that over the years or was
it Not a big.
Aren (39:53):
I think so.
I don't know.
I was kind of a compliant child,like, so I kind of went along
with the rules, whereas some ofmy friends that had diabetes
would like sneak me like sneaksnacks and foods and things like
that.
So I think it kind of depends oneach child.
And again, mamas, you guys knowyour kids into their
personalities the best.
But I was pretty compliant withit.
(40:15):
But then I remember when itswitched over to just being carb
counting later in my teen.
It was like, and then I went onthe insulin pump, like when I
was around 17.
It was just amazing to have thatfreedom and flexibility and not
feeling like I had to eatbreakfast, lunch, snack, you
(40:36):
know, like.
This regimented routine to matchup with my nph and r then now I
could just eat when I wanted,like a, like a normal kid would.
I feel like I did have a littlebit of animosity towards my
diabetes.
but I felt like it was kind ofthe rules that I had to follow,
but not a lot of kids.
(40:58):
That resonates with, they'llpush back, they'll dig their
heels in, they'll, you'll have alot more issues with, kids
following in that regime andstrict, rebellious kind of,
things around food because noone likes to be told what to
eat.
Like if you get, you know,diagnosed with some chronic
illness and you have to chalike, there's a lot of
(41:18):
resentment about that.
even if it's just something likelow salt.
Katie (41:22):
Mm.
Aren (41:22):
I feel like with diabetes, especially when you're raising
and you're, you're learningabout, food and how it interacts
with your body and listening tocues about fullness, it makes it
really hard to be successfulwith diabetes, especially if
you're not, if you're gettingcaught up in the rules so much
in terms of, again, you need tomatch the insulin with the food
(41:43):
and not the food, with theinsulin.
Katie (41:46):
Yeah.
Okay.
so before we wrap up, how, youknow, for all the for the type
one parents that are listening,which that's pretty much
everyone That's the vastmajority of listeners.
I guess just, you know, I feellike.
people listening are probablyprobably think it's a, this
(42:08):
sounds a little bit like a freefor all, but I promise you if
you read through one of herbooks, or get on her website,
I'll, I'll, leave a link toEllen Satter's website.
As well in the show notes.
It's, it is very structured.
you know, it's giving kids thefreedom to eat as much as they
want.
you know, when you have providedthem the food to eat.
(42:29):
But, you know, I, but then alsoas, Hold on, let me back up.
So I feel like, you know, typeone parents might hear that and
get really anxious, right?
Because that's, that can makemanaging the insulin and the
blood sugars and the diabetes alittle tricky.
but it is very structured and,you know, I I guess I want you
(42:50):
to kind of speak into a way thatparents could reconcile.
Her method, Ellen Satter'smethod that has has been very
successful and is, is, very, youknow, respected and well known
with kind of giving our kids,um, with also managing diabetes,
I guess without totally, and uncclipping the seatbelt and
(43:12):
letting go of the reins and justsaying, you know, do whatever
you want and we'll fix it later.
Does that make sense?
Aren (43:19):
Yeah, no, I mean, I totally, I totally get it cuz
it's, it's a lot of control thatyou don't wanna let go of
because you just don't wannajust let the blood sugars go
berserk.
So I would probably say, and Iwas blessed to have an amazing
mom that.
She just knew how to follow,like she automatically followed
the, the division ofresponsibility.
(43:39):
But I would say communicationand being that team, echoing the
team player kind of attitudetowards your child with type
one, because you're in ittogether.
And so if you can have thoseopen lines of communication,
like you're talking about withthe grapes on the way home from
school, that.
(44:00):
Her be a better pancreas bydosing ahead of time.
You can kind of get an idea ofwhat we're gonna have for snack
and kind of get all that stufflined up.
And then, like we were talkingabout before with communication,
like, Oh mom, I'm still reallyhungry.
I want another two pieces ofpizza.
And then working together tofigure out the best plan to make
that happen.
(44:21):
Whether it's giving anotherinjection, whether it's having
more veggies or salad or, orpepperoni sticks or something
else to kind of balance thingsout, but really still allowing
that child to have that autonomywith.
The, with their job of how muchand weather mm-hmm.
um, especially during thosegrowth spurts and things as well
(44:43):
or even um, special events andthings like that.
I feel like if you can just stayon your, on your tippy toes and
do it the best you can most ofthe time mm-hmm.
and then you can always go backand take correction doses to
accommodate for that.
And that's another way too to,without it being a judgment.
In a judgey, sort of, I told youso sort of way as a mom or a
(45:06):
caregiver is to be like, Oh man,I'm sorry, your sugar's 300.
Maybe next time we should blah,blah, blah.
Or what do you think we could donext time that would make you
feel not so sick?
Mm-hmm.
and really kind of, troubleshoottogether.
Come up with the idea of how tochange it next time.
(45:26):
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Right?
Because it takes a lot ofpractice with dosing and, and
especially like with pizza andthose challenging foods to get
it right.
So communi, keeping those linesof communication open so that
they don't feel restricted, butthat you're a team together in
figuring out the dosing as apancreas.
Katie (45:43):
Okay.
So lots and lots ofcommunication and just keeping
those doors open.
Got it.
Okay.
So do you use the division ofresponsibility in your house
with your kids?
Aren (45:52):
I do.
I do.
And it's funny, like I said, Evmy kids are absolutely like very
different, like mm-hmm.
and it's just interesting to seethem fall into their
personalities and their foodpreferences and things and, Not
everybody gets their favoritedinner every night.
And so, you know, my son lovescheeseburgers and so that's his
(46:17):
big win.
And my daughter likes Caesarsalad and spaghetti, so like,
Everybody will get theirfavorite meal and you just
reinforce that, you know, we allsat down together and there's
gonna be something that you likeat the table, whether it's the
the four rolls with butter thatthey eat or not, but it will
push them along.
(46:38):
To like more foods and to bemore adventurous and trying new
things and just, you know,finding something they like at
that meal.
Mm-hmm.
If not, they'll just be hungryand then there'll be another
opportunity for them to have, ahealthy snack or something later
after dinner, or bring the samemeal out again.
That, you know, they'll know,you know, that they'll eat
something else off of that platetoo.
(46:59):
At dinner or at the snack time.
So, they'll have something ifthey're still hungry, there'll
be another opportunity for themto eat.
Again, you're not trying to, to,Kind of play puppet, master
manipulate the food kind of inthe background.
But kids, it's interesting.
Kids versus adults.
So adults will eat stuff becauseit's healthy for them.
Mm-hmm.
(47:19):
kids will not eat anything thatdoesn't taste good.
So make sure that you're, whenyou're preparing the food that
you're.
using stuff that makes it tastegood.
Butter, really healthy, good forhealthy brains.
dressings and, and salt andthings that make the foods taste
better, for everybody.
Katie (47:38):
.Mm-hmm.
Yes.
I love it.
I, She talked about butter alot.
I'm like, I can get on boardwith this situation.
I love butter
Aren (47:47):
all those healthy fats, man, that make that brain grow
and all those neurons and stuff.
Fire.
Yeah.
Yep.
Katie (47:53):
Yep.
I was just having a conversationwith my oldest son the other day
about fat and food cuz he wasasking me questions about
something like, if you didn'teat any fat, would you like just
be bones and muscles or, youknow, whatever.
I forget how he worded it, but Iwas like, actually your body.
Requires fat.
Like fat is not a bad thing.
I feel like our society has madeeverybody think that it's a bad
thing, but you actually need itto survive.
(48:15):
It coats every nerve in yourbody.
It coats your brain.
It, you know, you need fat, butI, but there's healthy fats and
there's not so healthy fats, andso we talked a little bit about
that, but um, yeah, people, youneed some fat.
So get some butter, Get somereal butter.
Aren (48:31):
Here's the butter,
Katie (48:32):
here's the butter we're having.
We're having rolls and butterfor dinner.
I don't know about you.
He sounds really good.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, thank you so much.
I know you're gonna come back onand we're.
Talk about a few other things.
Um, I think that was definitelya good start to kind of just
raising a healthy eater ingeneral.
and some ideas for people tothink about on, on, how to do
(48:54):
that and how to maybe not be asrestrictive in their feeding
methods.
and that sounds scary,especially to type one parent.
But, I think in the long run itjust leads to, like you said,
being a more successful and amore competent eater and just
have a, having a healthiermindset around food in general
as you grow up and become anadult and are managing diabetes
(49:15):
on your own.
Aren (49:16):
Right.
And I feel like if it feels likea loving way, then that's a
good, you know, you're on theright track.
where you're not restricting or,again, the meal times are
pleasant.
And I would encourage you guysto go to, the Ellen Satter
website.
It's the Ellen Satter Institute.
Mm-hmm.
And look at that division ofresponsibility and kind of wrap
your brain around that concept.
(49:37):
And then what's really great isthere's age specific tips and.
On that website that can showyou, depending on how old your
child is, what that looks likein terms of, letting them choose
their snacks as they get alittle bit older.
They can choose their afternoonsnacks or, how you should
prepare the food in terms of,offering the family meals.
(49:57):
And so just different littleinside tricks and tips that can
help you, really embrace and bemore successful with the
division of responsibility andthat
Katie (50:07):
Okay, great.
Yeah, again, I will leave a linkto that in the show notes as
well as a link to all of yourstuff so people will be able to
find you.
okay.
Well thank you so much Erin.
Thank you for your time andthanks for coming on today.
I really enjoyed ourconversation.
Aren (50:20):
All right.
You're so welcome, Katie.
I hope it can be helpful for allthose mamas out there.
Katie (50:23):
Oh, I'm have no doubt that I will be.
Thank you.
That's it for our show today.
I hope you enjoyed listening.
Aaron we'll be back with me nextweek.
When we talk about.
How to handle and encourage ourpicky eaters.
You're not going to want to missthat Again, make sure to check
out all the links in the shownotes.
I'll have a link to Aaron'swebsite, Dodge, diabetes.com.
(50:45):
As well as to where you can findErin on social media.
Including Instagram andFacebook.
She has an awesome Facebookgroup, a great little community
on there.
And you're going to want tocheck that out.
All right.
My friends, I hope you have afabulous week.
I will chat with you soon, butuntil then stay calm and bolus
on by.
Hello, and welcome to episode 92 of the sugar mamas
podcast.
Today, we are talking aboutraising a healthy and competent
eater.
And my guest is Erin Dodge.
Erin is a registered dietician.
She's a certified diabetes careand education specialist also
known as a diabetes educator.
And she's been living with typeone diabetes for nearly 30
(00:22):
years.
As a diabetes educator, Erin istrained in several of the FDA
approved pump systems.
Including the automated ones.
And as a registered dietician,she has advanced training from
the Ellyn Satter Institute,which you're going to learn more
about today.
As a registered dietician and adiabetes educator.
Erin owns her own business.
Called Dodge diabetes.
(00:43):
So, if you feel like you mightneed Erin, check out all the
links in the show notes to whereyou can find her.
On our website at Dodge,diabetes.com.
And on social media.
She's definitely a fantasticresource for the type one
community.
All right.
Without further ado, let's getstarted.
(01:06):
You're listening to the sugarmamas podcast, a show designed
for moms and caregivers of typeone diabetics here.
You'll find a community oflike-minded people who are
striving daily to keep theirkids safe, happy, and healthy in
the ever-changing world of typeone.
I'm your host and fellow T one Dmom, Katie Roseboro.
(01:28):
Before we get started.
I need you to know that nothingyou hear on the sugar mamas
podcast should be consideredmedical advice.
Please be safe, be smart, andalways consult your physician
before making changes to the wayyou manage type one diabetes.
Thanks.
I am here with a very specialguest today.
(01:50):
I'm here with Aaron Dodge.
And Aaron, I'm gonna go aheadand let you introduce yourself
to the listeners.
Tell everybody what yourconnection is to type one
diabetes.
you have a lot of them.
so tell'em your connectionpersonally and also
professionally.
Aren (02:04):
Good morning, Katie.
I'm, I've had diabetes.
This will be my 30 yearanniversary this January.
And I had a misdiagnosis and areally high like coma for two or
three days, um, when I was akid.
So I've had diabetes since I was13 and, Ever since I was
diagnosed, I've been teaching myfriends, teaching my teachers,
(02:28):
family and relatives all aboutdiabetes.
So I just took that natural pathand went and got a degree in
nutrition Then became a diabeteseducator and I got my first
insulin pump in 1999 when I wentto college.
That tells you how old I am and,man, technology has just changed
so much.
Uh, no, we were chatting beforeabout like how far it's come,
(02:50):
but um, it's just so amazing howmuch we've learned about type
one.
We still have a lot to go, along way to go, but, I just love
teaching and I love, helpingother people because my
specialty is, um, at DodgeDiabetes I do one on one
counseling and I have, a groupclass called Be Your Best
Pancreas, where I teach peoplehow to like be an insulin ninja
(03:12):
and how to look at their CGMgraphs and figure out.
Trends and any weird variablesand things.
And I feel like that you'remissing that a lot in, um, our
15 minute endocrinologyappointments and follow ups and
even with the diabetes educator.
So having diabetes, I feel likegives me an advantage to help
other people that arestruggling.
(03:33):
but as a dietician, I reallyenjoy.
Love food.
obviously my husband and I arefoodies.
I'm so blessed that my husbandloves to cook, so, um, he has a
lot of that, um, groceryshopping, um, routine in his, in
his court.
I just, uh, am excited.
I have two kiddos.
I have, um, a fourth grader inwho's nine and a six year old
(03:56):
that's in first grade.
So it's an adventure here at thehouse.
Katie (03:59):
Oh my gosh.
Okay.
So many things.
Um, so so you are, you're aregistered dietician, which I
love that you said you love foodbecause my sister is also a
registered dietician and shealso just, I mean, she is a, you
know, a, a rather.
Slim fit person, but she justjokes around all the time how
she's like the worst dieticianin the world.
Cuz you know, she goes to workand she, she works in, well, she
(04:22):
works from home now for Teledoc,but she used to work in an
outpatient dialysis clinic andshe would of course go to work
and like educate her patients onwhat they should be doing
differently and how they canimprove their overall, you know,
health and nutrition.
And then we'd go out to dinnerand she'd get like, you know,
Heinously fried item on the onthe menu.
And I mean, she, she certainlygets in plenty of healthy stuff
(04:44):
too, but she, she would alwaysjoke around about how she's the
worst dietician in the world.
Aren (04:50):
Yeah.
Loaded nachos for the win.
Katie (04:52):
Yes.
Yes.
Absolutely.
So I, I want you to talk alittle bit more about Dodge
Diabetes because as a registereddietician, at least I know with
my sister, like she can only.
Treat people, in that field, inthe state that she's licensed
in.
Um, is that the case for you oris this something different
where through kind of yourcoaching courses, you can, you
can get to people nationwide?
Aren (05:13):
well a lot of the coaching is like part of, so I'm also a
certified diabetes educator.
Mm-hmm.
um, and a specialist.
So I have that sort of realm tooas, um, kind of a broad spectrum
of things where I can kind ofencourage and coach people on
insulin and things.
Mm-hmm.
Um, I do have a pretty bigfollowing across, um, mostly the
East Coast and kind of tricklinginto, uh, out west a little bit
(05:36):
now.
Um, but I do a lot of insulinpump trainings.
Um, And really kind of helppeople that way as well with the
technology and devices and youknow, when you wear all the
stuff, it just makes it so mucheasier to teach people when
you're kind of, you know, 24 7sort of.
Tapped into it.
Katie (05:55):
Yeah, because you, I want people to know this too, like
you're pretty much trained andcertified in, is it all of the
pumps that are out there?
Which pumps are you trained in?
Aren (06:04):
I really, There's only three on the market right now
that's FDA approved.
Um, and previously there's beenup to six or seven, which I got
to wear'em all, which is thecool part about my job.
but yeah, so I do mostlytradings with Omnipod and a few
tandem insulin pumps here and.
Um, but getting to wear all thedevices and learning how the
algorithms work, it really helpsme be able to help other people
(06:27):
that are trying to finagle andfinesse those algorithms to
really hone in and get theirbest blood sugars with the
technology.
Katie (06:34):
Okay.
So there's probably a lot ofpeople listening right now that
are like, I, I need that.
I need you.
So if people, if people wannafind you before we jump into our
topic today, where, where canthey go to find you?
Aren (06:45):
Uh, you can find me on social media, um, Dodge
Diabetes, um, on Facebook.
And then I also have a privateFacebook community where a lot
of the magic happens with someof my freebie courses and
things.
and that's, uh, the DodgeDiabetes community.
And then I also have anInstagram account as well.
And then you can go to my slowlybuilding website, um, dodge
(07:07):
diabetes.com.
Katie (07:08):
Yeah, I will link to all of that stuff in the show notes
so people will, will know wherethey can go to find you, to see
what you're all about and to gethelp from you if they, if they
need it.
Okay.
So today's topic is a veryimportant one, just in general
for parents.
Like, forget about type onediabetes for a second.
Um, but definitely also forparents of type one diabetics.
(07:30):
And Today we're going to betalking about raising A healthy
eater.
so I want everybody to know aabout your background and your
training as a dietitian.
I know that just from talkingwith you for several months now
that you're, trained, you haveadvanced training from the Ellen
Satter Institute, which.
Um, if you're in the dietitianworld, especially in the
pediatric, you know, dieteticsworld, you're probably very
(07:53):
familiar with that name atleast.
So can you tell listeners, um,who Ellen Satter is and what
she's known?
Aren (08:00):
Ellen Satter is my hero.
She, started out as a dietitian,probably, gosh, back in the
seventies.
And she.
Practiced as a dietician doing aweight loss clinic, and to make
the long story short, sherealized that it didn't work.
She would coach these people andthese intense weight management
programs and give them mealplans and have them scour
(08:24):
through their pantry and theirkitchens and.
Really be miserable to be honestand see a little bit of success,
but then to see the weight comeback on and she figured out that
the current weight managementprograms that are out there on
the market, only 5% of peoplewho lose weight actually keep it
(08:46):
off for more than a year, 5%.
And that's a major failure ratein terms of, healthcare and In
general, the process of things.
So she went back to school afterbeing a dietician and went into
psychology and got her,psychiatry degree.
So now she does, she's adietician and a therapist, and
(09:09):
what she found was she wanted totest her theory about people's
relationships with food and howthat correlates with general
overall health.
And what she found was crazy wasthat if you're a competent
eater, And you can kind of feedyourself in a positive way.
You enjoy food, you have astructure around your eating,
(09:32):
and you take time to nourishyourself.
That.
Your outcomes are drasticallybetter in all aspects of all
health.
So that would be cardiac riskfactors.
Your weight is in a more normalrange.
You're overall generally happierand don't have a lot of guilt
around food.
And this measurement that shedid, Was was pretty surprising
(09:54):
to a lot of the medicalcommunity and the psych
psychology side of things aswell, and it eventually became
adopted by the American Academyof Pediatrics, and so they
follow that guideline on how toteach.
parents how to feed their kids.
And we'll go into that in alittle bit more about how to
kind of be successful, with herapproach and the division of
(10:15):
responsibility.
Katie (10:16):
Okay.
Yes, I definitely wanna touch onthat and the division of
responsibility, cause I knowthat's.
That's like her big thing and Iwant listeners to know about
that too.
Um, but you, you kind of usedthe term competent eater A
minute ago when you were saying,you know, she she has found that
if you are a competent eater andyou're good at nourishing
(10:37):
yourself and taking care ofyourself and listening to your
body, then you're be a lot moresuccessful than trying to
restrict.
So can you just like, what is,what does it mean to be a
competent eater?
Um, to you or, and, and or toEllen Satter.
Aren (10:50):
Competent eating is just where you trust yourself to be
able to stop when you're full,to eat, when you're hungry, and
to not have a lot of emotion.
Tied with like guilt or, Oh, Ishouldn't be eating that or, and
just really be joyful abouteating and coming to the table
and focusing on so many otheraspects of nutrition besides
(11:12):
just the calories and theprotein and the fat.
And I know that's tricky whenyou're, when you have diabetes
or you're raising a child thathas diabetes, not to just focus
on all the.
But more on the emotional sideof how food brings us all
together and, you know, havingthat joy around the table.
Katie (11:30):
I know, I, I'm very big on, I mean, we really try to
have family meals as much aspossible and we could, you know,
we we'll talk about that too,cuz she, she talks about that a
lot in her book.
Um, Erin suggested that I read,um, a book by Ellen Satter.
She said they're all good, butshe said, If I was gonna pick
one to read this one called YourChild's Weight.
Helping Without harming.
(11:50):
and I did, I did, I skimmed someof it, but read most of it and
It was really a great read.
I feel like just the title couldprobably be pretty triggering
for some people, to be quitehonest.
It was a little triggering forme cuz I was a pretty overweight
kid.
So I was like, Oh geez, what is,what kind of light is this gonna
shed on on things?
but what, what I was gonna sayis, um, you know, in You know,
(12:10):
we we don't follow the EllenSaturn method.
Exactly to a T and we're gonnatalk about that, what it is in a
minute.
But one thing I do is if my kidsare just eating lunch, you know,
and they're maybe on a device,like if they're sitting there
with their iPad next to em, likeplaying Minecraft or the phone,
I always.
I make them get off the screencuz I'm like, I want your full
attention to be on your foodbecause I've, I really feel like
(12:34):
there's a mental tie to likeyour experience of eating.
It's just not, it's not justabout like, shoving calories in
your face that makes you fulland satisfied.
Like, I feel like being able tokind of focus on your food and
experience, it makes you fuller.
allows you to kind of remainfuller for longer, and it's
like, it, it like registers withyour brain more that you've
(12:55):
actually eaten a full meal.
Whereas when you're Kind ofdoing something else at the same
time while you're eating.
It's like it almost doesn'tregister with your brain, or at
least with my brain.
I know that if I'm scrolling onmy phone and eating a bowl of
oatmeal, I feel like I'mhungrier an hour later than I If
I had hadn't been scrolling onmy phone and eating at the same
time.
Aren (13:13):
Yeah.
You look down in your sandwichesgone and you don't even remember
eating it, and so being moremindful because your body's
giving you constant cues.
Mm-hmm.
just like when you're.
When your kids were babies, youhad to pay really close
attention or you were gonna get,the bowl thrown at you or spit
at you.
And so as babies we're born withthe ability to know how much to
(13:35):
eat, when to eat, and sort ofthat, demand.
So you're constantly, you know,listening for the baby cry.
And as a mom you could hearwhich cry is a hungry cry, and
my diapers wet and.
If you can just support and,feed in that loving way where
you're providing and notrestricting, then I think you're
(13:58):
gonna find that, you can createa child that has that joyful
around the table that, hascompetent eating skills and that
will eventually grow up withthose.
That's a huge skill set to beable to have competent eating as
an adult.
And we all know.
That you go out to dinner withand they like, don't like to eat
(14:18):
in front of people, or they'llorder salad and just push it
around, or they don't really, orthey're not in the moment and
don't enjoy the food.
Or they're obsessed with, youknow, how perfect their, their
nutritional like kind of profileis and their plate and they
don't enjoy it.
Like your sister, she goes outand enjoys her.
It's not her everyday routinethat she does the fried stuff,
but again, you get a lot of joyout of it.
(14:39):
You enjoy the company and it'sreally sad when people, um, as
adults, they don't have that joyaround eating.
And we wanna have that for ourkids as well.
So hopefully we'll get to allthe details of how you can do
that soon.
Katie (14:52):
Yeah, let's do that now actually.
So, she, her big phrase, thatshe has coined is called the
division of responsibility,which is kind of her method, Of
how to, and by the way, you'rethe expert.
So if I'm saying somethingwrong, you feel free to stop me
and be like, No, Katie, that'stotally wrong.
Um, but so her, the division ofresponsibility is kind of her
(15:13):
method parents to kind of bringback that joy to, to eating at
the table, and kind of allowkids to kind of figure out on
their own, How much food theyneed and when they need it and
and whatnot.
So could you, could you talkabout that?
Could you explain to listenerswhat is the division of
responsibility and how, she kindof suggests that we put it into
(15:35):
practice in our
Aren (15:36):
Right.
So, the division ofresponsibility divvies up jobs
for the parents when they'repreparing the meal and jobs for
the infant or the child.
So the job of the parent or thecaregiver is the, what you're
feeding.
When you're feeding it and whereyou're eating it.
Okay?
(15:56):
And if you can stay within thoseboundaries of your jobs, then
the child will be able to showup at the table and be
responsible for how much theyeat and whether or not they eat
at all.
And as long as you don't kind oftiptoe into the child's
responsibility, what they found,and again, this is what's
supported by the AmericanAcademy of Pediatrics, um, when
(16:20):
raising a competent, healthyeater, is that.
The child will grow up to getthe body that's right for them.
They'll be able to learn cuesand push themselves along for
hunger and satiety.
They'll get a variety ofdifferent foods that are sort of
introduced to them so they cantry different things and kind of
develop their, their pallet andtaste buds for a variety of
(16:43):
different foods and, again, havethat joy in feeding and eating.
Katie (16:49):
when I was reading through it, like she was talking
about how she had all theseparents coming to her, very
anxious and worried was cuztheir kid was, was gaining a lot
of weight or just wasn't eatingat all at the dinner table.
And what she found is that theseparents were putting, um, very
kind of strict rules around whattheir kids could eat and how
(17:10):
much of it they could eat.
Um, and just really restrictingtheir diets Quite a bit right In
both and, and what they'reeating in the quantity of it.
so she found that you.
if you kind of take off thoseres a little bit, which we're
gonna talk about this in alittle bit, but that can be very
scary for the parent of a typeone diabetic to be like, eat
however much of this you want,but she found that as long as
(17:33):
the parents brought to the tablethe food that was being.
Eaten.
Right?
Like the parents got to choosewhat was being eaten and when,
Right.
The time and where, whether thatwas at the family dinner table
or at a, you know, at a,obviously at a restaurant you
can't choose the the what somuch cuz people are ordering
from a menu, but,
Aren (17:50):
or even on in the car on the way to soccer practice.
You know, sometimes it getscrazy at after school
activities,
Katie (17:56):
Right, Right, right, right.
So if you show up with the food,And basically let your child
know, Okay, this is what we'reeating.
You can eat as much of it as youwant, or nothing at all, Um,
that's fine, right?
I'm gonna let you make thatdecision.
that's where the childresponsibility comes in of how
much and whether or not, So shefound, If the children were
(18:17):
allowed to make those decisionsabout how much or whether they
ate or not, then there was a lotmore success with getting kids
on a healthier path, um, toeating their meals.
And then she was finding toothat the weight was getting
regulated.
And I, and I say that cautiouslybecause I don't mean that all of
(18:37):
a sudden the kids dropped abunch of weight, but in the
sense that they were nowstarting to grow.
Normally on the growth chart,the growth chart was showing
consistent growth and weight andheight.
then that was consideredsuccessful.
Aren (18:51):
Right.
So anytime parents interfere inthe kids' jobs around feeding,
then.
It's usually results in, anegative outcome.
And what we found in research isthat if you have a heavy child
and you try to restrict theirfood, the child will typically
get heavier.
(19:12):
Hmm.
And if you have a child that'sunderweight that you're trying
to encourage and eat, have themeat more and try to add more
calories in here and there thatthey will typically.
Thinner.
So it's almost like, I mean, youguys have been parents, you know
how how that opposite effectkind of happens psychologically
so they can sense yourinterference and that you're
(19:35):
trying to persuade them intodoing something that they just
really don't wanna do andthey'll fight back.
The big trigger in what youwanna look for, especially for
children who are on the heavierside, is if you're over
restricting, they'll startsneaking food.
Mm-hmm.
or if you're over restrictivewith, Your allowance of some of
the not so healthy, likeforbidden foods, which we'll go
(19:58):
into, a little bit down theroad.
Then you're gonna find, again,sneaking food over consuming, to
the point where, it becomes moreof an issue than it was if you
would've just.
Supported your child's eating,as they go.
Because what we know with kidsand their growth is it's not a
smooth, perfect growth chart.
Mm-hmm.
(20:18):
is that a lot of times kids willget a little chubby mm-hmm.
and then they'll grow like twoinches.
Mm-hmm.
and then they'll get a littlechubby and then they'll grow two
more inches.
So you have to trust theprocess.
And again, like you said, it'snot gonna fix itself overnight
or even.
Three to six to nine months.
And with younger kids, it's apretty quick turnaround if you
can start applying these, theseapproaches with, the division or
(20:41):
responsibility.
But for older kids, you'reunraveling a lot of, a lot of
things that have been sort of inplace for several years.
So it may take a little longerto see strides in, that
competent eating and.
With, with the division ofresponsibility, again, like you
said, you sort of offer thefoods that you're gonna select.
So let's say it's, you know, ameat and size and a glass of
(21:05):
milk or a, you know, butterbread or something like that.
So your child can choose anycombination of those items from
that meal that you're servingand eat as much or as little or
none of it that they want.
The key piece though is that youhave established structure
around that meal.
So the worst thing that I seehappen with parents is snacking.
(21:29):
And if your child's not comingto the dinner table hungry,
number one, their behavior'sgonna be terrible.
They're just gonna be jerks.
Number two, they're not gonna behungry, which means they're not
gonna eat the items that you'vetook all this time to prepare.
Cause let's face it, makingfamily meals is hard work.
And when no one eats, it's like.
The biggest insult ever, youknow?
(21:51):
Yeah.
And it makes you not wanna do itagain.
It was like, well that was justa waste.
I should have just made peanutbutter and jelly.
Or, you know what, I'm just sortof, and, and there's nothing
wrong with peanut butter andjelly for dinner but effort
wise, it's a lot of work and alot of energy to put into
preparing meals.
So you want your child to showup hungry, so, in the structure
of feeding, it's typically, youknow, three meals a day and then
(22:14):
maybe a snack or two or threedepending on your child's age,
so that after school snack,you're gonna offer.
The item that you're gonnaselect and they can eat as much
or as little of it as they want,but, and once that snack is
over, they can't graze untilthey sit down at the dinner
table.
the recommendation is only waterbetween meals or snacks.
Katie (22:36):
Yeah.
I had to Put this into practicein my own house.
at some point because my, youknow, my kids will come home
from school and, they'll saythey wanna snack, but then
they'll do their homework andthey'll watch TV for a little
while and then they'll go outand play and then they come back
in at five 30 when we're gonnaeat dinner at six or six 30 and
now they're ready for theirsnack.
And it's like, well, no, thesnack window is closed.
and I guess I realized that Iwasn't really verbalizing that
(22:58):
very well.
Like there is a certain timethat I want you to eat a snack
and be done eating your snack.
And then after that there's, youknow, there's nothing until,
dinner.
because otherwise you're gonnaruin your meal.
And I, like you said, I workedhard to cook this meal and it
took me a long time to thinkabout it and buy the stuff and
prepare it and all that.
so we kind of had to start doingthat.
And with Sarah specifically, ifwe wanna look at it from a type
(23:18):
one lens, you know, we'll be inthe car on the way home from
school.
And I always ask, what are yougonna have for a snack when you
get.
And some days she says, I don'twanna have a snack.
And, I say that, that's fine,but just remember that like, you
know, we're not gonna besnacking close to dinner, so if
you want to eat something, youneed to eat it when we get home
from school.
you know, and then, but mostdays she does wanna snack and
(23:39):
she tells me, you know, I justwant, grapes or something, which
grapes.
great, Right.
They're healthy food and it'sone of Sarah's favorite foods,
but I try to encourage her toeat a little something more,
which.
maybe, Maybe, that's the wrongthing to do, but just for for
the lens of type one, like, I Iwanna bolus for the snack, and
then I wanna be done bolusinguntil dinner.
(24:01):
I mean, I'm not opposed to likeseconds or thirds at a meal, but
with snacking, I don't reallywanna be just snacking and
grazing all the way through theafternoon until we hit, until we
hit dinner.
So I try to encourage her like,Hey, what if we added a cheese
stick to that, or maybe somepepperoni slices, or try to get
her to eat a little somethingmore substantial.
to carrier through, and so I'monly having the goal once.
Aren (24:22):
and my kids are starved when they get home, depending on
what they had for lunch or whatthey did during the day.
they're ready to eat their armoff.
So I.
Again, putting the homework downand like focusing on the snack.
And even if it's okay, even toset a timeframe, be like,
Listen, finish up your snack.
We gotta move on and work onhomework and do these other
things.
And so you have five moreminutes to finish your snack and
(24:44):
then we're gonna put it away.
but what you did with offeringthe cheese or the pepperoni or
whatever else to go with the,the, grapes is perfect.
Now.
It would be her decision to say,eh, not feeling cheese or
grapes, but.
As, feeding with love, and evenwith diabetes, you could kind of
suggest, hey, let's get theboles in a little bit earlier.
(25:05):
Do the like pre boles for thegrapes.
and you can kind of talk herthrough, and I know you do a
great job of being a goodteammate with your daughter with
diabetes too, and justcheerleading and encourag.
but prebus are tricky.
They don't always, you don'talways have that perfect window
to be able to do that.
but you just have to be reallycareful that you don't tiptoe
into her realm of responsibilitywith, the how much and weather.
(25:29):
does that make sense with thetiming and, and dosing
Katie (25:32):
Yeah, and I do wanna encourage parents too with the
how much aspect, like if I bolist for X amount of grapes in
the, in the car.
And then we got home and Sarah,I measured those out and Sarah
ate them and then right then andthere was like, can I have some
more?
don't, I personally don't have aproblem with that.
Ive, I, have found that if I canget that first pre bowlus in, in
(25:54):
working, the first time aroundthat, and there's already
something working in her systemthat it's not necessarily
necessary, at least for us, forSarah to do another prelist
before she has like anotherhandful of grapes.
Like I can just give her theinsulin then and she can eat the
grapes.
And And that seems to work wellwhen there's already some,
something working in her system.
(26:15):
Um, So I feel like a lot ofpeople get a little panicky type
one parents about that.
About the how much, Like, oh no,now they want seconds or thirds
and, I don't know.
I have found, I don't know whatyour experience has been in your
own type one journey, but I havefound that if we can kind of get
the insulin flowing first, the,the second pre bolus doesn't
matter as much.
Aren (26:32):
Right, Right.
And now again, I'm a diabetesdinosaur and I still remember as
a kid being on an exchange list.
And for you guys that arenewbies, an exchange list was
back before, like literally Iwas diagnosed when food labels
just had come out in 1993 and.
I had a meal plan of, I got oneserving of fruit and I got one
(26:53):
starch and a meat and like, soit was a very regimented routine
as a teenager and so I had toeat to match up with my insulin.
Mm-hmm.
and now because of all theadvancements in diabetes and
what we know we can now.
Match the insulin with the food.
So you're doing the perfectapproach.
And now when you're on aninsulin pump, that makes life a
(27:15):
lot easier if you want seconds.
Mm-hmm.
Um, what I would tell parentswho are on injections is
depending on the age of thechild, You can let them decide.
You can put the, the, um,responsibility kind of in their
decision court and say, Hey,listen, I know you want more
grapes, or, I know you wantanother scoop of rice, but we
already do for this much rice.
(27:36):
You can either.
and then kind of lay out theoption so you can either eat a
little bit more meat and moregreen beans and not have to take
an injection, or if you reallywant that rice, we're gonna have
to do another injection.
And that gives them the choiceand the responsibility, in their
division of responsibility withfeeding so that they can choose
more.
But then they realize they haveto have that responsibility with
(27:59):
diabetes of taking a little moreinsulin.
and just having empathy andletting your child make that
decision.
on their own about taking a shotbecause I mean, if it's
delicious, It's worth an extrainjection for me for another two
slices of pizza or somethinglike that.
Mm-hmm.
you have to kind of give them alittle bit more reins and when
they're going through a growthspurt, man, they'll eat you
(28:19):
outta house and home.
Mm-hmm.
So as much as you try toguesstimate how much they're
going to eat, they may surpriseyou.
Katie (28:25):
I'm definitely experiencing that right now.
Mostly with my older son who'sa, Who's 12?
Oh my gosh.
I just, he just eats so muchfood, which I know that's
normal.
Right?
that's that's just normal forthat age.
But I'm like, Oh, we're gonnahave to increase the grocery
budget coming up here, I think.
I I wanna talk too about, youknow, I feel like people should
definitely go look up EllenSatter's method.
(28:47):
I think her philosophy aroundeating is, I definitely love it.
I think that for type oneparents, it might be a little,
anxiety inducing at first.
and I have a question about thatin just a second.
I wanna come back to it.
but I also know that there's alot of people out there that are
gonna read it and or hear it andnot agree with it.
And, and not.
I, I, just wanna say in themiddle of the episode here,
(29:08):
that.
It's just, it's not gonna be forevery, like, everything I say
isn't gonna be for everybody.
This is just one method.
A very, it's a very popularmethod.
It's, you know, it's very, itwas adopted by the American
Academy of Pediatrics.
so it, you know, it's very, verypopular, very well known.
Um, highly respected method, butit's also not for everybody.
And we might touch on that inanother episode cuz Erin's gonna
(29:29):
do a couple episodes with me.
But, um, okay, so I want, Iwanted to go back and say that
with the division ofresponsibility, In the book and
this was causing me to sweat alittle bit while I was reading
it, but she, you know, she's,you as the parent, you provide
what they eat.
That might mean you have rollson the table.
Like you said, you have steak,you have green beans or whatever
it may be, but it's up to thekid to decide what they eat or
(29:53):
whether or not they eat.
So if they decide they don'twant any steak or green beans,
but they want to eat five rolls,like she says.
Let'em do that.
she says to let them do that andthey will figure out, kind of
how to navigate that and how toslowly incorporate more foods
and increase their palate whenit comes to foods like meats and
(30:13):
vegetables and things like that.
would you talk about that alittle bit and maybe just, um,
help parents of type one s uh,ease our fears around letting
our kids eat an entire basket ofbread
Aren (30:23):
picky eating is one of the biggest concerns that moms and
parents have around eating.
And what we know is that.
When there's pressure aroundeating or the one bite role, or
you have to eat this before youcan get up from the table, that
that creates a lot of anxiety ina child's mind around that food.
(30:46):
And again, it's almost likereverse psychology.
Like there's some reason theywant me to eat this, but I don't
wanna eat it, kind of thing.
And you know your kids and yourfamily better than anybody else
and some.
Dig their heels in way more thanothers and their personalities.
But what they know is that ittakes anywhere from 10 to 20
exposures to a new food for achild or even an adult to come
(31:10):
around to get.
Comfortable with it and to likeit.
And so what might seem like to alot of moms, they said after
three introductions to a newfood, moms chalked it up like,
Eh, well, they don't like that.
I'm not gonna serve that again.
Where it actually takes a lotmore repetition than you'd
actually think to a food beforeit to become familiar.
(31:31):
And for people to try it, forkids to try it.
And I know, even the differencesin my two kids, like my older
daughter is so much moreadventurous with food.
She's not afraid to putsomething in her mouth and be
like, Oh, that's terrible, andspit it back out.
But my son is, He will startgagging before it even hits his
lips, like he's already decidedin his head.
(31:52):
But what they found is that themore pressure you put around
eating and trying a new foodand, and adding, again, you want
it to be like a neutral sort ofplaying field at the dinner
table to where if they wanna tryit, they can.
If not, they don't.
And it's just kind of like, eh,you know.
and you have to trust theprocess and some kids are gonna
(32:16):
be more adventurous.
Like I said, with my daughterand her pallet, she likes a lot
more items than my son does, buthe's really starting to come
around and try new foods and,and at least let it sit on his
plate cuz at one point.
With green beans, he wouldn'teven let it touch his plate.
He would set it off to the side,off on his napkin, and now he's
getting to where he'll squish itand smush it with his finger.
(32:38):
and that's signs that he'scoming around to adopting and
getting around to liking thatnew food.
So just be patient.
And again, if you're serving,meat and potatoes at all your
meals, then your child's notgonna learn to, like caviar and
sushi.
Mm-hmm.
If you're serving and using thedivisional responsibility, your
(33:00):
child will grow up to get tolike and choose foods that you
already serve and like that arefamiliar, and then be
adventurous to try other thingsas you push them out of the nest
and they go try other, otherfamilies', meals or at other,
other opportunities atrestaurants and things.
Katie (33:17):
Yeah, I can definitely speak to that, especially for My
my Sarah, thank goodness, mytype one, she is my most
adventurous eater.
so she's very, she loves allsorts of vegetables and she's
willing to try almost anything.
Um, my two boys on the otherhand, must be a boy thing.
Maybe maybe not.
Um, I'm sure there's a lot ofpicky girls out there, but they
are a lot more hesitant to try,especially my youngest to try
(33:40):
new food.
But with my oldest kid, we hadto have a conversation in our
family.
a few years ago, just aboutdinner time because it was very
stressful for me because I like,like you've already touched on,
like, I would, I would mentallyplan what I was gonna buy, go to
the grocery store, unload thegroceries, prep the meal, you
know, then have to clean up themeal.
(34:00):
So it was very stressful for meto sit down at the table and
have an unpleasant experience.
Like I just wanted to sit downwith my family.
Did not care what they put intheir mouths.
Honestly, I didn't care if theyate or what they ate.
I just was like, I just wanted,This is our really only time of
the day to sit down and have ameal together.
I just want it to be pleasantand I don't actually care what
(34:22):
they're eating, which I'm suresome parents are listening to
that and are just absolutelyhorrified.
But listen, I'm not everybody'scup of tea.
That's just, that's just me.
So I, and I, you know, singingas the meals were primarily my
responsibility.
I was like, can we.
Not care quite as much aboutwhat You know, people are
(34:43):
eating.
cuz I did not like, you know,I'm forcing them to take one
bite of something before theycould, you know, get up from the
table or try everything on theirplate before they could get up.
Like, that just wasn't my jam.
I told my husband, I was like,at this point in time, like if I
can just put broccoli on thetable and they can see it, and
they can identify a piece ofbroccoli, then I'm happy with
that.
(35:03):
Like they could just know what apiece of broccoli is or know
what a brussel sprout is like.
That's sounds great to me.
And so we agreed on that justbecause, you know, it was
something that was stressing meout.
So we agreed on that.
And I will say that over time,just being patient and
continuing to serve a variety offoods, but also not care About
the.
(35:23):
Whether or not those foods werebeing eaten because hon I love
leftovers, so whatever's noteaten, I will eat the next day
or a couple days after.
Like, that's fine with me.
but I will say over time thatlike, especially my oldest son,
I mean, he's really starting toget pretty adventurous with what
he will eat and what he willtry.
I mean, he still doesn't love toeat a bowl of broccoli, but you
know, he'll we got torestaurants and he orders
(35:43):
something that's not chickentenders or a cheeseburger, you
know, he'll, he's branching outand he's trying new things and
you know, he's asking for saladnow at dinner, where before I
would just, just, my husband andI would have salad or whatever.
you know, I just wanted to saythat so parents would have some
hope and just, you know, havethe long view, have the bigger
picture in mind that it's gonnatake Some time.
(36:04):
and certainly shoving a piece ofbroccoli down somebody's throat
is not gonna make them love it.
Aren (36:09):
and honestly, the amount of exposures with a neutral,
like your dinner table whereyou're not pressured, you, you
can take it or leave it.
When you don't fuss, it makesthem more curious and they're
more likely to try it sooner andless exposures than if you
pressure and you force and youhave to take one bite.
(36:32):
And it's almost like a mentalblock that they make where I am
never gonna like broccoli, youknow, kind of thing.
And.
Kids are, kids have got some,they're, they're pretty, they'll
flex on you big time
Katie (36:42):
They can hold a broccoli grudge for a long time,
Aren (36:45):
And so we don't want broccoli grudges.
And, it makes dinner time somuch more pleasant.
It makes the kids excited tocome to the table.
And family meals are a lost art.
And again, just turning the TVoff, sitting down together,
having a meal, enjoying.
Having that conversation isreally what kids thrive in, what
(37:07):
adults thrive in and thatstructure.
And, they've shown that sociallythey do way better in terms of,
drugs and, and cigarettes andpromiscuous, actions.
And then even.
The relationship with theirfamily.
They eat more vegetables, theydo better in school.
They have a better outlook justin positivity in general.
(37:30):
So it's just amazing how thoseconnections over the week with
your kiddos at that family meal,um, can make a huge difference
in, your relationships.
Katie (37:40):
we don't get to eat a family meal together every
single night just because ofactivities and work schedules
and and things like that.
But we, we make it a point to doit, at least, you know.
three three nights a week, Iwould, at minimum, that would,
you know, we we really shoot forthat.
And then, you know, and thenthere's weekends too where it
doesn't have to be dinner.
You know, I think people getstuck in this mindset of, Oh, it
(38:01):
has to be this dinner.
This public's beautiful public'scommercial esque dinner where
we're all sitting down together.
It could be breakfast, sometimesSaturday morning, we're all
sitting around the breakfasttable together and chatting or,
I'll come in on a Sunday forlunch from doing whatever we're
doing and, and eat lunchtogether, just kind of standing
around the the kitchen counter.
It doesn't have to be thisformal sit down situation
(38:23):
necessarily.
Um, and she even talks about itcan be, you know, in the, like
you said, in the car on the wayto soccer practice or, um, even
at a restaurant, which again,it, it's a little harder to do
with the what you're going eatof the division of
responsibility, but, But it'sreally more about the
connections that you're havingtogether as a family.
that kind of helps with kidskind of growing into being more
(38:45):
competent eaters
Aren (38:46):
mm-hmm.
and having that joy around themeal, and having it nourish your
body.
And, and I feel like with, withdiabetes, we know that there's
so much emphasis put on foodthat it's really hard to enjoy,
so you have to make.
intentional, especially I thinkwith type one to make food
joyful, and not associate itwith, I'll have to take an
(39:09):
injection.
Oh, you know, there's always afight around dinner and, and am
I eating the right amount ofcarbs?
And then seeing the numbers and,and even making, judgements
about what the sugars do interms of feeling guilty for
eating certain foods.
So again, it's just data, it'sinformation and you wanna
maintain that joy around eating.
Even if diabetes tries to stealthat joy a
Katie (39:32):
Yeah.
I'm just curious, like with youbeing on the exchange di with
you being on the exchange dietback in the day being, being the
diabetes dinosaur that you are,that's a good term.
I like it.
did that create some unhealthyrelationships with food for you?
Like did you have to kind ofundo that over the years or was
it Not a big.
Aren (39:53):
I think so.
I don't know.
I was kind of a compliant child,like, so I kind of went along
with the rules, whereas some ofmy friends that had diabetes
would like sneak me like sneaksnacks and foods and things like
that.
So I think it kind of depends oneach child.
And again, mamas, you guys knowyour kids into their
personalities the best.
But I was pretty compliant withit.
(40:15):
But then I remember when itswitched over to just being carb
counting later in my teen.
It was like, and then I went onthe insulin pump, like when I
was around 17.
It was just amazing to have thatfreedom and flexibility and not
feeling like I had to eatbreakfast, lunch, snack, you
(40:36):
know, like.
This regimented routine to matchup with my nph and r then now I
could just eat when I wanted,like a, like a normal kid would.
I feel like I did have a littlebit of animosity towards my
diabetes.
but I felt like it was kind ofthe rules that I had to follow,
but not a lot of kids.
(40:58):
That resonates with, they'llpush back, they'll dig their
heels in, they'll, you'll have alot more issues with, kids
following in that regime andstrict, rebellious kind of,
things around food because noone likes to be told what to
eat.
Like if you get, you know,diagnosed with some chronic
illness and you have to chalike, there's a lot of
(41:18):
resentment about that.
even if it's just something likelow salt.
Katie (41:22):
Mm.
Aren (41:22):
I feel like with diabetes, especially when you're raising
and you're, you're learningabout, food and how it interacts
with your body and listening tocues about fullness, it makes it
really hard to be successfulwith diabetes, especially if
you're not, if you're gettingcaught up in the rules so much
in terms of, again, you need tomatch the insulin with the food
(41:43):
and not the food, with theinsulin.
Katie (41:46):
Yeah.
Okay.
so before we wrap up, how, youknow, for all the for the type
one parents that are listening,which that's pretty much
everyone That's the vastmajority of listeners.
I guess just, you know, I feellike.
people listening are probablyprobably think it's a, this
(42:08):
sounds a little bit like a freefor all, but I promise you if
you read through one of herbooks, or get on her website,
I'll, I'll, leave a link toEllen Satter's website.
As well in the show notes.
It's, it is very structured.
you know, it's giving kids thefreedom to eat as much as they
want.
you know, when you have providedthem the food to eat.
(42:29):
But, you know, I, but then alsoas, Hold on, let me back up.
So I feel like, you know, typeone parents might hear that and
get really anxious, right?
Because that's, that can makemanaging the insulin and the
blood sugars and the diabetes alittle tricky.
but it is very structured and,you know, I I guess I want you
(42:50):
to kind of speak into a way thatparents could reconcile.
Her method, Ellen Satter'smethod that has has been very
successful and is, is, very, youknow, respected and well known
with kind of giving our kids,um, with also managing diabetes,
I guess without totally, and uncclipping the seatbelt and
(43:12):
letting go of the reins and justsaying, you know, do whatever
you want and we'll fix it later.
Does that make sense?
Aren (43:19):
Yeah, no, I mean, I totally, I totally get it cuz
it's, it's a lot of control thatyou don't wanna let go of
because you just don't wannajust let the blood sugars go
berserk.
So I would probably say, and Iwas blessed to have an amazing
mom that.
She just knew how to follow,like she automatically followed
the, the division ofresponsibility.
(43:39):
But I would say communicationand being that team, echoing the
team player kind of attitudetowards your child with type
one, because you're in ittogether.
And so if you can have thoseopen lines of communication,
like you're talking about withthe grapes on the way home from
school, that.
(44:00):
Her be a better pancreas bydosing ahead of time.
You can kind of get an idea ofwhat we're gonna have for snack
and kind of get all that stufflined up.
And then, like we were talkingabout before with communication,
like, Oh mom, I'm still reallyhungry.
I want another two pieces ofpizza.
And then working together tofigure out the best plan to make
that happen.
(44:21):
Whether it's giving anotherinjection, whether it's having
more veggies or salad or, orpepperoni sticks or something
else to kind of balance thingsout, but really still allowing
that child to have that autonomywith.
The, with their job of how muchand weather mm-hmm.
um, especially during thosegrowth spurts and things as well
(44:43):
or even um, special events andthings like that.
I feel like if you can just stayon your, on your tippy toes and
do it the best you can most ofthe time mm-hmm.
and then you can always go backand take correction doses to
accommodate for that.
And that's another way too to,without it being a judgment.
In a judgey, sort of, I told youso sort of way as a mom or a
(45:06):
caregiver is to be like, Oh man,I'm sorry, your sugar's 300.
Maybe next time we should blah,blah, blah.
Or what do you think we could donext time that would make you
feel not so sick?
Mm-hmm.
and really kind of, troubleshoottogether.
Come up with the idea of how tochange it next time.
(45:26):
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Right?
Because it takes a lot ofpractice with dosing and, and
especially like with pizza andthose challenging foods to get
it right.
So communi, keeping those linesof communication open so that
they don't feel restricted, butthat you're a team together in
figuring out the dosing as apancreas.
Katie (45:43):
Okay.
So lots and lots ofcommunication and just keeping
those doors open.
Got it.
Okay.
So do you use the division ofresponsibility in your house
with your kids?
Aren (45:52):
I do.
I do.
And it's funny, like I said, Evmy kids are absolutely like very
different, like mm-hmm.
and it's just interesting to seethem fall into their
personalities and their foodpreferences and things and, Not
everybody gets their favoritedinner every night.
And so, you know, my son lovescheeseburgers and so that's his
(46:17):
big win.
And my daughter likes Caesarsalad and spaghetti, so like,
Everybody will get theirfavorite meal and you just
reinforce that, you know, we allsat down together and there's
gonna be something that you likeat the table, whether it's the
the four rolls with butter thatthey eat or not, but it will
push them along.
(46:38):
To like more foods and to bemore adventurous and trying new
things and just, you know,finding something they like at
that meal.
Mm-hmm.
If not, they'll just be hungryand then there'll be another
opportunity for them to have, ahealthy snack or something later
after dinner, or bring the samemeal out again.
That, you know, they'll know,you know, that they'll eat
something else off of that platetoo.
(46:59):
At dinner or at the snack time.
So, they'll have something ifthey're still hungry, there'll
be another opportunity for themto eat.
Again, you're not trying to, to,Kind of play puppet, master
manipulate the food kind of inthe background.
But kids, it's interesting.
Kids versus adults.
So adults will eat stuff becauseit's healthy for them.
Mm-hmm.
(47:19):
kids will not eat anything thatdoesn't taste good.
So make sure that you're, whenyou're preparing the food that
you're.
using stuff that makes it tastegood.
Butter, really healthy, good forhealthy brains.
dressings and, and salt andthings that make the foods taste
better, for everybody.
Katie (47:38):
.Mm-hmm.
Yes.
I love it.
I, She talked about butter alot.
I'm like, I can get on boardwith this situation.
I love butter
Aren (47:47):
all those healthy fats, man, that make that brain grow
and all those neurons and stuff.
Fire.
Yeah.
Yep.
Katie (47:53):
Yep.
I was just having a conversationwith my oldest son the other day
about fat and food cuz he wasasking me questions about
something like, if you didn'teat any fat, would you like just
be bones and muscles or, youknow, whatever.
I forget how he worded it, but Iwas like, actually your body.
Requires fat.
Like fat is not a bad thing.
I feel like our society has madeeverybody think that it's a bad
thing, but you actually need itto survive.
(48:15):
It coats every nerve in yourbody.
It coats your brain.
It, you know, you need fat, butI, but there's healthy fats and
there's not so healthy fats, andso we talked a little bit about
that, but um, yeah, people, youneed some fat.
So get some butter, Get somereal butter.
Aren (48:31):
Here's the butter,
Katie (48:32):
here's the butter we're having.
We're having rolls and butterfor dinner.
I don't know about you.
He sounds really good.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, thank you so much.
I know you're gonna come back onand we're.
Talk about a few other things.
Um, I think that was definitelya good start to kind of just
raising a healthy eater ingeneral.
and some ideas for people tothink about on, on, how to do
(48:54):
that and how to maybe not be asrestrictive in their feeding
methods.
and that sounds scary,especially to type one parent.
But, I think in the long run itjust leads to, like you said,
being a more successful and amore competent eater and just
have a, having a healthiermindset around food in general
as you grow up and become anadult and are managing diabetes
(49:15):
on your own.
Aren (49:16):
Right.
And I feel like if it feels likea loving way, then that's a
good, you know, you're on theright track.
where you're not restricting or,again, the meal times are
pleasant.
And I would encourage you guysto go to, the Ellen Satter
website.
It's the Ellen Satter Institute.
Mm-hmm.
And look at that division ofresponsibility and kind of wrap
your brain around that concept.
(49:37):
And then what's really great isthere's age specific tips and.
On that website that can showyou, depending on how old your
child is, what that looks likein terms of, letting them choose
their snacks as they get alittle bit older.
They can choose their afternoonsnacks or, how you should
prepare the food in terms of,offering the family meals.
(49:57):
And so just different littleinside tricks and tips that can
help you, really embrace and bemore successful with the
division of responsibility andthat
Katie (50:07):
Okay, great.
Yeah, again, I will leave a linkto that in the show notes as
well as a link to all of yourstuff so people will be able to
find you.
okay.
Well thank you so much Erin.
Thank you for your time andthanks for coming on today.
I really enjoyed ourconversation.
Aren (50:20):
All right.
You're so welcome, Katie.
I hope it can be helpful for allthose mamas out there.
Katie (50:23):
Oh, I'm have no doubt that I will be.
Thank you.
That's it for our show today.
I hope you enjoyed listening.
Aaron we'll be back with me nextweek.
When we talk about.
How to handle and encourage ourpicky eaters.
You're not going to want to missthat Again, make sure to check
out all the links in the shownotes.
I'll have a link to Aaron'swebsite, Dodge, diabetes.com.
(50:45):
As well as to where you can findErin on social media.
Including Instagram andFacebook.
She has an awesome Facebookgroup, a great little community
on there.
And you're going to want tocheck that out.
All right.
My friends, I hope you have afabulous week.
I will chat with you soon, butuntil then stay calm and bolus
on by.
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