June 27, 2023 • 48 mins
Duane Williams was tried and convicted in a case of 2 arson related deaths. However, there is ample evidence to believe he had nothing to do with the fire. I've had a chance to review a report recently done by an independent investigator, and to say that the facts blew my mind would be an understatement. Witness tampering, falsification of evidence, and on and on. If you like true crime stories, check this one out.
***Names were redacted at the request of Mr. Williams***
Contact Dave:
https://survivingthesystem.org
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***Names were redacted at the request of Mr. Williams***
Contact Dave:
https://survivingthesystem.org
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Those whose jobs it is to protectand serve seem to be demanding more and
more blind obedient. You didn't thinkit just happened by chance, did you.
It's time to call attention to thefact our government as the most prolific
slave owner on the planet. Thisis surviving the system. Thank you for
joining me today on surviving the system. This is dancing, babe. And
(00:24):
today, as I said last week, I've had a lot of people that
are reaching out to me lately totalk about their cases, their loved ones
cases, just the system in general, which is fantastic. I love it.
That's what I asked for, andI want more of it, so
keep them coming. But I justreceived over the weekend some documentation from a
(00:48):
gentleman in Michigan, and I mean, quite honestly, I it's a huge
packet of information, but I wentthrough it and man, it's it's mind
blowing. It's mind blowing. I'mgoing to talk about his case and what's
going on with his appeal. He'scurrently incarcerated for life because of the system
(01:18):
basically fighting evidence, making up evidence, suppressing information, and just all around
lying to put in there. Sowe'll talk about that. I have a
feeling. This is probably going tobe an ongoing discussion that I have as
I bring people on to talk aboutthis. But before we get going,
if you are listening live on Springedot Fm, thanks for tuning in.
(01:41):
The call lines are open at oneeight hundred five eight eight zero three three
five eight hundred five eight eight zerothree three five and don't forget to check
out the website Surviving the System dotorg. I keep an archive of all
the shows on there if you'd liketo go back and take a listen.
I also have a contact me pageon there. You can shoot me a
(02:02):
quick message. I will get backto you. If you prefer to use
social media, of course, I'mon Facebook, dot com slash Surviving the
System and on Twitter at sts thepodcast either one of those I'm not very
active posting on, but I keepthose open for you to be able to
reach out to me. I loveto hear from you, folks. I
(02:23):
love to interact. As I saidat the beginning of the show here,
so please keep it up. Shootme a message if you have an idea
for a show, if you havea story that needs to be told,
That's what I'm here for. I'dlove to hear from you still keep them
coming, and if you haven't already, please do take some time to listen
(02:44):
on podcast platforms and shows available whereveryou listen to podcasts, take some time
to like the show, rate theshow, engage with me in some form
or fashion, and most importantly,share it with your audience. You know,
I guarantee that there is someone withinyour community that needs to hear some
of these stories. It needs tohear some of these topics that we discuss.
(03:07):
And before we get going, asalways, I do want to start
with just a quick moment of gratitudeas we can get into some darker and
more difficult topics, and especially withthis one here man, you read through
this and my blood boils for thisgentleman. So we want to make sure
that we tackle these topics constructively andproductively, that we don't let them drag
(03:30):
us down and get done talking aboutit and just feel completely unhinged or just
pissed or frustrated or whatever it mightbe. Those are completely disempowering and not
how we want to tackle these.So in order to accomplish that, we
start just with a quick moment ofgratitude to make sure that we keep the
vibration high, keep that frequency high, allows us to tackle these topics and
(03:53):
come out on the other end stillfeeling productive. So with that said,
just a quick moment to say thatI am so grateful to be here with
you, allowing me to live outmy purpose to help to remind you of
who you really are and what you'retruly capable of. So, Dwayne Lamar
(04:18):
Williams out of the State of Michigan, let me just read this quick summary
for you. Here. Duyne Williamswas charged with two counts of murder and
arson in the first and, followinghis trial in September of twenty thirteen,
was convicted by a jury of twocounts of murder in the second degree and
(04:39):
arson in the first and thereafter sentencedto life imprisonment. As of this moment,
mister Williams remains at this time servingthe life sentence affixed to his case.
So I'm reading from an independent reviewof this particular case, the people
(05:00):
of the State of Michigan versus DwayneLamar Williams, and this is done by
an outside organization named Clemency Investigations Incorporated. Unfortunately, I am not able to
have this gentleman on as the caseis still ongoing right now, they've got
some decisions to make before he cancome on. They have spoken with him,
(05:24):
and I'm going to bring him onbecause I really want to get his
perspective on this. The gentleman thatdid this review of mister Williams's case has
worked in law enforcement himself. He'sbeen in law enforcement for years and didn't
realize the level of corruption that wasgoing on around him, and I mean
(05:47):
until it smacked him in the face. And that's why he has started this
nonprofit organization and is going back andtrying to fight for the people who were,
I mean, essentially the victims ofthis corruption. And it's a tall
order because man, there is somuch of it out there. The sad
(06:09):
thing is, I only have myopinion to base that on, because what
are you going to do. You'regoing to go to this system and say,
hey, can you give me somestatistical data on how many people you've
framed and set up and how manypeople that you have fabricated or withheld evidence
on. I'm just trying to getan idea of how many people that we
(06:29):
have in this system right now shouldn'tbe there. There's no way you're going
to be able to get that.So I have no hard data to back
up anything that I'm saying other thanthe fact that I'm seeing it everywhere.
And after you've been in the system, after you start getting involved in this,
you start to see it everywhere too. And it's not that we're making
(06:51):
them up. It's just you startto realize. Your eyes are opened and
you look around and you go,holy crap, there's a lot of people
that are getting screwed over by thissystem. What is going on? And
then down that rabbit hole you go. So I want to talk a little
(07:12):
bit about this just in preparation becauseviously when I first heard about this information,
I was like, oh, I'lltake a look, no problem.
I've received documentation from people before I'vetaken a look, and you know,
sometimes there's not much really I cando. I can try to provide some
guidance and just say, hey,if you maybe talk to this organization over
(07:34):
here. I've had some people reachout and just say I don't know where
to go. Where can I turnto happy to help? You know,
I'll jump on Google and we'll makesome phone calls and do some quick searching.
And get you pointed in the rightdirection. But every so often some
information will come along and I'll go, holy crap, are you kidding me?
I need to take a look atthat. You know. The last
(07:56):
time this happened was well, funnyenough, about a year ago, about
the same time and when I broughton Tim right out of Virginia and I
had to send Tim an email theday and just say, man, I
just got some information on this case. Is Dwayne Lamar Williams out of Michigan.
Man, it reminds me so muchof you. The circumstances are vastly
(08:18):
different, but man, just thelevel of corruption that they went through here
just absolutely blatant, revising evidence,revising reports, hiding evidence, paying off
witnesses, paying off people whose testimonythey got. I mean, man,
(08:39):
it is just it's all right there. All you have to do is look
at it. So yeah, Ihad someone reach out to me on Twitter
and present this to me and justsay, hey, you know, I
know you're looking for people to talkto. I saw your Twitter paye you
(09:00):
know, maybe you can help Dwayne. And I was like, I'm happy
to at least listen. What areyou guys? And so of course,
I listened a little bit and theytold me about how the evidence was fabricated,
and okay, that's great. I'dlove to see it. Absolutely.
So he sent me a letter,a physical, handwritten letter, and just
introduced himself and said, hey,I'm going to be sending some information in
(09:24):
your way. I know you talkedto you, talked to my friend.
Thank you very much. You know, I hope you can get this because
man, this information is crazy.It's going to blow your mind. And
I said, yeah, it's sendit my way. I'd love to hear
about it. Fantastic, I'll takea look. I don't know what I
can do to you know, Ijust have a show. I'll be happy
to talk about it. I'd loveto do that. I'll have as many
(09:46):
people on as you want to discussit. You know. Outside of that,
I want to make sure that i'msending expectations. I can't really give
advice. I'm not an attorney.I'm not really going to be able to
blow the lid off of anything otherthan just start talking about it and get
somebody to listen. And he wasperfectly fine with that. He loved it,
and he said, hey, Igot some information coming your way.
(10:09):
Just be ready for it's going toblow your mind. I kept hearing that
it's going to blow your mind.So finally arrived this last weekend and I
sat down and started reading it.And that introduction that I gave is the
first paragraph of this. There's anexecutive summary that mister Butler has done the
individual from clemency Investigations, where hejust a couple quick pages, he just
(10:33):
summarizes the problems that they have withthe state's case and the reasons that they
feel that this should be overturned.And so I'm gonna I'm gonna talk a
little bit about it and go throughsome of the evidence that they have,
some of the evidence that they withheldthe witness quote unquote witness. I mean,
(10:58):
just one thing after another. It'sphenomenal. I sat down and read
it and I was like, holycrap, he's right. This is absolutely
blowing my mind. I can't believethat this stuff just so blatant. As
many times as I see it,I don't know why. It always surprises
me, but man, you runacross cases like this and you just go,
(11:18):
holy crap, look what they're doing. It gets right, How did
they get away with this? Itjust blows my mind. So back in
two and twelve, there were tworesidents that died in a house fire.
This was a house that mister Williamswas staying in. Now, and forgive
(11:41):
me because I do not know allof the specifics yet again, I'm still
going through this and trying to getas much detail as I can, and
I will bring someone on who hasmore information than me. But the individuals
that died in the house fire,and he'd been living there for a while
(12:01):
and was in a relationship. Sofive people in the home. Long story
short, the house catches fire unfortunatelypass away as a result of that fire.
Then, when the investigation first happened. When it first happened, no
(12:22):
one was charged in connection with thefire. The investigation basically couldn't go anywhere.
They couldn't find anything. The medicalexaminer even listed the cause of death
as accidental. There was nothing sayingthat anyone had purposely set this fire.
(12:48):
And then eventually a couple of thingshappened. So first a witness quote unquote,
came forward. This witness states thathe heard Dwayne say that he was
(13:13):
going to do this. An individualnamed Gary Jennings came forward and said,
Hey, I've got some information Igot to talk to you about on this,
and he told the police that misterWilliams Dwayne disclosed to him that he
was responsible for setting that five.So, following the interview with the police
(13:39):
that mister Jennings gave, that startedthe arrest warrant for mister Williams and they
went after it. And then suddenlyevidence from the arson report magically just disappeared,
(14:03):
and other information magically appeared. Thearson report that was initially used was
altered. It was altered multiple times, and the most important thing that was
altered on this was the fact thatfrom all accounts, it looked like it
(14:28):
looked like most likely had been smokingand probably passed out, fell asleep.
They found a cigarette ashtray, andthey found a Zippo lighter on the scene
after the fire. Well after thisindividual comes forth and says that he heard
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Dwayne say that. After mister Jenningscomes forth and says that he heard Dwayne
say, yep, I did that. That was me. I did it.
Magically, the Zippo lighter disappears fromthe arson report, completely disappears from
it. Any evidence showing that itwas accidental just completely disappears, and you
(15:22):
know what, just to be fairto everybody, I've been trying to make
sure that i keep all of thesedetails clear and make sure that I'm being
as specific as I can. Matter. In fact, I've got the packet
of information in front of me.I'm going through it and reading it as
I'm looking at this, so,you know it, just to be absolutely
fair to everybody involved here, let'seven call out the name of the individual
(15:46):
that investigated this. The arson investigatorwas named then Lieutenant Patrick McNulty. In
his initial report, he noted thepresence of a Zippo lighter inside the area
of origin and the fire and therewere two photographs taken of this lighter laying
(16:07):
on the floor inside the fire seatmagically disappears from the arson report. Not
only that prosecution didn't even disclose theexistence of the Zippo lighter to the defense.
Attorney for Dwayne McNulty provided no explanationfor concealing it, no explanation for
(16:37):
anything. He made no mention ofit a trial, nothing in his testimony.
Nothing. They just completely hid itand pretended like it never even existed.
Now, the Michigan Public Defenders ofPellet staff employed the services of another
(16:59):
gentleman named Fennel, who's a certifiedfire investigator with the International Association of Arson
Investigators, and he came out andchecked in everything. He checked the multiple
arson reports, he checked the photographs, he went through the trial testimony,
and basically he concluded that McNulty's reportwas an error. When he stated that
(17:21):
there were no smoking materials in thedebris of the fire, he noted,
hey, hold up, there's aZippo lighter. I don't know if you
know as or not, but lightersare smoking material. So he had outside
corroboration coming in and looking at thisinformation and going, well, now,
(17:44):
hold on a second, dude,you lied about that. But you know
what this is what This report thatI'm reading from was done March seventh,
twenty twenty three, so I mean, hot off the presses. This is
maybe not even two months old yetsix seven weeks as of right now today
(18:06):
it's April twenty five, twenty twentythree. So this gentleman, Dwayne has
been inside serving a life sentence forthe last ten years, and this information
is now starting to come to lightwhere people are actually looking at it and
taking it seriously. So he's beeninside having to sit there and think that.
(18:30):
I mean, I've been there.He's probably thinks he's losing his mind,
and at times he's probably even beenlike, man, maybe I did
do it. I don't know that. I don't even know anymore, and
I did I forget it? Didthe light or even exist? Maybe I'm
just hallucinating that I don't even know. His defense attorney didn't even have all
(18:52):
this information because they just withheld itfrom him. They withheld that, altered,
altered the forward, They went back, took the original report, altered
it, and then altered it againto make it completely look like it was
possible that Dwyane purposely did this.Now, going back to mister Jennings,
(19:18):
the individual who came forth and said, yep, Dwyane told me he did
that. Yep, yep, yep. This is a funny thing. So
when he came forward, when hetestified at trial, he said there were
no promises or threats made to himto solicit his testimony. Basically, they
(19:40):
were just saying, oh, I'mjust coming forward because this is the right
thing to do. Nobody's paying meto come forward and say this. Nobody
threatened me. Nobody's coercing me inany way. Sorry about that. Here's
the funny thing. Let me letme read this to you real quick.
This is a note from the policefile, and it's regarding quote Arson Control
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unquote request number zero zero one zerodash one three, Investigation number one three
dash two four seven eight. AndI'm going to read this verbatim, so
I don't misinterpret anything. This isnot my opinion. Let's just read this,
dear investigator Olsen. The Michigan ArsonPrevention Committee Arson Control Subcommittee met on
November twelfth, twenty thirteen, andapproved a reward payment in the amount of
(20:34):
blanked out for mister Gary von Jennings, the second of Detroit, Michigan,
for information he supplied your department inthe stated Arson case. We are enclosing
a check made out to mister Jenningsand ask that you deliver it in a
manner you deem appropriate. So thisguy comes forward magically with this testimony.
(21:00):
Just happens to hear the guys say, yep, I did it testifies on
the stand. Nope, nobody's payingme to do this. Nope, I'm
not being coerced, Nope, nope, nope, nothing like that. And
then a few months after Dwayne issentenced to life in prison, they cut
(21:21):
him a check to pay him.I mean again, folks, this is
just it. It's so blatant,like how how can nobody come back on
this and go, now, holdon a second, you testified to that
what is this check? Then?Where does that come from? And another
(21:44):
part of mister Jennings testimony, hestated that there was a third member that
also understood or heard Dwayne say thathe did this, a mister Deshaun s
Brooks. When the police went andtalked to Deshaun Seabrooks, he said,
I don't know what that dude's talkingabout. Man, I have no clue
(22:06):
what he's talking about. I've neverheard that. I never heard Dwayne say
that he's making that up. Idon't know a thing about it. Guess
what happened to that testimony? Nothing? Not a damn thing. They withheld
it from the defense. No mention, no mention in court during that trial
(22:26):
that that dude was interviewed and counterdictedthe testimony that mister Jennings who was magically
paid for his testimony after stating hewasn't paid for his testimony. I mean
and not only a few pages in. I haven't even started going through this
(22:48):
yet. This is why I needsomeone to come on and help me talk
about this, because this is justabsolutely mind blowing ridiculous, how blatant this
corruption is. It's just right therefor the world to see. But we're
going to pick this up after wecome back. We are just about at
(23:10):
the bottom of the hour, sowe're going to be taking a break.
Stick with us. If you're listeningon Fringe dot FM, we will be
right back with you if you wouldlike to discuss the case, ask some
questions, or again tell us somestories of your own. The phone lines
are open one eight hundred and fiveeight eight zero three three five eight hundred
five eight eight zero three three tofive. So we left off talking about
(23:33):
this independent review of mister Dwayne William'scase. We talked about the Arson Report
being written and then rewritten and thenrewritten again, evidence from it being withheld
and removed and change. We've talkedabout a supposed witness quote unquote that came
(23:55):
forward and testified that he was notpaid for his testimony and then promptly was
paid right afterwards with a check,which leaves documentation trail. I mean,
ladies and gentlemen, these are notgeniuses by any stretch of the imagination.
All it really takes is just tostart looking at these cases. I've talked
(24:21):
about this before before we get backinto Duane's case here, I just I
really want to stress this again.First of all, stop listening to the
news the mainstream media. Stop listeningto your nightly news, stop reading their
websites, stop reading the newspapers.I mean, just stop local talk radio.
(24:42):
I love talk radio, Like Igrew up listening to talk radio.
That's part of why I'm even doingthis. I mean, here I am
doing a talk radio but I'm talkingmore about like the local talk radio that
just tose the local politicians line.Just don't listen to them because they are
giving you the version of the truththat they want you to hear. I
(25:04):
guarantee you. In twenty twelve,when this case was being talked about,
nobody questioned anything that was coming outfrom the prosecution side. Nobody questioned anything
of it. And as they wouldtalk about it, they would say,
oh, you look at that,there's no evidence to say it was an
accidental fire. Obviously he had tohave done it. Do you think those
people are coming forward now and eatingcrow and saying, oh damn, I
(25:27):
didn't know all that. Man,I'm really sorry. I was absolutely wrong.
No, they're not. You knowwhat they're doing. They're moving on
to the next case, and they'rethrowing the next guy under the bus,
and nobody is stopping and actually lookingand asking questions and digging in and saying,
well, hold up, why doyou say that. Let me see
(25:48):
that evidence, let me see thatcourt testimony, let me see what's going
on here. It's not hard tofind at all. As I stated before,
the individuals that passed away in thehome fire in two and twelve,
(26:10):
I'm flipping hold on mister Bobby Crossand mister Darryl Sims now Darrell. Keeping
mind, Darryll again was the gentlemanthat was dating Dwayne's mother. So some
of the undisclosed evidence that was justnot given to his defense attorney. There
(26:33):
were first responder calls for service tothat address in the past. And basically
what these show is that mister DarrylSims. It talks about his medical and
physical condition prior to the fire,and it also talks about the fact that
he was an acknowledged smoker, andthe last time that anybody saw him on
(26:56):
that night of the fire, hewas on the couch, which is the
origin of the fire according to thereports. So in an attachment that's done,
it kind of goes point by pointand takes apart pieces of the evidence
(27:22):
that it's taking issue with. NowI'm going to cover a little bit about
that. A lot of this reallytalks about the City of Detroit fire investigator's
testimony, and I like looking throughthis. I'm not going to go through
all of it because it's a lot. I mean, it is absolutely a
(27:45):
lot, and I haven't even beenable to get through all of it yet,
But just a couple of these points. So the fire was caused by
the application of an open flame toavailable combustibles. The fire investigator was able
to eliminate all potential causes electrical,accidental, mechanical act of God, apart
(28:07):
from the open flame theory, claimsthere was no evidence to support the causation
of the fire. A couple ofthings about that again, First of mine,
keep in mind there was an ashtrayand as if a lighter that magically
disappeared and was removed after the reportwas altered. A couple of times.
Secondly, now, and I didn'teven know this because I don't know the
(28:32):
first thing about fire investigation or arsonreports, not my chosen field, so
I know not a damned thing.I can only rely on. I can
only rely on other people who dohave more knowledge about this to tell me
how it is. So when ittalks about like electrical fields, and arson
investigator will typically bring somebody in thatspecializes in looking at the electrical cause the
(29:00):
arson investigator doesn't do that himself.He brings somebody in and says, hey,
I need you to check and seecan anything be ruled out here?
Well, that was not done inthis case. So for him to just
flat out say he ruled out allthose cases, including electrical, well he
ruled it out because he just didn'twant to consider it. It's called a
(29:21):
confirmation bias. He made up hismind when he went into there and he
said, that's it. Dwayne's guilty, man. We're going to figure out
a way to make him look guilty. No, there's no way that it
can be anything outside. It hasto be this because that's the only way
that Dwayne can be guilty. Won'tlook at any other evidence outside of that
(29:47):
the area of fire origin was inthe southwest corner of the living room,
in the area of a couch thatwas near the front window. Okay,
However, vent elation can cause falsepositive fire analysis, and there was outside
(30:07):
analysis that even confirmed. Well,you know what if it is like an
accelerant, if it is something likea lighter or a lighter fluid or something
like that, that just gets burnedup in the fire, so you won't
find evidence of that after the fact. So the fact that there's no evidence
of an accelerant doesn't mean that onewasn't used or that one wasn't a contributing
(30:29):
factor to this fire. It justmeans that it could have burned up in
the fire. The initial cause ofthe fire was classified as undetermined. They
testified that the point of fire originis always low burning, which is false.
(30:53):
That's just not accurate. According toother testimony from other arson investigator.
It sifted through evidence in the areaof fire origin, did not find smoking
materials or electrical conductors. Again,we know that's a lie. We know
that's just flat out wrong because theydid find it and then went back altered
(31:18):
history and hid all of that information. In June of twenty and twenty two.
They even did a polygraph on DwyaneAnd I've never read a polygaric report,
so this was actually kind of cool. I was like, oh,
(31:41):
I've never seen one of these.That's super interesting. It talks about the
questions that they asked him, hisanswers, a lot of detail about this
and how they score it, theinstrument that was used, all kinds of
but they basically the opinion was,yeah, he's not lying, he's being
(32:04):
truthful according to the polygraph report.Now, I'll be the first one to
tell you I understand that polygraph reportsare not very reliable, and there's been
times that they've been used incorrectly,I mean inadvertently, even it doesn't have
to be purposely, but there's timesthat it will come back and they'll say,
(32:28):
no, they're being they're being truthful, but they're not, and vice
versa. There's times that the polygraphwill say they're lying, but they're not.
However, when you combine that withall of the rest of this evidence,
it's just one more piece of thepuzzle that says, yeah, this
dude probably didn't do it. Andafter that, I mean, there is
(32:52):
just a list of everything that thisgentleman, mister Butler for clemency investigations,
everything that he's done, and thesteps that he's taken to go back and
follow up and dig in and getsome of this information corrected. He talked
(33:22):
to mister Seabrooks. Mister Seabrooks,if you remember from just a few minutes
ago, I know this is alot of information. Again, I'm only
keeping track of it because I've gotthe documentation in front of me. Mister
Seabrooks was the third party individual thatwhen mister Jennings came forward to the police
(33:42):
and said he heard Dwayne say thatyou know he did that that he admitted
to the fire, he said,oh yeah, mister Seabrooks heard it too.
He talked to mister Seabrooks and hewas like, nope, nope,
I don't know what you're talking about. Man even asked if he was interviewed
(34:07):
by the police about the case,and he responded, guess again, why
was that not provided that testimony showsthat he completely contradicted jennings statements. Oh
(34:30):
man, And then he just goesthrough I'm not even going to try to
get into this because this is alot like at two h six, I
did this. At two forty PM, I did this, and then from
three o'clock I did this. Buthe got a hold of the original arson
investigator, Patrick Findulty, the gentlemanthat testified, altered these reports all the
(34:53):
way down the line, and hadthe chance to ask him these questions,
and he asked him a lot ofquestions, got documentation of all of it,
and then went back and found allof the other evidence and was able.
That's where he got all of thisand was able to put this back
(35:14):
together and say, well, nowhold on, you told me this,
but the evidence says something different,and even goes so far as to bring
forward a statement of mister Mark Fennel. This was again the certified fire investigator
(35:36):
from the International Association of Arston Investigators. And during his career he states this
since his words, not mine.He's done hundreds of fire and explosion evaluations
and commercial, residential and industrial facilitiesand automobile's heavy equipment. He's participated in
pro bono criminal cases on behalf ofindigent criminal defending it's wrongfully convicted of arson
(36:00):
related crimes. Expert testimony provided.I mean, on down the line,
the guy knows what he's talking abouthe reviewed everything and found the following problems
with mcnotie's testimony and his investigation intothe cause of the fire, and then
(36:21):
he just goes down and list itall out. So we even brought in
someone from the outside who's an expertin arson investigator to investigate the original arson
investigator and say, yeah, hedid a lot of this wrong and here's
why. And this gentleman ends hiswritten statement to the court by basically saying,
(36:51):
had I been consulted by defense counsel, I would have discussed with him
the above problems with the prosecutor's evidenceand would have testified as such had I
been called as a witness. Thereis so much information in here, and
(37:15):
it's fascinating too because as I readthrough here, there's handwritten notes that are
put in here, so like,for instance, as we're going through review
of the City of Detroit fire investigatortestimony. Again, there's a lot obviously
that goes into that because the fireinvestigator's testimony is a huge part of what
got Dwayne convicted. And if youcan prove that that dude was a liar,
(37:37):
well, then if he was convictedon the lies of this gentleman then
probably should be set free. Soa lot focuses on that. Yeah,
fire was classified as quote undetermined,and there's a handwritten note right next to
it, and this is where Ifigured this one out. It was also
(37:58):
classified as an apt sent by themedical examining. The two people that died
were ruled concidental debts by the medicalexamine I don't know how much more it
(38:22):
takes. And here's the sad thing. And I'm not going to read through
here too much anymore. And they, I mean refer back to one piece
here and there, But I meanthe bottom line is there is a mountain
of evidence to show that Dwayne wasset up. Man, I mean the
(38:49):
police, the fire investigator. Idon't know who did it, but I
mean the fire investigators on the hookbecause man, he definitely went back and
fabricated and changed evidence and withheld andlied, and he's the one that was
on the stand and did it.But they just decided, you know what,
I like him for this, let'sgo ahead and let's get him.
And rather than approached this in anunbiased manner, they approached it in the
(39:15):
manner of, well, he's guilty, so let's look for all of the
evidence that shows he's guilty, andwhen they were presented with anything else that
showed he wasn't guilty. Now blinderson ignore that. I that suppress that,
change that, remove that, anythingthey could do to twist it and
(39:39):
turn it and make it look likehe was guilty. You know, it's
a rule of the universe that whateveryou try to hide in the dark will
(40:04):
eventually be brought to life. Now, I don't know if anything's going to
happen to McNulty, this buyer investigator, Probably not. Probably not. Just
(40:27):
got news today that the police ina high profile shooting down in Kentucky.
The victim's name is escaping me.I'll think of it in a random moment
when I'm least expecting it. Thehigh profile shooting. The police shot someone
who really weren't even going after justabsolutely again blatant misuse of a power of
(41:00):
authority. And guess what, hewas just given another job in a small
county in Kentucky outside that city.One of those officers. He's still there.
The thing is, when you talkabout like the police and law enforcement
and how they interact with the legalsystem, this is to them, it's
(41:25):
just like the cost of doing business. We are expendable. We just get
caught in the crossfire. Now,they were just trying to do their job
and you were in the wrong place, wrong time. Sorry about that.
I mean, that's what he's tryingto do. And he gets commendations and
(41:51):
you're told great job. I mean, when is the last time? When
is the last time that you heardof law enforcement being held accountable for shooting
someone unjustly? But George Floyd Andthat's a big question mark on that too.
(42:15):
I don't even want to get intothat one. But that's the last
high profile one that I can remember. All the rest of it is police
found not guilty in the shooting,Police cleared of rondoing in that shooting,
and this whole fabricating evidence. Imean, who's going to call him on
(42:37):
it? What are you going todo? Go to their supervisor and say,
Hey, that police officer he withheldthe evidence, or hey, he's
saying that he found that on mebut he didn't really, And he's gonna
go ask him, but did youdo that? No? I didn't do
that. All right, Well that'sgood enough for me. I mean that's
how they work. They can sitat a brotherhood and they've got to watch
(43:00):
out for each other. Now,keep in mind, they are supposed to
be servants of the public to protectand serve, and somewhere along the line
that change to and us versus them. Any time that I have to call
(43:27):
the police for any matters over here, minor issues, whatever it might be,
man, I got to just notthe pit of my stomach. And
I will say the vast majority ofpeople in law enforcement are trying to do
the best that they can. Theones that cause these issues, the ones
(43:49):
that shoot people unjustly, the onesthat abuse their authority, misuse their power,
they're the minor's not. That's noteverybody in law enforcement. The man,
I don't know who I'm going toget. It's not like I can
(44:10):
request an officer when I need totalk to him about something. You never
know who you're going to get.I remember a few years ago seeing a
video of a gentleman who his wifewas having a heart attack in the car.
Police officer pulled him over for speeding, and this gentleman is just absolutely
(44:36):
frantic driving the car. He's saying, please, sir officer, I have
to get my wife to the hospital. She's having a heart attack. Please
and this son of a bitch wouldn'teven listen. Just nope, give me
your license and registration. I haveto follow my policies. I have to
follow my protocol. And she diedbecause that officer. And get his head
(45:00):
out of his ass and listen towhat that gentleman was saying. So Dwayne,
Dwayne's case sadly not unique. It'sjust not. There's so many of
them. That's why I said,Man, this reminded me, like going
through and reading all of this,all of the testimony that just blatantly shows
(45:21):
how they lied and made stuff up, and reminded me of Tim's case.
And the sad thing is there's morecases that are out there that probably just
don't have as blatant of a caseas this one does, so nobody looks
at them. Politics plays a hugepart under this too, clemency investigations.
(45:44):
I'll bet you that dude gets hundredsof requests on a daily basis, and
he can't take all of them,so he has to very carefully select who
he goes after. Does that automaticallymean that the ninety nine people that he
didn't work with are innocent. No, not necessarily, but the fact that
(46:05):
the matter is, I guarantee youa good portion of them probably are,
but we'll never know because there's notenough people to try to help them.
So as we get near the endhere, what do we do? What
do we do with this? I'vesaid it before, I'll say it again.
Get involved, start looking at thisinformation. They're able to get away
(46:30):
with this stuff because nobody is looking. We all fall right in line and
we buy it, hook line andsinker. When the news comes out and
says, oh, mister Duane LamarWilliams was found guilty of murder and arson
today and is sentenced to life inprison, and we all go, oh,
man, why would induce aboot it? What an asshole, that son
(46:52):
of a bitch. He deserves it. I hope he rots. I hope
he rots in prison, burn inhell. But if you would just look
look past that mainstream media, lookpast the narrative that they're trying to spin,
and actually dig into the information andlook at the case. Should even
(47:17):
talk to the guy. I've talkedto him. I've talked to him a
handful of times already. I've emailedwith him. He's handwritten me a couple
of letters. I've talked to hisfriend or his fiance. It's not that
hard, and she man, sheis desperate to get somebody to listen.
(47:38):
You know what, if we areat the point where we start to turn
a blind eye when people are screamingfor our attention, what have we become.
I hope you have found value intoday's show and definitely stay tuned.
(48:02):
I will be bringing mister Butler fromClemency Investigations on to talk about this in
much more clarity and detail than Iwas able to as soon as he is
able. If you have any questions, comments ideas for a show, If
you have a story that needs tobe told, don't forget to reach out
through Surviving the System dot org,Facebook dot com, slash Surviving the System
(48:24):
for on Twitter, at SPS thepodcast. Thank you again for your time.
As always, remember keep your headup, don't let him get you.
It may be easy to look atall the corruption and manipulation and the
system and feel hopeless. Here atSurviving a System, we hold to the
belief that greatness is born in themidst of extraordinary struggles. You were created
(48:45):
with a purpose, with infinite potential, and many have lost sight of that
fact. We're here to remind youof who you are. The best revenge the success
Those whose jobs it is to protectand serve seem to be demanding more and
more blind obedient. You didn't thinkit just happened by chance, did you.
It's time to call attention to thefact our government as the most prolific
slave owner on the planet. Thisis surviving the system. Thank you for
joining me today on surviving the system. This is dancing, babe. And
(00:24):
today, as I said last week, I've had a lot of people that
are reaching out to me lately totalk about their cases, their loved ones
cases, just the system in general, which is fantastic. I love it.
That's what I asked for, andI want more of it, so
keep them coming. But I justreceived over the weekend some documentation from a
(00:48):
gentleman in Michigan, and I mean, quite honestly, I it's a huge
packet of information, but I wentthrough it and man, it's it's mind
blowing. It's mind blowing. I'mgoing to talk about his case and what's
going on with his appeal. He'scurrently incarcerated for life because of the system
(01:18):
basically fighting evidence, making up evidence, suppressing information, and just all around
lying to put in there. Sowe'll talk about that. I have a
feeling. This is probably going tobe an ongoing discussion that I have as
I bring people on to talk aboutthis. But before we get going,
if you are listening live on Springedot Fm, thanks for tuning in.
(01:41):
The call lines are open at oneeight hundred five eight eight zero three three
five eight hundred five eight eight zerothree three five and don't forget to check
out the website Surviving the System dotorg. I keep an archive of all
the shows on there if you'd liketo go back and take a listen.
I also have a contact me pageon there. You can shoot me a
(02:02):
quick message. I will get backto you. If you prefer to use
social media, of course, I'mon Facebook, dot com slash Surviving the
System and on Twitter at sts thepodcast either one of those I'm not very
active posting on, but I keepthose open for you to be able to
reach out to me. I loveto hear from you, folks. I
(02:23):
love to interact. As I saidat the beginning of the show here,
so please keep it up. Shootme a message if you have an idea
for a show, if you havea story that needs to be told,
That's what I'm here for. I'dlove to hear from you still keep them
coming, and if you haven't already, please do take some time to listen
(02:44):
on podcast platforms and shows available whereveryou listen to podcasts, take some time
to like the show, rate theshow, engage with me in some form
or fashion, and most importantly,share it with your audience. You know,
I guarantee that there is someone withinyour community that needs to hear some
of these stories. It needs tohear some of these topics that we discuss.
(03:07):
And before we get going, asalways, I do want to start
with just a quick moment of gratitudeas we can get into some darker and
more difficult topics, and especially withthis one here man, you read through
this and my blood boils for thisgentleman. So we want to make sure
that we tackle these topics constructively andproductively, that we don't let them drag
(03:30):
us down and get done talking aboutit and just feel completely unhinged or just
pissed or frustrated or whatever it mightbe. Those are completely disempowering and not
how we want to tackle these.So in order to accomplish that, we
start just with a quick moment ofgratitude to make sure that we keep the
vibration high, keep that frequency high, allows us to tackle these topics and
(03:53):
come out on the other end stillfeeling productive. So with that said,
just a quick moment to say thatI am so grateful to be here with
you, allowing me to live outmy purpose to help to remind you of
who you really are and what you'retruly capable of. So, Dwayne Lamar
(04:18):
Williams out of the State of Michigan, let me just read this quick summary
for you. Here. Duyne Williamswas charged with two counts of murder and
arson in the first and, followinghis trial in September of twenty thirteen,
was convicted by a jury of twocounts of murder in the second degree and
(04:39):
arson in the first and thereafter sentencedto life imprisonment. As of this moment,
mister Williams remains at this time servingthe life sentence affixed to his case.
So I'm reading from an independent reviewof this particular case, the people
(05:00):
of the State of Michigan versus DwayneLamar Williams, and this is done by
an outside organization named Clemency Investigations Incorporated. Unfortunately, I am not able to
have this gentleman on as the caseis still ongoing right now, they've got
some decisions to make before he cancome on. They have spoken with him,
(05:24):
and I'm going to bring him onbecause I really want to get his
perspective on this. The gentleman thatdid this review of mister Williams's case has
worked in law enforcement himself. He'sbeen in law enforcement for years and didn't
realize the level of corruption that wasgoing on around him, and I mean
(05:47):
until it smacked him in the face. And that's why he has started this
nonprofit organization and is going back andtrying to fight for the people who were,
I mean, essentially the victims ofthis corruption. And it's a tall
order because man, there is somuch of it out there. The sad
(06:09):
thing is, I only have myopinion to base that on, because what
are you going to do. You'regoing to go to this system and say,
hey, can you give me somestatistical data on how many people you've
framed and set up and how manypeople that you have fabricated or withheld evidence
on. I'm just trying to getan idea of how many people that we
(06:29):
have in this system right now shouldn'tbe there. There's no way you're going
to be able to get that.So I have no hard data to back
up anything that I'm saying other thanthe fact that I'm seeing it everywhere.
And after you've been in the system, after you start getting involved in this,
you start to see it everywhere too. And it's not that we're making
(06:51):
them up. It's just you startto realize. Your eyes are opened and
you look around and you go,holy crap, there's a lot of people
that are getting screwed over by thissystem. What is going on? And
then down that rabbit hole you go. So I want to talk a little
(07:12):
bit about this just in preparation becauseviously when I first heard about this information,
I was like, oh, I'lltake a look, no problem.
I've received documentation from people before I'vetaken a look, and you know,
sometimes there's not much really I cando. I can try to provide some
guidance and just say, hey,if you maybe talk to this organization over
(07:34):
here. I've had some people reachout and just say I don't know where
to go. Where can I turnto happy to help? You know,
I'll jump on Google and we'll makesome phone calls and do some quick searching.
And get you pointed in the rightdirection. But every so often some
information will come along and I'll go, holy crap, are you kidding me?
I need to take a look atthat. You know. The last
(07:56):
time this happened was well, funnyenough, about a year ago, about
the same time and when I broughton Tim right out of Virginia and I
had to send Tim an email theday and just say, man, I
just got some information on this case. Is Dwayne Lamar Williams out of Michigan.
Man, it reminds me so muchof you. The circumstances are vastly
(08:18):
different, but man, just thelevel of corruption that they went through here
just absolutely blatant, revising evidence,revising reports, hiding evidence, paying off
witnesses, paying off people whose testimonythey got. I mean, man,
(08:39):
it is just it's all right there. All you have to do is look
at it. So yeah, Ihad someone reach out to me on Twitter
and present this to me and justsay, hey, you know, I
know you're looking for people to talkto. I saw your Twitter paye you
(09:00):
know, maybe you can help Dwayne. And I was like, I'm happy
to at least listen. What areyou guys? And so of course,
I listened a little bit and theytold me about how the evidence was fabricated,
and okay, that's great. I'dlove to see it. Absolutely.
So he sent me a letter,a physical, handwritten letter, and just
introduced himself and said, hey,I'm going to be sending some information in
(09:24):
your way. I know you talkedto you, talked to my friend.
Thank you very much. You know, I hope you can get this because
man, this information is crazy.It's going to blow your mind. And
I said, yeah, it's sendit my way. I'd love to hear
about it. Fantastic, I'll takea look. I don't know what I
can do to you know, Ijust have a show. I'll be happy
to talk about it. I'd loveto do that. I'll have as many
(09:46):
people on as you want to discussit. You know. Outside of that,
I want to make sure that i'msending expectations. I can't really give
advice. I'm not an attorney.I'm not really going to be able to
blow the lid off of anything otherthan just start talking about it and get
somebody to listen. And he wasperfectly fine with that. He loved it,
and he said, hey, Igot some information coming your way.
(10:09):
Just be ready for it's going toblow your mind. I kept hearing that
it's going to blow your mind.So finally arrived this last weekend and I
sat down and started reading it.And that introduction that I gave is the
first paragraph of this. There's anexecutive summary that mister Butler has done the
individual from clemency Investigations, where hejust a couple quick pages, he just
(10:33):
summarizes the problems that they have withthe state's case and the reasons that they
feel that this should be overturned.And so I'm gonna I'm gonna talk a
little bit about it and go throughsome of the evidence that they have,
some of the evidence that they withheldthe witness quote unquote witness. I mean,
(10:58):
just one thing after another. It'sphenomenal. I sat down and read
it and I was like, holycrap, he's right. This is absolutely
blowing my mind. I can't believethat this stuff just so blatant. As
many times as I see it,I don't know why. It always surprises
me, but man, you runacross cases like this and you just go,
(11:18):
holy crap, look what they're doing. It gets right, How did
they get away with this? Itjust blows my mind. So back in
two and twelve, there were tworesidents that died in a house fire.
This was a house that mister Williamswas staying in. Now, and forgive
(11:41):
me because I do not know allof the specifics yet again, I'm still
going through this and trying to getas much detail as I can, and
I will bring someone on who hasmore information than me. But the individuals
that died in the house fire,and he'd been living there for a while
(12:01):
and was in a relationship. Sofive people in the home. Long story
short, the house catches fire unfortunatelypass away as a result of that fire.
Then, when the investigation first happened. When it first happened, no
(12:22):
one was charged in connection with thefire. The investigation basically couldn't go anywhere.
They couldn't find anything. The medicalexaminer even listed the cause of death
as accidental. There was nothing sayingthat anyone had purposely set this fire.
(12:48):
And then eventually a couple of thingshappened. So first a witness quote unquote,
came forward. This witness states thathe heard Dwayne say that he was
(13:13):
going to do this. An individualnamed Gary Jennings came forward and said,
Hey, I've got some information Igot to talk to you about on this,
and he told the police that misterWilliams Dwayne disclosed to him that he
was responsible for setting that five.So, following the interview with the police
(13:39):
that mister Jennings gave, that startedthe arrest warrant for mister Williams and they
went after it. And then suddenlyevidence from the arson report magically just disappeared,
(14:03):
and other information magically appeared. Thearson report that was initially used was
altered. It was altered multiple times, and the most important thing that was
altered on this was the fact thatfrom all accounts, it looked like it
(14:28):
looked like most likely had been smokingand probably passed out, fell asleep.
They found a cigarette ashtray, andthey found a Zippo lighter on the scene
after the fire. Well after thisindividual comes forth and says that he heard
(14:54):
Dwayne say that. After mister Jenningscomes forth and says that he heard Dwayne
say, yep, I did that. That was me. I did it.
Magically, the Zippo lighter disappears fromthe arson report, completely disappears from
it. Any evidence showing that itwas accidental just completely disappears, and you
(15:22):
know what, just to be fairto everybody, I've been trying to make
sure that i keep all of thesedetails clear and make sure that I'm being
as specific as I can. Matter. In fact, I've got the packet
of information in front of me.I'm going through it and reading it as
I'm looking at this, so,you know it, just to be absolutely
fair to everybody involved here, let'seven call out the name of the individual
(15:46):
that investigated this. The arson investigatorwas named then Lieutenant Patrick McNulty. In
his initial report, he noted thepresence of a Zippo lighter inside the area
of origin and the fire and therewere two photographs taken of this lighter laying
(16:07):
on the floor inside the fire seatmagically disappears from the arson report. Not
only that prosecution didn't even disclose theexistence of the Zippo lighter to the defense.
Attorney for Dwayne McNulty provided no explanationfor concealing it, no explanation for
(16:37):
anything. He made no mention ofit a trial, nothing in his testimony.
Nothing. They just completely hid itand pretended like it never even existed.
Now, the Michigan Public Defenders ofPellet staff employed the services of another
(16:59):
gentleman named Fennel, who's a certifiedfire investigator with the International Association of Arson
Investigators, and he came out andchecked in everything. He checked the multiple
arson reports, he checked the photographs, he went through the trial testimony,
and basically he concluded that McNulty's reportwas an error. When he stated that
(17:21):
there were no smoking materials in thedebris of the fire, he noted,
hey, hold up, there's aZippo lighter. I don't know if you
know as or not, but lightersare smoking material. So he had outside
corroboration coming in and looking at thisinformation and going, well, now,
(17:44):
hold on a second, dude,you lied about that. But you know
what this is what This report thatI'm reading from was done March seventh,
twenty twenty three, so I mean, hot off the presses. This is
maybe not even two months old yetsix seven weeks as of right now today
(18:06):
it's April twenty five, twenty twentythree. So this gentleman, Dwayne has
been inside serving a life sentence forthe last ten years, and this information
is now starting to come to lightwhere people are actually looking at it and
taking it seriously. So he's beeninside having to sit there and think that.
(18:30):
I mean, I've been there.He's probably thinks he's losing his mind,
and at times he's probably even beenlike, man, maybe I did
do it. I don't know that. I don't even know anymore, and
I did I forget it? Didthe light or even exist? Maybe I'm
just hallucinating that I don't even know. His defense attorney didn't even have all
(18:52):
this information because they just withheld itfrom him. They withheld that, altered,
altered the forward, They went back, took the original report, altered
it, and then altered it againto make it completely look like it was
possible that Dwyane purposely did this.Now, going back to mister Jennings,
(19:18):
the individual who came forth and said, yep, Dwyane told me he did
that. Yep, yep, yep. This is a funny thing. So
when he came forward, when hetestified at trial, he said there were
no promises or threats made to himto solicit his testimony. Basically, they
(19:40):
were just saying, oh, I'mjust coming forward because this is the right
thing to do. Nobody's paying meto come forward and say this. Nobody
threatened me. Nobody's coercing me inany way. Sorry about that. Here's
the funny thing. Let me letme read this to you real quick.
This is a note from the policefile, and it's regarding quote Arson Control
(20:10):
unquote request number zero zero one zerodash one three, Investigation number one three
dash two four seven eight. AndI'm going to read this verbatim, so
I don't misinterpret anything. This isnot my opinion. Let's just read this,
dear investigator Olsen. The Michigan ArsonPrevention Committee Arson Control Subcommittee met on
November twelfth, twenty thirteen, andapproved a reward payment in the amount of
(20:34):
blanked out for mister Gary von Jennings, the second of Detroit, Michigan,
for information he supplied your department inthe stated Arson case. We are enclosing
a check made out to mister Jenningsand ask that you deliver it in a
manner you deem appropriate. So thisguy comes forward magically with this testimony.
(21:00):
Just happens to hear the guys say, yep, I did it testifies on
the stand. Nope, nobody's payingme to do this. Nope, I'm
not being coerced, Nope, nope, nope, nothing like that. And
then a few months after Dwayne issentenced to life in prison, they cut
(21:21):
him a check to pay him.I mean again, folks, this is
just it. It's so blatant,like how how can nobody come back on
this and go, now, holdon a second, you testified to that
what is this check? Then?Where does that come from? And another
(21:44):
part of mister Jennings testimony, hestated that there was a third member that
also understood or heard Dwayne say thathe did this, a mister Deshaun s
Brooks. When the police went andtalked to Deshaun Seabrooks, he said,
I don't know what that dude's talkingabout. Man, I have no clue
(22:06):
what he's talking about. I've neverheard that. I never heard Dwayne say
that he's making that up. Idon't know a thing about it. Guess
what happened to that testimony? Nothing? Not a damn thing. They withheld
it from the defense. No mention, no mention in court during that trial
(22:26):
that that dude was interviewed and counterdictedthe testimony that mister Jennings who was magically
paid for his testimony after stating hewasn't paid for his testimony. I mean
and not only a few pages in. I haven't even started going through this
(22:48):
yet. This is why I needsomeone to come on and help me talk
about this, because this is justabsolutely mind blowing ridiculous, how blatant this
corruption is. It's just right therefor the world to see. But we're
going to pick this up after wecome back. We are just about at
(23:10):
the bottom of the hour, sowe're going to be taking a break.
Stick with us. If you're listeningon Fringe dot FM, we will be
right back with you if you wouldlike to discuss the case, ask some
questions, or again tell us somestories of your own. The phone lines
are open one eight hundred and fiveeight eight zero three three five eight hundred
five eight eight zero three three tofive. So we left off talking about
(23:33):
this independent review of mister Dwayne William'scase. We talked about the Arson Report
being written and then rewritten and thenrewritten again, evidence from it being withheld
and removed and change. We've talkedabout a supposed witness quote unquote that came
(23:55):
forward and testified that he was notpaid for his testimony and then promptly was
paid right afterwards with a check,which leaves documentation trail. I mean,
ladies and gentlemen, these are notgeniuses by any stretch of the imagination.
All it really takes is just tostart looking at these cases. I've talked
(24:21):
about this before before we get backinto Duane's case here, I just I
really want to stress this again.First of all, stop listening to the
news the mainstream media. Stop listeningto your nightly news, stop reading their
websites, stop reading the newspapers.I mean, just stop local talk radio.
(24:42):
I love talk radio, Like Igrew up listening to talk radio.
That's part of why I'm even doingthis. I mean, here I am
doing a talk radio but I'm talkingmore about like the local talk radio that
just tose the local politicians line.Just don't listen to them because they are
giving you the version of the truththat they want you to hear. I
(25:04):
guarantee you. In twenty twelve,when this case was being talked about,
nobody questioned anything that was coming outfrom the prosecution side. Nobody questioned anything
of it. And as they wouldtalk about it, they would say,
oh, you look at that,there's no evidence to say it was an
accidental fire. Obviously he had tohave done it. Do you think those
people are coming forward now and eatingcrow and saying, oh damn, I
(25:27):
didn't know all that. Man,I'm really sorry. I was absolutely wrong.
No, they're not. You knowwhat they're doing. They're moving on
to the next case, and they'rethrowing the next guy under the bus,
and nobody is stopping and actually lookingand asking questions and digging in and saying,
well, hold up, why doyou say that. Let me see
(25:48):
that evidence, let me see thatcourt testimony, let me see what's going
on here. It's not hard tofind at all. As I stated before,
the individuals that passed away in thehome fire in two and twelve,
(26:10):
I'm flipping hold on mister Bobby Crossand mister Darryl Sims now Darrell. Keeping
mind, Darryll again was the gentlemanthat was dating Dwayne's mother. So some
of the undisclosed evidence that was justnot given to his defense attorney. There
(26:33):
were first responder calls for service tothat address in the past. And basically
what these show is that mister DarrylSims. It talks about his medical and
physical condition prior to the fire,and it also talks about the fact that
he was an acknowledged smoker, andthe last time that anybody saw him on
(26:56):
that night of the fire, hewas on the couch, which is the
origin of the fire according to thereports. So in an attachment that's done,
it kind of goes point by pointand takes apart pieces of the evidence
(27:22):
that it's taking issue with. NowI'm going to cover a little bit about
that. A lot of this reallytalks about the City of Detroit fire investigator's
testimony, and I like looking throughthis. I'm not going to go through
all of it because it's a lot. I mean, it is absolutely a
(27:45):
lot, and I haven't even beenable to get through all of it yet,
But just a couple of these points. So the fire was caused by
the application of an open flame toavailable combustibles. The fire investigator was able
to eliminate all potential causes electrical,accidental, mechanical act of God, apart
(28:07):
from the open flame theory, claimsthere was no evidence to support the causation
of the fire. A couple ofthings about that again, First of mine,
keep in mind there was an ashtrayand as if a lighter that magically
disappeared and was removed after the reportwas altered. A couple of times.
Secondly, now, and I didn'teven know this because I don't know the
(28:32):
first thing about fire investigation or arsonreports, not my chosen field, so
I know not a damned thing.I can only rely on. I can
only rely on other people who dohave more knowledge about this to tell me
how it is. So when ittalks about like electrical fields, and arson
investigator will typically bring somebody in thatspecializes in looking at the electrical cause the
(29:00):
arson investigator doesn't do that himself.He brings somebody in and says, hey,
I need you to check and seecan anything be ruled out here?
Well, that was not done inthis case. So for him to just
flat out say he ruled out allthose cases, including electrical, well he
ruled it out because he just didn'twant to consider it. It's called a
(29:21):
confirmation bias. He made up hismind when he went into there and he
said, that's it. Dwayne's guilty, man. We're going to figure out
a way to make him look guilty. No, there's no way that it
can be anything outside. It hasto be this because that's the only way
that Dwayne can be guilty. Won'tlook at any other evidence outside of that
(29:47):
the area of fire origin was inthe southwest corner of the living room,
in the area of a couch thatwas near the front window. Okay,
However, vent elation can cause falsepositive fire analysis, and there was outside
(30:07):
analysis that even confirmed. Well,you know what if it is like an
accelerant, if it is something likea lighter or a lighter fluid or something
like that, that just gets burnedup in the fire, so you won't
find evidence of that after the fact. So the fact that there's no evidence
of an accelerant doesn't mean that onewasn't used or that one wasn't a contributing
(30:29):
factor to this fire. It justmeans that it could have burned up in
the fire. The initial cause ofthe fire was classified as undetermined. They
testified that the point of fire originis always low burning, which is false.
(30:53):
That's just not accurate. According toother testimony from other arson investigator.
It sifted through evidence in the areaof fire origin, did not find smoking
materials or electrical conductors. Again,we know that's a lie. We know
that's just flat out wrong because theydid find it and then went back altered
(31:18):
history and hid all of that information. In June of twenty and twenty two.
They even did a polygraph on DwyaneAnd I've never read a polygaric report,
so this was actually kind of cool. I was like, oh,
(31:41):
I've never seen one of these.That's super interesting. It talks about the
questions that they asked him, hisanswers, a lot of detail about this
and how they score it, theinstrument that was used, all kinds of
but they basically the opinion was,yeah, he's not lying, he's being
(32:04):
truthful according to the polygraph report.Now, I'll be the first one to
tell you I understand that polygraph reportsare not very reliable, and there's been
times that they've been used incorrectly,I mean inadvertently, even it doesn't have
to be purposely, but there's timesthat it will come back and they'll say,
(32:28):
no, they're being they're being truthful, but they're not, and vice
versa. There's times that the polygraphwill say they're lying, but they're not.
However, when you combine that withall of the rest of this evidence,
it's just one more piece of thepuzzle that says, yeah, this
dude probably didn't do it. Andafter that, I mean, there is
(32:52):
just a list of everything that thisgentleman, mister Butler for clemency investigations,
everything that he's done, and thesteps that he's taken to go back and
follow up and dig in and getsome of this information corrected. He talked
(33:22):
to mister Seabrooks. Mister Seabrooks,if you remember from just a few minutes
ago, I know this is alot of information. Again, I'm only
keeping track of it because I've gotthe documentation in front of me. Mister
Seabrooks was the third party individual thatwhen mister Jennings came forward to the police
(33:42):
and said he heard Dwayne say thatyou know he did that that he admitted
to the fire, he said,oh yeah, mister Seabrooks heard it too.
He talked to mister Seabrooks and hewas like, nope, nope,
I don't know what you're talking about. Man even asked if he was interviewed
(34:07):
by the police about the case,and he responded, guess again, why
was that not provided that testimony showsthat he completely contradicted jennings statements. Oh
(34:30):
man, And then he just goesthrough I'm not even going to try to
get into this because this is alot like at two h six, I
did this. At two forty PM, I did this, and then from
three o'clock I did this. Buthe got a hold of the original arson
investigator, Patrick Findulty, the gentlemanthat testified, altered these reports all the
(34:53):
way down the line, and hadthe chance to ask him these questions,
and he asked him a lot ofquestions, got documentation of all of it,
and then went back and found allof the other evidence and was able.
That's where he got all of thisand was able to put this back
(35:14):
together and say, well, nowhold on, you told me this,
but the evidence says something different,and even goes so far as to bring
forward a statement of mister Mark Fennel. This was again the certified fire investigator
(35:36):
from the International Association of Arston Investigators. And during his career he states this
since his words, not mine.He's done hundreds of fire and explosion evaluations
and commercial, residential and industrial facilitiesand automobile's heavy equipment. He's participated in
pro bono criminal cases on behalf ofindigent criminal defending it's wrongfully convicted of arson
(36:00):
related crimes. Expert testimony provided.I mean, on down the line,
the guy knows what he's talking abouthe reviewed everything and found the following problems
with mcnotie's testimony and his investigation intothe cause of the fire, and then
(36:21):
he just goes down and list itall out. So we even brought in
someone from the outside who's an expertin arson investigator to investigate the original arson
investigator and say, yeah, hedid a lot of this wrong and here's
why. And this gentleman ends hiswritten statement to the court by basically saying,
(36:51):
had I been consulted by defense counsel, I would have discussed with him
the above problems with the prosecutor's evidenceand would have testified as such had I
been called as a witness. Thereis so much information in here, and
(37:15):
it's fascinating too because as I readthrough here, there's handwritten notes that are
put in here, so like,for instance, as we're going through review
of the City of Detroit fire investigatortestimony. Again, there's a lot obviously
that goes into that because the fireinvestigator's testimony is a huge part of what
got Dwayne convicted. And if youcan prove that that dude was a liar,
(37:37):
well, then if he was convictedon the lies of this gentleman then
probably should be set free. Soa lot focuses on that. Yeah,
fire was classified as quote undetermined,and there's a handwritten note right next to
it, and this is where Ifigured this one out. It was also
(37:58):
classified as an apt sent by themedical examining. The two people that died
were ruled concidental debts by the medicalexamine I don't know how much more it
(38:22):
takes. And here's the sad thing. And I'm not going to read through
here too much anymore. And they, I mean refer back to one piece
here and there, But I meanthe bottom line is there is a mountain
of evidence to show that Dwayne wasset up. Man, I mean the
(38:49):
police, the fire investigator. Idon't know who did it, but I
mean the fire investigators on the hookbecause man, he definitely went back and
fabricated and changed evidence and withheld andlied, and he's the one that was
on the stand and did it.But they just decided, you know what,
I like him for this, let'sgo ahead and let's get him.
And rather than approached this in anunbiased manner, they approached it in the
(39:15):
manner of, well, he's guilty, so let's look for all of the
evidence that shows he's guilty, andwhen they were presented with anything else that
showed he wasn't guilty. Now blinderson ignore that. I that suppress that,
change that, remove that, anythingthey could do to twist it and
(39:39):
turn it and make it look likehe was guilty. You know, it's
a rule of the universe that whateveryou try to hide in the dark will
(40:04):
eventually be brought to life. Now, I don't know if anything's going to
happen to McNulty, this buyer investigator, Probably not. Probably not. Just
(40:27):
got news today that the police ina high profile shooting down in Kentucky.
The victim's name is escaping me.I'll think of it in a random moment
when I'm least expecting it. Thehigh profile shooting. The police shot someone
who really weren't even going after justabsolutely again blatant misuse of a power of
(41:00):
authority. And guess what, hewas just given another job in a small
county in Kentucky outside that city.One of those officers. He's still there.
The thing is, when you talkabout like the police and law enforcement
and how they interact with the legalsystem, this is to them, it's
(41:25):
just like the cost of doing business. We are expendable. We just get
caught in the crossfire. Now,they were just trying to do their job
and you were in the wrong place, wrong time. Sorry about that.
I mean, that's what he's tryingto do. And he gets commendations and
(41:51):
you're told great job. I mean, when is the last time? When
is the last time that you heardof law enforcement being held accountable for shooting
someone unjustly? But George Floyd Andthat's a big question mark on that too.
(42:15):
I don't even want to get intothat one. But that's the last
high profile one that I can remember. All the rest of it is police
found not guilty in the shooting,Police cleared of rondoing in that shooting,
and this whole fabricating evidence. Imean, who's going to call him on
(42:37):
it? What are you going todo? Go to their supervisor and say,
Hey, that police officer he withheldthe evidence, or hey, he's
saying that he found that on mebut he didn't really, And he's gonna
go ask him, but did youdo that? No? I didn't do
that. All right, Well that'sgood enough for me. I mean that's
how they work. They can sitat a brotherhood and they've got to watch
(43:00):
out for each other. Now,keep in mind, they are supposed to
be servants of the public to protectand serve, and somewhere along the line
that change to and us versus them. Any time that I have to call
(43:27):
the police for any matters over here, minor issues, whatever it might be,
man, I got to just notthe pit of my stomach. And
I will say the vast majority ofpeople in law enforcement are trying to do
the best that they can. Theones that cause these issues, the ones
(43:49):
that shoot people unjustly, the onesthat abuse their authority, misuse their power,
they're the minor's not. That's noteverybody in law enforcement. The man,
I don't know who I'm going toget. It's not like I can
(44:10):
request an officer when I need totalk to him about something. You never
know who you're going to get.I remember a few years ago seeing a
video of a gentleman who his wifewas having a heart attack in the car.
Police officer pulled him over for speeding, and this gentleman is just absolutely
(44:36):
frantic driving the car. He's saying, please, sir officer, I have
to get my wife to the hospital. She's having a heart attack. Please
and this son of a bitch wouldn'teven listen. Just nope, give me
your license and registration. I haveto follow my policies. I have to
follow my protocol. And she diedbecause that officer. And get his head
(45:00):
out of his ass and listen towhat that gentleman was saying. So Dwayne,
Dwayne's case sadly not unique. It'sjust not. There's so many of
them. That's why I said,Man, this reminded me, like going
through and reading all of this,all of the testimony that just blatantly shows
(45:21):
how they lied and made stuff up, and reminded me of Tim's case.
And the sad thing is there's morecases that are out there that probably just
don't have as blatant of a caseas this one does, so nobody looks
at them. Politics plays a hugepart under this too, clemency investigations.
(45:44):
I'll bet you that dude gets hundredsof requests on a daily basis, and
he can't take all of them,so he has to very carefully select who
he goes after. Does that automaticallymean that the ninety nine people that he
didn't work with are innocent. No, not necessarily, but the fact that
(46:05):
the matter is, I guarantee youa good portion of them probably are,
but we'll never know because there's notenough people to try to help them.
So as we get near the endhere, what do we do? What
do we do with this? I'vesaid it before, I'll say it again.
Get involved, start looking at thisinformation. They're able to get away
(46:30):
with this stuff because nobody is looking. We all fall right in line and
we buy it, hook line andsinker. When the news comes out and
says, oh, mister Duane LamarWilliams was found guilty of murder and arson
today and is sentenced to life inprison, and we all go, oh,
man, why would induce aboot it? What an asshole, that son
(46:52):
of a bitch. He deserves it. I hope he rots. I hope
he rots in prison, burn inhell. But if you would just look
look past that mainstream media, lookpast the narrative that they're trying to spin,
and actually dig into the information andlook at the case. Should even
(47:17):
talk to the guy. I've talkedto him. I've talked to him a
handful of times already. I've emailedwith him. He's handwritten me a couple
of letters. I've talked to hisfriend or his fiance. It's not that
hard, and she man, sheis desperate to get somebody to listen.
(47:38):
You know what, if we areat the point where we start to turn
a blind eye when people are screamingfor our attention, what have we become.
I hope you have found value intoday's show and definitely stay tuned.
(48:02):
I will be bringing mister Butler fromClemency Investigations on to talk about this in
much more clarity and detail than Iwas able to as soon as he is
able. If you have any questions, comments ideas for a show, If
you have a story that needs tobe told, don't forget to reach out
through Surviving the System dot org,Facebook dot com, slash Surviving the System
(48:24):
for on Twitter, at SPS thepodcast. Thank you again for your time.
As always, remember keep your headup, don't let him get you.
It may be easy to look atall the corruption and manipulation and the
system and feel hopeless. Here atSurviving a System, we hold to the
belief that greatness is born in themidst of extraordinary struggles. You were created
(48:45):
with a purpose, with infinite potential, and many have lost sight of that
fact. We're here to remind youof who you are. The best revenge the success
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