How do you know creativity is the answer?

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Lisa and Lauren chat with Jenny and Stephanie, co-founders of Creative Nector Studio (https://www.creativenectarstudio.com/) about why creativity is the answer for them, why it might be the answer for you, and how you can let go of judgement and face your fear surrounding the act of making art or what making art might make you confront.

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Episode Transcript

Lisa (00:02):
Hello , welcome . This is Lisa from Artist Moving , and
Lauren on the other side. We'rehere today with Creative
Nectar, Stephanie and Jenny ,welcome so much. You guys. Tell
us a little bit about yourself.

Stephanie (00:15):
Hey , um, well, I'm Stephanie Gray and I'm in the
Kansas City, Missouri area, and, um, have been, I'm a
co-founder of Creative Nectar,a creative transformation guide
and an artist, and I'm happy tobe here.

Jenny (00:31):
And, hi everyone. I'm Jenny Hahn . I'm also in the
Kansas City area Co-founder ofCreative Nectar Studio. I'm an
artist and author, workshopfacilitator, mindfulness
teacher. And I too am thrilledto be here with you both and
with you all, all listening,.

Lauren (00:48):
Awesome. Thanks so much for being here. Um, so for our
podcast, we tend to just , um,jump off with , um, a question
that's sort of inspired by thelast conversation. And last
time Lisa and I chatted, wewere talking about the
collaboration we've had goingbetween us for 15 years. We're
in our 16th year, and we werelike, why are we still doing

(01:09):
this? And after listening tothat conversation, I wanted to
ask you guys , um, how do youknow that creativity is the
answer? And then, and just kindof like, why do we, like, for
me, it's like, why do I keepcoming back to creativity?

Stephanie (01:25):
Yeah. I mean, I, I I can go first. Um, I ,
creativity is the answer forme. We'll put it that way for
sure. Um, I, I've been doingsomething called process art.
Oh my gosh, I think it's gonnabe close to 25 ish or more
years now. And although Ididn't start out as an artist,

(01:49):
the, the, the creative sparkthat I found while doing the
process , um, long story short,has saved me, you know ? Mm-Hmm
. for manythings. So for me, I feel like
it is, it is the way for me, itis so much for me.

Jenny (02:09):
Yeah. And for me, as well as Steph and I both met
about 24 years ago, I wannasay, right, Steph , because I
started process painting in2000 , uh, with our teacher
Sarah Oblinger, who had a groupcalled Paint or Die. Oh, wow.
And I, at that time, I was justgraduating from art school. I

(02:30):
was struggling with an eatingdisorder with a lot of
self-hate , um, I, on the out ,uh, you know, outwardly I was
this, you know, young artistpracticing doing illustration.
But inwardly it was like I wasempty. There was something
broken. And when I saw theflyer for that class, something

(02:50):
in me, every cell of my bodyjust said, yes, yes, I have to
do it. And it was actually atStephanie's house, in
your basement stuff where , um,that class was happening, that
eight week class. And thatreally changed everything for
me, because facing the blankpage and not being told what to

(03:11):
paint, or not having anassignment or a desired
outcome, but just to say, juststart and see what shows up and
around the room youwould see people with,
everybody was paintingsomething different, you know,
and it, and huge pieces. Youknow, you start with a single
piece of paper, but, and temperpaints, but it would grow and

(03:32):
be just, and these magicalworlds and really powerful
images. And, and for me too, itended up after eight weeks, it
was like a nine panel allegorythat it, it , it just changed
everything. And I love thatquestion, like, why, like why
are you still doing it and whycreativity? Like, you know, why

(03:56):
is creativity the answer?
Because I don't know that it'ssomething that could be
answered intellectually. Andactually Steph and I, on our la
on , we have a podcast as well,in our last, our current
episode, it was all about thewisdom of the heart. And I
think this is a question thatcan't be answered so much with
the intellect, but definitelywith the heart wisdom and every

(04:18):
cell of the body , um, is likea yes. When, you know, when,
when you're in that flow, thatcreative flow. Mm-Hmm .
, um, yeah. It's,it's, it's an absolute yes .

Lisa (04:32):
, yes. I love this. So it's so fascinating .
I found you , I nectar cameinto my brain , and that sounds
have what it , so I use myintuition , my heart , which is
fascinating that we're talkingabout this. And I looked up,

(04:54):
create a nectar, and you guyspopped up and I was like, whoa
. There's a, there's a team,there's a group of creative
nectar people. So what I love ,I mean, that was my intuition
talking and I followed it . Andas an artist, you know , I
think we do follow our heartand our intuition. So my
question to you is tell the,the , our audience, what is

(05:16):
process art? How is it reallyrelated to the heart and the
intuition? And how can, I mean,this is a tough question, but
how can they do it like today?
How can they process, starttheir own process art ? If that
makes sense. .

Stephanie (05:32):
Yeah . .
Yeah. Yes . Well, I , uh, I'll,I'll go first and then Jenny ,
you can fill in the gaps.
'cause um, it's a big, it's anall encompassing thing. It is
process art is creating for theprocess, process , you know,
the inner process rather thanthe product. So you don't have
to have any artistic skillswhatsoever. And it's really

(05:55):
about connecting to thatauthentic space in ourselves.
And why I think it works, atleast for me, and we talked
about this in , in that podcastwe were talking about, it drops
us from the head space wherethere's all that chatter and
the self doubt and all of thatmore into the heart space. And

(06:16):
then when that happens, thenthis wisdom can flow when we
allow it, it's really apractice, you know? And it,
once that flow begins and yougo into that creative flow, I ,
there's just so much wisdomthere. There's so much wisdom
there. And so, I mean, nobodytells you how to do it. Um, you

(06:39):
can use basic , um, artmaterials. Um, it's, there is
facilitation generally. Like ,um, in the bigger workshops,
there will be a facilitatorlike Jenny or myself , um, or
Sarah or Stuart Cley . Um , andI mean, it , it's just
presence, right? It is justpresence in the paper and color

(07:02):
and breathing. And then theother question, which is, how
can you do it? How can you doit right now? I mean, we've got
lots of tools and stuff onNectar's website. Um, we have a
community, there's workshops.
Um, it's, it's fairly easy. Andyet to get started with it.

(07:24):
It's, I I needed help. We'lljust put it that way. Mm-Hmm .
.

Jenny (07:31):
Yeah. And I'll just add that , um, you know, I, I've
listened to, to the, your show,this podcast before, and I, you
know, I feel like process artcan also , um, encompass just
art making in general, any artmaking that is not focused on
creating an end result, youknow? So yes, there is the

(07:53):
formal like process art, likeyou can find workshops and
like, what, what Steph and Ioffer and what she was just
describing. Um, but also justengaging with the , your own
creative spark for the sake ofself connection, for the sake
of exploration in whatever way,whatever, with whatever

(08:14):
materials could be consideredprocess art. Right. Um, it's
really , um, a healing, Iconsider it, we consider it a
healing tool , uh, forreconnection to reconnection to
oneself, one's heart, but alsoreconnection to the world, to
our experience. It is a form ofmeditation, like a moving

(08:37):
meditation. And , um, itdoesn't necessarily have to, it
can be very simple. Like oneprompt that Steph often gives
and that we give together aswe're starting a workshop is ,
uh, doing a scribble practice.
You know, like tuning into thebody, seeing what part of the
body has the most energy in themoment, and then handing,

(08:57):
symbolically, handing the, thepen or the paintbrush or
whatever to that, you know,part of the body to just start
moving. You know, anything thatcan get us out of the critical
mind and the, the monkey mind,the comparison mind and into
the body and start , um, thatcan start us into the process

(09:19):
where it's not something thatwe control mentally , um, but
really surrender to that flow.
And that's where the magicstarts to happen, is when we
follow the thread of that andsee where it leads. And it's
always, I mean, it's alwaysbeyond our control and beyond
our imagining. You know, we cannever know where we're going to

(09:41):
end up. And that's the beautyof it.

Lauren (09:44):
Yeah. So, I'm, I was, I was going to ask the why. And I
feel like you just answered it.
Like, I was gonna ask, like,why does , um, process art sort
of get you to a place that thatother places may not get you
to? And it sounds like for yourexperience, it's that it, it

(10:06):
almost helps you take a, take abreak from your, from your mind
on almost tap into a differentpart of your mind, right? It's
almost like you are , you'resaying, okay , um, mind that
organizes things and judgesthings and categorizes things.
You can take a break now, I'mgonna go to another space and

(10:30):
I'm gonna dig around there fora bit, and I'm gonna let go of
those kinds of things. Andthat, like, why does, why does
scribbling do that? Is itbecause it, is it because it's
not representational? Is itbecause is it the mental
practice of like, okay, I'mgonna do this now and I'm

(10:52):
gonna, right. Because I'm, I'mtrying to talk , like, I'm
trying to figure out, 'causethere is a lot of fear around
even this notion. There's gonnabe a lot of people that are
like, I'm not gonna do that. Um, yeah . You know, how do you,
how do you talk people throughthat, when you explain all
this, which to the four of usis like, yeah, for sure

(11:15):
, because I've done it since Iwas like 14. You know, I'm in
my forties. And so for me it'slike, well, yeah, sure, it's
the answer. Um, how do you talkto someone who is still like,
number one, that's not gonna doanything for me? Or number two,
that opens up really scarystuff for me. Mm-Hmm . Or I'm
thinking that might , right.
They're still up here saying, I, I'm thinking that might open

(11:37):
up a lot of scary stuff, and Ican guarantee them it will.
That's what art does. Right.
Um, how do you, how do youguide someone through that part
of it? Like, you know what Imean?

Stephanie (11:51):
Yeah. Well, first, firstly, the , um, the
scribbling is a way to sort ofbypass what we're talking about
and getting into the body. Andthen inevitably as we scribble,
things will start to come up,you know, an image, a word or
two. Um, and then just, it's,it's really a mindfulness

(12:13):
practice too. So really justgoing one step at a time and
taking it very, verydelicately. You know, just,
just being present as much aspossible. And that's, you know,
and that's what Jenny and I dotoo. We create a safe space for
that to happen. Um, and ifpeople have questions or they
feel stuck or they're scared orwhatever, we would encourage

(12:35):
them to paint, paint the fear.
What color is it? You know, howdoes it wanna move? Does it
have a caricature? You know, orsame with your inner critic or
anything. And what I've found,'cause I, I mean, I encountered
some pretty gnarly stuff, and Istill do sometimes. And I, what
I've found is like I, my intermy inner self doesn't ever give

(12:59):
me more than I can handleMm-Hmm . And ultimately, it's
always scarier on the otherside that the brain, like
making it into something. Butwhen I actually just sort of
hang out with it, confront it,ask it questions , um, get
creative with it, it becomessomething entirely different.

(13:19):
And I'm able to look at it ,um, encompass it more and into
me have conversations. It'sreally, it's, it's really
amazing. Mm-Hmm , .

Jenny (13:30):
Yeah. And what you're describing, Steph, I , uh, I
think of that as almost turningthat fear into more of a sense
of play and curiosity about it.
And when we do that, like yousaid, Steph, I mean, it , it's
almost like it transforms it.
The monsters that we're holdinginside of us are trying to
stuff down. Suddenly theybecome these big puffy

(13:52):
characters or something, youknow, like there , it's, it's
almost, it , it can be fun andalmost silly, and it's like
shifting the energy of it and,and really getting it, like you
were saying, getting it out infront of us will shift. Because
when we're no longer inresistance, it's like those big

(14:13):
scary things are suddenlysomething to play with,
something to explore. And , andI love that you said that stuff
about that, you know, we neverget more than we can handle,
you know, when we're creating,there's also a sense of, of
agency, there's a sense of of,of being able to choose, being
able to say yes or no. And ifsomething feels too big, you

(14:35):
know, you don't have to gothere. Or you can seek help in
other ways. You know, it's,it's not like I , I mean, I
often say if somebody , uh, youknow, is going through
something really heavy or big,you know, yes, you can make art
around it, but also like , uh,you know, talk to your
therapist. I mean, like, there, there's, you know, it's , um,

(14:56):
so, so there's, I think there'salso that, that agency around
being able to , um, allow in ornot, and having the freedom and
, uh, empowerment to do that.
But, but certainly art making ,um, yeah, it is a , a space, a
safe space. I mean, hopefullyit's a safe space. We, that's

(15:18):
what we seek to create. Themind isn't always a safe space,
but that's why doing this incommunity can be so helpful,
because then we have a shared,agreed upon safe container
where we're all saying, yes,we're holding space for one
another. We're not going tospeak out loud judgments or
praise, you know, we're gonnakeep it a neutral space. And,

(15:38):
and just really holdingwhatever is coming up. And
that's where havingfacilitators or teachers or
guides, you know, can be reallyhelpful is just to, you know,
we, when we lead, we don't havethe answers for the individual.
We serve as sort of a mirror ,um, to reflect back whatever is
showing up, and just to holdspace, just to be present with.

(16:01):
And yeah, there's an alchemythat, that can happen when we
show up to our fears in thisway. And I really do want to
acknowledge the , the feararound it, because especially
for somebody who's not beencreative or, or, or was told
when they were in first grade,you know, oh, you really
shouldn't do this. I mean,there's some trauma, there's
some trauma around it. And so,you know, it is, we really do

(16:25):
acknowledge that the couragethat it can take, even just to
pick up a freaking paintbrushand make marks on paper. And
so, so not to downplay it inany way, but to say that, yes,
this is possible, and there issupport with it. And once you
get into get to the other sideof that fear, it's like, oh ,

(16:47):
feels so good . The bliss ofit. Oh my gosh, why have I
been, what , why have I beensaying no to this my whole
life, .

Lisa (16:53):
But I , but I love , I love, I mean, I, yes, I know
the fear factor, and I knowwe've seen the fear come out
with people and art here , butwhat I'm, what I'm kind of
tapping into is, wow, the powerthat art reflects within us. Do
you know what I mean? Like, howpowerful you are that you can
do. I mean, this is just whatI'm hearing. I'm like, it's

(17:15):
like it's, it's reflecting. Andsome people are so afraid of
their power, you know, it'salmost like that mirror is
like, oh my God, it's not amonster. It's me. I'm this
warrior or whatever goddess.
And I'm so powerful. And peopleare afraid of that. I mean, so
I don't know why I brought thatup, but like , maybe let's talk
about like, why are people soafraid of their true power?

(17:40):
Because that's what you'retalking about through process
art . You , you pull back theonion, you pull back the bales
, and you , there you are . Andwho are you ? And I mean, what
I'm hearing is you're apowerful being . Anyways .
Let's ride with that . .

Jenny (17:55):
Yes, yes. Steffi , were you gonna say something?
,

Stephanie (17:59):
This is what lights me up the most. I think , um,
uh, maybe not. Initially I hadno idea what I was going into,
you know , um, initially, butthrough the years, the
transformation that I've seenin myself and others, there is
that power. And we speak to ita lot , um, on our website and
Jenny's book and all of that,like this, it is, I feel like

(18:23):
it's necessary for this time,you know? And I think, I feel
like, at least for me, I wasconditioned out of my power
early on, you know, by parents,teachers , um, just authority
figures in general, you know,fill in the blank, like,
whatever. Um, and I don't needto know the reason why. I mean

(18:46):
, it wasn't necessarily done onpurpose, but there was a, like,
it was trained out of me. Andso, like, this is the art of
reclaiming that power, thatself, and who , I mean, I'm
getting goosebumps just talkingabout it. I feel , I, we feel
it is very necessary right now.

Jenny (19:06):
Absolutely. We're, we're all unique individual beings
that have something importantto, to share just through our
very being, not through, notthrough being doing machines,
but through being andconnecting with one another .
And we talk a lot about, and I, and I also talk about it in

(19:26):
the book Creative Flow, butthat, that we are all receiving
this. We , we all have accessto this , uh, inherent
universal life force energythat is moving through us,
that's animating it through us,that's expressing through us
every day. And it's ouruniqueness. It's our own

(19:49):
personalities, our ownhistories, our own
perspectives, all of that, thatcolor and flavor and give,
like, form to, and, and, andgive beauty to that energy, to
that inherent spark. And soit's like, so the more we step

(20:10):
into our uniqueness, the morewe claim our power, as you said
Lisa, you know, it's like, itis, it is. I , I mean, I can't
even find words for it rightnow, , you know, like
if you can imagine a worldwhere everybody has claimed
that for themselves, and notonly that, but they are
allowing it and expressing itand following their intuition

(20:33):
and seeing where it's neededand, and what connections they
wish to make and what they wishto create. I mean, you can
imagine what the world could belike when we all break free ,
break free from ourconditioning and our, our fears
, um, our own internal prisons,you know, and just really step
into that vibrance and, andbloom into whatever it is we're

(20:55):
here to do in the world. Imean, that's, that's

Lauren (20:58):
The

Jenny (20:59):
Power of creativity right there, .

Lauren (21:00):
Yeah. I know. I'm imagining, like right now in my
head, like a community increative flow with one another.
Um, I mean, there's like some,it's like a strange musical in
my head right now of like flowand dancing and singing , uh,
just because that's just how mybrain works. Um, but I heard ,
uh, Stephanie say it , uh, yousaid the words, it's so

(21:23):
important right now, and I wantyou to , uh, speak to that a
little bit more. Um, give me alittle bit more details , um,
from your perspective.

Stephanie (21:32):
From my perspective.
Okay. So I, I believe, and I,and I think Nectar Jenny does
as well, but for me, Ipersonally believe that we're
sort of on the cusp, like thevery beginning stages of a
transformation, a globaltransformation. And , um, uh,
humanity is shifting. And youcan feel it, you can see little

(21:54):
dots here and there of itlittle, you know, little clues.
And I feel it, I feel it insideof me . And I, I, I believe
that we're being asked to shiftmore from the heart and move
more from the heart space. Andthat involves creativity in all
of its forms, not just paintingor, you know, art making . Um,
because that creator beingthat's inside of us can move

(22:19):
mountains, right. And whenwe're doing it together in our
own unique form, blank Jittingwas saying, I mean, I, I just
feel like that's what is beingasked of, of as many people
that can do it as possibleright now.

Jenny (22:35):
Yeah. And I'll just add that, you know, we are also on
this cusp of , um, you know,we've got the, the, the
development of AI and , uh,technologies to do more of our
thinking for us and more ofour, you know, these more sort
of analytical tasks for us. Andit's like, if you, if you fast
forward into the future, it'slike, imagine, you know, when

(22:57):
we have , uh, when we havelike, yeah, what will the world
look like when we have, imaginehaving spaciousness to, to ,
um, create your reality, toco-create our world, to
co-create a world that isactually working and
sustainable for everyone. Likethat , that's . I,

(23:20):
again, it's, it's hard to putinto words, but it just seems
like, I, I hear people say thislike, the future is creative.
Mm-Hmm .

Lauren (23:27):


Jenny (23:28):
The future is creative.
And I believe that ,

Lisa (23:31):
Um, this is amazing. So, my question to you guys,
because Lauren was talkingabout a symphony and it seems
like is kind a , you know , amusical , you know , what is
the , um, what does that feellike, the buzz in a room full
of people doing process art andjust kind of like, you know, to

(23:53):
give people a taste of thatnectar . What is , what's the ,
and and what's the why for youguys ?

Jenny (24:01):
Oh , , do you wanna go first, ? Sure.
I'll try to describe, I'll tryto put it into words. Um, gosh,
what a great question, Lisa.


Lisa (24:14):
,

Jenny (24:16):
Because there is, there is a visceral shift Mm-Hmm .
in the room, andyou can feel it when people
have dropped into that space.
And I, I can only describe itas this, there's a presence,

(24:36):
but it's a , it's a, it's acalm, it's a grounded presence,
but it is so interconnected,and all I can say is flow. I
mean, I don't, but it's likewhen you feel that for
yourself, but then it's likeamplified by every person
around you. There's, yeah, I'msure there's something

(24:58):
scientific going on there, butreally I'm just, I'm speaking
to the magic of it that , um,there's some kind of coherence
that happens in a group that ismagnified. Like I can feel that
when I'm in my own studiopainting when I get into that
flow. But it is magnified whenit's in a room. Steph , do you

(25:22):


Stephanie (25:22):
It ? Well, it definitely , I wanna

Jenny (25:24):
Add to that .

Stephanie (25:25):
Well, and I, I do wonder , I would love, like
HeartMath to come to one of ourworkshops and like actually do
all the science behind it andfigure it out, because there is
something that happens. It'slike an empowered heart space
that is, that you can feel, andit feels so grounded and good

(25:45):
and, and, and authentic. Ithink that's the biggest thing.
It's like getting to knowpeople authentically is the
best thing ever. Ands. It'slike what I crave. And that is
what community, that's thecommunity that's created,
whether it's in person or we'refinding even online in our
community. It , it , there'sno, there's no real reason it

(26:10):
should happen, like,technically, but it does
. Like there's stillthat feeling and that, that,
yeah, it's try it out. I mean,that's like, the only way I can
describe it is like, just comeplay with us for a while . I
don't know. It's, yeah.

Lauren (26:26):
Yeah. We , um, so like , uh, and I'm sure you can
relate to this, it's a , it'sa, it's a, it's a mountain to
climb sometimes to get peopleto involved in community art.
You do, you, you hit lots ofhurdles along the way. Um,
that's one of the reasons Lisaand I are constantly asking
ourselves, why are we stilldoing this

Jenny (26:45):
? It's a valid question. Yeah . It's, it's

Lauren (26:49):
Because you, you encounter a lot of nos and a
lot of like, et cetera, etcetera. But then we, we do our
annual event called our BreakDay on the first part of every
September. We've done thatsince 2011. And exactly what
you were describing, the thingthere is no word for, and the
thing that happens in like fiveminutes of two strangers

(27:12):
sitting down together to makeart. Um, and it is something
you cannot explain. It issomething that someone has to
see, but I also think you, andthis is the hard part, you have
to be open to see it. Um, youknow, but, but every single
year I am exhausted by the timeour break day happens, and

(27:33):
every day after our break day ,I'm like, I can't wait to do it
again. And it's a strangecycle. Yes . Um, but it's that
knowing, right? Because , uh,it's that knowing that it ,
that it has to happen. It'salmost like I have to do it no
matter what, you know? Uh ,because of that, even those two
people that, like this year inSeptember, I had four people

(27:56):
sitting at a table for threehours, and none of them knew
each other, and they had thedeepest conversation, ,
right. Of truly knowingsomeone, and they'll probably
never talk to each other again.
But that's magic, right? That'sthe reminder that we all , we
all are literally connected.
It's not just a, it's not afigurative thing. We are

(28:19):
literally connected, you know?
Yeah ,

Jenny (28:22):
Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
That's, that's beautiful. That, yes. And I'm laughing because
we can so relate to that. Imean, we have times where we're
like, you know, corrallingpeople, you know, kind of,
hello, is there anybody outthere? ? But then, but
then it's like, when, but thenwhen it happens, and when you
have that room full of peopleand then you, and then it's

(28:42):
like, oh, yeah. I mean, yeah.
You described it sobeautifully, Lauren, like that
every time. I mean, there's noquestion as to whether or not
we wanna do this. I mean, it'slike we can't not do it. Yeah .
I guess I'll speak for myselfhere. I mean, I'm speaking for
you too, Steph . Oh ,it's true. For me, it's, it's ,
there's like not a, yeah. It ,it's something with, as with

(29:04):
anything creative, it's like,you know, because you can't not
do it.

Lauren (29:09):
Yeah. It's the can't not , right. There's the
distinction between that and,and Yeah. It's just like, it's,
yeah. What , it's not that youhave to do it, it's, you can't
not do it. Exactly.

Jenny (29:22):
But

Lauren (29:22):
What, what is that?
Like, I don't have the,obviously I'm asking a lot of
questions. I do not have theanswer .

Jenny (29:30):
Yeah. I mean, I define it as kind of like, you could
see it as like a sole purposealmost. Yeah . Or dharma a
reason for being here, youknow? I mean, I, for the first
, uh, gosh, for the first 12 orso years of my career, I also
worked a desk job. Um, at thesame time I was doing my art.

(29:51):
And , uh, I think I talkedabout this in our last episode,
didn't I? Steph ? But yeah,it's like when, when you get a
nudge, like that inner nudgethat doesn't let you go, and
you know , you know that you'remeant to do something else, you
know that you're here forsomething, or you feel that
confirmation when you do it,even though, no matter how hard

(30:12):
it was , uh, like you weredescribing Lauren, it's like,
there's just times where youjust know you Yeah. You don't
know why, but you know that,you know. Yeah. And ,
and , and it's, and it's a ,and it's a bodily knowing too.
It's a somatic knowing. It's a, um, you know, I , and I was
describing how when I waswanting to leave my day job for

(30:36):
two years, I carried a letterof resignation in my backpack.
Wow . And I was in battle withmy mind. My mind was saying,
but this is a steady thing, butthis is security. This is the ,
you know, and it's like, sosometimes there's a battle
there, but ultimately it'slike, my heart knew what I was
wanting to do next. And itdoesn't, sometimes these

(30:59):
nudgings just don't let go, orit'll keep whispering in your
ear. And it doesn't matter howlong it takes, it doesn't
matter how old we are, it'snever too late to say yes to
whatever that, that nudgingwants. And I don't know. I
don't have the answers either.
I, I describe it as like a soulthing, I guess. I mean, it's

(31:20):
all language anyway, but Yeah.
What is that? I mean, it'sjust, yeah. Steph , do you have
anything to add? ?

Stephanie (31:28):
Only that it feels like a mission, and that's sort
of the same thing. Mission .
Mission . Like it's my personalmission for, and I just won't,
it won't let go of me. So

Jenny (31:38):
I , and it's,

Lisa (31:40):
I'm sorry. Oh , sorry , Sue . Um , oh, I

Jenny (31:42):
Was just gonna say really quick, and it's not
like, again, like we're beingcoerced into this. It's like a
, it won't let you go in a goodway. Yes . You know what I
mean? ,

Lisa (31:50):
Right , right , right .
It's

Jenny (31:50):
Like, no, you will do this. .

Lisa (31:53):
I wanna allude to that because Lauren and I have this
conversation all the time. Imean, it's a nudge that we have
to do this because we, becauseyes, art saved my life , right?
And I want it to save otherpeople's lives. But why, just
curious. Why do we, this fourof us have this nudge to nudge
people. And then, you know, whydo we feel like, come on you

(32:14):
guys, we know the solution. Weknow that art is about
reclamation. You know, howcome, what is that desire? Or
what is that? And then there isthat challenge because you do
get a lot of notes . You know,you get a lot of like, w like,
I mean, you know, so let's,let's talk about that, and
maybe we can end with it. Like,why are we nudging people to

(32:36):
reclaim art as their

Lauren (32:38):
Superpower, I should say?

Stephanie (32:40):
Love that. Uh, I'll, if you don't mind, I will just
go ahead, jump right in. Um, I,I think art or creativity in
general, and that could be, youknow, dance or writing or, you
know, even how you set thetable or make a batch of
cookies from scratch, that thatcreative spark inside of us is

(33:02):
our authent authentic self, inmy opinion. And just sort of
like what I referred to before.
Like, I, I believe that moreand more people are going to
want that for themselves. Andthat's part of this
transformation that we talkedabout. And so, for me, I feel
like, I feel like all four ofus will probably see evidence

(33:25):
of that very, very soon. And I, I , I already do to a degree
. Mm-Hmm . . And, um, I mean, I just feel like
it's the flow. It's what'snext, because we're gonna need
it. 'cause it's us. Yeah .

Lauren (33:39):
Right. Yeah.

Jenny (33:41):
Yeah. And, and just to add on that, like we were
saying earlier about how we'reall interconnected, and we
really feel that and know itas, as , uh, you were saying
earlier about the, it's sittingaround the table, you know,
we're all interconnected. Wedon't always know it until we
drop into that other space. Andso if we're all interconnected

(34:01):
and we know this for ourselves,that this has saved our lives,
why wouldn't we want to shareit with others, you know, to
save our , I mean, not sa Imean, it sounds like
evangelical, but I really don'tmean it that way. , you
know, we've got the answer.
no , . Yeah .

Stephanie (34:20):
We , you have the answer. Yeah .

Jenny (34:22):
Yes. We're telling people you have the answer
within you, and here's thetool, here's the tool for
accessing it.

Lauren (34:30):
Yeah. You know? Yeah. I think, I think it's, it's
really interesting because like, um, I, it's, it , it's, I'm
finding this like almostcomedic, but like, it's so,
it's so vital to say, but like,I do it, part of me is like ,
um, I have a very much like,I'm gonna do what I, what I do
with my life, and you do what ,what you wanna do with your

(34:51):
life, because you should beyourself. But here I am being
like, , you should takean art break . And so I, I
think I have a little bit of aweird relationship with that
because I'm like, wait aminute, I'm, I'm telling people
they should do what we're , youknow, they should be

(35:11):
themselves. They should do whatthey wanna do. But like, I
think the way to explain thatis, the reason I want you to
take an art break is because itwill help you figure out how to
be you. I'm not, I'm not tryingto tell you who to be, I'm
trying to help you really findyourself. And so that's like,

(35:32):
you know, because the the preaching thing, I was just
like, , I , we do, Imean, we do, we definitely are
. Like we do sometimes we'relike, Hey, we're preaching to
the choir today. But, but weare , we're like, we're getting
out our bullhorns and we'relike, Hey, there's this thing
that you're not doing and we'renot, we're not, and I'm not

(35:53):
trying to be like, you'reliving your life incorrectly,
and this is da da da . Or I'mtrying to save you from
something. It's more like, bygolly, if you just did this,
you would know the no , that Iknow that I cannot
describe to you right now.
Right. Yeah.

Jenny (36:11):
I think, I think, I mean, the , the phrase that
comes to my mind is, is, isshow don't tell. And, and I
have to remind myself of this,it's like just, you know,
sharing our presence andsharing our own art and sharing
how it's changed us. Sometimesthat's how people end up coming
to a workshop. Uh , one , youknow, one of our workshops.

(36:33):
It's like when they seesomebody else's process art or
they see how we've changed orwhatever, you know? So it's
like, it's so funny, isn't it?
How it's like if I tell people,well, here's what it can do,
you know, but it's like, no,but they have, you know, they
kind of have to see it and thenbe Yeah . You know, see it to
believe it. I guess. I don't, Idon't know. Yeah.

Lauren (36:54):
It's ,

Jenny (36:54):
Its a funny dichotomy though, .

Lauren (36:56):
It's, yeah, it's a , it's a constant, like, and
that's probably like, 'causeit's in my brain, right? It's
your brain trying to wraparound this thing that it ,
that doesn't have to donecessarily with your, with
that front front part of yourbrain. It has to do with your
being. And so, yeah . And it is, it's like , um, it's the
experience that helps peopleunderstand it, but also

(37:19):
they're, they're notnecessarily gonna do it
unless you give them reasons todo it. So it's, it is, it's a
battle. Yeah. It's interesting.

Jenny (37:29):
Right, right.

Stephanie (37:31):
Yeah. It's like, it's, it's, I, I've used this
analogy a lot, the, like, theinternal excavation of that
authentic self. And we'rebasically just handing people
the pick acts , right. And the,the little brush to uncover
everything. And it's just like,and , but it , I get it. Like,
it there, I mean, when you feelwhat we feel or what we have

(37:53):
felt that authentic sense ofself , um, through creativity
in all its aspects. I mean,yeah.

Lisa (38:04):
I love it. It feels like traveling on some sense. That's
what I'm, I'm , you know what Imean? It's like, it's an inner
travel, you know , we , we goto other places to travel , but
I think it's a beautiful thing. And it could be , it doesn't
really cost much . It doesn'tcost

Jenny (38:20):
Anything

Lisa (38:20):
To travel into this , you know , this final frontier that
we all have.

Lauren (38:25):
Ooh , I like that. I like that.

Jenny (38:28):
I love it. Yeah. I , I call it the inward journey.
Yeah. Art making . Yeah. Ilove, I mean that is, that is
what it feels like. Yeah.

Lisa (38:37):
I know. If we were to just tell people it costs
nothing. Just yourself. Youneed to go nowhere .

Jenny (38:46):
And yet everywhere.
.

Lisa (38:49):
Yeah . Everywhere . Wow.
Thank you so much that this wassuch a fun conversation. Thank
you for having it with ustoday. And then still , you
talked about your workshops.
How can people join yourworkshops, get ahold of you and
, um, you know , you have apodcast, tell them all that
information.

Stephanie (39:09):
Absolutely. Um, everything can really be found
on creative nectar studio.com .
Um, we have, Jenny has a book,like we mentioned the podcast.
Um, I, I offer one-on-onesessions, and then our
community, which we're soexcited about , um, the online
community. So yeah, it shouldbe, it's just all there, all
there

Jenny (39:28):
For you . Yeah . The community , uh, soul Nectar is
the name of that. We have, it'skind of like a monthly , um,
subscription model, but we havea monthly live workshop on
Zoom. Um, we have , uh, a faceprivate Facebook group. We have
a bunch of resources kind ofattached with that, that , um,
and it's really, yeah, likeSteph was saying earlier, this

(39:49):
is kind of new to kinda shiftthe community from in person to
online in that way. We still doboth, but it's amazing how the
energy is still there, evenwith online. And it's, yeah,
we're really excited aboutthat. And that's awesome .
Yeah. And then the , thepodcast. Yeah. And the book
Creative Flow. It's all, likeSteph said, it's all on the

(40:10):
website and yeah. We'd love tosee you all there.

Lisa (40:14):
Sounds great. Yeah .
Alright . Thank you so much.
Thank you. Thank you

Jenny (40:19):
So much for having us on. It is a blessing and a
pleasure to connect with youboth. Mm-Hmm . .

Lisa (40:24):
Yeah . Eva . Be Art .