October 9, 2024 • 60 mins
Ever wondered what it truly means to embrace submission and explore the transformative power dynamics within BDSM? My good friend Kerry joins me to share her 6 yearjourney from a vanilla lifestyle to discovering her authentic submissive self. Her experiences shed light on the profound impact that power exchange can have on one’s life and identity, offering invaluable insights for both newcomers and those already familiar with the submissive path.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Do the sex Think fun, honest and feminist as fuck,
(00:28):
and always with the goal offighting the patriarchy.
One female orgasm at a time.
Welcome to the locker room.
Today's locker room talk andshots topic is subspace
exploration One woman's journeyinto the heart of BDSM.
(00:51):
It is Kingtober folks, and ifyou've been with me for any time
now you know that I havethoroughly explored the Femme
Dom experience, cocks in cages,women caging cocks, controlling
men.
Well, this is actually, in all,three years, three plus years
(01:13):
of this podcast.
This is the first time I'vereally invited on a true sub
submissive, if you will, a womanwho went from being pretty
average Jane yeah, a mom, amother, a worker, just, you know
(01:35):
, normal vanilla lady to a realsub, a real submissive, an
experienced submissive, and I'mnot just talking about she takes
a couple of spankings.
Our interview today with my verygood friend, carrie is going to
take you deep into what itmeans to become a submissive,
who really is submissive and hasexplored that power exchange
(02:02):
thoroughly, and I have witnessedsome of it.
Just saying we will get to that.
She's actually been mentionedin some past podcasts, but
you're gonna have to go back andlisten to all of my episodes to
find the little Easter eggs,but first before we dive in.
So this is Carrie.
If you are a listener, you canhead over to my YouTube channel
at TalkSexWithAnnette and youcan see Keri's beautiful face
(02:27):
and mine.
Keri is here today.
She is.
You are a submissive at heart,though I know you have now
dipped your toes in otherexperiences, but can you tell my
listeners just a little bitmore about you, who you are,
what you want to, what do youwant to share?
Speaker 2 (02:44):
little bit more about you, who you are, what you want
to, what do you want to share?
Yeah, just right now I'm livingmy best single life, but I've
gone through this journey inthis past six years.
That was incredible and it wasprofound and it changed me.
It changed the way I thinkabout the world around me and
about myself, and, man, I'm justkind of really excited to share
(03:06):
my perspective, basically.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
Right.
Right, Because it was a journeyand I actually don't even know
all of the details and Carrieand I are very good friends, so
a lot of this will kind of be myfirst time really hearing the
step-by-step process of how shewent from being vanilla like
maybe some of you are, althoughI don't think all of you, I know
I got a good following ofpeople who aren't, and so I
(03:31):
think for King Tober this time.
Usually I kick it off with alot of like male chastity stuff
and dominating men stuff, butthis is going to be a new take.
So if you are curious aboutwhat it really is like to be a
submissive, if you think youmight have a little bit of a
submissive in you, if you wantto explore that a little bit,
(03:52):
this is going to be a greatepisode for you.
Or if you're looking for a sub,this would be a great episode
to give to your potential sub.
So, hey, I'm ready.
I'm ready to talk about sex andBDSM, being submissive.
I think the best way to startthis episode is just to start at
the beginning.
(04:12):
You are not a submissive yet.
It is what?
Six years ago?
Six years ago, and you moved toPortland.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
I know that backstory , so she moves to Portland go,
move to Portland and spend a fewweeks getting a lay of the land
, and then I decide I want tostart dating and in my last
relationship, which was prettyvanilla, I'd always kind of been
drawn and intrigued by kink butdidn't know how to pursue it
(04:40):
and also was just like felt likeit was deeply wrong pursue it
and also was just like felt likeit was deeply wrong.
Um, so got here and it wasstill in the back of my mind but
um was swiping through peopleon bumble and came across, uh,
this man who happened to mentionin his profile like he was
looking for um, a woman who waslike open and kink, friendly,
(05:07):
and so I actually engaged withher because I was, like you said
, kink, I'm really curious andand so that kind of like sparked
a conversation and it was, itwas pretty great.
We planned to meet prettyquickly.
Quickly and we went on ourfirst date and um, wow, it was,
(05:28):
it was pretty incredible.
We went to McMinimins, which isalways a great, great first date
spot, and, um, we sat down andhe was talking about a lot about
BDSM and kink and he wastalking about it in a way that
was like so genuine and warm andhe made it feel a lot less
(05:50):
scary and so this was the firstperson I'd ever really spoken to
about kink, about BDSM and man.
He was just such a gentlemanand he made it seem so
approachable gentleman.
And he made it seem soapproachable and was just really
respectful.
Yeah, so I was like tell memore, Right?
Speaker 1 (06:15):
So first date, what is he telling you about it?
Though, Just out of curiosity,if you had been vanilla and he
made it feel comfortable, like,how does he bring this up in a
way that you're not like whoabuddy, we're on a, you know?
Speaker 2 (06:23):
Oh sure he was talking about.
He asked me kind of about myexperience and what I was
curious about, because I hadasked him about the kink portion
and he was talking about someof his past experiences, his
kink experiences, some sceneshe'd done with some women he had
dated before.
What did he tell you?
Speaker 1 (06:44):
do you remember the first scenes he shared with you
that piqued your interest anddidn't freak you out?
Speaker 2 (06:49):
um it was talking about.
He mentioned like, like bondage, and I that's that's always
appealed to me and we can getmore into that um, like some
bondage scenes, um, what?
Um, there's there's other wordsfor this, but basically he
called it forced orgasms.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
That's what we called it forced orgasms yeah, um, I
would love someone to force meto have an orgasm.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
That is just not something that, as ever, you
know, yeah um, and so he wasdescribing some of those, and I
was just enthralled it was.
I was like oh god, I was justlike allalled it was.
I was like oh God, I was justlike all worked up.
Speaker 1 (07:27):
I was like tell me more, so he intrigues you.
It's your first date.
Do you go home and taste?
Did you get a little tasty poo?
Speaker 2 (07:37):
I did, I did, I did Wait, wait, wait.
Speaker 1 (07:42):
Before we go on because I do know I've got a
large male listenership Do nottake this conversation as a on
your first date.
Tell her about your BDSMexperience and try and get her
to come home.
You, you will fuck yourself up,like don't.
Just just to be clear, this wasa very specific situation that
(08:04):
just happened to go right,mm-hmm.
Right, yeah, right people righttime.
Right people, right time.
Trying to keep men on the righttrack on their birthstates.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
Like I felt chemistry and he felt very respectful
through the conversation.
I felt like he was reading kindof my body language whether I
wanted it more or less.
Yeah, he was just very aware sothat made it very comfortable.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
So he was like come back to my casbah.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
I actually invited him back to my place.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
That is not very submissive of you.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
No, it wasn't so new to it.
I was like what is this?
So that was great, because thatnight I squirted for the very
first time.
He made that happen for me andI didn't even realize my body
could do that like I'd seen itin porn before and I was like
what?
What is really going on there?
I wasn't.
(08:54):
I wasn't even sure it was areal thing.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
Ironically, at least probably a year later, we would
squirt together.
He sure did.
He was back to the story so hemade you squirt, was he did?
Did he do any new bd like bdsme, things like how did you start
to?
Speaker 2 (09:16):
yeah, um, not on that first date, it was on the
second date.
How do you make you squirt then?
Okay, it was just um, at theend of the uh, like while we
were playing, he was like let's,let's try this.
And he, he went and got a towelfrom my bathroom and put it
underneath my bottom, thoughtfuland I wasn't even completely
sure what was going on.
And so then, like you know, heput his fingers in and started
like pulling down, um, and I wasjust like, and you know, it
(09:40):
almost feels like you're goingto yes, it does.
And I was like fighting againstit and and he was like, just
just relax, just just let go.
And I he was a paramedic and afirefighter, so I was like you
know what, if I pee, I pee, he'sinto it.
Like just why not?
just just like used to it, he'sdealt with bodily fluids, fuck
(10:03):
it I don't feel a sense of shameabout what's about to happen,
because he's he's makingsomething happen so yeah, just
like let go and was able tosquirt.
But that's, it was the firstdate, so it was the second date
where things really gotinteresting.
Speaker 1 (10:15):
Okay, let's get to the second day.
So the first date.
He makes you squirt your highfive.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
You send him on his way not submissive at all, but
then you talk and he's likelet's, and you're like yeah yes,
after I leave, the next morninghe sends me a picture and says
so much more exploring to do.
And it's this steamer trunk atthe end of a bed and it's lit,
is open, and it's got thesecrisscross like kind of red
(10:40):
ropes and I see like um, likefloggers and riding crops and a
cane tucked into it.
And then it's deep below and Isee things I don't understand in
that trunk.
I'm like I don't know how thatfunctions, but it was like you
know, as I come to find out,there's like anal hooks and butt
(11:00):
plugs and big dildos and allkinds of toys in there.
So, um, so as soon as he sentthat photo I was like, oh my.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
God, and so you weren't intimidated by it, you
were just curious.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
I was curious and again, he just made it feel
really safe and like he wasmatching my pace and wasn't
pushing me into anything.
He was just like you seemcurious about this.
Let me here's this information,Right.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
So things I want to point out like because I think
in these episodes, podcastepisodes, I think I need to do a
better job of pointing outthings that work.
I love the word curiosity.
When you approach anything withcuriosity instead of skepticism
or judgment, you open yourselfto more possibilities.
I love that you bring upsecurity, especially when it has
(11:46):
to do with sex or newexperiences, anything BDSM.
The first thing you have to dois lay the ground for people to
feel secure and safe, right,yeah, so just putting out those
words, I love them.
So you set up the second date,and where, where did you meet
for that?
Speaker 2 (12:02):
So, um, we went to his house, Just started right
there, yeah, okay.
So we arrive at his house andso we go into his bedroom and
we're kissing and dressing, andthen he kind of like bends,
turns like we're kissing upagainst the side of the bed, and
then he turns me around andlike bends me forward over the
bed and then he puts some cuffsaround my wrists and my ankles
(12:27):
and then he's got this beautiful, like like wood, deep wood,
colored, four poster bed and hehas straps that he pulls out and
he like ties me in and, um,wait, did he ask you ahead of
time what you were comfortable?
Speaker 1 (12:41):
was there like, did you have a conversation?
Speaker 2 (12:44):
we did kind of talk about what you were interested,
what I was interested okay, yeah, and that was also hard to
tease out for me, because it'slike being, you know, passing a
restaurant outside on the streetand somebody saying, what do
you want to order from thisrestaurant?
I'm like I don't know what theyhave on the menu, I don't know
what's possible, right?
So he was asking me, and Ithink he was probing to see what
I might, because I didn't knowhow to articulate what I wanted
(13:06):
because I was so unfamiliar.
So, um, I had definitelyexpressed an interest in being
restrained and so, um, so yeah,like cuffs out on, like pulled,
and he, even before he tightenedit, he just like took a moment.
He was like, do you have anyshoulder injuries?
and I was like no, oh,thoughtful, and then like that
quickly like and firmly, verysexily, like pulled it and like
(13:29):
a very taut and it wow, um.
And then, like it did the samewith my legs, but so that they
were spread and, um, the cuffswere really soft and it's not
like they were handcuffs, theywere really soft so that like
felt like a nice little hug andsecure and it started to feel
like being like really kind ofheld and that like felt really
nice.
Um.
So, yeah, he took out hisflogger and was doing working
(13:53):
with that and I was right, allright, wait, so you've never
like, let's not just skip over.
Speaker 1 (13:57):
Okay, now he's flogging her.
Yeah, so had you beeninterested?
Had you ever experienced impactplay before?
Never, but you were curious,it's very curious.
And did he ask you what tostart with, or were you just
like?
Speaker 2 (14:12):
he?
Um?
No, no, I think he was feelingit out, he was he was I noticed
he started out with all thesofter things and he seemed
again just very like, focused onme and my reaction it didn't
feel ever feel like he was doingit for his pleasure.
Speaker 1 (14:31):
It felt like he was do you know, if he was a sadist,
that doesn't sound verysadistic.
There are different types ofdoms like sadists really just
love to hurt people, and thenthere are doms who just love.
I guess that it's not reallyabout just hurting someone, it's
just about the power play.
Speaker 2 (14:49):
Um, God, that's a great question.
I need to reflect on that more.
Speaker 1 (14:52):
So the first time, uh , you were.
Do you remember?
The first time you were struck?
You experienced the impact,what your thought was what your
feeling was.
Speaker 2 (15:02):
Um, I was really into it because, as somebody who
struggles with attention andthen also, you know, sometimes
you get into a sex space and Ithink I don't know if it for me
sex felt so heavy that it feltlike a performative space too.
And this was taking that awaybecause it was slowly like
(15:24):
getting some genuine reactionfrom me.
And so I'll also tell you that,as he started to kind of up the
impact into something like thethuddy things, like the big kind
of what's the word?
I'm looking for.
The floggers, the thuddyfloggers started to move into
like riding crops and paddles,something a little more sharp.
(15:46):
So then he took out his magicwand and was like putting it
between my legs, so kind ofstarting to mix some like
pleasure and a little bit ofpain, and so that felt really
good and it was again keeping mybrain really present, in a way
that it was like helping meenjoy the pleasure and be
present and in my body, because,like my brain couldn't really
(16:09):
escape anywhere else, because,like, be here, now something's
happening to your body so it wasreally mixing that, um,
bringing in the pleasure andpain, do you know, like clearly,
from those beginning days ofjust trying out the different
types of impact play.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
So, just for people who haven't done this, there are
different types of impactimplements.
So there are floggers that canbe a lot lighter.
Then you can get floggers thatare heavier and cause kind of
more pain.
That are heavier and cause kindof more pain.
(16:49):
You can what writing crops aregoing to be sharper, kind of
pain, and then bamboo which is I.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
I hate to love it and love to hate it I'm not love it
at all.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
Uh, yeah, so I want to ask you what?
So tell what.
What kind of um impact andinstruments do you like the most
?
Speaker 2 (17:06):
I can occasionally.
You know my pain, tolerancechanges from day to day, so it
really depends Am I well rested,am I well hydrated?
Speaker 1 (17:13):
Emotionally.
I think that's an importantthing to share with people too.
I think people don't realize,like people think you have one
kind of pain, tolerance and itreally and as a woman who's
highly tattooed, I can tell youand has done months and months
and years of tattoos like it isstrange, what you can take and
what you enjoy maybe one dayversus the next day can change
(17:34):
drastically and I don't know ifthis is the way it is for you.
So I am a switch, I'm like ahardcore switch.
I might be.
I'm, I'm pretty half and half,wouldn't you say.
I mean, you've seen me more asa dominant than a submissive.
I would say Um, but when I havebeen in the submissive role, one
thing that I think is importantfor me is to work up like start
(18:00):
the pain low and then work itup to whatever it is I feel like
I can take.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:06):
Is that, or do you like to just go hard?
Are you a go hard or go homegirl?
Speaker 2 (18:10):
Again, it depends on the day, I might be able to just
go really hard and some days Ireally have to work into it and
keep it just low.
But I think something aboutbeing present really taught me
is how much fear is built intopain.
Because I noticed in thebeginning, like when we were
first establishing how much, inthe moment when the impact play
(18:30):
started to build, how much I'dkind of be bracing and
tightening up like ready for thenext impact and but you know,
in the moments after it would bethis, this impact, and then
your body would kind of buzzfrom it and just to like let go
into that sensation and andenjoy it, like your endorphins
going after that impact.
(18:51):
And really learning to let goof the fear of, like what's
coming next and truly be presentand that's like kind of what
started to change across my lifeis like not living in the fear,
really being in the present,you know, instead of
anticipating the next shoedropping so at what point?
Speaker 1 (19:08):
you have this first experience, and so what you he
in this first experience.
He starts, he like fucking,straps you up to fucking say I
know the bed.
I know exactly how she wastripped up and you experience
the impact play yeah, he mixesin the pleasure.
That's your first experience.
(19:30):
I assume it ends in sex.
Were there any new experiencesin that first play session?
Speaker 2 (19:37):
Let's see Squirted again.
It was definitely the impactplay and different positions.
And this is where I'm going tosay I dated this man for over
like close to six years andnever repeat performance.
He was a Picasso of pleasureand pain in the bedroom.
Speaker 1 (19:57):
He really was creative.
He was so creative andcreativity and sex go together.
Well, I mean, I don't thinkpeople get creative enough in
the bedroom.
So you did some squirting.
Then you had PNV sex.
Was that always part of yourdynamic?
Yes, always.
(20:17):
It always ended in that in that.
All right, so you get done, uh,you high five and go home, or
do you stay the night?
Um, I stayed the night.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
yes, um, that's sweet .
Yeah, it's sweet.
Um, but he was a firefighterand left at like four in the
morning for a shift, so he leftme with a magic wand and was
like, please masturbate in themorning and did you I did I sure
did, I, sure did.
I want to make sure my thesheet smelled like me when he
got back home.
You marked your territory.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
All right, so you leave and you are sitting in
that space of like what just had.
This is your first experience.
What was that?
Like the, the aftermath, wow.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
I just I couldn't wait to have more and explore
more.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
I just felt.
Speaker 2 (20:59):
That's when I kind of started looking at toys and
looking what I could have andstarting to be more curious
about my own pleasure, like howcan I touch my body.
And at the time he was startingto like give me instructions.
He's like I want you to have atleast two orgasms a day.
Like want you to get to knowyour body.
Speaker 1 (21:16):
He virtually gave you a assignment, so it went hard
quick with the two of you.
He was like, he was like, allright, so this is going to
continue and this is how itcontinues, lower apart.
Speaker 2 (21:25):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, we had some really good
chemistry, yeah, just I feltgreat.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (21:57):
So at this point did you start looking into, like am
I?
At what point did you go?
I think I'm a submissive, I.
Or was there a moment whereyou're like I wonder if I would
like to be a dom or this thing?
And I think, like we were bothnon-monogamous and he was dating
other women and then sometimes,as you know, sometimes other
women would join us.
And I remember seeing aconversation where he was yeah.
I remember seeing aconversation where he was
telling a woman yeah, I'm, I'm,I'm dumb, and, and Carrie is
(22:18):
more submissive, and I was likewhat's that?
Speaker 1 (22:21):
So that's when you so .
So all right, Was that wellinto the really?
At what point Did you just keepkind of doing this thing with
him?
Speaker 2 (22:30):
And then one day he says that I think it was it was
several months into therelationship when I had seen
those terms and at the same timehe'd encouraged me to go to
this, uh, women's group that metat a local sex club and it was
for women who were swinger, poly, non-monogamous ethically, you
know, just just very sexpositive, I mean we'll plug it
(22:52):
right now If you are in Portland, it is called.
Speaker 1 (22:55):
well, now it's called .
Speaker 2 (22:56):
Now it's called broadcast and it's open to
anybody who would feel at homein a femme space.
Speaker 1 (23:04):
I may go on occasion.
We may go on occasion.
Yes, you have this first date.
You go home.
He's giving you assignments.
I assume you're gettingtogether how frequently?
Speaker 2 (23:15):
assignments.
I assume you're gettingtogether how frequently?
Speaker 1 (23:17):
um, at that point I think it was about twice a week.
So, and what is he adding in?
Like you've already, you'reexperiencing all the different
types of impact.
What are some other things youstart to experience, and at what
point?
Because clearly there's a pointwhere other women are starting
to be invited in.
It becomes more of not aone-on-one situation.
And was that hard for you?
Like when you realized that wasgoing to happen?
Speaker 2 (23:38):
like Okay, both great questions.
So your first question wastalking about how things more
got introduced.
Yeah, we would keep going ondates and then he would do
something different, like onetime he had a remote controlled
vibrator in me and as I wasordering dinner he was like
messing with it and I was justlike struggling to keep a face
(24:01):
to order while he was playingwith that.
And then another time we wentand saw a movie and it was my
first time like with a butt plugand it was like the enjoy the
extra large, weighted butt plugand man, that was.
I really felt that.
But you know what that madeanal, like the beginning of
having anal sex, just so muchmore comfortable, a lot more
(24:26):
pleasurable.
Yeah, so that was great.
So it was he always, always wewere having dates and doing
little ideas.
We'd go to, maybe like loversor you know, some of the local
sex shops and kind of like shopfor things together.
He'd ask me what was making mecurious.
And then we visited some of thelocal sex clubs several times
(24:53):
and it was.
I remember this moment.
We were at the sex club and, man, he was kind of pushing me up
against a window where thiscouple was playing on the in the
bedroom on the other side ofthe window and he was kind of
like rubbing up against me and Ikept on wanting to, like you
know, hide my face so that thesepeople didn't see me staring at
them.
And he kept on like moving myhead and he was like I want you
(25:14):
to watch while I touch you and Iwas like, okay, it was, it was
just really great it was.
He was always doing somethingfun and new and interesting and
again kept on asking me likewhat my desires were and kind of
teasing those out in just a waythat felt really like safe for
me.
Speaker 1 (25:34):
What was the first time you experienced what is
known as subspace, and could youexplain to people what subspace
is?
Speaker 2 (25:41):
Okay, yeah, I think it was several times in when he
had we had impact play and hehad a hard point in his bedroom
and if you don't know what itwas, it's just like, uh, like a
really intense um it's, it'slike a hook you can put in it,
um, and he had it hidden, hiddenbehind a, um, a smoke alarm.
(26:03):
So he had that in his bedroomand I was suspended from that
and um he was.
He had Velcroed somethingaround my thigh and it was um in
it.
He tucked the magic wand, so itwas like right against my bits
and, uh, pussy, pussy my pussy.
Speaker 1 (26:22):
It was right there, my pit.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
I like that um, and yeah, so I was standing up and
he was going and man, I justreached this buzzy, beautiful
space where I kind of let go of,like I don't know all the like
again the performative elementsof sex and I was like really in
(26:48):
my pleasure and he was reallyserving my pleasure Like he got
off from like giving, so likevery focused on me and again he
provided a very non-judgmentalspace.
He was a paramedic, so I wasn'ttoo worried about letting go or
anything too terrible happening.
It was a great foundation onwhich to explore.
(27:13):
And yeah, so I was entering thatsubspace and again, very just
like buzzy, beautiful, freeing,and afterward when we'd play
like that and I would reach thatlike subspace where it's just,
I tend to go a little nonverbal,so I need to, I need
instruction, like go herehelping you know, do this next
thing, um, but yeah, and thenlike hold afterward, because you
(27:36):
really you know it's thatoxytocin that's really going
after an orgasm and that kind ofexperience and, um, like really
making the most of it as it'sin your bloodstream at what
point were you like okay, I'msubmissive, like that's, that's
my thing, that's my, this is whoI am um?
I think it was pretty early on,after he had kind of I'd seen
that conversation and I was like, and I was looking it up and I
(27:57):
was like, oh, oh, that's me.
And then after that he had sentme around that time he'd also
sent me that, which is that aBDSM test?
Speaker 1 (28:05):
that I think everybody takes and I was like
one of the highest rated thingswas just being yeah, yeah, being
submissive and I mean by thetime I met you, you like you
really had a pain, tolerance andinterest that was beyond, like,
definitely beyond mine, yeah,and was that something that
(28:27):
built over time, and was thatsomething that you desired or
that you just like?
How did that?
Speaker 2 (28:32):
how did that happen for you?
That was something I reallyplayed with.
A lot was kind of exploring theedges of pain and pleasure, and
I really liked taking it to theedge because I think the more I
took it to the edge, the more Ifelt I was in this really buzzy
subspace.
(28:52):
That felt really beautiful andfreeing to me.
Oh, you know what?
I want to circle back around tothe question you had about
other women, and I think, comingfrom monogamous relationships,
that was I.
You know, it was kind of alwayslike well, he's been with her
for several hours and I haven'theard and it's everything okay
(29:13):
and oh my God, am I going tolose this amazing thing?
You know a lot of thatinsecurity playing.
But early, very early on, hehad given me the ethical slut
and so I had read that and Ilove that he gave that to me so
early because I felt like itreally set the foundation of
(29:34):
understanding the dynamic thatcould exist there that, like you
, won't be there.
There's so many beautifulthings in that book, but it
really kind of kind of opened mymind to this idea of, like,
romance and pleasure.
It doesn't have to look the waywe've always been told it has a
really beautiful way it canlook Right.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
I'm going to fast forward, though, just to be
clear.
Like I met the two of them andyou say that I was on the dating
apps and I met both of them,you say I matched with him first
, but I swear to God, I rememberit as matching with both of you
and talking to you first.
Okay, let's talk about it.
Speaker 2 (30:15):
We're gonna look, we are going to problem solve a
problem we have here, okay Ifelt like, um, I had seen you on
bumble and I remembered youbecause you had these like
beautiful pictures that weremostly white, but then you had
your black hair and I think youwere in yoga poses, and then I'm
not sure that like you and Iactually, and so you talked to
(30:39):
him and then but then we didmatch then we did at some point
yeah, so maybe.
Speaker 1 (30:44):
I looked for you afterwards because he maybe he
shared a picture of you and thenwe met and my interest was
primarily with Carrie.
I mean, mean, clearly it waslike clear, and so I was never
in the situation where you werenever in the situation with me,
(31:04):
where I was alone with him.
He was in the situation thatyou and I spent time alone
together.
But I know because he wouldcould ask about that, and I'm
like yeah, yeah, I'm not gonnado that yeah, I mean he was, he
was fine and good and everything, but I like the girlies, um.
so just to clarify but you therewas this dynamic did so, but
(31:28):
for you guys mostly it would behim.
He would meet women and yeah,but you guys came out together
to meet me, yeah, and did you dothat typically with other women
?
Speaker 2 (31:39):
We did a handful of times.
Yeah, I think I was also tryingto match with women at the time
, just very embracing the ideaof ethical non monogamy and
trying to find people who wouldkind of fill more of my
emotional bucket and and so likeI was kind of meeting people
(32:00):
like that, but it wasn't a Venndiagram of people who would be
good for play for all three ofus, as opposed to like meeting
my needs over here.
Speaker 1 (32:08):
Yeah, that's hard, that's a hard thing to do.
So, along with impact play,being a submissive, there's more
to being submissive than justimpact play.
We obviously have focused onthat also, because I know that
that's that was kind of a bigpart of your journey.
But can you talk about otheraspects of being a submissive
that you experienced and enjoyedand discovered on your path,
(32:31):
because not all submissives evenenjoy impact play?
Speaker 2 (32:34):
correct, sure, correct, sure yeah, no, there's
what a spectrum of experiencesyou can have as a sub.
Um, yeah, like he'doccasionally kind of remind me
to do things like it was reallynice, kind of caring stuff you
tend to hear about like doms whoreally take care of their subs,
so like, have you had watertoday?
Have you eaten?
(32:55):
How did you sleep?
Are you taking care of yourself?
Yeah, and kind of pushing mesometimes toward my goals, like
he's like I would like you when,when I was struggling with my
work.
He's like before we see eachother again, I want to see 10
applications that you've sentout to new jobs.
Speaker 1 (33:13):
Right, okay, right.
Okay, right so doing some ofthat self growth kind of thing.
When you brought a third personin, what did that look like?
You being submissive?
Speaker 2 (33:27):
Um, it was a lot of like him directing and I think
it was so important for mebecause I think a lot of the
women knew that they were cominginto an established
relationship.
I didn't want them to feel likethere was competition or I was
going to be jealous.
It was like a lot of my focuswas on the woman whenever she
came, like on her pleasure andtrying to, because I thought
(33:48):
like he had created such abeautiful thing for me and I was
able to access that space withhim and I wanted other women to
experience that too, like so Imean that was that helped
mitigate some of my feelings oflike, like the, the jealousy
that can creep in sometimes,that that really helped it.
But, like in the bedroom andthere was other women, I think
(34:11):
the submissive side really cameout as like he was kind of
directing the scene and kind oftaking a more dominant role,
like, um, if we ventured intoany kind of play, really he was,
he was the one that was thedirector of it.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
Well, a lot of people talk about how submissives also
have power in the relationship.
Uh, how would you say thatshowed up in your experience and
did you feel powerful in yourexperience?
Speaker 2 (34:37):
I think I did because I felt like whatever was
happening in the bedroom, I hadthe final say.
I could say I don't want thisto happen anymore.
I was the one who was givingpermission for this to happen
and I was giving that permissionbecause I felt so safe.
Yeah, the trust that has tohappen to be that vulnerable, to
(34:59):
be tied up and let yourself goand let yourself have these
multiple orgasms where you'relike I might squirt, I might pee
, I don't know what's going tohappen.
Speaker 1 (35:09):
So, yeah, right, you felt like you, in the end had
the final word, even though hewas the one directing yes, so it
did make you feel powerful.
It did.
Speaker 2 (35:17):
And you know what I wrote down this little thing
that I had read, powerful it did.
And you know what I wrote downthis little thing that I had
read oh, the surrender in itfelt very peaceful and kind of
even my own control in thesituation.
That it felt like shelter.
It felt like a safe shelter.
Speaker 1 (35:33):
In this journey.
So, because this happened oversix years, right, what?
Over six years?
What are things that grew andexpanded Like from you know your
think about your first date tolike this place in your life now
?
Speaker 2 (35:49):
Yeah, I felt like I mean it to take a long way to
chip away those performativeelements, even though, like he
had taken me into the spacewhere I could be a sub.
It was still like really tryingto fight through the chatter in
my mind, like the idea that youhave to perform.
Am I making noises?
Do I, as he's folding me up intwo?
(36:10):
Do I still look sexy?
We all feel that yes, yeah, andI think near the end there was
a lot there.
There was, there was fewer, wewere doing less BDSM and that
was fine.
But it was like we had come tothis space where, like he really
(36:31):
knew my body and knew how tomake me react and would spend an
entire hour doing all thesedifferent scenes, making me come
in different ways in differentpositions, was always happy to
do what I asked.
But, like, the orgasms Istarted to have became like
(36:53):
profound and existential and Ifelt like it was, it was, it was
just, it was really incredible.
It was really incredible.
It almost having those playsessions with him.
It felt like it becamespiritual, like I had a whole
routine of getting ready beforeand like shaving myself and
perfuming myself and putting onmy best lotion and getting in
(37:15):
that that space, like almostlike the way people would
prepare for church, like justvery mindfully and very
thoughtfully, almost like theway people would prepare for
church, like just very mindfullyand very thoughtfully, because
really man accessing that spacewith him it felt like heaven,
like in a way I can't even beginto describe it.
It was so incredible and howdid it affect?
other areas of your life.
(37:35):
Okay, that was again.
I talked about how the pain andlearning to not fear what's
coming next, just kind of beingvery present in the moment, that
was a huge thing.
It made me, like, moreconfident because here's
(37:55):
somebody who has seen me at mymost vulnerable and they are
still there.
They are still there, theystill care about me, they still
love me.
Um, it made me more confidentat work, um, and then also man,
he set off amazing things in mylife.
Like I met really amazing sexpositive like me and um, and it
(38:18):
put me so in touch with, like mysexuality, which had been
deeply buried for so long, andrealize how much of a like a
sexual being I am.
And, um, I think it made mecome across as more confident.
I feel like it just made memore open and seeing how
non-judgmental like him holdingthis really amazing
(38:38):
non-judgmental space, likereally holding this really
amazing non-judgmental spacelike really taught me how to
hold that for myself and forothers.
Speaker 1 (38:45):
Before we move on, because I want to get to kind of
where you're at now, but beforewe move on, are there any
experiences in particular, orthings about this journey into
subspace, into becoming a subrather, that you would really
like to share and let listenersknow about?
Who are curious, who you know,think maybe you know there, I
(39:08):
think there are a lot of peoplewho are like.
I want to, I want to bedominated, but they don't know
what, what that all really means, sure.
Speaker 2 (39:14):
Sure, um, I think the one thing you'll probably see
as you look online look out forthe fake doms, the people who
are asking like you should callme daddy right away, and you
need to do this right awaybefore, like, any sort of trust
is established.
I think that's really importantfor people to understand and I
think it's important to do someof the reading, do the work,
(39:34):
educate yourself.
I'm so grateful I had thatfoundation Because, like I had
this educational foundation onwhich to build what was
happening next, instead ofsomebody else kind of driving
the train on my experience, so Ithink that was really helpful.
Speaker 1 (39:52):
Also, how much pain you take and can take does not
dictate how good of a submissiveyou are.
It's so true like if anyone'strying to tell you like I had,
uh, an experience in myrelationship with someone who
was more dominant than me, wherethe the pain dynamic, the way
(40:17):
the pain was being delivered,was unpleasant to me, and I
would say, hello, I would belike that's too much and they
would basically mock me for notbeing able to take as much and,
you know, make comments likekind of cutting me down, uh,
like about, like I was kind of awuss and that that should be a
(40:42):
red flag for you.
That should be a red flag foryou.
You don't have to be someonethat can go from zero to 100.
Like if someone just startswailing on you and they may tell
you that your ability orinability to withstand that
dictates how good of asubmissive you are, that should
(41:03):
be a red flag to you.
This is someone like a good Dom, someone who is someone who
cares about you.
First of all, is someone who iswants to bring you into the
pain and pleasure dynamic in away that creates an ecstasy for
you.
Yeah, they don't want to liketraumatize you and hurt you and
(41:27):
you don't have to be able totake as much pain.
I don't feel like I'm any lessof when I am submissive a sub
than Carrie, because I don'twant as much pain as she does.
It's all about what your bodyenjoys and reacts to.
So watch for red flags.
(41:48):
Watch for red flags.
And it can be hard.
Because I would say this whenyou say that the bond with
someone who you've had thatexperience with is so strong,
when you've allowed someone A touh make you that vulnerable,
restraining and, and you know,bringing about this pain
(42:09):
pleasure dynamic, it can bereally hard to say to them I'm
not enjoying that, yeah, likethis, I'm not enjoying this, but
it's super important for you,for your dom, to make you feel
safe doing that and to be ableto take your feedback.
And it sounds like he did that.
He was very much that way.
Like you should be able to givegood feedback.
Speaker 2 (42:28):
Yeah, and a good Dom will look for you to speak up to
yours for yourself.
Like we'll encourage it.
Be like like even with evenwith my partner he would.
He'd be like what kind of icecream do you want?
And I'd show someindecisiveness because I'm a
lifelong people pleaser.
And he'd be like if you don'tpick this ice cream out, I'm
going to pull down your pantsright here and everybody in the
(42:50):
store is going to come spank you.
Speaker 1 (42:54):
And you're like I'm not picking anything, so yeah,
yeah.
And also there are differenttypes of being submissive.
Right Were you into humiliation, so there's pain and pleasure.
So that's one thing I just wantto get to really like fold into
this.
This is about her journey.
I mean, we are in no way goingto be able to touch every kind
of dom sub dynamic.
(43:14):
There are so many different.
I am a sliver of the pie,sliver Right, and your primary
it sounds like your primarysubmissive type was restraint
impact.
I remember a littleelectrostimulation.
I may have been there for that.
That was great.
That was my first experiencewith it.
Speaker 2 (43:35):
I was like what the fuck?
Speaker 1 (43:37):
And now I'm like what the fuck?
What about humiliation?
Speaker 2 (43:44):
Ooh, I tried humiliation, but it's just
something that doesn't resonatefor me.
It just, yeah, it didn't feelgood like somebody tried
slapping me and I was like, oh,like there was just something,
that was just.
It felt too disrespectful in away to me and I, just when I get
into my subspace, I feel verylike goddess and to be slapped
or like spit on.
I was like that's taking meright out of my goddess space.
(44:05):
Yes, but you know what Somepeople want to be sub goddess,
and some people want to be dirtysub slut and you know what.
Whatever makes you feel goodand feel safe, and just as long
as you're feeling like respectedand's that's really important.
Speaker 1 (44:23):
All right.
So today you are single.
Today, have you dipped your toeinto being a dominant at all?
Have you tried that role?
I don't.
Have you tried that, have we?
Speaker 2 (44:33):
I have like with a woman I was dating, I kind of co
topped her with her malepartner.
Like with a woman I was dating,I kind of co-topped her with
her male partner and I reallydid enjoy that.
It wasn't necessarily likesuper sexual or turn on for me,
but it was like really nice toprovide that for my partner and
kind of like wield some of thatlike pleasure and power.
Speaker 1 (44:56):
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
Oh, trying to picture that, Ican kind of picture it, though I
don't know You've, I've, I'veknown you, you've gained this
kind of attitude.
Yeah, a little bit of a.
Speaker 2 (45:07):
Yeah, a little bit yeah.
Speaker 1 (45:09):
Do you find it hard to find people to top you now Um
?
Are you looking for?
Speaker 2 (45:20):
it.
Where are you at now in yourown journey?
I've carried so much of thatpleasure.
I'm so grateful for thatpleasure and I'm carrying so
(45:41):
much of that forward in my, inmy experiences, and even as I
masturbate and touch myself andtrying to find, like trying to
find that beautiful space again,like it won't be exact, I'm
coming close, coming, I got that.
So yeah, kind of that's, that'swhere I'm at.
I mean, it would be nice tofind, but we'll see Right, it's
(46:03):
a journey.
It's a journey and you knowwhat?
I'll probably never find thatsame thing again.
Speaker 1 (46:07):
But you could find something just as good or better
, but different, different, yeah, different.
That's kind of the way it is.
What are some things right nowthat you're like, oh, I kind of
want to try that.
Do you have anything on thehorizon that you're like I'd
like to try this thing?
I'd like to take myself.
Now that you're you know, youwent from literally vanilla to,
I mean again, folks.
(46:28):
I was in the room with them, soI know what that and I'm.
Can I just get my perspectivereally quick on my experience,
because I've never told thisstory in depth and I don't even
know if I can remember in detail, because it was more than once,
it was a couple times, right,see, that's where it like,
because it's a lot when you arein these intense sexual
(46:49):
situations, it's a lot.
It gets all blurred in yourhead in like the best of ways
and I only had really goodexperiences there.
But I was really into MissCarrie over here.
That was my main.
Was that an interesting dynamicfor you?
I've never even, I've nevereven asked her these questions.
Here you go, you get to be herefor it for the first time.
(47:09):
Folks, was that different foryou to have a woman that was
there, that you knew wasprimarily there for you.
Speaker 2 (47:16):
Um, yeah, yeah, I thought it was interesting, um,
and I think I'm somebody whodoesn't really like to be
perceived, so that's likesometimes why BDSM was hard,
because all the focus was on meand else to take, because it
would be a really sexy scene andI loved sitting there and kind
(47:46):
of like watching the two of youdo things and it was really
pleasurable for me.
Speaker 1 (47:55):
But very interesting and different, right right,
interesting and and differentright right.
well, I know that you didexpress at the time it was nice
to know that I was into you andthere was no like jealousy, uh,
that was going to come oh mygosh yes, of like me being like
oh, but I'm into this guy andyou're with him, like so all of
that was removed and from my endit was like what was happening
(48:17):
was like oh, to make you feelgood, like I knew he was gonna
be fine, he was gonna be fine,yeah, yeah I think, um, I really
appreciated that dynamicbecause I've had the experiences
where women you know they, theywere more interested in him and
then at points would ask him tobe exclusive and he was like
(48:38):
that's, that's not on the tablefor me, so right, um, and then
you know, even though I thoughtI was kind of maybe building a
friendship with these womensometimes and that that would
end right, so it was like awhole new thing to navigate I
was unique folks.
I was unique yeah that's what Itell myself, at least.
Um, all right.
So now, moving on from the endof this relationship where you
(49:01):
are now, you have all of thisexperience.
You've really found yourself asa submissive, which is
interesting to me, because evenin my own journey of knowing you
, I feel like you're outside ofthe bedroom.
Persona has evolved so much.
You are so much more decisiveand assertive and, yeah, I would
(49:23):
say, dominant.
Yeah, it is true, you're moredominant now in your everyday
life than when I met you.
Speaker 2 (49:30):
Yeah, and I think it was really kind of being in that
subspace, because you arereally in control of something
really important to you, yourpleasure, and you're the one
actually, at the end of the day,calling the shots.
You get to say yes or no to it.
Speaker 1 (49:47):
And yeah, it just it changed my brain right, right.
And I think you're just so opento experiences too.
Like sometimes we spend a lotof time, carrie and I, talking
about the things we're goingthrough now, um, and how we
perceive them, and and I wouldsay, like you, having gone
through what you have and I havenever gone through that sort of
awakening, not in that short aperiod of time, not that
(50:08):
profound, not with thatintensity for certain, and I
think for you it really openedup your just ability to perceive
things from a little bit moreof a non I want to say
non-emotional place but that'snot true A place of compassion
and kind of coming outside ofeverything and looking down at
it, where I get like caught upin the weeds of being in it.
(50:33):
We talk about that a lot and I'mlike I don't know, I'm not that
big of a person man, I can't dothat.
But so, from where you are now,with all of this growth and all
of this person man, I can't dothat.
But so, from where you are now,with all of this growth and all
of this perspective, what aresome things you're like I want,
I want to try this or that.
Here's maybe the next path I'lltake.
Do you have any of that mappedout?
What are you open to?
Speaker 2 (50:55):
I still feel open to so many things that I still
haven't tried, since the, themenu of things you can do, sex
wise and even within bdsm it's.
It's so long, um like, wesometimes played with shibari
and that was incredible and Iwent to somebody who who does
shibari professionally and did aphoto shoot and was suspended
(51:19):
and and bound and how safe thatfelt and God, it would be so
incredible to be suspended andalso have some like pleasure
going on too.
You and I should go to a class.
Speaker 1 (51:31):
That'd be fun.
You know what I know Carrie isopen to folks Sharing toys with
me and, lucky you, you can bepart of our experience because
she is joining me on two girlssharing toys with me.
And lucky you, you can be partof our experience because she is
joining me on two girls sharingtoys.
If you have not checked out mysex toy reviews, you should do
that now, hopefully, maybe not,maybe not.
But by the time this ispublished which is happening
(51:53):
really soon because we are inKing Tober we will have put
together some two girls sharingtoys, sex toys review reviews
and I have some that I'velaunched already with my
beautiful friend Andy.
But Carrie and I have beensharing toys and we have three
that we're getting ready toreview for you and we will be
(52:15):
launching.
So I know that she definitelyis ready for that and I want you
guys to check those out, seewhat toys we are going to be
looking into.
Who knows, maybe, since you'remy, you might be my kinkiest
girlfriend.
I don't know my othergirlfriend.
The minute anyone hears this,I'll get like the phone calls
like I'm kinkiest book.
What do you mean?
But I don't know.
(52:36):
You may be at the next levelthere.
Speaker 2 (52:42):
That's funny to hear you say, like from where I was
six years ago, to like you haveyour own podcast and here you
are, you're right, so my journeyhas been quite.
Speaker 1 (52:48):
I guess I'm totally different than when you yeah,
I'm in a way different place.
You're so different.
God.
We both have way better hairthan we did our.
Incredible when I think aboutwhat our hair looked like do you
remember our haircuts shorter?
Well, whatever we thought wewere cute we thought each other,
we were cute um, yeah.
So who knows, maybe we'll beable to get some kinky uh sex
(53:11):
toy products, uh, to try out youknow, separately, maybe you
never know and review for you.
So stay tuned to that.
Thank you for sharing.
There's so much to this storyand this guys.
This was just an overview, andlike sort of dipping the toe
into the water, of what it meansto be submissive, and I don't
(53:32):
know why I haven't done a lot ofcontent on it.
Maybe because I don't.
I don't personally, I've, Ihave, I have submissive goals.
I, I have submissive goals.
I have a submissive side to methat I enjoy.
I find it really hard to findpartners, though, who feel
comfortable dominating me.
I don't understand why, though.
Yeah, no, just joking, and I dolike being dominant a lot,
(53:57):
especially with women.
I think that's more natural forme.
I'm short, but I'm mighty right.
Yes, you are.
Thank you Can confirm.
But I do want to dive more intoit, and actually even for myself
, because I would love toexplore my own submissive side a
little bit more.
I just have no idea how to dothat.
(54:17):
So hopefully Carrie will joinme more and maybe we can start
drilling down into thesubmissive experience.
So seriously, if you havequestions about the submissive
experience, anything somethingyou want to know more about,
questions for Carrie uh, pleaseemail me at Annette at talk sex
with Annettecom, or draw you'reon my YouTube channel, which is
(54:40):
at TalkSexWithAnette.
You can drop a message or intothe comments section.
I will bring her back on.
We'll go through your questionstogether and answer them.
We could totally do that.
That would be super fun.
I'd love to.
You can scroll down and I'vegot my speak pipe.
You can send us a voice message.
We'd even play it right hereand then answer it on our video.
(55:02):
That would be super fun for us,because I do want to answer
your questions.
I know that people have a lotof questions about what it means
to be submissive and I don'tfucking know.
Speaker 2 (55:11):
She does, and I know just what I know is like one
part of an entire iceberg.
Speaker 1 (55:16):
But we also have a community that we can reach out
to.
A great community, a greatcommunity, and there are subs
out there, so many, yeah.
So we did it, we did it, we didit.
It's been a long time in thecoming Threesomes happened.
Lots of things happened Yearspassed.
Speaker 2 (55:33):
And here we are, here we are.
Speaker 1 (55:34):
Until next time, folks, I'll see you in the
locker room locker room Cheers.
Do the sex Think fun, honest and feminist as fuck,
(00:28):
and always with the goal offighting the patriarchy.
One female orgasm at a time.
Welcome to the locker room.
Today's locker room talk andshots topic is subspace
exploration One woman's journeyinto the heart of BDSM.
(00:51):
It is Kingtober folks, and ifyou've been with me for any time
now you know that I havethoroughly explored the Femme
Dom experience, cocks in cages,women caging cocks, controlling
men.
Well, this is actually, in all,three years, three plus years
(01:13):
of this podcast.
This is the first time I'vereally invited on a true sub
submissive, if you will, a womanwho went from being pretty
average Jane yeah, a mom, amother, a worker, just, you know
(01:35):
, normal vanilla lady to a realsub, a real submissive, an
experienced submissive, and I'mnot just talking about she takes
a couple of spankings.
Our interview today with my verygood friend, carrie is going to
take you deep into what itmeans to become a submissive,
who really is submissive and hasexplored that power exchange
(02:02):
thoroughly, and I have witnessedsome of it.
Just saying we will get to that.
She's actually been mentionedin some past podcasts, but
you're gonna have to go back andlisten to all of my episodes to
find the little Easter eggs,but first before we dive in.
So this is Carrie.
If you are a listener, you canhead over to my YouTube channel
at TalkSexWithAnnette and youcan see Keri's beautiful face
(02:27):
and mine.
Keri is here today.
She is.
You are a submissive at heart,though I know you have now
dipped your toes in otherexperiences, but can you tell my
listeners just a little bitmore about you, who you are,
what you want to, what do youwant to share?
Speaker 2 (02:44):
little bit more about you, who you are, what you want
to, what do you want to share?
Yeah, just right now I'm livingmy best single life, but I've
gone through this journey inthis past six years.
That was incredible and it wasprofound and it changed me.
It changed the way I thinkabout the world around me and
about myself, and, man, I'm justkind of really excited to share
(03:06):
my perspective, basically.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
Right.
Right, Because it was a journeyand I actually don't even know
all of the details and Carrieand I are very good friends, so
a lot of this will kind of be myfirst time really hearing the
step-by-step process of how shewent from being vanilla like
maybe some of you are, althoughI don't think all of you, I know
I got a good following ofpeople who aren't, and so I
(03:31):
think for King Tober this time.
Usually I kick it off with alot of like male chastity stuff
and dominating men stuff, butthis is going to be a new take.
So if you are curious aboutwhat it really is like to be a
submissive, if you think youmight have a little bit of a
submissive in you, if you wantto explore that a little bit,
(03:52):
this is going to be a greatepisode for you.
Or if you're looking for a sub,this would be a great episode
to give to your potential sub.
So, hey, I'm ready.
I'm ready to talk about sex andBDSM, being submissive.
I think the best way to startthis episode is just to start at
the beginning.
(04:12):
You are not a submissive yet.
It is what?
Six years ago?
Six years ago, and you moved toPortland.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
I know that backstory , so she moves to Portland go,
move to Portland and spend a fewweeks getting a lay of the land
, and then I decide I want tostart dating and in my last
relationship, which was prettyvanilla, I'd always kind of been
drawn and intrigued by kink butdidn't know how to pursue it
(04:40):
and also was just like felt likeit was deeply wrong pursue it
and also was just like felt likeit was deeply wrong.
Um, so got here and it wasstill in the back of my mind but
um was swiping through peopleon bumble and came across, uh,
this man who happened to mentionin his profile like he was
looking for um, a woman who waslike open and kink, friendly,
(05:07):
and so I actually engaged withher because I was, like you said
, kink, I'm really curious andand so that kind of like sparked
a conversation and it was, itwas pretty great.
We planned to meet prettyquickly.
Quickly and we went on ourfirst date and um, wow, it was,
(05:28):
it was pretty incredible.
We went to McMinimins, which isalways a great, great first date
spot, and, um, we sat down andhe was talking about a lot about
BDSM and kink and he wastalking about it in a way that
was like so genuine and warm andhe made it feel a lot less
(05:50):
scary and so this was the firstperson I'd ever really spoken to
about kink, about BDSM and man.
He was just such a gentlemanand he made it seem so
approachable gentleman.
And he made it seem soapproachable and was just really
respectful.
Yeah, so I was like tell memore, Right?
Speaker 1 (06:15):
So first date, what is he telling you about it?
Though, Just out of curiosity,if you had been vanilla and he
made it feel comfortable, like,how does he bring this up in a
way that you're not like whoabuddy, we're on a, you know?
Speaker 2 (06:23):
Oh sure he was talking about.
He asked me kind of about myexperience and what I was
curious about, because I hadasked him about the kink portion
and he was talking about someof his past experiences, his
kink experiences, some sceneshe'd done with some women he had
dated before.
What did he tell you?
Speaker 1 (06:44):
do you remember the first scenes he shared with you
that piqued your interest anddidn't freak you out?
Speaker 2 (06:49):
um it was talking about.
He mentioned like, like bondage, and I that's that's always
appealed to me and we can getmore into that um, like some
bondage scenes, um, what?
Um, there's there's other wordsfor this, but basically he
called it forced orgasms.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
That's what we called it forced orgasms yeah, um, I
would love someone to force meto have an orgasm.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
That is just not something that, as ever, you
know, yeah um, and so he wasdescribing some of those, and I
was just enthralled it was.
I was like oh god, I was justlike allalled it was.
I was like oh God, I was justlike all worked up.
Speaker 1 (07:27):
I was like tell me more, so he intrigues you.
It's your first date.
Do you go home and taste?
Did you get a little tasty poo?
Speaker 2 (07:37):
I did, I did, I did Wait, wait, wait.
Speaker 1 (07:42):
Before we go on because I do know I've got a
large male listenership Do nottake this conversation as a on
your first date.
Tell her about your BDSMexperience and try and get her
to come home.
You, you will fuck yourself up,like don't.
Just just to be clear, this wasa very specific situation that
(08:04):
just happened to go right,mm-hmm.
Right, yeah, right people righttime.
Right people, right time.
Trying to keep men on the righttrack on their birthstates.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
Like I felt chemistry and he felt very respectful
through the conversation.
I felt like he was reading kindof my body language whether I
wanted it more or less.
Yeah, he was just very aware sothat made it very comfortable.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
So he was like come back to my casbah.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
I actually invited him back to my place.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
That is not very submissive of you.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
No, it wasn't so new to it.
I was like what is this?
So that was great, because thatnight I squirted for the very
first time.
He made that happen for me andI didn't even realize my body
could do that like I'd seen itin porn before and I was like
what?
What is really going on there?
I wasn't.
(08:54):
I wasn't even sure it was areal thing.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
Ironically, at least probably a year later, we would
squirt together.
He sure did.
He was back to the story so hemade you squirt, was he did?
Did he do any new bd like bdsme, things like how did you start
to?
Speaker 2 (09:16):
yeah, um, not on that first date, it was on the
second date.
How do you make you squirt then?
Okay, it was just um, at theend of the uh, like while we
were playing, he was like let's,let's try this.
And he, he went and got a towelfrom my bathroom and put it
underneath my bottom, thoughtfuland I wasn't even completely
sure what was going on.
And so then, like you know, heput his fingers in and started
like pulling down, um, and I wasjust like, and you know, it
(09:40):
almost feels like you're goingto yes, it does.
And I was like fighting againstit and and he was like, just
just relax, just just let go.
And I he was a paramedic and afirefighter, so I was like you
know what, if I pee, I pee, he'sinto it.
Like just why not?
just just like used to it, he'sdealt with bodily fluids, fuck
(10:03):
it I don't feel a sense of shameabout what's about to happen,
because he's he's makingsomething happen so yeah, just
like let go and was able tosquirt.
But that's, it was the firstdate, so it was the second date
where things really gotinteresting.
Speaker 1 (10:15):
Okay, let's get to the second day.
So the first date.
He makes you squirt your highfive.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
You send him on his way not submissive at all, but
then you talk and he's likelet's, and you're like yeah yes,
after I leave, the next morninghe sends me a picture and says
so much more exploring to do.
And it's this steamer trunk atthe end of a bed and it's lit,
is open, and it's got thesecrisscross like kind of red
(10:40):
ropes and I see like um, likefloggers and riding crops and a
cane tucked into it.
And then it's deep below and Isee things I don't understand in
that trunk.
I'm like I don't know how thatfunctions, but it was like you
know, as I come to find out,there's like anal hooks and butt
(11:00):
plugs and big dildos and allkinds of toys in there.
So, um, so as soon as he sentthat photo I was like, oh my.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
God, and so you weren't intimidated by it, you
were just curious.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
I was curious and again, he just made it feel
really safe and like he wasmatching my pace and wasn't
pushing me into anything.
He was just like you seemcurious about this.
Let me here's this information,Right.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
So things I want to point out like because I think
in these episodes, podcastepisodes, I think I need to do a
better job of pointing outthings that work.
I love the word curiosity.
When you approach anything withcuriosity instead of skepticism
or judgment, you open yourselfto more possibilities.
I love that you bring upsecurity, especially when it has
(11:46):
to do with sex or newexperiences, anything BDSM.
The first thing you have to dois lay the ground for people to
feel secure and safe, right,yeah, so just putting out those
words, I love them.
So you set up the second date,and where, where did you meet
for that?
Speaker 2 (12:02):
So, um, we went to his house, Just started right
there, yeah, okay.
So we arrive at his house andso we go into his bedroom and
we're kissing and dressing, andthen he kind of like bends,
turns like we're kissing upagainst the side of the bed, and
then he turns me around andlike bends me forward over the
bed and then he puts some cuffsaround my wrists and my ankles
(12:27):
and then he's got this beautiful, like like wood, deep wood,
colored, four poster bed and hehas straps that he pulls out and
he like ties me in and, um,wait, did he ask you ahead of
time what you were comfortable?
Speaker 1 (12:41):
was there like, did you have a conversation?
Speaker 2 (12:44):
we did kind of talk about what you were interested,
what I was interested okay, yeah, and that was also hard to
tease out for me, because it'slike being, you know, passing a
restaurant outside on the streetand somebody saying, what do
you want to order from thisrestaurant?
I'm like I don't know what theyhave on the menu, I don't know
what's possible, right?
So he was asking me, and Ithink he was probing to see what
I might, because I didn't knowhow to articulate what I wanted
(13:06):
because I was so unfamiliar.
So, um, I had definitelyexpressed an interest in being
restrained and so, um, so yeah,like cuffs out on, like pulled,
and he, even before he tightenedit, he just like took a moment.
He was like, do you have anyshoulder injuries?
and I was like no, oh,thoughtful, and then like that
quickly like and firmly, verysexily, like pulled it and like
(13:29):
a very taut and it wow, um.
And then, like it did the samewith my legs, but so that they
were spread and, um, the cuffswere really soft and it's not
like they were handcuffs, theywere really soft so that like
felt like a nice little hug andsecure and it started to feel
like being like really kind ofheld and that like felt really
nice.
Um.
So, yeah, he took out hisflogger and was doing working
(13:53):
with that and I was right, allright, wait, so you've never
like, let's not just skip over.
Speaker 1 (13:57):
Okay, now he's flogging her.
Yeah, so had you beeninterested?
Had you ever experienced impactplay before?
Never, but you were curious,it's very curious.
And did he ask you what tostart with, or were you just
like?
Speaker 2 (14:12):
he?
Um?
No, no, I think he was feelingit out, he was he was I noticed
he started out with all thesofter things and he seemed
again just very like, focused onme and my reaction it didn't
feel ever feel like he was doingit for his pleasure.
Speaker 1 (14:31):
It felt like he was do you know, if he was a sadist,
that doesn't sound verysadistic.
There are different types ofdoms like sadists really just
love to hurt people, and thenthere are doms who just love.
I guess that it's not reallyabout just hurting someone, it's
just about the power play.
Speaker 2 (14:49):
Um, God, that's a great question.
I need to reflect on that more.
Speaker 1 (14:52):
So the first time, uh , you were.
Do you remember?
The first time you were struck?
You experienced the impact,what your thought was what your
feeling was.
Speaker 2 (15:02):
Um, I was really into it because, as somebody who
struggles with attention andthen also, you know, sometimes
you get into a sex space and Ithink I don't know if it for me
sex felt so heavy that it feltlike a performative space too.
And this was taking that awaybecause it was slowly like
(15:24):
getting some genuine reactionfrom me.
And so I'll also tell you that,as he started to kind of up the
impact into something like thethuddy things, like the big kind
of what's the word?
I'm looking for.
The floggers, the thuddyfloggers started to move into
like riding crops and paddles,something a little more sharp.
(15:46):
So then he took out his magicwand and was like putting it
between my legs, so kind ofstarting to mix some like
pleasure and a little bit ofpain, and so that felt really
good and it was again keeping mybrain really present, in a way
that it was like helping meenjoy the pleasure and be
present and in my body, because,like my brain couldn't really
(16:09):
escape anywhere else, because,like, be here, now something's
happening to your body so it wasreally mixing that, um,
bringing in the pleasure andpain, do you know, like clearly,
from those beginning days ofjust trying out the different
types of impact play.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
So, just for people who haven't done this, there are
different types of impactimplements.
So there are floggers that canbe a lot lighter.
Then you can get floggers thatare heavier and cause kind of
more pain.
That are heavier and cause kindof more pain.
(16:49):
You can what writing crops aregoing to be sharper, kind of
pain, and then bamboo which is I.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
I hate to love it and love to hate it I'm not love it
at all.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
Uh, yeah, so I want to ask you what?
So tell what.
What kind of um impact andinstruments do you like the most
?
Speaker 2 (17:06):
I can occasionally.
You know my pain, tolerancechanges from day to day, so it
really depends Am I well rested,am I well hydrated?
Speaker 1 (17:13):
Emotionally.
I think that's an importantthing to share with people too.
I think people don't realize,like people think you have one
kind of pain, tolerance and itreally and as a woman who's
highly tattooed, I can tell youand has done months and months
and years of tattoos like it isstrange, what you can take and
what you enjoy maybe one dayversus the next day can change
(17:34):
drastically and I don't know ifthis is the way it is for you.
So I am a switch, I'm like ahardcore switch.
I might be.
I'm, I'm pretty half and half,wouldn't you say.
I mean, you've seen me more asa dominant than a submissive.
I would say Um, but when I havebeen in the submissive role, one
thing that I think is importantfor me is to work up like start
(18:00):
the pain low and then work itup to whatever it is I feel like
I can take.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:06):
Is that, or do you like to just go hard?
Are you a go hard or go homegirl?
Speaker 2 (18:10):
Again, it depends on the day, I might be able to just
go really hard and some days Ireally have to work into it and
keep it just low.
But I think something aboutbeing present really taught me
is how much fear is built intopain.
Because I noticed in thebeginning, like when we were
first establishing how much, inthe moment when the impact play
(18:30):
started to build, how much I'dkind of be bracing and
tightening up like ready for thenext impact and but you know,
in the moments after it would bethis, this impact, and then
your body would kind of buzzfrom it and just to like let go
into that sensation and andenjoy it, like your endorphins
going after that impact.
(18:51):
And really learning to let goof the fear of, like what's
coming next and truly be presentand that's like kind of what
started to change across my lifeis like not living in the fear,
really being in the present,you know, instead of
anticipating the next shoedropping so at what point?
Speaker 1 (19:08):
you have this first experience, and so what you he
in this first experience.
He starts, he like fucking,straps you up to fucking say I
know the bed.
I know exactly how she wastripped up and you experience
the impact play yeah, he mixesin the pleasure.
That's your first experience.
(19:30):
I assume it ends in sex.
Were there any new experiencesin that first play session?
Speaker 2 (19:37):
Let's see Squirted again.
It was definitely the impactplay and different positions.
And this is where I'm going tosay I dated this man for over
like close to six years andnever repeat performance.
He was a Picasso of pleasureand pain in the bedroom.
Speaker 1 (19:57):
He really was creative.
He was so creative andcreativity and sex go together.
Well, I mean, I don't thinkpeople get creative enough in
the bedroom.
So you did some squirting.
Then you had PNV sex.
Was that always part of yourdynamic?
Yes, always.
(20:17):
It always ended in that in that.
All right, so you get done, uh,you high five and go home, or
do you stay the night?
Um, I stayed the night.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
yes, um, that's sweet .
Yeah, it's sweet.
Um, but he was a firefighterand left at like four in the
morning for a shift, so he leftme with a magic wand and was
like, please masturbate in themorning and did you I did I sure
did, I, sure did.
I want to make sure my thesheet smelled like me when he
got back home.
You marked your territory.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
All right, so you leave and you are sitting in
that space of like what just had.
This is your first experience.
What was that?
Like the, the aftermath, wow.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
I just I couldn't wait to have more and explore
more.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
I just felt.
Speaker 2 (20:59):
That's when I kind of started looking at toys and
looking what I could have andstarting to be more curious
about my own pleasure, like howcan I touch my body.
And at the time he was startingto like give me instructions.
He's like I want you to have atleast two orgasms a day.
Like want you to get to knowyour body.
Speaker 1 (21:16):
He virtually gave you a assignment, so it went hard
quick with the two of you.
He was like, he was like, allright, so this is going to
continue and this is how itcontinues, lower apart.
Speaker 2 (21:25):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, we had some really good
chemistry, yeah, just I feltgreat.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (21:57):
So at this point did you start looking into, like am
I?
At what point did you go?
I think I'm a submissive, I.
Or was there a moment whereyou're like I wonder if I would
like to be a dom or this thing?
And I think, like we were bothnon-monogamous and he was dating
other women and then sometimes,as you know, sometimes other
women would join us.
And I remember seeing aconversation where he was yeah.
I remember seeing aconversation where he was
telling a woman yeah, I'm, I'm,I'm dumb, and, and Carrie is
(22:18):
more submissive, and I was likewhat's that?
Speaker 1 (22:21):
So that's when you so .
So all right, Was that wellinto the really?
At what point Did you just keepkind of doing this thing with
him?
Speaker 2 (22:30):
And then one day he says that I think it was it was
several months into therelationship when I had seen
those terms and at the same timehe'd encouraged me to go to
this, uh, women's group that metat a local sex club and it was
for women who were swinger, poly, non-monogamous ethically, you
know, just just very sexpositive, I mean we'll plug it
(22:52):
right now If you are in Portland, it is called.
Speaker 1 (22:55):
well, now it's called .
Speaker 2 (22:56):
Now it's called broadcast and it's open to
anybody who would feel at homein a femme space.
Speaker 1 (23:04):
I may go on occasion.
We may go on occasion.
Yes, you have this first date.
You go home.
He's giving you assignments.
I assume you're gettingtogether how frequently?
Speaker 2 (23:15):
assignments.
I assume you're gettingtogether how frequently?
Speaker 1 (23:17):
um, at that point I think it was about twice a week.
So, and what is he adding in?
Like you've already, you'reexperiencing all the different
types of impact.
What are some other things youstart to experience, and at what
point?
Because clearly there's a pointwhere other women are starting
to be invited in.
It becomes more of not aone-on-one situation.
And was that hard for you?
Like when you realized that wasgoing to happen?
Speaker 2 (23:38):
like Okay, both great questions.
So your first question wastalking about how things more
got introduced.
Yeah, we would keep going ondates and then he would do
something different, like onetime he had a remote controlled
vibrator in me and as I wasordering dinner he was like
messing with it and I was justlike struggling to keep a face
(24:01):
to order while he was playingwith that.
And then another time we wentand saw a movie and it was my
first time like with a butt plugand it was like the enjoy the
extra large, weighted butt plugand man, that was.
I really felt that.
But you know what that madeanal, like the beginning of
having anal sex, just so muchmore comfortable, a lot more
(24:26):
pleasurable.
Yeah, so that was great.
So it was he always, always wewere having dates and doing
little ideas.
We'd go to, maybe like loversor you know, some of the local
sex shops and kind of like shopfor things together.
He'd ask me what was making mecurious.
And then we visited some of thelocal sex clubs several times
(24:53):
and it was.
I remember this moment.
We were at the sex club and, man, he was kind of pushing me up
against a window where thiscouple was playing on the in the
bedroom on the other side ofthe window and he was kind of
like rubbing up against me and Ikept on wanting to, like you
know, hide my face so that thesepeople didn't see me staring at
them.
And he kept on like moving myhead and he was like I want you
(25:14):
to watch while I touch you and Iwas like, okay, it was, it was
just really great it was.
He was always doing somethingfun and new and interesting and
again kept on asking me likewhat my desires were and kind of
teasing those out in just a waythat felt really like safe for
me.
Speaker 1 (25:34):
What was the first time you experienced what is
known as subspace, and could youexplain to people what subspace
is?
Speaker 2 (25:41):
Okay, yeah, I think it was several times in when he
had we had impact play and hehad a hard point in his bedroom
and if you don't know what itwas, it's just like, uh, like a
really intense um it's, it'slike a hook you can put in it,
um, and he had it hidden, hiddenbehind a, um, a smoke alarm.
(26:03):
So he had that in his bedroomand I was suspended from that
and um he was.
He had Velcroed somethingaround my thigh and it was um in
it.
He tucked the magic wand, so itwas like right against my bits
and, uh, pussy, pussy my pussy.
Speaker 1 (26:22):
It was right there, my pit.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
I like that um, and yeah, so I was standing up and
he was going and man, I justreached this buzzy, beautiful
space where I kind of let go of,like I don't know all the like
again the performative elementsof sex and I was like really in
(26:48):
my pleasure and he was reallyserving my pleasure Like he got
off from like giving, so likevery focused on me and again he
provided a very non-judgmentalspace.
He was a paramedic, so I wasn'ttoo worried about letting go or
anything too terrible happening.
It was a great foundation onwhich to explore.
(27:13):
And yeah, so I was entering thatsubspace and again, very just
like buzzy, beautiful, freeing,and afterward when we'd play
like that and I would reach thatlike subspace where it's just,
I tend to go a little nonverbal,so I need to, I need
instruction, like go herehelping you know, do this next
thing, um, but yeah, and thenlike hold afterward, because you
(27:36):
really you know it's thatoxytocin that's really going
after an orgasm and that kind ofexperience and, um, like really
making the most of it as it'sin your bloodstream at what
point were you like okay, I'msubmissive, like that's, that's
my thing, that's my, this is whoI am um?
I think it was pretty early on,after he had kind of I'd seen
that conversation and I was like, and I was looking it up and I
(27:57):
was like, oh, oh, that's me.
And then after that he had sentme around that time he'd also
sent me that, which is that aBDSM test?
Speaker 1 (28:05):
that I think everybody takes and I was like
one of the highest rated thingswas just being yeah, yeah, being
submissive and I mean by thetime I met you, you like you
really had a pain, tolerance andinterest that was beyond, like,
definitely beyond mine, yeah,and was that something that
(28:27):
built over time, and was thatsomething that you desired or
that you just like?
How did that?
Speaker 2 (28:32):
how did that happen for you?
That was something I reallyplayed with.
A lot was kind of exploring theedges of pain and pleasure, and
I really liked taking it to theedge because I think the more I
took it to the edge, the more Ifelt I was in this really buzzy
subspace.
(28:52):
That felt really beautiful andfreeing to me.
Oh, you know what?
I want to circle back around tothe question you had about
other women, and I think, comingfrom monogamous relationships,
that was I.
You know, it was kind of alwayslike well, he's been with her
for several hours and I haven'theard and it's everything okay
(29:13):
and oh my God, am I going tolose this amazing thing?
You know a lot of thatinsecurity playing.
But early, very early on, hehad given me the ethical slut
and so I had read that and Ilove that he gave that to me so
early because I felt like itreally set the foundation of
(29:34):
understanding the dynamic thatcould exist there that, like you
, won't be there.
There's so many beautifulthings in that book, but it
really kind of kind of opened mymind to this idea of, like,
romance and pleasure.
It doesn't have to look the waywe've always been told it has a
really beautiful way it canlook Right.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
I'm going to fast forward, though, just to be
clear.
Like I met the two of them andyou say that I was on the dating
apps and I met both of them,you say I matched with him first
, but I swear to God, I rememberit as matching with both of you
and talking to you first.
Okay, let's talk about it.
Speaker 2 (30:15):
We're gonna look, we are going to problem solve a
problem we have here, okay Ifelt like, um, I had seen you on
bumble and I remembered youbecause you had these like
beautiful pictures that weremostly white, but then you had
your black hair and I think youwere in yoga poses, and then I'm
not sure that like you and Iactually, and so you talked to
(30:39):
him and then but then we didmatch then we did at some point
yeah, so maybe.
Speaker 1 (30:44):
I looked for you afterwards because he maybe he
shared a picture of you and thenwe met and my interest was
primarily with Carrie.
I mean, mean, clearly it waslike clear, and so I was never
in the situation where you werenever in the situation with me,
(31:04):
where I was alone with him.
He was in the situation thatyou and I spent time alone
together.
But I know because he wouldcould ask about that, and I'm
like yeah, yeah, I'm not gonnado that yeah, I mean he was, he
was fine and good and everything, but I like the girlies, um.
so just to clarify but you therewas this dynamic did so, but
(31:28):
for you guys mostly it would behim.
He would meet women and yeah,but you guys came out together
to meet me, yeah, and did you dothat typically with other women
?
Speaker 2 (31:39):
We did a handful of times.
Yeah, I think I was also tryingto match with women at the time
, just very embracing the ideaof ethical non monogamy and
trying to find people who wouldkind of fill more of my
emotional bucket and and so likeI was kind of meeting people
(32:00):
like that, but it wasn't a Venndiagram of people who would be
good for play for all three ofus, as opposed to like meeting
my needs over here.
Speaker 1 (32:08):
Yeah, that's hard, that's a hard thing to do.
So, along with impact play,being a submissive, there's more
to being submissive than justimpact play.
We obviously have focused onthat also, because I know that
that's that was kind of a bigpart of your journey.
But can you talk about otheraspects of being a submissive
that you experienced and enjoyedand discovered on your path,
(32:31):
because not all submissives evenenjoy impact play?
Speaker 2 (32:34):
correct, sure, correct, sure yeah, no, there's
what a spectrum of experiencesyou can have as a sub.
Um, yeah, like he'doccasionally kind of remind me
to do things like it was reallynice, kind of caring stuff you
tend to hear about like doms whoreally take care of their subs,
so like, have you had watertoday?
Have you eaten?
(32:55):
How did you sleep?
Are you taking care of yourself?
Yeah, and kind of pushing mesometimes toward my goals, like
he's like I would like you when,when I was struggling with my
work.
He's like before we see eachother again, I want to see 10
applications that you've sentout to new jobs.
Speaker 1 (33:13):
Right, okay, right.
Okay, right so doing some ofthat self growth kind of thing.
When you brought a third personin, what did that look like?
You being submissive?
Speaker 2 (33:27):
Um, it was a lot of like him directing and I think
it was so important for mebecause I think a lot of the
women knew that they were cominginto an established
relationship.
I didn't want them to feel likethere was competition or I was
going to be jealous.
It was like a lot of my focuswas on the woman whenever she
came, like on her pleasure andtrying to, because I thought
(33:48):
like he had created such abeautiful thing for me and I was
able to access that space withhim and I wanted other women to
experience that too, like so Imean that was that helped
mitigate some of my feelings oflike, like the, the jealousy
that can creep in sometimes,that that really helped it.
But, like in the bedroom andthere was other women, I think
(34:11):
the submissive side really cameout as like he was kind of
directing the scene and kind oftaking a more dominant role,
like, um, if we ventured intoany kind of play, really he was,
he was the one that was thedirector of it.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
Well, a lot of people talk about how submissives also
have power in the relationship.
Uh, how would you say thatshowed up in your experience and
did you feel powerful in yourexperience?
Speaker 2 (34:37):
I think I did because I felt like whatever was
happening in the bedroom, I hadthe final say.
I could say I don't want thisto happen anymore.
I was the one who was givingpermission for this to happen
and I was giving that permissionbecause I felt so safe.
Yeah, the trust that has tohappen to be that vulnerable, to
(34:59):
be tied up and let yourself goand let yourself have these
multiple orgasms where you'relike I might squirt, I might pee
, I don't know what's going tohappen.
Speaker 1 (35:09):
So, yeah, right, you felt like you, in the end had
the final word, even though hewas the one directing yes, so it
did make you feel powerful.
It did.
Speaker 2 (35:17):
And you know what I wrote down this little thing
that I had read, powerful it did.
And you know what I wrote downthis little thing that I had
read oh, the surrender in itfelt very peaceful and kind of
even my own control in thesituation.
That it felt like shelter.
It felt like a safe shelter.
Speaker 1 (35:33):
In this journey.
So, because this happened oversix years, right, what?
Over six years?
What are things that grew andexpanded Like from you know your
think about your first date tolike this place in your life now
?
Speaker 2 (35:49):
Yeah, I felt like I mean it to take a long way to
chip away those performativeelements, even though, like he
had taken me into the spacewhere I could be a sub.
It was still like really tryingto fight through the chatter in
my mind, like the idea that youhave to perform.
Am I making noises?
Do I, as he's folding me up intwo?
(36:10):
Do I still look sexy?
We all feel that yes, yeah, andI think near the end there was
a lot there.
There was, there was fewer, wewere doing less BDSM and that
was fine.
But it was like we had come tothis space where, like he really
(36:31):
knew my body and knew how tomake me react and would spend an
entire hour doing all thesedifferent scenes, making me come
in different ways in differentpositions, was always happy to
do what I asked.
But, like, the orgasms Istarted to have became like
(36:53):
profound and existential and Ifelt like it was, it was, it was
just, it was really incredible.
It was really incredible.
It almost having those playsessions with him.
It felt like it becamespiritual, like I had a whole
routine of getting ready beforeand like shaving myself and
perfuming myself and putting onmy best lotion and getting in
(37:15):
that that space, like almostlike the way people would
prepare for church, like justvery mindfully and very
thoughtfully, almost like theway people would prepare for
church, like just very mindfullyand very thoughtfully, because
really man accessing that spacewith him it felt like heaven,
like in a way I can't even beginto describe it.
It was so incredible and howdid it affect?
other areas of your life.
(37:35):
Okay, that was again.
I talked about how the pain andlearning to not fear what's
coming next, just kind of beingvery present in the moment, that
was a huge thing.
It made me, like, moreconfident because here's
(37:55):
somebody who has seen me at mymost vulnerable and they are
still there.
They are still there, theystill care about me, they still
love me.
Um, it made me more confidentat work, um, and then also man,
he set off amazing things in mylife.
Like I met really amazing sexpositive like me and um, and it
(38:18):
put me so in touch with, like mysexuality, which had been
deeply buried for so long, andrealize how much of a like a
sexual being I am.
And, um, I think it made mecome across as more confident.
I feel like it just made memore open and seeing how
non-judgmental like him holdingthis really amazing
(38:38):
non-judgmental space, likereally holding this really
amazing non-judgmental spacelike really taught me how to
hold that for myself and forothers.
Speaker 1 (38:45):
Before we move on, because I want to get to kind of
where you're at now, but beforewe move on, are there any
experiences in particular, orthings about this journey into
subspace, into becoming a subrather, that you would really
like to share and let listenersknow about?
Who are curious, who you know,think maybe you know there, I
(39:08):
think there are a lot of peoplewho are like.
I want to, I want to bedominated, but they don't know
what, what that all really means, sure.
Speaker 2 (39:14):
Sure, um, I think the one thing you'll probably see
as you look online look out forthe fake doms, the people who
are asking like you should callme daddy right away, and you
need to do this right awaybefore, like, any sort of trust
is established.
I think that's really importantfor people to understand and I
think it's important to do someof the reading, do the work,
(39:34):
educate yourself.
I'm so grateful I had thatfoundation Because, like I had
this educational foundation onwhich to build what was
happening next, instead ofsomebody else kind of driving
the train on my experience, so Ithink that was really helpful.
Speaker 1 (39:52):
Also, how much pain you take and can take does not
dictate how good of a submissiveyou are.
It's so true like if anyone'strying to tell you like I had,
uh, an experience in myrelationship with someone who
was more dominant than me, wherethe the pain dynamic, the way
(40:17):
the pain was being delivered,was unpleasant to me, and I
would say, hello, I would belike that's too much and they
would basically mock me for notbeing able to take as much and,
you know, make comments likekind of cutting me down, uh,
like about, like I was kind of awuss and that that should be a
(40:42):
red flag for you.
That should be a red flag foryou.
You don't have to be someonethat can go from zero to 100.
Like if someone just startswailing on you and they may tell
you that your ability orinability to withstand that
dictates how good of asubmissive you are, that should
(41:03):
be a red flag to you.
This is someone like a good Dom, someone who is someone who
cares about you.
First of all, is someone who iswants to bring you into the
pain and pleasure dynamic in away that creates an ecstasy for
you.
Yeah, they don't want to liketraumatize you and hurt you and
(41:27):
you don't have to be able totake as much pain.
I don't feel like I'm any lessof when I am submissive a sub
than Carrie, because I don'twant as much pain as she does.
It's all about what your bodyenjoys and reacts to.
So watch for red flags.
(41:48):
Watch for red flags.
And it can be hard.
Because I would say this whenyou say that the bond with
someone who you've had thatexperience with is so strong,
when you've allowed someone A touh make you that vulnerable,
restraining and, and you know,bringing about this pain
(42:09):
pleasure dynamic, it can bereally hard to say to them I'm
not enjoying that, yeah, likethis, I'm not enjoying this, but
it's super important for you,for your dom, to make you feel
safe doing that and to be ableto take your feedback.
And it sounds like he did that.
He was very much that way.
Like you should be able to givegood feedback.
Speaker 2 (42:28):
Yeah, and a good Dom will look for you to speak up to
yours for yourself.
Like we'll encourage it.
Be like like even with evenwith my partner he would.
He'd be like what kind of icecream do you want?
And I'd show someindecisiveness because I'm a
lifelong people pleaser.
And he'd be like if you don'tpick this ice cream out, I'm
going to pull down your pantsright here and everybody in the
(42:50):
store is going to come spank you.
Speaker 1 (42:54):
And you're like I'm not picking anything, so yeah,
yeah.
And also there are differenttypes of being submissive.
Right Were you into humiliation, so there's pain and pleasure.
So that's one thing I just wantto get to really like fold into
this.
This is about her journey.
I mean, we are in no way goingto be able to touch every kind
of dom sub dynamic.
(43:14):
There are so many different.
I am a sliver of the pie,sliver Right, and your primary
it sounds like your primarysubmissive type was restraint
impact.
I remember a littleelectrostimulation.
I may have been there for that.
That was great.
That was my first experiencewith it.
Speaker 2 (43:35):
I was like what the fuck?
Speaker 1 (43:37):
And now I'm like what the fuck?
What about humiliation?
Speaker 2 (43:44):
Ooh, I tried humiliation, but it's just
something that doesn't resonatefor me.
It just, yeah, it didn't feelgood like somebody tried
slapping me and I was like, oh,like there was just something,
that was just.
It felt too disrespectful in away to me and I, just when I get
into my subspace, I feel verylike goddess and to be slapped
or like spit on.
I was like that's taking meright out of my goddess space.
(44:05):
Yes, but you know what Somepeople want to be sub goddess,
and some people want to be dirtysub slut and you know what.
Whatever makes you feel goodand feel safe, and just as long
as you're feeling like respectedand's that's really important.
Speaker 1 (44:23):
All right.
So today you are single.
Today, have you dipped your toeinto being a dominant at all?
Have you tried that role?
I don't.
Have you tried that, have we?
Speaker 2 (44:33):
I have like with a woman I was dating, I kind of co
topped her with her malepartner.
Like with a woman I was dating,I kind of co-topped her with
her male partner and I reallydid enjoy that.
It wasn't necessarily likesuper sexual or turn on for me,
but it was like really nice toprovide that for my partner and
kind of like wield some of thatlike pleasure and power.
Speaker 1 (44:56):
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
Oh, trying to picture that, Ican kind of picture it, though I
don't know You've, I've, I'veknown you, you've gained this
kind of attitude.
Yeah, a little bit of a.
Speaker 2 (45:07):
Yeah, a little bit yeah.
Speaker 1 (45:09):
Do you find it hard to find people to top you now Um
?
Are you looking for?
Speaker 2 (45:20):
it.
Where are you at now in yourown journey?
I've carried so much of thatpleasure.
I'm so grateful for thatpleasure and I'm carrying so
(45:41):
much of that forward in my, inmy experiences, and even as I
masturbate and touch myself andtrying to find, like trying to
find that beautiful space again,like it won't be exact, I'm
coming close, coming, I got that.
So yeah, kind of that's, that'swhere I'm at.
I mean, it would be nice tofind, but we'll see Right, it's
(46:03):
a journey.
It's a journey and you knowwhat?
I'll probably never find thatsame thing again.
Speaker 1 (46:07):
But you could find something just as good or better
, but different, different, yeah, different.
That's kind of the way it is.
What are some things right nowthat you're like, oh, I kind of
want to try that.
Do you have anything on thehorizon that you're like I'd
like to try this thing?
I'd like to take myself.
Now that you're you know, youwent from literally vanilla to,
I mean again, folks.
(46:28):
I was in the room with them, soI know what that and I'm.
Can I just get my perspectivereally quick on my experience,
because I've never told thisstory in depth and I don't even
know if I can remember in detail, because it was more than once,
it was a couple times, right,see, that's where it like,
because it's a lot when you arein these intense sexual
(46:49):
situations, it's a lot.
It gets all blurred in yourhead in like the best of ways
and I only had really goodexperiences there.
But I was really into MissCarrie over here.
That was my main.
Was that an interesting dynamicfor you?
I've never even, I've nevereven asked her these questions.
Here you go, you get to be herefor it for the first time.
(47:09):
Folks, was that different foryou to have a woman that was
there, that you knew wasprimarily there for you.
Speaker 2 (47:16):
Um, yeah, yeah, I thought it was interesting, um,
and I think I'm somebody whodoesn't really like to be
perceived, so that's likesometimes why BDSM was hard,
because all the focus was on meand else to take, because it
would be a really sexy scene andI loved sitting there and kind
(47:46):
of like watching the two of youdo things and it was really
pleasurable for me.
Speaker 1 (47:55):
But very interesting and different, right right,
interesting and and differentright right.
well, I know that you didexpress at the time it was nice
to know that I was into you andthere was no like jealousy, uh,
that was going to come oh mygosh yes, of like me being like
oh, but I'm into this guy andyou're with him, like so all of
that was removed and from my endit was like what was happening
(48:17):
was like oh, to make you feelgood, like I knew he was gonna
be fine, he was gonna be fine,yeah, yeah I think, um, I really
appreciated that dynamicbecause I've had the experiences
where women you know they, theywere more interested in him and
then at points would ask him tobe exclusive and he was like
(48:38):
that's, that's not on the tablefor me, so right, um, and then
you know, even though I thoughtI was kind of maybe building a
friendship with these womensometimes and that that would
end right, so it was like awhole new thing to navigate I
was unique folks.
I was unique yeah that's what Itell myself, at least.
Um, all right.
So now, moving on from the endof this relationship where you
(49:01):
are now, you have all of thisexperience.
You've really found yourself asa submissive, which is
interesting to me, because evenin my own journey of knowing you
, I feel like you're outside ofthe bedroom.
Persona has evolved so much.
You are so much more decisiveand assertive and, yeah, I would
(49:23):
say, dominant.
Yeah, it is true, you're moredominant now in your everyday
life than when I met you.
Speaker 2 (49:30):
Yeah, and I think it was really kind of being in that
subspace, because you arereally in control of something
really important to you, yourpleasure, and you're the one
actually, at the end of the day,calling the shots.
You get to say yes or no to it.
Speaker 1 (49:47):
And yeah, it just it changed my brain right, right.
And I think you're just so opento experiences too.
Like sometimes we spend a lotof time, carrie and I, talking
about the things we're goingthrough now, um, and how we
perceive them, and and I wouldsay, like you, having gone
through what you have and I havenever gone through that sort of
awakening, not in that short aperiod of time, not that
(50:08):
profound, not with thatintensity for certain, and I
think for you it really openedup your just ability to perceive
things from a little bit moreof a non I want to say
non-emotional place but that'snot true A place of compassion
and kind of coming outside ofeverything and looking down at
it, where I get like caught upin the weeds of being in it.
(50:33):
We talk about that a lot and I'mlike I don't know, I'm not that
big of a person man, I can't dothat.
But so, from where you are now,with all of this growth and all
of this person man, I can't dothat.
But so, from where you are now,with all of this growth and all
of this perspective, what aresome things you're like I want,
I want to try this or that.
Here's maybe the next path I'lltake.
Do you have any of that mappedout?
What are you open to?
Speaker 2 (50:55):
I still feel open to so many things that I still
haven't tried, since the, themenu of things you can do, sex
wise and even within bdsm it's.
It's so long, um like, wesometimes played with shibari
and that was incredible and Iwent to somebody who who does
shibari professionally and did aphoto shoot and was suspended
(51:19):
and and bound and how safe thatfelt and God, it would be so
incredible to be suspended andalso have some like pleasure
going on too.
You and I should go to a class.
Speaker 1 (51:31):
That'd be fun.
You know what I know Carrie isopen to folks Sharing toys with
me and, lucky you, you can bepart of our experience because
she is joining me on two girlssharing toys with me.
And lucky you, you can be partof our experience because she is
joining me on two girls sharingtoys.
If you have not checked out mysex toy reviews, you should do
that now, hopefully, maybe not,maybe not.
But by the time this ispublished which is happening
(51:53):
really soon because we are inKing Tober we will have put
together some two girls sharingtoys, sex toys review reviews
and I have some that I'velaunched already with my
beautiful friend Andy.
But Carrie and I have beensharing toys and we have three
that we're getting ready toreview for you and we will be
(52:15):
launching.
So I know that she definitelyis ready for that and I want you
guys to check those out, seewhat toys we are going to be
looking into.
Who knows, maybe, since you'remy, you might be my kinkiest
girlfriend.
I don't know my othergirlfriend.
The minute anyone hears this,I'll get like the phone calls
like I'm kinkiest book.
What do you mean?
But I don't know.
(52:36):
You may be at the next levelthere.
Speaker 2 (52:42):
That's funny to hear you say, like from where I was
six years ago, to like you haveyour own podcast and here you
are, you're right, so my journeyhas been quite.
Speaker 1 (52:48):
I guess I'm totally different than when you yeah,
I'm in a way different place.
You're so different.
God.
We both have way better hairthan we did our.
Incredible when I think aboutwhat our hair looked like do you
remember our haircuts shorter?
Well, whatever we thought wewere cute we thought each other,
we were cute um, yeah.
So who knows, maybe we'll beable to get some kinky uh sex
(53:11):
toy products, uh, to try out youknow, separately, maybe you
never know and review for you.
So stay tuned to that.
Thank you for sharing.
There's so much to this storyand this guys.
This was just an overview, andlike sort of dipping the toe
into the water, of what it meansto be submissive, and I don't
(53:32):
know why I haven't done a lot ofcontent on it.
Maybe because I don't.
I don't personally, I've, Ihave, I have submissive goals.
I, I have submissive goals.
I have a submissive side to methat I enjoy.
I find it really hard to findpartners, though, who feel
comfortable dominating me.
I don't understand why, though.
Yeah, no, just joking, and I dolike being dominant a lot,
(53:57):
especially with women.
I think that's more natural forme.
I'm short, but I'm mighty right.
Yes, you are.
Thank you Can confirm.
But I do want to dive more intoit, and actually even for myself
, because I would love toexplore my own submissive side a
little bit more.
I just have no idea how to dothat.
(54:17):
So hopefully Carrie will joinme more and maybe we can start
drilling down into thesubmissive experience.
So seriously, if you havequestions about the submissive
experience, anything somethingyou want to know more about,
questions for Carrie uh, pleaseemail me at Annette at talk sex
with Annettecom, or draw you'reon my YouTube channel, which is
(54:40):
at TalkSexWithAnette.
You can drop a message or intothe comments section.
I will bring her back on.
We'll go through your questionstogether and answer them.
We could totally do that.
That would be super fun.
I'd love to.
You can scroll down and I'vegot my speak pipe.
You can send us a voice message.
We'd even play it right hereand then answer it on our video.
(55:02):
That would be super fun for us,because I do want to answer
your questions.
I know that people have a lotof questions about what it means
to be submissive and I don'tfucking know.
Speaker 2 (55:11):
She does, and I know just what I know is like one
part of an entire iceberg.
Speaker 1 (55:16):
But we also have a community that we can reach out
to.
A great community, a greatcommunity, and there are subs
out there, so many, yeah.
So we did it, we did it, we didit.
It's been a long time in thecoming Threesomes happened.
Lots of things happened Yearspassed.
Speaker 2 (55:33):
And here we are, here we are.
Speaker 1 (55:34):
Until next time, folks, I'll see you in the
locker room locker room Cheers.
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If you eat, sleep, and breathe true crime, TRUE CRIME TONIGHT is serving up your nightly fix. Five nights a week, KT STUDIOS & iHEART RADIO invite listeners to pull up a seat for an unfiltered look at the biggest cases making headlines, celebrity scandals, and the trials everyone is watching. With a mix of expert analysis, hot takes, and listener call-ins, TRUE CRIME TONIGHT goes beyond the headlines to uncover the twists, turns, and unanswered questions that keep us all obsessed—because, at TRUE CRIME TONIGHT, there’s a seat for everyone. Whether breaking down crime scene forensics, scrutinizing serial killers, or debating the most binge-worthy true crime docs, True Crime Tonight is the fresh, fast-paced, and slightly addictive home for true crime lovers.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.
The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show
The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show. Clay Travis and Buck Sexton tackle the biggest stories in news, politics and current events with intelligence and humor. From the border crisis, to the madness of cancel culture and far-left missteps, Clay and Buck guide listeners through the latest headlines and hot topics with fun and entertaining conversations and opinions.