Episode Transcript
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Kristen (00:00):
Hey everybody.
Welcome back.
It's another installment of ourVirtual Book Club podcast where
we are reading perfect is Boringand Tastes like Kale by Jess
Johnston.
I am so excited as always tohave Kelly and Alexis joining me
again.
Hi, Alexis.
Hello.
(00:21):
Hey, Kelly.
Hey everyone.
All right, so we are wrapping upthe book today because we are
going over the final chaptersand epilogue.
So the lies we covered in thisportion of the book are lies, 10
through 14.
(00:41):
If you haven't read the firstpart of the book and you wanna
go over the earlier lies, youcan listen to our episodes
before this, but it's notrequired.
You are welcome to join and staywith us here today because even
if you haven't read the book,we're gonna talk about a lot of
different parts about the bookand our lives, and it'll still
be relatable and entertainingfor you.
(01:02):
So lies 10 through 14.
Were lie number 10.
I'm a junior varsity adult andthe best spot for me is usually
the bench lie number 11.
It's better not to try than tomess up in front of everyone.
Lie number 12, I can't do thatbecause no one does that lie.
(01:24):
Number 13, if I can't go big, Ishould just go home lie.
Number 14.
It's better to dream smallbecause then I won't be
disappointed.
Okay guys, so those are thelies.
Which ones resonated with youthe most this time?
Kelly (01:43):
Definitely number 10 for
me.
Kristen (01:46):
Alexis, did one stand
out more to you?
Alexis (01:50):
Number 13, if I can't go
big, I shouldn't do it.
Mm-hmm.
I think that one,
Kristen (01:57):
I think mine was line
number 11.
It's better to not try than tomess up, but I also had a bunch
of highlights also for number12.
I can't do that because no onedoes that.
Wow.
We're gonna do it in a littlebit of a different format this
time.
In previous episodes we'vetalked some questions overall
(02:19):
and then talked about chaptersspecifically.
But this time I was hoping wecould just ask some questions
about each of the chapters andgo through them together.
So the first one, line number10.
I'm a junior varsity adult, andthe best spot for me is usually
the bench.
The question for this I have foryou guys is have you ever felt
like you're just on the bench inyour own life?
(02:41):
And what contributed to thatfeeling?
Kelly (02:44):
Yeah, so this chapter
resonated with me the most.
I used to think it was justbecause I'm in my twenties.
Like everybody feels like I'lluse the term junior varsity
adult in their twenties.
Like we don't really have a cluewhat we're doing.
Everyone feels that way.
Now I'm going on 33 and I'mthinking maybe this is a
(03:09):
thirties thing too.
Maybe this is just always howit's gonna be.
I just sometimes stop and think,am I really the adult here in
this situation?
When I was younger I would lookup to different adults in my
life who were, in their thirtiesor forties and they just seemed
so put together.
(03:32):
They knew how to handle life andnow I'm like, now I am them.
And I feel like I don't have aclue.
One situation though to kind ofget back to your question, an
example that came to mind when Iwas listening'cause the chapter
was work related.
So about two and a half yearsago, I got thrown into what was
(03:55):
a brand new position for mycompany.
I had been with the company fora lot of years and had worked in
all aspects of the department.
This was a brand new positionthey had created and I stepped
into it I really liked what Iwas doing, but it required more
(04:17):
decision making than some of myprevious positions had.
And I felt.
Very unqualified.
And so I questioned myself alot.
I always felt like I needed toget the okay from my boss before
I made any decisions or saidlet's do things this way that
(04:41):
was a situation where I justvery much felt like I don't
belong in this position.
I'm not qualified.
What if I mess up?
What if I make the wrongdecision?
It wasn't until my boss wasabout to leave the company and
she had a conversation with meand just told me, she was like,
(05:03):
I can tell you're afraid to makedecisions.
But you shouldn't be.
And she said that she wasconfident in my discernment and
that I needed to take that andrun with it.
So that was a major shift, in mywork from then on, taking her
advice.
That was just an example thatcame to mind for that one.
Kristen (05:24):
That's a good example.
And I wanted to chime in on thefirst part you said about not
feeling like you're an adult andhow when you were younger and
you saw people at that age, theyseemed more adulty.
I feel like that so much, likemy perception of age is so
flawed because if I watch an oldepisode of friends, I'm still
(05:44):
like, oh, they're adults.
They're younger than I am atthis point.
Kelly (05:47):
See, this is still going
on in your forties?
Kristen (05:49):
I don't know if it's
for everybody in their forties,
but there's sometimes in my lifewhen adult things happen, like
we've had to get our AC fixed,our roof checked and I'm like, I
sure hope an adult shows up soonto, fix all these problems even
making doctor's appointments andstuff, like, isn't there
somebody who can do this?
For me.
I believe there's services youcan pay to do it, but there's
(06:10):
times like that where I agree,you know, it's a junior varsity
thing because clearly there'ssomebody on the main team that
can do these things and can dothem better.
And I am not prepared for thatbecause I am not a grownup yet.
Kelly (06:24):
Yes.
That's exactly how I feel on anygiven day of my life
Alexis (06:29):
you're not alone.
I frequently at these momentsof, I almost have a junior in
high school, he's a sophomoreright now, just finishing up his
sophomore year.
And I think, how is thatpossible?
I'm still 19, you know?
It's ridiculous.
We just went through a situationwith our house, like the
electrical I don't even knowwhat to do.
(06:50):
Isn't there an adult around thatcan figure this out?
Ironically though, I have foundin times like this, these are
the times where I do lean on mygrandma for wisdom or my
parents.
I have called my dad for moreadvice in the past six months
than I have anybody else, whichis probably really good because
(07:11):
I think they have the wisdom totell us.
It has made me feel a littlemore confident to be able to
address these weird issues.
When you get to late thirtiesand forties everything starts
breaking in your house andyou're like, that's a really
complicated problem and I shouldhave the money to fix this, but
I'm not really sure I do.
What are we gonna do?
I don't know.
Maybe that's just us.
Kristen (07:33):
No, I feel like that's,
totally legit.
And I actually feel better thatit's not just me because
sometimes.
My son, he's 12, so he's noteven that old.
But I feel the same thingsometimes.
I'm like, I'm not old enough tohave a 12-year-old, by numbers,
I am well old enough to have achild older than that.
But it's just like, like yousaid, like there is so many
times where I'm like, it's socrazy that here I am like 27 and
(07:57):
I have a 12-year-old.
That's crazy.
I'm not 27, but that's kind ofwhere mentally I am.
Kelly (08:05):
Yeah.
So my son is seven and I thinkback to when I was about his age
and my perception of my parentsor different adults in my life I
think, wow, they were so muchmore adulty than I am now with a
7-year-old.
(08:25):
What am I missing?
When am I gonna.
Finally feel like I'm a realadult.
Kristen (08:30):
And that's what she
actually has.
I'd highlighted the line and itsaid, we don't feel like real
adult women because there aren'tany.
So she starts by saying, thestandards are a joke.
We don't feel like grownups, wedon't feel like real adult women
because there aren't any.
So it made me think are we alllike this?
I know we, the three of us are asmall population of, all
(08:50):
American women, but it's gottabe more than just the three of
us.
So does everybody feel this way?
Are we all just not real?
Not real women?
Not real adults.
Like what is this?
Yeah, so maybe it's like midlifecrisis.
I don't know.
It could be a midlife crisisthat we're all in denial of.
(09:12):
'cause I'm like, there's no wayI'm midlife.
The other thing I'd highlightedis she had a quote and she said,
people who shoved their schoolpapers in their backpack with no
binder, folder, et cetera.
Where are you now?
I may or may not have been thatperson.
I was probably that person.
I would have all the folders andnotebooks, but I would just keep
stuffing stuff in my backpack.
(09:33):
It had so much stuff.
I'm the same with my purse now.
Since I've switched to a crossbody, fanny pack I can't fit as
much stuff in it.
But if, when I used to carry apurse, it would just have so
much stuff in it.
Here's a receipt, a gum wrapper,all the stuff.
So maybe my life is fallingapart on some level, but
whatever.
Alexis (09:50):
But if you're like me,
it's not organized and stuff.
You know where that paper is.
And if somebody moves it fromthe mess of the papers on your
desk, you're gonna be frustratedbecause you know it's there.
Yes.
Like, where'd that go?
I just, I just left
Kristen (10:04):
it here.
Alexis (10:05):
I know I left it here.
I know it's in this pile.
That's good enough.
Don't move it kind of a thing.
So yeah, I don't know.
Kristen (10:12):
Well, moving on or did
you guys wanna share anything
else about chapter 10 before wemove on?
Okay.
So lie number 11, it's betternot to try than to mess up in
front of everyone.
So I have two questions for youguys on this one, but I'll ask
them separately.
Can you share a moment when fearof public failure stopped you
(10:34):
from trying something?
Alexis (10:37):
How about any group
activity ever?
Like I'm not involved in groupactivities.
No, I don't like them.
Kristen (10:45):
Like what kind of group
activities?
If people are like, Hey, do youwanna go on this skiing trip
with us?
What kind of group activitiesare you talking about?
Alexis (10:55):
Probably when I was a
lot younger, even just doing
kickball, I'm not joiningkickball with you it was
different if I signed up for asport and like I did something
like that.
But just people that you don'tnormally do stuff, I probably
wouldn't do that.
But a, a ski trip now?
No.
Probably in the past I wouldhave done something like that.
(11:16):
I guess the biggest thing that Iremember is like youth group
activities.
If there was games and stuff, Iwas not doing them.
Kristen (11:24):
Okay.
I see what you're saying.
Kelly (11:27):
Yeah.
I think about, again, work,which maybe is lame, that
everything in this part of thebook I like related to that.
But, again, like specificallythinking about when I stepped
into my current position, therewere instances where, like maybe
(11:48):
on a meeting, you know,conversation was being had and I
didn't necessarily need toprovide input.
And so I absolutely was notgoing to because I don't wanna
say something and sound dumb orlike misunderstand and say the
(12:08):
wrong thing.
Or if there was like a scenariowhere, you know, there was this
thing to be done, but.
It wasn't necessarily somethingI had to do.
I am not gonna be the one tovolunteer to help do it because
what if I mess it up?
Or what if they don't like theway I do it?
I kind of sat in that mentalityfor a while when I came into
(12:32):
this position, but I think it'ssomething that I've definitely
grown away from.
Kristen (12:38):
I can see that in
meetings too, especially
depending on the level of peoplewho are there.
It's not just about not soundingstupid, but if you misunderstood
something and say something,they're like, that's not
actually what's going on here.
I can totally see that.
What,'cause I've also seen theopposite, where there's
sometimes people in meetings whoclearly don't care about how
they're viewed and they willjust ramble on about whatever,
(12:59):
whether it is relevance or not.
And again, like I don't wanna bethat person.
So a lot of times I will stopbefore I even say something in a
meeting and be like, is thereany value added of what I'm
going to say?
Because I also think sometimesmeetings are a waste of time and
I don't wanna waste anybody'stime.
Right?
And so I'm not going to saysomething if it's not going to
(13:21):
further what we're actuallytrying to do.
I hate when people say somethingjust to say something I don't
know that I have a great exampleof a time when a fear of public
failure stopped me from tryingsomething.
I usually will try a lot ofthings.
I will take the opposite of thisquestion where, the fear was
(13:42):
there and I tried somethinganyway, like we've talked about
how, I'm a dancer.
When I saw my son's first dancerecital and I saw women even
older than I am dancing, I waslike, oh, I could do that.
And there was that little partin my back of my head that's
like, you've never dancedbefore.
Like, could you really do that?
It's, tap and jazz and tap is alot harder than I thought it was
(14:03):
gonna be.
So there, and you know, we do arecital and there was that fear
that what if I can't do it?
What if I looked dumb, but I didit anyway?
And there's still some timeswhere like.
There's people I know in theaudience and like I think what
are they gonna think about me?
I don't know.
But it's kind of getting pastthat and doing it anyway, which
(14:25):
I think is where we all want tobe.
I can't say I do that witheverything in my life, but it
was something I was thinkingabout even though there was that
fear of, what if I mess up?
What if I can't do this?
What if I look dumb?
What if people don't like it?
I did it anyway because mydesire to dance outweighed my
fear of failure or what peoplewould think of me.
Kelly (14:49):
Do you think, like, so
you mentioned the about like
dancing and the people you know,being in the crowd.
Do you feel like sometimes withthings you have a harder time
putting yourself out there?
On display in front of peoplethat you do know versus putting
yourself on display for a wholegroup of people.
You don't.
(15:09):
'cause I feel like sometimesit's scarier to do it in front
of people that you do know.
Kristen (15:16):
Yes.
And I love that you bring thatup because that's kind of what
it is.
I will perform in a crowd ofstrangers all night long, like
I'm a performer.
I'm an actress.
I will do that.
And I will also do it in frontof people who I am very close
with.
Like you guys are some of myreally close friends in real
life.
I'll do that all day long.
(15:37):
It's those ones in thein-between phase.
Like I know who you are, orlike, you are the mom of one of
my son's friends and I don'tknow what you think about me and
maybe you'll be judging me forsomething.
And I think that's kind of whereit is.
Like it's definitely people whoI know, but I don't know very
(16:02):
well.
Those are the ones that I havethe hardest time because I want
to make a good impression.
So if I look dumb to them,that's not good for me.
Kelly (16:11):
'Cause I think when it's
a group of people, you don't
know whether you're dancing infront of them or doing whatever.
If you don't know them, it'slike this mentality for me where
I'm like, who cares if I messup?
I'm never gonna see these peopleagain, they don't know me but
when it is people, you know,then there's that fear of the
future of like, what are theygonna maybe say to me later
about this?
(16:31):
Or things like that.
Kristen (16:33):
Well, and Kelly, do you
think in the worship team that
you joined at your church, thisplays into that at all?
Like any of the fears you had ofgetting front of those people?
Because I mean, it's a bigchurch, so some of them are
strangers, but some of them youmay know.
How does that affect you there?
Kelly (16:50):
Yeah, I feel that for
sure when it comes to singing.
I think back to my high schooldays when, I was on some
different teams that wouldperform it was always a little
bit easier, to sing in theplaces where, we were traveling
to different places mm-hmm.
And thinking for people thatlike, we don't, we don't
(17:11):
actually go to this school, orwe don't go to this church, or
wherever we were.
It was easier because I didn'thave to face those people again.
Like, if I mess up, I'm notgonna see them again.
It's not a big deal.
But yeah, so I definitely hadthose fears walking into joining
the worship team, they just sentme a schedule invite to do my
(17:34):
first weekend later in June.
I haven't accepted it.
I should probably do that.
But.
Yeah, even just like walkinginto worship practice, I have
those fears because we have alot of people on the worship
team and obviously not everyoneis on every single weekend.
And so there's some that I knowpretty well, and then there's
others that I don't know.
(17:56):
And so I almost feel like goinginto practice that I'll be
better off practicing with theones that I don't really know
than the ones that I do.
It's so crazy.
Kristen (18:09):
No, I don't think it's
crazy at all.
One of the quotes I'dhighlighted in the book was, we
may fail.
We will definitely makemistakes.
We will face disappointments.
What if we started doing abetter job at honoring our own
bravery for facing our fears andstepping into the realm of, I
might bomb, but I'm going to tryit anyway.
(18:29):
That brings me to the otherquestion I have for you guys.
What role does vulnerabilityplay in growth and how do you
handle embarrassment or mistakesnow compared to earlier in your
life?
Alexis (18:41):
I think as I've gotten
older, I handle it a lot less
and I'm willing to do stuff alot less because I know I'm not
going to wanna do that.
So I just don't, rather thanwhen I was younger.
I'm not really sure that I'veactually.
Done any better now than ever?
I think it's probably justbecause, as you get older, you
(19:03):
know what you like and what youdon't like.
At least that's how I am.
I have just got to the pointwhere I'm not wasting time on
certain things if I know that'snot who I am or what I'm gonna
do.
And so it also can be a badthing because you're not willing
to try new things you're kind ofinflexible and you don't wanna
be embarrassed so you justdon't.
(19:23):
I don't think it's necessarily agood thing.
I just think that that'sprobably where I'm at.
Kristen (19:29):
What about you,
Kristen?
I was waiting for you to answer.
I'll say I do think as I'vegotten older, I care less about
what people think I know that'scrazy'cause so much of this
podcast I've been talking aboutmy people pleasing tendencies
and, wanting people to like mehonestly it's partly because of
the podcast and this book, but Ifeel like I've been able to let
(19:50):
go of some of that.
Here's a fun story.
Imagine Kristen in sixth gradeand we're having to read out
loud of our history books for isOld World History.
New world.
I don't, I don't remember.
We're having to read out loudand Australian native people.
I pronounce the word aboriginebecause it is spelled
A-B-O-R-I-G-I-N-E.
(20:14):
The entire class burst outlaughing and I was so
embarrassed.
I never heard that word before.
I didn't know that it's abini'cause like.
That's not really how it lookslike it should be pronounced.
I was mortified, like the kindof embarrassment that I wanted
to melt into a puddle and justdie right there.
(20:34):
Fast forward, I was at aconference and I was walking
around vendors just yesterdayand there was a word and it was
spelled C-O-M-B-I-N-E and Icalled it Combine, you know,
like what athletes go to beforethey join the draft or whatever
it was combined.
Their company's name had theword combine in it, and I called
it combine.
(20:55):
I totally just laughed it off.
I was like, combine.
Combine whatever, right?
And kept talking to them becauseit wasn't a big deal for me
anymore.
Like I found that we're gonnamake mistakes and we're gonna
mess up.
And if we can laugh about itlike the question says, it's the
vulnerability of it.
If you can show people thatlike, Hey, yeah, I said
something stupid, whatever.
(21:17):
And not make a big deal aboutit.
It shows how human you are.
It allows other people to feelmore comfortable and not worry
about making mistakes.
If they see you doing it andbeing okay with it.
I dunno if that's a greatexample, but that's what popped
in my head.
So here we are.
Alexis (21:34):
it made me laugh because
as I homeschool, I do a lot of
reading out loud to my children.
And I don't know if it was likemy generation, but I actually
never learned sonics.
It's just like a whole thing.
My sister and I were nevertaught phonics.
Kristen (21:51):
Did you just learn
words instead of sounds?
Alexis (21:55):
Yeah, and I picked up
reading really quickly.
Okay.
So I never, like, I was taught afew things, but not anything as
a perfect example.
When I first started to teach mykids how to read, I asked my
husband multiple times, whatdoes it mean by a long vowel
sound versus a short vowelsound?
Which should be a huge red flag.
Like, yeah, you're teaching yourkids to read, but I didn't know
(22:17):
that, that's not how I learnedto read.
And so I just said, it says it'sbeing or it doesn't, you know,
kind of a thing.
Because of that.
Sometimes I struggle withpronunciation.
My boys think it's hilarious.
They laugh hysterically to thepoint that my middle child is
(22:37):
the comedian.
When he is impersonating me,that's an impersonation that he
does sometimes.
They get great enjoyment out ofcorrecting me while I'm reading
what the actual word is.
They'll come, let me look.
No, this is how you pronounceit.
So I just had to laugh becausethis is like a weekly thing at
this point I do laugh about it'cause I'm like, yeah, you guys,
(22:57):
what is this word?
Tell me.
I know it in my head and thedefinition but I cannot
necessarily pronounce it wellbecause I did learn phonics.
Kelly (23:06):
That's funny.
Have you seen the posts onsocial media where it talks
about oh, where did your anxietystart?
Mine started in the sixth gradewhen we had to read out loud and
I would count the paragraphahead to figure out which one
was gonna be on my
Kristen (23:19):
I have seen that like,
yeah.
Then you don't even know what'sgoing on in the story because
you're not paying attention toanybody else reading and then
God forbid you're so focused onyour part that you miss it and
then you're like, oh, sorry.
People think you're not in theright place, but you are you're
just so focused on waiting.
Oh my gosh.
I'm like, yeah, bringing up somePTSD.
Alexis (23:40):
but now I love to read
out loud.
Oh yeah.
So I don't know.
Maybe it's because all theschooling that I do with my
kids, like I actually love toread out loud,
Kristen (23:48):
so I do too.
In fact, one of the other jobs Iwould like to have sometime is
an audiobook narrator.
So if you're looking for anarrator for your audiobook,
please consider reaching out.
I can do multiple voices.
I think you would be great atthat.
Thank you.
I agree.
See, I've got two loyal fansright here.
(24:08):
Come find me.
Authors.
The other line I had highlightedhere that I wanted to talk about
is she says, you are never goingto be perfect.
You are not, but you're alwaysgoing to be the perfect person
to live your life fully,wholeheartedly, messily,
brokenly, I, for one, am goingto celebrate you every single
time you enter the arena.
(24:29):
Win lose, doesn't matter.
Look how freaking brave you are.
And I loved that because we arebroken and messy and there's all
these parts of us, but it'sstill our life and we should go
into it fearlessly and livingour best lives regardless of
what's going on.
Any other thoughts on that?
Alexis (24:52):
I really love that too.
And as I'm sitting here thinkingabout it, I think about how
everybody kind of struggles withsomething different, and if we
all struggle with the samething, it would be really
boring.
So just being like ourindividual selves, even with all
of our mistakes, owning them,you know, it can be really
(25:15):
beneficial for variety in life.
But also sometimes thosestruggles, you.
Have people that you havesomething in common with, but
you can also find people thatcan help you in those struggles.
And it becomes like friendshipor just a relationship because
they can relate in a way thatthey come alongside you and help
(25:35):
you in those ways.
So just my little thought onthat.
Kristen (25:38):
So line number 12 is, I
can't do that because no one
does that.
How do societal or culturalexpectations shape what we
believe we can or should do?
Kelly (25:52):
I think this plays into
what she's talked about earlier
in the book about staying in ourlane.
Especially when you say thepressure, like feeling pressure
about things we think we shoulddo.
Social media, is probably thebiggest factor in feeling those
(26:13):
pressures just because we seesomething as a trend on whatever
platform, it makes us questionwhere we're at and think oh, I
should do that.
Or maybe you have a differentidea and you want to do
something, but you feel like youknow everyone's life because of
(26:36):
social media and you're like,well, no one else is doing that.
So.
Maybe I shouldn't.
Kristen (26:42):
Yeah.
And there's so many things ofthis one that I wanna say, she
talks in the book about, shavingher head and says, I decided I
wanted to shave it.
She needed a little wild in herlife, but she's like, you know,
moms aren't supposed to goaround with buzz heads or
whatever.
And it's funny'cause ifanybody's listened to the
episode Alexis and I did abouthair, I also have shaved my head
(27:04):
twice and I've had it all kindsof different colors that's not
something moms do.
Britney Spears did it in 2007,2008.
And it's'cause she was goingthrough something.
You don't do that kind of thing.
I cannot tell you how manycomments I got with my hair cut
like that.
So many women were like, oh mygosh, you're so brave.
Oh, I could never do that.
Yeah, you could it literallyjust took some men's clippers
(27:27):
and someone who knew how to usethem and your hair is gone.
Anybody can do it.
It wasn't a bravery thing to me.
It was just something, I wassick of my hair and I didn't
wanna deal with it anymore.
But it's things like that where,people say you're not supposed
to do it or it's not becauseother people aren't doing it.
Recently, another podcastepisode came out.
An episode recently came outwhere Emily and I were talking
(27:49):
about things and I talked abouthow.
I wear sparkly shoes and shewears, glitter in her hair.
We do all these different thingsthat, women maybe aren't
supposed to do because you're anadult and don't dress like a
five-year-old but who makesthese rules and why are they
rules?
Because I think we, they're notlike, why can't we just wear
whatever we wanna wear or dress,you know, do what we wanna do
(28:13):
or, you know, who I don't know.
I get so worked up about itbecause it shouldn't matter.
You should be able to expressyourself however you want.
And just because nobody else isdoing it or people think you
shouldn't do it, doesn't meanthat you shouldn't.
Kelly (28:31):
That reminds me of when I
was younger, my grandma, she
would say if you're talking andyou say well, they say you
shouldn't do this, or they saythis or that, or people say, and
she would always go.
Who are they?
Who is saying that?
Who is people?
(28:51):
And then she would say what isnormal?
Because really what is normal?
My normal is probably not yournormal.
Right.
And we'd all be
Kristen (28:59):
boring if we all had
the same thing.
Kelly (29:02):
Mm-hmm.
Kristen (29:03):
Alexis, you've been
quiet for a minute what are your
thoughts?
Alexis (29:08):
I agree with that.
I think that like you said,everybody would be boring.
I always go back to, it's notalways necessarily what I want
and I have to consider what doesGod want in that.
But I don't think that means youjust don't ever express yourself
or can't do certain thingsbecause that's not at all what
God wants either, because that'sjust legalism.
(29:29):
So, I agree with you on that.
Kristen (29:32):
One of the other lines
I highlighted is she says, there
was an article published yearsback listing a bunch of clothes
you should no longer wear ifyou're above 30.
I immediately set off to buyscrunchies graphic tees and
sparkly pants
Kelly (29:45):
and I was cracking up.
Kristen (29:46):
Yes.
Kelly (29:47):
Because I was like, oh,
this chapter is for Christmas.
Kristen (29:49):
It is.
I have so many thingshighlighted, but the best part
about that is again, okay, justgimme one more minute that is so
me because as I may or may nothave mentioned before,
strawberry Shore Cake is like mygirl and there is so much
Strawberry Shore Cakemerchandise out right now, like
Walmart, target five belowMarshalls, literally everywhere.
(30:10):
I have so many strawberryShortcake t-shirts right now
that I have acquired yeah.
I'm wearing strawberry Shortcaket-shirts and yes, I'm wearing my
sparkly shoes.
I think I'm going on week threeof wearing sparkly shoes to work
with every single work outfit,because if I'm gonna be the girl
in the sparkly shoes, I have todo it like literally every day.
And like, I don't care becausethis is how I'm expressing
(30:32):
myself.
In case you forgot, I helpedbring back the scrunchie trend a
few years ago.
Brought back butterfly clips,still working on the zigzag part
that's taken a little longerbecause my hair doesn't
naturally do it.
It's a lot of work.
I also remember there was anarticle shared on Facebook a few
years ago about makeup thatpeople over 40 shouldn't be
doing.
And again, they're like, oh no,shimmery eyeshadows because
(30:54):
you'll look old.
Who cares?
I like certain things.
Certain long eye shadows, right?
Stop telling me what I can andcan't do with all your made up
rules, society and Americanculture.
I'm gonna do me and I'm gonna behappy or try anyway.
I.
Because the other line too, shesaid, you weren't meant to be
(31:15):
tame.
You were meant to be you.
You're the only one who knowshow to be authentical.
You are the only one who knowshow to be authentically you.
You're the only one who can pushagainst the boundaries and say,
Nope, you are the only one whocan tap into that little girl
inside, who once upon a time,planted her toddler feet solidly
in that olive green shag carpet,placed her hands on her hips and
(31:36):
said no.
When she was told to brush herteeth, there was a time to
listen to that adult in ourlives.
But guess what?
You're an adult now too.
The varsity kind.
Remember?
And you get a say.
You get the main say, actually.
Love it.
Alexis (31:51):
I love that.
And I actually have to laughbecause my husband frequently
says, why can't you just do it?
Like if somebody tells you that.
That is what it should be, orthat is what they say.
You will automatically do theopposite.
You just cannot be told what itis.
(32:13):
There are a lot of things that Iwill just do the exact opposite.
Like if you tell me I'm gonnahave to have a baby in a
hospital, nope, I'm gonna havemy baby at home.
That's just the kind of personthat I am.
I highlighted this from there.
The buying gifts for otherpeople on airplanes.
I had to laugh at that because Iwondered when that became a
thing.
Like when did children become aburden on flying?
(32:36):
I loved her point about that.
I'm not buying anything for youjust because I have kids on an
airplane.
You can just get over it anddeal with it.
It's only for a couple hours,you'll survive.
Kristen (32:49):
Yes.
All right.
So line number 13, if I can't gobig, I should just go home.
What small steps have led to bigchanges in your life?
Or how can we celebrate smallwins without feeling like we've
(33:09):
settled?
I like this question because oneof the things I highlighted in
line number 13 was, I neverwanna be a person who thinks
that public wins are moreimportant than cooking dinner
for my family, or taking myfriend out for her birthday.
Kelly (33:28):
Liked that part too.
I, I did really like when shesaid that, and it just reminded
me going back to the whole stayin your lane thing, it's easy to
feel like we're not doinganything important if we're not
out, getting promotions or doingwhat.
Society says are the bigaccomplishments, but taking care
(33:52):
of my house and making sure myson is happy and well taken care
of, and that my marriage isthriving those are the huge
things.
That's what really matters.
Kristen (34:05):
A hundred percent
agree.
It's all those small things thatreally add up or sometimes the
little things you do are becauseof the big things in your life.
And I think you're right,society and others, social
media, always wanna praise allthe big things.
Your big vacations, your bigpromotions, your big things of
life.
But the small ones are soimportant to be celebrated too.
(34:28):
And sometimes just, making itthrough the day is a win, right?
It's not always the big things,depending on where you are in
your life and what's going onwith your mental, emotional, and
physical health.
Sometimes those little thingsreally are things that should be
celebrated.
Alexis (34:46):
Yeah, I agree.
Well, and I, this kind of, thiswhole topic is gonna kind of
relate to actually my worksituation in that.
I set up goals at the beginningof the year of things I wanted
to focus on for our year.
And it wasn't vacations, itwasn't, a bunch of stuff that
(35:08):
like we would like work on.
It was really to spend more timewith my kids and my grandma's.
I have two remaining grandmasalive and my grandpa had just
passed.
So those were the things, andunfortunately, when I set up
those boundaries, like, I am notgonna be working like all the
time because I have to go visitpeople.
(35:30):
It became a problem and I felthorrible, like, okay, I'm not
gonna have a job, but it's thepast, you know, month, I've
realized how really important itwas.
I gave up a really good payingjob.
I had a management position.
I mean, at one point I hadturned out a director position
(35:51):
because I did not want the workand I knew what it would be
involved and I didn't wanna giveup like my family.
So, giving up those things, likepeople probably look at me like
I'm crazy and sometimes I lookat myself like that when I look
at my budget for the month.
But seeing my grandmas the past,three months as much as I have,
(36:12):
and spending more time with mykids and doing stuff has been so
important.
And it's more important than thestuff and, being tied to my
computer.
So I think that if more peoplerealize that they might be a
little more content in life too,
Kelly (36:28):
that makes sense.
Kristen (36:29):
Mm-hmm.
Kelly (36:31):
Like not chasing after
the big things or feeling like
there's more they need
Kristen (36:38):
to keep up with
everybody else.
Like some of the previouschapters we talked about.
Mm-hmm.
So the final lie in the book wasline number 14.
It's better to dream smallbecause then I won't be
disappointed.
So this question I have is whenhave you downplayed a dream out
of fear of disappointment?
(36:59):
What was the result?
Alexis (37:01):
I actually just
experienced this so you guys
know that I grow dahlias, whichare like, it's a whole process
to Dahlia growing.
I had this dream for years thatI wanna be a flower farmer.
Unfortunately, I don't thinkit'll ever happen.
And this is where I.
Like, I just dream small becauseit won't.
(37:23):
And so this is the first yearthat I sold Dahlia tubers.
One day I wanna have a businesswhere I can sell them, because
my grandma grew them and it'ssomething that I wanna do, but I
just don't really trust that Ican, because there's so much
evolved, like with theagriculture, like having to get
(37:44):
certified and all that.
Plus you just don't have thespace.
I feel like we need land to dowhat I need to do.
So I don't dream big about it,but I dream small.
And surprisingly, my firstYouTuber sale went amazing.
And I sold out of everything inmade like what I thought I my
dream for making.
(38:05):
So it did as far as.
I had a set amount that Ipotentially could make, and I
did make that, but I didn'treally like deep down I'm like,
oh, I'm not gonna make that muchmoney, but I did.
So it was, I don't know.
It was eyeopening to see that Iprobably could do better than
what I think.
So that's where I'm at withsomething very recent and a
(38:29):
dream.
Kristen (38:31):
I love that though.
Look on so many levels.
If we can break it down for justa second.
First of all, is flower farmerthe technical term for it?
Alexis (38:41):
I don't know because if
I was a flower farmer, like I
would eventually sell to likeflorist or I would have like my
own floral bouquets in additionto selling seeds and stuff.
It could be a lot of things, butflower farmers, how I would
describe it, because you arefarming, you're a farmer of
flowers.
You're not growing flowers justto let them like in your garden
(39:02):
or whatever, be seen like you'regrowing them to harvest them.
Kristen (39:05):
No, I love that.
I think Flower farmer is such afun title and what I am
imagining you is I picture youin this like.
Flowy dress and this kind ofwide brim hat that you're
wearing and you've got a basketfull of flowers and you're like
walking through the streets likepedaling your wares, like
(39:25):
dahlia's for sale, dahlia's forsale.
People come to you and buy yourDahlia tubers.
And I love all of this for youand I want this to happen.
I think you are doing the rightthing by starting small because
you've gotta put yourself outthere and figure out how to do
it and build a customer base.
You are gonna do amazing things.
So don't dream small, dream big.
(39:47):
These are just the little stepsyou're taking to get to the
overall place that you wanna be,and you're gonna be amazing.
Obviously, and if not, it's okayIf I fail, it's okay.
This not happen comes of it,it's okay, but we're not gonna
think like that.
We're gonna be positive andwe're gonna manifest it.
And you are gonna be the bestfreaking flower farmer in all of
(40:09):
Idaho.
I said it, it's gonna happen.
Alright, Kelly, how about you?
When have you downplayed a dreamout of fear of disappointment
and what was the result?
Kelly (40:21):
So the main thing that
comes to mind here is that when
my husband and I got married, wedid have a dream of moving to
New England one day.
In those early years,opportunities didn't arise.
Newlyweds in our twenties, we'rejust trying to survive and
(40:45):
figure out, the adulting thing.
Eventually the opportunitystarted to arise.
We were in a place where it waslike, okay, we could do this.
But at that point, we had hadour son, he was, four I think at
the time.
And I started doubting all ofthose dreams, I just started
(41:08):
doubting all of that and hadfully made myself believe that.
Doing that would be a terribleidea.
But praise the Lord.
My husband had a bigger visionthan I did, and he started
pushing for it, I definitelypushed back for a long time.
(41:31):
But we ended up doing the thingand she actually talked about
that, in this chapter.
She talked about how they movedfrom, Montana to California, I
think.
And she said you know, peoplelooked at us like we were crazy
because usually if you're movingout of state, it's like, oh,
because my job is taking me, orwe have family there.
(41:53):
And she is like, not justbecause we wanna live near our
friends.
But that's what we did.
I have distant family here, likesecond cousins but ultimately,
when people ask why we movedhere, we're like, we just wanted
to, we just wanted to live inNew England.
So we did, my husband found ajob and we started taking the
steps and things started workingout.
(42:14):
And I am just so thankful thathe didn't decide to accept the
fears that I had adopted for us.
Making that move a little overtwo years ago now, it turned out
infinitely better than either ofus ever dreamed.
Kristen (42:35):
Oh, I love that.
And now you're living your bestlife.
Beautiful.
Kelly (42:40):
Listeners, if you follow
Kristen's social media page, you
will have seen a couple of AIphotos of the three of us, which
are so fun.
But Kristen, when you were justsaying like what you were
picturing, Alexis looking likein her little dress and out in
the street selling flowers, Ithink you need to make that
(43:00):
happen with ai.
Kristen (43:03):
Oh,
Kelly (43:03):
I think that needs to be
the next one for sure.
Kristen (43:05):
Love that.
Yes, a hundred percent.
We will make this happen.
I have been having so much fun.
My quick little side story,chat, GPT is one of my
assistants for, podcast stuff.
I call him Charles because Iwanted to make it more personal.
Charles has helped me come upwith some amazing photos of us,
and I love sharing them becauseit really does capture what
(43:29):
we're doing.
Kelly had one of us in Maine,and I'll probably share that one
sometime too.
But yes, the AI versions of us,like I said in the post, last
week they are living their bestlives right now.
Who knows the adventures thesegirls are gonna go on.
But I am here for it and we'regonna find out.
Kelly (43:46):
I had to laugh when you
shared the second one because it
made me laugh.
The very first one you posted,you and I were wearing the same
color.
Headphones and drinking outtathe same color coffee mug Alexis
had on different colors.
In the second one Alexis has herwhole little outfit on.
And I was wearing an identicalpink fuzzy sweater my first
(44:10):
thought when I saw those was Ilook like the annoying little
sister that's just trying tolook exactly like, well, because
like you're my sister-in-law andyou're like nine, maybe years
older than me.
And so that was the firstthought that came to my head.
I'm like, oh, look at me.
The annoying little sistertrying to look just like
Kristen.
That's so funny.
Alexis (44:29):
I have to laugh at
these.
'cause I don't think they lookanything like us.
Like there's a little bit ofresemblance, but I'm always
like.
These are just so funny to me.
So that's hilarious that youpicked up on that.
Kristen (44:42):
Okay, so back to the
question at hand real quick.
So for my example,'cause let'ssee, remember what the question
was'cause we got so off therails here for a minute.
One of you down played a dream,out of fear of disappointment.
What was the result?
So before I give my answer, I dowanna share, a quick couple
quotes from the book.
She said, the real risk isn, inthinking up ideas, it's owning
(45:06):
them and pursuing them.
It's a whole lot easier to leaveour hopes tucked into our
imagination, like sacredfantasies that provide sanctuary
from our day to day.
Choose wisely who you sharethose fragile ideas with,
because too much negativity cancrush them before they have a
chance.
So vulnerable moment arriving.
My dream was this podcast andfor months and months I put off
(45:30):
doing it.
My husband was kind enough.
He set me up a whole recordingstudio.
We have all the microphones, mysoundboard, all the things.
And I was scared to do it, formany different reasons.
And he kept saying, he's like,we put all the money in that you
aren't even using it.
You're not doing your podcast,which he meant in the most
positive way.
Like it was his way of trying tomotivate me.
(45:51):
And it was hard because, I wasso scared of, what if I fail?
What if nobody listens?
This is a terrible idea.
I don't know what I'm doing.
Like all those fears in my head.
And it kind of downplayed it.
Like, you know, it's never gonnabe anything big.
Nobody's gonna listen to it.
Oh, why would I do it?
And then I finally came with aplan.
I was just like, oh, we're gonnado it.
And I've been doing it and Ihave been absolutely loving it.
(46:12):
I always tell people, this isthe downplaying part of it.
I'm like, well, I'm not like JoeRogan or anything.
And I don't have those kind ofnumbers.
I don't know that I ever will, Idon't know that I will even
reach monetization status.
Like that's not something I seenecessarily, kind of Alexis,
what you were saying about like,I am never going to have the
big, you know, all this land andall these flowers.
(46:33):
I'm not gonna have like,bazillions of people listening.
But when I look at the stats,I've got a solid listener base
and I know that there are abunch of people who do come back
week after week listening towhatever I'm talking about and
whoever's here, and I love that.
I can't tell you listeners howmuch I love the support I get
from you all.
But I do downplay it.
For a long time I wouldn't eventell people I had podcasts.
(46:55):
I wasn't gonna post it on myFacebook.
Like I was, keep my personal onelike.
I had it all separate.
I had everything separated.
I was just gonna do it and startit on my own.
My husband, who, loves me verymuch was like, but all of the
people on your Facebook, thoseare your friends and they would
wanna support you why wouldn'tyou share something you're doing
with them to get their support?
And it like, I wasn't anything Iwas gonna do because I was so
(47:17):
scared of what I was doing thatI felt more comfortable.
Kelly, to your earlier pointabout sharing it with complete
strangers than people whoactually knew me.
Mm-hmm.
Especially because I knew I wasgonna be sharing insecurities
and vulnerabilities and I was soafraid of people using that
against me.
Like people I work with orpeople that know me are gonna
find out that, oh my gosh,Kristen has body issues.
Oh, let's go fat shame her.
(47:38):
I had all these fears the howfar I've come just from starting
four months ago.
I feel like I'm a completelydifferent person, and now I can
talk about it.
Like I was at this conferencefor work earlier this week and
I'm telling random strangers Ihave a podcast asking them if
they wanna be on it, which also,if any of you're listening, I
totally mean it.
And I look forward to talking toall of you, Kevin Heath, Brian,
(48:00):
Katie, like any of you, I planon having you all on my podcast
at some point in time in seasontwo.
The point is, you've gotta dreambig.
Like maybe I will be Joe Rogansomeday, maybe I will quit my
day job and I will be monetizedand I will be talking to famous
people and getting to just talkwith people every day of my
life.
(48:20):
Who knows it's possible.
Why should I keep myself in abox and not think that that is
impossible?
So that's, that's all I wasgonna say about that.
So.
Thanks for listening, all right.
So guys, that gets us to the endof the lies.
And we've talked a lot because Ihave rambled on a lot.
(48:42):
But what I would like for us todo is next week's episode if we
could talk about the epilogueand kind of some overall things
that we learned from the book.
Maybe things that we've put intoaction in our lives some key
points that we took from thebook, things that we're
employing in our lives now, andhow it's made us a better
(49:03):
person.
So before we close this episode,any final comments on any of
these lies or anything that wedidn't get to talk about that
you really wanna share before weclose?
Kelly (49:14):
I'm glad to know that no
one else feels like a real adult
either.
Kristen (49:20):
Yeah.
Which is either a really greatthing or a really terrible thing
Kelly (49:23):
because
Kristen (49:25):
Alright guys.
Thanks Kelly.
Thanks Alexis.
Look forward to talking to youagain next week.
Bye guys.
Bye.