October 30, 2025 • 41 mins
Darius Holland won a Super Bowl championship playing for the Green Bay Packers during his 10-year NFL career. Afterward, he found his calling as a chaplain in the Army National Guard and as a pastor of 20 years.
He currently specializes in religious practices and coaching that bridges cultural gaps and fosters spiritual readiness, especially within the military community.
A member of the Global War on Terrorism Memorial Foundation’s Design Advisory Council, Holland is the special guest in this episode, hosted by Army veteran Jennifer Ballou.
He talks about his NFL career, service as a chaplain, moral injury, and how he helps veterans and servicemembers heal.
This is the fifth episode in the initial six-part special series produced by The American Legion. It focuses on the GWOT memorial in Washington, D.C., that will serve as a special place of honor and remembrance.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:19):
Hello and welcome to the Global War on Terrorism Memorial
podcast hosted by the American Legion.
I'm your host, Jen Balu, and it's my honor to welcome you
home today. We are joined by Reverend Dr.
Darius Holland. Darius is a pastor of 20 years
(00:39):
and a chaplain in the Army Reserves, currently serving as a
recruiter. Prior to entering the military,
Darius played for 10 seasons as a defensive lineman in the
National Football League, winning a Super Bowl with the
Green Bay Packers in 1997. Darius has an undergraduate
(01:00):
degree from the University of Colorado Boulder, a Master of
Theological Studies from Golden Gate Theological Seminary, and a
Doctor of Ministry from Gateway Seminary, and one more APHD in
Educational Leadership from Liberty University.
Darius Holland, welcome home andthank you so much for being here
(01:24):
today. Jen, thank you so much for that.
I really appreciate it. Absolutely.
Darius, if it's OK with you, I'dlove for you to share a bit with
our listeners about how you transitioned from the NFL to an
Army chaplain and what that transition was like for you.
(01:47):
Well, there's, there's a little bit of a gap in between NFL and,
and the Army, but one of the things that it's interesting,
I've transitioned several times in my, in my adult career and
going from the NFL to to church ministry was one of the biggest
transitions I had simply becauseyou wear the uniform, but people
(02:09):
don't understand that that uniform is a part of your
identity. As much we like to say that that
uniform is that us, it's not whowe are.
It's really a hard thing to dismiss the fact that that
uniform brings so much identity to your life.
And so playing in the NFL for 10years, I usually equivalent it
(02:29):
to the, the, the story that you see from people were talking
about like the drums before the old Trojan Wars.
And as soon as the drums go off,the horses knew what time it
was. That's how our body feels.
It's certain times when we goingto go into a football game, we
(02:50):
just, our body just kind of responds.
Well, that's part of my identity.
And having the shed, that was difficult because every time I
heard the call, my body was like, it's time to fight, it's
time to do something. But I was no longer a player.
Transitioning out of the NFL wasdifficult.
It took a few years of trying tofind out who I am as a human
(03:15):
being, who I am, what's my identity?
What, why am I going to do? The beautiful thing was is that
I had the church because I completely gave myself into
church ministry. And then from there it, it
showed all the avenues and places where there were other
people like me who were trying to figure out about who, who am
(03:35):
I? And that's how I came to be a
part of the military actually. So we had an incident at my
house. The police came in.
There were basically SWAT officers trying to figure out
what it what was going on behindthe house.
It was a veteran. He was in the middle of a
suicidal ideation. He actually completed that and
(04:00):
the the officers, everyone around you could tell was really
enough in a bad place. And I just prayed for them.
And they're like, man, you'd be a great chaplain.
And that's what started the process of me realizing there
were people in the military who need someone who can help them
transition to the different places and different life cycles
(04:23):
that we go through. And so that was a natural
transition for me. And so that's how I got to be a
part of the of the military and the army, and it's been a great
decision for me and my family. I'm so glad to hear that,
Darius. You know, thank you for all you
do as a chaplain. When I think back to my time in
(04:46):
the Army, you know, some of my greatest times and some of my
most challenging times, a chaplain was always there,
jumping out of airplanes, going out to the field, getting
married when Eddie died, Like there was always a chaplain
there. And I'm curious, when you
reflect on your service as a chaplain, what's one of the most
(05:11):
challenging experience you've had to navigate or help someone
navigate or one of the most challenging?
There's a ton of different moments that are really, really
exciting and, and really, reallydifficult.
I'll give, I'll give both sides one of them.
(05:31):
I got a chance to marry one of my commanders and it was an
amazing moment because he had gone through so much as a Green
Beret. He had lost a lot of soldiers.
He had gone through the ups and downs of his personal life, but
then that moment of being reconciled to the woman that he
(05:52):
truly loved and cared for was a beautiful moment.
And you can see the hope and theand the Glee and the and just.
It was such a good moment for usto all experience as a battalion
us to see what's going, what he was going through.
On the flip side, in that same battalion, I had a man who
(06:13):
basically was a loving man, a soldier who come back from
several tours and is driving home on New Year's Day to see
his mother and is in a fatal caraccident.
And it takes the gas out of everything that you do.
(06:35):
You know, it's one thing to losein war.
It's another thing to lose at home and not by a suicide, but
by just, it happened. It just was, it was a bad
accident. It takes it takes so much of
your faith, it takes so much of your desire to be a minister to
(06:56):
help, to be a part of that process.
The only saving grace in that particular case, I had had the
opportunity to lead him to the Lord.
And so his going home ceremony was a celebration.
And so those ebbs and flows in military life are are all over
the place. I mean, you, you can't, you
(07:19):
can't minimize those one off tagwhen you were in the field and
it's and it's hot or cold or miserable and it's not fun.
And those individuals are gleaning from those moments what
you believe and what you trust and it allows for you to
actually do ministry in later days.
So it is, it is a, it's a happy and sad moment.
(07:43):
Yeah, absolutely. We are so grateful to have you
as part of the Global War on Terrorism Memorial Foundation's
Design Advisory Council, or DAC.You are one of 23 men and women
who serve on the Design AdvisoryCouncil, You know, the group of
people who are representing those that the memorial will
(08:08):
eventually honor. And this was the vision of Rod,
who you know very well. I I know that he reached out to
you directly to invite you to bepart of our DAC.
And I'm wondering if you think back to that conversation,
Darius, what do you remember? What did Rod say to you and how
(08:30):
did you feel about this invitation?
First, my first statement was, man, I don't know that I'm the
right person to be on this board.
And, and I think it wasn't just a humble statement.
It was a statement of the fact that you think about all the
people who have sacrificed. You think about all the great
(08:50):
men and women that are in uniform, think about what they
have done. And you're like, dude, I, I, I
don't, I don't fit in that I'm, I'm just a guy that's an
enabler, right? And I sit in the back.
I'm most of the times I, I try to fade the black, if you will.
I wanted him to know I would do anything I could to help him.
(09:12):
When I think about my dad who served in Vietnam, when I think
about bro, my brother's a Marine.
When I think about my uncles andmy cousins, we've all served.
I was like, man, I'm so honored to be a part of that process.
And I, and I can hope, just hopethat somehow or another my
inclusion in the process will make it something that's
worthwhile. So I don't, I don't know, my
(09:32):
emotions are still kind of running a little bit even as I
talk about it because I think it's such a huge event.
You go to the memorial law for the Vietnam Memorial Law and,
and it's overwhelming because ofthe history.
Every time I go there, I want tosee my dad's name, even though
he did not die there. You know, every time you go,
(09:53):
you're expecting to see one of your loved ones on that wall.
And so now to be a part of something where I know for a
fact I'm going to see people's names on that wall, that I know
it's overwhelming. And I know that all I can do is
just try my best to advocate, toencourage, to counsel in the
(10:14):
best way I know how. Well, I can tell you, Darius,
that you absolutely are the right person to be a part of the
Design Advisory Council. You are so very humble, just
like the other 22 Design Advisory Council members, Rod
(10:35):
has shared with me that every single time he made that phone
call or had that conversation, the person didn't think like,
why me? I'm not the right person.
And so I just want to remind youthat he asked you because you
are the right person. And I'm so grateful that our
(10:55):
listeners will get to know you alittle bit better and get to
know some of the Design AdvisoryCouncil members whose words,
whose experiences, whose storieshave helped shape the design of
our future Global War on Terrorism Memorial.
So thank you. I'm wondering if you could speak
(11:19):
to how the Global War on Terrorism has influenced your
life. I can remember the day it
started 9/11 right I I remember where I was standing.
I remember the level of pause itgave me.
(11:40):
And to think to myself like what's next?
Your your normal day is no longer normal because that day
will be infamous in your own life.
It will never go away, and so now the only thing that I can do
is go, well, what do I do in order to support it?
(12:02):
At the time, I'm still playing professional football, so all
I'm thinking to myself is, well,I better be really good for what
I do in honor of what I've had an opportunity to be a part of.
You know, it kind of, it caused you to be a greater American.
It caused you to be a greater citizen.
It caused you to do more for your country.
(12:23):
And at the time, you know, I really didn't have anything to
do with the military other than I knew my family members were a
part. I knew that was going on.
My brother was a Marine. Those things were happening, but
I didn't have a part to play in it.
You start to realize that all you can do is be supportive of
those who are currently serving at that point.
(12:45):
I, I played for a few more years.
Of course, you see the numbers go across the, the screen.
That's the people who are dying.Then you hear about the surge.
You see what's happening both inIraq and Afghanistan.
You see Iraq kind of dwindling. You see Afghanistan kind of
being spun up and all you can think to yourself is man, I, I
(13:06):
hope I can be a player part. So when when someone calls you
and says, Hey, man, I really think you can help in this way,
how do you say no? How do you say no to those who
were wounded, both physically, mentally, emotionally.
We start hearing words like PTSD.
(13:29):
Now, I didn't know what PTSD was.
Simply when my dad came back from Vietnam, he had the night
terrors, right? We didn't call it.
We didn't have like a name for it and and those things were
going on and I'm thinking who else, who else is going to help
them navigate those waters? For me, I realized this, that I
(13:50):
don't really have anything to dowith PTSD, but I have to do with
something called moral injury. And that's when people start to
realize either they were betrayed by their country,
betrayed by their their commander, they did something
that was horrible and they don'tknow how to deal with it.
They think that I, I, I murderedsomeone.
So how do I get over that? They know that the Bible is
(14:13):
telling them they shouldn't do certain things and they find
themselves doing it and they're working through all that.
So what a great place for me to stand in the gap and go wait a
minute, let's walk through that and to see those were Tier 1
assets down to the regular soldier.
Have someone stand before him and say, wait a minute.
That's not what God says about this.
(14:35):
Let me walk you through it and to see that I can unpack what
God was intending them to understand and to take that load
off their shoulders to let them know, like here's where you need
to repent and change. But here's where you were
actually in the in the very design of God in those moments.
(14:58):
To hear someone comfort you in that way, to hear someone
encourage you in that way in a time when you're literally
having to go back right back, you're cycling right back in
Afghanistan and you're like, man, I don't know if I can do
it. You're like, wait a minute,
let's walk through. That is a very sacred moment.
It's a sacred space for you to really help the first line,
(15:20):
right, The the line guys who areactually doing combat arms, it
allows you to help them navigatethose waters.
And so G1 as a whole is, is a huge animal.
But my part to, to, to take partin is to really help and enable
those individuals who are impacted by navigate them and
(15:43):
come back whole right. So many of our friends did not
come back physically or did not come back emotionally or did not
come back mentally. And so for me to be able to
bring them home and then wait a minute, hey man, let's get back
to who you really are. Not let that war impact you in
(16:03):
such a way that you can no longer function as a human being
is a part of my service and I'm so grateful to be a part of it.
We're grateful that you're a part of it too, Darius.
I don't know. I know I said the words at the
beginning of our time together, welcome home.
But I don't know if we've specifically told you that the
(16:27):
title of this podcast is Welcomehome and that we have started
saying when we're at the future site of the memorial and people
are there for different events, welcome home because this
memorial is going to be home forso many.
And I, I just think it's, it's so beautiful that you started
(16:50):
talking about those feelings associated with home.
We know that this memorial is going to save lives.
We, we know that for a fact. And I'm wondering, what do you
think about that, that this memorial will save lives?
Oh my gosh, having to preside over several funerals where the
(17:14):
individual came home physically,but mentally they never came
home. It would mean a lot to stop for
a moment and think, what if we could have avoided that?
What if we could avoid one person from being in a place
(17:34):
where they're alone? They're alone in their own
dreams, they're alone in their own home, they're alone in their
own head there. That no matter where they go,
they're alone. And then, like I said, when I
first started, I came off being a part of the team.
And it was hard because of the fact that as soon as the uniform
(17:55):
came off, I had no team. I had no locker room time.
I had no buddy time. I had no let's go over here and
just jaw Jack about the day. I didn't have a grind.
I didn't have I didn't have any part to play in what we do from
day-to-day. And now I'm just standing there.
(18:18):
And so to be alone with all those feelings and emotions that
you haven't really dealt with islike, man, it's just dangerous.
And so to think that now all of a sudden, hey man, we're having
an event in DC at the wall and that event is a rock March or
that event is we're just going to do a straight up gathering at
(18:39):
the memorial. And this just jaw Jack with all
teammates. It does something for people.
It does something for me. Just thinking about the
opportunity that one day me and a bunch of guys from 5:19 on
5/19 day that it's that's our that's our unit, right?
And we're going like, hey, instead of doing 519 down to
(19:01):
Colorado, we're going to go to DC and we're going to rock them
all and then end at the memorial.
And then we're going to celebrate the guys that we lost
and remember them. Man, that's huge.
It's it's used to think like, Hey, I got guys that are from,
you know, 1st, 3rd, 5th, 7th, 10th, you know, that they're all
(19:21):
the group guys that are like, man, we just need a moment.
And so just to have a place where we can, we can gaggle is
huge, right? So it, it's just the one place I
think that all of us, we will know a right here on this bit of
earth. We can still call it home.
So it's an amazing opportunity to be a part of that.
(19:45):
Curious, what would you say right now to someone listening
who feels alone? Well, the pastor immediately
comes out of me, right? You know, I think about a person
named Hagar in the Bible, in Genesis.
She's in the probably the hardest part of her life.
(20:08):
Her family basically has kicked her out.
Her kid is is dying in her arms and she has no idea what she's
going to do. There's no food, no water, no
nothing. She's kind of giving up.
She's like, I'm done and God says, Hey, pick up your face,
look at me and and basically tells her I have a hope and a
(20:33):
future for you. And it's not this.
And that's what I would say, theperson that's listening even
now, hey, you're not alone. Pick up your face, listen to the
voice that's speaking through your camera, through your TV,
through your computer, and is going to say to you there is a
(20:53):
hope and a future for your life.And what you're thinking about
is not it either your flesh, theenemy, or the world is lying to
you. Man, I could, I could name
several people right now that ifyou call them, they would
answer. Two of them are on this call
right now. Rod is another.
(21:14):
They would answer the call immediately to let you know
you're not alone. And then we would do it
everything we had to, to providea level of support on ground
right where you are so that you would never find yourself to be
like, man, I don't know what to do.
And that's the part that I want to be a part of, right, is, is
(21:35):
letting each and every person know their phone call away from
a friend, a brother, a sister inarms that would literally lay it
all down again for them. And so that's my hope is in
those moments that someone wouldinterrupt that cycle and say,
hey, man, we're right here. It's going to take me a few
(21:58):
hours to get to you, but I'll bethere, right?
That 3:00 AM phone call that yougo, hey, man, I'm here, man.
I'll be there in a minute. And you drop everything and go.
There's so many of us that will make that that call and will
respond when we're called. Yes, thank you so much for that.
That was really powerful. And I was thinking as you were
(22:24):
sharing that, Darius, that you know, as a chaplain, you do so
much for so many. You hold space, you bow your
head in prayer, you wrap your arms around so many people and
(22:44):
so many men and women share a lot with you and put so much on
you. And I'm wondering like, how do
you navigate that? How what is what is yourself
care look like? How do you let that go in a
healthy way? What are you taught how to do
(23:06):
that when you become a chaplain?Like how does that work?
But that's a that's a great question.
And, and I would say this, that far too often we, we think our
pastors, our caregivers are invincible, Superman and
Superwoman. And that is just an absolute
lie, right? We cry, We, we, we are
(23:29):
struggling. We are just as fallible and, and
we hurt just as much as anyone else.
I think the difference is, is that a few things have to
happen. One is, I'm going to say a point
of knowledge. If something happens, right, and
somebody pulls the fire alarm, we know that we're all supposed
(23:53):
to gaggle somewhere. What do we call that, Jen?
Remember what that was called when everybody said your rally
point? You knew the rally point, right?
And so no matter what happened, no matter what direction you
went in to get away from the problem, you knew the rally
point then you also knew what the the nine line was, you, what
(24:18):
you had to do in order to call for help, right?
You, you knew these things and they would make you drill them
over and over again so that in case something happened, you
knew where to go and who to call.
Well, as a pastor, I immediatelyknow what my rally point is and
(24:38):
who I'm supposed to call. Most of the times when I talk to
people, they're in trouble. They don't know who to call, and
they think, well, I'm alone. So who do I call?
It's 3:00 in the morning, what do I do?
The difference is you have been told, hey, man, I'm alone
because no one's here. But a person of faith goes no,
(25:00):
the creator of the heavens and the earth.
Since I see you in Psalm 139, hesays I knew you before you were
born. I knew the steps that you were
going to take. That means that he knows you
inside and out. He knows how he made you.
He knows how you're going to walk or where you're going to
be. And he says the God of all
comfort will come and be with you.
(25:22):
That's in Second Corinthians. And so when I think about my
that my current condition, whether happy or sad, I
immediately go to my father and say, Lord, I'm struggling Today
I had AI had a conversation withmy friends who's in around the
world in a different place as a commander.
(25:45):
And he's like, there is and he doesn't start off with he goes
with pleasantries, start 1st andthen he says what's really going
on? And I stopped the conversation
and I said, well, let's pray. The reason why prayer is so
important, it's not because you called me.
It's not because Darius fixed itis because we went to the one
(26:05):
who could do something about it.And for me, instead of calling
my buddy to the left and the right, I'm going to go to the
one that could do something about it.
And when I am done, when I get up, my hope is restored.
Why? Because I took a problem to the
place where something can be done about it.
When we when we don't take it tothe person that could do
(26:27):
something about it, we feel empty.
We feel lost. We feel concerned about whether
or not we're going to be able tofix the situation.
We still have anxiety where we have fear that anything is going
to happen. But when I am done, I have
assurance that whatever takes place, my God is involved.
And so I don't get up until I'm done.
(26:49):
I don't move until I feel sure. I don't, I don't leave until my
fear has gone away. I don't, I don't do anything
until I know everything that's in me that's troubling me is
going to the one that can do something about it.
And that's why they called me. They don't call me to be their
friend. They call me to take their
(27:10):
problems somewhere. When, when we walk away, they
go, man, it's fixed. That's what they that they walk
away in the back, it's done. It's dealt with, right?
That's what they're looking for.They're looking for someone who
can intercede on their behalf ina tab of trouble and know that
trouble has been dealt with. Whether they can see what they
are or feel it in their heart, they know it's been dealt with.
(27:34):
And that's what I do. Well, I know who I'm calling
next time I am feeling down or Ineed a little boost or a kick in
the behind or whatever it is, it's it's Darius Holland.
Darius. Why is the Global War on
Terrorism memorial so important,and why now?
(27:56):
Oh man, they should have had it up already.
I mean, it's been 20 plus years of, of, of, of a, of a conflict
that's still ongoing, right? We're still watching people die
from this conflict. You know, I'm not going to
mention political things here, but one thing that stuck out to
me a while ago, they were like, oh, we're no longer in a
(28:17):
conflict. And literally like months later,
we see the revert reserves out in Jordan die.
And I thought to myself, like, what are you talking about?
We still have people in harm's way and and we're still watching
the ramifications of one Day in History take place today, 20
(28:38):
plus years later. And so the global War on Terror,
the the memorial is about significance, right?
We used numbers all the time when we talked about the fact
that we want to make sure peopleunderstand the ramification of
this decision. And we'll say it cost billions
(28:59):
or trillions of dollars. Well, how much is 1 life before
we go into the numbers? That's how much is 1 life.
If it's your mother, your father, your brother, your
sister, your daughter, your son,how much is that life to you?
Before I go into like whether ornot we should create the wall,
(29:20):
What did you do when that persondied?
You, you, you put them in the ground and you put a stone
there, a stone of remembrance. Why did you put that stone of
remembrance there? You put it there because
whenever you have time and you want to stop, you go back there
to remember that life that impacted you so much, that made
(29:43):
you who you are. How much more should the men and
women have died serving this country in the global War on
Terror be given the same honor that when we go to that wall, we
remember the sacrifice and the cost that it it, you know, we
(30:06):
have to pay when we live the waywe live and how much those
individuals impacted our lives, not just not just in that
theoretical sense, but it in reality, we're now free.
We're able to vote the way we want to.
We're able to live and earn a wage the way we live and earn a
(30:30):
wage to the benefit, to our own personal benefit and to the
benefit of one another. So shouldn't we as a country do
the same things we do individually to remember those
who paid the cost so that we canhave the country that we have?
(30:50):
You, you made a really, you've made many important points, but
one thing I'd like to highlight that you said is the global war
on terrorism is not over. It continues today and this
memorial that we are working on,it absolutely honors those lives
(31:13):
that have been lost and the men and women who served and
sacrificed so much and the families that supported them.
But this memorial is also being built for things in the future
that haven't even happened yet. And so thank you for mentioning
that. Something else I think is really
cool. I know you're familiar with the
(31:35):
foundation's tenants of Honor, Heal and Power and Unite, but
without me even asking you any specific questions about those
tenants during our conversation,you've pretty much hit on each
and every one of them. And so I just thought it would
be nice to kind of tie that up and and mention to our listeners
(32:00):
that the foundations tenants or like our guiding stars, if you
will, are Honor, heal, empower and unite.
And when I mentioned those words, Darius, what what comes
up for you? You know, the, the, the key part
(32:22):
for me is the empowerment. You can't unite without it.
You can't heal without it, right?
It's, it's, it's, you can't evenhonor without it, right?
So honoring is about giving thatwhich you feel should be
esteemed the right privilege, the right deference that's
(32:42):
deserving. If I'm not empowered to do so, I
can't do it. If I, if I don't, if I don't, if
I don't really heal myself right, I can't do it.
Empowerment is huge, right? Why empowerment and why am I
keying in on that? Of all the four, how many times
have we watched a conflict, whether in war or in live
(33:06):
stream, where we see someone whois in desperate need and they're
like, they're calling for any and all help, right?
The Broken Arrow moment. I need help now, right?
If you don't have anyone that can empower you in that moment,
your hope is gone. Your thought of what's going to
(33:29):
happen next is all negative. But when I call out Broken
Arrow, when I say, hey, this thing is is beyond what I can
do. Anyone who has the power to
affect change right now, I need you, any asset within the, the,
(33:50):
the hearing of my voice, I need you to come and in fact change
in my circumstance. I think when we think about
global War on Terror as the memorial in and of itself, it is
a place where everyone's going to know.
It meant so much to us to build this wall, to build this
(34:10):
memorial to remind our people who have died, who are living
and who will come that this is what we would do for those who
have sacrificed and given the eternal costs.
What do you think we're going todo when you when you come and
threaten them? That's that's the part of people
(34:32):
don't realize. When someone comes to see the
memorial and they see the magnificence and the greatness
of what we have done on that memorial, they're in the back of
the mind. They have to think themselves,
if this is what they would do tohonor them when they're dead,
what are they going to do when you threaten them when they're
alive? So memorials have a big impact
(34:54):
on us. It has a big impact on anyone
who decides to threaten the country.
It also is a reminder for those who are currently working
through that healing process andcoming home, Hey, you can come
here and know that you will findthe power to get healed.
You have the the knowledge that you're being honored.
And you know full well that at the end of this, we will be
(35:18):
united around that. And so that's a beautiful part
about being a part of this Global War on Terror Memorial
Foundation. It's just amazing.
It is, it truly is. And so my last question for you
today, Darius, is if you can imagine the first time that you
(35:39):
visit the memorial, when it's complete, what do you hope to
feel? I, I don't, I don't know that I
hope to feel, I hope that I can bring my entire family there
with me because my kids haven't had a chance to really see what
(36:01):
I've been a part of. They get it a little bit because
they're on base or whatever. They, they have some of the
customs and courtesies that theysee.
They see the uniform, they see the ups and downs, but rarely do
they see the actual result. They don't get to see what they
have sacrificed for and they don't get to see the investment
(36:21):
actually produce anything other than conversation around the
dinner table. But when they go to the
memorial, and I remember taking them to the memorial, my kids
were walking and you know, kids don't have any clue.
And of course we get to Vietnam Memorial Wall.
And it was like everything slowsdown again.
(36:44):
I, every time I go there, I justexpect to see my dad's name.
Well, now my kids are going to be able to follow in the
footsteps and know, hey, this iswhat my family sacrificed for.
This is why dad wasn't home those weeks, days, months.
This is why he wasn't able to, to sit with me on that birthday
(37:08):
day or that Christmas Day or that Thanksgiving Day.
This is why I don't expect to feel.
I expect to be able to show my family, hey, This is why we did
what we did. And, and to be able to let them
know that it was worth it. You know, it was worth giving
our time and our sacrifice and missing birthdays and missing
(37:31):
holidays. It was worth it.
And for me, I think that will bethe first time I go there and,
and I'm and I'm expecting a lot of tears, a lot of a lot of
emotion. But I, I know for one thing, my
kids will finally be able to go.I get it now.
(37:51):
It was worth it. Wild Areas, thank you so very
much for your time today, for your encouragement, for allowing
both myself and the listeners toconsider the, the impact, the
(38:16):
power of our connection to something, someone so much
greater than ourselves. There were so many powerful
messages that you shared with ustoday.
I, for one, can't wait to listento this episode again and again
(38:36):
because I just really feel like there were so many beautiful
messages that you shared with ustoday.
So thank you so much. Is there anything else that you
want to say or mention before weclose out?
Absolutely. You know, the the units that
(38:58):
I've been a part of the most of them have been soft.
And one of the, the main things that you will hear them say is
DOL, the pretzel liver and what it means.
It says it means to free the oppressed.
As a chaplain, that is my greatest joy to see someone go
(39:22):
from being overwhelmed in the spiritual realm, being morally
bankrupt, to walking away knowing that there is a reserve
in the spiritual realm that is more than whatever they need or
can ask for. And so if I would leave them
with anything, know this. You are no longer slave.
(39:46):
You are no longer bound. Be free.
And if you don't understand the fullness of what I'm talking
about, please give me a call. I would love to walk you
through. God bless you, I love you and if
you need anything I'm here. Reverend Dr. Darius Holland,
thank you. Welcome home.
(40:07):
Thank you. Welcome Home is produced by
Jennifer Blum, Holly Soria and me.
Jennifer Blue, our operations manager, is Henry Howard.
Art for Welcome Home is by Minerva Consulting.
Our theme, A Place Like Home is by Bergenson Lunberg via
Epidemic. Sound mixing and editing is by
(40:31):
Jennifer Blum. Thank you to Tal Podcast and The
American Legion for their collaboration on this inaugural
series. You can find their episodes,
guests, and more at legion.org slash Tal.
You can find out more about the Global War on Terrorism Memorial
(40:51):
Foundation, get updates on the National War Memorial, and learn
how you can get involved by following us on your favorite
social media platforms or by visiting GWOT Memorial
foundation.org.
Hello and welcome to the Global War on Terrorism Memorial
podcast hosted by the American Legion.
I'm your host, Jen Balu, and it's my honor to welcome you
home today. We are joined by Reverend Dr.
Darius Holland. Darius is a pastor of 20 years
(00:39):
and a chaplain in the Army Reserves, currently serving as a
recruiter. Prior to entering the military,
Darius played for 10 seasons as a defensive lineman in the
National Football League, winning a Super Bowl with the
Green Bay Packers in 1997. Darius has an undergraduate
(01:00):
degree from the University of Colorado Boulder, a Master of
Theological Studies from Golden Gate Theological Seminary, and a
Doctor of Ministry from Gateway Seminary, and one more APHD in
Educational Leadership from Liberty University.
Darius Holland, welcome home andthank you so much for being here
(01:24):
today. Jen, thank you so much for that.
I really appreciate it. Absolutely.
Darius, if it's OK with you, I'dlove for you to share a bit with
our listeners about how you transitioned from the NFL to an
Army chaplain and what that transition was like for you.
(01:47):
Well, there's, there's a little bit of a gap in between NFL and,
and the Army, but one of the things that it's interesting,
I've transitioned several times in my, in my adult career and
going from the NFL to to church ministry was one of the biggest
transitions I had simply becauseyou wear the uniform, but people
(02:09):
don't understand that that uniform is a part of your
identity. As much we like to say that that
uniform is that us, it's not whowe are.
It's really a hard thing to dismiss the fact that that
uniform brings so much identity to your life.
And so playing in the NFL for 10years, I usually equivalent it
(02:29):
to the, the, the story that you see from people were talking
about like the drums before the old Trojan Wars.
And as soon as the drums go off,the horses knew what time it
was. That's how our body feels.
It's certain times when we goingto go into a football game, we
(02:50):
just, our body just kind of responds.
Well, that's part of my identity.
And having the shed, that was difficult because every time I
heard the call, my body was like, it's time to fight, it's
time to do something. But I was no longer a player.
Transitioning out of the NFL wasdifficult.
It took a few years of trying tofind out who I am as a human
(03:15):
being, who I am, what's my identity?
What, why am I going to do? The beautiful thing was is that
I had the church because I completely gave myself into
church ministry. And then from there it, it
showed all the avenues and places where there were other
people like me who were trying to figure out about who, who am
(03:35):
I? And that's how I came to be a
part of the military actually. So we had an incident at my
house. The police came in.
There were basically SWAT officers trying to figure out
what it what was going on behindthe house.
It was a veteran. He was in the middle of a
suicidal ideation. He actually completed that and
(04:00):
the the officers, everyone around you could tell was really
enough in a bad place. And I just prayed for them.
And they're like, man, you'd be a great chaplain.
And that's what started the process of me realizing there
were people in the military who need someone who can help them
transition to the different places and different life cycles
(04:23):
that we go through. And so that was a natural
transition for me. And so that's how I got to be a
part of the of the military and the army, and it's been a great
decision for me and my family. I'm so glad to hear that,
Darius. You know, thank you for all you
do as a chaplain. When I think back to my time in
(04:46):
the Army, you know, some of my greatest times and some of my
most challenging times, a chaplain was always there,
jumping out of airplanes, going out to the field, getting
married when Eddie died, Like there was always a chaplain
there. And I'm curious, when you
reflect on your service as a chaplain, what's one of the most
(05:11):
challenging experience you've had to navigate or help someone
navigate or one of the most challenging?
There's a ton of different moments that are really, really
exciting and, and really, reallydifficult.
I'll give, I'll give both sides one of them.
(05:31):
I got a chance to marry one of my commanders and it was an
amazing moment because he had gone through so much as a Green
Beret. He had lost a lot of soldiers.
He had gone through the ups and downs of his personal life, but
then that moment of being reconciled to the woman that he
(05:52):
truly loved and cared for was a beautiful moment.
And you can see the hope and theand the Glee and the and just.
It was such a good moment for usto all experience as a battalion
us to see what's going, what he was going through.
On the flip side, in that same battalion, I had a man who
(06:13):
basically was a loving man, a soldier who come back from
several tours and is driving home on New Year's Day to see
his mother and is in a fatal caraccident.
And it takes the gas out of everything that you do.
(06:35):
You know, it's one thing to losein war.
It's another thing to lose at home and not by a suicide, but
by just, it happened. It just was, it was a bad
accident. It takes it takes so much of
your faith, it takes so much of your desire to be a minister to
(06:56):
help, to be a part of that process.
The only saving grace in that particular case, I had had the
opportunity to lead him to the Lord.
And so his going home ceremony was a celebration.
And so those ebbs and flows in military life are are all over
the place. I mean, you, you can't, you
(07:19):
can't minimize those one off tagwhen you were in the field and
it's and it's hot or cold or miserable and it's not fun.
And those individuals are gleaning from those moments what
you believe and what you trust and it allows for you to
actually do ministry in later days.
So it is, it is a, it's a happy and sad moment.
(07:43):
Yeah, absolutely. We are so grateful to have you
as part of the Global War on Terrorism Memorial Foundation's
Design Advisory Council, or DAC.You are one of 23 men and women
who serve on the Design AdvisoryCouncil, You know, the group of
people who are representing those that the memorial will
(08:08):
eventually honor. And this was the vision of Rod,
who you know very well. I I know that he reached out to
you directly to invite you to bepart of our DAC.
And I'm wondering if you think back to that conversation,
Darius, what do you remember? What did Rod say to you and how
(08:30):
did you feel about this invitation?
First, my first statement was, man, I don't know that I'm the
right person to be on this board.
And, and I think it wasn't just a humble statement.
It was a statement of the fact that you think about all the
people who have sacrificed. You think about all the great
(08:50):
men and women that are in uniform, think about what they
have done. And you're like, dude, I, I, I
don't, I don't fit in that I'm, I'm just a guy that's an
enabler, right? And I sit in the back.
I'm most of the times I, I try to fade the black, if you will.
I wanted him to know I would do anything I could to help him.
(09:12):
When I think about my dad who served in Vietnam, when I think
about bro, my brother's a Marine.
When I think about my uncles andmy cousins, we've all served.
I was like, man, I'm so honored to be a part of that process.
And I, and I can hope, just hopethat somehow or another my
inclusion in the process will make it something that's
worthwhile. So I don't, I don't know, my
(09:32):
emotions are still kind of running a little bit even as I
talk about it because I think it's such a huge event.
You go to the memorial law for the Vietnam Memorial Law and,
and it's overwhelming because ofthe history.
Every time I go there, I want tosee my dad's name, even though
he did not die there. You know, every time you go,
(09:53):
you're expecting to see one of your loved ones on that wall.
And so now to be a part of something where I know for a
fact I'm going to see people's names on that wall, that I know
it's overwhelming. And I know that all I can do is
just try my best to advocate, toencourage, to counsel in the
(10:14):
best way I know how. Well, I can tell you, Darius,
that you absolutely are the right person to be a part of the
Design Advisory Council. You are so very humble, just
like the other 22 Design Advisory Council members, Rod
(10:35):
has shared with me that every single time he made that phone
call or had that conversation, the person didn't think like,
why me? I'm not the right person.
And so I just want to remind youthat he asked you because you
are the right person. And I'm so grateful that our
(10:55):
listeners will get to know you alittle bit better and get to
know some of the Design AdvisoryCouncil members whose words,
whose experiences, whose storieshave helped shape the design of
our future Global War on Terrorism Memorial.
So thank you. I'm wondering if you could speak
(11:19):
to how the Global War on Terrorism has influenced your
life. I can remember the day it
started 9/11 right I I remember where I was standing.
I remember the level of pause itgave me.
(11:40):
And to think to myself like what's next?
Your your normal day is no longer normal because that day
will be infamous in your own life.
It will never go away, and so now the only thing that I can do
is go, well, what do I do in order to support it?
(12:02):
At the time, I'm still playing professional football, so all
I'm thinking to myself is, well,I better be really good for what
I do in honor of what I've had an opportunity to be a part of.
You know, it kind of, it caused you to be a greater American.
It caused you to be a greater citizen.
It caused you to do more for your country.
(12:23):
And at the time, you know, I really didn't have anything to
do with the military other than I knew my family members were a
part. I knew that was going on.
My brother was a Marine. Those things were happening, but
I didn't have a part to play in it.
You start to realize that all you can do is be supportive of
those who are currently serving at that point.
(12:45):
I, I played for a few more years.
Of course, you see the numbers go across the, the screen.
That's the people who are dying.Then you hear about the surge.
You see what's happening both inIraq and Afghanistan.
You see Iraq kind of dwindling. You see Afghanistan kind of
being spun up and all you can think to yourself is man, I, I
(13:06):
hope I can be a player part. So when when someone calls you
and says, Hey, man, I really think you can help in this way,
how do you say no? How do you say no to those who
were wounded, both physically, mentally, emotionally.
We start hearing words like PTSD.
(13:29):
Now, I didn't know what PTSD was.
Simply when my dad came back from Vietnam, he had the night
terrors, right? We didn't call it.
We didn't have like a name for it and and those things were
going on and I'm thinking who else, who else is going to help
them navigate those waters? For me, I realized this, that I
(13:50):
don't really have anything to dowith PTSD, but I have to do with
something called moral injury. And that's when people start to
realize either they were betrayed by their country,
betrayed by their their commander, they did something
that was horrible and they don'tknow how to deal with it.
They think that I, I, I murderedsomeone.
So how do I get over that? They know that the Bible is
(14:13):
telling them they shouldn't do certain things and they find
themselves doing it and they're working through all that.
So what a great place for me to stand in the gap and go wait a
minute, let's walk through that and to see those were Tier 1
assets down to the regular soldier.
Have someone stand before him and say, wait a minute.
That's not what God says about this.
(14:35):
Let me walk you through it and to see that I can unpack what
God was intending them to understand and to take that load
off their shoulders to let them know, like here's where you need
to repent and change. But here's where you were
actually in the in the very design of God in those moments.
(14:58):
To hear someone comfort you in that way, to hear someone
encourage you in that way in a time when you're literally
having to go back right back, you're cycling right back in
Afghanistan and you're like, man, I don't know if I can do
it. You're like, wait a minute,
let's walk through. That is a very sacred moment.
It's a sacred space for you to really help the first line,
(15:20):
right, The the line guys who areactually doing combat arms, it
allows you to help them navigatethose waters.
And so G1 as a whole is, is a huge animal.
But my part to, to, to take partin is to really help and enable
those individuals who are impacted by navigate them and
(15:43):
come back whole right. So many of our friends did not
come back physically or did not come back emotionally or did not
come back mentally. And so for me to be able to
bring them home and then wait a minute, hey man, let's get back
to who you really are. Not let that war impact you in
(16:03):
such a way that you can no longer function as a human being
is a part of my service and I'm so grateful to be a part of it.
We're grateful that you're a part of it too, Darius.
I don't know. I know I said the words at the
beginning of our time together, welcome home.
But I don't know if we've specifically told you that the
(16:27):
title of this podcast is Welcomehome and that we have started
saying when we're at the future site of the memorial and people
are there for different events, welcome home because this
memorial is going to be home forso many.
And I, I just think it's, it's so beautiful that you started
(16:50):
talking about those feelings associated with home.
We know that this memorial is going to save lives.
We, we know that for a fact. And I'm wondering, what do you
think about that, that this memorial will save lives?
Oh my gosh, having to preside over several funerals where the
(17:14):
individual came home physically,but mentally they never came
home. It would mean a lot to stop for
a moment and think, what if we could have avoided that?
What if we could avoid one person from being in a place
(17:34):
where they're alone? They're alone in their own
dreams, they're alone in their own home, they're alone in their
own head there. That no matter where they go,
they're alone. And then, like I said, when I
first started, I came off being a part of the team.
And it was hard because of the fact that as soon as the uniform
(17:55):
came off, I had no team. I had no locker room time.
I had no buddy time. I had no let's go over here and
just jaw Jack about the day. I didn't have a grind.
I didn't have I didn't have any part to play in what we do from
day-to-day. And now I'm just standing there.
(18:18):
And so to be alone with all those feelings and emotions that
you haven't really dealt with islike, man, it's just dangerous.
And so to think that now all of a sudden, hey man, we're having
an event in DC at the wall and that event is a rock March or
that event is we're just going to do a straight up gathering at
(18:39):
the memorial. And this just jaw Jack with all
teammates. It does something for people.
It does something for me. Just thinking about the
opportunity that one day me and a bunch of guys from 5:19 on
5/19 day that it's that's our that's our unit, right?
And we're going like, hey, instead of doing 519 down to
(19:01):
Colorado, we're going to go to DC and we're going to rock them
all and then end at the memorial.
And then we're going to celebrate the guys that we lost
and remember them. Man, that's huge.
It's it's used to think like, Hey, I got guys that are from,
you know, 1st, 3rd, 5th, 7th, 10th, you know, that they're all
(19:21):
the group guys that are like, man, we just need a moment.
And so just to have a place where we can, we can gaggle is
huge, right? So it, it's just the one place I
think that all of us, we will know a right here on this bit of
earth. We can still call it home.
So it's an amazing opportunity to be a part of that.
(19:45):
Curious, what would you say right now to someone listening
who feels alone? Well, the pastor immediately
comes out of me, right? You know, I think about a person
named Hagar in the Bible, in Genesis.
She's in the probably the hardest part of her life.
(20:08):
Her family basically has kicked her out.
Her kid is is dying in her arms and she has no idea what she's
going to do. There's no food, no water, no
nothing. She's kind of giving up.
She's like, I'm done and God says, Hey, pick up your face,
look at me and and basically tells her I have a hope and a
(20:33):
future for you. And it's not this.
And that's what I would say, theperson that's listening even
now, hey, you're not alone. Pick up your face, listen to the
voice that's speaking through your camera, through your TV,
through your computer, and is going to say to you there is a
(20:53):
hope and a future for your life.And what you're thinking about
is not it either your flesh, theenemy, or the world is lying to
you. Man, I could, I could name
several people right now that ifyou call them, they would
answer. Two of them are on this call
right now. Rod is another.
(21:14):
They would answer the call immediately to let you know
you're not alone. And then we would do it
everything we had to, to providea level of support on ground
right where you are so that you would never find yourself to be
like, man, I don't know what to do.
And that's the part that I want to be a part of, right, is, is
(21:35):
letting each and every person know their phone call away from
a friend, a brother, a sister inarms that would literally lay it
all down again for them. And so that's my hope is in
those moments that someone wouldinterrupt that cycle and say,
hey, man, we're right here. It's going to take me a few
(21:58):
hours to get to you, but I'll bethere, right?
That 3:00 AM phone call that yougo, hey, man, I'm here, man.
I'll be there in a minute. And you drop everything and go.
There's so many of us that will make that that call and will
respond when we're called. Yes, thank you so much for that.
That was really powerful. And I was thinking as you were
(22:24):
sharing that, Darius, that you know, as a chaplain, you do so
much for so many. You hold space, you bow your
head in prayer, you wrap your arms around so many people and
(22:44):
so many men and women share a lot with you and put so much on
you. And I'm wondering like, how do
you navigate that? How what is what is yourself
care look like? How do you let that go in a
healthy way? What are you taught how to do
(23:06):
that when you become a chaplain?Like how does that work?
But that's a that's a great question.
And, and I would say this, that far too often we, we think our
pastors, our caregivers are invincible, Superman and
Superwoman. And that is just an absolute
lie, right? We cry, We, we, we are
(23:29):
struggling. We are just as fallible and, and
we hurt just as much as anyone else.
I think the difference is, is that a few things have to
happen. One is, I'm going to say a point
of knowledge. If something happens, right, and
somebody pulls the fire alarm, we know that we're all supposed
(23:53):
to gaggle somewhere. What do we call that, Jen?
Remember what that was called when everybody said your rally
point? You knew the rally point, right?
And so no matter what happened, no matter what direction you
went in to get away from the problem, you knew the rally
point then you also knew what the the nine line was, you, what
(24:18):
you had to do in order to call for help, right?
You, you knew these things and they would make you drill them
over and over again so that in case something happened, you
knew where to go and who to call.
Well, as a pastor, I immediatelyknow what my rally point is and
(24:38):
who I'm supposed to call. Most of the times when I talk to
people, they're in trouble. They don't know who to call, and
they think, well, I'm alone. So who do I call?
It's 3:00 in the morning, what do I do?
The difference is you have been told, hey, man, I'm alone
because no one's here. But a person of faith goes no,
(25:00):
the creator of the heavens and the earth.
Since I see you in Psalm 139, hesays I knew you before you were
born. I knew the steps that you were
going to take. That means that he knows you
inside and out. He knows how he made you.
He knows how you're going to walk or where you're going to
be. And he says the God of all
comfort will come and be with you.
(25:22):
That's in Second Corinthians. And so when I think about my
that my current condition, whether happy or sad, I
immediately go to my father and say, Lord, I'm struggling Today
I had AI had a conversation withmy friends who's in around the
world in a different place as a commander.
(25:45):
And he's like, there is and he doesn't start off with he goes
with pleasantries, start 1st andthen he says what's really going
on? And I stopped the conversation
and I said, well, let's pray. The reason why prayer is so
important, it's not because you called me.
It's not because Darius fixed itis because we went to the one
(26:05):
who could do something about it.And for me, instead of calling
my buddy to the left and the right, I'm going to go to the
one that could do something about it.
And when I am done, when I get up, my hope is restored.
Why? Because I took a problem to the
place where something can be done about it.
When we when we don't take it tothe person that could do
(26:27):
something about it, we feel empty.
We feel lost. We feel concerned about whether
or not we're going to be able tofix the situation.
We still have anxiety where we have fear that anything is going
to happen. But when I am done, I have
assurance that whatever takes place, my God is involved.
And so I don't get up until I'm done.
(26:49):
I don't move until I feel sure. I don't, I don't leave until my
fear has gone away. I don't, I don't do anything
until I know everything that's in me that's troubling me is
going to the one that can do something about it.
And that's why they called me. They don't call me to be their
friend. They call me to take their
(27:10):
problems somewhere. When, when we walk away, they
go, man, it's fixed. That's what they that they walk
away in the back, it's done. It's dealt with, right?
That's what they're looking for.They're looking for someone who
can intercede on their behalf ina tab of trouble and know that
trouble has been dealt with. Whether they can see what they
are or feel it in their heart, they know it's been dealt with.
(27:34):
And that's what I do. Well, I know who I'm calling
next time I am feeling down or Ineed a little boost or a kick in
the behind or whatever it is, it's it's Darius Holland.
Darius. Why is the Global War on
Terrorism memorial so important,and why now?
(27:56):
Oh man, they should have had it up already.
I mean, it's been 20 plus years of, of, of, of a, of a conflict
that's still ongoing, right? We're still watching people die
from this conflict. You know, I'm not going to
mention political things here, but one thing that stuck out to
me a while ago, they were like, oh, we're no longer in a
(28:17):
conflict. And literally like months later,
we see the revert reserves out in Jordan die.
And I thought to myself, like, what are you talking about?
We still have people in harm's way and and we're still watching
the ramifications of one Day in History take place today, 20
(28:38):
plus years later. And so the global War on Terror,
the the memorial is about significance, right?
We used numbers all the time when we talked about the fact
that we want to make sure peopleunderstand the ramification of
this decision. And we'll say it cost billions
(28:59):
or trillions of dollars. Well, how much is 1 life before
we go into the numbers? That's how much is 1 life.
If it's your mother, your father, your brother, your
sister, your daughter, your son,how much is that life to you?
Before I go into like whether ornot we should create the wall,
(29:20):
What did you do when that persondied?
You, you, you put them in the ground and you put a stone
there, a stone of remembrance. Why did you put that stone of
remembrance there? You put it there because
whenever you have time and you want to stop, you go back there
to remember that life that impacted you so much, that made
(29:43):
you who you are. How much more should the men and
women have died serving this country in the global War on
Terror be given the same honor that when we go to that wall, we
remember the sacrifice and the cost that it it, you know, we
(30:06):
have to pay when we live the waywe live and how much those
individuals impacted our lives, not just not just in that
theoretical sense, but it in reality, we're now free.
We're able to vote the way we want to.
We're able to live and earn a wage the way we live and earn a
(30:30):
wage to the benefit, to our own personal benefit and to the
benefit of one another. So shouldn't we as a country do
the same things we do individually to remember those
who paid the cost so that we canhave the country that we have?
(30:50):
You, you made a really, you've made many important points, but
one thing I'd like to highlight that you said is the global war
on terrorism is not over. It continues today and this
memorial that we are working on,it absolutely honors those lives
(31:13):
that have been lost and the men and women who served and
sacrificed so much and the families that supported them.
But this memorial is also being built for things in the future
that haven't even happened yet. And so thank you for mentioning
that. Something else I think is really
cool. I know you're familiar with the
(31:35):
foundation's tenants of Honor, Heal and Power and Unite, but
without me even asking you any specific questions about those
tenants during our conversation,you've pretty much hit on each
and every one of them. And so I just thought it would
be nice to kind of tie that up and and mention to our listeners
(32:00):
that the foundations tenants or like our guiding stars, if you
will, are Honor, heal, empower and unite.
And when I mentioned those words, Darius, what what comes
up for you? You know, the, the, the key part
(32:22):
for me is the empowerment. You can't unite without it.
You can't heal without it, right?
It's, it's, it's, you can't evenhonor without it, right?
So honoring is about giving thatwhich you feel should be
esteemed the right privilege, the right deference that's
(32:42):
deserving. If I'm not empowered to do so, I
can't do it. If I, if I don't, if I don't, if
I don't really heal myself right, I can't do it.
Empowerment is huge, right? Why empowerment and why am I
keying in on that? Of all the four, how many times
have we watched a conflict, whether in war or in live
(33:06):
stream, where we see someone whois in desperate need and they're
like, they're calling for any and all help, right?
The Broken Arrow moment. I need help now, right?
If you don't have anyone that can empower you in that moment,
your hope is gone. Your thought of what's going to
(33:29):
happen next is all negative. But when I call out Broken
Arrow, when I say, hey, this thing is is beyond what I can
do. Anyone who has the power to
affect change right now, I need you, any asset within the, the,
(33:50):
the hearing of my voice, I need you to come and in fact change
in my circumstance. I think when we think about
global War on Terror as the memorial in and of itself, it is
a place where everyone's going to know.
It meant so much to us to build this wall, to build this
(34:10):
memorial to remind our people who have died, who are living
and who will come that this is what we would do for those who
have sacrificed and given the eternal costs.
What do you think we're going todo when you when you come and
threaten them? That's that's the part of people
(34:32):
don't realize. When someone comes to see the
memorial and they see the magnificence and the greatness
of what we have done on that memorial, they're in the back of
the mind. They have to think themselves,
if this is what they would do tohonor them when they're dead,
what are they going to do when you threaten them when they're
alive? So memorials have a big impact
(34:54):
on us. It has a big impact on anyone
who decides to threaten the country.
It also is a reminder for those who are currently working
through that healing process andcoming home, Hey, you can come
here and know that you will findthe power to get healed.
You have the the knowledge that you're being honored.
And you know full well that at the end of this, we will be
(35:18):
united around that. And so that's a beautiful part
about being a part of this Global War on Terror Memorial
Foundation. It's just amazing.
It is, it truly is. And so my last question for you
today, Darius, is if you can imagine the first time that you
(35:39):
visit the memorial, when it's complete, what do you hope to
feel? I, I don't, I don't know that I
hope to feel, I hope that I can bring my entire family there
with me because my kids haven't had a chance to really see what
(36:01):
I've been a part of. They get it a little bit because
they're on base or whatever. They, they have some of the
customs and courtesies that theysee.
They see the uniform, they see the ups and downs, but rarely do
they see the actual result. They don't get to see what they
have sacrificed for and they don't get to see the investment
(36:21):
actually produce anything other than conversation around the
dinner table. But when they go to the
memorial, and I remember taking them to the memorial, my kids
were walking and you know, kids don't have any clue.
And of course we get to Vietnam Memorial Wall.
And it was like everything slowsdown again.
(36:44):
I, every time I go there, I justexpect to see my dad's name.
Well, now my kids are going to be able to follow in the
footsteps and know, hey, this iswhat my family sacrificed for.
This is why dad wasn't home those weeks, days, months.
This is why he wasn't able to, to sit with me on that birthday
(37:08):
day or that Christmas Day or that Thanksgiving Day.
This is why I don't expect to feel.
I expect to be able to show my family, hey, This is why we did
what we did. And, and to be able to let them
know that it was worth it. You know, it was worth giving
our time and our sacrifice and missing birthdays and missing
(37:31):
holidays. It was worth it.
And for me, I think that will bethe first time I go there and,
and I'm and I'm expecting a lot of tears, a lot of a lot of
emotion. But I, I know for one thing, my
kids will finally be able to go.I get it now.
(37:51):
It was worth it. Wild Areas, thank you so very
much for your time today, for your encouragement, for allowing
both myself and the listeners toconsider the, the impact, the
(38:16):
power of our connection to something, someone so much
greater than ourselves. There were so many powerful
messages that you shared with ustoday.
I, for one, can't wait to listento this episode again and again
(38:36):
because I just really feel like there were so many beautiful
messages that you shared with ustoday.
So thank you so much. Is there anything else that you
want to say or mention before weclose out?
Absolutely. You know, the the units that
(38:58):
I've been a part of the most of them have been soft.
And one of the, the main things that you will hear them say is
DOL, the pretzel liver and what it means.
It says it means to free the oppressed.
As a chaplain, that is my greatest joy to see someone go
(39:22):
from being overwhelmed in the spiritual realm, being morally
bankrupt, to walking away knowing that there is a reserve
in the spiritual realm that is more than whatever they need or
can ask for. And so if I would leave them
with anything, know this. You are no longer slave.
(39:46):
You are no longer bound. Be free.
And if you don't understand the fullness of what I'm talking
about, please give me a call. I would love to walk you
through. God bless you, I love you and if
you need anything I'm here. Reverend Dr. Darius Holland,
thank you. Welcome home.
(40:07):
Thank you. Welcome Home is produced by
Jennifer Blum, Holly Soria and me.
Jennifer Blue, our operations manager, is Henry Howard.
Art for Welcome Home is by Minerva Consulting.
Our theme, A Place Like Home is by Bergenson Lunberg via
Epidemic. Sound mixing and editing is by
(40:31):
Jennifer Blum. Thank you to Tal Podcast and The
American Legion for their collaboration on this inaugural
series. You can find their episodes,
guests, and more at legion.org slash Tal.
You can find out more about the Global War on Terrorism Memorial
(40:51):
Foundation, get updates on the National War Memorial, and learn
how you can get involved by following us on your favorite
social media platforms or by visiting GWOT Memorial
foundation.org.
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