July 29, 2025 • 32 mins
In this episode of the Teaching Tax Flow podcast, hosts Chris Picciurro, CPA, and John Tripolsky break down how proactive tax planning can help you take control of your financial future. Fresh off their visit to NATP’s Taxposium in Las Vegas, they explore the critical differences between tax compliance and forward-looking tax planning, providing a clear framework for implementing powerful strategies.
Chris introduces the Three Buckets of Tax Planning Implementations: behavioral strategies, tax-advantaged investments, and tax mitigation approaches. Together, they explore how each bucket impacts cash flow, tax flow, and duration—giving listeners an actionable blueprint for smarter financial decisions.
What You’ll Learn:
• The difference between tax compliance and tax planning
• How to leverage the three buckets of tax planning
• Why implementation partners matter just as much as strategy
• Real-world examples of behavioral strategies, tax-advantaged investments, and mitigation techniques
• How to systemize tax concepts to reduce overwhelm
Key Insights:
Tax planning isn’t just for the wealthy, it’s about creating intentional strategies that help you “own” your relationship with the IRS. By simplifying complex tax principles into digestible buckets, Chris and John make tax planning approachable, whether you’re a seasoned professional or just getting started.
Notable Quotes:
• “Ideas are cheap; implementation is valuable.”
• “Tax strategies don’t like to be single—they like to mingle, bundle, and stack.”
• “Having the wrong implementation partner could make you worse off than if you did nothing at all.”
• “Just because someone’s on TikTok doesn’t mean they can give accurate tax advice.”
Resources:
• Join the Defeating Taxes Community: DefeatingTaxes.com
• Teaching Tax Flow: teachingtaxflow.com
Episode Sponsor:
Reps Tracker
Get your special TTF discount at teachingtaxflow.com/reps and use code IFG.
- (00:00) - Exploring Tax Planning Strategies and Networking at Taxposium
- (05:27) - The Shift From Tax Compliance to Forward-Looking Tax Planning
- (10:45) - Effective Tax Planning Through Strategic Implementation and Partnerships
- (19:46) - Exploring Behavioral Tax Planning and Investment Strategies
- (27:22) - Engaging Tax Planning Discussions and Community Involvement
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
John Tripolsky (00:03):
Hey, everybody. Welcome back to the podcast
episode 146 today. We are gonnatake a look at should say a deep
look at those three buckets oftax planning implementations. So
if you don't know what that is,we're about to define it. We're
going to jump into it here injust a moment.
But as always, let's take abrief moment and thank our
episode sponsor.
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John Tripolsky (01:01):
Hey, everybody. We are back here again on the
teaching tax flow podcast.Obviously, as you can tell if
you're watching this, I may looka little disheveled. And, you
know, I should say, oh, I forgotto shave, but I think I always
forget to do that. Chris,remember to shave his head.
Beautiful, beautiful, stunninggentlemen. So we are coming off
of an amazing time, I shouldsay. Amazing's kind of an
understatement, Chris, if if youecho that too. I mean, we just
(01:23):
got back from taxposium, right,put on by the NATP. So you know
what?
Here, let's do this. Let's takethirty seconds. Give us your
thoughts on that event, what itis, and and what a fun time we
got there.
Chris Picciurro, CPA: Absolutely. So this is our third (01:33):
undefined
visit to taxposium for you and Iin teaching tax flow. It was an
awesome event. And whattaxposium is is it's a
collection of usually about athousand or 1,500 professionals.
Most of them enrolled agents andCPAs.
Most of them own tax andaccounting firms, but pretty
(01:56):
much all of them work in a firmat least. But vast majority are
are firm owners put on by theNational Association of Tax
Professionals, which is a verylarge trade organization. The
comp the taxposium, I mean, theyand and NACP and many of the
other professional organizationshave a lot of educational
opportunities, and this wasdefinitely an educational
(02:17):
opportunity. However, thisconference is is a little
different. And there is theeducational component, but
there's also the social andconnection component as well.
So they have a large trade show,and they have people, coming in
from all over the country toconnect, to network, to talk
about technology, to talk aboutnew trends in tax. With o b
(02:39):
three, one beautiful bill, onebig beautiful bill act passing a
few weeks ago, It definitelychanged a lot of things, and and
and we had to pivot on some ofour presentations. However, this
yeah. This is our third one,John. We were this year was in
Las Vegas in Caesar's Palace, sothat was an honor, just
(03:03):
personally to present there.
I've had the, luck to presentelsewhere in Vegas, but never at
Caesars Palace. That was prettysweet. And, and then it was
previously in Orlando at the atthe, was it the Dolphin and then
in San Antonio? Honestly, Ithink San Antonio was my
favorite out of the three sofar. I really had a great time.
(03:27):
They're always in the summer.We've we've been very fortunate.
And and if you're part of ourour tax pro meetup group and
you're listening, thank you forwatching. We have developed an
amazing just I I don't know howto say it, John. I I don't wanna
call it a posse, but just areally deep friend group that we
enjoy being around each other.
(03:49):
We hang out for meals, betweensessions, and but it were very
inviting. You know, we've weactually welcomed in a couple
new people that this was thefirst taxposium and jumped in
right with our group and and,had a great time. So it's it's
an opportunity for, taxprofessionals and to to sharpen
their skills, not justeducationally, socially, and and
(04:12):
to network. And and being yourcohost of this podcast has
always, provided us with a lotof opportunity. But I'm gonna
tell you, a lot of the specialguests that we have, they're
either coming from one or twotwo places.
One, there's someone that we'vebeen working with in our private
CPA firm for many years,integrated CPA group. Or two,
(04:33):
it's someone that we met at aconference or maybe I've done
been on a panel with or someone,something like that
professionally that we'vedeveloped a relationship with,
and and, to the level that thatwe'd feel comfortable with them
speaking to our audience. Andand many of these people are
actually in the defeating taxesprivate Facebook group. So if
you're not in there,defeatingtaxes.com. It's not
(04:55):
just I'm not the only taxprofessional in there.
There are tons of reallyqualified tax professionals.
John Tripolsky (05:01):
Yeah. And being that there's a lot of taxpayers
that are listening to this.Right? I promise you that your
CPA or EA, basically your taxpro, was not trying to reenact
the hangover movie while we wereat Caesar's Palace. At least
that we've seen.
So they behaved themselves. Theygot their they got their
continuing education credits,learned some stuff, and you'll
be seeing that soon. So, Chris,on this topic that we're gonna
(05:22):
talk about today. Right? Sowe're we're jumping into those
three buckets of tax planningimplementation.
So I I kinda emphasize that.Implementations. Right? Like,
that's the that's the keywordhere. Sure.
Buckets are important, andthere's three, whatever, in tax
planning. So let's start thisoff, actually. Let's go back
some time. You know, we kindaneed maybe we had some music or
(05:43):
something in here.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (05:44):
You know?
John Tripolsky (05:44):
It's a time traveling way back when
Chris Picciurro, CPA (05:46):
Bill and Ted's excellent adventure. Or or
we could do a little we
John Tripolsky (05:50):
could do a little Wayne's World. Oh, that's
a good movie too, man. Oh, nowwe're talking about the hang the
hangover movie. Bill and yeah.There's a lot going on here.
So let's define for a lot ofpeople that may not know what it
is. I mean, I'm sure taxplanning. Right? You everybody
can kinda take a guess at whatit is. Right?
It's planning, taxes, yada yadayada. But that's something that
(06:13):
you and your firm I mean, youpersonally, over recent years
more than ever have reallyshifted into because a lot of
people aren't doing it becausethey think it's completely out
of touch. So maybe let's startoff. Define that for us a little
bit, and then we'll get into,you know, the buckets of the
implementations and what thoseimplementations actually look
like. And I would say firstbase.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (06:34):
Yeah. We've been analogy. We've been
leading for over a decade in ourprivate CPA practice with tax
planning and strategy. Weobviously work with clients on
what we call tax compliancework. I'm gonna define that
difference for you in a moment.
We've we've been doing taxcompliance work for over well
over twenty years. But we'vebeen focusing on leading, like I
(06:56):
said, with tax planning andstrategy, and so over for over a
decade. I would say over thelast five to six years, more tax
professionals are embracing thetax planning and strategy. And,
actually, John, one of the oneof the presentations that that
we did in Las Vegas was focusedon looking at a ten forty,
(07:18):
looking at the four coreschedules of a ten forty, which
are schedule a, schedule c,schedule e, and schedule d, and
finding opportunities withinthat. So this is not just
something that, hey.
Sounds good. And and this hasreally come to the forefront of
our of our industry, especiallywith the fact that we are losing
(07:39):
a lot of people in our industry,to to retirement, quite frankly.
So we've gotta deeper thoseclient relationships as tax
professionals, and we've gottamove over from just tax
compliance to tax planning. Nowtax planning, you're gonna hail
you're gonna hear tax planning,tax strategy, all these little
buzzwords, and it's toughbecause these are all intangible
(08:00):
things. Right?
It's hard to you know, it's likeretirement planning. Okay. Well,
what you know, what's the well,your four zero one k is part of
a retirement plan, But if yourfour zero one k or your house is
not the retirement plan, if thatmakes sense. So here's here's my
definition of it. Tax taxcompliance is the function of
(08:21):
reporting things that havealready occurred.
Now that could be a tax returnsprepared, and all it's doing is
reporting all the activitiesthat was that were done before
that reporting cycle. So a 2024form ten forty, which is a
personal tax return, isreporting to the government all
of the things that that taxpayerdid during 2024. It's looking
(08:42):
back. Now there are some tightthere are some implementations
which we're gonna talk aboutthat you could still do in 2025
and count for 2024, but,ultimately, 2020 that tax return
is is activity for 2024. If you,let's say you're filing payroll
tax returns with the government.
It's called a nine forty one.That's just reporting to the
(09:03):
government all of the payrollthat was run for a company in
the past. So when you thinkabout tax preparation, we don't
love the term tax preparation ortax season in a private
practice, but we'd look at thatas tax compliance work. Anything
that has, again, occurred in thepast, You could even look at
that, bring it into thefinancial world. You could have
(09:26):
an like, pretty much every cityor municipality has an audit.
Or and that's just looking atthe last the previous activity
and putting it into a financialstatement. So tax planning is
everything looking forward.Okay? So when you're with tax
(09:46):
compliance is looking backward,looking forward. So when it
comes to making decisions arepart of your tax plan.
If you're an individual, and itcould be on the individual
level, such as should I buy aprimary residence? Should I buy
a rental property? Should Iinvest in a Roth? Should I put
my money into a traditional IRA?Should I convert?
(10:08):
Should I buy a new vehicle?Should I lease a new vehicle?
All especially for businessowners. What type of entity
should I consider? All thewoulda, coulda, shouldas, all
the things looking forward is mydefinition of tax planning.
John Tripolsky (10:25):
And when you do that too, it's a couple things
there that that I'll point outtoo, and then I'll reference
some other many conversationsthat we've had around this as,
you know, it's it's basicallythe the windshield and the
rearview mirror analogy. Right?Like, the windshield, it's it's
very, very wide open. Everythingis in front of you. Things are
moving around.
Right? You're passing by things.That's the planning perspective.
(10:47):
The compliance or the taxpreparation, I say it lightly,
and I'm about 800 miles awayfrom you so I can say these
words. Right?
There are you know, you lookback. It's a very, very small
vantage point. It's verydefined. You know? Here's the
outline of your rear viewmirror.
Everything's behind you. It'smoving much slower. It's static.
It's done. It's set.
(11:07):
K. What I really like about taxplanning and and and full
transparency. Right? Like,you've been doing this a while.
I've known you for two and ahalf decades.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (11:15):
Mhmm.
John Tripolsky (11:15):
I can't wait till we've known each other
three decades. Like, that'sthat's a good number.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (11:19):
Oh, man.
John Tripolsky (11:20):
I'm gonna be
Chris Picciurro, CPA (11:20):
really old.
John Tripolsky (11:21):
I'll always be younger than you, though.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (11:23):
I know.
John Tripolsky (11:24):
That's something that's never gonna change.
They're but with this wholeplanning things, right, tax
planning, there's so much powerto it because I didn't even know
so many things you can actuallycontrol. Like, I remember one of
our earlier podcasts. I think wemay have done one, you know,
about owning the relationshipthat you have with the IRS, and
(11:44):
some people may say, well, whatthe, you know, what the heck are
you talking about? Like, theysend me a bill.
I pay it. What do you mean I owethe own the relationship or can?
And we're gonna get into thesethings. Right? It's having
having the knowledge, having thepartners, having the people, the
resources.
It helps guide your decisionsthat you make. I mean, sure. As
everybody goes into business oranything, you know, right out of
(12:06):
the gate, you look at it as,alright. Great. I can expense
this.
Blah. You know? Blah. Blah. Thisis a deduction.
This is an deduction. You feellike that's it. But even if
you're not in business, youknow, you're not if you're not
self employed, there's a lot ofcrap you can do. I should and
you shouldn't say crap, but youhave to have the right people to
do it. Right?
Chris Picciurro, CPA (12:23):
Exactly. You it's a team approach. And
that's what's confusing abouttax planning. And so one of the
things we've done at teachingtax flow, excuse me, is we have
taken things and systemize themand categorize them because it's
very overwhelming and confusing.Know just like if someone said,
hey I don't, I'm sick.
(12:45):
Oh my, okay, are your symptoms?Why are you saying you're sick?
You know, it could be somethinglike I've had a it could be a
variety of things. Or like, Ican't get out of bed. Okay.
Did you break you know, is itdid you break your leg? Are you
have a flu? Do you have youknow, what's going on here? So,
yeah, so within teaching taxflow, we have a we have a
(13:07):
proprietary system where wewhere where we work through four
steps of tax planning. And Ilike your analogy about the
rearview mirror.
Like, we can't change what we wejust drove through. We can learn
from it, and we can say, youknow what? That was pretty darn
good. Like, think about going ona road trip. You come down to
Nashville quite a bit.
You know, you fly a lot.Sometimes you drive. There's
(13:28):
certain times of the day youwanna leave for a long trip.
There's certain times of the daythat you don't. So no learning
from that.
And then we also know and wetalk about a lot is that ideas
are cheap, implementation'svaluable. So just because
someone's on and, again, we havea we we have content on TikTok
and Instagram, so I'm not bad.I'm not saying that that's a bad
(13:51):
thing, but many times, that typeof advice is misapplied to, to
someone's situation. So ideasare cheap. What's important is
implementation, but evenimplement tax planning
implementations sometimes can beconfusing.
So we so that's where we reallybroke it down, and and all this
(14:11):
experience is really coming fromour private CPA practice. And
part of our mission and passionis to share it with as many
people as possible. And I hope,you know, if you're listening to
this or watching this, that thatyou are doing some type of tax
planning and implementation. Buteven more than that, if you've
never been exposed to taxplanning, you're the type of
(14:33):
audience we wanna touch as well.We want to get this out there.
So because it get but it isvague. Right? Sometimes we say,
oh, tax planning. Okay. Well,let's talk about this.
Implementations. We've we'vedetermined that implementations
for tax planning come in threedifferent buckets. I like the
bucket approach or categories,you could say. And one of the
(14:54):
laws of teaching tax flow isthat cash flow and tax flow are
different things. Cash flow ismoney that came in or out of
your pocket.
Tax flow is your after tax ortax benefit or tax burden of
your decisions. So each of thesebuckets, we've identified a
level of cash flow, a level oftax flow, meaning tax reduction
(15:17):
or tax benefit, and duration. Isthis a strategy or something
that you're gonna do or animplementation rather that is
year by year, or is it a longtime long time duration? So and
we'll I'll give you an exampleof each, strategy in each of
these buckets as we go along.So, yeah, let's start off with
(15:37):
the most basic bucket.
John Tripolsky (15:39):
I'm sorry. And it is really good too. You
mentioned, you know, tidbits,Like, we're on social. We have
content out there. Some of ittoo, it's I feel, and I know
we've talked about this as notall of it is incorrect
information.
There's a lot of it out therethat's just often la la land.
But if you don't actually see itall the way through or don't
know about it all the waythrough, you only know a little
(16:00):
bit of it, it can get you in alot of trouble. Absolutely.
Basically misrepresented. Right?
I mean, I and I would say,Chris, tell me if if I'm wrong
on this one. Probably the numberone and the number two that I
see is in you know what? I'mnever gonna say them because I
know you're gonna talk aboutanywhere. I'm not gonna steal
your thunder, but there is a lotof stuff out there. AKA don't
listen to a TikTok and pay yourkids and buy a truck.
(16:22):
Two things.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (16:23):
Right. Exactly. I mean
John Tripolsky (16:24):
Here we go.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (16:25):
The the point you have is you're using
tax planning implementations iskinda like playing you know,
kinda like having you know,fireworks. They're beautiful,
but you have to light themproperly. Right? So having the
wrong implementation partnercould make you worse off than if
(16:47):
you did nothing, actually.
John Tripolsky (16:49):
That's a great you know, we need to do, like,
an animation of that, like,lighting things at the on the
wrong end.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (16:56):
Like Absolutely. What kind of what
kind
John Tripolsky (16:58):
of explosive thing that would be? So It's
okay.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (17:01):
Planning implementations, many times you
need what are calledimplementation partners to make
this happen. If if that's youand you you some of this might
sound like, gosh. I should beshould be doing this. I don't
know where to start. We've got asolution for you.
John, you you know it wellbecause you designed it,
actually. Go to our hub,teaching tax law. Think it's
(17:21):
.combackslashhub. I'm sure youcould put a link to that in the
in the show notes and reach out.We are very diligent part again,
part of going to the events ofthe world and some of our other
things we do is to make surethat we are vetting and working
with the proper implementationpartners.
And that could be something aseasy as, like you just
mentioned, John, putting letlet's start with behavior. Okay?
(17:43):
Let's let's start with that, andwe're gonna we're gonna bring
home your example. John, youactually have some good examples
and analogies today. Sometimesyou're out in left field.
John Tripolsky (17:51):
You know what? I'll I'll I'll take it when they
come in, man. That's, you know,like, we're talking we started
this episode off talking abouttaxposium. I love going to these
because everybody knows, I sayit all the time, like, I'm not a
tax pro. I'm not.
We'll we'll say, like, I bet Idon't even know what to call
myself. It's like a tax, I don'tknow, sponge or something.
Although, you know, I will saythis to a couple members of our
(18:12):
mastermind group, gave me areally, really good compliment
this week, and they said, youknow what? Because I I thought I
said something. I was like, oh,you know, I don't know I don't
know Jack about taxes.
I'm like, I'm the dumb guy here.And then I start I don't know. I
followed it up with something.They go, you know what? You
actually probably know more thanyou give yourself credit for.
So, I mean, I I think that'slike a a a true testament to
teaching tax flow. Right? Like,everything and this sounds like
(18:34):
an advertisement, but it's true.If any somebody's just chiming
into this is, you know, a lot ofthis stuff we're taking, which
is very, very detailed, very,very intimidating, like, high
level stuff, and we break itdown. And that's really because
I think that's, like, the theglorious thing about our
relationship.
Right? As you get too far in theleads, I, like, throw a rock at
(18:55):
you and bring you back to thethe real world for the the
average Joe. And then we, youknow, we trek along back into
it, which this is probably thebest example of we could go deep
or we can stay very high levelRight. On a lot of this stuff.
Right?
Chris Picciurro, CPA (19:09):
Yeah. So so think about these buckets,
tax planning implementation. Inthat first bucket is what we
call behavioral. So this issomething that when we think
about the cash flow, meaning howmuch money is going out of your
pocket or your net worth to makethis happen? And it's gonna be
(19:31):
none.
Okay? What's the tax floweffect? It's usually a bit
little low to medium tax benefitrelatively. Still pretty good.
Right?
If no cash is going out andyou've got a tax benefit, that's
pretty good. What's theduration? Year to year. So I'll
give you a couple examples ofthis. Again, diagnose,
prescribe.
Right? But you look at shouldshould I put money into my
(19:53):
retirement account? You know,should I fund my should I put
money into an I r an IRA? Orshould I sure. Is it is it gonna
like, you still own the IRA orthe money was in your brokerage
account, so maybe it doesn'treally cost you anything.
You still own that IRA. Mhmm.It's not like you purchased a
vehicle, and you drove it offthe lot and it went down in
(20:15):
value. Is there a tax benefit?Yeah.
There's a tax benefit, either aRoth or a traditional. There are
different types of benefits.What's the duration? Year to
year. Okay.
I could put money into my Roththis year, not put it in the
next year. I could do it theyear after that. Those are and
another example would be payingyour children. Right? Should I
pay my children if they're doingnow we have a you know, We have
(20:36):
other content on there.
We wanna make sure that you'repaying your children reasonable
compensation for what they'redoing. But, ultimately, the
money is not leaving yourhousehold. Right? It's not
leaving your household. Sothere's really no cash flow and
there's a tax benefit.
Not a big huge tax benefit,you're getting out of a higher
marginal tax rate into a lowernone, and it's a year to year.
(20:57):
Maybe this year, my child worksfor me. Maybe the next year that
child didn't work me. And sothat's and those are example of
behavioral tax planningimplementations. I'll give you
one more health savings accountcontribution.
Right? So it's now that you putmoney in a health savings
account, and it's not youraccount. That's your account.
And as long as it's usedproperly, it's the growth and
(21:20):
income's tax free. So in partof, like, you're saying, John,
part of the implementationpartners is, hey.
I've got a okay. I'm thinkingthat I should hire a family
member. Great. I don't knowwhere to start. Part of the
teaching tax flow, we obviously,we had a we had a whole episode
on modern payroll with the folksat Gusto, but let's get let's
(21:42):
get you set up with them.
You know, they're you know,they're typically are gonna
gonna get really well taken careof no matter what, but
especially if you're part of theteaching taxable community. They
might even offer some type ofpromotional code to that's for
our for our community members.So, again, that that's just an
example of those behavioral taxplanning implementations.
John Tripolsky (22:01):
And I'm glad you brought up that one
specifically. Right? Becausethat really is a great example
that, I mean, if I just had tothink of a random number, I'd
you know, well, I will say,like, 78 and a half percent of
people. When you hear, oh, youknow, I should pay my kids or or
pay a family member, whatever itis, they probably think of it as
either, oh, you know, I couldjust give them cash, but, you
(22:22):
know, I wanna do it legit, soI'm gonna write them a check,
which still is not the right wayto do it. Right?
Like, you have to go they haveto be put on payroll. Correct?
It's not as simple as I suresure. Treating them like a
$10.99. So that's one I thinkthat is very, very, very rarely
explained all the way through,especially in a TikTok video or
(22:43):
something.
Chris Picciurro, CPA: Absolutely. Absolutely. There's (22:43):
undefined
a there's a there's a again, itcomes down to the right
implementation partners to makesure you get the best result
possible, and that would includecompany that processes payroll.
So those
John Tripolsky (22:57):
those And we'll put in that one, we're gonna put
some links in the show notes tothe episodes on those because
that's a whole whole anotherdiscussion.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (23:03):
Well, you're gonna like this because
my examples for the next twobuckets will also we also have
content episodes on. So thesecond one, second bucket would
be a tax advantaged investment.Now I'm gonna before I jump into
this, I wanna let people know.Just like tax strategies, don't
like to be single. They theylike to they like to mingle.
They like to jingle. They liketo be blended and stacked. Okay?
(23:27):
You could we have clients thatutilize all three buckets of tax
planning implementations in oneyear. It's they they're not
think about it like tires on aon more on a on a three wheeler
motorcycle.
I guess you wouldn't call that areal motorcycle, the the the
(23:47):
hardcore people. But they'retires. You don't if one tire
needs to be inflated, it doesn'tmean you inflate the other two.
Right? You just fix that one.
So they could be utilized I knowit's a bad analogy because I'm
not I'm not a motorcycle and carguy like you are, John, so
that's why you're but you couldutilize it's not all or nothing
in each bucket. Let's put itthat way. So tax advantage
(24:09):
investments, typically, theircash flow is going to be higher.
Right? Typically higher, whichis usually over a $100,000 to be
involved in one of these type ofinvestments.
Usually, you're going to besomething called an accredited
investor. The tax flow istypically medium. So in general,
(24:31):
you know, if you you were topartake in a tax advantage
investment that gave you animmediate deduction on your tax
return that you're able to take,you're probably gonna see about
a 30 to 35% tax reduction ordeduction that first year. So
that's that's prettysignificant. Right?
That
John Tripolsky (24:51):
which I would say that's
Chris Picciurro, CPA (24:52):
cash flow is still more than the tax flow.
Right? The you're still layingyou're still putting a $100,000
into an investment and getting a$3,035,000 dollar immediate tax
deduction tax benefit year one,but you still own the
investment. Go ahead, John.
John Tripolsky (25:05):
I'm sorry. And when we're and when we're
talking about these, I mean,that literally is, I mean,
owning the relationship. Right?Like, you're not giving a bill
at that point. You know what thebill's gonna be.
I mean, if you plan for it, youcould forecast and say, I know
exactly what I'm gonna owe.Right. And no surprises.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (25:21):
So you've got so so it's a tax so you've
got high cash flow, medium taxflow. The duration is long term,
which is actually good. So someof these this might be an
investment, and we always saydon't let the tax tail wag the
dog, but it could be somethingthat you own for, you know,
between seven and fifteen years.A quick example, which is a
(25:41):
podcast episode that we that wehave, was talking through
investing in oil and gas. Now,obviously, speak with your
financial adviser about this.
We're not suggesting this atthis point. We have but we do
have a podcast episodespecifically on that topic. That
is just an example of a taxadvantaged investment. So there
(26:05):
are several out there. So that'sthat's the second bucket.
And third, final, is a taxmitigation strategy as our third
tax planning implementation. Thecash flow is typically low to
medium, right, about a $50,000minimum, but your tax flow or
your tax reduction is very high.You know, in that case, probably
(26:27):
75 to $80,000 on a tax reductionon that type of investment. And
the duration is one time. Agreat example of a tax
mitigation strategy would beleveraged charitable giving,
which we have a podcast episodeon.
Yeah. We're not suggestedsuggesting you would do that.
It's an example of a taxmitigation strategy. And as you
(26:49):
could see, we have clients inour private CPA firm that
utilize all three buckets, andthey all have their place in
understanding that duration.Because remember, not all tax
deductions have to come in yearone is very important.
John Tripolsky (27:04):
Right. Absolutely. Absolutely. And,
Chris, these ones before wekinda wrap this up here too,
when did it dawn on you? I knowwe talked about a little bit
that you're like, you know what?
We need to make this intobuckets so people understand
Chris Picciurro, CPA (27:17):
these things.
John Tripolsky (27:18):
Like, did you have, like, an moment on the
pickleball court?
Chris Picciurro, CPA (27:21):
Okay. So I don't really get I never get
moments on the pickleball courtbecause it's too it's thanks for
bringing it up too, though. Bythe way, little chat taxposium
shout out. I one of thepresentations we were doing, I
asked the audience, tell me aplace you find a lot of clients.
That a guy spouted out thepickleball court.
(27:43):
Mhmm. Then about
John Tripolsky (27:44):
I heard it.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (27:44):
About about 200 or so people had to
listen to me and him talk aboutpaddles for a minute or so on
our president, then we moved on.But I wasn't on the pickleball
court, but it was it wasprobably about November, like,
2024. I and these things come tome when I'm out for a run or
walk, typically. So yep. Andthen it really just started
(28:04):
diving into, like, okay.
How do I it all comes from andand I know this sounds corny. It
comes from you, the listener,the watcher. It comes from you,
people that I'm working with ontax planning and strategy,
because I'm constantly trying tofigure out easier ways to
explain these things that thatare digestible and
understandable. So that's that'swhere it comes from. And, yeah,
(28:31):
just like people were defeatingTackler's group.
John Tripolsky (28:34):
I was just gonna say, and and that group, I
think, is is great because justthe messages we get from people.
And, I mean, even if it's assimple as somebody messaging us
saying, hey. You know, can youelaborate more? Can you explain
more? And it always leads tosomething, which is great.
And sometimes, I mean, again,being the, quote, unquote, a non
tax pro in the room usually, Ilove seeing those because half
(28:54):
the time I mean, me and Chris,we spend endless hours working
on this stuff on a on a weeklybasis, and sometimes I forget
her or I kinda let him get intothe weeds too far. So,
collectively, let's let's reelhim back out of this thing. But
thanks for going into this, man.I I appreciate it. I I always
love, you know, getting intospecifics on some of these
things.
(29:14):
But then also too, takingsomething that that is perceived
as such it's obviously highvalue, but, like, you know, oh,
it's out of reach for so manypeople and bringing it back down
and diving into it andseparating it out, I think, is
is very, very important,obviously. So
Chris Picciurro, CPA (29:31):
I'd say, hey. We'd we'd love to hear from
you. If if you have a comment,let us know what your favorite
tax planning implementation is.And that'd that'd be great to
hear, and if we don't have acontent on it, we'll make some.
John Tripolsky (29:44):
That's the fun part. Keep us busy. Keep us busy
coming up with stuff. And I'llput it out there too. So
taxpayers, taxpayer only, sendus questions we have on this,
but also tax pros, CPAs, EAs,anybody that's dealing with this
stuff.
We'd love to hear from you too.I mean, obviously, if if you
don't feel comfortable puttingit
Chris Picciurro, CPA (30:03):
out there, you know, in the
John Tripolsky (30:04):
public eye in these groups, send us a message.
We love we love hearing it. Andjust, you know, hearing your
take on some of these, I think,is is also great, great feedback
we get from all this. So asChris had mentioned to anybody
that's listening to this, I'lladd shame on you. You should be
watching it.
But if you're not, it's okaylistening to it.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (30:21):
It's fine. Even just put
John Tripolsky (30:22):
it on the background. But more
importantly, also subscribe tothe YouTube channel that we get
the notifications when these dodrop. Obviously, we're creeping
up on a 150 episodes of doingthem weekly. So if you are still
with us, we appreciate it.Hopefully, the content's gotten
a little bit better.
Don't go back and listen to,like, one through 20. If you do,
(30:43):
you know, the equipment sucked.Let's be honest. We we were so
focused on getting it out there.We're like, oh, we'll deal with
details later.
Great content, but the deliverytweaked a little bit, obviously,
around the episode. Actually, Ithink at episode a 100, we went
to video. So, obviously, youwon't find video before that.
But check out the stuff. Let usknow what you think.
Share with a friend, familymember, colleague, anybody you
(31:03):
think of. Hey. Go up to somebodyon the streets, step them on the
shoulder, and say, hey. I got agreat podcast for you and see
what they say. If they don'tpunch you in the throat, hey.
Maybe it'll thank you. But checkit out. Stay in touch with us.
We love it, and we will seeeverybody back here again next
week as we do creep towards thatepisode one fifty. Show notes,
obviously, as I'm pointing downthere off to the side.
(31:24):
Lots of links, resources. Followthose. Don't be lazy. As I
started saying a while back,they're right there in front of
you, and we'll see everybodyback here again next week.
Different date on the calendar.
Completely different topic. Seeeverybody soon.
Disclaimer (31:47):
Advice from your financial professional. For all
tax and legal advice, pleaseconsult your CPA or attorney.
Investment advisory services areoffered through Cabin Advisors,
a registered investment advisor.Securities are offered through
Cabin Securities, a registeredbroker The content of this
podcast does not constitute anoffer of securities. Offerings
can only be made through anoffering memorandum, and you
should carefully examine therisk factors and other
(32:09):
information contained in thememorandum.
Hey, everybody. Welcome back to the podcast
episode 146 today. We are gonnatake a look at should say a deep
look at those three buckets oftax planning implementations. So
if you don't know what that is,we're about to define it. We're
going to jump into it here injust a moment.
But as always, let's take abrief moment and thank our
episode sponsor.
Ad Read (00:28):
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John Tripolsky (01:01):
Hey, everybody. We are back here again on the
teaching tax flow podcast.Obviously, as you can tell if
you're watching this, I may looka little disheveled. And, you
know, I should say, oh, I forgotto shave, but I think I always
forget to do that. Chris,remember to shave his head.
Beautiful, beautiful, stunninggentlemen. So we are coming off
of an amazing time, I shouldsay. Amazing's kind of an
understatement, Chris, if if youecho that too. I mean, we just
(01:23):
got back from taxposium, right,put on by the NATP. So you know
what?
Here, let's do this. Let's takethirty seconds. Give us your
thoughts on that event, what itis, and and what a fun time we
got there.
Chris Picciurro, CPA: Absolutely. So this is our third (01:33):
undefined
visit to taxposium for you and Iin teaching tax flow. It was an
awesome event. And whattaxposium is is it's a
collection of usually about athousand or 1,500 professionals.
Most of them enrolled agents andCPAs.
Most of them own tax andaccounting firms, but pretty
(01:56):
much all of them work in a firmat least. But vast majority are
are firm owners put on by theNational Association of Tax
Professionals, which is a verylarge trade organization. The
comp the taxposium, I mean, theyand and NACP and many of the
other professional organizationshave a lot of educational
opportunities, and this wasdefinitely an educational
(02:17):
opportunity. However, thisconference is is a little
different. And there is theeducational component, but
there's also the social andconnection component as well.
So they have a large trade show,and they have people, coming in
from all over the country toconnect, to network, to talk
about technology, to talk aboutnew trends in tax. With o b
(02:39):
three, one beautiful bill, onebig beautiful bill act passing a
few weeks ago, It definitelychanged a lot of things, and and
and we had to pivot on some ofour presentations. However, this
yeah. This is our third one,John. We were this year was in
Las Vegas in Caesar's Palace, sothat was an honor, just
(03:03):
personally to present there.
I've had the, luck to presentelsewhere in Vegas, but never at
Caesars Palace. That was prettysweet. And, and then it was
previously in Orlando at the atthe, was it the Dolphin and then
in San Antonio? Honestly, Ithink San Antonio was my
favorite out of the three sofar. I really had a great time.
(03:27):
They're always in the summer.We've we've been very fortunate.
And and if you're part of ourour tax pro meetup group and
you're listening, thank you forwatching. We have developed an
amazing just I I don't know howto say it, John. I I don't wanna
call it a posse, but just areally deep friend group that we
enjoy being around each other.
(03:49):
We hang out for meals, betweensessions, and but it were very
inviting. You know, we've weactually welcomed in a couple
new people that this was thefirst taxposium and jumped in
right with our group and and,had a great time. So it's it's
an opportunity for, taxprofessionals and to to sharpen
their skills, not justeducationally, socially, and and
(04:12):
to network. And and being yourcohost of this podcast has
always, provided us with a lotof opportunity. But I'm gonna
tell you, a lot of the specialguests that we have, they're
either coming from one or twotwo places.
One, there's someone that we'vebeen working with in our private
CPA firm for many years,integrated CPA group. Or two,
(04:33):
it's someone that we met at aconference or maybe I've done
been on a panel with or someone,something like that
professionally that we'vedeveloped a relationship with,
and and, to the level that thatwe'd feel comfortable with them
speaking to our audience. Andand many of these people are
actually in the defeating taxesprivate Facebook group. So if
you're not in there,defeatingtaxes.com. It's not
(04:55):
just I'm not the only taxprofessional in there.
There are tons of reallyqualified tax professionals.
John Tripolsky (05:01):
Yeah. And being that there's a lot of taxpayers
that are listening to this.Right? I promise you that your
CPA or EA, basically your taxpro, was not trying to reenact
the hangover movie while we wereat Caesar's Palace. At least
that we've seen.
So they behaved themselves. Theygot their they got their
continuing education credits,learned some stuff, and you'll
be seeing that soon. So, Chris,on this topic that we're gonna
(05:22):
talk about today. Right? Sowe're we're jumping into those
three buckets of tax planningimplementation.
So I I kinda emphasize that.Implementations. Right? Like,
that's the that's the keywordhere. Sure.
Buckets are important, andthere's three, whatever, in tax
planning. So let's start thisoff, actually. Let's go back
some time. You know, we kindaneed maybe we had some music or
(05:43):
something in here.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (05:44):
You know?
John Tripolsky (05:44):
It's a time traveling way back when
Chris Picciurro, CPA (05:46):
Bill and Ted's excellent adventure. Or or
we could do a little we
John Tripolsky (05:50):
could do a little Wayne's World. Oh, that's
a good movie too, man. Oh, nowwe're talking about the hang the
hangover movie. Bill and yeah.There's a lot going on here.
So let's define for a lot ofpeople that may not know what it
is. I mean, I'm sure taxplanning. Right? You everybody
can kinda take a guess at whatit is. Right?
It's planning, taxes, yada yadayada. But that's something that
(06:13):
you and your firm I mean, youpersonally, over recent years
more than ever have reallyshifted into because a lot of
people aren't doing it becausethey think it's completely out
of touch. So maybe let's startoff. Define that for us a little
bit, and then we'll get into,you know, the buckets of the
implementations and what thoseimplementations actually look
like. And I would say firstbase.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (06:34):
Yeah. We've been analogy. We've been
leading for over a decade in ourprivate CPA practice with tax
planning and strategy. Weobviously work with clients on
what we call tax compliancework. I'm gonna define that
difference for you in a moment.
We've we've been doing taxcompliance work for over well
over twenty years. But we'vebeen focusing on leading, like I
(06:56):
said, with tax planning andstrategy, and so over for over a
decade. I would say over thelast five to six years, more tax
professionals are embracing thetax planning and strategy. And,
actually, John, one of the oneof the presentations that that
we did in Las Vegas was focusedon looking at a ten forty,
(07:18):
looking at the four coreschedules of a ten forty, which
are schedule a, schedule c,schedule e, and schedule d, and
finding opportunities withinthat. So this is not just
something that, hey.
Sounds good. And and this hasreally come to the forefront of
our of our industry, especiallywith the fact that we are losing
(07:39):
a lot of people in our industry,to to retirement, quite frankly.
So we've gotta deeper thoseclient relationships as tax
professionals, and we've gottamove over from just tax
compliance to tax planning. Nowtax planning, you're gonna hail
you're gonna hear tax planning,tax strategy, all these little
buzzwords, and it's toughbecause these are all intangible
(08:00):
things. Right?
It's hard to you know, it's likeretirement planning. Okay. Well,
what you know, what's the well,your four zero one k is part of
a retirement plan, But if yourfour zero one k or your house is
not the retirement plan, if thatmakes sense. So here's here's my
definition of it. Tax taxcompliance is the function of
(08:21):
reporting things that havealready occurred.
Now that could be a tax returnsprepared, and all it's doing is
reporting all the activitiesthat was that were done before
that reporting cycle. So a 2024form ten forty, which is a
personal tax return, isreporting to the government all
of the things that that taxpayerdid during 2024. It's looking
(08:42):
back. Now there are some tightthere are some implementations
which we're gonna talk aboutthat you could still do in 2025
and count for 2024, but,ultimately, 2020 that tax return
is is activity for 2024. If you,let's say you're filing payroll
tax returns with the government.
It's called a nine forty one.That's just reporting to the
(09:03):
government all of the payrollthat was run for a company in
the past. So when you thinkabout tax preparation, we don't
love the term tax preparation ortax season in a private
practice, but we'd look at thatas tax compliance work. Anything
that has, again, occurred in thepast, You could even look at
that, bring it into thefinancial world. You could have
(09:26):
an like, pretty much every cityor municipality has an audit.
Or and that's just looking atthe last the previous activity
and putting it into a financialstatement. So tax planning is
everything looking forward.Okay? So when you're with tax
(09:46):
compliance is looking backward,looking forward. So when it
comes to making decisions arepart of your tax plan.
If you're an individual, and itcould be on the individual
level, such as should I buy aprimary residence? Should I buy
a rental property? Should Iinvest in a Roth? Should I put
my money into a traditional IRA?Should I convert?
(10:08):
Should I buy a new vehicle?Should I lease a new vehicle?
All especially for businessowners. What type of entity
should I consider? All thewoulda, coulda, shouldas, all
the things looking forward is mydefinition of tax planning.
John Tripolsky (10:25):
And when you do that too, it's a couple things
there that that I'll point outtoo, and then I'll reference
some other many conversationsthat we've had around this as,
you know, it's it's basicallythe the windshield and the
rearview mirror analogy. Right?Like, the windshield, it's it's
very, very wide open. Everythingis in front of you. Things are
moving around.
Right? You're passing by things.That's the planning perspective.
(10:47):
The compliance or the taxpreparation, I say it lightly,
and I'm about 800 miles awayfrom you so I can say these
words. Right?
There are you know, you lookback. It's a very, very small
vantage point. It's verydefined. You know? Here's the
outline of your rear viewmirror.
Everything's behind you. It'smoving much slower. It's static.
It's done. It's set.
(11:07):
K. What I really like about taxplanning and and and full
transparency. Right? Like,you've been doing this a while.
I've known you for two and ahalf decades.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (11:15):
Mhmm.
John Tripolsky (11:15):
I can't wait till we've known each other
three decades. Like, that'sthat's a good number.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (11:19):
Oh, man.
John Tripolsky (11:20):
I'm gonna be
Chris Picciurro, CPA (11:20):
really old.
John Tripolsky (11:21):
I'll always be younger than you, though.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (11:23):
I know.
John Tripolsky (11:24):
That's something that's never gonna change.
They're but with this wholeplanning things, right, tax
planning, there's so much powerto it because I didn't even know
so many things you can actuallycontrol. Like, I remember one of
our earlier podcasts. I think wemay have done one, you know,
about owning the relationshipthat you have with the IRS, and
(11:44):
some people may say, well, whatthe, you know, what the heck are
you talking about? Like, theysend me a bill.
I pay it. What do you mean I owethe own the relationship or can?
And we're gonna get into thesethings. Right? It's having
having the knowledge, having thepartners, having the people, the
resources.
It helps guide your decisionsthat you make. I mean, sure. As
everybody goes into business oranything, you know, right out of
(12:06):
the gate, you look at it as,alright. Great. I can expense
this.
Blah. You know? Blah. Blah. Thisis a deduction.
This is an deduction. You feellike that's it. But even if
you're not in business, youknow, you're not if you're not
self employed, there's a lot ofcrap you can do. I should and
you shouldn't say crap, but youhave to have the right people to
do it. Right?
Chris Picciurro, CPA (12:23):
Exactly. You it's a team approach. And
that's what's confusing abouttax planning. And so one of the
things we've done at teachingtax flow, excuse me, is we have
taken things and systemize themand categorize them because it's
very overwhelming and confusing.Know just like if someone said,
hey I don't, I'm sick.
(12:45):
Oh my, okay, are your symptoms?Why are you saying you're sick?
You know, it could be somethinglike I've had a it could be a
variety of things. Or like, Ican't get out of bed. Okay.
Did you break you know, is itdid you break your leg? Are you
have a flu? Do you have youknow, what's going on here? So,
yeah, so within teaching taxflow, we have a we have a
(13:07):
proprietary system where wewhere where we work through four
steps of tax planning. And Ilike your analogy about the
rearview mirror.
Like, we can't change what we wejust drove through. We can learn
from it, and we can say, youknow what? That was pretty darn
good. Like, think about going ona road trip. You come down to
Nashville quite a bit.
You know, you fly a lot.Sometimes you drive. There's
(13:28):
certain times of the day youwanna leave for a long trip.
There's certain times of the daythat you don't. So no learning
from that.
And then we also know and wetalk about a lot is that ideas
are cheap, implementation'svaluable. So just because
someone's on and, again, we havea we we have content on TikTok
and Instagram, so I'm not bad.I'm not saying that that's a bad
(13:51):
thing, but many times, that typeof advice is misapplied to, to
someone's situation. So ideasare cheap. What's important is
implementation, but evenimplement tax planning
implementations sometimes can beconfusing.
So we so that's where we reallybroke it down, and and all this
(14:11):
experience is really coming fromour private CPA practice. And
part of our mission and passionis to share it with as many
people as possible. And I hope,you know, if you're listening to
this or watching this, that thatyou are doing some type of tax
planning and implementation. Buteven more than that, if you've
never been exposed to taxplanning, you're the type of
(14:33):
audience we wanna touch as well.We want to get this out there.
So because it get but it isvague. Right? Sometimes we say,
oh, tax planning. Okay. Well,let's talk about this.
Implementations. We've we'vedetermined that implementations
for tax planning come in threedifferent buckets. I like the
bucket approach or categories,you could say. And one of the
(14:54):
laws of teaching tax flow isthat cash flow and tax flow are
different things. Cash flow ismoney that came in or out of
your pocket.
Tax flow is your after tax ortax benefit or tax burden of
your decisions. So each of thesebuckets, we've identified a
level of cash flow, a level oftax flow, meaning tax reduction
(15:17):
or tax benefit, and duration. Isthis a strategy or something
that you're gonna do or animplementation rather that is
year by year, or is it a longtime long time duration? So and
we'll I'll give you an exampleof each, strategy in each of
these buckets as we go along.So, yeah, let's start off with
(15:37):
the most basic bucket.
John Tripolsky (15:39):
I'm sorry. And it is really good too. You
mentioned, you know, tidbits,Like, we're on social. We have
content out there. Some of ittoo, it's I feel, and I know
we've talked about this as notall of it is incorrect
information.
There's a lot of it out therethat's just often la la land.
But if you don't actually see itall the way through or don't
know about it all the waythrough, you only know a little
(16:00):
bit of it, it can get you in alot of trouble. Absolutely.
Basically misrepresented. Right?
I mean, I and I would say,Chris, tell me if if I'm wrong
on this one. Probably the numberone and the number two that I
see is in you know what? I'mnever gonna say them because I
know you're gonna talk aboutanywhere. I'm not gonna steal
your thunder, but there is a lotof stuff out there. AKA don't
listen to a TikTok and pay yourkids and buy a truck.
(16:22):
Two things.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (16:23):
Right. Exactly. I mean
John Tripolsky (16:24):
Here we go.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (16:25):
The the point you have is you're using
tax planning implementations iskinda like playing you know,
kinda like having you know,fireworks. They're beautiful,
but you have to light themproperly. Right? So having the
wrong implementation partnercould make you worse off than if
(16:47):
you did nothing, actually.
John Tripolsky (16:49):
That's a great you know, we need to do, like,
an animation of that, like,lighting things at the on the
wrong end.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (16:56):
Like Absolutely. What kind of what
kind
John Tripolsky (16:58):
of explosive thing that would be? So It's
okay.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (17:01):
Planning implementations, many times you
need what are calledimplementation partners to make
this happen. If if that's youand you you some of this might
sound like, gosh. I should beshould be doing this. I don't
know where to start. We've got asolution for you.
John, you you know it wellbecause you designed it,
actually. Go to our hub,teaching tax law. Think it's
(17:21):
.combackslashhub. I'm sure youcould put a link to that in the
in the show notes and reach out.We are very diligent part again,
part of going to the events ofthe world and some of our other
things we do is to make surethat we are vetting and working
with the proper implementationpartners.
And that could be something aseasy as, like you just
mentioned, John, putting letlet's start with behavior. Okay?
(17:43):
Let's let's start with that, andwe're gonna we're gonna bring
home your example. John, youactually have some good examples
and analogies today. Sometimesyou're out in left field.
John Tripolsky (17:51):
You know what? I'll I'll I'll take it when they
come in, man. That's, you know,like, we're talking we started
this episode off talking abouttaxposium. I love going to these
because everybody knows, I sayit all the time, like, I'm not a
tax pro. I'm not.
We'll we'll say, like, I bet Idon't even know what to call
myself. It's like a tax, I don'tknow, sponge or something.
Although, you know, I will saythis to a couple members of our
(18:12):
mastermind group, gave me areally, really good compliment
this week, and they said, youknow what? Because I I thought I
said something. I was like, oh,you know, I don't know I don't
know Jack about taxes.
I'm like, I'm the dumb guy here.And then I start I don't know. I
followed it up with something.They go, you know what? You
actually probably know more thanyou give yourself credit for.
So, I mean, I I think that'slike a a a true testament to
teaching tax flow. Right? Like,everything and this sounds like
(18:34):
an advertisement, but it's true.If any somebody's just chiming
into this is, you know, a lot ofthis stuff we're taking, which
is very, very detailed, very,very intimidating, like, high
level stuff, and we break itdown. And that's really because
I think that's, like, the theglorious thing about our
relationship.
Right? As you get too far in theleads, I, like, throw a rock at
(18:55):
you and bring you back to thethe real world for the the
average Joe. And then we, youknow, we trek along back into
it, which this is probably thebest example of we could go deep
or we can stay very high levelRight. On a lot of this stuff.
Right?
Chris Picciurro, CPA (19:09):
Yeah. So so think about these buckets,
tax planning implementation. Inthat first bucket is what we
call behavioral. So this issomething that when we think
about the cash flow, meaning howmuch money is going out of your
pocket or your net worth to makethis happen? And it's gonna be
(19:31):
none.
Okay? What's the tax floweffect? It's usually a bit
little low to medium tax benefitrelatively. Still pretty good.
Right?
If no cash is going out andyou've got a tax benefit, that's
pretty good. What's theduration? Year to year. So I'll
give you a couple examples ofthis. Again, diagnose,
prescribe.
Right? But you look at shouldshould I put money into my
(19:53):
retirement account? You know,should I fund my should I put
money into an I r an IRA? Orshould I sure. Is it is it gonna
like, you still own the IRA orthe money was in your brokerage
account, so maybe it doesn'treally cost you anything.
You still own that IRA. Mhmm.It's not like you purchased a
vehicle, and you drove it offthe lot and it went down in
(20:15):
value. Is there a tax benefit?Yeah.
There's a tax benefit, either aRoth or a traditional. There are
different types of benefits.What's the duration? Year to
year. Okay.
I could put money into my Roththis year, not put it in the
next year. I could do it theyear after that. Those are and
another example would be payingyour children. Right? Should I
pay my children if they're doingnow we have a you know, We have
(20:36):
other content on there.
We wanna make sure that you'repaying your children reasonable
compensation for what they'redoing. But, ultimately, the
money is not leaving yourhousehold. Right? It's not
leaving your household. Sothere's really no cash flow and
there's a tax benefit.
Not a big huge tax benefit,you're getting out of a higher
marginal tax rate into a lowernone, and it's a year to year.
(20:57):
Maybe this year, my child worksfor me. Maybe the next year that
child didn't work me. And sothat's and those are example of
behavioral tax planningimplementations. I'll give you
one more health savings accountcontribution.
Right? So it's now that you putmoney in a health savings
account, and it's not youraccount. That's your account.
And as long as it's usedproperly, it's the growth and
(21:20):
income's tax free. So in partof, like, you're saying, John,
part of the implementationpartners is, hey.
I've got a okay. I'm thinkingthat I should hire a family
member. Great. I don't knowwhere to start. Part of the
teaching tax flow, we obviously,we had a we had a whole episode
on modern payroll with the folksat Gusto, but let's get let's
(21:42):
get you set up with them.
You know, they're you know,they're typically are gonna
gonna get really well taken careof no matter what, but
especially if you're part of theteaching taxable community. They
might even offer some type ofpromotional code to that's for
our for our community members.So, again, that that's just an
example of those behavioral taxplanning implementations.
John Tripolsky (22:01):
And I'm glad you brought up that one
specifically. Right? Becausethat really is a great example
that, I mean, if I just had tothink of a random number, I'd
you know, well, I will say,like, 78 and a half percent of
people. When you hear, oh, youknow, I should pay my kids or or
pay a family member, whatever itis, they probably think of it as
either, oh, you know, I couldjust give them cash, but, you
(22:22):
know, I wanna do it legit, soI'm gonna write them a check,
which still is not the right wayto do it. Right?
Like, you have to go they haveto be put on payroll. Correct?
It's not as simple as I suresure. Treating them like a
$10.99. So that's one I thinkthat is very, very, very rarely
explained all the way through,especially in a TikTok video or
(22:43):
something.
Chris Picciurro, CPA: Absolutely. Absolutely. There's (22:43):
undefined
a there's a there's a again, itcomes down to the right
implementation partners to makesure you get the best result
possible, and that would includecompany that processes payroll.
So those
John Tripolsky (22:57):
those And we'll put in that one, we're gonna put
some links in the show notes tothe episodes on those because
that's a whole whole anotherdiscussion.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (23:03):
Well, you're gonna like this because
my examples for the next twobuckets will also we also have
content episodes on. So thesecond one, second bucket would
be a tax advantaged investment.Now I'm gonna before I jump into
this, I wanna let people know.Just like tax strategies, don't
like to be single. They theylike to they like to mingle.
They like to jingle. They liketo be blended and stacked. Okay?
(23:27):
You could we have clients thatutilize all three buckets of tax
planning implementations in oneyear. It's they they're not
think about it like tires on aon more on a on a three wheeler
motorcycle.
I guess you wouldn't call that areal motorcycle, the the the
(23:47):
hardcore people. But they'retires. You don't if one tire
needs to be inflated, it doesn'tmean you inflate the other two.
Right? You just fix that one.
So they could be utilized I knowit's a bad analogy because I'm
not I'm not a motorcycle and carguy like you are, John, so
that's why you're but you couldutilize it's not all or nothing
in each bucket. Let's put itthat way. So tax advantage
(24:09):
investments, typically, theircash flow is going to be higher.
Right? Typically higher, whichis usually over a $100,000 to be
involved in one of these type ofinvestments.
Usually, you're going to besomething called an accredited
investor. The tax flow istypically medium. So in general,
(24:31):
you know, if you you were topartake in a tax advantage
investment that gave you animmediate deduction on your tax
return that you're able to take,you're probably gonna see about
a 30 to 35% tax reduction ordeduction that first year. So
that's that's prettysignificant. Right?
That
John Tripolsky (24:51):
which I would say that's
Chris Picciurro, CPA (24:52):
cash flow is still more than the tax flow.
Right? The you're still layingyou're still putting a $100,000
into an investment and getting a$3,035,000 dollar immediate tax
deduction tax benefit year one,but you still own the
investment. Go ahead, John.
John Tripolsky (25:05):
I'm sorry. And when we're and when we're
talking about these, I mean,that literally is, I mean,
owning the relationship. Right?Like, you're not giving a bill
at that point. You know what thebill's gonna be.
I mean, if you plan for it, youcould forecast and say, I know
exactly what I'm gonna owe.Right. And no surprises.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (25:21):
So you've got so so it's a tax so you've
got high cash flow, medium taxflow. The duration is long term,
which is actually good. So someof these this might be an
investment, and we always saydon't let the tax tail wag the
dog, but it could be somethingthat you own for, you know,
between seven and fifteen years.A quick example, which is a
(25:41):
podcast episode that we that wehave, was talking through
investing in oil and gas. Now,obviously, speak with your
financial adviser about this.
We're not suggesting this atthis point. We have but we do
have a podcast episodespecifically on that topic. That
is just an example of a taxadvantaged investment. So there
(26:05):
are several out there. So that'sthat's the second bucket.
And third, final, is a taxmitigation strategy as our third
tax planning implementation. Thecash flow is typically low to
medium, right, about a $50,000minimum, but your tax flow or
your tax reduction is very high.You know, in that case, probably
(26:27):
75 to $80,000 on a tax reductionon that type of investment. And
the duration is one time. Agreat example of a tax
mitigation strategy would beleveraged charitable giving,
which we have a podcast episodeon.
Yeah. We're not suggestedsuggesting you would do that.
It's an example of a taxmitigation strategy. And as you
(26:49):
could see, we have clients inour private CPA firm that
utilize all three buckets, andthey all have their place in
understanding that duration.Because remember, not all tax
deductions have to come in yearone is very important.
John Tripolsky (27:04):
Right. Absolutely. Absolutely. And,
Chris, these ones before wekinda wrap this up here too,
when did it dawn on you? I knowwe talked about a little bit
that you're like, you know what?
We need to make this intobuckets so people understand
Chris Picciurro, CPA (27:17):
these things.
John Tripolsky (27:18):
Like, did you have, like, an moment on the
pickleball court?
Chris Picciurro, CPA (27:21):
Okay. So I don't really get I never get
moments on the pickleball courtbecause it's too it's thanks for
bringing it up too, though. Bythe way, little chat taxposium
shout out. I one of thepresentations we were doing, I
asked the audience, tell me aplace you find a lot of clients.
That a guy spouted out thepickleball court.
(27:43):
Mhmm. Then about
John Tripolsky (27:44):
I heard it.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (27:44):
About about 200 or so people had to
listen to me and him talk aboutpaddles for a minute or so on
our president, then we moved on.But I wasn't on the pickleball
court, but it was it wasprobably about November, like,
2024. I and these things come tome when I'm out for a run or
walk, typically. So yep. Andthen it really just started
(28:04):
diving into, like, okay.
How do I it all comes from andand I know this sounds corny. It
comes from you, the listener,the watcher. It comes from you,
people that I'm working with ontax planning and strategy,
because I'm constantly trying tofigure out easier ways to
explain these things that thatare digestible and
understandable. So that's that'swhere it comes from. And, yeah,
(28:31):
just like people were defeatingTackler's group.
John Tripolsky (28:34):
I was just gonna say, and and that group, I
think, is is great because justthe messages we get from people.
And, I mean, even if it's assimple as somebody messaging us
saying, hey. You know, can youelaborate more? Can you explain
more? And it always leads tosomething, which is great.
And sometimes, I mean, again,being the, quote, unquote, a non
tax pro in the room usually, Ilove seeing those because half
(28:54):
the time I mean, me and Chris,we spend endless hours working
on this stuff on a on a weeklybasis, and sometimes I forget
her or I kinda let him get intothe weeds too far. So,
collectively, let's let's reelhim back out of this thing. But
thanks for going into this, man.I I appreciate it. I I always
love, you know, getting intospecifics on some of these
things.
(29:14):
But then also too, takingsomething that that is perceived
as such it's obviously highvalue, but, like, you know, oh,
it's out of reach for so manypeople and bringing it back down
and diving into it andseparating it out, I think, is
is very, very important,obviously. So
Chris Picciurro, CPA (29:31):
I'd say, hey. We'd we'd love to hear from
you. If if you have a comment,let us know what your favorite
tax planning implementation is.And that'd that'd be great to
hear, and if we don't have acontent on it, we'll make some.
John Tripolsky (29:44):
That's the fun part. Keep us busy. Keep us busy
coming up with stuff. And I'llput it out there too. So
taxpayers, taxpayer only, sendus questions we have on this,
but also tax pros, CPAs, EAs,anybody that's dealing with this
stuff.
We'd love to hear from you too.I mean, obviously, if if you
don't feel comfortable puttingit
Chris Picciurro, CPA (30:03):
out there, you know, in the
John Tripolsky (30:04):
public eye in these groups, send us a message.
We love we love hearing it. Andjust, you know, hearing your
take on some of these, I think,is is also great, great feedback
we get from all this. So asChris had mentioned to anybody
that's listening to this, I'lladd shame on you. You should be
watching it.
But if you're not, it's okaylistening to it.
Chris Picciurro, CPA (30:21):
It's fine. Even just put
John Tripolsky (30:22):
it on the background. But more
importantly, also subscribe tothe YouTube channel that we get
the notifications when these dodrop. Obviously, we're creeping
up on a 150 episodes of doingthem weekly. So if you are still
with us, we appreciate it.Hopefully, the content's gotten
a little bit better.
Don't go back and listen to,like, one through 20. If you do,
(30:43):
you know, the equipment sucked.Let's be honest. We we were so
focused on getting it out there.We're like, oh, we'll deal with
details later.
Great content, but the deliverytweaked a little bit, obviously,
around the episode. Actually, Ithink at episode a 100, we went
to video. So, obviously, youwon't find video before that.
But check out the stuff. Let usknow what you think.
Share with a friend, familymember, colleague, anybody you
(31:03):
think of. Hey. Go up to somebodyon the streets, step them on the
shoulder, and say, hey. I got agreat podcast for you and see
what they say. If they don'tpunch you in the throat, hey.
Maybe it'll thank you. But checkit out. Stay in touch with us.
We love it, and we will seeeverybody back here again next
week as we do creep towards thatepisode one fifty. Show notes,
obviously, as I'm pointing downthere off to the side.
(31:24):
Lots of links, resources. Followthose. Don't be lazy. As I
started saying a while back,they're right there in front of
you, and we'll see everybodyback here again next week.
Different date on the calendar.
Completely different topic. Seeeverybody soon.
Disclaimer (31:47):
Advice from your financial professional. For all
tax and legal advice, pleaseconsult your CPA or attorney.
Investment advisory services areoffered through Cabin Advisors,
a registered investment advisor.Securities are offered through
Cabin Securities, a registeredbroker The content of this
podcast does not constitute anoffer of securities. Offerings
can only be made through anoffering memorandum, and you
should carefully examine therisk factors and other
(32:09):
information contained in thememorandum.
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